Latest / The Overland Journal Podcast / Greg Miller on Overlanding Continents and Land Cruisers

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Greg Miller on Overlanding Continents and Land Cruisers · The Overland Journal Podcast

0:06
Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to the Overland Journal podcast. I am
0:09
Speaker 1: your host Scott Brady, and I am here with longtime
0:12
Speaker 1: friend Greg Miller. Reg and I were fortunate to co
0:15
Speaker 1: found the Expedition seven series, which ultimately took us around
0:19
Speaker 1: the world twice and to all seven continents with the
0:22
Speaker 1: same land cruiser. Greg, thank you so much for being
0:24
Speaker 1: on the podcast today.
0:26
Speaker 2: It's my pleasure. Scott, thank you for having me.
0:28
Speaker 1: For me looking back on Expedition seven, we started off
0:31
Speaker 1: with this goal of taking the same land cruiser at
0:34
Speaker 1: all seven continents, but I don't think either of us
0:36
Speaker 1: had any idea how much it was going to change
0:39
Speaker 1: us as people. When I think about that trip, it's
0:42
Speaker 1: always interesting to know your backstory with land cruisers, and
0:45
Speaker 1: I think the audience would enjoy that as well. What
0:47
Speaker 1: started this passion, this love for land cruiser And a
0:50
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1:33
Speaker 2: That's a good question. It's one that I've actually given
1:36
Speaker 2: a lot of thought to, and I think what it
1:37
Speaker 2: comes down to is my dad began his professional career
1:41
Speaker 2: with Toyota in nineteen sixty eight. I was born in
1:44
Speaker 2: nineteen sixty six, so basically along for the ride from
1:47
Speaker 2: day one. We moved to Colorado in the early seventies
1:51
Speaker 2: and my dad worked at Stephen's and Toyota. I just
1:53
Speaker 2: remember some of my earliest memories involved land cruisers. My
1:57
Speaker 2: dad restored an FJ forty. I remember going to the
1:59
Speaker 2: ball park on summer nights with a top off and
2:02
Speaker 2: a forty. Later we took vacations to the Moab area
2:05
Speaker 2: and Canyon Lands and an FJA fifty five wagon. I
2:08
Speaker 2: took my driver's test in an FJA sixty on my
2:11
Speaker 2: sixteenth birthday. And I mean, there's just a long list
2:14
Speaker 2: of memories and land cruisers, and I just think they
2:16
Speaker 2: were part of my upbringing. And that's like maybe a
2:19
Speaker 2: dog or a sibling or a grandparent, you know, It's
2:21
Speaker 2: just it's such a part of your life that it
2:23
Speaker 2: becomes something that you developed really strong feelings for.
2:26
Speaker 1: Yeah, they weave into the fabric of who we are.
2:28
Speaker 1: They become a character in our life story for sure.
2:31
Speaker 1: What was your first land cruiser?
2:33
Speaker 2: Yeah, my first one that I owned was a nineteen
2:37
Speaker 2: seventy FJ forty awesome Factory Soft top three speed laughing
2:41
Speaker 2: because when I was seventeen years old when I bought it,
2:44
Speaker 2: and when I was on the demo drive with the seller,
2:47
Speaker 2: we actually got hit in the quarter panel by a
2:50
Speaker 2: lady and we just got out and pulled the sheet
2:52
Speaker 2: metal back out, and it's just like it was before
2:55
Speaker 2: I got hit. And I've tried to buy that car
2:56
Speaker 2: since I still have the vin and I've a couple
2:58
Speaker 2: of times I've posted some than just hoping that somebody said, Hey,
3:01
Speaker 2: I know where that car is, but no luck so far.
3:03
Speaker 1: Oh maybe you'll get lucky. That would be incredible. And
3:05
Speaker 1: I didn't know that that was your first land cruiser
3:08
Speaker 1: because it was the same for me at a nineteen
3:10
Speaker 1: seventy seven FJ forty. It was read and it was
3:12
Speaker 1: my very first land cruiser.
3:14
Speaker 2: Very cool car.
3:14
Speaker 1: So we now know what your first land cruiser is.
3:16
Speaker 1: What is the land cruiser that you have owned the longest.
3:19
Speaker 2: It's in nineteen eighty FJ forty and I probably bought
3:23
Speaker 2: it in about nineteen ninety eight, Okay, And my kids
3:28
Speaker 2: actually dubbed it Senior because it's the senior member of
3:31
Speaker 2: the collection. They've all let me know that if I
3:34
Speaker 2: ever sell it that we're no longer on speaking terms.
3:37
Speaker 2: And I think that's because they have fund memories of
3:40
Speaker 2: that car, much like I did of the others growing up.
3:43
Speaker 2: And I think every one of my kids and now
3:45
Speaker 2: some of my grandkids have actually learned to drive or
3:47
Speaker 2: drive a stick in that car.
3:49
Speaker 1: And is it in the museum or is it in
3:50
Speaker 1: its own museum?
3:51
Speaker 2: Someone protected I have a little car closet where I
3:55
Speaker 2: got that won't sit in the museum. I kind of
3:57
Speaker 2: keep it hidden in there, but that's where it is.
4:00
Speaker 1: And do you ever find yourself, like on a Tuesday morning,
4:02
Speaker 1: just wanting to go drive that vehicle?
4:04
Speaker 2: Not anymore in an earlier day. Maybe that thing is
4:08
Speaker 2: just so rusted out and rattled and sure it's work
4:11
Speaker 2: to drive it. Yeah, my kids, I think feel that
4:13
Speaker 2: way a long time. They would take turns driving it
4:15
Speaker 2: during the summer. I'm sure it's say at one house
4:18
Speaker 2: for a couple of weeks and then another one for
4:19
Speaker 2: a couple of weeks, and hasn't been quite as much
4:21
Speaker 2: pressure on it lately, But I think that's because my
4:23
Speaker 2: kids have just gotten older and developed other interests.
4:26
Speaker 1: Well, it's certainly a positive coincidence that your love for
4:29
Speaker 1: a specific kind of vehicle was land cruisers, because they're
4:32
Speaker 1: one of the best vehicles possible to travel around the
4:35
Speaker 1: world in. But how did you go from having a
4:38
Speaker 1: love for land cruisers because of how they helped you
4:40
Speaker 1: and your family escape into southern Utah to wanting to
4:43
Speaker 1: drive one around the world. What was that transition for you?
4:46
Speaker 1: What made you think you wanted to drive around the world.
4:48
Speaker 2: I don't know that there was a singular moment where
4:50
Speaker 2: I decided I wanted to drive around the world. It
4:52
Speaker 2: was probably just a culmination of events. I was fortunate
4:56
Speaker 2: in my career to get to a point where I
4:58
Speaker 2: had means to do you big expeditions like that, not
5:02
Speaker 2: really knowing what it would cost. I just knew that
5:04
Speaker 2: I could write a really good sized check to make
5:07
Speaker 2: something big happen. That sort of made it possible for
5:10
Speaker 2: me to pursue dreams. And I remember in the early
5:13
Speaker 2: thought process of Expedition seven, getting my computer out and
5:16
Speaker 2: just doing a brain dump, asking questions like which vehicle,
5:19
Speaker 2: how many vehicles, which route, which time of year, And
5:22
Speaker 2: it was like three pages of notes. That was shortly
5:25
Speaker 2: before you and I met. I just remember thinking what
5:27
Speaker 2: a blessing it was when you and I finally connected
5:29
Speaker 2: and I walked you through that list or missed a
5:32
Speaker 2: portion of it, and you, very matter of fact you said, yeah,
5:34
Speaker 2: I've got the blueprints for that trip. I've already designed
5:38
Speaker 2: all that and planned all that. We can get together
5:40
Speaker 2: and talk about it. It was just a series of
5:42
Speaker 2: things like that and more before it, probably and a
5:45
Speaker 2: few after, But it just was an idea that continued
5:48
Speaker 2: to evolve until there was a moment where I thought,
5:50
Speaker 2: you know, I've got everything I need to pull this off.
5:52
Speaker 2: I've got guidance from Scott, I've got the vehicles, got
5:55
Speaker 2: a route, we've got a plan, we've got the ability
5:58
Speaker 2: to finance it, We've got the mechanicals and so on.
6:01
Speaker 2: It was like, are we going to do this or not?
6:02
Speaker 2: I was like, Yeah, we're going to do this.
6:04
Speaker 1: And if I remember, you had a hundred series land
6:06
Speaker 1: Cruiser at the time, and that was the vehicle. In fact,
6:09
Speaker 1: I remember the first time we talked. I asked you,
6:11
Speaker 1: what big thing do you want to do next? And
6:13
Speaker 1: you said, Scott, I want to drive around the world.
6:14
Speaker 1: And I asked you what you wanted to drive and
6:16
Speaker 1: you had this hundred series that you were very thoughtfully
6:18
Speaker 1: built to be perfect for that kind of thing. And
6:21
Speaker 1: it was really interesting to see that you were already
6:23
Speaker 1: thinking in those terms.
6:24
Speaker 2: Yeah, and that might have been a good vehicle to
6:27
Speaker 2: travel around the world. I think the vehicles that we
6:29
Speaker 2: ultimately selected, which were the BDJ seventy eight, probably produced
6:34
Speaker 2: a better result, especially when we were going across the
6:36
Speaker 2: Namib Desert and so on. I don't know that the
6:38
Speaker 2: hundred series would have served us quite as well. I
6:41
Speaker 2: think a hundred series would have would have done Okay,
6:43
Speaker 2: maybe we might have influenced our route a little bit,
6:45
Speaker 2: but it would have got us home.
6:46
Speaker 1: And there was something about the purity of that seventy series.
6:49
Speaker 1: Maybe it's because you and I started in forty series
6:52
Speaker 1: that it felt like just enough comfort and power and
6:56
Speaker 1: convenience to make it where you could drive all day long.
6:58
Speaker 1: But it was so simple, so easy to drive.
7:01
Speaker 2: I couldn't agree more. I love that term, the purity
7:04
Speaker 2: of those seventy series to me, even a contemporary seventy
7:08
Speaker 2: series seventy eight, seventy nine, if you go sit in one,
7:11
Speaker 2: a brand new one and still got that new car smell.
7:13
Speaker 2: For me, it ridges the gap between an up to
7:16
Speaker 2: the moment car that was just built a week or
7:18
Speaker 2: a month ago, but still has the feeling the soul
7:22
Speaker 2: of the FJ forties that I remember crawling through as
7:25
Speaker 2: a young boy at Stevenson Toyota in the early seventies.
7:28
Speaker 2: The same smell, the same feel, the same DNA And
7:31
Speaker 2: I think that's remarkable, And I don't get that as
7:34
Speaker 2: much from you, like the eighties or the hundreds and
7:37
Speaker 2: the two hundreds, they've just become more luxurious. I got
7:40
Speaker 2: it a little bit from the sixty series, but the seventies,
7:43
Speaker 2: as you said, they're still so pure. They just evoke
7:46
Speaker 2: a really neat emotion for me. To be able to
7:49
Speaker 2: have that travel with us on E seven with four
7:52
Speaker 2: point five liter turbov eight the front and rear difflocks,
7:55
Speaker 2: that was, like you said, that was the perfect combination
7:58
Speaker 2: of attributes.
7:59
Speaker 1: For a vehicle for that expedition. I think so. And
8:01
Speaker 1: there's just an honesty about them. There's just nothing pretentious.
8:05
Speaker 1: They are a tool like nothing else in the world
8:07
Speaker 1: to do a job. Maybe something will come out at
8:10
Speaker 1: some point in time, but as of today and the
8:12
Speaker 1: time that we did that trip, there was nothing equivalent. Yeah,
8:14
Speaker 1: there were things that were close, but nothing equivalent to
8:16
Speaker 1: that vehicle.
8:17
Speaker 2: At the risk is sounded like the guy who recommended
8:19
Speaker 2: the United States close their patent office because everything had
8:22
Speaker 2: been invented way back when. I just don't know how
8:25
Speaker 2: you would ever improve on that seventy eight series so pure,
8:29
Speaker 2: it's so durable, it's so well built, well thought out,
8:33
Speaker 2: well engineered, well manufactured, and as you know, we put
8:37
Speaker 2: I think on the fleet of seventy series. I think
8:39
Speaker 2: it came to just under one hundred and sixty thousand
8:41
Speaker 2: miles of travel, most of which was not on pavement.
8:45
Speaker 2: And we had that one failure that was the solenoid
8:48
Speaker 2: switch to activate the rear diplock, that occurred within one
8:51
Speaker 2: thousand miles on three vehicles within a thousand miles of
8:54
Speaker 2: each other, in the middle of the Australian outback. After
8:57
Speaker 2: the sand and the spin efects and everything that we
9:00
Speaker 2: rejected them. To to have that kind of burden load
9:03
Speaker 2: on those vehicles for as long as we did and
9:05
Speaker 2: only have that one failure, to me, is still absolutely
9:08
Speaker 2: almost unbelievable.
9:08
Speaker 1: Things remarkable, Yeah, yeah, and that was really trail damage.
9:11
Speaker 1: It wasn't even that the trucks had a reliability Yeah.
9:14
Speaker 2: It wasn't an engineering issue. It was just interesting that
9:17
Speaker 2: it all came at such a tight period. And I
9:19
Speaker 2: remember sometime after we got back from E seven, we
9:22
Speaker 2: were asked to bring one of those trucks down to
9:24
Speaker 2: moapp as part of Toyota's Ever Better Expedition. I remember
9:28
Speaker 2: they asked me to give a little presentation about E
9:30
Speaker 2: seven in a little mobile classroom they had in a trailer,
9:33
Speaker 2: and as I was presenting. I saw standing against the
9:36
Speaker 2: back wall about a dozen engineers from Toyota. They all
9:39
Speaker 2: have their black slacks on and their red golf shirts,
9:41
Speaker 2: and when I started telling that story, you could see
9:43
Speaker 2: them all just perk up, and they didn't want to
9:45
Speaker 2: be rude, but they couldn't wait to get outside. They
9:48
Speaker 2: knew that truck was just right outside the door, and
9:49
Speaker 2: as soon as I finished my presentation, they bolted out
9:53
Speaker 2: the door, and I've got a picture of like six
9:55
Speaker 2: or eight of them under that car with Kurt Williams
9:57
Speaker 2: there showing them what the malfunction was. Pretty sure if
10:00
Speaker 2: we went and bought a seventy eight today or whatever
10:02
Speaker 2: allowed those malfunctions to happen has been cured and it
10:05
Speaker 2: won't happen again.
10:06
Speaker 1: I think it was just there's a little skid plate
10:08
Speaker 1: or a little deflection plate, and those got dented and
10:11
Speaker 1: then the wires got warned basically down to the just
10:14
Speaker 1: from all that spin effects. It was the Australian segment
10:18
Speaker 1: was the most abusive on the trucks. It felt like
10:20
Speaker 1: to me, yeah, yeah, incredible. It was such a pleasure
10:23
Speaker 1: for us to be able to both be in that
10:25
Speaker 1: place where without you there's no way I could have
10:28
Speaker 1: realized that it was. People who are listening may not
10:31
Speaker 1: know this, but I was considering Expedition seven before starting
10:34
Speaker 1: the magazine, and I just didn't know. I had no
10:36
Speaker 1: way to figure out how to do it. I needed
10:38
Speaker 1: the right partner. There was no way to do it.
10:40
Speaker 1: So we started the magazine instead, which of course I'm
10:42
Speaker 1: so grateful that we did. And then for you and
10:44
Speaker 1: I to be at a party with Paul May at
10:46
Speaker 1: Paul May's house and to talk about traveling around the world,
10:49
Speaker 1: and then the next morning we met for breakfast and
10:51
Speaker 1: it was just everything just fit together so perfect that
10:54
Speaker 1: we knew it was time to it.
10:55
Speaker 2: Yeah, I feel the same way. I had certain things
10:58
Speaker 2: that I could contribute to the effort, but I had
11:00
Speaker 2: huge blind spots, huge areas of bignor incident. I think
11:04
Speaker 2: you were perfectly suited to fill and I was able
11:08
Speaker 2: to fill some needs that you weren't, and it was
11:10
Speaker 2: the perfect compliment. And I you know, here we are
11:13
Speaker 2: a little over ten years from the original launch of
11:16
Speaker 2: that and I'm still amazed that we were able to
11:19
Speaker 2: pull it off, that we completed it. You know, it
11:21
Speaker 2: was a long journey and there were enormous logistics involved
11:26
Speaker 2: in even ways that the best planning wouldn't have been
11:29
Speaker 2: able to consider. And we got through all that stuff,
11:31
Speaker 2: and we got the vehicles home and they're in the
11:33
Speaker 2: museum and You're safe and I'm safe, and here we
11:35
Speaker 2: are talking about it ten years later. That was That's
11:37
Speaker 2: a pretty remarkable feed. I'm very proud of it. Yeah,
11:40
Speaker 2: I would say so. I feel the same way. And
11:42
Speaker 2: for us to be this many years later and all
11:45
Speaker 2: of those experiences and enjoy being able to see each
11:48
Speaker 2: other and to talk about that experience, not everybody gets
11:51
Speaker 2: to have that result.
11:52
Speaker 1: And I think that a lot of it comes down
11:54
Speaker 1: to the types of people that you and I brought
11:56
Speaker 1: into the trip. If you think about the constants out
12:00
Speaker 1: the journey, Kurt Williams is one of the first that
12:02
Speaker 1: comes to mind, and he's just an individual of such
12:05
Speaker 1: rare and exceptional quality that he makes the trip better
12:09
Speaker 1: just by him being there. It was the first big
12:11
Speaker 1: trips that Clay got to do internationally. Clay cross from
12:14
Speaker 1: X Overland and now he's had this incredible career traveling
12:17
Speaker 1: around the world with X Overland and telling stories and
12:20
Speaker 1: Cruiser Outfitters is bigger and stronger than it's ever been.
12:23
Speaker 1: And now Kurt has all of those experiences that he
12:25
Speaker 1: gained from E seven and me too. I remember one
12:28
Speaker 1: day I was feeling the weight of getting it all
12:30
Speaker 1: done and hitting timelines and was I going to do
12:33
Speaker 1: it and still take care of my team back home?
12:35
Speaker 1: And I was talking to a good friend of mine
12:37
Speaker 1: and he said, Scott, He's like, anytime you do something
12:39
Speaker 1: exceptional like this that changes your life, it's going to
12:42
Speaker 1: be hard, he said, So look at it like a
12:44
Speaker 1: PhD in Overland? Do you get a chance? Like a
12:47
Speaker 1: PhD's not going to be easy. There's going to be
12:48
Speaker 1: hard days, there's going to be sleepless nights, there's going
12:51
Speaker 1: to be all of these challenges that come along. And
12:53
Speaker 1: if you want the PhD, you got to put in
12:55
Speaker 1: the work, and you got to endure the hard days,
12:57
Speaker 1: and you got to just wake up and make it happen.
13:00
Speaker 1: He told me that advice, and it completely reset my expectation.
13:03
Speaker 1: This understanding that what we were doing was difficult and
13:06
Speaker 1: there were going to be hard days for all of us,
13:08
Speaker 1: and the result is that we had an experience that
13:11
Speaker 1: had never been done before.
13:12
Speaker 2: So, yeah, that's a great story. You've never shared that
13:15
Speaker 2: that part of it with me before, so it's interesting
13:17
Speaker 2: to hear that. I think I had similar experiences, like
13:19
Speaker 2: you know, what have I gotten myself into? You know,
13:21
Speaker 2: have I've bitten off more than I can chew? And
13:24
Speaker 2: as you said, like any worthwhile endeavor, especially a life
13:27
Speaker 2: changing endeavor, it's going to come at a price, and
13:29
Speaker 2: we just kept chipping away at it. You know, as
13:31
Speaker 2: everybody knows, we made it home. But I'd like to
13:32
Speaker 2: go back and revisit what you said about the quality
13:35
Speaker 2: of the people that were part of the project. That's
13:37
Speaker 2: one of my favorite things to tell about the original
13:41
Speaker 2: E seven expedition as well as the later Greenland Expedition
13:45
Speaker 2: which occurred in the spring of twenty eighteen, and that
13:48
Speaker 2: is that with all of the adversity. The way I
13:50
Speaker 2: tell the story is, go and select your six favorite
13:53
Speaker 2: people on planet Earth, the people you love the most,
13:56
Speaker 2: and then bring them into a space where you're literally
13:59
Speaker 2: within earshot for a matter of weeks, and then subject
14:03
Speaker 2: yourself to a series of challenges. You know, every day
14:06
Speaker 2: you're going to get stuck, You're going to have mechanical failure,
14:08
Speaker 2: you're going to have logistical or political challenges or whatever,
14:12
Speaker 2: and so you're constantly problem solving, you're eating out of
14:14
Speaker 2: a can or out of a sellofhane wrapper, probably sleep
14:17
Speaker 2: deprived and all of these things. Later on, it's pretty
14:20
Speaker 2: easy to start getting snippy with people. But in all
14:23
Speaker 2: of those experiences that we had over those you know,
14:26
Speaker 2: for two hundred and eighteen days I was in the
14:28
Speaker 2: field on the original and then probably another twenty days
14:31
Speaker 2: in Greenland later. The thing that I'm most proud of,
14:33
Speaker 2: other than accomplishing that, you know, we accomplished everything we
14:36
Speaker 2: set out to do. The thing that I'm probably equally
14:38
Speaker 2: proud of is the quality of the team members and
14:41
Speaker 2: that even though we were in those close confines, in
14:44
Speaker 2: those conditions, there was literally never a crossword spoken.
14:47
Speaker 1: I can't remember one.
14:48
Speaker 2: Yeah, and that just doesn't happen. And that speaks to
14:51
Speaker 2: the camaraderie, to the level of respect we had for
14:54
Speaker 2: each other, to the expertise and the way we all
14:57
Speaker 2: were able to contribute and lean in to our a
15:00
Speaker 2: collaborative problem solving. You know, I remember going back to
15:03
Speaker 2: Greenland now and I'm kind of jumping around when we
15:05
Speaker 2: were so close to a hot shower in pizza after
15:08
Speaker 2: being out in forty below for almost three weeks. Some
15:11
Speaker 2: of us wanted to punch through, and some of us said, no,
15:13
Speaker 2: we got to stop here. It's too dangerous. And I
15:15
Speaker 2: just remember standing there in that cold twilight with ice
15:18
Speaker 2: below us and crevasses who knew where but we knew
15:20
Speaker 2: they were below us, and just having that deliberation, and
15:23
Speaker 2: those who didn't get what they wanted just just said, Okay,
15:26
Speaker 2: I'm going to go with the group. I respect the group,
15:28
Speaker 2: and it just worked out. That's a remarkable thing. You
15:30
Speaker 2: don't see that. I don't see that anywhere in my
15:33
Speaker 2: life or in society other than that. So that's that
15:35
Speaker 2: is something that I really love about the East seven experience.
15:38
Speaker 1: And we were surrounded by danger. I mean I remember
15:41
Speaker 1: at that spot where we stopped and we got some
15:43
Speaker 1: food in us when I stepped out of the vehicle,
15:46
Speaker 1: I fell into a crevass, and my harness is what
15:48
Speaker 1: stopped me. Yeah, it was.
15:49
Speaker 2: I remember you were actually in the lead truck, so
15:52
Speaker 2: it was me and Kurt. I think, we're in my
15:54
Speaker 2: truck and we watched Solberg get out with this probing
15:57
Speaker 2: rod and he's trying to find the crevasses and he
16:00
Speaker 2: did the same thing. He stepped into one and kind
16:01
Speaker 2: of got one leg, you know, up to his thigh
16:04
Speaker 2: in there, and it's like, wow, this is sketchy.
16:06
Speaker 1: And they were everywhere, Yeah, everywhere, I mean, And what
16:09
Speaker 1: was it about half of our third of the time
16:11
Speaker 1: that he dropped his hole and it went all.
16:13
Speaker 2: Thes and we had to drive across that bit.
16:16
Speaker 1: It was our only way. It was our only way out.
16:18
Speaker 2: That was that was the adventure.
16:20
Speaker 1: When you look back on Expedition seven, how do you
16:23
Speaker 1: feel like it changed you as a personal.
16:25
Speaker 2: Well, I would say that it reinforced in me the
16:28
Speaker 2: value of surrounding myself with quality people. I'd like to
16:31
Speaker 2: think I knew that before, but the experience heightened that
16:34
Speaker 2: awareness in me. Number one. Number two, it gave me
16:38
Speaker 2: confidence that with the right relationships and the right people involved,
16:42
Speaker 2: I can do hard things, really hard things, even if
16:44
Speaker 2: they're long duration. For me, that just everything that E
16:48
Speaker 2: seven is that it represents is one of the things
16:51
Speaker 2: that I'm most proud of in my life. I'm proud
16:53
Speaker 2: of my marriage. I've been married thirty eight years. I'm
16:55
Speaker 2: proud of my kids. They're all wonderful, they have beautiful spouses.
16:58
Speaker 2: I have wonderful grandchildren outside of family. I think Expedition
17:02
Speaker 2: seven and the way it was executed and just the
17:06
Speaker 2: robustness of the experience is something that just for me
17:10
Speaker 2: gets more. I'm more and more fond of it with
17:12
Speaker 2: time passing, and I think it will inspire me at
17:16
Speaker 2: some point to do other big and you probably improbable things.
17:21
Speaker 1: Yeah, we've talked about boats in the Northwest Passage and
17:24
Speaker 1: all kinds of fun ideas, so who knows where things
17:27
Speaker 1: will go from there. I think when I look back,
17:29
Speaker 1: I realize how much Expedition seven humbled me and how
17:34
Speaker 1: much it softened me. And I think that a lot
17:37
Speaker 1: of it was the amount of hours that I spent
17:39
Speaker 1: with Ruce Storn, who's just a very thoughtful guy, and
17:41
Speaker 1: the amount of the conversations that we had about his
17:44
Speaker 1: life and the people that he interacts with and he helps.
17:47
Speaker 1: And then just seeing all of these unique places around
17:50
Speaker 1: the world, and how not only fortunate we are to
17:53
Speaker 1: live where we live and the amount of opportunity that
17:56
Speaker 1: we have in the United States, but that people can
17:59
Speaker 1: be happy and that they can be joyful, and that
18:01
Speaker 1: they can be excited about their day when they have
18:04
Speaker 1: a fraction of that opportunity, and that really recalibrated me.
18:07
Speaker 1: It made me be far less critical of myself and others,
18:11
Speaker 1: and it also allowed me to be a lot more
18:12
Speaker 1: open of I'm really lucky every day, and I got
18:15
Speaker 1: to be I got to take can't take that for granted.
18:17
Speaker 2: I agree. I think that's that was something that I
18:20
Speaker 2: was impressed by as well. And I have sort of
18:22
Speaker 2: a companion thought to that, which is that I feel
18:25
Speaker 2: like everywhere we went, anytime we were engaging with the
18:29
Speaker 2: local and getting to know them and their family and
18:31
Speaker 2: their home and their job, you know, their circumstances, there
18:34
Speaker 2: was a common thread, and that is that everybody just
18:36
Speaker 2: wants an opportunity. They want an opportunity to work for
18:40
Speaker 2: a living. They want to you know, they want to
18:42
Speaker 2: earn what they get. They want to make sure that
18:44
Speaker 2: people they care about are love and they want to
18:46
Speaker 2: have a good time once in a while. It was
18:48
Speaker 2: interesting to me how similar that pattern was anywhere we went.
18:51
Speaker 2: I mean, you think about that reindeer farm in icer Talk, Yeah,
18:55
Speaker 2: that was true there, It was true in South America,
18:57
Speaker 2: it was true in Africa and that little village when
18:59
Speaker 2: we went in the adobe huts and all of those
19:01
Speaker 2: people just just wanted those same basic fundamental things and
19:05
Speaker 2: they're the same things I want exactly, you know here
19:07
Speaker 2: I am in America. But to me, it just was
19:09
Speaker 2: an awakening of how, you know, there's these bonds of
19:12
Speaker 2: humanity and how much we have in common with people.
19:14
Speaker 2: No matter how different their culture or their skin color,
19:17
Speaker 2: their upbringing, maybe we still have so much in common.
19:20
Speaker 1: And speaking about those bonds, Greg, I thought one of
19:23
Speaker 1: the really unexpected and positive things that came out of
19:26
Speaker 1: the trip for me was the opportunities that we had
19:29
Speaker 1: to travel with family. I traveled with family less than
19:31
Speaker 1: you did, but you had your family with you on
19:34
Speaker 1: almost every leg of the journey, even Antarctica. You know,
19:36
Speaker 1: you had family that was able to come and Oakley
19:39
Speaker 1: was able to fly in and spend time with you.
19:41
Speaker 1: When you look back on that time with your kids
19:44
Speaker 1: and with your extended family, even when we were in Europe,
19:47
Speaker 1: what were some of the things that were your fondest
19:49
Speaker 1: memories or the things that you thought was the most
19:51
Speaker 1: touching for you.
19:52
Speaker 2: I think is if I look at it in terms
19:54
Speaker 2: of memories, I got enormous joy from seeing my family
20:00
Speaker 2: exposed to exotic places. You know, cultures, people, foods, landscapes.
20:06
Speaker 2: It was just neat to see their reaction to it.
20:08
Speaker 2: And now that these ten years or so have passed,
20:11
Speaker 2: it's been equally magical for me to see every one
20:14
Speaker 2: of my kids affinity for travel, and it's different kinds
20:18
Speaker 2: of travel. Some is super adventure related. My middle son
20:23
Speaker 2: Josh just summited El Cap. He loves to go to Yosemite. Yeah,
20:26
Speaker 2: I mean that's legit. Four or five nights on the walls,
20:28
Speaker 2: like one hundred pitches to get up there, and the
20:30
Speaker 2: first time he tried he was unsuccessful, but he learned
20:33
Speaker 2: so much about it he went back the next year
20:35
Speaker 2: and got to the summit, which I'm really proud of
20:37
Speaker 2: him for. Others are more they'll runt a sprinter van
20:40
Speaker 2: and take their three kids and stay in a beach
20:42
Speaker 2: house somewhere. It's a little more posh, a little more
20:44
Speaker 2: laid back, doesn't matter what the flavor is. They're all
20:46
Speaker 2: getting out and having those experiences.
20:49
Speaker 1: Yeah, which is really important. I remember for me, Greg,
20:52
Speaker 1: watching you with your kids. There were several times, in fact,
20:56
Speaker 1: almost on every continent that you had these moments with
20:59
Speaker 1: one of them just with you, and you guys were
21:01
Speaker 1: spending days together in a car, and I could see
21:04
Speaker 1: the relationship soften and get closer, and the laughter, and
21:08
Speaker 1: because at first they were probably a little intimidated, I'm
21:10
Speaker 1: going to go where and I'm going to have to
21:13
Speaker 1: drive how many hours a day? But consistently every time,
21:16
Speaker 1: whether it was one of your daughters or one of
21:17
Speaker 1: your sons. As a father of several children, was that
21:21
Speaker 1: a unique or an unexpected outcome to spend that full
21:24
Speaker 1: time with each one of your kids.
21:25
Speaker 2: Well, if I'm being honest, I think I would have
21:28
Speaker 2: to say that I expected a quality experience when I
21:32
Speaker 2: arranged to have whoever that was with me. But I
21:34
Speaker 2: also think it would be accurate to say that in
21:37
Speaker 2: every instance my expectations were exceeded just because of the moment.
21:41
Speaker 2: Whatever it was that we experienced, it drew us closer together,
21:44
Speaker 2: and having one on one time when it was one
21:46
Speaker 2: on one, and you know, just being around the camp
21:48
Speaker 2: at night, sleeping in at the seventy eight, eating in
21:51
Speaker 2: the restaurants or you know, grilling in the jungle or
21:53
Speaker 2: whatever it was. I just don't think there's any way
21:56
Speaker 2: that those kind of experiences can't help people and grow
21:59
Speaker 2: closer together.
22:00
Speaker 1: I agree, and it was so fun to watch, like
22:01
Speaker 1: in Africa, for example, where all the boys climbed up
22:04
Speaker 1: on top of the rack and we're doing this deep
22:06
Speaker 1: water crossing and there were crocking fested waters the smiles.
22:10
Speaker 1: I can zoom in on the photos Greg, and I
22:12
Speaker 1: can see they are lit up. I mean they are
22:15
Speaker 1: in the wildest places on the planet and they are
22:18
Speaker 1: absolutely alive because of that experience. And then we're sitting
22:21
Speaker 1: around the campfire later that night. And this is a
22:23
Speaker 1: funny story for me seven that I'll share for the audience.
22:26
Speaker 1: But I remember we were sitting around the campfire and
22:29
Speaker 1: for whatever reason, like the hair I don't have hair
22:31
Speaker 1: on the back of my head, but the hair used
22:32
Speaker 1: to put the vestigal hair follicles on the back of
22:36
Speaker 1: my head stood up, and I just knew that something
22:39
Speaker 1: wasn't right. And I had a flashlight with me and
22:41
Speaker 1: you were working on your laptop around the fire, and
22:44
Speaker 1: I popped the light on and there was a hyena.
22:46
Speaker 1: I don't know how close it was to you like
22:48
Speaker 1: it to me, it's probably it feels like the story,
22:51
Speaker 1: it was close, and it was just this reminder that
22:54
Speaker 1: we were in a wild, wild place.
22:57
Speaker 2: I remember that vividly. Yeah, that was there's no fences,
23:00
Speaker 2: there's no cages. We were right in their backyard.
23:02
Speaker 1: We were right and thank goodness for the fire, that
23:04
Speaker 1: was what kept the animal at bay a little bit.
23:06
Speaker 1: But it was it was experiences like that for me
23:10
Speaker 1: that were so powerful. But it does come back to
23:12
Speaker 1: those people that we did it with. You know, if
23:14
Speaker 1: you think about the time we spent with Sinway and
23:16
Speaker 1: Paul traveling on several of the trips, and you know,
23:19
Speaker 1: the time that we spent going across North America and
23:22
Speaker 1: making it all the way to Saint John's and just
23:24
Speaker 1: those experiences with people that we just developed a very
23:27
Speaker 1: deep bond with because of that trip.
23:29
Speaker 2: Yeah, and taking that a step further, Yes, all of
23:31
Speaker 2: those bonds were either created or solidified or strengthened you mentioned.
23:36
Speaker 2: But I look back now, I have friends all around
23:38
Speaker 2: the world, one of which I talked to today as
23:41
Speaker 2: a result of that trip. Yeah, I stay in contact
23:44
Speaker 2: with They're probably a dozen of them that I met
23:46
Speaker 2: through E seven. There are meaningful relationships to me. And
23:49
Speaker 2: I feel like, you know, I've had some of them
23:50
Speaker 2: come to Salt Lake and stay at my house, and
23:52
Speaker 2: I feel like they would reciprocate if I was in
23:54
Speaker 2: one of their neighborhoods and I said, hey, I need
23:56
Speaker 2: a place to crash for a day or two, and
23:58
Speaker 2: I'll say come on over. That's obviously a wonderful takeaway
24:00
Speaker 2: from the trip as well, and a special thanks to
24:03
Speaker 2: this week's sponsor, Gcioutdoor.
24:05
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24:08
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Speaker 1: their email list. Thanks again, GCI, and I think for
24:47
Speaker 1: those that are listening, it just comes back to this.
24:49
Speaker 1: For Greg and I, this realization that despite the extreme
24:52
Speaker 1: nature of the journey and the length of time that
24:54
Speaker 1: it took for us to do it and the resources
24:56
Speaker 1: it took to pull it together, the thread at the
24:58
Speaker 1: end of it was it was about the people that
24:59
Speaker 1: we traveled with and that can be replicated on a
25:02
Speaker 1: trail in Utah as easily as it can be crossing
25:05
Speaker 1: a continent. And those are the Ten years later, you
25:07
Speaker 1: and I are looking back on those moments that we
25:09
Speaker 1: had with the people that we care about, and maybe
25:11
Speaker 1: a hyena in there. And a special thanks to this
25:13
Speaker 1: week's sponsor, GCI Outdoor. Whether you're heading out for a
25:16
Speaker 1: weekend of adventure in the woods or to your backyard
25:19
Speaker 1: fire pit, Gcioutdoor Gear is ready for whatever you have planned.
25:24
Speaker 1: Gcioutdoor has been around for twenty five years, so they
25:27
Speaker 1: know what they're doing when it comes to the best
25:29
Speaker 1: and portable recreation gear. GCI has innovative products ranging from
25:34
Speaker 1: outdoor rockers to complete camp kitchens and everything in between,
25:38
Speaker 1: and with a limited lifetime warranty, you know they stand
25:41
Speaker 1: behind everything they make. GCI Outdoor Gear is comfortable, durable,
25:45
Speaker 1: and built for adventures big and small. Try them out
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25:56
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think that's another one of my takeaways. You
25:59
Speaker 2: just led us into it. When I address audiences about
26:02
Speaker 2: Expedition seven, I'm always concerned about people's reaction, and you know,
26:07
Speaker 2: I would never want to give the impression about elitism
26:10
Speaker 2: or you know, I never talk about how much the
26:12
Speaker 2: expedition costs or anything like that, And I always end
26:16
Speaker 2: my remarks by saying that I understand everybody doesn't have
26:19
Speaker 2: the means to pull off an Expedition seven scale journey.
26:23
Speaker 2: Good news is that that's not necessary, because the emotions
26:27
Speaker 2: that I experienced throughout E seven were remarkably similar to
26:31
Speaker 2: the emotions that I experienced as an eight year old
26:33
Speaker 2: boy when I went through the hole in the back
26:35
Speaker 2: fence with a neighbor friend and we went down a
26:38
Speaker 2: ditch under a culvert onto a frozen canal one winter morning,
26:41
Speaker 2: and I remember walking along the canal with these willow
26:44
Speaker 2: branches that were laden with snow, and we're kind of
26:47
Speaker 2: going through this tunnel and we just started exploring. We
26:50
Speaker 2: didn't know where it was going to go, but it
26:51
Speaker 2: was this willow tunnel and we went down. It seemed
26:53
Speaker 2: like forever, but it was probably just a few hundred yards,
26:56
Speaker 2: and we came out at this gravel cory where there
26:58
Speaker 2: was a big rock piles that a beyer had created
27:00
Speaker 2: in a big sand pilot. It seemed like it was
27:02
Speaker 2: fifty feet tall, and because it was so cold, it
27:05
Speaker 2: was frozen. And me and my friend Max climbed to
27:07
Speaker 2: the top of his hill and it was this huge
27:09
Speaker 2: adventure and you can see forever and it's like, hey,
27:11
Speaker 2: there's our house over there, and all of that, just
27:14
Speaker 2: that adventure and what's around the next turn. It was
27:16
Speaker 2: just so deeply ingrained in me at the time. And again,
27:19
Speaker 2: those are the emotions that I felled on Ey seven.
27:21
Speaker 2: So that literally cost us nothing other than the effort
27:23
Speaker 2: to get off. You know, I go out the back
27:25
Speaker 2: door and do it. And so I think I think
27:27
Speaker 2: there's a lesson in there for me and hopefully for others,
27:29
Speaker 2: where you just do what you can live within your means,
27:32
Speaker 2: but take that first step and get out and try something.
27:35
Speaker 2: You know, go go someplace you've never been, Take a
27:38
Speaker 2: friend that you want to get to know better. Just
27:40
Speaker 2: take a risk and do something and you will be
27:42
Speaker 2: rewarded for it.
27:43
Speaker 1: Yeah, I agree, and it makes me think of this
27:45
Speaker 1: good friend of mine, Stefano Melgrotti. He left Italy and
27:49
Speaker 1: he traveled around the world for two years. He went
27:51
Speaker 1: all the way down the length of Africa, shipped over
27:53
Speaker 1: to South America, and drove all the way back up
27:55
Speaker 1: the same route that we did. His average expenses per
27:57
Speaker 1: day were twenty six dollars. Wow, you're right. It is
28:00
Speaker 1: possible to have a version of these adventures just by
28:03
Speaker 1: a different means or with a different set of expectations,
28:06
Speaker 1: and it's really impressive to see people do that on
28:08
Speaker 1: a daily basis.
28:09
Speaker 2: Yeah, there's so many different ways to experience the world
28:12
Speaker 2: and to you know, to drink it in, so to speak.
28:14
Speaker 2: And I just love it when people take the initiative,
28:17
Speaker 2: and I especially love it when they take the initiative
28:19
Speaker 2: to get their kids out and introduce their kids to
28:23
Speaker 2: something new that then creates a spark in them and
28:26
Speaker 2: they want to keep doing bigger things.
28:28
Speaker 1: When you look back at Expedition seven, what was your
28:31
Speaker 1: favorite content?
28:32
Speaker 2: I would say, Man, there were so varied and they
28:35
Speaker 2: were also remarkable in their own way. But I don't
28:37
Speaker 2: think there's any anything that can equal that moment we
28:41
Speaker 2: had in the Oka Bongo Delta that one night when
28:43
Speaker 2: the sun was low in the sky and it seemed
28:45
Speaker 2: like it just stayed there for an hour, and we
28:48
Speaker 2: were on that river bend, and I remember looking over
28:51
Speaker 2: and seeing two huge crocodiles on the far bank. There
28:53
Speaker 2: were six or seven elephants that were in the river
28:56
Speaker 2: near the crocodiles, and then looking over towards the sun,
28:59
Speaker 2: there was a pot of hippos and you could see
29:01
Speaker 2: their backs in the glistening water, and then just to
29:04
Speaker 2: their right there was that hurt of zebras that was
29:07
Speaker 2: only obstructed by those three giraffes that were coming to
29:10
Speaker 2: get a drink in the water. And all the while
29:12
Speaker 2: my boys are up on the rack with their long
29:14
Speaker 2: lens is just just drinking this in, just like we
29:17
Speaker 2: will never replicate this moment. That was probably my singular
29:20
Speaker 2: wow moment from me seven. But then it was complimented
29:23
Speaker 2: with the experiences we had driving across the Namib Desert,
29:26
Speaker 2: three hundred miles of pure sand dunes, and driving up
29:29
Speaker 2: the Skeleton coast and having to time the tide just
29:31
Speaker 2: right so we didn't get holed out to see and
29:33
Speaker 2: that old diamond quarry that we found there. It just
29:36
Speaker 2: goes on and on, and so I think I'd probably
29:38
Speaker 2: have to say Africa was the most magical.
29:41
Speaker 1: Yeah, I would say for me it was the same Africa,
29:43
Speaker 1: followed by our time on the canning stock, but that
29:46
Speaker 1: would have been because of the people. Again, because we
29:48
Speaker 1: hit real challenge. I mean we were stuck for I
29:49
Speaker 1: don't know. I mean I was stuck for how long,
29:51
Speaker 1: fourteen hours or something. But Kurt Williams and these guys
29:55
Speaker 1: are getting bit by I don't know what was in
29:56
Speaker 1: the water.
29:57
Speaker 2: Like no, we dubbed them Assassin Tadpoles.
30:00
Speaker 1: They they were like Assassin Tadpole.
30:02
Speaker 2: Yeah, and we still we have a max track we
30:04
Speaker 2: need to go get at some point. We went in
30:05
Speaker 2: with fourteen and came out with thirty.
30:07
Speaker 1: That's right. Yeah, that was when we needed every single
30:09
Speaker 1: one of them. Incredible, what an experience.
30:11
Speaker 2: Yeah, and then of course, in a very different way,
30:13
Speaker 2: Antarctica was remarkable. I mean, when do you drive to
30:16
Speaker 2: the South Pole and when are you on your way
30:18
Speaker 2: to the South Pole and you run into Prince Harry.
30:20
Speaker 2: You know, it was just it was.
30:22
Speaker 1: Crazy yeah, it's not every day you get to save
30:24
Speaker 1: a prince right curtain when the radio cracked and they said, guys,
30:28
Speaker 1: can we have some help getting closer to the South Pole?
30:31
Speaker 2: And then as we got close, you know, and as
30:33
Speaker 2: we were pulling into their camp, I was so impressed
30:35
Speaker 2: to see Prince Harry in the back of a time
30:37
Speaker 2: Tacoma and he was basically a porter some of his
30:40
Speaker 2: the other aids on that trip were throwing gear up
30:42
Speaker 2: to him and he's stacking in the back of that
30:44
Speaker 2: Arctic truck and highles. I guess it would have been.
30:46
Speaker 2: I just thought, yeah, this guy's cool. It was impressive
30:49
Speaker 2: be doing that. Yeah.
30:49
Speaker 1: Yeah, he jumped right in. There was nothing elitist about him.
30:53
Speaker 1: He just got to work because they had an opportunity
30:55
Speaker 1: to problem.
30:56
Speaker 2: They were just as you can tell as we're started
30:58
Speaker 2: to sit here in the memory start rolling back, there
31:00
Speaker 2: were a lot of great things that happened to us
31:01
Speaker 2: on that trip. We could probably stay here a long time,
31:03
Speaker 2: and no question reminisce it was years of our life
31:06
Speaker 2: for sure. Expedition seven completes in South America and the
31:10
Speaker 2: vehicles make it safely back to the land Cruiser Heritage
31:13
Speaker 2: Museum in Salt Lake, which for those that are listening,
31:16
Speaker 2: please make sure that you take the opportunity. If you
31:19
Speaker 2: love anything about fold drives, especially if you love anything
31:22
Speaker 2: about land cruisers or about overland travel, you've got to
31:25
Speaker 2: go take a look at the land Cruiser Heritage Museum.
31:27
Speaker 2: It is one of the most special places on the planet.
31:29
Speaker 2: If you have any doubt, go check out the Google reviews.
31:32
Speaker 2: There's about eight billion five star reviews on that place.
31:35
Speaker 2: And there's a reason for it. Cruiser Dan and Kurt
31:38
Speaker 2: Jewels and the people that pull that together, and Greg
31:41
Speaker 2: for you for curating that. It's a very special place
31:43
Speaker 2: on the planet. So we really recommend that people take
31:46
Speaker 2: a look and kind of honor that collection of very
31:49
Speaker 2: rare vehicles. The trucks are in the land Cruiser Heritage Museum.
31:52
Speaker 2: And a couple of years later, you get the bug
31:54
Speaker 2: again and you decided that you wanted to do something big.
31:57
Speaker 2: Let's talk a little bit about what ultimately became the
31:59
Speaker 2: Green Crossing. That seed was planted when we were driving
32:03
Speaker 2: across Antarctica and we had those eighty forty fours. One
32:07
Speaker 2: was a forty four and one was a six by
32:09
Speaker 2: six at the south Pole, and I just thought, Wow,
32:12
Speaker 2: this would be It'd be really cool now that I've
32:14
Speaker 2: been to the South Pole, to drive this truck to
32:16
Speaker 2: the North Pole. I know, obviously, I knew obviously that
32:19
Speaker 2: the geology was very different or in Antarctica you've got
32:22
Speaker 2: a continent with two miles of ice on it, and
32:24
Speaker 2: in the Arctic it's very different because you just have
32:27
Speaker 2: ocean with the floating ice sheets on it and very
32:30
Speaker 2: dynamic currents underneath it. And so I knew it was
32:32
Speaker 2: probably much more dangerous to attempt something in the Arctic.
32:36
Speaker 2: And as it turned out, April of twenty fifteen, I
32:39
Speaker 2: had the opportunity to go to the North Pole. I
32:42
Speaker 2: flew in to Long Year Been and then me and
32:45
Speaker 2: a friend jumped on a Russian plane and flew to Borneo,
32:48
Speaker 2: which is the Russian base for explorers and scientists up there,
32:51
Speaker 2: and we got on a Russian helicopter and flew the
32:54
Speaker 2: last twenty miles to the North Pole. And that was
32:57
Speaker 2: all just a rekie trip for me to see how
32:59
Speaker 2: fees a drive would be to the North Pole, and
33:02
Speaker 2: that that same truck I had at the South Pole,
33:04
Speaker 2: and it confirmed what I thought. There was no safe
33:06
Speaker 2: way to do it between the open leads and the
33:09
Speaker 2: pressure ridges and so on. It it just wasn't something
33:12
Speaker 2: I wanted to take on. In the meantime, the truck
33:14
Speaker 2: that I had in Antarctica had been shipped back to
33:18
Speaker 2: Arctic Trucks in Iceland, just kind of waiting for direction
33:21
Speaker 2: for me on are we going to go to the
33:23
Speaker 2: North Pole or not. Once I determined that wasn't going
33:25
Speaker 2: to happen, I spoke with Ami Grimson of Arctic Trucks.
33:28
Speaker 2: We just talked about what surrogates might be. It didn't
33:31
Speaker 2: take very long for Greenland to surface as a possible surrogate,
33:35
Speaker 2: so the research began on that and eventually we were
33:39
Speaker 2: able to pull it together. It was probably probably two years,
33:42
Speaker 2: maybe three years later. It took to pull everything together,
33:45
Speaker 2: mostly because we just didn't concentrate time on it. Once
33:48
Speaker 2: we got focused on it, it came together fairly quickly.
33:50
Speaker 2: That was about as much adventure as I could ever
33:53
Speaker 2: want to take on. It was I knew it was
33:55
Speaker 2: going to be challenging. When I left, I mentioned that
33:58
Speaker 2: to my wife Heidi. I said, this is going to
33:59
Speaker 2: be a huge adventure. And when I was able to
34:02
Speaker 2: talk to her a few days into the trip via
34:04
Speaker 2: satellite phone, I said, I told you it was going
34:06
Speaker 2: to be a big adventure, but I so underestimated it.
34:09
Speaker 2: This is just unbelievable.
34:10
Speaker 1: But you know, it felt like an order of magnitude
34:13
Speaker 1: more challenging than Antarctica.
34:14
Speaker 2: It did. And you know, once the what I call
34:17
Speaker 2: the parade of terribles started. Sure, it was with us
34:20
Speaker 2: the second day, and as we're headed north, we started
34:22
Speaker 2: losing hubs and axles and tired and you name it,
34:25
Speaker 2: CV joints and so on. Those problems were with us
34:28
Speaker 2: in multiples every day until we got to Wolfland in
34:31
Speaker 2: the north, and then remarkably the next day. You know,
34:34
Speaker 2: after we stayed there and started making our way back,
34:36
Speaker 2: it seems like the frequency and severity diminished. It didn't
34:40
Speaker 2: go away, because we still had the you know, problems
34:42
Speaker 2: with the trailer and the suspension on the truck other things. Yeah,
34:44
Speaker 2: but they were relatively small by comparison and much less frequent, thankfully,
34:49
Speaker 2: and so we're able to get everybody back and make
34:51
Speaker 2: the connecting flights and so on. But it was a lot.
34:54
Speaker 1: I just remember we were driving along and I think
34:56
Speaker 1: it was Emil driving or something like that. He says, O,
34:59
Speaker 1: there's a tire. Your tire came off the trailer. The
35:02
Speaker 1: whole hub broke, and here goes the tire and wheel
35:05
Speaker 1: rolling past you, and it goes down the track and
35:08
Speaker 1: then drops over right in front.
35:10
Speaker 2: Yeah. If we would have tried to stage that and
35:13
Speaker 2: done a thousand takes to make that happen, we couldn't
35:15
Speaker 2: have replicated it. I'm driving along and all of a sudden,
35:17
Speaker 2: there's this resistance and I can't that's like there's some
35:20
Speaker 2: drag here somewhere, and it just as I'm thinking that,
35:22
Speaker 2: I see this tire forty more in all four come
35:25
Speaker 2: rolling by me, and it rolls towards you in the
35:28
Speaker 2: lead truck, maybe one hundred yards up ahead of me,
35:31
Speaker 2: and then it listed to the left and fell over
35:34
Speaker 2: right in between your tracks. And I'm stuck. I can't
35:37
Speaker 2: drag anymore because that trailer had now gotten so stuck
35:41
Speaker 2: in the snow. And so I remember getting on the radio, guys,
35:44
Speaker 2: I lost a tire, and that's when it began.
35:46
Speaker 1: To struggle after struggle and then tow it. You know,
35:48
Speaker 1: pulling sleds filled with fuel, and I mean fuel was
35:51
Speaker 1: just such a challenge, Like we didn't have to do
35:53
Speaker 1: any of that. In Antarctica, it was a fuel stop
35:55
Speaker 1: far enough apart where you could resupply.
35:57
Speaker 2: There were some similarities and some differences. We didn't have
36:01
Speaker 2: the infrastructure in Greenland. We had limited as it was
36:04
Speaker 2: in Antarctica, but as you know, we were able to
36:07
Speaker 2: arrange to have some fuel drops kind of scattered across Greenland,
36:11
Speaker 2: but it still meant that we needed to haul. I
36:13
Speaker 2: think those bladders were one hundred and fifty gallons each,
36:16
Speaker 2: and as I recall, we had.
36:18
Speaker 1: Were two or three per sled.
36:20
Speaker 2: Yeah, so I think we had two sleds with two
36:22
Speaker 2: bladders on each sled, and man trying to keep those
36:26
Speaker 2: things contained on those sleds with all the SASTRUGI and
36:29
Speaker 2: up and down, and it was way more challenging than
36:32
Speaker 2: I anticipated. When I got home, I called the guy
36:35
Speaker 2: that manufactured those trailers in Alaska and I said, I
36:37
Speaker 2: need to give you all these ideas while they're fresh
36:39
Speaker 2: on my mind of how to make this more efficient.
36:41
Speaker 2: It was really thankful for that, and I wish I
36:44
Speaker 2: had all of those ideas incorporated into those sleds that
36:46
Speaker 2: would have made the journey much less taxing.
36:48
Speaker 1: I mean, just the pintle hooks on there. They were
36:51
Speaker 1: smashed and hammered down warn thin. I mean that was
36:54
Speaker 1: warn thin.
36:55
Speaker 2: It was probably what three quarter inch cast steel, and
36:58
Speaker 2: it wore halfway through all the rubbing and vibration, and
37:01
Speaker 2: we broke one eventually. Absolutely incredible. And again it came
37:05
Speaker 2: back to just this remarkable group of people, John Solberg
37:08
Speaker 2: making us a hot meal when we were all repairing
37:11
Speaker 2: the trailer. For me, how about the fire in the tent.
37:13
Speaker 2: Were two days into this thing, and if it was
37:15
Speaker 2: so cold that the fuel wouldn't atomize and so it
37:19
Speaker 2: wasn't just you know, the mist. It was raw liquid
37:22
Speaker 2: fuel and it got out of the stove and started
37:24
Speaker 2: two days into the in this expedition, and our tent
37:27
Speaker 2: our home is on the vergion going up in flames
37:29
Speaker 2: through that fire retardant blanket on it, and the flames
37:32
Speaker 2: just went right out to the sides of it. So
37:33
Speaker 2: I remember you went over and held the I don't
37:36
Speaker 2: remember if I held the door open and you threw
37:37
Speaker 2: this the stove out on it, this ice or vice versa.
37:40
Speaker 2: But we just threw it out there and let it
37:42
Speaker 2: burn down. You don't burn out, but that would have
37:44
Speaker 2: been a game changer.
37:45
Speaker 1: I could you imagine we had this one big tent
37:48
Speaker 1: that we all ate in, and everything with the big
37:50
Speaker 1: hole burned in Thereile Greenland was exceptional. And all of
37:54
Speaker 1: those things gave you some ideas about what worked and
37:57
Speaker 1: what didn't work. So when you look back at the
38:00
Speaker 1: the land cruisers that we built for the Seven Continents,
38:02
Speaker 1: what were some of your favorite things about those trucks, Like,
38:05
Speaker 1: what were the few modifications that you came away with?
38:07
Speaker 1: This was awesome.
38:08
Speaker 2: I think it's all pretty basic stuff. I think we
38:11
Speaker 2: had just the right lift on them. I think we
38:13
Speaker 2: had the dipflocks. We had that four point five liter
38:16
Speaker 2: turbo diesel. That was the perfect combination because it gave
38:19
Speaker 2: us the ability when we had the opportunity to really
38:22
Speaker 2: get rolling, like on some of those roads in Australia,
38:25
Speaker 2: you know, some of the paved roads, we could roll
38:26
Speaker 2: along eighty miles an hour without taxing the vehicles too bad.
38:30
Speaker 2: But then when we needed to throw them in four
38:31
Speaker 2: lough with front and rear difflocks activated and just crawl
38:34
Speaker 2: up something, we had the ability to do that as well.
38:36
Speaker 1: I was so impressed with how well those sleeping platforms
38:40
Speaker 1: came together. The fact that it had the National nar
38:42
Speaker 1: fridge integrated, and then we could drop down that panel
38:45
Speaker 1: and take additional people along. Like in Europe, we were
38:48
Speaker 1: able to carry so many more people in the vehicle.
38:50
Speaker 1: And the number of nights that I slept in that configuration,
38:52
Speaker 1: I've lost count. I mean it was at least two
38:54
Speaker 1: hundred and fifty nights that I slept in the back
38:56
Speaker 1: of a seventy eighth Series Lanthuiser, and I never felt
38:59
Speaker 1: like I had a bet night's sleep because even with
39:01
Speaker 1: the heater and everything else, it was just there wasn't
39:03
Speaker 1: a lot of room, but it was. It worked.
39:05
Speaker 2: It's probably because you were so tired you were two
39:06
Speaker 2: steps from death, and not because it was so comfortable.
39:10
Speaker 1: That's a valid point. We did some driving, Greg, For
39:13
Speaker 1: those that are listening, I have never in all of
39:15
Speaker 1: my travels around the world met someone with the capacity
39:18
Speaker 1: for NonStop driving like you.
39:20
Speaker 2: Yeah, we put in some long, long driving show.
39:23
Speaker 1: We really did. And this is another funny story. So
39:26
Speaker 1: we're on the road to Laddie boss Stock we were
39:28
Speaker 1: before we had turned off to do the Road of
39:30
Speaker 1: Bones to Magga Dan and we were all exhausted. Greg
39:34
Speaker 1: is in the back of the land Cruiser ahead of me,
39:36
Speaker 1: sleeping on the platform and Clay's driving, and I think
39:39
Speaker 1: maybe Kurt was in the vehicle or somebody else was
39:41
Speaker 1: in the vehicle with him, and we hit this. I
39:43
Speaker 1: saw him hit this frost team and it's the only
39:45
Speaker 1: time I've ever seen someone jump a seventy eight series
39:48
Speaker 1: land Cruiser. Clay aired this land Cruiser. I mean, there
39:50
Speaker 1: was air under the tires I've never seen. And of
39:53
Speaker 1: course I'm on the binders and all our remember is
39:55
Speaker 1: in the lights of my vehicle, seeing you levitate up
39:59
Speaker 1: in the air and come back down again. And from
40:02
Speaker 1: what Clay tells me, you did not wake up.
40:04
Speaker 2: I can't say. I think we were pretty delirious at.
40:06
Speaker 1: That point, but totally delirious.
40:08
Speaker 2: I remember that road in that drive, and that was
40:11
Speaker 2: that was the longest haul. I think that night we
40:13
Speaker 2: drove for forty hours without ninety day that night, forty
40:17
Speaker 2: hours straight because we had something at ferry or something
40:19
Speaker 2: we needed to catch. YEP, that's right, Otherwise it would
40:21
Speaker 2: have delayed us another couple of days.
40:23
Speaker 1: And yeah, there was a ferry that goes to al Dan,
40:25
Speaker 1: the al Dan River Ferry, and you got to hit it.
40:27
Speaker 1: Just right, and we pulled in a couple hours before
40:30
Speaker 1: it showed up. That was unbelievable, and that ferry itself
40:32
Speaker 1: was amazing. We were under sail for hours with our
40:35
Speaker 1: cars and a couple of Russian vans.
40:37
Speaker 2: It was so primitive. I mean, obviously they knew what
40:39
Speaker 2: they were doing. That was an old barge. It hadn't
40:42
Speaker 2: seen a lot of duty, but it was still I
40:44
Speaker 2: was a little anxious rolling on to it because it
40:47
Speaker 2: was primitive.
40:47
Speaker 1: Somehow they'd make it work. It's amazing how they do
40:50
Speaker 1: all of this learning all this time in seventy eight
40:52
Speaker 1: series land cruisers. During the trip we had, you and
40:54
Speaker 1: I had several conversations about what kind of vehicle would
40:57
Speaker 1: we use next if we were to go around to
40:59
Speaker 1: the world again, And you had all of these nights
41:01
Speaker 1: spent sleeping in it, all this time driving it. You
41:04
Speaker 1: have now come up with what you think is the
41:06
Speaker 1: next version of an Expedition seven truck. And I think
41:09
Speaker 1: it'd be really fun to announce that right now, and
41:12
Speaker 1: let's talk about what you got coming up.
41:13
Speaker 2: I'd love to. As time has gone on and I've
41:17
Speaker 2: considered what it might be like to do another installment
41:20
Speaker 2: in the Expedition seven adventure. It's obviously not feasible to
41:24
Speaker 2: take the seventy eight that we took on all seven
41:26
Speaker 2: continents out because of the equity that is invested in it,
41:29
Speaker 2: you know, from having been to all seven continents. And
41:32
Speaker 2: also it had its own shortcomings the fact that it
41:34
Speaker 2: was just a two door with the doors on the back.
41:36
Speaker 2: It made it hard to get into the backseat to
41:38
Speaker 2: get gear people in or out. And I think, you know,
41:40
Speaker 2: we learned a lot from driving around. One of the
41:43
Speaker 2: concerns we had when we discussed which vehicles to take
41:46
Speaker 2: on the originally seven was fuel availability, and we fell
41:49
Speaker 2: the time that diesel would be more available than petrol
41:52
Speaker 2: or gasoline. Was I think by the time we got
41:54
Speaker 2: halfway around the world, we realized that really wasn't a
41:57
Speaker 2: valid concern. So, as you said, with a lot of
41:59
Speaker 2: the eperience we gained from the prior expeditions, it's informed
42:03
Speaker 2: my thinking on what the next vehicle might be, or
42:06
Speaker 2: the vehicle we use for the next installment. And I
42:09
Speaker 2: decided that it would be really cool if we could
42:11
Speaker 2: use two hundred series, even cooler if we could use
42:14
Speaker 2: North AMERICANSPEC two hundred series for the last year and
42:17
Speaker 2: a half roughly, I've been working with some colleagues on
42:22
Speaker 2: a project to take seven US Spec two hundred series
42:27
Speaker 2: land cruisers and send them to Germany and have Maultech
42:31
Speaker 2: work their magic and add the living cabin right behind
42:34
Speaker 2: the b pillar, suitable for two people to sleep and
42:37
Speaker 2: to eat and travel. In addition to that, we've worked
42:40
Speaker 2: with cruiser outfitters to modify it to add the bumpers
42:43
Speaker 2: and the rocksliders and the winches and so on. We've
42:45
Speaker 2: just received the first of the seven vehicles, got it
42:48
Speaker 2: all outfitted, We've got the E seven livery on it.
42:51
Speaker 2: Thanks to you, we've been able to get out and
42:53
Speaker 2: get some nice images and some nice video of that
42:56
Speaker 2: that we'll be sharing before too long. This will be,
42:59
Speaker 2: as I said, one of seven vehicles, one that you'll
43:01
Speaker 2: tell the story about the ideas that we'll name each
43:04
Speaker 2: one of the seven after a continent and just make
43:07
Speaker 2: that part of the Expedition seven story. I will keep
43:10
Speaker 2: a couple of these vehicles for myself in the event
43:12
Speaker 2: that we ever do that next installment, and I believe
43:15
Speaker 2: that these vehicles are outfitted to me. They're outfitted perfectly
43:19
Speaker 2: to do a global expedition with everything we needed on
43:22
Speaker 2: the original E seven journey and nothing that we really don't.
43:26
Speaker 2: They're semi minimalist, I think for sure. But there they've
43:30
Speaker 2: got the beauty and the power of that five point
43:32
Speaker 2: seven engine. They've got the engineering and the robustness of
43:35
Speaker 2: that two hundred series platform and suspension, even though it's
43:38
Speaker 2: been modified with the old man EMU suspension. It's got
43:42
Speaker 2: better sleeping quarters, it's got the ability to cook inside
43:44
Speaker 2: if we need to. It's got the ability to have
43:46
Speaker 2: a table inside so we can do our journaling, or
43:49
Speaker 2: you know, with internet connectivity now we can stay in
43:52
Speaker 2: touch as necessary. So it's just an evolution of our
43:55
Speaker 2: best thinking on the original vehicles that we've now tried
43:59
Speaker 2: to capture with technology and current vehicle offerings and have
44:03
Speaker 2: those vehicles ready so that when the next moment comes
44:06
Speaker 2: when it's time to go to another drive, we've got
44:08
Speaker 2: them built and ready. And then with the other five,
44:10
Speaker 2: plan is to make those available over time and just
44:14
Speaker 2: put them in the hands of people who will appreciate
44:16
Speaker 2: them and use them for what they're intended for. I
44:19
Speaker 2: hope that they become a platform for those who wind
44:22
Speaker 2: up owning them to do great things and experience wonderful
44:25
Speaker 2: opportunities and so on with what people they care about.
44:28
Speaker 1: When you look at the vehicle, it's impressive to me
44:30
Speaker 1: how compact it is. So you retain all of the
44:33
Speaker 1: capability of a lifted two hundred series land cruiser because
44:37
Speaker 1: it's a lifting roof, it's not too tall, it still
44:40
Speaker 1: fits in a container. The wheelbase hasn't been stretched, so
44:43
Speaker 1: it can still fit on small trails technical routes. In fact,
44:46
Speaker 1: we had it on moapp slick Rock where we were
44:49
Speaker 1: testing every inch and degree of the departure angle. So
44:52
Speaker 1: you're going to end up with a vehicle as capable
44:54
Speaker 1: as a two hundred one that's only three or four
44:56
Speaker 1: hundred pounds heavier because they remove all that glass and
44:59
Speaker 1: all of that structure behind the B pillar, and then
45:02
Speaker 1: you have the ability to sleep two people on a
45:04
Speaker 1: comfortable bed and stand up height to change and to cook,
45:07
Speaker 1: and to stretch out at the end of a long day.
45:09
Speaker 1: So this is definitely the evolution of the e seven
45:12
Speaker 1: trucks for sure. I mean it would be if we
45:14
Speaker 1: had a chance tomorrow to start again and choose between
45:17
Speaker 1: the seventy eighth and the two hundred that would be a
45:19
Speaker 1: pretty tough choice. And how amazing is it that there
45:22
Speaker 1: will be a few of these vehicles available for people
45:24
Speaker 1: to purchase to head off on their own global journeys.
45:27
Speaker 1: That's really an incredible thing, Greg. And how do people
45:30
Speaker 1: find out more about these new two hundred series.
45:34
Speaker 2: The best way would be to go to Expeditions seven
45:37
Speaker 2: dot com. You could also go to the land Cruiser
45:40
Speaker 2: Heritage Museum website. You can just google land Cruiser Heritage
45:42
Speaker 2: Museum or go to land CRUISERHM dot com. There'll be
45:46
Speaker 2: a link to the E seven web page, so ultimately
45:49
Speaker 2: you wind up at the same place. And then we'll
45:51
Speaker 2: have a sheet in there, a spec sheet that talks
45:53
Speaker 2: about the modifications that have been done to these vehicles
45:56
Speaker 2: and other pertinent information that a perspective buy or might
45:59
Speaker 2: want with contact information. If there's questions that aren't answered
46:03
Speaker 2: with that set of information.
46:04
Speaker 1: It's what an amazing opportunity for people to have something
46:07
Speaker 1: really exceptional. When you think about the fact that you've
46:10
Speaker 1: got these new vehicles and they're going to be available
46:13
Speaker 1: here soon. If you could leave a month from now,
46:15
Speaker 1: where would you want to go? Where would you want
46:16
Speaker 1: this next stage of Expedition seven to be what sounds
46:20
Speaker 1: exciting to you, Well.
46:21
Speaker 2: I think it would be for me. It's appealing to
46:24
Speaker 2: go someplace that I haven't been. When I look at
46:26
Speaker 2: a globe and I start, you know, we'll start turning
46:29
Speaker 2: a little bit. I usually wind up focusing on Mongolia,
46:33
Speaker 2: Gobi Desert, moving on down through Asia and eventually winding
46:37
Speaker 2: up probably in New Zealand.
46:39
Speaker 1: Yeah, as at least.
46:39
Speaker 2: Part of the segment. Another thing that you know but
46:42
Speaker 2: the listeners might not know, is that I just need
46:45
Speaker 2: to get from basically from Morocco to Cape Town, sure,
46:49
Speaker 2: and then I will have done a north south traverse
46:53
Speaker 2: of the world, that's true, which is something that I'd
46:55
Speaker 2: really like to do before I'm too a holder, before
46:58
Speaker 2: the world's too unsettled or something. So that's what I've
47:00
Speaker 2: got my eye on as well, So that might play
47:02
Speaker 2: into it.
47:03
Speaker 1: That's amazing, Greg, and thank you for all of the
47:06
Speaker 1: support for the community throughout the years as well, the
47:09
Speaker 1: events that you held at the Motorsports Park and the
47:12
Speaker 1: support that you've provided to the land cruiser community and
47:15
Speaker 1: the overland community as a whole. The resources that you
47:18
Speaker 1: have available on Expedition seven dot Com and thank you
47:21
Speaker 1: for being a friend. It's just it's been a joy
47:23
Speaker 1: to spend all this time with.
47:24
Speaker 2: You, Scott. I feel the same way. My life has
47:26
Speaker 2: been enriched through my friendship with you. It's my hope
47:29
Speaker 2: that we've got a lot more big adventures ahead of us.
47:31
Speaker 2: I would just like to acknowledge what you've done for
47:34
Speaker 2: the overlanding community. I tell people often that as I
47:38
Speaker 2: see it, you've created the water cooler or crazy guys
47:41
Speaker 2: like you and me to gather around and tell stories
47:43
Speaker 2: about what we've done. And that water cooler is in
47:45
Speaker 2: the form of Expedition Portal and Overland Journal and your
47:48
Speaker 2: other properties. And I think that those have been wonderful
47:52
Speaker 2: resources for those who aspire to adventure and you've made it,
47:55
Speaker 2: You've made it a common thing for people to get
47:58
Speaker 2: out and do big stuff, and I think that's a
48:00
Speaker 2: real compliment to you.
48:01
Speaker 1: Thank you, Greg. I appreciate that. And looking back on
48:03
Speaker 1: our conversation today, it's we're reinforced that it's not about
48:07
Speaker 1: where you go on the journey, it's about going there
48:09
Speaker 1: with people that you love, doing things that you love,
48:11
Speaker 1: and in your case, in a vehicle you love, like
48:14
Speaker 1: a land cruiser and that's I borrowed that statement from you.
48:17
Speaker 1: That's something you shared many years ago, and it really
48:19
Speaker 1: proved itself out. It really didn't matter where we were,
48:22
Speaker 1: it was that we were doing it together. We were
48:23
Speaker 1: having those experiences, in those memories and learning a little
48:26
Speaker 1: bit more about ourselves along the way.
48:28
Speaker 2: Yes, it's a great experience, very rich and hope to
48:31
Speaker 2: do something similar to it before too much more time passed.
48:34
Speaker 1: Oh that's exciting. Well we all look forward. We'll be
48:36
Speaker 1: here with baited breath here what the what the next
48:39
Speaker 1: announcement is going to be? Greg, thank you again for
48:41
Speaker 1: being on the podcast, and we thank you all for listening,
48:44
Speaker 1: and we'll talk to you next time.