Latest / FAITH and FRICTION / When Hegseth War Language Becomes Faith Language
Transcript
- speaker-0: Welcome to When Heggseth War Language Becomes Faith Language, this week's episode of the Faith and Friction Podcast. Join Mac and his co-host The Rev as they tackle the rising intensity of political and religious rhetoric in the United States with a sharp focus on Pete Heggseth's language, the shift from defense to war framing, and what that means for faith, military culture, and national division. Welcome to the conversation. One more time, Rev. Mm-hmm. Here's an introduction we haven't done before. How speaker-1: Okay on. speaker-0: about this? Faith and Friction Podcast, where hard questions about faith and culture asked out loud with mavericks who refuse the easy answers. Would that be us? Can that be us, man? speaker-1: I'll take it. I'll own it. speaker-0: So here, welcome. Welcome to the play. speaker-1: Welcome, fellow Mavericks and Mystics in the place where what? The place where speaker-0: Where we're gonna just delve into the friction and enjoy it and create it or try to I don't know, understand it better maybe, frame it differently. speaker-1: And find its value. There. Discover its meaning. speaker-0: think we've said that all along on this podcast that there is great value. speaker-1: But I like when you I I've always liked the terms mavericks, misfits and you know, that's what I feel like. speaker-0: Yeah. Well, as as we're telling stories and we're gonna talk more about this next week about telling stories, but let's just I'm gonna tell this one. Mavericks and Mystics, right? Do you remember how this whole thing started, what, two years ago, two and a half years ago? speaker-1: a message to some point from a platform somewhere you did about mystics, mavericks, and misfits. speaker-0: Yes, that was your title, all right, of that sermon. speaker-1: Responsible. speaker-0: And and I'm sitting there in the midst of it and I'm going, I'm looking at my phone and a website that I had just created, and I was getting ready to call this things Mavericks, Mystics, and Mentors. Mentors. speaker-1: Yeah, which I think is a little more positive. speaker-0: Yeah, a little different. And I couldn't believe it. That's when I came up to you and I said look. speaker-1: Divine appointments. You know, nothing's happened by accident in our world. And so if there is tension and friction, I'm saying lean into it. Yeah. It's it is a divine appointment. Something wants to be born. Yeah. speaker-0: I would I just it blew my mind. That's when I said, Okay, we gotta get together. Let me ask you if you wanna do a podcast. What did you say? Yes. Except. Right. speaker-1: I remember Let's go. I don't remember what I said. I can't remember what I did said yesterday. speaker-0: You said, I f I posed that question to you and the first thing out of your mouth was, Yes, but you're gonna have to make sure you, you know, handle it because I can't put another thing on my plate. speaker-1: Yeah, you're gonna have to he b for the record, he does all the work. speaker-0: So I said, I'll do it. I've done it before. No worries. And that well you thank you very much. I enjoy it. It's a labor of love. So there's where we are and some good things are starting to come on the pike. We're gonna make a few changes. We're gonna talk about that on our next speaker-1: They're gonna ask me to stretch a little more, which is a good thing. speaker-0: That's right. You know, but I'm I'm really looking forward to some of the stuff we've talked about for change. All right. So with that, I'd already asked you, we another thing we did this week is we recorded audio, the pre-show. speaker-1: The best part for me of what we do here is what happens pre-show and it's like, dang, we don't have it on tape. speaker-0: So now we do and we're gonna start, you know, banking these pre-show conversations. And as we get some traction here, some people sign up on our on our website and start communicating with us and having a conversation that we're gonna open those up, you know, to some of the some that gang. speaker-1: Yeah, it's it's a new example. our pre show today it was like, make sure nobody hears the speaker-0: I will have to do a little bit of that. speaker-1: Editing a few things perhaps. speaker-0: But I think that'll be fun too. So that's another little nugget right there. All right. speaker-1: So it's evolution. The podcast is going to evolve as we're asking ourselves to involve evolve. speaker-0: Well, and I'm excited about it. I think, you know, you're exactly right. We learn things, we go certain places, things get put on our heart, you know, that we for whatever reason, and that we we talk about all the time on the podcast. We have to be open to the maybe. should we consider? Let's consider maybe, right? I don't know. Should we try that? speaker-1: Some of the most powerful words are little tiny words. And also. speaker-0: yeah. Okay. speaker-1: Yeah, exactly. speaker-0: So that's where we're going, man. I mean I'm excited about it. So it'll be a lot of fun. And anyway, so tonight. speaker-1: Tonight's a nice kind of a four way into maybe a a little bit harder hitting podcast. speaker-0: Yeah, I mean we're gonna you know, I hate to use these colloquial type statements. one other thing that I didn't mention is that if you don't if you aren't watching us on the video, we've got a little merch on tonight. Got some merch. Yeah, there we are. Got the hat on, without a doubt. Also have some merch from my son's open house and his new business that they've got. Hockey barn. So yeah, I'm all decked out, man. I'm good. I forgot to mention that, but I wanted to make sure I did. All right. Get back to tonight. All right, back to this episode. speaker-1: Meanwhile back at the speaker-0: Back at the ranch. So here's what we're here. Here's what's really just it's grieved me. It's in some regards angered me. It's disappointed me. It's just, I just finally am getting to the point with some of this stuff politically that you just gotta go. Mm. speaker-1: I think that there is a collective unrest happening in the planet, or in the country, with the rhetoric and the narrative that's escalating. Yeah. and it's getting more divisive, it's getting more angry, it's getting more hateful, and it's getting more bold. And I think if you're not concerned, you're not really paying attention. Well whether you agree with the person saying it or not, the rhetoric is amping up. And I think we need to pay attention to that. speaker-0: He yes, and that comes from all different places. W what what we typically want to talk about on on this faith and friction. So in all of that rhetoric, where do we see friction with whatever's being espoused from the government when it comes to faith? You know, where do we have that, you know, that rub? Where do we have that opportunity or that avenue to be able to say, careful? Careful, careful, careful, don't go there. speaker-1: Well, and we're always at the we're at the place of choice. Everything in our life puts us at choice. So when we notice the rhetoric, when we pay attention to the narrative, we can run from it or we can lean into it and say, Wait a minute. Right. Slow down. Yeah. This it doesn't feel right or just avoid it at all costs. And nothing ever changes. And I think that's when unfortunately dangerous things happen. When we run away and d and are so afraid of the friction it might cause to go, wait a minute. Yeah. Let's replay that. Yes. That's not okay with me. Right. speaker-0: Well, there there we go. So we're gonna we're gonna wait a minute here. We're gonna tonight this episode's gonna be about a hey, wait a minute. You know, speaker-1: And I think it's a worthy wait a minute. speaker-0: I think it's just gotten out it's gotten out of hand. Yeah, quite frankly. You know, you can look past some of this political stuff and this and that and blah I mean, you know, depends on how much you wanna get wrapped around the axle, which I have had a tendency to do in the past. I'm a lot better about it now. But this is the kind of stuff when you want to mix God into the equation. we watched well, you sent me a video this morning that it was, you know, power pious power, right? Whatever that was, you know. I mean y you have all these little narratives that just it's just gonna be ridiculous. So here's what I'll here's speaker-1: It's abuse disguised in in the Bible. speaker-0: Well, we've discussed this lots of different times in a general sense. Yeah. Sometimes we've gone a little bit s we've gotten a little specific, but I really wanna I wanna I wanna get right down to the nitty gritty in this episode. Well I speaker-1: Think it's a worthy character. speaker-0: Well just recently, just recently, our infamous secretary of war I almost hate to even say that word because that's what speaker-1: Beginning of the amped out rhetoric. The amped up rhetoric went from the Department of Defense. Right to the Department of Energetic talk about an energetic shift. Now we're the Department of War. Very and it and I'm sure we all paid attention to it and we thought, no big deal. It's getting speaker-0: Worse. It's a big deal. All right. And we're gonna talk about that a little bit more. But we've got this gentleman, you know, Pete Heggseth. He is the quintessential poster child for the administration, quite frankly, et al. This, you know, very bold, you know, individual that you know, not taking no for an answer, you know, the whole and on the surface. Warriors, our armed forces. We want to you know, we want warriors now as part of our, you know, armed forces. We don't want any wimps. We don't want anybody that can't do these push-ups. We don't want anybody to so we have this whole persona of a television personality individual who stands up there in front of the cadets this last weekend talking speaker-1: It's it's young men and women in the art speaker-0: R speaker-1: representing our nation and our sovereignty. speaker-0: I should have paid more attention to where which one he was at. Point is he gets these young people all amped up over a bunch of rhetoric. All right. And now when you start to you start to marginalize people and elevate other people. For instance, he's talking about how they're the best people in America. That 1% that he was lifting weights with that morning. I was with the best Americans. And and it wasn't like they're just great people, they're the best. All right. speaker-1: Well it's not just the the best that's fine. You're better better than anybody else. That's a very different mindset. You're better than anybody else that isn't worthy. That isn't valuable. Boy, now we're creating a divisive nation. So speaker-0: But all of this rhetoric continues to create more divisions. Sure. speaker-1: Visiveness speaker-0: It's it's constant. It spews out of that guy all the time. speaker-1: It is it is a militaristic and political tack. Divide and conquer. But unfortunately when you do it within, which is what's happening within, then we become the country that can is already divided. We're easily conquered. speaker-0: Well, in his book, you know, he talks about he how about in in the twenty twenty election, if the Democrats won, right, you have this thing. speaker-1: Well and like you gotta examine the rhetoric there. It's not just that the Democrats win. If the people who are less than, if the people who are stupid, if the people who don't know what they're doing win, wait a minute, you're c the name calling's all over what's going on there. It's just not a label of Democrat. It's the people that are not in the one percent. speaker-0: Yes. Well heak people. And he doesn't h hold anything back when he's talking about the evil people, the Democrats. I mean he comes right out and it's war. It's not get along. I mean it's figure out speaker-1: Well it's been spoken by a lot of people. We are at war with the people who have a different political agenda than we do. Period. Wow. The Department of War is really living up to its name. speaker-0: That we're an enemy with ourselves. It's the enemy within is what he keeps wanting to promote. And there's this thing called there would be a national divorce. And I hadn't heard this term until I started r you know pull peeling the onion back a little bit on him. And that's the whole idea behind almost like, you know, succeeding f seceding from the union. Yep. Now we got blue states over here and we got red states over here. We're divorcing. You're the blue, you're the red. How can you possibly even speaker-1: We're no longer the United States. speaker-0: I mean it's it's like what kind of rhetoric are you trying to spew? speaker-1: Well, and what is the intention behind the rhetoric? Okay. The rhetoric I I I use words all the time, and sometimes my words don't really convey. Sometimes they do. What is the intention behind the divisiveness? That what behind the name calling, become behind the labels of evil. Because speaker-0: Yeah. speaker-1: you think differently than I do. That's what makes me nervous. That's what's very dangerous. speaker-0: Hexeth predicted that if Democrats won the twenty twenty election, which they did, no matter who might say they didn't, right? There would be a national divorce. We just talked about that. That the military and the police will be forced to make a choice. Why? What does that mean? All right. Yeah, speaker-1: No, we're gonna choose sides. speaker-0: we we we're gonna f now those people in the military there, if they chose the different than what the administration that was current with with a Republican or the Democrat, now all of a sudden how do they deal with that? Well, I know how do we choose? You know? now you're gonna be a traitor. Now what's gonna happen? You know, treason, all that other kind of stuff starts coming into. I mean it speaker-1: Now my bias can be enforced by the military or by the judicial system that you're the evil one and I putting you down. And that's but history has shown us that that's not a good recipe. speaker-0: Let's talk about ICE. Let's talk about how we sent National Guard, how we sent military troops into cities. That's just my I mean it's just it's ridiculous. speaker-1: And again, an intention behind it for more law and order. I want I want to be bare handed as best I can. Right. But but an intention can get warped really quickly. And it goes way past the point of accomplishing a goal. You know, if if there are has there been an immigration problem? Yes, there has. Has it always been addressed well? No. And it's still not being addressed well because it is it is there's injustices happening at the hands of we're right and you're evil. speaker-0: Well, this is what's it's prevalent. It's it's pervasive right now. We've taken it to the nth degree of saying, for instance, let's talk about our favorite topic of discussion almost all the way across the board, the war in Iran, right? Well, this just gives Mr. Pete a platform every single day. to be able to talk about what they're doing, how great he is, how great President Trump is, how they won the war, how it's not really a war. I mean, all of this stuff, we we have this war and it's just created a personality. speaker-1: Americans are dying. You know. And have died, whether we acknowledge it or not. speaker-0: It I mean it it's just absolutely it's just absolutely insane. All right. So here we go with with all of that. And he's actually said we gotta make a choice. There will be some form of civil war. He said this. Right? I mean, here we are. We're speaker-1: I have I've not heard that quote. That's an exact quote from his speech. speaker-0: His book. That was Okay. We're I mean, we're manifesting all of this kind of stuff of this is our this is the point of this episode. Yeah. The more we talk war, the more we're gonna get. speaker-1: War this is what I teach every every Sunday, every Wednesday, every class. What we are putting out is going to come back to us. And I think there is an intention. We want that. Right. I am inviting in war, I'm inviting in violence, I'm inviting in divisiveness. So I'm gonna speak it. Well and I have a right to say, wait a minute, there's something better that can happen here. speaker-0: Yeah. But then what happens that it gets diffused in the limelight isn't on these individuals. You know, the people are listening to other voices. They're trying to calm the rhetoric down instead of trying to you know instigate it. speaker-1: You know, and I was not somebody I may take black on all sides of this one. Marianne Williamson was you know, running for president at one point, but she said we need the Department of Peace. We need those in the government who are working to create a greater peace. Well but that gets shot down anything. No, you're the enemy, you're weak. speaker-0: Wow. All right. So I I went out and I had to do some I said, why? What was the impetus to even speaker-1: Change it. speaker-0: shit? You know, I mean, regardless of whether we're talking Lake Ontario or Lake Michigan or the Gulf of America. speaker-1: Gold correct. speaker-0: You know, that's just, you know, out here, you're exactly right. But now when you I mean, pretty much a little bit more front and center where we say we're gonna now. Do understand one thing. The no president or administration can officially change the name of a department. So from an official standpoint, see here's the here's the nuance. This is what this administration has been doing since the very beginning. Well, officially on the books, it's not the Department of War. All right. Officially it's still Department of Defense. But in all reality It's the Department of War. So I mean t potato potato. I mean, give me a break here. That's a y you know that speaker-1: Names, words are meaningless. But the emotion and the intent behind it is everything. speaker-0: Here we are. So I went out there and I Well, why do they do it? I mean, it was the speaker-1: Because I can't. speaker-0: reason. What was your reasoning? So here's what here's what it is. The original Department of War was established in 1789 to oversee the Army, Navy, and Marine Corps. This is true. Back when we first were founded. When we first were founded, were we at war pretty much all the time as we try to establish the nation? Yeah. All right. Plus, in those days, countries and you know they were warlike anyway. I mean, that was just the way the world was, right? Everybody was always looking to take over somebody else's stuff, all right? So, point is that's true. Then we have symbolism and tone, and here's the kicker. Okay. Officials argue that department of war conveys a stronger message of readiness. now, see, the minute you say, War connotates readiness. speaker-1: We're pounding our chest. speaker-0: That's it. We have more readiness. Resolve. You're not pushing us around. Yeah. Because we got a department of war. And here it is. And offensive capability. See? It's not about trying to diffuse the situations. Right. It's about basically saying, this is department of war and we are warlike. I mean, speaker-1: Then we are in essence playing the same game that countries like Iran have played. Yes. we're pounding our chest, we're gonna we wanna wipe Jews off the planet, we wanna wipe America off the planet. We're playing the same game. But they've been doing it a lot longer than we have, they're better at it. What speaker-0: Well they're the evil ones though. speaker-1: what well the evil? I made another and their rhetoric, they need to pay the price for their rhetoric. I believe in the power of strength and standing on our strength, but when you use the same language and the same tactics that Your enemy that you have made, your enemy wins. You have to find a different way. Yeah. speaker-0: We can't it it's just you did it, I did you, you talk about this all the time. The middle school mentality got a bigger stick than you do, and so they're but speaker-1: I got a bigger gang than you'd have. speaker-0: again underlying all of this, don't don't lose sight of the rhetoric that's causing all this. Things like him saying in his book. He believes there are irreconcilable differences between the left and the right in America. Irreconcilable, leading to perpetual conflict that cannot be resolved through the political process. Now what's that leave you? speaker-1: You know, connect the dots. Connect the dots here. And I and again, I will be fair-handed. Rhetoric that is hateful and calling for violence on any side of the equation is not okay. But just because somebody else does it doesn't make this okay. That is a a dog whistle for violence. That's calling for it. From the Department of War, that we cannot do this politically, so we're gonna have to put you down because you're less than. speaker-0: Physically, I mean it's gonna be a physical confrontation thing. Yep. This is and this is and b see so if you believe that, if that's where you're coming from, then I don't care whether you ever again say those same words outright. Yeah. It's built into the it's it's just basic. speaker-1: And when you've done is you've empowered your chest pumping friends, but you've empowered the enemy as well. They're calling us the enemy. They're calling us evil. I'm not gonna pump my chest. And next thing you know, everybody's dead. speaker-0: Okay. speaker-1: Nobody wins this fight. Nobody wins that narrative. speaker-0: You know, it's crazy. So so all of this this was just sort of a setup to say, look, this is the underlying motivation. This is the perspective. This is Pete Hexeth ideology. This is where this guy is coming from. So let's not we don't need to mince words. We don't need to kind of tiptoe around it. We don't need to sort of be soft on it or all that. What you were saying. speaker-1: Soft and go, well, he's kinda ignored he's kinda ignorant. It's no big deal. No, it is a big deal 'cause it's escalating. And I don't think he's ignorant at all. I think he's a very smart man with a very big agenda. speaker-0: Well, be aware. Be aware that y you know, it's the frog in the pot thing, gang. I don't know how else to describe. speaker-1: The temp's being turned up and we're not paying attention. speaker-0: We're not and we're not calling it out enough to say that no. No. All right. We that's speaker-1: Same kind of hateful speech I will not tolerate from somebody who's on the blue side. Or somebody who's in my church or somebody who's in my family. We don't do that here. We just we're above that. We're better than that. speaker-0: That you so yes, but here's now what it's given him and his organization coming from the top. You know, he doesn't operate at all, you know, without you know who's blessing. All right. I mean, this is just the way it goes. All right. So here we are, and we're now gonna use the fact that he's a man of faith. Here we are. Here's the faith and friction. We were just kind of setting the whole thing up to this point. Faith and friction. He constantly will proclaim his Christianity, his faith. He will use by the Bible and Bible verses all the time in his talks and in whatever it is he's saying. speaker-1: And it is counter to everything that the man that the Bible is centered around taught. speaker-0: It's so it it it's so ridiculous not only yes, not only is it contrary, but it diminishes and marginalizes people that aren't necessarily of a biblical faith. Yeah. So no speaker-1: True. Let's take the the pieces there. I f I don't fear I am concerned that the very Christianity that I love has been stolen and it is being twisted and manipulated. I believe Jesus himself would come back and go, What have you done to my message? This is not what I taught. This is not what I was about. Then I've got the whole other faction that you've mentioned. I have people who are Beautiful, amazing contributors to the United States of America who do not follow a Christian path. Yeah. And they are Buddhist, they are Hindu, they are also Muslim, they are Jewish, and they are equally as value. And step by step we're taking away the rights of the people who don't necessarily think religiously the same way. That's a very dangerous world and not one that's in congruity with what the United States of America was founded in. Well speaker-0: We're we we're doing it left and right. All right. It's happen. speaker-1: It's dividing. It's it's the us and them. We are creating an us and them which is going to destroy our nation. speaker-0: This is it's it's just i i it's horrible what he's doing with the department of defense. I'm not gonna call it department of war with the department of defense all the way around. He will speak like he did to the cadets and he will say, Well, I'm so proud of you because what did God say? You know, who shall I send? Raise your hand, send me. Now what are you done? What is he telling them? They're being sent in God's name. Right. You're being faithful to God by picking up a weapon and going if it gets boots on the ground. speaker-1: Yeah, make no mistake about it, it'll eventually be going to Canada. It'll be eventually going to Mexico. Yeah. You bet. speaker-0: With righteousness, you know, you know, right tucked underneath our arm. And so he talks like this. It it's just arm the full armor of God. is that militarily, is that speak right to the armed forces? Sure it does. Of course it does. So it resonates on that level. So now I'm putting this physical armor on, but it's really God's armor because I'm doing the righteous thing by speaker-1: My God can beat up your God. God's on my side. speaker-0: They're sending me, all right? So it and it doesn't even have to be a religious conflict per se, right? We can go invade Venezuela, and we're still carrying that pompous attitude that we're doing this in God's name because we're the favored nation status. speaker-1: Well in Venezuela, which is a very Christian nation. speaker-0: Anyway, that's right. You know, and so we justify all of this all the way around. If we go to you know, Greenland, right? If we go to Cuba, that's another way. speaker-1: Anywhere in the name of our God is better than your God, and God justifies our violence and our attack. It's wrong. Period. That's right. It's not the God I understand. It's not the Jesus I understand. It's not any of the world's prophets and teachers and spiritual sages throughout time. So we're using something in an incorrect way. speaker-0: Hey? No. speaker-1: Right. And I have to believe that our Christians sitting there, the cadets, the young, wonderful men and women supporting our country, that they they're not buying it, hook, line, and sinker. And I would you know the option is there's a coup at some point where we rise up. Generals, unfortunately, generals who have spoken up against this kind of mentality have been fired. Danger, danger, pay attention. speaker-0: Well, this this is part this is the winnowing process. And so he here the other big announcement that he made in this talk was this whole new department that he's you know that he's commissioned, if you will, that's called the Office of Religious Affairs. Okay. Now he's zeroing in on we need to be not only you know, physically fit, but we need to be spiritually fit. So all of a sudden now, right, it's he's taken it upon himself that his department is not only gonna make you do fifty pushups and run this and run the speaker-1: But now you have to pray the prayer that I pray. speaker-0: What we need to do to you know to get you spiritually fit? And how in the world? So we've already had chaplaincy, you know, we've already got that as part of the military. speaker-1: I know people who are in the military who no longer have a chaplain that will serve them. Mm-hmm. I have to go to s a different faith tradition to have a chaplain to have the support. Wow. That's very much intentional. Yeah. speaker-0: There you go. See, this is an abuse. It's an abuse b it's it's it's promoted under the guise that we want you to be spiritually fit. speaker-1: Well, under and under the guise hidden agenda that you're weaker than you're not in the one percent if you believe different than my Christian. Yeah, speaker-0: Physically, but also spiritually. speaker-1: you're weaker. speaker-0: Here we go. All right. So now all of a sudden, and not only do we have this new agency, but he's completely bypassed any chain of command for the most part. And guess who's running it? Him. Right? So he is the last he, you know, he gets the say in the whole move. speaker-1: All checks and balances removed. speaker-0: So it's about, yeah, it's about speaker-1: Don't question or you are removed. speaker-0: So there we are. So we've set this thing up under the guise that we want you to be spiritually fit. See, it's kind of like you were talking earlier. Well, we need better control at the border. Yes, we do. Argument. speaker-1: Yep. No argument there. No argument. speaker-0: Okay. But now it's the means and the ends. See, that gets all convoluted there. Well, the way we you you're gonna want to achieve that goal is not anywhere near the way I thought you were gonna do it. speaker-1: I mean let's put it into the most absurd terms. If you and I are in a fight and in a in a disagreement, I can end that argument a number of ways. I can sit in the fire and maybe come to some conclusion, or I can just get a gun. Okay, I won. You lose. And I think that's the mentality that's rising to the surface. I just destroy you and then I've won the army. speaker-0: Makes right. speaker-1: That doesn't make America great. It doesn't make our military great. It makes us absolutely on a on a trajectory to our destruction. Great speaker-0: A decadence. Wanna be great? A decadence? Okay, we're winning that battle, man. I mean we are way out in front of everybody else per se. So there's a ripple effect to all of this now. To to the requirements and to who they're gonna put in there. And they took the the definition of different faiths down from a couple hundred down to like thirty, all right. And most of them are Christian, all right? But and they included, you know. Buddhist and and you know, Islam and you know, all of those kind, you know, the normal ones, right? But what they did was they left out the the non normative faith traditions. And I thought this was really speaker-1: yeah. speaker-0: Yeah, definitely. All right. Unity would be definitely members of Wiccan and other earth-based religions said the cuts to recognized faiths would make it far more difficult, if not impossible, for active duty military personnel to request a day off for a religious holiday, have access to their faith's sacred books, or get permission to gather for a religious service or study. There's the friction. speaker-1: friction. Your faith isn't valid. Your belief system is not valid. speaker-0: Pick a different category. Yeah. You know, you're gonna have to go somewhere else because they all have to declare something. That's part of the deal in the military. You have to pick a category. All right. Then there's no not speaker-1: Well, and again, is this a a subversive method of proselytizing? Well, gosh, you have to pick one, but now there's only five choices. Now there's only three. Pick one. Now you got one choice. You're gonna pick it, you get the benefits or you don't, period. There it is. And that's and that's that's obscure, that's a little bit projectoring. But I'm telling you, if you don't pay attention and challenge what's going on, that's where it goes. speaker-0: Yes, we're all subject to embellishing and going down some certain rabbit trails that we shudden connect the dots over, but sometimes we're almost left with no recourse but not to do that, to make our case. It has to get speaker-1: I'm not sitting here behind this mic going the sky is falling. Yeah. But I'm saying the sky will fall, the United States will fall if we don't speak up. Yeah, we're Which is our right. And I celebrate that freedom. So I speaker-0: Let this go on, Rev. Damn it. You know, we've gotta stand up a little bit and just say. speaker-1: And not be labelled, you're just you're just making waves. No. It's like something doesn't smell right. speaker-0: Well yeah, I mean all forget about we haven't even tipped it that the whole Christian nationalism thing, but that all goes into this whole stirred pot about faith, religion, who's controlling who through it? Are we skewing things? Are we of course it's all going on right now. And again, frog in the pot. And so, you know, there was other people are complaining about this, about the going from 211 to 31, the definitions excluded were atheists, pagans, humanists, and new age faiths. Now, again, you don't have to be one of those. I mean, that that that didn't have to be you. That's okay. But the minute you again begin to marginalize all of these people that you you say this all the time. I don't know if we said in the pre-show, you've already said it on the episode. I think it was on the episode already. That there are many people that you know that don't have the label, whatever the label is. Beautiful speaker-1: I won't accept a label. speaker-0: people. They're, you know, they care about people. They care about they have speaker-1: They care about the country. speaker-0: integrity. They, you know, they don't have any of the religious labels. Right. But speaker-1: No, you have to pick one now. speaker-0: Well, it and the one of the the most of the thirty one are just different types of Christianity. Right. And and let alone there's how many different I mean, they just narrowed it down, but there's tens of thousands of different Christian denominations. speaker-1: Today forty forty four thousand, forty five thousand different sects of Christianity. speaker-0: Now you've narrowed it down even further. So even if I am a Christian and but maybe I don't fit in one of the thirty one or that all of those, I maybe I think there's like twenty five speaker-1: Well, and it's easy as a Christian to go, Well, I wasn't affected. I didn't lose mine until you do. It's like the old thing if they came for the industrialist and I didn't say anything because I wasn't an industrialist. They came for the Jews and I didn't say anything because I wasn't a Jew, then they came for me. And there was nobody left to defend me. The reality is we have to pay attention to this. I'm Episcopalian. I'm still on the list, I'm good. I'm Catholic, I'm still on the list until you aren't. I'm telling you, the religion that's being espoused right now from the highest offices in our country, Catholics will be on the chopping block. Mormons will be on the chopping block. Episcopalians speaker-0: Well there already there is speaker-1: will be on the chopping block because you don't fit the Christian nationalist agenda. speaker-0: Well, we just can't let this gain a momentum because again, if we continue to put our head in the sand, then they will get away with whatever they can. All right. He's gonna get away with whatever he can. But this whole administration has done that since the beginning. Well it's they've said we're gonna do it and until you tell us we can't. Well I speaker-1: Often use the phrase it's easier to ask for forgiveness than it is permission. But the reality is nobody's asking for either. speaker-0: That's very true. All right. I mean it's a sad state of affairs, but it's caught, it's what's taught is caught. And so I don't care you want to talk about it being subconscious or subliminal or what we talked about this in an episode four or five episodes ago that an angry God produces angry people. An angry secretary of war. is going to produce angry wars. speaker-1: Angry. speaker-0: Angry wars. I mean it just goes hand in hand. Fill in the blanks. I mean you can put anything else in there you want. speaker-1: Self righteous, you know, angry people who are violent are going to create more of that on the planet. And period. And that is not a political statement on either side of the aisle. Because both aisles are doing it to an extent. I need to be in the middle and say, wait a minute, we need to stop this Cause and effect. speaker-0: It's natural law. It's the way things work. A loving, kind, first century individual rabbi will produce what? Loving, kind, caring, compassionate people. speaker-1: Said if I remember my scripture well enough, put the sword down. Yeah, I've not come to be a warrior king, but I've come to with a different agenda, a different way. And I believe that you know everything is cyclical. We're breathing out, we're breathing in. Right now is a great kind of inhale, a collapse. I'm not saying it's the end of the world, there's gonna be a breath that comes. And unfortunately, sometimes it has to get to the point of turning blue because we're holding our breath so long. That it's going to be okay. Yeah. That we're gonna be okay, but it will only be okay if we can have civil dialogue and talk about it and not if you have a counter opinion to be said you're the enemy, you're less than the one percent, you're evil. That doesn't work. No. It's not gonna work and it never has. speaker-0: Let's just I'm gonna reiterate. cannot let a lot of this stuff go on, and especially not in God's name, and there's all kinds of other examples. speaker-1: And I wanna be honest. I all roads lead to me. I can't allow that in me. No, that's I'm one idea, one anger, one moment of frustration or fear from being like that. Yep. Woo, I don't want that. speaker-0: Alright, so I'm gonna I'm gonna wipe the froth off my mouth for a moment, okay? And just say, take this to heart. You don't have to agree with us. You don't have to think that we're, you know, maybe we're a little bit crazy wacky down the path, but there's not no wisdom here. That's a double negative, I know, but you know, seek out and just at least I'm encouraging everybody listening out there, it's just not false. speaker-1: Stay awake, okay? Just stay awake, stay conscious, and pay attention. I think that that we'll be fine if we speaker-0: I agree. All right, man. Thanks a bunch. Next week, as we said, we're going to talk a little bit more about where the we're going for the future. We hope you'll tune into that. So have a great week and we'll catch you on the flip side.