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5 Tigers who are likely to return in 2027 · Tiger Territory: A Detroit Tigers Podcast

• 0:09
  Speaker 1: And welcome in to another episode of Tiger Territory, part
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: of the Foul Territory Network, Troy Tiger's podcast. I'm Kieran Steckley.
• 0:16
  Speaker 1: With me, as always, is a man who is eight
• 0:18
  Speaker 1: times the fun of the average person when he goes
• 0:21
  Speaker 1: to Oktoberfest. He is Cody Stavenhagen. How are we doing?
• 0:25
  Speaker 2: I'm doing good, Kieran. How are you?
• 0:28
  Speaker 1: I am doing excellent. You know, we talked recently about
• 0:31
  Speaker 1: enjoying the playoffs, and we had a couple games last
• 0:34
  Speaker 1: night that were... I enjoyed. They were fun to watch.
• 0:38
  Speaker 1: Competitive games, you can kind of feel the excitement. And
• 0:41
  Speaker 1: it got me thinking, like, you know, our last episode,
• 0:44
  Speaker 1: we talked about guys that, you know, we don't necessarily
• 0:48
  Speaker 1: think or at least kind of make sense that the
• 0:50
  Speaker 1: Tigers move off of them. So if you guys want
• 0:52
  Speaker 1: to listen to the full context of that conversation, you
• 0:54
  Speaker 1: can go listen to our previous episode. I'll recap them
• 0:57
  Speaker 1: right here. Kenley Jansen, Matt Bierling, Jace Young, Bo Briske,
• 1:01
  Speaker 1: and Kerry Carpenter was the one that we Had some
• 1:04
  Speaker 1: soft disagreement on. But I do think it was a
• 1:08
  Speaker 1: fun discussion about Kerry Carpenter. So, yeah. So, this episode
• 1:12
  Speaker 1: is going to be focused on guys that you want
• 1:16
  Speaker 1: to say must return, kind of need to return, likely
• 1:19
  Speaker 1: to return. Like, it's kind of however you want to
• 1:22
  Speaker 1: interpret it.
• 1:22
  Speaker 2: Friends, guys, who we kind of think are coming back.
• 1:24
  Speaker 2: I think that's how I would describe it.
• 1:27
  Speaker 1: Yeah. And so, like. While watching the playoffs, as I
• 1:31
  Speaker 1: mentioned in the previous episode, you're trying to figure out
• 1:34
  Speaker 1: where the game is going. And is this a one-off?
• 1:37
  Speaker 1: Is this sort of like the way that winning baseball
• 1:40
  Speaker 1: is now and all that stuff? And then kind of
• 1:43
  Speaker 1: focus it in on the Tigers. And on that note, Cody,
• 1:49
  Speaker 1: my first guy that I have on here as a,
• 1:54
  Speaker 1: you know, got to bring back, Zach McKinstry. Mm-hmm. Zach
• 1:59
  Speaker 1: McKinstry is somebody that... Look, I am a big believer in...
• 2:04
  Speaker 1: I'll just kind of explain my process for everybody here. Obviously,
• 2:08
  Speaker 1: I watch the games. I read everything I can. Look
• 2:11
  Speaker 1: at the numbers on a day-to-day basis. And then when
• 2:14
  Speaker 1: I kind of want to form a more overarching opinion,
• 2:19
  Speaker 1: I start looking to see if the stats back up
• 2:23
  Speaker 1: what I'm thinking in the moment. And so I say
• 2:28
  Speaker 1: that to say... that I anticipated for much of the season,
• 2:32
  Speaker 1: this conversation about Zach McKinstry being in the previous episode,
• 2:35
  Speaker 1: because he is somebody who is getting up there in
• 2:38
  Speaker 1: age because he is somebody who is in an ideal scenario,
• 2:44
  Speaker 1: not an everyday, like, you know, player in the same
• 2:47
  Speaker 1: way of like a Riley green or, you know, like
• 2:50
  Speaker 1: a Kevin McGonigal, Dylan Dingler, like those kinds of guys.
• 2:54
  Speaker 1: But then I go and I look at the numbers
• 2:56
  Speaker 1: and then I think of like, what I, you know,
• 2:58
  Speaker 1: what I saw over the course of the season, I'm like,
• 3:02
  Speaker 1: I think you kind of need to have a Zach
• 3:04
  Speaker 1: McKinstry on your team. And I think a Zach McKinstry
• 3:08
  Speaker 1: would help every single team in the playoffs this season.
• 3:12
  Speaker 1: And even the, you know, the final four teams that
• 3:14
  Speaker 1: we have now, I just think somebody with that versatility,
• 3:18
  Speaker 1: with that athleticism speed, and I would say even surprising
• 3:24
  Speaker 1: defensive ability and right field at times this year, uh,
• 3:27
  Speaker 1: you could do a lot worse than having a Zach
• 3:30
  Speaker 1: McKinstry on your roster. So I went even looked at
• 3:33
  Speaker 1: it a little bit further, like his splits, because again,
• 3:35
  Speaker 1: there were times where I was like, you just can't
• 3:37
  Speaker 1: do this again, man. We've been doing this for years.
• 3:39
  Speaker 1: I don't know, man. Like in June, you hit two 43,
• 3:45
  Speaker 1: July two 40 and August hit two 40. And September
• 3:52
  Speaker 1: wasn't great, but obviously things changed once the calendar turned
• 3:55
  Speaker 1: to September, and then he started off really slow. He
• 3:57
  Speaker 1: was bad offensively in May. Who else was bad offensively
• 4:01
  Speaker 1: in May? Literally the entire team. So it's not a mulligan,
• 4:06
  Speaker 1: but it is some context there. So I think Zach
• 4:09
  Speaker 1: McKinstry is a winning player. I think he's demonstrated that,
• 4:12
  Speaker 1: and I think this is somebody that is a great
• 4:17
  Speaker 1: tool in the tool case that A.J. Hinch can utilize.
• 4:21
  Speaker 1: And I would also add that, similar to what I
• 4:24
  Speaker 1: talked about last time, about not kind of being beholden
• 4:29
  Speaker 1: to a not long but not short playoff run, like
• 4:36
  Speaker 1: in terms of some of these guys, Zabrick History is
• 4:39
  Speaker 1: now a year removed from being an all-star. So we
• 4:41
  Speaker 1: don't have to have, like, all-star type, expectations, I guess,
• 4:46
  Speaker 1: if you would, and you can kind of treat him
• 4:48
  Speaker 1: like exactly that McKinstry player that we know he is
• 4:52
  Speaker 1: and not really have any misgivings there. So I thought
• 4:57
  Speaker 1: I was going to side on the Zach McKinstry. It's
• 4:59
  Speaker 1: time to move on. I'm now on it. It's not
• 5:03
  Speaker 1: time to move on. It's time to continue forward with
• 5:05
  Speaker 1: Zach McKinstry.
• 5:07
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I can see why you wavered. I think for me,
• 5:10
  Speaker 2: McKinstry is probably the single player I struggle with the
• 5:14
  Speaker 2: most in terms of what to do with him. Scott
• 5:18
  Speaker 2: Harris had cited WRC Plus at his press conference. Let's
• 5:21
  Speaker 2: read the WRC Plus of Zach McKinstry with the Tigers
• 5:26
  Speaker 2: by year.
• 5:27
  Speaker 1: 2023, 81.
• 5:27
  Speaker 2: 2024, 73.
• 5:27
  Speaker 1: 2025, 113.
• 5:27
  Speaker 2: 2026, 65. Three out of four years, he has not
• 5:28
  Speaker 2: just been below average, he has been a well below
• 5:32
  Speaker 2: average hitter And I think one of the big things
• 5:46
  Speaker 2: is you've got to improve this offense. You can't continue.
• 5:48
  Speaker 2: I don't care what your WRC plus is. You can't
• 5:50
  Speaker 2: continue to finish in the middle of the pack range offensively.
• 5:55
  Speaker 2: You need to have a top 10 run scoring offense.
• 5:57
  Speaker 2: And one way to do that would be to get
• 5:58
  Speaker 2: rid of a guy who generally is a well below
• 6:01
  Speaker 2: average hitter. But then I kind of come back to
• 6:04
  Speaker 2: some of the things you were just saying. If you
• 6:07
  Speaker 2: get rid of Zach McKinstry, you're probably looking to replace
• 6:10
  Speaker 2: him with a left-handed bat, who can play multiple positions,
• 6:15
  Speaker 2: be athletic. You're kind of looking for another Zach McKinstry.
• 6:19
  Speaker 2: You're kind of looking for someone who can be the
• 6:21
  Speaker 2: 2025 Zach McKinstry, and I don't know where else you
• 6:25
  Speaker 2: are necessarily finding that. In some ways, he can still
• 6:29
  Speaker 2: be an answer to so many problems that arise in
• 6:32
  Speaker 2: the course of a game or throughout the course of
• 6:34
  Speaker 2: a season. I think what he did defensively in right
• 6:36
  Speaker 2: field certainly opened some eyes. And I think that's one
• 6:40
  Speaker 2: of the big questions. Like the two positions, I'll say
• 6:42
  Speaker 2: it again, that I have circled are shortstop and right field.
• 6:45
  Speaker 2: What are the Tigers doing there? I don't know. I
• 6:48
  Speaker 2: think those are the two big question marks. There's a
• 6:50
  Speaker 2: world where they could just run a right field of Malgeri, McKinstry, Carpenter,
• 6:56
  Speaker 2: and hope one of McKinstry and Carey kind of bounces
• 7:01
  Speaker 2: back to their previous levels of play. I mean, I
• 7:06
  Speaker 2: think 2025 was kind of an outlier for McKinstry. I
• 7:09
  Speaker 2: don't really expect him to hit quite that well again,
• 7:11
  Speaker 2: but it is interesting to look at him metrically. There's
• 7:15
  Speaker 2: still some things he does well. I do think he
• 7:17
  Speaker 2: was hurt a good chunk of this year. If you
• 7:19
  Speaker 2: guys remember his collisions with Jack Caglione, and he just
• 7:24
  Speaker 2: wasn't quite the same for a while after that, but
• 7:28
  Speaker 2: often still puts up a pretty good at-bat. Now, he
• 7:30
  Speaker 2: doesn't really hit the ball hard, but a pretty good
• 7:32
  Speaker 2: launch angle sweet spot. You can see the fielding, that
• 7:37
  Speaker 2: the running is still overall pretty good. Then you look
• 7:40
  Speaker 2: at the service stats, like, well, he hit 199 with
• 7:43
  Speaker 2: four homers. That's just not going to cut it. He
• 7:45
  Speaker 2: can't hit 199 with four homers again, Karen. We've got
• 7:48
  Speaker 2: to be done with that. But until I see a
• 7:51
  Speaker 2: better solution, I actually think I would not be surprised
• 7:56
  Speaker 2: if the Tigers bring back Zach McKinstry. You know what
• 8:00
  Speaker 2: I actually think? I'm not sure. I think I go
• 8:02
  Speaker 2: back and forth. By the day, by the hour. If
• 8:07
  Speaker 2: I had to pick what Scott Harrison and the Tigers
• 8:09
  Speaker 2: will do right now, I'd lean toward they're going to
• 8:11
  Speaker 2: bring this guy back.
• 8:15
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and I think if you, you know, the sprint
• 8:20
  Speaker 1: speed is unimpressive. You guys were looking at the, for
• 8:23
  Speaker 1: what we think of Zach McKinstry, it was unimpressive, 62 percentile.
• 8:26
  Speaker 1: He was hurt, as you mentioned. And if the range
• 8:29
  Speaker 1: is in the 93 percentile fielding, I think the sprint
• 8:32
  Speaker 1: speed will probably bump up. Obviously, I know it's not
• 8:35
  Speaker 1: pure speed, but obviously that's part of it. And again,
• 8:38
  Speaker 1: if you're going to do this more athletic contact thing
• 8:42
  Speaker 1: next season, he's somebody that could potentially help. And I
• 8:46
  Speaker 1: do think that part of this exercise is bringing these
• 8:53
  Speaker 1: guys in, figuring out where everybody fits, and if it
• 8:56
  Speaker 1: doesn't work, that's okay. You know what I mean? Again,
• 9:00
  Speaker 1: this is not necessarily a beholden thing, but it's like,
• 9:03
  Speaker 1: what do you know and where can you go type exercise.
• 9:07
  Speaker 1: And I think McKinstry fits that very well. And again,
• 9:10
  Speaker 1: I think he's a guy that could play on any
• 9:12
  Speaker 1: postseason team, which, speaking of postseason, Cody, I've never been
• 9:16
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• 9:17
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• 9:20
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• 9:22
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• 9:48
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• 10:26
  Speaker 1: coming back here, Cody, I think number two on my
• 10:31
  Speaker 1: list here is somebody that, look, I get it. I
• 10:37
  Speaker 1: get the frustration. I still think there's enough there to
• 10:41
  Speaker 1: justify the spot, and I will kind of put my
• 10:45
  Speaker 1: heels in there until I have reason to change, and
• 10:49
  Speaker 1: that is Spencer Torkelson. Spencer Torkelson is not a perfect player.
• 10:56
  Speaker 1: You could say overall he is a disappointment given his
• 10:59
  Speaker 1: 1-1 status. You know what he's not? He's not a
• 11:03
  Speaker 1: bad player. You know what he is? He is a
• 11:05
  Speaker 1: power threat. Think about how much Spencer Torkelson has struggled
• 11:10
  Speaker 1: at times this season. And you look at the end,
• 11:12
  Speaker 1: it's 2-30, it's 26 home runs. It's a 766 OPS.
• 11:20
  Speaker 1: There's a lot you can manage with that being in
• 11:22
  Speaker 1: your lineup every day, and the defense metrics do not
• 11:26
  Speaker 1: like him. I do believe that is partially the Tigers
• 11:30
  Speaker 1: fielding MO in terms of what he is coached to do,
• 11:34
  Speaker 1: allowed to do, whatever you want to say. Obviously, the
• 11:39
  Speaker 1: scoopage stuff is his trademark, but To me, Cody, like,
• 11:44
  Speaker 1: you go searching for answers for every single position, like,
• 11:48
  Speaker 1: you're going to end up having a really long offseason
• 11:50
  Speaker 1: and then going to be like, ah, I kind of
• 11:53
  Speaker 1: wish we had someone that was 230 and almost, you know,
• 11:58
  Speaker 1: a damn good chance of having a 30 home run season.
• 12:02
  Speaker 1: Sounds kind of nice. So I think Spencer Torkelson fits
• 12:05
  Speaker 1: on this list despite, you know, kind of the evidence
• 12:08
  Speaker 1: we have of what can be a frustrating watch over
• 12:11
  Speaker 1: the course of 162.
• 12:14
  Speaker 2: It's kind of amazing because there were certainly times this
• 12:17
  Speaker 2: year where it began to feel like, wow, you know,
• 12:20
  Speaker 2: maybe this is actually the end of the Twork era.
• 12:24
  Speaker 2: But now here we are, we're at the end of
• 12:26
  Speaker 2: the season. I do think it's worth mentioning that, you know,
• 12:30
  Speaker 2: of course he had a crazy September to kind of
• 12:33
  Speaker 2: boost that end of year OPS and some other things
• 12:38
  Speaker 2: of that nature. I mean, he had more than a
• 12:39
  Speaker 2: thousand OPS in September. which I don't know. Evaluating September
• 12:44
  Speaker 2: is always hard, even though there's not the roster expansion
• 12:47
  Speaker 2: there once was. You see teams getting younger guys' experience,
• 12:51
  Speaker 2: managing their pitching staff different ways. It's not always the
• 12:54
  Speaker 2: best evaluation environment, but I do think you can look
• 12:58
  Speaker 2: at TORQ's career numbers and see mostly consistent offensive performance.
• 13:04
  Speaker 2: It's not necessarily great, but it's not the worst thing
• 13:08
  Speaker 2: ever either, um, I'll take a 766 OPS. I wish
• 13:13
  Speaker 2: he would get there in a little bit less of
• 13:15
  Speaker 2: a feast or famine way, but that's just not the
• 13:18
  Speaker 2: player he has realistically been. I come back to the
• 13:22
  Speaker 2: McKinstry thing. Like, I don't know how many guys, like,
• 13:26
  Speaker 2: like where are you going? There, there are plenty of
• 13:28
  Speaker 2: power hitting first baseman out there, but where can you
• 13:31
  Speaker 2: confidently say you're going to go do better? Especially if
• 13:35
  Speaker 2: you're talking outside the organization and, I don't know that
• 13:38
  Speaker 2: I really see it, and I'm not trying to give
• 13:40
  Speaker 2: a big contract to a first baseman in their 30s
• 13:43
  Speaker 2: or anything like that. There are only seven first basemen
• 13:45
  Speaker 2: in the game who hit more home runs than Spencer
• 13:49
  Speaker 2: Torkelson last season. Those were Matt Olson, Pete Alonzo, Munutaka Murakami.
• 13:54
  Speaker 2: This has Luis Garcia as a first baseman, Christian Walker,
• 13:57
  Speaker 2: and Jake Berger. Yeah, I don't know.
• 14:04
  Speaker 1: I think.
• 14:05
  Speaker 2: Things are certainly coming to a head. I think next
• 14:07
  Speaker 2: year you're going to have Josue Briseño knocking at the door.
• 14:11
  Speaker 2: The Tigers will see how they end up using Colt Keith,
• 14:14
  Speaker 2: but he may see more time at first base. Twerk,
• 14:16
  Speaker 2: I think, is going to have to come to camp, compete,
• 14:20
  Speaker 2: win a spot, justify his roster spot through his performance.
• 14:24
  Speaker 2: But I do not think the Tigers are going to
• 14:25
  Speaker 2: non-tender him. I think you can actually live with a
• 14:28
  Speaker 2: 760-25 homer OPS guy The other important thing is I
• 14:33
  Speaker 2: think we've all kind of come to realize Torque can't
• 14:36
  Speaker 2: carry the order. And if you notice, he was hitting
• 14:39
  Speaker 2: in the bottom half of the order really for a
• 14:42
  Speaker 2: good portion of this season. Maybe that's now where he fits.
• 14:45
  Speaker 2: But if you took away the number one overall tag
• 14:48
  Speaker 2: and he was just a guy, and you said, hey,
• 14:49
  Speaker 2: the Tigers, they have a first baseman, kind of strikes
• 14:51
  Speaker 2: out too much, goes through some slumps, but he can
• 14:54
  Speaker 2: hit you at 25 to 30 homers. Metrics hate him,
• 14:57
  Speaker 2: but eye test, he's solid defensively. It's a strange player.
• 15:02
  Speaker 2: The conversation never gets easier, but I fully expect Spencer
• 15:07
  Speaker 2: Torkelson to show up to spring training as a Detroit Tiger,
• 15:10
  Speaker 2: unless maybe there's some sort of trade that we're just
• 15:12
  Speaker 2: not able to foresee right now. But again, I don't
• 15:15
  Speaker 2: think other teams are clamoring to have Spencer Torkelson for
• 15:19
  Speaker 2: because they see the same cons that we do.
• 15:24
  Speaker 1: Yeah, look, there's no mystery about Spencer. That's part of it.
• 15:28
  Speaker 1: And also, I would I would add this. This is
• 15:34
  Speaker 1: not somebody who has been babied by the organization. This
• 15:39
  Speaker 1: is not somebody who has been given a free pass
• 15:42
  Speaker 1: through his struggles. I mean, it was a couple of
• 15:43
  Speaker 1: years ago that they literally signed a second baseman essentially
• 15:47
  Speaker 1: to replace him. Right. And then they, and then he
• 15:50
  Speaker 1: earned himself his, his job back. Essentially. He's been demoted
• 15:54
  Speaker 1: multiple times when he's gone through extended slumps. Like I don't,
• 16:00
  Speaker 1: I don't think this, like the Tigers aren't just going
• 16:04
  Speaker 1: to like give him a spot. Like you said, he's
• 16:06
  Speaker 1: going to compete. Like, I don't think Valencia being at
• 16:09
  Speaker 1: first base is, is a more advantageous than him being
• 16:12
  Speaker 1: the backup catcher. Colt Keith still is not like the
• 16:16
  Speaker 1: comfort level that I like at first base. And it's
• 16:19
  Speaker 1: in like, you know, other guys have gotten opportunities, but
• 16:23
  Speaker 1: says Spencer, as much as people like to ding him
• 16:26
  Speaker 1: usually ends up on top of that. And again, This
• 16:29
  Speaker 1: might have an expiration date. Brasenio comes up. You have
• 16:32
  Speaker 1: to put him in the lineup. He's a star. Who knows?
• 16:34
  Speaker 1: But that's like two or three steps from now. This
• 16:38
  Speaker 1: is right now, and I think you've got to bring
• 16:40
  Speaker 1: Spencer Torkelson back.
• 16:42
  Speaker 2: Yeah, the only real other option I see is just say, hey,
• 16:46
  Speaker 2: we're going to move on from Tork. Colt Keith is
• 16:48
  Speaker 2: going to play first base every day. I wouldn't necessarily
• 16:51
  Speaker 2: hate the idea of investing in Colt Keith and giving
• 16:54
  Speaker 2: him runway and just picking a position and letting him
• 16:57
  Speaker 2: play there. Colt Keith, as much as I'm still kind
• 17:00
  Speaker 2: of a believer in his bat, he's never posted a
• 17:02
  Speaker 2: 766 OPS in the major leagues. Like he just hasn't
• 17:06
  Speaker 2: done it. He's never hit 20 homers in the major leagues.
• 17:08
  Speaker 2: He just hasn't done it. I don't know how he
• 17:10
  Speaker 2: would grade out with more time at first base metrically,
• 17:13
  Speaker 2: but I actually prefer Spencer Torkelson's eye test defense to
• 17:16
  Speaker 2: Colt Keith's eye test defense at first base. So again,
• 17:22
  Speaker 2: I don't see the way the Tigers have operated. I
• 17:24
  Speaker 2: don't see them just drawing a line through Tork's name
• 17:28
  Speaker 2: and November and being like, yeah, we're done with this guy.
• 17:30
  Speaker 2: Just doesn't seem to make a ton of sense. All right.
• 17:34
  Speaker 1: Well on that accord, you know, we've mentioned it him
• 17:38
  Speaker 1: a couple of times here. I Colt Keith obviously is
• 17:40
  Speaker 1: under contract for another, what, six years or whatever. Uh,
• 17:45
  Speaker 1: but you know, there's options in there and all that stuff.
• 17:48
  Speaker 1: Colt Keith is someone who, because of his contract, like,
• 17:52
  Speaker 1: you know, getting the extension before he ever played in
• 17:54
  Speaker 1: the major leagues and, uh, and being someone who just
• 17:58
  Speaker 1: looks like a masher at the plate. And look, it's
• 18:01
  Speaker 1: not like he doesn't hit, but he doesn't hit like
• 18:04
  Speaker 1: you think he can. And now he's kind of coming into,
• 18:08
  Speaker 1: in theory, he should be coming into his kind of
• 18:10
  Speaker 1: grown man body, even though he kind of always looks
• 18:13
  Speaker 1: like he's got a grown man body, at least since
• 18:15
  Speaker 1: he's been in the major leagues. Maybe some of that
• 18:18
  Speaker 1: power comes. He hasn't been able to find a true
• 18:21
  Speaker 1: home defensively, as we've mentioned. I put him on my list, Cody,
• 18:27
  Speaker 1: not obviously because he is in danger of being non-tendered,
• 18:30
  Speaker 1: but he's constantly thrown into trays and people want to
• 18:36
  Speaker 1: ding him, and I still believe in the runway of
• 18:39
  Speaker 1: Colt Keith, even if it's not necessarily with a true position,
• 18:44
  Speaker 1: but just like the general Colt Keith runway, I'm still
• 18:46
  Speaker 1: all aboard that path for him because I believe the
• 18:51
  Speaker 1: talent is there, and I still think this contract, as
• 18:54
  Speaker 1: much as people might poo-poo the fact that the years
• 18:57
  Speaker 1: of the extension, it's essentially free. If you look at
• 19:01
  Speaker 1: the war to dollar ratio. It's not like he's overpaid
• 19:07
  Speaker 1: or anything like that. At a bare minimum, you're getting
• 19:13
  Speaker 1: market value for the production with Colt Keith. with the
• 19:17
  Speaker 1: possibility of getting more. So I just wanted to kind
• 19:19
  Speaker 1: of put him on the list for those reasons.
• 19:21
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and I've always been pretty clear. I don't think
• 19:24
  Speaker 2: Scott Harris is trading a guy like that, that arguably
• 19:28
  Speaker 2: if he has a breakout year could suddenly have incredible
• 19:31
  Speaker 2: surplus value. I think the question is just making the
• 19:34
  Speaker 2: puzzle work because it seems pretty clear the Tigers don't
• 19:38
  Speaker 2: want to play Kevin McGonigal at shortstop every day. So
• 19:42
  Speaker 2: let's operate under the assumption McGonigal's going to play mostly third. Well,
• 19:46
  Speaker 2: Cole Keith ain't playing third then. And if they keep Tork,
• 19:49
  Speaker 2: then Cole Keith ain't playing first. And I guess he
• 19:52
  Speaker 2: could go back to playing second. He's already a few
• 19:56
  Speaker 2: years older than he was the last time he played there.
• 20:00
  Speaker 2: If you put Colt Keith at second, I don't know
• 20:02
  Speaker 2: where you're getting the right-handed bat to help replace the
• 20:05
  Speaker 2: production of Gleyber Torres. I think he kind of got
• 20:07
  Speaker 2: to bring in a right-handed bat at one of shortstop
• 20:10
  Speaker 2: or second base. And it's like, well, he can DH some,
• 20:14
  Speaker 2: but we just talked about Kerry Carpenter. I think they're
• 20:16
  Speaker 2: going to keep him, and I think they would like
• 20:18
  Speaker 2: to not play him in right field as much. And
• 20:20
  Speaker 2: then Colt can bounce around and play some of all
• 20:23
  Speaker 2: of those positions, but it's not necessarily ideal. I guess
• 20:26
  Speaker 2: that's where the depth thing comes in, though, because let's
• 20:28
  Speaker 2: be real. Someone's going to get injured, and then a
• 20:30
  Speaker 2: lot more bad bats open up at one of those positions,
• 20:33
  Speaker 2: and that's frustrating as it is, and as much as
• 20:37
  Speaker 2: I think Colt Keith has probably got a little frustrated
• 20:39
  Speaker 2: with it, that's why they've kind of talked about keeping
• 20:41
  Speaker 2: that versatility with him. He can still answer a few
• 20:45
  Speaker 2: different questions. I think there's still some belief in that bat.
• 20:49
  Speaker 2: I do think of all these guys we're talking about,
• 20:52
  Speaker 2: he might have a little more trade interest than all
• 20:55
  Speaker 2: the others because he's young, because he's under contract, because
• 20:59
  Speaker 2: there's reason to think he could be a little more
• 21:02
  Speaker 2: than he has been at so far in the major leagues.
• 21:06
  Speaker 2: But I think it would take a pretty hefty return
• 21:09
  Speaker 2: for the Tigers to part with Colt Keith. And so
• 21:12
  Speaker 2: the thing I come back to going through these guys, again,
• 21:14
  Speaker 2: it's like, well, they're starting to look like the same
• 21:17
  Speaker 2: team again. And I don't know if that's great. I
• 21:21
  Speaker 2: don't know if that inspires me. But I actually wouldn't
• 21:23
  Speaker 2: be surprised if they run back a pretty dang similar
• 21:26
  Speaker 2: position core. I really wouldn't. Especially given the weak free
• 21:29
  Speaker 2: agent class. It's just going to be hard to find
• 21:31
  Speaker 2: better solutions. I think they're going to bank on better health.
• 21:34
  Speaker 2: I think they're going to bank on a couple of
• 21:36
  Speaker 2: these guys playing better than they did last year. I'd
• 21:41
  Speaker 2: love it if they could somehow be more creative and
• 21:44
  Speaker 2: make a couple moves and everyone comes into spring training
• 21:46
  Speaker 2: being excited. But I don't... They might actually take the
• 21:50
  Speaker 2: more pragmatic route and... do things pretty similarly and hope
• 21:54
  Speaker 2: for better results. And that's going to frustrate a lot
• 21:57
  Speaker 2: of people. That's kind of what I'm predicting. Maybe they
• 22:00
  Speaker 2: add one guy at either shortstop or right field that
• 22:03
  Speaker 2: I don't know that I'm expecting a ton other than that.
• 22:09
  Speaker 1: Well, on that note, Cody, what do we do with,
• 22:13
  Speaker 1: and I kind of grouped these guys together a little bit.
• 22:16
  Speaker 1: What do we do with the Wentzel Perez and Parker
• 22:18
  Speaker 1: Meadows like piece of this? Because again, those are, certainly
• 22:23
  Speaker 1: be two guys that would, you know, brought back and,
• 22:25
  Speaker 1: you know, team looking similar type places there. I think,
• 22:31
  Speaker 1: even though I did group them together, I think we
• 22:33
  Speaker 1: have a better idea of the Wentzel-Perez floor-to-ceiling. I think
• 22:39
  Speaker 1: we kind of understand Perez. Parker, it's still... I don't know, man. Like,
• 22:47
  Speaker 1: this could have been a really big year. I mean,
• 22:49
  Speaker 1: it was going to be a really big year for him, like,
• 22:52
  Speaker 1: in either way. But, like, before he had that freak
• 22:57
  Speaker 1: collision with Riley Green, that was a concussion. And, like, he, like,
• 23:00
  Speaker 1: bit his inner cheek and, like, obviously broke his forearm. Like,
• 23:05
  Speaker 1: you know, he was hitting 250. Like, again, we're not
• 23:07
  Speaker 1: going to overrate these numbers here. but this was somebody
• 23:10
  Speaker 1: that like, who knows, maybe this could have been like
• 23:12
  Speaker 1: the Parker Meadows, like true breakout. And it was interrupted
• 23:15
  Speaker 1: by a freak accident. I don't want to give up
• 23:20
  Speaker 1: on Parker Meadows, but I do think that there is a,
• 23:28
  Speaker 1: I do think like he, like Max Clark has earned
• 23:30
  Speaker 1: the right to be the center fielder moving forward. If
• 23:33
  Speaker 1: you want to have a real competition, we can have
• 23:35
  Speaker 1: a real competition, but like, Parker Meadows, I think, still
• 23:39
  Speaker 1: fits on this team, but it's not going to be
• 23:42
  Speaker 1: the same role that we've been accustomed to Parker Meadows
• 23:45
  Speaker 1: the past couple of years.
• 23:47
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it definitely seems like Max Clark is likely going
• 23:50
  Speaker 2: to be close to the everyday center fielder. I mean,
• 23:53
  Speaker 2: it is interesting to think about playing, pick one of
• 23:55
  Speaker 2: those guys and put them in right and just how
• 23:57
  Speaker 2: good your defensive outfield could be. That's fully contingent on
• 24:01
  Speaker 2: Parker Meadows hitting, which is, you know, he's he's done
• 24:06
  Speaker 2: at times in spurts, but he hasn't been able to
• 24:08
  Speaker 2: do consistently. I thought, you know, I asked Scott Harris
• 24:12
  Speaker 2: some question about basically the hard decisions to come. And
• 24:15
  Speaker 2: he kind of talked about guys who still have options
• 24:19
  Speaker 2: have an advantage. Like they want to keep those guys around.
• 24:22
  Speaker 2: They want to build depth. And that's one reason. I
• 24:25
  Speaker 2: think some of these guys aren't going anywhere other than
• 24:27
  Speaker 2: maybe AAA Toledo. I don't think Parker Meadows wants to
• 24:31
  Speaker 2: be in Toledo. I don't think Winslow Perez wants to
• 24:33
  Speaker 2: be in Toledo. Everyone would rather be in Detroit. But
• 24:35
  Speaker 2: there is a world where at least one of those
• 24:37
  Speaker 2: guys starts the season in AAA and could be some
• 24:39
  Speaker 2: pretty quality depth if you get there. There's also maybe
• 24:44
  Speaker 2: a roster construction where, hey, your fifth outfielder is Parker
• 24:48
  Speaker 2: Meadows and he happens to be a top-tier center fielder
• 24:51
  Speaker 2: and every now and then he can run into one
• 24:54
  Speaker 2: and catch a fastball and hit it out of the yard. Again,
• 24:58
  Speaker 2: a huge, huge year for Meadows, but not a guy that,
• 25:02
  Speaker 2: I would just get rid of for nothing. I guess
• 25:04
  Speaker 2: he could be a slightly intriguing, more than slightly intriguing,
• 25:08
  Speaker 2: the right team could maybe find him quite interesting in
• 25:11
  Speaker 2: a trade. Again, if we want to talk about what
• 25:13
  Speaker 2: other possibilities are there, if I were a team trading
• 25:17
  Speaker 2: with the Tigers, I might circle that name and say, hey,
• 25:20
  Speaker 2: we kind of want one more player in this deal.
• 25:21
  Speaker 2: Could you throw in Parker Meadows? That's the only way
• 25:24
  Speaker 2: I see him not showing up to Lakeland and not
• 25:28
  Speaker 2: coming in and competing for a job, and I think
• 25:31
  Speaker 2: A lot of the same can be said for Winslow Perez, who, again,
• 25:34
  Speaker 2: switch hitter, pretty good in right, can play center in
• 25:38
  Speaker 2: a pinch. Not necessarily a ton of ceiling there, as
• 25:42
  Speaker 2: you mentioned, but a guy the Tigers, I think they like.
• 25:46
  Speaker 2: I don't think they're just going to get rid of
• 25:47
  Speaker 2: him until they have to.
• 25:51
  Speaker 1: I guess it should be noted, both with the eye
• 25:54
  Speaker 1: situation with Winslow and Winslow, and, and Parker with the,
• 25:58
  Speaker 1: with the broken, was it, it was the forearm technically.
• 26:01
  Speaker 2: Uh, yeah.
• 26:02
  Speaker 1: Uh, you know, we're assuming by the time spring training happens, uh,
• 26:09
  Speaker 1: that they'll, that they'll be healthy. I, I guess, you know,
• 26:12
  Speaker 1: you used to ever know what these things, but, uh,
• 26:16
  Speaker 1: I think both of those guys should, like I said,
• 26:19
  Speaker 1: should be brought back. You're going to have to have
• 26:22
  Speaker 1: the uncomfortable conversation about Toledo, but like, given what we
• 26:26
  Speaker 1: know about baseball and even these players on this team,
• 26:31
  Speaker 1: they will be heard from. Uh, and I think that
• 26:33
  Speaker 1: would be, this is like the Scott Harris, like dream
• 26:35
  Speaker 1: scenario where it's like all this competition and all this
• 26:37
  Speaker 1: major league experience sitting there ready to be plucked, uh,
• 26:41
  Speaker 1: when needed in, uh, in Toledo. Uh, I think he gets,
• 26:45
  Speaker 1: I think that's like Christmas day for him thinking about
• 26:47
  Speaker 1: all that kind of stuff. Um, which, you know, brings
• 26:52
  Speaker 1: me to another guy, Cody, uh, I kind of don't
• 26:58
  Speaker 1: know about the Trey Sweeney thing, but I kind of
• 27:02
  Speaker 1: think Scott Harris traded for him. He's been a part
• 27:06
  Speaker 1: of successful teams. He was hurt. We don't really know
• 27:10
  Speaker 1: whether he's recovered or recovering or whatever. But he's a shortstop.
• 27:15
  Speaker 1: He bats left-handed. There might be some defensive versatility in
• 27:19
  Speaker 1: there if they kind of went down that route. Obviously,
• 27:23
  Speaker 1: they haven't to this point. But we spent a lot
• 27:26
  Speaker 1: of time talking about who's going to play shortstop and
• 27:30
  Speaker 1: not wanting Kevin McGonigal to be doing that full-time. There's
• 27:33
  Speaker 1: the hobby piece of this, but the underrated part of
• 27:36
  Speaker 1: it is the Trey Sweeney piece of this, where he
• 27:38
  Speaker 1: fits in there. And for those reasons, again, it doesn't
• 27:41
  Speaker 1: have to be a long-term thing, but for those reasons,
• 27:45
  Speaker 1: I kind of think you bring Trey Sweeney back.
• 27:48
  Speaker 2: Yeah, Sweeney's a little bit of a forgotten man after
• 27:50
  Speaker 2: missing all season with, what was it, a labrum, a
• 27:54
  Speaker 2: shoulder procedure?
• 27:55
  Speaker 1: Rotator cuffs.
• 27:57
  Speaker 2: Rotator cuff.
• 27:59
  Speaker 1: Yeah, rotator cuff. Throwing shoulder, obviously. Rotator cuff strain, ended
• 28:03
  Speaker 1: up having surgery.
• 28:04
  Speaker 2: So a little bit forgotten, but he played a lot
• 28:07
  Speaker 2: the year before, wasn't great at the plate, but If
• 28:11
  Speaker 2: you remember in spring training, he kind of reshaped his
• 28:13
  Speaker 2: swing a little bit. There were kind of some whispers like, oh,
• 28:16
  Speaker 2: Sweeney's looking kind of interesting. And then he got hurt
• 28:18
  Speaker 2: before we could really see that in spring training games
• 28:22
  Speaker 2: or against real pitching. I don't think this is someone
• 28:25
  Speaker 2: you want to, you know, who's going to be on
• 28:28
  Speaker 2: the roster and like our offseason roster projections. But this
• 28:32
  Speaker 2: is someone, especially if I think the Tigers will want
• 28:36
  Speaker 2: to keep in AAA and maybe even have a chance
• 28:39
  Speaker 2: to win a job if If that new swing shows
• 28:42
  Speaker 2: up and if things look good, he's a left-handed hitter
• 28:44
  Speaker 2: who plays shortstop. We know the Tigers love that. He's
• 28:47
  Speaker 2: a Scott Harris trade acquisition. I think they're still part
• 28:50
  Speaker 2: of the Tigers that wants to be able to brag
• 28:52
  Speaker 2: about what they got for Jack Flaherty. That return looked
• 28:56
  Speaker 2: a lot better two years ago than it does now.
• 28:58
  Speaker 2: Tyron Lorenzo and Trey Sweeney. Again, you can't keep everybody,
• 29:04
  Speaker 2: so again, who's going to go this offseason? We could
• 29:08
  Speaker 2: get to a point where Sweeney's name is kind of
• 29:10
  Speaker 2: sticking out a little bit, but I wouldn't be shocked
• 29:12
  Speaker 2: if the Tigers want to see more of this guy.
• 29:16
  Speaker 2: There are some others who can go off the 40-man.
• 29:20
  Speaker 2: You still have Gilbert Diaz. You still have Bailey Horn.
• 29:23
  Speaker 2: Jacob Wagaspak is actually a really interesting case. I don't know.
• 29:27
  Speaker 2: They might bring him back.
• 29:28
  Speaker 1: You have.
• 29:30
  Speaker 2: In Manuel De Jesus, who's kind of an interesting case.
• 29:33
  Speaker 2: We've talked about Will Vest, Corey Jolks, Sawyer Gibson Long,
• 29:37
  Speaker 2: Bailey Horn. There are some other names that jump out
• 29:41
  Speaker 2: that I think would probably go before Sweeney. And then
• 29:44
  Speaker 2: some of it might be a matter of how much
• 29:46
  Speaker 2: do they add, who do they want to add to
• 29:48
  Speaker 2: the 40-man roster, how many spots do they want to clear.
• 29:52
  Speaker 2: But I think Trey Sweeney certainly has a chance to
• 29:55
  Speaker 2: stick around.
• 29:59
  Speaker 1: Ah. Cody, it just occurred to me that there's definitely
• 30:01
  Speaker 1: going to be a Scott Harris news conference where he
• 30:04
  Speaker 1: mentions all the production coming back to the roster about
• 30:08
  Speaker 1: guys who missed the majority of last season. It's a,
• 30:13
  Speaker 1: you know, if you think about it, we really added
• 30:15
  Speaker 1: like a young shortstop that that's left-handed and a gold
• 30:19
  Speaker 1: glove caliber guy in center field. And yeah, that's, that's,
• 30:23
  Speaker 1: that's coming. All right. Real quick. I did want to
• 30:26
  Speaker 1: get at least one picture on here. Drew Anderson, there
• 30:29
  Speaker 1: is technically a decision to be made there. It is
• 30:31
  Speaker 1: a team option for $ 10 million. We had talked about
• 30:34
  Speaker 1: this previously. I'm all aboard bringing Drew Anderson back, even
• 30:39
  Speaker 1: with a little bit of a pay bump, I think.
• 30:41
  Speaker 1: He showed, certainly as a starter, he showed me what
• 30:45
  Speaker 1: he's capable of. I almost wish it slotted more to
• 30:50
  Speaker 1: where he was kind of able to be a starter
• 30:54
  Speaker 1: until otherwise, even though it's likely going to be, he'll
• 30:57
  Speaker 1: be the swing man and then make starts. Uh, but all,
• 31:02
  Speaker 1: all that to say, I, I was really impressed with
• 31:05
  Speaker 1: him down the stretch. I think, uh, he adjusted to
• 31:08
  Speaker 1: the American. Once he got back to the American game,
• 31:12
  Speaker 1: I think he kind of showed what he's capable of.
• 31:14
  Speaker 1: And then you, you can do a lot worse than
• 31:17
  Speaker 1: Drew Anderson for $ 10 million, even though it's a little
• 31:20
  Speaker 1: bit on the high end for, for what, you're going
• 31:24
  Speaker 1: to use him for. But I'm all in favor of
• 31:28
  Speaker 1: bringing him back because if this season taught us anything,
• 31:31
  Speaker 1: you just can't have enough pitching. And if you don't
• 31:34
  Speaker 1: exercise that team option, guess what? You're going to wish
• 31:36
  Speaker 1: you had someone like Drew Anderson on the roster.
• 31:40
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I definitely think he's coming back. I mean, gosh,
• 31:41
  Speaker 2: look what he did in August and September. 266 ERA
• 31:45
  Speaker 2: in August, 286 ERA in September. He, again, was oddly
• 31:49
  Speaker 2: a lot better as a starter than he was as
• 31:52
  Speaker 2: a reliever. Some of that was adjusting to the big leagues,
• 31:55
  Speaker 2: adjusting to life in the bullpen. Some of that, like
• 31:58
  Speaker 2: he just kind of, he does have that kind of
• 32:00
  Speaker 2: four plus pitch mix that can play pretty well as
• 32:04
  Speaker 2: a starter. This guy's coming back. I mean, Scott at
• 32:08
  Speaker 2: his news conference just kind of raved about Drew Anderson
• 32:11
  Speaker 2: for like two minutes and then at the end goes,
• 32:13
  Speaker 2: but I'm not going to forecast our decision with the option.
• 32:15
  Speaker 2: At that point, I was like, dude, just say like
• 32:17
  Speaker 2: you're probably picking up the option. I mean, I know you're,
• 32:20
  Speaker 2: I know why he doesn't speak in that direct of terms,
• 32:24
  Speaker 2: but he basically said we're picking this thing up based
• 32:27
  Speaker 2: on how glowing he was for Drew Anderson. I expect
• 32:30
  Speaker 2: Anderson to be back. I think that's a good decision.
• 32:32
  Speaker 2: I think he deserves it. $ 10 million and maybe a
• 32:36
  Speaker 2: little high, but overall that's not a terrible price point,
• 32:39
  Speaker 2: especially if he does get some starts. I kind of expect,
• 32:42
  Speaker 2: hopefully they bring in enough other guys where he's a
• 32:46
  Speaker 2: little bit outside looking in entering spring training, but Yeah,
• 32:50
  Speaker 2: to your point, look, take all the quality pitching you
• 32:54
  Speaker 2: can get. Drew Anderson was pretty solid overall. I don't
• 32:58
  Speaker 2: think it was like this home run, oh my gosh, signing.
• 33:00
  Speaker 2: But they went out and they went to Korea and
• 33:02
  Speaker 2: they got a guy who was pretty good. And there's
• 33:05
  Speaker 2: nothing at all wrong with that.
• 33:08
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and then again, part of this exercise, especially with pitching, is.
• 33:14
  Speaker 2: In a way, Drew Anderson's been their best pitching acquisition
• 33:17
  Speaker 2: in two years. Yeah.
• 33:19
  Speaker 1: And you think of all the data and the coaching
• 33:21
  Speaker 1: that went into getting the best version out of Drew Anderson,
• 33:25
  Speaker 1: one could argue it's actually not a great return on
• 33:28
  Speaker 1: investment on that if you don't use it going into
• 33:31
  Speaker 1: a second season.
• 33:32
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I think that's part of it. I think they
• 33:34
  Speaker 2: probably think they can get even a little more out
• 33:36
  Speaker 2: of him, and they might not be wrong.
• 33:39
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so, and, you know, the move back, you know,
• 33:42
  Speaker 1: the thing with his wife and, like, with the... I
• 33:47
  Speaker 1: guess I'd call it immigration. They don't have to figure
• 33:49
  Speaker 1: that out, that part out of it. I mean, maybe,
• 33:52
  Speaker 1: maybe like a whole year, like things are just a
• 33:54
  Speaker 1: little bit smoother overall for him. You know what I mean? Uh,
• 33:57
  Speaker 1: cause obviously I couldn't imagine, you know, having to do
• 33:59
  Speaker 1: all that and then, you know, pitch a major league baseball. So, uh,
• 34:02
  Speaker 1: so yeah. Uh, all right. That was technically more than five.
• 34:06
  Speaker 1: So I'm sorry for lying to everybody about having five, uh,
• 34:08
  Speaker 1: five guys on there, but, uh, is there any, anybody else, Cody,
• 34:12
  Speaker 1: you want to mention while we're, while we're here?
• 34:16
  Speaker 2: I don't know. I think we talked about kind of
• 34:18
  Speaker 2: the most interesting, the most pressing cases. So that pretty
• 34:22
  Speaker 2: much covers it. Look, there's still going to be some
• 34:24
  Speaker 2: hard decisions. But we kind of took four or five
• 34:30
  Speaker 2: guys off the roster in the last episode. I mentioned
• 34:32
  Speaker 2: some other names who can go. Although they can't keep everybody,
• 34:36
  Speaker 2: I do think they're going to keep some of these guys.
• 34:40
  Speaker 1: Yeah. And again, like some of these, the way I
• 34:42
  Speaker 1: look at it, some of these guys are, it's like,
• 34:44
  Speaker 1: all right, we got this. Now we can pivot to
• 34:46
  Speaker 1: these other needs. And I think most everybody that we
• 34:49
  Speaker 1: talked about here is that. And if you can eliminate
• 34:55
  Speaker 1: the things that you got to figure out in this
• 34:58
  Speaker 1: part of the equation and just kind of focus here,
• 35:00
  Speaker 1: I do believe that makes for a smoother offseason. So
• 35:03
  Speaker 1: don't go for searching for something you already have, as
• 35:05
  Speaker 1: we've said a couple of times. All right. You guys
• 35:07
  Speaker 1: can follow us on X, formerly known as Twitter, at
• 35:09
  Speaker 1: Cody Stabenhagen. I am at Kieran underscore Steckley. Pod page
• 35:12
  Speaker 1: at Tiger Territory underscore. YouTube, Apple, Spotify. You guys know
• 35:16
  Speaker 1: what to do. We appreciate all of you. So for
• 35:18
  Speaker 1: Cody Stabenhagen, I am Kieran Steckley. Everybody have a great day.