Latest / The Paul Barron Crypto Show / Crypto-Friendly Countries🚩Nomad Capitalist INTERVIEW

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Crypto-Friendly Countries🚩Nomad Capitalist INTERVIEW · The Paul Barron Crypto Show

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Things are starting to move around in the markets, and of course some of
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the things that we're seeing is how people are looking at international opportunities around whether
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you're a bitcoiner or maybe you're just into cryptocurrency as a whole. Well,
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today we're going to be breaking down a little bit more about all that.
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I think you guys are gonna love it. My name is Paul Bara.
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Welcome back into tech Path. Before we get started with our guest today,
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link down below. It'll get you started. All right, So let's get
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into it. I want to go a little bit further into this. This
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is something that we've talked about for quite some time around getting into a topic
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of how you know, people are starting to see crypto as more of a
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global impact on whether it's wealth growth or you're just in a position to maybe,
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hey, I want to look at retirement. All those kind of things
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really start to play out into a strategy. And we're going to have nomad
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Capitalist on today. Who is Andrew Henderson. You guys have probably seen him.
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Andrew. Good to have you on the show. Yeah, thanks for
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having me. So, Andrew, let's get into a little bit about nomad
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capitalists. Some people may not know your channel, of course, you guys
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just search No Bad Capitalists. You'll find it over there on YouTube. You
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guys talk a lot about going to what going where you're treated best? Is
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that the claim to fame? Give us a little bit words, Yes,
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yeah, go where you're treated best. And I think that I've looked for
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years, since I was a kid around the dinner table with my family,
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at the statistics and the indexes and the benchmarks, and I see where I'm
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from in the United States and other Western countries what we call the legacy brand,
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countries that are kind of living off of fumes. They were once worth
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going to, but now it's kind of just the residual marketing. It takes
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decades to get marketing out of people's brains. And so I've been watching for
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decades how these countries are heading in the wrong direction, and the people in
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those countries often laugh at the countries that are growing that you don't hear a
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lot about in the Western media, the countries where I'm in places like Malaysia,
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where we host our annual event and I spend my winters, it's tax
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friendly, the quality of living is great, the people are a lot nicer.
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I mean, there's a lot of things in a country like Malaysia and
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many other emerging countries that are growing. And now I think you're seeing this
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multipolarity where different businesses are not welcome in different parts of the world. Different
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investors are not welcome crypto investors. If you're an American, you're at a
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disadvantage. And so you're kind of seeing a reduction in freedom on the personal
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freedom freedomnomically in Western countries, and you're seeing in some places overseas an increase.
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And so what I've said is go where you're treated best. It doesn't
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have to be the same place. You could put your brokerage account somewhere your
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bank account somewhere else. You could put your crypto account somewhere else, if
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you're holding it on an exchange, as you mentioned, you could live somewhere
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else. You can have your business somewhere else. Entirely figure out what is
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the best place for each part of your life. You can marry someone or
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date someone from somewhere else. People come up to me, I met the
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level of my life following your advice. So you know, go where you're
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treated best, and it doesn't have to be just one place. Yeah.
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I think the key here is we've seen, you know, most of our
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audience, about forty five percent or so are US based, and then we
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have another one hundred and sixty countries that follow this channel around the world,
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obviously cryptocentric. That really has kind of set up, I think, into
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a very unique position because of what we've seen with Miko. We'll talk about
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that in the EU, but also we're starting to see the Pacific rim be
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become a lot more receptive of what's been happening in Web three, crypto and
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of course blockchain technologies going forward. With that being the case, and if
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the US does lose its pole position in terms of kind of the next generation
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of technology. Many people would look at Silicon Valley as kind of the reason
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that the US rose to power, and I would agree with that. But
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if you look at the next generation, whether that's AI obviously, chips as
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well as the software that might be offshoring, and then of course blockchain going
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offshore. When you look at that and you see the different areas and regions
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of the globe, what have you seen that has been more technologically savvy that
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could fit into at least the blockchain side of things, mostly in the Pacific
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rim Or are you seeing things like in Dubai, etc. Well it's all
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over I mean for years now. The country of Georgia, which I talked
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about long time ago, I mean they decided to put a lot of their
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public records on the blockchain, and so they've embraced technologies. I think what
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you're seeing is a couple of trends. Smaller countries in a more competitive world
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want to gain an edge, and so if you're into crypto or web three
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or AI, there may be a country that's specifically of interest to you that
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might not be of interest as much to someone who runs a consulting business,
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for example, because what you're going to see is and imagine this countries competing
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for your business. There are a number of countries that have tax incentives,
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hiring incentives, grants from Chile you know a dozen years ago, to our
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media today and many others to bring your tech company there. They've got special
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regimes for tech companies. They want those people to come. I can't bring
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my business, a consulting business there and reduce my taxes to single digits,
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but a tech business could. And so you know, it's it's kind of
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like you know, the dollars, the world reserve currency. People say,
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oh, it's never going to fall off its pedestal, what would replace it?
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Well, that's exactly the point. Nothing is going to replace it.
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It's just going to slowly lose share. As you know, the yen added
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two percentage points in the last couple of years, the euro and everybody's adding
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a couple of percentage points. And I think that's what countries are looking at
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in a space like this. Hey, if we could add a niche field
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in Bermuda or Malta or Georgia cater to crypto bitcoin minors with cheap electricity,
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for example, you know, if we can just get this one field and
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be known for that. That's all we need. I just interviewed a guy.
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He renounced US citizenship like thirty years ago. He moved to Angolin the
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Caribbean. They got fourteen thousand people, and he says, by the end
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of this year, half of the entire island's budget is going to come from
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dot Ai domains. I mean, if you've got six million dollars a month
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in the United States, that would pay the debt off for about a millisecond.
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But it pays off, you know, it pays half the expenses of
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his island, and so you can do things a lot more innovative. And
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so I think when you look at you know, the U and I think,
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you know, people can say Trump's going to be a good thing,
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but I think Trump's going to, you know, ratchet up some of the
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you know, we talked about trade wars and stuff with China. You see
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companies like Kasperski Labs now recently, you know, wanting to get they have
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to go to the US. They're Russian. You see Chinese companies getting out.
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What's happening more quote unquote enemy countries for Westerners are developing their own stuff
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they're going to make their own ships, they're going to do their own thing,
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and I think that's just going to keep contributing to multiplarity more competition around
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the world that never existed twenty five years ago. When I was a kid,
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there weren't that many options, and now there are. I think you're
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looking for smaller countries that are pro market, pro frey market, and that
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want to attract this particular Niche well, I think, you know, when
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you look at Trump's position, obviously we've seen, you know, so pretty
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big deals happening here over the last couple of weeks, with Trump also pivoting
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his position on blockchain, because he's been one that was somewhat anti blockchain,
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and I think once Vivic Ramaswami was able to kind of get in his ear
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teach him a little bit of what really what is happening. He say it
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was a scam in nineteen he did. Yeah, very very anti crypto and
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education sometimes I think will open, you know, true innovator's minds. Now,
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whether Trump is a true innovator or not, the fact is he sees
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there's an opportunity here for the United States to maybe get a pole position in
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technology again. Now is it too late? Is the real question? What
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we've seen happening not only in Japan, and I'll talk about that in a
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second, also in Hong Kong. Then you look at Singapore as being a
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hub now for a lot of blockchain development comes, including Cambodia. And then
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you look at Dubai, which is kind of the haven for millionaires that have
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kind of already made it and are looking to kind of grow their consulting business.
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Do you think that Trump could come in get in a position, even
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if he does do a hardline in terms of import export, but at least
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get back into putting the US in an innovation stance in terms of growth.
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Do you think that is a possibility. By the way, I think that
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the consulting business owner should look at other options in dubuy. I mean,
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we've got about thirty two tex friendly countries to buy now has and the UAEL
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has a nine percent tax for almost all businesses. So if you're choosing somewhere
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to move and there's a place that zero, one, two or five percent
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that maybe you can get a passport from while you're living there, that should
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be considered. I mean, don't just look at hey, I'm paying forty,
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Now I can go to nine. That's pretty good. Well, if
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you could go from forty to three plus you get a passport five years from
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now and you get that extra perk, you know, that's worth considering.
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But to your point on Trump, you now, I'm an entrepreneur first and
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an investor second. I think that's how I'm wired. And so I've said,
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for example, I'm not going to buy in Vidia stock. I do
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have you know, a tech you know, fun Tech, ETF and Vidias
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in there. But I spend my time running my business. That's my growth
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stock. And for me to pay attention to all the machinations of what's happening
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in AI and is there's some is going to overtake Ennvidia and always paying attention
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to that. If you're a full time investor, that's one thing, But
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for the rest of US, I just can't do that. And I look
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at countries the same way Trump gets in for four years. Does that mean
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that the culture of the United States has changed? I don't think it does.
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I think it means that people flip like the wind. I think it
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means that people in the US and other Western countries are harder hit than ever
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I just saw it takes you to the middle of July living in London just
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to pay your rent. So people are hurting. And this is what I
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talked about with my father when I was twelve, thirteen, fourteen years old.
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I don't think people have changed the culture of give us free stuff,
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regulate the rich guys take from them. I think that's generally where the Western
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world is going increasingly. And I see that. I think that people number
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one, Joe Biden probably the worst political candidate you know, in the history
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of planet Earth or planet Zuutron. So there's that, and I think people
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are just saying, let's shake things up. I don't think that's an endorsement
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from the average person from crypto or web three or Ai. And if some
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of the demagogue comes in and says, hey, these people. Look at
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these crypto bros. Look at them in Dubai. They're with the Ukrainian girls
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with their US passport. They're not paying as everything. You think the average
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American or Brett or Australian's not going to say, yeah, that's offensive to
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I'm paying I can barely pay my rent. Yeah, go after that guy.
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I think you know, citizenship based taxation in the US is already a
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thing. I think more Western countries will will bring it in. So sure,
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maybe it gets better for four years. But I'll tell you we have
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a company in another Western country, Ireland. We have some staff there,
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and I saw the tax return they had to file for that company and the
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work they had to do to manage that company. It is night and day
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difference than the US, where you're pooping your pants practically worrying that you don't
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put the wrong number in the wrong place by accident, and they come and
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you know, get you. You know, it's only the United States where
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I see I go on you know, coin desk, and every day someone's
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being sued by the US or someone's being thrown in prison. I'm sure some
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of them deserve it, and I'm sure some of them were just like running
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an honest business like entrepreneurs do. And I just don't know that one guy
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gets in power. I mean, I just I think with anything you've got
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to you know, the United States is not a country that turns on a
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dime. It's an aircraft carrier, not a pontoon boat. And I don't
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know how one guy in four years changes the fabric of the country. Well,
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I think the key here is understanding where innovation can happen, because really
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entrepreneurs are looking for places to do startups. You look at a lot of
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companies now who are stateside here in the US, including companies like our own
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and a media company who have looked at blockchain integrations, and a lot of
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varieties of our own businesses, and we start to question whether or not it's
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even going to be innovative enough here in the US. So if you look
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at that as a challenge, because in the past, the United States has
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been pretty much the crib, the cradle of innovation, especially around technology.
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Where would you say is the next I won't say Silicon Valley, but at
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least the next innovation hub or mecca that is starting to emerge early on because
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right now it feels like there's a lot of jockeying for position right now around
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the world. Well, this is kind of the classic question is how much
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development and how much infrastructure do you want? So you mentioned Singapore more recently
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Dubai. I was talking to very wealthy guy in Dubai. Now that long
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ago, we said, back in the mid twenty tens, nobody was here.
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This was like a real nascent place for tech and for innovation, and
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now it's a hub now again, I mean you saw on the UAE,
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I mean they changed the free zone after saying they wouldn't, and now there
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is a tax. Okay, I'm not opposed to paying any tax at all.
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I just think people should be aware there is a tax there for most
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companies. Now, so those are maybe two that have more development. You
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could argue, you know, someone that changes their tax policy in a dime
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is less developed. But as Singapore is there, you know, Malta is
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a developed place, and I think that they're trying to get into some of
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these you know, these spaces you know again Georgia and some regard was Bermuda
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was in there, and me, I think there's a lot of places.
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I mean you're seeing just even parts of places that are interested in doing this.
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I mean there's guys down you know, in El Salvador of course,
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who are interested in the president. There is Argentina going to be a place.
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I'm not so convinced, but you know, you know, the the
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question is do I want to go to the place where it's already working,
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or do I want to go somewhere up and coming. I mean I mentioned
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even in our you know, Armenia a little bit more developed than that is
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Israel. I mean, they have tech spaces, So you know, it's
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you know, what am I comfortable going to? For me, I like
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to live in places that have some room to run. But not everybody's going
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to agree with me. Somebody might want to go to Singapo that the challenge
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that I see from the nomad capitalist perspective is that, you know, Singapore
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is a hard place to get into these days. You better start one hell
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of a business that impresses them. And even then there's going to be some
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restrictions on you moving there and your family moving there for a little while.
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You're not going to get citizenship the way you used to be able to,
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so you're always going to kind of be there in a residence permit. It's
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not the lowest tax jurisdiction. So I mean, you always want to look
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at what's the reality in the ground if you want to go there. The
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place that super developed may say, well, we only need you if you've
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got you know, fifty million dollars in revenue, and so if you're not
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there, it may be harder to move in so okay, So that brings
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up a point, and I think this is something that is started to make
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its way into Western countries more so. Ramaswami talks a little bit about this.
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You know, border problems are not just in the United States, but
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that's one of our biggest one. You get the law and order issue that
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has started to appear in a lot of the EU. You also have economy
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issues that are in some of these emerging markets. Where would you go and
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if you are a business owner, if you're an innovator, if you're a
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software developer, you're someone in Web three that's starting to build a new business.
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Now I'm looking at the landscape and I'm saying, Andrew, there doesn't
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seem to be a lot of places to really hang our hat. Well,
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there's two hundred and fifty two sovereign countries and autonomous territories out there. I
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think that what you want to do is two things. Number One, you
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can't look at the places that you've heard of. And so yeah, people
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will say, oh, I'm from the US, Well, Canada was the
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option twenty years ago. Now look at it and the UK is not great.
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And I took a vacation to Italy and they're having problems. Well,
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number one, from a tax perspective, Italy has gotten so bad that they've
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realized, hey, let's have a number of different tax incentives for both average
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people and rich people, and so you can go there and pay a pretty
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low vaiti of tax at least for quite a number of years. But if
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that's your system, right, I mean, how many people are thinking about
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Georgia. A Salvador has gotten some press now in the bitcoin community, but
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how many people are thinking about Malaysia? For example? Someone the other day
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I made a video and I said, the average American probably thinks Malaysia as
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a hell hole. And someone said that's dumb, and someone else replied,
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I bet seventy five percent of Americans think it's like collapsing and people are dying
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in the streets. So, you know, if you're only looking at places
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that are similar to yours, you're going to come to that conclusion. I
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think we just put out something recently saying, you know, if you're worried
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about the whole you know, World Economic Forum kind of stuff, you know,
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where you should really look at least having a passport and having optionality.
17:33
I'm not saying move there. But I'm saying having optionality for the future Africa.
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But you know it's easy to laugh at that and say, yeah,
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but in Africa, look at Africa, Okay, Well, listen, A
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lot changes in a decade, and certainly in two or three or five decades,
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in the same way that you know, if I had to give birth
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somewhere. If I'm American, I would give birth in Mexico. I would
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want my child. Fine, get them a US passport if you can also,
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but I would rather my child be a Mexican. Twenty years from now,
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I think there'll be fewer restrictions, fewer regulations, and more opportunities.
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And if they can be both, all the better. So that's the first
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thing you have to consider. The second thing is I would live in a
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place where I feel good, where I have an affordable and a nice lifestyle,
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where I'm left alone with what I call soft freedom. Some Malaysia would
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fit into that criteria. People are pretty chill if you're a foreigner. They
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leave you alone. They're not really bothered with what you're doing overseas for the
18:27
most part. And then I'd have my business structured somewhere else. Our business
18:32
is set up in a place we have zero people located there. Yeah,
18:36
well, I mean zero people kind of like working on the business. And
18:40
so I think that that's the part that I'm saying. I would find a
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place where I like to live where from an economic and a personal freedom standpoint,
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they're not concerned what I'm doing. Tax systems that say, hey,
18:52
what you do somewhere else is your business, and just a fabric where it's
18:56
like, hey, we don't want to screw with people maybe in general or
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certainly not foreigners. And so if you can cut those two in half,
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you know, Dubai is that one place some people like to live there,
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and the taxes were always good, So that's kind of one stop shopping.
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If you want to do that, that's fine. I don't think that you're
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that diversified. So I would certainly want other residents permits, passports, places
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to go, that kind of thing. But you know that to that point.
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By the way, you know, the one thing that nails a lot
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of people on Malaysia is the time zone. If your customers or your people,
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I mean, you're twelve thirteen hours ahead of New York and people.
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I had a guy from Ireland go there. He's like, Man, I'm
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up till two in the bloody morning. He's like, everything else is great,
19:38
but that So maybe that's what sinks it for you. Okay, what's
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the equivalent. Maybe it's Uruguay in South America where they just kind of leave
19:45
your offshore stuff alone and you set up shop in whatever the best place for
19:49
you. Maybe it is Dubai. Maybe you're willing to pay the nine percent
19:52
because you like the regulatory framework they're building and you like their attitude because they
19:56
do want to put themselves on the map. So it could be living Europe.
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I live in Malaysia, have your business in Dubai, have your business,
20:02
you know, in Malta. But I would look at cutting it up.
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But there's two hundred and fifty two places to go. There's somewhere to
20:08
go. Yeah, well, okay, So you look at the changes that
20:11
are happening in the EU. MICA has been passed, which is basically a
20:15
crypto regulation front that is very favorable to a certain extent. Again, I
20:22
always look at it in the sense of I'm waiting for the other shoot to
20:25
drop, you know, in the EU around the companies that are now kind
20:29
of flocking to this area. But Mika, of course talked about a couple
20:33
of things are going after more consumer protection, more market stability, crypto businesses
20:38
getting them license. So at least there's a pathway because we're here in the
20:44
US. It's almost impossible because the SEC is constantly on top of these guys.
20:47
But could the EU end up fostering a handful of countries that might be
20:52
good for this next generation of tech? And specifically, I want to look
20:56
at places like Portugal, which has been market good friend of mine set up
21:02
a shop there. He's got a great media company running it, but he
21:04
himself has said he probably would make a different choice. Now, what are
21:07
your thoughts on the EU if we do see some tech advances there? I
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mean, Portugal is a good place to live, and they had the tax
21:15
incentive. They got with of the tax incentive, now they may bring it
21:18
back in a quite limited capacity. So I think that Portugal the ship is
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sailed. And again, if you like living there and you're already living there
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and you already have that ten year tax, still great. I don't see
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a reason to go out of all the places on Earth to a place that
21:33
is affordable. But I mean, the Communist Party gets a chunk of the
21:38
boat there, and that's been that way since I first went fifteen years ago.
21:42
I think you can find other places. We've got a guy in my
21:45
team who even advocates that for a limited period of time you'd be halfway better
21:49
off in Spain, which is crazy to me. Yeah, I mean,
21:53
listen, I'm very I have mixed feelings on the EU. It is very
21:56
regulated. You can look at it both ways in terms of all the consumer
22:00
protection laws. Yes, they're always going after tech companies. There's this kind
22:03
of animosity between the US and the EU, and you know they look out
22:07
for their citizens kind of thing. I will say this, I'm in business
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and I'm generally pro business. There is I think there's more of a logic
22:15
at times to what the EU does and the framework they try to build.
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I don't always agree with the framework, but it makes a bit more sense
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to me in terms of what they're trying to accomplish, even if I don't
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agree with it. So I feel maybe Germany's a little bit different. But
22:32
you know, many of the EU countries, and I mentioned Ireland is one,
22:36
it just feels a bit easier to operate even if things are not quite
22:40
as agreeable to a tech company. And yeah, I think you will see
22:45
some companies again. I mean, just look at this the other day.
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I mean, the populations of some of these countries in Europe are not that
22:52
big. Some of them they want to get on the map. Everyone's competing
22:55
today, that's the message. It was not the case when I was a
22:57
kid. Every country is competing. Now you've got countries that were left for
23:02
dead thirty years ago that have thrown their hat in the ring and they have
23:04
grown five ten x faster than Western countries. So yes, I think there's
23:10
an opportunity. The other benefit is if you're an EU citizen, if an
23:14
EU member state, you can move around. If you're a US citizen,
23:17
you can move from California to Texas, but the federal government still rules.
23:22
I mean to say, you got rid of a state tax, well that's
23:25
great, but you still have all the federal rules, all the federal regulations
23:27
everything in the European Union. If you're Irish, you can say, hey,
23:32
malt is the best place. I'm just going to move there, and
23:33
it's a whole new ballgame. And unlike the US, Ireland or all the
23:37
other EU countries let you out when you no longer live there. Their regulations
23:42
in taxes don't follow you. So if I had to choose between being European
23:47
and American, I think you've had a lot more optionalities a European, even
23:52
though I don't agree with absolutely everything that they said. Yeah, yeah,
23:56
I can understand that you spoke of a lot of these emerging markets. One
24:00
of the areas we've been watching quite a bit, primarily as a potential for
24:04
an alternate reserve system out there, and that is bricks. When you look
24:10
at the Bricks organization and also just the amount of countries that are starting to
24:15
roll into this and the potential for them to dedollarize, because this is something
24:18
that is really kind of showingcasing a little bit. This is Iran who just
24:25
proposed this, but they're looking at dedollarization campaign that would change bilateral oil and
24:29
gas to trade deals, and this could implement potentially looking at things around cryptocurrency,
24:34
which of course would be very beneficial to our audience. You look at
24:38
BRICKS as a whole, and if it continues to grow in terms of the
24:41
number of countries that are joining it within that group, have you analyzed the
24:47
Bricks Group as far as countries and said, okay, well, these might
24:49
be some potential opportunities here for nomads. We have looked at it, and
24:55
again it's a spectrum of how much development do you want? I mean,
24:57
okay, Uganda is small player in the world of bricks. I think there's
25:02
interesting things in Uganda. I think that as part of a play. You
25:06
know, once you get past your Plan B, you know, I look
25:08
at Plan e FG. We have more clients who are looking at doing very
25:12
deep you know, backup planning. You know, that's something for the for
25:17
a real adventurer. The stuff like that that I've done in Cambodia, in
25:22
Georgia and other countries like that, you know, for over a decade has
25:25
paid off. I'm happy I have it. I think there's value to that
25:29
in terms of Hey, it's easy to get a passport, it's easy to
25:30
get a residence permit, it's easy to get cheap deals. It's easy to
25:33
talk to people in the government and pitch you know, crypto when no one
25:37
else is interested. On the other hand, you know what I mentioned,
25:41
Malaysia, Thailand, they recently won in here's the interesting analogy. You know,
25:48
Visa v. Trump is America first to the United States, and the
25:52
reason I always thought that was kind of weird. People say, oh,
25:55
why don't you believe America first. I'm okay with America first, but it
25:59
should be other countries can have their country first. To Malaysia first, is
26:03
what they're saying. We want to join bricks. Why the same thing that
26:07
the African countries say, the same thing that all of the countries are saying.
26:11
The US comes as the only guy in the block, and they bully
26:15
us, and they lecture us, and they tell us, hey, you've
26:18
got to be on our side or else you're bad. And now we have
26:22
an alternative. Seventy five percent of Malayians would rather be with China. And
26:26
that sounds scary to Americans. I swear Malaysians probably the nicest people and the
26:30
kindest people you'll ever meet. But seventy five percent of them say, you
26:34
know what, geopolitically, militarily, all those things, we're better off with
26:38
China. We've been at a US ally, they haven't done much for US.
26:41
Africa says the same thing. It's all about we want to grow our
26:45
economy. We don't want crumbs of aid. We don't want you to lecturers,
26:48
we want business partnerships. And so those countries are dealing with's best for
26:52
them and they're saying, let's join bricks. I think the US flew too
26:56
close to the sun. They have five xd in this century, the number
27:00
of people and basically countries that they've sanctioned. Nineteen percent of the world is
27:06
sanctioned by the US government. Now, really nineteen percent of every man,
27:10
woman and child you see up the street is a terrible person who deserves to
27:12
be shut out of the financial system. No, they got drunk on power.
27:17
There was no one to rein them in. There was nobody else.
27:21
And I think that a lot of Americans who think, oh, you know,
27:23
this is still going to be the best country, they're looking at the
27:26
marketing campaign from ten to twenty years ago, not realizing that. You know,
27:30
Indonesia just went out and dramatically increased their economy at a seven to ten
27:34
x faster pace than Germany did this century. You haven't heard about it yet,
27:38
But they're moving in the right direction. Your country's moving in the wrong
27:42
direction. That people can't even afford to rent. They're living in their cars.
27:47
Nobody that I meet in the countries I go around the world, is
27:49
talking about living in their car, They're talking about opportunities, They're optimistic.
27:53
That's the story you should take away, all right. So my last question
27:57
is exit taxes, because this is something that kind of plagues the American that
28:03
is looking at maybe doing something, whether it's you know, getting into another
28:07
company with a you know, a residential a residential program, or actually becoming
28:12
a you know, a citizen and getting another passport US exit of taxes right
28:17
now, the price of renouncing your citizenship really what it boils down to,
28:21
from what I'm understanding within our research here is if your net worth exceeds two
28:26
mil when you renounce, you'd be a you basically considered and covered an expatriate.
28:32
But if you're going above that, you're continuing to get hit here from
28:34
the RS. So it's even into the sense of unrealized capital gains. What
28:40
have been some of the strategies that you've done for Americans that have been able
28:42
to say, Hey, Okay, I'm going to go and look at retiring
28:45
in Mexico. How do I go about that? And I'm my net worth
28:49
is twenty million or ten million or whatever, it might be well, none
28:53
of this is tax advice is a couple of things. First of all,
28:56
I mean, just getting a residence permit or just getting a second citizenship doesn't
29:00
trigger an exit tax. Americans who choose to give up US citizenship to exit
29:03
the US tax system, they basically move forward. Hey, you would have
29:07
had to sell this stuff eventually, so just consider that you sold it now
29:11
as you're leaving, and we'll get our last pound of flesh from you,
29:15
and so you're moving that up. I mean, one thing is just when
29:18
do you go in and do the appointment. You can defer the actual payment
29:22
more, you know, as much as you know, twelve fifteen months,
29:25
depending on when you go in and do the appointment. We had a guy
29:26
with like half a billion dollars and I said, why did none of your
29:30
lawyers tell you to do it, you know, on this date rather than
29:33
two weeks earlier, because you'll have more time. Sometimes you don't want more
29:36
time, but sometimes you do. But anyway, this is not just a
29:38
US issue. You know, people who leave certain other countries you keep your
29:44
citizenship in, you know, Australia or Canada, for example. But it's
29:48
like, well, okay, you're leaving our tax system. You know,
29:52
the Netherlands has kind of ramping this up right now. So a lot of
29:55
countries have an exit tax when you leave your tax resident status. The difference
30:00
is to fully do that as an American, you have to give up your
30:03
citizenship. Yes, there's the Puerto Rico. Yes, if you're running a
30:07
business, there's the foreigner an income exclusion. But to fully just remove all
30:11
the chains and shackles of the US, you have to give up citizenship,
30:12
whereas in other Western countries you just have to comply with increasingly rigorous tax non
30:18
residence rules. You're gone a majority of the time, you cut your ties.
30:22
You don't do this, you don't do that. So it's not just
30:25
an American thing. And what I'll tell you is we had someone, we
30:29
had a couple people that hired us multiple times. It eventually became too expensive
30:33
because they kept thinking they had time, and then when they finally wanted to
30:37
pull the trigger, they couldn't afford to renounce, or there wasn't any benefit
30:41
of renouncing, because I mean, in one case, the guy, his
30:44
company was valued a couple hundred million dollars. Well, unless you have the
30:48
liquidity to pay that. How do you renounce? How do you do that?
30:52
So, I mean what I've told clients over the years, it's not
30:55
about retiring to Mexico. I mean you can do that and keep your citizenship
30:57
and just staying compliance with tax laws, and there's ways you can reduce.
31:02
You can reduce in many cases harder if you're in passive stuff like crypto.
31:07
But what we've told people is if you're in crypto, I've had a lot
31:10
of guys, hey, I've got eight hundred grand today, I said,
31:12
well, better get your second passport. And it hurts, and it hurts
31:17
a lot more now because we used to get people's second passports in the Caribbean
31:21
if you have no other way to get one six months, one hundred thousand
31:23
dollars plus some fees. Now it's taken a little bit longer because the EU
31:27
and the US bullied them. You've got to do an interview. They're a
31:30
little slower. It might take nine to twelve months, and now it costs
31:33
two hundred grand thanks to the bullying. So if you're sitting at a million
31:37
dollars in crypto, my advice might have to be if you don't want to
31:41
be in a situation where one day you've got twenty million and you're locked in,
31:45
like the guy I've talked about, you might have to just bite the
31:48
bullet and take that two hundred grand hit and just get it done as quickly
31:52
as you can, because that's probably the quickest way to get a passport these
31:56
days, faster than through your ancestry, faster than moving somewhere else. You
32:00
might have to bite that bullet for the price of your future freedom. And
32:04
I find that a lot of people they struggle with that because like, well,
32:07
that's two hundred thousand dollars in my crypto. It's like, well,
32:09
if the croll crypto is going to twenty x, then your tax bill is
32:13
going to twenty x and you're gonna be stuck. But if you find a
32:15
way to get out now you're at a million now, and when it gets
32:17
to one point seven, you start making the moves, you could potentially pay
32:22
close to nothing if you're an American versus maybe you have to pay who knows
32:27
what the rate is in the future. Maybe Trump lowers it, but then
32:29
the next guy comes in and raises it. So I I think that,
32:32
yeah, you got to bite the bullets. Sometimes I have. All right,
32:37
listen, Andrew, it's been great having you on the show. If
32:40
you guys want to learn a little bit more about what he's doing, just
32:43
go over to Nomadcapitalist dot com. Always fun to kind of get different perspectives
32:46
on what's happening around the world. So thanks again for stopping in and we
32:50
appreciate it. Thank you you bet Are you guys are maybe tuned in on
32:54
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