Latest / Curiously Guided Podcast / Ep.54 | Removing Shame & Finding Joy in Your Business Finances, with Financial Coach, Keina Newell

Transcript

Ep.54 | Removing Shame & Finding Joy in Your Business Finances, with Financial Coach, Keina Newell · Curiously Guided Podcast

• 0:07
  SPEAKER_04: Welcome back to the Curiously Guided Podcast, the place for intuitive business owners and curious minds.
• 0:14
  SPEAKER_04: We're your hosts, Mariah and Shay.
• 0:17
  SPEAKER_04: And today, well, in today's episode, it's all about money.
• 0:22
  SPEAKER_04: Money, finances, all of that stuff that kind of like, I don't know, freak some of us online business owners now.
• 0:29
  SPEAKER_04: So we had the pleasure of chatting with Kina Newell from Wealth Over Now.
• 0:36
  SPEAKER_04: And y'all, this episode is like everything that I knew that I needed.
• 0:41
  SPEAKER_04: Because a lot of things it's like, oh yeah, it's like everything that I didn't know that I needed.
• 0:45
  SPEAKER_04: And it's like, no, I 100% needed like somebody to kind of light a fire under my ass when it comes to money and finances.
• 0:54
  SPEAKER_04: And the reason why I kind of reached out to Kina because I ended up finding her on Instagram.
• 0:59
  SPEAKER_04: And I just really enjoy the way that she explains this stuff in a really grounded perspective.
• 1:05
  SPEAKER_04: And the information that she gives in this episode is no different.
• 1:10
  SPEAKER_04: We kind of bounce all over the place, talking about like removing the shame around not being able to support yourself as a new business owner.
• 1:18
  SPEAKER_04: Like, I think that that's super important.
• 1:20
  SPEAKER_04: And then we also dive into just things for a little bit more advanced business owners, too, of just like, where do I start investing?
• 1:27
  SPEAKER_04: What big mistakes are people making?
• 1:29
  SPEAKER_04: And one of my favorite parts of this episode was like her giving real tangible examples with like money examples, number examples.
• 1:40
  SPEAKER_04: It just really helped ground things in.
• 1:43
  SPEAKER_04: And I think this episode is just going to be really helpful for business owners of all levels.
• 1:49
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, this episode was like a little bit more on the practical strategic side.
• 1:55
  SPEAKER_00: Kina definitely shares our strategy brains, but she did a great job of kind of bridging the gap between money and creativity.
• 2:03
  SPEAKER_00: Honestly, that was one of my big takeaways.
• 2:06
  SPEAKER_00: Um she had a really great way of like saying everything from a really grounded place, but also from a really, I don't know, hopeful place.
• 2:14
  SPEAKER_00: I feel like a lot of times with the conversation around money, it can be easy to feel like, oh, I've really fucked up and I'm really far behind.
• 2:21
  SPEAKER_00: Like, what am I gonna do?
• 2:22
  SPEAKER_00: And um Kina's approach was just I left feeling really inspired and optimistic.
• 2:27
  SPEAKER_00: I like Mariah said, I really enjoyed her perspective around removing shame.
• 2:32
  SPEAKER_00: And then another big takeaway for me from her was, you know, one thing with all the clients I work with, it's like, yeah, we're aware that there's highs and lows in business.
• 2:41
  SPEAKER_00: And there's all this talk around out there about like how to steady that out and not have to be on this like roller coaster all the time.
• 2:50
  SPEAKER_00: And I think the advice Kina shares around that in particular was really, really helpful for me and helpful for a lot of the people I work with.
• 2:57
  SPEAKER_00: So definitely stick around, listen to the wise words that this lovely woman has shared with us.
• 3:02
  SPEAKER_00: Mariah and I both got off the call and like immediately started taking action.
• 3:06
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm excited to hear from y'all about what you guys take away from the episode.
• 3:10
  SPEAKER_00: Um, a little bit more about Kina.
• 3:11
  SPEAKER_00: She's the founder of Wealth Over Now, like Mariah said, where she works with professional women and solopreneurs to create new possibilities with their money so they can save more, pay off debt, invest in themselves, and stress less about money.
• 3:25
  SPEAKER_00: She is passionate about her work and finds no greater satisfaction than helping her clients start managing their money with joy because they've learned to feel possibility where they once felt shame, guilt, overwhelm, and anxiety.
• 3:38
  SPEAKER_00: When she is not coaching, Kina is spending quality time with friends and family and traveling.
• 3:43
  SPEAKER_00: To learn more about her, head over to Wealth Over Now and explore her tips to manage your money well.
• 3:49
  SPEAKER_00: Now let's dive into the episode.
• 3:51
  SPEAKER_04: Eena, welcome to the Curiously Guided podcast.
• 3:55
  SPEAKER_04: We are so fucking excited for this episode.
• 3:58
  SPEAKER_04: Uh, we were kind of telling Kina before this, while I was, of just like how much I avoid thinking of finances.
• 4:08
  SPEAKER_04: And like in the business world, I'm kind of just like, well, I make money and I pay my bills and like my taxes are cool and like everything feels, I don't know, like it's chugging along.
• 4:18
  SPEAKER_04: So I guess like, why put the emphasis on this?
• 4:22
  SPEAKER_04: But then there also is a deeper part of me that it's like, Mariah, that's just an excuse on why you haven't taken your finances seriously.
• 4:28
  SPEAKER_04: Like, there's there's definitely like excuses under the surface.
• 4:32
  SPEAKER_04: So I'm excited to dive in to get your perspective on finances to also shift the narrative to make this a lot more empowering.
• 4:41
  SPEAKER_04: Because I do think that, especially getting into the business world, we not only bring like all of these old stories and subconscious patterns and all of these things from growing up, but like a lot of them have to do with money, or it's like our business essentially mirrors back to us like our own relationship with ourselves.
• 5:01
  SPEAKER_04: And so that can play out in our relationship with our finances and money and things like that.
• 5:06
  SPEAKER_04: And I just feel like it's it's a blind spot that a lot that a lot of us are like okay with having because we're scared to go any deeper.
• 5:16
  SPEAKER_04: So I'm excited for this episode, but before we get into like the real juice, can you kind of just take us into like how did you start getting interested in finances?
• 5:26
  SPEAKER_04: Like, how did you become a financial coach?
• 5:28
  SPEAKER_04: Like, where did this all kind of start?
• 5:30
  SPEAKER_01: I think I'm like one of the 1% of people in the world that find budgeting to be very therapeutic.
• 5:38
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and so like I'll try to make this as short as possible.
• 5:42
  SPEAKER_01: I was just telling somebody the other day that when I have a management and finance degree, but um, when I graduated college, I decided to do Teach for America and I had accepted a job offer in oil and gas that was like$55,000 a year.
• 5:57
  SPEAKER_01: And then there was like Teach for America kept calling me and they're like, Don't you want to come be an underpaid teacher?
• 6:03
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm like, No, I do not want to.
• 6:06
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but like for me, it was like definitely something that I wanted to do because I was passionate about giving back to the community.
• 6:13
  SPEAKER_01: But when they would tell me how much money I was gonna be making, which was like$30,000 a year, I'm like, how am I supposed to live off of that?
• 6:20
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and so it started with me like actually being like, hold on, let me do a budget to see if that makes sense.
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_01: Um and then I ended up staying in education for over a decade.
• 6:30
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, because I say that God has a sense of humor because I'm supposed to be rich by way of a lot of other things.
• 6:37
  SPEAKER_01: But I was in education, and so like all of my next moves kind of question like, okay, what do the numbers say?
• 6:45
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and so when you're making$30,000 a year and they're like, oh yeah, buy a home, save for retirement, like I was having to answer all of those questions, but it was like, how do I do that with the amount of money that I make?
• 6:57
  SPEAKER_01: And so um I ended up leaving St.
• 7:01
  SPEAKER_01: Louis, which is where I taught first, and then moved to DC.
• 7:04
  SPEAKER_01: I was making more money, but they didn't tell me like the cost of living, like basically tripled.
• 7:09
  SPEAKER_01: And so everything has kind of come back to like what are the numbers?
• 7:13
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and I didn't want money to be something that held me back in life.
• 7:18
  SPEAKER_01: So I would say, like, knowing my numbers has helped me.
• 7:21
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, granted, I've had credit card debt, I've done all the like things, I've had student loan debt.
• 7:26
  SPEAKER_01: Um I bought a house before like I was 30 and still had debt.
• 7:30
  SPEAKER_01: Like all the things that kind of they say you shouldn't do, I've done them.
• 7:33
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but when I got out of education, the question came to like if you could do anything for free, what would you do?
• 7:39
  SPEAKER_01: And I was like, help people budget.
• 7:41
  SPEAKER_01: So like I found like what what is that job title of like actually helping people experience like peace of mind when you actually like know your numbers and what you could actually achieve.
• 7:55
  SPEAKER_00: So it sounds like your story is like personal example you like taught yourself.
• 8:01
  SPEAKER_00: I I'm in St.
• 8:01
  SPEAKER_00: Louis too.
• 8:02
  SPEAKER_00: I didn't know we had that connection.
• 8:03
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I know you're not here anymore, but I think that's the best place to come from is like the lived experience.
• 8:11
  SPEAKER_00: You enjoyed budgeting, you used it to help you, and then now you help other people with it.
• 8:16
  SPEAKER_00: So tell us about that pivot or that transition from teaching into coaching.
• 8:20
  SPEAKER_00: What did that look like?
• 8:21
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so um, I should say I was a vice principal, which I like coached in that role.
• 8:26
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and I really enjoyed like seeing people have this aha.
• 8:29
  SPEAKER_01: And you coach kids too, to like I taught math, so you have to teach kids not to fear numbers um because they naturally they fear them because there's some teachers that jacked up the way that they think naturally, but that's a whole different podcast episode.
• 8:42
  SPEAKER_01: Um and so I quit my job in 2018 that summer.
• 8:47
  SPEAKER_01: I had some money and savings, and I was like, great, I'm gonna start a business.
• 8:50
  SPEAKER_01: One of my girlfriends hyped me up and I pressed, you know, whatever, publish on a website.
• 8:57
  SPEAKER_01: Um, what I didn't know is that clients don't just come because you publish a website, but I felt like they should have.
• 9:03
  SPEAKER_01: You know, so it was like filled of dreams.
• 9:05
  SPEAKER_01: If you build it, they'll come, but I didn't see anybody.
• 9:08
  SPEAKER_01: Um and so like my own money story at that time was like I was seeing my savings account like deplete.
• 9:17
  SPEAKER_01: It takes so long to fill it, but it can go so quickly.
• 9:20
  SPEAKER_01: And um, I did contract work in education while I was like building my business.
• 9:24
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and then I ended up going back to work full time, but still building my business at the same time.
• 9:30
  SPEAKER_01: And um in 20, what is this, 2023?
• 9:34
  SPEAKER_01: In 2021, in that January of that year, I left my leadership coaching job and went again, I guess you could say like full time for myself, this time with like some numbers in my business that made sense, some personal numbers that made more sense.
• 9:50
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and I think in 20, what was it, 2020 is the first year that I hit six figures in my business.
• 9:57
  SPEAKER_01: So it like felt better to like actually leave a job and know that I could actually make money doing something that I enjoyed.
• 10:07
  SPEAKER_04: I feel like that's kind of a story that we hear a lot on the podcast of like it's okay to not have like the doors flood with clients as soon as you like hit publish, because like that's actually not normal.
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_04: You know what I mean?
• 10:25
  SPEAKER_04: Like, just because you declare, like, I am now a business owner and I own MariahMagazine.com, like that does not mean that like we're gonna be out here killing it with uh with money and with finances.
• 10:38
  SPEAKER_04: And I think just allowing us to share that transparency is so important because I know that a lot of newer business owners come into this space and they're sold this story of like, make six figures in an hour by blowing your nose.
• 10:51
  SPEAKER_04: And then it's just like, and then they just beat themselves up with this shame of just like shit, it's been three months and I don't have any clients.
• 10:59
  SPEAKER_04: And it's like, I I really like how you use numbers as like a reflection point.
• 11:05
  SPEAKER_04: And like on this podcast, we're always talking about like collecting the data points.
• 11:09
  SPEAKER_04: And it's funny because for me and Shay, that's usually like our feelings, and it's usually like, how do we feel?
• 11:14
  SPEAKER_04: Or like Shay will do um like a future meditation and just like, how did she want her day to look?
• 11:21
  SPEAKER_04: And I'm more just like, How did my day go?
• 11:22
  SPEAKER_04: How do I feel?
• 11:23
  SPEAKER_04: And you're just like, what the fuck did the numbers say?
• 11:25
  SPEAKER_04: And I just think that that it's such like it's a really grounded way to make decisions instead of allowing your emotions to come in and kind of sidestep you.
• 11:36
  SPEAKER_04: And it's not like saying, I guess if you're like shit, I don't have the money for this right now.
• 11:40
  SPEAKER_04: It's not like saying you can never do it.
• 11:42
  SPEAKER_04: It's just like, okay, then how do we game plan in a way that makes sense for you to get the money so that you can do it if that's still a desire?
• 11:49
  SPEAKER_04: So I just really appreciate the fact that like use numbers as a data point.
• 11:53
  SPEAKER_04: You make it a lot more fun already.
• 11:56
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I think it's like for me, numbers are very like solvable.
• 12:00
  SPEAKER_01: They're concrete.
• 12:00
  SPEAKER_01: Like two plus three will always be five.
• 12:03
  SPEAKER_01: You can break it up in different ways, right?
• 12:05
  SPEAKER_01: Like one plus two plus two plus one.
• 12:08
  SPEAKER_01: Or no, that's not right, but one plus two plus two equals five, right?
• 12:12
  SPEAKER_01: But it's like I just love that because it's a it's a picture for me.
• 12:17
  SPEAKER_01: It's like a puzzle, and we can figure out what that next piece is.
• 12:20
  SPEAKER_01: But um, Mariah, you said something about like not making money right away when you start in your business.
• 12:26
  SPEAKER_01: And I feel like I encounter a lot of people who shame themselves if they like can't make it on their own financially.
• 12:35
  SPEAKER_01: And I don't think people realize, like when we're thinking from a number standpoint, how hard it really is to have a business.
• 12:42
  SPEAKER_01: Because a number, like a dollar in your business is not the same as you getting a dollar when you like, oh, I like had a side hustle in my job, right?
• 12:52
  SPEAKER_01: But like you have real expenses as a business owner.
• 12:55
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and so I also like to talk to people about not having shame about working and having and like building a business, like you get to do it your way.
• 13:03
  SPEAKER_01: Um and it's all about like your mindset and how you choose to frame that.
• 13:08
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, you nobody wants to sell from like this graspy place um because you like need money.
• 13:14
  SPEAKER_01: And this is not good.
• 13:18
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I'm curious what advice would you give someone who's in the nine to five, they have the dream to take the leap and go out on their own.
• 13:27
  SPEAKER_00: How, how, how did you personally look at the numbers or what advice would you give someone to look for in the numbers to decide that that's a safe leap?
• 13:35
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so for me, I thought about like, and I'm single, I should say that.
• 13:39
  SPEAKER_01: So like I knew I needed to cover things that like I didn't have a partner to cover.
• 13:44
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and for anyone who's like in a nine to five, at your current job, you have a total value proposition, which is like your offer that you have, plus your healthcare, plus like retirement, like all of these different benefits.
• 13:56
  SPEAKER_01: And for me, I wanted to kind of when I went back to work, I like needed to look at all of that to because I also had anxiety about like, but what about my retirement?
• 14:06
  SPEAKER_01: I'm supposed to be like contributing money there.
• 14:08
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so I calculated, like I made a budget in my business that accounted for, you know, what would it look like if I wanted to contribute to retirement?
• 14:19
  SPEAKER_01: Like what would be my kind of average monthly revenue?
• 14:23
  SPEAKER_01: Um, if I like need to pay for healthcare, what does that look like?
• 14:27
  SPEAKER_01: If I want to pay myself, like and match similarly to like what I was being paid, like what does my average monthly income need to be?
• 14:36
  SPEAKER_01: So for me, once again, going back to the numbers, I was able to play with them in a safe space because I had a guaranteed paycheck.
• 14:43
  SPEAKER_01: But um I could earn like in 2020, it was about like looking towards like can I create five figure months, right?
• 14:52
  SPEAKER_01: If I could do a$10,000 month and kind of get that consistency, I knew I could trust myself to make money.
• 14:59
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and then I built like a three-month reserve to be able to pay myself, be able to pay my expenses, and that gave me a lot of comfort to be able to completely go out on my own.
• 15:12
  SPEAKER_04: How do you not?
• 15:13
  SPEAKER_04: I guess this is just like my personal perspective with finances.
• 15:18
  SPEAKER_04: How do you not allow the numbers to what's the word?
• 15:23
  SPEAKER_04: Like, make you feel kind of boxed in.
• 15:26
  SPEAKER_04: I feel like when I have like a money goal or something like that, it makes me, I guess, just like now I'm only focusing on the money.
• 15:34
  SPEAKER_04: And I feel like I'm like losing the other perspective of the other things that I want to grow in my business.
• 15:40
  SPEAKER_04: It kind of feels like not desperate energy, but it doesn't feel deep enough to motivate me.
• 15:46
  SPEAKER_04: I think that's kind of where I'm coming from.
• 15:48
  SPEAKER_04: So I guess like, how do you, how do you balance both?
• 15:51
  SPEAKER_04: Or like, how would you suggest if you had a client that you're working with and they kind of came to you with that, like, how do we kind of take that apart and maybe reframe it?
• 15:59
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 16:00
  SPEAKER_01: I think it's also like there's a money goal, but that money goal is connected to impact.
• 16:05
  SPEAKER_01: And so for me, like I'm a I would consider myself like a heart-centered business owner.
• 16:10
  SPEAKER_01: I think a lot of the clients that I work with would say the same thing as well.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_01: So if you have a$10,000 month goal, just taking it from there and you charge$5,000 for um, let's just say you charge$5,000 for a client per month.
• 16:27
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, some people may think that's really high, whatever.
• 16:29
  SPEAKER_01: That's a different conversation, right?
• 16:31
  SPEAKER_01: But now you're talking, now you can ground about like in the two people you want to help, and you can be thinking about like what's the transformation you want to provide them.
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_01: What what transformation do you does your service or the product that you have, like what does that create?
• 16:46
  SPEAKER_01: And so I really think about my money goals also attached to value.
• 16:52
  SPEAKER_01: So the money is just like a byproduct of the value that I like actually produce in the world.
• 17:00
  SPEAKER_01: So it's not like I'm like, excuse me, sleazy email, you know, or like like DMing people, but I'm really like values focused.
• 17:09
  SPEAKER_01: Like this morning I was um thinking about like signing my next client.
• 17:14
  SPEAKER_01: And so I'm asking myself, like, what does she need to hear from me?
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_01: Like, what is she struggling with today?
• 17:18
  SPEAKER_01: Like at 1 p.m., like what's gonna be the problem that she's focused on?
• 17:22
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and so like what content do I want to create that answers a question for her, um, that makes her feel safe to actually engage in the work and pull her head out of the sand.
• 17:33
  SPEAKER_01: So for me, it's always coming back to like what my clients need.
• 17:36
  SPEAKER_01: And like I said, the money is just a byproduct of that.
• 17:39
  SPEAKER_01: And I think as you um are in business longer, right?
• 17:43
  SPEAKER_01: Like you have more people that know about you, you have this brand awareness.
• 17:47
  SPEAKER_01: So if you're continually adding to like what one of my coaches calls a value bank, the money is just the byproduct.
• 17:56
  SPEAKER_04: I like that reframe.
• 17:58
  SPEAKER_04: I'm glad that I asked that question because I feel like it just it connected a few points that I feel like I naturally already kind of do, but like I just didn't put money in there.
• 18:07
  SPEAKER_04: Do you know what I mean?
• 18:08
  SPEAKER_04: Of just like getting excited about the transformation, getting excited about like supporting my people in the way that like they need to be supported, essentially, but then also just adding on at the end, and money gets to be a byproduct of that.
• 18:21
  SPEAKER_04: That was really helpful.
• 18:23
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 18:23
  SPEAKER_01: Cause like at some point, I think there are some entrepreneurs that don't have revenue goals, and then I question, like, well, why don't you have a revenue goal?
• 18:30
  SPEAKER_01: Like, and what are your thoughts about that?
• 18:33
  SPEAKER_01: And I think you are kind of uncovering what I think some people would say, like, that's like icky, but it's really like they have thoughts about money or they have thoughts about their ability to create money, which is then mindset work that you as an entrepreneur need to do because you're you're blocking the amount of money that you could be making because your um like your self-concept isn't there.
• 18:58
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 18:58
  SPEAKER_04: And I I think for me personally, like money doesn't feel icky to me.
• 19:02
  SPEAKER_04: It feels confined.
• 19:04
  SPEAKER_04: It feels like I'm not sure.
• 19:08
  SPEAKER_04: It it feels like a container that can only be created through certain means.
• 19:13
  SPEAKER_04: Not that it's icky, but it's like if I get too focused on money, it feels too uh permanent versus like allowing also some like creativity and like flexibility to flow, is kind of my perspective on it.
• 19:28
  SPEAKER_04: But yeah, yeah, I think that that reframe is really helpful, even just adding on like that extra piece there of like, yeah, this is just the fucking byproduct of it.
• 19:38
  SPEAKER_04: Like you get to be creative and like do whatever, like you can fucking do whatever you want to do to make money.
• 19:44
  SPEAKER_04: That's why we own a business to begin with, right?
• 19:46
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, is essentially to be able to share our genius and support our people, and money is a byproduct of supporting our people.
• 19:55
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, you know, one thing, Keena, I've heard you mention a couple of times now, is this idea of safety and building self-trust.
• 20:02
  SPEAKER_00: And I think a lot of times with money in particular, like finding that sense of safety is really important.
• 20:10
  SPEAKER_00: I liked how in your story, when you did that transition, and that's often what I coach people to do, like have if you have the nine to five, let it be your safety net.
• 20:18
  SPEAKER_00: Um, a lot of times I think our brains can't really think higher if we don't have our basic needs taken care of.
• 20:26
  SPEAKER_00: So if you're trying to start a business and you have no income coming in and you're trying to figure out how to wear all these hats, it can really put you in a place of fight or flight.
• 20:35
  SPEAKER_00: And it's hard to make big business decisions and be that new person, that wealthy person when you're in that kind of survival mode.
• 20:43
  SPEAKER_00: So I really, I have really gotten a lot out of establishing safety with myself.
• 20:49
  SPEAKER_00: It was almost like a muscle that I had to build.
• 20:51
  SPEAKER_00: And then along with safety came self-trust that I can rely on myself to show up for myself.
• 20:56
  SPEAKER_00: Um, can you take us through how you work with clients to kind of establish that basic level of safety when it comes to money?
• 21:05
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 21:06
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I mean, I feel like a lot of it's just like around giving people an opportunity to celebrate themselves in like a basic form.
• 21:17
  SPEAKER_01: Um, whether it's like having the safety to have money or the safety to spend money, it's the safety to like create money, whatever that kind of looks like, right?
• 21:28
  SPEAKER_01: Um but I like I'm thinking about one of my clients who constantly tells me, like, I'm never gonna make any money again, and then she like creates a$30,000 a month.
• 21:39
  SPEAKER_01: It's really fascinating.
• 21:42
  SPEAKER_01: And so um, like specifically in our coaching work, like just even going back and like looking at what is working, because I think our brains like to look at like what isn't there, what's not working.
• 21:54
  SPEAKER_01: And we just have to like uh someone calls it, I can't remember the book, but it's like automatic negative thoughts.
• 21:59
  SPEAKER_01: Like our brain.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_01: Are trained to go in that way.
• 22:02
  SPEAKER_01: And so, like gently guiding in a coaching conversation, right?
• 22:05
  SPEAKER_01: Like it's like actually look at the evidence, right?
• 22:08
  SPEAKER_01: Like, what about all of the other like 36 months before this, like one day at 2 p.m.
• 22:14
  SPEAKER_01: because somebody told you no?
• 22:16
  SPEAKER_01: I was like, what's the other evidence?
• 22:18
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and so just like when we were talking about like safety and trust, and I talked about self-concept, I like to help my clients like establish a new financial self-concept.
• 22:29
  SPEAKER_01: So just thinking about asking them, like, even like what would you tell your friend right in this moment?
• 22:35
  SPEAKER_01: Because sometimes we have to have that like out-of-body experience um to be able to guide ourselves, or it could take the form of celebrating your own wins, but looking at what's working and not looking at like what's not working, looking at the tools that you do have um and creating, like, especially, you know, with being in business for yourself, there can be a month where you're like, no, no, no, this month is it does not look good, right?
• 22:59
  SPEAKER_01: But then how do you kind of write out your own protocol for how you're gonna make it through whatever financial season that you're in?
• 23:06
  SPEAKER_01: Because I think that's another piece of make like establishing that safety and that trust.
• 23:12
  SPEAKER_01: Because so much of safety and trust, I think also comes from our thoughts and not just from like the number in the bank account.
• 23:20
  SPEAKER_04: Yes.
• 23:21
  SPEAKER_04: Yes.
• 23:22
  SPEAKER_04: That's so good.
• 23:22
  SPEAKER_04: That's like a that's like a mic draw moment right there.
• 23:25
  SPEAKER_04: That was good.
• 23:25
  SPEAKER_04: That was really good.
• 23:26
  SPEAKER_04: Um, that kind of brings me to another question.
• 23:30
  SPEAKER_04: So, like being a business owner, it's normal to have fluctuating income.
• 23:35
  SPEAKER_04: Even though we'll see people on Instagram that are like, oh my God, I hit this crazy number all the time, and like this is normal.
• 23:42
  SPEAKER_04: Guys, it is normal to have fluctuating income as a business owner.
• 23:45
  SPEAKER_04: Even like big brands have fluctuating income.
• 23:48
  SPEAKER_04: Like, they're you are no less of a business owner because your fucking income fluctuates.
• 23:53
  SPEAKER_04: So I guess that's also another excuse on why I personally, I guess, haven't taken finances as seriously as I want to.
• 24:04
  SPEAKER_04: There is a deep desire for me to do this.
• 24:05
  SPEAKER_04: And so I don't want to use the word should because there is a desire for me to kind of explore this a little bit more.
• 24:11
  SPEAKER_04: But I guess like how or like what advice or insight of just like, how do we create a money plan or a budgeting plan or like account for retirement and all of these other things when like our income fluctuates?
• 24:29
  SPEAKER_01: Um very easy answer.
• 24:31
  SPEAKER_01: So I base everything off of like averages.
• 24:35
  SPEAKER_01: So um let's take like 2022, right?
• 24:38
  SPEAKER_01: If you've been in business for that year and you've made um$120,000, well, on average you made$10,000 a month.
• 24:48
  SPEAKER_01: Some of it could have come with a$15,000 a month, some could have come with a$5,000 a month, but it kind of gives you um a baseline for where you're starting.
• 24:57
  SPEAKER_01: And so I tell people to like look at your average and you can check it every like six months to be like, am I still within this average?
• 25:05
  SPEAKER_01: Am I higher?
• 25:06
  SPEAKER_01: Am I lower?
• 25:07
  SPEAKER_01: Like, but it'll allow you to kind of have at least one data point to make some decisions around.
• 25:13
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but I plan, I like help clients plan off of that average.
• 25:18
  SPEAKER_01: So let's plan how much you want to spend in your business, let's plan how much you want to set aside for investing in your business, saving in your business, taxes, um, paying yourself.
• 25:28
  SPEAKER_01: Like everything is kind of generated off of this average.
• 25:32
  SPEAKER_01: Um and what that's allowed for me, and I would say even for clients, is like for everything to feel very flatlined.
• 25:40
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and it doesn't feel erratic.
• 25:42
  SPEAKER_01: Although your months might be erratic, if you're doing the same thing with your money every month, when you have a lower than average month or a higher than average month, they come back down to this line that balances everything.
• 25:56
  SPEAKER_01: So you can feel like, okay, I can make some projections, I can know whether or not I can hire a team member.
• 26:01
  SPEAKER_01: Can I afford to start a podcast?
• 26:03
  SPEAKER_01: Can I afford to pay myself more?
• 26:06
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but I would say start with like your average amount of revenue that you're making.
• 26:11
  SPEAKER_01: Even if you're just starting out in business, I think it's still good to know those numbers because they're going to increase over time.
• 26:17
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and whatever you start practicing now, you'll practice when you make more money.
• 26:23
  SPEAKER_01: And um just to just to give people like a baseline, like if your average was$10,000, just play around with, okay, if I paid myself 50% of a$10,000 month, like does$5K sound good for my paycheck, right?
• 26:39
  SPEAKER_01: Or um if 30% of that was for expenses, like knowing like, okay, that would give me$3,000 a month to think about like a budget um on what I can spend.
• 26:51
  SPEAKER_01: And then you can think about 20% for taxes and 10% for I'm actually saving in your business.
• 26:57
  SPEAKER_01: So it just gives you this concrete plan, um, even though months feel very different, whether, like I said, higher or lower.
• 27:07
  SPEAKER_00: I really love that you've brought that idea up a couple of times that just because you you hear someone say they made a 10K month doesn't necessarily mean they paid themselves$10,000.
• 27:18
  SPEAKER_00: And most of the time it doesn't.
• 27:19
  SPEAKER_01: And you're they did and then they struggle in other areas.
• 27:23
  SPEAKER_00: You're absolutely right about that.
• 27:25
  SPEAKER_00: It's hard, I think, in the online space, especially, we hear all of these really big, salacious numbers, but they're oftentimes given without context.
• 27:33
  SPEAKER_00: And um, you know, it's not fair to compare the salary you got at your nine to five to what your business makes.
• 27:40
  SPEAKER_00: It's not apples to apples.
• 27:42
  SPEAKER_00: It's like you're saying it's apples to oranges.
• 27:44
  SPEAKER_00: There's a whole bunch more that goes into calculating.
• 27:46
  SPEAKER_00: So I love what you're saying.
• 27:48
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and I'm actually a little taken away or taken aback by the parallels of what you're talking about and the themes that we talk about on this podcast all the time.
• 27:57
  SPEAKER_00: Like Mariah mentioned, we are really the theme of every episode is how are you making time for stillness, stillness to check back in with yourself?
• 28:06
  SPEAKER_00: Where do you have these little moments of intention where you can take a pause to kind of zoom out, see what's going on?
• 28:12
  SPEAKER_00: Like Mariah said, her and I are usually focused more on a bit more ethereal things and feelings, but you're saying the exact same thing about money, which is where do you have these little check-in points to check in with your money?
• 28:25
  SPEAKER_00: Where are you at?
• 28:26
  SPEAKER_00: Where are you headed?
• 28:28
  SPEAKER_00: What are the numbers?
• 28:28
  SPEAKER_00: Do you even know your numbers?
• 28:30
  SPEAKER_00: And for some reason, I avoid that.
• 28:32
  SPEAKER_00: I'm so good about the other check-in points, but I avoid the money stuff.
• 28:36
  SPEAKER_00: So you, I really am feeling encouraged by this idea of like having these little intentional moments of stillness for money.
• 28:43
  SPEAKER_00: And you have this idea around money dates.
• 28:45
  SPEAKER_00: So can you kind of take us into that and how you use the money dates as like a moment of stillness and reflection?
• 28:52
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 28:52
  SPEAKER_01: I'm gonna like put a pin in that if I don't come back to it.
• 28:55
  SPEAKER_01: But you have mentioned your emotions a couple of times, and money is very emotional.
• 28:59
  SPEAKER_01: You're right.
• 29:00
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 29:00
  SPEAKER_01: Like it's so much more than a spreadsheet.
• 29:03
  SPEAKER_01: Like everybody can do elementary math.
• 29:05
  SPEAKER_01: So if you say you're bad with math, that has nothing to do with like why you can't budget.
• 29:10
  SPEAKER_01: I promise you.
• 29:11
  SPEAKER_01: It's your thoughts and it's your emotions, but I feel like you can use the work.
• 29:15
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm not an emotional person.
• 29:17
  SPEAKER_01: Um, hopefully, none of my friends are listening to this that coach me on this.
• 29:20
  SPEAKER_01: Because I have to like, I have to be intentional about beating in my body because I'm like, anyways, there's like some logical way we can solve this while you're over here, like, tell me what color the fear is.
• 29:31
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know what it is, I don't know what it looks like.
• 29:33
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know where it is.
• 29:35
  SPEAKER_04: It doesn't feel sticky, it doesn't feel pointy.
• 29:37
  SPEAKER_04: I just know that I'm fucking pissed off right now.
• 29:40
  SPEAKER_01: Right, we're gonna make it, it's fine.
• 29:43
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but I think like for anybody who maybe is more feelings based, like being able to also ask your yourself the question like, what's happening, what emotions are coming up for you when you start to think about money and where are they coming from?
• 30:00
  SPEAKER_01: And then I think you can also ask yourself how do you desire to feel and even be curious about what's like the what's a win that you could get today that would allow you to generate that feeling?
• 30:12
  SPEAKER_01: Because I think oftentimes people think that when they start looking at their numbers, they're like, oh God, okay, I need to do my QuickBooks, I need to do my back taxes.
• 30:20
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I forgot that other bill, right?
• 30:22
  SPEAKER_01: Like there's like a laundry list of things, which like honestly, it could be like, do I know all the passwords for my bank accounts?
• 30:29
  SPEAKER_01: Like that could be the thing that makes you feel proud in that moment or like accomplished.
• 30:34
  SPEAKER_01: So it's finding that thing for you that's gonna move the needle.
• 30:37
  SPEAKER_01: Because if you can get that feeling of feeling proud or like feeling in control, it's gonna keep you making those like steps forward to where you are going to be genuinely curious to either ask for help or to continue to do the work on your own.
• 30:53
  SPEAKER_01: So I just wanted to say that because you've talked about feelings um and just thinking about how they like really pair with um with like the work that I do, because it is like yeah, it's it's just all really emotional.
• 31:07
  SPEAKER_01: And then um how that translates to money dates, like one of the things I do want people to ask themselves in a money date is like, what's going well?
• 31:16
  SPEAKER_01: It's the simplest question, right?
• 31:18
  SPEAKER_01: And um, and then also thinking about um like if you're if you're doing a money date, which I suggest that you can calendar a time week to week, be 30 minutes.
• 31:28
  SPEAKER_01: Like it doesn't have to be something super long, but you can ask yourself that constant question of what's going well.
• 31:34
  SPEAKER_01: You can ask yourself, um, like how did money move in my business last week or in my personal life?
• 31:40
  SPEAKER_01: Ask yourself, do you agree with the movements or do you disagree with the movements?
• 31:45
  SPEAKER_01: And um, it could be like you didn't realize that you had two quick books, quick books accounts, right?
• 31:50
  SPEAKER_01: Like when you actually go and look at your your transactions or whatever that looks like, or you realize, like, dang, I went out to eat a lot this week, and that's in conflict with my health goals, which is like a different reason for like adjusting why you maybe don't want to spend money eating out.
• 32:06
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and then you can be asking yourself, like, what do I want to do differently in the week ahead?
• 32:12
  SPEAKER_01: So that gives you a decision point to actually be able to plan for how you want to move forward.
• 32:17
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you could put something else on your list that you want to actually address.
• 32:22
  SPEAKER_01: Like maybe you're like, okay, I'm gonna go cancel like three subscriptions, right?
• 32:25
  SPEAKER_01: Like that's what I want to be my win next week.
• 32:27
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and I would say, like, that's just like the minimum that you could do on a money date that has nothing to do with like, let me actually get into a spreadsheet.
• 32:37
  SPEAKER_01: But I would also say as a as a business owner on these money dates, like I'm looking, I like I'm adjusting my spending plan that I have for my business, um, looking at transactions that have gone in and out.
• 32:47
  SPEAKER_01: I can look at my revenue in my business, you know, did everybody pay like they were supposed to, if that's something.
• 32:53
  SPEAKER_01: But like I just use that calendar time um also as a place to know, like that's where all of my financial thoughts live and any money task live.
• 33:02
  SPEAKER_01: So it's not something that has to take up space in my head.
• 33:05
  SPEAKER_01: I can just put it on the calendar and know that I have a time to address it.
• 33:15
  SPEAKER_04: Just wanted to slide in here mid-episode and fill you in on some cool things quick.
• 33:22
  SPEAKER_04: So we are in our third season of Curiously Guided, and there's nothing that fires us up more than making this podcast and hearing all the positive impacts it's having on our listeners.
• 33:33
  SPEAKER_04: Up until this point, this has been a pure passion project.
• 33:37
  SPEAKER_04: But we've got bills and expenses for this podcast, y'all.
• 33:41
  SPEAKER_04: If you have the means and would love to support us in creating new episodes, feel free to head over to curiouslyguided.com slash support to buy us a coffee.
• 33:53
  SPEAKER_00: And if you want even a deeper dive, we're excited to offer.
• 33:58
  SPEAKER_00: We're gonna now um start doing some strategy sessions where you get both Mariah and I's brains on your business.
• 34:06
  SPEAKER_00: And um there's nowhere else in the world where you can we Mariah and I both don't work with people in such micro ways.
• 34:13
  SPEAKER_00: So this is kind of a cool thing to get both of us looking at your business in kind of like a one-off strategy session.
• 34:19
  SPEAKER_00: Just imagine us two and you together diving deeper on your business, marketing sales, and everything in between, um, all while filtering it through the lens of strategy energetics and energetics, which you know is our style.
• 34:33
  SPEAKER_00: So if you want to learn more about what working with Mariah and I could look like, head on over to our website, curiously guided.com/slash session, to get the details.
• 34:42
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you guys so much for hanging out with us.
• 34:44
  SPEAKER_00: We appreciate you so, so much.
• 34:47
  SPEAKER_00: Now let's get back into the episode.
• 34:56
  SPEAKER_04: I'm really glad that you explained that.
• 34:58
  SPEAKER_04: And also it's hilarious what is coming up in my head right now because Shay was like, Oh, like, what do you do for money dates?
• 35:06
  SPEAKER_04: And you're like, every week you should do it.
• 35:08
  SPEAKER_04: And I was like, yo, I thought she was gonna say every fucking six months, and she's telling me every week.
• 35:12
  SPEAKER_04: And I was like, how hilarious that that's where my brain went.
• 35:16
  SPEAKER_04: Because here I'm just used, I'm in the like the um the avoidance area, you know what I mean?
• 35:24
  SPEAKER_04: I'm like, oh, I have my bookkeeper and she sends me my financial statements every quarter, and I spend two minutes scrolling and looking at everything, and like that's my money date for an entire quarter.
• 35:36
  SPEAKER_04: So you're like every week.
• 35:37
  SPEAKER_04: And I was like, Anne called out.
• 35:39
  SPEAKER_04: Okay, cool.
• 35:40
  SPEAKER_01: So for you, maybe it's a shift to even doing it on a monthly basis, like asking her to send me my PL for this month.
• 35:47
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, I think, yeah, I think that that's that's really cool.
• 35:51
  SPEAKER_04: And I'm glad that you said every week, and I'm glad that I noticed the internal reaction in my brain when you said that.
• 35:58
  SPEAKER_04: But I also like when you said what's a win that you can feel today that aligns with how you want to feel, I just wanted to repeat that and just like allow that to sink in because like that is a really great question.
• 36:12
  SPEAKER_04: And like, how awesome that we can make it really actionable and like just a little baby step of just like what's a win that we can celebrate today?
• 36:22
  SPEAKER_04: I think that that's really impactful.
• 36:24
  SPEAKER_04: And what I'm also noticing is the parallels between SEO and like website traffic data.
• 36:34
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, yeah, money and SEO go together.
• 36:36
  SPEAKER_04: Like, and and finances.
• 36:39
  SPEAKER_04: So you're just like, yo, I make my decisions based on the fucking numbers.
• 36:42
  SPEAKER_04: Like it is like this is this, and then we go in and we reflect, and then we're able to make decisions off of other things based on what we did, what we didn't, how it worked, whatever.
• 36:51
  SPEAKER_04: And I'm just over here literally laughing at myself of like, of course, of course it can be looked at the same way.
• 36:58
  SPEAKER_04: Because like I have clients that are like, I don't want to look at my website traffic, like, I don't want to look at my email subscriber list, I don't want to see if we're making any progress from SEO.
• 37:08
  SPEAKER_04: Like, I'm nervous to see, and I'm like, what do you mean?
• 37:10
  SPEAKER_04: Like this is the data point that we get to that we get to look at in order to make decisions moving forward.
• 37:14
  SPEAKER_04: And now you're saying this, and it's just funny because it just it feels like a mirror back to myself.
• 37:21
  SPEAKER_04: So already in this conversation, I'm having just like a whole lot of aha moments.
• 37:27
  SPEAKER_04: Um, but my bookkeeper, when we first started working together, I don't think that she listens to this podcast, thank God.
• 37:33
  SPEAKER_04: But she sent me the book Profit First.
• 37:36
  SPEAKER_04: And in that, I haven't read it.
• 37:38
  SPEAKER_04: It's been three years.
• 37:39
  SPEAKER_04: I haven't fucking read it.
• 37:40
  SPEAKER_04: So if she was like, Did you read it?
• 37:42
  SPEAKER_04: I was like, love it so much.
• 37:44
  SPEAKER_04: Thank you.
• 37:46
  SPEAKER_04: But in the book, I'm pretty sure because I I feel like I looked up Spark notes, like I'm fucking 14 years old, but like I'm pretty sure that they suggest having like four or five business accounts in order to organize things.
• 38:00
  SPEAKER_04: Like, is that something that you tell clients?
• 38:02
  SPEAKER_04: Is that true?
• 38:03
  SPEAKER_04: Like, what is your perspective on that?
• 38:05
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so I feel like I do a modified profit first for my own business and give clients the option to do that as well.
• 38:12
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and I think it works really well for like people have this like natural thing where they like just look at their bank account and that's how they make decisions.
• 38:21
  SPEAKER_01: So like someone long, I can't remember who said this, but like if your money's all in one account, it can feel like gumbo.
• 38:29
  SPEAKER_01: And gumbo's great, you know, if you want everything mixed together.
• 38:33
  SPEAKER_01: But for a lot of people, that gumbo account is sticky for them because they can't clearly see that some of the money is tagged to different things, or they haven't even thought about it being tagged to different things.
• 38:44
  SPEAKER_01: So I do like the multiple accounts because you can clearly set aside money for taxes, you can clearly know what you have for business reserves, right?
• 38:51
  SPEAKER_01: And when a month is lower than expected, and maybe you need to pull some money to like float some expenses or pay yourself, you can have your team account so you know, like, okay, this is the money that I can pay my team.
• 39:03
  SPEAKER_01: So I think for clarity's sake, it's a really great option.
• 39:07
  SPEAKER_01: If you can have your money all in one account, maybe you manage it through a spreadsheet or whatever that looks like for you.
• 39:14
  SPEAKER_01: But one of the principles I teach is like giving every single dollar a name.
• 39:18
  SPEAKER_01: And, you know, if you have$20,000 in your business accounts, I want you to know what that's for because it's going to make you empowered to um make decisions that feel good for you and your business, even if it looks different than the plan that you talked about with yourself last week.
• 39:36
  SPEAKER_01: You're gonna do that from a very intentional decision as a business owner.
• 39:41
  SPEAKER_04: So, how many bank accounts do you think?
• 39:43
  SPEAKER_04: Like I feel like I have like my business bank account, which is like gumbo, and then I have my savings account, which is like a different kind of gumbo.
• 39:53
  SPEAKER_04: So I guess like like that one's chili, and then the other one is gumbo.
• 39:58
  SPEAKER_04: So I definitely have like there's differences, but it's like a fucking Modge Podge, and then I have my personal bank account that it's like I just transfer money to to like pay my personal bills, but it's like I guess do I need another bank account?
• 40:11
  SPEAKER_04: Is it a savings account?
• 40:13
  SPEAKER_04: Is it another checking account for business?
• 40:15
  SPEAKER_04: Like, I guess, like, how would I start being able to sift and organize my gumbo?
• 40:20
  SPEAKER_01: So I think I have six accounts, if I'm not mistaken.
• 40:23
  SPEAKER_01: And I will also say if you are someone, be careful with who you bank with, because a lot of banks like to charge for additional accounts, which I don't subscribe to paying for your money to be held by a bank that's using it to lend to other people.
• 40:36
  SPEAKER_01: Um so like first check and make sure that you're not gonna get like$15 fee per account, like change to another institution.
• 40:44
  SPEAKER_01: But I have an account where like all of my money comes in.
• 40:47
  SPEAKER_01: So all of my invoices hit one account.
• 40:50
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I have a taxes account, savings, um, I have compensation, which is like my pay, and then I have expenses.
• 40:59
  SPEAKER_01: So I think what's five accounts?
• 41:02
  SPEAKER_01: I hope I named all of them.
• 41:04
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I feel like I always miss one, but I definitely have at least five accounts.
• 41:08
  SPEAKER_01: And so with that invoice account, all the money just comes and it sits there.
• 41:13
  SPEAKER_01: And like twice a month, I try not to touch it a lot, but only like twice a month I put it into like an allocation calculator, which is just a Excel form that I made for myself.
• 41:23
  SPEAKER_01: So if I got$10,000 back to that$10,000, I know that like 20% of it I'm gonna put into taxes.
• 41:29
  SPEAKER_01: So I just transfer that$2,000 to the tax account.
• 41:32
  SPEAKER_01: 10% I'm gonna save.
• 41:34
  SPEAKER_01: So I transfer, you know,$1,000 to that account.
• 41:37
  SPEAKER_01: And so all of those accounts just can grow on their own.
• 41:41
  SPEAKER_01: Um and I generally have more than I need in expenses.
• 41:45
  SPEAKER_01: I have more than I need in my compensations account, but I do the same thing with my money all the time.
• 41:51
  SPEAKER_01: So if I once again going back to this idea that if I have a$15,000 month or a$20,000 month, but all of my decisions are made off of a 10K month, then I'm building reserves over time.
• 42:03
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and that's how you know you get in your business, you can get ahead and be like, oh yeah, I have three months of expenses set aside, or I have uh three months of my compensation set aside, or I can see that I'm trending upward and I can afford to pay myself more, or I can't afford to take on a team member, et cetera.
• 42:23
  SPEAKER_04: Super fucking helpful.
• 42:24
  SPEAKER_04: Thank you for that.
• 42:25
  SPEAKER_01: You're welcome.
• 42:25
  SPEAKER_01: And like you could have another account just to throw this in.
• 42:29
  SPEAKER_01: Where I love using additional accounts, like if you're trying to figure out if you can save for a team member, like that could be an account.
• 42:35
  SPEAKER_01: So, like, see if you could make that payment every single month.
• 42:38
  SPEAKER_01: You're like, could I afford to pay somebody three thousand dollars and not feel hurt?
• 42:41
  SPEAKER_01: You can do that for three to six months, and now you have their salary also set aside.
• 42:47
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and it's an easy transition, and you know if you experience any hiccups.
• 42:53
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but it's kind of like saving for a car before before you buy one.
• 42:57
  SPEAKER_01: Like they can't come and repossess it if you don't actually have it, right?
• 43:00
  SPEAKER_01: But like you know, oh yeah, I can make that car payment and I can feel comfortable doing that.
• 43:06
  SPEAKER_00: What I like the most about that, it's getting back to that idea of ebbs and flows, and how do we really steady the ship?
• 43:13
  SPEAKER_00: And I think to your point, one thing I think a lot of business owners forget about is when you have the 20K month, what are you doing with the excess?
• 43:22
  SPEAKER_00: Are you padding your accounts?
• 43:24
  SPEAKER_00: Because you're being honest that in the future there will be an ebb.
• 43:26
  SPEAKER_00: There'll be, I think that we try to avoid that there will be these lows and we only want to think about the highs.
• 43:32
  SPEAKER_00: But really, you can set yourself up for lows during your high months.
• 43:36
  SPEAKER_00: You can set some things aside, but you have to be intentional about that.
• 43:40
  SPEAKER_00: That's a pretty hard and disciplined practice to get into.
• 43:43
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I love what you were saying about.
• 43:46
  SPEAKER_00: I've heard you say this idea of like building finding examples, positive examples.
• 43:52
  SPEAKER_00: I definitely really resonate with that idea of like my brain goes to the negative.
• 43:55
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that that like evolutionarily, right?
• 43:58
  SPEAKER_00: Like our brains are just trying.
• 44:00
  SPEAKER_00: protect us from dying.
• 44:01
  SPEAKER_00: So of course it's gonna look around for all the bad things that could be coming.
• 44:07
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that is probably why a lot of us tend to avoid money.
• 44:11
  SPEAKER_00: But I like your when you start talking about money, my brain immediately goes negative.
• 44:17
  SPEAKER_00: I'm the person that I would celebrate knowing all my passwords, right?
• 44:20
  SPEAKER_00: Like I get when you talked about six accounts, the first thought I had was like how will I remember all the passwords?
• 44:24
  SPEAKER_00: So like that really hangs me up.
• 44:28
  SPEAKER_00: And I like what you're saying about like what is the next small win that you could outline for yourself and then really celebrate that win because I'm a person that like once I get the win, I'm just like, all right, what's what's next?
• 44:40
  SPEAKER_00: But the problem is when you're not celebrating, you're not adding little proof examples to your proof bank.
• 44:45
  SPEAKER_00: And that's how you build confidence, right?
• 44:47
  SPEAKER_00: We're talking about building self-trust, building confidence.
• 44:51
  SPEAKER_00: One of our past guests talks about confidence comes through proof, examples of proof.
• 44:56
  SPEAKER_00: And when you can stack those examples of proof that's how you really build those muscles.
• 45:00
  SPEAKER_00: So it's not fake it or for me it's never been fake until you make it.
• 45:04
  SPEAKER_00: I need the proof.
• 45:05
  SPEAKER_00: So what you're saying is you can go find the proof find the littlest win you can get and celebrate the hell out of it.
• 45:12
  SPEAKER_01: And then that's going to lead to more of the same is that right yes and I can give you an example I was talking to one of my friends and I talk to her about money all the time and she makes seven figures and she was like telling me about all these things and she's like and then I did this and did she's like but you know what Keno my win is like that I'm only paying myself on the like schedule I've identified for myself instead of like taking out owner's draw.
• 45:38
  SPEAKER_01: So for her one of her like goals this week this not this week but this year was to be like I'm going to live within the paycheck I've determined for myself and do quarterly owner straws but like still have a plan for them.
• 45:51
  SPEAKER_01: And so I think like even that as an example is just something like paying attention to like that simple shift like wow I'm not paying myself in between the 15th and the 30th or like the times that I've designated like I can trust myself with my Lenny decisions.
• 46:10
  SPEAKER_04: I think these examples that you're giving are so helpful because like especially if you've avoided thinking about this too much, it feels like really lofty and like it feels far away.
• 46:22
  SPEAKER_04: And I feel like you just giving like practical examples of just like either how you work with money or like your friends or your clients like it just helps really ground it in to be like it doesn't have to like it doesn't have to be this emotional turmoil thing.
• 46:39
  SPEAKER_04: Like you can make decisions from a neutral place because money has the energy that we give it.
• 46:44
  SPEAKER_04: And I think that that's such like a a powerful reframe of just like you can start where you're at and then move and be curiously guided essentially like even with your money of just like okay you have this money day or you've done a check-in maybe you don't like this or you do like this like how do we generate more of what we like and less of what we don't like while also having that that flat line of security and how you do that can be done in so many different ways.
• 47:34
  SPEAKER_01: I mean the first one that comes to mind um I would say is like not saving for taxes which I think that's like a very intro mistake and they don't have a consistent plan to save for taxes especially because you're going back to this idea that your income can fluctuate right it's like you don't know potentially what your tax bill is and so um just like having a system that you can count on to easily um like save for taxes.
• 48:09
  SPEAKER_01: I would say that's one um I think another mistake that people make is um and this one maybe be something like you wouldn't expect is that people are investing in things like as because they think it's like a silver or like magical whatever that word is right and so like not knowing for your like investing basically when you are graspy like for me and I tell my clients this too is like I try to make like a hell yes and a hell no investment list for myself like if I thought about the last year it's like what were my hell yes investments and what are my hell no investments like I don't need to invest in a like static course because I'm not opening it up.
• 48:50
  SPEAKER_01: I still have a Pinterest course somewhere because I thought that that was like the key to get people to come.
• 48:56
  SPEAKER_01: I jinak your course login don't know it.
• 49:01
  SPEAKER_01: And so just like think like knowing for myself like what are the things that I always want to invest in what are the things that I don't want to invest in.
• 49:10
  SPEAKER_01: But also checking in going back to this emotional work you guys talked about like checking in with your thoughts and checking in with how you feel before you actually go and make an investment because sometimes like you already have something that solves the problem.
• 49:23
  SPEAKER_01: You just don't trust um in yourself to be able to get the result that you want.
• 49:28
  SPEAKER_01: And generally right like you're trying to work for more sales um but you probably already have something in your toolkit that will allow you to do that.
• 49:37
  SPEAKER_01: And so I think just like making sure that you're once again not overinvesting because that can also not be financially healthy for your business or just get you into like solution greed um and you're not actually going through the things that you are investing in.
• 49:54
  SPEAKER_01: And then I would say like third, I think that as entrepreneurs make more money, where one of the mistakes is like you're not actually investing into your future.
• 50:04
  SPEAKER_01: Like there's this missed opportunity where people aren't contributing to a retirement account.
• 50:09
  SPEAKER_01: It's not even on their radar.
• 50:11
  SPEAKER_01: And so just like not putting your future self first and creating this habit where you're actually saving like an ASPIRA or a solo 401k.
• 50:21
  SPEAKER_01: But I think the sooner that you can make that a habit, maybe right now it's like$100 a month, right?
• 50:25
  SPEAKER_01: And then it's like oh okay I can do two or three but put that into your financial plan in the same way you put other things into your plan so that you can be this six or seven figure business owner and know that when you are 50 you have the option to work and not living leaving it up to like circumstances that like oh well I'm gonna make so much money in my business which you are however if you don't actually save any of it then what what's that actually going to yield Mariah you made a face yeah yeah girl yeah I made a face it's me it's me over here like yeah I'm gonna be blove of like future me is so set up not because anything that I am doing right now like so funny.
• 51:14
  SPEAKER_04: And that's why honestly like I was that's why I was drawn to your Instagram to begin with because A, I like the way that you explain money and I was just like yo we need to have her on the podcast and it was a little selfish because I was like yo like I need to get schooled for sure on this.
• 51:31
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 51:31
  SPEAKER_04: And I know that our listeners and like it's just it's really helpful information.
• 51:35
  SPEAKER_04: I love the way that you explain it.
• 51:38
  SPEAKER_04: But one thing that you mentioned was the investments and me and Shay have a joke that it's not fucking financially smart.
• 51:46
  SPEAKER_04: But we're just like yo if an investment is under$100, it's basically free.
• 51:50
  SPEAKER_04: Like fuck it.
• 51:50
  SPEAKER_04: We're just like let's get it.
• 51:52
  SPEAKER_04: And I think that especially uh well in the past year I've been a lot more aware of the investments that I made but before that timeframe I was there where I was like everybody else has the answer and I don't have the answer.
• 52:09
  SPEAKER_04: And so I was kind of like looking for these solutions and I would invest and invest and invest and invest in coaches and programs and just investing nonstop because I was like well if I want people to invest in me then I need to invest in me and blah blah blah blah blah and that like I'm not saying that that's like the worst mentality ever, but it also can get real slippery real fucking quick.
• 52:30
  SPEAKER_04: And that was kind of happening to me.
• 52:32
  SPEAKER_04: And it took like some serious wake up calls for myself to be like what the fuck are you doing?
• 52:38
  SPEAKER_04: A you have the answers inside of yourself.
• 52:40
  SPEAKER_04: You're not a dummy like what are you doing?
• 52:43
  SPEAKER_04: Trust in yourself and so that started the whole new fucking chapter.
• 52:47
  SPEAKER_04: But we also had uh somebody on the podcast our girl Topsy and she brought up at the end of her episode about delaying gratification and how that could be really supportive for entrepreneurs and online business owners not only in the mindset arena but like also in the financial space too.
• 53:06
  SPEAKER_04: And so I'm really glad that you kind of um elaborated on that a little bit from that perspective.
• 53:12
  SPEAKER_04: But I do have a question about retirement.
• 53:15
  SPEAKER_04: So like I said you read me to shreds and like I have not really been saving for retirement and I know that I have to and I know that I have to so much so and I got a medium reading I shit you not like four years ago and she was like you expect to be like fucking balling when you're older and you're not saving for retirement.
• 53:36
  SPEAKER_04: So like how the fuck is that gonna happen?
• 53:38
  SPEAKER_04: And I was like yep and I'm gonna avoid this for the next four years gotta go.
• 53:43
  SPEAKER_04: So I guess it's like how do I start doing this like what is in like an IRA?
• 53:48
  SPEAKER_04: I think my bookkeeper mentioned I should probably look into that but I haven't even read the book that she meant like that she physically sent me.
• 53:54
  SPEAKER_04: So it's like is it an IRA and like a 401k to be honest I've never really worked in like a big corporate thing where I had a 401 of this is kind of new to me because I've never been in like that structured benefit package type deal.
• 54:11
  SPEAKER_04: I started my business when I was 22.
• 54:13
  SPEAKER_04: So it's like if I was gonna start doing this now like what do I what do I look for?
• 54:20
  SPEAKER_04: What makes the most sense?
• 54:21
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah um this is where I start to think about like I think everybody needs a financial team and when you think about your financial team it could have a bookkeeper, um an accountant you could have a financial advisor, a financial coach.
• 54:34
  SPEAKER_01: But in any one of those people I'm always looking to see whether or not those people like educate me.
• 54:42
  SPEAKER_01: And like if I ask them questions can they either answer the question or can they point me in the right direction right because I think retirement is like nobody really knows what it is.
• 54:51
  SPEAKER_01: Like everybody's grandmother is living off of pension or some like royalties from like minerals underneath the ground like that's I grew up in Oklahoma and like people like oil and gas I'm like well we didn't have anyone and no one's given reparations.
• 55:04
  SPEAKER_01: So like you know like it's not like these things are happening.
• 55:08
  SPEAKER_01: So I even for myself like rely on having these money conversations with people that I trust.
• 55:14
  SPEAKER_01: Um so one I would say like you could have a conversation with your bookkeeper if she knows a little bit about like opening up a step IRA or solo 401k because the other question you can ask with the bookkeeper and accountant is like thinking about the tax benefits for yourself, um, which is very beneficial because you're like look I'm like saving money and then saving money for myself later.
• 55:40
  SPEAKER_01: But in the act of actually like doing it and making it a priority it comes back to like the numbers in your business.
• 55:47
  SPEAKER_01: So my structure that I use for myself out of the percentage of money that I pay myself I've just decided that 15% of it goes into my SEP IRA.
• 55:58
  SPEAKER_04: What is that a a CEP IRA?
• 56:01
  SPEAKER_01: Yes self-employed yeah oh okay writing that down and um actually I might have lied to you because I think I switched over to a solo 401 after I became an S Corp.
• 56:11
  SPEAKER_01: Don't ask me all the ins and outs Mariah there's like a whole bunch of details online where they're like this makes sense over here and then because like some of it too is also like the other questions you want to ask um that I do know is that um it looks different if you have contractors versus employees because if you get into this space where you have employees potentially you also have to offer them the benefit like just a whole bunch of additional questions you want to ask um which could delay which are important questions though to ask because it could delay you deciding to hire employees versus contractors and like what does that mean in terms of benefits that you have to offer them but there's some like time frame time limit to it.
• 56:53
  SPEAKER_01: Once again talk to an accountant or a financial advisor that can really help you see like what does this mean for me this year?
• 57:02
  SPEAKER_01: What's going to be similar or different in three to five years from now if I have contractors right now what does this mean?
• 57:08
  SPEAKER_01: If I have employees right now what does this mean?
• 57:11
  SPEAKER_01: If I like double my revenue what does this mean?
• 57:14
  SPEAKER_01: And so just really like also they could do backwards um like projections for you where you're thinking about this is the type of lifestyle I want to have and I want to retire at 60.
• 57:26
  SPEAKER_01: And so actually like what would I need to be doing every month to get to this number.
• 57:32
  SPEAKER_01: And also I would say like don't be overwhelmed.
• 57:35
  SPEAKER_01: Like I talk to my financial advisor all the time and I'm like great I'm under earning I get it like I'm just gonna go make more money.
• 57:41
  SPEAKER_01: But it's helpful for me to have that information because I know the target number that I'm working towards and I'm actually getting ready to interview a financial advisor on my podcast because what's also true about retirement is like retirement isn't an age, it's a number that's helpful.
• 58:00
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 58:04
  SPEAKER_00: Wow I'm like sitting here trying to just like wrap my head around all that wisdom that you just shared that was so um good and I so I have I really appreciate your attitude and perspective on all of this because I also have a financial advisor and when I get those numbers I go into a shame spiral I'm like oh I'm under earning I'm gonna be living under a bridge an older person.
• 58:29
  SPEAKER_00: You're gonna have lots of friends beside you don't you worry and and it's silly because like you said a lot of this is all abstract we're planning for some future state that doesn't even exist.
• 58:40
  SPEAKER_00: And so hearing your attitude of like when you get fine when you talk to your financial advisor it's positive.
• 58:45
  SPEAKER_00: It's like oh okay I'll just I'll go out and try to earn some more this is just a data point that I can kind of tweak my actions on now.
• 58:52
  SPEAKER_00: I don't have to go into existential my life's falling apart mode which I think is my MO.
• 58:58
  SPEAKER_00: So I just really appreciate like Maria said you have this really nice new neutrality to the way that you're approaching money to like maybe in the past I have some old negative stories around all of this stuff and it's just data right it's feelings that that connection was awesome.
• 59:14
  SPEAKER_00: You've also how does that make you feel how do you want to feel when you have that much money like money is emotion it's emotionally driven sales are emotionally driven it's all emotion.
• 59:24
  SPEAKER_00: So like I think that this whole conversation has been really cool in a way that I wasn't expecting Mariah and I are not emotional people by life.
• 59:33
  SPEAKER_00: We're now we are as adults trying to explore this world.
• 59:37
  SPEAKER_00: So we're both very logical strategic thinkers and I really like how you're able to bridge the gap between those two things because I think it's really really insightful.
• 59:46
  SPEAKER_00: The last bit I wanted to touch on I really appreciated what you shared about the three common things you see new business owners making mistakes.
• 59:54
  SPEAKER_00: I agree with all of those.
• 59:56
  SPEAKER_00: I think that idea of solution greed is a trap that I have fallen into like Mariah was saying feeling like I don't have the answers and I have to go outsource blah blah blah.
• 1:00:05
  SPEAKER_00: Oh the the one thing I was wondering if you would mention how do you approach pricing with clients when clients say to you I don't know how to price my services I have a feeling I know what your answer is but like where do you start with that?
• 1:00:17
  SPEAKER_01: Oh what's my answer?
• 1:00:19
  SPEAKER_00: You got to check the numbers oh that's not my answer.
• 1:00:26
  SPEAKER_01: I mean maybe we do at some point but I I mean it really depends on the person.
• 1:00:32
  SPEAKER_01: I think for some people it's just getting them to say a price to someone right and being able for them to get the dopamine hit that someone else says yes to them.
• 1:00:40
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 1:00:41
  SPEAKER_01: I'm actually working I have a client who's actually another financial coach and she's like I want to charge what you charge.
• 1:00:48
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like okay but you also have to be able to say the price that I charge without gagging.
• 1:00:53
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 1:00:53
  SPEAKER_01: And like so I can tell you in the beginning when I was charging like someone the first offer I made to someone was like I'll work with you for two hours for$100 and then they told me no and I was like okay well how about$50 right like everybody kind of starts in that space.
• 1:01:10
  SPEAKER_01: So I think for pricing depending on where people are in their business I think it's also like what's a number that you feel comfortable with and not to mistake comfort for like oh my goodness um I hope somebody pays me or I don't want to charge too much because I think that you have to make sure you're like not in somebody else's pockets but thinking about um what's a number that you can say confidently like if you look at your client's results you're like no this is like totally worth this investment for my best client.
• 1:01:42
  SPEAKER_01: And I think you also have to be thinking about who's your best client and sometimes you're not even your own best client.
• 1:01:48
  SPEAKER_01: I have a friend who like does like luxury stationery.
• 1:01:51
  SPEAKER_01: She's like I am by no way like my ideal client because I wouldn't pay this but she knows for them like the value of having this like invitation that's a one of a kind and so she prices accordingly but I think it's definitely thinking about for yourself um what's a number that feels good.
• 1:02:10
  SPEAKER_01: But then if we were checking the numbers like I figured out I can't charge people a hundred dollars if I want to replace my salary like I'm gonna have to work with the entire world right and so that's kind of like a good gut check for yourself where you're like okay I'm probably priced a little bit too low and I need to um increase my price.
• 1:02:31
  SPEAKER_01: And so uh also running your numbers that way to say like you know if I am charging people$500 and I want to make um my goal is making$5,000 a month like how many people do I need to work with?
• 1:02:43
  SPEAKER_01: Like what would my calendar look like?
• 1:02:45
  SPEAKER_01: What would my time look like?
• 1:02:46
  SPEAKER_01: And asking yourself is that how I want to earn that money because I think that also makes you think about what your offers are.
• 1:02:56
  SPEAKER_04: That was really helpful for me like a year ago I think somebody told me I was in some some coaching thing and somebody else asked the question of like how do I price something and they were like pricing is fucking personal.
• 1:03:09
  SPEAKER_04: Like what I price for my stuff like I feel confident in my pricing but I've also done the work to feel confident in my pricing.
• 1:03:17
  SPEAKER_04: And that's why when you're starting off in business usually you're more likely to lowball because it's like I don't feel confident charging anything myself, let alone X amount of money.
• 1:03:27
  SPEAKER_04: And I remember I got into the industry doing website design and development and I sold my first custom coded WordPress website sold that for$800 and I was jumping up and down like holy fuck 22 year old me made$800 when before I was just making like seven dollars an hour.
• 1:03:51
  SPEAKER_04: And now I was like I ain't fucking touching a website for anything less than five grand get the fuck out of here and that ain't even custom that's like semi custom I'll swap out your colors type shit.
• 1:04:03
  SPEAKER_04: You know what I mean?
• 1:04:04
  SPEAKER_04: But it's because like I've been in this process of learning and really fine tuning my craft um the the one question that I kind of want to dive into before we wrap up here and we mentioned this on our coffee chat that we had a few weeks ago but I have the perspective in terms of putting prices on websites.
• 1:04:25
  SPEAKER_04: So like my perspective is like if I want to be transparent about money, I'm gonna put my prices on my website.
• 1:04:33
  SPEAKER_04: Also my thing is like I don't want people guessing about my pricing.
• 1:04:38
  SPEAKER_04: I like people to be able to look at the price and be like I can't afford that I can't afford that.
• 1:04:42
  SPEAKER_04: And that kind of weeds out people where I don't have to keep hopping on consult call after consult call.
• 1:04:48
  SPEAKER_04: But I know Keena, you and Shay both don't have pricing on your website.
• 1:04:54
  SPEAKER_04: So I'm just curious about your guys's perspective.
• 1:04:57
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah I mean I've I've done well I've never actually had it on my website I've had it on like my intake form at a time but I will say that honestly my thought when I had it on there was like people know the price then they would just be a yes which is not true.
• 1:05:12
  SPEAKER_01: And I think we talked because you were telling me about your pricing transparency and I was like you know I don't have my price anywhere I can raise my hand.
• 1:05:21
  SPEAKER_01: But um I definitely think I get more people on calls with me because of it.
• 1:05:27
  SPEAKER_01: But I see like I do 60 minute consults with people and are they free consults?
• 1:05:34
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah they are um so my idea especially with talking about money people have a lot of thoughts about money and so if I can get them on a consult, we actually get to dive into like okay what are your challenges and like how can we actually make a plan so you can afford this or talk through how you want to invest in it.
• 1:05:55
  SPEAKER_01: But in the same breath like if somebody asks me my price, I'm not like no you can't know it.
• 1:06:00
  SPEAKER_01: I will talk about my price.
• 1:06:02
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but yeah, I just made a decision, I think I can't remember how many years ago now.
• 1:06:08
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but I just tell people my price on the console.
• 1:06:12
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm pretty good at sales, so people are like, yep, I'll pay you.
• 1:06:16
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, I like that perspective.
• 1:06:18
  SPEAKER_04: I mean, it's helpful also a 60-minute console.
• 1:06:21
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 1:06:22
  SPEAKER_01: That's a that's a long console.
• 1:06:24
  SPEAKER_01: And I tell people, like, if you get on a console, I like and people tell me they're like, this feels like therapy.
• 1:06:30
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, yeah, it's kind of what coaching feels like, but they get a taste of like what the experience is gonna be.
• 1:06:36
  SPEAKER_01: And I like to leave space for the emotions and things coming up.
• 1:06:42
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I have people cry, like all of these things because money is just something that's really personal.
• 1:06:48
  SPEAKER_01: And so um the 60 minutes, I actually was at 45 minutes, and then I just moved it to 60 in in January.
• 1:06:57
  SPEAKER_04: I'm glad that we're giving like what a beautiful example, another example of like you can do business any way you want to.
• 1:07:04
  SPEAKER_04: Truly, like you you don't have to like stay by the standard.
• 1:07:07
  SPEAKER_04: Some people are like, don't go longer than a 10-minute consult, don't go longer than a 17-minute consult.
• 1:07:13
  SPEAKER_04: And you're just like, that doesn't fucking feel good for me.
• 1:07:15
  SPEAKER_04: So, like, I'm gonna do 60 minutes where I have the space to actually like flush this out with my people, especially if you're gonna be in like a longer coaching container with them.
• 1:07:25
  SPEAKER_04: You want to be able to know.
• 1:07:26
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and I'm asking, like, I charge$8,000 for five months.
• 1:07:30
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm asking you to make an investment.
• 1:07:34
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 1:07:35
  SPEAKER_01: And I want you to feel safe and I want you to feel taken care of.
• 1:07:39
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and like some people find me on Google and I don't know what yes, I think I have great copy, I think I have great testimonials, but like 10 minutes I don't think is enough to establish like I feel like money is so like people are so overwhelmed and very shameful about it, right?
• 1:07:59
  SPEAKER_01: It's like I the analogy I always use is I feel like it's like showing somebody your underwear drawer and you're like, no, don't look at those, look at these, right?
• 1:08:06
  SPEAKER_01: And so I I really want people to have an experience, even if they don't work with me, to have this experience to be like, wow, I've never talked about money and felt safe and felt like this was like something that I could do.
• 1:08:19
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and I would say like that is something that I whether people choose to work with me or not, like that conversation they have with me definitely changes um where they'll end up.
• 1:08:30
  SPEAKER_01: And yeah, there's just a lot of sensitive matters.
• 1:08:33
  SPEAKER_01: Like one of my clients that I'm thinking of right now, um, last year she was like just going through a divorce, and she was like, You're the first person that's like ever told me that like it's going to be okay.
• 1:08:44
  SPEAKER_01: But like that came through sitting on a call with her, you know, for 45 minutes and her being able to say, like, dang, I am gonna be okay.
• 1:08:52
  SPEAKER_01: And so we're getting ready to work together a year, and she's like doubled or again this year, and so she's like doubled her salary, like all those things.
• 1:08:59
  SPEAKER_01: So for the 45 minutes, like I'm totally fine with that.
• 1:09:03
  SPEAKER_01: Um, especially know that knowing the results that my clients are gonna get.
• 1:09:07
  SPEAKER_04: I got chills with that example.
• 1:09:09
  SPEAKER_04: That's deep shit.
• 1:09:11
  SPEAKER_04: That like you don't even assume when you're just like, oh, I'm looking for a financial coach so they can tell me how much to put in my what do we an S E S E P I R A.
• 1:09:20
  SPEAKER_04: You know what I'm saying?
• 1:09:22
  SPEAKER_04: It's so much deeper than that.
• 1:09:24
  SPEAKER_04: And then Shay, I just uh for the conversation, what's your perspective on putting prices on websites?
• 1:09:31
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I am with you, Kina.
• 1:09:33
  SPEAKER_00: I'm very anti of not anti, if you want to put it on there, put it on there.
• 1:09:38
  SPEAKER_00: That's great.
• 1:09:38
  SPEAKER_00: But um, I think it depends on your industry and your target client and also your price point, right?
• 1:09:44
  SPEAKER_00: Like in Kina's example, she's asking, it's a pretty uh sizable investment, right?
• 1:09:49
  SPEAKER_00: So you have to establish trust and safety somehow.
• 1:09:53
  SPEAKER_00: And it's hard to do that, that you're taking people from cold stranger to give me$8,000 in almost six, like zero to 60, right?
• 1:10:02
  SPEAKER_00: So I think it's really savvy what you're saying and wonderful.
• 1:10:06
  SPEAKER_00: I'm all about sales, but creating safety in some kind of sales container is the most powerful thing you can do.
• 1:10:13
  SPEAKER_00: And I think the sign of a best salesperson is someone who's able to detach from their agenda and just show up in support of someone.
• 1:10:22
  SPEAKER_00: I'm just here to support you right now.
• 1:10:24
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not, if you work with me, great, if you don't work with me, great.
• 1:10:27
  SPEAKER_00: This is a free offering.
• 1:10:28
  SPEAKER_00: And I love that idea of like being able to provide offering and value in your business, but I think that's a really just smart sales move as well.
• 1:10:36
  SPEAKER_00: Um, for me in my industry, I'm selling creative a lot and high, high-ticket creative.
• 1:10:42
  SPEAKER_00: And so there's a lot of, there's a lot of you could go to Fiverr and get really cheap creative.
• 1:10:47
  SPEAKER_00: You could go to LA and hire the most expensive agency on the block and have it for really expensive.
• 1:10:51
  SPEAKER_00: And there's people that want all styles.
• 1:10:54
  SPEAKER_00: And so for me, everything we do is a la carte and I need to understand you and your situation.
• 1:10:59
  SPEAKER_00: I almost think of myself like a doctor, and you're coming into me.
• 1:11:02
  SPEAKER_00: I need to understand you and your situation before I can scope out a project for you that I think fits your situation, right?
• 1:11:08
  SPEAKER_00: So I also need to explain to you that like what we do is a little different than what they do on Fiverr.
• 1:11:14
  SPEAKER_00: So this is why you should maybe consider paying a little bit more for um this investment you're about to make.
• 1:11:19
  SPEAKER_00: So like there's a conversation that has to happen for me to give you a bid that I think serves you well.
• 1:11:25
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so that's why I don't have, I'll give a range on my form.
• 1:11:30
  SPEAKER_00: Sometimes I'll say like an average price is in this range because I do like we have a floor.
• 1:11:35
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I do want to do some of that pre-qualifying when people are coming in.
• 1:11:39
  SPEAKER_00: I can't be on the phone all day with people.
• 1:11:41
  SPEAKER_00: I definitely get that, Mariah, but I do like to have the conversation and um it allows me, I feel like, to show up better.
• 1:11:48
  SPEAKER_00: And like Hina was saying, it's my chance to screen them as well.
• 1:11:52
  SPEAKER_00: I I'm also evaluating them if I think we're gonna be a good fit to work together.
• 1:11:57
  SPEAKER_00: So I really like having the conversation um live like that.
• 1:12:01
  SPEAKER_00: I like that whole flow and then talking about what price for them makes sense at the end of that conversation works really well for me.
• 1:12:08
  SPEAKER_00: So that's long story short, why I don't have prices on my website.
• 1:12:12
  SPEAKER_04: Thank you so much.
• 1:12:13
  SPEAKER_04: I appreciate everybody's perspective here.
• 1:12:18
  SPEAKER_04: It's just another example of like we get to do business anyway that feels good.
• 1:12:22
  SPEAKER_04: And if like you choose one way right now, tomorrow I could go and take all the prices off my website, or I could tomorrow go ahead and put the prices on my website.
• 1:12:30
  SPEAKER_04: I just always enjoy giving the the transparent what and whys behind the decisions that we make in our business.
• 1:12:38
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and to your point, Mariah, and what Kina said, if someone asks me, tell me your prices, I don't want to talk, I'll tell them.
• 1:12:44
  SPEAKER_00: I'll give them a range, I'll say on average, maybe this will be this for you, maybe this will be this for you, but I really can't say for sure.
• 1:12:50
  SPEAKER_00: So I don't, I don't try to hide it as like a manipulation tactic, which is a tack, a sales tactic for sure.
• 1:12:57
  SPEAKER_00: It's more of like incise support, but I like what you're saying.
• 1:13:00
  SPEAKER_00: Like, do it however feels good for you and your people.
• 1:13:03
  SPEAKER_00: And to Kina's point, at the end of the day, you have to get up and say that stuff with confidence.
• 1:13:07
  SPEAKER_00: So, does it make you feel like more confident when you have those prices on your website?
• 1:13:11
  SPEAKER_00: Do it.
• 1:13:12
  SPEAKER_00: You know, like whatever makes you feel good and you can deliver things with a really solid, grounded place.
• 1:13:17
  SPEAKER_00: I think that's the strategy you should go with.
• 1:13:20
  SPEAKER_01: I would agree to that.
• 1:13:22
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I wanted to respond, Mariah, to something that Shay said earlier.
• 1:13:25
  SPEAKER_01: We were talking about retirement.
• 1:13:27
  SPEAKER_01: Um I can't remember the exact, I just wrote retirement on my paper.
• 1:13:31
  SPEAKER_01: I didn't take as good as notes as you do, but um, we were just talking about, oh, we were talking about how it feels like daunting.
• 1:13:37
  SPEAKER_01: And for me, knowing like where I am versus where I desire to be, especially now knowing that I can make money outside of a nine to five, has really made me think about like what additional streams of income do I desire to create.
• 1:13:53
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and I think if I didn't know, like I think my retirement, my financial advisor has said, like, I need like$3 million, right?
• 1:14:00
  SPEAKER_01: And so if I didn't know that number or know what that actually looks like, I can't solve for it right now.
• 1:14:06
  SPEAKER_01: Like it would be too late if I'm asking at like 58.
• 1:14:10
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so I'm using it as like creativity for myself to be like, okay, well, my business could do this.
• 1:14:16
  SPEAKER_01: I could think about real estate, you know, like there's other streams of income.
• 1:14:20
  SPEAKER_01: So it's an empowering step for me and a problem I get to solve versus um feeling really stressed out by that.
• 1:14:29
  SPEAKER_01: But like that's that's even how I like to like do work with clients.
• 1:14:33
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, once you look at the numbers, then you actually know like you're over here making a lot of assumptions, but now you don't need to make assumptions.
• 1:14:39
  SPEAKER_01: You can actually say, like, here's the next thing I want to work on, or here's like, here's how I close this bridge.
• 1:14:45
  SPEAKER_01: Um, or maybe like the thought I had, it's not even a real thing.
• 1:14:48
  SPEAKER_01: Like I can do more than I actually expected.
• 1:14:51
  SPEAKER_01: But if you're just like spiraling, nobody's nobody's winning.
• 1:14:56
  SPEAKER_00: Retirement planning is an act of creativity.
• 1:14:59
  SPEAKER_00: That's such a good reframe.
• 1:15:01
  SPEAKER_00: That's amazing.
• 1:15:02
  SPEAKER_00: How can I be creative and figure out this problem?
• 1:15:04
  SPEAKER_00: That that was what I needed to hear.
• 1:15:06
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you so much.
• 1:15:09
  SPEAKER_00: Um, okay, awesome.
• 1:15:10
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I think we're gonna start wrapping this episode up.
• 1:15:12
  SPEAKER_00: Akina, before we end, one question we ask all of our guests is what has been sparking your own curiosity lately.
• 1:15:22
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so my curiosity right now is in investing in real estate.
• 1:15:27
  SPEAKER_01: I have I have a coach, but I also have zero idea what I'm doing.
• 1:15:33
  SPEAKER_01: And so um that's actually something that I'm like really interested in learning more about because um I've decided I need to live in a two-income household.
• 1:15:42
  SPEAKER_01: And so the real estate's gonna be the second source of income.
• 1:15:47
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and so just also thinking about like for me, one of the goals that I have is like to be able to position and think about like generational wealth.
• 1:15:57
  SPEAKER_01: Um and I have a ton of nieces and nephews, but I think about how cool it could be if they live in a city and go to college somewhere and they like have access to a property that gives them a little bit step ahead because they're not having to pay for rent or some other thing, right?
• 1:16:13
  SPEAKER_01: That uh is a financial burden to them actually being able to start whatever life they want to lead at like 18 or 22.
• 1:16:23
  SPEAKER_00: I love that.
• 1:16:25
  SPEAKER_00: Um do you have any thoughts on what your first re uh real estate investment?
• 1:16:31
  SPEAKER_00: Are you gonna do like a multifamily or like have you made it that far yet?
• 1:16:34
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so I've been like right now, I've just been like looking at properties with um a realtor.
• 1:16:41
  SPEAKER_01: And right now I'm looking at these two properties where I'm like, I need to go and I need to like make some money because they're like$500,000, but they are multifamily properties.
• 1:16:51
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, but I can see like the potential in these.
• 1:16:54
  SPEAKER_01: So my brain, going back to numbers, I'm like, mm-mm, I can figure this out.
• 1:16:57
  SPEAKER_01: This is a math problem.
• 1:16:59
  SPEAKER_01: We're gonna see how it's gonna work.
• 1:17:01
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but the goal would be to like potentially buy something like a a duplex where I can rent out both sides.
• 1:17:08
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and the other goal is to make sure that it's cash flowing, basically from like day one of me signing a mortgage.
• 1:17:16
  SPEAKER_01: But yeah, it's I've also been told like I could have to look at I could have to make a hundred offers or look at a hundred properties.
• 1:17:22
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm having to exhibit patience um at the same time.
• 1:17:26
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, I I think that's a great I'm also I've been a landlord since 2014.
• 1:17:32
  SPEAKER_00: I've also wanted to have another uh income source with real estate.
• 1:17:36
  SPEAKER_00: And I think your point about being patient is really well received because it is a it's more of a slow game.
• 1:17:42
  SPEAKER_00: I do think it's a great vehicle for building wealth um in a lot of other things.
• 1:17:47
  SPEAKER_00: But yeah, definitely t take your time with it.
• 1:17:49
  SPEAKER_00: Uh it's something to let your curiosity bloom and explore a bunch of options because it's all really about timing.
• 1:17:55
  SPEAKER_00: Like, can you be at the right place at the right time?
• 1:17:57
  SPEAKER_00: And be clear on what you're looking for and be intentional on why.
• 1:18:02
  SPEAKER_00: So I love to hear all of that.
• 1:18:03
  SPEAKER_00: That's certainly where my curiosity goes most days.
• 1:18:06
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but before we log off here, how I can't wait to follow you.
• 1:18:11
  SPEAKER_00: Tell us how we can stay in touch with you.
• 1:18:13
  SPEAKER_00: Tell us how we can learn more.
• 1:18:15
  SPEAKER_00: Do you have any freebies for us?
• 1:18:16
  SPEAKER_00: How can our audience kind of get connected with you?
• 1:18:18
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so I'm on Instagram at Wealth Overnow.
• 1:18:22
  SPEAKER_01: And you can find my website at wealthovernow.com.
• 1:18:25
  SPEAKER_01: I also have a podcast called Money Files.
• 1:18:28
  SPEAKER_01: So if you've enjoyed this conversation, you're like, she's not scary in telling me to give up my latte.
• 1:18:33
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I do a weekly episode.
• 1:18:35
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and then you can also grab, if you are a business owner, I have like a free template that you can like start looking at your business expenses, um, start thinking about, you know, how much do you need to be paying yourself based off of the expenses that are in alignment with your household?
• 1:18:52
  SPEAKER_01: And you can go to um actually don't ask me the website address.
• 1:18:57
  SPEAKER_01: That's terrible.
• 1:18:57
  SPEAKER_01: Um, just link it in your show notes.
• 1:18:59
  SPEAKER_01: You can link it.
• 1:18:59
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, nobody can like it.
• 1:19:01
  SPEAKER_01: I think there's a hyphen somewhere.
• 1:19:04
  SPEAKER_01: Let me not take a deep breath and fail at that date.
• 1:19:08
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, no worries, no worries.
• 1:19:10
  SPEAKER_04: So yeah, we are going to put a link to all of those in the show notes.
• 1:19:15
  SPEAKER_04: So Keena's podcast, that template that she has that I'm about to go and download to as soon as she sends over that URL.
• 1:19:23
  SPEAKER_04: And uh you can follow along with her on Instagram.
• 1:19:27
  SPEAKER_04: We will put the link to our website and to her Instagram in the show notes.
• 1:19:32
  SPEAKER_04: But I think we're gonna close this episode down.
• 1:19:34
  SPEAKER_04: If you guys enjoyed this episode, feel free to screenshot it, share it on Instagram, tag all of us.
• 1:19:41
  SPEAKER_04: If something really popped out to you, or if you have a question for any of us, definitely DM us on Instagram.
• 1:19:48
  SPEAKER_04: We really love connecting with you.
• 1:19:50
  SPEAKER_00: And as always, thank you so much for listening and for your support.
• 1:19:54
  SPEAKER_00: If you haven't already, subscribe to the podcast and leave us a review so we can all go together.
• 1:19:59
  SPEAKER_00: And until next time, remember that you have the power to create whatever the hell you want.
• 1:20:03
  SPEAKER_00: Follow the nudge, ask questions, and let curiosity guide the way.
• 1:20:07
  SPEAKER_00: We'll see you in the next episode.