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The Huddle: How can we bring more revenue into New Zealand? · The SME Stream

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  Speaker 1: The Huddle with New Zealand Southby's international realty, local and
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  Speaker 1: global exposure.
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  Speaker 2: Like no other.
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  Speaker 1: On the Hudle Tris Sharson of Sheerson Willis pr and
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  Speaker 1: Joe Spagani of ChildFund.
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  Speaker 2: Hi are you guys?
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  Speaker 1: Hello?
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  Speaker 2: Hello Trish?
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  Speaker 1: Why do you think these ladies are the banks are
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  Speaker 1: so keen on the tax?
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  Speaker 3: I don't know the reason for speaking up on the tax,
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  Speaker 3: but the one thing that I do back them both
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  Speaker 3: on is that we do need business New Zealand, business
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  Speaker 3: leaders in New Zealand who do speak up on things
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  Speaker 3: that they you know, they have a point of view on,
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  Speaker 3: so just want their opinions exactly, and in fact, you
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  Speaker 3: know the government is saying that to business leaders, we
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  Speaker 3: want you to have an opinion. So so that's my
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  Speaker 3: view on that. But I absolutely agree with Robin Oliver
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  Speaker 3: when it comes to the fact that we cannot tax
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  Speaker 3: our way to success in New Zealand. And in fact,
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  Speaker 3: in my view, discussions around tax have become punitive and
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  Speaker 3: as a sort of bludgeon to success and we need
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  Speaker 3: to turn that around. And if taxing our way to
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  Speaker 3: success was the right way to do things in New
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  Speaker 3: Zealand would be absolutely ripping and we are not. And
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  Speaker 3: I further to that, I think that a lot of
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  Speaker 3: New Zealanders have actually lost faith in value for money
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  Speaker 3: in terms of the taxes they are paying, because look
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  Speaker 3: at the state of things.
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  Speaker 1: I agree with you, Josey, what do you think.
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  Speaker 4: Yeah, if you go back to A and z's Antonia
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  Speaker 4: Watson what she was advocating for a capital gains tax.
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  Speaker 4: So I think what they're not saying, you know, tax
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  Speaker 4: the country to hell, and that will be how you
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  Speaker 4: get prosperity and growth. And I listened to your interview
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  Speaker 4: with Robin Oliver, and he's saying, don't tax it. You know,
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  Speaker 4: we won't have surgeons and doctors and teachers and nurses
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  Speaker 4: and so on if we.
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  Speaker 2: Don't grow, and he's absolutely right.
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  Speaker 4: But I think what they're saying, these two bank chief
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  Speaker 4: executives is you need a tax switch because at the moment,
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  Speaker 4: you've got about forty five percent of our tax revenue
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  Speaker 4: is coming from tax off people who work for wages.
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  Speaker 4: It's levied on work, and thirty one percent coming off
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  Speaker 4: spending on GST. So so you know that's most of
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  Speaker 4: us and what and that's really out of kilter with
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  Speaker 4: the rest of the world where there there's a much
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  Speaker 4: better balance between taxing the non productive sector ie houses
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  Speaker 4: that just sit there and do nothing and don't create
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  Speaker 4: any jobs and don't do anything.
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  Speaker 2: So they're saying capital gains.
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  Speaker 4: Tax, taxing on the games makes sense rather than taxing
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  Speaker 4: on all the innovators and the wealth makers of tomorrow
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  Speaker 4: who are still climbing up the hill. Perfect.
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  Speaker 1: But no, no, no, no, Josie, because what we need
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  Speaker 1: in this country, which is winni capital, which is why
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  Speaker 1: both Winnie Pee and David Cymore is saying we've got
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  Speaker 1: to get foreign capital, and you don't then tax the
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  Speaker 1: very thing that you're trying to get into the country,
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  Speaker 1: thereby creating a disincentive.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, but this is.
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  Speaker 4: About taxing things that don't make any money at all,
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  Speaker 4: So we're not it's not about taxing stuff that invests
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  Speaker 4: in businesses and invests in innovations.
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  Speaker 2: It's about you taxing the dead like cap does.
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  Speaker 1: Make business and there's a gain, there's a capital gains tax.
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  Speaker 4: And also people who are buying lots and lots of houses,
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  Speaker 4: which we know that speculation around housing has been a thing,
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  Speaker 4: and that's just sort of money that's not feeding into
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  Speaker 4: the productive sector.
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  Speaker 2: So I do think we need it.
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  Speaker 4: In your right, Trish, let business leaders have a say
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  Speaker 4: and have an opinion about this. I think you have
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  Speaker 4: to accept that there is we are out of kilter
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  Speaker 4: with the rest of the world, where we tax people
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  Speaker 4: who earn wages far more, and the people earning wages
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  Speaker 4: today are the capital makers and the wealth makers of tomorrow.
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  Speaker 4: What we're saying is that the people at the top
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  Speaker 4: of the hill, we've already made all their money, and
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  Speaker 4: good on them for doing it. We're saying they don't
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  Speaker 4: have to pay any tax. We'll just tax everybody else
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  Speaker 4: who's coming up the hill. But they're the wealth. They're
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  Speaker 4: the wealthy of tomorrow. See, you know, you've got to
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  Speaker 4: get a better balance in the tax system.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, I don't agree.
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  Speaker 3: I think one of the great examples currently is the
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  Speaker 3: small and medium business owners who have been hit with
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  Speaker 3: the increase in the tax.
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  Speaker 2: Rate on trusts.
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  Speaker 3: And you know that they are people who are working
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  Speaker 3: really hard, and that's a tax of up at forty percent.
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  Speaker 3: So I don't agree. It's not it's not as simple
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  Speaker 3: as that. But I also I do think that overwhelmingly
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  Speaker 3: it's also about a signal to New Zealand and where
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  Speaker 3: we want to head and that we do want to
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  Speaker 3: start celebrating our success.
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  Speaker 2: And I just don't think that.
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  Speaker 4: I don't think this is but I don't think this
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  Speaker 4: is about you know, putting a down or on success.
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  Speaker 4: What we're actually saying is we need some kind of
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  Speaker 4: tax switch. So you're right, small to medium businesses, we
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  Speaker 4: need to support them in every way we can. So
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  Speaker 4: let's reduce taxes in other places. Let's reduce income tax
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  Speaker 4: for a start. So you've got to look at the
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  Speaker 4: whole tax system and go because it's not just about
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  Speaker 4: creating realm, and that's also about taxing the right stuff.
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  Speaker 5: I don't live in that world, right then, no one's
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  Speaker 5: going to give us a tax switch. But they're not
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  Speaker 5: going to give us a tax switch. They're just going
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  Speaker 5: to increase their revenue and government.
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  Speaker 4: But we've done it before, Heather, we did it, John
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  Speaker 4: Key did it with GST, cut income tax and put
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  Speaker 4: up GST. So absolutely when the different situations, I mean.
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  Speaker 1: Which we're kind of broke at the moment, we're very broke.
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  Speaker 5: Yeah, So anyway, listen, we'll take a break, come back
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  Speaker 5: and talk about how the government's doing one year and
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  Speaker 5: and also after six o'clock with Nickoliwillis, we are going
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  Speaker 5: to talk about getting the foreign capitalist the Huddle with.
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  Speaker 1: New Zealand Southeby's International Realty, elevate the marketing of your
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  Speaker 1: home right. You're back with the Huddle, Joe Speguanni and
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  Speaker 1: Tricious and Josie. What do you think about this government
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  Speaker 1: a year and how they're tracking.
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  Speaker 4: Well, we're clearly feeling very ill, aren't we. We're not
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  Speaker 4: very tigger. We're pretty miserable. So you can't necessarily blame
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  Speaker 4: the government on that. But look at what I think
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  Speaker 4: they've got right, is they've got the diagnosis right of
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  Speaker 4: what's gone wrong, so cost blowouts, we're not delivering. We
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  Speaker 4: haven't been building stuff. We've got to make that faster.
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  Speaker 4: We've got to make that easier. What they lack and
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  Speaker 4: why those polls are not looking good for national They
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  Speaker 4: lack a sort of big plan. And the thing about
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  Speaker 4: a plan is that you don't expect a government to
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  Speaker 4: fix everything in the first year, but you do want
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  Speaker 4: to believe that they will. And there's a wonderful quote
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  Speaker 4: from the former German Chancellor Helmet Schmidt who once said
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  Speaker 4: politicians with a vision should go and see a doctor.
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  Speaker 4: What they need is a plan. And the thing about
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  Speaker 4: a plan is, you know, it's a map for what
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  Speaker 4: you're going to do. It identifies destination, you can see
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  Speaker 4: the milestones and most importantly, you can see the priorities.
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  Speaker 4: So without a plan, I think they've got a bit derailed.
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  Speaker 4: Where you know, the biggest noise that comes along, which
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  Speaker 4: has been treaty issues, and really I don't think we
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  Speaker 4: were worried about any of the race issues until this
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  Speaker 4: suddenly became a huge, big issue. It kind of throws
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  Speaker 4: them off balance and they end up talking, you know,
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  Speaker 4: forever about treaty principles and all of this, and that's
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  Speaker 4: not what they want to be doing. So that's the problem.
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  Speaker 4: You get led around by the nose if you haven't
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  Speaker 4: got a clear plan. I think that's what they lack.
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  Speaker 3: What do you think for It's exactly what came out
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  Speaker 3: in mood of the boardroom recently. Everybody said we want
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  Speaker 3: to see the plan for growth. I think here's my
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  Speaker 3: little dipstick on where we are right now as a country.
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  Speaker 3: And what sparked this was a conversation I had with
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  Speaker 3: someone who owns a small business in Russell over the weekend.
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  Speaker 3: I was saying, oh, you know, as you do go
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  Speaker 3: aroundtown or how's things going, and she said, look, right now,
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  Speaker 3: people can't afford a day trip. So you get people
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  Speaker 3: on a Sunday that go from Fungarray to Russell. It's
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  Speaker 3: an hour, spend a day there, buy some fish and chips.
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  Speaker 3: So my quick assessment is, right now we're a country
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  Speaker 3: that can't afford a Sunday day trip. We're broke. Our
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  Speaker 3: bright young things are leaving New Zealand, and record numbers
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  Speaker 3: the things we trust to look after us, like the
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  Speaker 3: health system, are broken. And the bright spot is we're
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  Speaker 3: campaigning to be the best country in the world to
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  Speaker 3: have her peace. That was right expected to rest wishes,
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  Speaker 3: but actually, just on a serious I just can't you
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  Speaker 3: know that.
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  Speaker 2: It made me laugh when I saw that campaign.
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  Speaker 3: But I think the hard thing for the government is
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  Speaker 3: that for people who have lost their businesses in the
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  Speaker 3: past four years and who are still losing their businesses,
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  Speaker 3: that is a decade long or multi generational problem for
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  Speaker 3: those families. And if you just look at some numbers
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  Speaker 3: in disposable income per capita is down six point two
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  Speaker 3: percent compared to September twenty twenty two. Now, how much
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  Speaker 3: is that in twenty twenty four dollars, a four person
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  Speaker 3: household is over sixteen hundred dollars a month worse off
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  Speaker 3: than two years ago. That is a huge amount of money. So, yes,
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  Speaker 3: I think the government's ticking things off. Yes, I think
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  Speaker 3: they are. They're working quickly, and we all feel better
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  Speaker 3: that they are in But New Zealanders, I think, are
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  Speaker 3: in a harder place than a lot have been in
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  Speaker 3: a generation. So there is a very long way back,
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  Speaker 3: but way back is through growth. And I was really
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  Speaker 3: pleased to see the foreign capital stuff over the weekend
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  Speaker 3: because New Zealand is absolutely parched and we need foreign
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  Speaker 3: capital desperately to get things going again.
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  Speaker 2: I'll give you an.
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  Speaker 4: Idea of another quick dipstick is the way the government
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  Speaker 4: has cut a lot of staff in the public sector.
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  Speaker 2: So cut costs great.
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  Speaker 4: I understand that, But then again, where's the big idea
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  Speaker 4: about how you actually fix the public sector which hasn't
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  Speaker 4: been able to deliver even on former government plans either.
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  Speaker 4: So what's gone wrong? What's causing the group think, what's
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  Speaker 4: causing the inability for the public sector to be.
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  Speaker 2: Better at delivery? And get things done fast.
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  Speaker 4: And I think that, you know, it's a really good
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  Speaker 4: little microcosm of what's gone wrong. You can cut things, yes,
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  Speaker 4: but you've still got to do a diagnostic about what
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  Speaker 4: is why is the public sector not delivering and what
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  Speaker 4: does it need to do that. You know, maybe it's
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  Speaker 4: separating policy develop development from delivery of stuff because if
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  Speaker 4: you don't have the government, right, if you don't government departments, right, yeah,
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  Speaker 4: that's that's who delivers the government.
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  Speaker 1: You make a good point. Cutting is not transformation and
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  Speaker 1: what we need is transformation.
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  Speaker 3: Quick outside view though, which is a bright spot. Someone
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  Speaker 3: who works with me, who's immigrated to New Zealand this year,
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  Speaker 3: he said, other countries would kill for the kind of
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  Speaker 3: business like focus government we've got at the moment. He said,
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  Speaker 3: look at the UK. We'll look at the keir Starmagual
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  Speaker 3: less than two months and they are rudderless and in
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  Speaker 3: absolute shambles. He said, look at the US. So I
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  Speaker 3: think it's good to balance the out the inside view
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  Speaker 3: with the outside.
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  Speaker 1: I have a little bit of a little bit of
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  Speaker 1: a glasshouse for there. Guys. Thank you. I really appreciate
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  Speaker 1: the power of you coming on to chat to me.
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  Speaker 1: As always on a Monday, Joe Spagani, Trishas and our
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  Speaker 1: huddle