Latest / Space Nuts: Astronomy Insights & Cosmic Discoveries / Black Holes, Time Twists & the Future of Life on Mars: A Q&A Episode

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Black Holes, Time Twists & the Future of Life on Mars: A Q&A Episode · Space Nuts: Astronomy Insights & Cosmic Discoveries

• 0:00
  Andrew Dunkley: Hi there. Andrew Dunkley here and this is
• 0:02
  Space Nuts, a Q and A edition. Thanks for
• 0:05
  joining us. Coming up we're going to oh
• 0:08
  gosh, talk about something never before
• 0:10
  spoken of on Space Nuts. A black
• 0:13
  hole. A little bit of a different twist on
• 0:15
  this one though. We're also going to look at
• 0:17
  the. Dimension of time, our obsession
• 0:20
  with life, the malinkov cycles
• 0:23
  of Mars and Paddy's got an idea for
• 0:25
  me to write a book. That's all coming up
• 0:28
  on this edition of space nuts.
• 0:30
  Generic: 15 seconds. Guidance is internal.
• 0:33
  10, 9. Ignition
• 0:36
  sequence start. Space nuts. 5, 4, 3.
• 0:39
  2. 1. 2, 3, 4, 5, 5, 4,
• 0:41
  3, 2, 1. Space nuts. Astronauts
• 0:44
  report it feels good.
• 0:46
  Andrew Dunkley: And with all the answers is Professor
• 0:49
  Fred Watson Watson, astronomer at large.
• 0:50
  Hello friend.
• 0:52
  Professor Fred Watson: Hello Andrew. It's not all the answers but
• 0:55
  well, two or three of them, that's all
• 0:58
  we need.
• 0:59
  Andrew Dunkley: I thought I'd show you my background today.
• 1:02
  Professor Fred Watson: Yes, I was to ask you about that.
• 1:04
  Andrew Dunkley: All these rockets launching into space.
• 1:06
  That's from the sphere in Las Vegas.
• 1:09
  I took that photo when we went to a show
• 1:11
  there called Postcard From Earth.
• 1:13
  And the basis of the story
• 1:16
  is that Earth's become uninhabitable due to
• 1:19
  global warming. So everyone basically went
• 1:22
  let's get out of Dodge. And that's the scene
• 1:25
  of all the rockets taking off as humanity
• 1:27
  leaves the planet. And the whole
• 1:30
  storyline basically is about people coming
• 1:32
  back to visit but we can't live here anymore
• 1:35
  because we messed it up so bad. And
• 1:37
  that, yeah, so that's the launch sequence
• 1:39
  from all the humans leaving the planet after
• 1:42
  we decimated it with global warming and
• 1:44
  climate change. and it's a
• 1:47
  360 degree sphere in Las
• 1:49
  Vegas, which you can walk around and
• 1:53
  it has pictures on the outside, but on the
• 1:55
  inside it's a visual screen that goes all
• 1:58
  around you. not only is it showing you
• 2:00
  pictures but you can also experience weather
• 2:04
  while you're there. So you fly over snow
• 2:06
  fields and you can feel the cold and the
• 2:08
  wind. you fly over an orchard in
• 2:11
  California, you can smell the citrus. it's
• 2:13
  really brilliant, really amazing facility
• 2:16
  that they've, they've built there and all
• 2:18
  centred around science. So yeah, loved it,
• 2:21
  Absolutely loved it. Notwithstanding the fact
• 2:23
  the Eagles are performing there pretty much
• 2:25
  as I speak. So they do all kind of thing as
• 2:27
  well. Yeah. But yeah, I like that, I like
• 2:30
  that as a backdrop. Sort of fits in with what
• 2:32
  we do. Space Nuts launching rockets, that
• 2:35
  kind of thing.
• 2:37
  Professor Fred Watson: So the reason why Earth, is uninhabitable. Is
• 2:39
  because of all these rockets leaving behind
• 2:42
  their trailer were nasty
• 2:45
  stuff.
• 2:45
  Andrew Dunkley: They dusted chemicals.
• 2:49
  It probably didn't help that many take.
• 2:50
  Professor Fred Watson: I don't think it would, no.
• 2:52
  Andrew Dunkley: Let's get down to some questions. And our
• 2:55
  first one comes from Mark, Painter. this one
• 2:56
  came via, Facebook. Dear Andrew and Professor
• 2:59
  Fred Watson. I have a few questions that
• 3:01
  puzzle me today. I'll start with, of course,
• 3:03
  black holes in the movie Interstellar.
• 3:07
  As they get closer to the black hole, time
• 3:09
  slows down relative to the outside observer.
• 3:12
  By extension, as we get close to the event
• 3:15
  horizon, time would stretch more and more and
• 3:17
  I assume follows an exponential curve
• 3:20
  to the point where time effectively stops.
• 3:23
  So then to enter the black hole, wouldn't
• 3:26
  time have to go in reverse? Could it be
• 3:29
  that all black holes are actually chunks that
• 3:32
  come from the Big Bang that did
• 3:34
  not, form, That did not
• 3:37
  form normal matter?
• 3:39
  Andrew Dunkley: Thanks in advance.
• 3:41
  Andrew Dunkley: We kind of talked about that in our last
• 3:43
  episode. The primordial black holes. And
• 3:47
  they're maybe being responsible
• 3:49
  for dark matter, which
• 3:52
  Fred Watson debunked pretty heavily. Yeah,
• 3:55
  there's a big up. Really? No, but, So
• 3:58
  he's asking about time being reversed. If you
• 4:01
  entered a black hole, I know something
• 4:03
  that would be reversed. Your life. But that's
• 4:06
  besides the point.
• 4:08
  Professor Fred Watson: Yeah, Just. Just to, elaborate on what you
• 4:11
  were just saying though, Andrew.
• 4:14
  primordial black holes may exist. We just
• 4:16
  don't know. and my comment was that I didn't
• 4:19
  think they would amount to forming
• 4:22
  the. The dark matter that, you know,
• 4:25
  looking for. But we do, we do know that,
• 4:28
  some black holes are actually formed
• 4:31
  from supernova explosions. The debris left
• 4:34
  over by supernova. The collapse of the core
• 4:36
  of a star that has sufficient mass,
• 4:39
  up to 22. Something like 22
• 4:42
  solar masses. So, the answer to the
• 4:45
  last bit of Mark's question there. Could it
• 4:47
  be that all the black holes are actually
• 4:49
  chunks that came from the Big Bang that did
• 4:51
  not form normal matter? And, some of
• 4:54
  them probably did, the primordial ones. But,
• 4:56
  some also didn't. We know that black
• 4:59
  holes are formed by. By stars getting to the
• 5:01
  ends of their lives. And regarding time
• 5:05
  reversal, Mark is absolutely right that
• 5:07
  as you, To an outside observer, the
• 5:10
  closer you get to the event horizon,
• 5:14
  the, More
• 5:17
  your time to the outside observer slows down,
• 5:19
  if I can put it that way. And when you cross
• 5:22
  the event horizon, basically time stops. So
• 5:24
  your person would be frozen, on the event
• 5:27
  horizon. Although they've actually fallen
• 5:29
  into it. They don't see the event horizon
• 5:32
  because that's ah, basically an optical
• 5:34
  illusion. It's the point at which light
• 5:36
  cannot escape.
• 5:38
  Andrew Dunkley: We thought this, some
• 5:40
  episodes back about how if you were to
• 5:43
  cross the threshold, like, oh, space and
• 5:46
  time would flip.
• 5:47
  Professor Fred Watson: Yes, that's right, they do. that's. As you
• 5:50
  get close to it, it's exactly right. The
• 5:53
  dimensions flip. And we had quite a nice
• 5:55
  explanation as to why that would be.
• 5:57
  Andrew Dunkley: Which great YouTube video on it, I think.
• 6:00
  Professor Fred Watson: Yes, that was it. There was a YouTube video.
• 6:02
  Very nicely put. very nicely put.
• 6:05
  Why the. Effectively space and time
• 6:07
  flip. and that in a way sort
• 6:10
  of illuminates Mark's question as
• 6:13
  well. The, the time
• 6:16
  doesn't reverse for you. time basically
• 6:19
  disappears along with you
• 6:22
  and you get swallowed into the, into the
• 6:24
  black hole from your perspective. and
• 6:27
  you know, it's no good thinking about whether
• 6:29
  to an outside observer time might reverse
• 6:33
  because the outside observer can't see you
• 6:35
  because you're, by that time you're inside
• 6:38
  the event horizon. So nobody's going to see
• 6:40
  you, Nobody will feel your pain.
• 6:42
  Andrew Dunkley: No, no.
• 6:43
  Andrew Dunkley: But you'll be covered in spaghetti sauce.
• 6:45
  Professor Fred Watson: Spaghetti. Yes, that's right.
• 6:46
  Andrew Dunkley: In the movie Interstellar, of course he's
• 6:48
  referring to a situation where an
• 6:51
  astronaut did cross the plane into a black
• 6:54
  hole to help solve,
• 6:57
  a, a, a puzzle that they could only solve
• 7:00
  if they could get inside a black hole.
• 7:03
  Professor Fred Watson: Yes, that's right.
• 7:03
  Paddy: Yep.
• 7:04
  Professor Fred Watson: I, I did see the movie, but I don't remember
• 7:06
  the exact plot. I just remember thinking, no,
• 7:09
  that couldn't possibly happen. No. What are
• 7:12
  they talking about?
• 7:12
  Andrew Dunkley: All a gravity problem and they couldn't do
• 7:15
  it. Black hole. So that's,
• 7:18
  I had to go in, brilliant film, but that was
• 7:21
  probably where it jumped the shark, so to
• 7:23
  speak. in terms of reality. But
• 7:26
  who cares? It's science fiction. I loved it.
• 7:28
  Absolutely loved it. Thank you Mark, great to
• 7:31
  hear from you and thanks for reaching out on
• 7:34
  Facebook. Our next question comes from
• 7:37
  Craig.
• 7:37
  Craig: Hi professors, it's Craig calling from
• 7:40
  Sunny Marimbula in New South Wales.
• 7:43
  I have a question about dimensions.
• 7:47
  1, dimension, 2, 3.
• 7:51
  They all need time and we
• 7:53
  describe time as a dimension. But
• 7:56
  is it really? It's kind of
• 7:59
  like half a dimension. We can move in
• 8:02
  one vector but not in the other.
• 8:05
  Unless you can move faster than the speed of
• 8:07
  light and I don't think we can. So
• 8:10
  it's not really a full dimension.
• 8:13
  It's as I said, more like a Half a dimension.
• 8:16
  What are your thoughts?
• 8:18
  Andrew Dunkley: M. Okay, Craig, thank you.
• 8:21
  Andrew Dunkley: yes, half a dimension.
• 8:23
  Andrew Dunkley: We do describe time as a dimension
• 8:26
  and while you're talking I'm going to do some
• 8:28
  research because I remember us talking not so
• 8:31
  long ago about a paper that was
• 8:34
  released suggesting time travels
• 8:36
  in two directions at once.
• 8:40
  Was that.
• 8:42
  Professor Fred Watson: Yeah, that's that was
• 8:44
  for the. It's
• 8:47
  the way some quantum processes experience it.
• 8:50
  I think that was what it was about. Yeah. so
• 8:53
  time is a dimension. this
• 8:55
  emerged from sort of mathematical
• 8:58
  studies in the wake of Einstein's special
• 9:00
  theory of relativity.
• 9:03
  and so you can write down an
• 9:06
  equation, if I
• 9:09
  remember it rightly
• 9:12
  so you, excuse me, imagine yourself
• 9:15
  moving, in
• 9:18
  three dimensions, a
• 9:21
  distance which we'll call S. You've got
• 9:24
  three coordinates and actually in three
• 9:27
  dimensions you can write down an equation
• 9:28
  which we call the metric. And this is for
• 9:30
  normal non relativistic space which would be
• 9:33
  the S squared equals X squared plus Y squared
• 9:36
  plus Z squared. That would be a formal
• 9:38
  equation of how you would move in a three
• 9:41
  dimensional coordinate system. we,
• 9:45
  you know, we express these things
• 9:47
  mathematically. It's called a metric. That is
• 9:50
  the bottom
• 9:52
  line of this. but with
• 9:55
  relativity coming along people realise that
• 9:58
  yes, time behaves just like a dimension,
• 10:01
  and it is variable, it can be
• 10:03
  squashed and it can be extended. Just as
• 10:06
  we've been talking about time dilation, your
• 10:08
  time can look differently from the time
• 10:11
  of somebody else, who's in a different frame
• 10:14
  of reference from you, whether
• 10:15
  gravitationally or moving. so time is
• 10:18
  bendy, but
• 10:21
  you find that when you move to that
• 10:24
  relativistic situation you can write the
• 10:27
  equation down where you've got four
• 10:29
  dimensions, and one of them is time. And if I
• 10:31
  remember rightly, it's S squared equals X
• 10:33
  squared plus Y squared plus Z squared minus C
• 10:36
  squared T squared, where T is time.
• 10:39
  So it behaves just like a dimension.
• 10:43
  And that is why we call it a
• 10:45
  dimension, because it is, but it is clearly
• 10:48
  different in some ways from the three
• 10:51
  dimensions of space because. Exactly, as
• 10:54
  Craig says, we can move willy nilly about the
• 10:56
  three dimensions of space within reason of
• 10:59
  course, but we can move around them, but we
• 11:01
  can't move willy nilly around the dimension
• 11:04
  of time, except under certain circumstances
• 11:06
  where you're travelling at very high
• 11:07
  velocities and things of that sort. So it
• 11:10
  is a very unusual, it's an unusual
• 11:13
  dimension, but it is a dimension.
• 11:17
  I quite like the idea of it being half A
• 11:19
  dimension. but I think my mathematical
• 11:22
  friends would say no, it's definitely
• 11:25
  not half a dimension.
• 11:26
  Andrew Dunkley: Yes, I found several articles on what
• 11:29
  we'd spoken about, which was, a paper
• 11:31
  published late February, early March. In the
• 11:34
  quantum realm, time arrow might fly in
• 11:37
  two directions. Mark might want
• 11:40
  to, Craig, I mean, might want to look that
• 11:43
  up, and read a bit more about it. But
• 11:45
  yeah, it's a special circumstance I
• 11:48
  suppose would be the best way to
• 11:51
  describe it. but yeah, it's,
• 11:54
  it's, yeah, it's an interesting article.
• 11:57
  Professor Fred Watson: It's an interesting question from Craig too.
• 11:59
  Andrew Dunkley: Yes, very interesting. Thank you Craig. Great
• 12:01
  to hear from you.
• 12:03
  this is Space Nuts, Andrew Dunkley here with
• 12:05
  Professor Fred Watson Watson.
• 12:08
  Andrew Dunkley: Let's take a break from the show to tell you
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  Now back to the show.
• 13:57
  Andrew Dunkley: SpaceNuts. Okay, Fred Watson, we've got
• 13:59
  another audio question from a regular
• 14:02
  senderinera. Here's Mikey.
• 14:04
  Mikey: Hey friend. And Andrew. It is Mikey from
• 14:06
  Illinois. Once again, I'm sitting here
• 14:09
  at 5:30 in the morning as one does, pondering
• 14:11
  about life in the universe. And I Was just
• 14:14
  wondering why we're so fixated on life
• 14:17
  had already happening on other
• 14:19
  planets. we look for signs of life
• 14:22
  from the past on Mars, you know eventually on
• 14:24
  Venus and all these places that we go. But
• 14:27
  what are the odds that these places say
• 14:31
  Venus for example are
• 14:34
  on their infancy stage of life and
• 14:36
  Venus will eventually cool down
• 14:39
  one day and when the Earth is
• 14:42
  long gone, possibly because we've self
• 14:44
  annihilated ourselves, maybe one day
• 14:47
  millions of years in the future, Venus will
• 14:49
  be an oasis. I'm just
• 14:52
  curious on your guys thoughts of this and I
• 14:55
  mean what are, what are the chances that
• 14:57
  maybe some planet or somebody in our solar
• 15:00
  system as of right now may not be able to
• 15:02
  harbour life but someday in the future will
• 15:05
  be. Thanks guys.
• 15:07
  Andrew Dunkley: Thank you Mikey.
• 15:08
  Andrew Dunkley: that's a really interesting question. in
• 15:10
  terms of the Venus theory,
• 15:14
  you might argue that Venus has already been
• 15:16
  there because I remember a story way back
• 15:19
  when we talked about the potential for
• 15:22
  three planets in our own solar system that
• 15:24
  all could have potentially harboured life.
• 15:27
  We know of one, we live on it. But Mars and
• 15:30
  Venus were also cited as planets at some
• 15:33
  stage had what would
• 15:36
  have been a ah,
• 15:38
  chemistry, an environment
• 15:41
  that could have harboured life. And
• 15:45
  Mars lost its atmosphere which sort of put
• 15:47
  them to bed. Venus went rogue.
• 15:51
  Greenhouse effect. And that put their
• 15:54
  potential for life to bed but doesn't write
• 15:57
  off the possibility that they might have had
• 15:59
  it.
• 16:00
  Professor Fred Watson: That's true. and I think that's absolutely
• 16:02
  right. Both those planets might have had it.
• 16:06
  as you say Venus had the
• 16:08
  runaway greenhouse effect which put its
• 16:11
  surface temperature up to what is it, 450 or
• 16:13
  thereabouts.
• 16:14
  Andrew Dunkley: That's yeah, Celsius.
• 16:16
  Professor Fred Watson: so I think with Venus it's
• 16:19
  done its dash because as time
• 16:23
  goes on the likelihood is that Venus will
• 16:26
  get even more inhospitable to life.
• 16:29
  as the sun basically
• 16:32
  swells towards the end of its
• 16:34
  lifetime and I'm talking now about 3 billion
• 16:37
  years or so in the future it'll start
• 16:38
  swelling, Venus will get
• 16:41
  even hotter than it is now. Earth might
• 16:44
  very well become uninhabitable by then.
• 16:47
  Mars however might turn into a
• 16:50
  warm world. it's doubtful it would
• 16:53
  regain its atmosphere. it might regain
• 16:56
  a lot of water which probably would
• 16:59
  evaporate into space without pressure of an
• 17:01
  atmosphere. But yeah it's impossible. Future
• 17:05
  ah, habitable world even if it's not. Now we
• 17:07
  don't know whether any microbes on Mars, but
• 17:10
  that's why we're being so careful to avoid
• 17:12
  contaminating them if there are, Perhaps an
• 17:15
  even more interesting world is Titan.
• 17:19
  As the Goldilocks zone creeps outwards as the
• 17:22
  sun expands in its later years,
• 17:25
  Titan is going to become a much more
• 17:27
  desirable place. in terms of
• 17:30
  habitability. It's the only place in the
• 17:32
  world. Sorry, the only place in the universe
• 17:35
  that we know of where there are ah, lakes and
• 17:37
  rivers in equilibrium with its atmosphere.
• 17:40
  They are liquid natural gas rather than
• 17:42
  water. But I think it's a, you know, it's a
• 17:45
  big planet. It's bigger than the planet
• 17:47
  Mercury. Sorry, It's a big satellite. It's
• 17:49
  bigger than the planet Mercury. maybe that's
• 17:51
  a place where we could find living organisms
• 17:54
  some way down the track in the future.
• 17:57
  Andrew Dunkley: Not, not to mention Europa,
• 17:59
  Enceladus, Ganymede, Callista,
• 18:02
  Triton.
• 18:03
  Professor Fred Watson: All possible. Yapetus.
• 18:05
  Andrew Dunkley: Yapetus, yes, yes.
• 18:09
  the ice moons in
• 18:12
  orbiting the gas giants are all looking,
• 18:16
  being looked at favourably for potential life
• 18:19
  with their under ice oceans.
• 18:22
  So you can't say never. I mean we haven't
• 18:25
  yet. We haven't found it yet.
• 18:28
  But they have found the,
• 18:31
  the seeds of life in the, in the geysers
• 18:34
  coming out of Of one or two of these moons.
• 18:36
  Professor Fred Watson: Yeah.
• 18:37
  Andrew Dunkley: Was it Cassini that did that?
• 18:39
  Professor Fred Watson: Yes, with Enceladus.
• 18:41
  Andrew Dunkley: Yeah, yeah.
• 18:42
  Professor Fred Watson: Such as some of us.
• 18:43
  Andrew Dunkley: No, it's The evidence is starting to build
• 18:46
  up. I do believe that we will
• 18:49
  find something in our own solar system in
• 18:52
  the not too distant future. That's
• 18:55
  my theory anyway.
• 18:57
  Professor Fred Watson: I hope you're right because I'd like.
• 18:59
  Andrew Dunkley: To know, and in
• 19:02
  answer to the initial question, why are we
• 19:04
  so obsessed with life? because
• 19:07
  we are living creatures and we want to know
• 19:10
  if there are any others beyond our planet. I
• 19:12
  mean it's, it's a natural thing to consider.
• 19:15
  And wouldn't it be great if we found it? It
• 19:17
  would be the, the probably the biggest
• 19:21
  discovery in the history. History of
• 19:23
  humanity.
• 19:24
  Professor Fred Watson: Yes, exactly.
• 19:25
  Andrew Dunkley: Even if it's a flea
• 19:28
  or krill, I'm still hanging.
• 19:33
  Yes, there's krill, there's whales.
• 19:36
  Professor Fred Watson: Yes.
• 19:38
  Andrew Dunkley: Thanks Mikey.
• 19:39
  Good to hear from you. And our next question
• 19:41
  comes from Fritz, who's put
• 19:45
  this one.
• 19:45
  Paddy: Hi, space nuts. This is Fritz from
• 19:49
  Northeast, rural Georgia.
• 19:52
  My question is for
• 19:54
  planetary scientists and Mars
• 19:57
  and water on the surface. Why
• 20:00
  aren't they discussing further the
• 20:03
  Milankovitch cycles and the influence
• 20:06
  on Mars having wetter, warmer
• 20:09
  phases? This is part of the
• 20:13
  obliquity the axle tilt which can
• 20:15
  range between 10 to
• 20:18
  66.0degrees
• 20:22
  over a range of 120,000
• 20:25
  years up to a longer modulation
• 20:28
  of as much as 1.25 million
• 20:31
  years. And even at 40%
• 20:34
  it could trigger significant ice
• 20:37
  redistribution or melting.
• 20:40
  And this could change
• 20:43
  what's a cold dry period to a surface
• 20:46
  of flowing water at times and
• 20:49
  a wetter period at times.
• 20:51
  And this happens regularly and Mars will
• 20:54
  have a wet and warm period
• 20:57
  again. So I'm surprised
• 21:00
  planetary scientists don't discuss this when
• 21:02
  they talk about the loss of water. But water
• 21:04
  is there in the permafrost and
• 21:07
  such and where did it all go and everything.
• 21:10
  But it's not discussed how it will return.
• 21:12
  Thanks a lot and love the show.
• 21:15
  Can't wait to hear more.
• 21:17
  Andrew Dunkley: Thank you.
• 21:17
  Andrew Dunkley: Fritz, you kind of touched on that when you
• 21:19
  were talking about Mikey's question
• 21:22
  and how Venus is probably a write off but
• 21:25
  Mars will actually get back to a state of
• 21:28
  having liquid water.
• 21:30
  what's the Malinkov cycle?
• 21:34
  Professor Fred Watson: actually the Milankovitch
• 21:37
  is yes the name of the person
• 21:41
  who put the idea on the map that
• 21:45
  various periodicities and they're to do
• 21:48
  with the eccentricity or
• 21:51
  non circularity of an orbit, the
• 21:54
  incline of the you know, the axis in the
• 21:56
  orbit, and other parameters like
• 21:59
  that, these things vary in cycles.
• 22:02
  Mars has had exactly as Fritz says,
• 22:06
  a really big range in its axial tilt,
• 22:08
  10 to 60 degrees is what he quoted. And I
• 22:11
  think that's about right. we think the reason
• 22:13
  why that hasn't happened on Earth is because
• 22:15
  the moon actually stabilises the Earth's
• 22:17
  rotation. So it's the tilt of its axis has
• 22:20
  remained much much closer to its present
• 22:23
  23 and a half degrees. but
• 22:26
  the answer to Fritz's question is that
• 22:29
  actually planetary scientists do look at this
• 22:32
  and you don't have to look that far to find
• 22:34
  papers that refer to
• 22:37
  these M. Milankovitch cycles.
• 22:40
  in terms of Mars climate. I found a nice
• 22:43
  one by some Swiss authors published in
• 22:46
  2019. this is
• 22:49
  called time scales of the climate record in
• 22:52
  the south polar ice cap of Mars. And it's
• 22:54
  basically linking the
• 22:57
  ice layer deposits
• 23:01
  basically in the south polar ice cap of Mars,
• 23:03
  the largest water ice reservoirs on Mars as
• 23:06
  they say in the abstract of their paper, and
• 23:09
  linking them to climate oscillations, the
• 23:11
  Milankovitch cycles of Mars's orbit.
• 23:14
  and so that's quite an interesting paper.
• 23:16
  As I said I don't Know whether I mentioned
• 23:18
  published in 2019 in Geophysical
• 23:21
  Research Letters. and there are other papers
• 23:23
  too that talk about the climatic effect
• 23:26
  of these orbital cycles. So it's not
• 23:29
  something that's being ignored by planetary
• 23:31
  scientists. I think the view that they've
• 23:33
  come to though is that they're
• 23:36
  giving you relatively modest changes in
• 23:39
  climate. the fact that the
• 23:41
  solar parameters will themselves change over
• 23:44
  time, as we were discussing in Mikey's
• 23:47
  question, that means that even without those
• 23:50
  you might find that Mars is warming up enough
• 23:52
  that perhaps we will see a warm wet planet
• 23:54
  one day, but we won't be around to see it
• 23:56
  here on planet Earth because we'll be gone by
• 23:58
  then.
• 23:58
  Andrew Dunkley: Yeah, however, as you said
• 24:01
  with Mikey's question, that water will
• 24:04
  probably.
• 24:04
  Professor Fred Watson: Get, it depends what, yeah, what the,
• 24:07
  what the circumstances are. But yeah, check
• 24:10
  out Mars and Milankovitch cycles and there's
• 24:13
  quite a few papers that refer to it.
• 24:15
  Andrew Dunkley: Very good, thank you Fritz. Great question
• 24:17
  though. Love those curveballs. That's ah,
• 24:20
  a rip up.
• 24:22
  Andrew Dunkley: Let's take a little break from the show to
• 24:24
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• 27:39
  Now back to the show.
• 27:41
  Andrew Dunkley: Okay, we checked all four systems and being
• 27:44
  with a go Space Nuts, one final
• 27:47
  thought and this one comes from
• 27:50
  Paddy. He said hi Andrew and Fred Watson. I
• 27:53
  have a premise for a book for Andrew. your
• 27:56
  discussion on Martian water provoked the
• 27:58
  thought what if humans are on Mars,
• 28:01
  drink unfiltered water and ingest a
• 28:03
  Martian microbe that merges with human
• 28:06
  cells like mitochondria did,
• 28:09
  resulting in whatever you wish to
• 28:12
  knew the story with. I hope you
• 28:15
  like the idea. Cheers from Patty. I do like
• 28:18
  the idea. Funny, funny you should bring that
• 28:20
  up Patty because this is my last show
• 28:23
  for a few months. Judy and I and
• 28:26
  going around the world basically and we're
• 28:28
  going to take our time. and Judy
• 28:31
  said, you know, I don't want you to get
• 28:33
  bored. Why, why don't you write a book while
• 28:35
  you're away. And I was trying to come up with
• 28:37
  concepts. I was thinking about
• 28:40
  maybe, you know, a story
• 28:43
  revolving around Earth building its own
• 28:45
  Dyson Sphere or some kind of megastructure.
• 28:49
  But, now you've given me something else to
• 28:51
  think about. So might. Might
• 28:53
  go down that road. Although it's kind of been
• 28:56
  done before. There was a movie many, many
• 28:59
  years ago about a, meteorite
• 29:01
  that hit Earth and it had some
• 29:04
  kind of viral thing in it that.
• 29:07
  That was basically killing people. And the
• 29:09
  whole story centred around a bunch of
• 29:11
  scientists that were basically in
• 29:14
  lockdown in some facility in the middle of
• 29:16
  the desert trying to figure out how to stop
• 29:18
  it. I can't remember what it was called, but
• 29:20
  it's a great film. Fabulous film.
• 29:23
  scared the bajeebis out of me. It
• 29:26
  was. It wasn't the Blob or anything like
• 29:28
  that. This was just a micro. But it had, It.
• 29:30
  It just was highly volatile and,
• 29:33
  and very destructive and. Yeah,
• 29:36
  but look, definitely food
• 29:39
  for thought, Patti. I'll. I'll give it some
• 29:41
  consideration and wonder how I can
• 29:44
  actually merge that with a Dyson spear angle.
• 29:47
  Professor Fred Watson: Sure you'll manage it, Andrew. I look forward
• 29:49
  to hearing about it. when you come back in
• 29:51
  August, we'll probably get a full
• 29:54
  rundown of what the plot is. Yes.
• 29:57
  Andrew Dunkley: a few people have contacted me saying, oh,
• 30:00
  when are you in New York? I might. And things
• 30:02
  like that.
• 30:02
  Professor Fred Watson: So cool.
• 30:04
  Andrew Dunkley: We might be able to track a few people down
• 30:06
  and have a chat. But look, what I'm going to
• 30:08
  try and do during the trip is do
• 30:11
  some monologues back into the show so I can
• 30:14
  give you updates of, of what we're doing. So
• 30:16
  if anyone's interested. If you're not, I'll
• 30:18
  just stay out of it.
• 30:20
  Professor Fred Watson: I think that would be great. I think you
• 30:21
  should, do that. It will, be something that
• 30:24
  Heidi and I can fit into the, into the scheme
• 30:27
  of things, I hope. And, and enjoy it very
• 30:29
  much. So we look forward to that every
• 30:31
  week.
• 30:32
  Andrew Dunkley: But, there's some really interesting
• 30:34
  places. So, there might be something to talk
• 30:36
  about. we'll see. It looks like every
• 30:39
  time we go somewhere there's a volcano, it
• 30:41
  erupts.
• 30:42
  Professor Fred Watson: So.
• 30:44
  Andrew Dunkley: Might be able to. That, we'll see how it
• 30:47
  goes. but yeah, we've been planning this trip
• 30:49
  for a long, long time and yeah, we, we head
• 30:51
  off next week.
• 30:52
  Andrew Dunkley: So.
• 30:53
  Andrew Dunkley: Very exciting, very exciting.
• 30:56
  and that brings us to the end. Thanks to
• 30:58
  everybody who contributed. Keep the questions
• 31:00
  coming because Heidi will need them to try
• 31:02
  and stump Fred Watson. which is very, very
• 31:05
  hard to do. but yes,
• 31:08
  just go to our website and send them via the
• 31:10
  AMA tab. So there's two
• 31:13
  URLs Space Nuts IO or
• 31:16
  Space Nuts podcast.com
• 31:19
  and keep those, keep those messages coming
• 31:21
  in. and Heidi and Fred Watson will
• 31:24
  tackle them over the next few months. Gosh,
• 31:26
  it's hard to believe it'll be that long. But,
• 31:28
  yeah, I've never been away from home for that
• 31:30
  long in my life. But you
• 31:33
  know, it'll be exciting. And thank you as
• 31:36
  always, Fred Watson. Thank you very much as
• 31:38
  always.
• 31:38
  Professor Fred Watson: A pleasure, Andrew. And yeah, have a great
• 31:41
  trip. We hope everything goes well for you.
• 31:44
  I look forward to seeing your emails from
• 31:46
  time to time. Find out what's happening. I'd
• 31:48
  be interested to know whether you'll be
• 31:49
  homeless when you get back.
• 31:52
  Andrew Dunkley: It's a distinct possibility. We put an ass on
• 31:54
  the market and just deal with all that when
• 31:56
  we get home.
• 31:58
  Professor Fred Watson: There you go. Nice, good, good, good stuff.
• 32:00
  And so have a great time, both you and Judy.
• 32:03
  And we'll speak again in August.
• 32:05
  Andrew Dunkley: Indeed. Thank you, Fred Watson. Thanks as
• 32:07
  always been, it's been terrific.
• 32:09
  And thanks, to Huw in the studio who
• 32:11
  couldn't be with us today. Tried to ride a,
• 32:14
  Milankovich cycle and the chain fell off.
• 32:18
  And from me, Andrew Dunkley. Thanks for your
• 32:20
  company. See you in a few months.
• 32:21
  Professor Fred Watson: Bye.
• 32:22
  Andrew Dunkley: Bye.
• 32:23
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• 32:25
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