Latest / The You Project / #1561 Doctor, Doctor, Doctor - Dr. Marc Cohen

Transcript

#1561 Doctor, Doctor, Doctor - Dr. Marc Cohen · The You Project

0:00
Speaker 1: Good.
0:00
Speaker 2: I tell them at TAPS, who else would it be?
0:02
Speaker 2: Welcome to you? Project? Doctor Mark Cohen is back for
0:05
Speaker 2: that BT and I third fourth. Do you know how
0:07
Speaker 2: many times you've been here?
0:08
Speaker 1: Doc?
0:09
Speaker 2: So few?
0:10
Speaker 1: Therefore, Yeah, fun.
0:14
Speaker 2: How's life?
0:15
Speaker 1: Oh that's awesome. I've been bouncing around the world and
0:21
Speaker 1: doing good things since I've retired. I've never been busier.
0:23
Speaker 1: And yeah, I've built in New Zealands last week. I
0:26
Speaker 1: mean Arizona next week. I me in Melbourne this week.
0:29
Speaker 1: So what's this stuff?
0:30
Speaker 2: What's the stuff that you're doing, what's got your attention
0:32
Speaker 2: and what's got you excited?
0:36
Speaker 1: What I'm really excited about is I'm channeling or rediscovering
0:40
Speaker 1: medical practices that were really common a thousand years ago.
0:44
Speaker 1: So a thousand years ago there was in the height
0:46
Speaker 1: of the Persian Empire, there was a guy called Advisena
0:49
Speaker 1: who wrote that he wrote a textbook that they saved
0:51
Speaker 1: the most read textbook of all time for the canon
0:54
Speaker 1: of medicine. And in those times in Persia, he was
0:57
Speaker 1: doing contrast basing, so he was doing her mum firsteen
1:00
Speaker 1: rooms and saunas and cold plunge, and he was combining
1:03
Speaker 1: that with oxymals and oxymals. Oxymel means acid honey, where
1:09
Speaker 1: you mix vinig with honey, and that was the basis
1:12
Speaker 1: of medicine in ancient Persia. In fact, there was a
1:15
Speaker 1: basi of medicine. Hippocrates time and hypocative says that food
1:18
Speaker 1: be thy medicine and medicine bee thy food well, viegar
1:20
Speaker 1: and foods. They're both medicines and you can mix them together.
1:25
Speaker 1: And in ancient Persia a thousand years ago, they had
1:27
Speaker 1: twelve hundred recipes for these oxymals. It was like that
1:31
Speaker 1: was the form of medicine you took. And I've just
1:34
Speaker 1: sort of rediscovered this. So I've got a you know,
1:36
Speaker 1: I'm working with vinegar and honey and I'm making oxymals,
1:39
Speaker 1: and I'm also doing a lot with bathing on the
1:41
Speaker 1: medical director of the Poeninsula Hot Springs Group and I'm
1:44
Speaker 1: the shareholder of the hot spring in New Zealand, and
1:46
Speaker 1: I'm off to Arizona next week on a cold plunge
1:49
Speaker 1: research workshop with a small group of cold plunge researchers
1:53
Speaker 1: all talking about ice bathing. So I'm really big into
1:56
Speaker 1: the sauna and the ice bath world now, and I've
1:59
Speaker 1: been big in the herbal medicine, got to write textbooks
2:01
Speaker 1: on heable medicine, and I've been a doctor for thirty
2:04
Speaker 1: years in that space and now it's all coming in together,
2:07
Speaker 1: and I'll just only recently realized this. This was down
2:10
Speaker 1: a thousand years ago. Yeah, I call it. I call
2:13
Speaker 1: it ancient future medicine because it stays. Yeah, it's old,
2:18
Speaker 1: but it's the future.
2:20
Speaker 2: Did you say ancient future medicine?
2:22
Speaker 1: Correct putting?
2:25
Speaker 2: I think that's the title of my show. Thank you Now,
2:27
Speaker 2: I don't have to think about that at the end.
2:30
Speaker 2: How much stuff, doc, do you think that we have
2:35
Speaker 2: unlearned or just forgotten? You know, it's like you're saying
2:38
Speaker 2: a thousand years ago in Persia blah blah blah before
2:41
Speaker 2: that Hipiocrates, and like, I wonder how much genius the
2:46
Speaker 2: world has forgotten about.
2:49
Speaker 1: It's pretty clear that's the case. And I know a
2:50
Speaker 1: lot of people talk about you know, these ancient mega
2:53
Speaker 1: liths and you know go blecktly Tepe and you know
2:57
Speaker 1: the Pyramids, and there's all the technology that we don't
2:59
Speaker 1: understand how people did. But with in terms of medicine,
3:02
Speaker 1: the stuff I'm really interested in is the stuff that
3:05
Speaker 1: was so obvious that our hominy ancestors used it even
3:08
Speaker 1: before we were even human, our homony way way two
3:15
Speaker 1: million years ago. Ancestors are using it, and that every
3:18
Speaker 1: great tradition and every medical every medical practice, every master
3:23
Speaker 1: physician would prescribe these things. And they're actually so complicated
3:27
Speaker 1: we can't fully understand them. Yet they're so simple. You
3:30
Speaker 1: can do them at home with very little cost, training
3:33
Speaker 1: or equipment. And I like that. So things like hot
3:36
Speaker 1: and cold bathing, you can do that at home, just
3:38
Speaker 1: hot and cold shower. Mixing vinegar and honey, that's anyone
3:41
Speaker 1: can make vinegar, make kombucha and ignore it for six months,
3:44
Speaker 1: or turn to vinegar you mix out with honey. And
3:48
Speaker 1: you just got to a bee keeper or have your
3:49
Speaker 1: own bees. And I'm just about to get my own bees,
3:51
Speaker 1: which I'm really my sixtieth birthday and my ex wife
3:54
Speaker 1: gave me from beehives. So that's pretty exciting, you know,
3:57
Speaker 1: just my suburban bee and I'm making my own oxymors
4:02
Speaker 1: and we're expanding that. But these therapies, which are super ancient,
4:08
Speaker 1: haven't been really talked about or promoted. I spoke, I
4:13
Speaker 1: got the key opening keynote lecture of the Herbalist and
4:15
Speaker 1: Naturopaths conference a couple of weeks ago, and I asked
4:18
Speaker 1: all the audience about two three hundred natropaths there, you know,
4:21
Speaker 1: who's heard of oxymors and about it? Maybe a quarter
4:23
Speaker 1: put that put their hand up. And then when I
4:25
Speaker 1: told them oxyd memes acid mel memes, honey, this is
4:28
Speaker 1: acid vinegar that, oh yeah, the first year in the
4:31
Speaker 1: history of medicine, they mentioned that we never really talked
4:34
Speaker 1: about it. So these are things that I guess there's
4:40
Speaker 1: no industry around it because you can do it yourself.
4:43
Speaker 1: No one's selling you packets and pills and making a
4:46
Speaker 1: big about it. And also beekeeping is hard to make
4:49
Speaker 1: a massive industry because you actually need to someone on
4:52
Speaker 1: the ground tending to the bees, and you need flowers
4:56
Speaker 1: and have one person with a harvester doing one hundred
4:59
Speaker 1: thous makers. It's a small industry.
5:03
Speaker 2: And I guess with that kind of ancient medicine and
5:07
Speaker 2: all of these kind of herbal medicines, naturopathic approaches whatever,
5:14
Speaker 2: as you as you kind of intimated, it's it's not
5:18
Speaker 2: highly commercialable, commercially exploitable, right, especially so there's going to
5:23
Speaker 2: be a whole lot of industry, a whole lot of
5:26
Speaker 2: companies that don't want this to happen, you know, because and.
5:31
Speaker 1: I've seen pushback already. You know, hot and cold bathing,
5:34
Speaker 1: it's such a cheap thing to do. Were having a
5:38
Speaker 1: hot and cold shower, having an ice batha masually controlling
5:41
Speaker 1: to different ice bath companies. Now. In fact, the guys
5:43
Speaker 1: I'm going to meet in America in Arizona, they credit
5:46
Speaker 1: an ice bath company and they just exploded after Joe
5:48
Speaker 1: Rogan was promoting them. So that's and they saw, you know,
5:53
Speaker 1: really beautiful ice bath, but they're twenty grand. Yeah. Yeah,
5:57
Speaker 1: but you don't need the twenty band ice bath to
5:59
Speaker 1: do cold bathing. He just need cold water, which is
6:02
Speaker 1: pretty cheap and easily accessible. And I'm really keen to
6:07
Speaker 1: promote these ideas. I also have products, So I'm making
6:11
Speaker 1: an oximal company, and we'll sell you the best oximal.
6:13
Speaker 1: We have vinegar that we've done research on. It's high polyphenols,
6:16
Speaker 1: got two hundred probiotics. But I also teach you how
6:19
Speaker 1: to make yourself for free. That's how to create a culture.
6:22
Speaker 1: And I think what we really need on the planet
6:25
Speaker 1: right now, or what everyone needs, is to create a
6:27
Speaker 1: wellness culture and having a culture that supports your well
6:32
Speaker 1: being isn't really about making money. It's actually about making
6:36
Speaker 1: healthy people, and healthy people will create value and make money.
6:40
Speaker 1: So my first, my first objective in my life is
6:42
Speaker 1: to how do I co create a culture of wellness
6:45
Speaker 1: that can infect good health? Yeah?
6:48
Speaker 2: Yeah, like just off the top of my head, Like
6:51
Speaker 2: when we think about building a culture of wellness, so
6:55
Speaker 2: I think about obviously I'm writing this down, so food
6:59
Speaker 2: not in order of importan's food, sleep, movement, exercise, lifestyle,
7:05
Speaker 2: stress relationships. The way we socialize has an impact on
7:11
Speaker 2: fucking everything from cellular health to immune system relationships. How
7:18
Speaker 2: would you not prioritize those? But how would you? So
7:21
Speaker 2: if we talk about like we know that people that
7:24
Speaker 2: are lonely and disconnected and isolated and don't feel loved
7:27
Speaker 2: or seen or you know, that affects their immune system
7:30
Speaker 2: and that affects everything from their cellular health up right,
7:34
Speaker 2: And we know that food plays a big role. We
7:36
Speaker 2: know that, you know, not just micros and macros, but
7:40
Speaker 2: all the other shit around that. And then we know
7:42
Speaker 2: that sleep is a big deal, and we know that movement, exercise,
7:47
Speaker 2: you know, incidental activity, occupational activity, lifestyle, stress, How would
7:53
Speaker 2: you sort those and what's missing from those jigsaw pieces?
7:57
Speaker 1: So I've been trying to sort it's out for years.
8:00
Speaker 1: And I've got a philosophy of more meaning less words,
8:05
Speaker 1: So how to condense more meaning to f your words?
8:08
Speaker 1: And when you do that, it ends up as poetry.
8:11
Speaker 1: So I've sort of individentally become a poet. I think
8:13
Speaker 1: we shared some of my poet poems in the past,
8:15
Speaker 1: but I have this one poem which I call it
8:17
Speaker 1: the Recipe for Wellness, and it's super simple. It's bathing
8:21
Speaker 1: beautiful water, Prepare delicious food, make the most of every breath,
8:26
Speaker 1: Dance through every mood.
8:29
Speaker 2: I thought you were going to say something about mood then,
8:31
Speaker 2: but okay, not nothing wrong of the moods, but in
8:35
Speaker 2: dance mood.
8:35
Speaker 1: If you want, tend the soil beneath your feet, embraced
8:39
Speaker 1: sunshine from above, share your gifts with all the world,
8:43
Speaker 1: and fill your life with love. Social connection, they say
8:49
Speaker 1: the currency of wellness of connection, connection to yourself, with
8:52
Speaker 1: the environment, with other people. And that's ultimately that they're
8:57
Speaker 1: the priorities. And I've got I've got other poems to
9:01
Speaker 1: talk about all the different activities you can do in
9:02
Speaker 1: your life that improve this anxiety, and things you can
9:07
Speaker 1: do if you're anxious, upset, or a fraid or in
9:10
Speaker 1: pain that you can do with your body to relax
9:12
Speaker 1: your body. So there's all these little hacks and tricks,
9:16
Speaker 1: but I really there's it seems to be a big
9:19
Speaker 1: emphasis now on what activities can I do to prevent
9:24
Speaker 1: cancer or to be healthier, to live a long and
9:26
Speaker 1: a healthy life. And people are living their life for
9:30
Speaker 1: the future of not being sick, rather than living their
9:32
Speaker 1: life for the moment and enjoying your life in the moment.
9:36
Speaker 1: And there's a tension between those two. But I really
9:39
Speaker 1: believe if you have the most fulfilling life in each
9:43
Speaker 1: moment and create as much connection as possible in each moment,
9:46
Speaker 1: that's going to pay off down the track.
9:49
Speaker 2: I feel like a lot of us reactive with our health,
9:55
Speaker 2: not proactive, like we wait until something breaks or something
9:58
Speaker 2: falls off, or we get terrified. What's the Is that
10:03
Speaker 2: just a fear thing, a laziness thing, or something else.
10:07
Speaker 1: Great business model getting people to.
10:10
Speaker 2: Get from a commercial point of view.
10:15
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly, a great business model, and that really changed
10:20
Speaker 1: my whole career. In early nineteen nineties. I just graduated
10:23
Speaker 1: as the doctor and I'd come across a health retreat
10:26
Speaker 1: in barr Skiffsland and I was doing this yoga health
10:29
Speaker 1: retreat and I came across Clean Ornish and his yoga teacher,
10:34
Speaker 1: and he was the first person to prove that you
10:36
Speaker 1: could lifestyle change could reverse heart disease. And he sort
10:42
Speaker 1: of said it, but I sort of paraphrased it. At
10:44
Speaker 1: the time, it was conventional treatment for a heart attack
10:48
Speaker 1: or heart disease was to open up your chest, take
10:51
Speaker 1: a vein from your leg, put that vein across the
10:54
Speaker 1: blockage in your chest, and repeat that every ten years.
10:58
Speaker 1: Because that's what you happened with. It was considered totally
11:01
Speaker 1: radical and extreme to relax, exercise, eat good food, and
11:05
Speaker 1: share your feelings. And I saw that and I was
11:09
Speaker 1: a week in the hospital seeing, yeah, look if you
11:11
Speaker 1: do bypass two, sure you get forty grand, fifty grand.
11:15
Speaker 1: And I was part of the Health Enhancement lifestyle program
11:18
Speaker 1: where we were trying to educate people in a rehab
11:20
Speaker 1: hospital at to see the court and other places to
11:23
Speaker 1: do that. When we were charging four hundred bucks for
11:25
Speaker 1: a lifestyle program and people just weren't interested they'll paid
11:28
Speaker 1: forty grand for their heart to fix their heart attack,
11:30
Speaker 1: because they won't pay four hundred dollars to live a
11:33
Speaker 1: healthy life. So there is a bit of I don't
11:37
Speaker 1: know if it's hedonism or people just they don't they
11:41
Speaker 1: want what they want now and they're not really interested
11:44
Speaker 1: in prevention. But I think the whole culture that we
11:46
Speaker 1: have this is where I talk about a culture of wellness,
11:48
Speaker 1: because at the moment, we have a culture of illness. Now,
11:51
Speaker 1: food comes pre poisoned, our water comes pre poisoned, our
11:54
Speaker 1: air is poisoned. The industries, the biggest industries in the
11:58
Speaker 1: world are the ones that make only out of people's units.
12:02
Speaker 1: But it's a great business model, but it's not great
12:04
Speaker 1: for healthy people.
12:06
Speaker 2: Well, and you think about that, you know how people
12:09
Speaker 2: have paid forty grand for an operation but not four
12:11
Speaker 2: hundred for a wellness program or whatever. Right, And then
12:15
Speaker 2: I think about as an excise scientist, I think about
12:20
Speaker 2: you know, people paying people putting ozepic in their body, right,
12:26
Speaker 2: which essentially, among other things, kills their appetite, whereas and
12:33
Speaker 2: has some pretty disgusting side effects. Whereas they could get
12:39
Speaker 2: you know, albeit a bit longer and a little bit well,
12:42
Speaker 2: a lot more discipline and effort, you know, but obviously
12:46
Speaker 2: with modifying lifestyle factors, you know. But it's it's like
12:50
Speaker 2: people would rather appeal than some kind of work or
12:53
Speaker 2: effort or discomfort, you know. And it's like that's why
12:57
Speaker 2: instant gratification sells. That's why surgery cells because I can
13:03
Speaker 2: just go in and you weave your magic and I
13:05
Speaker 2: come out and you know this is yeah, this is
13:09
Speaker 2: I think very much indicative of a lot of people's thinking,
13:13
Speaker 2: like quick fixes, magic pills, instant gratification cells.
13:17
Speaker 1: Well, what's the saying that instant gratification is not fast
13:19
Speaker 1: enough anymore? Yes, people that right now. And so what
13:24
Speaker 1: I'm interested in is things like that you want to
13:27
Speaker 1: do because they're fun in themselves. So that is the gratification.
13:31
Speaker 1: So I've been making these oximals myself. So it's honey
13:34
Speaker 1: and vinegar and I put herbs in it, and I
13:36
Speaker 1: put a lot of bitter herbs, so you've got the
13:38
Speaker 1: sweet and the sour and the bitter. And what that
13:41
Speaker 1: does It just sparks your brain off. It tastes like
13:44
Speaker 1: it tastes like sherbet candy, So it's sweet and sound
13:48
Speaker 1: like it's almost like a dessert wine, and you'll sip
13:51
Speaker 1: it and your brain just does backflips because it's got
13:53
Speaker 1: all these different flavors, and we put leaves, roots, flowers, fruits,
13:56
Speaker 1: and fungi, so it gives a really broad favor profile.
14:00
Speaker 1: You want to have it every day because it's so delicious.
14:03
Speaker 1: And then the side effect is it's super good for
14:05
Speaker 1: you at balancing your blood sugar, It helps gut microbio
14:08
Speaker 1: and it feels better, you sleep better, you got more energy,
14:12
Speaker 1: it stops the blood sugar spikes. So all these secondary benefits,
14:16
Speaker 1: but they're not the reason why you're having it. The
14:18
Speaker 1: reason why you're having it is it tastes delicious and
14:20
Speaker 1: it feels good to have it. So they're the sort
14:23
Speaker 1: of things I'm interested in.
14:25
Speaker 2: How do I I'm just right now, which is terrible protocol.
14:29
Speaker 2: So it's O X Y M E L right yep
14:33
Speaker 2: Oximal is a mixture of honey and vinegar used as medicine.
14:37
Speaker 2: According to Scientific America. Recently, the mixture is but used
14:40
Speaker 2: been used successfully in biofilm for topical uses on wounds
14:45
Speaker 2: where bacteria has become resistant to antibiotics. Both ingredients have
14:49
Speaker 2: been used historically as antseptics, but the combination blah blah blah.
14:53
Speaker 1: Okay. So it's interesting because it was one thousand years
14:56
Speaker 1: ago or two thousands and they were using this. But
14:59
Speaker 1: last last year there were two big scientific studies published
15:03
Speaker 1: on oximals and one was a review article reviewing all
15:06
Speaker 1: the history of the pre clinical and clinical studies of oximals.
15:10
Speaker 1: And the other study was a really interesting one where
15:12
Speaker 1: they took manuka honey and vinegar and they diluted the
15:17
Speaker 1: manuka honey to the point where it didn't kill bacteria anymore.
15:20
Speaker 1: And they took the vinegar and they diluted that to
15:22
Speaker 1: the point where it didn't kill bacteria anymore. Then they
15:25
Speaker 1: took the two dilutions and mix them together and it
15:28
Speaker 1: did kill bacteria. And what that showed is that there's
15:32
Speaker 1: a different mechanism of action between the honey and the
15:34
Speaker 1: vinegar and that their synergy. So there's a combined effect
15:38
Speaker 1: of honey and vinegar that's effective against bacteria. And what
15:41
Speaker 1: they found there was the vinegar with the highest polyphenols.
15:45
Speaker 1: And polyphenols are like the plants immune system. They're they're
15:48
Speaker 1: the chemicals that the plants used to defend themselves. They're
15:52
Speaker 1: often what really expensive food so are really high in
15:57
Speaker 1: so coffee and chocolate and red wine and olive oil
16:00
Speaker 1: the high in polyphenols. And they found that the high
16:02
Speaker 1: polyphenol vinegars had a much bigger difference. So they use
16:05
Speaker 1: pomegranate vinegar and date and apple and white wine vinegar.
16:11
Speaker 1: We use kombucha vinegar because green tea actually has more
16:13
Speaker 1: polyphenols than apples or grapes or pomegranites. So the highest
16:17
Speaker 1: polyphenol vineggar you can make is that I know of,
16:20
Speaker 1: is kombucha vinegar. And people can do that at home
16:22
Speaker 1: pretty much for free sugar tea and some water and
16:27
Speaker 1: a bit of time, and you can make your ow
16:28
Speaker 1: kombucha vinegar. And it does does depend on the tea
16:33
Speaker 1: that you use. I mean, there are different qualities of tea,
16:36
Speaker 1: and I think there's a reason that tea is actually
16:39
Speaker 1: the most drunk beverage on Earth. He's drug more than
16:44
Speaker 1: coffee or any even just more than water, I think
16:47
Speaker 1: in terms of just as a bear fridge, and it's
16:50
Speaker 1: got a broad flavor profile. But to make a high
16:53
Speaker 1: polyphenol vinegar and mix that with honey, you've got you've
16:56
Speaker 1: got a really potent form of medicine that never gets
17:01
Speaker 1: resistance for antibodic resistance, never builds up against it by films.
17:09
Speaker 1: You know, they did some studies on biofilms and by
17:11
Speaker 1: films bacterial form sheets, especially in the back of your
17:13
Speaker 1: throat or on wounds, and then show that the honey
17:17
Speaker 1: vinegar combinations are super effective against buiofilms.
17:21
Speaker 2: If somebody wants to start, you know, making their own,
17:26
Speaker 2: is there a recipe? Is there is there a Can
17:28
Speaker 2: they go somewhere?
17:30
Speaker 1: Sure? I mean, just they can google it online. I've
17:33
Speaker 1: been studying these recipes because in the past what they
17:36
Speaker 1: do sometimes there was fifty percent vinegar and fhibuous en honey,
17:40
Speaker 1: and they used to boil it. And I think the
17:42
Speaker 1: boiling it was a way to stop it fermenting, because
17:44
Speaker 1: if you don't stop the fermentation, it actually becomes more delicious,
17:49
Speaker 1: It becomes fuzzy, and then it turns to meat and
17:51
Speaker 1: becomes alcoholic. Right, so, which is not a necessarily bad thing.
17:57
Speaker 1: And actually I've been researching that the origins of meta
18:00
Speaker 1: and that the word need has the same roots as
18:02
Speaker 1: the word medicine. The very first medicines were made from honey.
18:07
Speaker 1: Honey used to be the most most valuable thing on earth.
18:10
Speaker 1: If you if you're a caveman or a hominid, you know,
18:13
Speaker 1: honey is the most dense form of bluecoase. You can
18:17
Speaker 1: a wound or a burn and it will cure the
18:20
Speaker 1: wound or a bern. You can put any other food
18:22
Speaker 1: in it and will preserve the other food. And if
18:24
Speaker 1: you get it wet, it'll ferment and turn it into
18:26
Speaker 1: alcohol and become medicine. So honey is the most amazing substance.
18:31
Speaker 2: So you can get ship faced and treated all at
18:34
Speaker 2: the same time.
18:36
Speaker 1: That's what happens.
18:36
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly. You know when you finished medicine. So you're
18:40
Speaker 2: a doctor, doctor, You're you're a double doctor. You're a
18:42
Speaker 2: medical doctor in Europe.
18:44
Speaker 1: Doctor. I did two PhD so doctor, doctor, doctor, Oh
18:48
Speaker 1: you did too, of course you did?
18:50
Speaker 2: Okay, well, before I asked, mate, so what did in
18:54
Speaker 2: what order did you do your doctoring?
18:57
Speaker 1: I start off with Western medicine, then did an honors degree,
19:01
Speaker 1: then took some time off and did a pH d
19:03
Speaker 1: in Chinese medicine, then went back and finished my medical degree,
19:06
Speaker 1: and then did a second PhD in electrical computer systems engineering.
19:11
Speaker 2: Of course, as you do. Yeah, no, of course. Okay,
19:17
Speaker 2: so you're a three times doctor. Well that is fucking ridiculous.
19:21
Speaker 2: When you when you finished medicine Western medicine and then
19:24
Speaker 2: you headed off to see Dean Cornish and the like
19:28
Speaker 2: Dean Cornish at ol Audis year, did you get push
19:34
Speaker 2: back from you? You know, your your colleagues.
19:38
Speaker 1: Who I have, but not as much as my mentors
19:42
Speaker 1: and the people before me. Right so, And because because
19:46
Speaker 1: I have, you know, got a medical degree in two PhDs,
19:49
Speaker 1: I'm often accepted by the medical fraternity. But and I
19:52
Speaker 1: used to be the head of the Australasian Integrated Medicine Association.
19:56
Speaker 1: I had that at the start of the two thousands,
19:59
Speaker 1: and I was involved integrated medicine and acupuncture research and
20:02
Speaker 1: stuff throughout the nineteen nineties. And most of the research
20:05
Speaker 1: I've done is all the stuff there's no money behind it,
20:09
Speaker 1: meditation and acupuncture and herbal medicine and spas and saunas
20:13
Speaker 1: and things like that, and there has been pushed back,
20:16
Speaker 1: and this still is pushback. You'll read mainstream articles about
20:20
Speaker 1: cold cold water swimming and ice bading and they'll say, oh, yeah,
20:24
Speaker 1: look it does help with depression, but it can kill you.
20:26
Speaker 1: So be careful, you know, they sort of just try
20:29
Speaker 1: and sort of put a damping on it. No pun there.
20:35
Speaker 1: But I haven't had nearly the pushback that there was
20:38
Speaker 1: a generation of doctors before me who are ten fifteen
20:41
Speaker 1: years older than me, who are getting deep and getting
20:44
Speaker 1: attacked at. And I do have colleagues in the integrated
20:47
Speaker 1: medicine community you have been really pushed hard against. And
20:52
Speaker 1: they keep on telling me that a kite flies highest
20:55
Speaker 1: and it's got a strong wind against it. But otherwise
20:59
Speaker 1: I've made a conscious decision in my career and in
21:02
Speaker 1: my life that I don't want to fight against anything.
21:05
Speaker 1: I want to work towards what I want. Y So
21:08
Speaker 1: I want health and wellness and to have fun. I mean,
21:11
Speaker 1: having fun is really high in my values. So all
21:15
Speaker 1: the research on stuff that's fun, you know, health retreats
21:17
Speaker 1: and spars and saunas and hot spring and yoga and meditation,
21:21
Speaker 1: it's all fun stuff. There's not a lot of money
21:23
Speaker 1: in it, but it's really fun rather than sort of
21:25
Speaker 1: trying to fight a system or trying to tackle And
21:29
Speaker 1: there's great people who do that, but that's not me.
21:33
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think also, sometimes you know, when people live
21:39
Speaker 2: in a certain eir co chamber. You know, they and
21:43
Speaker 2: they've believed something for a very long time, and they've
21:47
Speaker 2: had a certain operating system and existed in a certain
21:51
Speaker 2: paradigm of thought and behavior and whatever. That also becomes
21:55
Speaker 2: their identity. So if you question anything, you question their
21:59
Speaker 2: identity as well. So yeah, it's very and people are
22:04
Speaker 2: emotional and people are self protecting, and it's like, if
22:07
Speaker 2: you question my belief or my ideology, then you're attacking me,
22:14
Speaker 2: you know.
22:15
Speaker 1: And and there's a book called the Four Agreements, which
22:18
Speaker 1: I really love, and let's saying that being peckable with
22:22
Speaker 1: your word, don't take anything personally, don't make assumptions, and
22:27
Speaker 1: do your best. So not taking anything personally is really great.
22:31
Speaker 1: So you know, if they're attacking you, they're not really
22:33
Speaker 1: attacking me. They're just they've got their issues and you know,
22:36
Speaker 1: poor them. So that's that's stead me in good, good position.
22:42
Speaker 1: Throughout there's always detractors, and then sometimes it's been good.
22:46
Speaker 1: Like in the pandemic, people were trolling and saying, oh,
22:50
Speaker 1: you can't talk about Sauls as reducing viral infections because
22:54
Speaker 1: and that it's obviously true. So I end up writing
22:57
Speaker 1: a peer reviewed article about it, just to get back
22:59
Speaker 1: at these people who are try to kick me down.
23:02
Speaker 1: And you know, I published that article, and then I
23:04
Speaker 1: publish a whole lot of articles on hydro thermal facilities
23:07
Speaker 1: because when you're in a sauna, you're improving your immune
23:10
Speaker 1: system and it'll dissolve any viruses, say they melt. And
23:15
Speaker 1: because of that article, I've been told in Europe that
23:18
Speaker 1: was translated into half a dozen languages, and a lot
23:20
Speaker 1: of spar centers were allowed to open because of that research.
23:24
Speaker 1: So sometimes it is good to get you back up.
23:26
Speaker 1: And you know, my tendency is just really to follow
23:30
Speaker 1: the stuff that I love doing, rather than trying to
23:32
Speaker 1: fight against something else.
23:34
Speaker 2: So while I've got you here, I want to I'm
23:36
Speaker 2: going to I'm going to use you a little bit. Okay,
23:39
Speaker 2: So infrared sauna or steamwre sauna.
23:42
Speaker 1: Whatever makes you sweat. There's been no studies comparing the two.
23:46
Speaker 1: And in fact, I had a PhD student show we Hassan,
23:49
Speaker 1: who's a brilliant medical doctor. She did a PhD. It's
23:53
Speaker 1: eight years researching saunas, and we were going to do
23:56
Speaker 1: the first ever human clinical trial comparing infrared sauna with
23:59
Speaker 1: traditional with exercise she was doing this with the Queensland
24:04
Speaker 1: Institute of Sport. We had it all set up and
24:06
Speaker 1: then their traditional sauna busted and then the pandemic hits.
24:12
Speaker 1: So we ended up doing the study, but we didn't
24:13
Speaker 1: use the traditional sauna, so we didn't We compared disordering
24:17
Speaker 1: with exercise. We looked at detoxification and the effects on
24:21
Speaker 1: the heart, but we didn't compare directly infrared with traditional sauna.
24:26
Speaker 1: I had it both home. I'm pretty privileged. I yes,
24:29
Speaker 1: I was given an infrared sauna about fifteen years ago,
24:32
Speaker 1: which I still haven't. I built a traditional sauna, and
24:35
Speaker 1: I prefer the traditional sauna because I love putting. I
24:38
Speaker 1: love the steam. I loved able to loft the steam
24:41
Speaker 1: around and wave it around. I love putting cold water
24:43
Speaker 1: on my body when I'm in the sauna. Put squater
24:47
Speaker 1: on your head or on your feet when you're really
24:48
Speaker 1: hot is just super delightful, and you can't do that
24:51
Speaker 1: the red sauna. But I think that the benefit it
24:54
Speaker 1: really is from the stress and sweating and doing something
24:59
Speaker 1: you don't really we want to do, or doing something
25:02
Speaker 1: to the point where you're comfortably uncomfortable. MM. So, whether
25:07
Speaker 1: it's an infrared fat or a hot bath or whatever
25:10
Speaker 1: it is. If it's if it's hot enough to make
25:11
Speaker 1: you sweat and turn on your physiological air conditioning. Yeah,
25:16
Speaker 1: your panther willle bit, your heart beats harder. You know,
25:19
Speaker 1: you sweat, you turn on your heat shop proteins and
25:21
Speaker 1: all of those biochemical things that happen. That's the benefit.
25:25
Speaker 1: So how do you get there, I think is less important.
25:28
Speaker 2: I know there's a lot of variables around kind of
25:31
Speaker 2: cold water immersion and ice bars and cold showers and
25:35
Speaker 2: because you know, the temperature of the tap border in
25:38
Speaker 2: Melbourne is probably different to Queensland, to work of course.
25:42
Speaker 1: But pretty cold this morning. Yeah, this morning it was
25:45
Speaker 1: like six six degrees out of the shower or something exactly.
25:49
Speaker 2: So is there if somebody's thinking, you know what, I
25:52
Speaker 2: want to introduce a little bit of cold water or
25:55
Speaker 2: cold showers into my life? Is there a Is there
26:00
Speaker 2: are kind of an optimal time one to three minutes
26:03
Speaker 2: or something.
26:04
Speaker 1: I credit a little song and dance for this xpression.
26:07
Speaker 1: I don't know. I told me you set me up.
26:10
Speaker 1: So I did a lecture series about seven eight years
26:14
Speaker 1: ago with Wim Half When I was I was talking
26:16
Speaker 1: about the science of the wim Holf method, and all
26:18
Speaker 1: the vow for males, all the full on by fighters
26:22
Speaker 1: and martial artists were all getting into the ice bath.
26:24
Speaker 1: And then I ran a retreat at wing Ghana, which
26:27
Speaker 1: was a luxury hell to treat in Queensland, and they
26:30
Speaker 1: were like autun seventy year old mostly females, who said,
26:33
Speaker 1: we're not going to get into the cold water. We
26:34
Speaker 1: don't we don't do cold And I was I sort
26:37
Speaker 1: of worked out how can we make it appealing for them?
26:39
Speaker 1: And I came up with little song and dance. I
26:41
Speaker 1: call it the cold water Hokey pokey, so you can
26:44
Speaker 1: do it home in the shower and and it makes
26:47
Speaker 1: it really easy. But basically what you do you start
26:49
Speaker 1: off with the hot shower, and everyone loves the hot shower,
26:52
Speaker 1: and you get well, you get hot. Then at the
26:54
Speaker 1: end of that you turn the heat up a little bit,
26:56
Speaker 1: so a bit prickly hot and a bit flushed. And
26:59
Speaker 1: then the hardest part of the whole thing, The hardest
27:02
Speaker 1: part of any cold water immersion is the decision to
27:04
Speaker 1: do it. It's jumping into the swimming pool or just
27:07
Speaker 1: getting wet that's making that decision the hardest. If you
27:10
Speaker 1: make the decision you're going to do it. So you
27:11
Speaker 1: turn the hot water off and the cold water on,
27:14
Speaker 1: but you just wet your left foot, right, it's okay,
27:17
Speaker 1: you know you're hot, and your left foot. Then you
27:19
Speaker 1: do your leg, and then you do your right foot.
27:20
Speaker 1: In your leg, your left hands and arm and your
27:22
Speaker 1: other hand and arm. And what that does. It pushes
27:24
Speaker 1: the warm blood. It constricts the book blood vessels in
27:27
Speaker 1: your arms and legs, and that pushes all this warm
27:29
Speaker 1: blood into your core. So you're still feeling warm even
27:32
Speaker 1: though your arms and legs are cold. Keep breathing calmly
27:36
Speaker 1: and smile to yourself, because that's what it's all about,
27:38
Speaker 1: breathing calmly and smiling to yourself, being comfortably uncomfortable. And
27:42
Speaker 1: then you take a really big breath in and as
27:44
Speaker 1: you as you're slowly breathing out, you put your left
27:46
Speaker 1: side in, and normally, when you put best side in,
27:49
Speaker 1: the water would hit your neck where the blood vessels
27:51
Speaker 1: are close to the surface, and that causes you That
27:53
Speaker 1: would normally cause you for gasp, and that's the cold
27:56
Speaker 1: water hyper ventilation reaction. But if you're already breathing out slowly,
28:01
Speaker 1: when you do that you don't, but you do feel
28:05
Speaker 1: the cold, but it doesn't have that emotional shot to it.
28:09
Speaker 1: So you just slowly breathing out. You put your left
28:11
Speaker 1: side in and you're right side in and your front
28:13
Speaker 1: side in, and you chain yourself around. Then keep calmly
28:16
Speaker 1: and smile to yourself, because that's what it's all about.
28:18
Speaker 1: And then you put your whole head in. If you
28:20
Speaker 1: take a big breath as you're brething out, and you
28:22
Speaker 1: put your whole head in, move your head around, stand still,
28:25
Speaker 1: get a drenching, slowly turn yourself around, continue breathing, calmly,
28:28
Speaker 1: smile to yourself. That's what it's all about. And then
28:31
Speaker 1: you go poke you put the water on your groin,
28:34
Speaker 1: water on your kidneys, oh hokey, pokey, put the water
28:37
Speaker 1: on your armpits, and then all the places vessels come
28:40
Speaker 1: close to the surface. And you'll find if you do
28:42
Speaker 1: that that takes about one minute. You end up standing
28:46
Speaker 1: under the cold shower quite comfortably. And at that point
28:48
Speaker 1: you're breathing comfortably and you can turn it off and
28:51
Speaker 1: get out and you'll feel tingly and alive. And you've
28:53
Speaker 1: started to day singing and dancing and doing something that
28:56
Speaker 1: you didn't want to do, which makes everything else that
28:59
Speaker 1: you don't want to do, if there's that conversation or
29:01
Speaker 1: that job or that mess you have to clean up,
29:04
Speaker 1: you've already practiced that whellpower of just getting along with
29:08
Speaker 1: it and doing it. So that's that's and it doesn't
29:10
Speaker 1: cost any money. You don't need a membership, you don't
29:13
Speaker 1: need special clothes, you have to do anything other than
29:16
Speaker 1: cold shower, so that's that's super easy. Or you can
29:20
Speaker 1: buy a twenty grand Icepa and like yourself with the
29:24
Speaker 1: whole hot tub scene room my spa sorta situation. So
29:30
Speaker 1: it's as I say, there's high endways to do it,
29:33
Speaker 1: there's always a way you can do it quite inexpensively.
29:36
Speaker 2: Well, definitely in Melbourne, Like I try to finish my
29:38
Speaker 2: showers with about a minute of just no no hot
29:43
Speaker 2: water at all. And when I first started, it's fucking horrible,
29:48
Speaker 2: but it just gets, it gets more and more, like
29:50
Speaker 2: you get used to it over time and you get
29:52
Speaker 2: out and there's just a lights up my brain like
29:54
Speaker 2: a Christmas tree. It's just it's a really good feeling.
29:58
Speaker 2: And also I think, you know, I don't really do
30:01
Speaker 2: it for this, but for me there's a real psychological
30:05
Speaker 2: and emotional benefit as well as the physiological like I
30:09
Speaker 2: feel great, I feel more energetic, but I also feel
30:15
Speaker 2: clarity and I you know, I what in terms of
30:19
Speaker 2: like treating mental health using these kinds of mechanisms and treatments,
30:26
Speaker 2: you know, and like depression and anxiety and which is
30:29
Speaker 2: pretty rampant mental health, you know, and rather than reaching
30:32
Speaker 2: for an anti axiotic or an antis So there is.
30:35
Speaker 1: Good research on that. But again the problem is there
30:38
Speaker 1: are a lot of research on cold water swimming as
30:40
Speaker 1: an antidepressant. Yeah, it's not an industry. No one's making
30:43
Speaker 1: money out of it, so it's not really widely promoted,
30:46
Speaker 1: whereas prozacs are multi billion dollars and drug And just
30:51
Speaker 1: on that point, one of my PhD students is I'm
30:53
Speaker 1: Lauren Burns. She was or she's graduated now. So Lauren Burns.
30:57
Speaker 1: She won the gold medalp for taekwon do at the
30:58
Speaker 1: Sydney Olympics and she's an absolute champion of a human
31:02
Speaker 1: being but also a world champion athlete. And in her
31:05
Speaker 1: PhD she interviewed people who are multiple world champions and
31:09
Speaker 1: asked the how do you stay at the top of
31:11
Speaker 1: your game, How do you how do you say the
31:12
Speaker 1: best in the world in your sport over multiple years?
31:14
Speaker 1: What do you do? What do you think? How do
31:15
Speaker 1: you perform? You know, what do you how do you practice?
31:20
Speaker 1: And she were published a few papers on that, and
31:23
Speaker 1: you know, mindset was the biggest factor. Social connection came
31:28
Speaker 1: up really strong, and they hadn't been widely talked about.
31:30
Speaker 1: But one of the things we did was ice bathing.
31:33
Speaker 1: And when we interviewed them, or when Lauren interviewed them,
31:36
Speaker 1: they said that they started doing ice bathing for recovery,
31:40
Speaker 1: but they kept on doing it for the mental health
31:42
Speaker 1: benefits because when they when they were doing in the
31:45
Speaker 1: ice part, they're just in the in the ice part,
31:48
Speaker 1: that they're not thinking about the past and the future,
31:50
Speaker 1: what their competition's doing, and just gave them mental discipline
31:53
Speaker 1: and that clarity and that focus. So and that was
31:56
Speaker 1: that hadn't been talked about widely before. And this was
32:00
Speaker 1: there was one Lane Beachley, who was the surfing World champion.
32:05
Speaker 1: She but she spent most of the time in cold
32:08
Speaker 1: water anyway. But all of the other athletes she interviewed
32:11
Speaker 1: who are multiple world champions, audio icepaving and I all
32:14
Speaker 1: said it was for the mental health benefits, not to
32:16
Speaker 1: the physical recovery and benefits.
32:20
Speaker 2: Yeah, we love Laurence. She was on here a couple
32:22
Speaker 2: of weeks ago. She's a gun and I think also
32:27
Speaker 2: unis A did did some research looking at exercise as
32:33
Speaker 2: a treatment for depression, which like really really really outperformed drugs.
32:40
Speaker 1: So bottle it. It'd be the most successful drug ever. Yeah.
32:45
Speaker 2: What's what's something that if anything that you've you have
32:51
Speaker 2: ever done a one ad on where you got something wrong,
32:55
Speaker 2: or you were taught told train something that you later
32:58
Speaker 2: on went that's bullshit, or or there's a much better way.
33:02
Speaker 2: Is there anything that you've either done a one id
33:05
Speaker 2: on or really had to unlearn something.
33:09
Speaker 1: That's a great question. I haven't haven't thought about that before.
33:11
Speaker 1: I mean there's a lot, a lot that I learned
33:13
Speaker 1: in medicine that is now no longer true, even though
33:16
Speaker 1: I was taught it thirty forty years ago when I
33:20
Speaker 1: was studying medicine. I mean, all the discussion about brown fat,
33:25
Speaker 1: we were taught, you know, there's no brown fat in
33:27
Speaker 1: the in the adult body. It's only in babies and
33:30
Speaker 1: hibernating animals. And that's that's been a one ady for
33:32
Speaker 1: the medical community, not me personally, who are saying, oh yeah,
33:35
Speaker 1: brown and fats in everybody and you can develop it,
33:38
Speaker 1: and that the process you've described earlier where you gradually
33:41
Speaker 1: get used to the cold, that was a process that
33:45
Speaker 1: everyone went through every year one hundred years ago before
33:47
Speaker 1: we had central heating. That as the winter got gone on,
33:50
Speaker 1: it got each dag a little bit colder, and you
33:52
Speaker 1: built up your brown fat stores and the brown fat
33:54
Speaker 1: actually makes heat and protects you from the cold. So
33:59
Speaker 1: that's there's all a whole lot of research now about
34:01
Speaker 1: brown fatter and people using it but improving brown fat
34:06
Speaker 1: to lose weights because brown fat eats up white fatter
34:09
Speaker 1: uses white fatter's fudel to generate heat. But I think
34:12
Speaker 1: the benefit it's not so much for the weight loss,
34:14
Speaker 1: it's for the metabolic benefits that you get. So that's
34:18
Speaker 1: that's where the medical communities change. The other thing I
34:21
Speaker 1: guess is the whole our whole attitude of bacteria. Again
34:26
Speaker 1: forty years ago and I started medicine, the bacteria of
34:29
Speaker 1: the enemy. You know, you needed antibiotics, and germs were bad.
34:34
Speaker 1: You know, you want to disinfect into antibiotics and all
34:37
Speaker 1: these things, and now we're realizing, hey, germs are actually
34:41
Speaker 1: the best thing ever. They're actually supporting our health and
34:46
Speaker 1: not just in our gus. One of the biggest revelations
34:50
Speaker 1: I had just it was only three four years ago,
34:51
Speaker 1: this was published talking about the skin micro bio that
34:57
Speaker 1: when I when I started medicine, we were taught you
34:59
Speaker 1: the service area your skin is one point eight square meters,
35:02
Speaker 1: which is about the size of the single bed. If
35:04
Speaker 1: I skinned you and lay your skin out, it's about
35:05
Speaker 1: the size of a single bed. But then they realize
35:08
Speaker 1: there's a thought yeah, and then they use that measurement
35:12
Speaker 1: for measuring the size of burns and the proportion of
35:15
Speaker 1: the body for different things. But then someone calculated, oh, well,
35:19
Speaker 1: there's actually three million sweatlands on the body and all
35:22
Speaker 1: these sabaceous glands every time that the skin dips down
35:25
Speaker 1: and comes back up, and if you stretch that out,
35:27
Speaker 1: it's thirty square meters. It's the size of a cat.
35:31
Speaker 1: And all those little glands in the sweatlands and the
35:34
Speaker 1: sabacious glands when the skip the skin dives down, that's
35:38
Speaker 1: where the bacteria live. And those plans secrete oils that
35:41
Speaker 1: support good bacteria and those oils protect you from protect
35:46
Speaker 1: your skin from drying out, They protect your skin sun
35:49
Speaker 1: from sun damage and in cancer and sunburn. They also
35:53
Speaker 1: feed the good bacteria that protect you from infection. And
35:57
Speaker 1: that's that was never talked about in the past. And
36:02
Speaker 1: what I've realized is when you bathe in chlorine, you
36:07
Speaker 1: oxidize those oils and you get rid of those those
36:10
Speaker 1: good bacteria, and you actually make your skin more prone
36:13
Speaker 1: to drying out, more prone to sun damage, more prone
36:15
Speaker 1: to wrinkles and aging, and more prone to infection. Wow.
36:19
Speaker 1: So that's yeah, And that's that's when you think about it.
36:21
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, chlorinees and oxidizer. It kills bacteria. If you
36:24
Speaker 1: if you're washing your skin with that, it's kind of
36:25
Speaker 1: stripped the natural oils off. But those are your protection.
36:30
Speaker 1: So that was a revelation to me. And I've always
36:32
Speaker 1: been really keen on water, you know, and I do
36:34
Speaker 1: have a water filled company and I promote that, but
36:36
Speaker 1: it was really these and the whole water industry is
36:40
Speaker 1: a it's a whole nother rabbit hole because water is
36:42
Speaker 1: so complicated. But one of the simplest things you can
36:46
Speaker 1: do to change your health is just improved the quality
36:48
Speaker 1: of your water.
36:50
Speaker 2: So is that just by filtering? I mean, obviously water
36:54
Speaker 2: that's sitting in a plastic bottle in a hot car,
36:58
Speaker 2: that's just a try. Can you just explain to people
37:03
Speaker 2: what salts are and what they.
37:06
Speaker 1: Do and disruptives. So, Falet's are a type of plastic.
37:09
Speaker 1: They're used in a whole lot of they're often us
37:11
Speaker 1: in fragrance, so they make smells last longer in the air.
37:15
Speaker 1: And but microplastics in water is one of the biggest issues.
37:18
Speaker 1: I think it was the University of New South Wales
37:20
Speaker 1: did some research about four or five years ago and
37:22
Speaker 1: they used to make it in Australia and pretty much
37:24
Speaker 1: everyone in the western world eats a credit card of plastic.
37:27
Speaker 2: The week, a week a week.
37:31
Speaker 1: I thought that was I thought that was a year.
37:35
Speaker 1: Look it up.
37:36
Speaker 2: And that's because that's because plastic, among other things, there's
37:41
Speaker 2: plastic in our water. And when we have a plastic
37:43
Speaker 2: bottle filled with water, especially when it's sitting anywhere near sun,
37:48
Speaker 2: it leaches plastic into the water. Right.
37:51
Speaker 1: And the think about the companies that make in a
37:55
Speaker 1: bottled water, They don't make the water, they make plastic
37:57
Speaker 1: bottles water. But yeah, we need a credit cardo plastic week.
38:03
Speaker 1: Most of that comes from our water. Yeah, I do
38:07
Speaker 1: the microplastics everywhere. Now there's nanoplastics, which is the next level.
38:10
Speaker 1: So you're talking about thal aides and endochrome disrupting chemicals
38:13
Speaker 1: that hang out on the plastics, and a lot of
38:16
Speaker 1: those chemicals are what we call abe sigents. They make
38:19
Speaker 1: you a bet, they take your commodal system, and they
38:22
Speaker 1: cause infertility, and their carcinogenics they cause cancers. So pretty
38:28
Speaker 1: much all the diseases of the modern world you can
38:30
Speaker 1: trace back to us polluting ourselves, which is tragic when
38:34
Speaker 1: you think about it. But again, I'd rather than try
38:37
Speaker 1: and fight pollution, I'd say, Okay, how do we clean
38:39
Speaker 1: it up? And how do we live without that? So
38:41
Speaker 1: you filtery of water, and there are ways to do that.
38:45
Speaker 1: You can even if you don't have a water filter
38:46
Speaker 1: at home. If you've got a hot bath, you can
38:48
Speaker 1: turn on the bath really hot, put the fan on
38:51
Speaker 1: and wait twenty minutes and the chlorine will evaporate out.
38:55
Speaker 1: And I do that in hotels and stuff, and I'm traveling,
38:58
Speaker 1: so there are ways to get rid of CHLORI out
38:59
Speaker 1: of it a system, and when you do that your
39:01
Speaker 1: skin changes, actually you feel better the surface. There's ONTs
39:07
Speaker 1: of little things that you can do, but affecting your
39:11
Speaker 1: water and obviously food as well, just plastic packaging and food,
39:16
Speaker 1: so that the increase in endocrime disrupting chemicals, not just
39:21
Speaker 1: stalates but also I mean pfasts. They were talking about
39:24
Speaker 1: the perfluorinated compounds and the forever chemicals. There's made a
39:30
Speaker 1: couple of minutes about it recently. It's just a global
39:33
Speaker 1: disaster and there's no living organism on Earth that isn't
39:36
Speaker 1: impacted by these chemicals. Down at the bottom of the
39:39
Speaker 1: Mariana Trench, ten kilometers down at the bottom of the
39:41
Speaker 1: ocean to the top of Mount Everest, they're found microplastics.
39:44
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah. Have you heard of a guy called David
39:48
Speaker 2: Gillespie who wrote Sweet Poison?
39:52
Speaker 1: Oh no, I haven't. Yeah.
39:53
Speaker 2: Yeah, So he's one of Australia's most prolific writers. Is
39:57
Speaker 2: a lawyer, but is a researcher, he's an inventor. Is
40:00
Speaker 2: a little bit like you, and that he's quirky. You're quirky,
40:04
Speaker 2: you know you're quirky. But he's a fucking genius. And yeah,
40:08
Speaker 2: he and I talk. We do an episode once a fortnite,
40:11
Speaker 2: and he's dead against seed oils and daletes and endocrime disruptors,
40:16
Speaker 2: and he talks a lot about it, talks a lot
40:20
Speaker 2: about the dumb shit we do to our body basically.
40:22
Speaker 2: But he was talking recently, we're talking him. He was
40:26
Speaker 2: wheeling out these figures about the rapidly declining testosterone production
40:33
Speaker 2: in men, you know, and what the average how much
40:38
Speaker 2: testosterone I can't remember the numbers, but it's like, compared
40:42
Speaker 2: to seventy or eighty years ago, it's crazily low.
40:47
Speaker 1: And he was suggesting that boom counts had gone down
40:50
Speaker 1: too dramatically.
40:51
Speaker 2: Yeah, sperm count sorry, that's what I meant is plummeted.
40:55
Speaker 2: And he was saying that within the next ten to
40:58
Speaker 2: fifteen years that like a lot of like a fair
41:02
Speaker 2: percentage of males won't be able to produce enough sperm
41:06
Speaker 2: to get someone pregnant. Essentially, like fertility.
41:09
Speaker 1: Look at infertility is an epidemic in the modern world. Yes,
41:13
Speaker 1: that's the way. Ten fifteen years, a lot of couples
41:16
Speaker 1: have infertility issues, are having a sistive fertility because the
41:21
Speaker 1: normal system doesn't work anymore.
41:23
Speaker 2: Yeah, Yeah, it's crazy. So in terms of moving forward,
41:30
Speaker 2: if somebody wants to do like a little bit of
41:32
Speaker 2: a stock take on their own life, you know, their
41:35
Speaker 2: own lifestyle is there. And I know there's no three
41:38
Speaker 2: step plan for anything, doc, But if somebody is listening
41:42
Speaker 2: to this and they're like, where do I start? Because
41:45
Speaker 2: when we go, oh, well, there's food, and there's sleep,
41:47
Speaker 2: and there's lifestyle, and there's stress and anxiety, and then
41:50
Speaker 2: there's booze and there's you know, there's should we take
41:53
Speaker 2: should I take a drug for this? Or should I
41:55
Speaker 2: have a cold shower? Or if somebody wants to, for
41:58
Speaker 2: want of a better term, start to renovate their life
42:01
Speaker 2: or change their operating system, where might they start?
42:06
Speaker 1: I think you need to start where it's easy, where
42:10
Speaker 1: you enjoy it, so and start with something you can
42:14
Speaker 1: actually keep going on. Ye, So, and it all starts
42:18
Speaker 1: with the decision to do it so that that will power.
42:24
Speaker 1: So like hot and cold shower, that's a great place
42:26
Speaker 1: to start because you're exercising will power. You don't need
42:28
Speaker 1: to buy any equipment, you know, you can just do it.
42:30
Speaker 1: And that little cold water hockey pokey I talked about.
42:33
Speaker 1: You can just start with the first you know, you
42:36
Speaker 1: can spend a week just on your arms and legs
42:37
Speaker 1: and then work up to the second verse, and then
42:39
Speaker 1: you can do the whole thing. So I think you
42:41
Speaker 1: want to do baby steps. You want to do something
42:43
Speaker 1: that's sustainable. You want to do something that's fun, because
42:47
Speaker 1: otherwise you're not going to keep it up, you know,
42:49
Speaker 1: whether it's going you're getting a gym membership or doing
42:52
Speaker 1: you know, jogging every morning or something. Unless it's fun
42:56
Speaker 1: for you, it's hard to keep up. And then one
43:00
Speaker 1: of the really effective things I found is changing your
43:03
Speaker 1: flavor profile by having more bitters in your life. Right,
43:07
Speaker 1: and if you have more bitter, this is a Chinese
43:09
Speaker 1: medicine sort of knowledge. You reduce sweet cravings. Most people
43:14
Speaker 1: get their business from coffee and chocolate. That's where they
43:17
Speaker 1: get their polyphenols as well, actually occidents in our life.
43:21
Speaker 1: But increasing your range of business, so having and please
43:24
Speaker 1: do that in Europe, and having a pair of teeth
43:26
Speaker 1: before dinner, you know, a digestive with business, prepare your
43:30
Speaker 1: liver for digestion and opens up your palace so you
43:32
Speaker 1: enjoy your food more. You tend to eat less. You
43:35
Speaker 1: tend to enjoy your food more, you digest better. And
43:37
Speaker 1: you don't get the big blood sugar spike and it
43:40
Speaker 1: actually stops you craving sweets. So tweaking your flavor profile
43:47
Speaker 1: is much easier than going on a diet for meaning
43:50
Speaker 1: your body to enjoy good food. Never even sort of that.
43:54
Speaker 2: So where are you off? Do you go on somewhere
43:56
Speaker 2: next week? Where you go?
43:57
Speaker 1: I'm going to Phoenix, Arizona, So I'm going for the
43:59
Speaker 1: shore to stay to the longest day and it's forty
44:02
Speaker 1: six degrees integrated there today. But I'm at an ice
44:05
Speaker 1: bath conference. There's Morosco Forge, there's an ice bath company
44:09
Speaker 1: that have blown up with Joe Rogan support and they're
44:12
Speaker 1: bringing you a whole lot of a whole about a
44:14
Speaker 1: dozen researchers on ice bath. They're a beta talk to
44:18
Speaker 1: each other and plan a conference for next year. So
44:20
Speaker 1: and they invited me to go. I said, yeah, why
44:22
Speaker 1: might sounds like fun meet some good people.
44:24
Speaker 2: How ironic? How ironic that you go into one of
44:27
Speaker 2: the hottest places on earth for an ice bath conference?
44:30
Speaker 1: Exactly, that's hilarious.
44:33
Speaker 2: How do people how do people find you doc and
44:36
Speaker 2: connect with you and follow you?
44:38
Speaker 1: I'm not super active on socials. I do have a
44:41
Speaker 1: Facebook and LinkedIn profiles just Mark Mark with a sea
44:44
Speaker 1: and I have a website Doctor Mark d M A
44:47
Speaker 1: r C dot co. And I've got a lot of
44:50
Speaker 1: poems and all my academic I've got one hundred academic
44:52
Speaker 1: papers and books and products and stuff that they can
44:55
Speaker 1: get from my website. But I do try and post
44:59
Speaker 1: about my life on Facebook and LinkedIn just to keep
45:01
Speaker 1: people up to date with what I'm doing. And I'm
45:03
Speaker 1: really open to having people contact me and yeah, where
45:07
Speaker 1: I can, I can provide some value.
45:11
Speaker 2: Well, we appreciate you will say goodbye here, but once again, Enlightening,
45:15
Speaker 2: thanks for coming to have a chat on you project.
45:18
Speaker 1: Great. It's always great to chat with you. Pray we
45:20
Speaker 1: do it again sometime. Thanks TOC