Transcript

Sharri | 25 February · Sharri

0:01
Speaker 1: Why on Sky News This is Sharry.
0:07
Speaker 2: Good Evening tonight.
0:08
Speaker 3: Serious questions over a Western Sydney doctor at the center
0:13
Speaker 3: of the Isis Bride's controversy and the handling.
0:16
Speaker 2: Of thirty four passports. That's coming up.
0:19
Speaker 3: The two men arrested over the cruel kidnapping and murder
0:22
Speaker 3: of grandfather Chris Bagsarian they've now been named, will tell
0:27
Speaker 3: you who they are shortly behind the scenes and our
0:30
Speaker 3: Bondai documentary and the moments that I'll never forget, and
0:35
Speaker 3: why the Royal Commission rejecting this crucial witness testimony is
0:40
Speaker 3: the wrong move. Plus, the US President delivers an ominous
0:45
Speaker 3: warning to Iran during his State of the Union address.
0:48
Speaker 2: Well is a strike intimate. We'll speak about this.
0:51
Speaker 3: With Dave Shama, but I just want to start tonight
0:56
Speaker 3: by thanking everyone for supporting our documentary on Bondai last night,
1:01
Speaker 3: and especially to those who courageously sat down with us
1:06
Speaker 3: and told their stories. Almost everyone who was in that
1:10
Speaker 3: documentary last night had never been on camera before, and
1:14
Speaker 3: for the first time they were sitting down to talk
1:17
Speaker 3: to the media, and it was about the single most
1:21
Speaker 3: tragic event that had ever happened to them, and that
1:25
Speaker 3: takes courage now to take you behind the scenes a bit.
1:30
Speaker 3: Each interview we did went for around an hour, some
1:34
Speaker 3: a bit more, some a bit less. And we had
1:37
Speaker 3: in total fifty seven witness testimony on camera, so that's
1:42
Speaker 3: around fifty hours of footage and we had to condense
1:46
Speaker 3: it all to just ninety minutes of television. So there's
1:51
Speaker 3: still more detail and depth, which is why I wanted
1:55
Speaker 3: to write the book and record it all properly. Now
1:59
Speaker 3: you know how distressing it was to watch, well, can
2:02
Speaker 3: I tell you that filming this was at times heart wrenching.
2:07
Speaker 3: And there are many moments that have stayed with me
2:11
Speaker 3: in my heart, and none more than Matilda's little sister Summer.
2:17
Speaker 4: When at school someone asked you whom you want to
2:21
Speaker 4: be when you grow up?
2:22
Speaker 5: What did you answer?
2:24
Speaker 6: Sissy?
2:31
Speaker 3: And You'll always carry her around with you.
2:35
Speaker 7: She's always dead, she's everywhere watching over you.
2:45
Speaker 3: Summer shared a bedroom with her big sister and they
2:48
Speaker 3: did everything together, from dancing to judo.
2:56
Speaker 2: And what does she love doing?
2:58
Speaker 8: She loved singing.
3:01
Speaker 9: Sing dancing, gymnastics, gymnastics, minecraft, roadblocks.
3:10
Speaker 3: Six seven six oh yeah, six seven, even wait okai.
3:19
Speaker 6: Now I eleven six seven.
3:26
Speaker 3: I think Matilda will still be doing six seven in heaven. Yes,
3:32
Speaker 3: it'll stay with me always, and there's not a day
3:36
Speaker 3: when I don't think about Matilda. And Summer just turned seven.
3:40
Speaker 3: She actually has her birthday party this weekend, and it'll
3:44
Speaker 3: be her first without her sissy. The other person that
3:50
Speaker 3: really stays with me is Eva Whits and Now. The
3:54
Speaker 3: last thing she remembers is speaking to her childhood friend
3:58
Speaker 3: Edith Brookman and her husband Tebow about the donuts, and
4:03
Speaker 3: Edith was complaining that they were a bit stale, and
4:06
Speaker 3: Eva was saying to her, well, if you have to
4:08
Speaker 3: make a thousand donuts, then they're not going to be
4:11
Speaker 3: so fresh. And Eva said to Edith, I'll make you a.
4:14
Speaker 2: Fresh batch this week.
4:16
Speaker 3: That's the last thing she remembers. Her next memory is
4:21
Speaker 3: at nine thirty pm that night, when she's at her
4:25
Speaker 3: home dressed in weird clothes, and she starts asking her
4:30
Speaker 3: daughter Hannah where Tebow is, where's daddy, and her daughter
4:35
Speaker 3: has to sit down and tell.
4:36
Speaker 2: Her that he was killed.
4:38
Speaker 3: The footage was too graphic to show on air, but
4:41
Speaker 3: Eva miraculously survived as her husband and best friend were
4:45
Speaker 3: killed right next to her and Hannah spoke about how
4:50
Speaker 3: her dad was murdered in the most brutal fashion.
4:57
Speaker 10: Mum was looking for the keys because we needed to
4:59
Speaker 10: go back home, and she said to me, I don't
5:02
Speaker 10: have the kids. And I said, who has the keys?
5:04
Speaker 10: And she says, Dad has the kids. And I said, Mandy, please,
5:08
Speaker 10: can you try and get the keys from Dad's pocket?
5:12
Speaker 10: And I followed him with my eyes and because I
5:17
Speaker 10: wanted to go and see Dad, and he kept on
5:20
Speaker 10: pushing me. He said, no, you can't go, you can't go.
5:23
Speaker 10: And I didn't understand. But then when he went to
5:26
Speaker 10: get the keys, and I saw him, and I saw
5:29
Speaker 10: his face. The minute he picked up the blanket, I
5:33
Speaker 10: knew exactly what happened. I knew exactly what my dad
5:38
Speaker 10: went through. And he went through it just because being
5:44
Speaker 10: he's a Jew, just because of that, nothing else. He
5:51
Speaker 10: was a healthy man, He loved life. The Thursday before
5:57
Speaker 10: it happened, Mom and Dad went and booked across There
6:01
Speaker 10: was supposed to be on a cruise on the twenty
6:04
Speaker 10: second of March Dad's birthday and there will never never
6:09
Speaker 10: go on this cruise because they are Jewish. Because we
6:15
Speaker 10: are Jewish, we don't deserve this. We really don't deserve this.
6:23
Speaker 2: So tragic.
6:24
Speaker 3: As the rabbis said to Eva, it's a blessing that
6:28
Speaker 3: she has no memory of what happened to her and
6:31
Speaker 3: to her husband of fifty seven years, right before her
6:35
Speaker 3: very eyes. Now I spoke to Eva today. I called
6:38
Speaker 3: her this morning just to see how she felt about
6:41
Speaker 3: watching the documentary, and Eva told me it was a
6:46
Speaker 3: million percent good, not one hundred a million, And that
6:51
Speaker 3: to me means the world knowing that we have done
6:54
Speaker 3: justice to those who lost their lives. It was also
6:59
Speaker 3: so sad to know that Rabbi Elie Schlanger had personally
7:02
Speaker 3: written to Anthony Albanizi accusing him of betraying the Jewish
7:06
Speaker 3: community just three months before he was killed at Bondai.
7:11
Speaker 3: But not only that, but then the tragic story that
7:14
Speaker 3: his wife.
7:15
Speaker 2: Was also shot and she ended up in hospital.
7:18
Speaker 3: And that night she was separated from their newborn baby.
7:23
Speaker 3: Then the next day they discovered that their bub had shrapnel.
7:29
Speaker 3: Rabbi Ellie's wife, Kyler was also shot at Bondai. Even
7:34
Speaker 3: their newborn baby was hit with shrapnel. The tiny bub
7:38
Speaker 3: then spending days in hospital with a fever.
7:44
Speaker 1: The next thing I heard was that Kaila was on
7:45
Speaker 1: her way to hospital because she had got shot.
7:49
Speaker 11: So I was just like, this is not normal, like
7:52
Speaker 11: and she.
7:52
Speaker 2: Had the new bond.
7:54
Speaker 3: Yes, she was a two month old baby, newbon baby. Yeah, yeah,
7:59
Speaker 3: these are just my so I'll never forget. But alongside
8:02
Speaker 3: the tragedy, we also saw incredible stories of heroism the
8:08
Speaker 3: lifeguards and even the opposition leader Kelly Sloane, I.
8:13
Speaker 1: Don't talk about this much. There were people on the
8:16
Speaker 1: ground everywhere. So I went in and I saw a
8:19
Speaker 1: guy from the surf club. He said, grab some bandages
8:23
Speaker 1: and plug the holes. I went to the first person
8:27
Speaker 1: I saw on the ground and it was a lady
8:30
Speaker 1: and she had people already plugging the holes. But what
8:34
Speaker 1: she didn't have was someone holding her hand.
8:37
Speaker 12: And so I.
8:40
Speaker 1: Remember holding her hand and saying, my name's Kelly. I'm
8:45
Speaker 1: here with you, I'm holding your hand, I'm with you.
8:48
Speaker 2: I'm not going to leave you. And she didn't.
8:52
Speaker 1: Make it, you know, and I and then I went
8:59
Speaker 1: to the next person and it was a lady and
9:01
Speaker 1: she was sitting there and I said, who are you with?
9:03
Speaker 1: So she was sitting there by herself, and she said,
9:07
Speaker 1: this is my husband. And her husband was on the
9:10
Speaker 1: ground in front of us, you know, and she was
9:12
Speaker 1: in an incredible shock.
9:14
Speaker 6: So as first responders looking back on the event now,
9:19
Speaker 6: I really love the families of the victims and patients
9:23
Speaker 6: to know that everybody had a hand to hold. And
9:26
Speaker 6: that's what really stood out for me is that the
9:30
Speaker 6: patient care was unbelievable and so.
9:33
Speaker 2: No one was alone in their final moments.
9:35
Speaker 6: No one was alone in their final moments. Everybody was
9:38
Speaker 6: feeling loved and cared for, and that's the image that
9:42
Speaker 6: I take away from the incident most.
9:46
Speaker 3: And what's amazing about Kelly Sloane's story there is that
9:49
Speaker 3: even though she's the new South Wales opposition leader, she's
9:52
Speaker 3: a politician. She hadn't spoken about this in the media
9:57
Speaker 3: up until I actually sat down with her drew it
10:00
Speaker 3: out of her in a long interview. She hadn't used
10:03
Speaker 3: this for politics, which you'd think most politicians would have done,
10:08
Speaker 3: and you can see just how touched she was by that,
10:12
Speaker 3: and I personally think she has been quite affected by
10:16
Speaker 3: this over the past couple of months by what she
10:19
Speaker 3: saw that night. Now, one of the most powerful messages
10:22
Speaker 3: from the documentary was one of resilience that we won't
10:27
Speaker 3: let the haters win. And to me, that was encapsulated
10:32
Speaker 3: by this grandmother, Tessa Neeson, who was at the Kanaka
10:36
Speaker 3: event with her family, and she hid during the shooting.
10:41
Speaker 12: And we went home and the minora had already been
10:43
Speaker 12: put up, and.
10:44
Speaker 4: We let it and we sang and we just thanked
10:49
Speaker 4: Ushim and we are proud Jews, and nobody and no
10:54
Speaker 4: one is going to take that away from us. And
10:56
Speaker 4: if I had to die as a Jew, I'd die
10:59
Speaker 4: a proud you.
11:03
Speaker 3: Such strength, resilience, determination, so emotional, so important. Then when
11:10
Speaker 3: we'd finished filming all the interviews, we held this vigil.
11:13
Speaker 3: At the very end, Rabbi Yossi Friedman held it, and
11:17
Speaker 3: for me, this was a really healing part of the
11:20
Speaker 3: filming process. And survivors and victims and family members all
11:25
Speaker 3: came together. We gather in grief and stand in strength
11:31
Speaker 3: out of the darkness. A shared light will endure. We
11:36
Speaker 3: pray for the healing of the wounded, and we'll always
11:41
Speaker 3: remember the fifteen whose lives were taken too soon. If
11:49
Speaker 3: you missed it, head to the Sky News app or
11:53
Speaker 3: our website. There's also that code, that code where you
11:57
Speaker 3: hold your camera up. What's it called Joe QR code,
12:01
Speaker 3: Thank you QR code. But you hold your camera up
12:04
Speaker 3: and if you click on the link it'll take you.
12:06
Speaker 3: But otherwise just download the Sky News Australia app.
12:10
Speaker 2: You should have it on your.
12:11
Speaker 3: Phone anyway, you get alerted whenever there's news happening if
12:14
Speaker 3: you choose to have the news alerts, or go to
12:16
Speaker 3: our website and scroll down to documentaries and you can
12:20
Speaker 3: screen it there. Now the rest of Australia has moved
12:24
Speaker 3: on after Bondi, but life just still isn't the same
12:27
Speaker 3: for our community.
12:28
Speaker 2: And that's particularly.
12:30
Speaker 3: So for the hundreds of children, Australian children who are
12:34
Speaker 3: actually there during the massacre. This grandmother, Marlene spoke about
12:40
Speaker 3: having to run with her grandkid, run with her grandkids
12:44
Speaker 3: away from the shooting.
12:45
Speaker 2: We haven't actually aired these comments yet. Have a look.
12:49
Speaker 13: I don't remember as I was running with the boys
12:53
Speaker 13: and they were saying. Jacob was saying we're going to die,
12:56
Speaker 13: We're going to die, and the other five year old
13:00
Speaker 13: I was saying, I'm scared. I'm scared. I kept on
13:03
Speaker 13: sailing them, don't worry, We're going to be safe. The
13:06
Speaker 13: police are here. The police are going to get the baddies,
13:08
Speaker 13: We're going to be safe. So I just kept some
13:11
Speaker 13: reassuring while we were running that will be safe and
13:15
Speaker 13: the police are coming to keep us safe.
13:19
Speaker 3: And her son in law Greg spoke about the devastating
13:22
Speaker 3: questions that he was asked from his children.
13:26
Speaker 11: Eight year old he said, over and over and over again,
13:30
Speaker 11: we're going to die. My children trying to understand why
13:33
Speaker 11: this was happening and why they were trying to shoot
13:36
Speaker 11: at us, and something that I'll never forget. My five
13:40
Speaker 11: year old, you're saying to me, he said, Daddy, why
13:45
Speaker 11: are baddies trying to kill us? And I didn't have
13:48
Speaker 11: an answer, and then he said to me, but Daddy,
13:53
Speaker 11: I thought we were good children, he said, I've been
13:56
Speaker 11: trying to be a good boy. I thought I thought
13:58
Speaker 11: Jakie and I good children. You know, what did we
14:02
Speaker 11: do wrong? And it's the first time that I think
14:05
Speaker 11: they've ever been exposed to evil and that was really,
14:10
Speaker 11: really difficult to hear.
14:14
Speaker 3: Now the Royal Commission needs to hear all of this testimony.
14:19
Speaker 3: This is the very heart of the issue. Australian children
14:24
Speaker 3: are now traumatized and forever scarred. And I just wanted
14:31
Speaker 3: to take a moment to say a huge thank you
14:34
Speaker 3: to the team here at Sky News for putting this
14:36
Speaker 3: incredible documentary together, a documentary, more than anything else, is
14:42
Speaker 3: truly a team effort. Executive producer Alex Garripoli, Director of
14:48
Speaker 3: Programs Mark Calvert, our amazing camera team Aaron Hage and
14:52
Speaker 3: Murray MacLean, editor Rory Brennan, and producers Madison Thorn and
14:58
Speaker 3: Carole Pillmer.
15:00
Speaker 2: A big thank you to all of you.
15:02
Speaker 3: Such a special and talented team, and I enjoyed every
15:06
Speaker 3: minute of working with every.
15:08
Speaker 2: One of you.
15:09
Speaker 3: And a documentary like this doesn't happen overnight. It takes
15:12
Speaker 3: weeks and weeks and months.
15:14
Speaker 2: Of hard work.
15:15
Speaker 3: So, and I've said this before, but I'm very grateful
15:18
Speaker 3: to work here at Sky News because nowhere else would
15:21
Speaker 3: dedicate so much time and resources to an important project
15:25
Speaker 3: like this that's not just crucial for today, but for
15:29
Speaker 3: future generations. And also, while I'm thanking everyone, just want
15:33
Speaker 3: to thank as well, Ben Fordham, Chris Kenny, Andrew Bolt
15:37
Speaker 3: and Rowan Dean for supporting the documentary the way they
15:41
Speaker 3: have and for their very kind and generous words today.
15:45
Speaker 3: All right, let's move on now, and let's talk about
15:48
Speaker 3: President Donald Trump's historic State of the Union address.
15:52
Speaker 2: It was a.
15:53
Speaker 3: Record breaking nearly two hours and Trump covered immigration, the
15:58
Speaker 3: economy around and more, and then, in his own unique style,
16:02
Speaker 3: the President started off by proclaiming that the Golden Age
16:07
Speaker 3: of America.
16:08
Speaker 8: Is back, my fellow Americans.
16:11
Speaker 14: Our nation is back, bigger, better, richer, and stronger than
16:16
Speaker 14: ever before. Less than five months from now, our country
16:25
Speaker 14: will celebrate an epic milestone in American history, the two
16:29
Speaker 14: hundred and fiftieth anniversary of our glorious American Independence. This
16:35
Speaker 14: July fourth, we will mark two and a half centuries
16:39
Speaker 14: of liberty and triumph, progress and freedom in the most
16:42
Speaker 14: incredible and exceptional nation ever to exist on the face
16:46
Speaker 14: of the earth.
16:47
Speaker 8: And you've seen nothing yet. We're going to do better,
16:50
Speaker 8: and better and better. This is the Golden Age of America.
16:55
Speaker 3: And he then asked Congress to stand up. If they
16:57
Speaker 3: believe it's the duty of the US government to prioritize
17:00
Speaker 3: American citizens over illegal aliens, just have a look at
17:05
Speaker 3: who stayed seated.
17:08
Speaker 14: One of the great things about the State of the
17:10
Speaker 14: Union is how it gives Americans the chance to see
17:14
Speaker 14: clearly what their representatives really believe. So tonight I'm inviting
17:19
Speaker 14: every legislature to join with my administration and reaffirming a
17:24
Speaker 14: fundamental principle.
17:26
Speaker 8: If you agree with this statement, then stand up and
17:29
Speaker 8: show your support.
17:31
Speaker 14: The first duty of the American government is to protect
17:35
Speaker 14: American citizens, not illegal aliens.
17:52
Speaker 2: Yeah.
17:52
Speaker 3: That was pretty disgraceful. And one of the congresswomen, Ilan Omar,
17:57
Speaker 3: was then seen screaming throughout the address at.
18:00
Speaker 14: The criminals and enact serious penalties for public officials who
18:05
Speaker 14: block the.
18:06
Speaker 8: Removal of criminal aliens.
18:08
Speaker 14: In many cases, drug lords, murderers all.
18:11
Speaker 8: Over our country. They're blocking the removal of.
18:15
Speaker 14: These people out of our country, and you should be
18:18
Speaker 14: ashamed of yourself.
18:22
Speaker 3: Yeah, and the heckling didn't stop the President from calling
18:25
Speaker 3: out his detractors, including the US Supreme Court judges who
18:29
Speaker 3: continue to block his latest round of tariffs.
18:33
Speaker 14: I used these tariffs, took in hundreds of billions of
18:36
Speaker 14: dollars to make great deals for our country. Many of
18:38
Speaker 14: the wars I settled was because of the threat of tariffs.
18:41
Speaker 14: I wouldn't have been able to settle them with a
18:44
Speaker 14: will remain in place under fully approved and tested alternative
18:47
Speaker 14: legal statutes. And as time goes by, I believe the
18:51
Speaker 14: tariffs paid for by foreign countries, will like in the past,
18:57
Speaker 14: substantially replace the modern day system of income tax, taking
19:01
Speaker 14: a great financial burden off the people that I love.
19:06
Speaker 3: Finally, in a moving moment, Trump also paid tribute to
19:10
Speaker 3: the families of Charlie Kirk and Irene A Zarotska, who
19:14
Speaker 3: were both allegedly violently murdered in public last year.
19:18
Speaker 14: So last year, Charlie was violently murdered by an assassin
19:24
Speaker 14: and martyred, really martyred for his beliefs. His wonderful wife,
19:30
Speaker 14: Erica is with us tonight.
19:31
Speaker 8: Erica, please stand on that train.
19:41
Speaker 14: No one will ever forget the expression of terror on
19:44
Speaker 14: Irena His face as she looked up at her attacker
19:47
Speaker 14: in the last seconds.
19:48
Speaker 8: Of her life. She died instantly.
19:51
Speaker 14: She had escaped a brutal war, only to be slain
19:54
Speaker 14: by a hardened criminal set free to kill.
19:57
Speaker 8: In America came in through open borders.
20:01
Speaker 14: Missus Zaretska, Tonight, I promise you we will ensure justice
20:05
Speaker 14: for your magnificent daughter.
20:07
Speaker 8: Hi readA.
20:16
Speaker 3: And it was the longest State of the Union address
20:18
Speaker 3: in history, clocked in at one hundred and one minutes.
20:21
Speaker 3: And this was the President presenting strength and unity ahead
20:25
Speaker 3: of the midterms. And I'll come back to that state
20:32
Speaker 3: of the Union with Adam Crichton a bit later. But
20:34
Speaker 3: joining me now as usual on a Wednesday is former
20:37
Speaker 3: Victorian Liberal Party president Michael Kroger and Sky News host
20:40
Speaker 3: Joe huter Brand.
20:41
Speaker 2: Great to see.
20:42
Speaker 15: Great to.
20:44
Speaker 2: Start with the sky News Pulse poll.
20:48
Speaker 3: It shows the Liberal Parties position is improving slightly at least.
20:53
Speaker 2: Let's have a look at the figures.
20:54
Speaker 3: The Coalition captured a twenty two percent primary vote, that's
20:58
Speaker 3: up three percent, trailed one Nation on twenty four percent,
21:02
Speaker 3: which is down for and Labor and twenty nine percent.
21:06
Speaker 3: Now Labour lost one percentage point to the Coalition on
21:09
Speaker 3: a two party preferred basis, leading fifty three to forty seven.
21:15
Speaker 3: So and then when it comes to the preferred prime
21:17
Speaker 3: Minister Albanezi was at forty five percent, Angus Taylor at
21:21
Speaker 3: thirty four percent and twenty one percent undecided. So, Michael,
21:26
Speaker 3: looking at these figures, has Angus Taylor taken the Liberal
21:30
Speaker 3: Party off life support?
21:34
Speaker 16: First of all, Jerry, can I say that was stunning
21:37
Speaker 16: last night. Congratulations to you and the whole Sky team
21:40
Speaker 16: that was that was an unbelievable ninety minutes and boy,
21:45
Speaker 16: I don't know that I've seen anything better on TV
21:47
Speaker 16: in a long long time. So congratulations to you and everybody.
21:50
Speaker 12: What he's done is I really appreciate that.
21:53
Speaker 2: Thank you.
21:54
Speaker 16: Well, it's it's so well deserved. And you've been a
21:57
Speaker 16: rock for the community ever since October seven. And you
22:02
Speaker 16: can see what's happening in this country if you turn
22:04
Speaker 16: to that pole. Now, what Angus has done is focus
22:08
Speaker 16: the Liberal Party and the community back on economics. He
22:11
Speaker 16: and Tim Wilson and Jane Hume have talked at the
22:14
Speaker 16: economy about tax and people were starting to feel that, well,
22:18
Speaker 16: you know, maybe there's going to be some change down
22:20
Speaker 16: the track to the tax system because that's the Liberal
22:24
Speaker 16: Party's number one core brand equity. The other big change
22:28
Speaker 16: is the one nation vote. Now, if you analyze what's
22:31
Speaker 16: happening with the one nation vote and you look at
22:34
Speaker 16: what's happened to the Morgan Pole the other day in Sydney,
22:38
Speaker 16: Chris Mins has gone from thirty seven percent two years
22:41
Speaker 16: ago at the New South Wales election to twenty five percent.
22:45
Speaker 16: Mins has dropped twelve Mins has dropped twelve percent. Now,
22:49
Speaker 16: why is this? It's for the reasons that Julian Hill
22:52
Speaker 16: has pointed out today the Labor member for Bruce, the
22:56
Speaker 16: violent left, the Antifas, the left wing Nazis, the Islamist
23:01
Speaker 16: terrorists and extremists, the hate Islamic hate preachers, the alleged
23:07
Speaker 16: Bondi terrorists, the people smashing up synagogues and you know,
23:14
Speaker 16: intimidating young Jewish men and women, et cetera. There is
23:17
Speaker 16: a very large group of this people of people in
23:20
Speaker 16: this country who are now saying enough, we love this country.
23:24
Speaker 16: It's a proud country. The working middle class who you know,
23:29
Speaker 16: and the working Australians who a labour's base are moving
23:32
Speaker 16: away from labor and now saying if you're representing this
23:37
Speaker 16: sort of left wing in a city elitism, and we've
23:39
Speaker 16: seen enough of it from Albanesi, Wong and Burke in
23:42
Speaker 16: the last two years, you're not for us. And they're
23:44
Speaker 16: parking their votes with One Nation who at the minute
23:47
Speaker 16: they're saying is is representing a proper immigration program, opposition
23:52
Speaker 16: to Islamic extremism and national pride.
23:58
Speaker 2: Joe the Poe also looked at why people were joining One.
24:00
Speaker 3: Nation, So the top reason was well pit by no
24:05
Speaker 3: confidence of the major parties unsurprising, but also their policies,
24:09
Speaker 3: Pauline Hanson's leadership, and just a tiny four percent because
24:13
Speaker 3: of Barnaby Choice.
24:14
Speaker 1: Yeah.
24:14
Speaker 15: Look, I think One Nation has you know, just you know,
24:18
Speaker 15: as John Howard once said, the time suit it very much.
24:20
Speaker 15: But I think the story of One Nation is actually
24:22
Speaker 15: the story of the collapse of the Coalition more than
24:24
Speaker 15: anything else. And I think that under Susan Lee, the
24:27
Speaker 15: right of the Liberal Party simply felt that this was
24:30
Speaker 15: no longer their party and they went to pretty much
24:34
Speaker 15: the only viable alternative they could go to, which was
24:36
Speaker 15: One Nation. And I think Angus Taylor's stronger conservative credentials
24:41
Speaker 15: are the reason why those votes have now come back.
24:45
Speaker 15: And if you know, I mean, yes, the Coalition is
24:48
Speaker 15: still marginally behind One Nation, but they've gone up three.
24:52
Speaker 15: It's gone down four because I can't decide whether all
24:54
Speaker 15: Muslims are bad or not, and they've already been struck
24:57
Speaker 15: by internal division. If you continued that, pat and the
25:00
Speaker 15: next poll, suddenly you know, the Coalition would be you know,
25:03
Speaker 15: in the high mid twenties, and that's within striking distance
25:07
Speaker 15: of normality. It's still terrible, but it's within the striking
25:10
Speaker 15: distance of normality, and one nation suddenly is looking like
25:13
Speaker 15: it's going to end up back in the teen. So
25:16
Speaker 15: one nation cannot sustain itself. It cannot be a major party.
25:20
Speaker 15: It structurally cannot be a major party because I mean
25:23
Speaker 15: we saw it with the two party preferred with the
25:25
Speaker 15: Labor there, Labor does much better against one nation than
25:28
Speaker 15: it does above the coalition. It always has and it
25:30
Speaker 15: always will. And the only way that one nation can
25:33
Speaker 15: get enough votes in a compulsory preferential voting system to
25:37
Speaker 15: get a majority is if it becomes more and more
25:39
Speaker 15: mainstream and moves further and further to the center.
25:42
Speaker 8: And if it.
25:42
Speaker 15: Does that, it loses all the appeal that attracted voters
25:45
Speaker 15: on the right to it in the first place. And
25:47
Speaker 15: again we saw that with Paul and Hanson getting in
25:50
Speaker 15: trouble over her Muslim comments on your show. If it's
25:53
Speaker 15: fine to do that, if you want to be a
25:54
Speaker 15: fringe party of the hard at immigration right, but if
25:58
Speaker 15: you are trying to be a serious major part you
26:00
Speaker 15: just can't say stuff like that. And that's why Barnaby
26:03
Speaker 15: Joyce of all people was coming out and saying, now
26:06
Speaker 15: you've gone too far. You can't say that now in
26:08
Speaker 15: Barnaby Joyce's can't say something, you should probably listen.
26:12
Speaker 3: Clearly Pauline Hanson's rise though, has influenced Labor because, as
26:17
Speaker 3: you just refer to a moment ago, Michael Kroger, we
26:20
Speaker 3: had Julian Hill saying this today, have a.
26:22
Speaker 9: Look, most migrants integrate. But I call that in the
26:29
Speaker 9: speech that where we see unacceptable cultural practices of extreme
26:33
Speaker 9: gender segregation, the Islamist radical extremism, will right wing nationalist extremism,
26:39
Speaker 9: then we should be able to call that out speaking
26:41
Speaker 9: up for our values. It's not demonizing whole ethnic or
26:44
Speaker 9: religious clips.
26:45
Speaker 3: I mean, when was the last time you heard that
26:47
Speaker 3: from anyone in Labor. So clearly that is the influence
26:51
Speaker 3: of one nation on the Albane So there are.
26:54
Speaker 15: People in the Labor Party, Joe Fitzgibbon, myself, I have
26:57
Speaker 15: been saying this for years in.
26:59
Speaker 3: The government party, lot of people who've been saying who
27:03
Speaker 3: are very sensible, but they are no longer in the
27:05
Speaker 3: Albanese government.
27:06
Speaker 2: But let's move right.
27:07
Speaker 3: So we learned more today about why the Prime Minister
27:11
Speaker 3: was evacuated from the lodge last night. Now News dot
27:14
Speaker 3: Com reports that a bomb threat written in Chinese said
27:18
Speaker 3: blood will flow and the Prime Minister's lodge will be
27:21
Speaker 3: blown into ruins. Now, the threat made via email was
27:26
Speaker 3: sent to local performers dancing for the chen yun Performing
27:30
Speaker 3: Arts shows and demanding that their performance has be canceled.
27:35
Speaker 2: Now, Michael, have.
27:36
Speaker 3: You seen anything like this before, the Prime Minister being
27:39
Speaker 3: evacuated from the lodge?
27:43
Speaker 16: I haven't. Not since Malcolm Fraser was locked in the
27:46
Speaker 16: theatre at Monash University in the late seventies. I have
27:49
Speaker 16: not said anything like it. But it's very alarming. Obviously,
27:54
Speaker 16: it's extremely alarming. So this dance troup who have been
27:58
Speaker 16: banned by the Communist Party of China, who are linked
28:01
Speaker 16: to the Felongo movement, who are anti the Chinese communist
28:04
Speaker 16: Chinese government. Basically we're seeing the Australian Prime Minister disgracefully
28:10
Speaker 16: threatened by someone or a group of people. Now, you know,
28:17
Speaker 16: we don't have evidence of what happened, but they're clearly
28:21
Speaker 16: not opponents of the Chinese government that have done this.
28:25
Speaker 16: So it's extremely alarming. This is a problem in Australia
28:29
Speaker 16: to day. I mean, we just see these threats with
28:31
Speaker 16: there's almost a thousand I read today, there's almost a thousand,
28:38
Speaker 16: you know, attempts a tax on parliamentarians in Australia in
28:42
Speaker 16: the last year in one form or another, most of
28:44
Speaker 16: them on line threatening to kill Albanesi or et cetera.
28:48
Speaker 16: C I mean, we have a serious, serious problem in
28:53
Speaker 16: this country with extremists of predominantly overwhelmly on the left,
28:57
Speaker 16: the sort of neo Nazi Islamist left, some on the right. Obviously,
29:02
Speaker 16: we have a serious problem in this country. And you know,
29:05
Speaker 16: let's hope the AFP can track down who these people
29:07
Speaker 16: are that have done this and have them thrown out
29:09
Speaker 16: of our country.
29:11
Speaker 2: Yeah.
29:11
Speaker 3: Absolutely, that is if they're not Australian citizens. Joe, do
29:15
Speaker 3: you know what unfolded last night?
29:17
Speaker 8: No, I don't.
29:18
Speaker 15: I only know what I was revealed in your show
29:20
Speaker 15: and in The Australian last night. I know that the
29:23
Speaker 15: PM is safe and well obviously and was not particularly
29:28
Speaker 15: rattled by it. It was pretty cool about it. But
29:32
Speaker 15: it is, you know, I mean, I suppose it just
29:34
Speaker 15: goes to show the constant level of threat that there
29:37
Speaker 15: is out there for everyone, and especially the PM. I
29:41
Speaker 15: think in this case it's clearly too sort of ham
29:44
Speaker 15: fisted and useless and crazy and stupid to be an
29:48
Speaker 15: actual Chinese government agent or a Chinese government action. But
29:53
Speaker 15: I think a lot like Isis. For example, one of
29:56
Speaker 15: the things you can do is you just indoctrinate as
29:58
Speaker 15: many people as you possible can disseminate your message of
30:01
Speaker 15: hate and say and it just takes one crazy, you know,
30:05
Speaker 15: card carrying flag waving China ultra Chinese ultranationalist communist to say, yes,
30:11
Speaker 15: this is my chance to stand for something.
30:14
Speaker 3: I mean, if that's who it was, because the Fallon
30:16
Speaker 3: Gung opposes the Chinese Communist Party, so it's all a
30:18
Speaker 3: bit marking no this.
30:20
Speaker 15: So this person was this person was anti Fallangong and
30:22
Speaker 15: anti chen Yorn and was saying, if you don't shut
30:24
Speaker 15: down this program, which is seen as this whole show
30:30
Speaker 15: that people are raving about, is seen as a deliberate
30:33
Speaker 15: f you if you like to the Chinese Communist Party.
30:36
Speaker 15: And so this is clearly a Chinese Communist sympathizer who's
30:38
Speaker 15: saying shut it down and will kill you.
30:42
Speaker 3: Joe Hudebrand, Michael Kroger, I apologize, we're out of time.
30:45
Speaker 2: Great to see you.
30:46
Speaker 15: Always a pleasure, Thank you, Thanks Sherry.
30:48
Speaker 3: Now a group of ISIS brides detained in Syria have
30:51
Speaker 3: begged the Prime Minister to repatriate their children at any cost,
30:55
Speaker 3: even if it means being separated. One of the mothers,
30:58
Speaker 3: Zara Ahmed, the Guardian that they can't cope anymore and
31:02
Speaker 3: they can't understand why they're in this situation. Meanwhile, The
31:06
Speaker 3: Daily Telly is reporting that questions have been raised about
31:09
Speaker 3: the legality of the steps taken or allegedly taken by
31:13
Speaker 3: doctor Jamal Riffi, who is reported to have assisted with
31:17
Speaker 3: the passport applications. Johiny minow Is Shadow Minister for Citizenship
31:21
Speaker 3: and Multicultural Affairs. Dave Sharma, Dave, thanks for joining me.
31:26
Speaker 3: So what do you think about this? Could there be
31:29
Speaker 3: questions of legality over the handing out of passpots if
31:35
Speaker 3: that's what an Australian is doing in Syria.
31:39
Speaker 17: I think they're a very serious question to answer here, Sharon.
31:42
Speaker 17: And this is the problem with the government basically outsourcing
31:44
Speaker 17: its diplomacy and foreign policy to private citizens. The Passport
31:49
Speaker 17: Act is quite clear here. Section thirty two makes it
31:53
Speaker 17: an offense for someone to be holding or in possession
31:57
Speaker 17: of someone else's passport. Section thirty seven makes an offense
32:00
Speaker 17: to carry someone else's passport across an international boundary. Now,
32:04
Speaker 17: clearly someone has taken these thirty four or thirty five
32:07
Speaker 17: passports is in possession of them, who is not the
32:10
Speaker 17: passport holder has taken them across the international boundaries. Those
32:14
Speaker 17: offenses carry a maximum penalty of ten years in jail.
32:17
Speaker 17: So these are very serious offenses. And my question is
32:20
Speaker 17: to the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade and the
32:23
Speaker 17: Foreign Minister, were they aware that they were going to
32:26
Speaker 17: be aiding and assisting the commission of a crime by
32:29
Speaker 17: handing out passports like this?
32:32
Speaker 3: I mean, there certainly are questions because I mean, as
32:34
Speaker 3: anyone knows, if you try and collect someone else's exactly
32:38
Speaker 3: mail at the post office, let alone a passport, even
32:42
Speaker 3: if it's a family member and you're trying to pick
32:43
Speaker 3: up their mail at the post office, it's you know,
32:46
Speaker 3: it's impossible, let alone thirty four passpots. I think there
32:50
Speaker 3: certainly needs to be more questions answered here by the
32:54
Speaker 3: Albanezi government on whether any permission or authority was given
32:58
Speaker 3: to an Australian to do this. Just finally, what do
33:02
Speaker 3: you think about this suggestion from one of the mothers
33:05
Speaker 3: that some of the children should be repatriated. I mean,
33:08
Speaker 3: surely most mothers wouldn't want to be separated from their kids.
33:13
Speaker 17: No, I don't think so, and I can't imagine that
33:15
Speaker 17: anyone thinks that's in the best interests of the children.
33:18
Speaker 17: I mean, look, I have sympathy for the children, but
33:20
Speaker 17: I also am quite conscious that it's the mothers of
33:23
Speaker 17: these children that have put themselves in this predicament and
33:26
Speaker 17: their children in this predicament by leaving Australia against all
33:30
Speaker 17: the advice, going to a terrort zone, against our laws
33:34
Speaker 17: at the time, and joining a listed terrorist organization. I mean,
33:38
Speaker 17: you know, as Anthony Albernezi himself has said, they've made
33:42
Speaker 17: their bed, they now need to lie in it.
33:46
Speaker 3: Just on Trumps said of the Union address, he gave
33:48
Speaker 3: an update on negotiations with Iran.
33:51
Speaker 2: Today.
33:51
Speaker 8: Have a look some terrible people.
33:55
Speaker 14: They've already developed missiles that can threaten Europe and our
33:59
Speaker 14: bases over and they're working to build missiles that will
34:02
Speaker 14: soon reach the United States of America.
34:05
Speaker 8: We are in negotiations with them.
34:07
Speaker 14: They want to make a deal, but we haven't heard
34:09
Speaker 14: those secret words.
34:11
Speaker 8: We will never have a nuclear weapon.
34:16
Speaker 3: I mean, listening to that, do you expect a US
34:19
Speaker 3: attack on Iran will be imminent or a military strike,
34:23
Speaker 3: I should say.
34:25
Speaker 17: I think the likelihood's quite high, Shari. I mean, there's
34:28
Speaker 17: two US aircraft carrier battle groups in theater at the moment.
34:32
Speaker 17: This is the biggest US military build up in the
34:34
Speaker 17: Middle East since the prelude of the Iraq War in
34:37
Speaker 17: two thousand and three. You know, not only that aircraft
34:40
Speaker 17: carrier battle groups, there are joint strike fighters, air air fuelers,
34:44
Speaker 17: there's growler aircraft, there's destroyers, there's any number of assets.
34:48
Speaker 17: So Donald Trump certainly has the means in place right
34:52
Speaker 17: now to stage quite a significant strike on Iranian nuclearan, military,
34:57
Speaker 17: and civilian leadership capabilities. Whether he does so, of course,
35:01
Speaker 17: depends on the diplomatic track and depends on his own decisions.
35:07
Speaker 3: Yeah, it'll be fascinating to see. It's all in place,
35:10
Speaker 3: as you say, So, it's just a matter of time.
35:13
Speaker 3: And these things tend to happen on the weekends, don't
35:16
Speaker 3: you find Whenever Israel and the US has been involved
35:19
Speaker 3: in an unexpected strike before, it has usually been Saturday
35:24
Speaker 3: night or even Friday night the tine.
35:27
Speaker 17: Often that's the case, And I think Donald Trump's past
35:30
Speaker 17: record here has been he wants, for good military reasons,
35:34
Speaker 17: an element of strategic surprise. So although there's a build
35:37
Speaker 17: up and he's given a deadline of fifteen days as
35:40
Speaker 17: of last Thursday, you know, what do we now know?
35:43
Speaker 17: Nine days in six days in Rather, you know, it
35:46
Speaker 17: doesn't mean that after fifteen days a strike will come.
35:49
Speaker 17: It could come before, it could come later, because I
35:51
Speaker 17: don't think he wants to telegraph exactly what he's going
35:53
Speaker 17: to do, and there are obviously very good reasons for that.
35:56
Speaker 3: Well, I think you should make it a midweek strike
35:58
Speaker 3: then for more surprised, because we're getting used to the
36:02
Speaker 3: weekend strikes. All right, Dave Sharma, good to see you.
36:06
Speaker 3: Still to come the latest on the alleged kidnapping and
36:09
Speaker 3: murder of this poor grandfather and should the Democrats have
36:14
Speaker 3: stayed seated during Trump's State of the Union?
36:17
Speaker 2: Talk about that with Adam Crichton.
36:19
Speaker 3: Next, Welcome back and Joding Minow is the Institute of
36:26
Speaker 3: Public Affairs Chief economist Adam Crichton, And good to have
36:29
Speaker 3: you in Sydney and studio to Adam.
36:31
Speaker 2: Now, Trump's State.
36:32
Speaker 3: Of the Union addressed today, what did you think were
36:35
Speaker 3: his strongest remarks?
36:37
Speaker 12: Well, I think on the economy, I think you'd have
36:39
Speaker 12: to say that the first twelve months have been pretty
36:42
Speaker 12: good in that regard. I mean, he has many detractors,
36:44
Speaker 12: as you know, he mentioned the Nobel Prize winning economists
36:47
Speaker 12: that he said got it totally wrong, and indeed they
36:50
Speaker 12: kind of did, especially on the inflation rates, the growth rates.
36:53
Speaker 12: I mean, the US economy is still the standout economy
36:55
Speaker 12: in the OECD. Okay, it grew at two percent last year,
36:59
Speaker 12: but that's still much better than the European Union, much
37:01
Speaker 12: better than Australia, much better than New Zealands and all
37:03
Speaker 12: the rest. So you know, it's a difficult time for
37:05
Speaker 12: the West, but the US is still a standout. And
37:08
Speaker 12: if you look at where all the smartest people in
37:10
Speaker 12: the world want to migrate to, it's still the United States,
37:12
Speaker 12: you know, for all the stuff about Trump, that's where
37:14
Speaker 12: they want to go.
37:15
Speaker 3: Although of course there's different economies within the US, and
37:18
Speaker 3: a lot of people are leaving New York because of
37:20
Speaker 3: the tax situation there. I just want to ask you
37:23
Speaker 3: about tariffs and then inflation. So starting with tariffs, So
37:26
Speaker 3: Trump this week increased or announced global tariffs would be
37:30
Speaker 3: a flat fifteen percent after the US Supreme Court said
37:35
Speaker 3: that his pre existing tariffs were unlawful. You know, the detractors,
37:41
Speaker 3: the argument has been that the US tariffs would drive
37:44
Speaker 3: the US economy into recession.
37:47
Speaker 2: What do you think the IMPACT's been.
37:49
Speaker 12: Well, that's why the economists have been so wrong. But
37:50
Speaker 12: they clearly haven't. It's the fun you know, one of
37:52
Speaker 12: the fastest growing economists in the OECD and you know,
37:56
Speaker 12: somewhat comically, they all said, these economists there'd be a
37:59
Speaker 12: big spike and inflation in the US because of the tariffs,
38:01
Speaker 12: and it's just simply not happen. Their inflation rates two
38:04
Speaker 12: point four percent. I think over the twelve months of
38:06
Speaker 12: last year, Australia's is three point eight, much much higher.
38:10
Speaker 12: So tariffs clearly have not been a disaster. And I think,
38:13
Speaker 12: as you said this week in one of your editorials,
38:15
Speaker 12: they need the money. I mean, the US has a
38:17
Speaker 12: massive budget deficit two trillion a year or something. The
38:20
Speaker 12: debt's thirty eight trillion. The White House only has one
38:23
Speaker 12: way to raise money without Congress, and that is tariffs.
38:26
Speaker 12: And so I think, you know, Trump doesn't often put
38:28
Speaker 12: it that way that we need to raise money, although
38:30
Speaker 12: I think he actually did in the speech for the
38:32
Speaker 12: first time. But you know, it raises three or four
38:35
Speaker 12: hundred million dollars a year. That's a massive amount of money,
38:38
Speaker 12: and it's not really hurt American consumers so far that much.
38:41
Speaker 2: So he's actually trying to tackle the debt here.
38:45
Speaker 12: Exactly, yeah, exactly, and they have to because otherwise it
38:47
Speaker 12: will be a huge global financial crisis. I mean, you know,
38:49
Speaker 12: thirty eight trillion dollars, right, it's one hundred and ten
38:51
Speaker 12: percent of GDP or something. That's much higher than Australia's
38:53
Speaker 12: debt relatively the US. Of course, it's so big and
38:57
Speaker 12: powerful it can go on for much longer than other countries,
38:59
Speaker 12: but at some point it's not sustainable.
39:02
Speaker 3: You just mentioned inflation in the US compared to Australia,
39:04
Speaker 3: so two point four percent in the US and news
39:08
Speaker 3: today that inflation is now sitting in the past twelve
39:10
Speaker 3: months at three point eight percent in Australia. Why do you,
39:15
Speaker 3: as an economist think that it is so much higher?
39:17
Speaker 3: And is this because of the Albanesi government.
39:19
Speaker 12: Well, it certainly is partly. I mean, there are budget
39:21
Speaker 12: deficits as far as I can see, and certainly government
39:24
Speaker 12: demand plays a big role we've had the fastest growth
39:26
Speaker 12: in government spending since the Whitlam years except for the
39:29
Speaker 12: pandemic twenty seven percent of GDP. Now, I believe the
39:32
Speaker 12: federal government is which is extraordinary. That is obviously, that's
39:36
Speaker 12: obviously boosting demand, and you know it's partly their responsibility.
39:40
Speaker 12: Our inflation rate, I think is more or less the
39:42
Speaker 12: highest in the OECD. I worried about it, yes, of course,
39:46
Speaker 12: because it hits every single Australian's wage. I mean, who's
39:48
Speaker 12: getting a four percent parrise every year? Certainly not me.
39:51
Speaker 12: Maybe you are showing it, but I'm not. And that's
39:54
Speaker 12: a four percent cut in your living standards every single year.
39:57
Speaker 12: So it's a very serious problem. And the government's kind
39:59
Speaker 12: of hand waves it away as if it's not important.
40:03
Speaker 12: But I think they're going to pay for it at
40:04
Speaker 12: the ballot box now.
40:06
Speaker 3: I was watching Chris Kenny's program earlier this evening and
40:08
Speaker 3: he had Pauline Hanson on, and she said, because Chris
40:13
Speaker 3: was quizzing her on one of her new policies of
40:16
Speaker 3: income splitting, and she said, well, that bloke crightened. She
40:20
Speaker 3: couldn't remember your guy's name, and she said that economis
40:22
Speaker 3: Crighten endorses this policy. So what do you think of
40:27
Speaker 3: income splitting as an economic policy?
40:30
Speaker 12: Well, she must have been referring to my tweet about
40:31
Speaker 12: the fact that the One Nation has more policies on
40:34
Speaker 12: their website than the Liberal Party.
40:35
Speaker 8: Which is true.
40:37
Speaker 12: But the policy of income splitting is reasonable. The US
40:40
Speaker 12: does it. You know, you either file as a single
40:42
Speaker 12: or you file as a married couple, and that has
40:44
Speaker 12: tax consequences.
40:46
Speaker 3: And so if you file as a married couple that
40:48
Speaker 3: means the tax rate is lower.
40:49
Speaker 8: Yeah.
40:49
Speaker 12: So basically, if there's only one income owner, you basically
40:52
Speaker 12: divide the income across the two people, and because of
40:54
Speaker 12: the progressive rate, that means you get two tax free
40:56
Speaker 12: thresholds instead of one. So it makes a big difference
40:59
Speaker 12: to the average tax rate. That's something we could do
41:01
Speaker 12: in Australia. I think it's probably a good idea. It
41:03
Speaker 12: does cost a lot of money though, in terms of
41:04
Speaker 12: lost revenue, so you have to make cuts. The other
41:07
Speaker 12: good thing about One Nation is they at least have
41:09
Speaker 12: the courage to point out on their website the things
41:11
Speaker 12: they would cut, you know, twenty thirty billion dollars a
41:13
Speaker 12: year of climate change nonsense, They would can't and that's
41:15
Speaker 12: what needs to be said I think by the Liberal
41:17
Speaker 12: Party for them to have similar policies.
41:20
Speaker 3: All right, Adam Crichton, thanks so much for your time.
41:22
Speaker 2: Thanks Erry, and still to come across.
41:24
Speaker 3: Live to London where The Telegraph's Crime editor has the
41:28
Speaker 3: latest details on the Andrew and Mandelson arrests, plus that
41:32
Speaker 3: shocking case the two men being arrested over the alleged
41:36
Speaker 3: kidnapping and murder of the Sydney grandfather. Will show you
41:41
Speaker 3: who they are. That's after the break when New South
41:47
Speaker 3: Wales Police have arrested two men over the alleged kidnapping
41:51
Speaker 3: and murder of Chris Bagzarian. His body was found near
41:57
Speaker 3: a pit Town golf course yesterday. Now show you A
42:01
Speaker 3: twenty nine year old and a twenty four year old
42:03
Speaker 3: have been taken into custody after New Southwell's Police executed
42:08
Speaker 3: search warrants at separate homes this morning and New Southerwan's
42:12
Speaker 3: Police provided this update today.
42:16
Speaker 7: We'll ledge in court that these men participated in a
42:20
Speaker 7: joint criminal enterprise with other persons to kidnap mister Bagsarin
42:24
Speaker 7: and ultimately where he was held hostage, where he come
42:27
Speaker 7: to his death, and he'll be that'll be charged with
42:30
Speaker 7: his murder. Once again, I wish to stress that mister
42:34
Speaker 7: Bagsariin was not the intended target of the kidnapping.
42:39
Speaker 3: And we're going to show you on screen now the photographs.
42:42
Speaker 3: This is as reported by the Telegraph Daniel Stevens you
42:48
Speaker 3: can see him there and the next one is Gerard Andrew.
42:55
Speaker 3: So this is the Daily Telegraphs exclusive up.
42:58
Speaker 2: On their website right now.
43:00
Speaker 3: They have named and shown photographs of the two men
43:05
Speaker 3: arrested such a tragic story. In Joining me now is
43:08
Speaker 3: Central Queensland University criminologist doctor Xanthy Western XANTHI, thank you
43:13
Speaker 3: so much for your time, as we just heard their
43:16
Speaker 3: police say he wasn't the intended target.
43:19
Speaker 2: So what do we know about this case of mistaken identity?
43:24
Speaker 18: Well, the police believe that the alternative person who was
43:29
Speaker 18: the alleged victim that they were trying to kidnap was
43:33
Speaker 18: related to Dimitris d'fannan, who.
43:35
Speaker 3: Looks such a sad case. I mean, you just think
43:38
Speaker 3: of a grandfather being treated like this. I know it's
43:41
Speaker 3: impossible to know the motivation, but you have to ask
43:44
Speaker 3: why wouldn't he have been returned to his home in
43:48
Speaker 3: North Ryde. When they did realize that this was a
43:52
Speaker 3: case of mistaken identity.
43:54
Speaker 11: Well, that's the.
43:54
Speaker 18: Big question, isn't it. Clearly they realize very early on
43:58
Speaker 18: that they have ducted the wrong person, they say, and
44:00
Speaker 18: some texts to mister Stefanian, and he told them that,
44:05
Speaker 18: you know, they'd got the wrong house, and so they
44:07
Speaker 18: were in a very difficult position at that stage and
44:10
Speaker 18: probably didn't really know what to do. They're hardly criminal masterminds,
44:13
Speaker 18: given the catalog of errors they made during this abduction,
44:18
Speaker 18: so they possibly panicked when they realized that they'd actually
44:21
Speaker 18: abducted the wrong person.
44:24
Speaker 3: In usual in cases like this, I mean, to us,
44:29
Speaker 3: it seems so unusual that a grandfather was kidnapped mistaken identity.
44:33
Speaker 3: How often does this happen, not necessarily with the kidnapping,
44:36
Speaker 3: but someone being shot or you know, something else where.
44:39
Speaker 3: It's just the completely wrong individual has ended up being targeted.
44:45
Speaker 18: Well, we have seen it before with these organized crime
44:47
Speaker 18: gangs when they're basically going to war, and that is
44:50
Speaker 18: the risk that members of the public inadvertently get caught
44:53
Speaker 18: up in these events. So it's not unheard of, but
44:58
Speaker 18: certainly pulling family into this is fairly new. You know,
45:02
Speaker 18: there were some unwritten rules years ago that you know,
45:05
Speaker 18: family weren't touch wives, weren't touch children, parents, and those
45:09
Speaker 18: rules seemed to have gone out the window more recently.
45:12
Speaker 18: And that is really worrying because it shows a distinct
45:15
Speaker 18: escalation in the violence and really what these individuals will
45:18
Speaker 18: do to get one up on the other gangs.
45:22
Speaker 3: Yeah, now, hearts go out to the family of Chris.
45:27
Speaker 3: This evening just beyond devastating and it's been such an
45:30
Speaker 3: excruciating period as this is all unfolded, right doctor Xanthey,
45:34
Speaker 3: Western appreciate your time.
45:36
Speaker 2: That's still to come.
45:37
Speaker 3: The confidential information farmer Prince Andrew shared with Epstein, that's next. Well,
45:48
Speaker 3: the UK government has endorsed the release of more damaging
45:51
Speaker 3: files on Andrew as they learn more of his disparaging
45:55
Speaker 3: behavior and relationship with Jeffrey Epstein, particularly when it comes
45:59
Speaker 3: to his time Trade Envoy from two thousand and one
46:02
Speaker 3: to twenty eleven. And joining me now to discuss this
46:05
Speaker 3: further is Crime editor for The Telegraph, Martin Evans. Martin,
46:10
Speaker 3: thanks for your time. Now, it's been reported that former
46:13
Speaker 3: Prince Andrew shared confidential government information with Epstein.
46:18
Speaker 2: What can you tell us about this.
46:22
Speaker 5: Well, as we know. Earlier this month, the Department of
46:25
Speaker 5: Justice in the United States released a huge tranch of
46:30
Speaker 5: material known as the Epstein Files. There were about three
46:34
Speaker 5: million documents. It was a huge volume of material, and
46:38
Speaker 5: within that there were many, many references to the former
46:42
Speaker 5: Prince Andrew Andrew Mountbatten Windsor as he now is, having
46:45
Speaker 5: had all his titles stripped away, and also to Lord
46:49
Speaker 5: Mandleton Peter Mandleson, the former business Secretary. Now, when you
46:55
Speaker 5: get into the details of these, I mean a lot
46:58
Speaker 5: of them are mundane social but within them there are
47:02
Speaker 5: some which seemed to be relating to business arrangements deals.
47:10
Speaker 5: When Prince Andrew Andrew Mountbatten Windsor was a trade envoy,
47:14
Speaker 5: he was traveling the world meeting rich, powerful people, heads
47:18
Speaker 5: of state in order to do business for Britain, in
47:21
Speaker 5: order to sell Britain around the world. But in doing that,
47:25
Speaker 5: obviously he was becoming privy to lots of market sensitive information.
47:30
Speaker 5: And the allegation is that he was sending some of
47:33
Speaker 5: that market sensitive information to Epstein, who obviously at the
47:37
Speaker 5: time was one of the world's leading financiers.
47:41
Speaker 2: So about a.
47:42
Speaker 3: Week ago, just under a week ago, we saw Andrew's arrest.
47:45
Speaker 3: Then that was followed a few days later by the
47:48
Speaker 3: arrest of the UK s farmer ambassador to the US,
47:51
Speaker 3: Lord Peter Mandelson. Where are these cases both going and
47:56
Speaker 3: how quickly do you expect police will move.
48:00
Speaker 5: I don't think we should be sitting here with bated
48:03
Speaker 5: breath expecting any an eating significant to happen anytime soon.
48:08
Speaker 5: In fact, late last night UK time, Thames Valley Police,
48:12
Speaker 5: who were the police force who were investigating the allegations
48:15
Speaker 5: against Andrew, put out a statement saying that they had,
48:20
Speaker 5: after six days, completed their searches that had been carrying
48:24
Speaker 5: out at Royal Lodge in Windsor, which was Andrew's former home,
48:30
Speaker 5: and also in that statement they did stress that this
48:34
Speaker 5: was a complex investigation, it was likely to be a
48:38
Speaker 5: long investigation and essentially telling us not to expect any
48:42
Speaker 5: major development soon. In the case of Lord Mandals and
48:47
Speaker 5: my understanding I discovered yesterday, my understanding was that what
48:51
Speaker 5: the Metropolitan Police, who were investigating the allegation against him,
48:55
Speaker 5: he got two different police forces here. Metropolitan Police had
48:59
Speaker 5: actually agreed to interview Lord Mandelsson voluntarily next month, and
49:06
Speaker 5: then at some point in the last couple of days
49:11
Speaker 5: they were made aware of claims that he was planning
49:15
Speaker 5: to flee the country and move abroad, and so they
49:19
Speaker 5: moved in on Monday afternoon and arrested him at about
49:24
Speaker 5: five pm UK time at his London home. Lawyers for
49:28
Speaker 5: Lord Mandalson have said that those suggestions that he was
49:33
Speaker 5: planning to move aboard are completely baseless. But essentially I
49:37
Speaker 5: think this is going to be quite a long drawn
49:39
Speaker 5: out investigation. The police have searched properties belonging to both men.
49:44
Speaker 5: They will have gathered a lot of material, computer, presidence documents.
49:49
Speaker 5: It's going to take time to go through that. And
49:52
Speaker 5: then of course you've got the rather thorny issue of
49:56
Speaker 5: the offense for which they are being investigated is called
49:59
Speaker 5: misconduct and office. It's not a very straightforward defense. It's
50:03
Speaker 5: not legislation. It's common law that's developed over many years
50:07
Speaker 5: of case law and it's rather ill be fined. And
50:10
Speaker 5: so the Crown Prosecution Service, who were the body who
50:13
Speaker 5: will made the decision on whether to charge both men,
50:18
Speaker 5: will have to sit down with the evidence that's gathered
50:20
Speaker 5: and work out whether or not they think that they
50:23
Speaker 5: have reached this law.
50:25
Speaker 3: Yeah, I thought it was going to be a bit
50:28
Speaker 3: speedier seeing as the arrests happened so quickly. Martin Evans
50:31
Speaker 3: really appreciate your time and your insights. Thank you very much. Now,
50:36
Speaker 3: just before we go, I'm going to show you that
50:38
Speaker 3: QR code again for how to watch our Sky News
50:42
Speaker 3: documentary BONDI A Timeline of Terror. If you missed it
50:45
Speaker 3: last night, you can still watch it. You can download
50:49
Speaker 3: our Sky News Australia app. You just pull it up
50:51
Speaker 3: in the app store, head to our website, or if
50:54
Speaker 3: we have time. I don't think we're going to the
50:56
Speaker 3: QR code. Here's Paul Mary