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Monday Mini: Why Are Men Lying About Politics on Dating Apps? · Stuff Mom Never Told You

• 0:05
  Speaker 1: Hey, this is Annie and Samantha. I'm welcome to.
• 0:07
  Speaker 2: Stuff and never told you protection of iHeartRadio, and just
• 0:18
  Speaker 2: because we live in a real fast moving world. Today,
• 0:22
  Speaker 2: for this Monday, Minnie, I'm gonna time stamp it. It
• 0:26
  Speaker 2: is November sixth, twenty twenty five, and today we are
• 0:31
  Speaker 2: talking about something that has been going on for a while,
• 0:34
  Speaker 2: but especially in the age of Trump and MAGA. It's
• 0:40
  Speaker 2: men lying about their politics on dating profiles are being
• 0:43
  Speaker 2: very very vague. With a small update of something I
• 0:47
  Speaker 2: hadn't heard of until Samantha let me know about it.
• 0:50
  Speaker 2: That will be at the end. So while it is
• 0:54
  Speaker 2: true that some people can have romantic relationships with someone
• 0:58
  Speaker 2: who has different political beliefs, certainly couldn't right now, but
• 1:01
  Speaker 2: people can. It is easier to find someone who shares
• 1:05
  Speaker 2: your values, especially I would argue if you're coming from
• 1:09
  Speaker 2: a marginalized community and the current administration is harming you
• 1:13
  Speaker 2: and stripping you of your rights and the rights of
• 1:15
  Speaker 2: those that you care about, which has been heightened under Yes,
• 1:20
  Speaker 2: this current administration. Trump has demonized feminism, he's sexually assaulted
• 1:25
  Speaker 2: women and embraced hyper masculinity. So yeah, that's that's pretty polarizing.
• 1:32
  Speaker 3: Well did you know he says that he was better
• 1:34
  Speaker 3: looking than Mundani, Like a.
• 1:37
  Speaker 2: What, oh my god, does it even matter?
• 1:40
  Speaker 3: What?
• 1:40
  Speaker 1: What?
• 1:41
  Speaker 2: Like that?
• 1:41
  Speaker 1: But he needed to make that statement. I just just like,
• 1:44
  Speaker 1: he's so insecure.
• 1:45
  Speaker 2: He is so insecure as a.
• 1:49
  Speaker 3: Like almost dying man because he's old, y'all. I'm sorry
• 1:52
  Speaker 3: not to be ageist, but he's also not healthy.
• 1:54
  Speaker 2: But all that to.
• 1:55
  Speaker 3: Say, needs to compare himself to a like a young dude,
• 1:59
  Speaker 3: which other the I mean, come on anyway, keep going?
• 2:03
  Speaker 2: Yes, yeah, clearly so strong emotions, strong emotions.
• 2:06
  Speaker 3: Strong emotions, but like when you're that frail and fragile
• 2:09
  Speaker 3: that you need to be like, but I'm better logging
• 2:11
  Speaker 3: than him, bro?
• 2:12
  Speaker 2: What yeah? Is that the comeback got you? I have
• 2:16
  Speaker 2: a friend who I just am like, I don't I
• 2:19
  Speaker 2: never want this to be the news story, but just
• 2:22
  Speaker 2: with you, I want to complain about all of these
• 2:25
  Speaker 2: very superficial things about Trump. I would never do it
• 2:30
  Speaker 2: because I think that actually takes up a lot of
• 2:31
  Speaker 2: space and harms other people exactly.
• 2:34
  Speaker 3: But the fact that he needed to compare himself, yes,
• 2:37
  Speaker 3: like he had to say.
• 2:39
  Speaker 2: What is happening?
• 2:41
  Speaker 1: Okay, this is the leader supposedly this is the guy.
• 2:45
  Speaker 2: So finding someone who shares your politics, while it doesn't
• 2:50
  Speaker 2: necessarily mean you won't find plenty of other issues, maybe
• 2:53
  Speaker 2: even political ones, because by goodness I have with them,
• 2:58
  Speaker 2: it is generally like a few less things to worry about,
• 3:03
  Speaker 2: and it indicates that this person and you are more
• 3:06
  Speaker 2: likely to agree with several things of on values that
• 3:12
  Speaker 2: are important to you. Politics are personal. We've said it,
• 3:17
  Speaker 2: people have said it. It's true. Because of this, more
• 3:20
  Speaker 2: and more people, women specifically have started asking, typically men,
• 3:25
  Speaker 2: before the first date, what are your politics? Who did
• 3:29
  Speaker 2: you vote for? And surprise, surprise, a lot of conservative
• 3:34
  Speaker 2: men are lying about it to get more dates. Okay,
• 3:39
  Speaker 2: and they aren't wrong that a lot of women don't
• 3:42
  Speaker 2: want to date them. In the beginning of this year,
• 3:46
  Speaker 2: twenty twenty five, reminder, the conservative think tank American Enterprise
• 3:52
  Speaker 2: Institute released a study that found while thirty six percent
• 3:55
  Speaker 2: of heterosexual men reported they wouldn't date a Trump supporter,
• 3:59
  Speaker 2: fifty two percent of heterosexual women reported that they wouldn't.
• 4:04
  Speaker 2: Here's some quotes from that. Sixty percent of single women
• 4:08
  Speaker 2: believe that women will be treated worse under the Trump
• 4:10
  Speaker 2: administration of you, only forty seven percent of single men share.
• 4:15
  Speaker 2: Not surprisingly, most single women, including three quarters of college
• 4:19
  Speaker 2: educated single women, report that they would be less likely
• 4:22
  Speaker 2: to date a Trump supporter. Single men and women also
• 4:26
  Speaker 2: have dramatically different views about what Trump's election means. Single
• 4:30
  Speaker 2: women are uniquely fearful of Trump's return to power. Among
• 4:35
  Speaker 2: those who voted for Kamala Harris, forty one percent of
• 4:38
  Speaker 2: single women and twenty six percent of single men report
• 4:41
  Speaker 2: that they are frightened by Trump's election. Six to ten
• 4:45
  Speaker 2: single women believe that women in the US will be
• 4:48
  Speaker 2: worse off under a second Trump presidency. Most single men
• 4:53
  Speaker 2: do not share these concerns. I also think something that's
• 4:57
  Speaker 2: not being discussed as much he is the intensity of
• 5:02
  Speaker 2: women's dislike of Trump. It's not like a minor dislike.
• 5:06
  Speaker 4: It's like a big one, like a vitual that is, yes,
• 5:11
  Speaker 4: saving out exactly some women that I might be, Yes, Well,
• 5:18
  Speaker 4: you might get to see some of it already, heard
• 5:20
  Speaker 4: some of it already.
• 5:22
  Speaker 2: Here's a quote from American Survey Center. The antipathy young
• 5:26
  Speaker 2: women feel towards Donald Trump has been well documented, but
• 5:31
  Speaker 2: the strength of the aversion they feel towards him is
• 5:34
  Speaker 2: less remarked upon. The typical way we measure feelings toward
• 5:38
  Speaker 2: political figures is on a scale of very favorable to
• 5:41
  Speaker 2: very unfavorable. Seventy five percent of unmarried young women have
• 5:46
  Speaker 2: a very unfavorable view of Trump. But this survey question
• 5:51
  Speaker 2: does not adequately capture the visceral feelings of disgust many
• 5:56
  Speaker 2: young women have for Trump. A twenty sixteen ap pole
• 6:00
  Speaker 2: found that a majority of young women said the term
• 6:03
  Speaker 2: sexist described Trump, which, yeah.
• 6:06
  Speaker 3: I feel like that's the polite way of saying that's
• 6:08
  Speaker 3: the nicest way to say it. Very very of diplomatic,
• 6:14
  Speaker 3: politically correct here, I know.
• 6:18
  Speaker 2: The dating app Hilly released a survey around the same
• 6:21
  Speaker 2: time that found one in three of gen Z and
• 6:23
  Speaker 2: millennial women wouldn't date someone with different political beliefs. I
• 6:28
  Speaker 2: believe the prevailing quote was I'd rather die alone only
• 6:33
  Speaker 2: one only one and ten of the men surveyed reported
• 6:37
  Speaker 2: the same thing. A twenty twenty Pew Research study found
• 6:42
  Speaker 2: that while half of Republicans said they probably are definitely
• 6:46
  Speaker 2: wouldn't date someone who voted for Biden, seventy one percent
• 6:50
  Speaker 2: of Democratic women said they probably are definitely wouldn't date
• 6:53
  Speaker 2: someone who voted for Trump. A twenty twenty four survey
• 6:56
  Speaker 2: of one thousand people from the dating app Coffee Meats
• 6:59
  Speaker 2: Bay found that eighty three percent would be willing to
• 7:03
  Speaker 2: end the relationship based on politics. Eighty three percent. Yeah,
• 7:08
  Speaker 2: it's and these are only a handful of numbers listeners.
• 7:10
  Speaker 2: There has been a lot about that.
• 7:14
  Speaker 3: I was just thinking about the fact that you were
• 7:15
  Speaker 3: saying the single some of the single men who said
• 7:17
  Speaker 3: they would be afraid, I'm sure they were all Like,
• 7:20
  Speaker 3: I wonder if they're part of the queer community. Yeah,
• 7:23
  Speaker 3: I could chug of those people or like some marginalized
• 7:26
  Speaker 3: group single men, like it wasn't just white obviously, Yeah,
• 7:31
  Speaker 3: white heteronormative men.
• 7:32
  Speaker 2: Yes, I would not be surprised at all. Uh. I'm
• 7:37
  Speaker 2: also not surprised about this. Unfortunately, what have conservative men
• 7:42
  Speaker 2: started doing because of all this? They have been labeling
• 7:46
  Speaker 2: themselves as moderate or being otherwise very politically vague, so
• 7:53
  Speaker 2: that they can match with women who have like a
• 7:55
  Speaker 2: no Conservatives descriptor or something like that in their profile
• 7:59
  Speaker 2: where they meet see that and just swipe left. This
• 8:04
  Speaker 2: practice has become so widespread from these men that for
• 8:07
  Speaker 2: many moderate has become a red flag that's an immediately nope,
• 8:12
  Speaker 2: a lot of women have described days months of messaging,
• 8:18
  Speaker 2: only to eventually find out not only are these men
• 8:22
  Speaker 2: not moderate, but are in fact far right and anti feminist.
• 8:28
  Speaker 2: Some even lie, like outright lie about who they voted
• 8:32
  Speaker 2: for at first, given that women's rights are under attack,
• 8:37
  Speaker 2: reproductive rights are being stripped, the administration's promotion of proto
• 8:42
  Speaker 2: nationalism to increase the white Christian birth rate in the
• 8:46
  Speaker 2: US switch by the way, I almost did that for
• 8:48
  Speaker 2: a Monday many but it was such a big topic
• 8:51
  Speaker 2: that we're just going to have to come back. But yeah,
• 8:54
  Speaker 2: and the rise of online discourse around trad drives that
• 8:57
  Speaker 2: women are rightfully anxious about this. It feels like a threat,
• 9:02
  Speaker 2: it feels like a violation, and it's exhausting. It's exhausting.
• 9:06
  Speaker 2: Dating is already a minefield, and now you may go
• 9:11
  Speaker 2: on a date where you have to explain why this
• 9:15
  Speaker 2: whole political thing isn't just a difference of opinion. This
• 9:19
  Speaker 2: is about safety, it's about rights, it's about humanity. Do
• 9:23
  Speaker 2: you see me as human? Do you see me as
• 9:25
  Speaker 2: someone deserving equal rights? Now I have to do this.
• 9:29
  Speaker 3: If they're lying about it, then they know the significance
• 9:32
  Speaker 3: that that's the thing is what bothers me is eventually
• 9:35
  Speaker 3: it will come out because they will slip up and
• 9:37
  Speaker 3: say something because it inevitably, whether it's an eye roll,
• 9:40
  Speaker 3: whether it's a dismissal, whether it's like, oh but he
• 9:43
  Speaker 3: wasn't that bad type of conversation, it'll eventually come out,
• 9:46
  Speaker 3: and the red flags will be like being because the
• 9:47
  Speaker 3: women are like, wait, what the thing is?
• 9:51
  Speaker 1: They know? How about it is?
• 9:53
  Speaker 3: Is? They know it's a big deal if they have
• 9:54
  Speaker 3: to lie to get to these women, And also, why
• 9:58
  Speaker 3: would you want to date someone with these things that
• 10:00
  Speaker 3: are so against what you quote unquote voted for. As
• 10:04
  Speaker 3: well as the fact that didn't they start like these
• 10:07
  Speaker 3: conservative dating websites specifically so they could.
• 10:10
  Speaker 2: Find their own people.
• 10:11
  Speaker 1: Why are they straying away from them so hard?
• 10:14
  Speaker 2: Yes, well, part of the reason that this was on
• 10:28
  Speaker 2: my radar. We have been talking about doing this for
• 10:30
  Speaker 2: a while, but it came up again to me recently
• 10:33
  Speaker 2: because there was a news article that was about people
• 10:36
  Speaker 2: in Washington, DC. Basically nobody likes Trump there. It's pretty rare,
• 10:44
  Speaker 2: and so they were saying like conservative men were having
• 10:49
  Speaker 2: such a hard time matching, and so it was sort
• 10:51
  Speaker 2: of a way of gaming the system, because if you say,
• 10:55
  Speaker 2: a lot of dating apps now give you the option
• 10:59
  Speaker 2: to screen out if they say conservative or anything like that,
• 11:05
  Speaker 2: just immediately screen them out. And so it was sort
• 11:07
  Speaker 2: of like a way of getting back. Yeah. So the
• 11:11
  Speaker 2: problem is compounded in liberal cities, where conservative men have
• 11:15
  Speaker 2: far fewer chances of matching. I saw the nicest, most
• 11:18
  Speaker 2: diplomatic quote about this from a woman who was interviewed,
• 11:21
  Speaker 2: and she said, well, they really have no option because
• 11:24
  Speaker 2: no one wants to take them. But no. That made
• 11:29
  Speaker 2: me laugh, but she was saying, like, in such a
• 11:31
  Speaker 2: liberal city, you're dating pool. It's very small. Some women
• 11:36
  Speaker 2: have reported that men in these situations say things like
• 11:40
  Speaker 2: you're in a blue state, You're fine, which makes me
• 11:42
  Speaker 2: want to throw something. That is a horrible thing to say.
• 11:47
  Speaker 2: Some sites that I found even have like these questions
• 11:51
  Speaker 2: like advice about how to how to figure out what
• 11:55
  Speaker 2: moderate means to someone you're messaging, which blows my mind
• 11:59
  Speaker 2: that there's actual dating advice about this. There's also apps
• 12:03
  Speaker 2: like maple Match, which was a dating service to put
• 12:06
  Speaker 2: Americans and Canadians together that was created in twenty sixteen
• 12:10
  Speaker 2: after the election. By the way, was.
• 12:13
  Speaker 1: It a green card yesship.
• 12:17
  Speaker 2: Yes, and they were talking about all the numbers went
• 12:22
  Speaker 2: way up after the other election. So again, maybe we
• 12:27
  Speaker 2: could come back and do that topic for another day.
• 12:30
  Speaker 2: Another topic we need to do another day. But I
• 12:32
  Speaker 2: did find some articles about how some consider tradwive relationships
• 12:36
  Speaker 2: being a twenty four to seven kink relationship. Well, we'll
• 12:41
  Speaker 2: come back to that maybe maybe. Okay, So not only
• 12:48
  Speaker 2: do women report feeling catfish or being lied to after
• 12:51
  Speaker 2: all of this, but there is something else going on here.
• 12:54
  Speaker 2: Some men are doing this not just for a date,
• 12:57
  Speaker 2: but because they want to change the politics of the
• 13:01
  Speaker 2: liberal woman they match with. They see it as like
• 13:04
  Speaker 2: a duty and or they can't meet the standards of
• 13:09
  Speaker 2: conservative women. They want to have sex before marriage, they
• 13:14
  Speaker 2: want the duel income, they want a conquest, they didn't
• 13:18
  Speaker 2: actually want to be the breadwinner. So who do they
• 13:22
  Speaker 2: go for liberal women because they can't meet conservative women's standards?
• 13:26
  Speaker 1: Interesting?
• 13:28
  Speaker 2: Yeah, very interesting. Also, like I've read a pretty heartbreaking
• 13:31
  Speaker 2: story from a woman that this happened to, and she
• 13:35
  Speaker 2: really liked this guy, spent a long time with him,
• 13:38
  Speaker 2: and after they had sex, he the next morning he said,
• 13:43
  Speaker 2: what do you think is the biggest problem facing feminism,
• 13:46
  Speaker 2: and she gave, like, you know, reproductive rights, like a
• 13:49
  Speaker 2: bunch of answers that I would agree with, and then
• 13:53
  Speaker 2: he said, I think it's because you all hate men,
• 13:55
  Speaker 2: and then left, like he just had sex with her
• 13:58
  Speaker 2: and left her, and that's so gross that he took
• 14:02
  Speaker 2: that final moment to be like, you're actually very unintelligent,
• 14:07
  Speaker 2: and here's why.
• 14:10
  Speaker 1: Because I tricked you.
• 14:11
  Speaker 2: Because I tricked you. There is a pretty fiery Reddit
• 14:15
  Speaker 2: post that I found about this, where the poster I
• 14:18
  Speaker 2: think it was it was something like too afraid to ask,
• 14:23
  Speaker 2: but they asked why are men doing this? And a
• 14:27
  Speaker 2: lot of the comments I'm guessing from largely men were
• 14:30
  Speaker 2: essentially things like because things have been so radicalized and
• 14:34
  Speaker 2: conservatives are seen aren't seen as people anymore. Our people
• 14:36
  Speaker 2: won't even give us a chance for more than our
• 14:39
  Speaker 2: political beliefs, or that they're actually more progressive than people think.
• 14:44
  Speaker 2: I don't believe it in extremes was a big one.
• 14:47
  Speaker 2: Once they get to know me better, they'll know I'm
• 14:50
  Speaker 2: a good person and forget the lying. I love that one.
• 14:53
  Speaker 2: It's discrimination, It's about the economy. I'm a political or
• 15:00
  Speaker 2: and believe in it right, I'm glad you have the.
• 15:03
  Speaker 1: Privilege to be right, like a political is the biggest
• 15:08
  Speaker 1: red Like you are so privileged that you do you
• 15:11
  Speaker 1: are securely okay with everything going wrong, and you do
• 15:15
  Speaker 1: not care about other people, Like that's the big red flag.
• 15:18
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, that was a That one came up a lot.
• 15:22
  Speaker 2: I just don't. I mean, I get it, but that
• 15:25
  Speaker 2: is the most frustrating, like shrug of responsibility or care
• 15:30
  Speaker 2: I've ever just no, no thanks, no thanks. And yeah,
• 15:36
  Speaker 2: this whole thing is not surprising. It aligns with a
• 15:39
  Speaker 2: lot of pickup culture or lying to get a date
• 15:43
  Speaker 2: or hookup that we do see is really popular in
• 15:46
  Speaker 2: conservative circles. But it's gross that people, largely heterosexual men
• 15:51
  Speaker 2: in this case, feel so comfortable lying, and the hopes
• 15:55
  Speaker 2: of getting women invested are getting laid because a lot
• 15:58
  Speaker 2: of them said I just have to get her invested
• 16:02
  Speaker 2: and then she won't leave right exactly. And I'm not
• 16:10
  Speaker 2: saying it's.
• 16:11
  Speaker 5: Easy dating these days, but if you have to start
• 16:14
  Speaker 5: with a lie, then maybe we should be examining a
• 16:17
  Speaker 5: bunch of other things, as has been pointed out by many,
• 16:21
  Speaker 5: For a lot of heterosexual, usually white men that have
• 16:24
  Speaker 5: never felt threatened by politics, or by like a vagueness.
• 16:29
  Speaker 2: Around politics, so they don't understand the actual danger and
• 16:33
  Speaker 2: threat that some of us feel, or they dismiss it
• 16:37
  Speaker 2: or if they laugh at it. But for marginalized folks,
• 16:40
  Speaker 2: this is not the case. That American Enterprise Institute study
• 16:44
  Speaker 2: I mentioned earlier, it also found that only thirty five
• 16:47
  Speaker 2: percent of unmarried women felt safe using online dating apps.
• 16:51
  Speaker 2: Only thirty five percent, And this is a significant drop
• 16:56
  Speaker 2: from a previous study in twenty nineteen.
• 16:58
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a huge job.
• 17:00
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean thirty Oddly. I actually think this whole
• 17:06
  Speaker 2: thing is part of what helped get Trump elected because
• 17:09
  Speaker 2: angry single men largely voted for Trump, while single women
• 17:14
  Speaker 2: largely didn't. And these men are angry that they're single, uh,
• 17:19
  Speaker 2: and so they vote for things that embody that anger,
• 17:22
  Speaker 2: this misogyny, but it perpetuates numerous things that are why
• 17:27
  Speaker 2: they are single.
• 17:29
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 17:30
  Speaker 3: Oh, I don't see the like cyclical bit of this,
• 17:33
  Speaker 3: Like you are the problem and you are causing more problems.
• 17:37
  Speaker 2: Right, Like if we actually honestly worked on rape culture
• 17:40
  Speaker 2: and made that better, I promised to you a lot
• 17:42
  Speaker 2: more women would be willing to go on dates with you.
• 17:46
  Speaker 3: The bar is so low that a decent dude that
• 17:50
  Speaker 3: literally is like, yeah, you know what if a woman
• 17:53
  Speaker 3: says no and and he walks away, people clap for them.
• 17:57
  Speaker 3: I know.
• 18:00
  Speaker 2: You're going in the wrong way, my man.
• 18:03
  Speaker 1: You really don't have to do that much not lying.
• 18:07
  Speaker 3: This is one of the beginnings changing some of your
• 18:09
  Speaker 3: views about human rights.
• 18:12
  Speaker 2: Barely right.
• 18:14
  Speaker 3: I just saw a post about a girl saying that
• 18:16
  Speaker 3: she saw this man holding a baby in the correct way,
• 18:19
  Speaker 3: and she was like, my uter is jump.
• 18:21
  Speaker 2: Man right, it's it's bad news. I know we've talked
• 18:26
  Speaker 2: about it before, but every time I hear my friends
• 18:29
  Speaker 2: who are still dating their stories, I'm like, this is
• 18:31
  Speaker 2: not worth it. This is not worth it. And in fact,
• 18:35
  Speaker 2: many of my friends, my women friends, they're just like that,
• 18:40
  Speaker 2: you're right, I don't want to date anymore. That's it's
• 18:43
  Speaker 2: not worth it. And this contracts with the idea that men,
• 18:49
  Speaker 2: a lot of men feel that they are entitled to
• 18:51
  Speaker 2: women and resort to violence when they don't get dates.
• 18:58
  Speaker 2: We talked about the male loneliness. I think that you
• 19:02
  Speaker 2: know in it we said women are lonely too. It's
• 19:06
  Speaker 2: just that the male loneliness part is leading.
• 19:09
  Speaker 1: To violence, right, leading to death.
• 19:12
  Speaker 2: Exactly. Uh So this whole thing, like Trump's ruining your
• 19:18
  Speaker 2: dating chances. Dudes, I know you're not listening and you
• 19:22
  Speaker 2: never would, but I'm just gonna put it out there.
• 19:25
  Speaker 3: Christian nationalism is killing your chances of having a family.
• 19:30
  Speaker 2: Yeah, those things that you're like supporting and pushing, they're
• 19:36
  Speaker 2: not working out, okay.
• 19:38
  Speaker 3: Like the thing is, women are just as lonely, but
• 19:40
  Speaker 3: we also have better friend groups. So when we say
• 19:43
  Speaker 3: we're okay singles, because we have a family within our
• 19:46
  Speaker 3: friend groups. Like I talk about the fact that if
• 19:49
  Speaker 3: my relationship with my partner were to end right now,
• 19:52
  Speaker 3: I would not want to try to date again, Like
• 19:55
  Speaker 3: I feel like I'm already too old, which is an
• 19:57
  Speaker 3: age's kind of attitude in the sexist, misogynistic world. But
• 20:00
  Speaker 3: also I'm tired, and I don't want to try to
• 20:03
  Speaker 3: maneuver through that. Also, I know I have a great
• 20:05
  Speaker 3: group of like women who are either single or like childless,
• 20:10
  Speaker 3: and we are a community that does okay. We are
• 20:13
  Speaker 3: okay because we're not attached to our partner in such
• 20:16
  Speaker 3: a way that if one of us, if we would
• 20:18
  Speaker 3: break up, like everything falls apart. That's not a thing
• 20:21
  Speaker 3: as were once upon a time when you you know,
• 20:24
  Speaker 3: my parents specifically and my older siblings, it it did
• 20:27
  Speaker 3: feel that way, like they have to figure out their finances,
• 20:29
  Speaker 3: they have to figure out how to get you know,
• 20:31
  Speaker 3: all these things that really held them into that marriage
• 20:34
  Speaker 3: or relationship. And also because they lost a lot of
• 20:37
  Speaker 3: their friendships or those friendships are all caught up in
• 20:39
  Speaker 3: their families, we have less of that, Like I have
• 20:42
  Speaker 3: enough group of people that I'm like, I could lean
• 20:45
  Speaker 3: to being able to have my time in I'm gonna
• 20:48
  Speaker 3: hang out with this person. This person they would let
• 20:51
  Speaker 3: me stay with them if I need like stuff like that.
• 20:54
  Speaker 3: And knowing that, you know, I have enough single friends.
• 20:56
  Speaker 3: I have enough like childless friends.
• 20:58
  Speaker 1: I have people who.
• 20:59
  Speaker 3: Do have children, but not a lot of you know what,
• 21:01
  Speaker 3: I'm like that we can make a community and we
• 21:03
  Speaker 3: don't feel lonely.
• 21:05
  Speaker 1: Yeah, in that same way.
• 21:08
  Speaker 2: Yeah, Yeah, And I mean that's it's also such a
• 21:11
  Speaker 2: larger conversation of pilots.
• 21:16
  Speaker 3: And we talked about that with the loneliness epidemic, Like
• 21:18
  Speaker 3: that's exactly like we were able to be like we
• 21:20
  Speaker 3: can suffice. Being single is no longer a threat for us.
• 21:24
  Speaker 2: Yes, And going back to the episode I mentioned that
• 21:26
  Speaker 2: I was going to do for this Monday Mini. I'm
• 21:28
  Speaker 2: proto nationalism. We've talked about that before with the Monday
• 21:31
  Speaker 2: many of yours about the South Korean birth rate. There
• 21:36
  Speaker 2: has been a lot of handwringing about that recently, and
• 21:39
  Speaker 2: not just the US but a bunch of countries, and
• 21:43
  Speaker 2: a lot of it was, you know, women, don't they
• 21:47
  Speaker 2: have job opportunities where they didn't. It wasn't it wasn't
• 21:51
  Speaker 2: painted in a bad light for a lot of people,
• 21:52
  Speaker 2: but they were saying, this is why it's happening, is
• 21:54
  Speaker 2: because a lot of these things weren't there before that
• 22:00
  Speaker 2: women are now able to pursue.
• 22:02
  Speaker 3: Right. It also studies that say things like being married
• 22:07
  Speaker 3: is actually detrimental women but helps men and like single
• 22:11
  Speaker 3: women outlive married women and do better for themselves.
• 22:15
  Speaker 1: Like the studies have shown, oh.
• 22:17
  Speaker 3: Like women lose themselves because they have to sacrifice so
• 22:21
  Speaker 3: much for a family or married but when they don't
• 22:23
  Speaker 3: have to do all that, they live just as well
• 22:25
  Speaker 3: as the married dude.
• 22:27
  Speaker 1: Yeah without the baggage.
• 22:29
  Speaker 2: Yeah. There was another quote I found from somebody talking
• 22:34
  Speaker 2: about this that was just I'm good. I don't need
• 22:40
  Speaker 2: the drama men bring into my life. I feel like, right,
• 22:45
  Speaker 2: I'm okay.
• 22:46
  Speaker 3: And honestly this goes for like queer relationships too, because
• 22:49
  Speaker 3: I've seen statistics where the abusive relationships within like specifically
• 22:53
  Speaker 3: like lesbian relationships and gay relationships have kind of like
• 22:57
  Speaker 3: it is now that they're actually researching it is higher
• 23:00
  Speaker 3: than you would expect. And so just being single even, yeah,
• 23:05
  Speaker 3: it's still better.
• 23:06
  Speaker 2: Yeah I know, I know, but yes, I see that too.
• 23:13
  Speaker 1: You're living that dream right now, like, yes, Anie.
• 23:16
  Speaker 2: No, That's why I'm excited to come back to the
• 23:19
  Speaker 2: article you were you sent to me that we'll mention
• 23:21
  Speaker 2: at the end. But it's been it's been a kind
• 23:24
  Speaker 2: of interesting journey for me from going to like to
• 23:27
  Speaker 2: hear the sad single lady he'll never get married, to
• 23:30
  Speaker 2: be like survive one. Well, welcome back to that in future.
• 23:38
  Speaker 2: We already were planning it. Another thing I stumbled upon
• 23:50
  Speaker 2: researching this is apparently another trick men are using is
• 23:53
  Speaker 2: putting in therapy in their profiles to indicate that they
• 23:57
  Speaker 2: know how to communicate and are emotionally intelligent. This was
• 24:02
  Speaker 2: in part because of questions about openness of discussing mental
• 24:05
  Speaker 2: health that we're on a lot of dating apps, so
• 24:07
  Speaker 2: if people of men answered yes, they saw about a
• 24:11
  Speaker 2: five hundred percent increase in potential matches. So you can
• 24:16
  Speaker 2: see the episode bar so low that bar is so loo.
• 24:18
  Speaker 2: They just want to know are you okay? And you
• 24:22
  Speaker 2: can see the episode we did with bridget about this
• 24:24
  Speaker 2: whole thing. We kind of talked about it with Jonah
• 24:27
  Speaker 2: Hill's controlling behavior of his ex and he was using
• 24:31
  Speaker 2: these therapy terms inaccurately, like these are my boundaries, which
• 24:35
  Speaker 2: that was not correct uses at all. But yeah, you
• 24:38
  Speaker 2: can listen to that episode to learn more about that.
• 24:41
  Speaker 2: Also to mention once more this there has been a
• 24:45
  Speaker 2: whole push for women who have said they don't want
• 24:48
  Speaker 2: or can't afford to have kids and some there's been
• 24:52
  Speaker 2: a really interesting conversation I'm seeing playing out about that
• 24:56
  Speaker 2: on dating apps where men are like, we can have
• 24:58
  Speaker 2: five kids and women are like, no, uh, we can't.
• 25:04
  Speaker 1: Were you talking who is we batman exactly?
• 25:08
  Speaker 2: But also just the reality of our economy right now
• 25:11
  Speaker 2: and then like the economies of a lot of the
• 25:13
  Speaker 2: world is no, we cannot do it, and you're talking
• 25:18
  Speaker 2: about me probably losing.
• 25:20
  Speaker 3: My job or having one thousand dollars as like like
• 25:26
  Speaker 3: your your incentive to children who know grow out of
• 25:31
  Speaker 3: clothes have to use diaper like what.
• 25:34
  Speaker 2: YEP called Trump accounts listeners. I had to go to
• 25:38
  Speaker 2: the White House official website for the first time to
• 25:41
  Speaker 2: learn about this, and it's gross. I was like, I
• 25:46
  Speaker 2: knew that you had really hijacked this website. But wow. Anyway,
• 25:53
  Speaker 2: all of this has perhaps led to something that yes,
• 25:56
  Speaker 2: Samantha turned me on too, that we're planning on returning
• 26:00
  Speaker 2: in the future, which is the recent viral Vogue article
• 26:03
  Speaker 2: by Chante Joseph is having a boyfriend embarrassing Now? And
• 26:07
  Speaker 2: it includes the quote why does having a boyfriend feel Republican?
• 26:11
  Speaker 1: Yes, so.
• 26:15
  Speaker 2: Look out for that. But yeah, I mean, this just
• 26:20
  Speaker 2: makes me so angry. I there's a part of me
• 26:23
  Speaker 2: that like because the comparison that kept coming up was
• 26:27
  Speaker 2: men lie about their heights on on dating apps because
• 26:32
  Speaker 2: it just screened you out, and they feel like if
• 26:35
  Speaker 2: I just if they just get to know me, I
• 26:37
  Speaker 2: have less of a problem with that. I still think
• 26:40
  Speaker 2: you shouldn't just lie, But this feels like a serious
• 26:45
  Speaker 2: This is.
• 26:45
  Speaker 3: All our rights and infringements and also your beliefs of
• 26:49
  Speaker 3: the value of me.
• 26:51
  Speaker 2: Yes, and also a lot of the profiles will say
• 26:55
  Speaker 2: specifically know and they'll lie and then they'll say something
• 27:01
  Speaker 2: like you just needed to get to know me, Like
• 27:04
  Speaker 2: it has nothing to do with how highly do you
• 27:08
  Speaker 2: have to think of yourself? Right where you think you
• 27:11
  Speaker 2: can enter a relationship like that and she'll get to
• 27:14
  Speaker 2: know me, and then I'm in the clear. She'll forget
• 27:18
  Speaker 2: about this whole live that started the whole thing.
• 27:21
  Speaker 3: I there's so many conversations that you have to wonder
• 27:28
  Speaker 3: why you would think this is just a minor like
• 27:35
  Speaker 3: once upon a time, once upon a time, maybe I
• 27:39
  Speaker 3: don't know, I don't know, I like maybe when I
• 27:42
  Speaker 3: was talking about Bush, which still is bad, don't get.
• 27:45
  Speaker 1: Me wrong, don't get me wrong.
• 27:48
  Speaker 2: But like.
• 27:51
  Speaker 3: Today's rhetoric is literally the extreme of whatever. Like we
• 27:55
  Speaker 3: have Nazi parties coming back, we have neo Nazis coming
• 27:59
  Speaker 3: in full wing. We have anti black people like literally
• 28:03
  Speaker 3: the Clue Klux Klan in different forms have been shown
• 28:06
  Speaker 3: back up, the Daughters of the Confederacy slash Moms for Liberty,
• 28:10
  Speaker 3: like all of these things are literally trying to take
• 28:12
  Speaker 3: away rights to the point that we are seeing queer
• 28:17
  Speaker 3: rights being taken away. When rights are being taken away,
• 28:22
  Speaker 3: that is when we were like, no, no, this is
• 28:24
  Speaker 3: not an extreme. This is a failure of humanity. This
• 28:27
  Speaker 3: is an access to atrocities and new things that we're
• 28:32
  Speaker 3: coming to see when we see people being locked up
• 28:34
  Speaker 3: for no damn reason and be dying, and facilities and
• 28:38
  Speaker 3: systems being shot because they're a different race, because like
• 28:42
  Speaker 3: all being profiled just because you might be a different race,
• 28:47
  Speaker 3: being told that using having food for your kids is
• 28:51
  Speaker 3: a privilege, yeah, and not a right, Like these are
• 28:54
  Speaker 3: the things that like, that's the problem that I'm like
• 28:56
  Speaker 3: when you trying to downplay that to being like it's
• 28:59
  Speaker 3: just the political it's just a viewpoint, it's just an opinion.
• 29:02
  Speaker 3: It's like, it's not what it's actually trying to actively
• 29:07
  Speaker 3: kill people, actively hurt people, Like this is the difference,
• 29:13
  Speaker 3: and if you can't see that, then that is a
• 29:17
  Speaker 3: failing in itself.
• 29:20
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, And I mean the if you want to
• 29:25
  Speaker 2: be infuriated, you can look up some of the responses
• 29:28
  Speaker 2: these men have had when they've been found out and
• 29:30
  Speaker 2: they're just oh but also, uh, it was it was
• 29:35
  Speaker 2: kind of funny to read about how many dates hit
• 29:40
  Speaker 2: so quickly. Yeah, now where they're like seven minutes in,
• 29:44
  Speaker 2: got it, I do come.
• 29:46
  Speaker 3: Up very quickly because they say something real silly. I
• 29:50
  Speaker 3: remember way back when it was John McCain that was
• 29:53
  Speaker 3: running with Sarah Palin, right, yes, I remember when that
• 29:57
  Speaker 3: was going on, which was bad enough. And by the way,
• 30:00
  Speaker 3: as much as I disliked John McCain, love him compared
• 30:03
  Speaker 3: to everything else.
• 30:05
  Speaker 1: Can we just lido rip? Can we just say that?
• 30:09
  Speaker 3: But like I remember the girl went on a date
• 30:11
  Speaker 3: and they didn't even talk about politics.
• 30:13
  Speaker 1: This is before the whole like, let me know your politics.
• 30:17
  Speaker 1: That was when moderate was okay.
• 30:19
  Speaker 3: Moderate was seemingly okay because at the very least they're like, fine,
• 30:23
  Speaker 3: we'll give you, you know, queer rights, we'll give you
• 30:27
  Speaker 3: like twenty weeks and like some which is still not enough,
• 30:31
  Speaker 3: but like at the very least they weren't actively trying
• 30:33
  Speaker 3: to quick kill women or the queer community or people
• 30:37
  Speaker 3: of color kind of but like at least they were
• 30:40
  Speaker 3: hiding it.
• 30:41
  Speaker 1: We'll say it that way.
• 30:42
  Speaker 3: But he literally said to her, he was like, so,
• 30:44
  Speaker 3: how excited are you? And she was like excuse me,
• 30:48
  Speaker 3: and she was like how He's like, how is si
• 30:50
  Speaker 3: are you? I mean Sarah Palin, She's amazing. It's a
• 30:53
  Speaker 3: woman it's a woman. I'm like, that is again, this
• 30:57
  Speaker 3: is where we have to talk about your insane sexism
• 31:02
  Speaker 3: to believe that will quill right any type.
• 31:05
  Speaker 2: Of yes, perfect, yay, right, that's all I needed.
• 31:10
  Speaker 3: That is her intellectual abilities to understand it's a woman. Yay.
• 31:16
  Speaker 3: That's not Now I can go back to my lipstick
• 31:19
  Speaker 3: and having babies. Like I was like at that point,
• 31:24
  Speaker 3: it was that insulting, like to this, like you don't
• 31:26
  Speaker 3: say it, and now we're here. But it's always been
• 31:29
  Speaker 3: a little bit and now it's just come to the extremists.
• 31:33
  Speaker 2: Yeah, well it's incredibly condescending and and somebody included a
• 31:39
  Speaker 2: quote from Trevor Noah's book, but it was basically like
• 31:44
  Speaker 2: men want to they want to capture the quote exotic bird.
• 31:49
  Speaker 2: They want to they want to tame and subdue. There's
• 31:53
  Speaker 2: just a challenge exactly. So the conservative woman to them
• 31:57
  Speaker 2: is like she's already in the cage. But what we
• 32:00
  Speaker 2: want is the woman who doesn't agree, and you want
• 32:05
  Speaker 2: to tame her, change her mind, kill her spirit, kill
• 32:09
  Speaker 2: her spirit. And I was like, yeah, that unfortunately rings
• 32:14
  Speaker 2: pretty true to me. Yeah, so we will be back
• 32:19
  Speaker 2: to talk more about this. It's it's been a big
• 32:24
  Speaker 2: news item for a long time. Like I said, we've
• 32:26
  Speaker 2: been talking about this for a while, but I just
• 32:28
  Speaker 2: last week ran into it again. So if any listeners
• 32:32
  Speaker 2: have experienced this and you want to share your story,
• 32:37
  Speaker 2: I'm sorry, please write in what a Mess. You can
• 32:42
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• 32:45
  Speaker 2: You can find us on blue Sky at mom Stuff podcast,
• 32:47
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• 32:50
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• 32:53
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• 32:58
  Speaker 2: Christina or executive producer My and your contribut Joey. Thank
• 33:00
  Speaker 2: you and thanks to you for listening. Steffan never Told
• 33:03
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