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Does Paul Skenes Actually Want to be Traded to the Yankees? · Bucco Territory: A Pittsburgh Pirates Podcast

0:08
Speaker 1: What's up, everybody.
0:09
Speaker 2: Welcome back to another episode of Bucko Territory, presented to
0:12
Speaker 2: you by the Foul Territory Network.
0:15
Speaker 1: I'm Noah Hiles, joining.
0:16
Speaker 2: Me as always are my lovely co hosts Josh Harrison
0:20
Speaker 2: and Platinum Key aka Mark. Again, you're listening to Bucko Territory.
0:25
Speaker 2: You're watching Bucko Territory. We've got a big show today
0:28
Speaker 2: talking about the Biggest Guy and the Pirate Organization. And
0:33
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0:39
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0:41
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0:49
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0:51
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0:54
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1:00
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1:03
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1:06
Speaker 1: But fellas Big Day, Big.
1:08
Speaker 2: Night, we're recording this Wednesday evening in a few hours.
1:11
Speaker 1: I'm gonna go ahead and assume it. I'll be. It's
1:15
Speaker 1: like on election night.
1:16
Speaker 2: I'll be the first media outlet to officially declare Paul
1:19
Speaker 2: Skeins the National League winner in cy Young. I'll be
1:25
Speaker 2: shocked if he's not. I just don't see how he
1:30
Speaker 2: doesn't win this award. I was a voter for this
1:33
Speaker 2: year's cy Young and I did give him my first
1:36
Speaker 2: place vote. I'm allowed to say that now because this
1:39
Speaker 2: is releasing after the award is announced. So I guess
1:44
Speaker 2: we'll start there. This is gonna be a Skeens focused show.
1:48
Speaker 2: We'll start with the good news. I guess that he
1:50
Speaker 2: won the cy Young and react to that, because we've
1:53
Speaker 2: got some bad news for Pirates fans pertaining to Paul
1:55
Speaker 2: Skeens as well to react to.
1:57
Speaker 1: But Josh, I'll go to you first.
1:59
Speaker 2: I mean you alongside I'd say, probably the best picture
2:04
Speaker 2: the Pirates have had in my lifetime that's not named
2:06
Speaker 2: Paul Skins Garrett Cole. When you look at what Garrett
2:10
Speaker 2: Cole did as a rookie and as a youngster, and
2:13
Speaker 2: how good he was, especially in that twenty fifteen season,
2:16
Speaker 2: does it just kind of make you marvel and amazement
2:18
Speaker 2: and what how much better schemes has been? Really than
2:21
Speaker 2: just anyone who's thrown a baseball in this organization.
2:26
Speaker 3: Uh, it's been it's been definitely a sight to see
2:29
Speaker 3: watching him from you know, the outskirts. He is definitely
2:33
Speaker 3: a generational talent, something that you want to be able
2:37
Speaker 3: to be proud of and not waste any of his
2:39
Speaker 3: you know, better years, as I would say, and you know,
2:43
Speaker 3: deservingly so, cy Young. That is, you know, an award
2:46
Speaker 3: that I don't think anybody you know would look at
2:48
Speaker 3: this as a surprise. But all that does is just
2:51
Speaker 3: I think put more fuel to the fire for for schemes,
2:54
Speaker 3: but also for the pirates. Is hey, you got the
2:56
Speaker 3: best picture in baseball. Let's let's let's put some behind it,
3:00
Speaker 3: because you know, it's very rare that you get a
3:02
Speaker 3: picture to do what he does. And I know every
3:04
Speaker 3: fifth day, whoever that opposing team is, they I don't
3:08
Speaker 3: want to say they chalking it up, but they're like,
3:10
Speaker 3: if we can get this guy out before five or six,
3:12
Speaker 3: you know, we got a better chance. And you know
3:15
Speaker 3: it's a testament to his body of work.
3:18
Speaker 2: And Mark, I'll ask you, I mean, you're you're a
3:20
Speaker 2: guy who loves to celebrate all of the wins, the
3:25
Speaker 2: Pirates have all the big moments, and you know this,
3:28
Speaker 2: this is the day you're probably looking forward to as
3:30
Speaker 2: a fan. Skins is obviously one of your main guys.
3:34
Speaker 2: How much joy is he brought to you as a
3:36
Speaker 2: fan in the seas.
3:38
Speaker 4: I can't imagine what the Pirates would look like without
3:41
Speaker 4: Paul Skins. It's been hard to watch, you know, as
3:45
Speaker 4: a fan, hard to stick with him. It's We've had
3:47
Speaker 4: some disappointing seasons, but every five days there is a
3:51
Speaker 4: shining bright spot of just sheer dominance on the mound
3:55
Speaker 4: of watching the best picture in baseball play for your
3:57
Speaker 4: baseball team.
3:58
Speaker 3: It's awesome.
4:00
Speaker 4: I mean, I can't imagine how many posts are about
4:03
Speaker 4: Skeens on my account, but it's got to be over
4:06
Speaker 4: twenty five percent for one guy on a twenty six
4:09
Speaker 4: man roster. He is a superstar. It's undoubtedly. I thought
4:14
Speaker 4: it was maybe just, you know, like the rookie hype.
4:16
Speaker 4: You know, I don't know if a picture can really
4:19
Speaker 4: be a superstar in today's MLB, and he's blown that
4:23
Speaker 4: out of the water. He is a national name, national face,
4:27
Speaker 4: and yeah, I mean it's so so appreciative to have
4:30
Speaker 4: him on this team.
4:32
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'll just share a quick story.
4:36
Speaker 2: My first year on the beat was twenty twenty four
4:38
Speaker 2: for the Post Gazette, and I remember going up to
4:41
Speaker 2: Louisville to watch Skenes' first triple A start.
4:44
Speaker 1: And he only threw three innings. He was nine up,
4:46
Speaker 1: nine down.
4:48
Speaker 2: I remember calling my dad after that game and he
4:50
Speaker 2: was asking, how you know how to look, and I
4:52
Speaker 2: just said that this isn't an exaggeration. This is the
4:55
Speaker 2: best picture I've ever seen. And however, however good like
4:59
Speaker 2: people think he's going to be when.
5:01
Speaker 1: He arrives, he will exceed their expectations.
5:05
Speaker 2: Like this guy the moment, I said, the moment he
5:08
Speaker 2: steps on a big league mound, he'll be a top
5:09
Speaker 2: ten pitcher in the game.
5:11
Speaker 1: And I even undersold him because really, from.
5:13
Speaker 2: The moment he's arrived, he's been the best picture on
5:17
Speaker 2: the planet.
5:18
Speaker 1: It's been truly incredible to watch.
5:20
Speaker 4: But it's crazy to even think that there was a
5:22
Speaker 4: debate about who the Pirates should take at one on
5:25
Speaker 4: one that year, because I mean, Dylan Cruz, no shade
5:29
Speaker 4: to him at all, but I mean that was a
5:33
Speaker 4: tough choice to make if Pirates had a wealth of pitching,
5:36
Speaker 4: saying oh, we obviously have a need and outfield still do.
5:39
Speaker 4: But to have a top ten player in the game,
5:42
Speaker 4: and maybe that's under selling him, not just pitcher, I
5:44
Speaker 4: mean just overall is yeah.
5:47
Speaker 3: I mean that's what you hope with the first overall pick,
5:49
Speaker 3: is to not miss and that's one that you would
5:52
Speaker 3: say that they didn't miss on.
5:54
Speaker 2: Yes, but having Paul Skins on your roster for a
5:58
Speaker 2: team like the Pirates is both a gift and in
6:01
Speaker 2: a way a bit of a curse because Paul Skins
6:05
Speaker 2: is excellence in a way shines light on the Pirates'
6:09
Speaker 2: many inadequacies.
6:11
Speaker 1: It puts pressure on them to perform.
6:14
Speaker 2: Like Josh just mentioned, it's a gift to have the
6:18
Speaker 2: best pitcher in baseball, and when you do not succeed
6:21
Speaker 2: despite having something a resource and asset that no other
6:26
Speaker 2: team in baseball has, people are going to start to
6:29
Speaker 2: wonder why. And some things that probably weren't at the
6:36
Speaker 2: forefront of the attention of the baseball world have become
6:41
Speaker 2: a mainstream discussion over the last year. The fact that
6:46
Speaker 2: they don't spend a ton of money, their struggles with
6:49
Speaker 2: developing hitters, identifying big league capable hitters.
6:54
Speaker 1: You know, their lack of I don't even know a
6:58
Speaker 1: better way to say it.
6:59
Speaker 2: Just they're they're they're never seeming to be on the
7:02
Speaker 2: same page as an organization. All of these struggles have
7:05
Speaker 2: become a national conversation because when you have a star
7:09
Speaker 2: like this, it's not just Pittsburgh who wants to see
7:12
Speaker 2: him play on the game's biggest stage. It's all of baseball.
7:16
Speaker 2: They want to see what this guy can do in
7:18
Speaker 2: the playoffs. They want to see him try to replicate
7:21
Speaker 2: what Yamamoto did this postseason. When you're watching that, you
7:24
Speaker 2: think how many guys could even attempt to do that.
7:27
Speaker 1: I can think of two.
7:28
Speaker 2: One plays in Detroit, albeit who knows for much how
7:32
Speaker 2: much longer? And one plays in Pittsburgh for again, who
7:36
Speaker 2: knows how much longer. The big topic of today's show,
7:40
Speaker 2: unfortunately for Pirates fans, isn't about Paul Skeins winning the
7:43
Speaker 2: Cy Young. It's about a top It's about a story
7:48
Speaker 2: that ran in the morning his Cy Young Award was announced.
7:53
Speaker 2: A story from Randy Miller of New Jersey dot Com
7:57
Speaker 2: UH included this quote from a non this ex teammate
8:01
Speaker 2: of Paul Skeins's, and it reads, trust me, he wants
8:05
Speaker 2: to play for the Yankees. I heard him say it
8:08
Speaker 2: multiple times. Anytime you throw the words schemes and Yankees
8:13
Speaker 2: in the same sentence, it's going to explode.
8:17
Speaker 1: And that's what this did. That's been all over graphics.
8:20
Speaker 2: I've seen a million quote cards from every baseball outlet,
8:24
Speaker 2: every media outlet that covers baseball, and it's going to
8:27
Speaker 2: be a conversation that continues.
8:29
Speaker 1: It's going to be something that Paul has the answer for.
8:31
Speaker 2: Unfortunately for him, it's going to be a conversation that
8:35
Speaker 2: goes on in New York media for years. I'm sure
8:39
Speaker 2: in Pittsburgh. There's a lot of ways we can react
8:45
Speaker 2: to this news. I want to start by just asking Josh. Josh,
8:49
Speaker 2: let's say you're a player in the Pirates clubhouse, what's
8:52
Speaker 2: your reaction to seeing this story? Because it's twofold. One
8:56
Speaker 2: your best player is allegedly having told play that he
9:00
Speaker 2: wants to play for another team.
9:02
Speaker 1: And then on the other side, you got a guy.
9:04
Speaker 2: Who was your brother, was your teammate, and he's airing
9:07
Speaker 2: out someone's personal conversations to the media.
9:10
Speaker 1: So what is your reaction to this entire scenario.
9:14
Speaker 3: Reaction is not to read too much into it, you know,
9:18
Speaker 3: especially around this time of year, you know, trade roomors
9:20
Speaker 3: are gonna pop up. And the thing with trade rumors,
9:22
Speaker 3: you don't know how recent, how current, how true it is,
9:26
Speaker 3: you know, and not saying that there isn't any truth
9:28
Speaker 3: and not saying that there is. But honestly, when when
9:32
Speaker 3: you're in the clubhouse with guys, you have conversations not
9:35
Speaker 3: necessary about who you would like to play for this
9:37
Speaker 3: or that, but you know you're gonna have organic conversations
9:40
Speaker 3: around the table just in general about baseball. And you know,
9:44
Speaker 3: everybody comes from different places, and some people, oh, yeah, man,
9:46
Speaker 3: I grew up a you know, a Yankees fan, or
9:48
Speaker 3: I grew up a Dodgers fan. Somebody could take that
9:50
Speaker 3: out of context saying that you want to play for them.
9:53
Speaker 3: But at the same time, you know, it's a business
9:57
Speaker 3: and we live in an era where you know, I
10:00
Speaker 3: guess you can kind of speak on where you want
10:01
Speaker 3: to go if that was the case. But I wouldn't
10:03
Speaker 3: read too much into it because the bit that I've
10:07
Speaker 3: seen Paul and how he interacts, I'm the type that
10:10
Speaker 3: I got to hear it come from the horse's mouth,
10:12
Speaker 3: and not to go there, but a little situation with me.
10:16
Speaker 3: I said something some years ago, you know, to where
10:20
Speaker 3: I want it out, And it wasn't really wanting out,
10:23
Speaker 3: but it was just the way that the team was moving.
10:25
Speaker 3: And you know, I made two comments. So as I said,
10:28
Speaker 3: I wouldn't read too much into it unless it comes
10:30
Speaker 3: from Paul's mouth. He says, she say ex teammates, teammate
10:34
Speaker 3: this or that, whether it's any truth to it or not.
10:37
Speaker 3: I wouldn't look too much into it unless Paul was
10:39
Speaker 3: to come out and say, Hey, I want to be
10:41
Speaker 3: a Yankee.
10:43
Speaker 1: Yeah, Mark, I'll ask you.
10:46
Speaker 2: I mean, like you just you just poured your heart
10:49
Speaker 2: out on how on your schemes fandom.
10:52
Speaker 1: Was it tough to read that quote?
10:54
Speaker 4: Not really? I mean it's we had the whole trade deadline.
10:57
Speaker 4: Everyone was saying, oh, where Schein's gonna go. It's not
11:00
Speaker 4: going to trade him? But are they the will They
11:02
Speaker 4: won't they? It's they're not going to trade.
11:04
Speaker 3: Him this year.
11:05
Speaker 4: It makes zero sense for the Pirates. There's nothing that
11:08
Speaker 4: the Yankees could offer that would intrigue the Pirates enough.
11:11
Speaker 4: There's nothing any team really that could offer the value
11:15
Speaker 4: that Paul Skins brings to this franchise. Right now, now,
11:19
Speaker 4: two years, three years from now might be a different
11:21
Speaker 4: story once he's entered arbitration. But he hasn't even hit
11:24
Speaker 4: arbitration yet, so I don't understand why the pirates would
11:27
Speaker 4: move him. It's not going to happen. So as as
11:31
Speaker 4: when I saw that, my instant reaction was nothing, Burger is,
11:35
Speaker 4: this is nothing. This is a great headline that makes
11:39
Speaker 4: me want to click on it, and a lot of
11:41
Speaker 4: people did. I'm sure that's it accomplished that goal, but
11:45
Speaker 4: as far as the validity behind it, whether I trust
11:49
Speaker 4: the source or anything of that nature, no, I mean,
11:52
Speaker 4: he could have just been in New York been like, man,
11:54
Speaker 4: I would love to play here someday. This is a
11:55
Speaker 4: great stadium, And that's the quote, and that's the whole headline.
11:59
Speaker 4: That's the story you run with. So it doesn't move
12:02
Speaker 4: the needle at all for me. He's going to be
12:04
Speaker 4: a pirate in twenty twenty six.
12:06
Speaker 2: Yeah, and ben Cherrington said as much. I personally I
12:09
Speaker 2: had two reactions to this.
12:10
Speaker 1: The first was.
12:14
Speaker 2: Like, kind of what you said, Mark, where it's like
12:17
Speaker 2: the way I take that comment is more. I mean,
12:20
Speaker 2: we didn't even get the verbatim comment from schemes. But
12:23
Speaker 2: the way I imagine it on going is, you know,
12:27
Speaker 2: he's probably talking to guys who have played in big markets,
12:31
Speaker 2: and it was just kind of a man, wouldn't that
12:33
Speaker 2: be nice?
12:34
Speaker 1: You know, wouldn't it.
12:35
Speaker 2: Be nice to play in a place like Yankee Stadium,
12:38
Speaker 2: a place where so many legends have worn that uniform?
12:41
Speaker 2: And I mean, who doesn't think about playing for the
12:44
Speaker 2: Yankees or the Dodgers. I mean that's when you're a
12:47
Speaker 2: little kid growing up, I don't care what team you
12:49
Speaker 2: root for. If you get traded to one of those
12:52
Speaker 2: two teams in MLB the show on Dynasty Mode, You're
12:56
Speaker 2: you're not restarting the game. Those are the marquee franchises.
13:00
Speaker 2: It's the same thing in football. I mean, who doesn't
13:02
Speaker 2: think about playing for the Cowboys or the Steelers or
13:05
Speaker 2: the Packers, or the Lakers or the Celtics, Right Like,
13:09
Speaker 2: that's that's just sports. And that's kind of how I imagine
13:14
Speaker 2: that conversation going. Just you know, that would be that'd
13:17
Speaker 2: be a cool opportunity. You think about it like, it's
13:19
Speaker 2: a team that's always relevant. It's a team where their
13:23
Speaker 2: standard is championship or bust. And that's how Paul Skeens operates,
13:26
Speaker 2: and I think that's probably what attract would attract him
13:30
Speaker 2: the most.
13:30
Speaker 4: And done happy too. I mean, she's from New Jersey.
13:35
Speaker 4: She works in New York a lot, so.
13:38
Speaker 1: She can live in New York and just wherever he's
13:41
Speaker 1: pitching every five days.
13:43
Speaker 3: You know, like Pittsburg, New York.
13:46
Speaker 1: That's true, right, We got tons of direct flights lots.
13:49
Speaker 4: In the similarities.
13:51
Speaker 1: Yes. Uh.
13:52
Speaker 2: The other thing is if Paul really wanted to be
13:56
Speaker 2: traded to New York, to anywhere, I don't know if
14:00
Speaker 2: there are five players who have more of a powerful
14:05
Speaker 2: voice in baseball right now, who have more of a
14:07
Speaker 2: vocal equity against their team than Paul schemes. If Paul
14:12
Speaker 2: said trade me. If Paul wanted trade it, he would
14:15
Speaker 2: just say it himself. If he wanted out, he would
14:18
Speaker 2: say it himself. And he's a guy where if he
14:20
Speaker 2: did it, if those words came out of his mouth,
14:23
Speaker 2: then the Pirates really have an issue and you have
14:27
Speaker 2: to change your whole I would assume your whole plan
14:30
Speaker 2: is an organization. But he hasn't said those words yet,
14:33
Speaker 2: and I don't anticipate Paul ever saying that on record.
14:37
Speaker 2: It might be something he says eventually behind a closed
14:41
Speaker 2: door to someone in the organization.
14:45
Speaker 1: But I don't think that that's how he operates. I
14:47
Speaker 1: think that he will.
14:49
Speaker 2: He will, you know, keep a public presenting face of
14:54
Speaker 2: I want to grind this out in Pittsburgh until I'm
14:57
Speaker 2: no longer here, and whenever he won out, he'll he'll
15:01
Speaker 2: do it in a different way.
15:03
Speaker 3: But I want to get no, not to cut you off.
15:06
Speaker 3: But that was kind of to go along with what
15:07
Speaker 3: I said was if it's not coming from the guy
15:10
Speaker 3: or not saying it, I wouldn't read too much into it, because,
15:13
Speaker 3: as I said, I have a little bit experience in this.
15:15
Speaker 3: It was after they traded Garrett and Coutch. It's not
15:19
Speaker 3: that I said trade me, but I was like the
15:22
Speaker 3: from the out from looking in, you're not putting our
15:24
Speaker 3: best team forward when you trade Garrett and Couch. So
15:27
Speaker 3: if we're not trying to win, you know, I want
15:29
Speaker 3: to be traded as well. Ended up playing my last
15:32
Speaker 3: year and becoming a free agent the year after. But
15:35
Speaker 3: you know, the guys in the clubhouse, you know, knew
15:38
Speaker 3: it came from me, but it wasn't anything that they
15:40
Speaker 3: knew was a not towards them. That was more of
15:42
Speaker 3: me pretty much calling out the front office and saying, hey,
15:45
Speaker 3: I signed here. You know, I want to win, and
15:47
Speaker 3: two guys that helped us win the past couple of years,
15:49
Speaker 3: you've traded, which, as I said, Paul has not come
15:53
Speaker 3: out and say, hey, I want to be traded. So
15:54
Speaker 3: that's why with me saying I don't, I wouldn't read
15:57
Speaker 3: into it because I've had experience of if it's not
16:00
Speaker 3: coming from the guy, don't read into.
16:01
Speaker 1: It, right.
16:03
Speaker 2: And let's look into this whole discussion a little bit
16:08
Speaker 2: further though, because like I said earlier in the show,
16:12
Speaker 2: this has been a narrative connected with Skins from his
16:15
Speaker 2: rookie year on that you know, people just seemingly can't
16:19
Speaker 2: wait for him to get out of Pittsburgh.
16:21
Speaker 1: When are they gonna get rid of them?
16:22
Speaker 2: Because they're not gonna build around him. At some point
16:27
Speaker 2: in time, you would have to figure this lights of
16:30
Speaker 2: fire under the Pirates rear ends, right, they can't continue
16:35
Speaker 2: to let this.
16:36
Speaker 1: Narrative, I mean, is there no shame?
16:38
Speaker 2: Is there no embarrassment that they have this once in
16:43
Speaker 2: a generation talent who puts their organization on a national stage.
16:49
Speaker 2: He is one of the highest branded players in this sport.
16:53
Speaker 2: Aside from maybe Otawnian Judge, I don't know who else
16:57
Speaker 2: you could put him in that put him or put
16:59
Speaker 2: on that level that he's on, and the narrative around
17:03
Speaker 2: him is, boy, we can't wait to get him out
17:06
Speaker 2: of there? Are the pirates ever going to do anything
17:10
Speaker 2: about this?
17:11
Speaker 1: Josh? You played there?
17:14
Speaker 2: What's what's the mentality like when, like you said in
17:16
Speaker 2: that in that seventeen or that eighteen season, excuse me,
17:20
Speaker 2: after Cutch and Cole were moved, how frustrating is it
17:24
Speaker 2: to feel like you're in an organization where you don't
17:27
Speaker 2: agree with the path in which it's going.
17:29
Speaker 3: Very frustrating. Uh. You know, as I said, I had
17:32
Speaker 3: signed my contract extension and we were heading the right direction.
17:35
Speaker 3: And you know, after being a couple years of moved
17:37
Speaker 3: from the playoffs, it's like, if we're going to try
17:39
Speaker 3: to make the playoffs, why are we trading two of
17:41
Speaker 3: our key pieces and one of the one of the
17:43
Speaker 3: words that were said, I remember when Garrett got traded,
17:46
Speaker 3: and I think Cutch got traded, and it sounds good,
17:51
Speaker 3: but to a guy that was in my situation, that
17:54
Speaker 3: was seven years and you know, around seven years into
17:56
Speaker 3: the league, been to the playoffs three years. Our response was,
18:00
Speaker 3: we got back a lot of controllable pieces that we like,
18:03
Speaker 3: and I'm like, I'm not interested in controllable pieces coming
18:05
Speaker 3: from the playoffs for three years. We have something here special.
18:09
Speaker 3: Controllable pieces are fine, but I'm sure everybody in that
18:11
Speaker 3: clubhouse and the fans around would want even if they
18:15
Speaker 3: are controllable pieces, pieces that are gonna add to winning now,
18:17
Speaker 3: not for the future, because we had a window of
18:21
Speaker 3: where we had those three years and then it's like
18:23
Speaker 3: that window closed very quickly and right now with a
18:26
Speaker 3: picture like you know schemes who at the time, who
18:30
Speaker 3: would be you know, this version of Garrett Cole for
18:32
Speaker 3: this era, meaning like you know, you got a first
18:34
Speaker 3: round pick, Oh, you got a you know guy that
18:36
Speaker 3: you want to build around. I think this puts pressure
18:40
Speaker 3: on the front office to say, Okay, we know we're
18:42
Speaker 3: not trading him. Obviously he's controllable, but what are you
18:45
Speaker 3: gonna do within those next couple of years that you
18:47
Speaker 3: have him make it worthwhile for him to want to stay.
18:51
Speaker 3: If that's something that Pittsburgh is willing to do, grant,
18:54
Speaker 3: I'm gonna keep my fingers crossed. We know free agency
18:56
Speaker 3: and you know price points with certain people, but sometimes
19:01
Speaker 3: things change. Winning changes everything, and you put a winning
19:04
Speaker 3: product out on the field. They can definitely make his
19:07
Speaker 3: time here worthwhile and show something to the fans that hey,
19:10
Speaker 3: we're trying to win and we want to make the
19:12
Speaker 3: most of these years.
19:14
Speaker 2: Mark, I'll ask you, your general manager, Platinum Key, now
19:20
Speaker 2: what are you doing? What are you doing to make
19:22
Speaker 2: this guy happy? I mean, it can't be as simple
19:26
Speaker 2: as spend money, because you might not have money to spend.
19:30
Speaker 1: Is it possible?
19:32
Speaker 2: Is this a possible situation where you can maximize Paul
19:35
Speaker 2: Skins's window?
19:37
Speaker 1: Yeah?
19:37
Speaker 4: I mean I think they've already started by listening to him.
19:40
Speaker 4: You know, they made a change at pitching coach and
19:42
Speaker 4: said is this I assume he was a big part
19:45
Speaker 4: of that discussion and said can we get better? We can,
19:47
Speaker 4: let's do it. That's something that the Pirates can afford
19:50
Speaker 4: and can control and made that happen, which I think
19:54
Speaker 4: that's the best thing they can do. But as far
19:56
Speaker 4: as a general manager, you got to at least try
19:58
Speaker 4: and figure out the contract extension. I think that ship
20:01
Speaker 4: has sailed way way past. I mean, he's about to
20:04
Speaker 4: win the cy Young tonight. I don't know if there
20:08
Speaker 4: ever was a window for the pirates, because I mean,
20:13
Speaker 4: this is a guy that's going to be making at
20:15
Speaker 4: least forty million a year probably at some point, probably more.
20:19
Speaker 4: We'll see, like where Schooble sets the market. So that's
20:22
Speaker 4: out of the window. If you're a GM, you can't
20:24
Speaker 4: really extend him. But you're looking at this window then
20:27
Speaker 4: a set window of all right, he's a free agent
20:30
Speaker 4: after the twenty twenty nine season. How can we make
20:33
Speaker 4: these next three to four years worthwhile? How can we
20:36
Speaker 4: build with this? How can we go all in and
20:39
Speaker 4: not just get the controllable assets that you know we
20:42
Speaker 4: used to try and go for it, go for winning assets,
20:46
Speaker 4: go for the veteran presence. Sign a couple guys in
20:49
Speaker 4: free agency. You don't have to necessarily spend over one
20:52
Speaker 4: hundred million, but build the right pieces and just show
20:56
Speaker 4: that you are trying at least show some confidence and
21:01
Speaker 4: rely on schemes to here are you home?
21:04
Speaker 2: If there was ever a time to put all your
21:06
Speaker 2: chips in the middle of the table, this would be it, right.
21:09
Speaker 1: I mean, you only got this guy for a couple
21:12
Speaker 1: more years.
21:13
Speaker 2: What if this were the time to spend an uncomfortable
21:16
Speaker 2: amount of money, Why wouldn't you do it right now?
21:19
Speaker 2: When you have Paul Skins and all these other young
21:21
Speaker 2: pitchers at a league minimum, I want to bring one.
21:25
Speaker 4: I mean, how many times are you going to have
21:28
Speaker 4: two number one overall? Like MLB prospects, They're going to
21:32
Speaker 4: be a team control.
21:34
Speaker 1: Three of them, really if you include Chandler. Yeah, I mean.
21:39
Speaker 4: So there's just so much young talent all in the
21:42
Speaker 4: same window. It's kind of like what the Orioles had
21:45
Speaker 4: a couple of years ago, where they had all these
21:47
Speaker 4: guys coming up and they had the one good season
21:50
Speaker 4: and then they, you know, gave corpor Burns a bunch
21:53
Speaker 4: of money. So there's a path out there of what
21:56
Speaker 4: to do when you have a young core like that,
21:58
Speaker 4: but you got to execute it.
22:02
Speaker 2: On the note of the extension, I'm glad you brought
22:04
Speaker 2: that up, Mark Josh. When you signed your extension in Pittsburgh,
22:09
Speaker 2: was it because you thought that Pittsburgh was the place
22:11
Speaker 2: that could give you the most money in free agency?
22:14
Speaker 2: Or was it because you were happy that they were
22:16
Speaker 2: winning and you wanted to continue to be a part
22:18
Speaker 2: of the organization.
22:20
Speaker 3: So I signed my deal. It was my first year arbitration,
22:24
Speaker 3: So we went arbitration and then I ended up signing
22:27
Speaker 3: the day after opening day. And honestly, it was twenty fourteen.
22:31
Speaker 3: It was after twenty fourteen. It was twenty fifteen. So
22:34
Speaker 3: we had just went to the playoffs two years in
22:36
Speaker 3: a row, you know, and Pittsburgh is I mean a
22:40
Speaker 3: sports town. When you're winning, Oh my goodness, it is
22:43
Speaker 3: so fun to play there. So being a part of that,
22:46
Speaker 3: and then not only that, the clubhouse, the guys that
22:48
Speaker 3: I played with, it was a no brainer. My family
22:51
Speaker 3: was comfortable, it was close to home. So like that
22:54
Speaker 3: winning culture that we had created and that I was
22:57
Speaker 3: a part of, made me want to be there. You know,
23:00
Speaker 3: Tasting the playoffs two years in a row, I'm like,
23:03
Speaker 3: why would I want to go anywhere else? He's my
23:04
Speaker 3: boys right here. We don't make the playoffs, Like, yeah,
23:07
Speaker 3: let's keep this thing rocking. And you know, as I said,
23:10
Speaker 3: things happened, you know, three four years later, out of
23:12
Speaker 3: being you know, not being in the playoffs or not
23:14
Speaker 3: even sniffing it for three to four years, you know,
23:17
Speaker 3: at some point something's got to change. And you know,
23:19
Speaker 3: obviously Roster's gonna change year to year, but nobody that
23:22
Speaker 3: plays this game gets younger. And you know, in my case,
23:25
Speaker 3: I'm like, man, I know him thirty, got a lot
23:28
Speaker 3: of years ahead of me. But at the same time,
23:29
Speaker 3: the way this game is going, I know I'm not
23:31
Speaker 3: going to be in Pittsburgh forever. I could see it.
23:34
Speaker 3: So I was trying to maximize my opportunity with those
23:37
Speaker 3: guys there because it was a place. As I said,
23:39
Speaker 3: we had some great years and I enjoyed my time,
23:42
Speaker 3: and those are my brothers. I was ready to rock.
23:44
Speaker 2: With them, right And as as you were talking, Josh,
23:47
Speaker 2: I was taking notes on some of the things you said.
23:49
Speaker 1: And that's.
23:52
Speaker 2: Because I get asked all the time, why don't they
23:53
Speaker 2: just try to send them to sign them to this
23:56
Speaker 2: mega extension, Like why don't they just break the bank.
23:59
Speaker 1: For him to keep them here? And blah blah blah.
24:01
Speaker 2: You have to want to be here too, And what
24:04
Speaker 2: reason does Paul have to want to be here right now?
24:08
Speaker 2: If money's the only incentive, Well, one, this place doesn't
24:11
Speaker 2: have it, and two, even if it does, he can
24:14
Speaker 2: get just as much, if not more money, literally anywhere
24:19
Speaker 2: else anywhere. You're right, you've got to give another reason.
24:25
Speaker 1: And right now they don't have that winning culture.
24:28
Speaker 2: They have some talent, but even Josh, like when you
24:31
Speaker 2: signed your extension and that era of Pirates baseball, they
24:35
Speaker 2: were investing in winning. They were they were bringing in
24:39
Speaker 2: free agents, and they were extending guys. They they extended Marte,
24:44
Speaker 2: They'd extended Cutch, they had extended Larryano. They they were
24:48
Speaker 2: they were bringing in guys like Edison Volcz and like
24:51
Speaker 2: we talked about earlier, obviously like the Burnette.
24:53
Speaker 1: They brought a J.
24:54
Speaker 3: Burnett back and then don't forget the last one since
24:57
Speaker 3: two thousand and eighteen of von Nova von No, Well, yeah, yeah,
25:02
Speaker 3: I can't forget that. That's the last one, right.
25:04
Speaker 2: Right, And like they were doing things the right way
25:07
Speaker 2: and they just haven't done that here. And so that's
25:11
Speaker 2: why when I personally am asked what do they do
25:16
Speaker 2: with Paul, I'm of the frame of mind and I'm
25:19
Speaker 2: certainly in the minority here in Pittsburgh.
25:21
Speaker 1: I think they should trade them. I think they should
25:23
Speaker 1: trade them. I think they should.
25:25
Speaker 2: Trade them right now because I think right now, the
25:28
Speaker 2: way they've operated a tells me they're not going to
25:31
Speaker 2: change the way they do business. They're gonna keep operating
25:34
Speaker 2: under this way, and if they're gonna keep doing this
25:37
Speaker 2: the same way, then the pieces they currently have are
25:42
Speaker 2: not good enough. And if you're not able to acquire
25:45
Speaker 2: the necessary pieces to complement your team, then you have
25:48
Speaker 2: to trade something to get the necessary pieces. And they're
25:52
Speaker 2: not a Mitch Keller trade away from being a playoff team.
25:55
Speaker 2: They might be a Pulse Skians trade away from being
25:57
Speaker 2: a playoff team, though, especially down the line as some
26:00
Speaker 2: of these other prospects continue to develop. If you trade
26:03
Speaker 2: him now and you get that King's ransom, something that
26:07
Speaker 2: makes the Sodo deal look like nothing right, and that's
26:11
Speaker 2: what it would be.
26:12
Speaker 1: It would be.
26:13
Speaker 2: It has the potential to be the largest trade return
26:15
Speaker 2: in Major League Baseball history for one single player.
26:18
Speaker 1: It should be. It absolutely should be for the value
26:22
Speaker 1: that he could provide. I don't even know if you
26:23
Speaker 1: could quantify it.
26:24
Speaker 2: And if you move him and you get three to
26:28
Speaker 2: four everyday contributors and you pair that with the pitching
26:33
Speaker 2: you already have, you pair that with Connor Griffin coming up,
26:35
Speaker 2: Spencer Horowitz over at first base, maybe you have a
26:39
Speaker 2: better shot. And maybe that's the contribution. Paul Skenes ends
26:43
Speaker 2: up making em pirate's history that he was so good
26:46
Speaker 2: that he alone built a playoff roster. It's an unfortunate end.
26:51
Speaker 2: It would be like a tragic engine ending to this story.
26:55
Speaker 2: That an ending that happened way too early. But the
26:57
Speaker 2: harsh reality is personally, having seen a little bit of
27:02
Speaker 2: how the sausage is made, having covered this team thoroughly,
27:06
Speaker 2: having sources close to the organization. In the organization, I'm
27:10
Speaker 2: of the frame of belief that they're not gonna do
27:13
Speaker 2: enough to get this guy a winning roster. They might
27:17
Speaker 2: be better than what they've been, it's still not gonna
27:22
Speaker 2: be good enough. I think their ceiling is maybe lucking
27:24
Speaker 2: into a twenty twenty five red situation. And as these
27:28
Speaker 2: years go by, the longer you hang on to them,
27:32
Speaker 2: the lesser this value gets. And if you're not going
27:35
Speaker 2: to extend him with money out, if you're not going
27:38
Speaker 2: to extend him, you got to get rid of them
27:41
Speaker 2: with multiple years of control, because if you let him walk,
27:45
Speaker 2: or if you only trade him with one year left
27:47
Speaker 2: on his deal, then.
27:48
Speaker 1: You've done your organization a disservice.
27:51
Speaker 2: This is a player who is an asset, and if
27:53
Speaker 2: you're not going to properly surround him with talent. Then
27:56
Speaker 2: you need to treat him as an asset and you
27:57
Speaker 2: need to trade him. You need to cash them in.
27:59
Speaker 2: If you can't afford the free car you won on
28:02
Speaker 2: the prices right, then sell the free car and use
28:06
Speaker 2: that money to build a better life so you can
28:08
Speaker 2: afford the next free car you win.
28:10
Speaker 1: That's how they have to approach this. That's my frame
28:13
Speaker 1: of mind on the situation. It's a very harsh reality
28:16
Speaker 1: for this team, but it's a reality that they've built
28:18
Speaker 1: for themselves. So I don't know if either of you
28:22
Speaker 1: have any reaction to that little rant I just went on.
28:26
Speaker 3: Honestly, definitely a harsh reality. And I'm not gonna sit
28:30
Speaker 3: here and say that I can't disagree with you because
28:33
Speaker 3: having played, you know, for the organization and also seeing
28:36
Speaker 3: how things I mean you, it would take one to
28:40
Speaker 3: you know, think that things are gonna change that I'm
28:43
Speaker 3: with you. The status quo has been what it is,
28:45
Speaker 3: and I know they've said that they're going to open
28:47
Speaker 3: up a little bit more of this offseason, but to
28:50
Speaker 3: what extent is opening up a little bit more? You
28:52
Speaker 3: know what I mean? Obviously we know schemes is more
28:55
Speaker 3: than a little bit more of what he's gonna be worth.
28:57
Speaker 3: But at the same time, I get it because you
29:00
Speaker 3: can ask the question, would you rather have the best
29:02
Speaker 3: picture in baseball or would you rather win the World Series?
29:06
Speaker 3: And what you're saying is, if we're not gonna win
29:10
Speaker 3: the World Series with Paul Skiings, maybe we trade them
29:14
Speaker 3: and get pieces that will win the World Series. That's
29:17
Speaker 3: gonna hurt some people's hearts. That's gonna hurt some feelings
29:19
Speaker 3: because I mean, it's the best picture in baseball. But
29:22
Speaker 3: I have a funny feeling that most people would be
29:25
Speaker 3: willing to say, I don't care who's on the team
29:26
Speaker 3: as long as we get that parade and we get
29:28
Speaker 3: to go out there and celebrate our team winning. Hey,
29:31
Speaker 3: And as you said, being traded is part of a contribution,
29:34
Speaker 3: you know, as you said, might it could be, But
29:37
Speaker 3: as of right now, I still don't expect them to
29:38
Speaker 3: be traded. So you gotta go out and get something
29:41
Speaker 3: to be aggressive, you know, maybe offensive, That's what I'm thinking.
29:45
Speaker 3: I'm standing by it.
29:47
Speaker 2: They've had them for two years, they finished it in
29:49
Speaker 2: last place those those two seasons.
29:51
Speaker 1: Something's got to give. Hey, Any final thoughts.
29:54
Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean, my only concern with the Paul Skiings
29:57
Speaker 4: trade is you better be damn sure that the prospects
29:59
Speaker 4: you are get back, or the controllable pieces are getting back,
30:02
Speaker 4: are going to be part of the major league team,
30:05
Speaker 4: because the worst possible case scenario is that everyone is, oh,
30:11
Speaker 4: this is the Chris Archer trade again, like the what
30:13
Speaker 4: are the Pirates doing? You know, this is the worst
30:16
Speaker 4: trade ever? And yeah, it would just it would demoralize
30:20
Speaker 4: the fan base to go from having a cy young
30:22
Speaker 4: winner and then believing in prospects that just don't pan out.
30:27
Speaker 4: It would be really tough. I think a lot of
30:28
Speaker 4: people would be skeptical, and for good reason, and not
30:32
Speaker 4: like the Pirates have turned a lot of these all
30:34
Speaker 4: stars that they've traded away in the past into players
30:38
Speaker 4: on the team.
30:38
Speaker 3: Now.
30:39
Speaker 4: Just look at the Marte trade. You know we just
30:41
Speaker 4: had leover Piguero. Do you or put placed on waivers?
30:45
Speaker 4: So it would be tough. I would be very scared
30:49
Speaker 4: that the right trade would be made, and I think
30:53
Speaker 4: part of that is why you wait just a little
30:55
Speaker 4: bit longer until you are absolutely positive you have the
30:59
Speaker 4: right trade.
31:02
Speaker 2: They've got time to figure it out. I guess you'll see.
31:05
Speaker 2: I I don't anticipate, for for everything I just said,
31:08
Speaker 2: I don't anticipate he's going to be a pirate throughout
31:10
Speaker 2: all twenty six. I just think we're we're prolonging the
31:15
Speaker 2: inevitable here.
31:16
Speaker 1: They're not going to be a playoff team next year. Yeah,
31:19
Speaker 1: unless they can be.
31:20
Speaker 2: They're like, they're really not that far away if their payroll,
31:24
Speaker 2: if they just invest the right way, they could be.
31:28
Speaker 1: But they're not going to games.
31:31
Speaker 3: Yeah on the margins, yeah yeah yeah.
31:37
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31:40
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32:30
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