Latest / Love Conquers Fear / #38: What Extreme Environments Can Teach Us About Courage, Curiosity, and Safety – Sam Cossman

Transcript

#38: What Extreme Environments Can Teach Us About Courage, Curiosity, and Safety – Sam Cossman · Love Conquers Fear

0:00
You know, I had a lot of feelings while I was down in
0:01
this environment. You know, some of these projects
0:03
would last well over a month where we essentially lived
0:05
inside the volcano for extended periods of time.
0:07
I remember a feeling in between the moments of like exhilaration
0:10
and fear. Of course, all of those things.
0:13
You are a speck. You're very acutely reminded of
0:16
that in a place like that, inside the earth, looking out,
0:19
there was a oneness in that, you know, something very profound.
0:22
There was a sense of gratitude, not just being among the few
0:25
people to stand in a place like that, but also just to be alive,
0:28
because you're very reminded of the fragility of your life when
0:31
you're in a place like that. Welcome back everybody to the
0:36
Love Conquers Fear podcast. I'm going to give a short intro
0:40
this time gave gave the long one last time of all the different
0:44
things going on. One of the things that I'm doing
0:47
here in 2026 with my theme being embodiment is I mentioned I'd be
0:54
revisiting my favorite books of 2025.
0:57
I read probably over 55 books in 2025.
1:01
Really all these amazing books on AI, consciousness,
1:05
spirituality, quantum physics, and some other topics as well.
1:09
Some couple of novels. As you know, I've talked about
1:11
Dan Brown's The Secret of Secrets on here.
1:14
I'm diving back into The Seat of the Soul by Gary Zhukov and
1:19
that's a spiritual classic. The forward to that is written
1:23
by Oprah Winfrey for the 25th anniversary, and Gary Zhukov
1:28
also writes a new Ford for the 25th anniversary.
1:31
And and it's just a amazing book.
1:34
And and it's a really interesting one to think about
1:37
right now because, you know, the world is in a state where
1:41
there's a lot of focus on external power.
1:43
You know, as I've covered in this podcast many times before,
1:48
you know, we have around 50 times the amount in the world of
1:52
nuclear weapons that it would take to destroy all medium to
1:56
large sized cities in the world, send the world into a nuclear
1:59
Holocaust for a decade, darken the skies and kill, you know,
2:04
billions and billions of humans and untold numbers of animals as
2:10
well. And this is a time in the world
2:14
where there's a lot of focus on this external power.
2:18
And the sea of the soul is all about cultivating authentic
2:23
power, which comes from evolving beyond the five sensory human,
2:29
as he calls it, into multi sensory human.
2:33
And it really dives deep on leading from the heart, the
2:38
shift that's undergoing in our evolution.
2:41
You saw an episode that I did with Chris Baish where we talked
2:46
about the shift underway right now evolutionarily with
2:52
humanity. And, you know, a lot of these
2:55
books really sync well with each other because I think there is a
2:58
universal truth. So I would very much encourage
3:01
you. You know, Carrie Sue Cobb was a
3:03
recluse living in the forest, didn't even have a, you know,
3:10
ATV. And Oprah Winfrey was so moved
3:13
by his book that she found out how to get a hold of him and
3:19
ultimately, you know, gave him a huge audience.
3:23
He became very popular after being on her show.
3:26
I think. I think she said it was
3:27
something like 36 times and it really changed her entire life.
3:32
And I'll tell you, it'll change your life too.
3:34
If you embody what's in that book, then it'll help you have a
3:40
heart shift. And it's written by a guy that
3:42
would consider to be a real prophet.
3:44
You know, one of my goals here in 2026 is just like I had Chris
3:48
Bache on the podcast as as someone who I had read his book
3:53
twice last year. I'm reaching out to Gary Zukov
3:58
and we'll see what happens there, right?
3:59
It's a stretch, but you never know.
4:02
And there are a lot of people in the spirituality space that are
4:08
hoping that business and capitalism will also have the
4:12
hardship needed so that we make it to this age of abundance for
4:15
all. So I promise to keep this short.
4:18
I'm going to dive right in. I've got a guest today that is
4:24
one of the great entrepreneurs that Deborah and I have invested
4:27
in via our family office. And he is a really extraordinary
4:33
human being with extraordinary story that got him to be doing
4:38
what he's doing today. So welcome.
4:39
Sam Kosman. Thank you so much, Brett.
4:41
Yeah, great to be here with you. What?
4:42
What an honor to have you here. It's, it's wonderful to be here
4:45
and, and I, I love the work that you're doing and I and I'm, I'm
4:50
grateful to be in your orbit. So thank you for having me on.
4:53
Well, I, I, I knew that Deborah and I needed to invest in you
4:58
when, when I ultimately found out what you're doing with
5:01
firefighters to really not just save their lives, but save the
5:04
lives of the people that they're trying to save.
5:07
And so you have a very, in a very incredible way that you
5:13
that you got to that. Why don't we start back at
5:17
volcano diving? It's, it's a, it's kind of hard
5:20
to believe that you did that and that you're sitting here alive
5:23
in front of me today. And I know that that was kind of
5:26
a viral moment for you back in the day.
5:29
Yeah. And people, people ask me that
5:31
question a lot. They they are curious to know
5:34
why would one would even find themselves in in the heart of an
5:37
active volcano and what would compel someone to do that.
5:40
And it's interesting, I would say at the core of it, the
5:43
answer to that lies with just a very, you know, human quality,
5:47
which is curiosity. And that's something that, of
5:50
course, as a, as someone who's now 44 years old is evolved, you
5:55
know, in terms of the, the quality itself.
5:57
But I had that since I was a kid.
6:00
I grew up in and in Georgia on some land, and I have a twin
6:04
sister. So she and I would often find
6:06
ways of entertaining ourselves and our childhood, which usually
6:09
involved exploring the, you know, the woods behind our
6:12
house, finding little things to float on and floating down the
6:16
river, you know, from very early, early days.
6:20
And looking back, I attribute some of my adventurous spirit to
6:23
to those little moments. But as I got older, you know, my
6:29
parents really instilled a desire to travel, see the world.
6:33
And it wasn't until I did that, you know, in college that I
6:35
started to really understand, you know, the inequities of the
6:39
world. And, and that I would say I
6:45
shined a light on some of the challenges that I thought, you
6:48
know, as a, as a human growing up in this developing part of
6:51
the world, you know, I felt a sense of responsibility to, to
6:56
somehow make the world a better place.
6:57
I didn't know exactly what that was going to be.
6:59
But as a, as a young person, I pursued adventure, something
7:03
that kind of made me feel alive inside.
7:06
I love the idea of just getting out, learning about new places,
7:09
coming back with stories and things to share.
7:12
And I would say maybe in the early days, it was somewhat, you
7:17
know, selfishly motivated, But over time, I realized that the,
7:23
the value of going to these places to pursue adventures were
7:29
much bigger than myself. And at, at one point I, I had a
7:34
chance to go to a volcano. That was, it was part of the
7:41
project that I put together as as part of an earlier startup
7:43
that I had done. And it was, it was in a part of
7:48
the world that I'd heard about just literally through a book.
7:51
But it sounded like a real life Mordor, you know, this place
7:53
that had this. Mordor from Lord of the Rings.
7:56
From Lord of the Rings, Yeah, and.
7:59
My favorite book ever. OK, so no, I should have called
8:01
you back then. I I got to go as a pretty much
8:06
as a film extra. I was, I kind of helped incubate
8:09
this adventure idea and BBC picked it up as a film, as a
8:13
film job. They funded it.
8:16
And I found myself sitting at the top of a volcano in the
8:19
middle of the Pacific Ocean on an island nation called Vanuatu.
8:23
And I don't know if I fully appreciated what I got myself
8:27
into until I was standing at the edge of this crazy volcanic
8:31
Cliff. But deep inside the volcano was
8:35
one of the world's only lava lakes, which I just found so
8:37
fascinating. Like a lake of lava.
8:39
Yeah, this the size of an ocean. It seemed 400 meters down inside
8:45
this volcanic shaft. And I, yeah, the idea of, of
8:52
seeing the forces underneath our, you know, feet that are
8:55
usually invisible and having it like a perception of, of what
8:59
would otherwise be just theoretical is such a exciting
9:02
thing to be able to see with your own eyes.
9:04
So that was why I was motivated to go there.
9:07
Bbci think got nervous about the idea of going down to the shore
9:12
of this lava lake, which is a very unusual and unpredictable
9:15
phenomenon. There's only a few of them in
9:16
the world and so they left all their gear and got a few shots
9:21
from the top and left so some friends they were.
9:23
They were worried just about filming that period.
9:26
Yeah, from halfway in, much less going all the way in.
9:29
Long story short, that that resulted in a couple of friends
9:33
that I was there with deciding to go into this crater, which
9:37
very few people had gone into, to the bottom of, and go and
9:42
check it out, explore it, learn about it, experience it.
9:46
So it was a somewhat harrowing descent down to this, this very
9:50
remote place. And of course, I was reveling in
9:55
the excitement of it all, of just being in this remarkable
9:59
place that so few people get a chance to see with their own
10:01
eyes. But I thought it would be a
10:02
great story to tell and to share some of what I've learned about
10:05
being in a place like that. And so I made it.
10:07
I made a little video, I've never made a video before, but I
10:12
captured some footage with the thought that maybe I would piece
10:14
them in together. And on the return I I wind up
10:19
opening up my laptop and making a little.
10:22
I think what wound up being a 2 minute video, the first one I'd
10:25
ever made and I created a YouTube account just to post it
10:28
because I had nowhere else to put it with the idea of sending
10:30
the link to my mom and I. I went to bed that night after I
10:35
arrived back in the United States and I got a a call from
10:38
Good Morning America asking if I had seen, you know, my account
10:44
and what had happened overnight. And much to my surprise, people
10:46
took an interest in it. And there were millions of
10:48
people that had clicked on that link, right.
10:51
And so that was kind of the, the first moment that I realized
10:56
this thing that I loved doing. Others found it interesting.
11:00
And and it was kind of a moment of authenticity, which is AI
11:03
think a word that you just used that I that I connect with.
11:08
I think a lot of people tend to gravitate in their life to
11:14
whatever, you know, the external world thinks they should be
11:18
doing at a given moment. And a lot of young people are
11:22
not quite sure how to turn their passions into an actual business
11:26
of sorts. But it was a lesson to me that,
11:31
you know, if you actually, you know, follow your passions,
11:34
whether you try to turn them into a business or not, some
11:36
amazing things can happen. And for me, that was getting the
11:39
attention of the world and getting the opportunity to do a
11:42
lot more of that kind of thing, which I did for a number of
11:44
years after that. I mean, there's a lot of prep
11:46
that goes into not, you know, extinguishing yourself in terms
11:53
of going into a volcano. And you know, one, one of the
11:56
one of the things that comes to mind is, you know, Alex Hannold
12:00
is we're as we're recording this is about to free solo, a
12:04
building in Taipei does that Friday and as a live Netflix
12:08
event. So that'll already be be done by
12:11
the time this goes live. But I'll never forget, you know,
12:14
watching Free Solo and the 60 minutes on Alex Handel before
12:21
that and and then being at Ted and seeing him speak at at the
12:26
Ted conference about the movie Free Solo.
12:29
And he's like, he's fuller alert.
12:31
I survived, right? And one, one of the big points
12:35
he made at that Ted conference in his Ted talk is that he
12:41
practiced that 100 times before doing it as a free solo.
12:46
So he, he, he was really giving a talk where it's all about
12:50
preparation. So how do you prepare to go into
12:53
a volcano like that and know that you're going to, well, I
12:56
hope you know, I guess know you're going to survive.
12:59
I'll, I'll, I'll say it like that.
13:00
Yeah, Yeah, it's a it's a fair question.
13:03
And, and I would, I'll answer it by maybe bringing up kind of
13:08
talking about it from a different perspective.
13:09
The thing that I so that that first volcano that I went to in,
13:13
in Vanuatu is really my, my foray into, you know, exploring
13:16
more regions like this. And I found that people were so
13:20
fascinated by it. And it was largely driven by the
13:22
fact that there's still such a misunderstood phenomenon.
13:25
And they're all over the world and they pose danger and they,
13:28
they, they are destroyer creators.
13:30
There's this great paradox about volcanoes that I think people
13:32
have been, you know, I've never met a young person or an older
13:36
person that what didn't have an equal fascination with these,
13:38
you know, natural wonders. And so for me, that was the
13:43
stepping stone to pursuing more of that, but less about less
13:47
from the perspective of actually just getting the thrill of being
13:51
in this otherworldly place and more from the perspective of
13:54
what can we learn about it and how can humanity benefit from
13:57
that? And to do that, I, I realized
14:00
that, you know, it's not really a solo effort, you know, while
14:04
we were descending into, you know, extreme environments and
14:07
they were very technical climbing aspects to it.
14:11
And a lot of, you know, a lot of earth science elements that
14:16
needed to be navigated. It was as much about identifying
14:19
the right team and the right skill sets to pair together.
14:22
And in many cases, they were ones that had never been brought
14:25
together to deliver something of value to come away with.
14:29
Some some, you know, not just the story, but knowledge.
14:32
And, and so to answer your question directly, obviously I,
14:37
you know, I spent a lot of time outdoors climbing,
14:42
understanding, you know, how your technical equipment that
14:45
would be required to descend into, into environments like
14:48
this and to survive, knowing there's all kinds of dangerous
14:51
gases and things of that nature. So there's definitely an element
14:54
of preparation with equipment, but it's, you know, the way in
14:59
which you would prepare often times came down to what we were
15:03
trying to achieve. And with that first Vanuatu
15:08
project, that was the first of a number of projects that I did.
15:12
And they all had a different band, a different objective.
15:17
And depending upon what we were trying to achieve, we would
15:19
prepare in different ways. I'll give an example of that.
15:22
So one of the last projects I did was in was in Nicaragua.
15:27
And I don't actually know if I've ever told this story out
15:31
loud or, you know, on camera, but that was it was an
15:35
interesting origin. The short version of that is
15:38
that someone reached out to me while I was doing another
15:42
project in Guatemala. It was an e-mail that I received
15:44
with an incredible video of a what looked like a, a, a lava
15:48
waterfall. And it was from a concerned
15:51
Nicaraguan citizen who said this just emerged practically in my
15:56
backyard. I'm in a town with, you know,
15:59
over 1,000,000 people. And a lot of people are
16:02
concerned about this thing that he's kind of awoken, if you
16:05
will. So I was, I was given the an
16:09
e-mail address and told not, you know, to communicate where I got
16:11
it from. And I didn't know whose e-mail
16:13
address it was, but I was told that that person could help me
16:16
pull something together to help understand more about what was
16:19
being what was causing this kind of volcanic eruption, that it
16:22
sprung to life after hundreds of years.
16:25
And it turns out that that that e-mail address was to the
16:29
president and, and first lady of Nicaragua, who after a couple
16:34
weeks, surprisingly responded to my e-mail and invited me to come
16:37
and do a, a recce to see, you know, what could we learn about
16:41
this place? And it led to an expedition
16:44
where we were developing a proof of concept early warning system,
16:51
looking at volcanoes as instead of just like through a singular
16:54
lens of seismology or some other kind of very narrow field of
16:57
science. We were looking at it across the
16:59
whole spectrum of, of, of phenomenon, which was much more
17:05
cross cutting. And you know, this was some
17:07
years ago, but it was, I would say before the whole AI
17:10
revolution really kind of exploded.
17:13
But the idea was to like like a human would go into a, to a
17:16
doctor and say I have something systemically wrong with me.
17:19
They wouldn't just check your temperature or look in your ear.
17:21
They would do a whole holistic work up.
17:24
And that was kind of what was missing in the field of volcanic
17:27
science that we thought would be quite interesting.
17:30
To do that, of course, we needed to pull together all these
17:32
people who had never been inside active volcanoes.
17:36
We needed to get pieces of equipment that were hundreds of
17:39
pounds down to the bottom of the, of the the shore of these
17:42
lava lakes, which were hundreds of meters down in these inverted
17:46
walls that you couldn't just propel down into and say to
17:50
prepare for something like that. It was less about, you know,
17:53
propelling and climbing and more about ingenuity of, of
17:57
developing, you know, zip lines to the bottom of very active
18:01
volcanoes, which had never been done before.
18:04
So the preparation there involved working with civil
18:07
engineers, working with firefighters, working with rope
18:11
access technicians to think about, you know, how would we,
18:15
you know, bring all these people that needed to do the work that
18:18
we are doing down there seamlessly and be able to
18:21
extract them out quickly in the event of a, of a crisis of some
18:25
kind. So, you know, I think there's,
18:29
there's kind of the internal preparation and then there's the
18:33
external preparation. And internally, I think it's
18:37
very, very similar probably to what Alex and others, you know,
18:41
go through, which is, you know, mentally manifesting things and
18:46
practicing things mentally and of course sharpening your skills
18:51
and, you know, harnessing the the power of of staying calm
18:56
under stress. But externally there's a lot of
18:59
factors as well that have to do with building teams and thinking
19:02
cross disciplinary and you know, thinking really outside the box
19:06
and like keeping that that stored really sharp as well.
19:11
So yeah, there's a range of things and every project was
19:13
somewhat different, but the through line there was to your
19:17
point, be prepared for anything. Have a plan.
19:21
Things will always not go exactly as you imagine they
19:24
would. So have a plan AB and C and and
19:29
then have the right people around you.
19:31
What? What type of equipment do you
19:34
have to wear to make sure that it can withstand that type of
19:38
heat? I mean, I can't even imagine
19:40
like how, how, how hot are we talking about as you go?
19:43
The service of lava is about 2500°F, so it's, it's warm.
19:48
Interestingly, it's actually not that much different than being,
19:52
you know, at the edge of a being, you know, in the heart of
19:55
a fire and a fully involved, you know, house fire, for instance,
19:58
that the temperatures are actually not that dissimilar.
20:02
So that's obviously very hot. You know it's hot enough to.
20:04
To melt metal and and you know when you see lava, it's
20:09
something that always surprises people it surprised me was that
20:12
lava. It looks especially when you go
20:13
to a lava lake where there's there's quite literally, it
20:16
looks like the Bellagio fountain, except it's made of
20:19
fire and. Not to be touched out.
20:22
Not to be touched. It looks like a fluid, but it is
20:26
the density of rock. It is a solid and, and so part
20:32
of the issue is the temperature because if that comes into
20:34
contact with you or your equipment, obviously will
20:36
instantly melt or compromise it. But also, you know, it's, it's
20:41
the same density as rock. So what may look like a little
20:43
splash might also be a big boulder coming your way, right?
20:47
The temperatures are, are, are they kind of fall off as a
20:51
function of distance and, and something that might, you know,
20:54
impede that the radiant energy that's coming out.
20:56
So there's a rock between you and the lava.
20:59
The temperatures fall off precipitously, you know, very
21:01
quickly, linearly. So if you could find, you know,
21:05
something to block yourself from the radiant energy, you know, by
21:08
ducking behind something, you could actually get very close
21:11
with just modern firefighting equipment.
21:14
We we would use these these silver suits that you might have
21:16
seen in some of the National Geographic videos.
21:19
Yeah, we'll, we'll include some links in the in the podcast
21:22
notes. Yeah.
21:22
OK, great. Yeah.
21:23
And, you know, it's interesting because a lot of what we would
21:25
use would come, you know, from other industries.
21:28
And, and I, I love that idea because that's like the very
21:30
definition of innovation in a way, you know, just repurposing
21:34
existing things to kind of forge, you know, new ideas.
21:38
And in order for us to gain access to these environments, we
21:42
had to use equipment that was designed for steel mill workers
21:46
or, you know, aviation firefighters.
21:48
And the silver suits were, were one of those examples.
21:53
So we had those, they were just thin aluminum, aluminized steel,
21:59
and they had different materials inside that were, you know,
22:02
thermally resistant things like Nomacs that again, are used
22:06
across industry. And there were some visors that
22:09
had, you know, gold plated material to reflect a lot of the
22:12
radiant light and energy that would come your way.
22:14
At the end of the day, it's still very hot, you know, and if
22:17
you got really close, as we did, yeah, you're feeling it and, and
22:22
it's, it's, it's hot from the outside, but it's also extremely
22:26
hot from the inside. So we would, you know, we, we've
22:29
at times used some of the cooling systems that are used by
22:31
NASA astronauts. And, you know, the goal being
22:34
to, you know, continue to be able to do the work without
22:37
being exhausted or, or, you know, have your physiological
22:41
condition compromised. Because once you're in there,
22:44
you're, you're in there for 8 hours.
22:46
It's a it's a long journey in and a long journey out.
22:49
Really. So it takes it takes that long
22:51
to just descend and then come come back up.
22:53
Yeah, the ascent was usually longer.
22:56
Dropping in was, you know, gravity is kind of on your side,
22:58
right, Right. And some of the projects we
23:01
would use these, these motorized ascenders that kind of look like
23:04
a little motorcycle of sorts, gas powered systems that you'd
23:07
start up like a lawn mower and turn with a throttle and
23:10
basically climb your way out. And you needed them because the
23:13
walls were inverted. You couldn't just walk down.
23:16
They were, you know, oriented in that manner.
23:20
Then other times we were using the zip lines that we
23:22
instrumented and but they were always manually driven.
23:26
And so we had people at the top hoisting, yeah, which required
23:29
big crews of strong people to to to pull you out one at a time.
23:34
And and yeah, it was a long distance.
23:35
So a lot of I. Mean the videos we'll we'll
23:38
share in the notes are just mind blowing.
23:40
You know, it's seeing it as an observer is just like it's it's
23:46
hard to even fathom. And I I absolutely love nature,
23:50
love going on hiking trips with my wife Deborah.
23:53
What was the most beautiful moment as you're doing this
23:58
where you just have to be? I'm sure you're just in a place
24:01
of absolute awe and wonder. It even like here I am, Sam
24:07
doing this and seeing this, this lava lake, you know, flowing.
24:14
I mean, what were what were some of those moments?
24:17
I, I, you know, I had a lot of feelings while I was down, down
24:19
in this environment. And at times we, you know, some
24:23
of these projects would last, you know, well over a month
24:25
where we essentially lived inside the volcano for extended
24:28
periods of time. And then there were other times
24:31
where it was just a, you know, kind of surgical strike.
24:35
And, you know, we had to come out for a variety of reasons.
24:39
But I, there were some moments there that I, I remember, I
24:43
think you described it well. I remember kind of feeling in
24:47
between the moments of like exhilaration and, and, and fear,
24:52
of course, all of those things, you know, no one would not be
24:55
fearful in an environment like that.
24:56
It is you are a speck, you know, and it and there's you're very
25:04
acutely reminded of that in a place like that.
25:06
So perhaps that might be one of the distinct feelings that I
25:10
remember having. And later I did some research on
25:13
that feeling that I had and, and I discovered that it was it's
25:16
also a feeling that, you know, many astronauts feel when
25:19
they're looking down at the pale blue dot and they see every,
25:24
everything that ever was in one little speck.
25:26
I mean, our whole Galaxy is a speck in the entire vast
25:29
universe, correct? That, as far as we know, is
25:31
infinite. That's right.
25:32
And, and perhaps, you know, theoretically you can imagine
25:35
yourself out there looking in, but you know, astronauts,
25:38
obviously, as they're sitting in the ISS looking down at Earth,
25:41
they, they're left with their thoughts for a long time.
25:43
And that, that phenomena apparently was called the
25:45
overview effect, where they have this sensation of, of smallness,
25:50
but in an inspirational kind of way.
25:52
And I, I remembered feeling that way, but maybe to some degree
25:55
like the inverse, being inside instead of outside, you know,
26:02
inside the earth looking out was, was there was a oneness in
26:06
that, you know, something very profound and you know,
26:14
definitely it definitely was awe, awe inspiring.
26:17
There was a sense of gratitude, I would say, from not just being
26:20
among the few people to stand in a place like that and actually
26:23
get to feel that, share those those feelings, but but also
26:27
just to be alive, you know, because you're very reminded of
26:32
the fragility of your life when you're in a place like that.
26:35
Like you could literally be taken away in the moment.
26:38
And I think that that kind of begs a bigger question, which is
26:41
like, why would you put yourself in a place like that ever?
26:44
You know, who would? It's like the Darwin Award, you
26:46
know, someone jumps into a volcano.
26:49
But it's for me, the theme, you know, in my life has been pretty
26:53
constant and I've never quite reverse engineered exactly where
26:58
this came from. But I think it was probably from
27:00
a, a, a whole a sampling of different influences, including
27:04
those of my parents who spent, you know, their careers doing
27:08
things that they loved that were to the betterment of, of humans
27:10
in one little way or another. My mom was a was AI call her a
27:16
baby whisperer. She was a nurse practitioner,
27:18
lactation consultant. She loved helping new mothers
27:21
for their first month of life, which was so, so important.
27:24
And as a father, he's been through that.
27:26
Now I I've come to appreciate the role that she's played.
27:28
But she loved it. And my dad was, was always about
27:34
education and reading and books and sharing of ideas and wind up
27:40
spending 30 years of his career building a bookstore that was
27:43
kind of a cultural hub for young people in a place that didn't
27:46
have much of that, you know, in North Georgia.
27:49
How cool. And so I, I remember growing up
27:52
feeling like, OK, that's what life is supposed to be.
27:54
You know, you're supposed to create something that you're
27:55
passionate about that helps other people.
27:57
And I never really put too much thought into it.
28:00
I never marinated on that. But I I think just to kind of
28:03
seeped in over the years. Well, you're raised that way.
28:06
I mean, all the, all the books I've read on spirituality, they
28:10
all, they all sink at a common root, which is, you know, you
28:15
have to develop yourself to be the embodiment of love,
28:19
conquering fear. And then you can help others do
28:24
that. And then humanity is sins.
28:25
But the the highest form of service that you can do in a
28:28
lifetime is service to humanity, especially selfless service to
28:34
humanity. Yes.
28:35
And I, I totally agree. As a young person, I didn't know
28:40
exactly personally, I didn't know what that would form that
28:43
would take. But one of the lessons that I, I
28:46
think I emulated from my parents was just finding something that
28:49
you really enjoy with the thought that if you enjoy it,
28:54
you'll get good at it. And if you get better than
28:56
anybody at it, you'll excel in it.
28:58
And if you excel in it, then you have power to be able to affect
29:01
real change. And, and that was kind of a
29:03
through line, I guess in my, in my life.
29:05
But the, the, the basis of it was always, once you achieve
29:09
those three things, you can actually help people.
29:11
And so for me, I think, you know, I started off loving
29:16
adventure and exploration. And I later realized that there
29:20
was so much of the world that we didn't yet understand.
29:22
And yet we live in this amazing time of abundance where, you
29:25
know, new technologies were emerging that would allow us to
29:29
learn about the world in new ways that we hadn't seen before.
29:33
And I remember going to, you know, as I got more into this
29:37
world, I, I went to the Explorers Club and, you know,
29:41
there's a lot of old white men sitting around.
29:43
And, and not to knock the, the organization, actually it's,
29:46
it's transformed into very exciting ways, I think as a, as,
29:49
as the years have gone by, But it's, I, I remember hearing the
29:56
thought that, you know, so much as we've kind of already seen
29:59
and seen it all and done it all and.
30:02
No, we're we're not even close. We're bare.
30:03
And yeah, my conclusion is that we're barely scratching the
30:05
surface. And I think as technology makes
30:07
its way into people's hands and you were thinking about new ways
30:10
of using it, like there's just so much to be done.
30:14
And, and so as I, as I wound up getting, you know, deeper into
30:20
this world, I realized perhaps I can combine my love for, you
30:24
know, discovery and, and the curiosity that underpins that.
30:27
And, and you kind of overlay that to problems in the world.
30:32
And that became that kind of through line as I did more and
30:35
more projects, because I later discovered that there were
30:38
hundreds of million, like 800 million people in the world that
30:40
that lived exposed to volcanic threats, which is just one
30:44
little sliver of, you know, problems related to earth
30:47
science and volcanoes. But that's a big number.
30:50
That's a big number. Yeah, that caught my attention.
30:55
I never thought that I was going to and I still don't think that
30:57
I'll, I'll ever, you know, plug a volcano and prevent it from
31:01
from exploding. But if we can understand these
31:03
these phenomenon more than we can take steps to kind of avoid
31:06
crisis and we can improve livelihoods and we can.
31:10
And that was kind of always the thinking around like taking on
31:12
these projects. So kind of coming full circle to
31:15
the topic of preparation and, you know, justification for even
31:20
being in a place like this. It always was underpinned by
31:24
this idea of, you know, I'm just one life and I don't have a
31:28
death wish by any means. I was always, you know, as much
31:31
as. Anyone doesn't either.
31:32
Yeah, Yeah, I would. I would imagine so.
31:35
He's got a child and he's got a lot of reasons to live.
31:37
And I felt this. I feel the same way.
31:39
But the calculus for me was if I going into a place like this, I
31:44
could actually have an outsized impact and I can do it
31:47
moderately, you know, safely. And that's a subjective term,
31:50
but then the costs are dramatically outweighed by the
31:55
potential benefits. And then your fear kind of fades
31:59
away when you think about all the good that can come from
32:01
something. So that was kind of what was
32:03
going through my head a lot of the times when I was in this
32:05
crazy hostile places was what a privilege it is to be in a place
32:10
like the seeing these forces that are these invisible things
32:13
that we read about in books. But so if you get a chance to
32:15
see while doing something so, you know, with so much gravity,
32:20
you know, and, and with so much potential human positive human
32:23
impact, it was always, yeah, there was a, there's a, a level
32:29
of, of gratitude, you know, that came from it.
32:33
I also remember some specific moments as I was descending in
32:37
on the zip line, just looking around and almost feeling like
32:43
transported because you know, by this time that that the sun had
32:47
fallen and the illumination of the lava underneath was just
32:51
ambiently illuminating everything from within.
32:53
It looked like the surface of Mars.
32:55
And I remembered feeling like so foreign in this, in this place.
33:01
And it reminded me that the world is still so, you know, so
33:05
big and so, so vast, as are the, the unanswered questions.
33:09
And I, I, I feel inspired by, by that.
33:13
But yeah, there's a whole range of emotions.
33:15
I think you know, you're, you're fearful, you're grateful,
33:17
you're, you're exhilarated. You know, one of the one of the
33:21
pushbacks I I get, I get this actually a lot is what is
33:29
humanity do wants it achieves real abundance, like abundance
33:33
across the planet. You know, I've talked about Chad
33:36
and how Chad as a country in Africa, the continent of Africa
33:40
has AGDP of $660 a person versus our 85,800 in the US.
33:47
And and so things like, you know, a hot shower would be a
33:50
massive luxury in Chad, like stable electricity, clean water.
33:57
And you know, I think that we're going to as humanity be able to
34:03
turn Chad into an Anasis just like we've we've turned the US
34:11
into on Asus after a lot of development.
34:15
You were we're in the point 1% of all Homo sapiens that have
34:18
ever been in existence that have experienced electricity and
34:22
99.9% of our evolutionary time, we haven't even experienced
34:26
that. And I get this pushback like,
34:30
well, does that just mean we're all going to kind of meditate
34:33
like they do in Bhutan, which that's actually where we went
34:36
over, over the December break and and amazing, amazing place,
34:41
very, very spiritual place, you know, is known as as one of the
34:47
happiest countries on earth. And you know, you can really
34:52
feel that it you can, you can feel the contentment there,
34:56
which is which is so beautiful and always like you're thinking
35:01
too small, like there's a universe out there that is
35:04
completely infinite and vast. And the ambitious among us,
35:10
which are plentiful, will want to go out there and explore
35:14
that. And there's no end to the
35:16
curiosity. And, and in the lattice, that's,
35:19
that's what, that's what I explore is once humanity unites
35:23
through the protagonist, Dr. Alexander Bliss and his his
35:27
audacious idea to get humanity to unite, then, you know, then
35:34
there's this unprecedented tech technological take off.
35:37
We we conquer faster and lightspeed travel.
35:40
And there's just all these amazing things that happen as a
35:44
result. And just, just just on Earth, I
35:48
mean, there's so many things, yeah, left to do.
35:51
And I think that that's, you know, the, the, the proxy here
35:54
is if you extrapolate that to kind of the greater universe,
36:00
it's, there's an untold amount of things to, to learn about, to
36:03
discover, to explore. There's hundreds of millions of
36:07
galaxies. Exactly, you know, and and
36:09
interestingly, if you, you know, take things out to the to the
36:12
11th to the NTH degree on, you know, getting to a point of
36:15
abundance where, you know, perhaps you have this
36:18
technological liftoff of sorts. You in a sense, I could see how
36:26
we come back to kind of our most human like fundamental human
36:30
qualities, right, of which creativity, you know, is one of
36:33
which exploration or desired is kind of see beyond is another
36:37
that desire to do good for one another.
36:40
So those are the. Main activities for another,
36:43
just being with each other, you know, having the time versus the
36:47
constant, like just trying to make ends meet.
36:49
So it's interesting to contemplate, you know, where
36:52
that inevitability goes if if we can get there, of course.
36:56
Yeah, 'cause there is there, there is part of humanity that
36:58
will take the path of like the Bhutanese, which that's great,
37:03
you know, no, no, no judgement about that all.
37:06
I think that's fantastic. Like if if humanity returns to a
37:09
more communal place where we can really selflessly love each
37:13
other and, and, you know, go on voyages together and not have so
37:18
much scarcity to deal with. But there there's I am very
37:24
convinced there is no end to human curiosity, ever.
37:27
I agree. I agree with that, that
37:29
sentiment and curiosity, a quality that I think our modern
37:34
world squelches a bit just by virtue of the business of life.
37:38
I don't think it's an intentional thing per SE.
37:40
But, you know, when I think about my younger self and you
37:46
know, the, as I grew older, kind of how that little spark kind of
37:51
they were moments where it felt like it was kind of fading a bit
37:55
until I was reinvigorated by some other thing that I came
37:57
across. It was an undeniable kind of
37:59
draw for me. And in some ways, you know, how
38:03
our educational systems work and kind of, you know, optimizing
38:06
for the lowest common denominator.
38:08
It's there's a, there is a tendency for, for that, that
38:12
curiosity to kind of be tuned out a bit.
38:15
And it's something that I would, you know, it's if you were ever
38:19
to get to a world where there was true, you know, kind of
38:22
abundance in that way that you've described, then I would
38:26
imagine something like that fundamental quality would get
38:29
unlocked in in adults as much as they do and as we see in in
38:33
children. And who knows what they the net
38:36
benefit of that could be? Yeah, Yeah.
38:38
It's the thing I'm, I'm most excited about near term with,
38:42
with, with AI is just this ability to shatter the barrier
38:47
to, to creativity. Yeah, I, you know, I've been a
38:51
long time entrepreneur, started six different companies and you
38:56
know, when, when, when I was out there constantly speaking about
39:01
how to take this entrepreneurial path and hopefully become
39:05
successful with it. I think people were personifying
39:09
me as a guy that, you know, has been programming since I was
39:11
seven years old, etcetera, etcetera.
39:14
And now that barrier's being shattered for the better,
39:20
because creativity is plentiful all over the world and there's a
39:25
tremendous amount of capability that people have innately, but
39:30
slogging through all that rote work to get to it is is really,
39:35
really tough. Yeah, there's, there's always
39:36
such an interesting paradox between, you know, the
39:39
democratization of something that was held by, you know, the
39:43
fortunate few who perfected the skill versus, you know, the net
39:47
benefit perhaps of, of like making that available to all
39:50
because of the inherent qualities that we all possess as
39:52
humans and we are all creative in one way or another.
39:56
I, I, I definitely, I have heard the argument by, by like
40:00
professional artists that, you know, the, the negative around
40:05
what happens when anybody can create and, you know,
40:08
everybody's repurposing each other's works.
40:10
And I can understand that from, from that perspective.
40:14
You dedicated your whole life to to something and it you know you
40:17
have a certain view of what that should look like and you know a
40:21
certain need to protect. On the other hand, you know,
40:27
when there are tools that allow someone to express creativity by
40:31
way of a skill they've never had that they get to unlock, So they
40:34
get on the other side of that and anybody can access it
40:38
because it's just ubiquitously available through free
40:41
applications, you know, derived from AI that that's a pretty
40:44
exciting, you know, concept. And I think we're, we're there
40:49
in many ways. So the, I see it kind of, you
40:52
know, both sides, but I think like with all things and like
40:57
with AI as an example, I think, you know, my personal opinion is
41:01
that the, the, the goodwill outweigh the bad.
41:03
Yeah, Well, is as you and I are recording this episode 32 just
41:07
went Live Today with Michael Collins, which is making an
41:10
amazing documentary on intuition and about how it can really be
41:15
fostered in young children, especially through different
41:19
schools that that allow them to do what would be considered
41:24
miraculous things that we all innately have these abilities
41:27
that can be cultivated. And we, I met him on a trip in
41:33
the Grand Canyon in August, which which is amazing, like the
41:38
presence you have with each other.
41:40
Did you go on a rafting trip? Yes, 277 miles.
41:45
Have you done that before? And that was a life changing
41:47
experience for me. How cool.
41:48
Yeah. OK.
41:49
We've never talked about that. And, you know, it's, well, it's
41:51
well, the same thing being in a volcano, which I've never done
41:54
for a month. You know, that that would be the
41:59
same type of experience. We're just completely bonding
42:02
with the people there. There's nothing there but
42:04
presence. But one of the one of the things
42:06
that happened there is that one of the people that went on that
42:10
trip writes for TV and he was pretty dystopian at the
42:16
beginning of the trip with me on AI.
42:19
I'm just like, what this is going to mean.
42:23
And and I wasn't intending to turn him, but you know, we're
42:28
just talking a lot about how this is going to play out.
42:31
And one of the things he educated me on, which I just
42:35
just didn't know, just totally ignorant to it, but makes
42:38
complete sense, common sense, if you really thought about it, is
42:43
that, you know, the storyline for a movie or for ATV show,
42:49
they only have a certain budget to shoot it with.
42:52
And so if you get it wrong, it's not going to be a very good
42:55
movie. It's not going to be a very good
42:56
TV show. And so I was like, well,
43:01
imagine, you know, using things like Sora, you know, from Open
43:04
AI and, and you know, Google's video 3 or 4 or whatever they're
43:10
out to now and using these to prototype like ideas and see
43:16
kind of how they sit. And don't you think over time
43:21
that's going to make us much more creative and make the
43:24
content much better because you're getting to try out new
43:27
things to optimize within that budget.
43:30
And as we work through it, you know, by the end of the trip,
43:32
he's like, actually I'm like, really excited now, you know?
43:36
Yeah, that's an interesting way to kind of to frame it up for
43:40
somebody who might be kind of sitting on the on the edge
43:42
because it is, you know, in that sense it's a true utility and
43:45
you get to maximize the, you know, the output based on, you
43:48
know, the cost saving nature of like trial running on some
43:51
things. I think where people get a
43:52
little, humans tend to take things to the NTH degree.
43:56
They they just take it all the way out.
43:57
You know, it's job replacement. It's like the loss of true
44:00
creativity. It's the proliferation of other
44:02
people's ideas all blended into something.
44:06
But it's, but I stand by, you know, my thinking, I think there
44:09
will always be a world for both. And we're kind of getting a
44:12
little bit off topic here, but I, it's like a book, you know,
44:15
books are never going to go away, right?
44:16
Of course we have the Kindle and we have all these digital
44:18
formats and podcasts and things of this nature.
44:20
But there's always a world for a book, you know, a physical
44:24
embodiment of someone's ideas. And, and in some ways the, the
44:28
value of those things get greater over time because they
44:31
become more rare in a way. So by the same token, the idea
44:35
of like spreading, you know, positive information by way of
44:39
these digital means, of course there's, you know, two sides of
44:42
this coin, but that can be it's very powerful thing and to
44:47
create content more effortlessly and to, you know, to create new
44:52
genres of media, you know, I think it'd be pretty
44:54
interesting. Think about that.
44:56
So I want to, I want to shift to, you know, this, this, this
45:02
amazing experience you have in nature with volcano diving and
45:08
all the preparation that goes into that, all the teamwork, all
45:13
of the equipment you're building and assembling to actually make
45:19
it even possible to what you're doing now.
45:21
Because we, we invested in what you're doing now.
45:24
I don't know what we would have said if he was like, hey, would
45:27
you invest in Mia's volcano? Smaller market.
45:30
Smaller market, but you had your sponsors, you know, so you know
45:35
what you're doing now really, really hit me and Deborah in the
45:40
heart in a beautiful way where you know, you, you've really
45:44
taken that that skill set to develop this new age helmet for
45:50
firefighters that not only help save their life, but helps them
45:54
save more lives. I, I'm a very spiritual person.
45:58
I would say that there was some divine guidance there, but it
46:03
but it's just a beautiful arc in your life that you would go from
46:06
that. You know, a lot of people
46:08
listening to this or watching this would would assume that
46:14
that person is an adrenaline junkie and is going to just
46:17
continue on that path. It'll be like the next, you
46:20
know, crazy thing, you know, go to the lowest point in the ocean
46:26
or whatever it is. And you know, not that there's
46:29
anything wrong with that, but you actually took this to to go
46:34
into a place, you know, taking those learnings from growing up
46:38
with your parents. I grew up with very similar
46:41
types of parents to say I want to do something really good for
46:45
humanity. So I'd love to love to talk
46:48
about the transition and you. Know it's, it's interesting
46:51
because I feel like most of my life has been these like very
46:55
seamless transitions where it it almost had happens, you know,
47:00
just poetically in a way and looking back in hindsight, you
47:04
know, it's like it's an incredible story and that
47:06
natural transition just seems so seamless but it wasn't planned.
47:13
And I think therein lies, you know, perhaps a lesson in life,
47:16
you know, that some of the best things are never planned.
47:20
And maybe there were some divine intervention, who knows?
47:23
I can't claim that. But you know, the for me, it, it
47:28
originated, I think, like, like many founder stories where
47:33
you're doing something that you love and you have a problem for
47:37
yourself. It wasn't necessarily trying to
47:41
solve this particular group's problem.
47:44
I just discovered that as I was trying to safely navigate these
47:48
austere environments inside these active volcanoes, a
47:52
problem that kept cropping up was we just couldn't see.
47:54
It was very a lot of toxic super heated gases that made
47:58
navigation very difficult. And to that end, you know, there
48:01
were, you know, 50 people on these expeditions and we needed
48:06
to communicate and make quick decisions.
48:08
And that was all very difficult with the tools that we were
48:11
being given. And we're very fortunate in
48:13
that, you know, some of the big companies that make the gear
48:15
that these various industries use were, you know, giving them
48:19
to a sponsoring us. So we had, and we're very
48:21
grateful for that, but you know, we had the SCBAS, the, the air
48:26
that sits on the firefighters back.
48:28
They used to breathe in these, these smoke or gas filled
48:32
environments, which worked perfectly for our needs.
48:35
We had silver suits to protect us from the, the, the radiant
48:39
heat. We had radios that allowed us to
48:41
communicate. We had thermal imaging cameras,
48:44
which was a technology that had been borrowed from the military
48:47
to see through smoke and through particulate.
48:49
And they were all fine and they all worked.
48:52
And many of the people that were on these projects were familiar
48:55
with them because they came from military backgrounds, first
48:57
responder backgrounds. But what the thing that really
49:01
struck me was that specifically as it related to seeing was that
49:05
in order for us to see in many of these environments.
49:07
And then we had a couple really, yeah, scary moments where super
49:14
heated burst of, you know, 700° gas would belch out of a nearby
49:18
vent. And we just literally couldn't
49:20
see where we were going. And you had to take a step in
49:22
the direction and you're running out of air.
49:24
And, you know, it was it was intense.
49:28
And it dawned upon me that the idea of having to let go of a
49:31
rope, which we needed as a lifeline to hold up a camera
49:34
that you, you could see, you know, a small display that had a
49:38
grayscale image, like a film negative.
49:40
Just to be able to understand where you were so that you could
49:44
then put it down and grab the rope and be blind again, just
49:47
really was such a, you know, it just didn't meet the need.
49:51
You know, to put it, to put it bluntly, we did our best to to,
49:55
you know, not take unnecessary risks.
49:57
But I would say there was definitely a couple of moments
49:59
that, you know, we got lucky. But that those moments as
50:03
experiences, especially as it related to the people that I was
50:06
there responsible for, is what led to me scouring, you know,
50:09
the Internet and looking for prep solutions that, you know,
50:12
firefighters were using or other people were using.
50:14
And I stumbled upon what I thought was a product that I
50:17
could buy. In some cases we would to do our
50:20
expeditions, we would, we would buy things that's necessary.
50:23
And other times we would, we would build things.
50:26
And I, I found this very futuristic looking stormtrooper
50:30
like helmet that appeared to see through smoke.
50:33
And I later discovered that it was a very talented design
50:36
designer overseas who had come up with this concept.
50:39
But it was, it was just a concept.
50:42
And it's ultimately what led to me, you know, working with this
50:47
individual to realize this, this idea that was, I mean, purely
50:54
for the sake of benefiting our team.
50:56
All right. And so I pulled together a cross
50:58
functional team of folks that had a very different, you know,
51:01
very diverse set of backgrounds and, and skills.
51:04
And we built this helmet mounted vision system to see through
51:10
smoke. And really the rest was history.
51:13
Firefighters heard about it and said, you know, if you bring
51:16
that to us, you're going to change the game for our
51:19
community. So they heard about it through.
51:22
Videos. Through videos on YouTube and.
51:24
Correct. And it started off small, you
51:27
know, and I was thinking, here I am doing this work.
51:29
This could really benefit hundreds of millions of people.
51:32
But as you know, these inquiries continue to come in.
51:35
I realized that, you know, the number of people that could
51:39
benefit from this specific technology, which, you know, I
51:41
later realized was vision was just a small piece of it really
51:44
kind of transcended that in so many other areas and industries
51:48
was so much bigger. And, you know, I'm constantly
51:51
thinking about like, OK, well, I'm, I'm only going to live for,
51:53
you know, 50 years more at best, maybe longer if, you know, we,
51:57
we hit some big breakthroughs. I think it's going to be longer
51:59
with the age of abundance for all.
52:01
OK. All right.
52:02
Major, major health tech breakthroughs.
52:05
I believe that as well. But even, but nonetheless, the
52:08
the time is limited and yes, and we have to make use of our time
52:12
here on earth in the best way that we can.
52:14
And I came to the conclusion that this was a very noble, you
52:18
know, worthwhile thing to do that was going to benefit a lot
52:20
of people. And that was before I really
52:25
fully understood, you know, the plight of firefighters and
52:30
specifically, you know, first responders, but specifically
52:32
firefighters as as this story goes, we had created something
52:38
that I thought, you know, would be useful in the world.
52:41
And so my natural thought was as a non firefighter, you know,
52:46
maybe I wasn't the right person to bring this, you know, to this
52:48
community. There's probably better people
52:49
than I. And I, I thought that, you know,
52:52
really humbly just, you know, I would imagine that folks who
52:56
already make this kind of equipment have a lot of trust
52:58
already established and those companies would be highly
53:00
incentivized to make something like this real.
53:02
So, and I was a bit of an idea starter, you know, that was kind
53:05
of my sweet spot that I like to operate in.
53:09
So I took this invention, this, this tool that you could put on
53:13
your head that combines some new technologies, augmented reality,
53:18
thermal imaging, cameras, computer vision, AI, and, you
53:22
know, wireframe to the environment that you were
53:24
looking at in real time. So you can more rapidly
53:26
understand what you were looking at and navigate more quickly to
53:30
the groups that make this equipment.
53:31
And much to my surprise, the reaction was was disappointing
53:36
to say the least. And I sat down with the
53:38
executives of, you know, the monopoly that is the fire
53:41
industry. And the conclusion that many of
53:45
these folks came to after realizing, you know, wow, this
53:48
is the future was firefighters aren't ready for this, which I
53:52
later realized was just a ploy and not true at all.
53:55
And you know, the realization that I think profits would be
53:59
cannibalized if they out innovative themselves, which is
54:02
a classic Clayton Christensen, you know, innovator's dilemma,
54:05
right, Which makes sense. And it's just.
54:07
Innovator Stillman. Definitely one of the best books
54:09
I've ever read as an entrepreneur.
54:10
Yeah, absolutely. And and that that was like
54:14
unraveling in real time. But what it what it did for me
54:18
is I realized, OK, maybe I will be the person that brings us to
54:21
this community. I don't think I realized at the
54:24
time, you know, that it would be a journey to, you know, quite a
54:27
journey to get there as it as it wound up becoming.
54:28
But because I think for many, it seemed like such an obvious
54:33
thing that should exist in the world, but there were a lot of
54:37
forces that kept it from being so.
54:38
And it took about 10 years to get something that was, you
54:44
know, kind of look, the part, work the part, and to align all
54:48
the incentives with, you know, the industry and the customers
54:51
and the technology and everything to kind of eventually
54:54
arrive at a tool that I, I truly believe is going to well, not
54:59
just change how fires are fought all around the world, but how
55:02
humans, you know, perceive and how decisions get made in, you
55:06
know, high stress, time sensitive environments, which
55:09
spans well beyond fire, of course.
55:13
But you know, part of the motivation to continue building.
55:16
This was when I learned as an on firefighter what the
55:20
state-of-the-art was today, you know, and, and this is the to
55:24
this day, it, it still amazes me that and, and talking about
55:28
abundance here, you know, we live in Austin.
55:30
I get to work every day in a self driving car And you know, I
55:33
was in the medical device industry prior to this with
55:35
robotic tools that people were operating on bodies across, you
55:38
know, geographies and so many amazing things exist in the
55:42
world. But today, the state-of-the-art
55:44
for firefighting, which is that kind of entry point to what the
55:47
bigger play that we're working on is, you know, you go into the
55:50
building, you listen for the screams of the baby in the
55:53
backroom. You literally close your eyes
55:55
because that's what you're trained to do.
55:57
So you heighten your senses of hearing your, your other senses
56:00
and you basically blindly feel around in the dark.
56:02
And firefighters are really good at it because that's what they
56:05
spend 90% of their time doing is training.
56:08
But you know, just because you're, you get good at doing
56:11
something that's extremely inefficient, does that mean that
56:13
we shouldn't invest in making it better?
56:15
To me, the answer is definitely no.
56:17
And I. Bet you most people listening to
56:19
this do not know that that's what they have to do.
56:22
Yeah, and, and, you know, I'm, I'm somewhat simplifying it, but
56:26
it's, it's, that's the level of crudeness to how the work is
56:30
done. And, and the net result of that
56:32
is that firefighters spend, you know, a lot more time in those
56:35
really toxic environments. And they should.
56:37
And and that leads to, you know, many firefighters who are much
56:42
younger than me getting cancer. And it's the number one reason
56:45
for line of duty death amongst firefighters now is, you know,
56:47
being in those environments by the way, you know, things aren't
56:51
made of, you know, traditional wood the way they used to be.
56:54
We have so many new building materials and, and chemical
56:59
compounds, you know, IKEA furniture and the like that
57:03
they've done studies on, you know, what it takes for a fire
57:06
to kind of spread. And it used to be that a
57:08
traditional room in a, in a conventional sized house was 40
57:11
minutes before I would become fully involved.
57:13
Now with all these modern building materials and, and
57:16
fabrics and different, you know, petroleum based materials, it's
57:18
4 minutes, literally an order of magnitude less.
57:20
So you have less time today to get out of a burning building
57:22
than you did 40 years ago. And all of that lends itself to
57:27
you need to do more with less. And the threat is evolving.
57:32
You know, people are are doing this extremely noble work and
57:35
they're doing it with primitive things that haven't changed in
57:37
40-50 years. And it's a scourge.
57:39
It's it's, you know, still blows my mind that the industry is
57:45
you're kind of where it is. And I've come to understand why
57:48
largely, you know, external corporate influences.
57:52
But it's just so exciting to think about this future that
57:57
we're now upon after 10 years in the making.
57:59
Yeah, having launched a a product it, it's a tool called
58:03
see through that we've created as you know and.
58:06
And the name of the company is Quake.
58:07
Yes, the name of the company is Quake Technologies.
58:10
QWAKE. That's right.
58:12
There's a story behind that of course as well from my prior
58:15
work. But the product itself is called
58:18
see through with the idea of you can, you know, see through the
58:20
data, see through your eyes and actually make sense of your
58:23
environments, make faster decisions.
58:25
And what we realized is that, you know, just flipping the
58:31
lights on for folks who are operating in these dark
58:33
environments, smoky environments, was just like a
58:35
piece of the puzzle. But really what I came to
58:39
appreciate was that in the history of the fire service, in
58:43
the 250 years of American fire service heritage, no one has
58:49
ever taken anything more than a tiny little processor into a
58:53
fire that kind of could do one thing, basically.
58:56
And that was a much smaller percentage of the overall
58:58
history because processors didn't exist, you know, up until
59:00
fairly recently. But turned out that, you know,
59:04
the reason for not being able to take anything with a cell phone
59:07
level of compute or greater was because of some physics
59:10
challenges related to, you know, the internally generated heat
59:15
from having processors required to deliver AI in environments
59:19
like that. So, you know, the bottom line is
59:21
that everyone's benefiting from AI except arguably the people
59:25
that need it the most. Right.
59:26
The people that are quite literally saving lives.
59:28
Yeah. And so, and so that's become a,
59:30
a real, you know, motivational thing for me and for our team
59:36
who have been very self selecting, you know, group of
59:39
people who could, you're very smart, could do a lot of
59:41
different things in their lives. And they choose to, to work on
59:43
this because I think they, they realize the outsized impact.
59:46
They could have an industry that has just been left behind.
59:50
And now that's kind of what we've unlocked is we've invented
59:55
a system that can take essentially A supercomputer into
59:58
a fire that has all kinds of sensory perception abilities.
1:00:03
You know obviously I'm primary 1 is a high speed thermal camera.
1:00:07
And we can make use of that compute in the moment, you know,
1:00:13
right there in these hostile environments to make sense of
1:00:17
the environment for the, you know, for the person that's
1:00:20
operating right then and there. And that isn't unlocked that,
1:00:24
you know, is so, you know, pivotal for the for the
1:00:29
industry. And I think it really will
1:00:32
change the trajectory of things. And I spent a lot of time
1:00:35
thinking about this, obviously, as someone who's like,
1:00:37
dedicated, you know, my life's work to this.
1:00:40
And I at times will run into, you know, more traditionally
1:00:46
minded people who say, well, you're taking this piece of
1:00:50
technology into the fire and what happens if it breaks or,
1:00:54
you know, what happens if, you know, there's a condition where
1:00:56
it doesn't work as well. And I've spent time thinking
1:01:02
about that and, and one of the things that always comes to mind
1:01:05
is, well, that's for every breakthrough, there was always
1:01:07
that question that was being asked.
1:01:08
And in the case of firefighting, you know, many people said the
1:01:11
same thing about the air that they breathe, which is like an
1:01:14
indispensable. It's like one of the three
1:01:16
things that were created in the fire service that like changed
1:01:18
the game. It came from the space industry
1:01:19
and was borrowed and like many things in the fire industry,
1:01:22
gets borrowed from other industries.
1:01:25
But people. Also like many things, and.
1:01:26
Everything exactly to your point and people thought, well, you
1:01:29
know, you can now breathe inside the fire.
1:01:31
It used to be really cool and you'd use your beard to like,
1:01:34
you know, smoke dive as they called it.
1:01:37
You know, that was considered manly and you know, a sign of
1:01:40
bravado. And when the later people were
1:01:42
getting cancer and it became less cool, of course.
1:01:44
But for many people, the idea of having this like cheat code to
1:01:48
go deeper into the fire was possibly a risk because then,
1:01:52
you know, you could stay in there longer and you could get
1:01:55
farther into it and you may have difficult finding your
1:01:57
difficulty finding your way out. Well, now we look back at those
1:02:00
moments and we're like, that was dumb.
1:02:02
You know, it's actually required by law now.
1:02:04
And you better not go into that fire without a breathing
1:02:05
apparatus because you know, you'll be fired and you likely
1:02:10
won't come home to your family. More importantly, And I think
1:02:13
we're, we're seeing a similar, you know, shift and you know,
1:02:17
how people are viewing this, my prediction at least very acutely
1:02:19
on this application is that, you know, young people growing up
1:02:24
who maybe are coming into the fire service now, they will have
1:02:27
a hard time imagining a world where firefighters didn't have
1:02:30
an assist like this. Some AI capability that's
1:02:34
helping support decision making and helping people see and hear
1:02:38
and, you know, perceive the world around them as they're
1:02:40
making these critical decisions to save the lives of others and
1:02:42
themselves. And I have some strong beliefs
1:02:47
around that because of the support that we're getting from
1:02:49
Congress and, and others in positions to affect, you know,
1:02:52
laws that would be similar to what they experience with, you
1:02:56
know, SCB as and the breathing apparatuses.
1:02:58
So it's exciting. It's exciting to see, you know,
1:03:01
what is possible now after 10 years in the making and what
1:03:05
will be possible tomorrow and where this can go even beyond,
1:03:09
you know, firefighting and public safety and industrial
1:03:12
applications and, you know, their types of national security
1:03:14
efforts. And we need tools like this and
1:03:17
we need to get out of our own way and, you know, break past
1:03:21
this, this innovator dilemma, you know, kind of boundaries.
1:03:25
So I'm proud of the work that our team has done to to take
1:03:27
this from a concept and for many prototypes over the years into
1:03:32
what is now a commercial product is living on fire trucks.
1:03:34
And, and literally in this very moment, probably being used to
1:03:37
save a life, which is something that it's a deep moment to, to
1:03:41
contemplate how something that you might have created could
1:03:43
actually result in a mother, you know, hugging her child once
1:03:47
more, who may not have otherwise been able to do that, or a
1:03:51
firefighter coming back to their, to their crews who would
1:03:54
have otherwise become disoriented.
1:03:56
And I, I really encourage people to visit your website.
1:03:59
I'll put a link in the show notes, but just to see the what
1:04:03
the display looks like. I mean, it's really kind of mind
1:04:06
blowing. Yeah, thank you.
1:04:08
Yeah, it's, it's, it's funny because there, you know, the
1:04:12
immediate thing that catches your attention, as you know, is,
1:04:14
is this edge detection perception where, you know,
1:04:17
everything you're looking at has bright green lines like Tron or
1:04:20
Matrix, which people, you know, think that maybe we inherited
1:04:24
because we were just trying to be futuristic.
1:04:25
But actually there's some, there's some science behind
1:04:27
that. And my Co founder came from a
1:04:32
brain brain machine interface lab and was a neuroscientist and
1:04:35
had done a lot of research on learning and, you know,
1:04:38
perception. And it turns out there is a very
1:04:40
particular part of the electromagnetic spectrum that
1:04:42
the eyes most naturally and most quickly kind of discern.
1:04:46
And it's this very, very electric, you know, yellow,
1:04:51
green color. But therein lies some of the
1:04:54
paradox of the fire industry as well, because yeah, fire trucks
1:04:58
are red, so you expect them to be yellow, as they are in many
1:05:01
other countries for that exact reason.
1:05:04
But yeah, therein lies the the, you know, one of the the
1:05:10
wonderful things about firefighting, which is this
1:05:12
treasure treasuring of heritage, but the counterproductive things
1:05:17
as well, which is that sometimes we realize something is not good
1:05:20
for us, but we hang on to it anyways because it's
1:05:23
sentimental, right? Rather than, you know, because,
1:05:25
you know, knowing that perhaps there may be a better option and
1:05:28
and we're going that. So we, one of the things that
1:05:30
we've had to do as a startup, which I'm sure many, many others
1:05:33
also have gone through, is to navigate, you know, the delicate
1:05:37
dance between, you know, preserving the importance of
1:05:41
heritage while also mapping out the future and, you know,
1:05:45
breaking some molds. I think they, especially the
1:05:47
younger generations who are kind of coming into the job now,
1:05:49
really appreciate the importance of doing both.
1:05:52
Yeah, I mean, this is it. It invokes a a book that was so
1:05:56
popular for so long. Who moved my cheese?
1:05:58
Yes, of course I remember. That it's just, you know, we, we
1:06:02
do have sometimes a tough time adapting when it's changing the
1:06:07
paradigm. And that's, that's, that's part
1:06:10
of human nature and, and part of what what will eventually
1:06:13
transcend as we, as we evolve into this age of abundance for
1:06:17
all. Yeah, yeah.
1:06:20
I remember 2024 where the number one word that popped in my mind
1:06:26
is we're entering even the AI age.
1:06:29
You know, it was November 30th of 2022 that Chat chief PT came
1:06:33
out. So, you know, we're just over
1:06:35
three years into this at this point.
1:06:38
Was agility like just adaptability, like, like just
1:06:42
that that trait among humanity was going to really need to
1:06:47
continue to evolve and be embarrassed?
1:06:49
Yeah. Yeah, definitely.
1:06:50
And you know that that the need for adaptability, that is a core
1:06:58
skill that gets ingrained in firefighters.
1:07:03
There's a lot of repetition, you know, that goes into kind of
1:07:06
doing the job well and safely. And adaptability has always
1:07:10
meant one thing. But in in the industry now it
1:07:12
you know, it's beginning to mean something different.
1:07:14
Like the unlocks that can happen from from, you know, correlating
1:07:18
thousands of data points that are happening inside an
1:07:20
environment. Whether it's to help you, you
1:07:22
know, find your way out, like a self driving car from inside
1:07:25
out, or whether it's to cross reference saying what happens,
1:07:28
what it means when like a temperature is changing and
1:07:30
there's airflow going on one side and there's a victim on the
1:07:33
other side. Like all of those things
1:07:34
together mean something where you could deliver an intuitive
1:07:38
cue to someone who's got a heads up display adaptability, you
1:07:41
know, very much is like the very definition of that word I think
1:07:44
will be changed as it relates to firefighting anyways, because,
1:07:48
you know, the ability to react to new cues to new information
1:07:53
quickly and swiftly, you know, with Evergreen quality.
1:07:58
But it will just manifest in in new ways as we kind of get into
1:08:01
the yeah. To the next chapter of.
1:08:03
This well, how, how do you, how do you look at that?
1:08:05
I mean, you know, you're, you're an entrepreneur.
1:08:07
I'm an entrepreneur of my core. That's the main, that's the
1:08:10
main, the main thing that I've done my whole career.
1:08:14
Investing has just been on the side for us, But we're in 150
1:08:18
startups. We've been doing it for, for 16
1:08:20
years and, and you know, number of VC funds as well.
1:08:25
But how do you, how do you look at how humanity is going to make
1:08:29
it to this age of abundance for all and this exponential curve
1:08:34
we're in where you've got not only AI that that is being
1:08:38
prioritized like humanity's never prioritized anything
1:08:41
before with money, energy, time. You have quantum computing which
1:08:48
is going to supposedly be staple and really come online in 2029,
1:08:53
the same year that Ray Kurzweil projected projected we'd get to
1:08:57
AGI in his book The Singularity is Nearer, where he reaffirmed
1:09:01
that from the original book The Singularity is Near.
1:09:05
You have, you know, brain computer interfaces, you have
1:09:09
robotics that's going to come online in a huge way and it's
1:09:12
all going to play out in this next 10 to 15 years.
1:09:16
And you know, the reason I've been doing this is and you know,
1:09:21
writing the book love conquers fear, humanity, AI and age
1:09:24
abundance for all the podcast is to help humanity have the heart
1:09:29
shift. You know, the meta message of
1:09:32
love conquering fear, first of all is in all the spiritual text
1:09:36
that's in every every one of the roots of spirituality.
1:09:40
But it also is just the only way I see it playing out for
1:09:45
humanity to make it into this age because it's one of those
1:09:49
moments where with great power comes great responsibility.
1:09:51
We're going to have technology that's so vastly powerful than
1:09:55
anything we can imagine to do great good.
1:09:58
You know, like firefighting, augmented reality helmets to
1:10:03
save their lives and other lives and all of the all the different
1:10:08
plans that you'll have to expand that out to to other categories.
1:10:13
How do you how do you kind of look at this moment, you know,
1:10:16
and think about it with your children and everything else,
1:10:18
like, yeah. It is, it's, it's a daunting
1:10:23
concept. Yeah.
1:10:24
It's like with many things in life, whether it's related to
1:10:27
startups or, or just life in general.
1:10:30
I, I, I tend to, there's actions are driven by other actions and,
1:10:38
and, you know, forcing functions become kind of the, the means by
1:10:41
which, you know, good or bad things happen.
1:10:44
And humans have kind of proven many times over to like be have
1:10:48
a endless amount of potential to positively affect outcomes when
1:10:55
they're aligned. But you don't have to look much
1:10:58
further than the Internet and you know, X and the headlines
1:11:01
that there's a lot of fractured thinking right now and there's a
1:11:03
lot of problems in the world. There are yeah.
1:11:05
You can't ignore that. And so when I think about, you
1:11:10
know, this world of abundance, like I absolutely, you know,
1:11:13
can, can see, you know, the, the potential of that with the
1:11:18
confluence of all these technologies coming together
1:11:20
and, and, and at this very present moment, and all the
1:11:25
resources are getting thrown towards it as you reference.
1:11:28
But it does, it does kind of make me wonder like what type of
1:11:32
event, you know, would would have to happen to realign
1:11:36
everybody's thinking in the same direction, Because right now it
1:11:40
does, you know, the, my strong sense is that there's, there's
1:11:43
more people, there's as many people that are saying one thing
1:11:46
as they're saying another. And there's this kind of
1:11:48
opposing force that prevent us from being as efficient towards
1:11:51
that goal as we could possibly be.
1:11:53
And there's a lot of people struggling in the world and
1:11:54
there's real, there's realities to that.
1:11:57
You know, it's a, it's a privilege to be sitting here and
1:11:59
having this conversation and, and talking about that because
1:12:02
it means that we, we're not suffering in that same way that
1:12:05
others may be. So I think part of it is part of
1:12:09
what I think about is like what would, what would have to be
1:12:12
true in the world for everyone to realign or to at least to
1:12:15
some degree align? And it's more similar direction.
1:12:18
And I'm not sure what that is. I think this could be a range of
1:12:21
external factors. Sometimes you scare yourself so
1:12:24
much into something by way of some, you know, fear based thing
1:12:28
that, you know, you just kind of get awoken into like what really
1:12:30
matters? God forbid there was a nuclear
1:12:33
threat or anything of that sort. But you know, we've seen the
1:12:36
country and the world come together over similar things,
1:12:39
right, War and other other factors.
1:12:41
I certainly hope that that's not the case, you know, because that
1:12:44
would be an ugly chapter if that's what we had to go
1:12:47
through. And, and perhaps sometimes you
1:12:49
have just tremendous breakthroughs which are
1:12:51
possible, which just change our perception of like maybe that's
1:12:55
the struggles go away or they're greatly reduced because of, you
1:13:00
know, the you just not only does everything cost less to make so
1:13:04
it's more affordable, but you have less need for money in the
1:13:07
1st place. Maybe there is a, a realignment
1:13:09
around just the economics of that, right?
1:13:12
The 10 to 15 year time scale is interesting.
1:13:15
And I'm sure there are people who are outsmarter and I and
1:13:17
more tuned into this whole world that have reasons to believe
1:13:21
that that's the timeline that we would see that the results.
1:13:25
In some ways I'm very aggressive when it comes to predicting
1:13:28
things, but in other ways I'm pressed more a little bit more
1:13:30
conservative in my thinking. I think I ultimately I do
1:13:33
believe that we will get there. Maybe, but my, my sense is that
1:13:38
maybe that timeline's a little further out and, and, or at
1:13:44
least I tell myself that so that, you know, I don't like
1:13:48
just, you know, check out and my kids don't just check out, you
1:13:51
know, you need the skills, the hard skills to navigate the
1:13:54
world that we have today and to hopefully see the world that we
1:13:57
will create tomorrow. But I do think of a lot about,
1:13:59
about the point that you brought up around your, how you
1:14:02
communicate this with your family and your kids.
1:14:04
And, you know, I've got 3 kids, 13 and 21.
1:14:08
I've got a, a good range there and I, I have spent, you know, a
1:14:16
decent amount of time thinking about what are the skills that I
1:14:18
would want them to, to Foster and to cultivate that would
1:14:22
prepare them for that world, for the world that we have today and
1:14:25
for the world that is to come. And.
1:14:28
How? How are you getting in the
1:14:29
moment? It's it's I, I wish I could say
1:14:32
I was doing an excellent job. I think I'm doing the best job
1:14:34
that I can. But you know some of the core
1:14:38
things that come to my. About everything in parenting.
1:14:41
I'm trying to do the best job I can.
1:14:43
There are two kids, 16 and 21. Yeah, unfortunately no user
1:14:46
manual there, otherwise I would have read that a few times over.
1:14:49
But I think some of the fundamentals are are Evergreen,
1:14:55
but you know, so being a good person, holding yourself to a
1:15:00
degree of integrity and and honor, I don't think that in any
1:15:04
world that will never go away, if we are to be remain human,
1:15:07
that we have to uphold some of those values.
1:15:10
There is going to be A and there already is a proliferation of
1:15:12
crazy amounts of information that we're going to get
1:15:14
bombarded with and through algorithms, we're going to be
1:15:17
targeted. So it's all going to seem very
1:15:18
real. And I think discerning, yeah.
1:15:21
Understanding how to even evaluate what is real and not
1:15:25
real, even if it means using certain tools because it's where
1:15:27
it's imperceptible to our human eyes and brains.
1:15:32
Is, is a big part of it is like really seeking truth and knowing
1:15:37
what utilities will help you do that and not just, you know,
1:15:41
going along with the, the, the popular narrative narrative or
1:15:45
the headlines, because I think that's dangerous and can
1:15:48
misguide us. Well, we're being
1:15:50
algorithmically programmed. That is true, yeah.
1:15:53
It's, it's, it's the, it's much more profitable if you want to
1:15:57
put profits over people to try to hijack the amygdala just
1:16:01
because of the way we've evolved.
1:16:03
We've had scarcity for so long that our fear center is very,
1:16:08
very well devolved, evolved. And that's where people go after
1:16:13
that and algorithms seek that. I do think the, the the youngest
1:16:18
generation and the younger generations are, are really
1:16:22
going to be more like Neo and The Matrix to say we don't want
1:16:26
this word. I'm seeing a lot of evidence of
1:16:29
that. You know, alcohol use is
1:16:31
plummeting. Social media use is going down
1:16:33
among the youngest generation. But you know, it's a tall, it's
1:16:39
definitely a tall order. I mean, that's why that's why
1:16:41
I'm doing what I'm doing. I'm 95% certain that humanity
1:16:45
makes that I'm trying to do everything I can.
1:16:49
And I know a lot of people are out there doing everything they
1:16:52
can. You know, there's a lot, a lot
1:16:55
of people showing up. And you know, as, as, as Chris,
1:17:00
Chris Bass said, you know, God's sending in, sending in the
1:17:03
troops right now to really make sure that we make it.
1:17:08
Yeah, I think, I think. I think technology is going to
1:17:11
force us to make the choice because I think that we're going
1:17:18
to be able to glimpse and in your in my lifetime, you know,
1:17:21
it's not going to be that long where we're going to be able to
1:17:24
glimpse abundance. And I think that in that fateful
1:17:30
choice, humanity will make the right heart shift at the right
1:17:33
time to cleanse it. And you know, the lattice was a
1:17:37
attempt to say, here's a positive way where you know, on
1:17:43
how it could happen. We're not doomed to repeat the
1:17:47
atrocities of the past, but it's going to, it's going to be, it's
1:17:54
going to be an intense, I think, build up to that over the next
1:17:57
10 to 15 years. It is, yeah.
1:18:00
I, I, I agree with that. And there's so many unknowns
1:18:02
still that, but you know, the, the good work that you're doing
1:18:05
and, and that so many people are doing right now, I think you
1:18:08
know, tips the scale and the, and the positive.
1:18:10
Yeah, yeah, certainly trying to. I mean, it's, it's amazing to
1:18:13
think how many guests I've already had on and you know, I
1:18:17
think, I think it's like 5 that are 100% certain that we make it
1:18:22
out of, out of the gifts. That's pretty good odds.
1:18:26
But but, you know, there's real challenges.
1:18:30
I mean, there's a lot that we need to transcend in terms of
1:18:34
our nature. But if you think about it,
1:18:36
technology really has forced changes.
1:18:40
You know, there was a time in this country where slavery was
1:18:45
justified for labor and then industrial revolution came along
1:18:49
and, you know, it just it, it was like shocking that we ever
1:18:53
treated human beings that way at all.
1:18:57
And, you know, machines took over that ability where it led
1:19:02
to the Civil War. And and so I think that, you
1:19:05
know, we're going to have such abundance that it's going to
1:19:08
force humanity to make the heart shift.
1:19:11
Because if you think about the root of lots and lots of
1:19:15
conflict, it's been about land and resources and and all of
1:19:21
these things that have been because of scarcity.
1:19:24
Yeah, I know. I think that's that's right.
1:19:26
And, you know, the resources, you know, have a way of landing
1:19:30
in the hands of the few and the few don't have the means and the
1:19:33
tools to be able to secure them on their own.
1:19:35
And therein lies some of the problems.
1:19:37
But yeah, there's so many great examples of, of where, you know,
1:19:40
technological revolutions came around and, you know, you know,
1:19:44
unrooted, you know, those challenges.
1:19:46
And I've I believe that that will be true here for us as
1:19:48
well. And you're a part of it, and
1:19:49
you're a part of it. You know, thank you, I think.
1:19:51
About think about the karmic beauty of what you and your team
1:19:56
are doing, you know, for humanity and where that's going
1:19:59
to go. You know, we're in the very
1:20:00
early innings of just AR based technology, sensor based
1:20:04
technology, I mean. Yeah, yeah, it is.
1:20:06
It is very interesting to think about how AI will be used to
1:20:12
help. I mean, especially, you know, in
1:20:14
the, the sector that we're, we're focused on obviously
1:20:17
firefighting, public safety and just general, you know,
1:20:20
industrial applications. You know, humans have always
1:20:23
been limited to the tissue between our ears, you know, our
1:20:26
senses and our hands. And we make the best decisions
1:20:30
that we can. But at the end of the day, we're
1:20:31
human and we're not operating as a hive mind.
1:20:34
We're we're just, yeah, putting 1 foot in front of the other and
1:20:39
using intuition and judgment, all very valuable things.
1:20:41
But the unlock that comes from, you know, if using AI into the
1:20:48
mix and kind of and unleashing, you know, the collective
1:20:51
intelligence, which I think, you know, it will now be possible.
1:20:55
And that's kind of how I'm thinking about the future of
1:20:57
what we're doing because, you know, what are the limitations
1:21:01
of, of, you know, just putting a headset on someone's head is
1:21:05
that it's just still 1 human and those human, you know, systems
1:21:11
still fail, right? You, you, you have connectivity
1:21:13
and different things. But if you can figure out a way
1:21:16
to, to build a level of like technological resilience by
1:21:24
bringing AI to these very localized environments where the
1:21:30
the work is being done and you build systems that are extremely
1:21:34
resilient and you you make use of the sensors that are
1:21:38
available and becoming smaller and cheaper.
1:21:39
And yeah, there's just a whole world of things that we can do
1:21:42
to unlock human potential. And that's, that is what I find
1:21:45
to be so, you know, just transcendent and exciting about
1:21:49
the world that we're living in. Of course, the opportunity that
1:21:51
that I'm developing, but even beyond.
1:21:55
But I, I would say just in general, I guess as a parting
1:21:57
thought, my, you know, there's a lot of, a lot of buzzwords and a
1:22:03
lot of, you know, predictions and things that we could discuss
1:22:07
and we'll continue to hear, I think in the headlines.
1:22:10
But you're bringing it down to just like the most basic human
1:22:15
fundamental principles. Like life is short, it's long,
1:22:19
but it's short and we have one life to live.
1:22:24
I suspect that, you know, the heart also comes from like young
1:22:28
people kind of moving in the direction of realizing that, you
1:22:30
know, the brevity of their life as well and actually choosing to
1:22:32
do things that are good in the world.
1:22:34
And especially as like, you know, these decisions become
1:22:37
less monetarily driven, as I would imagine they will with,
1:22:40
you know, the abundance concept. You know, people will choose to
1:22:43
go in the direction of whatever their passions are.
1:22:46
And then hopefully there's some of them and many of them are to
1:22:48
the betterment of, of the, you know, the collective, you know,
1:22:52
and others. And I, and I would, I would like
1:22:55
to think of that could be a trend that would really help
1:22:57
transform and take us kind of further into that, into that
1:23:00
world. I know that that's, those are
1:23:03
some ideals that I've, that I've taken from my parents and, and
1:23:06
my grandparents and, and they've served us well.
1:23:10
So yeah, it's it's a great honor to be working on something that,
1:23:13
you know, has the potential to help a lot of people.
1:23:15
It's a great honor for us to be investors in you and and I'm
1:23:20
looking forward to it being wildly successful and continuing
1:23:24
to help along the way. Thank.
1:23:25
You, Brad, yeah, you guys have been so such tremendous
1:23:27
supporters and and every bit of that has has helped.
1:23:31
So I'm very deeply grateful for for that and the work that
1:23:34
you've done here in Austin to pull so many bright minds
1:23:36
together. And you know, nothing happens
1:23:39
alone. It's a.
1:23:41
It is a the collective unlock that I think really makes all
1:23:45
the difference. So since the beginning of Love
1:23:48
Conquers Fear, it's team humanity all the way.
1:23:50
Yeah, that's well played. I appreciate it, brother.
1:23:52
Thank you, Brett. Thank you so much.
1:23:55
Thanks again, everybody for tuning in to Love Conquers Fear.
1:23:58
I thought that was an amazing episode, deeply soulful, really
1:24:02
helping a lot of people out there.
1:24:05
And I can't even imagine the potential that when it goes all
1:24:09
over the world and there's so many obvious adjacencies to
1:24:12
outside of firefighting for that to really have an impact.
1:24:15
So it's going to be amazing to see Sam and his team unfold over
1:24:21
the years and just really proud to be a part of it.
1:24:24
Amazing, amazing guest coming up.
1:24:27
As I said on prior episodes, I am fully, fully booked until the
1:24:32
end of February. I'm starting to book into March
1:24:35
now. So you'll see a lot of episodes
1:24:39
launching. And I really appreciate all the
1:24:42
love everybody's giving. You know, I'm seeing a real
1:24:46
heart shift out out there. I'm having a lot of messages now
1:24:50
every day from people who this is really impacting.
1:24:54
And stay tuned. Thanks for all the love.
1:24:57
Keep on sharing it and Team Humanity all the way.
1:25:02
Thank you.