Latest / Bloomberg Intelligence / Investing Strategies For Crypto, ESGs, And Telecommunications

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Investing Strategies For Crypto, ESGs, And Telecommunications · Bloomberg Intelligence

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Welcome to the Bloomberg Markets Podcast. I'm Paul Sweeney alongside
• 0:04
  Speaker 1: my co host Matt Miller. Every business day we bring
• 0:06
  Speaker 1: you interviews from CEOs, market pros, and Bloomberg experts, along
• 0:11
  Speaker 1: with essential market moving news. Find the Bloomberg Markets podcast
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: called Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen to podcasts, and
• 0:18
  Speaker 1: at Bloomberg dot com Slash podcast. Let's get into the
• 0:22
  Speaker 1: cloud right now. We've got Ido Susan with us, founder
• 0:26
  Speaker 1: of drive nets UM. He had founded Into Sales Sol
• 0:30
  Speaker 1: Cisco worked for them for a while UM, but now
• 0:33
  Speaker 1: he's back out there building a bigger company. You've got, uh,
• 0:37
  Speaker 1: I know what, two hundred two hundred million dollars in
• 0:40
  Speaker 1: funding already. Yes, So what are you doing at drive nets?
• 0:44
  Speaker 1: What's your main focus after coming out of Into Sell
• 0:48
  Speaker 1: and Cisco. I will go it's basically to change the
• 0:52
  Speaker 1: network and the Internet infrastructure design and building operators of today,
• 0:58
  Speaker 1: supporting with the custom of the operators like A T
• 1:02
  Speaker 1: and T and other UM to reduce a cost per
• 1:05
  Speaker 1: bit and to create new revenue because the way that
• 1:07
  Speaker 1: we consume the network UM as consumer enterprise different change
• 1:13
  Speaker 1: dramatically and the network didn't. And we are here to
• 1:17
  Speaker 1: support and then drive the transformation to the cloud. Yeah,
• 1:20
  Speaker 1: you would think that a lot of that would have
• 1:22
  Speaker 1: been accelerated to the pandemic, But somehow we look at
• 1:25
  Speaker 1: our country and we're still pretty woefully behind. It is
• 1:28
  Speaker 1: that fair to say? Um? If you you know, we
• 1:32
  Speaker 1: operate worldwide, so the US market advancing in this area.
• 1:37
  Speaker 1: But I think, um, the boorders between consumers and enterprise
• 1:42
  Speaker 1: does not exist anymore. Our home it's our new office.
• 1:46
  Speaker 1: And if the operators will not focusing to all out
• 1:50
  Speaker 1: fiber to the home five G WiFi C capability, um,
• 1:54
  Speaker 1: we will not be able to walk to study from
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  Speaker 1: home and to support the demand. Yeah, I'm looking for
• 2:00
  Speaker 1: houses right now in the Tri state area, and every
• 2:03
  Speaker 1: place that I look at takes pains to point out
• 2:06
  Speaker 1: there's room for a home office. It's it's recently been rewired,
• 2:10
  Speaker 1: you know, or if it hasn't, it just stays on
• 2:12
  Speaker 1: the market for a hundred and fifty days and nobody,
• 2:14
  Speaker 1: nobody wants to buy it. How is it competing ido
• 2:18
  Speaker 1: with your former employer, with behemos like Cisco and Juniper
• 2:23
  Speaker 1: and these gigantic companies. How do you get um, I
• 2:26
  Speaker 1: know you recently got a contract with a T and T.
• 2:28
  Speaker 1: How do you get contracts um with with with these
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  Speaker 1: huge clients when you have to compete with you know,
• 2:34
  Speaker 1: the biggest goliaths in the world. First of all, as
• 2:38
  Speaker 1: you mentioned, um, Um, you know Cisco was a qualet
• 2:41
  Speaker 1: my previous company. And I'm not forget what I'm coming from,
• 2:44
  Speaker 1: the amazing company and also the rest of the incumbent
• 2:47
  Speaker 1: in this industry. But because I'm coming from Cisco, I
• 2:52
  Speaker 1: know how it's how then almost unpossible to change that
• 2:56
  Speaker 1: you're doing business because you need to support the stock,
• 3:00
  Speaker 1: you need to run after the quarterly revenue, and to
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  Speaker 1: do transformation to your technology and the way that you
• 3:08
  Speaker 1: are selling and create a value to the customer. It's
• 3:11
  Speaker 1: very hard, um. So you know we are here to
• 3:15
  Speaker 1: do challenge money. It's not our drive anymore. And we
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  Speaker 1: are here to transform um the network industry, begin industry
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  Speaker 1: and to create value and the customer. Like A T
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  Speaker 1: and T and other looking for the startups like us
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  Speaker 1: that will help them to disrupt the way that they
• 3:32
  Speaker 1: are operate and build their network in order to again
• 3:35
  Speaker 1: create new revenue and too, would you say the cost
• 3:37
  Speaker 1: I'm wondering also with the shift to the home office.
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  Speaker 1: What the cybersecurity concerns are. I know that's a huge
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  Speaker 1: issue that a lot of employers are struggling with. Yes, cybersecurity,
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  Speaker 1: it's a big thread all over. UM. It's not related
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  Speaker 1: only to home, to our mobile, to our privacy. UM.
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  Speaker 1: We see a lot of challenges. I think, UM, the
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  Speaker 1: way and the opportunity for the operators UM to help
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  Speaker 1: to protect our privacy and to help to drive more
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  Speaker 1: security to any type of device that we all connected,
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  Speaker 1: if it's IoT, mobile, home, you name it. UM, it's
• 4:19
  Speaker 1: a big opportunity and I think, UM, I cannot share
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  Speaker 1: too much, but I can tell you that they are
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  Speaker 1: walking around it and this is one of the revenue
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  Speaker 1: generation that they all play to have in the next
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  Speaker 1: coming years. And of course it would benefit of US.
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  Speaker 1: I know we had recently uh a US infrastructure buil
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  Speaker 1: five billion dollars in new spending has earmarked a pretty
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  Speaker 1: sizeable piece, UM for what you're doing, and I'm sure
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  Speaker 1: other countries also are going to be spending money to
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  Speaker 1: try and improve the infrastructure. How much of a boost
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  Speaker 1: will that give you over the coming years. It's a
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  Speaker 1: huge boost boost, UM, we see it. Yes, as you mentioned,
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  Speaker 1: it's not only here in the state, it's all over,
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  Speaker 1: it's worldwide. UM. It's help us. UM, it's help our
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  Speaker 1: customer to moderate their infrastructure and to think out of
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  Speaker 1: the box. And also for US, it's UM we're getting
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  Speaker 1: a big and very nice contracts to move ahead. UM.
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  Speaker 1: I think it's just the beginning. I think more and
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  Speaker 1: more money will go from government to those infrastructure because
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  Speaker 1: everybody understands that if you want to move ahead with
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  Speaker 1: any segment, if it's healthcare, if it's education, if it's
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  Speaker 1: you name it, you need very robust infrastructure, networking infrastructure
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  Speaker 1: to support the demand of the traffic. UM. And the
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  Speaker 1: way to do it it's with technology like US and
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  Speaker 1: others as well, UM, that we help to convert it
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  Speaker 1: to be cloud based solutions, software based solution. UM. So
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  Speaker 1: I think it's just the beginning. Yeah. Absolutely. I'm still
• 6:02
  Speaker 1: working on upgrading my electric panels and after I get
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  Speaker 1: past that, then I'll boost the cloud computing power of
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  Speaker 1: my house. Ido, thanks so much for joining us. Ido
• 6:13
  Speaker 1: Susan there. He is the founder of drive nets, coming
• 6:17
  Speaker 1: out of into Cell and Cisco. Talking to us about
• 6:20
  Speaker 1: the move away from hardware and into the cloud. That
• 6:23
  Speaker 1: we've all taken part in over the past few years,
• 6:25
  Speaker 1: but we need to accelerate. I promised you we would
• 6:33
  Speaker 1: talk about corporate governance and UM E s G investing.
• 6:36
  Speaker 1: Maya Becker joins us. She's the director of Corporate Governance
• 6:39
  Speaker 1: Responsible Investment with rbc UM and Maya, it's great to
• 6:44
  Speaker 1: have you on. You know, there was a time when
• 6:45
  Speaker 1: we would have thought of this maybe as a fat
• 6:47
  Speaker 1: as a trend, but it now seems like a strategy.
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  Speaker 1: How do you see it? Yes, thank you so much
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  Speaker 1: for having me. Absolutely, we are seeing that the E
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  Speaker 1: s G and climate change is absolutely top of mind
• 6:58
  Speaker 1: for institutional and sters. Rbc GAM actually just completed out
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  Speaker 1: fifth innual Responsible Investment survey of eight hund global institutional
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  Speaker 1: asset managers and it showed that not only our investors
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  Speaker 1: concerned and interested in E s G, but climate change
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  Speaker 1: is their top priority after anti corruption and cyber security.
• 7:20
  Speaker 1: And for those that care about E s G, their
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  Speaker 1: top E s G concern is climate change. And this
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  Speaker 1: concern and this focus is really more felt, certainly by
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  Speaker 1: European investors who are paying the closest attention, and we
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  Speaker 1: see regulation as a real key driver of that. I
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  Speaker 1: am curious about developed versus undeveloped nations here or under
• 7:39
  Speaker 1: developed nations. You know, we were having a conversation this
• 7:41
  Speaker 1: morning with a representative from Mercy Corps was doing work
• 7:45
  Speaker 1: in Nigeria and really talking about the lack of support
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  Speaker 1: that they were getting as a lot of conflict was
• 7:52
  Speaker 1: breaking out in the country over climate related issues. Do
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  Speaker 1: you think that these promises being made a COP twenty
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  Speaker 1: six or going to start moving the needle for the
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  Speaker 1: countries that need it most. I think that's a great question,
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  Speaker 1: and what we're seeing at the COP twenty six Climate
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  Speaker 1: Conference is really there are a lot of high level
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  Speaker 1: commitments that are being made by governments. One of the
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  Speaker 1: key focuses of those conversations and negotiations is how advanced
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  Speaker 1: economy can provide support to developing nations, exactly what you're
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  Speaker 1: referring to their I think what we're going to want
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  Speaker 1: to see moving away from COP as COPS closes very shortly,
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  Speaker 1: is how do those commitments start to turn into government frameworks,
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  Speaker 1: policies or legislations and what are the actions that governments
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  Speaker 1: will be taking as they walk and leave COP twenty
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  Speaker 1: six with those commitments made, and will that actually generate
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  Speaker 1: support for developing nations too, in many ways are those
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  Speaker 1: that are most vulnerable to climate change, and that is
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  Speaker 1: a really important piece. As the investors when we look
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  Speaker 1: at E. S G and we look at climate change,
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  Speaker 1: our focus is really on integrating climate change into the
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  Speaker 1: investment process, and that means looking at how climate risks
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  Speaker 1: and opportunities will impact different sectors and different geographies, because
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  Speaker 1: they'll each be impacted in different ways, and we need
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  Speaker 1: to be taking those considerations into account when we look
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  Speaker 1: at our investments. And government has a key role to
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  Speaker 1: play in addressing climate change and in supporting that just
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  Speaker 1: an orderly transition for all global nations. And it feels
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  Speaker 1: to me like we'd rather pass out band aids to
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  Speaker 1: underdeveloped nations than fix the gaping wounds in our own Um.
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  Speaker 1: We can't even in the US, in Germany, in France
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  Speaker 1: agree to phase out internal combustion engines at our manufacturers
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  Speaker 1: over the next twenty years. I mean, it's I feel
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  Speaker 1: like COP twenty six achieved really very little in terms
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  Speaker 1: of meaningful commitments from the biggest nations. Am I wrong?
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  Speaker 1: Am I being too cynical? Well? I think, firstly, if
• 9:52
  Speaker 1: we think of what we can take away from COP
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  Speaker 1: twenty six and it is still long agoing, there's still
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  Speaker 1: a few days left here. As we did see governments
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  Speaker 1: make some significant cap commitments that CAUGHT twenty six new
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  Speaker 1: climate pledges, which will do this year since it is
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  Speaker 1: the fifth conference after the Paris Agreement, and that is
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  Speaker 1: something to take encouragement from those commitments that are being made.
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  Speaker 1: They're also specific sectors we're so far off from We're
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  Speaker 1: so far off from hitting the climate pledges we made
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  Speaker 1: it Paris in two thousand fifteen. I mean, what's the
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  Speaker 1: point in making new promises if we can't even meet
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  Speaker 1: the old ones. Well, what will be important is when
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  Speaker 1: we leave CAUGHT twenty six is seeing how these pledges
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  Speaker 1: and these commitments get turned into policies and practices and
• 10:32
  Speaker 1: looking at what those sector transition plans are, because I
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  Speaker 1: think that's what we're talking about here. How does each
• 10:37
  Speaker 1: sector transition to net what does that look like? What
• 10:41
  Speaker 1: is the price on carbon, what are the subsidies, what
• 10:44
  Speaker 1: are the commitments that are made at a sector level,
• 10:46
  Speaker 1: because each of those sectors needs to have a plan
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  Speaker 1: of how they're going to transition to net zero the
• 10:52
  Speaker 1: climate change and why it's so complex and challenging is
• 10:55
  Speaker 1: because it affects all sectors and all geographies, although in
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  Speaker 1: different ways. And what we do need to be able
• 11:01
  Speaker 1: to find is to be able to find solutions that
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  Speaker 1: bring all sectors along that pathway to that zero when
• 11:07
  Speaker 1: he said that give us is a direction, but you're right,
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  Speaker 1: it doesn't give us an indication of the speed of
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  Speaker 1: travel and the path of that travel will take and
• 11:15
  Speaker 1: just thirty seconds or so here may because you know,
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  Speaker 1: there's this great question now in the US about the
• 11:20
  Speaker 1: disclosures needed out of the SEC. Do you think that
• 11:25
  Speaker 1: that can be done this year in a way that's
• 11:27
  Speaker 1: meaningful to someone like you? Well, I think disclosures absolutely
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  Speaker 1: is a priority. We need a single, ideally global sustainability
• 11:37
  Speaker 1: of reporting standard for investors in order to integrate and
• 11:40
  Speaker 1: consider how fun it is impacting an individual issue where
• 11:44
  Speaker 1: we need that information to be consistent, comparable, and publicly disclosed.
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  Speaker 1: We're starting to see more interest from regulators in putting
• 11:52
  Speaker 1: in place those consistent and comparable disclosures. What I would
• 11:55
  Speaker 1: say we did here announced um during COP is the
• 12:00
  Speaker 1: i f r S Foundation has formed a new International
• 12:03
  Speaker 1: Sustainability Standards Boards and the hope there is that that
• 12:07
  Speaker 1: will establish that common consistent standards for reporting, because absolutely
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  Speaker 1: that's something investors, Nathan, it is an important piece of
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  Speaker 1: all of this. Yeah, that's the key. That's that's that's
• 12:17
  Speaker 1: got to be a key move for you and for
• 12:18
  Speaker 1: your clients. UM, and that's I think what listeners investing
• 12:22
  Speaker 1: in E s G want to want to get more of. Maya,
• 12:24
  Speaker 1: thanks so much for joining us. Maya Becker is the
• 12:27
  Speaker 1: director of Corporate Governance and Responsible Investment over at RBC
• 12:30
  Speaker 1: Global Asset Management, talking to us about E s G
• 12:33
  Speaker 1: and COP Let's get to crypto right now. I am
• 12:42
  Speaker 1: pomped to talk to our next guest. Brett Harrison is
• 12:44
  Speaker 1: the president of f t X and UM. This is
• 12:48
  Speaker 1: a company we've been just watching absolutely explode. Brett, thanks
• 12:52
  Speaker 1: so much for coming on the program with us. Let's
• 12:55
  Speaker 1: talk about the um accept the broader acceptance crypto. It's
• 13:00
  Speaker 1: been amazing to me. Ten years ago, I spent two
• 13:04
  Speaker 1: weeks living only on bitcoin, stopped using dollars, and it
• 13:07
  Speaker 1: was kind of a side show. It was a clown event.
• 13:11
  Speaker 1: It was silly. It worked, but um, it was an oddity.
• 13:14
  Speaker 1: Let's say, and now everybody, uh in every age group,
• 13:18
  Speaker 1: in every walk of life wants to know something or
• 13:22
  Speaker 1: does thinks they know something about crypto. How have you
• 13:25
  Speaker 1: experienced the acceptance? Yeah, I think personally, I have a
• 13:30
  Speaker 1: similar story. You know, before joining f t X, had
• 13:33
  Speaker 1: very little experience with crypto. I had primarily been in
• 13:36
  Speaker 1: the proprietary trading space on the equities and equity prohibitive
• 13:39
  Speaker 1: side for my whole career, and coming to crypto it
• 13:43
  Speaker 1: was very new to me as well. But it does
• 13:45
  Speaker 1: feel like it is. It's ubiquitous now. Everyone wants to
• 13:49
  Speaker 1: know something about crypto, understand the space, either invest in
• 13:52
  Speaker 1: it or build on top of it. And it's more
• 13:54
  Speaker 1: than just you know, a potential new currency or a
• 13:57
  Speaker 1: means of transfer. It an entire technology platform that people
• 14:00
  Speaker 1: really excited for the applications of. Now. I'm really curious
• 14:03
  Speaker 1: about what you think about the Bitcoin versus ethereum debate,
• 14:07
  Speaker 1: because on one hand, you know, I could talked to,
• 14:09
  Speaker 1: for example, Elizabeth Stark of Lightning Labs last week, and
• 14:13
  Speaker 1: for someone like her, bitcoin is the ultimate crypto to
• 14:17
  Speaker 1: be building things on top of. But if you talk
• 14:19
  Speaker 1: to someone like Ken Griffin, he believes that Bitcoin will
• 14:24
  Speaker 1: be eventually replaced in concept by ethereum. How do you
• 14:28
  Speaker 1: make sense of a debate like that? Sure, you know,
• 14:32
  Speaker 1: I think that one really needs to dig into the
• 14:34
  Speaker 1: details of these different cryptos and why they're built and
• 14:37
  Speaker 1: what they're used for to understand them. Bitcoin and ethereum
• 14:41
  Speaker 1: have very different applications. You know, Bitcoin itself was was
• 14:44
  Speaker 1: the first real crypto to gain mass adopting, so it
• 14:47
  Speaker 1: has that staying power. But Ethereum is coming something some
• 14:51
  Speaker 1: pretty separate. You know. It's a place where you can
• 14:53
  Speaker 1: build smart contracts, you can actually build applications on top
• 14:57
  Speaker 1: of Ethereum. It's sort of like an Internet layer, are
• 15:00
  Speaker 1: some kind of software software platform, And even just those
• 15:03
  Speaker 1: two alone aren't going to be the only answers. You know,
• 15:06
  Speaker 1: there are other cryptocurrencies built on blockchains that have even
• 15:10
  Speaker 1: higher transactions per second, lower cost fees to do transfers,
• 15:13
  Speaker 1: like Salada. We're going to see more than just Bitcoin
• 15:16
  Speaker 1: the theoryum that have staying power in the crypto ecosystem. Yeah,
• 15:19
  Speaker 1: I think there are big differences there that maybe Ken
• 15:22
  Speaker 1: Griffin doesn't take into account Um, and he might be
• 15:27
  Speaker 1: looking for something else rather than Um. Trying to appreciate
• 15:33
  Speaker 1: the diversity in the crypto space. I wonder what you
• 15:36
  Speaker 1: think of the I've always had a question as to
• 15:39
  Speaker 1: why we'll necessarily need to buy whole tokens or multiple
• 15:44
  Speaker 1: tokens just because we like the technology platform upon which
• 15:47
  Speaker 1: they're built. For example, UM, I loved the Internet computer
• 15:51
  Speaker 1: when it came out. It didn't do so well, but
• 15:53
  Speaker 1: the idea I thought was cool and the technology was cool.
• 15:56
  Speaker 1: I didn't necessarily need to own a token, or if
• 15:58
  Speaker 1: I was going to start a business on it wouldn't
• 16:00
  Speaker 1: have needed to buy two. I think you make a
• 16:03
  Speaker 1: really excellent point here, which is that there's the blockchain
• 16:08
  Speaker 1: that's being built for particular applications, and then there's a
• 16:12
  Speaker 1: token associated with that blockchain or a token associated with
• 16:15
  Speaker 1: that application. And I agree with you. I don't think
• 16:18
  Speaker 1: we need thousands of different tokens or hundreds of different blockchains.
• 16:22
  Speaker 1: I think what we will see as a real consolidation
• 16:25
  Speaker 1: over the next couple of years, where a few winners
• 16:28
  Speaker 1: will emerge in terms of you know, which blockchains are
• 16:31
  Speaker 1: actually going to be the ones that people build applications upon,
• 16:35
  Speaker 1: and the others probably will die off over the time.
• 16:37
  Speaker 1: They don't have as many unique characteristics, or they're not
• 16:39
  Speaker 1: going to outcompete, you know, the couple best ones. But
• 16:42
  Speaker 1: what's the utility of the token? I mean, if you
• 16:45
  Speaker 1: build um your business off of the Ethereum blockchain, you
• 16:50
  Speaker 1: don't necessarily need to acquire Ether to do that, do you. Well,
• 16:57
  Speaker 1: you might need to use Ether in order to silicate
• 17:00
  Speaker 1: a transaction. So, for example, when you do an Ethereum
• 17:03
  Speaker 1: based transaction, you need to use Ether tokens to pay
• 17:06
  Speaker 1: the gas fees required to do a transaction, or to
• 17:10
  Speaker 1: pay a smart contract to evaluate some function. So that's
• 17:14
  Speaker 1: the sense in which you need the token UM. But
• 17:17
  Speaker 1: there are also applications built on top of them where
• 17:19
  Speaker 1: they use different tokens, they can convert under the hood,
• 17:22
  Speaker 1: and so it's not necessarily that you need to own
• 17:24
  Speaker 1: them yourself in order to interact with them, you know.
• 17:27
  Speaker 1: But you have such an interesting background worked at some
• 17:29
  Speaker 1: of the biggest market makers in the world, Jane Street,
• 17:32
  Speaker 1: Citadel Securities, which is obviously is known for its relationship
• 17:35
  Speaker 1: with Robin Hood. These days, I'm wondering if you think,
• 17:39
  Speaker 1: and speaking of Robinhood, I'm wondering if you think crypto
• 17:42
  Speaker 1: how much it's truly a way to start to get
• 17:47
  Speaker 1: financial assets into the hands of more younger people who
• 17:51
  Speaker 1: for a long time until now have not been trading,
• 17:55
  Speaker 1: have not been paying attention to finances um and have
• 17:59
  Speaker 1: had a mistrust for so many of you know, institutions
• 18:03
  Speaker 1: in finance. Absolutely, it's not just a way and in
• 18:08
  Speaker 1: theory and in practices is what empirically we're seeing. And
• 18:11
  Speaker 1: there were um several polls done that showed that the
• 18:15
  Speaker 1: percentage of people who were underbanked owning crypto was actually
• 18:20
  Speaker 1: considerably higher than those that were banked. In addition, demographics
• 18:24
  Speaker 1: that are you know, typically more minority demographics that are
• 18:27
  Speaker 1: have either not had the same kind of affair access
• 18:30
  Speaker 1: to banking and investment opportunities in the past, are disproportionately
• 18:34
  Speaker 1: involved in crypto. So I do think that there's a
• 18:37
  Speaker 1: there's a democratizing effect of crypto, and that it's so
• 18:40
  Speaker 1: low friction, so low barrier to get involved to invest
• 18:44
  Speaker 1: and I think that that's why it's so popular among
• 18:47
  Speaker 1: young people. And also there are so many applications again
• 18:50
  Speaker 1: of crypto. You know, it's not just about owning a
• 18:53
  Speaker 1: bitcoin hoping that it goes up. Think about all the
• 18:56
  Speaker 1: blockchain based gaming that we're seeing investments and including from
• 18:59
  Speaker 1: our own company f t X. Think about n f
• 19:01
  Speaker 1: t s and the the idea of having collectibles and
• 19:04
  Speaker 1: collectible art and communities around them. These are all I
• 19:06
  Speaker 1: think very appealing to the younger generations. Is the SEC
• 19:10
  Speaker 1: you going to figure out a way to regulate this stuff?
• 19:12
  Speaker 1: I mean, so far they've allowed a futures based e
• 19:15
  Speaker 1: t F, which is I think pretty silly, um, but
• 19:19
  Speaker 1: it doesn't really make much sense since it's an unregulated
• 19:22
  Speaker 1: product to begin with. So it's a very good question
• 19:27
  Speaker 1: right now. People might not know that cryptocurrency exchanges are
• 19:32
  Speaker 1: not regulated the same way as a stock exchange or
• 19:35
  Speaker 1: a futures exchange. They're regulated under the finn Send Money
• 19:38
  Speaker 1: Services Business, which is not really the most appropriate regulatory
• 19:42
  Speaker 1: regime for an exchange that can have millions of transactions
• 19:46
  Speaker 1: per day happening, you know, by high frequency market makers.
• 19:49
  Speaker 1: And so there's we are in constant dialogue with the SEC,
• 19:53
  Speaker 1: with the CFTC. We believe that there is probably going
• 19:56
  Speaker 1: to be some sort of joint jurisdiction between these two
• 20:00
  Speaker 1: agencies of exactly what form we don't know, UM, that's
• 20:03
  Speaker 1: going to be able to regulate these tokens because it's
• 20:06
  Speaker 1: it's tricky. You know, for every one of these tokens,
• 20:08
  Speaker 1: they have different characteristics. Some of them have characteristics of commodities,
• 20:11
  Speaker 1: some of the characteristics of equities, and you know, we'll
• 20:14
  Speaker 1: we'll see where the where regulation heads and then your future.
• 20:18
  Speaker 1: It's a very interesting point. Brett, thanks so much for
• 20:20
  Speaker 1: your time. Really appreciate it. Brett Harris and their president
• 20:23
  Speaker 1: of f t X talking to us about the crypto world.
• 20:31
  Speaker 1: Let's get over right now to Wendy Wong right now,
• 20:35
  Speaker 1: head of Sustainable Investment Partnerships at New York Life Investments. Wendy,
• 20:40
  Speaker 1: we were talking earlier about the trend in or the
• 20:43
  Speaker 1: it's beyond the trend. I guess at this point the
• 20:45
  Speaker 1: strategy of E s G investing. How has COP twenty
• 20:49
  Speaker 1: six changed things for you? First of all, thank you
• 20:52
  Speaker 1: so much for having me in for your interest in
• 20:55
  Speaker 1: E s G and besting UM COP twenty Yeah, it's
• 20:59
  Speaker 1: a bit clear that it's a hot topic UM and
• 21:01
  Speaker 1: so you know, I think there's a realization that there's
• 21:04
  Speaker 1: only so much that governments can do UM. But there's
• 21:07
  Speaker 1: also a role that the private sector can play as well. Well.
• 21:11
  Speaker 1: I'm wondering the private sector as far as it goes
• 21:14
  Speaker 1: do you think that some of the biggest strides can
• 21:16
  Speaker 1: be made there? Uh, well, you know, we always believe
• 21:22
  Speaker 1: that when we work together for collective goal, good things
• 21:25
  Speaker 1: could happen, and so that was the thinking between our
• 21:28
  Speaker 1: i Q Dual Impact e t s. So it's meant
• 21:31
  Speaker 1: to have a compelling investment thesis that is investing in
• 21:34
  Speaker 1: some of these themes that are so important to us
• 21:36
  Speaker 1: gender equality, climate, health and well being. But there's also
• 21:40
  Speaker 1: UM a give back component as well. So we worked
• 21:43
  Speaker 1: with a nonprofit organization for each of these new e
• 21:47
  Speaker 1: t s and we reinvest our management fiece a portion
• 21:51
  Speaker 1: of our management fees back to these uh these nonprofit
• 21:54
  Speaker 1: organizations so they can continue doing the work they're doing.
• 21:57
  Speaker 1: So it's a great partnership between the private during the
• 22:00
  Speaker 1: public sector. So what are the themes? Talk to us
• 22:02
  Speaker 1: more about the c t F product. What are the
• 22:04
  Speaker 1: themes here? We have four themes UM that we have
• 22:08
  Speaker 1: UM that are part of the i Q Dual Impact
• 22:10
  Speaker 1: e t F. We have a health and well being
• 22:13
  Speaker 1: theme that was designed with American Heart Association to help
• 22:18
  Speaker 1: people live longer, healthier lives. There's a gender equality e
• 22:22
  Speaker 1: t F that was developed with girls who code investing
• 22:25
  Speaker 1: in UH companies, US companies that have demonstrated a commitment
• 22:29
  Speaker 1: to gender equality. There's a Cleaner Transport UM. It provides
• 22:33
  Speaker 1: exposure to global companies that are helping us move to
• 22:36
  Speaker 1: a more environmentally efficient transportation technologies. That includes bikes, rails, UM,
• 22:43
  Speaker 1: buses of course, electric vehicles. But it's also beyond all
• 22:46
  Speaker 1: of that. It's sort of the grid and infrastructure that's
• 22:49
  Speaker 1: needed to produce and UM support all of that, and
• 22:52
  Speaker 1: the value chain UM. And then finally, we have an
• 22:54
  Speaker 1: oceans themed e t F i Q oceans UM Clean
• 22:57
  Speaker 1: Oceans e t F o C e N that was
• 23:00
  Speaker 1: developed to aligned with Oceana and that that it offers
• 23:04
  Speaker 1: exposure to global companies that are helping to protect and
• 23:07
  Speaker 1: achieve a cleaner ocean. Yeah. I'm curious about this because
• 23:11
  Speaker 1: a lot of you know, the newer generations that want
• 23:14
  Speaker 1: to invest in socially friendly e t you know, E
• 23:18
  Speaker 1: t F and investment products, a lot of them feel
• 23:21
  Speaker 1: like they're getting exposures exposures to non clean items as well,
• 23:27
  Speaker 1: especially when you're kind of investing in things that pertain
• 23:30
  Speaker 1: to the broader market. I mean, what advice do you
• 23:32
  Speaker 1: have to people who really want to start to limit
• 23:35
  Speaker 1: their investments towards things that are good for the environment
• 23:40
  Speaker 1: and good for society. Well, there's a lot of different
• 23:43
  Speaker 1: ways people incorporate e s G in the portfolio. You know,
• 23:47
  Speaker 1: we started sort of as an industry doing negative screaming
• 23:50
  Speaker 1: where we're sort of screening out since stocks and um,
• 23:53
  Speaker 1: you know, fossil fuels. It's gone a lot more sophisticated. UM. So.
• 23:58
  Speaker 1: You know, part of New York Life Investments is a
• 24:01
  Speaker 1: company called Candrium. They've been doing sustainable investing for over
• 24:04
  Speaker 1: twenty five years. UM and you know, they were a
• 24:07
  Speaker 1: key key part in developing these e t F and
• 24:11
  Speaker 1: they do a lot of scoring and screening of companies
• 24:14
  Speaker 1: that they've been doing it for a long time. They
• 24:15
  Speaker 1: specialize this. UM. So it's just making sure that investors
• 24:19
  Speaker 1: are doing their research, UM, that the product that they
• 24:22
  Speaker 1: are investing it is in fact accomplishing what they wanted
• 24:26
  Speaker 1: to do. And if that means more than negative screening
• 24:29
  Speaker 1: and you know, sort of the top of the top,
• 24:32
  Speaker 1: then you know that's what they should look for. UM.
• 24:35
  Speaker 1: If you don't mind, I want to double up because
• 24:37
  Speaker 1: if I'm looking for example, the ocean e t F
• 24:40
  Speaker 1: that you guys had formed. Some of the companies include,
• 24:44
  Speaker 1: if I'm reading this correctly, Home Depot, Microsoft, Procter and
• 24:48
  Speaker 1: Gamble and even Semens. Some of the companies that are
• 24:51
  Speaker 1: in here, how do you really assess them on some
• 24:55
  Speaker 1: of the things that are doing that are good for
• 24:56
  Speaker 1: the environment, but also some of the things that aren't
• 25:00
  Speaker 1: maybe not meeting the standards that we want to see
• 25:03
  Speaker 1: you in a few years. Yeah, so for will you
• 25:06
  Speaker 1: we can use ocean right, So that investment thesis is,
• 25:10
  Speaker 1: you know, companies that are taking steps towards mitigating harm
• 25:13
  Speaker 1: to the ocean. UM. You know, companies are not perfect,
• 25:17
  Speaker 1: no one is. We're all making we're making steps. It's
• 25:20
  Speaker 1: sort of a gradual process. So it doesn't it includes
• 25:24
  Speaker 1: companies that are sort of um doing the best in
• 25:27
  Speaker 1: their sector among their peers of reaching towards that UM. So,
• 25:31
  Speaker 1: in addition to some of the stocks that you had listed,
• 25:35
  Speaker 1: it also includes um Adidas. You know, for the first
• 25:39
  Speaker 1: time in more than half of the polyester that are
• 25:42
  Speaker 1: using their products are going to come from recycled plastic waste.
• 25:44
  Speaker 1: We love that story. And then from four onwards their company,
• 25:48
  Speaker 1: that company is committed to only using recycled polyester. So
• 25:51
  Speaker 1: it's that circular economy um. And you know a seafood
• 25:54
  Speaker 1: A seafood provider is also included from Norway and they
• 25:58
  Speaker 1: supply sustainably farm stand men and process seafood worldwide and
• 26:03
  Speaker 1: everything that they sent out is sustainably certified. All right,
• 26:07
  Speaker 1: Really interesting stuff. Wendy, thanks so much for joining us
• 26:11
  Speaker 1: and talking to us about these products. Wendy Wong is
• 26:13
  Speaker 1: head of Sustainable Investment Partnerships at New York Life Investments.
• 26:17
  Speaker 1: Talking about these thematic e t F s and the
• 26:20
  Speaker 1: broader um E s G trends that have really gone
• 26:24
  Speaker 1: beyond at this point, I think are becoming just a
• 26:27
  Speaker 1: mainstream strategy for investing as which we as we UH
• 26:33
  Speaker 1: confront these challenges with things like COP twenty six. Thanks
• 26:38
  Speaker 1: for listening to the Bloomberg Markets podcast. You can subscribe
• 26:41
  Speaker 1: and listen to interviews with Apple Podcasts or whatever podcast
• 26:45
  Speaker 1: platform you prefer. I'm Matt Miller. I'm on Twitter at
• 26:49
  Speaker 1: Matt Miller three, pt on false Sweeney I'm on Twitter
• 26:53
  Speaker 1: at pt Sweeney. Before the podcast, you can always catch
• 26:55
  Speaker 1: us worldwide at Bloomberg Radio