Latest / Beheaded / The Last of the Gurus | Sikh Gurus

Transcript

The Last of the Gurus | Sikh Gurus · Beheaded

0:04
SPEAKER_00: Hello and welcome to Beheaded.
0:06
SPEAKER_00: This is season five, episode twelve.
0:08
SPEAKER_00: I'm Megan Moore.
0:09
SPEAKER_00: And I'm Elizabeth Black.
0:11
SPEAKER_01: It is 9 37 p.m.
0:16
SPEAKER_01: Pacific Standard Time on Thursday, April 18th, 2024, as we record this, which means we are 37 minutes into what, Elizabeth?
0:32
SPEAKER_00: Well, to correct you, Megan, it's Pacific Daylight time right now.
0:35
SPEAKER_00: Oh.
0:36
SPEAKER_00: Um and so all the Swifties know.
0:41
SPEAKER_00: This is when Tortured Poets Society.
0:45
SPEAKER_01: No, the Tortured Poets Department.
0:47
SPEAKER_01: Tortured Poets Museum comes out.
0:49
SPEAKER_01: No, yes, yes, yes.
0:51
SPEAKER_01: You got it close enough.
0:52
SPEAKER_01: Got it.
0:53
SPEAKER_01: The Tortured Poets Department.
0:55
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
0:56
SPEAKER_01: For my fellow Swifties, we are in this together.
0:59
SPEAKER_01: For non-Swifties, you're missing out.
1:02
SPEAKER_01: It's a it's a culture, it's a cult, it's a thing.
1:05
SPEAKER_01: It's been a week-long thing of clues and hints and secret messages and decoding because it's not just listening to Taylor.
1:12
SPEAKER_01: Of course.
1:13
SPEAKER_01: It's nursing into her brain.
1:15
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
1:16
SPEAKER_01: Of magic and science.
1:18
SPEAKER_00: Magical scientific brain.
1:20
SPEAKER_00: Poetic.
1:21
SPEAKER_00: I will say uh we did listen to one song before we started recording because 38 minutes ago the album dropped, and Megan was like, just one.
1:30
SPEAKER_00: And I knew she was gonna be distracted when we recorded, so I was like, yes, one song.
1:33
SPEAKER_00: I'm very out of focus.
1:35
SPEAKER_00: I will say, which of our phones actually had the album on it?
1:39
SPEAKER_01: Mine wasn't working.
1:40
SPEAKER_01: Theally barjew.
1:42
SPEAKER_01: I know.
1:43
SPEAKER_01: It's like I was there refreshing it.
1:45
SPEAKER_01: It was weird.
1:46
SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
1:46
SPEAKER_01: And I literally was like, well, I'll just check on my phone in case.
1:48
SPEAKER_00: And it was just the whole album was there.
1:51
SPEAKER_01: So what's funny is because we're kind of like caught we're very well caught up on recording, and I just have to edit these episodes and get them out.
1:58
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
1:59
SPEAKER_01: But um, because we we got better at this point.
2:02
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, this one won't come out for a while.
2:04
SPEAKER_01: So at this point, like Megan Moore, as you're listening to this, we're speaking third person now.
2:10
SPEAKER_01: Yes, I'm talking to you, Megan.
2:12
SPEAKER_01: At this point, I expect for you to memorize every lyric.
2:16
SPEAKER_01: Oh, you're talking to your future self-cause my future self.
2:18
SPEAKER_01: I'm gonna know every song inside and out.
2:21
SPEAKER_01: I'm gonna have them decoded and deciphered.
2:24
SPEAKER_01: I'm gonna go through the evidence of the postmortem.
2:27
SPEAKER_01: Oh lord.
2:28
SPEAKER_01: Yes, it's a thing.
2:28
SPEAKER_00: Okay, so Elizabeth Black, make sure she's staying on task.
2:32
SPEAKER_01: I'm so excited.
2:33
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's it's just funny because like I love these little things where people are like, just think like by this time tomorrow, you might have a new favorite Taylor Swift song that we've never heard before.
2:44
SPEAKER_01: That's wild.
2:45
SPEAKER_00: I know it's such a world we live in.
2:47
SPEAKER_00: So I do watch Survivor, and this ties in half because there's a guy on this current season who's a diehard Swifty.
2:54
SPEAKER_00: Oh good, I love he's awful.
2:57
SPEAKER_00: Oh sorry if he's listening.
2:58
SPEAKER_00: What if he's a listener?
2:59
SPEAKER_00: Oh my god.
3:00
SPEAKER_00: What if Taylor's a listener?
3:02
SPEAKER_00: She could support her.
3:03
SPEAKER_00: Well, we don't say anything bad about her.
3:05
SPEAKER_00: Um they had this really funny music off, like him and another contestant, because the other contestant's big into like heavy metal.
3:13
SPEAKER_00: Oh.
3:13
SPEAKER_00: So he was listing every Metallica song he knew, and then the Swifty guy was saying every Taylor song he knew, and the Taylor guy won.
3:21
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, because she has so many songs.
3:23
SPEAKER_00: They they literally both of them went up to like 120 or something crazy.
3:26
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, they were just naming the song after.
3:28
SPEAKER_01: About 128 in her dis if you're including like the Christmas specials and whatnot.
3:33
SPEAKER_01: Oh.
3:34
SPEAKER_01: Um Christmas Tree Farm and Could you do that?
3:38
SPEAKER_00: Could you list 120 T Swift?
3:40
SPEAKER_01: I probably could.
3:41
SPEAKER_01: Really?
3:42
SPEAKER_01: I we should test that.
3:43
SPEAKER_01: Not recording.
3:44
SPEAKER_01: Oh god.
3:45
SPEAKER_01: We'll do a special feature episode of Megan sitting there listing.
3:48
SPEAKER_01: Not only can I list the songs, I I'm not trying to be conceited.
3:54
SPEAKER_01: I could probably sing them with the lyrics also.
3:58
unknown: Sorry.
4:00
SPEAKER_01: You don't believe me.
4:01
SPEAKER_01: No, I just imagine you singing each song that you know.
4:04
SPEAKER_01: Like I'm I I can do my own Ares tour.
4:08
SPEAKER_00: Okay.
4:08
SPEAKER_00: I'm really good at it too.
4:10
SPEAKER_00: I I might be able to match you with just like Disney songs.
4:14
SPEAKER_00: Maybe.
4:15
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, you're pretty, you're pretty.
4:16
SPEAKER_01: Okay, so that's what we can do.
4:18
SPEAKER_01: We'll go one for one.
4:20
SPEAKER_01: One for one.
4:21
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
4:21
SPEAKER_01: And we'll do a little contest.
4:23
SPEAKER_01: And whoever wants to listen to this, you can buy a special episode.
4:28
SPEAKER_01: Ooh, Patreon?
4:30
SPEAKER_01: Flagging a Patreon.
4:31
SPEAKER_01: Buy us a coffee and we'll send you a secret episode and you can see who wins.
4:35
SPEAKER_00: And it's just us rattling off song, maybe.
4:37
SPEAKER_01: We'll get one creep who lives like somewhere far away.
4:42
SPEAKER_01: Oh, they exist.
4:44
SPEAKER_01: Don't worry, they exist.
4:47
SPEAKER_01: And so that's been my world.
4:50
SPEAKER_01: Also, Megan broke both of her knees.
4:52
SPEAKER_01: I broke so sorry.
4:53
SPEAKER_01: Last episode I shared how I was going roller skating.
4:56
SPEAKER_01: This episode, I can report both kneecaps are fucked up.
5:00
SPEAKER_01: They're just you didn't have great knees to start with, right?
5:03
SPEAKER_01: I have weak knees and I I fell.
5:05
SPEAKER_01: I don't even want to tell you how many times I fell because I counted.
5:08
SPEAKER_01: You did count?
5:09
SPEAKER_01: 14 times.
5:10
SPEAKER_01: That's not that bad.
5:11
SPEAKER_01: Hard on my kneecaps with no protection.
5:14
SPEAKER_00: How did you keep falling forward?
5:17
SPEAKER_00: Don't you usually fall back in roller skates?
5:19
SPEAKER_00: Or did you have a stopper in the back, like a break in the back?
5:22
SPEAKER_00: No, there was a little stopper in the front.
5:23
SPEAKER_00: I just didn't know how to use it.
5:24
SPEAKER_00: So you tried to stop and just fell.
5:27
SPEAKER_01: Why am I choking?
5:28
SPEAKER_01: Sorry.
5:30
SPEAKER_01: Uh I thought I was good at roller skating, but there was a lot of people there, and you know, I don't know.
5:36
SPEAKER_01: I get it.
5:36
SPEAKER_01: I was getting I was getting nervous.
5:38
SPEAKER_01: Trixy.
5:39
SPEAKER_01: No, I was trying to like do do things and then I'd fall.
5:42
SPEAKER_01: Oh well, yeah, you know, you were trying real hard.
5:44
SPEAKER_01: That's good.
5:45
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so I'm just hobbling around with my broken and scabbed knees.
5:49
SPEAKER_00: They're pretty scabbed.
5:50
SPEAKER_00: When she told me she hurt them, I was like, oh, you just like bruised your knees, and then she showed them to me, and it looks like a nine-year-old who like fell on their bike.
5:57
SPEAKER_00: I have no skin on my knees.
5:59
SPEAKER_01: I'm like, oh my god, I didn't need peroxide on you.
6:02
SPEAKER_01: I know the skin is gone.
6:03
SPEAKER_01: The bruising and the swelling went down, which is good.
6:06
SPEAKER_01: Um did you clean them up?
6:07
SPEAKER_01: Like, you know how your mom used to do that as a kid?
6:09
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, every mom.
6:11
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, Jake got the yeah, the brown bottle.
6:13
SPEAKER_01: The brown bottle.
6:14
SPEAKER_01: Everyone knows the plastic brown bottle.
6:16
SPEAKER_01: You did the brown bottle.
6:17
SPEAKER_01: Did you scream?
6:18
SPEAKER_01: No, I was brave and drunk.
6:19
SPEAKER_01: Oh, drunk is the keyword.
6:21
SPEAKER_01: No, I was brave and drunk.
6:24
SPEAKER_01: Hence the 14 times falling.
6:26
SPEAKER_00: Oh, it's all connected.
6:28
SPEAKER_00: I see.
6:29
SPEAKER_01: It was a 21 plus.
6:30
SPEAKER_01: That's good.
6:32
SPEAKER_00: At least you didn't like fall on children.
6:34
SPEAKER_01: No, it was all adults, and we were all falling.
6:36
SPEAKER_01: And uh, we took a Waymo there.
6:39
SPEAKER_01: They don't tell the people what a Waymo is.
6:41
SPEAKER_01: So nobody knows what the way it's real big in Arizona right now, is the self-driving, they're basically self-driving Ubers, but they're Jaguars.
6:48
SPEAKER_01: I didn't realize the car is a jaguar.
6:50
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
6:50
SPEAKER_00: So, and like again, people don't know exactly what this is yet.
6:53
SPEAKER_00: People in Arizona do, and I think San Francisco, they're all over the place.
6:58
SPEAKER_00: But um, literally it's like, yeah, it's a nice white Jaguar, like jag Jaguar car.
7:03
SPEAKER_00: A Jaguar.
7:04
SPEAKER_00: And there's like this weird like propeller thing that kind of sits on top of the car that spins, and it like, I don't know, it's like an electric, self-driving car.
7:14
SPEAKER_00: So it's literally there's no driver, it's just you in the back seat in this phantom ghost car that drives you.
7:20
SPEAKER_01: Maybe I have a funny video when the car got into a roundabout and we all just start screaming because we're like, does it merge?
7:26
SPEAKER_00: Does it know how to merge?
7:28
SPEAKER_00: Well, I actually crossed in front of a Waymo like today when I was walking to work.
7:32
SPEAKER_00: Every which way.
7:34
SPEAKER_00: But I go, I don't go on like a normal crosswalk.
7:36
SPEAKER_00: It's like one of those, if there's a pedestrian, like they have the right-of-way.
7:40
SPEAKER_00: And I didn't think about it.
7:41
SPEAKER_00: I was with a few other people, and we just like walked across because we always just go.
7:45
SPEAKER_00: And it stopped, and I was like, How does it know?
7:47
SPEAKER_01: Because it knows people are we went through an intersection where there was an accident.
7:52
SPEAKER_01: Really?
7:52
SPEAKER_01: And it was blocked off, and there was cops around because some guy rear-ended somebody, and we're like, What's gonna happen?
8:00
SPEAKER_01: And the Waymo went around it all and followed traffic and went slower, and it was weird.
8:05
SPEAKER_01: Interesting.
8:06
SPEAKER_00: Um, it's only in Phoenix and Scottsdale and Tempe right now.
8:09
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, like I I live a little further away, so I tried to get one here, but it wouldn't go this far, which is good because it's not ready for this area.
8:16
SPEAKER_01: It was expensive too.
8:17
SPEAKER_01: We kind of did it as a splurge.
8:18
SPEAKER_01: We're like, well, it's like$10 for an Uber or$35 for a Waymo.
8:24
SPEAKER_01: We're like, let's do the Waymo.
8:26
SPEAKER_01: That would do that.
8:27
SPEAKER_01: Um, it is a weird experience because yeah, it pulls up and you're like you're in the car with your friends by yourself.
8:32
SPEAKER_01: There's no stranger with you.
8:34
SPEAKER_01: But I like that, and it's so much safer for girls.
8:36
SPEAKER_00: Oh, yeah.
8:37
SPEAKER_00: You know what I mean?
8:38
SPEAKER_00: Like, no girl wants to be with like creepy Uber driver man.
8:41
SPEAKER_00: Driving around at midnight.
8:42
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
8:43
SPEAKER_00: And like, no offense to the Uber drivers out there, but just it's an uncomfortable thing when you're like kind of drunk, it's you know, midnight.
8:50
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and this like stranger is just like taking you a few blocks and then knows where you live.
8:55
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's just like, you know, and guys never get it.
8:57
SPEAKER_00: I love when guys are like, well, just get an Uber.
8:59
SPEAKER_01: And you're like, it's not that great when you're I'd rather pay a little bit more and die in a self-driving car.
9:05
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, like if I'm gonna die, I'm gonna crash in a self-driving car and not be raped and murdered.
9:09
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, you know.
9:10
SPEAKER_01: Anyways, that's enough about me.
9:12
SPEAKER_01: So my life is just tailor, scabby knees, and self-driving cars.
9:16
SPEAKER_01: What have you been up to?
9:17
SPEAKER_00: So, I mean, I'm in the middle of training for my next race.
9:21
SPEAKER_02: Woohoo!
9:21
SPEAKER_00: So good old 15-mile run, which was really fun.
9:25
SPEAKER_00: Um, but other than that, I let's see.
9:29
SPEAKER_00: I went to a pool party.
9:32
SPEAKER_00: Oh my god.
9:33
SPEAKER_00: What?
9:34
SPEAKER_00: I have to tell you.
9:34
SPEAKER_00: I didn't, I didn't tell you.
9:35
SPEAKER_01: You haven't told you about the pool party at all.
9:38
SPEAKER_00: Okay, I have to like tell you an off-air story, but I'll tell you on the airplane.
9:43
SPEAKER_00: Wait, wait, wait, wait.
9:44
SPEAKER_01: Are we gonna like secretly pretend like I'm gonna stop recording it?
9:47
SPEAKER_00: And then No, no, no, no.
9:48
SPEAKER_00: I'm just I'm gonna tell you the high level right now, and then like after recording, I'm gonna tell you I get the T And because it's I can't say it like because it's incriminating to somebody we know.
9:59
SPEAKER_00: So to this party, and we're like, we're like in Scottsdale, like middle of Scottsdale.
10:04
SPEAKER_00: Uh-huh.
10:05
SPEAKER_00: And we drove up to the party, and I was like, I know this house, like I've been here before, you know, and I walk in and I was like, oh my god, I know I know whose house this is.
10:13
SPEAKER_00: It's really weird.
10:14
SPEAKER_00: And then I Oh my god, I want to stop recording so you can tell me.
10:18
SPEAKER_00: And then I went to the party.
10:20
SPEAKER_00: Yes, very much so.
10:22
SPEAKER_00: You probably guess.
10:23
SPEAKER_00: Okay, keep going.
10:25
SPEAKER_00: So I went up and I didn't know the hostess.
10:27
SPEAKER_00: It was like her birthday party, and it was like, she's like, Oh, I wanted this Wolf of Wall Street party.
10:31
SPEAKER_00: So it was like That sounds it's kind of dumb.
10:34
SPEAKER_00: Sounds ridiculous.
10:34
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it was like, it was like uh like pool, you know, pool, and everyone had to wear white.
10:39
SPEAKER_00: We're all in like white swimsuits, and she wore black, that whole thing.
10:44
SPEAKER_00: Okay.
10:44
SPEAKER_00: Everyone was very plastic surgeried.
10:47
SPEAKER_00: Okay, I'm feeling the vibe here.
10:49
SPEAKER_00: You're feeling the vibe.
10:50
SPEAKER_00: But so the first thing I say to this girl whose party it is because I'm like, yo, is this so and so's house?
10:57
SPEAKER_00: She's like, and her face just like dropped, and she was like, Yeah, like I I'm renting from them.
11:02
SPEAKER_00: And I was like, Oh, okay, so you don't like own this house because it was like a nice house.
11:07
SPEAKER_02: Oh my god.
11:07
SPEAKER_00: But so I don't, I think she was trying to pass it off like she wasn't renting the house.
11:11
SPEAKER_00: Okay, it was kind of weird because I knew the person who owned the house.
11:15
SPEAKER_00: Yes, I called her out and like this the first thing I said to her, and I didn't mean to make it weird, but I think she thought it was weird, and so we got that's the foot we got off of, and she was like, and she literally said, Don't tell anyone that, and then she was like, also don't tell that person I'm having a party here.
11:29
SPEAKER_00: I was like, Oh.
11:31
SPEAKER_01: So I don't know, I can't.
11:33
SPEAKER_01: I this is a more interesting story.
11:35
SPEAKER_01: Okay, sorry, we're gonna pause, we're gonna pause because I I I can't go.
11:38
SPEAKER_01: Okay, we'll pause, I'll tell you, and we're gonna go back on again.
11:41
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
11:42
unknown: Okay.
11:43
unknown: I'm dead.
11:44
SPEAKER_01: I just told her.
11:45
SPEAKER_01: Sorry, we had a pause because I wasn't gonna let you just like let that slip.
11:50
SPEAKER_01: I know.
11:51
SPEAKER_01: So I know I'm giggling.
11:53
SPEAKER_00: I'm how weird is that?
11:54
SPEAKER_00: Like of all the places.
11:55
SPEAKER_00: I definitely know the person you're referring to.
11:58
SPEAKER_00: You know that person.
11:59
SPEAKER_00: Anyway, how we move on.
12:01
SPEAKER_00: It was it was just a weird thing where like you walk into the house and you like I knew it so well.
12:04
SPEAKER_00: It's like I've been here a bunch.
12:07
SPEAKER_00: You're like, did this person move?
12:09
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, but then I felt like an asshole because it was clearly like supposed to be a secret, I guess.
12:13
SPEAKER_01: That's what kills me when people try to put off this facade of something that's not real.
12:17
SPEAKER_01: Like, just be honest, just own it.
12:19
SPEAKER_00: Dude, I'm like, are you trying to pass it off?
12:21
SPEAKER_00: Like you own this nice plate.
12:22
SPEAKER_00: I don't know.
12:23
SPEAKER_00: I digress people in Scottsdale.
12:25
SPEAKER_00: Oh, yeah.
12:26
SPEAKER_00: A lot of a lot of plastic surgery at that party, like I said.
12:30
SPEAKER_01: Did you wear white?
12:32
SPEAKER_00: I did wear white.
12:32
SPEAKER_01: Oh well, good for you.
12:34
SPEAKER_01: Thanks.
12:34
SPEAKER_01: We fixed in with the crowd.
12:36
SPEAKER_01: I tried my best.
12:38
SPEAKER_00: I'm not really a good uh crowd pleaser.
12:41
SPEAKER_00: That's okay.
12:42
SPEAKER_01: Um, well, we are going to try to crowd please tonight.
12:47
SPEAKER_01: Excellent.
12:48
SPEAKER_01: And we're gonna transition.
12:51
SPEAKER_01: We are going worldly.
12:53
SPEAKER_01: We're gonna go more international than we have had in the past.
12:59
SPEAKER_01: That sounds interesting.
13:01
SPEAKER_00: Well, we realize, because obviously, with a lot of executions, I feel like we focus a lot on obviously like Tudor England and like England in general.
13:10
SPEAKER_00: We do a lot of French stuff, we do a lot of Russian stuff, some German, um Scottish, a few American, yeah, Irish, Scottish.
13:19
SPEAKER_00: You know, obviously we've done some cool things like ancient Egypt and ancient Greece, but we realize like there's a few places we haven't even explored in this world, and there's still a lot of good stories out there.
13:29
SPEAKER_00: So this one takes place in India.
13:33
SPEAKER_01: I was I was nervous.
13:35
SPEAKER_01: I'm gonna be honest.
13:37
SPEAKER_01: I was so nervous, and I appreciate you getting me out of my comfort zone.
13:42
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I clearly obviously am obsessed with tutor history.
13:45
SPEAKER_01: Like when you go to the Instagram and it's all a bunch of reels and videos, it's all very central focused around King Henry VIII.
13:52
SPEAKER_01: And yes, we have a lot of King Henry the Eighth esque executions.
13:56
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
13:57
SPEAKER_01: But I have to give it to Elizabeth to be the one to be like, let's try Greece, let's try Egypt, yeah, New Orleans and different different regions of the world.
14:07
SPEAKER_01: I have to remember there are different areas of the world.
14:09
SPEAKER_01: I'm just, it's it's hard for me because I definitely have it's it's not second nature to me, and I really have to like research and study.
14:17
SPEAKER_01: Yeah and mostly it's the names and the pronunciations.
14:20
SPEAKER_01: I just don't want to do anyone wrong by my I we already have I can't even say mispronunciations, we already mispronounce things in English in British terms, let alone Indian or Asian or so.
14:35
SPEAKER_01: So please forgive us.
14:37
SPEAKER_01: This is our disclaimer.
14:38
SPEAKER_01: Please forgive us in advance.
14:41
SPEAKER_00: Please have some grace with us.
14:42
SPEAKER_00: Again, like we we watch some documentaries, we think we know how to pronounce things, but I've said this before.
14:48
SPEAKER_00: It's one of those things like you can practice it a bunch, and once you start recording, you just kind of throw one out there and it sticks, and so sometimes it's hard to go back.
14:56
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, if it this I did a lot of Google, like how do you pronounce pronunciate?
15:01
SPEAKER_01: That's not even the right word.
15:02
SPEAKER_01: Annunciate, pronounce.
15:04
SPEAKER_01: Pronounce.
15:05
SPEAKER_01: How do you pronounce this name, this word?
15:08
SPEAKER_01: So we've we've been learning.
15:09
SPEAKER_01: We've had this has been a very big learning experience for both of us.
15:12
SPEAKER_00: And I think my favorite part about this execution was the first name we threw out there led to like four other names.
15:19
SPEAKER_00: So this is like a multiple execution story.
15:22
SPEAKER_01: This is gonna be a different type of um layout than I think what we're used to.
15:27
SPEAKER_01: Because we started, you threw out a name.
15:30
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
15:30
SPEAKER_01: And I was reading up on this person, and I got nervous.
15:34
SPEAKER_01: I was like, there's not a lot on this person.
15:35
SPEAKER_01: And we've had some episodes like that before where there's not a lot of meat.
15:39
SPEAKER_01: So, and it went on this like spider web.
15:42
SPEAKER_01: Right.
15:42
SPEAKER_01: And then you were like, oh my god, everybody was executed.
15:45
SPEAKER_01: I was like, wait, this whole family was like executed.
15:48
SPEAKER_01: Family had like the worst luck.
15:50
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
15:51
SPEAKER_01: So we're gonna, so we're gonna get into it.
15:53
SPEAKER_01: So what are we specifically talking about tonight, Elizabeth?
15:56
SPEAKER_00: Alright, so our main character is Guru Gobind Singh, but he's not exactly where this story begins.
16:04
SPEAKER_00: And he, I guess in a way is where it ends, but it goes through a series of centuries, this story.
16:11
SPEAKER_00: So I'm gonna bring you to uh 1400s India, specifically Eastern India.
16:17
SPEAKER_00: Um, it's a region around like the Punjab area.
16:21
SPEAKER_00: So in this area, um, that is where the religion Sikh or Sikhism was born.
16:28
SPEAKER_00: So Sikhism is a it's actually the fifth largest religion in the world, which I didn't know.
16:33
SPEAKER_00: I didn't know that either.
16:34
SPEAKER_01: I'm gonna be completely honest.
16:36
SPEAKER_00: Had you ever heard of it before?
16:38
SPEAKER_01: I mean, I feel like I've seen the name.
16:40
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
16:41
SPEAKER_01: I never really took the time to learn what it was.
16:44
SPEAKER_00: I think I always thought it was a branch of Hinduism.
16:47
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I think that's I I knew it was something, I thought maybe it was more related to Muslim or I thought it was Hindi, yeah.
16:56
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I thought it was some break-off religion of that.
17:00
SPEAKER_01: It's completely separate.
17:01
SPEAKER_01: So Sikhism is S-I-K-H.
17:04
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
17:04
SPEAKER_01: The Sikhs.
17:05
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
17:06
SPEAKER_01: Which is it's funny, like when we were watching some shows and they would do captions, it would just come up as like Sikh or Sikh.
17:12
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
17:13
SPEAKER_01: But it's S-I-I-K-H.
17:16
SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
17:16
SPEAKER_00: Sikh.
17:17
SPEAKER_00: Sikhism.
17:18
SPEAKER_00: Sikhism.
17:19
SPEAKER_00: Um, so Sikhism was created in 1469 um by a guru named Nikar.
17:26
SPEAKER_00: So he was the first guru, and we're gonna we're gonna get into all the terminology.
17:32
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, we're gonna break it down really, really uh, I guess, granular here.
17:36
SPEAKER_00: So if you don't know what a guru is, I'm sure you've heard of it, like in everyday language, but a guru is like a guide, a teacher, a master, usually on a spiritual level.
17:46
SPEAKER_00: Like these days, I feel like we throw the word gur guru around a lot.
17:49
SPEAKER_01: I realize I do it all the time, and I kind of want to stop doing that.
17:52
SPEAKER_01: Kinda, because it's a little disrespectful.
17:54
SPEAKER_01: It really is, and I'm surprised that hasn't kind of been canceled yet.
17:57
SPEAKER_01: Because even in um business culture, it'd be like, oh, she's the guru on this.
18:02
SPEAKER_01: She's the spreadsheet guru.
18:03
SPEAKER_01: And now I kind of want to stop saying that because it's a little disrespectful.
18:07
SPEAKER_01: It's like she's not a spiritual leader of uh of the fifth largest religion in the world.
18:11
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so and guru literally is broken down.
18:14
SPEAKER_00: I don't even know if you knew this because we didn't talk about it beforehand, but um guru is broken down where goo means darkness and rue means light.
18:23
SPEAKER_00: I feel like you're gonna teach me a lot in this right now.
18:25
SPEAKER_01: Just teach me.
18:26
SPEAKER_01: So guru, teach me mama.
18:28
SPEAKER_01: I don't know why I said that.
18:30
SPEAKER_01: Sorry, I'm in tortured pose department brain.
18:32
SPEAKER_00: Yes, young padwan.
18:34
SPEAKER_00: So um so guru, again, dark it's darkness and light.
18:37
SPEAKER_00: Okay.
18:38
SPEAKER_00: And I guess in a way it can be translated to like someone who guides you to enlightenment.
18:42
SPEAKER_00: Someone who like, you know, is the it's the yin it's yin and yang, it's the opposing energies, but they ultimately guide you to the light.
18:49
SPEAKER_00: So that's what guru the actual word breaks down to.
18:52
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
18:52
SPEAKER_00: Um, and so this person, uh Nekar, who is the first guru, he's the one that founds this the Sikh religion.
19:01
SPEAKER_00: And so Sikh religion is uh it's really something that's about uh tolerance, it's about uh like having just one god, one deity.
19:12
SPEAKER_00: It's it rests heavily heavily on meditation and inner peace.
19:17
SPEAKER_00: And it's really just about like like again, just acceptance of everyone.
19:21
SPEAKER_00: It comes from a place of love.
19:23
SPEAKER_00: And I think that's a little bit different than what a lot of Indians were experiencing in this time, because in that time, I mean, you're having a heavy caste system in India, right?
19:32
SPEAKER_00: It's like you were born into your specific class, and that's the class you stay in.
19:37
SPEAKER_00: So I think this religion came from a place of like it shouldn't matter your uh your class, your wealth, like it shouldn't matter your gender, even.
19:45
SPEAKER_00: Like women were treated just as respectful as men in this religion.
19:48
SPEAKER_00: It's shocking.
19:49
SPEAKER_00: Which is shocking in a lot of religions anyway.
19:51
SPEAKER_00: Any religion.
19:52
SPEAKER_01: I mean, yeah, any culture, I find that to be a shock to hear that, especially in the 1400s.
19:57
SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
19:58
SPEAKER_00: Um, so so that so essentially Sikhism at this point in our story is like two and a half centuries in the making.
20:04
SPEAKER_00: It starts in the 1400s, and immediately when it started, they're getting a lot of resistance from like the Arab world.
20:12
SPEAKER_00: So they're bordering the Middle East and like Eastern India.
20:15
SPEAKER_00: So in the Middle East, like there's this uh this Arab emperor, his name's Barber, and he's kind of the first one who tries to like suppress this new religion.
20:24
SPEAKER_00: He's like, no, no, you are either you know Hindu or you're Muslim.
20:28
SPEAKER_00: And like there's really no, like, what do you do when starting this whole new religion?
20:31
SPEAKER_00: Um, but this guru came forth and he was like, No, we created something new.
20:35
SPEAKER_00: Like, we're creating a light in the world, and it comes from this again, place of of love and acceptance.
20:40
SPEAKER_00: The uh, this guru, the one who started it all, he was like, he was special from childhood.
20:44
SPEAKER_00: People knew that since he was a kid, like he listened to um to spiritual leaders more than he did his own parents.
20:50
SPEAKER_00: Like he was like touched by something extra.
20:53
SPEAKER_00: So he was the first one to again come forward with this new religion, and then after him, he was succeeded by other gurus who were generally young children, and they like fine them by being like, You're going to be the next leader of our religion.
21:06
SPEAKER_01: I like this part.
21:07
SPEAKER_01: Myth myth has it that as a baby he had the laugh of a full-grown man.
21:13
SPEAKER_01: Which is a weird thing to say about a baby.
21:15
SPEAKER_01: Like, that's a cool thing.
21:15
SPEAKER_01: I'd be like, They're like the laugh.
21:18
SPEAKER_00: He has the laugh.
21:18
SPEAKER_01: Oh, he has that deep-throated laugh that sh shows he knows something.
21:23
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, a very strange.
21:24
SPEAKER_00: Like they had very weird things, like the way they described his childhood.
21:28
SPEAKER_00: But overall, they they saw something special in him.
21:31
SPEAKER_00: Um, so we're gonna kind of fast forward a bit because he was the first guru, and now we're gonna fast forward into the like 1600, 1700s when we've now had about nine or ten gurus.
21:43
SPEAKER_00: So, really quick, like I mentioned, the Arab world does not love that this religion is happening and that they're growing.
21:50
SPEAKER_00: A lot of people are converting from Islam to uh to Sikhism.
21:55
SPEAKER_00: And so, what happens is the fifth guru of this chain of gurus.
22:00
SPEAKER_00: Is actually executed.
22:01
SPEAKER_00: His name is Guru Arjan.
22:04
SPEAKER_00: It's our first execution.
22:05
SPEAKER_00: First execution of the evening.
22:08
SPEAKER_00: So he was tortured and executed.
22:10
SPEAKER_00: He was actually burned alive.
22:12
SPEAKER_00: Oof.
22:12
SPEAKER_00: I know.
22:13
SPEAKER_00: And before he was burned, they told him, you know, the people, these invaders from the Arab world, they were like, hey, you either convert to Islam or this is it for you.
22:21
SPEAKER_00: And he refused.
22:22
SPEAKER_00: So after him, the guru line still continued.
22:25
SPEAKER_00: So now, fast forward a few years, and this is about like again, 1600s, like mid-1600s, the ninth guru comes to power.
22:34
SPEAKER_00: I won't say power because they don't even think of it like that.
22:37
SPEAKER_00: There's no power, it's more of they're the guides, they're the ones.
22:40
SPEAKER_00: So they're like the leaders of the religion at that time.
22:42
SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
22:43
SPEAKER_00: It's kind of like the Pope.
22:44
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, exactly.
22:45
SPEAKER_00: That's a good way to put it.
22:46
SPEAKER_00: I mean, though.
22:47
SPEAKER_00: Not really, but they're a little more power-hungry, I think, in the Catholic Church.
22:51
SPEAKER_00: A more humble version.
22:53
SPEAKER_00: Yes, exactly.
22:54
SPEAKER_00: So by the ninth guru, this guru is called Guru Teague.
22:59
SPEAKER_00: And Guru Teague, um, he actually is, again, executed.
23:05
SPEAKER_00: And I think you're gonna speak a little bit more about it.
23:07
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I'm gonna I'm gonna share about Teague.
23:09
SPEAKER_01: So Teague was the ninth guru.
23:12
SPEAKER_01: The Sikhs were all about social justice, you know, equalism for all.
23:17
SPEAKER_01: And it wasn't even just about their own culture and their own like fellow Sikhs, but they really were also turning to other religions as well.
23:25
SPEAKER_01: Right.
23:26
SPEAKER_01: Despite the fact that they were being persecuted by some of these other religions.
23:30
SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
23:31
SPEAKER_01: Um, they really had good intentions.
23:33
SPEAKER_01: So Teague brings together a congregation for a peaceful meeting between two different cultures, um, one's being persecuted by the other.
23:43
SPEAKER_01: And they're trying to convert them to Islam.
23:46
SPEAKER_02: Yes.
23:47
SPEAKER_01: And unfortunately, they end up arresting Teague.
23:50
SPEAKER_01: Right.
23:50
SPEAKER_01: And this gets pretty nasty.
23:52
SPEAKER_01: So all of this is in an effort to get Teague converted to become Islamic.
23:57
SPEAKER_01: And they actually give him one of two options when they arrest him.
24:00
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
24:01
SPEAKER_01: They say, either do some magical miracle in front of us and prove that you are some vision of God.
24:09
SPEAKER_01: Or if you can't do that, then you need to convert to Islam.
24:13
SPEAKER_01: And he refused to do either.
24:15
SPEAKER_01: He said, you know, this isn't what I'm here for.
24:18
SPEAKER_01: I'm just asking for peace.
24:20
SPEAKER_01: And this is where they get pretty dark.
24:22
SPEAKER_01: First, they arrest him and they arrest him for four months, but then they put him in an iron cage.
24:27
SPEAKER_01: Oh.
24:27
SPEAKER_01: And yeah.
24:28
SPEAKER_01: They transport him to Delhi.
24:30
SPEAKER_01: And along with him is three of his um, like service members, like other other Sikhs who one was a there, there was two brothers.
24:38
SPEAKER_01: One was a cook, one was more like his kind of like a secretary, like a transfer, like a scribe type.
24:43
SPEAKER_01: And then there was a third service member as well.
24:46
SPEAKER_01: So they have them all publicly being shown here, and he starts torturing his three service members in front of him until he can convert to Islam.
24:56
SPEAKER_01: Jeez.
24:57
SPEAKER_01: They ask, so the three the three men, they were bear with me here.
25:02
SPEAKER_01: You're gonna love this.
25:03
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
25:03
SPEAKER_01: By Mati Das.
25:05
SPEAKER_00: Perfect.
25:05
SPEAKER_01: And by Sati Das, they were the two brothers.
25:08
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
25:09
SPEAKER_01: And then by Dial Das.
25:11
SPEAKER_01: Oh.
25:12
SPEAKER_00: Sounds right?
25:13
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
25:15
SPEAKER_01: So they start with one of them and they ask him, Do you want any final wishes before we're about to end your life?
25:22
SPEAKER_01: And his only final wish was, I want to face my guru while I die.
25:26
SPEAKER_01: Oh my god.
25:28
SPEAKER_00: Imagine being the guru.
25:29
SPEAKER_01: Also, disclaimer, we I know this is a podcast about execution, so I'm sure you know what you're getting into.
25:36
SPEAKER_00: But this is brutal.
25:37
SPEAKER_01: This gets brutal.
25:38
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
25:39
SPEAKER_01: They put him between two planks.
25:42
SPEAKER_01: When you say him, you're talking about the servants.
25:44
SPEAKER_01: Servant by Mati Das.
25:47
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
25:47
SPEAKER_01: They put him between two planks, and they he has his, like, he's kind of like in this um like Grey's Anatomy type, like arm spread, leg spread, like a star-shaped figure.
26:01
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
26:02
SPEAKER_01: And they've got him planked up in between two pieces of wood, so his arms are held out.
26:09
SPEAKER_01: Sure.
26:09
SPEAKER_01: And they're kind of squeezing him together.
26:12
SPEAKER_00: And then they take a double-headed saw.
26:14
SPEAKER_00: When you say squeeze, do you mean the boards are running flank side or like front and back?
26:20
SPEAKER_00: Like are they like this way on the sides?
26:23
SPEAKER_00: They're on his sides.
26:24
SPEAKER_00: Okay, yeah.
26:24
SPEAKER_01: They're on his sides and they're kind of like um It's like a vice.
26:28
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
26:29
SPEAKER_01: They're they're holding him together.
26:31
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
26:32
SPEAKER_01: Um, and the planks are underneath his arms.
26:34
SPEAKER_01: I know that's kind of hard to envision.
26:36
SPEAKER_00: Right.
26:36
SPEAKER_01: Um, I'm not gonna post a picture on Instagram, but I can make a drawing.
26:42
SPEAKER_00: Do stick figure drawing of where the boards are in relation to the arms.
26:47
SPEAKER_01: Anyways, so he's facing the guru by Mati Das, and they get a double-headed sword, uh saw, sorry, a double-headed saw, and two men start sawing his body starting at the top of his head from his scalp, and they saw him down the middle all the way to his loins.
27:11
SPEAKER_01: Well, his guru watches and he's alive while they're doing this.
27:16
SPEAKER_00: Well, you would die once in a while.
27:17
SPEAKER_01: Oh, I mean you start dying, but he's it's not like they strangulated him or anything first.
27:23
SPEAKER_01: So yeah, it's strangled.
27:25
SPEAKER_00: I noticed you said strangulate in another episode.
27:28
SPEAKER_00: Strangulate.
27:29
SPEAKER_00: Strangle.
27:31
SPEAKER_00: Strangulation.
27:33
SPEAKER_00: Strangulation, strangle.
27:35
SPEAKER_00: Pronunciation.
27:36
SPEAKER_00: It's like when you say, like, I had a conversation, but you're like, but we're conversing, we're not conversating.
27:43
SPEAKER_00: Oh god, I'm so embarrassed.
27:46
SPEAKER_00: I just noticed it on one other episode.
27:49
SPEAKER_00: You gotta tell me these things.
27:50
SPEAKER_00: Well, I didn't notice until I listened later.
27:52
SPEAKER_00: Wow, I'm just gonna find that and maybe that's a word.
27:56
SPEAKER_00: Actually, maybe, maybe at this point.
27:57
SPEAKER_00: I don't think it is.
27:58
SPEAKER_00: A lot of things are in the dictionary.
28:00
SPEAKER_00: Strangulate.
28:01
SPEAKER_00: Hold on.
28:01
SPEAKER_00: Should we do a quick little Sorry.
28:04
SPEAKER_00: We were in a really graphic part of the story and I had to be that person.
28:07
SPEAKER_00: Strangulated.
28:10
SPEAKER_00: Is that a word?
28:11
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it's a strangulated.
28:15
SPEAKER_00: That's a word.
28:16
SPEAKER_00: It sounds weird.
28:18
SPEAKER_00: But that says a strangulated cry.
28:20
SPEAKER_00: So I think it's meant in a different way.
28:22
SPEAKER_01: Is it strangulated or strangled?
28:24
SPEAKER_01: Oh, there we go.
28:25
SPEAKER_01: Strangulate is nothing but a longer version of strangle.
28:28
SPEAKER_01: I'm actually smarter.
28:31
SPEAKER_01: Megan's smarter.
28:32
SPEAKER_01: I win.
28:33
SPEAKER_01: I'm smarter.
28:34
SPEAKER_01: I won.
28:35
SPEAKER_01: I win.
28:36
SPEAKER_01: There's no stick.
28:37
SPEAKER_01: I won it.
28:38
SPEAKER_00: Okay.
28:39
SPEAKER_00: Strangulate.
28:40
SPEAKER_00: Maybe conversate's a word.
28:41
SPEAKER_00: We should look that up later.
28:43
SPEAKER_01: Another time.
28:44
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
28:45
SPEAKER_01: So by mas by was strangulated.
28:49
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
28:50
SPEAKER_01: No, he wasn't.
28:50
SPEAKER_01: No, he was not.
28:52
SPEAKER_01: Damn it.
28:53
SPEAKER_01: Sorry.
28:54
SPEAKER_01: I'm so sorry.
28:55
SPEAKER_01: What's his name?
28:56
SPEAKER_01: By Mati Das.
28:57
SPEAKER_01: So they're sawing him down, and he is muttering the prayers as they're sawing him from head to loin.
29:04
SPEAKER_01: A rumor has it, take it for what it is.
29:08
unknown: I don't believe it.
29:09
SPEAKER_01: But they said even when his body was completely separated into two halves, both sides of his lips were still.
29:20
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's it was a little much for that.
29:21
SPEAKER_00: I believe in a lot of things in this earth.
29:24
SPEAKER_00: No.
29:25
SPEAKER_01: No.
29:26
SPEAKER_01: Be open-minded for this episode.
29:28
SPEAKER_00: I am, but that's ridiculous.
29:30
SPEAKER_00: Your brain's severed.
29:32
SPEAKER_01: Anyway, continue.
29:34
SPEAKER_01: So that was the first one.
29:35
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
29:36
SPEAKER_01: We're only a third of the way done on this part of the execution.
29:39
SPEAKER_01: Strangulate.
29:40
SPEAKER_01: His brother by Sati DOS was put into a large cauldron.
29:46
SPEAKER_01: Like Richard Roos.
29:48
SPEAKER_01: Like Richard Roos.
29:49
SPEAKER_01: See season one.
29:50
SPEAKER_01: They didn't dunk him in though.
29:52
SPEAKER_01: They kind of just built a little soup.
29:55
SPEAKER_00: So it like started in a simmer.
29:57
SPEAKER_01: Mm-hmm.
29:58
SPEAKER_01: They put him in water and then they put it over fire.
30:02
SPEAKER_01: And then they just heated it up.
30:04
SPEAKER_00: Honestly, I think that might be better than Richard Roos, where it's already a vat of liquid and they dunk you in.
30:09
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
30:10
SPEAKER_00: Because then you kind of get used to it gradually and you're like, this is comfortable, and then it's too much and then it's over.
30:15
SPEAKER_00: Versus I think you reacting to hot liquid like instantly is, I don't know, different sensations.
30:22
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, but I feel like I don't know.
30:24
SPEAKER_00: I feel like other parts of your body would shut down first before you're in immense pain.
30:28
SPEAKER_01: Maybe.
30:29
SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
30:30
SPEAKER_01: They boiled him alive until he was like a charred block of body, is what I read.
30:36
SPEAKER_01: Like just charred up.
30:39
SPEAKER_01: The third one, who wasn't a brother but had like a similar name by Dial Das.
30:45
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
30:46
SPEAKER_01: He was burned alive.
30:48
SPEAKER_01: That's humane.
30:49
SPEAKER_00: Of the three, I guess you'd take that away.
30:52
SPEAKER_00: I know.
30:52
SPEAKER_00: I would and the guru's watching all of this.
30:56
SPEAKER_01: The guru's watching all of it.
30:57
SPEAKER_01: Because that was their dealing.
30:58
SPEAKER_01: Because they're they're saying, well, they're saying convert to Islam.
31:01
SPEAKER_01: And he's torturing it, they're torturing and executing his men in front of him until he can convert, and he refuses.
31:08
SPEAKER_01: He says, I'm not going to convert.
31:10
SPEAKER_01: Right, right, right.
31:10
SPEAKER_01: And then finally, because he doesn't convert, they behead him.
31:15
SPEAKER_01: Oh, that's okay.
31:16
SPEAKER_00: Behead the guru.
31:17
SPEAKER_00: Right.
31:18
SPEAKER_00: Which, again, better than the other methods, but still.
31:21
SPEAKER_01: I mean, I guess that's what you get as a guru.
31:23
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
31:23
SPEAKER_01: I also think it's funny because they mentioned one of the brothers was a cook.
31:27
SPEAKER_01: So I think the one who was boiled was the cook, which is just like Richard Roos.
31:31
SPEAKER_00: Oh, interesting.
31:32
SPEAKER_00: Why do they do that?
31:34
SPEAKER_00: They're weird like that.
31:35
SPEAKER_00: It's like a Don't be a cook.
31:36
SPEAKER_00: What do you call it?
31:37
SPEAKER_00: Like cruel and unusual punishment type of thing.
31:40
SPEAKER_01: Don't be a cook if you don't want to be cooked.
31:43
SPEAKER_00: Perfect.
31:44
SPEAKER_00: Um, on that note, so that is our.
31:46
SPEAKER_00: Did you have anything else to add?
31:47
SPEAKER_00: No, that that was really it.
31:49
SPEAKER_01: I mean, the only other thing is he had a son, which Elizabeth is gonna get into.
31:54
SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
31:55
SPEAKER_00: So we've talked about the fifth guru being executed by burning.
31:59
SPEAKER_00: Now we've had the ninth guru being executed by beheading, but then also they did those awful things to his servants, right?
32:06
SPEAKER_00: So this man's son, so Teague's son, is kind of our main person of the evening.
32:12
SPEAKER_00: It's um Guru Gobind Singh.
32:14
SPEAKER_00: And so Guru Gobind Singh is only nine years old when they execute his father.
32:19
SPEAKER_00: And again, it's a very public display, it's a public execution.
32:23
SPEAKER_00: I'm not sure if Gobind was there to see it.
32:26
SPEAKER_01: I'd be curious to know.
32:27
SPEAKER_01: I I will I want to say no because they transported him so far away.
32:31
SPEAKER_01: Right.
32:32
SPEAKER_01: They transported him.
32:32
SPEAKER_01: They kept him in that metal cage, and and he was arrested for four months.
32:36
SPEAKER_01: So I don't think his family was prepared to see it.
32:40
SPEAKER_01: But I could be wrong, right?
32:41
SPEAKER_01: Honestly, there's a lot we're learning with this whole story.
32:43
SPEAKER_01: Right.
32:44
SPEAKER_00: Um, but despite all of the things, the lights just flickered really weirdly.
32:50
SPEAKER_00: Spooky.
32:51
SPEAKER_00: Sorry.
32:52
SPEAKER_00: By Mati?
32:53
SPEAKER_01: Oh.
32:54
SPEAKER_00: Anyway, um, so but despite all these kind of horrible things that have happened to the line of gurus, like this didn't affect Gobine's um like views at all of of uh Sikh is Sikhism.
33:06
SPEAKER_00: You say Sikh, I say Sikh.
33:07
SPEAKER_00: Sikhism.
33:08
SPEAKER_00: Sikhism.
33:09
SPEAKER_01: I think it is Sikh.
33:10
SPEAKER_01: I think you're right.
33:11
SPEAKER_01: I think it's Sikhism.
33:12
SPEAKER_00: Well, you say Sikh, but I think the documentaries we watched, they kept saying sick.
33:15
SPEAKER_01: Hold on, I I keep doing my Oh your pronunciation.
33:19
SPEAKER_01: Um Sikh is um pronunciation.
33:24
SPEAKER_01: Sikh S Sik.
33:26
SPEAKER_01: Sikhism.
33:27
SPEAKER_01: Sikhism.
33:28
SPEAKER_01: Sikhism.
33:29
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
33:29
SPEAKER_01: I think it's also hard because sometimes when we watch the shows, yeah, they have accents as well.
33:34
SPEAKER_01: So I don't know how we're supposed to say.
33:36
SPEAKER_01: I feel like Sikh sounds better.
33:38
unknown: Sikh.
33:38
SPEAKER_00: Okay.
33:39
SPEAKER_00: We're gonna try to say that.
33:40
SPEAKER_00: Um, so despite all of that, he's still very devout with Sikhism, right?
33:44
SPEAKER_00: And he becomes the next guru as like a nine-year-old, which is pretty crazy.
33:48
SPEAKER_00: Because again, he inherits the light.
33:50
SPEAKER_00: Like a big part of this is that you're you don't just like learn to be um a guru.
33:56
SPEAKER_00: You're like you're born with the light.
33:58
SPEAKER_00: The light passes from one guru to another.
34:00
SPEAKER_00: Um, so again, so he still upholds these values of equality, social justice, service to others, tolerance.
34:07
SPEAKER_00: Like, um, again, to re-emphasize the beliefs a bit, they believe in one God.
34:11
SPEAKER_00: They are all about truthfulness and an honest life.
34:14
SPEAKER_00: They also really believe in like an honest living.
34:17
SPEAKER_00: Like, you're not really supposed to be to reference like a rope drop episode.
34:21
SPEAKER_00: You're not like in the burial society collecting money.
34:24
SPEAKER_00: You're you're you're working with your hands, you're sweating, like you're doing a good, honest day's work type of thing.
34:30
SPEAKER_00: And you're not just like getting money for yourself and your family, you're sharing it with the community, like you mentioned before.
34:36
SPEAKER_00: So he still doubles down on this whole on this whole lifestyle.
34:40
SPEAKER_00: So to the point where he actually like founded new pillars of Sikhism.
34:46
SPEAKER_00: So he didn't just again like uphold the same values, he went deeper into Sikhism and created kind of a whole new subsect of Sikhism, which um I know you'll get into.
34:57
SPEAKER_00: But before we get into what those what those foundational things are, just some other notes about him as a kiss.
35:03
SPEAKER_00: Please.
35:03
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, sure.
35:04
SPEAKER_00: So he learned martial arts when he was really young.
35:06
SPEAKER_00: So he became like the small little warrior.
35:08
SPEAKER_00: Um, he got really into horseback riding and archery.
35:11
SPEAKER_00: He had his first wife by the time he was 10.
35:14
SPEAKER_00: Ooh.
35:14
SPEAKER_00: I know.
35:15
SPEAKER_00: I think at this first at this point, it's like polygamy, you know, it's like in this society.
35:21
SPEAKER_00: So it's like, yes, women are equal, but I think it's still acceptable to have multiple wives, which is kind of common of the era.
35:28
SPEAKER_00: That's a pull.
35:29
SPEAKER_00: He did.
35:29
SPEAKER_00: So he had he got his first wife when he was 10.
35:32
SPEAKER_00: They had two sons together, obviously, once they became childbearing age.
35:36
SPEAKER_00: And then he got another wife.
35:37
SPEAKER_00: So again, not like divorced, like still just had another wife.
35:41
SPEAKER_00: Um had an add-on.
35:43
SPEAKER_00: An add-on wife, second wife, and then the sequel.
35:46
SPEAKER_00: The sequel had two kids with her, and then when he was 33, got another wife, even though he said they had no, like they had no children, and I don't think they were even physical together.
35:57
SPEAKER_00: He said it was more of a spiritual marriage, which is interesting.
36:00
SPEAKER_00: That sounds nice.
36:01
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
36:01
SPEAKER_00: Um, so that's just a little bit about like him and his personal life and all of that.
36:05
SPEAKER_00: But aside from his personal life, you can tell us a little bit about what he did to kind of further Sikhism.
36:11
SPEAKER_01: Well, what's kind of cool though, too, because so what year is this?
36:14
SPEAKER_01: 1690?
36:16
SPEAKER_01: I think so.
36:17
SPEAKER_01: Wait, no.
36:18
SPEAKER_00: He was Yeah, yeah, yes, you're right.
36:20
SPEAKER_00: Like late 1600s.
36:22
SPEAKER_01: Very late 1600s.
36:23
SPEAKER_01: So it's funny how you say he's learning horseback riding and martial arts.
36:29
SPEAKER_01: Um, he was learning different languages, he was reading and writing.
36:32
SPEAKER_01: And it's funny because when you think of what's happening in um the West with, you know, at this time too, it's not that different, you know.
36:42
SPEAKER_01: Right.
36:43
SPEAKER_01: If someone is um being raised in a I guess they were kind of prominent, right?
36:48
SPEAKER_01: Because he's coming from a line of gurus and his father was a guru.
36:51
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
36:52
SPEAKER_00: But um, you know, education again, they believe in education, but not again, necessarily like classism.
36:58
SPEAKER_01: Sure, there's no classism, but they still wanted to educate and yeah, and and in the same time period, it's just interesting to think what's happening in some of the other countries and what's happening, because go me in my brain, I'm like, okay, what's going on in England?
37:12
SPEAKER_01: What's going on?
37:13
SPEAKER_01: Okay, Salem witch trials are kind of happening around this time as well.
37:17
SPEAKER_01: Um, anyways, I I just like to think putting into perspective what's happening around the world in the 1690s.
37:25
SPEAKER_01: Totally.
37:25
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's oh sorry, I knocked it interesting.
37:28
SPEAKER_00: You're fine.
37:29
SPEAKER_00: Um I also think in the offseason we should do another because remember we used to do timeline checks?
37:33
SPEAKER_00: Oh, yeah, when we had like five episodes, but now we have like 70.
37:36
SPEAKER_00: I was gonna say now that we have 70, it's a little bit harder to do, but it'd be fun to do an episode where we kind of put like we could make it a little more condensed and put a little timeline together of what's going on, where in the world.
37:47
SPEAKER_01: I'll let you do that.
37:47
SPEAKER_01: All right.
37:48
SPEAKER_01: So the year is 1699, and Go Bind is putting together what is called the Khalsa.
37:56
SPEAKER_01: It's kind of like a sub-category of of the Sikhs, right?
38:01
SPEAKER_01: Of Sikhism.
38:02
SPEAKER_01: And it's a warrior community, which is kind of cool.
38:06
SPEAKER_01: And it's not warriors in the sense where we're not thinking Vikings pirates, they're not out for revenge, they're not hostile.
38:14
SPEAKER_01: Again, they're Sikhism is all about peace and yes, reducing hostility.
38:20
SPEAKER_01: Right.
38:21
SPEAKER_01: So their philosophy is they are only going to attack if all other measure has failed, and it's really for the defense of righteousness.
38:31
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
38:32
SPEAKER_01: Really, only when they have to pull out their sword is when they will pull out their sword as a they're not gonna just lay there and be murdered.
38:40
SPEAKER_01: They're going to defend themselves, but they still needed this community within their religion of someone who's gonna defend them and fight for them.
38:47
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and that's what Go Bind is putting together.
38:50
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and really just to capitalize on that thought too, like he specifically was like, fighting is not about revenge, it's not about greed, it's not about destruction.
38:59
SPEAKER_00: It's just again, like you said, like as a last resort to fight against persecution, tyranny, and defend your religious values.
39:06
SPEAKER_01: Yep, exactly.
39:08
SPEAKER_01: And so he's starting to put together this little congregation, and this is how he he does this.
39:14
SPEAKER_01: I like this.
39:15
SPEAKER_01: So he's in front of a tent and he has all of his people in front of him, and he asks for a volunteer.
39:22
SPEAKER_01: Of course, someone eagerly raises their hand and he brings them into the tent.
39:27
SPEAKER_01: Hi, it's Megan.
39:28
SPEAKER_01: Hey, meeny me in the front menod.
39:32
SPEAKER_01: And then a few moments later, Gobind walks out of the tent with a bloody sword.
39:38
SPEAKER_01: Oh, the volunteer is not with him.
39:41
SPEAKER_01: So people kind of start shuffling around, like, okay.
39:44
SPEAKER_01: And he goes, I need another volunteer.
39:46
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
39:46
SPEAKER_01: Someone else raises their hand.
39:48
SPEAKER_01: Same thing.
39:49
SPEAKER_01: He goes into the tent a few moments later, only go bind comes out with a bloody sword.
39:53
SPEAKER_01: Now he's bloodier than he was the first time.
39:55
SPEAKER_00: Oh no.
39:57
SPEAKER_01: He does this a total of five times.
39:59
SPEAKER_01: So he gets five volunteers who are watching their predecessor walk into the tent, not come back out, but with go bind with a bloody sword.
40:07
SPEAKER_01: Right.
40:08
SPEAKER_00: I'm sure those pauses in between volunteers got a bit longer every day.
40:12
SPEAKER_01: Sure.
40:12
SPEAKER_01: Everyone's kind of looking to their left and looking to their own.
40:17
SPEAKER_01: I'm picturing when uh Ron Weasley like pushes forward Harry to go and like pet the griffin during care of magical creatures class.
40:27
SPEAKER_01: Like, you everyone takes a step backwards and oh shit.
40:31
SPEAKER_01: Oh, I guess I'm the volunteer.
40:33
SPEAKER_01: So, so, anyways, this is where it gets funny.
40:36
SPEAKER_01: Uh, all five of those volunteers then walk out of the tent, kind of like smug looking.
40:43
SPEAKER_01: You got new hats on.
40:44
SPEAKER_01: Ooh, new gear, new swag.
40:47
SPEAKER_01: They were declared the Pongee paid.
40:51
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
40:51
SPEAKER_01: Payer.
40:51
SPEAKER_01: Sorry, Ponji Pyer.
40:53
SPEAKER_01: Pyre.
40:53
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
40:54
SPEAKER_01: P-A-Y-R-E.
40:55
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I think it's pyre is what they say.
40:57
SPEAKER_01: Pyre.
40:58
SPEAKER_01: But again, there was an accent.
41:00
SPEAKER_01: I know.
41:01
SPEAKER_01: So hard.
41:02
SPEAKER_01: Maybe we just need accents, and then everything we say will just be okay.
41:05
SPEAKER_00: I think this would be so much worse if we had accents.
41:08
SPEAKER_00: We do have American accents.
41:09
SPEAKER_00: People called us out on that.
41:12
SPEAKER_00: At least I'm not from California as I am.
41:16
SPEAKER_01: At least I'm not a valley girl.
41:18
SPEAKER_01: At least I don't talk like this, but I kind of do.
41:20
SPEAKER_01: Kind of do.
41:21
SPEAKER_01: Sorry.
41:22
SPEAKER_01: Uh so those five volunteers were declared the leaders of the Khalsa because they were the only ones that were still brave enough despite what was happening.
41:34
SPEAKER_01: It's all about self-sacrifice.
41:35
SPEAKER_01: It's all about are you brave enough to walk into the tent without knowing what your fate's going to be?
41:40
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
41:40
SPEAKER_01: Are you um selfless?
41:42
SPEAKER_01: Are you gonna do this for others?
41:43
SPEAKER_01: Do you have faith in your religion?
41:45
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
41:45
SPEAKER_01: Do you have faith in your guru?
41:47
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
41:47
SPEAKER_01: And um, yeah, and are you gonna just do a selfless act if you know you're volunteering and it's it's you're helping out your brother next to you by taking that spot.
41:57
SPEAKER_01: Right.
41:57
SPEAKER_01: So that's how he gets his five leaders.
41:59
SPEAKER_01: And I want to talk a little bit about what this community is about.
42:03
SPEAKER_01: So we already know there is a warrior community all about peace, but they're also very disciplined.
42:09
SPEAKER_01: There's no tobacco, um the type of meat, halala, halara.
42:15
SPEAKER_01: I think halal.
42:16
SPEAKER_01: Halal, halal, thank you.
42:17
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, which I didn't know what halal is, is the way that the animal is killed.
42:22
SPEAKER_01: I learned that recently.
42:23
SPEAKER_01: I didn't know that, which is interesting.
42:25
SPEAKER_01: Um, no adultery, all that.
42:29
SPEAKER_01: And then Go Bind is really fighting for any type of persecution against non-Muslims.
42:35
SPEAKER_01: Right.
42:35
SPEAKER_01: That's his entire purpose.
42:37
SPEAKER_01: They're taxing non-Muslims, they're putting specific taxes on groups of religions, hence the Sikhs and the Hindus.
42:45
SPEAKER_01: If they're doing specific practices related to their religion, just really any opportunity the Muslims can get, because right now the moguls are taking over this territory.
42:58
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
42:58
SPEAKER_01: And they're aggressive, they are not tolerant, they don't like the Sikhs, they don't like the um the Hindus.
43:05
SPEAKER_01: And so uh yeah, Gobind is there as their guru and as their warrior to try to defend them.
43:13
SPEAKER_01: Overall, Gobind had a really strong legacy, and he was a really amazing defender for the for the Sikhs.
43:20
SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
43:21
SPEAKER_00: But he is the last guru in this line of gurus.
43:24
SPEAKER_00: So we mentioned that there's 10 gurus, right?
43:27
SPEAKER_00: And it's not, it's not really for the reasons you think.
43:30
SPEAKER_00: It's I mean, we're gonna get into some dark stuff, but darker than someone getting sawed in half.
43:36
SPEAKER_00: Cool.
43:36
SPEAKER_00: Maybe not that dark.
43:37
SPEAKER_00: Click on a lot of work.
43:39
SPEAKER_00: Um, but one thing that he did as a guru is he actually like finalized the primary scripture for for Sikhism, and it's something called the Guru Granth Um Sahib.
43:52
SPEAKER_00: Sahib.
43:53
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
43:53
SPEAKER_00: And so Grant me translates to book, sahib translates to Lord.
43:57
SPEAKER_00: Okay.
43:58
SPEAKER_00: So what this means is like it's A version of like the Bible or the Quran.
44:02
SPEAKER_00: It's basically saying, like, this is the primary scripture, and it's going to be your spiritual guide.
44:08
SPEAKER_00: So he kind of declares himself the last guru because he says you don't need a human as a guru.
44:15
SPEAKER_00: Like all you need is this scripture, and like there's no need to elevate any one of us amongst others because it's about the word of God.
44:23
SPEAKER_00: It's about this specific like book.
44:26
SPEAKER_00: So he declares the text to be eternal, which is kind of like I think very romantic.
44:31
SPEAKER_00: Like he really removes, you know, himself, his ego, his humanness from the situation, and says, Yes, like for two centuries, two and a half centuries, there's been gurus that you look to for guidance, but you don't need to look to us, you just need to look inside yourself and to the scripture.
44:45
SPEAKER_00: I love that.
44:46
SPEAKER_00: Kind of nice, right?
44:46
SPEAKER_00: I kind of like that.
44:47
SPEAKER_00: I love, I like, I like these gurus.
44:50
SPEAKER_00: I like Sikhism.
44:51
SPEAKER_01: I know.
44:52
SPEAKER_01: We were like, the more we were learning, we're like, well, that sounds good.
44:55
SPEAKER_01: Kind of like that.
44:56
SPEAKER_01: I'm kind of onto that as well.
44:58
SPEAKER_00: I'm like, fifth largest religion, you might have gotten two new followers tonight.
45:02
SPEAKER_00: Um, so so anyway, um, but as Megan said, unfortunately, the Mughal Empire is starting to double up on their hostility towards the Sikh people.
45:13
SPEAKER_00: So there's one Emperor in particular.
45:15
SPEAKER_00: His name is Emperor Arungazeb.
45:18
SPEAKER_00: Good job.
45:18
SPEAKER_00: Thank you.
45:19
SPEAKER_00: I tried.
45:20
SPEAKER_00: Had to syllab.
45:22
SPEAKER_00: Um so strangulate.
45:24
SPEAKER_00: Strangulate.
45:25
SPEAKER_00: Arugazeb issued an order to exterminate Gobind and his entire family.
45:31
SPEAKER_00: So even though Gobind is, you know, and like basically said there's not gonna be any more gurus, the final guru is the scripture.
45:38
SPEAKER_00: Like the Islam people are still not satisfied and they still need to have blood.
45:42
SPEAKER_00: They still need to like eliminate the gurus in their line.
45:46
SPEAKER_00: So this essentially leads into about 14 different wars, which it's interesting they call them wars because they were of grand scale.
45:54
SPEAKER_00: I think of them more like battles because they're just like smaller sieges and stuff, but they were, again, they a lot of blood was like lost.
46:01
SPEAKER_00: A lot of like people died on both sides.
46:03
SPEAKER_00: Um, but anytime that there they had run-ins with Gobind, Gobind was very adamant that they would never take captives and they would never like harm a place of worship, even if it was like a Muslim temple or Muslim mosque.
46:17
SPEAKER_00: Like it was like, you know, let's not let's make sure that we're fighting for the reasons of like, again, defending righteousness, and we're not here to like persecute anyone else's gods, we're not here to to harm, you know, each other as brothers.
46:31
SPEAKER_00: So even throughout all of these wars, he's still maintaining that peace and that love and that like, hey, we're all one humankind type of spirit.
46:39
SPEAKER_00: Um, but to go off of the fact that again, he does have four children.
46:43
SPEAKER_00: Unfortunately, these children are very vulnerable.
46:46
SPEAKER_00: They're they're still fairly young.
46:48
SPEAKER_00: He has a five-year-old, an eight-year-old, a 13-year-old, and a 17-year-old.
46:53
SPEAKER_00: Oh, jeez.
46:54
SPEAKER_00: So all very young children, essentially.
46:57
SPEAKER_00: And they're in these wars.
46:58
SPEAKER_00: The older kids, the 13 and the 17-year-olds.
47:01
SPEAKER_00: Older, quote unquote.
47:01
SPEAKER_00: I know, quote unquote, the adults, they're actually fighting in these wars.
47:05
SPEAKER_01: Maybe I get maybe the 17-year-olds, because that would be pretty similar to what we've seen in any other um in America.
47:14
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
47:19
SPEAKER_01: But yeah.
47:20
SPEAKER_00: Um, but they but the young ones are still trying, they're still trying to keep them safe and kind of away from the violence.
47:27
SPEAKER_00: Um, so there's one of the battles, one of these wars, is called the Second Siege of Andipur.
47:33
SPEAKER_00: And this is now 1705.
47:35
SPEAKER_00: So it's just turn of the century into the 1700s.
47:38
SPEAKER_00: And so Gobine's family is broken up into two groups to kind of escape this siege.
47:43
SPEAKER_00: And his two sons, uh, Zorawar and Fey uh Fateh, they're taken captive because they're removed from the rest of their family.
47:52
SPEAKER_00: So they think they're being led to a place of safety, but in fact, they're actually being taken to a place called Sir Hind.
48:00
SPEAKER_00: So in Sir Hind, they're again faced by like the Muslim authorities, and they're trying to say, once again, you have to convert to Islam.
48:10
SPEAKER_00: Like if you want to live, if you value your life, let it go.
48:13
SPEAKER_01: You will convert to Islam.
48:15
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
48:16
SPEAKER_00: And even these young boys who at this point are, you know, eight and five, they're they're in captivity so long that I think they finally get to be like one year older, so they're nine and six.
48:26
SPEAKER_01: That's funny because I read nine and six, so that makes sense.
48:29
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
48:29
SPEAKER_01: They started that young.
48:30
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
48:31
SPEAKER_00: Gotcha.
48:31
SPEAKER_00: Um, but they were they were captured, they refused to convert to Islam throughout that whole time.
48:37
SPEAKER_00: And so there's a little bit of discrepancy as to how they were executed, which is very sad, the fact that they were executed.
48:43
SPEAKER_00: They're so young.
48:44
SPEAKER_01: But I don't I this is for sure our youngest execution, and we apologize in advance.
48:49
SPEAKER_00: And I think I'm trying to think how young the youngest Romanoff was.
48:54
SPEAKER_01: I don't think he he wasn't six.
48:56
SPEAKER_01: I think he was like a little older.
48:57
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I think he was like nine.
48:58
SPEAKER_01: Because he had that weird glass body issue.
49:02
SPEAKER_01: He was a little bubble boy.
49:03
SPEAKER_00: Now we're insulting the Romanov family.
49:05
unknown: Yeah.
49:06
SPEAKER_00: Anyway um, so so again, even these young boys removed from their family and removed from anyone that's of the same faith, are still holding true to their Sikhism and their beliefs.
49:17
SPEAKER_00: So they were either A, beheaded, we're not sure, or B, there's a big story out there saying that they were entombed or like bricked.
49:29
SPEAKER_00: Meaning they literally like put their bodies into a wall, whether it was they put them physically into a wall and sealed it, or they built a wall around them.
49:38
SPEAKER_00: And essentially you die of like, I guess, suffocation and maybe hunger, yeah, starvation.
49:45
SPEAKER_01: Thirst.
49:45
SPEAKER_01: Um, the the proper term for it is immurement.
49:49
SPEAKER_01: Immurement.
49:50
SPEAKER_01: Immurement.
49:51
SPEAKER_01: I look, I I learned it.
49:53
SPEAKER_01: Tell me you learned it.
49:54
SPEAKER_01: I learned it.
49:54
SPEAKER_01: Strangulated and I learned.
49:56
SPEAKER_01: I learned immurement is the actual term for like an execution of being bricked in.
50:02
SPEAKER_01: Oh, that's crazy.
50:03
SPEAKER_01: I know.
50:04
SPEAKER_01: I didn't know there was a word for that.
50:05
SPEAKER_01: I just can't believe how creative we are.
50:07
SPEAKER_01: You know, unbeheaded podcast.
50:10
SPEAKER_01: Nice.
50:11
SPEAKER_01: You like that?
50:11
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, we'll put a little graphic with it.
50:13
unknown: Thanks.
50:14
SPEAKER_00: I like that too.
50:15
SPEAKER_00: Thank you.
50:16
SPEAKER_00: Um, so unfortunately, like that's how these two die.
50:19
SPEAKER_00: And that's actually where we found this story because we found that the sons were executed and we were like, oh my gosh, we're gonna do a whole episode on these poor children who are barely young enough to have let's make this podcast worse and do an execution on a six-year-old.
50:33
SPEAKER_01: That's why we were a little hesitant because we're like, this is this is dark.
50:36
SPEAKER_01: This might be too dark.
50:37
SPEAKER_01: We've had some feedback, we get a little too insensitive about things, so here we go.
50:42
SPEAKER_01: Also, I have another word for you.
50:43
SPEAKER_01: Oh.
50:44
SPEAKER_01: Extrajudicial execution.
50:47
SPEAKER_01: You told me about this.
50:48
SPEAKER_01: What is this?
50:49
SPEAKER_01: I didn't know this was a term.
50:50
SPEAKER_01: Go ahead.
50:51
SPEAKER_01: This is a term when there's a formal execution.
50:57
SPEAKER_01: However, the state or the authorities and it's lawful.
51:00
SPEAKER_01: It's a they also call it an extra an extrajudicial killing.
51:04
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
51:05
SPEAKER_01: Basically, it's killing someone lawfully, but there was no trial, really no reason.
51:10
SPEAKER_01: The only reason was that somebody within the government wanted that person dead.
51:15
SPEAKER_01: But there's because they didn't have a trial, they I mean, honestly, he's six years old.
51:19
SPEAKER_01: He's innocent, he didn't do anything.
51:22
SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
51:22
SPEAKER_01: So that's that's what they call that.
51:24
SPEAKER_01: If um the job got done, but there's really no reason why it should have ever happened.
51:29
SPEAKER_00: Right.
51:29
SPEAKER_00: And I mean, I the again, that emperor kind of issued the death of Gobind and all of his family.
51:34
SPEAKER_00: So it's like I guess you could say Anne Boleyn was an extra judicial, but she had a trial.
51:39
SPEAKER_01: She did have a trial.
51:40
SPEAKER_01: Anyways, I mean, I guarantee we just want to prove her.
51:43
SPEAKER_01: I just really wanted to talk about the tutors at least once.
51:45
SPEAKER_00: Good job.
51:46
SPEAKER_00: Thanks.
51:46
SPEAKER_00: I got it in there.
51:47
SPEAKER_00: Um, and unfortunately, Gobind is still living, so he's aware that the sons died.
51:52
SPEAKER_00: And even the grandmother in this family, she it was said it was said that she died of shock after hearing the news of her grandson's execution.
52:01
SPEAKER_00: So now the whole family is like very aware of the execution.
52:04
SPEAKER_00: It obviously is she magic.
52:07
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's putting a different tone on these wars.
52:09
SPEAKER_00: Um, but the older boys didn't get off like, you know, scotch-free either.
52:15
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
52:16
SPEAKER_00: They weren't executed, but just a bit later, um, in the battle of Cam Kamakur, again, if I say that correctly, sorry, but the the eldest boys died in that war fighting, and their names were um Aegit and Juhar.
52:31
SPEAKER_00: Juhar.
52:32
SPEAKER_01: Um, we do have a quote from Guru Go Bind after the execution.
52:37
SPEAKER_01: The uh yeah, after he found out that his two sons were executed, he said it stoically and calmly.
52:44
SPEAKER_01: And then he wrote actually he wrote this.
52:46
SPEAKER_01: He said, What use is it to put out a few sparks when you raise a mighty flame instead?
52:54
SPEAKER_01: Calling his son sparks.
52:57
SPEAKER_01: Almost that, or I read it as like almost opposite, where they were trying to do these other things, but instead, like the worst of it happened.
53:06
SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
53:07
SPEAKER_01: It's that's a that's a good quote.
53:08
SPEAKER_00: That sounds like David Cooker.
53:11
SPEAKER_00: Like this was a sacrifice for the greater good, or what's what's all this worth if I lost everything?
53:17
SPEAKER_00: Kind of thing.
53:18
SPEAKER_01: And then just to wrap us up, so what happens to Go Bind?
53:22
SPEAKER_01: I have good news.
53:24
SPEAKER_01: He was not executed.
53:26
SPEAKER_01: But uh the bad news is he still died.
53:29
SPEAKER_01: The year is 1707.
53:32
SPEAKER_01: The emperor, who was the same emperor who had his sons executed, his father executed, was doing all this persecution.
53:40
SPEAKER_01: So that guy's still on in power?
53:42
SPEAKER_01: Well, he kicks it.
53:42
SPEAKER_01: He kicks the bucket, he dies.
53:44
SPEAKER_01: But there's this big fight over his succession between his four sons.
53:49
SPEAKER_01: And there was one son that Gobind actually supported.
53:53
SPEAKER_02: Oh.
53:53
SPEAKER_01: And they set up this meeting where Gobind was gonna go meet the son that he supported.
53:59
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
54:00
SPEAKER_01: Along the way, though, he was being tracked.
54:02
SPEAKER_01: And unfortunately, there was two Afghans who were responsible for tracking his whereabouts and they assassinate him.
54:11
SPEAKER_00: Who were they hired by, do we know?
54:14
SPEAKER_00: I don't.
54:14
SPEAKER_00: Okay.
54:15
SPEAKER_01: But someone in like in the I it's in there.
54:17
SPEAKER_01: I don't have it in my notes.
54:19
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
54:19
SPEAKER_01: It could be one of the other brothers.
54:21
SPEAKER_01: But probably someone from like someone who doesn't like him.
54:26
SPEAKER_01: I think that is my final theory.
54:30
SPEAKER_01: Someone who didn't like Go Bind had him murdered.
54:33
SPEAKER_00: I mean, obviously, it's probably someone from like the Mughal Empire or something like that.
54:38
SPEAKER_01: Um they stab him twice.
54:41
SPEAKER_01: And the near the heart one.
54:44
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, like right right below his heart, and it took a few days for him to die.
54:48
SPEAKER_01: But um his legacy lived on though.
54:51
SPEAKER_00: It did.
54:52
SPEAKER_00: And I think people who um still uh still believe, you know, in Sikhism, like, you know, what do you call them?
54:59
SPEAKER_00: Sikhs?
55:00
SPEAKER_00: Sikhs.
55:01
SPEAKER_00: Seekers, that's a good word.
55:03
SPEAKER_00: Um, I, you know, very much use him as this symbol, right?
55:05
SPEAKER_00: Because it's like he never backed down.
55:07
SPEAKER_00: He always like fought for his beliefs and his uh specific belief in righteousness, and again, like defending his belief of the one God and never in a destructive way, never to hinder anyone else's like faith.
55:20
SPEAKER_00: Um, and they use him also as a symbol of just like again, he was the one to kind of move on from human gurus and the like the flaws we all have as humans to putting it in scripture and making it this like religion that still thrives today.
55:33
SPEAKER_01: He was surrounded around death all the time.
55:36
SPEAKER_01: His father, yeah, his sons, his family was crumbling around him.
55:42
SPEAKER_00: He literally, yeah, he within his lifetime, he saw not again, maybe not like actually saw with his eyes, but he was around for his father being executed, two sons being executed, and two other sons dying in battle.
55:55
SPEAKER_00: You know, plus like other family members that were just lost while fighting or or running away.
55:59
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and all the, I'm sure, hundreds of thousands of of men and women fought too.
56:06
SPEAKER_01: Fighting in the battles.
56:07
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, because it was very I don't want to say gender neutral, but I mean again, like both genders were seen as equal.
56:13
SPEAKER_00: So a lot of women did fight with the Sikhs, which is that's awesome.
56:17
SPEAKER_00: I wish we had those stories, like a Joan of Arc of Sikhism.
56:21
SPEAKER_01: Anyways, I'm um I'm proud for us for like getting out of our comfort zone.
56:25
SPEAKER_01: And when I say us, I say me, like I was very much having to learn all new things for this episode.
56:33
SPEAKER_01: It was good.
56:34
SPEAKER_00: It's always nice going to a new area of the world too, just in terms of like geography, and like you said, kind of context and a global scheme of things, like okay, what's going on in the world?
56:43
SPEAKER_00: Like you know, talk about him growing up like uh learning horsery and archery.
56:48
SPEAKER_00: Horsery.
56:49
SPEAKER_01: Is that a word?
56:50
SPEAKER_01: Look it up.
56:50
SPEAKER_01: Who knows?
56:51
SPEAKER_01: Horsery.
56:52
SPEAKER_01: We're just gonna this is the this is the episode of looking up words and how to pronounce things.
56:57
SPEAKER_01: Horsery.
56:58
SPEAKER_01: That is not a word.
57:00
SPEAKER_01: It looks like it showed up on Google.
57:02
SPEAKER_01: Horsery.com.
57:03
SPEAKER_00: Designer clothing store.
57:05
SPEAKER_00: That says horsery.
57:11
SPEAKER_00: Anyway.
57:12
SPEAKER_00: Wow.
57:12
SPEAKER_00: Um, Elizabeth.
57:14
SPEAKER_00: I did make you tikamasala tonight, also.
57:17
SPEAKER_00: Oh, we didn't even say that.
57:19
SPEAKER_00: I was waiting for you to compliment my cookie.
57:20
SPEAKER_01: I'm sorry.
57:21
SPEAKER_01: I'm so sorry.
57:23
SPEAKER_01: I mean, it was only 37 minutes after the release of Tortured Poets Department Space.
57:27
SPEAKER_00: Maine was very distracted tonight.
57:29
SPEAKER_01: I was.
57:30
SPEAKER_01: It was a really good dinner.
57:31
SPEAKER_01: Uh Elizabeth slow cooked it in this crock pot all day.
57:36
SPEAKER_01: All from scratch.
57:37
SPEAKER_01: Oh, yeah.
57:37
SPEAKER_01: I thought it was really good.
57:39
SPEAKER_01: I told her it was restaurant worthy.
57:41
SPEAKER_00: Thank you.
57:41
SPEAKER_00: I made it once before, like a long time ago, so it's just been sitting in this like spreadsheet I have of recipe.
57:47
SPEAKER_00: You kind of want the recipe.
57:48
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's not bad.
57:49
SPEAKER_00: It does, it's a lot of spices involved, and you do have to like again make it overnight so it sits and marinates.
57:54
SPEAKER_00: You made that overnight?
57:55
SPEAKER_00: Well, yeah, I made it last night to marinate, and then this morning I put it in the crook pot.
57:58
SPEAKER_00: Well, thank you for doing that.
57:59
SPEAKER_00: It was really good.
58:00
SPEAKER_00: I I actually was shocked how much I already had on hand.
58:03
SPEAKER_00: Good.
58:03
SPEAKER_00: Because I like looked it up and I was like, oh, I think I have like, it's like, you know, what's it called?
58:08
SPEAKER_00: Uh garum masala and turmeric.
58:11
SPEAKER_00: Oh wow.
58:12
SPEAKER_00: Like fresh ginger, fresh garlic.
58:13
SPEAKER_00: And I just happened to have everything, and I was like, oh, like all I needed to buy was like heavy whipping cream for the book.
58:21
SPEAKER_01: I apologize I didn't bring it up sooner.
58:24
SPEAKER_01: That's fine.
58:24
SPEAKER_01: I did.
58:25
SPEAKER_01: I wanted the listeners to know.
58:27
SPEAKER_01: I need to go cry and immerse myself into Taylor's world.
58:33
SPEAKER_01: The next time you hear Megan, she will be have you you will have new favorite songs.
58:38
SPEAKER_01: I'll be a new person, actually.
58:39
SPEAKER_01: Oh.
58:40
SPEAKER_01: I'll have a new outlook on life.
58:41
SPEAKER_01: Are we rebranding?
58:43
SPEAKER_01: I'm in my tortured poets department era.
58:45
SPEAKER_01: Although I am wearing a reputation shirt tonight, so.
58:47
SPEAKER_01: Well, she might have two albums.
58:49
SPEAKER_01: So the Swifties are saying?
58:52
SPEAKER_01: There's something with the two.
58:53
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
58:54
SPEAKER_01: And maybe by the time this episode is released, we'll know what the two is about.
58:59
SPEAKER_01: And if you don't know what I'm talking about, then just unless you have a lot of time on your hands, don't get into it.
59:06
SPEAKER_00: Thank you, as uh my residential Taylor Swift guru.
59:11
SPEAKER_01: Oh we can't say that.
59:13
SPEAKER_01: Can't say that anymore.
59:14
SPEAKER_01: Um, final words.
59:15
SPEAKER_01: Do you want to call me that again?
59:17
SPEAKER_01: Because I will accept that.
59:18
SPEAKER_01: You will take it.
59:19
SPEAKER_01: Just kidding.
59:20
SPEAKER_00: Final words, Elizabeth.
59:21
SPEAKER_00: Remember to be the light in the dark.
59:24
SPEAKER_01: Oh.
59:24
SPEAKER_00: Guru.
59:26
SPEAKER_01: Guru.
59:27
SPEAKER_00: Guru.
59:27
SPEAKER_00: Don't use it lightly.