Latest / Halo Territory: A Los Angeles Angels Podcast / Angels might have to install slide rule for head-first diving shortstop Zach Neto

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Angels might have to install slide rule for head-first diving shortstop Zach Neto · Halo Territory: A Los Angeles Angels Podcast

0:09
Speaker 1: Helly Angel fans, Welcome back to Halo territory. I am
0:12
Speaker 1: Mike di Giovanna, former Alla Times Baseball writer and host
0:16
Speaker 1: of the show, joined today by my regular co host
0:19
Speaker 1: Mark Trumbull, the former Angel slugger Mark. How you doing today? Great?
0:24
Speaker 1: We got a lot to cover today. We got a
0:28
Speaker 1: jam pack show. We're gonna talk a little bit about
0:30
Speaker 1: Robert Stevenson's latest setback infielder Christian Moors, the motion to
0:34
Speaker 1: the minor leagues in the emergence of another young pitching prospect.
0:39
Speaker 1: But we're going to open today's show with a new
0:42
Speaker 1: segment that we're calling I can't believe it. I can't
0:47
Speaker 1: believe Zach Netto slid head first into home plate in
0:51
Speaker 1: an exhibition game. What is he thinking? As we all know,
0:56
Speaker 1: Netto suffered a right shoulder injury on a head first
0:58
Speaker 1: slide into second base since September of twenty twenty four.
1:02
Speaker 1: He had off season surgery and missed the first three
1:05
Speaker 1: weeks of twenty twenty five recovering from that. He aggravated
1:09
Speaker 1: the injury on another head first slide last June, after
1:13
Speaker 1: which he vowed to slide feet first more often. But
1:17
Speaker 1: there he was on Saturday, diving into the plate while
1:20
Speaker 1: trying to score from first base on a double against
1:24
Speaker 1: the Mariners. For those watching on YouTube, we do have
1:27
Speaker 1: a video of the play, courtesy of the Seattle Mariners
1:31
Speaker 1: PR department. Here's the bitch.
1:33
Speaker 2: We're gonna slightly just down the line of spray left,
1:36
Speaker 2: going to play in a left field and rolls to
1:38
Speaker 2: the corner.
1:39
Speaker 1: O Hapi was in for Raza scores here Coupsnado.
1:43
Speaker 2: The thrill coming home to get Nado.
1:44
Speaker 1: It's rolls to the plate. The tear I apply correct now,
1:52
Speaker 1: as we know, players can get hurt on head first
1:54
Speaker 1: slides into any base. They can injure hands and wrists
1:57
Speaker 1: on feet first slides in the base. Who will ever
2:00
Speaker 1: forget Gary DiSarcina in nineteen ninety five early August stone
2:05
Speaker 1: base attempt. I believe maybe he was breaking up a
2:07
Speaker 1: double play, slides his feet first into second, reaches back
2:12
Speaker 1: for the bag with his left hand, tears a ligament
2:14
Speaker 1: in his left thumbs out for seven weeks, an injury
2:17
Speaker 1: that many thought may have cost the Angels of Pennant
2:20
Speaker 1: that year. But Mark sliding in the home plate is
2:23
Speaker 1: a little our head for a slide in the home
2:25
Speaker 1: plate is a little different animal, isn't it.
2:29
Speaker 2: It is. It is a risky play. It is something
2:32
Speaker 2: that I think is best avoided. But when the adrenaline
2:39
Speaker 2: is running and you know the play is in front
2:42
Speaker 2: of you, I think in this instance there's a couple
2:46
Speaker 2: of things going on. The head first slide, I don't
2:50
Speaker 2: think he even thought about it. I think that's just instinct.
2:52
Speaker 2: He's done it for his whole life, and he did
2:55
Speaker 2: it there. Obviously we know what happened. It seems like
3:01
Speaker 2: it's going to be a couple of games. I'm sure
3:03
Speaker 2: he's got gotten an image by now, but it should
3:07
Speaker 2: be a good reminder to him that for him, especially
3:13
Speaker 2: feet first, I think it's much easier to do when
3:16
Speaker 2: you're on first base, and let's say plot into steel,
3:18
Speaker 2: you can kind of gameplan that and whatever. This play
3:22
Speaker 2: there was a lot of moving parts. I think the
3:23
Speaker 2: main problem here was the poor initial lead he got,
3:28
Speaker 2: which I believe he spoke about made a comment about,
3:31
Speaker 2: and then I'm not sure because the camera wasn't focusing
3:36
Speaker 2: on that area, I don't know how hard he was
3:38
Speaker 2: really running. I do know that we can kind of
3:40
Speaker 2: judge off of the runner in front of him, which
3:43
Speaker 2: was Parazza, I believe, and how quickly he got the
3:48
Speaker 2: third and I think he did get to third before
3:50
Speaker 2: Zach touched second, And Paraza didn't appear to be really
3:55
Speaker 2: going all out either. So that play, whether Zach thought
3:59
Speaker 2: there was there's no chance he was going to be
4:01
Speaker 2: sent or for whatever reason. You know, that's why you
4:06
Speaker 2: don't assume anything, and especially you don't assume that someone's
4:09
Speaker 2: going to hold you up. As a runner. Your whole
4:12
Speaker 2: plot or your plan is your scoring, especially from first
4:15
Speaker 2: base on a ball down the line, your first and
4:17
Speaker 2: only thought is unscoring. And I don't care what your
4:20
Speaker 2: speed is, and the coach will make that decision to
4:22
Speaker 2: hold you up. Zach has good speed. I'm assuming that
4:25
Speaker 2: was the thought process there. But I also think he
4:29
Speaker 2: broke his stride a little bit going into third, probably
4:33
Speaker 2: assuming he might get held up. Maybe he didn't feel
4:35
Speaker 2: like he. I looked at it, you know, it didn't
4:38
Speaker 2: look like a late send. Now we can talk about
4:41
Speaker 2: and maybe you can talk about, you know, as far
4:45
Speaker 2: as where the game was, the fact that spring training
4:48
Speaker 2: is that ill advised. I mean, what are your thoughts
4:50
Speaker 2: on that?
4:51
Speaker 1: Yeah, I have a big problem with that. It turns
4:55
Speaker 1: out Keith Johnson, the regular third base coach, was not
4:58
Speaker 1: doing the game yesterday. Andy Shatsley, who is the Doba
5:03
Speaker 1: manager last years and now promoted to infield coach, was
5:07
Speaker 1: a coach in third base. And to me, there were
5:11
Speaker 1: no outs in the sixth inning and it's still a
5:13
Speaker 1: Cactus League game. So yeah, I had a big problem
5:16
Speaker 1: with that. And really, when you look at the play,
5:19
Speaker 1: I'm surprised he suffered the injury he did because really
5:21
Speaker 1: all the catcher did was slap his tag on it.
5:23
Speaker 1: And that's why I don't think you can slide head
5:26
Speaker 1: first in the home plate. Catchers are usually a lot
5:29
Speaker 1: bigger than the middle infielders. They got all the gear on.
5:32
Speaker 1: How many times you see that catcher feel the ball
5:34
Speaker 1: maybe up toward the first base line, he slides with
5:37
Speaker 1: his whole body and his shin guards right into the
5:39
Speaker 1: guy sliding in the home plate trying to make a tag.
5:41
Speaker 1: Imagine sliding with your left hand jammed into col Rally's
5:45
Speaker 1: shin guard while you're diving in a home plate. So
5:49
Speaker 1: I just think, all around, not a good sin considering
5:52
Speaker 1: the situation, and not a heady played by Zach Nan
5:56
Speaker 1: And I agree with you mark instincts do take over.
6:00
Speaker 1: But I mean, how many times have you seen veterans
6:03
Speaker 1: just ease up and not crist things in spring training?
6:05
Speaker 1: It's just not worth it. I mean, did you have
6:07
Speaker 1: a problem with the send?
6:11
Speaker 2: I initially know I didn't have a big problem. And
6:15
Speaker 2: it is a tough thing. Being a base coach is
6:16
Speaker 2: a very thankless position. You are usually only acknowledged for
6:21
Speaker 2: your screw ups, and I think that and who praises
6:28
Speaker 2: third base as coaches? I don't hear much. I mean,
6:31
Speaker 2: Dino is excellent, and are some that are better than others,
6:35
Speaker 2: and some will out themselves for being well reckless to
6:39
Speaker 2: be honest, any guys out by a wide margin. And
6:43
Speaker 2: this really wasn't that a Zach had gotten a better
6:45
Speaker 2: lead and was running harder. I think it would. There
6:48
Speaker 2: might not have been a play at all. The ball
6:50
Speaker 2: might have been cut. For example, if I was running
6:54
Speaker 2: at first base a guy with average at best, probably
6:58
Speaker 2: below average speed and Peter Board was behind me. An
7:00
Speaker 2: example that I can relate to, Yeah, there's a real
7:03
Speaker 2: concern he is going to catch me. And it's not
7:06
Speaker 2: literal like, but it could be a lot closer than
7:09
Speaker 2: I would really like if a guy is going full
7:11
Speaker 2: till now, braz is a good runner, so that's not
7:13
Speaker 2: going to happen here, But that should be the mindset
7:15
Speaker 2: that the guy behind you, and as you know Netto,
7:18
Speaker 2: he should be trying to catch the guy in front
7:19
Speaker 2: of him. So I think we've covered this, but in
7:23
Speaker 2: the future, I mean a learning experience. Hopefully we never
7:26
Speaker 2: or anyone has to discuss this and Zach never has
7:29
Speaker 2: to answer questions about this again.
7:31
Speaker 1: Yeah, luckily Netto appears to have dodge a bullet. X
7:33
Speaker 1: rays were negative. He suffered a small spring on his
7:36
Speaker 1: left hand and expects to return in a few days.
7:39
Speaker 1: And yeah, he did call it a learning experience. Spoke
7:43
Speaker 1: to reporters this morning and temp b definitely a learning
7:47
Speaker 1: experience for me. Don't slide head first in spring training.
7:50
Speaker 1: Maybe get a bigger lead next time at first base.
7:53
Speaker 1: I caused this just a little sort of day, but
7:55
Speaker 1: everything should be back here in a couple of days.
7:58
Speaker 1: That is a pretty tough learning experience. But Mark, in
8:04
Speaker 1: all your I believe ten years in the big leagues,
8:06
Speaker 1: did you ever slide head first into any base, let
8:09
Speaker 1: alone home plate?
8:11
Speaker 2: Believe you and I are tied at zero and with
8:17
Speaker 2: the time I can remember triple A Little League. Wow,
8:22
Speaker 2: it just it wasn't something I did. It was no
8:25
Speaker 2: good at it, first and foremost, and it just is
8:29
Speaker 2: really uncomfortable. Now guys that have done it and do
8:31
Speaker 2: it really well, it looks graceful. There are some advantages.
8:35
Speaker 2: You can sneak your hand in there, maybe avoid the
8:38
Speaker 2: glove and whatnot, But it's a risk reward thing. I
8:42
Speaker 2: think when in doubt, feet first as often as possible,
8:46
Speaker 2: never into first base. And you know, I just prefer
8:50
Speaker 2: feet first into second as well. But some guys still are,
8:54
Speaker 2: you know, pretty adept going head first. But you know,
8:56
Speaker 2: you see the the gloves, the big oven mits and
8:59
Speaker 2: everything else. You know you probably have to wear it.
9:01
Speaker 2: If you're a guy that doesn't.
9:02
Speaker 1: Were you safe on that play in littlely? Who knows.
9:06
Speaker 2: I'm going to say yes, probably, but I still remember it.
9:10
Speaker 2: If that tells you anything, was.
9:13
Speaker 1: It a size thing for you or an athleticism things.
9:16
Speaker 1: I always remember Garrett Ins, and you know he did
9:20
Speaker 1: not die for balls in the outfield, and he just said,
9:23
Speaker 1: flat out if I do that, I'm going to get hurt.
9:25
Speaker 1: What good am I to this team? If you know
9:27
Speaker 1: the cleanup batter on what was then a championship Calider team,
9:30
Speaker 1: you know, missing a month or two because of an injury.
9:33
Speaker 1: I know, you know, for guys your size, it's probably
9:35
Speaker 1: not the wisest thing to do.
9:38
Speaker 2: There's outliers Judge for example, he incredibly athletic. He can
9:43
Speaker 2: pull it off and it looks right. For me, didn't
9:45
Speaker 2: look right, didn't look smooth, rarely worked, and give up
9:49
Speaker 2: a lot of extra basis, an ill advised dive in
9:52
Speaker 2: the outfield can can cost a lot more than now.
9:56
Speaker 2: You don't want to look like the guy that's pulling
9:57
Speaker 2: up and not going hard either, So you got to know.
10:01
Speaker 2: I actually, for me, I preferred the slide in the
10:03
Speaker 2: outfield too, Tim Salmon, growing up watching him, he was
10:06
Speaker 2: so good at it, and it can be a real
10:08
Speaker 2: weapon too. And when the infielders are going back and
10:11
Speaker 2: the outfielders are coming in, the outfielders are taught to
10:14
Speaker 2: get down because the infielders are you know, getting down
10:17
Speaker 2: with they're falling over. So it's the outfielder's job and
10:19
Speaker 2: you need loud communication. On the basis, it was very
10:23
Speaker 2: simple because I stunk at it, so you know, why bother.
10:26
Speaker 2: But for those that can do both, you know, be
10:30
Speaker 2: interesting to hear. Maybe we'll get somebody on here in
10:32
Speaker 2: short order that can give a better opinion, and you
10:37
Speaker 2: know we can we can hear a little bit more.
10:38
Speaker 2: But that's my take.
10:41
Speaker 1: Now we're going to turn our attention to the World
10:43
Speaker 1: Baseball Classic. All of our World Baseball Classic coverage is
10:47
Speaker 1: brought to you by our friends at Fox one, which
10:50
Speaker 1: is live stream all your Fox favorites together in one place,
10:53
Speaker 1: including all WBC games and after that the best MLB
10:58
Speaker 1: action all season and long well mark. The WBC has
11:03
Speaker 1: reached the semi final stage, and let's let's be honest here.
11:07
Speaker 1: One of the great storylines of this WBC his team Italy,
11:14
Speaker 1: my Italians, the Italian the Azure as we like to
11:19
Speaker 1: call them, undefeated going into a semi final matchup against
11:23
Speaker 1: Venezuela Monday night, upset the US team in pool play.
11:30
Speaker 1: And what a great story. And I'm so happy for
11:32
Speaker 1: my good friend need Coletti, who the GM who put
11:35
Speaker 1: that team together. I sent him a text message after
11:39
Speaker 1: the after they beat the US team and just with
11:41
Speaker 1: a little emoji of an Italian flag, and he got
11:44
Speaker 1: right back to me. His response was f Yeah, so
11:47
Speaker 1: you know he's really into it, and hey, there's a
11:50
Speaker 1: there's an Angels player who's been a pretty big part
11:52
Speaker 1: of the Italian run up to the semi final, sam Aldegarry,
11:56
Speaker 1: the left hander four and two third scoreless innings in
11:59
Speaker 1: the eight nothing win over Brazil. I believe that was
12:03
Speaker 1: the opener, and he didn't pitch as well in the
12:06
Speaker 1: quarter finally only lasted what one on the third innings,
12:10
Speaker 1: gave up town runs, but they did come back and
12:12
Speaker 1: be Puerto Rico in that game. There's a slim chance,
12:16
Speaker 1: I guess, some chance that he would be available to
12:19
Speaker 1: pitch in the semi finals Monday night against Venezuela or
12:24
Speaker 1: if they reached the final Tuesday night. What are your
12:28
Speaker 1: thoughts on Sam so far? Did you see any of
12:30
Speaker 1: them in that in the tournament? And I gotta hunch
12:33
Speaker 1: something like this can really boost his confidence a bit.
12:37
Speaker 2: I haven't seen any of the action, admittedly, but I
12:40
Speaker 2: have been following the updates. It looked like he cruised
12:43
Speaker 2: through the Brazilian team. Their record not so hot, but nevertheless,
12:49
Speaker 2: you know those are good quality innings. It seems like
12:53
Speaker 2: he's really His name is out there quite a bit
12:56
Speaker 2: more through this tournament, giving interviews and other things, very passionate.
13:00
Speaker 2: I think that especially some of these other countries take
13:03
Speaker 2: this very very seriously. I think we do to some extent,
13:08
Speaker 2: but maybe not quite as much as the others. But
13:11
Speaker 2: I think the question for you is, I mean, the
13:13
Speaker 2: WBC has been going on, I guess started in two
13:16
Speaker 2: thousand and six, so we're on what's six iteration or so,
13:21
Speaker 2: do you think this tournament is fully formed, has come
13:24
Speaker 2: into its own you know, is this the year that
13:27
Speaker 2: really defines it?
13:28
Speaker 1: Yeah? I think the end of the last WBC, when
13:31
Speaker 1: show Hey struck out Mike Trout in the tournament and
13:34
Speaker 1: clinched the win for Japan, sort of catapulted the WBC
13:38
Speaker 1: into this year's tournament. And I think it was perfectly
13:42
Speaker 1: positioned as a lead into the Olympics in twenty twenty eight.
13:45
Speaker 1: And some of these teams are earning automatic berths in
13:48
Speaker 1: the Olympics, so that's huge. I think the passion has
13:53
Speaker 1: always been there from the teams in Latin America and
13:56
Speaker 1: the Caribbean, you know, watching the Dominican Republic, Venezuela, Mexico,
14:02
Speaker 1: Puerto Rico. These teams are so into it. I mean,
14:05
Speaker 1: you have Keith k Hernandez saying he'd almost rather win
14:08
Speaker 1: in the WBC than a World Series. Juliu Rodriguez the
14:11
Speaker 1: Seattle Star said the same thing over the weekend. So
14:16
Speaker 1: I do think, yeah, I know you're shaking your head,
14:18
Speaker 1: and I agree. I before the last WBC, I really
14:22
Speaker 1: and I've covered a lot of it over the years.
14:23
Speaker 1: I just didn't think the Americans took it that seriously.
14:26
Speaker 1: But I think the pride factor definitely started kicking in,
14:30
Speaker 1: and you know, it's certainly elevated. I don't know if
14:33
Speaker 1: it'll I don't think it'll ever replace the World Series.
14:35
Speaker 1: We'll see what happens in the Olympics, but I definitely
14:38
Speaker 1: think the tournament is definitely elevated. And we saw that
14:41
Speaker 1: in the LA Time Sunday Morning Bill Plashki, who admittedly
14:44
Speaker 1: had watched I think one batter, one inning of the WBC,
14:49
Speaker 1: He's sold. He's like, I'm all in. You know, this
14:51
Speaker 1: is great. So I think it's definitely taken a huge
14:55
Speaker 1: step forward this year, and I think the Olympics are
14:58
Speaker 1: just going to make an even bigger tournament in the future,
15:01
Speaker 1: from the WBC through the World Series to the World
15:04
Speaker 1: Cup to NASCAR in IndyCar With Fox One, You'll get
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Speaker 1: com for complete terms and conditions Fox one Streaming. Now,
15:26
Speaker 1: let's turn our attention out of Robert Stevenson, the reliever
15:29
Speaker 1: who suffered another elbow injury that, let's be frank, does
15:33
Speaker 1: not look good at all. Stevenson said, the concern right
15:39
Speaker 1: now is for the state of my UCO and my flexer.
15:43
Speaker 1: I'm going to see if there is a way we
15:45
Speaker 1: can rehab this thing and be able to pitch this year.
15:48
Speaker 1: But I don't know what it looks like now. I
15:51
Speaker 1: remember Stevenson had Timmy John surgery and tooth twenty twenty
15:54
Speaker 1: four and armissions that prevented him from pitching for most
15:57
Speaker 1: of twenty twenty five. He's now the third year of
16:00
Speaker 1: a three year, thirty three million dollar contract, and as
16:05
Speaker 1: he told Jeff Fletcher of the Orange County Register, it's heartbreaking,
16:10
Speaker 1: steven Sid said, his voice cracking. It's three years and
16:14
Speaker 1: I've got ten innings to my name. It sucks. I
16:17
Speaker 1: just want to be on the field. Ah. You know, God,
16:22
Speaker 1: how many times on the show we said, Oh, it
16:24
Speaker 1: looks like Robert Stevenson is going to be healthy, and
16:27
Speaker 1: that's gonna be a huge addition to the bullpen. I
16:30
Speaker 1: would you know. When I hear the letters UCL and
16:33
Speaker 1: the term flex are ten and together, my first thought
16:36
Speaker 1: is Tommy John surgery. I can think there's maybe two guys.
16:40
Speaker 1: I know. One of them. Irvan Santana had a spring
16:42
Speaker 1: ligament in his elbow. He somehow pitched through it in
16:45
Speaker 1: two thousand and five. Is pretty good. Most guys don't
16:48
Speaker 1: pitch through this thing. Mark, how do you read this
16:51
Speaker 1: situation on how big of a blow to the Angels
16:53
Speaker 1: bullpen are they looking at?
16:57
Speaker 2: This is not good. There's no way to it other
17:00
Speaker 2: than that. I feel very bad for him. He is
17:03
Speaker 2: saying all the right things, and you can tell getting emotional,
17:07
Speaker 2: and I can commiserate to some degree. The end of
17:11
Speaker 2: my career was severely hampered by a knee injury, and
17:14
Speaker 2: at a certain point you just can't overpower it. I'm sure,
17:18
Speaker 2: especially with some of the stuff this spring. I did
17:21
Speaker 2: allude to it on one of the episodes. A lot
17:24
Speaker 2: of skepticism because the injuries have accumulated and sometimes you
17:28
Speaker 2: just cannot stop the bleeding literally, I guess. But when
17:33
Speaker 2: it comes to him, the stuff is fantastic when he's
17:37
Speaker 2: out there. He said to himself ten innings total. I
17:40
Speaker 2: think he feels like he has not lived up to
17:44
Speaker 2: this contract and not contributed anywhere near what he feels
17:49
Speaker 2: like he should have for the amount of money that
17:51
Speaker 2: they committed to him. But it seems like they knowingly
17:55
Speaker 2: signed a guy with arm issues due to the structuring
17:58
Speaker 2: of the contract in the additional year if he were
18:00
Speaker 2: to blow out. So is this the situation, you know,
18:06
Speaker 2: is anyone to blame? I mean, what do you think
18:08
Speaker 2: do you do you sign a guy to this contract
18:11
Speaker 2: if you are skeptical for that amount of money.
18:14
Speaker 1: It wasn't just the injury issues for me. When you
18:17
Speaker 1: look at Robert's track record, and this is not to
18:20
Speaker 1: demean him or diminish them in any way, he really
18:22
Speaker 1: kind of had that really good year the year before
18:25
Speaker 1: the Angel signed him. It was kind of a breakout year.
18:28
Speaker 1: You can't deny the stuff. We saw it in just
18:30
Speaker 1: a couple of appearances last year. But yeah, thirty three
18:34
Speaker 1: million for a non closing reliever is a lot. Whether
18:39
Speaker 1: he had those issues or not. So yeah, I think
18:42
Speaker 1: there's definitely, you know, there's so many risks you can
18:45
Speaker 1: take with these guys. And even though you wouldn't think
18:47
Speaker 1: thirty three million would blow a massive hole when you're
18:50
Speaker 1: talking about budgets, you know, anal payrolls of two hundred
18:53
Speaker 1: million plus, it's still a big bite out of your bullpen. Now,
18:57
Speaker 1: the Angels do have two veterans with close experience in
19:01
Speaker 1: Kirby Yates and Jordan Romano. But until Ben Joyce returns
19:05
Speaker 1: and you know, God, cross your fingers and hold your breath,
19:07
Speaker 1: there could there be a sleeper candidate maybe to close
19:11
Speaker 1: that we're not thinking about right now.
19:12
Speaker 2: Mark sam Bachman having an excellent spring. I've always liked
19:18
Speaker 2: his stuff. I think that again, a guy that has
19:23
Speaker 2: struggled with some health issues, but when he's out there,
19:26
Speaker 2: I have confidence that he's going to do a nice job.
19:29
Speaker 2: He does. The stuff is definitely there. He attack hitters.
19:33
Speaker 2: It's it's tired of saying it's a matter of staying healthy,
19:36
Speaker 2: but it is the truth. I think his stuff is
19:40
Speaker 2: as good, actually, I think it's better than the other two.
19:43
Speaker 2: Yates has had a mediocre spring and Romano's numbers are
19:47
Speaker 2: pretty good. Neither of them have pitched all that much,
19:50
Speaker 2: so I'm sure that they are starting to formulate some opinions.
19:55
Speaker 2: I'd hope they are starting to formulate some opinions as usual,
20:00
Speaker 2: you know, they play their cards. The Angels and manager
20:03
Speaker 2: Kurt Suzuki. It's not giving anything away, nor should he
20:07
Speaker 2: probably would be nice for fans and us be able
20:09
Speaker 2: to say definitively one way or the other. But maybe
20:12
Speaker 2: it is up for grabs, which is interesting because some
20:15
Speaker 2: of these roster moves are a little bit intriguing with
20:20
Speaker 2: you know, we can get into it, but some guys
20:22
Speaker 2: have had excellent springs and they are not with the
20:24
Speaker 2: big league club anymore.
20:25
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, we have one of those big roster moves
20:28
Speaker 1: over the weekend was Christian Moore getting demoted. Pretty good
20:32
Speaker 1: indication that Adam Fraser has either won the second base
20:35
Speaker 1: job or he's closing in on it. Mark, what did
20:38
Speaker 1: you think of this move and could reflect some kind
20:42
Speaker 1: of shift in organizational philosophy?
20:47
Speaker 2: I think it could. I In recent years we've seen
20:51
Speaker 2: you know, very aggressive with the younger players, and here's
20:54
Speaker 2: one and Bremner as well, slow rolled his debut into spring.
21:00
Speaker 2: He pitched single inning and he was reassigned to minor
21:03
Speaker 2: league camp wherever that is. That's a ball or double
21:06
Speaker 2: a yet to be seen. It look like he and
21:10
Speaker 2: by the wording, and there was a lot to go
21:11
Speaker 2: off of, but it was the third pitch, the slider
21:14
Speaker 2: for him work in progress, and I'm assuming they saw
21:19
Speaker 2: someone who needed maybe a lot more refinement. A clip
21:22
Speaker 2: with Mike Maddox came out yesterday that the Angels, But
21:25
Speaker 2: that was really cool to see nice Spanish out of Mike.
21:29
Speaker 2: He's probably practiced it for a long time, but he
21:31
Speaker 2: seemed like you not. Even the tips I saw that
21:33
Speaker 2: he gave were stuff that really translates. They're not super complex,
21:37
Speaker 2: not hard to understand. One of them was releasing the
21:40
Speaker 2: ball out in front of your nose. That's something a
21:41
Speaker 2: pitcher can get right away. When it comes to Christian Moore,
21:44
Speaker 2: his well, his numbers are lousy. He didn't have a
21:47
Speaker 2: good showing with the bat. I haven't seen a single
21:50
Speaker 2: at bat from him, so I don't know what his
21:53
Speaker 2: swing looks like. I will try and track something down,
21:57
Speaker 2: maybe an iPhone video or something, but I don't know
22:00
Speaker 2: what he's doing. I don't know what his approaches. Maybe
22:03
Speaker 2: there was an off season change to the swing or whatever.
22:06
Speaker 2: Either way, sub two hundred average maybe one seventy five
22:11
Speaker 2: ish and Fraser hitting nearly three seventy and a veteran
22:15
Speaker 2: and a left handed bat as we covered, So you know.
22:19
Speaker 2: In addition, Grissom is still with the club. I think
22:22
Speaker 2: maybe that's a contractual thing. I haven't seen much from him,
22:26
Speaker 2: appeared in the limited bats. I saw to have someone
22:28
Speaker 2: of a launch angle swing. I think everyone knows what
22:31
Speaker 2: that means by now, But interesting there. Praza has had
22:36
Speaker 2: a great spring, lightening it up. So maybe competing for
22:39
Speaker 2: the starting third base job. What do you think?
22:41
Speaker 1: Well, first of all, I like this move just to
22:44
Speaker 1: maybe take a little pressure off Christian Moore. You know,
22:47
Speaker 1: they probably rushed him up to the big leagues last year.
22:51
Speaker 1: You know, let him start in the minor leagues, trip
22:53
Speaker 1: a A, whatever. Just let him get his feet under him,
22:55
Speaker 1: let him get a month or two of at bats
22:57
Speaker 1: and you know, get some confidence. Because if you start
23:00
Speaker 1: him in the big leagues this year and he's sitting
23:02
Speaker 1: in like one thirty after three weeks, then you're sending
23:06
Speaker 1: him down with just nothing but disappointment and angst and
23:09
Speaker 1: you know, kicking himself. So I think it's the right play.
23:12
Speaker 1: He needs to develop more in the minor leagues. Now.
23:14
Speaker 1: We talked about on our last show with Fletch, just
23:18
Speaker 1: the plethor of infielders that are probably going to be
23:20
Speaker 1: on this roster. So I don't know, it sets up
23:25
Speaker 1: an interest situation. I love that Fraser's bat in left handed.
23:28
Speaker 1: They do need left handed bats in that lineup. I talked,
23:31
Speaker 1: I think on the last show about maybe Peraza, because
23:35
Speaker 1: Moncata is not as strong from the right side, platooning
23:37
Speaker 1: at third base, but maybe he platoons at second base
23:40
Speaker 1: with Fraser and you know, plays a lot of third
23:43
Speaker 1: base too. If he's one of your better bats, you know,
23:47
Speaker 1: as almost more of a super utility guy, why not
23:49
Speaker 1: get him in the lineup as much as he can.
23:52
Speaker 1: You think Fraser can play full time every day at
23:55
Speaker 1: his age. I don't know, probably can, but you know,
24:00
Speaker 1: maybe pacing him out and having more of a platoon
24:03
Speaker 1: might be good at second base. What do you think?
24:05
Speaker 2: I agree four to five times a week would be
24:08
Speaker 2: my gut reaction. But he I'm sure capable will playing more.
24:12
Speaker 2: That's something that I learned a long time ago, but
24:15
Speaker 2: every day major league players are usually built very sturdy,
24:19
Speaker 2: and guys that are not everyday players, if given sometimes
24:24
Speaker 2: a bigger sample size, you'll see why they're not everyday players.
24:29
Speaker 2: Fraser is the guy that has been there and done
24:31
Speaker 2: it before at his age, I think it would be
24:33
Speaker 2: best to spread it out a little bit. And if
24:35
Speaker 2: Moncott is raking, then he's going to be the everyday
24:38
Speaker 2: third basement. That's pretty simple. He's got the most power
24:41
Speaker 2: by far, pretty good on base percentage, and hopefully the
24:45
Speaker 2: defense last year was just kind of a fluke because
24:48
Speaker 2: I think he's a little bit better than what.
24:50
Speaker 1: He showed now. Jeff Passim, the outstanding baseball writer for ESPN,
24:56
Speaker 1: had a passage in his Monster preview of all thirty
24:59
Speaker 1: teams the other day, and when he got to the Angels,
25:03
Speaker 1: had an interesting observation about one read Debt Meers, and
25:07
Speaker 1: he set up his preview for every team he had
25:10
Speaker 1: a bull faced lead and it wouldn't surprise me if
25:13
Speaker 1: dot dot dot, and for the Angels it's read Debtmer's
25:17
Speaker 1: moves back to the bullpen and leads the Angels in saves.
25:21
Speaker 1: The Angels are trying Debtmers as a starter again this spring,
25:23
Speaker 1: a move that is understandable at some point, though the
25:27
Speaker 1: reality of Detmo's five year career is that he's a
25:30
Speaker 1: Middlings starting pitcher but was excellent last year as a reliever.
25:35
Speaker 1: Sometimes guys are who they are, and if Debtmer's is
25:39
Speaker 1: an exclamation point in one role and a question mark
25:42
Speaker 1: in the other, the Angels need to follow strunk In
25:44
Speaker 1: White's advice and punctuate properly. A kudos to Jeff for
25:49
Speaker 1: his knowledge of grammar in the English language. I really
25:51
Speaker 1: love that. I don't necessarily disagree with Jeff passing here,
25:57
Speaker 1: but I do think the Angels need to give Reed
26:01
Speaker 1: Debtmers a runway as a starter. You know, they drafted
26:04
Speaker 1: him in the first round. He took one for the
26:07
Speaker 1: team and moved to the bullpen, but you know he's
26:11
Speaker 1: a starter at heart. And let's face it, you know,
26:14
Speaker 1: the money you can make as a relatively you know,
26:17
Speaker 1: middle of the rotation starter so far outweighs what you
26:21
Speaker 1: can make in free agency as a as even an
26:24
Speaker 1: elite setup man that you know, for his career and
26:28
Speaker 1: his career earnings, I think they do owe it to him.
26:30
Speaker 1: To give him a pretty long, pretty big chance. Just
26:32
Speaker 1: as an example, I looked up Chris Bassett, pretty solid,
26:36
Speaker 1: you know, maybe two, maybe three, maybe four depending on
26:39
Speaker 1: the rotation. Always known as an innings eaters. Once he
26:43
Speaker 1: hit free agency, he averaged twenty point three million in
26:46
Speaker 1: four years of free agency. Blake Tryning, elite setup man
26:51
Speaker 1: for the Dodgers. Once he hit free agency, he averaged
26:54
Speaker 1: eight point one five million a year in seven years.
26:58
Speaker 1: So I don't know what you know. I know we
27:00
Speaker 1: don't like to focus too much on money, but you know,
27:03
Speaker 1: these guys, it's their careers and they need to maximize
27:06
Speaker 1: as much as they can during their playing days. What
27:08
Speaker 1: are your thoughts on this?
27:11
Speaker 2: I think it's up to read. I think that the
27:14
Speaker 2: ball is in his court. They've given him. To be honest,
27:18
Speaker 2: I think we may differ a little bit in an opinion.
27:20
Speaker 2: I think he's had substantial runway to do what he
27:24
Speaker 2: needs to do. I think, more than anything, when I
27:26
Speaker 2: watch him, and I am a big fan of his,
27:28
Speaker 2: I think that he has really good stuff. He seems
27:31
Speaker 2: mild mannered, soft spoken. I'd like to see him amp
27:34
Speaker 2: it up a little bit. Take charge of your career.
27:38
Speaker 2: I don't know who's calling his pitches, but it should
27:41
Speaker 2: be him. It seems like there's some doubt at times
27:45
Speaker 2: as to what to throw, what to do. I think
27:47
Speaker 2: Mike Maddox is probably a perfect guy to get with
27:50
Speaker 2: him and say, look, you know you're not a green
27:54
Speaker 2: first year guy anymore. You've been here, you've done this
27:57
Speaker 2: for a while. Now, like, let's get it going. The
27:59
Speaker 2: stuff was there. The stuff was there in the bullpen,
28:02
Speaker 2: and I think what Jeff Passen was almost certainly getting
28:05
Speaker 2: out with is a Zach Britton type situation. I don't
28:09
Speaker 2: know if Josh Hater was ever a starter, but thinking
28:12
Speaker 2: left hand and thinking that Devers and Zach started for
28:16
Speaker 2: parts of three seasons with the Orioles before converting and
28:19
Speaker 2: went on to be a All Star closer for many years.
28:23
Speaker 2: Incredibly nasty stuff. Fortunately I was on his team, not
28:27
Speaker 2: on the team's trying to hit him. But you can
28:30
Speaker 2: earn a lot of money. If we're talking money, I'm
28:32
Speaker 2: not sure the Angels are dying to pay through the
28:35
Speaker 2: nose for a starting pitcher. It's not really in their DNA.
28:38
Speaker 2: But Reid could maximize, and with pitching, it's when do
28:42
Speaker 2: you do it? Timing if he were to take off
28:45
Speaker 2: and have an excellent year, his stock could rise enormously.
28:48
Speaker 2: And I don't believe he's a free agent at year's end.
28:52
Speaker 2: This year probably be the following. But yeah, if he
28:57
Speaker 2: times it right and then everything clicks, he could make
28:59
Speaker 2: a fortune. But you can also make a lot of
29:01
Speaker 2: money being a very good especially closers make a lot
29:05
Speaker 2: more than a setup man. Now just you know, a
29:09
Speaker 2: regular reliever. No, that's probably worst case scenario for Reid,
29:12
Speaker 2: but I think he needs to get after it and
29:16
Speaker 2: pound the strike zone. Stop messing around with these guys.
29:19
Speaker 2: Your stuff is better then, especially these bottom of the
29:23
Speaker 2: order bats, Go right at them, put them away. Three
29:25
Speaker 2: pitches or less would be ideal. I know it's not
29:28
Speaker 2: always realistic, but that would be my message there.
29:32
Speaker 1: Speaking of big stuff, Fangraphs came out with a pretty
29:36
Speaker 1: interesting chart last week that ranked Spring training starting pitchers
29:41
Speaker 1: by stuff. I have no idea how this is calculated,
29:45
Speaker 1: but on top of the list was the Angels number
29:47
Speaker 1: nineteen prospect, a twenty two year old right hander named
29:52
Speaker 1: Wilbert Urinya. Mark. Did you see this chart? And what
30:00
Speaker 1: do you know about this kid? He's their number nineteen prospect,
30:03
Speaker 1: so he's at least on the radar as opposed to
30:06
Speaker 1: many Ramirez a kid and some of the WBC guys
30:09
Speaker 1: you mentioned in previous shows. But you've done some studying
30:13
Speaker 1: on this kid. Is this stuff legit stuff?
30:17
Speaker 2: Plus is a saber metric model that evaluates the nastiness
30:21
Speaker 2: of a pitcher's arsenal. So there you go, velocity, spin rate.
30:26
Speaker 2: It measures movement vertical and horizontal release point, and essentially
30:31
Speaker 2: does try to quantify how nasty a guy's pitches are.
30:37
Speaker 2: It separates fastball, breaking ball, change up, assigns a score.
30:41
Speaker 2: An average offering is rated as one hundred, So if
30:45
Speaker 2: you see plus ten percent, it's very good, so one ten.
30:50
Speaker 2: If you see anything that's under one hundred, it starts
30:52
Speaker 2: to trend towards a below average pitch. So when you're
30:55
Speaker 2: formulating pitch usage for guys and what he should be
30:59
Speaker 2: throwing more of or less of useful stat I think
31:02
Speaker 2: what I was reading it's it's more designed to get
31:06
Speaker 2: to the point quicker than maybe some of the more
31:09
Speaker 2: traditional accounting stats, especially for relievers who don't always qualify
31:13
Speaker 2: because they don't have enough innings pitched, number of pitches, YadA, YadA.
31:16
Speaker 2: So hopefully that was a decent explanation of the stat itself.
31:21
Speaker 2: Now about mister Uranya, why is he not rated higher
31:25
Speaker 2: in the Angels prospects, Well, that would probably be because
31:30
Speaker 2: of his enormous walk rate. His command has been very bad,
31:35
Speaker 2: and I watched some of the YouTube clips I could find.
31:40
Speaker 2: I thought he was I don't know why. I thought
31:41
Speaker 2: he was a bigger guy. He's six feet yeah, yeah,
31:46
Speaker 2: so more of a compact I hate say it, but
31:51
Speaker 2: shorter pitcher. I mean, there's a lot of big dudes,
31:53
Speaker 2: and when you see I think of Stroman probably first
31:56
Speaker 2: and foremost, and when I was watching him, kind of
32:00
Speaker 2: short arms the ball and it does seem to have
32:03
Speaker 2: a little bit of deception. He throws very hard, which
32:07
Speaker 2: is probably the stuff. Plus STAT takes that into account.
32:09
Speaker 2: All his pitches are hard, so his fastball can get
32:13
Speaker 2: up to one hundred and two. I think this spring
32:15
Speaker 2: he's been ninety eight, ninety nine. But he's a guy
32:19
Speaker 2: that is doing it with a lot of the horizontal movement,
32:22
Speaker 2: so he doesn't strike out a ton of hitters, which
32:24
Speaker 2: is intriguing because you see, you know those raw numbers,
32:27
Speaker 2: and it's like, well you must punch everybody out. Well
32:29
Speaker 2: he doesn't, so why is that? And you know, the
32:33
Speaker 2: hitters will let you know. I saw a very good
32:36
Speaker 2: change up in the videos I saw, and I once
32:38
Speaker 2: for a while I saw a mediocre at best breaking ball.
32:41
Speaker 2: But he does throw it very hard, so the raw
32:43
Speaker 2: stuff may may kind of do that. I think Vangrafts
32:47
Speaker 2: hasn't pinned for a twenty twenty seven debut, so for
32:50
Speaker 2: those getting very excited, maybe he'll beat that. If you
32:54
Speaker 2: know his late season. He did have a nice end
32:56
Speaker 2: to last season, so maybe that'll vault him.
32:59
Speaker 1: The twenty aid.
33:00
Speaker 2: Command they put on him would be the big asterisk.
33:03
Speaker 2: That is as low as it gets.
33:05
Speaker 1: That's a brand.
33:06
Speaker 2: That is why there will there should be caution because
33:09
Speaker 2: big league hitters in general have a lot better idea
33:12
Speaker 2: of the strike zone than double A hitters. For example,
33:16
Speaker 2: they won't swing it. And for him especially, I saw
33:18
Speaker 2: too many pitches that were not competitive out of the hand,
33:21
Speaker 2: meaning they weren't even hard takes. They're just balls. And
33:25
Speaker 2: if he can refine that, he doesn't have to be
33:27
Speaker 2: one of those guys that gets you out in the zone.
33:29
Speaker 2: For Landers Shuz or some of those guys the elite
33:31
Speaker 2: of elite gets you out in the zone. He can
33:34
Speaker 2: be a guy that gets you out with strikes to balls,
33:37
Speaker 2: those types of chases, but they have to start relatively
33:40
Speaker 2: looking like strikes. They can't just be a mile off.
33:44
Speaker 1: All right. We will close the show with that. Thanks
33:47
Speaker 1: for tuning in today. Please like and subscribe, and we'll
33:50
Speaker 1: see you next time on Halo Territory.