Latest / The Standard / Faith, Family, Football, and Navigating NIL with Character | Ep. 37 Johnnie Perkins

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Faith, Family, Football, and Navigating NIL with Character | Ep. 37 Johnnie Perkins · The Standard

• 0:02
  SPEAKER_02: Good morning, team.
• 0:03
  SPEAKER_02: Welcome to the Standard Podcast, where we raise the bar, rebuild the culture, and call out the lies or misconception that nobody else will.
• 0:11
  SPEAKER_02: This isn't motivation, this is a movement.
• 0:15
  SPEAKER_02: I'm Thomas Rowan.
• 0:16
  SPEAKER_02: Today I'm joined with my host, Aaron Charles.
• 0:18
  SPEAKER_02: And today we're sitting down with Johnny Perkins, a name, image, and likeness NIL compliance and athlete service strategist who lives by three principles faith, family, and football.
• 0:31
  SPEAKER_02: Johnny has proven ability to lead operational and compliance transformations in highly regulated athlete-centered environments.
• 0:39
  SPEAKER_02: He provides strategic counsel on all aspects regarding NIL from contract structure to recreation, I'm sorry, to creation and negotiations and execution.
• 0:49
  SPEAKER_02: He advises athletic departments and athletes on NIL matters related to the NCAA.
• 0:55
  SPEAKER_02: Institutionally and the conference requirements, working with organizations like the College Sports Commission and NIL GO.
• 1:03
  SPEAKER_02: But here's what makes Johnny different.
• 1:05
  SPEAKER_02: He has a vast experience as strategic operation and financial management executive in both public and private sectors.
• 1:12
  SPEAKER_02: With half his career in government, he's worked for a president, two governors, an attorney general, two mayors, and sitting council members.
• 1:21
  SPEAKER_02: He led the successful negotiation of the first ever$1.5 billion project labor agreement with 26 labor unions creating thousands of new jobs.
• 1:32
  SPEAKER_02: Beyond the boardroom, Johnny is a sports enthusiast who has coached baseball, football, basketball, soccer, and track and field.
• 1:39
  SPEAKER_02: As a baseball umpire, basketball official, and football referee, he has officiated some youth, high school, and collegiate levels.
• 1:48
  SPEAKER_02: His son, Lauren, is the director of merchandising for the Sacramento Rivercats, the San Francisco Giants, and I just found out the Oakland A's AAA affiliate, reminding him daily how blessed he is.
• 2:00
  SPEAKER_02: Johnny's mission is clear: educating and empowering the student athlete and their families to pursue NIL opportunities while building character, integrity, discipline, accountability, and he's going to add wisdom, which we just talked about off-camera.
• 2:14
  SPEAKER_02: We're diving into the truth behind what it really takes to build identity, discipline, and legacy in sports and in life.
• 2:22
  SPEAKER_02: Let's get into it.
• 2:23
  SPEAKER_02: Johnny, big thanks for taking time out of your day right before the weekend to join us.
• 2:28
  SPEAKER_02: We really appreciate it.
• 2:30
  SPEAKER_01: I'm honored, uh Thomas, and it's great to be here today with both you and Aaron.
• 2:34
  SPEAKER_01: Just want to compliment the work you all are doing at Blueprint and Blue Chip.
• 2:38
  SPEAKER_01: It's just really outstanding work for our student athletes and their families.
• 2:42
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you so much.
• 2:43
  SPEAKER_02: We believe that as well.
• 2:45
  SPEAKER_02: So you're an NIL compliance and athlete service strategist, and you live by three principles: faith, family, and football.
• 2:52
  SPEAKER_02: Your favorite verse is 1 Corinthians 16, 14.
• 2:56
  SPEAKER_02: Do everything in love.
• 2:58
  SPEAKER_02: What does raising the standard, what does raising the standard mean to you in the NIL world?
• 3:04
  SPEAKER_01: It really means a couple of things.
• 3:07
  SPEAKER_01: Exceeding expectations, you know, in the private sector and even in the public sector, people don't think a lot about customer service, but customer experience is exceeding expectations.
• 3:19
  SPEAKER_01: Sure.
• 3:20
  SPEAKER_01: And to me, raising the standard, that's part of what that means.
• 3:24
  SPEAKER_01: Also, I think raising the standard is living with integrity, with character, discipline, and wisdom when really no one is looking.
• 3:32
  SPEAKER_01: And my father, God bless him, passed on.
• 3:35
  SPEAKER_01: One of the things he he instilled in my sister and I were son, your word is your bond.
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_01: And to me, that's what raising the standard means that your word is your bond.
• 3:53
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 3:54
  SPEAKER_02: You know, I I pause simply because that's something you and I have in common, how important our dads were to us and the the wisdom that they instilled us in us, right?
• 4:03
  SPEAKER_02: The pearls of their journey ahead of us and how much things have changed.
• 4:07
  SPEAKER_02: And I don't think people value that, that your word is your reputation.
• 4:12
  SPEAKER_02: And we see that, and we're going to get into this, that you know, I think I'm jumping ahead, but how the NIL, the transfer portal, has become an emergency exit, even when some of these student athletes committed to a program, they hit a little adversity and they jump ship.
• 4:26
  SPEAKER_02: What would you say is the biggest, biggest lie you feel the culture of NIL, the NIL industry has sold student athletes and families about name, image, and likeness opportunities?
• 4:38
  SPEAKER_01: And and and I want to say just and I'll come back to contracts as we go along, but trust trust in contracts is really important just to get to that raising that standard.
• 4:48
  SPEAKER_01: You've got to really have trust and faith in someone when you're negotiating a contract.
• 4:52
  SPEAKER_01: But going to uh the the culture, I've been very blessed to work for uh elected officials and private sector companies.
• 5:02
  SPEAKER_01: And one of the things that I've seen in in the public sector, one of the I don't want to call it a lie, but I think it's misleading.
• 5:10
  SPEAKER_01: We've sold leaders on the fact that they're they're this greater than God entity and they can do no wrong.
• 5:17
  SPEAKER_01: And I've worked with some great leaders, trust me, outstanding men and women for sure.
• 5:23
  SPEAKER_01: But we've given this impression that as we see today a lot, you can you can do kind of whatever you want, and you can't, because you have to do things with character, integrity, and and and respect.
• 5:35
  SPEAKER_01: So I see that in some of the leadership going on today.
• 5:39
  SPEAKER_01: Second, with athletes, uh, and this you know plays into a little bit myself as well, when I was in high school, in terms of uh my athlete athletics, is it's winning at all costs.
• 5:51
  SPEAKER_01: It's winning is everything.
• 5:53
  SPEAKER_01: And no, it isn't.
• 5:54
  SPEAKER_01: Winning is not everything.
• 5:56
  SPEAKER_01: You have to learn how to win and lose gracefully.
• 5:58
  SPEAKER_01: You have to understand there's there's an infrastructure and a foundation to your role as an athlete.
• 6:06
  SPEAKER_01: And too many times we just try to press the stats and push the stats and not really understand the person behind those stats.
• 6:13
  SPEAKER_01: What are we building within them so when they finish that sport?
• 6:17
  SPEAKER_01: Because a lot of athletes don't go on, those student athletes, what do we do to raise that level of how to succeed in life?
• 6:25
  SPEAKER_01: Right, and I think that's one of the misleading things that we do.
• 6:30
  SPEAKER_01: I played baseball and ran cross-country in high school, and I was told I'm awesome, I had pretty good times.
• 6:36
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I did the mile under five minutes.
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, today if you don't do it around four minutes, you're it's a little different, but I was pretty good.
• 6:44
  SPEAKER_01: And and I played four years of varsity baseball, but I wasn't really good enough to play at a collegiate level, yet I was offered a scholarship.
• 6:52
  SPEAKER_01: I was told, hey, you're good enough, you can do it.
• 6:55
  SPEAKER_01: I just wanted people to be really be honest with me and let me know and help me build my character and foundation beyond beyond sports.
• 7:05
  SPEAKER_01: And it's the same thing I think in the professional world.
• 7:07
  SPEAKER_01: Sometimes people just want to who work with us, want to just give us what they think we want to hear.
• 7:13
  SPEAKER_01: And no, I I want to know, I don't want yeah, a yes person, I want someone who's gonna work with me and say, hey, let's pause and take a breath and kind of maybe tact differently when we're when we're doing something.
• 7:24
  SPEAKER_01: So to me, it's that honesty, integrity, character, discipline, and wisdom that goes into our culture and our system and some of the misleading numerations that are out there.
• 7:39
  SPEAKER_02: No question.
• 7:42
  SPEAKER_02: You have a vast experience in government working for a president, two governors, an attorney general, two mayors, and you've led billion-dollar negotiations.
• 7:51
  SPEAKER_02: How does that background inform your approach to NIL compliance and strategy?
• 7:59
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I have to tell you, college sports has entered the golden era.
• 8:02
  SPEAKER_01: And it's not just college athletics in high school, junior high, or youth sports.
• 8:08
  SPEAKER_01: And it's not just football, basketball, softball, baseball, gymnastics, it's all men and women's sports, particularly flag football.
• 8:16
  SPEAKER_01: I love flag football.
• 8:17
  SPEAKER_01: The women's flag football movement has really taken off.
• 8:20
  SPEAKER_01: And with the Olympics having flag football as an Olympic sport in 2028, we're really going to see participation triple in women's flag football.
• 8:29
  SPEAKER_01: But that preparation in terms of what's important and two things about NIL that are really, really important, among others, but two that relate to particularly this particular conversation and topic are contracts and finances.
• 8:44
  SPEAKER_01: And education goes with that too.
• 8:46
  SPEAKER_01: And with contracts, there's three words that I always like to talk about when to be aware of any contract at NIL.
• 8:54
  SPEAKER_01: The words are perpetuity, exclusivity, and irrevocability.
• 8:59
  SPEAKER_01: Those words should never be they should never be found in a contract because perpetuity is forever.
• 9:04
  SPEAKER_01: Exclusively me exclusivity means the brand has the your your right to do whatever they want and you can't work with anyone else.
• 9:12
  SPEAKER_01: And irrevocability means you don't have a right to get out of the contract, only one side does.
• 9:17
  SPEAKER_01: And you and you've got to you've got to avoid those.
• 9:20
  SPEAKER_01: And then on the finances side, there's taxes in NIL, there's taxes in revenue sharing, and you got to understand IRS is gonna come knocking, and you got to know what tax structure is.
• 9:32
  SPEAKER_01: And in most states, you have to pay a tax.
• 9:35
  SPEAKER_01: Seven states have no income tax, like Nevada and Texas.
• 9:39
  SPEAKER_01: Some states have a flat tax, like Arizona and Pennsylvania, and then there's other states that have 2.5 up to 13.3, which is the great state of California I'm in, which is 13.3 state income tax.
• 9:52
  SPEAKER_01: And so you got to be aware of what those taxes are.
• 9:55
  SPEAKER_01: But Thomas, what's really important is education.
• 9:58
  SPEAKER_01: And it's one of the reasons I'm really proud to be working with Pliable Marketing and its founder, Greg Glenn, you know, providing strategic counsel on contract development and negotiation, advising athletic department and athletes on compliance matters with the NCAA, College Sports Commission.
• 10:16
  SPEAKER_01: But what I really love about what we're doing at Pliable, we're educating athletic departments, student athletes and their families on NIL.
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_01: And that's our one of our main focuses at Pliable, is supporting student athletes and their families through education.
• 10:30
  SPEAKER_01: And so I think that's part of what my background and my that wisdom when I talk about character, integrity, discipline, and wisdom.
• 10:39
  SPEAKER_01: It's the wisdom from my background in the public and private sector that allows me to understand how to work with student athletes and their families on levels that deal with contracts and compliance, relationship management and development, as well as education.
• 10:58
  SPEAKER_02: Awesome.
• 10:59
  SPEAKER_02: Awesome.
• 11:00
  SPEAKER_02: We're going to turn it over to Aaron for segment two, which is identity and legacy.
• 11:04
  SPEAKER_02: Aaron, take it away.
• 11:07
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 11:08
  SPEAKER_00: I get to do the favorite, my my favorite section.
• 11:12
  SPEAKER_00: So I want you to tell our audience who are you?
• 11:15
  SPEAKER_00: Who is Johnny Perkins beyond all the accolades that Thomas riddled off at the beginning of the episode?
• 11:23
  SPEAKER_00: Just who are you and what values define you?
• 11:28
  SPEAKER_01: I'm guided by my faith.
• 11:30
  SPEAKER_01: You know, there's there's a verse in the Bible, 1 Samuel 16, 7, and I love this verse.
• 11:36
  SPEAKER_01: The Lord doesn't see things as we see them.
• 11:39
  SPEAKER_01: People judge by outward appearance, but God looks at the heart.
• 11:44
  SPEAKER_01: And I look at that part and go, that's what I'm about.
• 11:48
  SPEAKER_01: You look at someone's heart because outward appearance shows different things, but you know the character and integrity of somebody when you can see their heart.
• 11:57
  SPEAKER_01: And to me, when you look at character, integrity, and discipline, to me, character is how kind are you?
• 12:04
  SPEAKER_01: And there's not a lot of there's not enough love, grace, and kindness in the world.
• 12:08
  SPEAKER_01: To me, that cuts to the heart of character.
• 12:10
  SPEAKER_01: Integrity cuts to honesty, truthful.
• 12:13
  SPEAKER_01: When no one's looking, are you being truthful and honest?
• 12:16
  SPEAKER_01: That's the true test of integrity.
• 12:18
  SPEAKER_01: And discipline is being consistent, doing what you say.
• 12:20
  SPEAKER_01: As my father said, son, your word is your bond.
• 12:24
  SPEAKER_01: So I look at in defining who I am beyond the contract successes, the 1.5 billion that Thomas mentioned, and some of the other things I've been fortunate to do, is I am based and live live by my faith.
• 12:41
  SPEAKER_01: And in terms of that character, integrity, discipline, and that wisdom I've been able to achieve over the years.
• 12:48
  SPEAKER_00: I love that.
• 12:49
  SPEAKER_00: Your word is your bond.
• 12:51
  SPEAKER_00: I think it's really the only thing we truly have.
• 12:54
  SPEAKER_00: And with that, uh what does legacy beyond NIL deals, beyond contracts, what's the legacy you're trying to build or impart with these young athletes that you're working with?
• 13:09
  SPEAKER_01: Legacy isn't what you uh leave behind.
• 13:12
  SPEAKER_01: Everybody thinks, well, I'm gonna leave behind something.
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_01: Legacy is really to me what you build every single day.
• 13:20
  SPEAKER_01: That's your legacy.
• 13:21
  SPEAKER_01: You are building the legacy every single day.
• 13:25
  SPEAKER_01: I think that's an important message to to student athletes and their families.
• 13:29
  SPEAKER_01: The other thing I live by is how many unkind people have you been kind to?
• 13:37
  SPEAKER_01: Think about that for a second.
• 13:39
  SPEAKER_01: How many unkind people have you been kind to?
• 13:42
  SPEAKER_01: How many people are just not polite to us?
• 13:44
  SPEAKER_01: They're rude.
• 13:44
  SPEAKER_01: Rather, you go to a retail store, the grocery store, a sports arena.
• 13:49
  SPEAKER_01: Somebody's in your way, you ask them politely to maybe move and they get upset with you.
• 13:53
  SPEAKER_01: How many unkind people have you been kind to?
• 13:56
  SPEAKER_01: To me, that's that's that's legacy beyond performance.
• 14:01
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that's really important for our student athletes.
• 14:06
  SPEAKER_01: And and I want to point out, and and I'm not sure if this is the right time or not, but but I'm I really feel passionate about this.
• 14:12
  SPEAKER_01: And so let me know if it isn't and I can hold off.
• 14:14
  SPEAKER_01: But I'm real passionate about, and we are appliable as well, the mental health of our student athletes.
• 14:21
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 14:22
  SPEAKER_01: Go ahead, share away.
• 14:24
  SPEAKER_01: And and I have a deep passion for that because throughout society we have mental health issues, there are problems out there, there really are.
• 14:33
  SPEAKER_01: And our student athletes are are experiencing that.
• 14:36
  SPEAKER_01: Elite athletes are failing off the field.
• 14:38
  SPEAKER_01: It isn't because they don't have the talent, it's because we're solving the wrong problem.
• 14:43
  SPEAKER_01: We're solving the wrong problem.
• 14:45
  SPEAKER_01: Three-quarters of athletes quit before they're 13.
• 14:48
  SPEAKER_01: A third college athletes feel anxiety and almost 80% struggle after they end sports.
• 14:54
  SPEAKER_01: When I coached, when I was a coach, flight football, basketball, and baseball, I had two goals.
• 15:00
  SPEAKER_01: One, I want to teach you one thing about the sport every season, just one.
• 15:05
  SPEAKER_01: And second, I want you to enjoy the fun of playing sports so you return the next season.
• 15:12
  SPEAKER_01: I can't tell you how many parents requested their son or daughter play for my team because of the second one.
• 15:18
  SPEAKER_01: We're just gonna have fun.
• 15:20
  SPEAKER_01: And we have to, we have to, we have to return that.
• 15:23
  SPEAKER_01: It's it's the adage visibility versus viability.
• 15:27
  SPEAKER_01: Visibility, I got to do a lot of things when I'm athletes, but what's viable to give me that foundation to succeed?
• 15:32
  SPEAKER_01: And and I want to point this out because it's really important.
• 15:35
  SPEAKER_01: The National Federation of State High School Associations is doing some great work in the mental health area.
• 15:41
  SPEAKER_01: In fact, there's an article that was out recently by their CEO, Dr.
• 15:46
  SPEAKER_01: Carissa Nihov, about balancing fun and pressure in high school sports and the importance of addressing mental health.
• 15:51
  SPEAKER_01: And and they have on their website, nfhslearn.com, some tools and resources for student athletes and their families.
• 15:58
  SPEAKER_01: But I wanted to read this one quote from a Missy Townsend about helping athletes manage pressure and protect their managed health.
• 16:05
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm I'm gonna look down and read this because I didn't I don't have it memorized, but I but I love it.
• 16:09
  SPEAKER_01: It's about the mental wealth wellness of student athletes.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_01: And she says, When you teach young people how to manage pressure, face adversity, and support one another, you're not just building better athletes, you're building stronger humans.
• 16:23
  SPEAKER_01: The scoreboard will always matter, but the greater score is measured in how our student athletes grow, how they handle a loss, how they lift each other up, and how they carry the life of sport into every aspect of their lives.
• 16:39
  SPEAKER_01: Sports takes us into our lives, and we need to make sure that our student athletes have the foundation to be successful when that sporting day comes to an end.
• 16:51
  SPEAKER_00: I think that's part of our mission here at Blueprint to Blue Chip.
• 16:56
  SPEAKER_00: And I also, it was fun to watch the young woman that won the gold medal at the Olympics of uh figure skating.
• 17:03
  SPEAKER_00: She had actually retired at 20, I think 20 years old, just because of the the amount of pressure that she felt.
• 17:11
  SPEAKER_00: And it was so beautiful because she came back, won the gold medal, and she's like, I just skated for myself.
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_00: I just skated for me and the love I have for the sport, not to win something, not to beat somebody, but just for me.
• 17:24
  SPEAKER_00: And so that word fun, like how do we bring fun back into sport, which is so uh deeply missing, is it's it is a game and it should be a good time, especially for the younger, the younger athletes.
• 17:38
  SPEAKER_00: And so with that in mind, what do you see that separates athletes who handle NIL well from those that don't?
• 17:48
  SPEAKER_00: What's really the separation factor that you're seeing?
• 17:54
  SPEAKER_01: So one other thing I wanted to add, when I flip the coin at the 50-yard line for a football game, there's two things I'd say to the captains.
• 18:02
  SPEAKER_01: We're gonna have sportsmanship today, and you're gonna have fun.
• 18:05
  SPEAKER_01: So that just goes back to trying to still still that that that that that funness.
• 18:11
  SPEAKER_00: I love that.
• 18:12
  SPEAKER_01: If you can maybe repeat that question for me one more time, I think it was about the separate yeah.
• 18:19
  SPEAKER_00: What what's the separation factor?
• 18:21
  SPEAKER_00: Like, what do you see with the athletes that may succeed from those that maybe like crumble under the pressure?
• 18:28
  SPEAKER_00: Like, is there a differentiating factor for those athletes in the NIL space?
• 18:36
  SPEAKER_01: A big part of it is education, and I and I think one of the things that's really important, and and and there's really three three areas I talk about with student athletes and families that they need to know about NIL.
• 18:50
  SPEAKER_01: And and this is often sometimes the difference in success or not.
• 18:54
  SPEAKER_01: One is NIL rules in high school, the NCAA, the NAIA, and junior college, they're different.
• 19:00
  SPEAKER_01: It's not one size fits all.
• 19:02
  SPEAKER_01: Everyone has a suppression, it's one size.
• 19:03
  SPEAKER_01: No, it's it's different.
• 19:05
  SPEAKER_01: So that's one.
• 19:06
  SPEAKER_01: NIL rules in different segments are different, it's not a one size fits all.
• 19:11
  SPEAKER_01: Second, is you've got to understand state law and school policy.
• 19:16
  SPEAKER_01: State law is different in every state, there's different rules in each state, and you don't want to ever compromise a student athlete's eligibility.
• 19:25
  SPEAKER_01: Some states are supportive of NIL deals.
• 19:27
  SPEAKER_01: In fact, 45 states in the District of Columbia support them.
• 19:30
  SPEAKER_01: There's five states that don't.
• 19:31
  SPEAKER_01: It's prohibited in Alabama, Indiana, I believe it's Mississippi, Hawaii, and Wyoming.
• 19:37
  SPEAKER_01: And then finally, there's plenty of NIL opportunities, and I think a lot of people are missing that.
• 19:42
  SPEAKER_01: NIL is an ecosystem, it's at every level D1, D2, D3, junior college, NAIA.
• 19:50
  SPEAKER_01: It's even now in high school and sometimes it's at middle school, and there are plenty of legal ways to monetize uh your NIL.
• 19:57
  SPEAKER_01: And so I think that's that's important.
• 19:59
  SPEAKER_01: And the other thing is you don't have to be that five-star athlete getting the million-dollar NIL deal.
• 20:07
  SPEAKER_01: I'm not sure if people know this, but the median NIL per deal value is$60.
• 20:13
  SPEAKER_01: $60.
• 20:14
  SPEAKER_01: And the average NIL per value deal is$6,000.
• 20:18
  SPEAKER_01: So there are plenty of opportunities.
• 20:21
  SPEAKER_01: I think sometimes athletes get concerned with, oh gosh, I'm it goes back to I'm not good enough because it's winning at all cost.
• 20:32
  SPEAKER_01: And we have to do more educating to prepare our student athletes and their families for the foundation of who they are as a non-athlete, because that will add value to who they are as an athlete.
• 20:48
  SPEAKER_00: I love that.
• 20:49
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I think there's a lot of misperceptions out in the marketplace, and that was just invaluable what you shared.
• 20:56
  SPEAKER_00: So, with that, what's one truth you wish every student athlete and family understood about NIL that most aren't hearing?
• 21:08
  SPEAKER_01: Well, the one thing I wish every young athlete or leader under leader understood, I'll just underscore that too, is respect.
• 21:13
  SPEAKER_01: Because I think sometimes there's a little bit of disconnection with how we how we re respect each other.
• 21:22
  SPEAKER_01: But I think it goes to what I want them to know about NIL is there there are NIL opportunities everywhere.
• 21:31
  SPEAKER_01: You don't have to go to a national brand to get a name, image, and likeness deal.
• 21:37
  SPEAKER_01: There are plenty of opportunities within your local community.
• 21:42
  SPEAKER_01: And that's one of the things that we do a lot at Pliable is is and working with with our partners is look at those local brands and helping our NIL student athletes understand there are local branding opportunities to.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_01: To pursue your name, image, and likeness.
• 22:03
  SPEAKER_01: And we want them to make sure they understand that truth.
• 22:06
  SPEAKER_01: You don't have to go to a national brand to be successful.
• 22:09
  SPEAKER_01: There are plenty of local brands that will be very happy to have their local student athletes on their collegiate team be a part of their operations.
• 22:23
  SPEAKER_00: That's it.
• 22:23
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, you you nailed it on the head.
• 22:26
  SPEAKER_00: There's so many opportunities.
• 22:27
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, with that being said, I'm going to turn it back over to Thomas.
• 22:32
  SPEAKER_02: Awesome.
• 22:34
  SPEAKER_02: Johnny, we got into a lot of your background.
• 22:37
  SPEAKER_02: I kind of want to go off script a little bit here.
• 22:39
  SPEAKER_02: And yesterday we had a fantastic, Aaron and I had a fantastic meeting with a gentleman by the name of Jim Croner.
• 22:46
  SPEAKER_02: He's the director of player development for USA basketball.
• 22:49
  SPEAKER_02: And he his comment was parents are the problem.
• 22:53
  SPEAKER_02: And he didn't mean that in a demeaning way, but parents are getting too involved in athletics beyond just the the character.
• 23:02
  SPEAKER_02: I'm sorry, just beyond the development of their student athlete.
• 23:06
  SPEAKER_02: You being a referee, an umpire, what has been your experience of late dealing with parents when it comes to youth athletics?
• 23:17
  SPEAKER_01: What's interesting about that, I don't see parental issues or commentary at the higher athletic levels, collegiate.
• 23:30
  SPEAKER_01: I don't really even see it that much in high school.
• 23:33
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 23:33
  SPEAKER_01: Where I see it is at the junior high, elementary, and youth level.
• 23:40
  SPEAKER_01: And where I particularly see a lot of it is the youth football level, where and it's not every parent, and it's not every team, and it's not every community, but parents continue to live their athletic dreams through their children.
• 23:59
  SPEAKER_01: I'm gonna give you a great example.
• 24:01
  SPEAKER_01: I'll give you a great example.
• 24:03
  SPEAKER_01: My son was a basketball player in high school, and I really wanted him to go to college and play basketball.
• 24:11
  SPEAKER_01: And he didn't want to do that.
• 24:13
  SPEAKER_01: And that bothered me.
• 24:16
  SPEAKER_01: But then I realized it's Lauren's journey, not mine.
• 24:20
  SPEAKER_01: I I had mine.
• 24:22
  SPEAKER_01: So my message to parents that are engaged with their children in youth sports, whatever sport is, let the child live their dream, but have fun while doing it.
• 24:35
  SPEAKER_01: Don't put that added pressure.
• 24:37
  SPEAKER_01: And I see that a lot.
• 24:38
  SPEAKER_01: I see it as a baseball umpire, I see it as a football referee, and I see it as a basketball official.
• 24:44
  SPEAKER_01: The pressure that are put on these players that is just not necessary.
• 24:53
  SPEAKER_01: There's no reason to do that.
• 24:54
  SPEAKER_01: And I think we just kind of need to back off a little bit.
• 24:56
  SPEAKER_01: And I've had a few parents I've had to talk to or a few coaches about parents making certain comments that even may not be directed at us, but I can see the emotional impact it has on their child.
• 25:08
  SPEAKER_01: And so I just let the coach know, coach, we're out here to have fun.
• 25:11
  SPEAKER_01: I just need the temperature to come down, the emotion to drop.
• 25:16
  SPEAKER_01: Sports is an emotional game.
• 25:17
  SPEAKER_01: I understand that.
• 25:18
  SPEAKER_01: But at youth sports, it's got to be about fun, really at every level.
• 25:23
  SPEAKER_01: But I see that emotion, Thomas, more with the youth sports in terms of parental, I don't want to say interference, but certainly parental pursuits of their dream as opposed to their child's.
• 25:37
  SPEAKER_02: Got it.
• 25:38
  SPEAKER_02: And you work with athletic departments.
• 25:40
  SPEAKER_02: That's interesting because I would have expected.
• 25:43
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, you if you flip on YouTube or scroll through social media, you just see all these little clips.
• 25:48
  SPEAKER_02: And maybe it's just my algorithm because you know now Aaron and I are looking at a lot of sporting events, youth sports and high school sports, we see a lot of you know parents' interference with the referees and the umpire.
• 25:58
  SPEAKER_02: Maybe that's just the algorithm, but that's good to hear that some of the parents are just kind of laying off, which is nice.
• 26:04
  SPEAKER_02: But that it's not a surprise in in youth sports.
• 26:08
  SPEAKER_02: What about college athletes who are now and and I don't go ahead.
• 26:15
  SPEAKER_01: No, and I don't on the football field, we have a pretty good separation from the fans, so I don't hear a lot a lot of it uh then on the basketball court.
• 26:26
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, it's a little different because you know, they're right there, and on the baseball diamond, it's a little different because they're right there.
• 26:33
  SPEAKER_01: But I just haven't seen that, and when I do see it, Thomas, my I just go to the head coach and I always tell a head coach, you can say whatever you want to me.
• 26:44
  SPEAKER_01: Hey, ref, that's a hold, or blue, what you know, why why is that not a strike?
• 26:49
  SPEAKER_01: Or gosh, that's a foul.
• 26:50
  SPEAKER_01: What why aren't you calling that?
• 26:52
  SPEAKER_01: But I just can't have parents continue to challenge a call that's a judgment call, because then their child or then the players start to get engaged, and that leads to trouble.
• 27:03
  SPEAKER_01: And so I always tell the coach, coach, you can talk to me all game.
• 27:06
  SPEAKER_01: I'm okay with that.
• 27:07
  SPEAKER_01: But if that parent steps out of line, I kind of got to give you a technical, and they know they don't want a techno, and I don't give a lot of technicals early in my career.
• 27:16
  SPEAKER_01: I did now I like to say I'm more I have professional maturity as I call it that, but I'd like to think I'm a little bit and I'm a better official, certainly.
• 27:27
  SPEAKER_01: But that people skills are are really important, and I and I doggone it, particularly in a high school game, the last thing you want to do is throw out a player because in high school, particularly football where you only play 10 games, you throw a player out, they're out for two games.
• 27:42
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, wow.
• 27:43
  SPEAKER_01: That's a lot in their high school career if they're a senior trying to get a scholarship.
• 27:47
  SPEAKER_01: Sure.
• 27:47
  SPEAKER_01: And I just I'll send a player to a bench, say, coach, keep them out for three plays, and I'll explain why.
• 27:53
  SPEAKER_01: Just again, it's that communication skill that I think is so viable.
• 27:57
  SPEAKER_01: We need more of that in sports uh in general.
• 28:02
  SPEAKER_02: So true, so true.
• 28:04
  SPEAKER_02: Uh so you work with athletic departments on the NCAA, institutional and conference compliance requirements.
• 28:10
  SPEAKER_02: What do coaches and administrators need to understand about NIL and what they're missing?
• 28:20
  SPEAKER_01: A lot of coaches are spending an enormous amount of time now having to deal with NIL.
• 28:27
  SPEAKER_01: Got it.
• 28:28
  SPEAKER_01: I've talked to a number of coaches, athletic departments, where that's now been added to the job description, which before it never was.
• 28:37
  SPEAKER_01: There are a number of coaches that even during the season, because of the transfer portal, and I want to comment on that in a second, they've got to continually be aware of their student athletes in terms of what they're doing, what's going on.
• 28:51
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that's where having an effective and grounded compliance up department, a name, image, and lightness director who can continually talk with a student athlete and their families about campus life.
• 29:04
  SPEAKER_01: How are classes going?
• 29:06
  SPEAKER_01: How are you adjusting to the schedule, having to be in class full time and having to practice and play games full time?
• 29:12
  SPEAKER_01: Because essentially it's two jobs student athlete and and student athlete player, it's two jobs.
• 29:19
  SPEAKER_01: And so a lot of coaches, athletic departments we've talked to, coaches are spending a lot of time, athletics are spending more time than they would like to, and having that infrastructure and support for them is really important.
• 29:33
  SPEAKER_01: And I think the transfer portal has created some issues as well.
• 29:38
  SPEAKER_01: And I know there was an op-ed by the University of Arkansas head coach John Caliperi recently, where he called for an end to unlimited transfers.
• 29:46
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I'd like to take that a step further.
• 29:48
  SPEAKER_01: My belief is that I think student athletes should make a minimum two-year commitment to a university before they're eligible to transfer.
• 29:57
  SPEAKER_01: I just think that's going to eliminate some of the confusion, some of the anxiety, some of the pressures on these coaches on the athletic departments, and maybe bring back some great traditions and stop the madness.
• 30:09
  SPEAKER_01: So if you go to a you sign with a university, it's a two-year minimum commitment before you can get into the transfer portal.
• 30:18
  SPEAKER_01: I'd like to see more of that because right now you can hop around every year.
• 30:21
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that's dysfunctional to a university, a team, and coaches and athletic directors.
• 30:28
  SPEAKER_01: And they're already under so much strain with financial challenges that they now have to deal with to get the competing athletes.
• 30:38
  SPEAKER_02: No question.
• 30:39
  SPEAKER_02: I I they have to do something to fix it.
• 30:42
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, right now it's just and we see it all the time, the pendulum has has swung too far.
• 30:47
  SPEAKER_02: And I do I do believe that, you know, the I I don't think we've gotten into it.
• 30:51
  SPEAKER_02: Maybe we have off air, but you know, one of the things Aaron and I talk about is these kids that are jumping around, they have to remember when you transfer universities, not all your credits are gonna go with you, right?
• 31:01
  SPEAKER_02: So if you're transferring and jumping around two, three, four times and you're just chasing the money deal, by the time you're 28 to 30, more than likely you're gonna be broke, you don't have a degree, and then what?
• 31:12
  SPEAKER_02: And then what?
• 31:13
  SPEAKER_02: That's the scary part where we're, you know, Aaron and I are trying to get ahead of it.
• 31:16
  SPEAKER_02: And also with working with people like yourself is to make sure that these families, athletes, and universities are aware of the pitfall, not maybe today or tomorrow, but in the next couple of years, because it's gonna it's gonna be damaging, no question.
• 31:30
  SPEAKER_01: With that being said, and Thomas, that's where education comes in.
• 31:35
  SPEAKER_01: That's why at pliable marketing, we are so focused on educating the student athlete and their families, because the more they know, the better informed decisions they're gonna be able to make for not just the interest of today, but the benefits of tomorrow.
• 31:51
  SPEAKER_02: No question.
• 31:53
  SPEAKER_02: No question.
• 31:53
  SPEAKER_02: So tell us a little bit about pliable marketing.
• 31:56
  SPEAKER_02: You kind of touched on it a few times, but I just want to open up the floor for you to kind of explain a little bit about what they do and what you do when you when you're working with plowable and with families and athletes.
• 32:08
  SPEAKER_01: So, my role with Pliable Marketing's founders is Greg Glenn.
• 32:12
  SPEAKER_01: And Greg has years of experience in marketing, uh, public relations as an NIL agency.
• 32:20
  SPEAKER_01: My my job is I provide strategic counsel on contract development, help advise athletic departments on issues relating to NIL compliance requirements for conferences and the NCAA and College Sports Commission.
• 32:34
  SPEAKER_01: And then we're continuing to educate our student athletes and athletic departments and families on NIL opportunities.
• 32:41
  SPEAKER_01: And so part of our process is to make sure we're educating the student athletes and their families on NIL and everything to do with branding, social media, how to leverage their future, not just on the field, in the court, in the arena, but but outside of that.
• 33:04
  SPEAKER_01: And applyable marketing and Greg have years of experience dealing with student athletes, dealing with NIL.
• 33:11
  SPEAKER_01: Greg teaches a course on name, image, and lightness with sports management worldwide.
• 33:19
  SPEAKER_01: And he's one of the foremost experts and authority on NIL and what it means to understand and for a student athlete to work in the name, image, and lightness space.
• 33:32
  SPEAKER_02: Gotcha.
• 33:33
  SPEAKER_02: Perfect.
• 33:34
  SPEAKER_02: With that, we're gonna turn it over to Aaron, which is the rapid fire round segment four.
• 33:39
  SPEAKER_02: Aaron, take it away.
• 33:41
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, I get to do my favorite section of the thing.
• 33:45
  SPEAKER_00: I think everything's my favorite section.
• 33:47
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm gonna start a sentence and you're gonna finish it.
• 33:50
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, Johnny.
• 33:51
  SPEAKER_00: So discipline equals your word is your bond, consistency.
• 34:00
  SPEAKER_00: Leadership equals ability to inspire trust and have a vision.
• 34:08
  SPEAKER_00: What about can you hear me?
• 34:13
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 34:14
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, great.
• 34:15
  SPEAKER_01: What about faith equals Hebrews 11:1, assurance of things hope for and conviction for things not seen.
• 34:25
  SPEAKER_01: Essentially believing in something when common sense tells you not to.
• 34:34
  SPEAKER_01: I think that's ensuring character, integrity, discipline, and wisdom.
• 34:40
  SPEAKER_01: And as I mentioned before, how many unkind people have you been kind to?
• 34:45
  SPEAKER_00: I love that.
• 34:46
  SPEAKER_00: And what about what is one thing you would never compromise on?
• 34:54
  SPEAKER_01: I would never compromise my values and my principles under any conditions.
• 35:01
  SPEAKER_00: I love that.
• 35:02
  SPEAKER_00: And what is one message if you could put it on a billboard for student athletes today, what would that be?
• 35:09
  SPEAKER_01: Be respectful.
• 35:12
  SPEAKER_00: I love that.
• 35:13
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, I did the rapid fire.
• 35:15
  SPEAKER_00: Now Thomas gets to do the hot seat.
• 35:18
  SPEAKER_02: Awesome, Johnny.
• 35:20
  SPEAKER_02: Before we wrap up, is there something we didn't touch on today that you feel student athletes, families, or athletic departments need to hear about NIL, about coaching, about refereeing, as far as compliance and building character through this process?
• 35:35
  SPEAKER_02: It's kind of like this is kind of an open floor to you on anything you feel like we didn't touch on.
• 35:41
  SPEAKER_01: I I think I think the the one thing that I wanted to mention, a couple things.
• 35:48
  SPEAKER_01: One is the women's flag football movement, and I hit on it a little bit, but 10 years ago, there weren't any really women's flag football leagues.
• 35:57
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 35:58
  SPEAKER_01: Now we have you know 17 states and over 60 universities of sanctioned women's flag football.
• 36:04
  SPEAKER_01: And and I think that's exciting because that provides so much more in the NIL space.
• 36:11
  SPEAKER_01: And now that you've got the NFL, USA football making investments in women's flag football, the NCAA last month at their at their convention approved adding flag football to their emerging sports uh for women.
• 36:26
  SPEAKER_01: The University of Wisconsin at Parkside is the first university in Wisconsin to offer scholarships for women's flag uh football.
• 36:36
  SPEAKER_01: And I just think when you look at worldwide 20 million flag football players, nearly 2 million are females, that's exciting.
• 36:44
  SPEAKER_01: And I think we need to really celebrate it and advocate more there because there is definitely opportunities in the NIL space for women's flag football.
• 36:58
  SPEAKER_02: No question.
• 36:58
  SPEAKER_02: You know, one of the things that I don't know if this is kind of pulling back the curtain a little too far, or maybe it's a little premature, Aaron.
• 37:05
  SPEAKER_02: But Johnny, one of the things that we're working on is we're working what started off with Blueprint just being kind of a just an a North American-based company has reached all the way over to Germany, and we're working with some basketball agents over there.
• 37:22
  SPEAKER_02: And it's we're actually talking about going over there and we want to do football as well.
• 37:26
  SPEAKER_02: And meaning we want to introduce flag football with the women because you're what you touched on it is I don't think people realize how how impactful and how big women's flag football is gonna be.
• 37:37
  SPEAKER_02: Not just in the Olympics, but I'm I'm talking about country to country.
• 37:41
  SPEAKER_02: What do you what is it what's your insight on that, or what's your prediction?
• 37:45
  SPEAKER_01: I I I agree.
• 37:46
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, that number 20 million, 20 million players worldwide, that and that's just gonna grow with with, like you said, Thomas, not just the Olympics, but I mean, I know at the high school level, here in the Sacramento region, we didn't have enough officials to cover all the female high school flag football games because almost every high school has a junior varsity and a varsity women's flag football team in high school here in the Sacramento region, called the Samuel Keynes section.
• 38:20
  SPEAKER_01: That's incredible to me.
• 38:21
  SPEAKER_01: And other states are bringing it on board, it is uh just an amazing sport, and you've got men's flag football as well.
• 38:29
  SPEAKER_01: Middle schools are also playing flag football now, so uh because a lot of parents don't want their child playing tackle football, so they're now going to flag football, and there's just so many opportunities and football, it's a world game.
• 38:45
  SPEAKER_01: Flag football is a worldwide game, and I'm just excited to be a part of it and look forward to what it looks like one, two, three years from now.
• 38:54
  SPEAKER_02: Oh yeah.
• 38:56
  SPEAKER_02: So you went from the rapid fire, and this is my favorite question, just to have a little tongue-in-cheek fun.
• 39:02
  SPEAKER_02: I I love to ask the guests what are your top three sports movies?
• 39:06
  SPEAKER_02: What are Johnny's top three sports movies and your honorable mention?
• 39:12
  SPEAKER_01: Oh gosh, top three.
• 39:14
  SPEAKER_01: I think Hoozers would probably want Gene Hackman, God bless him.
• 39:18
  SPEAKER_02: No doubt.
• 39:22
  SPEAKER_01: Gosh, what what um oh I know varsity blues?
• 39:28
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, varsity blues was one I I I really uh enjoyed.
• 39:34
  SPEAKER_01: I thought those are really my top, my top two.
• 39:38
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know that I have a top three, but those are definitely my top two.
• 39:45
  SPEAKER_02: I love it.
• 39:45
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it's it's still amazing to be able to talk to, you know, we've talked to across all all sports spectrum.
• 39:52
  SPEAKER_02: We've talked to soccer players, we've talked to football and everything in between.
• 39:55
  SPEAKER_02: But it's so interesting when we talk to football players and and all three of their are basketball movies or baseball movies.
• 40:02
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, I whenever I ask this, I always follow up with my Hoosier's is my number three, no question.
• 40:08
  SPEAKER_02: My number one is miracle, especially it's it's apropos right now with the Winter Olympics about the men's ice hockey.
• 40:14
  SPEAKER_02: Two is Rocky, and Hoosier's is always number three for me.
• 40:18
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I I I think I would add the natural is probably my my my number three.
• 40:23
  SPEAKER_02: Oh yeah, no question.
• 40:24
  SPEAKER_01: And then and and then probably honorable mention, although it could be three switched out with the natural, is Field the Dreams with Kevin Costner.
• 40:32
  SPEAKER_02: Come on.
• 40:33
  SPEAKER_01: I I I just think that whole I just love the entire script.
• 40:38
  SPEAKER_01: I love the uh actors in in the movie, and I'm a big Kevin Costner fan anyway, so I just love that.
• 40:45
  SPEAKER_01: So that would probably be my three, and then that honorable mention would change back and forth between Field the Dreams and the Natural.
• 40:51
  SPEAKER_02: Sure, Feel the Dreams.
• 40:52
  SPEAKER_02: I'm not crying, you're crying, right?
• 40:54
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, good Lord.
• 40:56
  SPEAKER_02: Johnny, where can people connect with you?
• 40:58
  SPEAKER_02: Whether it's your website or whether it's social media or an email, where could people reach out and connect with you?
• 41:06
  SPEAKER_01: Johnnyperkins.com, J O H N N I E, P-E-R-K-I-N-S.com, Instagram, YouTube at Johnny Perkins Referee.
• 41:17
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 41:18
  SPEAKER_01: Johnny Perkins Referee.
• 41:20
  SPEAKER_01: And then certainly on LinkedIn, uh, I'm also on LinkedIn as well.
• 41:25
  SPEAKER_02: Perfect.
• 41:26
  SPEAKER_02: Johnnyperkins.com, thank you for helping student athletes and families navigate NIL with character, integrity, accountability, and wisdom.
• 41:36
  SPEAKER_02: Team, if this conversation hit you, do two things for us.
• 41:40
  SPEAKER_02: One, share this episode with someone who needs to hear it.
• 41:43
  SPEAKER_02: A student athlete exploring NIL opportunities, a parent protecting their kid in the new era of NIL into the transfer portal, a coach helping athletes make informed decisions, two, visit johnnyperkins.com and connect with Johnny on LinkedIn or via his website.
• 42:01
  SPEAKER_02: If you need NIL compliance guidance, contract expertise, or help educating your athlete and family, Johnny brings the government and private sector experience and everything you'll need.
• 42:14
  SPEAKER_02: And if you're an athlete parent or coach ready to raise the standard, visit us at blueprintbluechip.com.
• 42:19
  SPEAKER_02: We help athletes build identity, discipline, and legacy that goes far beyond the game.
• 42:25
  SPEAKER_02: And if this episode has resonated with you, please leave us a five-star review on Apple Star, on Apple Podcasts or Spotify.
• 42:32
  SPEAKER_02: It helps us reach more athletes, parents, and leaders who need to hear this message.
• 42:36
  SPEAKER_02: This is the standard podcast, and this movement only grows when we raise the standard together.
• 42:42
  SPEAKER_02: Talent fades, but truth endures.
• 42:45
  SPEAKER_02: Let's raise the bar, let's rebuild the culture, let's become the standard.
• 42:50
  SPEAKER_02: Johnny, Aaron, thank you guys both so much for joining me today.
• 42:53
  SPEAKER_02: We look forward to the next time.