Latest / Becker’s Healthcare Podcast / Value-Based Care, Consumerism, and Leading Leaders with Dan Tasset

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Value-Based Care, Consumerism, and Leading Leaders with Dan Tasset · Becker’s Healthcare Podcast

0:00
This is Scott Becker with the Beckers HealthCare
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podcast.
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It's a privilege and a pleasure today to
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get to visit with Dan Tasset.
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I've known Dan for a long time. He
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he's one of the leading sort of entrepreneurs,
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thinkers in the health care industry
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early on in the surgery center industry, but
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then was able to move adjacent
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to physician owned hospitals, to imaging, to all
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kinds of other areas. Really a gifted person.
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Dan, it's a pleasure to have you with
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us today. We'll talk about what you're doing
0:28
today,
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trends,
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what you're most focused on, and a lot
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more. Can I ask you to take a
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moment and introduce yourself and tell the audience
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a little bit about your background and what
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you do?
0:39
Well, first, Scott, thank you for having me
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on your podcast. I've been extremely impressed. I've
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called you a medial mogul here
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many times. So
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I'll start with just a big thank you.
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But, yeah, my name is Dan Tasset. I'm
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the chairman
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of, a company called NewHealth. It's been in
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business now, like, thirty years.
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Our parent company is Nueterra Capital. It's really
1:01
a privately held family office.
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Most of our investments are in health care,
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and the investments that we make in health
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care are generally those investments where we believe
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we can,
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lower the cost, improve quality, thereby, you know,
1:15
maybe saving our US health care system,
1:19
that we all hope to save.
1:22
Thank you. Take a second on sort of
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let me ask you first.
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You've really come back. You you built an
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incredible company to begin with. I remember watching
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Nueterra, the different iterations of new health, incredible
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talent,
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incredible success.
1:37
You you've come back at this with sort
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of what I look at as sort of
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a vengeance to get back in the game
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more fully, it feels like. Talk about what's
1:44
exciting you, what you're focused on, what's driven
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you to sort of like you know, I
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feel like I'm talking to the godfather who's
1:50
come out of retirement, has come back at
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it. And I know you never retired, but
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but you're sort of back at it fully.
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What's driving that, and what are you excited
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about? Well, that's an interesting perception on your
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part, Scott. And
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I I did really, you know, we have
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played the fee for service world and have
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been very successful at the in the ASC
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and surgical hospital
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industry, as you know.
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And we spent a lot of time partnering
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with physicians, and then we did like many
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of the ASC management companies have done. We
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started to partner with health systems as well.
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So we play that
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vertical integration leverage, if you will, that, the
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health system sometimes are able to to do,
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by that vertical integration. Sometimes they get a
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net effect of a of a monopoly. So
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it was a great run-in the business,
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for us.
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But I I saw a different vision,
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and maybe it's just because, you know, I
2:45
got bored doing that same old fee for
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service thing and
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and growing, you know, in 30 some states
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that, you know, with,
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like, almost 39 states. And I saw a
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vision, I think, where health care is going
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or at least I think it wants to
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go and needs to go, and that is
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this word that everybody throws around called value
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based care.
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And we came up with a early definition
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of value based care, and, really, it's a,
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it's a formula. And it the formula numerator
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in it is,
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clinical quality,
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outcomes, whatever you wanna call it,
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plus patient satisfaction
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divided by a cost.
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So whenever we deliver care and any investment
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we make, and in this case, I'll talk
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about the surgery center industry,
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we always want to increase the numerator and
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decrease the denominator,
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decrease the cost.
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So I've been on this,
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this goal and this journey
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to really truly define and do value based
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care, not just something we talk about and
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we use as some
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term or rhetoric, but really truly make a
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difference. And I think
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in surgery,
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and particularly surgery centers,
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can be the example for the rest of
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health care. And so I've been I've been
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really invigorated
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by what I see as directionally where health
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care
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wants to go and needs to go. And,
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Scott, look, I I think the trend that
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I see right now is the narrative is
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changing,
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and it's changing
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the federal government level. It's changing at the
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employer level.
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And we all know that costs and health
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care have outpaced inflation
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since
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year 2000, last twenty five years.
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You know, the health care cost and particularly
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hospital cost
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have outpaced inflation by three times.
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And so when you look at that, you
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say, well, how on earth can we sustain
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that,
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as a system, as a health care system?
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You know, I get really excited about the
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trend that I see happening right now. And
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that trend is more
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more focused
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on consumerism,
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patient empowerment.
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You hear the government talking about increasing HSA
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and HRA,
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allowances,
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increasing
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co pays and deductibles. I think employers are
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doing the same thing. The successful employers,
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self funded employers, of which we're one. We
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have thousands of employees, and we haven't had
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a premium increase in our company in over
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five years. We have high deductible, high co
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pay plans. We generously fund them with HSA,
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HRA accounts.
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And then we turn our our employees into
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real consumers of health care, real shoppers looking
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for the best deal.
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And I think that's a national trend right
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now.
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Better price transparency,
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not some of this current transparency laws that
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are out there, but true price tags. So
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the for the employee, the patient, the consumer
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can actually shop.
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I think the second big trend that we
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see is
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that's all going to force more provider competition.
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And I think the employer, the federal government,
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they want more
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provider competition,
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not
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to reverse the trend that's actually happened, which
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is
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competition has been systematically just removed,
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or has been removed from our health care
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delivery, particularly in the hospital space.
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And then I think the third trend is
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obviously
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technology.
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Everything from
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data analytics to AI,
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you know, improving efficiency,
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clinical support,
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you know, navigation workflow, all of that. So,
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you know, we're really,
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really excited about direction where health care is
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going.
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It feels like there is brand new
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era
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of,
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ambulatory surgical services and ambulatory,
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health care in general.
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And it's like it's got tremendous tailwinds right
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now. And,
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I feel really good about where we're positioned,
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against some of the competition and, you know,
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what we're able to do and hope hopefully,
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we'll be able to contribute to true transformation
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in our health care system.
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Where do you see the government in all
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of this? Because they they've tried to move
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towards Medicare Advantage.
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It's been sort of received by some well,
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received by others very poorly. What do you
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see the government's
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ability to help change the sort of direction
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of health care?
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Any thoughts there? I do. I have a
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lot of thoughts. Number one, I, you know,
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I've spent a lot of time on the
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Hill in Washington, DC, a lot of time
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talking to US senators and large groups of
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senators. A couple months ago, I was in
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Washington, DC and had lunch with about, there
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was almost 40 US senators. And and, I
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was the only speaker talking about what change
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would look like and what it should look
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like. And,
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I came back to the basic fundamentals, the
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basic foundation of,
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empowering the patient with true price tags,
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and,
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along with,
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you know, the competition
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amongst so removing some of the politically removing
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some of the the competitive barriers that are
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out there right now. We all know what
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those are. I mean, there's been there's been
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volumes written on,
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and some of it has been published in,
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you know, Becker's own hospital review.
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You know, what are some of those things
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that are that are,
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that are, noncompetitive?
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The the certificate of need,
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laws and and still a great number of
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states,
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is a is is just truly anti competitive.
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And so I think the government
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now the big question whether or not, Scott,
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whether or not they have the stomach for
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it or the political will for it.
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You know, but I know there's a lot
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of dialogue going on and,
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you know, reducing,
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benefits to state from the federal government, any
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state that has a certificate of need law.
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A lot of talk right now at federal
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government level, as you would know, about,
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physician noncompetes.
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Some of the states have done away with
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them. There's still a lot of states that
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still do.
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Physicians
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owning hospitals. I mean, those basic
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noncompetitive,
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laws that are in place today, there's an
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awful lot of, dialogue.
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I also see,
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CMS
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starting to with some of the programs that
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they are,
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coming out with today.
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It really is is talking more value based
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care. I still think they've they've got it
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wrong. I think they need to put the
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physicians more at the center
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of value based care, lowering cost, improving quality.
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And I think they need to not just
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do shared savings, but they do need to
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do downside risks.
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That's we're starting to see that come out
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a little bit, not as much as I'd
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like to see it. But,
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Scott, I think look. I think the main
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thing is this. It's it's that old saying,
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it's not so much where we are today,
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but the direction we're headed. And I think
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we are clearly headed, even at the federal
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government level,
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we're clearly headed into true,
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downside risk contracts, what we used to call
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value based care.
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And and and that's fantastic to hear your
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thoughts on it. Dan, you've had this tremendous
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career as a leader, as an entrepreneur,
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as a health care guru. What advice do
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you give to emerging leaders?
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Well, that's a favorite subject of mine. And
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and I gotta tell you, emerging leader, I
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think the number one advice I could give
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them is lead yourself first.
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I'll repeat that.
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You may may not have heard that term
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before,
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but lead yourself
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first. You can't lead other people unless you're
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leading yourself.
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So if you're
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if you're out, you know, watching three hours
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of television every night and looking at at
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mindless social media for hours on end, you're
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not leading yourself. You're not being the best
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version of you.
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And, you know, I you have to when
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you lead yourself, you have to say,
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who do I want to become?
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So I would encourage all of those emerging,
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evolving leaders. Ask yourself the question, who do
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you want to be? Who do you want
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to become? What kind of husband? What kind
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of parent? What kind of what kind of
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boss? What kind of employee? What kind of
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leader do you want to be?
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And I I think the second
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the second thing I would put in that
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is goals are nice,
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but they don't drive change.
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Habits
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drive change.
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So put into place,
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if you want to become
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something different than you are today, define what
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that is, and then we'll put the habits
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in place to do that,
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and put the systems in place to do
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that. Whatever,
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you know, it takes. If you if you
11:38
are a person that,
11:40
you know, doesn't like to exercise, put a
11:42
system in place where you get up in
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the morning and you have your shoes laying
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by your bed, and before you wake up,
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you got your shoes and you're out the
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door jogging.
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So
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I think the third thing I might say
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is I love anticipatory
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leaders. I the people in our organization
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that anticipate
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problems or anticipate change.
12:02
So look ahead. Try to be try to
12:05
look ahead and anticipate. And I think the
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last thing
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is is probably the most important.
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If you're an emerging leader,
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think of yourself as a leader who leads
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leaders.
12:20
Not a leader who leads
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followers,
12:23
but a leader who leads leaders.
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And you develop those leaders under you
12:30
rather than followers by delegating authority,
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not delegating
12:35
tasks.
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So kind of the general rule I have
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that if I think somebody under me can
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get it 60%
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right,
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I'll delegate it.
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And
12:48
and then I can check on them and
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feel confident that, you know, they may not
12:53
as good do it as well as I
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think I could have done, but the way
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they learn and the way you develop leaders
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is you you have to delegate authority to
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do so. So that'd be my advice for
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the evolving leaders.
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Can you do me a favor? I think
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that was just great. The the starting with
13:10
the manager self, could you just summarize those
13:13
five again very quickly, four to five again
13:15
very quickly for people that are listening?
13:17
First would be lead yourself first,
13:20
number one. You can't lead other people unless
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you lead yourself.
13:25
Who do you want to be?
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And then put those processes in place, put
13:30
the habits in place
13:32
to become the person you wanna be.
13:35
You know, the old idea of setting a
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goal or New Year's resolutions,
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it doesn't work.
13:42
You know, put the process and the habits
13:43
in place. Lead yourself first. Number two, be
13:47
an anticipatory
13:48
leader.
13:49
Anticipate the problems. Anticipate what direction things are
13:53
going. Be out in front of it. And
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the the the last one was be a
13:59
leader. Think of yourself as a leader who
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leads leaders or develops leaders,
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not a leader who leads followers.
14:06
And you do that by delegating
14:10
authority, not delegating tasks.
14:13
And, again, my rule is, get 60% of
14:16
it right.
14:17
Let them take it and do it,
14:19
and they'll get better at it down the
14:21
road and you just developed a leader, and
14:23
then you yourself
14:25
are no longer the the bottleneck.
14:29
Then you can continue
14:30
to get more creative or do whatever you
14:33
do. Scott, I gotta believe you're as good
14:35
at this as anybody on the planet based
14:37
on the empire that you've developed. So you
14:40
have to know how to delegate,
14:42
authority in your business or you wouldn't be
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where you are. Well, no. You you've done
14:47
a wonderful job of it, and and I'm
14:48
a huge fan of really, a lot of
14:50
what you said is the evolution of a
14:52
founder, the evolution of a leader is is
14:54
really at the end of the day, it's
14:55
thrive, thrive, great people side by side with
14:57
you, and
14:59
you you can't be in a spot where
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the bottleneck is you. You've got gotta grow
15:04
to a spot where we've developed multiple leaders,
15:07
and and and you're no longer the bottleneck
15:09
to to growth of whatever you're trying to
15:11
accomplish.
15:12
And I think what you said about, you
15:13
know, there's an old concept, Peter Drucker concept
15:16
of Harvard Business School concept of manage yourself.
15:19
You know, you can't manage others, not manage
15:20
yourself. Couldn't do that more.
15:22
I love the concept of inhabits versus goals.
15:24
I love the concept on, you know, we're
15:27
trying to delegate
15:28
whole things, not just tasks to people, whole
15:30
areas to people and build them to where
15:32
they can get there. Because if you're if
15:34
you're if you're delegating tasks,
15:36
at the end of the day, there's only
15:38
so far you can go. You're you're not
15:39
really
15:40
an agentic company that's self actualizing. You're you're
15:43
you're really top down and still from that
15:45
person, and it's very limiting. So I I
15:47
couldn't That's absolutely right. Yeah. It's limiting. That's
15:50
that's a good word for it. Yeah. No.
15:52
I love it. Dan Tasset again,
15:55
founder, I think, CEO still of New Health.
15:58
You've been doing this for a long time.
15:59
You've been incredibly successful. You've been really an
16:01
inspiration to me with a lot of what
16:03
you've done and how you do it. I
16:05
love it. Again, Dan, thank you so much
16:07
for joining us today on the Becker's Healthcare
16:08
Podcast. It's always a pleasure to visit with
16:10
you, and I'm always inspired. Thank you. Scott,
16:13
thank you.