Latest / The On Purpose Podcast / Ep. 372 – Heather Melville: Finding Purpose Beyond Pain
Transcript
- speaker-0: You are listening to the On Purpose Podcast. What's up, everybody? Welcome to this week's edition of the show where you know it's our job to get you moving, get you thinking, maybe get you looking in that mirror, going, Man, am I being honest to the person I see back? Am I letting myself off the hook? Am I challenging myself to be who I'm supposed to be? And this week I'm super excited to talk with one of my newest friends, Heather Melville, a former engineer. transitioned into her purpose as a toxic relationship recovery coach who helps people rebuild healthy relationships with others and most importantly with themselves. Her work blends empathy, connection, creativity, and lived experience. And her mission is simple and powerful and is to help as many people as she can break unhealthy patterns, heal, and create relationships rooted in clarity, respect, And South Worth. But before I introduce you to Heather, I need you to hop over to YouTube, hit the subscribe button. You know, that helps other people around the world maybe find a conversation they did here just like this one. So do that for us. Then sit back and enjoy this week's conversation with our newest friend, Heather Melville. Heather, how are you today? speaker-1: Good, very good. That was a wonderful introduction, probably better than I could have ever said it. speaker-0: that's why you always have somebody else write your introductions. I 'cause we'll always shortchange ourselves. speaker-1: Yeah, yeah. And then when you're too close to the problem, too close to all of it, you just start getting in your head of like, How do I say this the way that it it needs to come out? So that was perfect. I appreciate it. speaker-0: you thank you. I'm glad you enjoyed it. I you know what I usually say who writes the best introductions is people's moms. speaker-1: Huh. speaker-0: Moms love to brag about their kids. speaker-1: That's true. That's true. But would they know exactly what I want them to say is the thing. So my mom would probably say something like, and I've had her do this before. I actually was at a winery and I had these people looking at me and from behind and they finally came up to me, they're like, Are are you a swimmer or something? I was, you know, I'm looking jacked and stuff like that. And my mom's like, No, she played softball for twelve years and I'm like, Well, you know, that was almost fifteen years ago. So But yeah, so yeah, and that's a good point. I think they would say, you know, the best things. It's just what they they touch on the topics we really speaker-0: them to touch on. That's true. Yeah, you don't know what you're gonna get. Well Heather, I wanna ask you this question to kind of open things up. As you arrive here today for us, with us I guess, how would you describe who you are? speaker-1: I am life. Simple as that. I am life. I I am here to live. I'm here to experience everything. And and as much as we think that's all those fun experiences of traveling the world and living in different countries and experiencing different cultures, it's also about experiencing the hardships. Because we don't grow in the comfort zone. We don't grow in just enjoying. We grow through the hardship. So I'm I'm here to experience it all. Even though like going through it when it's so painful, I'm like, screw this. I don't want to be here. I don't want this. And then at the end you get bassed and you're like, well, I mean, look look what I learned. Look what I figured out. Look who I've become because of it. And it's just an underlying theme, I think, in all of my life. It's also an underlying theme I see that I need to like draw out of my clients that And it's how I reframed some of my more painful experiences so that I could actually get past the pain and take the lesson. Because sometimes I was just so stuck in the pain that I couldn't even see how is okay. I mean, yeah, right, a toxic relationship, how is that benefiting you? I mean, it's not, but take the lessons from it so that you can transform your life and go past it. Otherwise, you just sit in that pain and then you think. This is what life is. Life is pain. But so for me, life is all, and I am that. I am all of it. speaker-0: That was a great, great explanation. How I I guess one of the things, the first thing that comes to mind is because I I agree with you, like we shouldn't be avoiding pain at all in life, right? Like we shouldn't do everything to to stay safe and not feel this because it does, you know, like they say, to appreciate a sunny day, you gotta have some rainy days, right? And to appreciate the good, you gotta have the bad. What kind of led you to diving deeper into that? world going from engineering to relationship coaching, specifically toxic relationships. And so kind of talk us through that switch. And was there a moment when you're like, wait, I've got to follow this. I owe it to myself to pursue this. speaker-1: Well, and I will say I I I should preface that I am kind of a consultant engineer now for a startup company, which I'm actually kind of excited for. And in in previous conversations, previous podcasts, which I've found that I had put my foot in my mouth, kind of thing, that I said something like, I hated engineering, which is not the case. I enjoy math. I have always been a math person. Something about the logic, a universal language, love problem solving. I am a jigsaw puzzler, I can do those for days kind of thing. So it felt n good to go into that, but also my reasonings for going into engineering were not really because of that. They were because at the time I was in the toxic relationship where money was a very big problem. Mine was being taken and wasted. And so I thought the only way to have the life I want is I gotta make more money to out out make my partner's spending habits. And so I was, you know, jogging my brain around. This was after I had graduated with my first degree in theatrical lighting design, the creative side of me. Also previously I wanted to be an actor, realized I can only be myself, so moved into lighting design. But anyways, I, you know. needed to find something that would make me money and maybe have a respectable career in the eyes of my friends and family. So I heeded everybody's talk of me being great at math that I should be an engineer. So me pursuing that was never like, because I'm passionate about it, because I'm in line with what I'm supposed to do. It was really a desperation. It was really like this is the only way I can see this will work. So when I found myself in a job Yeah, I enjoyed some things, but I also realized that I have not I'm not made for a nine to five. I have never been I thought I thought theater was not a nine to five job and it it really isn't, but that's why I struggled so hard in the engineering field because it is this nine to five of draining your soul on things that don't matter, that don't make a difference. And of course I was part of a DOD contracting which is just, you know Sometimes dealing with the government isn't the easiest. so I was looking for something that lit me up that because I kept thinking, God, I'm gonna sit in this job for the next 30 years, counting down the days till I get my weekend or I can finally take a two week two week vacation once a year. No, that's not how I wanna live my life. We're not here to be clocking in, clocking out, having somebody monitor our times and then having to bargain with them of when we can actually rest, take time for ourselves, and do the things we really came to do and want to do. So I I really struggled and my fiance now has always had an entrepreneurial spirit. So he introduced me to a lot of things. You know, we we talked about selling on Amazon, which I I do that on the side and And you know, just trying to do e-commerce and and it it wasn't fulfilling me. It wasn't I felt like I was just adding to the consumerism that is already too much and you know to those landfills. So I was like, I need something. And what is it that I'm good at? Well, I'm very good at presentations. I can talk to anybody, even a tree, if it would respond back. Actually, I probably don't need him to respond back. I could just talk, you know. And the other thing is I had noticed even even being in an engineer in a DOD kind of place where security and secrecy is a big thing, people would come up to me and tell me their life stories. And it's not like they just like, hi, you're you're Heather. Okay, here's my life story. It was just this flow, this easy flow of conversation that maybe because I would be vulnerable. They felt comfortable to be vulnerable with me and and tell me all these things. Also, I'm just naturally interested. I want to ask everybody questions all the time. So I was like, okay, what what do these gifts culminate to? What what can I do? I know I want to help people. I know I want to leave the world better than I found it. And what does that look like? Well, and then I did some you know, researching and then I found life coaching and I was like, yeah, I I just want to talk to people and and help them feel better about their lives, maybe point them in a a right direction, whatever that is. And they always talk about teaching about something you know, something you experience. And I was like, well, what have I experienced? Well, I've solo traveled across Europe, which is an a very empowering experience that I highly recommend for absolutely everybody because When you step off that plane and you're in a country where you can't read the street signs and you've got to figure out how to get from here to wherever you're staying, it's all on you. There's nobody to be like, What do you think? Should we take the bus or should we take the train? It's all on you. And that builds resilience and confidence and courage in yourself. And it's funny because I kind of like weave it in. It's probably what helped me heal from my toxic relationship while I was still in it. but so I was like, Okay, well, what do I know? Well, I know. Toxic relationship. I know what it's like to be in an eight-year-long abusive relationship that occasionally had physical violence, but a lot of mental and emotional experiences as well. And and it's been me switching to this that has made me realize this is my purpose. This is where I'm finding my voice. This is where I'm finding how I can make a dent in the world. And it also reminds me too that like I have this kind of philosophy that imagine if we all had healthy, fulfilling relationships. Imagine how we would all feel. Because I remember some of those fights with my ex would be just catastrophic right before I'm going to work and the whole day is just ruined. My experience at work is ruined. My experience with my friends is ruined because of that one experience in my relationship. So imagine if we had relationships where we were fulfilled, we were satisfied. How would we show up in the world? And what would the world look like if we were all that way? And I know that's a utopian idea, but it it's something I just I think will be like a never ending journey for me to help others experience that healthy relationship. And I'm not saying and here's here's the preface I always start with is like healthy relationships does not mean you don't have arguments, does not mean you don't have conflicts. And and I mean I can attest to that. I mean my fiancee had a huge argument even this weekend, you know, and it was equal, right? It was equal sides. There was some things of his communication we needed to work on and some of my past triggers that keep coming up. Because even though I'm I feel I'm very healed, there's always gonna be something, some residue that I need to work through. So speaker-0: So talk to me about that before you can start sharing with everybody else and and lean into the business side of it. What was that transition like for you? And what was what was the first step you took in going, Okay, let me fix me now? speaker-1: coming out of the toxic relationship. Yeah. Well, it's funny because, you know, I part of me helping others is also reflecting on my own journey. Like what worked for me? And then, you know, who is this person in front of me? Will this work for them? It might, it might not. But there's some core roots, right? And I think about it and it's like they say that women actually break up with the person six more six months before they leave the relationship. And that was absolutely true for me. Like it was a slow going process when I finally left the relationship. But there were seeds pant planted through. Like, like I said, I had gone to Germany for an electrical engineering internship. And that time apart allowed me to see some of these patterns I hadn't seen before. I took off the rose colored glasses and I also gained back some of that. You know what? Even if I was alone, I can still do it. I don't need somebody, you know, I'm fine being alone. I'd rather be alone than be in a relationship that makes me feel lonely and hurts me. But I think the one thing for me that was really I started to realize like, what is it that I want from life, from myself, and in a relationship. And and I mean I didn't sit here and write these down like a bullet point in a journal kind of thing. They actually presented themselves to me. And it's interesting, a lot of the research and learning that I do for myself talks about asking yourself a question, even if it's out loud or within you, but then not expecting an answer, not pushing for an answer, but letting the wisdom within you come in and give you that answer. And so many times it was like time to explore me. You know, getting back to some of those things that I suppressed when I was in the relationship, you know, like even even something so simple as like I have always been a crafty person. So the back in the nineties, paint by numbers was huge. I mean it's coming back, but they also now have paint by diamonds, which just really feeds my logical brain as well, because it's like a diamond in a square and it is so satisfying. But just doing that allowed me to get back to myself, give myself time. speaker-0: Yeah, and what I what I hear there, Heather, and and we have a lot of similarities as far as interest and stuff is you gave yourself space to explore you again. Yeah. Right. It's hard to explore yourself if you're still in a situation where you don't feel you can be yourself. speaker-1: Yeah. And when you're so focused on putting the relationship above yourself. speaker-0: Yeah, and your your comment about asking yourself questions, right? It reminds me of I can't remember I think it was on an episode I just did recently with another guest and we were talking about that's the beauty of trail running or hiking or getting in nature is that nature's gonna ask you questions you didn't even know you wanted to know. speaker-1: so you hit so it's funny because I was doing this healing work up in Flagstaff, Arizona, which is just hiking paradise. And it was. It was those moments of being out on a trail, nobody around, and you know, maybe imbibing in some more conceptual things that are fun to do, that give you that space to really go down the rabbit hole and really think about things. Sometimes, not all the time. but and actually those hikes are also what led me to the conclusion that it was time to get out as well. I asked the question of okay, we're we've been in this relationship for eight years. The next logical step when it comes to kind of dating, because there is I mean a lot of us don't want to admit it, but there is usually an end goal for dating. Even if it's not getting married, there's an end goal of choosing somebody and staying with them. But I was like, okay, eight years, you know, typically they get married. And I started asking myself, like, well, what would that look like if we got married? Well, I'd have friends and family all around, and when the priest says, Does anybody object? Everybody would stand up. I don't think I could even have a successful wedding with this person. You know, and and there was another question too of like, Okay, what happens when we have kids? How do I explain to a daughter? That mom can accept this treatment, this abuse, but it is not okay for you. Or to a son, like this is not how you treat women, but mom can accept that. Your father can do that. So, like, yeah, being in nature, just being in nature, honestly. You don't even need to ask yourself questions, just being in nature, being there. And it's like it evaporates all those, those silly worries, those silly fears, because it's like. Well what does it matter? This matters. Life matters. speaker-0: Yeah, no, that's well said. So s when somebody finally steps out, 'cause like you said, you know, they're they're broke up or leaving a relationship six months before they actually break up. So like emotionally, mentally, they're withdrawn, they're moving on. When somebody finally decides to step away, what obviously that's gonna be where the real work starts, right? Cause now you got you got a lot of things you to deal with. What do the early stages of healing look like there? speaker-1: Ooh, those that is just like based on each individual person because it can be a range of things and it really depends too, is this a repeated relationship? Is this not the first toxic relationship? for me it was my first and first relationship and first toxic relationship. So it was a lot of Going back to what do I even know about relationships? What do I know about myself? I started this relationship when I was like twenty-one, before I even really knew me. Not that we know ourselves in our twenties anyways. I feel like it takes to be forty or or mid-thirties when you finally start realizing who you are. Or you stop accepting all the bullshit that you've been in unundated from childhood on. But I and I'll share my experience. It was a mixture. And that's I think what a lot of us struggle with is this mixture because there's, you know, it is loss of a relationship. Even if it was a horri horrible relationship, is it is still the ending of something. And then, you know, then there's second guessing. Is this the right decision? I mean, I think about all those good times, which if you really think about it and go into some of those good times, you can see the underlying darkness, which is what I realized. And it and actually so one of the things I did is I took all of our pictures, everything I'd ever give gotten from him that wasn't like valuable that I couldn't like make money off of, and burned it. Because I realized I was holding on to these pictures that, you know, were were us smiling. And then going back into the memory of when that picture was taken, it was like, yeah, we had just had an argument right before where he accused me of cheating on him out of nowhere. Just another way to try and manipulate me. Yeah, he's he accused me of cheating on him with some person that I had already explained I did not like. I thought he was a horrible person. So it's just like, gosh, another and so every time I look at that picture, I would think, yeah, good times. And then I'd be like, wait a minute. Not really good times. Me idolizing these moments. So it's a lot of like a mixture of like confusion there, of pain, of hurt angry for staying, angry for what I endured. angry for wasting time and especially for me because it was my twenties. Angry for my youth gone. Not that I'm not young now. I mean you may see me and you're like, yeah, what are you talking about? You're 27. No, I wish. But and then, you know, and then there was moments of relief. Like I could finally breathe. Like I don't have to tell anybody where I'm gonna go, what I'm gonna do. I can have a conversation with somebody and not be worried that if I mention this later, you had a conversation with a man, you're cheating on me. No, I I I had a conversation, that's all. But so it's it's a real mixed bag in the beginning. Like relief, pain, anger, maybe a little bit of sh well, a lot of bit of shame, judgment on yourself, but then also excited, like, huh. I don't care if I'm never in a relationship again. I can finally breathe. I can go do anything I've wanted to do. And I did. A lot of the times. And speaker-0: What about blame? Does blame come in there or they sit and blame themselves for what could they have done different? How could I have made this work? speaker-1: Couldn't I have been a better girlfriend in some way? Well, and that's and then it also c it really comes into the the gravity of the relationship as well. So, like for me, the blame I had was kind of blaming myself for staying, blaming myself for feeding into some of the argument cycles, knowing that he was trying to manipulate me or get a rise out of me, and couldn't I have handled that differently? And then, you know. I didn't experience this, but I know a lot of my clients have, that afterwards you kind of become a little bit obsessive where you want to keep looking at their social media and be like, who are they dating somebody? And they look happy. Is he not treating her the way he treated me? Well, if he's not treating her that way, has he changed or was I the problem? Was I the reason he was so abusive? Did I do something? There's that blame, but for me, the blame I experienced came from my fa friends and family. That not only did I experience this relationship, so did they. And my ex was pretty awful to my my mom and two of my best friends. He pissed my family, my larger family off, but they experienced this as well. And so I blamed myself. For staying and having them endure this as well. Yeah. speaker-0: Yeah, I guess I hadn't even thought of that angle, but that's yeah, that's I could see where that would weigh. What would you say? speaker-1: If if if you're close to your friends and family, if they're really involved, you know. And and he did he did say and do th some things to my mom and friends that it was just like I should have walked away and I didn't blame speaker-0: What what would you say are some of the misconceptions people have about recovery and or the process of that? speaker-1: The big misconception is that we need to be fully healed to get into another relationship. We have we have to have some piece of paper stamp mark that says fully healed. Okay, you can go out and date again. Cause honestly, right? Honestly, that's never gonna be the case. It will never be the case. Even as I'm in a healthy relationship now and working through things and now in a position where I'm helping others through the same thing, I am still healing. And part of it is not just the toxic relationship I was in before, but some of those childhood wounds that kind of hung around, led me to be in a toxic relationship. But it's just like there's never gonna be an end date where it's like okie dokie, I've reached the finish line, I can move on. And actually Some of my best healing has been in my relationship because there's some triggers that I didn't even know existed until I was faced with being in a relationship with somebody else. if I can think of an example, hmm. So the real life example is I have taken tone of voice and some words. You're doing exactly what I do. You're you're like Who's out there? I heard a noise. speaker-0: the our wind just kicked up and it blew my blind. speaker-1: Careful of the Starlink, I have had that happen before. speaker-0: A Starlink gangster. speaker-1: dang, see now I need some tips, man. I it's it's funny. Last year we were up I think we were up in Flagstaff already, so we were taking the bus out for like a long time. It was two months we were out and I was doing a workshop and and it was one of the days that all of Starlink had just crashed, like all the satellites had crashed. It was mid workshop too and it was just like floop and all like and I was like, How could that even happen? But so misconceptions, so like one of the triggers I was talking about that I didn't even know, you know, I do focus on tone of voice, you know, being being the coach that I am, you know, there are more than just words being said when we communicate, right? Seven percent of our words is what our our communication is based off of. The other ninety three percent is tone of voice, body language, facial expressions, all that. and so Of course, I have all these teachings and it's like I'm in a relationship with a real life human who might not know these teachings, who might not experience this. And so one of the triggers for me is if somebody uses a tone of voice that is exhibiting stress or anger or irritation, not towards me, but because of whatever they're dealing with in their own life, I reflect it back onto me. I must be the problem. I'm losing love here. They've lost love for me. And it goes back to the previous relationship that I sit there and think, how can if if we're in love, how can he ever talk to me like that? And so kind of one of those things is working through and realizing, hey, well, we all have our days. We all have our emotional days. And a lot of the times, especially me being programmed to see so much it's not that I was looking for the negativity, but in the toxic relationship there was so much. It was constant negativity. So I've been programmed to look out for the negativity. And when there isn't any, not that I'm creating something, but I try to find where it is so that I can be validated in my bias, can can confirm that I'm not crazy. See, he said it right there. That tone of voice. That was it. You know? So relationships are are what what's gonna draw out those triggers. And we need to do that. And hopefully you find a person who can sit in that space with you, can still give you the love and the compassion you need to work through it. And that's that's the basis of a healthy relationship, really. speaker-0: I love it. Yeah, I I that was such a good point 'cause I would not have thought of I would have been on opposite. If somebody was jumping back into a relationship, I'd have like, Are you sure you're ready? Do you need that? You need more time. But you're absolutely right. Like getting if it feels safe and it's secure, you're gonna be able to work through things because now you are actually in the place to work through them versus doing it by yourself where you're not like you said, exposed to the triggers, exposed to other people's mood, swings, demeanor and speaker-1: Well, and then and like you you had said, I don't know if we had already started recording, but balance. So that's my big thing in life is balance, right? So you're absolutely right though. If somebody gets out of a relationship and they're jumping right in again, have they given themselves enough time to feel what it's like to be alone, to come back to themselves? Are they jumping because they're trying to fill a void? They're seeking love because of that desperation for validation. So this is where when you do get into a relationship, asking yourself these questions and being kind of honest. And it was a worry for me because mine was actually pretty quick. I had left my ex in March and I had moved down to Tucson to for a internship. And I was in the mindset of I'm I'm just trying to have fun now. I'm trying to live relive some of those S T D twenties, you know, like Let's explore. Let's go crazy. I was like, the next time I'm in a relationship, it's not gonna be for another two to three years and it's gonna be open. I'm not gonna be controlled. So like I was fighting it. I was like, this is my time. And of course, you know, the universe means like, so so this means you're not gonna go into anything with expectations, which means you're gonna be your full authentic self. And if somebody accepts you there, that means that's love. When they accept you authentically. So of course I I met my fiance and again in the beginning I was fighting it hard. I was like, no, I'm establishing rules here, you know, boundaries. And again, when you don't have expectations, when you're not forcing something, when you're not looking to fill a void, when you're just being and just enjoying people's company, you show up your real self. You're not carrying a mask around of I've got to be this perfect girlfriend so that they'll like me. So that they'll want to be my boyfriend, you know? and and then when you are your real self and you meet somebody who's also real, there's real connection there. speaker-0: So let me ask you this, Heather, let me ask this. What if somebody listening or people listening have been in multiple toxic relationships? Like they get out of one, they rebuild themselves, and they find themselves back in another one. How do you get them to rebuild the trust for themselves that that they can be worth more? That they they don't have to just settle for this if it's been a pattern. speaker-1: Well, the first thing is when we don't trust ourselves, it leads into that blame. Like, how could I I not only did I not see it the first time and now here I am repeating the second time, I thought I did all that rebuild stuff. So now it comes back to, well, what's underlying that's underneath these that's having you miss whatever it is this person is exhibiting, those red flags we like to call them, right? Why are you missing them? Have you established what is a red flag to you? So I I like to talk about deal breakers and red flags. Red flags, you know, they're there and it's like, am I reading into this too much? Am I projecting my previous relationship onto this? Or is this a real thing? Like they're showing me who they really are and I'm trying to hide it because I'm desperate for a relationship. Or and then there's deal breakers, which is like, you know, you're First year in and they come up and throw a punch, deal breaker. But why did I stay? Why did I keep on going? And that's what didn't get worked on. In in between the previous toxic relationship, the the building healing phase and falling into another toxic relationship, we didn't work on why we stay. What keeps us wanting a relationship? What keeps driving us? And a lot of those for me was. self-esteem, not believing I was worthy of anything more, and that I could only be defined in a relationship. I can only be defined as successful or happy or beautiful if I had somebody there to validate that. Rather than giving that to myself, rather than believing in myself. And and a lot of us struggle to be alone because of these kind of things. Also because, you know, that's when our mind has the moment to do that. But I've actually been practicing on being alone. And and this is where we can change the phrase from being alone to solitude, moments of peace, moments of quiet. But a lot of us fight that because then the thoughts come up. Well this is that's what we gotta face. We've gotta face those thoughts or we're gonna fall right back in. speaker-0: Yeah. Yeah, that's so true. I I'm just sitting and I'm just like picturing what you're saying and that alone time and the negativity creeps in or the doubts creep back in, the negative self-talk. So for somebody that's that's early in that process, what are some things you'd say to them to to maybe tools to use to work through that first set of conversations? speaker-1: Well, the key through all of this is gonna be compassion. And I know that's hard to do for yourself. I still struggle with it. Sometimes I sit there and blame myself or or like say these things like, you didn't get this done. You're you're worthless. You didn't get this done. You must be stupid. But it's coming back to where does that come from? Where does the term me calling myself stupid come from? Because Were you born into this world, stupid? I I don't think so. So what's that repeating? What are you repeating here? Is this something from your childhood? And and it's just like being okay with it. Because when you fight it, you're suppressing it. And and I do like to really focus on the body as well, because I don't think this is all conceptual. It is also in your body as well. And that's it's funny because like when I reflected on my own journey. as I'm reading and learning on how to help others, I would see things and then be like, I did that. I didn't know that's what that was for. I didn't know that was going to help me. So like one thing for me was I actually signed up for Krav Maga, which is, if people don't know, is like the Israeli fighting. And it's very much not like specific movements like Taekwondo or Jiu Jitsu or anything like that. It's somebody's coming at you with a knife, how to get out of it. Somebody's coming at you with a gun, how to get out of it kind of thing. Which is really effing cool. got me in good shape, made me f yeah. Yeah, I I have so many pictures of like I had like my my finger was like swollen looking after punching so much. But it and it made me confident that I mean something that we we touch on now a lot more of what it's like to be in a a woman in the world where you're walking to your car with your key i in between your fingers just in case kind of thing. So I now feel confident. I mean, I don't think I can take down a whole bunch of people, but I know I could probably at least fight, get away. But doing that movement and it really helped me release some of the anger because that's the other part of this outside of going deep down of where these thoughts come from, what's the childhood wound here that's being replayed over and over in your relationships? It's also releasing that energy that's stuck in there. All of those times that you were upset at that person and didn't have a way to release that, it's suppressed in your body. And you've got to move it to get it out of there. And that's why I think like Krav Maga, some type of fighting, punching your pillow is gonna help after a toxic relationship because there is so much anger there. Maybe there's anger, a lot of anger. I honestly for me, there's a lot more anger towards myself than there was towards my ex. I mean I was angry for the way you treated me, but you know, staying for eight years, you kind of get past that anger or you have to, otherwise the relationship ends. But so when you're at that state of working through some of those negative things and something pops up and and then there's an emotion in that. And maybe it's like a tightness in your chest, s maybe some pricklies in your shoulder that like like a pinching nerve or something like that. Or maybe it's the pit of your stomach and it kind of drops. That means that there's some energetic emotional stuff in your body and you've got to move with it. Otherwise you're just working through conceptually. And and I mean that's all fine and dandy, but it has to be a a a cohesive unit thing. Otherwise it won't stick. speaker-0: Yeah, now there's something so powerful about the mind body connection. And when we incorporate the body into what our mind's trying to heal and work through, the learning's deeper, the messages that resonate more, and we're creating lasting change. speaker-1: Yeah. And and I know I know like a lot of people think that this is kind of like woo-woo, mind, body, whatever, everything has energy. But I'm coming from an engineering standpoint. So the way I like to describe it, ca and this is how I mix it, right? So I I am a creative person, but I am also very logical. You give me the proof and I will understand. And the way I describe when it comes to emotion or energy, if you want to go even deeper of like how we're all connected, that The law of conservation of energy states that energy is neither created nor destroyed. Doesn't just go away. If you're angry at something, it's not going to just disappear. It has to be released or it's going to come back inside and it's going to stay there. And the other way I explain it too, that everything has energy, like thoughts have energy, emotion has energy, is if you really think about it, what it what do they say our building block is, the basis of us is atoms. Well, atoms have You know, you've got your nucleus, your your your protons, your neutrons there, and then the rest of the atom, which is majority of the size, is just this electron cloud, which is just energy. It's just like fluffy. If you think about it it's like a shot and ball, but it's not tangible, you can't touch it. That's what everything we are. All of it. All of it, everything. So we're like we're like a little part of matter and then a big bunch of just energy. So everything has energy. So That emotion that you have has energy. And because it's not created nor destroyed, it has to be released or it stays there inside you. And then creates some fun like issue health issues. That's where dis-ease comes from, right? You're not at ease. So yeah. I just that's what I I love to meld the the logical science with the spiritual. I think it is just the coolest. speaker-0: think it's a great place to be. I think the the intersection where those two meet is a place that can empower you to control what you can control, right? And to realize like, okay, there's things that are beyond my control in the universe, but my response is always mine. speaker-1: Right. Well, and that's yeah, exactly like you said, the place where it empowers you. It it gives you just enough of taking away the responsibility in the sense that, you know, life is and it will always do what it's going to do beyond me, just enough so that I can actually work through things and really take accountability for what is something. I you know, it's funny, a previous podcast I was on. It it came up from a reality show, but this woman had said something like something like along the lines of, I don't need to take accountability 'cause that means I did something wrong. And I think a lot of us have that same idea that accountability means I was in the wrong. Accountability means blame. No, accountability means exactly what you just said. What I can control, which is my responses. speaker-0: Yeah, for sure. Accountability is ownership. Right. And that's it's funny you bring that up. I literally just had this conversation recently with a couple people that one of the first things I want to do as if something goes wrong is look for what was my role in it. Right. Because if I have a role in it, now I can make a change, not repeat it. But if I only say, that went wrong and it's all Heather's fault. Heather did this and Heather did that. Well, what am I learning? What am I changing? How can I not repeat it again? speaker-1: And I'm the victim here and I have no power. Exactly. speaker-0: Which is what they which is what the controller in the toxic relationships wants you to believe that you are the victim and you have no control. speaker-1: Yeah. Yeah. speaker-0: Right, because as soon as you get empowered, as soon as you take your chromagogue class, as soon as you start to realize, wait, my body can be used to protect me, my mind works and stinks and solves problems, now all of a sudden you can look at that relationship and go, Wait a second. This isn't me tricking me. This is s I I have power here. speaker-1: Right. Or or you could go, this is them tricking me and me tricking myself into believing that this can work and that I don't have any power. speaker-0: So what does it look like, Heather, when someone when you see that shift in your work, what does it look like when that shift happens where somebody finally goes, Wait a second, I know my value now. I understand my value. What does that look like? speaker-1: I think it looks like a a deep breath out because when you understand your value, there's no longer a need to prove myself. There's no longer a need to hold up any type of mask that is very draining. You know, I don't have to sit here and prove that I am worthy of love. I don't have to be this perfect, prim, proper person to the world. And and then it it it fades into everything because If you even think about our careers and like I was mentioning before, going from engineering was a career I didn't really it was not like my for sure, I've got to go here. This is my purpose. I'm doing it because of other people so that I can prove that I'm valuable, that I'm successful, that I'm lovable. And so when you when you get to that accountability, responsibility, realizing you have value. It just lets go of all these other expectations that have been pushed onto you 'cause now you don't care because you're not proving anything. speaker-0: so it's so freeing, right? speaker-1: Yeah. Yeah, it really is. And I'm not saying this is going to last forever. It is a working thing. It is a practice. That's why they call a lot of those things like meditation. It's a practice. There are gonna be days where it is hard and you're gonna have to keep and and this is coming from somebody who's in a healthy relationship and and you wanna talk about healthy, you you know it just as much as I do. Y build something with somebody, then you can see if it's a healthy relationship. Be in 80 square feet with each other when you're dumping each other's piss and poop and see if you want to be together, you know? That's the real test right there. So I I'm I'm coming from this place of yes, I'm in a healthy relationship, but that doesn't mean that my job is done when it comes to healing, that I am not still making sure that I'm not trying to prove myself in any way because I already know my worth, my value. speaker-0: Man, I what would I be wrong, Heather, would I be wrong in taking that answer and going all the way back to one of the questions I asked you earlier about a misconception of healing and that is saying that the healing is will reach an end, that it's not just a continuous journey. speaker-1: No, I don't think you're wrong at all. I think that's exactly what I believe. I and it's kind of like it would kind of be like if you've ever seen Finding Nemo, it's one of my favorites. I saw it so many times in the theaters growing up. But there's a moment where they've had this whole plan, the whole movie, the the I'm talking about the fish in the aquarium at the dentist's office, right? The whole time they've got this plan of how to escape, get back into the water. At the end, they land finally in the ocean and they're in their bags and they're like, Now what? speaker-0: And speaker-1: It's kind of like the same thing with anything in our lives that we're building or growing. There's never gonna be an endpoint because imagine if we did get to that endpoint and be like, Okay, so I just ride off into the sunset for the next 30 years. Is that what life is now? Like how how Boring would that be? I mean, that just like it scares the crap out of me. But you know, so that's the same thing with healing. And I'm not saying that, like, okay, you're just gonna always be in this traumatic state for the rest of your life. There, it's just you're gonna slowly work through things and it's not gonna be a hindrance anymore. It's not gonna be overshadowing every decision that you make. That's what real healing is, is it's still there. those memories. of my previous relationship, there's some that are so powerful that will never go away, unfortunately, but they don't affect me l like they used to. They don't make me do have different decisions, have different thoughts anymore. Now it's almost like if they're a movie about somebody else's life. Not really for me. So I yeah, I agree with you completely. speaker-0: What would you say as we get close to wrapping up here, Heather, what would you say for our listeners going, man, I don't know, am I in a good relationship or not with myself? What are some key factors that would let you know if if you're in a healthy relationship with yourself? speaker-1: I think the first thing would be listening to the thoughts you have. How what do they sound like when you do something? When you mess up, when you fail, when when you succeed. What are those thoughts saying? Like when you succeed and and again I I am not a guru by any means. I still have my own moments where I had a success a successful thing and I was like, yeah, no, it wasn't because of me. It was something else. I'm not the reason it was was succeeding. Or if I failed, God, yeah, I screwed that up so awfully because I am the worst person in the world. So that's the very first thing is listening to what are the thoughts you have about yourself. And those are gonna tell you, do you have compassion for yourself? Because that's what a healthy relationship is, compassion with yourself. And believing in yourself. Not not some blind believing thing that I can do everything, but really rooting down into understanding who you are, what are your what are your weaknesses, what are your strengths, what do you like about yourself and and really being okay with that and accepting yourself flaws and everything. Like right now, hmm, okay, hair day, but that doesn't mean I hate my hair or I think I'm ugly. Right? I just Just today is not the day that my hair looks the best. I have other days where my hair looks great. You know, so it's how do you talk to yourself? How do you feel about yourself? Do you hide in the mirror? Do you quickly try and do your makeup real quick just so you don't have to look at yourself that long? And then and then it also shows up in how you present yourself to the world and and that goes into finding the balance between presenting yourself for other people or presenting yourself because it makes you feel good. This is kind of the we have this other hanging conversation that's now prevalent in social media of like why do women wear the things they wear. And I there I think there's a balance there, right? Knowing that what you wear, you're going to be looked at no matter what. Even if I wore a burlap sack, people would look at me. So understanding that you will get a reaction no matter what, but who are you doing it for and what are you doing it for? I wear things because I love the way I look at them because I know that I'm gonna walk by a mirror windows and every single time I'm gonna check myself out. So so I wear You speaker-0: Yeah. speaker-1: gotta I mean why else do you wear it, right? So speaker-0: Why we have all these windows if you don't want me to look at me? speaker-1: I mean, if it's a dirty window, that makes sense, right? You're trying to cover it up. But if you're gonna keep cleaning the window, I'm gonna keep looking. And I'm like, that window is weird. I don't like that. But this window over here. But you know, so it's just it's really like that's how you understand if you have a healthy relationship. How do you talk to yourself? How do you look at yourself? How do you think about yourself? And is a lot of that coming from other people's expectations or the image you want to portray? Or is it coming from who you really are and what really lights you up? And what makes you feel so at ease with yourself. It's like like if you can think of an uncomfortable moment when things just didn't feel good. Now imagine that's how you feel about yourself. You just feel like your skin's crawling, like you just need to get out of your body. That means it's an unhealthy relationship with yourself and we need to focus on what's what's that coming from. But when you really do like love yourself and and have compassion and acceptance, it's just an ease. It's like floating in a river. You know? speaker-0: Yeah, that's a good analogy. Heather, it's been an honor to have you on the show. Where can our audience follow you, connect with you, and be part of your community? speaker-1: Well, anything that says healthy relationships. So it's it's either healthyrelationships dot coach on Instagram, healthy relationships coaching on Facebook, Healthy Relationships, Yeah, it's just all healthy relationships. But the other thing is I took a little siesta from it, but I'm gonna start doing workshops again. usually free workshops to kinda hit some of these big buttons like trauma bonding, boundaries, needs. Worthiness, everything that we have to kind of work on as we heal. so I usually do them through Eventbrite. Again, healthy relationships is where you're gonna find me on. speaker-0: Awesome. Heather, before I let you go, I have one last question for you. And that is this. At this stage of your life, what does a life well lived mean to you? speaker-1: No regrets. I mean I'm sure I'll have a lot of failures, a lot of things that it's like, that could've been done differently. But I I don't know. I just like I think my biggest fear is getting to the end and thinking about all the things I never did, all the things I never tried because I was too scared. So no regrets. speaker-0: Love it. Heather, thank you so much for joining us. It's been an honor to share your story and we're blessed to have you, my friend. speaker-1: Well, thank you so much, and to like minded nomads for sure. speaker-0: Hey everybody, if you've been tuning into the On Purpose podcast, you already know we don't do a lot of fluff. My excellence on the leadership course is built on tactical coaching that transforms how you prepare, connect, and lead. Whether you're building a business, leading a team, or leveling up personally, we focus on deliberate actions, strategic relationships, and decisions that create lasting impact. If you're ready to lead with purpose and precision, book me for a class or a speaking engagement at teamhardy.net. And remember team, life is far too short to live any other way than on purpose. We will see you all again next week.