Latest / A Hamster With a Blunt Penknife - a Doctor Who Commentary podcast / Talks to David Gillespie-Pratt about his choice of Spearhead from Space (1/4)

Transcript

Talks to David Gillespie-Pratt about his choice of Spearhead from Space (1/4) · A Hamster With a Blunt Penknife - a Doctor Who Commentary podcast

• 0:33
  Hamster with a blump. Pen knife for doing quicker.
• 0:36
  Welcome back to a hamster with a blump.
• 0:38
  Pen knife, the Doctor Who Commentary podcast.
• 0:42
  Now look, David Gillespie Pratt and I've been gossiping for the
• 0:46
  last hour. All right, so we're out of steam
• 0:49
  by the end of episode 1. It's because we've been put in
• 0:51
  the wells to rise. Hello David.
• 0:53
  Hello. I'd say hello after we've been
• 0:55
  chatting for an hour and 10 minutes actually, you
• 0:59
  particularly. Like the gossip I told you about
• 1:01
  that podcast? Oh, I mean, I couldn't repeat
• 1:05
  what you just told me. I mean that that sort of comment
• 1:10
  would probably lead to all sorts of fallout on social media.
• 1:14
  Go in. That position with that other
• 1:16
  podcaster? Both of those podcasts.
• 1:21
  I know the last thing I expected to see at that convention, if
• 1:24
  I'm honest. I'll never look at a pair.
• 1:27
  I'll never look at a pair of scissors in the same way again.
• 1:31
  All I know is right now every podcast that has ever been on
• 1:34
  this is sweating going Oh my God is he talking about me?
• 1:39
  Well, if you would go and spread your secrets and tell your
• 1:42
  stories, these, that's how these things come out.
• 1:45
  It all goes on in those convention shows.
• 1:46
  She goes for them. I've I've I've only ever done 1
• 1:49
  convention in my life which was some SFX weekend.
• 1:53
  I think it was the very first one they did.
• 1:55
  Met Tom Baker, met Elizabeth Slayden, had a lovely chat.
• 1:58
  Slayden met her briefly and then bumped into Paul Cornell at one
• 2:03
  of the the book sale tables and had a bit of a chat.
• 2:06
  That's about it. That's what I kind of remember.
• 2:09
  And somebody walking around with the just after Torchwood,
• 2:13
  Children of Earth went out and there was a there was a Yanto
• 2:16
  fan with a petition walking around kind of, you know,
• 2:19
  unhappy that he was dead, you know, please sign my petition to
• 2:22
  make the BBC bring him back to life.
• 2:24
  It's like. Oh, those petitions.
• 2:27
  It's like force Russell Minton to put my AIS on DVDs.
• 2:34
  Yes, if I if I make any comments about those constructions, I am
• 2:39
  going to end up on some sort of list of the hatred.
• 2:42
  What? Do you mean you will?
• 2:43
  You already are I probably. I probably am.
• 2:45
  I've got I've I've said something not flattering about
• 2:49
  them, which is not difficult considering the many chin
• 2:53
  tartanals that. We had to.
• 2:57
  God, looks just like Bruce Forsyth, isn't it?
• 3:00
  It's unique. I'll tell you, it doesn't look
• 3:04
  like Bruce Forsyth, and that's John Perry.
• 3:07
  You see how I brought was round? That is a good segue that light
• 3:12
  entertainers. He used to go to conventions,
• 3:15
  but he used to call them conferences.
• 3:17
  I don't know if you've ever seen any of his interviews.
• 3:19
  He goes, well, I think about these conferences is, but of
• 3:22
  course he wouldn't have been done in doing them at this
• 3:24
  point. The story we're going to watch
• 3:26
  today because it is Jon Pertwee's introductory story,
• 3:31
  Spearhead from Space. The start of the 70's, The start
• 3:36
  of colour and the start of exile on Earth.
• 3:40
  This is Doctor Who's probably first big reboot and probably
• 3:46
  the probably the most substantial reboot as well,
• 3:49
  because a lot of the ones that come later this, the format of
• 3:52
  the series is still generally the same.
• 3:55
  This is the one where it's actually, no, we're going to do
• 3:57
  something different. And I love season 7 because when
• 4:03
  we first start talking about this, I was like, I want to do
• 4:04
  Inferno. But somebody else said bags
• 4:06
  these inferno, so it's like, all right, we'll just be ahead from
• 4:09
  space. It's my least favorite of Season
• 4:11
  7, but only. In that, is that just because
• 4:14
  all the rest are so great? It's basically they're all like
• 4:18
  910 out of 10 and this is 8.9. But that's well, not going to
• 4:26
  not going to give all the information yet because we've
• 4:28
  got some episodes to commentate on and we're talking.
• 4:30
  I don't want to run out of steam in the 1st 10 minutes.
• 4:33
  But you won't. You got me.
• 4:34
  There'll be no running out of steam here.
• 4:36
  But I think it it's a little more insubstantial than the
• 4:41
  other three stories, which all feel like they've got something
• 4:42
  to say and a bit more character and a bit more.
• 4:46
  There's a bit more going on they.
• 4:47
  Kind of got the time to do it as well.
• 4:49
  I've like, and obviously this has a massive mission statement
• 4:53
  to, you know, it has to establish all of this.
• 4:56
  And it does so really well. I mean, like I say, it might be
• 5:01
  my fourth favorite story of the season, but bloody hell, what a
• 5:03
  season. And it is still when we watched
• 5:06
  it the other week and it's like, yeah, this just it looks great.
• 5:10
  It hold, it holds up so well. I mean, the fact that it's all
• 5:13
  on film and the direction is really polished.
• 5:19
  And John makes a good debut as well.
• 5:23
  I mean, he's not quite the doctor as he will become.
• 5:26
  He's he's he does definitely grow into the part a bit more as
• 5:30
  does Caroline John as well, who's really she's a bit rigid
• 5:34
  in this, but it kind of it kind of works as the characters
• 5:39
  coming in and she doesn't really want to be there and she loosens
• 5:41
  up as as the series goes on, but.
• 5:44
  That's one of my all time favorite quotes, so you know.
• 5:47
  What is it? Which one?
• 5:48
  Camouflage general. It's not really a police box,
• 5:52
  it's a spaceship. I love that bit.
• 5:56
  She is wonderfully dry in this one though, and I is she the say
• 6:00
  is she's as dry in the she. Chills out though from from
• 6:03
  Solura's onwards, she's. A lot, so much more relaxed, but
• 6:09
  it's great. And of course, the legend that
• 6:11
  is Nicholas Courtney, who is who is the bit of the linchpin here
• 6:15
  because he's the returning character.
• 6:16
  He's kind of the hook for why should we watch Doctor Who
• 6:19
  again? Well, it's got that bloke from
• 6:21
  that that series last year, if you remember the one with the
• 6:23
  army. And he is just he is one of the
• 6:27
  most reliable actors you can get in a series in in a show like
• 6:32
  this. He is dependable.
• 6:34
  And this is the point where the Brigadier has been written as a
• 6:36
  character and not a bumbling like release with.
• 6:40
  Intelligence, yeah. He's very intelligent.
• 6:43
  He's judging with the doctor. He he, he's not one step ahead,
• 6:48
  but he's kind of in control of some of the situations.
• 6:51
  So I think this is some of the Brigadier at his probably at his
• 6:55
  best is in this season. I think he's written as a proper
• 6:57
  character, proper character, and he's not not really sent up too
• 7:02
  much. I think not only does he not
• 7:05
  only is it like the biggest rug pull, like you said, in terms of
• 7:08
  the concept of the show and and reformatting it into something
• 7:11
  completely different. It's so influential going
• 7:15
  forward as well because every time the show is booting up
• 7:20
  again, they return to Spirit Air from space.
• 7:22
  I think it happens in the TV movie now they don't do the
• 7:24
  Autons, but they have the doctor going to hospital 2 hearts.
• 7:28
  You know, like it's the same scenes that are in the first
• 7:30
  episode of this with Rose again, we're back on Earth.
• 7:34
  It's the Autons again. You know that we do look to
• 7:37
  Spirit Air from space as a good starting point.
• 7:40
  I think 11 power attack has a elements of it as well.
• 7:44
  You know, there's, there's definitely it's a story that
• 7:47
  casts a long shadow and it's it is incredibly influential And
• 7:54
  for what a lot of people say is basically just equate a mass RIP
• 7:56
  off, which I'm, I've got a a bit of a bee in my bonnet sometimes
• 8:01
  about these things where, you know, when people write about
• 8:05
  either mind of evil or ambassadors of death, they'll
• 8:07
  say it's like a Bond film. And I'm like, how?
• 8:09
  How are these like a Bond film? It's got some action sequences.
• 8:13
  It's got, it's got some guns and a number plate that rotates, but
• 8:16
  there isn't, this is in no way like a Bond film.
• 8:20
  The one recently that I saw and it was from it was Moffat who
• 8:24
  used it. He said, oh, boom's like a
• 8:26
  Hitchcock film and it's like it's got a bit of suspense in
• 8:30
  it. But Hitchcock films are more
• 8:32
  than just a bit of suspense. There's usually a lot of
• 8:35
  character, There's usually a lot of sex and there's usually
• 8:38
  sexual tension. There's a lot of darkness in the
• 8:40
  characters going there was there wasn't any of that.
• 8:43
  There was just a bit of tension. I will say though, I have
• 8:46
  recently watched Quite a Mass because I did it for Hamster
• 8:49
  Extra with Toby Heydo and some of the scenes in episode 1.
• 8:53
  The radar, the meteorites on the screen, even some of the
• 8:57
  dialogue come straight out of Quite a Mass.
• 9:00
  It and I think Robert Holmes has taken the trappings of it.
• 9:03
  He's taken some of the visuals, but he hasn't got some of the
• 9:07
  subtext. He hasn't got the character, he
• 9:09
  hasn't got the Cold War paranoid.
• 9:10
  Because the one thing that this story could have done with the
• 9:13
  facsimiles and everything is the paranoia side.
• 9:16
  Government being they suggest it, but they're not interested
• 9:20
  in doing that story. By the time we get to all those
• 9:23
  shop window dummies coming to life in the High Street, we've
• 9:26
  left quite a mouse behind and we're back in Doctor Who now.
• 9:29
  It, it uses quite a mouse as a bit of a of cue, but then takes
• 9:33
  it into that Doctor Who world fairly quickly.
• 9:37
  And and you know what it's it's a, it's almost like a bubble by
• 9:41
  itself. This and possibly the war games,
• 9:44
  because these are the two Derek Sherwin produced stories and I
• 9:48
  was kind of think if he hadn't left, how would the series have
• 9:54
  continued to develop? Because obviously Barry Letts
• 9:55
  came in here. Very differently, I think.
• 9:58
  And I think we would have had something very different.
• 10:02
  But the interesting thing life, this is a, this is a theory.
• 10:05
  I know that's, you know, put a theory out there.
• 10:06
  Somebody on Twitter will come along and go.
• 10:09
  I think you'll find and we'll have some paperwork.
• 10:12
  Is that Derek, Derek Sherwin with his story saves Doctor Who
• 10:16
  because it's all on film. And it was on film because there
• 10:20
  was a strike looming. And someone came up with the
• 10:23
  plan of, well, if we shoot it all on film, and we will because
• 10:26
  we can save money from the studios, because the risk is if
• 10:30
  we wait and there's a strike, we will probably not get the studio
• 10:33
  time and we will not finish this and this.
• 10:36
  One has to be. Made and this has to be made.
• 10:38
  So if that if you don't make your debut story is was there a
• 10:41
  possibility of them just dropping the whole thing?
• 10:44
  So this story had to be made and thank God it did and and it
• 10:50
  looks glorious as a result. But not just in, I mean, I agree
• 10:55
  with everything you said there, apart from the paperwork I have
• 10:57
  here that contradicts everything that I'm joking.
• 11:01
  I also think as well, by taking the show in such a radical
• 11:05
  direction as well, you know, the end of the War Games was getting
• 11:08
  something like 3.5 million viewers.
• 11:10
  This got 8 million viewers per episode.
• 11:13
  So suddenly people were paying attention again.
• 11:16
  My God, it's Jon Perwis in colour.
• 11:18
  Where on earth the army's involved?
• 11:20
  Like what the hell is this? People were interested it.
• 11:23
  It got the sort of kick up the ass it kindly and I'm a big I'm
• 11:27
  a massive fan of war games, but I would be I would be naive to
• 11:30
  say I can probably see why over 10 weeks probably the audience
• 11:34
  tailed off. That's the length of a new hoe
• 11:37
  season. That's long.
• 11:38
  That's a new hoe season. That's a long story, but this is
• 11:42
  probably one of the most bold reboots as well because it's a
• 11:46
  it's reformatting the show. People talk about game changing
• 11:49
  stories and I think the end of the war games and the start of
• 11:52
  this is one of the few times where there's when you talk
• 11:55
  about game changers, this is actually one where they change
• 11:58
  and it sticks because OK, you know, key to time, yes, that
• 12:01
  that brings in the quest thing, but generally those it doesn't
• 12:05
  really affect much of those stories and that's not casting
• 12:11
  aspirations. I love those stories.
• 12:12
  I love most stories but the. Key to time, the Doctor Who
• 12:16
  format, that sort of malleable format is wrestling against how
• 12:21
  Ricky, you know what I mean? By the time you get to Angela
• 12:23
  Zatara, we're like, oh, screw the key to time.
• 12:25
  There it is. There's a segment, Right?
• 12:26
  Let's go. Let's have an adventure.
• 12:28
  You know, you're right. This This is the format for this
• 12:31
  entire season, most of the next season, half of the season after
• 12:35
  that, this really lands. I mean, I think it's not until
• 12:40
  season 14 that elements from this season stop appearing.
• 12:45
  Completely dropped. So that's what's what 7 years?
• 12:48
  So you know that the the earthbound unit setup is is he
• 12:54
  is here for a long time. How did you describe it?
• 12:56
  Casts a long shadow? Casts.
• 12:58
  A long shadow, it really does. And this, yes, it might be my
• 13:02
  fourth favorite. This is a bloody good story as
• 13:05
  well. Well, should we start watching
• 13:07
  the thing? I think we probably should,
• 13:09
  otherwise, you know, we're going to be here all night.
• 13:12
  And so it's me. And and not to date it.
• 13:15
  There's a general election tomorrow.
• 13:16
  Oh, that's right. Yeah.
• 13:18
  Yes. So there's only, there's only
• 13:20
  one way I could possibly go. Although we've already said
• 13:22
  we're not going to talk about politics, didn't we?
• 13:25
  OK, well, would you care to count us in?
• 13:28
  I'll count us in in 321 go. Imagine the shock everyone would
• 13:35
  have got seeing this, but oh actually most people would have
• 13:38
  still had black and white TV. 'S it probably would have still
• 13:40
  been in black and white, but I was trying to make this
• 13:44
  outgoing. How early a doctor of colour was
• 13:46
  Doctor Who? Because it's like when Doctor
• 13:48
  Who went HD in 2009 with Plants of the Dead.
• 13:53
  It's like that was not there wasn't an early doctor of HDI
• 13:57
  think it was HD was around Doctor Who was early on colour.
• 14:01
  It was. It wasn't the first drama, but
• 14:04
  BBC One went colour in November 69.
• 14:07
  This is January, This is what, 2nd of January?
• 14:09
  So BBC One has only been in colour for about 6 weeks.
• 14:13
  That's like the opening shot of Rose.
• 14:15
  That opening that is such a statement in a bit like trial of
• 14:20
  a Time Lord. It's like, let's open with one
• 14:22
  hell of a visual effect. And now we've got something
• 14:26
  interesting here because as part of my research for this podcast,
• 14:32
  oh. I love that you do all this
• 14:33
  research. But I did something a bit
• 14:34
  different. So I looked at other programs
• 14:37
  from around this time because I kind of wanted to get an idea of
• 14:40
  what, what was the television landscape like in 1970?
• 14:45
  And we watched, I made my husband watch these things.
• 14:48
  We watched UFO, the Jerry Anderson series.
• 14:50
  We watched Callan. I watched a couple of episodes,
• 14:53
  Steptoe and Son, Dad's Army, few things all broadcast in and
• 14:56
  around this time. Doomwatch was another one, and
• 15:01
  there's a lot of similarities and a lot of differences, but
• 15:03
  the one thing that a lot of those shows didn't do very well
• 15:07
  was women and female characters. And there's a character here
• 15:12
  that I don't think because she doesn't have a name.
• 15:15
  And it's like she's the senior officer here.
• 15:18
  She's probably the most senior until Bambera, the most senior
• 15:21
  female officer in unit that we see.
• 15:23
  Because I think Corporal Bell is basically just the secretary,
• 15:26
  but she is, I think she's a Lieutenant.
• 15:28
  She's mom, I don't. Think Jane Blythe counts, Does
• 15:32
  she in the She's only making sandwiches.
• 15:34
  She's making the sandwiches, so it's quite nice briefly that we
• 15:39
  have a woman in a position of authority and it is just normal
• 15:44
  and it's a shame that. You're doing 3 strong women in
• 15:47
  this, David. You know you've got her, Liz
• 15:49
  Shaw and of course, the strongest woman of all, Meg
• 15:52
  Seeley. Meg Seeley and her wonderful
• 15:57
  husband who's reenacting Creative Mass 2 at this point.
• 16:00
  Don't think I'm having that dirty old box in my house.
• 16:04
  Bet you've said that before. I've had many dirty boxes now
• 16:09
  please move us on please. And the creative mass link can
• 16:14
  this is you can get some active facts.
• 16:15
  Neil Wilson was in the Creative Mass experiment.
• 16:19
  I think it's right. All right.
• 16:21
  Hey, I could be listening. He he will be listening, I
• 16:23
  think. I think he might be in Christmas
• 16:24
  in the pit as well. I might be wrong there.
• 16:27
  But so that you know, it's not just storylines.
• 16:29
  They're nicking the nicking actors as well.
• 16:31
  Look how fabulous all this Lunit Unit Laboratory looks on film.
• 16:36
  It looks great and the model shop now how seamless is this
• 16:41
  level? Shop.
• 16:43
  It is you know You cannot tell. You cannot tell.
• 16:48
  Did you hear what happened when they brought the DVD out?
• 16:50
  No. So that, you know, when the
• 16:52
  TARDIS lands, it kind of has a weird kind of warped sound
• 16:56
  effect. That wasn't how it was meant to
• 16:58
  be. It was meant to be just a normal
• 17:00
  effect, but something went wrong.
• 17:02
  So on the DVD, think I've got this right, they fixed it, or
• 17:06
  they fixed it in inverted commas.
• 17:09
  And I think people were up in arms saying how dare you change?
• 17:12
  It no. We like weird warping noise, so.
• 17:14
  I think for the Blu-ray it was then put back to the as
• 17:18
  broadcast sound effect. See, This is why don't tamper.
• 17:21
  Because the fans don't like it. Is that Derek Sherwin?
• 17:24
  I'll see you there in. That that is the producer giving
• 17:27
  himself a role. And I read somewhere that that
• 17:31
  the extra whoever they'd hired was not very good.
• 17:33
  So he just said give me the costume.
• 17:35
  I'll. Get him out of it.
• 17:36
  I'll do it. It does sound very hard.
• 17:39
  It sounds like a bit of a prick. I think if he's stuck with it,
• 17:43
  we would have had a very different series to the one we
• 17:47
  got. I think he he very, when you
• 17:50
  hear him being interviewed, he has very strong ideas, and
• 17:53
  they're all his ideas. You know, I think it'd be
• 17:56
  interesting if they ever got to work with Donald Tush because
• 17:58
  they'll be arguing over who, who created what and who was
• 18:00
  responsible for what. I love the the commentary on
• 18:03
  this with him and Terence Dix who basically Terence Dix just
• 18:05
  goes well Derek, he goes all your ideas for this season were
• 18:10
  terrible exile and the doctor to earth seven partners.
• 18:13
  He goes for God's sake. We were lumbered with all your
• 18:15
  terrible ideas. He really tells him off.
• 18:18
  He. Did, but they made it work.
• 18:20
  They've actually made a brilliant season out of it and
• 18:23
  this these two. Do you know who they are?
• 18:26
  That's Moulder and Scully right there.
• 18:28
  The skeptic and the person you know behind the desk who's got
• 18:32
  all the facts about aliens. And she's great.
• 18:36
  And I mean, she is, she's bit of tight and everything and but
• 18:40
  he's just so cool and so chilled.
• 18:42
  Isn't leaning back, you know he's a bit nonchalant.
• 18:45
  I think it's it's written so specifically this to explain
• 18:51
  what unit is. It's so cleverly done.
• 18:53
  Well, she's taking the piece going oh, invisible ink, that
• 18:56
  sort of thing. Think it's this is a.
• 18:59
  This is a good example of how to do exposition sometimes and it
• 19:04
  doesn't feel unnatural, I think. Not that I'm, I'm not going to
• 19:10
  cast aspersions on the most recent series of Doctor Who, but
• 19:13
  that the opening 10 minutes of space babies where it's just
• 19:16
  let's rattle through the the thing.
• 19:18
  And, and it's what the TV movie got criticised for as well,
• 19:22
  which is let's just rattle through.
• 19:23
  It's like if you can write it into your characters and
• 19:26
  actually her coming in here and him explaining it, it's feels
• 19:31
  quite natural and. There's sort of tension between
• 19:35
  them, so we're interested in them on a character level as
• 19:38
  well as hearing all the details. And also because it's like, this
• 19:41
  is the first time we've met this sure.
• 19:42
  So as an audience, like, who is she?
• 19:45
  What's she doing here? And putting in again, it's
• 19:47
  another strong woman. It's a woman who's a scientist.
• 19:49
  She's got her. She knows her own mind.
• 19:51
  Yes, we had Zoe the previous year who was intelligent, but
• 19:55
  you know, sometimes could be helpless or need rescuing and
• 19:59
  you don't. Have this year.
• 20:00
  They did ask Wendy Padbury to do this.
• 20:02
  Year they did, it would. Have been interesting actually
• 20:05
  if you had Zoe brought in by you, who obviously has a
• 20:07
  relationship with the Brigadier already.
• 20:11
  I I think the fact that even though you've got the Brigadier,
• 20:14
  you've got no real carry over from what's come before.
• 20:18
  It is even the greatest day. It is such a clean break.
• 20:21
  It is one of those few occasions where you've got there is nobody
• 20:25
  who's in this episode, one who was in episode 10 of the War
• 20:28
  Games. There is no carry over between
• 20:31
  the two. And so sorry, sorry to it's so
• 20:34
  unflappable, She goes. Do you really expect me to
• 20:36
  believe that? Deadly seriously goes I'm not in
• 20:39
  the habit. I'm telling lies, Miss Sure.
• 20:41
  And it doesn't, I mean, the the mustache is looking a little bit
• 20:45
  fake here. It does look a little bit like,
• 20:47
  you know, they've just glued it on, but.
• 20:49
  Who cares? When I look at my own in the
• 20:51
  screen here, Yeah, actually it does look very.
• 20:53
  Oh yeah, Actually, you're sporting a mustache at the
• 20:55
  moment. It is.
• 20:56
  I mean, I can't grow a bit to save my life.
• 20:58
  And it was like, oh, I'm just going to, I'm just going to let
• 21:00
  the mustache stay in. And it's like, I'm still not
• 21:02
  sure about it, but it will. No, it's very.
• 21:04
  Classy. Keep it.
• 21:05
  I'm going for class now. Oh, the actor there playing
• 21:09
  Captain Monroe, I was trying to find something out.
• 21:11
  It's part of the research now. His name is John Breslin, and I
• 21:16
  believe he was openly gay as well.
• 21:18
  And there was an interview. Somebody, somebody shared an
• 21:20
  interview. He was on television being
• 21:22
  interviewed about being gay. And it was shared 10 years ago.
• 21:26
  And I could not find this clip because it was quite an
• 21:28
  impassioned interview about his sexuality and could not find it.
• 21:33
  And I think whoever shared it has since taken it down, and I'm
• 21:36
  going to keep looking for it because I think Toby Haddock
• 21:40
  could have remembered it as well.
• 21:42
  So whether or not that might surface, but I think he's an
• 21:45
  interest. He potentially has an
• 21:46
  interesting story that we maybe we don't know too much about.
• 21:48
  Well, it continues that sort of roll call of head unit captain,
• 21:54
  doesn't it? Because we had a different one
• 21:56
  in Weber Fear, who ended up dead.
• 21:58
  We had one in what was it, Jimmy, in the invasion?
• 22:03
  The Dolly Soldier. Who ended up with Isabel
• 22:05
  Watkins? Yeah.
• 22:06
  Now we've got Munro here, we've got Paul Darrow in the
• 22:10
  Silurians. Then then sort of Benton.
• 22:13
  And Benton comes in for the last two stories, doesn't he, of this
• 22:16
  season. And then Yates comes in in in
• 22:19
  Series 8. Yeah, and that feels kind of a
• 22:22
  bit more believable because it's like he's he would have more
• 22:24
  than one captain, he would have staff, he would have rotating
• 22:28
  personnel. I think sometimes when you say
• 22:31
  here is the Brigadier and here's the captain and here's the
• 22:34
  Sergeant, it all. It's yes, it's nice cosy family,
• 22:38
  but it just makes all a little bit smaller.
• 22:41
  And one of the one of the shows that we watched was UFO with the
• 22:45
  Jerry Anderson show. And that has a bit of a
• 22:47
  revolving door cast. So there's quite a lot of
• 22:50
  regulars who come and go and watching it with Chris, my
• 22:54
  husband, and because he's done shift work and stuff in the past
• 22:56
  and he's worked in railway control and stuff.
• 22:58
  And he says that feels actually, even though it's because the
• 23:01
  production is going, that's how it is in some of these
• 23:03
  workplaces that there'll be different people on shift at
• 23:06
  different time. There'll be people who come in
• 23:07
  and you don't see. And he's actually, this is
• 23:10
  actually quite a realistic depiction of a workplace because
• 23:14
  yes, you will have that person's on shift this time actually, you
• 23:17
  won't see. So I think when you start having
• 23:19
  these regular characters, it starts to feel that little bit
• 23:22
  more artificial. You get a bit of that at the end
• 23:24
  of this, don't you? Do you remember live?
• 23:25
  Sure. Just think the rest of the world
• 23:28
  is fast asleep as they're working through the night to
• 23:32
  create this Auton destroying machine.
• 23:35
  And oh hang on, we now have the Welshest Welsh actor.
• 23:39
  Oh. Yes, Talfin, that Talfin Thomas.
• 23:41
  That's Talfin Thomas, Yeah. Does he sound up in the Green
• 23:44
  Death as well? Doesn't he?
• 23:45
  He is. You know, they've got as they've
• 23:47
  got all the Welsh actors in that one.
• 23:49
  But he. Loves his character here though.
• 23:51
  He's such a toad, isn't he? He's got a little hint of
• 23:54
  information that something's wrong in the hospital.
• 23:55
  He's straight on the phone to the papers.
• 23:57
  He's selling, he he, he, he's just, he's a slimy.
• 23:59
  And then there's a little bit later on where he's kind of
• 24:01
  almost being a bit, Oh no, you can't do that going.
• 24:03
  But you called them in. I tell you why you've got, The
• 24:05
  thing is you've got your money. And but I do, when I was
• 24:10
  listening to this, it's like, has he toned his accent down
• 24:12
  slightly? Because he sounds a little bit
• 24:13
  less Welsh when he's on the phone, but then he's properly
• 24:17
  doing the fall, the valleys later on.
• 24:20
  We can't hear it because I'll say props to Dudley Simpson and
• 24:24
  his music in this, because these early scenes where the
• 24:26
  meteorites are coming out of the ground, the the ominous tone.
• 24:30
  The the the music was one of the things on this.
• 24:32
  I think it's just absolutely superb.
• 24:34
  I think it's so much better than what we were get we're going to
• 24:38
  get in a few weeks time with the Crum horn.
• 24:44
  But then he's back for ambassadors, and again, he's on.
• 24:49
  He's on and you know this, but Derek Martin is directing this.
• 24:56
  All this location stuff is just it's a step up from anything.
• 25:00
  I mean, I know they shot some of it because of necessity, but the
• 25:04
  film work on this is more intricate.
• 25:07
  So if you think of the the film work on something like the war
• 25:09
  games, which is still there's a lot of it, but here you've got
• 25:12
  you're shooting through the trees there you've got sticky
• 25:15
  the. Masters better though because
• 25:17
  when I watch this on Blu-ray it's so sharp it looks like it
• 25:21
  was filmed today. I.
• 25:23
  Think they can. It's not proper HD, but it can
• 25:26
  be scanned to nearly because it's the original film elements
• 25:28
  and stuff. So it looks probably better here
• 25:32
  than it did on broadcast. I mean, I had it on VHS and the
• 25:38
  one the weirdest thing watching it because I think I would have
• 25:41
  got it when I was still quite getting into doctor.
• 25:43
  So it was before I had too many of the reference books and stuff
• 25:46
  to put Spear from Space on. And I I knew enough that it's
• 25:49
  like location is on film. You're on video in the studio.
• 25:54
  And I was watching this going when are we going into the
• 25:57
  studio? And there was that point when
• 25:59
  you go hang on. We're not, we're not.
• 26:01
  This is all on the film. And it it does.
• 26:05
  I mean, all of this, all this stuff with the Brigadier here
• 26:07
  probably would have been shot in a studio.
• 26:10
  Oh. Originally.
• 26:11
  Definitely, yeah. And so you wouldn't have got
• 26:13
  shots where you're actually the news camera here in the
• 26:15
  Brigadier's face, this hand held.
• 26:17
  It's wonderful, isn't it? And in the crowd, we have
• 26:22
  everybody's favorite bad actor, Prentice Hancock probably give
• 26:26
  him one of his best performances because he's only got about 3
• 26:29
  he. Doesn't have to do much.
• 26:30
  You know who else is in that crowd?
• 26:32
  Don't you? Yeah, Go on.
• 26:34
  That fella Stevens from Who Killed Kennedy?
• 26:37
  David Bishop's book. He's all, he's all over the
• 26:40
  place. Every time there's a reporter in
• 26:42
  the 3rd Doctor's era, it's him of.
• 26:45
  Course I forgot about. I've never read the book.
• 26:47
  I'm not sure which one he is. Probably that one with a bowler
• 26:49
  hat there just on the left. Look.
• 26:51
  Oh, look who's at the back there.
• 26:52
  Hugh Bergen? No.
• 26:54
  What's his name? Oh.
• 26:54
  Hugh Burden, Burden, Burden and. Look at this tracking shot.
• 26:59
  This shot, I mean. It just doesn't stop.
• 27:03
  It keeps going. I think the, the this has got
• 27:07
  some of the most and there's business in the background as
• 27:10
  well. There's people talking, you
• 27:12
  know, this is for 1970. This is quite that's that's sort
• 27:17
  of short. Martinus is a great director
• 27:20
  because you look at the other stuff he did, the Ice Warriors,
• 27:22
  the War Machines, it's all very stylish.
• 27:24
  So he's a very, very good director.
• 27:26
  But I bet you had, oh God, I've forgotten his name.
• 27:29
  Now. The producer, Derek Sherwin, I
• 27:34
  bet he's there as well saying, come on, let's just make this.
• 27:37
  You know, they've told us we can't do this.
• 27:39
  Let's make this as good as it can possibly be.
• 27:42
  And yeah, say some of the the, the stuff that they could do
• 27:45
  because they had to do it all on film.
• 27:47
  They were doing thing the, the hand held and the rigours of his
• 27:49
  face, the tracking shot. There's loads of other little
• 27:51
  bits and pieces that had they gone into a studio, it would
• 27:55
  have been four or five cameras. It would have been Derek Martin.
• 27:59
  So it would have been probably as dynamic as it could have
• 28:01
  been, but you wouldn't have got just those flourishes.
• 28:05
  I think this is Derek Martin's last last one as well.
• 28:08
  And that's a real shame because I think there's this Tennis
• 28:11
  Planet and Ice Warriors. Ice Warriors might be a little
• 28:15
  bit on the double side, but the direction is really good.
• 28:20
  So he, he, this is, he knows what he's doing.
• 28:22
  He must seem to convince we're on that ice tundra even though
• 28:25
  we're in the corner of a tiny studio.
• 28:27
  It doesn't. So, and we're now talking over
• 28:30
  John's first lines. He, I mean, he doesn't do very
• 28:33
  much. And that that's an interesting
• 28:36
  choice because obviously this is the only second time that
• 28:38
  they've done it. Trout was straight up doing lots
• 28:41
  of business, wasn't he in that first episode?
• 28:43
  He was centre of attention here. It's like, well, the Brigadier
• 28:46
  is the returning character, let's make him the focus.
• 28:50
  And, and again, it's kind of a bit like what they do with Rose
• 28:53
  and the TV movie a little bit is it's through the supporting
• 28:56
  characters that we meet the Doctor.
• 29:00
  So he only starts talking and he starts waking up once the
• 29:02
  Brigadier arrives. I love it when he turns him over
• 29:06
  and he's, the Brigadier looks so disappointed.
• 29:07
  Doesn't he like, oh, I've no idea where this man is.
• 29:10
  He's. Like, oh God, it's John Poole.
• 29:14
  Oh, when he he looks at the mirror, doesn't he goes well,
• 29:16
  that's not me at all, is. He and then gradually and how
• 29:21
  much of this is I mean we've got an angle up his nose that will
• 29:24
  that will be a no that was going.
• 29:26
  To be a no tunnel shot, that's. Going to be a no no very
• 29:29
  shortly, but of course the vanity.
• 29:31
  So I know I said he wasn't the most fully formed, but there are
• 29:35
  flashes of what John's doctor will be.
• 29:38
  He says, doesn't he, when he talks in conventions about how
• 29:42
  he didn't like the comedy that he played in the so the, you
• 29:47
  know, the bit in the shower in a minute when he's in the
• 29:49
  wheelchair. So, and it's all sort of wacky
• 29:51
  races, you know, all of that stuff he didn't really like, but
• 29:53
  it really quickly tones down in Episode 2.
• 29:56
  I think because he was known as a comedy actor, he did silly
• 30:00
  voices. This is, I think, the first time
• 30:02
  he's acting with his own voice. And it was that there's that
• 30:05
  tale that he told all the time when he was hired.
• 30:08
  It was like, well, how do you want me to play it as?
• 30:10
  I would play it as John Pertwee. Who the Hell's that?
• 30:13
  And I think he does play it pretty much as John Pertwee
• 30:16
  because I think a lot of the Doctors full of himself
• 30:20
  attitude, I think a lot of that's coming from in Pertwee,
• 30:24
  but it works. If I ever was offered the role
• 30:26
  of the doctor, I don't think anyone would ever say play it
• 30:29
  like Joe Ford. Jesus Christ, nobody wants that.
• 30:33
  It would be a very different style of Doctor Who at that.
• 30:35
  Point cop jokes Ahoy actually sure you got one?
• 30:39
  No, no, let's move on. Well, where are we now?
• 30:42
  See, you know this wood panelled hospital When Howard Jones
• 30:45
  talking about cottage hospitals in Avis of London, this is
• 30:49
  exactly what I'll say. This because this is the only
• 30:51
  time I've ever really heard of cottage hospitals is here and in
• 30:54
  aliens of London. So when?
• 30:55
  So when she's talking across now, is that Russell T Davies
• 30:58
  doing a really obscure in joke or is it just coincidence?
• 31:02
  I'm not sure. Look at that woman over his
• 31:04
  shoulder, there with the fabulous headscarf and the black
• 31:07
  rimmed glasses, the picture of the 1970s.
• 31:12
  And there's Channing being all sinister because the the the
• 31:16
  autumn plot is really secondary in this episode.
• 31:19
  It's a bit like Rose. It, it's basically, it's all
• 31:23
  just putting the pieces gradually into place and got Sam
• 31:27
  Sealy here talking with the soldier.
• 31:29
  And I when I watched this for the first time, I was, I was
• 31:33
  young and stupid because he keeps calling him son and I'm
• 31:36
  like, is he his son? Is that?
• 31:38
  Is that father? Of course it bloody isn't.
• 31:42
  This is when you happen, when you're watching.
• 31:43
  You're 13. You're thick.
• 31:44
  David, I thought, I thought we sort of put you in compromising
• 31:47
  positions, but is that the least attractive unit soldier we ever
• 31:50
  see? Definitely up there.
• 31:53
  I think as we get into the 70s and the hair starts to get
• 31:57
  longer and and with some of the unit soldiers, there's a lot of
• 32:01
  hair on display. Things don't get much better, do
• 32:03
  they? I.
• 32:04
  Mean I will just say if you want worst looking unit soldier worst
• 32:09
  moment episode 6 of the time monster lasts 30 seconds when
• 32:14
  John Levine. Naked.
• 32:17
  Gets the, gets the naked joke. You want to see the hottest unit
• 32:20
  soldier, then go and watch the Suntara stratagem and see Ross.
• 32:24
  He's very pretty. Everybody like Ross, I know.
• 32:27
  Yeah, well, it's so pretty. I like the nursery, you know.
• 32:31
  Which is just. It's his heart, Sir, isn't?
• 32:34
  She she's she's quite she's rolling her eyes.
• 32:37
  She's a bit sassy, I think. I think she's making of making
• 32:40
  more of the role and probably is on the page.
• 32:42
  It's like just just nurse. It's like I'm going to I'm going
• 32:45
  to play this up again. I'm going to roll my eyes.
• 32:47
  He's got I think he is he I think he had something up his
• 32:50
  nose. I think he had.
• 32:51
  I think he's got. Something He's got a bogey, I
• 32:54
  think. He's got a bogey.
• 32:55
  Oh no. This is why I'll be.
• 32:57
  Looking out for that now. This is what happens when you
• 33:00
  remaster in high definition. You see all sorts of things.
• 33:04
  You see the wires, you see the strings, you see snot up
• 33:07
  Pertwee's nose. These things were never supposed
• 33:09
  to be seen on TV's. This.
• 33:11
  Clear TVTV the time Very small, Very small.
• 33:14
  I've only got one thing to say to you, David Shoes.
• 33:18
  Shoes and that cat, then TV movie.
• 33:22
  When I was a kid right it, grabbing those shoes and turning
• 33:24
  over like that was so hilarious. It, it, I mean, is this him
• 33:29
  playing? Is he post regenerative amnesia?
• 33:32
  I mean, the the good thing is that by the time we get halfway
• 33:34
  to episode 2, that's all done and it's back on with the story
• 33:38
  because I think. He does get some comedy music in
• 33:41
  a minute as well, doesn't it? Boom boom boom boom boom boom.
• 33:45
  And the comic We get the comedy chase.
• 33:47
  Oh. God, the music there, do you
• 33:49
  remember that? It's like Wacky Races, not.
• 33:56
  Quite it's probably not as Dudley as you know, the subtle
• 33:59
  sinister stuff that we had earlier that we'll get later,
• 34:01
  but the the the plucky comedy stuff and oh, men covered in
• 34:07
  Vaseline it. Is quite scary though, isn't it?
• 34:10
  They they just literally slap that over his mouth and out he
• 34:14
  goes now. I mean, I am pleased there is a
• 34:17
  bit of comedy in this because it does get quite horrific later
• 34:20
  on. It's there's quite a bleak story
• 34:22
  in place and I think part of that is down to the atmosphere.
• 34:26
  It's all on films when they're in these big interiors there's
• 34:28
  it's very echoey. There's a lot of sort of
• 34:31
  atmosphere to sort of think. So it can feel certainly when we
• 34:34
  get to the factory and stuff like that, there is a sort of
• 34:37
  grimness. It's not grim, it's just a bit.
• 34:39
  There's one bit in particular, one image which I'll point out
• 34:43
  when we get there, that I actually think might be going a
• 34:46
  bit too far, I think. There's an image much later on
• 34:51
  that I think has gone a bit too far, but possibly for different
• 34:53
  reasons. Oh.
• 34:55
  Wow, we haven't much to discuss later.
• 34:58
  We do. I mean, we're, we're, we're
• 35:00
  crashing towards the end of Episode 1, are we?
• 35:02
  In the end of episode 1, really. Because wow, we're going to have
• 35:06
  that great cliffhanger of him stumbling through some bushes
• 35:09
  and they haven't quite got going into the entitled Barry.
• 35:15
  Liz, that said, no, we need the sting, the.
• 35:17
  Sting. I think it's missing the sting
• 35:20
  and I think it's we're so used to these episodes with these
• 35:23
  titles having the sting. It feels weird without it.
• 35:27
  It's particularly bad here because the fella just goes, who
• 35:30
  told you to fire you? And then the music's just there.
• 35:33
  It's very jarring. There's Is that cutting out a
• 35:37
  swear or is that just a bit of bad editing?
• 35:41
  But. The only other line I wanted to
• 35:43
  hear the last word of more was we don't want you breaking your
• 35:47
  neck, at least not until until it's another cliffhanger, the
• 35:51
  way that someone is killed and it's cut off.
• 35:53
  And there you go. I.
• 35:57
  Mean this is what I'm saying. There's such pace as well, 25
• 36:02
  minutes there and that is. And even then, the the main plot
• 36:05
  isn't really starting yet. It's all kind of, but it looks.
• 36:09
  I don't feel short shades because it's establishing so
• 36:12
  much. I mean, you've got even then,
• 36:14
  even then the Doctor doesn't do very much.
• 36:17
  But this isn't just setting up a new Doctor.
• 36:19
  It's setting up the new format. It's setting up Liz is setting
• 36:22
  up the Brigadier. It's it's got a lot to do.
• 36:26
  And it is like we're setting up Brigadier and Liz Morey in
• 36:29
  episode 1, Doctors More part two, and then we get more of the
• 36:33
  Autons and Channing and all that through 2-3 and four.
• 36:37
  And it's really establishing the, the tone, that contemporary
• 36:41
  tone as well. The hospital, bringing in the
• 36:43
  press, you know, all of that. It it really it, it feels like
• 36:47
  we are down on Earth now. I think it's there's not much
• 36:52
  Doctor Who before this that felt like this, that maybe bits of
• 36:57
  the war machines, bits of web of fear because they've got
• 36:59
  journalists and they've got. That real?
• 37:01
  The invasion maybe? But in terms of this really
• 37:05
  proper, we're now on Earth and it's all recognisable.
• 37:10
  They've never really done anything like this before.
• 37:14
  Well, I think it seems quite promising.
• 37:15
  Don't. You I think it's a promising
• 37:17
  start. I think it's it's got.
• 37:18
  Legs, I think. I think this series will do
• 37:21
  rather well. I'm not sure it's going to run
• 37:23
  too long, but we'll see. We'll see.
• 37:24
  I. Mean it.
• 37:26
  This was a show on a knife edge as well, not just with the the
• 37:29
  strike. This was the show that I think
• 37:31
  was on the verge of being cancelled.
• 37:34
  So this if this didn't impress, fortunately it did.
• 37:39
  It did, and I think it looks great.
• 37:41
  It sounds great. It's just great.
• 37:45
  Well. Let's, well, let's go and see if
• 37:48
  episode 2 is going to be as great as episode 1.
• 37:52
  You ready? I'm ready.
• 37:54
  Let's do it.