Latest / CIAM Radio / Building Relationships - Resolve Conflict With Adult Children | Dr. Kathy Koch

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Building Relationships - Resolve Conflict With Adult Children | Dr. Kathy Koch · CIAM Radio

0:00
S1: We are parents, but we don't parent as a verb
0:03
S1: unless we're invited to do so. So what do we do?
0:06
S1: We guide, coach, cheer, mentor, counsel, help. We're present. And
0:11
S1: you keep your mouth shut. And you listen and you
0:13
S1: pray and it's hard.
0:18
S2: Welcome to Building Relationships with Doctor Gary Chapman, author of
0:22
S2: the New York Times best seller, The Five Love Languages.
0:25
S2: And if you're having conflict with an adult child. Author
0:28
S2: and speaker Doctor Kathy Cook wants to come alongside with
0:31
S2: some encouragement today. If you go to our website, Building relationships.us,
0:35
S2: you'll see Doctor Cook's book Resolve Conflict and Find peace
0:38
S2: and Hope with adult children strategies and conversations that work.
0:43
S2: Just go to building relationships.us. Gary. When we open the
0:47
S2: listener line for questions from parents, this is right at
0:50
S2: the top, isn't it?
0:52
S3: It is Chris and I've seen a lot in my
0:54
S3: office as well. You know, just the conflicts between parents
0:58
S3: and their adult children. And it involves all sorts of things.
1:01
S3: So I am really excited about our conversation today and
1:05
S3: talking with Doctor Cooke about her book on that topic.
1:08
S2: If you go to building relationships.us, you'll see our featured
1:11
S2: resource resolve conflict and find peace and hope with adult children.
1:16
S2: Doctor Cathy Cooke is founder and president of Celebrate Kids Incorporated.
1:20
S2: She's written several best selling parent child enrichment books such
1:24
S2: as Screens and Teens, eight Great Smarts and Resilient Kids,
1:28
S2: among others. She earned a PhD in Reading and Educational
1:31
S2: Psychology from Purdue University. Find out more about her and
1:35
S2: her resource at Building relationships.us.
1:38
S3: Well, Doctor Cooke, welcome back to Building Relationships.
1:42
S1: Thank you so much, Doctor Chapman. It's great to be here.
1:45
S3: Your ministry is dedicated to helping children and the parents
1:48
S3: who love them become who they were uniquely created to be.
1:53
S3: But this resource is a little different. Why did you
1:56
S3: want to tackle this topic?
1:59
S1: Yeah, thanks for asking that question, Gary. Part of it
2:01
S1: is what I've seen in culture, which is what, you know,
2:04
S1: you and Chris have seen just how many parents are
2:07
S1: struggling with decisions adult children are making. How many adult
2:10
S1: children I've spoken with who are frustrated with their parents
2:13
S1: and disrespect and other issues. And so I wondered if
2:16
S1: I could speak into it. You know, I've written for
2:18
S1: 21 years and I know like you're a prolific author.
2:21
S1: So impressive what the Lord has given you to do.
2:24
S1: So I've been an author for 21 years, which means
2:26
S1: that my audience has grown up. So the people who
2:28
S1: started following me when they had young children now still
2:31
S1: follow me and have older people. And you know what?
2:33
S1: I come from a multi-generational, beautiful family. I grew up
2:36
S1: kitty corner from my grandparents, and my dad cut a
2:38
S1: hole in the fence, and my brother and I could walk,
2:40
S1: you know, back and forth. I was about four blocks
2:43
S1: from my other grandparents. I went to church with aunts
2:45
S1: and uncles. I played, I went to school with my cousins.
2:48
S1: I come from a multi-generational, solid family, and I know
2:53
S1: it matters. God ordained the family and he's grieving over this,
2:57
S1: and enough people had approached me to say, you know, Kathy,
3:00
S1: I think that you have something to say here. And
3:02
S1: I tackled it. And I'm so grateful for people like
3:04
S1: you who allow me to be influential on, on your show.
3:07
S1: So thank you for your support.
3:10
S3: Do you think that there's more of a problem with
3:13
S3: this situation, adult children today than in previous generations?
3:18
S1: You know I do. Although I wonder if we well,
3:22
S1: like we obviously know more about it now because of
3:24
S1: social media, right? And we have these 24 hour a day,
3:27
S1: quote unquote, news stations that tell us about all the
3:30
S1: brokenness that's in the world. So, you know, I do
3:32
S1: think that there's been family dysfunction since, you know, Cain
3:35
S1: and Abel, if you will. Um, so it's not, it's
3:37
S1: not surprising, but is it, is it more frequently? I
3:40
S1: think so I don't think it's as frequent as the
3:43
S1: media suggests, though. So, you know, people who are listening
3:46
S1: and they have good relationships with their, uh, family, like
3:49
S1: praise God, don't be looking for trouble. Don't be thinking that,
3:52
S1: you know, you probably have some trouble under the mat
3:55
S1: that you're not aware of. That might not be true.
3:57
S1: You actually might have a beautiful, really healthy give and
4:00
S1: take supportive family. So yes, it's there, but I don't
4:04
S1: think it's as big as the media.
4:06
S3: Yeah. Yeah. Are there different levels of fractured relationships between
4:11
S3: parents and adult children?
4:13
S1: I do think so. I've met people who have totally
4:16
S1: cut off all contact, and they mean it, and they
4:18
S1: have good reasons for doing that. And they're very clear
4:22
S1: on that. And then there are others who will have
4:24
S1: maybe a boundary. You know, you can text and call,
4:26
S1: but don't stop over or there'll be people who, you know,
4:29
S1: holiday only kind of like the the church attenders who
4:32
S1: go only on the holiday. There's family, people who only
4:34
S1: go on the holiday, if you will. And so all
4:36
S1: kinds of changes. There are some where the parents cut
4:39
S1: it off, and there are some where the adult children
4:41
S1: cut it off. There are some times where the grandchildren
4:44
S1: are the ones who are making decisions because of the
4:46
S1: way that they feel about things. So I think it
4:49
S1: is different. And I and again, it makes it complex, right?
4:52
S1: But it's all relational. It's all your expertise.
4:56
S3: Yeah, well, you say that parents will always be parents.
5:00
S3: That's their noun. But the problem comes when we get
5:04
S3: the nouns and the verbs mixed up. Can you explain that?
5:08
S1: Yes. This is actually chapter one. Like I started in
5:11
S1: this very bold place where parents will always be a noun.
5:14
S1: Child will always be the noun of a child. But
5:17
S1: we don't parent as a verb, adult children unless we're
5:21
S1: asked to adult children. One of the things they told
5:24
S1: me over and over again was how much disrespect they
5:26
S1: feel from parents who are still trying to parent them.
5:30
S1: When the adult child believes that he or she doesn't
5:33
S1: need to be parented. Now, the parent might be looking
5:35
S1: at and going, oh, you are. You're still a work
5:36
S1: in progress, just like you need help. But you know,
5:39
S1: that adult child is thinking, no, you know, I'm 18
5:42
S1: or I'm 21 or I'm 23 and married and you know,
5:44
S1: you need you need to leave me alone. So we
5:47
S1: our parents, but we don't parent as a verb unless
5:49
S1: we're invited to do so. So what do we do?
5:52
S1: We guide Coach. Cheer. Mentor. Council. Help! We're available. We're present.
6:00
S1: And we have insight because we're wise. There's wisdom in
6:04
S1: this older generation. You guys have lived a long life,
6:06
S1: and it's killing you to not share something with one
6:09
S1: of your kids or in-laws that you think is really relevant,
6:11
S1: but you wait and you have an insight and maybe
6:14
S1: you say, hey, I've got something that might be relevant,
6:16
S1: let me know if you'd like me to share it.
6:19
S1: And if they say not yet, you, you honor that
6:22
S1: and you keep your mouth shut and you listen and
6:24
S1: you pray and it's hard.
6:27
S2: I think that is part of the the power of
6:29
S2: this book, Doctor Kathy. And that is not that it's
6:33
S2: going to solve all your problems. It's not the bibbidi
6:35
S2: bobbidi boo, you know, to, to wave over the wand
6:38
S2: of your relationships with your adult kids or the children,
6:42
S2: adult children waving it over their parents to get them
6:45
S2: to understand what I think the power is, is that
6:49
S2: the person who feels like they're all alone. They're the
6:53
S2: only one in the world with this situation. They are
6:57
S2: not alone when they read what you've written here. What
7:00
S2: do you think?
7:01
S1: Oh, thanks for saying that. Right. You know, the devil
7:04
S1: wants us to isolate, and it's hard. Like some of
7:07
S1: some of the people listening today, they haven't been able
7:09
S1: to tell, you know, their own, you know, maybe brother
7:12
S1: or sister or their parents, if their parents are still alive,
7:15
S1: that they've got an adult child who's choosing to separate.
7:18
S1: Like it's awkward, it feels embarrassing, it feels like there's
7:21
S1: shame and blame. And maybe we don't tell a life
7:24
S1: group or a Sunday school class or a prayer circle.
7:26
S1: And we do have to be careful. Their adult children
7:28
S1: have told me that they feel like prayer time is
7:30
S1: gossip time. So we have to be really careful who
7:32
S1: we share with. But we certainly should not be living
7:34
S1: this out alone. And so again, thanks for having me
7:38
S1: on the show. I pray that we make a difference
7:40
S1: today to just bring this to light.
7:43
S3: Cathy, let's address the topic Chris talked about earlier. And
7:46
S3: that is the adult child's perspective. What's going through the
7:50
S3: mind of the son or daughter who feel the need
7:53
S3: to get some distance between themselves and their parents.
7:57
S1: Yeah, I appreciate you asking that. You know what? They
8:00
S1: want to grow up. They want to mature. They and
8:04
S1: maybe we should say finally, like some of you know,
8:07
S1: some of these adult children we've raised have maybe been,
8:10
S1: you know, lazy and disrespectful for a season. Hard to
8:13
S1: reach or whatever. But now they're realizing they have a
8:16
S1: need to mature and need to grow up. And they
8:18
S1: need respect. It's easier. Here's the thing. I think for
8:22
S1: some of them, Doctor Chapman, it's easier for them to
8:26
S1: separate from their parents than to feel like they've disappointed
8:31
S1: their parents daily.
8:33
S3: Mhm.
8:33
S1: The pressure that they're feeling, so many of our adult
8:36
S1: children feel like they've been performing for their parents. I
8:40
S1: actually addressed in chapter one of my book, The Very
8:42
S1: Dangerous Reality, that some parents are idolizing their children and grandchildren, which,
8:49
S1: you know, were created to worship. We're supposed to worship God.
8:51
S1: But there are parents who worship their children. And what happens?
8:55
S1: That means that, you know, if a child has a
8:57
S1: good day, they have a good day. And if their
8:59
S1: child has a bad day, they have a bad day.
9:01
S1: And some of our adult children have felt that pressure
9:04
S1: for years. And they've told me I'd rather cut off
9:08
S1: all connection to my parents than to stay in relationship
9:11
S1: and only hear what I've done wrong, or believe that
9:15
S1: I continue to disappoint my dad and the choices that
9:17
S1: I'm making. So it's very awkward, but I think that's
9:21
S1: some of what's going on.
9:22
S3: Yeah. Do you think that moms or dads tend to
9:28
S3: do this more often, or is it equal?
9:31
S1: Yeah, I'd be interested in what you think of that
9:34
S1: in your work. I think moms, moms tend to be
9:36
S1: more emotionally invested with their kids of all ages. They
9:41
S1: often define themselves as mom. They talk about their mom role. They,
9:45
S1: you know, live through their children's successes. And I mean,
9:48
S1: praise God for invested moms. I'm not saying they shouldn't
9:52
S1: be that, but I think often it's the heartache of
9:55
S1: the mom. The mom probably has had more dreams about
9:58
S1: rocking the grandbaby and going out for coffee with the
10:02
S1: daughter or the daughter in law as their friends. As adults,
10:05
S1: they've probably dreamt those dreams more than the dads have.
10:09
S1: But the dads are hurt too. And the dads sometimes
10:12
S1: the dads, they've been the ones that have been helpers, right?
10:15
S1: Like they've changed the oil in their daughter's car or
10:18
S1: they've taught a son how to, you know, change a tire.
10:21
S1: Those are classic stereotypes. But the dad has sometimes been
10:24
S1: more involved in some practical things, even, you know, financial
10:28
S1: literacy or advice about which apartment to sign a lease for.
10:32
S1: So I think sometimes the dad misses that role of
10:36
S1: support when it comes to practical help. The mom often
10:39
S1: misses just that heart to heart kind of conversations. It's hard.
10:44
S3: Yeah, yeah, that whole thing of criticism or pushing a child.
10:48
S3: I'll never forget the young man who came to me.
10:51
S3: He had just finished med school and he said to me,
10:56
S3: I'm not going to do a residency because I've never
10:59
S3: wanted to be a doctor. My father pushed me to
11:01
S3: be a doctor, and I felt exactly like you just felt,
11:06
S3: you know? Yes, man. And I'm sure his father meant well,
11:10
S3: you know, and he wanted to see his son succeed.
11:12
S3: And he thought being a doctor was, you know, the
11:14
S3: road for that. But it was not his son's desire
11:17
S3: at all. And so, you know, obviously there's a fractured
11:20
S3: relationship after that.
11:22
S1: You know, it's interesting. If I can just interject, I
11:25
S1: think what you just pointed out is really important. Parents
11:28
S1: will often look at me like, like, where did this
11:30
S1: come from? Like I thought our relationship was perfect. So
11:33
S1: they're reinventing the past. Now children have also reinvented the past.
11:38
S1: Often they have a negative script. Parents are also doing that, though.
11:42
S1: Parents are like, we've always gotten along just great. Like,
11:44
S1: what's the problem? That's not true. There were conflicts when
11:47
S1: their kids were 17 and 18 years old. They're just
11:49
S1: choosing not to remember that, or this kind of example
11:52
S1: where the child felt in order to please the dad
11:56
S1: to be loved by the dad, the child had to
11:58
S1: do what dad wanted him to do. The dad didn't
12:00
S1: realize that that was going on. Never really intended that
12:03
S1: at a, at a real level of understanding. But I
12:07
S1: think it's good for us to look back and wonder, okay, wait,
12:10
S1: are there some things we're responsible for that have caused
12:13
S1: our children to doubt the kind of love that we
12:15
S1: have for them? Let's own that. Let's apologize if we
12:18
S1: need to, and let's see if we can, you know,
12:21
S1: repair something that truly is broken. I think, I mean,
12:25
S1: I wrote chapter two is really hard. Chapter two is about,
12:27
S1: you know, your responsibility. I've had people say they wanted
12:29
S1: to skip the chapter, but they knew they couldn't because
12:32
S1: it's chapter two, like on purpose.
12:35
S3: Yeah. Yeah. Well, I'm assuming that when there are conflicts
12:40
S3: with adult children, that moms and dads often handle that
12:45
S3: conflict in a different way. Have you found that true?
12:48
S3: And if so, what would be some of those differences?
12:51
S1: Uh, the mom can be more demanding and more emotionally whining.
12:56
S1: I've seen this happen, and this is what some adult
12:58
S1: children have told me that the mom has a harder time,
13:01
S1: you know, not texting or not calling or, you know,
13:05
S1: the mom, you know, drops off cookies even though she
13:07
S1: was told not to. As an example, I think dads
13:10
S1: might have an easier time of putting it into a
13:12
S1: compartment and locking it away and just realizing, hey, you know,
13:16
S1: that I was a dad and I loved being a dad.
13:18
S1: I'm still a dad. That's still my noun. But at
13:20
S1: least for this season, I'm not going to invest. I'm
13:24
S1: not going to push. I think I think based on
13:26
S1: what I've seen, moms have more of a tendency to
13:28
S1: push and dads have an easier time maybe letting go,
13:33
S1: or maybe they look like they're letting go and they're
13:35
S1: more private with their pain.
13:37
S3: Yeah, yeah. What about when adult children have children? What
13:43
S3: are the dynamics that come into play there. What are
13:46
S3: what are some of the common challenges for parents when
13:49
S3: that happens?
13:50
S1: It's so hard, right? If the if the children are
13:54
S1: not raising the grandchildren the way that you want them raised,
13:56
S1: it's so hard. And so like, you just need to
13:59
S1: be quiet. Like if you're the grandparent, you know, you're
14:02
S1: not the parent. Like, write that down. Like, you know,
14:06
S1: when you get out of here, you know, you're stopping
14:08
S1: by the house, you've been invited for dinner or it's
14:09
S1: a holiday, you need to, you need to repeat ten
14:12
S1: times in the car. I am not the parent. I
14:14
S1: am not the parent. I get to be the grandparent. And,
14:17
S1: you know, it's it's some of that is none of
14:19
S1: your business. And this is where, oh, this is hard.
14:22
S1: But you know what? Different is different. Different isn't always bad. So,
14:27
S1: you know, your kids might let your kids eat pizza.
14:30
S1: You never did. You might let your, your, your kids
14:32
S1: might let the grandkids, you know, stay up late and
14:34
S1: have a, have a movie night. And you think that's terrible?
14:37
S1: Why is it terrible? Just because you didn't do it
14:40
S1: doesn't make it wrong or bad, especially if it's not
14:42
S1: a school night and the movie is healthy. ET cetera.
14:44
S1: ET cetera. So I think I think grandparents need to
14:48
S1: be quiet. Grandparents need to point out what's going well to,
14:53
S1: to affirm your children and your, the, you know, the, the,
14:57
S1: the spouses of your children affirm them and say, hey, man,
15:00
S1: Betsy looks so joyful. I love you must be like,
15:03
S1: you must be her security. Look at how she trusts you. Man,
15:06
S1: that inspires me. Or, you know, let your son and
15:09
S1: daughter in law know that you've noticed that your kids are,
15:13
S1: you know, content and secure or, I don't know, they
15:17
S1: they go to bed easily without whining, like compliment your
15:19
S1: kids for that. I think we need to look at
15:22
S1: what's good. I think we observe and we ask questions.
15:25
S1: You know why? Help me understand why you've gone organic only.
15:28
S1: I know there's this whole section in the grocery store now,
15:30
S1: and I've never taken the time to figure it out.
15:32
S1: Why are you a believer in organic only? Like, ask
15:35
S1: the question before we assume that they're doing something that's wrong.
15:38
S1: I could go on and on with that. Um, it's it's,
15:42
S1: you just have to keep. You have to keep your
15:44
S1: mouth shut at times because some of it isn't your business.
15:46
S1: And I really mean that.
15:48
S3: Yeah, I think another thing I run into, not necessarily
15:52
S3: with with the grandchildren, but a couple who marries and
15:56
S3: they live in the same town with their parents, and
15:59
S3: the parents just drop in without letting them know when
16:02
S3: they're coming. And I remember this one young man who
16:05
S3: said one night, for example, he, my wife and I
16:08
S3: decided we were going to have a really nice romantic
16:11
S3: night together.
16:12
S4: Uh oh.
16:13
S3: Just about before we just barely getting off the ground
16:16
S3: and the and the doorbell rings and that's my mom
16:19
S3: and dad, you know? Yeah. So, you know, treating them
16:24
S3: like we would treat other people to call and see
16:26
S3: if this would be a good time to come over.
16:29
S3: It would be a certainly a wise thing to do. Right.
16:32
S1: Oh, that's exactly right. Because we don't do that to friends.
16:36
S1: I can't I think it's extremely rare that we would
16:39
S1: drop by on friends without letting them know and asking
16:42
S1: if this is a convenient time. So no, this is
16:44
S1: what adults should do. They feel disrespected. They feel like
16:47
S1: we don't understand that they have a life. You know,
16:50
S1: some some adult kids have said to me, you know,
16:52
S1: Doctor Kathy, I don't want them to be in my business.
16:55
S1: I want them to be aware of my business, but
16:58
S1: not in my business. But when they stop by without
17:01
S1: asking if it's a good time, it's just it's just pushy.
17:05
S1: And it's just, it just doesn't make us feel safe
17:07
S1: with them. So it's hard. But again, we've got to
17:10
S1: consider that they have a life. And I'm going to
17:13
S1: say something pretty bold here, Doctor Chapman and that is that.
17:16
S1: I don't know about you, but I see those social
17:18
S1: media posts about little kids and the mom is like,
17:21
S1: stop growing up. And I'm just screaming at my at
17:24
S1: my device. Did not did you not know this would happen? Like,
17:27
S1: did you not realize that they were going to grow
17:30
S1: up and you can't stop it? And haven't you moms
17:34
S1: and dads prayed that they would have an abundant life?
17:37
S1: Haven't you prayed that they would launch well, that they
17:40
S1: would find meaningful careers, that they would live on purpose,
17:44
S1: that they would engage with the things that they that
17:46
S1: matter to them. Like, haven't you prayed for this? So
17:49
S1: why are you in the way? Because you've chosen not
17:52
S1: to have your own life. Oh, that sounds painful. Oh dear.
17:55
S1: I don't want anyone to stop listening. But, you know, seriously,
17:58
S1: sometimes the parent needs to decide to make some changes.
18:04
S1: I hope that comes across okay.
18:05
S3: Yeah. I hope parents are listening.
18:09
S5: Thank you.
18:11
S3: Uh, you mentioned you mentioned this earlier, but could you
18:15
S3: talk more about social media and the instant information that
18:19
S3: we have today and how that affects, uh, resolving conflict
18:23
S3: with our adult children?
18:25
S1: Yeah, that's an interesting question. I love that social media
18:29
S1: is a reason that adult children are distancing themselves from
18:33
S1: their family. They've been following people we don't know they're following.
18:36
S1: They've been misled by. I think The liar is loud
18:39
S1: and much of social media, and it's really dangerous. And
18:42
S1: you're right about instant information. They don't think they need
18:44
S1: us anymore. You know, when I was a kid, I
18:47
S1: had to leave my bedroom and go find my dad.
18:49
S1: And when I became an adult kid and I moved away,
18:51
S1: I still reached out to my dad for a variety
18:54
S1: of things and my mom for other things. Now our
18:57
S1: young adults are asking, you know, AI for information because
19:00
S1: they it's efficient, it's quick, it's easy, it's private. Nobody
19:04
S1: has to know that. I've just googled an answer to
19:06
S1: this particular question, if you will. So it's really dangerous.
19:10
S1: And it teaches kids that they, they, it teaches kids
19:13
S1: to believe that they don't need anybody. They don't need siblings.
19:16
S1: They don't need grandparents. They don't need parents. Um, and that's,
19:19
S1: that's really dangerous. So many opinions out there, right? But
19:22
S1: we haven't taught our adult children to discern which opinion
19:25
S1: to follow. Like, if I have a biblical worldview, I
19:28
S1: should be paying attention to people who also have a
19:30
S1: biblical worldview. But when I go to AI and I
19:34
S1: ask questions, unless I research who's giving me the answer,
19:37
S1: I don't have a clue if that answer came from
19:39
S1: anybody who has values similar to mine. And I'd love
19:42
S1: to tell children that AI is. It's a liberally programmed
19:45
S1: computer who doesn't know you, love you, or know or
19:46
S1: love your God. So you have to be really careful.
19:49
S3: Yeah, yeah.
19:50
S2: What about the flip side of that? Doctor Kathy and
19:53
S2: the grandparents who see all of their friends having these
19:57
S2: wonderful relationships with their grandkids, taking a fishing, going to,
20:01
S2: you know, watching a movie with popcorn and the grandparents
20:05
S2: look at that. And, and they long for that. That
20:09
S2: accentuates the, the loss in their own life, doesn't it?
20:14
S1: It does. They can become jealous and resentful and more
20:17
S1: bitter when they see that. And this is here's what
20:19
S1: I would say. Find someone in your church and take
20:22
S1: them to a movie. I know it's not the same.
20:24
S1: I understand that you grieve and there's a whole chapter
20:28
S1: on grief. You grieve the loss of your adult children
20:31
S1: and their children, and you dreamt of movies and ice
20:35
S1: cream sundaes and all of that. But how many people
20:37
S1: in our churches are lacking family? There are children in
20:40
S1: your churches who don't have people in the grandparent age group,
20:43
S1: either because they're deceased. They're on the other side of
20:45
S1: the country, or they can't be trusted because they don't
20:47
S1: have a biblical worldview. And the adult children have chosen
20:50
S1: to not let their grandchildren be majorly influenced by that.
20:54
S1: But could you go to them? Could you ask a
20:56
S1: children's pastor or youth pastor, hey, who do you know
20:59
S1: in like the 13 year old age range who could
21:01
S1: benefit from a mentor of my age? And then you
21:04
S1: ask permission to, to get a phone number of an
21:06
S1: adult and you say, hey, could could we invite you
21:08
S1: guys over for Mother's Day? Because we understand you don't
21:10
S1: have a mother in town. We'd love to invite you
21:12
S1: over on Mother's Day or, you know, does your is
21:14
S1: your kid a piano player? I love playing the piano
21:18
S1: and I loved all my piano recitals. Could I go
21:19
S1: to your kid's piano recital and be like the surrogate grandmother?
21:23
S1: I mean, like, come on. And I think this is
21:25
S1: where some of our heartache then diminishes because we're investing
21:29
S1: and we're loving because the thing is, you guys, the
21:32
S1: love hasn't stopped. You are created to love. And your
21:35
S1: dream was to love your family and you can still
21:37
S1: love your family even though you're not with your family.
21:40
S1: But now you can pour out your love to your
21:43
S1: neighbor and to a community group, and to an agency
21:46
S1: in town that needs the type of service that you
21:48
S1: could provide and families in your church.
21:52
S2: Doctor Cathy, one of the things you point out in
21:54
S2: the book is the family dynamic of a marriage. The
21:58
S2: son or daughter gets married and that spouse is seen
22:03
S2: then by the the parents as bringing, you know, it's
22:09
S2: her fault or it's his.
22:10
S4: Fault.
22:10
S2: Or she must, you know, talk about that dynamic.
22:13
S4: It is hard.
22:14
S1: Sometimes. It is the person your child married who chooses
22:17
S1: to separate for any number of reasons. Often that's not
22:20
S1: the case, but sometimes it is. But you know, we're
22:23
S1: going to struggle when our kids marry. We want them married. Perhaps. Again,
22:26
S1: you've prayed for the spouse, you celebrated the marriage and
22:28
S1: all of that, but you didn't realize how much you'd
22:30
S1: miss your kids like they used to live with you.
22:33
S1: You used to serve their favorite meal every Sunday noon,
22:36
S1: you know. And you did movie night and board game night,
22:38
S1: and you ran errands with them, and you celebrated all
22:41
S1: of their college achievements or whatever. And now they're married
22:44
S1: and maybe they live in town, maybe they don't, but
22:46
S1: it's hard because you miss them. So you got to grieve.
22:49
S1: You've just got to grieve. It's so important. You've got
22:51
S1: to assume that the one they married isn't necessarily a
22:54
S1: horrible person. Um, look for what you have in common.
22:57
S1: Talk about traditions like, you know, we're a Christmas Eve.
23:01
S1: Open the present family. Are you a Christmas morning family,
23:05
S1: or are you also a Christmas Eve family? How are
23:06
S1: we going to do that? You know, how important is
23:08
S1: Easter dinner? You know, what about, you know, summer vacations?
23:11
S1: Could we do that together? And you talk about that
23:14
S1: and you look for the good. Always, always, gentlemen, you
23:17
S1: look for the good. What do we have in common
23:20
S1: and what is good about this relationship? And what is
23:22
S1: it that we can talk about, where we'll have quick
23:25
S1: agreement so that we don't necessarily have a silent supper
23:29
S1: or a dinner that's full of discord.
23:32
S2: So you're going for an open, honest, communicating relationship together
23:39
S2: that you build on rather than one that you know
23:42
S2: just happens, right?
23:44
S1: Wouldn't that be the dream? But you know, that's only
23:46
S1: possible if we decide we don't have to be right
23:49
S1: all the time. Like, come on, we don't have to
23:51
S1: be right all the time. And we can choose to
23:54
S1: agree to disagree. And we can choose to talk about
23:57
S1: only some things and we can share our marriage victories.
24:00
S1: And we can ask about in the last month, where
24:03
S1: have you just known and just been? How have you
24:05
S1: been renewed in your love for each other? Like ask
24:07
S1: different questions. And I think it could be profoundly beautiful.
24:13
S2: You're listening to the Building Relationships with Doctor Gary Chapman podcast.
24:17
S2: You can find more simple ways to strengthen your relationships
24:21
S2: at building relationships.us. Our featured resource today is Doctor Kathy
24:25
S2: Cook's book, Resolve Conflict and Find Peace and Hope with
24:29
S2: Adult Children. You can find out more right there at
24:32
S2: Building relationships.us or go to five love languages.com.
24:40
S3: Doctor cook, The title of your book involves the words
24:42
S3: resolve conflict between parents and their adult children. But when
24:48
S3: you say resolve, does that mean that all the conflict
24:52
S3: is going to go away? If you can just do one, two, three, four, five.
24:56
S1: Like, did I write a miracle book? Is that what
24:58
S1: you're asking? Wouldn't that wouldn't that be great? No, that's
25:03
S1: really not what I mean. And I love your question.
25:06
S1: I think, though, that if we if we communicate the
25:09
S1: way that I recommend, if we understand, again, the perspective
25:12
S1: of the other people in our dynamic, if we, you know,
25:15
S1: choose to love well, et cetera. ET cetera. We can
25:18
S1: agree to disagree. We can learn to relate. So there
25:22
S1: are fewer conflicts going forward. We can put conflict behind
25:26
S1: us and just recognize, hey, we're never going to see
25:28
S1: eye to eye on this issue. So let's just rest
25:31
S1: that issue, at least for now. And we develop a perspective,
25:35
S1: we develop a respect and a love. And I think
25:37
S1: it makes new conflict less likely.
25:40
S3: Yeah. How do you know as a parent, if you're
25:43
S3: making progress in the relationship with your adult children? Or
25:47
S3: are there some signs?
25:49
S1: Mhm. I think so. Um, they would reach out to
25:52
S1: us rather than us always having to reach out to
25:54
S1: them and they would reach out to us for, um,
25:58
S1: every day. Nonsense. A friend of mine has had a
26:01
S1: difficult relationship with an adult child who's married and just
26:03
S1: told me this past week that all of a sudden
26:06
S1: her daughter is starting to call just because she's in
26:08
S1: the car and has a moment to talk, that there's
26:10
S1: nothing significant to necessarily communicate. It's just the kind of
26:14
S1: stuff that you communicate, you know, because you care about
26:17
S1: the other person's perspective or whatever. So I think when
26:20
S1: they reach out to us, it's a good sign when
26:22
S1: we reach out to them and they don't reject us.
26:24
S1: Of course, that's a good sign. Less anxiety, less stress.
26:28
S1: I know of some parents who are stressed the entire
26:31
S1: morning before they're going to meet a child for lunch,
26:35
S1: because they're just so afraid that it might not go well.
26:38
S1: So feel the less stress, feel less anxiety, and praise
26:42
S1: the Lord for that and recognize that progress is made.
26:44
S1: One of the problems I think we have in general, relationally,
26:47
S1: is that we don't look for small growth. We expect
26:52
S1: the major miracle. And so we're always frustrated. No. If
26:55
S1: you look for small growth, more eye contact, longer answers
27:00
S1: to your questions rather than grunts, you know, if you
27:03
S1: look for small growth and celebrate that you might get
27:06
S1: more growth and you'll feel better and the kid will
27:09
S1: feel better because you're feeling better about them. It's a
27:11
S1: win win.
27:11
S5: Yeah.
27:12
S3: Yeah. You know, Cathy, one of the things I faced
27:16
S3: in my office for the last few years, more than ever,
27:19
S3: is when adult children are walking away from their faith
27:23
S3: in Christ.
27:24
S1: Mhm. Mhm.
27:25
S3: So what encouragement do you give for parents whose adult
27:28
S3: children are in fact sharing with them that no, I
27:33
S3: no longer believe in God or I no longer believe
27:35
S3: in whatever you know.
27:36
S1: Right, right, right. Whole chapter on that. Because again, this
27:40
S1: is this is the key, right? This is what we
27:42
S1: should be grieving about more than anything else. I do
27:45
S1: talk about, again, looking for small growth and expecting it.
27:48
S1: I think we need to pray specifics. And I think
27:52
S1: one of the things that we pray for them is
27:54
S1: that God will surround them with Christians. Because you know what, Gary?
27:57
S1: We might not be the ones that win them back.
28:00
S1: And it's not about us. It can't be about us.
28:02
S1: If you think that you have to be the one
28:04
S1: to say the right thing to get your son back
28:06
S1: into church, then again, you're idolizing yourself and you put
28:09
S1: your hope in yourself rather than in God. And I
28:11
S1: don't say that lightly. It happens all the time, and
28:13
S1: I get that. But it's not about us. So I
28:16
S1: think we pray that they'll be surrounded by Christians who
28:19
S1: will be able to live a Christian life in front
28:22
S1: of them, and even surprise your adult child. Go, wait,
28:24
S1: you're a Christian, you know? And then they realize, okay,
28:27
S1: some Christians are really nice or whatever. And then, um,
28:30
S1: here's here's another thing, Doctor Chapman. I think we need
28:33
S1: to be more concerned about winning them to Jesus than
28:36
S1: winning them to the church.
28:37
S5: Mhm.
28:38
S1: The the majority of questions that I hear is, how
28:40
S1: do I get my kid back into church? And I
28:42
S1: know church matters. My church is very important to me,
28:45
S1: my pastor, my people, my fellowship. Very, very important. Um,
28:48
S1: and yet I want, I want these adult children to
28:52
S1: care again about Jesus, to care again about the God
28:55
S1: who created them and who loves them, you know, more
28:58
S1: deeply than we ever could. So and it's possible. Doctor Chapman,
29:02
S1: that there are adult children who have walked away from
29:04
S1: something they never actually had.
29:06
S5: Yeah.
29:07
S1: And that I don't say that lightly, but where, again,
29:09
S1: they pretended to have a relationship, they they were religious.
29:13
S1: I was religious until the age of 19. I looked
29:15
S1: like such a good little good girl. I was a
29:18
S1: religious person and then praised God for Jesus. So I
29:21
S1: think we pray them into Jesus, and we pray that
29:24
S1: they would desire more of Jesus that they would turn
29:28
S1: to the God of the Bible and his hope and
29:30
S1: his strength and his wisdom and his love. On the
29:33
S1: days when they're struggling, rather than turning to social media
29:36
S1: and turning to something they're addicted to. I think those
29:39
S1: those things really matter. And we also need to live
29:41
S1: a vibrant life before them if we are in relationship
29:45
S1: with them and still available to the conversation and the
29:47
S1: occasional get together. Then we talk about the Jesus we love,
29:51
S1: and we demonstrate unconditional love, and we talk about the
29:55
S1: hope that we get from the God of the Bible
29:57
S1: without apology because our testimony is not wrong.
30:00
S2: Gary, let me turn that question to you because, you know,
30:04
S2: there are a lot of parents who say, uh, train
30:06
S2: up a child in the way they should go. Well,
30:08
S2: I did that. You know, I did my part. God,
30:10
S2: why didn't you show up here? What do you say
30:13
S2: to the parent who is really struggling with, you know,
30:17
S2: that that faith choice that their child has made?
30:20
S3: Yeah. Well, you know, Chris, one of the things I've
30:23
S3: said is when you look at the prodigal son in
30:27
S3: the New Testament who left, you know, took his money
30:30
S3: and left and lived a life of riotous away from
30:32
S3: God and family. The father did not go out and
30:36
S3: try to bring him back.
30:38
S5: Right.
30:38
S3: The father kept the farm going so that when God
30:42
S3: brought his son to the hog pen and he realized
30:46
S3: I'd be better off working on the farm than out
30:48
S3: here feeding somebody else's hogs, he went home, you know.
30:53
S3: And so I think we have to recognize we pray
30:56
S3: for them, and we ask God. We're not asking him
30:59
S3: to bring them to the hog pen. But but often
31:03
S3: that's what it takes. You know, but we're we're praying
31:06
S3: for God to work in their hearts. And we certainly
31:08
S3: want to be available and reaching out to them if
31:10
S3: we have if we have information on how to contact them.
31:14
S3: But I think we have to recognize that God is
31:17
S3: the one who brings people either back to himself or
31:21
S3: to himself. Because as you said, Kathy, sometimes they really
31:26
S3: don't know Christ and they've just walked away from religion. Uh,
31:29
S3: so but whatever. God is the one that touches hearts
31:32
S3: and draws them to himself. And so I, that's one
31:35
S3: of the things I've encouraged couples to, I mean, you know,
31:37
S3: parents to do. Yeah.
31:38
S2: Yeah. And it follows along with what you just said, Kathy.
31:41
S2: It's not, you know, the prodigal son came to himself.
31:45
S2: I love that the scripture, he kind of woke up,
31:48
S2: but it was himself. It's the not the parent pressing
31:52
S2: the nerve or yelling or sending him texts to the
31:57
S2: to the hog pen. The parent has to have that
32:00
S2: confidence that God, in his wisdom and sovereignty and timing,
32:05
S2: is going to do something in that child's life. Right?
32:09
S5: Mhm.
32:10
S1: Yes. And and, you know, he doesn't always work the
32:13
S1: way that we would like him to. Hello. He's God,
32:16
S1: he gets to make these decisions. But that doesn't mean
32:18
S1: that we don't have hope that he will. We don't
32:21
S1: question the fact that he loves them. We don't question
32:23
S1: the fact that he would love to protect them. But again,
32:25
S1: we have free will and sin is a real thing.
32:28
S1: And we have to recognize that.
32:31
S3: Yeah. A man said to me not long ago, he said,
32:34
S3: Doug Chapman For four years I've had no contact with
32:37
S3: my adult daughter. She refuses to answer phones. You know,
32:41
S3: she cut me off from all contact. And he said,
32:45
S3: I've been praying, you know, that God would just work
32:47
S3: in her heart. And he said, last week I got
32:50
S3: a phone call and she said, dad, I'd like to
32:54
S3: I'd like to come home and visit with you. Would
32:56
S3: that be okay? He said, certainly, honey, I would love
32:59
S3: for you to come home. And he said the conversation
33:02
S3: we had there, man, he said, that's what I've longed
33:05
S3: for all these years. But you know, it was God
33:07
S3: that worked in her heart. It wasn't the father, you know,
33:10
S3: pounding her over the head with, you know, that kind
33:13
S3: of pressure.
33:13
S1: Amen. Amen. Mhm. Beautiful.
33:17
S3: Doctor cook, you mentioned earlier the value of communication and
33:21
S3: communication patterns. Uh, but, but talk with us a little
33:25
S3: more about that because I think a lot of parents,
33:28
S3: they know how to talk, but they don't know how
33:31
S3: to listen and other factors. So talk, talk a little
33:36
S3: more about the whole thing about healthy communication.
33:39
S1: Yes, I would love to. And of course, you're you're
33:41
S1: an expert here. Um, we've got to listen to understand.
33:45
S1: We don't listen for our turn to talk. We don't
33:48
S1: listen to judge, we listen to understand. And that means
33:54
S1: that we listen longer. We let them tell their whole story.
33:57
S1: We question in a way that is not feeling intrusive
34:02
S1: or dismissive, but genuine, you know, help me understand. Um. Hey.
34:07
S1: Keep talking. Tell me more about that. Well, what do
34:10
S1: you want to know? Well, I want to understand you,
34:13
S1: so I just. I need more information. So listen to understand.
34:16
S1: It will it will go far for you. They will
34:18
S1: feel respect in that. Um, and I love the idea
34:22
S1: and I know you do too, of I language versus
34:24
S1: you language. So I feel disappointed when you never follow through.
34:29
S1: Don't use never because never and always are never true.
34:32
S1: I just said never. Um, but you know, so, um,
34:36
S1: I feel disappointed when you don't follow through or I
34:40
S1: feel dismissed when you just appear to not have time
34:45
S1: for me versus you never have time for me when you,
34:50
S1: when you use a you statement, you know, you disappoint me. Whoa.
34:53
S1: That that's judgment. And that is going to cause them
34:56
S1: to kind of back away and rise up and disagree
35:00
S1: with you. But you have a right to your feelings, right?
35:03
S1: You have a right to being disappointed. Like, I am
35:07
S1: so sorry that our relationship isn't what it could be versus,
35:12
S1: you know, because of your choices. Our relationship is terrible.
35:16
S1: So I language practice that in front of the mirror
35:18
S1: because it's not always the, the natural way to communicate,
35:21
S1: but it can be a real blessing to people. And then, um,
35:25
S1: I'll say one other thing. Doctor Chapman And that is
35:28
S1: this idea that we have a story that we tell ourselves.
35:31
S1: So let's say, for instance, that you've invited your child
35:34
S1: over to dinner. She lives, she lives in town and
35:36
S1: you've invited her over three different nights of the week
35:38
S1: for three weeks in a row. And she always says no.
35:41
S1: And then you ask again and she says, no. And
35:43
S1: now you could say to her, the story that I'm
35:46
S1: telling myself is that I'm not important to you. See,
35:50
S1: we tell ourselves a story, right? And that might not
35:52
S1: be true. The story that I'm telling myself is that
35:56
S1: I'm not important to you, or the story that I'm
35:59
S1: telling myself is that everybody else is more important than
36:01
S1: I am. And then your daughter goes, oh, no, that's
36:04
S1: not true. I'm just legitimately busy. Oh, well, what are
36:07
S1: you doing on all of those nights? I mean, you
36:09
S1: could ask that question and maybe you don't know that
36:12
S1: your daughter has signed up for a committee at work,
36:14
S1: and they're having to work outside of normal hours or
36:16
S1: whatever the case may be. But the story that I'm
36:18
S1: telling myself, It's really interesting. And you guys think about that.
36:22
S1: So let's say that, you know, I don't know, again,
36:25
S1: the example of or maybe you've offered to help out
36:27
S1: with the grandkids and they never accept your help. No,
36:30
S1: I don't need, you know, I've got a different babysitter. No,
36:33
S1: it's really okay. And then the story that I'm telling
36:35
S1: myself is that you don't trust me with your children,
36:39
S1: or the story that I'm telling myself is that I've
36:42
S1: done something to cause you to doubt my ability to
36:45
S1: take care of the kids. Is that true? Well, no. Okay.
36:52
S1: So then can I help out tomorrow night? Well, no,
36:54
S1: we don't need you. Well, see, that's why I'm telling
36:56
S1: myself the story that you don't trust me. And I
36:59
S1: must have done something. That language can be very powerful.
37:04
S1: It doesn't sound as judgmental, and it's a fascinating way
37:08
S1: to look at it. I'd love to know, Doctor Chapman,
37:11
S1: what you think of that. Would you agree that that
37:13
S1: can be profitable? I'm kind of putting you on the spot.
37:16
S3: Well it's very interesting. Yeah. I don't know that I've
37:18
S3: thought of it that way before, to be honest with you.
37:21
S3: Interesting story I'm telling myself is because that's rather than
37:25
S3: just saying, you make me feel this way or you.
37:27
S5: Do.
37:28
S3: This. Yeah. No, I like that idea.
37:31
S1: Cool.
37:32
S3: Well, let's talk a minute about the whole political world,
37:36
S3: because today we have lots of disagreement when it comes
37:40
S3: to this area of life. So what if your adult
37:43
S3: children are going to vote a different way from the
37:47
S3: way you vote, and they share that with you? Uh,
37:51
S3: how are you going to respond? How do you handle that?
37:53
S1: Well, I think you should be honored that they trust
37:55
S1: you with that information.
37:57
S5: Mhm.
37:58
S1: So I think maybe the first words out of your
38:00
S1: mouth are, man, thanks for letting me know that. And
38:02
S1: we can be. Let's be sad before we're mad. Like,
38:05
S1: if you really believe that they're a believer and they're
38:07
S1: not voting biblical values, let's be sad before we're mad.
38:11
S1: And you don't have to say that to them, but
38:14
S1: you could if you feel like you have the relationship
38:16
S1: where they would hear that. I think often we don't
38:19
S1: need to talk about it like it's frustrating, right? Because
38:22
S1: they cancel our vote. This is what's so real.
38:24
S5: You know, I'm.
38:25
S1: Going to vote for this candidate. They're going to vote
38:27
S1: for that candidate. Why are we bothering to vote? Like
38:29
S1: that's what's so frustrating. But here's what I want to
38:31
S1: really point out to people. We can agree to disagree.
38:34
S1: And but if you're listening today and you have younger children,
38:37
S1: teach them why you vote the way you vote. Like
38:40
S1: I have met so many parents who have admitted to
38:43
S1: me they've never taught their children why they give to
38:47
S1: the organizations they give to, why they're pro-life, why they're this,
38:51
S1: and why they're that, and why they vote this platform
38:53
S1: and not that platform. Why do we expect that our
38:56
S1: adult children, having grown up with us, will vote the
38:59
S1: way that we vote? If we don't talk with them
39:02
S1: about why we have the values that we have now,
39:04
S1: some families have done a beautiful job of that. Praise
39:06
S1: the Lord. But other parents have looked at me and go, oh,
39:09
S1: you're right. Like we've gone through the motions, like we
39:12
S1: go to the poll. Maybe we even took them when
39:14
S1: they were little because we wanted them to know that
39:16
S1: voting matters. It's like a really beautiful thing that we
39:18
S1: have in America. But have I ever sat down with
39:21
S1: my preteens and my teens and looked at the platforms
39:24
S1: of this candidate and that candidate and talked about why
39:26
S1: we would vote for one versus the other. And if
39:29
S1: I went to a meeting with this candidate, what question
39:31
S1: might I want to ask to find out what she believes? Like,
39:35
S1: I don't think we've done a good job of teaching
39:37
S1: our kids, and this is why they feel like we
39:40
S1: shouldn't just be mad at them. And gentlemen, I don't
39:43
S1: say that lightly, but I want. I want people to
39:46
S1: understand that the difference is different. It doesn't mean that
39:50
S1: they're terrible people, that they're voting for a different candidate.
39:53
S1: They might be confused and deceived, and they're believing somebody
39:56
S1: else's perspective. That doesn't necessarily make them terrible people. But
40:01
S1: that's something we have to choose to believe.
40:03
S3: Yeah, I think there are families that have just stopped
40:05
S3: talking about politics because they know it gets hot. Yeah
40:10
S3: they do. But you're I think you're right. We need
40:13
S3: to be doing that when they're teenagers, helping them understand
40:16
S3: what various ideas that are being discussed and so forth.
40:20
S3: So yeah, very. Thank you. Good.
40:22
S5: Yeah. Cool.
40:24
S3: Okay. Now we know that there are adult children who
40:27
S3: eventually just cut themselves off from all contact with their parents.
40:31
S3: I mentioned an example of that earlier. Is that a
40:34
S3: bad thing? And why do sometimes adult children do that?
40:39
S5: Wow.
40:39
S1: Is it a bad thing? Um, unless there's real abuse. Yes.
40:43
S1: I mean, I think again, God ordains the family before
40:46
S1: he ordains the church. We're perfectly imperfect for each other.
40:50
S1: We're perfectly imperfect parents for perfectly imperfect children, and the
40:56
S1: family matters generationally. And so I do think that in
41:00
S1: in a perfect world, and we don't live in a
41:01
S1: perfect world, we would not need to distance ourselves from
41:05
S1: any blood relative. So is it a bad thing? Yes,
41:08
S1: unless there's been real abuse. And gentlemen, we all know
41:12
S1: there's real abuse in some dysfunctional families, and for the
41:15
S1: emotional safety and even the spiritual safety of some adult
41:19
S1: children they've they've chosen to distance. Now, some of them
41:23
S1: are being given really horrible advice by counselors. Um, you know,
41:27
S1: you and I both work with the American Association of
41:29
S1: Christian Counselors. You know, the three of us care deeply
41:32
S1: about biblical truth. And we would we would counsel that way.
41:35
S1: But if our adult children are seeing a therapist, a counselor,
41:39
S1: a mental health coach, a life coach, and that person
41:42
S1: does not share a believer, um, belief system, if you will,
41:46
S1: they're going to counsel them badly. And there are some
41:49
S1: counselors that said, oh, you don't need parents anymore, you know,
41:51
S1: 24 years old. Why do you care what your dad thinks?
41:53
S1: And it's motivating to many adult children to walk away,
41:56
S1: which is tragic. I, as I told you already on
41:59
S1: the show, sometimes they've had bad relationships with their parents
42:03
S1: in the past. You know, they were 16, 17 years old.
42:05
S1: They were rebellious. They felt like their parents were too
42:07
S1: strict or they resented they were raised in a Christian school.
42:11
S1: They made me go to a Christian school. They expose
42:13
S1: me to all of this nonsense. This is a story
42:16
S1: that they're reinventing. They're telling themselves a new story. They
42:20
S1: didn't resent it when they were kids. They loved their
42:22
S1: Christian school education. They loved that it was a generous,
42:25
S1: safe and good place to be. But now they're hanging
42:29
S1: out with people like, oh, you were so protected. You
42:31
S1: were so privatized. Like, what? Did your parents not trust
42:34
S1: you in the public schools? What were they thinking? And
42:37
S1: so they reinvent the story, which is really hard and truly,
42:41
S1: like I said before, there are some adult children who
42:43
S1: do not want to keep disappointing their parents. It's too
42:46
S1: much stress, too much pressure. So they'd rather cut themselves
42:49
S1: off than be in communication with somebody who's continually disappointed.
42:54
S1: And I don't say that lightly, but I do know
42:56
S1: that that's true. And I'll mention one other thing, and
42:59
S1: this is interesting. You know, a lot of our parents
43:02
S1: have helicoptered their kids, right? They were over parented. So
43:07
S1: and being a helicopter parent or a bulldozer parent, that
43:09
S1: usually means that, you know, you're the one that says, hey,
43:11
S1: don't spill the juice. And you're the one who said, hey,
43:14
S1: soccer tryouts are Saturday. Do you want to go in
43:16
S1: the backyard and kick the ball around like you're helping
43:18
S1: your kids? You meant it as good help. Now, many
43:21
S1: parents who over parent did it because they wanted to
43:24
S1: look good. You got to decide if I'm speaking truth
43:27
S1: to you or not. But now what's happened is those
43:31
S1: children who were helicoptered, who were over parented don't want
43:35
S1: to be over parented anymore. They want to grow up.
43:38
S1: They have to learn how to make decisions, and they
43:41
S1: have to deal with the consequences of the decisions they make,
43:44
S1: and they know that. But if we keep being in
43:47
S1: their business over protecting, then they believe they won't have
43:50
S1: that chance to mature, which is what they actually want.
43:53
S1: And what they've said to me is, Kathy, I don't
43:55
S1: think my mom can be any other kind of a
43:57
S1: mom except an overinvolved mom. So I have to separate.
44:02
S1: So if you're listening to us today and you're like, oh,
44:05
S1: I was a helicopter mom, first of all, we're not
44:07
S1: judging you. You were the best that you knew how
44:08
S1: to be in the moment. No shame or blame here
44:10
S1: at all. Just realize that if you were overparenting and
44:15
S1: your motives were good, and you have an adult child
44:18
S1: who's distancing themselves from you, it could be that they
44:21
S1: don't know if you can back away. And what you
44:23
S1: could do is have a conversation. Man, I heard this
44:25
S1: radio interview and they were talking about the fact that
44:28
S1: parents who over parented have maybe caused the adult children
44:32
S1: to think that they're going to keep being in their business.
44:35
S1: And son, if I've done that to you, I am
44:36
S1: so sorry. I get it now. Why you have said,
44:39
S1: you know, could you please stop calling every night? I
44:42
S1: am so sorry. Like my love has compelled me to
44:45
S1: be so involved. But I get it now. And if
44:47
S1: you'll give me some grace and space, I'm going to
44:49
S1: really try to learn how to how to back off.
44:52
S1: Like that would be an amazing conversation. And I think
44:54
S1: in some cases it would work.
44:55
S3: Yeah, absolutely. Well, Doctor Cook, the last chapter of your
44:59
S3: book is speaking to the whole issue of Hope, because
45:04
S3: we know many of those parents are just struggling. They
45:06
S3: feel frustrated. They feel angry about their the relationship with
45:10
S3: their adult children. So let's close our program with just
45:12
S3: a few words about hope that you that you share
45:15
S3: in that last chapter.
45:17
S1: Yeah. Thank you so much. We have to put our
45:19
S1: hope in God, not in ourselves and not in our children.
45:23
S1: We can't place our hope in our adult kids and
45:26
S1: hope they turn around. We can't put our hope in
45:28
S1: ourselves because we're we're imperfect and we only know what
45:32
S1: we know. But to hope in God, look back. Has
45:35
S1: he been faithful to you? Has he loved you in
45:38
S1: your adult children well through life? Has he been there
45:42
S1: in a time of need? Has his strength, you know,
45:45
S1: been available to you? Has his wisdom changed you, etc.?
45:48
S1: So know the God of the Bible and know that
45:51
S1: he is worthy of all hope. And so you pray
45:54
S1: to him and with your children's names, and you ask
45:58
S1: him to show up and be their everything. Yeah, it
46:01
S1: can't be us.
46:03
S3: Well, that's a great place to bring a conclusion to
46:05
S3: our discussion today, because our hope really is in God.
46:09
S3: So thank you for being with us today and God
46:11
S3: bless you for the time and energy you've invested in
46:13
S3: this book. I think it's going to help a lot
46:16
S3: of people. So thank you again for what you're doing.
46:19
S1: Thank you so much.
46:20
S2: The title, again of Doctor Kathy Cook's book is Resolve,
46:23
S2: Conflict and Find Peace and Hope with Adult Children. We
46:27
S2: have it linked at the website building relationships.us. Again, go
46:31
S2: to building relationships.us.
46:34
S3: And next week, a fictional couple named Rick and Jane
46:38
S3: learn to communicate in marriage.
46:41
S2: See Rick and Jane, learn to listen and talk in
46:44
S2: one week. Our thanks to Janice Backing and Steve Wick
46:47
S2: for their work behind the scenes building relationships with Doctor
46:50
S2: Gary Chapman's, a production of Moody Radio in association with
46:53
S2: Moody Publishers, a Ministry of Moody Bible Institute. Thanks for listening.