Latest / The Refrigeration Mentor Podcast / Episode 223. Female Leaders in Refrigeration: Advancing Diversity & Equality in the Skilled Trades

Transcript

Episode 223. Female Leaders in Refrigeration: Advancing Diversity & Equality in the Skilled Trades · The Refrigeration Mentor Podcast

• 0:00
  Okay. Welcome to another Refrigeration Mentor podcast and welcome to World Refrigeration Day. This is one of my favorite days of the year. I'm really excited about this because this is something we should be celebrating every year and multiple times a year, not only once a year, because our industry is so vast and big and global, and which I really am excited about the conversation today because I have some of the top female experts in the refrigeration industry from all around the world.
• 0:01
  And we're going to be diving into a topic that I, I really been diving into the last couple of years, diversity, quality, and commercial refrigeration, because I think this is very important. I met all these female leaders in the industry throughout going to industry events. Online and just really getting to know them really well and the challenges they have coming through the refrigeration industry and the successes they had being in the refrigeration industry.
• 0:02
  So I'm super excited to really dive into these conversations today. I would like to everyone to meet our guests. So I'm just. Sharing a screen. So those ones that are listening to you, I'll get each person to introduce themselves and those that are here on the zoom, they, they can check out the screen, but I want to, I want to get an introduction on the experience and where they came from and where they're at today to, to really kick this off.
• 0:03
  And Brandy, I'd love I'd love you to, to, to start off and do an introduction. Cause me and Brandy go back many, many years through social media, meeting up at an advance and just having great conversations about. Refrigeration because she is a refrigeration expert at her craft and Brandy, welcome to World Refrigeration Day and Refrigeration Mentor Podcast.
• 0:04
  How you doing? Yeah. Thanks. Oh man. It's so great to be here this morning. I've, I've been getting comfortable not getting up too early in the morning since recently coming out of the field, but this is totally worth it for this group of superstars here. So for those of you that don't know me, I'm a 313A refrigeration mechanic and a gas fitter one by trade.
• 0:05
  And I actually started in the trades two decades ago, which makes me feel super old. But what I what else I ended up doing? Not realizing was where my career path would take me as my life grew and changed. So around 2013, I became, I started instructing in different, different capacities, but now I am a, I'm an HVAC instructor.
• 0:06
  I still part time at a local college and I also work for a non profit. So I'm a technical mentor for 313 apprentices, but also any of the women the female apprentices that they have in any trades, as all of us know here, we have a very unique experience navigating this pathway and last but not least in my spare time, I thought, what the hell two years ago, I started my own company called Fairtrades Toolbox as well as a contracting company with my husband, but For today's discussion, Fair Trades Toolbox, my, my goal is to work with employers and industry leaders to help solve our retention issues with women in skilled trades.
• 0:07
  So not so much on the recruitment side, but through education, I believe we can, we can get that retention number up. So thanks for having me. Yeah. I love it, Brandy. And I love everything that you've been doing and been watching you for years and just putting in the work and that's it. It's putting the work and we'll talk about that too.
• 0:08
  Colleen. So me and Colleen once again, we go way back from different industry events, seeing each other. She's a big part of women in hvac, which I'm really proud to know a lot of people in that organization. And we became really good friends over the last few years. We met in Savannah with our good friend drew Vi Hirsch there a few back in April.
• 0:09
  I think. It was super excited. Great people there. Colleen, I'd love you to do an introduction to the. So I started in the industry through my family's contracting company. So I'm in Fort Huron, Michigan, and we have a 60 plus year old family business that I started working in and grew up in, and I thought it was the lamest thing in the entire world.
• 0:10
  And I actually got fired from our family business pretty early on for being clunk and not understanding what I had. It took my a couple of years to find myself and figure out what I wanted to do, did a couple odd jobs and then. Actually got hired at our, our family's marketing company. My father had encouraged me, like, you need to do this, you need to public speak, you need to be in marketing.
• 0:11
  And I was like, eh, I don't want to do the HVAC stuff again. It's dumb. It's lame. And anyway, I, I did actually join back in because we have a marketing company for contractors. And that's a 25 year old marketing company for contractors, wholesalers, distributors, manufacturers. And so that's all we deal with.
• 0:12
  And we I started working in that company and immediately I met some women at a show at Comfort Tech, which doesn't even exist anymore. And I actually met my male mentors at H-V-A-C-R join the board. Oh, yeah. They were almost looking for everybody with a pulse. 'cause I mean, like, they were just like, Hey, you wanna do stuff?
• 0:13
  You want me on the board? Perfect. And I was like, yeah, all these stuff. And I joined the board. It was like 2015 or so. I spent nine years on the board for women, H-V-A-C-R helping broke. That entire initiative and I just retired as its president after nine years, and now that group has exploded, and in fact we actually have helped inspire other groups.
• 0:14
  I mean, like, it's been a huge, huge undertaking. I'll volunteer. That is now, like, Just massive. And it got recognized by the United Nations as the largest group for women in RACHP and HVAC, which is awesome. And then they started INWIC, which is the International Network of Women in Cooling. And that's for starting women's groups in other countries that don't have them and just building resources.
• 0:15
  And it's made up of several partners all over Europe and in India and Africa and the Netherlands and Canada and Mexico and in the States. And so I am the president of INWIC currently. And that's why I'm currently in. England right now, ready to speak for World Refrigeration Day tomorrow. Actually, as it were for a women's day that they're having here in Birmingham, England at the Installer Show.
• 0:16
  So that is the shortest truncated version of my story that I can give. I love it. I know each one of your stories and I've talked to all of you. We could be here for hours and hours, but I love that. And all this stuff is going to be in description. So go down and check out the description from all the panelists and the guests here, because this is how you want to get involved and you want to connect with them.
• 0:17
  And we'll talk about that again. So thank you so much, Colleen. So Jessica, me and Jessica, once again, we go back many years now through social media. That's when we first connected on Instagram. So this is the real world today is that we meet industry experts through social media. Then we started meeting at events like CMPX and we've been on podcasts together, and this is This is how you want to grow your network and Jessica is in the field crushing a day in day out.
• 0:18
  She's actually in the field today to do this talk. And I'm super excited to have her. Jessica, do you want to do a quick introduction of yourself, please? Yeah. Thanks Trevor. Thanks so much for having me. I'm a, so I'm not a mute, right? Yeah. I'm good. So, yeah. So my name is Jessica. I am a, I'm currently an HVACR apprentice here in Vancouver, BC.
• 0:19
  In British Columbia, our apprenticeships is four years and 7, 200 hours. And I'm currently about three quarters of the way through that. What should have taken me four years is probably going to end up taking me about seven years. But what I find so interesting is that my dad was always in refrigeration.
• 0:20
  It's in my family. I work with my family and in our family business. And it never occurred to me that I could do this job until later in life. And the more I am in, in, in this industry, the more fascinating and interesting it is to me. It's just so fascinating. So that is why I'm so active on social media is to really promote this industry to everybody, that this is an option for them.
• 0:21
  And it's so interesting and rewarding and challenging. And I just love this industry. So I also do a lot of social media. I have my own HVAC Jest sort of brand that I'm trying to grow here. And then I also have a little YouTube channel. It's called the HVAC Diaries, where I do a vlog of my, my job basically every week.
• 0:22
  And I'm also part of an organization called Women in HVAC R Canada. Which is sort of like a, an offshoot of the women in HVAC down in the States that Colleen was speaking about. So, lots going on, lots happening. I love it. And that, and that's what it's all about. This is, when you are an expert in your field, when you're passionate, this is, we have a lot going on.
• 0:23
  All the time and I I'm really thankful that you're here today, Jessica. And my, our next panelist is Ashley Fuller. I mean, actually, once again, we go back way, way back, even my years working at Copeland we've done a couple of podcasts together, so definitely go and check the podcast out that I did with Ashley.
• 0:24
  It was great conversation. And she's been in the industry just like me for, for decades, crushing it. And the experience she had back then versus now, it hasn't. And we're gonna get into that as, as well. Ashley, why, why don't you give a quick introduction to everyone? Thanks, Trevor. Thanks again for having me.
• 0:25
  This is a very insta inspiring panel to be a part of. I have a little bit of a different journey and I'm, I am I actually studied food science at university and ended up knowing that I wanted to do something in the food business. but not necessarily work as a technician in a lab. And Hussman actually had a sales trainee program.
• 0:26
  So when I was finishing my degree, I thought, you know what, why not throw my hat in the ring for that job and, and see how it goes. And then when I got here, I realized that I do have a passion for the grocery retailing business. I love grocery stores. And all the little intricacy, intricacies of putting them together.
• 0:27
  And then I realized very quickly I needed to get my refrigeration skills up to speed. So I've been learning and learning. I, you know, don't have the same on the tools experience. But I've been on a lot of job sites and I, I love riding along with the technicians and learning as much as I can.
• 0:28
  So after being with Hussman for a few years, I went and worked for Copeland worked in the control side of the business. And then I had an opportunity to spend some time in the variable frequency drive area of the business, and then came back to Hussman, and I've spent a lot of time working on energy and carbon reduction programs, so that's kind of my specialty, and I, I think that there's going to be a lot of opportunities for decarbonization in the future.
• 0:29
  And I, I like Brandy, I'm at the 20 year mark in my career and thought, okay this career this industry has given so much to me. How can I kind of start turning the tables and giving back to other people who want to get into this exciting industry? Yeah. I love it and this is it. This is, this is a massive panel.
• 0:30
  You can hear the experience from the, the women that are on this panel and, and the things that they have done. And we're going to dive into some great questions on some of the things that they've done to some of the things that they seen, and this is important. They put the work in. They put the work in through some of the hardest times in the refrigeration industry.
• 0:31
  And this is why we want to get into this conversation on diversity and equality because I've been training a lot of women from around the world coming into my training programs and we've talked about some of their successes. Some of their challenges and, and where we can make this industry and take this industry, because I really believe there's so much opportunity for women inside this industry who can help ignite it.
• 0:32
  Because of the things that you've got, all of you've done over the last few decades, putting in the work, working under You know, now working with family, which is hard right off the bat, then working in with refrigeration on top of that is even another challenge on that. So I'm excited for these conversations.
• 0:33
  We're going to dive into some of the first questions here. I do have some of the people that are watching I popped it up and you see, there's a really great animation of me there so I'm changing my look. But Jessica, I'll start with you, right? How has diversity and equality contributed to a driving innovation and growth in the refrigeration industry based on your experience?
• 0:34
  Well, I'll say my, I feel like my experience is very minimal. I, I still feel like a little tiny baby in this industry. Yeah, like I still haven't even gone through my apprenticeship yet. And I, I keep hearing that the learning only starts once you're a journeyman. So I still feel like I've got a long way to go.
• 0:35
  So I'm not quite sure what I personally, like my experience has, has contributed. I just think that it's just so important that not only in our industry, but in every industry, like across the board that we have diversity and equality, because it really just brings. A different set of skills and opinions and thought ideas to the table.
• 0:36
  And I think that's really important to be inclusive because our industry really touches every single person on the planet. And we really need to take that into account. And I like what you said there, that the diversity ideas and that's the big thing. I've read a book that was recommended by Steve Gill, which is, who's on the call today.
• 0:37
  It was called Rebel Ideas by Matthew Syed. And it's about diversity thinking and inclusion and how diversity. Thinking will change the, an industry, a company, an organization you do so much in social media and you will get a lot of messages from different people and different walks of life from around the world.
• 0:38
  How has that, because when you started, it was new to you. You're making your first video on HVAC and showing people how to do installs and do things the proper way. How has that changed over the last say, three or four years from doing this stuff on social media and being in contact with people? With different people.
• 0:39
  Well, it's really cool because there are so many cool innovations and technical, a lot of technological changes in our industry. I mean, we're going through a pretty big change right now with our refrigerants and you know, that, that's a big thing. It's been really great over the last few years and the innovations that are coming out are so cool and they make it easier to do our jobs every day.
• 0:40
  And that's why I do think that it, there's never been a better time to be a woman in this industry because yes, it might be a little bit more challenging for us. But there are tools and technologies that are coming out that are making it easier for us to do our jobs. So yeah, I think there's so much cool stuff that's already come out and that is still going to come out.
• 0:41
  I think, yeah. And I totally agree with AI technology, the way we learn and adapt. And I, I really think. Getting into groups just like the, the women at H HVACR Canada is a good stepping stone to, to start to learn and see some of these ideas because these groups that you're, you're in is that.
• 0:42
  There are a lot of forward thinkers and a lot of people looking to see that those next steps in the industry. So thank you so much, Jessica. Colleen, I want to ask you a few questions because you've been, your family has been in the industries 60 years. You said, and and you've been part of the industry on and off.
• 0:43
  So you were out of the industry. You're like, I don't want anything to do with this, but now you're in full tilt. Nine years as president of women at HVAC are on the board. And how does, how have you seen it as a change? Because you've been in it since you were a kid. Right. So how did you see that? How have you seen the industry change and diversity and equality?
• 0:44
  So as a kid, it was kind of locked down to the, very much the local aspect of the industry. So of course, having a contracting company, you don't really have an idea of how big the industry really is. And of course, most of the time it was sorting copper or answering the phone. So very, very small experience into that.
• 0:45
  And I just thought it was super lame. So it took me being fired to actually, you know, go out there and explore the world and try a couple of jobs and then come back. Since joining though, and since like last 15 years being involved and like, learning all sides of it through the marketing company and getting involved in the manufacturers wholesalers.
• 0:46
  And of course, Lemme HBCR, getting to go to the technical schools, getting to speak to schools, being to talk to technicians, female technicians, female business owners. I feel like we kind of already kind of hit that hit the nail on the head is a lot of the creativity. It's a different perspective. Women have a different tendency to see things differently.
• 0:47
  I think it's just because of sometimes cyber emotionally are wired to things. I've seen it in creativity. I've seen it in a lot of the technicians that I know, and the ones that have been scholarship winners in the past have gone on to invent things. that are being added to catalogs for tools and stuff that weren't on the market before.
• 0:48
  So I do think that diversity really does drive the creativity and gets us out of our boxes and challenges a new way of thinking in order to bring more ideas, more efficiencies. And so that's kind of probably the number one thing I see if we're, we're talking about one of the most important factors.
• 0:49
  The other is like most important factor for diversity is a lot of it is like filling jobs that we need to fill and looking in a broader, broader range of people, especially considering women make up 51 percent of the population. That's something I think it's overlooked a lot and underestimated. You know, we talk about that as far as filling the skills gap.
• 0:50
  I think that that's one of the places to start. Yeah. And I, and I like some of your points there because refrigeration meds or wouldn't be where it is. If it wasn't for my wife and some of the ideas that she helped me come up with to develop to where we are today. So, and it, it is she thinks differently than me and is different and creatively and gives some great ideas for me to roll out these amazing programs.
• 0:51
  So, and I think this is the same thing that we can have. In the industry, for example, my wife never worked on the tools a day, but she can troubleshoot, troubleshoot a lot of refrigeration technicians out there from just like conversations you heard over the years and picking up on it. And I think this is some of these ideas we need to bring in here.
• 0:52
  Cause I, like I said earlier, I have some women that come into my programs and they're ACE students and they're going out to the field and doing the stuff and coming back and. Really top in that class. A lot of the times when I'm doing these courses, so I'm, I'm excited to see how we can get more women involved in it because I know it will help ignite it.
• 0:53
  Like I said earlier, so that that's fantastic, Colleen. So I appreciate you talking like that because one of the things that it caught me too, is like. This happens to everyone, but you have to get fired before you realize that refrigeration and HVAC is the thing. You know what I mean? There are boring parts of the industry, but this is any industry.
• 0:54
  But you got in and now you're in it for so many decades and it's like, man, I want to be here. Do you want to elaborate on that? Well, I think that's, that's part of it is we all have a story of falling into it somehow. Everybody on this call, it's not like any of us graduate school and we're like, this is what I'm going to do.
• 0:55
  Very few of us had that, that path. And that's something we want to change so that that is a path option. Like people actually see it as an option. But currently a lot of us have a backstory falling into it. And some of us were fortunate to have family in it, which made it a lot easier for us to enter.
• 0:56
  But once you're in, You're in. I think that's the biggest takeaway is like, none of us would willingly leave the industry because you have so many connections. It's so lucrative. It's such a giving industry. The people are fantastic. You'll always have a job. Every single person on this call has a safety boat at any time because they can pick up and start somewhere new and get hired immediately because we're there.
• 0:57
  Well, we're pretty incestuous as an industry, but you'll know the same person with like three different job titles throughout their lifetime, just because nobody wants to leave. And I think that that's a great thing to, to bring students into and say, there's safety here. There's longevity, there's, there's money.
• 0:58
  There's a need. And I think with so many other industries having a lot of turmoil after how work has changed. Whether that be virtually or online or by pandemic or whatever, we stayed the same. We have advancements, but we also have job security. Yeah. And I love that. And that's so true about this industry.
• 0:59
  Ashley, I would love to ask you, like, can you share like a personal story? That really changed your career because you said, you know, you weren't, you were, you had a food, food and beverage, not food and beverage sorry, food science, the food science background, go to university. And then, you know, all of a sudden now.
• 1:00
  You're a leader at your company and really changing the way it's been done in the supermarket industry by building relationship networking, which you started in one of the hardest, like really a hard time for women getting into the industry, but your journey has been different than a lot of people.
• 1:01
  There's ups and downs. And you made it to you know, you pushed through any of the challenges and kept going forward to where you're at today. Do you want to talk about some of the milestones that, and those stepping stones to get you to where you're at in the refrigeration industry? Yeah, I think that for me, the most important thing has been mentorship.
• 1:02
  And I had a piece of advice very early on, which is find a few people, whether they be male or female in this business that you can call any time of the day or night and ask any stupid questions. And they will, they will answer you and help, help move you forward. And I've been very lucky with the mentors I've had.
• 1:03
  They have thrown me some opportunities, called me when I needed a little extra push to stay involved. Checked up on me when I was taking, you know, my breaks, having my family, making sure I was coming back, all those kinds of things. So I think mentorship is the most important thing. You know, I got told, Hey, go back to school, get your MBA, see where that will take you in this business.
• 1:04
  And, and that was a really great experience for me too. I think that just recently I heard Brandy speak and it really opened my eyes to what else I can be doing. I think that. It's important, like Colleen said, retention is going to be very important. And I think it's important for us to demonstrate different pathways in this business.
• 1:05
  And at different stages of your life, different things are going to work for you. And I think you know, by us working together, we can really show people like, you know, there, there may be a time when you do want to get off the tools and have more of an office job. Or a job where you could be home to meet the bus in the evening.
• 1:06
  And some of the points that Brandy made really made me think, you know flexibility is going to be important. And I've been very lucky to work for companies that have given me the flexibility that I needed when I needed it. I love that. And, and Brandy, how about you? What are some of the significant milestones in your career that really helped you along your journey in refrigeration?
• 1:07
  Because you're, you're an excellent technician out there. You can out troubleshoot so many, so many people in the industry and you put the work in. Once again, you put the work in for decades and you had to put the work and you had to work the way it was, is you had to work harder. To then, then the next person.
• 1:08
  And this is what it was for a lot, you know, for a long time and which was good. This is who, what made you who you are today, which is great. But what are some of those milestones that you've seen that really helped your journey along? Yeah, I think first and foremost, and I'm sure Jess was looking forward to this for me right up until the end, and I've never been at a company with another female.
• 1:09
  I've been the first one through the door. I didn't, I didn't go to trade school with another female. I didn't go to gas school with another female. So for me although I'll talk about a milestone, what kind of kept me going in the beginning like most people is you have to have that thing that you're reaching for, right?
• 1:10
  So when it got really difficult as an apprentice and I kind of got, I got, I guess, lucky and unlucky all at the same time. I was actually a 306A apprentice first because I couldn't get into HVAC. So I couldn't get signed up. I couldn't get hired. I had wonderful interview questions like, are you here to find a husband?
• 1:11
  Are, are you going to get pregnant and things like that? And so I, I took the first red seal I could get because I was already 30 years old and they, I actually got offered a plumbing apprenticeship in construction. So I took it. And then I guess the first thing that happened is I was the first female to compete at skills skills Ontario in the heating systems competition in 2007.
• 1:12
  And as a result, I placed third and a recruiter called me from a very large company. to offer me my 313 apprenticeship. So I, I switched trades at that point. So really competing at skills was a game changer for me. And I was lucky enough to have my first instructor that against all odds, he chose me as one of his two students to enter in the competition.
• 1:13
  So, you know, I really owe my HVAC career to, to Dan for that. But then again, when I got into HVAC, what I didn't know, I, I was from construction. So you know, I showed up on a job site every morning. I got a set of work orders and I did my job as part of a crew. Fast forward to when I end up starting at my first HVAC company and it was, here's your truck.
• 1:14
  Here's your flip phone. Here's a fax machine. Bye. Like, we'll see you later. And I had to move to a new city for my apprenticeship, so I, this was before the, this beautiful technology, so I was printing out, like, Google Maps at night to try to figure out how to get to jobs and wholesalers, and, and it was difficult I definitely felt the vibe right away was very different, I would say.
• 1:15
  In general, we have a tough gig. It's a tough trade. I call it the God complex. Now years later plumbing was, I don't know. They just seemed a little more jovial and accepting when I was on the construction sites after I proved I would work. So as an apprentice, my first milestone was, okay, once I become a mechanic, I got to get licensed, right?
• 1:16
  So I'm sure Jess is super looking forward to like writing her CFQ. So I did that, right? That was my first major milestone. I wrote my CFQ. I became a journey person. And as Jess already alluded to it was really just the beginning of my journey. The caveat to that for me though, was actually as a female my life got much more difficult after I became licensed.
• 1:17
  So there's a theory on that. It's called from pet to threat. So it's super cute. When, you know, Oh, she wants to be a mechanic. How cute is that? But then I became a mechanic. And all of a sudden it actually there be there with that came a lot more weight. So you know, I got asked questions actually from from service managers from foreman.
• 1:18
  Do you, do I think I deserve to make the same amount of money as my male counterpart? I was asked how do I feel about taking a man's job? And things like that. And as we know today with the current labor shortage not only, I, I definitely was deserving as we all are, right. I wrote the same license.
• 1:19
  So kind of moving forward from that, my next milestone was. You know, I guess I've never left that proving ground, you know, Trevor, you say wonderful things about us, like, it's like, oh, you know what, you're great at this, but, but really in my mind even today, I'm still that person that has to work, you know, 100 times harder, right?
• 1:20
  Because I'm still proving myself and I, and I still feel like that every morning when I get up, you know they call it that imposter syndrome, but, yeah. You know, I would get put onto jobs that I was totally unqualified for. One of one of my actually big wins was we only had one person in our company that was trained to work on a steam turbine chiller.
• 1:21
  So I was lucky enough to come up in the world and I have a lot of chiller experience, which to me is, is great. I'm really, I feel grateful for that, but yeah. So somebody trying to obviously set me up for failure they put me on this job to do a teardown on it. And I was, I was literally the least qualified.
• 1:22
  I considered myself at the time a junior chiller mechanic, even as a journey person, because it's all experience based as we know. I was able to do the job, albeit it came at a huge cost to my mental health. So looking back, I would say, you know, completing that job, you feel like it's a win, but then what, what's the downside of that?
• 1:23
  Like, you know, what did it cost me personally to get to, to do that? And then I like to fast forward, and you know, for me, I started to try to get a little bit of my self confidence, my self force back, and when I left the service van, believe it or not, some people would think you're taking a step down. But when I, when I had the courage to leave the service van, I took an in house position at a local hospital not that long ago.
• 1:24
  And you know, for me, that was a, that was a pretty significant milestone for me. It really allowed me to realize, you know my manager would get asked things like, well, how's the girl working out? I was the first female to join their facilities maintenance team. And he would say, she's the best guy I have.
• 1:25
  And to me, that was like the greatest compliment, right? He said it. If I had 10 of her in the shop, you know, it would be a game changer for the facility, you know, and again, I was coming off of a 14 year stretch of really. Really mentally being beaten down and it's very cumulative and people that have been through a cycle of abuse could attest to that.
• 1:26
  So, you know, having the courage to not just leave the industry I think that Colleen alluded to that, like, once you're in, like, I felt like, who would I be if I wasn't an age back? But I, I almost did leave, but instead I took this, I took this in house position. So, you know, for me, that was a huge milestone and it really allowed me some time to.
• 1:27
  Kind of heal and I thought that was gonna be my thing. Like I was like, okay, I'm gonna retire here We all know it's a bit of a retirement gig right when we go in house for some guys. It's cushy I had regular lunch breaks. I wasn't running an on call schedule anymore and unfortunately I still had an incident there.
• 1:28
  So now for me, my, my last big milestone was, you know, having the courage to incorporate my own business and just really throwing it all out there because when I left the field, not that long ago, it was, it was now with no strings attached, I can use my voice. I don't have to worry about. You know, some company policy or someone pulling me in and saying, you know, we don't like what it's true.
• 1:29
  Social media can have an impact on your full time job. Right? And so having the courage to kind of leave the field and start to address the elephant in our HVAC room, right? Which is, you know, Which is some of the things that people don't want to talk about, which does happen as a minority or an underrepresented group in our trade.
• 1:30
  So, you know, Fairtrade's toolbox for me, I would say is my crowning moment right now. And it comes with this huge learning curve, which is still super exciting. So I, you know, still talking, still being a part of the industry. And actually now I'm advocating not just for, for change, but measurable change, right?
• 1:31
  I put less than 50 women in Ontario, so that's, it's a big deal, right? That number hasn't changed. In 20 years, right? Yeah. I like that because a lot of people talk about they want change. And this is what Matthew Syed talks about in the rebel ideas. A lot of people talk about change, but the implementation doesn't, doesn't really happen.
• 1:32
  Or it's all the same people trying to change the same thing and not a diverse group of thinking inside there. And you, you went through and you're not the only woman that I've spoke with coming up through the industry and the trials and tribulations you had to go through. And still go through it because women getting in the industry get some of those same questions.
• 1:33
  I've talked to them, same questions. I have one one really smart refrigeration technician in one of my programs. You told me like I am at my company. I want to learn more. And I tried to get with the lead tech and they don't want to work with me at all because I am a woman. You know what I mean? That still happens in the industry.
• 1:34
  But what I, I see happening now is that more people are, are, cause it's hard. It's hard to speak out on yourself, especially when you're all by yourself. But I think there's bigger groups. Like what Colleen's in and Jessica's in and the women in HVAC, people to support you more than they did 20 years ago.
• 1:35
  There wasn't as much support group and now what you're doing with Fair Trades is really helping mentor in these when you do have problems. Because the same thing does happen with other groups as well. Yeah. And I see, I see this. It's not only women. I see a lot of groups in the refrigeration industry not getting the opportunity because of this, where they're from, their culture and all that.
• 1:36
  At the, at the end of the day, we are, we are one, one world, right? World refrigeration day. We are one group in the world where there are 15 million of us all together. How do we get more people and be more inclusive to help people grow? Because I want to see every, anyone in the refrigeration industry get to that next level.
• 1:37
  Because that will help support the backbone of what we're all about. Helping the world strive to perfection in the way that we can live like this. Air conditioning, cell phones, you know, electric electricity, all these things come back to refrigeration and air condition. So thank you so much, Brandy. And we'll dive into that a bit more because there is a lot of unique challenges for women in the industry.
• 1:38
  Colleen, I'd love to ask you, you've been dealing with women in the All over the world, thousands of women coming into the women in HVAC. What were some of the challenges and opportunity you've seen with these different women coming into the HVAC and refrigeration industry? So it's different. I think that's, that's something that like what Ashley and I can experience is very different from what Jessica and Brandy can experience.
• 1:39
  I can't generalize anything, but it's just two different types of pathways. So, being, that being said, in my experience, it's, it's different on a, when you're in the, the, the offices or the business or the marketing or the sales or anything like that. versus what you're doing actually in the field. And I feel like there's much more aggression in the field.
• 1:40
  It's not as, it may not be as, as rampant as it has been. I think we've made a lot of strides. It's not so much of a crazy idea. But I think that we need to recognize that there's still microaggressions happening. There's still things that are being overlooked and things that people don't think are things.
• 1:41
  I was just doing a factory tour and the factory floor didn't have a women's bathroom accessible off of it. It only had a men's room. And like, that was just something that blew my mind. They had two females on that factory floor. And I was like, whoa. And these guys really wanted to be diverse and they're amazing.
• 1:42
  And they're making those, they're making those changes. And they asked what to be changed. And I said that, and they're like, you're right. We need to do that. And it's small things that you don't need to think of, but you know what? It's, it's uninclusive. It's things that say, okay, I'm an afterthought. I'm not an intention.
• 1:43
  It's little things that we don't think about. It's you know, whether you're un, you know, you're biased and you don't even know it. I have been fortunate that I have, I personally have not experienced pushback for, for my gender in my role and, but I know that the women I have as my mentors when they were doing this 30 years before I was here, they were paving the way so that wasn't happening.
• 1:44
  I wasn't getting that. And so I know that like when I talk to my peers and stuff like that, everybody experiences stuff differently. For me, I've always found it to be kind of more of a strength. Like I'm usually the one in the room that people remember. I don't look like all the rest of, you know, the guys in the slacks and the button downs.
• 1:45
  I could really, every man dresses the same at most of these business events. And you know, it's kind of like we really stick out. And so that's made me more memorable. It's made me be able to make more contact. There are, there are advantages and disadvantages both ways. And I can only speak to my experience on it.
• 1:46
  And yet I don't want to sell short any of the millions of experiences over the last. 10 years of my career that I've heard from all over. Culture makes a big one and that can be different everywhere. Like we take for granted sometimes what we have in the U S and Canada. And I've learned a lot since joining NWIC, things that I didn't even think were things are huge, like working with Mexico right now.
• 1:47
  Oh my gosh, that, that we didn't even think, like, it would be a big deal to ever be pregnant at an office or, like, you know, be getting married pretty quickly. That's a big deal down there. That's, like, a deal breaker in most cases. So, like, there are things that we have made strides on that, like, there's no sense of arrival.
• 1:48
  I don't think, like, oh my gosh, everything's gonna be perfect. But I do think we have made strides. I do think even comparing the last 10 years to now, there are some normalcies to things that we don't consider obstacles, but there obviously can always be improvements. And what field experience is, I think is probably some of the worst of it. In my opinion, just because I feel like there is a sense of like displacement because people don't think women belong there because of the optics they've been fed all their life. And it's like, that's a part of it. And changing optics is probably some of the biggest messaging that I do in any of my advocacy for women is just starting to change the optics, whether that be movies, TV, Hollywood, even manufacturers and their advertisements.
• 1:49
  And I agree with that because depending on the companies that I work for like I work for a lot of contractors all around the world and it comes back to culture and the leadership of those organizations to really think that the, you know, On a job site that men and women technicians are equal.
• 1:50
  They can do, they can do the same work cause I've seen it and heard it so many times. Oh, well they can't lift the compressor up. I have some friends that are women in the field that can squat me. No problem. They'll, they'll squat 500 pounds and they lift compressors. No problem. So I, and it's to work smarter anyway, you shouldn't be lifting this stuff.
• 1:51
  That's. You know, so bad for your, like my back lifting compressors on the roof. That wasn't a very smart idea. There should have been a hoist to bring it up. You know what I mean? And this is where I've seen, and I've worked with women to come up with these ideas to make, why have you make it so hard at your body when we can do it this way, it's a, it's a better way than the way it was done.
• 1:52
  And I think that those ideas and thinking comes in because there has been a lot of challenge for them. So they come up with the different ideas to make it work. But those leaders in those organizations. That really include different people from around the world and, and different backgrounds really make a game changer in their company.
• 1:53
  And I see a few of the, a few companies I'm working with now that are more inclusive than others. And those companies are growing a lot faster, honestly, because they got different way of thinking. They got more different. Ideas coming into the company to make them more efficient, more better, and do it a different way than it's always been done. Jessica, I got, I'd love to, you, you've been, you're new in the industry. And like I said, you have a lot of people following you. What are some of the opportunities you see for women over the next, say three to five years? Because you're coming into some of the most exciting times. In your career, getting up to that journeyman position, journey person position.
• 1:54
  And that was one of my favorite parts, getting to that milestone. But what are some of the opportunities you see coming forward in their industry? I think there's so many opportunities for us. I, what I equate women in our industry to just like as a comparison is decarbonization slash slash electrification.
• 1:55
  I feel like it's a very hot topic right now, and it's a bit polarizing, like whether you are on board or whether you're not, it doesn't matter, it's happening, it's progress, it's happening. And I think the same is happening with women or diversity in our industry. Whether you're on board or not, however you feel about it, if you like it, if you don't, it doesn't matter, it's happening, the ball is rolling and we are going.
• 1:56
  I don't think it's going to happen overnight, by any, by any means, we've come a long way without having this diversity in our industry and now we can't just dump it on like, oh, now we're all 100 percent equal. That's never going to happen, it's going to take a long time, but that ball is rolling and we should just keep with that momentum and keep going with it.
• 1:57
  I think there's so many opportunities for us, both in the field, on the tools, getting that kind of experience and skill set, and then moving it over to like what Brandy's doing. And that's really what I aspire to be one day, is to be a mentor or like a teacher, an instructor, to, to open these opportunities for women and for, for everybody really.
• 1:58
  And I, what I love about this industry too, is we've been speaking about this throughout this this discussion is that our, our careers can evolve with us as we evolve, like I'm not, I don't see myself as a 65 year old woman climbing a ladder to a rooftop unit. You know what I mean? But my, my career can evolve as I change.
• 1:59
  There's so many opportunities. I love that because that, that is it. The, the, some of the, the, the best people, salespeople, project managers, business owners were actually technicians in the field. And, and I see that too. I see a lot of what Brandy has done. My friend just sent a Lisa Jean cook, all these women in the industry who's been in it for a long time coming up.
• 2:00
  And proving themselves time and time again, when they get outside of the, say the, the technician role and they take these mentorship role, it's huge for the industry, first of all, but it's, it's a game changer because this is. Journey, refrigeration is a journey. I'm on my third career in refrigeration right now.
• 2:01
  Yeah. Refrigeration mentor. And this is what I really try to talk about with everybody that I, I work with that, what does that career path look like for you? And, and starting out as a technician, definitely as a woman is a, is a lot harder started starting out than, than when I started out not knowing anything.
• 2:02
  But if you put the work in and you learn the technical side, You can do any high level role in refrigeration because I see it having that background and understanding the thermodynamics, understanding everything to do with the, the awesomeness of refrigeration because a lot of people, Oh, well, what's refrigeration while I just opened my fridge and pull out some milk and it's cold, you know, but behind that, There's a designer, there is a, a person assembling, there's a service person, there's an installer.
• 2:03
  There's so many different things, which is so, so cool, and this is the opportunity that's out there today, which I'm excited about. Yeah. So we talked about mentorship and mentoring. I was, and I know earlier, Ashley, you said that you had some key mentors along the way. What are some of the things that, that you learned from them being mentored in the, in the industry to some of the things that you're hoping to pass down to some mentees as we go forward.
• 2:04
  Cause we talked about this multiple times. You're like, Trevor, how do I help more people? How do I help more women? How many, how do I help more men get into the industry and just really offer support for them from all my experience throughout my career? What are some of the things that your mentors helped you with?
• 2:05
  And, and what are some of the things that. You would like to share with some mentees. I think that one of my early mentors was very good at pushing me to not stand in the back of the room. And if, if you get to know me, I'm not a stand in the back of the room person anyway. So I didn't need a, a big push, but own your seat at the table, put your hand up, grab the opportunities when you're, when they come your way.
• 2:06
  I have been thrown a lot of challenges and have, have grabbed them just to see what's gonna happen. And, and like Colleen said, I think it has been a bit easier to be one of the few women in the room. And you can look at that, you can look at that any number of ways. Being the only woman in the room sometimes has been an advantage because people have said, well, what is your opinion?
• 2:07
  So when you get asked for your opinion, offer it. This book has become a little bit controversial, but Sheryl Sandberg's Lean In was a pretty important book for me. Just own, own your seat at the table and don't be afraid to, to participate in things. And I like that. I think that's, it's very, very important because I see this.
• 2:08
  Once again, it is in my courses where I ask a question and the people that participate and that I'll ask them a question because there's sometimes people don't answer back, you know, they just stay, stay quiet. The people that, that do offer up opinion that do talk about it, this is the way change happens and things happen.
• 2:09
  So it's things that you want to, to think about. And that's really good advice by your mentor because. I've been shut down so many times. I've failed at so many things. I've been said no to so many times, but I didn't, I didn't give up. And that's what I see. All of you here today on the panel, you're, you're people that don't give up that you're going to push forward.
• 2:10
  And for any of you listening out there, this is what you got to, this is what the refrigeration industry is, is about. So there's going to be some challenges. There's going to be some obstacles, but. Keeping on the path of that refrigeration journey is probably the most important thing. And then when you're in, you're in, you don't, you don't want to leave it.
• 2:11
  And then you find. New people inside the industry, global, we're a global community. Now we got people from many different countries on, on the call today here listening. So thank you for sharing that. What are some of the things actually that you would like to share or pass down to people that may come into the role?
• 2:12
  Say someone reaches out to you and say, Ashley, I'd love some advice. I'd love to get into what you're doing or get into the industry. What is some advice you'd like to give to them? I think the biggest piece of advice is just. Be open minded. Be open minded about the different opportunities out there. Don't be afraid to try something that you think is not for you. There's, there's just a lot of different angles in this business, as you can see from the people on in this group. So when someone offers you something, give it, give it a try. I love that. Open mindedness is, is, is a big thing and I, growth mindset, Trevor, you talk a lot about growth mindset. I think it's just the way you look at it. Is it, I'm the only woman in the room or I get to be the only woman in the room. Let's take advantage of what opportunities that, that brings with it. I love that. And, and Brandy, you own a company on mentoring and you mentored so many people from, from women, men, you train so many people. What are some of the things and how important is mentorship for you and how is that going to help?
• 2:13
  How do you believe it's going to help the refrigeration industry in, in years to come? Okay, so I want to clarify so Fairtrade isn't, isn't really about mentorship. And although I love that we're talking about this if Ashley heard me, mentorship is just one piece of the puzzle. And unfortunately we are, we are going to help a lot of people through mentorship.
• 2:14
  And I know a lot of women that, myself included, that might not have made it to the finish line. You know, I had one woman, the first day I had to get out of my truck. On a job site of 300 guys and me, my first construction site, I phoned the only female I'd met in a pre apprentice carpentry program.
• 2:15
  And I wouldn't have got her to the truck had it not been for her. However, having said that what I've learned over the course of this, this past little while is mentorship alone, although very important for an individual, It is not going to help evolve all by itself the culture of the skilled trades.
• 2:16
  So for me with, with fair trades, my, my work is really surrounding education, which I'm sure you, you, you can relate to Trevor. We grow through education, right? We know better, so we have to do better. So, so really for me, I'm coming from a top down approach. Employers have the, have the ability to make a difference if, you know what, they lead by example, you know, and, and it starts from the top down, organizational leaders, large unions, large companies it just takes somebody brave to say, you know what, We are going to do a bit of an overhaul of this system and we're going to, we're going to do things differently and that, that starts through education and it actually starts for me, my mind shift is really, has changed as well.
• 2:17
  Women are definitely, we've got these great groups together, women in HVACR Canada and the one in the States, again, phenomenal organizations. But what I found is when we talk as lady tradies in our silos. It's phenomenal, but we're not talking to the right people to facilitate the change and, you know, yourself, Trevor and our male allies, really the strength is in the numbers and the, and the greater change will come with our male allies standing up and saying, you know what, that isn't okay.
• 2:18
  And and we can do better and all it takes is that one person. We all want to fit in somehow. We want to get along, but I really believe, you know, the change is going to come with our male allies in this industry. So. By educating, you know, your current male team and letting them have the floor to ask the uncomfortable questions, you know, I'll say from one personal example, although it didn't work out at the hospital before I joined the team, they tried and I'd never heard a company do this before.
• 2:19
  So a few months and I learned just a quick little story from my HVAC partner at the hospital. I put my two weeks in obviously like a professional before I started. So during their, their usual safety meeting, the manager came in and said, yeah, we hired another HVAC mechanic. The guys are like, yeah, when does he start?
• 2:20
  Well, they start in two weeks. Perfect. What's his name? Well, her name is Brandy and a hush fell over the shop and Rob quickly could see the body language change. Guys were looking at each other. Whispers were starting to ripple. So my manager took the opportunity to say. You know, it is the first female to join our team.
• 2:21
  What are your concerns, guys? Like, tell me your thoughts. How are you feeling about this? And, you know, albeit it might sound insignificant, one of the guys said, Well, does that mean we can't, we can't the weather stop anymore? And, yeah, the manager was like, Yes, you'll have to use the change rooms. Prior to my arrival, you know what?
• 2:22
  We had a uniform delivered to us at the hospital, so the guys changed at their workbenches, right? And that was that. You know, then, then there was other concerns over maybe some of the, the banter and, and the vocabulary in the shop, which obviously if anyone knows me, not that much of that would be a problem, but just the effort that went in to have a conversation with his existing male team and nip those pain points in the bud, right?
• 2:23
  Because as the first female in the door, I can, I can attest to the fact that. The first part of my job isn't fixing equipment. When I'm breaking in a new team, the first part of my job is actually to manage all the personalities coming at me and I'd have to make everyone else in the room feel better. I have to make them feel comfortable.
• 2:24
  It's not about me, right? It's about making them feel comfortable. So I think that mentorship is so important in one facet. But really, overall, my drive and my passion, it's really ensuring that the numbers go up. Right? I want, I want women to be a part of this industry and I want them to have longevity.
• 2:25
  And like Jeff said, that doesn't mean that we're going to be, you know, 65 years old. I mean, there's probably most men don't want to be 65 and climbing, climbing ship ladders, right, Trevor? But it means that you're going to be able to get your license and you're going to be able to continue to work in the field to have that growth experience on the equipment.
• 2:26
  The statistics show really that most women will become a journey person and they will immediately take that license for the few that make it to the finish line. And they'll use it to secure a more female friendly position somewhere else. Like you said, maybe that's in sales or project management, right?
• 2:27
  So, mentorship, I think, obviously, I'll attest that I wouldn't be sitting here today without it. But have I seen a huge cultural shift or evolution through my two decades with mentorship or habits? So it's one really important piece of the puzzle, but yeah, I think, you know, moving forward, we've got to really kind of open up those blinders and get a little more creative and kind of like we all would know in this industry, like let's not be afraid to make a mistake.
• 2:28
  Let's not be afraid to fail. Right? Like. Let's just try something new and see if it works, because we are entering, you know, like it or not, the changes here, women represent 52 percent of the population now, right? So, like someone else alluded to, where are we going to fill those labor shortages? We've got to look outside the box, right?
• 2:29
  To underrepresented groups. And you know what? In order to do that, We've got to start talking to our existing teams and see what we can do to make sure that it's a viable career path for those underrepresented groups. I think what you said there too is the conversation. It was great that that leader talked with his team about it because it is change and people don't like change.
• 2:30
  It doesn't matter if it's men or women, it's just human, human nature that we don't like change. And I think when you get the leaders involved and, and not just for. You know, the, the optics of it, this is where we need real leaders to, like you said, to, to talk about it and discuss it, and we could dive deeper and deeper and all the opportunities and the challenges, but I really believe too, as well, it is training.
• 2:31
  It is education. It is mentorship, which is the three cornerstones of refrigeration mentor. And focusing on helping others grow and succeed. I'm super excited for the refrigeration industry because it is World Refrigeration Day, and there's so much many advantages for anybody in this industry from traveling the world to making six figures, and I'm super excited to see the growth.
• 2:32
  I'd love to hear your final thoughts. Colleen on. On what you see the next steps for refrigeration in general and what you're excited about over the next few years. Well, I was kind of inspired a little bit by what Brandy said. So I did want to add this. It's a question that comes up a lot from running many, many booths. But you know, it's you know, our men allowed are in these groups. We have these groups for a reason. And are the groups solving everything? I think the groups create a platform for issues. And honestly, there's, there's no group that's like men aren't allowed. And I think that that's where we are in a predominantly, and I say this very intentionally, a predominantly male industry, not a male dominated industry.
• 2:33
  I think words have power. But we're in a predominantly male industry and you cannot, we can't have traction without the participation and support of men. And some of my best mentors, some of my best you know, contacts in this industry are men and some of our best supporters, sponsors, advocates. And it really, there is no room for like, Oh, like men are the enemy or like that.
• 2:34
  I have found in my experience, and I hate that this came out, but I'm going to say it. Some of the biggest obstacles I've had in my career have been other women. And I don't think we talk about that enough. And, and, and it's something I think we got, I'll consciously be aware of it, aware of, and to come back around to that growth mindset is also having a, a.
• 2:35
  health check on your own mental state when how you're approaching situations as a woman to live in conflict or a man to live in conflict. They're both very, very different. And so I guess I, I guess for anybody coming in or thinking about the, you know, as far as this as a career, I think mentorship is a big puzzle piece because if you're coming in, mentorship is going to help you.
• 2:36
  Stay in this career. However, is it going to change the needles for where we're going forward? Everything like that. I think I go back to the optics thing quite a bit, is being cognizant of what you're putting out there, being very transparent about what you do. Brandy and Jessica are some of the biggest examples of like putting forward content.
• 2:37
  That changes people's mind and I got that and you keep saying Jessica's new and it kind of cracks me up a little bit just because I remember working the booth six years ago, people coming up and being like, you don't justice to HVAC Jess. I see her prints all the time. I don't know who she was at the time.
• 2:38
  But that was a reoccurring theme. People would recognize her stuff from Instagram. She was one of the first ones out there. So it's like, you don't know what you want to pack, but being transparent in what we do, bringing more spotlights to more stories and bringing out there, it allows people to picture themselves in these jobs.
• 2:39
  And that's something we all have to do. Men, women, whatever, is we have to change the narrative. And a lot of it is optical. Because we think about, we can talk about it, but we're not taking responsibility for what we're putting out there and what people are seeing and taking in. That's movies, that's books, that's everything.
• 2:40
  So that's just. Something I would actually like want to end with is, is be cognizant of what advertising you're putting out for your own jobs and what pictures you're using. What language, because you're painting the picture for the next generation. Yeah. I love that. Ashley, final thoughts on where you see the future of refrigeration.
• 2:41
  Cause you're, you're involved. You, you see, you see what the, some of the future is you're with one of the largest manufacturers in the world for supermarket refrigeration. What, what do you, what do you think? What are you excited about in the coming years? Well, there is so much change coming so much change in equipment design, store design.
• 2:42
  I mean, I know this is about mentoring and bringing other people into the industry, but I, I would say. The exciting thing is there's going to be so much to be passionate about. Are you interested in design? Then pick your lane, focus on that and, and see what you can bring to the industry from that.
• 2:43
  Are you interested in decarbonization? I think that's going to be huge in the next few years. And there's just a lot of room for. Experts and, and growth, pick, pick an area, focus on it, become an expert in something and see where you can go with that. I agree with that. There is so much job every day.
• 2:44
  And someone's emailed me saying, do you know anyone for this role or that role? And for the refrigeration industry, we're looking, we're crying for someone who just understands refrigeration. So there's so much opportunity to come. Jessica, your final thoughts on the exciting things for the refrigeration industry.
• 2:45
  Cause you're brand new. You only been in the industry for six plus seven years. I think, but I'm just going to say what Ashley said. Decarbonization I think is a huge push in our industry. I think, I don't even know what's going to come. I mean, there's just so much technical, technological advances and everything in our industry.
• 2:46
  It's so fascinating. Yeah, I'm not really sure, like, I feel so new and yeah, just making my way through and yeah. You're pretty new with all those videos you're crushing out there. So I really appreciate you doing that and keep doing it. You know what I mean, paving the path for other women out there to, to make these videos, to get out of their comfort zone.
• 2:47
  Because I do a lot of training with people on content, men and women, just to, you know, it is something that's hard to do, but when you have a passion and you care about helping others, that's, that's what I can see that you do. So I appreciate that, Jessica. Yeah, thanks. Brandy, final thoughts on the excitement of refrigeration and, and how you, you, you're excited about the coming future in your journey in refrigeration.
• 2:48
  Yeah, just a quick thought. I'm just excited about the tools, man. Like, I love the innovation on the tool side. Although not refrigeration, I tested out the Hilti exoskeleton recently at an event. Like, what a game changer on the things that our technicians are inventing. Like, if that's not an incentive enough, like not only Are is this industry just exciting in general, but we are the game changers, right?
• 2:49
  It's technicians that are are paving the way not only through, you know, mentorship education and all these great things But also with our tool innovation, I mean how many of our tools are you know, bluetooth wireless? It's just it's incredible So lots of exciting things to come and even as a as an instructor That really gets young people excited about being a part of our industry.
• 2:50
  You know, even the VR training, we could go on and on. We could do this all day, guys. But anyway, it's been amazing and I'm just stoked to to celebrate our day together. So thanks for having me. Well, I want to thank all of you for taking the time because I know you're, you're all crazy busy. You're in refrigeration.
• 2:51
  This is what it's all about. On rural refrigeration, they taking the time to be with me. It means a lot to me. And I appreciate the conversation cause I know we can have lots more deeper conversations on, on a lot of these different topics in the refrigeration industry, but I, I really appreciate you taking the time.
• 2:52
  I appreciate all the people that, that are here and listening to your great stories and continue to listen. So head to the refrigeration mentor podcast and listen to the other podcasts. They've been on and continue to enjoy this beautiful refrigeration, world refrigeration day, because if it wasn't for us in refrigeration, the world wouldn't be where it is today.
• 2:53
  So I thank all of you for putting the time in for the refrigeration and HVAC industry. And I will, and I know we will continue to grow and flourish and be one of the strongest steel trades. And I love it. So I want to thank all of you for taking the time. Once again, in the show notes, check out Colleen, Ashley, Jessica, Brandy, go take a look at their websites, go connect with them on LinkedIn or Instagram or Facebook, and get a conversation going with them because they, they are people that want to train you, mentor you and educate you about.
• 2:54
  The, the way the industry was to the way the industry is going. I'm super excited about this. I want to thank all of you again, and I appreciate all your time. Thanks, Trevor.