Latest / Dr Justin Coulson's Happy Families / The Silent Drift: How Apathy and EarPods Erode Family Bonds

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The Silent Drift: How Apathy and EarPods Erode Family Bonds · Dr Justin Coulson's Happy Families

• 0:05
  Speaker 1: Welcome to the Happy Families podcast. I'm doctor Justin Coulson.
• 0:09
  Speaker 1: So excited to answer your questions or you need to
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: do to submit your question about how to make your
• 0:14
  Speaker 1: family happier is go to happy families dot com dot A.
• 0:17
  Speaker 1: You scroll down to where it says podcasts, push the
• 0:20
  Speaker 1: record button, start talking. Literally that simple. Submit your questions
• 0:26
  Speaker 1: at happy families dot com dot au stay with us.
• 0:31
  Speaker 1: Only one question today comes from an anonymous listener who
• 0:33
  Speaker 1: says our teenager has a very different outlook on life
• 0:36
  Speaker 1: to me. She gets good grades, has great friends, and
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  Speaker 1: is involved in sport and music. She's happy to coast
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  Speaker 1: through her life, though she doesn't aim high as I did,
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  Speaker 1: but rather is happy with good enough in all aspects
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  Speaker 1: of her life. She says she just wants to be
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  Speaker 1: happy and get an okay job. Her words, Should I
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  Speaker 1: be thankful that she has a balanced outlook on life
• 0:56
  Speaker 1: or be pushing her to achieve more as she's so
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  Speaker 1: academically capable. Part two of the question a chores a
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  Speaker 1: chance to tune out or should that be present during chores?
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  Speaker 1: My husband often wears EarPods when he's doing chores, even
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  Speaker 1: in our kitchen, cooking or tidying up. It bugs me.
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  Speaker 1: The rest of our family are in the same space,
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  Speaker 1: often trying to connect in a casual way. But he
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  Speaker 1: says he's doing enough by helping at home and should
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  Speaker 1: be able to listen to whatever he wants while he's
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  Speaker 1: in the kitchen, maybe your podcast. Sometimes he gets very
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  Speaker 1: cranky when I politely ask him to remove them when
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  Speaker 1: he's inside with us. Any advice, Okay, love both of
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  Speaker 1: these questions. Let's start with the cruizy teen who's happy,
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  Speaker 1: go lucky and just doesn't seem to want to put
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  Speaker 1: the effort in. I have a couple of ideas around
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  Speaker 1: here that might be useful. What I'm hearing when I
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  Speaker 1: listen to this question is a parent who has climbed
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  Speaker 1: I don't know, forty maybe fifty runs on the ladder
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  Speaker 1: of life. If each rung represents a year of your life,
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  Speaker 1: you're climbing up and up and up, and obviously the
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  Speaker 1: higher you go, the better your perspective. You can see more.
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  Speaker 1: You can see past the forest, you can see through
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  Speaker 1: the woods, you can see around corners and through the shadows.
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  Speaker 1: You know what's coming. And as a parent who loves
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  Speaker 1: your children very much, you're invested in them making the
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  Speaker 1: best decisions possible to find their way through this journey
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  Speaker 1: of life in the most effective, efficient and successful way possible.
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  Speaker 1: That makes sense. Of course, force creates resistance, and anyone
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  Speaker 1: who's ever raised a teen or being a team knows
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  Speaker 1: that most teens don't love parents being on their case
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  Speaker 1: and telling them what to do. So you've got the
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  Speaker 1: situation where you want the very best for your child,
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  Speaker 1: your child wants the very best for themselves, but they
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  Speaker 1: think that they know better, and you're now trying to
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  Speaker 1: tell them that in spite of their limited view and
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  Speaker 1: your wonderful view, and you're trying to talk to them.
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  Speaker 1: The difficulty is they don't know how good the view
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  Speaker 1: is from where you are. They can only see the
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  Speaker 1: view from where they are, and it's never been better
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  Speaker 1: than it is right now for them. They see you
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  Speaker 1: as old, out of touch, at least a generation older
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  Speaker 1: than them. In fact, most of them think that we
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  Speaker 1: were born well over a generation before them. Despite the
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  Speaker 1: math's not working out, and so there's this conflict, this
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  Speaker 1: tension that makes it really hard. Where do you go
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  Speaker 1: with this? Well, I think the most important thing to remember,
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  Speaker 1: given that force creates resistance is that the harder you
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  Speaker 1: work to take away your autonomy, the more you work
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  Speaker 1: to convince them, the more they'll push back. Like I said,
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  Speaker 1: force creates resistance. There's an old couple that said one
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  Speaker 1: convinced against their will is of the same opinion. Still,
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  Speaker 1: you can have every conversation under the sun, you can
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  Speaker 1: talk to your blue in the face, But until your
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  Speaker 1: daughter buys into it and starts to have that perspective
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  Speaker 1: taking moment, it's not going to happen. Everything that your
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  Speaker 1: child does make sense to them, even if it doesn't
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  Speaker 1: make sense to you. And that perspective taking is very,
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  Speaker 1: very challenging. Getting them to take yours is even harder.
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  Speaker 1: As a dad of a couple of twenty somethings now
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  Speaker 1: three twenty somethings, now, I can tell you how refreshing
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  Speaker 1: and how delightful it is when they say to you,
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  Speaker 1: I really appreciate what you are trying to tell me
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  Speaker 1: six or seven or eight years ago. I get it now,
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  Speaker 1: I can see it. But when they're going through their
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  Speaker 1: adolescent years, they just can't see it, and it's infuriating. Okay,
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  Speaker 1: So here's where we go with this. Conversations need to
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  Speaker 1: be consensual. That is, Hey, I've been thinking about this thing.
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  Speaker 1: Would you be open to having a milkshake with me
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  Speaker 1: and chatting with me about it a bit. This is
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  Speaker 1: not an explorer explain in power conversation as much as
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  Speaker 1: it's two people trying to wrestle around with some tricky things.
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  Speaker 1: And I find that a useful framing can be upside downside.
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  Speaker 1: In other words, let's say you've got two opposing views.
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  Speaker 1: You say to your child, Okay, your view is this,
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  Speaker 1: you want to cruise through life. You've got this nice
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  Speaker 1: balanced out look you find having a I don't know,
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  Speaker 1: a minimum wage job and just doing enough. I get it.
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  Speaker 1: It's really appealing, especially especially when you're a teenager looking
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  Speaker 1: at things and looking at all the stress that school
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  Speaker 1: can create. What's the upside here? And so get them
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  Speaker 1: to explore the upside with you. They'll talk about how
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  Speaker 1: nice it feels to be relaxed, and how everything's probably
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  Speaker 1: going to work out. And they come from a good family,
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  Speaker 1: like the upside is really apparent to them, and then
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  Speaker 1: you can talk to them about the downside. That's the
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  Speaker 1: next question. What's the downside to you making these choices?
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  Speaker 1: If they're willing to be honest with you. They will
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  Speaker 1: acknowledge that there are several pitfalls to this approach. Nevertheless,
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  Speaker 1: there are also I mean, the upside's real and this
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  Speaker 1: is the great challenge, right. I mean, I was a
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  Speaker 1: high school failure. I scored on the bottom fifteen percent
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  Speaker 1: of New South Wales in my HSC. And it wasn't
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  Speaker 1: until I was twenty seven years of age, married with
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  Speaker 1: a mortgage, a couple of kids that I went back
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  Speaker 1: to school and literally turned my life around. So if
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  Speaker 1: they do want a cruise, there is still the potential
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  Speaker 1: that that can change later in life. It's just that
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  Speaker 1: the numbers are against them. The probability is lower and
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  Speaker 1: lower the older they get. Nevertheless, there's an upside downside
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  Speaker 1: conversation looking at their choices. Then you can spin around
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  Speaker 1: and say, well, let's have a look at it from
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  Speaker 1: my perspective, what's the upside to working really hard at
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  Speaker 1: school and perhaps having a little bit more get up
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  Speaker 1: and go, and then what's the downside. Once you've had
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  Speaker 1: that conversation, hopefully your child will walk away and start
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  Speaker 1: to contemplate the discussion. I guarantee you they're not going
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  Speaker 1: to look at you and say well, this has changed everything.
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  Speaker 1: I'm so motivated, inspired, I'm ready to go right now.
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  Speaker 1: Thank you so much for doing that. That won't happen.
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  Speaker 1: What does happen, though, is kids go away and they
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  Speaker 1: think about stuff, and little by little attitudes can shift,
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  Speaker 1: not all the time, but sometimes. And I think this
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  Speaker 1: is probably going to be your best bet. Ultimately, who
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  Speaker 1: we are as models is going to be more predictive
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  Speaker 1: of who our children become than anything else. It takes
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  Speaker 1: a real concerted effort on the part of our children
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  Speaker 1: to buck the trend or buck the conditioning and the
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  Speaker 1: socialization that we've given them. Some do, but if we
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  Speaker 1: can maintain those good relationships and support our kids, they'll
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  Speaker 1: usually be fine. I think there's one more thing I'd add,
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  Speaker 1: and that is just to find that thing your child
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  Speaker 1: might not be particularly motivated because for many children, and
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  Speaker 1: I say this with no disrespect to people working in education,
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  Speaker 1: but for many kids school really does sad. They just
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  Speaker 1: they hate it and they don't see an academic element
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  Speaker 1: to their futures. I had a student at a school
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  Speaker 1: in Brisbane just last week when I was giving a
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  Speaker 1: talk about year eleven, year twelve and what to expect
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  Speaker 1: and how to do well and what options they have.
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  Speaker 1: I had a student put up his hand and said,
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  Speaker 1: he said, I just don't understand why I have to
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  Speaker 1: do the maths that I have to do, given that
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  Speaker 1: I'm never going to do maths again once i leave
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  Speaker 1: high school, certainly not this kind of maths. What's the point?
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  Speaker 1: And this is a legitimate question that a lot of
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  Speaker 1: kids are asking. This doesn't seem relevant at all. And
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  Speaker 1: that's why I think there's real value in finding the
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  Speaker 1: thing that lights them up and finding the thing that
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  Speaker 1: they can really orient themselves towards and move forward in
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  Speaker 1: that direction. Because then, well, if that maths is necessary
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  Speaker 1: to get there because they want to go to UNI,
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  Speaker 1: more power to them. They're going to get in there
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  Speaker 1: and do it. And if it's not because they have
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  Speaker 1: different plans, then they can have that a more relaxed approach.
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  Speaker 1: They can have an alternative approach because they've found the
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  Speaker 1: thing that really does it. For now, let's step into
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  Speaker 1: part two about a husband in the kitchen using his
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  Speaker 1: EarPods rather than participating in the family discussion. This one
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  Speaker 1: really frustrates me. I totally get where you're coming from
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  Speaker 1: this one. It's one of those situations where it's totally
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  Speaker 1: understandable that you'd feel bugged by your husband's epod habit.
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  Speaker 1: When you feel disconnected from your husband or partner and
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  Speaker 1: you're sharing the same space, it's frustrating, and it makes
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  Speaker 1: sense that you would crave those casual moments of connection
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  Speaker 1: because that's what we all do, That's how most of
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  Speaker 1: us are wired. Now here's what I want to recommend.
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  Speaker 1: It's important to understand his perspective. It doesn't mean that
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  Speaker 1: you're necessarily going to accept it, but it's important to
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  Speaker 1: understand where he's coming from. When I hear your perspective,
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  Speaker 1: his response seems dismissive. However, it's possible that your husband
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  Speaker 1: is using his EarPods as a way to create a
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  Speaker 1: sense of personal space and decompress while still making a
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  Speaker 1: contribution to what needs to happen at home. Now, you
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  Speaker 1: and I both agree that he's got his priorities around
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  Speaker 1: the wrong way. It's actually about involvement. It's not about
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  Speaker 1: helping that is, it's about being together and having that
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  Speaker 1: casual connection more than it's about getting the dishes dried
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  Speaker 1: and put away. A lot of people, though, find listening
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  Speaker 1: to musical podcasts really soothing and it can help them
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  Speaker 1: focus on mundane chores. I think, though, that it's important
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  Speaker 1: that he understands that his choice is impacting your ability
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  Speaker 1: and the ability of the kids to connect with him.
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  Speaker 1: And that's ultimately what this is about. The task is
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  Speaker 1: the vehicle to connection. It's not the purpose of the ride.
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  Speaker 1: The whole idea is that we're spending time together. Every
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  Speaker 1: night in our family, we have all in and that
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  Speaker 1: means everyone comes into the kitchen and they help with
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  Speaker 1: the dishes and the clearing of the table, and the
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  Speaker 1: sweeping or the vacuum or the mopping of the floor.
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  Speaker 1: We're all in there together for ten, fifteen, twenty minutes
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  Speaker 1: getting the job done. And it's about togetherness. It's not
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  Speaker 1: actually about the task though. It's about the conversations. It's
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  Speaker 1: about the laughter. It's about the continued discussion from the
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  Speaker 1: kitchen table. So what do you do about it? I
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  Speaker 1: think there's a couple of things. Number one, what's his
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  Speaker 1: expectation of the kids. They allowed to have their headphones
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  Speaker 1: in as well. Is he fine with that or is
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  Speaker 1: that not okay? Because consistency is important more than anything, though,
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  Speaker 1: I think that we've got to communicate really clearly and
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  Speaker 1: really collaboratively. What does that mean. It means probably four things,
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  Speaker 1: maybe five things. Number One, you've got to choose the
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  Speaker 1: right time. It's not the right time to have the
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  Speaker 1: conversation while he's in the middle of cooking or cleaning
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  Speaker 1: and the EarPods are in. You don't rip about and
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  Speaker 1: say we need to talk about this. I've had enough.
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  Speaker 1: Really need to find a neutral time when you can
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  Speaker 1: both talk calmly and openly. And while I don't talk
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  Speaker 1: about this sort of stuff much on the podcast and
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  Speaker 1: I'm not a huge fan of the quote unquote eye statements,
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  Speaker 1: sometimes they're really helpful. Expressing your feelings using eye statements
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  Speaker 1: gets messages across. You might say, I feel disconnected when
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  Speaker 1: you wear your ear pods while we're in the kitchen together.
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  Speaker 1: I miss our casual chats. I miss the chance to
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  Speaker 1: connect with you. You're not blaming him. You're not telling
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  Speaker 1: him there's anything wrong with him. You're saying I feel this,
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  Speaker 1: I missed that, I want this, And what I'm really
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  Speaker 1: be working towards is focusing on the positive. If you
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  Speaker 1: frame your request in terms of what you'd like to
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  Speaker 1: gain rather than what he's doing, wrong, it's going to
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  Speaker 1: go down much better. An example would be, I'd love
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  Speaker 1: it if we could have earpod free time in the
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  Speaker 1: evenings while we're making dinner, while we're tiding up, because
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  Speaker 1: it means so much to me when we have that
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  Speaker 1: time to connect, and the kids love it as well.
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  Speaker 1: So we're really focusing on the benefit to having the
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  Speaker 1: ear pods out rather than you're dismissing us. You're ignoring us,
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  Speaker 1: you're abrogating your responsibilities as a father and a husband.
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  Speaker 1: And I think there's also value in considering what a
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  Speaker 1: compromis or negotiation might look like. Maybe he promises to
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  Speaker 1: just wear one earpod instead of two, or he agrees
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  Speaker 1: that he'll go earpod free at some times but not others.
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  Speaker 1: I don't know where you'll fall on that, and certainly
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  Speaker 1: I'd struggle with some compromises around this, but maybe some
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  Speaker 1: of those will work for you ultimately. Ultimately, I think
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  Speaker 1: that if he continues to dismiss your feelings, if he
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  Speaker 1: refuses to talk with you, if there's no willingness at
• 12:24
  Speaker 1: all to compromise, if there's an unwillingness to connect, I
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  Speaker 1: think that there's boundaries that can be set. You might say,
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  Speaker 1: I get it. I know that you need personal time.
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  Speaker 1: We all do. It makes sense you using the EarPods
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  Speaker 1: in the kitchen is a barrier to the relationship and
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  Speaker 1: that's not acceptable to me. And so therefore you might say,
• 12:47
  Speaker 1: I'd rather be in the kitchen with the kids without
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  Speaker 1: you there, so that we can have time together without
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  Speaker 1: feeling like we're on eggshells around you because you've got
• 12:54
  Speaker 1: the earphones in. Or you might say you're going to
• 13:00
  Speaker 1: have to plan up the kitchen on your own because
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  Speaker 1: we're missing under that connection time and you can go
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  Speaker 1: and do something else with the kids. I don't know.
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  Speaker 1: I mean, this is where it starts to get messy,
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  Speaker 1: and I want to tread very carefully, but sometimes cynically
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  Speaker 1: a boundariesn't just saying I'm an adult here and I
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  Speaker 1: have feelings too, might be where you go. I really
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  Speaker 1: think that those other ideas are going to be more
• 13:17
  Speaker 1: helpful though, choosing the right time to communicate using some
• 13:19
  Speaker 1: carefully phrased eye statements, really focusing on the positive of
• 13:23
  Speaker 1: having those EarPods out and trying to compromise if it's necessary.
• 13:28
  Speaker 1: Sometimes sometimes this type of behavior can be a symptom
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  Speaker 1: of a larger issue. Your husband may be consistently withdrawing,
• 13:36
  Speaker 1: consistently being disengaged, and if he is, it's probably going
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  Speaker 1: to be helpful to explore those underlying dynamics. This is
• 13:43
  Speaker 1: where you go and have couples counseling. It can be
• 13:45
  Speaker 1: a valuable resource for navigating the challenges and strengthening your
• 13:51
  Speaker 1: connection over communication, though, mutual respect and a willingness to
• 13:55
  Speaker 1: compromise are probably going to be the best solutions to
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  Speaker 1: resolve in this type of conflict. By expressing your needs
• 14:01
  Speaker 1: really clearly and respectfully, you will be able to create
• 14:04
  Speaker 1: a more connected and fulfilling relationship. Good luck, hope it works.
• 14:08
  Speaker 1: Thank you so much for the question. If you would
• 14:10
  Speaker 1: like to submit a question every Tuesday, I'll do my
• 14:12
  Speaker 1: best to answer them for you. Happy families dot com
• 14:16
  Speaker 1: dot A. You go to the super simple system on
• 14:19
  Speaker 1: the homepage where it says podcasts. Just click the record
• 14:22
  Speaker 1: button start talking. That's all you got to do. The
• 14:25
  Speaker 1: Happy Families podcast is produced by Justin Ruland from Bridge Media.
• 14:28
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• 14:31
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• 14:37
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