Latest / I Choose Me with Jennie Garth / Don’t give yourself cyberchondria! Here's how to search your symptoms and avoid paranoia

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Don’t give yourself cyberchondria! Here's how to search your symptoms and avoid paranoia · I Choose Me with Jennie Garth

• 0:01
  Speaker 1: You're listening to I Choose Me with Jenny Garland. Welcome
• 0:09
  Speaker 1: to I Choose Me. Okay, yes, we have all done this.
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: We have a headache or some other health symptom that's
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: caught our attention. And so what do we do? We
• 0:18
  Speaker 1: Google search. What is wrong with me? Could this be serious?
• 0:23
  Speaker 2: What do we get back?
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: We get back multiple scary diagnosis. And then we go
• 0:27
  Speaker 1: down a rabbit hole of what ifs. We have become
• 0:31
  Speaker 1: what my guest today refers to as cyberchondriacs. I don't
• 0:37
  Speaker 1: know what that is, but I think I am one
• 0:39
  Speaker 1: of them. So today, my guest knows something about all
• 0:45
  Speaker 1: of that. Dr. John White is a board-certified internist and
• 0:49
  Speaker 1: CEO of the American Medical Association, whose last job was
• 0:54
  Speaker 1: chief medical officer for WebMD.
• 0:57
  Speaker 2: That is huge.
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  Speaker 1: He's on a mission to help us search our symptoms
• 1:01
  Speaker 1: online without freaking out. Thank goodness you're here.
• 1:05
  Speaker 2: Hello, Dr.
• 1:06
  Speaker 1: White.
• 1:06
  Speaker 2: Hello. Thank you for having me.
• 1:09
  Speaker 1: I'm so pleased that you're here. This is such a
• 1:11
  Speaker 1: great topic for us to discuss. I'll be honest, I
• 1:14
  Speaker 1: have definitely Googled what's wrong with me. And you say,
• 1:18
  Speaker 1: so have a billion others. And you also say that
• 1:23
  Speaker 1: information isn't knowledge. In fact, in your TED Talk, you
• 1:28
  Speaker 1: discuss why Googling our symptoms leads us more confused. Please
• 1:33
  Speaker 1: explain all of this to me.
• 1:35
  Speaker 2: Sure. And everyone Googles their symptoms. Everyone's putting it into
• 1:41
  Speaker 2: a chatbot nowadays, and that's okay. But what you have
• 1:46
  Speaker 2: to do, Jen, is you have to put it into context.
• 1:50
  Speaker 2: And what I mean by that is, You know, a
• 1:53
  Speaker 2: chatbot or Google's not going to know everything about you.
• 1:57
  Speaker 2: What you put in determines partly what you get out.
• 2:01
  Speaker 2: And you can go down this rabbit hole where you
• 2:04
  Speaker 2: keep searching more and more information. And you're actually not
• 2:10
  Speaker 2: getting more informed. You're getting less informed and then more
• 2:15
  Speaker 2: anxious about everything. So what I say is, sure, go
• 2:20
  Speaker 2: ahead and get more information. because information can be power.
• 2:25
  Speaker 2: But you also wanna bring that to an expert, your doctor,
• 2:29
  Speaker 2: who can help you put it in the right context.
• 2:33
  Speaker 1: You were WebMD's chief medical officer. So I'm curious, how
• 2:37
  Speaker 1: did you come to see this side of it?
• 2:41
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and up until recently, I still saw patients, which
• 2:45
  Speaker 2: was nice. So my wife would say it's very humbling
• 2:49
  Speaker 2: because when you go see patients as a doctor, nobody
• 2:53
  Speaker 2: cares that I work at WebMD or doing other things.
• 2:57
  Speaker 2: They want to know, you know, am I getting my
• 2:59
  Speaker 2: GLP-1 or why do I still have knee pain? But,
• 3:03
  Speaker 2: you know, I grew up at this time where the
• 3:06
  Speaker 2: physician-patient relationship is changing. It's more of a partnership. I
• 3:12
  Speaker 2: embrace the fact that you're coming in and telling me
• 3:16
  Speaker 2: about your symptoms and what you think it may be,
• 3:19
  Speaker 2: because that's actually going to, Help us have the better
• 3:22
  Speaker 2: conversation and get to the point quicker. So if you're
• 3:26
  Speaker 2: seeing a physician or someone else who's not doing that
• 3:29
  Speaker 2: with you, it might be time to think about finding
• 3:33
  Speaker 2: someone else because you want to have a partner in
• 3:36
  Speaker 2: your care. And it's not the old way where the
• 3:38
  Speaker 2: doctor tells you to do something. They never really listen
• 3:41
  Speaker 2: that much anyway. But now at least we can have
• 3:44
  Speaker 2: a real conversation. Mm-hmm. Yes.
• 3:47
  Speaker 1: I'm wondering, though, how can we get clarity instead of confusion?
• 3:51
  Speaker 1: When we do go and search, I have a terrible
• 3:54
  Speaker 1: headache or it's 2 a.m. I just found a weird mole.
• 3:58
  Speaker 1: You know, what can we do to get the right
• 4:01
  Speaker 1: information or what should we do instead of Googling it? Right.
• 4:05
  Speaker 2: And that happens. It's always late at night where people
• 4:09
  Speaker 2: find the mole or, as you said, the headache. And
• 4:12
  Speaker 2: it is very concerning. And I get it. It's hard
• 4:15
  Speaker 2: to get a doctor. At that hour, you might be
• 4:17
  Speaker 2: able to get a telehealth visit, but still that can
• 4:20
  Speaker 2: require some work. So it's okay that people are searching
• 4:24
  Speaker 2: for this information. But at the same time, what I've
• 4:27
  Speaker 2: been telling Jenny is for people to search their health
• 4:32
  Speaker 2: information like they search their financial information. And what I
• 4:37
  Speaker 2: mean by that, you don't listen to just any influencer
• 4:42
  Speaker 2: that tells you to invest in crypto. Or better yet,
• 4:47
  Speaker 2: here's a hot secret tip for you of how to
• 4:51
  Speaker 2: get rich. No, what do you do? You look for
• 4:54
  Speaker 2: other sources of information.
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  Speaker 1: Do a little more digging.
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  Speaker 2: You ask some more questions. Usually you ask an expert
• 5:02
  Speaker 2: or someone you trust because it's your money and that's
• 5:06
  Speaker 2: really important. But what I would argue, your health is
• 5:10
  Speaker 2: even more important. Absolutely. And too often- The attitude is
• 5:15
  Speaker 2: I find what's the harm? Why not try it? And
• 5:20
  Speaker 2: the problem is there can be some harm. So it's
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  Speaker 2: okay to search the information, to look for other corroborated
• 5:27
  Speaker 2: sources that will tell you, yes, this information is likely
• 5:30
  Speaker 2: accurate or maybe it's not. But then you have to
• 5:33
  Speaker 2: go to that trusted source that is a physician that's
• 5:37
  Speaker 2: going to help you put it all into context.
• 5:41
  Speaker 1: Yes, that makes such sense. You know, as a doctor,
• 5:45
  Speaker 1: you spend your days helping other people to take care
• 5:48
  Speaker 1: of themselves. You are also the CEO of the AMA.
• 5:52
  Speaker 1: You are all about helping other people with their health care.
• 5:55
  Speaker 1: I'm curious, what do you actually do for your own health?
• 5:58
  Speaker 1: And what do you let slide?
• 6:01
  Speaker 2: Yeah. No, I love that question. And I had a
• 6:05
  Speaker 2: feeling you were going to ask me something like that.
• 6:08
  Speaker 2: And I've actually written some books about take control your cancer,
• 6:11
  Speaker 2: take control your diabetes. And sometimes I'm like, I have
• 6:15
  Speaker 2: to lose some weight and follow my own advice. I'd
• 6:19
  Speaker 2: say what I don't do well is I tend to
• 6:23
  Speaker 2: be a snacker at night. And I do have two
• 6:28
  Speaker 2: young boys That shouldn't be an excuse. But, you know,
• 6:31
  Speaker 2: they like to snack at night. So a lot of
• 6:33
  Speaker 2: times I say if I could just stop eating after
• 6:36
  Speaker 2: 8 p.m., that would be great. And, you know, I'm
• 6:41
  Speaker 2: trying better on there. But that's an area where, you know,
• 6:45
  Speaker 2: I have to work harder. It's the same thing where
• 6:47
  Speaker 2: I've always wanted to be physically active and exercise. It's
• 6:52
  Speaker 2: harder as we get older. We come up with 10,000 excuses.
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  Speaker 2: But I kind of have recommitted to that. recently what
• 7:01
  Speaker 2: i am good at is kind of portion control in
• 7:05
  Speaker 2: terms of what i put on the plate i think
• 7:07
  Speaker 2: that's one area where i've learned over the years um
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  Speaker 2: to be very conscious about.
• 7:14
  Speaker 1: So you're talking you you watch what you eat especially
• 7:18
  Speaker 1: your portions because in america our portions are i know.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah supersized absolutely.
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  Speaker 1: It's wild And you're saying also that getting exercise is very,
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  Speaker 1: very important to you.
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  Speaker 2: I have focused more on sleep in recent years, too.
• 7:36
  Speaker 2: And that's what everyone is talking about. I don't always
• 7:39
  Speaker 2: get eight hours, but I tend to try to at
• 7:42
  Speaker 2: least get seven. And I have made it a priority.
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  Speaker 2: And I know that's something that we all do as
• 7:48
  Speaker 2: we get older. And we joke about that, like, you know,
• 7:51
  Speaker 2: after 9 o'clock, we're not going out. We're, you know,
• 7:54
  Speaker 2: meeting dinner at 5, not that early. But what I
• 7:57
  Speaker 2: would say, Jenny, is I wish people thought about that
• 8:00
  Speaker 2: sooner because we do know how important sleep is. And
• 8:05
  Speaker 2: when we're young, it's the thing we are willing to
• 8:07
  Speaker 2: get rid of first, right?
• 8:09
  Speaker 1: Right.
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  Speaker 2: Either because we're working hard or we want to meet
• 8:11
  Speaker 2: friends or we're doing things with family. And then it's 11,
• 8:14
  Speaker 2: 12 o'clock. And you're getting up then at, you know,
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  Speaker 2: at 6 a.m. or 6.30. That's not enough time for
• 8:23
  Speaker 2: your body to reset, for your brain to reset and recharge.
• 8:29
  Speaker 2: And that's one of the most important things that people
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  Speaker 2: can do to improve their health is focus more on
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  Speaker 2: quality sleep.
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  Speaker 1: You say, so you would recommend six to eight hours?
• 8:41
  Speaker 1: What do you?
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  Speaker 2: Usually most people will say like seven to nine. You know,
• 8:46
  Speaker 2: some people can be a little less, but that's where
• 8:49
  Speaker 2: I shoot for. And that's really what I recommend to
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  Speaker 2: patients in that seven to nine timeframe. Now, that doesn't
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  Speaker 2: mean every day there are going to be days where
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  Speaker 2: just life gets in the way, but that should be
• 9:00
  Speaker 2: your goal on most days of the week. And that
• 9:05
  Speaker 2: doesn't count averaging, sleeping more on the weekend and then
• 9:08
  Speaker 2: sleeping four hours during the week. It doesn't quite work
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  Speaker 2: that way.
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  Speaker 1: It's so important. I've heard people say, oh, I sleep
• 9:16
  Speaker 1: for five hours a night and that works for me.
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  Speaker 1: Like that's enough sleep.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah. What do you think of that? Believe it or not,
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  Speaker 2: there is a genetic variant where people can function on
• 9:26
  Speaker 2: four or five hours of sleep. That's not most people.
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  Speaker 2: The problem that's happening there, people are using that as
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  Speaker 2: a badge of honor, right? Like I'm so strong. I'm
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  Speaker 2: so tough. Oh, you weaklings need seven, eight hours. I
• 9:39
  Speaker 2: only need four or five. But that's not the reality.
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  Speaker 2: People need seven to eight hours and your body actually
• 9:47
  Speaker 2: tells you when you're not sleeping well.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah. And if you don't listen to your body well
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  Speaker 1: enough yet, get a, I have a ring. My sister
• 9:56
  Speaker 1: has a watch thing that really tracks your sleep and
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  Speaker 1: it's been so fascinating to sort of understand what's going
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  Speaker 1: on while you're sleeping. And if you're getting that right
• 10:06
  Speaker 1: amount of quality sleep and being able to track it
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  Speaker 1: is so great. Yeah.
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  Speaker 2: I really enjoy wearables. I wear a watch. I've worn
• 10:14
  Speaker 2: a ring, I think you need that feedback. You don't
• 10:17
  Speaker 2: want to become overwhelmed by the amount of data. And
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  Speaker 2: some people do that. And I'll tell you, sometimes as
• 10:24
  Speaker 2: a physician, I say to a patient, you know, how
• 10:25
  Speaker 2: did you sleep last night? They look at their phone.
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  Speaker 2: I want to say, just tell me, like, if you're
• 10:32
  Speaker 2: sleepy right now, you didn't get enough sleep. So there
• 10:35
  Speaker 2: is some measure that we don't need, you know, the
• 10:39
  Speaker 2: data as some of us are so focused on. But
• 10:41
  Speaker 2: what I do like, it is nice to also know
• 10:45
  Speaker 2: what depth of sleep you're getting in terms of REM
• 10:48
  Speaker 2: versus non-REM sleep. It's nice to know the number of
• 10:51
  Speaker 2: steps that you're getting that you're looking at on trends.
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  Speaker 2: People are notorious for overestimating how active they are during
• 10:58
  Speaker 2: the day. They think they're getting 7,000 to 8,000 steps.
• 11:01
  Speaker 2: Studies have shown this. And they're actually getting about 3,500
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  Speaker 2: on average. So there's a big disconnect. And I like
• 11:09
  Speaker 2: it because it can give you feedback.
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  Speaker 1: Right. And then when you have feedback, you can go
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  Speaker 1: forward from there and make changes where you need to.
• 11:19
  Speaker 2: I'm actually, have you tried these continuous glucose monitors that
• 11:23
  Speaker 2: you can get over the counter? It's like the shape
• 11:25
  Speaker 2: of a quarter. You put it on your arm for
• 11:28
  Speaker 2: two weeks and it gives you your blood sugar over time.
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  Speaker 2: And what I like about it is it helps you
• 11:35
  Speaker 2: understand kind of your reaction to food. So you see,
• 11:39
  Speaker 2: that bagel, that scone is not really that healthy.
• 11:43
  Speaker 1: Are you speaking to me right now?
• 11:45
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that's right. Scone is a fancy word for a bagel.
• 11:50
  Speaker 2: And some of those cereals, they're not healthy. But it
• 11:54
  Speaker 2: gives you that feedback. And then you see, well, okay,
• 11:57
  Speaker 2: when I eat yogurt, I have a more steady blood
• 12:01
  Speaker 2: sugar level, which is what you want. And what I
• 12:03
  Speaker 2: really learned from it is we tend not to say–
• 12:06
  Speaker 2: to be active right after a meal. But what I've
• 12:10
  Speaker 2: seen is if you have a meal and then you
• 12:12
  Speaker 2: go for a walk, it helps keep your blood sugar
• 12:16
  Speaker 2: pretty stable. And that's what we want to aim for,
• 12:18
  Speaker 2: which goes to your point about let's give you feedback,
• 12:22
  Speaker 2: let's give you information so you can take better care
• 12:26
  Speaker 2: of yourself. Right.
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  Speaker 1: That's why I love it so much because I feel
• 12:30
  Speaker 1: like I'm in charge a little bit more. I at
• 12:32
  Speaker 1: least have the information instead of guessing.
• 12:36
  Speaker 2: That's right.
• 12:36
  Speaker 1: Blood sugar level monitor.
• 12:39
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Okay.
• 12:40
  Speaker 1: I got to get that. You say that not every
• 12:47
  Speaker 1: symptom should be ignored.
• 12:49
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 12:50
  Speaker 1: What is something women over 50 accept as just aging,
• 12:55
  Speaker 1: normal aging, and what should they actually get checked?
• 12:59
  Speaker 2: Yeah. You know, one of the biggest things, particularly for women,
• 13:03
  Speaker 2: is fatigue. You feel... tired and you just think that's
• 13:09
  Speaker 2: a normal part of aging or I'm working too hard.
• 13:13
  Speaker 2: Having fatigue on a daily basis is not a normal
• 13:16
  Speaker 2: part of aging. Sometimes as we get older, our thyroid
• 13:20
  Speaker 2: stops working. That's something to check. In women, as they
• 13:24
  Speaker 2: get older, fatigue can also be a sign of heart disease.
• 13:28
  Speaker 2: People don't think of it that way, but it can
• 13:31
  Speaker 2: be a sign of early heart disease. And then we
• 13:34
  Speaker 2: know premenopausal, perimenopausal symptoms actually can also change hormone levels
• 13:41
  Speaker 2: that can also cause fatigue. So that's something that you
• 13:45
  Speaker 2: shouldn't dismiss as just getting older. Exhaustion.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, I can remember in my postmenopausal era how I
• 13:55
  Speaker 1: felt exhausted and I had done nothing. And it just
• 14:00
  Speaker 1: sort of like, you know, kept building every day. I
• 14:02
  Speaker 1: would just be like, what is wrong with me? I'm
• 14:04
  Speaker 1: so tired and I didn't do anything today.
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  Speaker 2: That's exactly right. And, you know, cancer often can present
• 14:10
  Speaker 2: as fatigue as well. And as we get older, incidence
• 14:13
  Speaker 2: of cancer increases. There's an element of age to it.
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  Speaker 2: So that's one thing. And I love how you said
• 14:20
  Speaker 2: early on, it's listen to your body. I always say
• 14:23
  Speaker 2: that to patients. You know your body the best. Listen
• 14:26
  Speaker 2: to your body. If your body is telling you something,
• 14:29
  Speaker 2: that you're having it on a daily basis, not just
• 14:34
  Speaker 2: once in a while, but daily, like you said, this exhaustion,
• 14:38
  Speaker 2: that's not normal. You need to get it checked out.
• 14:42
  Speaker 2: Your body is sending you a message, and you shouldn't
• 14:45
  Speaker 2: ignore it.
• 14:46
  Speaker 1: So if I do go to the doctor to get
• 14:47
  Speaker 1: that checked out, what am I looking for the doctor?
• 14:50
  Speaker 1: What kind of information am I looking for my doctor?
• 14:52
  Speaker 2: Thyroid levels for women is going to be menopausal.
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  Speaker 1: So full blood work.
• 14:59
  Speaker 2: Yeah, because the other thing is I want to look
• 15:00
  Speaker 2: at your blood counts. Sometimes anemia can present as fatigue.
• 15:05
  Speaker 2: That often can be the case. That can be an
• 15:07
  Speaker 2: increased bleeding for women. It could also be signs of
• 15:12
  Speaker 2: cancer as well. I want to look at your electrolytes.
• 15:16
  Speaker 2: Even you could be fatigued. Actually, it could be early
• 15:19
  Speaker 2: signs of diabetes. You have high blood sugar and then
• 15:21
  Speaker 2: low blood sugar, and then you're just tired. So you
• 15:23
  Speaker 2: really have to have, based on the symptoms, an approach.
• 15:28
  Speaker 2: And I would start with labs and then the physical
• 15:30
  Speaker 2: exam as well.
• 15:38
  Speaker 1: I've heard of women who go to the doctor to
• 15:40
  Speaker 1: get labs and they don't do the hormonal lab checks.
• 15:44
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 15:44
  Speaker 1: Like they leave those off of, it's just, they give
• 15:46
  Speaker 1: them the run of the mill.
• 15:48
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 15:48
  Speaker 1: You know, RX for black work.
• 15:49
  Speaker 2: That's not enough. No. I will tell you, historically, we
• 15:53
  Speaker 2: didn't have great ways to measure some hormones. Sometimes there's
• 15:57
  Speaker 2: things called these diurnal variations and they vary during the day.
• 16:02
  Speaker 2: So sometimes it's hard to tell, like what's a random
• 16:05
  Speaker 2: cortisol level? Sometimes that's hard to measure. It's the same
• 16:08
  Speaker 2: thing in men and testosterone, but we have better ways,
• 16:11
  Speaker 2: better assays of measuring it. And to be honest, Jenny,
• 16:16
  Speaker 2: some doctors just didn't grow up learning that and acknowledging that.
• 16:21
  Speaker 2: So that's why this is a great way to search
• 16:26
  Speaker 2: Google and the internet. Use generative tools to say, what
• 16:30
  Speaker 2: should I talk to my doctor about? What tests do
• 16:33
  Speaker 2: I need?
• 16:34
  Speaker 1: Yeah, like type in, I'm 54, a 54-year-old female. What
• 16:38
  Speaker 1: should I ask my doctor when I go see him
• 16:40
  Speaker 1: next time?
• 16:41
  Speaker 2: That's right, or that I'm really tired. Now, one thing
• 16:43
  Speaker 2: I would say to your audience is, If you're going
• 16:45
  Speaker 2: to upload labs into these tools, take your name and
• 16:49
  Speaker 2: identifying information off of it because you shouldn't assume anything
• 16:53
  Speaker 2: remains private. Most of these tools say they can train
• 16:56
  Speaker 2: on you. It's just a good idea to remove your
• 17:01
  Speaker 2: identifying information. And it's not a bad idea to put
• 17:04
  Speaker 2: your lab tests in and ask them for some general interpretation.
• 17:07
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a good idea. I think I've put mine
• 17:11
  Speaker 1: in before and did not remove my name. So I'm
• 17:14
  Speaker 1: going to do that.
• 17:15
  Speaker 2: Time. Especially when you're, some of these tools keep it
• 17:18
  Speaker 2: as memory. So then they know who you are. Yeah.
• 17:22
  Speaker 1: They keep my conversations. When I use AI, it kind
• 17:25
  Speaker 1: of keeps the conversation going. So it doesn't forget who
• 17:29
  Speaker 1: they're talking. They don't forget who they're talking to.
• 17:30
  Speaker 2: No, I know. And it's kind of nice some days.
• 17:32
  Speaker 2: And then other days I've learned you can delete those
• 17:34
  Speaker 2: chats too. So it doesn't have to remember everything. Okay.
• 17:38
  Speaker 1: Tell me in your experience, what is the craziest thing
• 17:42
  Speaker 1: that someone has done for their health that they learned
• 17:46
  Speaker 1: from the internet. I'm sure you have stories.
• 17:49
  Speaker 2: And sadly, they're not good ones. So I did have
• 17:53
  Speaker 2: a patient that came in to urgent care with ear pain.
• 17:58
  Speaker 2: And I still remember this. What had happened is she
• 18:02
  Speaker 2: had wax in her ear and that can be uncomfortable.
• 18:04
  Speaker 2: And she microwaved hydrogen peroxide because she saw that on
• 18:12
  Speaker 2: the internet. to melt the wax in her ear. And unfortunately,
• 18:18
  Speaker 2: it caused an extremely severe burn where she had to
• 18:23
  Speaker 2: go for reconstruction at ENT and plastic surgery. And, you know, sadly, Jenny,
• 18:29
  Speaker 2: I should have said when I said to her, why?
• 18:32
  Speaker 2: I should have said it quite that way. And she said,
• 18:36
  Speaker 2: I saw it on the internet. And there is a
• 18:39
  Speaker 2: role for hydrogen peroxide when it's diluted. And you know,
• 18:43
  Speaker 2: there are this thing called candling, where sometimes people will
• 18:46
  Speaker 2: do that to get rid of wax. But someone else
• 18:49
  Speaker 2: on the internet said that if you heat the hydrogen peroxide,
• 18:53
  Speaker 2: it's going to melt the wax. And yes, it melts
• 18:55
  Speaker 2: the wax, but it also melts part of your ear canal.
• 18:58
  Speaker 2: So a really unfortunate story. You know, I've had a
• 19:04
  Speaker 2: patient during residency where she had breast cancer. And there
• 19:10
  Speaker 2: were these stories that shark cartilage was going to improve
• 19:12
  Speaker 2: breast cancer. It doesn't, and it didn't. And this woman
• 19:16
  Speaker 2: ultimately forgone chemotherapy, and she ultimately died in a very
• 19:21
  Speaker 2: short period of time of breast cancer. She thought she
• 19:24
  Speaker 2: was doing the right thing, and her chemotherapy was harmful,
• 19:28
  Speaker 2: was poison to her body, so she wanted to try
• 19:30
  Speaker 2: this other therapy, and it didn't work. That's why it's
• 19:35
  Speaker 2: so important to really trust your physician. Sure, inform yourself,
• 19:41
  Speaker 2: look for information, Don't go overboard and make yourself super anxious,
• 19:46
  Speaker 2: but get some facts that that the key thing. And
• 19:50
  Speaker 2: treat it like your financial information. And don't just be
• 19:53
  Speaker 2: willing because that was the attitude. Jenny, what's the harm? Yeah.
• 19:59
  Speaker 2: Why not try it? Like what could microwaving hydrogen peroxide do? Well,
• 20:05
  Speaker 2: she's going to have a hearing deficit for the rest
• 20:07
  Speaker 2: of her life. Oh, man.
• 20:10
  Speaker 1: Note to self, don't take advice from people's hacks or
• 20:14
  Speaker 1: tutorials on the line.
• 20:16
  Speaker 2: Yeah. And some is common sense. Then we do have
• 20:19
  Speaker 2: to remind people. Oh, man. Okay.
• 20:22
  Speaker 1: On the reverse, what is something that people panic about
• 20:26
  Speaker 1: that's completely normal?
• 20:29
  Speaker 2: Yeah. People often will panic about one or two points
• 20:34
  Speaker 2: above a normal level in a lab. So, you know,
• 20:39
  Speaker 2: people will say like my chloride, which is something taken
• 20:43
  Speaker 2: on a basic metabolic panel. Okay, if it's a little
• 20:49
  Speaker 2: higher or a little low, I wouldn't panic about those things.
• 20:52
  Speaker 2: I would always repeat an abnormal test because some lab
• 20:55
  Speaker 2: ranges are different. So if you have something just a
• 20:57
  Speaker 2: little high, it can be okay. Those are the things
• 21:03
  Speaker 2: where people don't, you know, need to panic if their
• 21:06
  Speaker 2: lab is just a little off. You kind of alluded
• 21:09
  Speaker 2: to the beginning. People panic about headaches all the time.
• 21:12
  Speaker 2: And headaches can be serious. But the overwhelming majority of
• 21:17
  Speaker 2: headaches aren't serious. So you do want to make sure
• 21:21
  Speaker 2: it's evaluated, but you don't want to come in with
• 21:24
  Speaker 2: the idea that you have a brain tumor. And that
• 21:26
  Speaker 2: still happens for a lot of people. They really do
• 21:28
  Speaker 2: panic over the idea of a headache.
• 21:32
  Speaker 1: What do you think about GLP-1s? What's your honest take?
• 21:35
  Speaker 2: I think there's value.
• 21:36
  Speaker 1: There's value, yes.
• 21:37
  Speaker 2: For GLP-1. Certainly if people are overweight, if they've had diabetes.
• 21:43
  Speaker 2: Here's kind of my challenge at times with the GLP-1s.
• 21:47
  Speaker 2: People start on GLP-1s, they have significant weight loss, but
• 21:51
  Speaker 2: they haven't changed anything. They're still eating unhealthy. They're still
• 21:55
  Speaker 2: not going to the gym. And they feel like, why
• 21:58
  Speaker 2: do I have to, Dr. White? I've lost 30 pounds
• 22:02
  Speaker 2: and I feel good. Why do I have to now
• 22:04
  Speaker 2: do those things? And my point to them, is food
• 22:07
  Speaker 2: is still medicine. It still has many benefits and you
• 22:11
  Speaker 2: want to eat a healthy diet. GLP-1s can actually result
• 22:14
  Speaker 2: in muscle loss. You actually want to build muscle. They
• 22:18
  Speaker 2: make you lose weight everywhere. And then do you want
• 22:21
  Speaker 2: to be on a medication for the rest of your life?
• 22:26
  Speaker 2: And if you don't adopt healthy habits and you try
• 22:30
  Speaker 2: to come off the GLP-1, you're going to regain the weight.
• 22:33
  Speaker 2: And we've seen that. So that's where I think some
• 22:38
  Speaker 2: patients aren't making the changes that they need to make.
• 22:40
  Speaker 2: But there certainly is value for many patients with the GLP-1s. Yes.
• 22:47
  Speaker 1: Okay, so say a woman goes to the doctor and
• 22:50
  Speaker 1: her doctor kind of dismisses or brushes off some of
• 22:54
  Speaker 1: her concerns regarding whether she's in perimenopause or menopause. How
• 22:59
  Speaker 1: should she speak to her doctor in order to be
• 23:03
  Speaker 1: clearly heard and taken seriously?
• 23:05
  Speaker 2: And sadly, that is common. It still happens. You know,
• 23:09
  Speaker 2: I get it. People have 10, 12 minutes to spend
• 23:12
  Speaker 2: with the patient. And most doctors don't want to, you know,
• 23:16
  Speaker 2: just hear the story. They want to cut to the chase.
• 23:19
  Speaker 2: And I think, you know, we have to be our
• 23:21
  Speaker 2: own advocates. So what I often tell people is to
• 23:27
  Speaker 2: come with your list of questions and write them down.
• 23:30
  Speaker 1: Yes, write them down.
• 23:31
  Speaker 2: Yes. I have patients and I like this. They give
• 23:34
  Speaker 2: me the list. when I walk in the room. And
• 23:36
  Speaker 2: I liked that. And I say to them, which are
• 23:39
  Speaker 2: the key ones? So I make sure I address.
• 23:41
  Speaker 1: Because no matter what, you think of your problems and
• 23:45
  Speaker 1: then you go to the doctor and you forget everything. Yeah.
• 23:47
  Speaker 1: And you have no idea what to ask them.
• 23:48
  Speaker 2: That's why you have to write it down. Yes. And
• 23:50
  Speaker 2: I have said to family members, don't leave the room.
• 23:52
  Speaker 2: Don't get up until those answers are done. And then sadly,
• 23:57
  Speaker 2: sometimes it's not the right fit with the doctor and
• 24:00
  Speaker 2: you need to find a different one. If someone's not
• 24:03
  Speaker 2: addressing the concerns that you have, then they're not the
• 24:06
  Speaker 2: right person. But you want to come with the questions ahead.
• 24:10
  Speaker 2: You want to come with them written down so you know.
• 24:12
  Speaker 2: You want to come with, I love the idea that
• 24:14
  Speaker 2: you feel you need to have these tests or this
• 24:17
  Speaker 2: is what you want to talk about. More and more
• 24:19
  Speaker 2: physicians embrace that. And that's kind of relationship that you want. Absolutely.
• 24:23
  Speaker 1: It's kind of a collaborative thing. I mean, you as
• 24:26
  Speaker 1: the patient have the instincts and the symptoms and the
• 24:29
  Speaker 1: doctor has expertise and the knowledge.
• 24:31
  Speaker 2: That's right.
• 24:32
  Speaker 1: I think it's definitely a team effort in order to
• 24:35
  Speaker 1: just get yourself handled.
• 24:37
  Speaker 2: Absolutely.
• 24:40
  Speaker 1: What's the question that patients never ask the doctor that
• 24:43
  Speaker 1: they should?
• 24:43
  Speaker 2: You know, really what patients sometimes don't get to quick
• 24:46
  Speaker 2: enough is what's really bothering them, right? And that's what
• 24:50
  Speaker 2: they need to bring forth as well in terms of
• 24:55
  Speaker 2: why are they really there? What's the concern that they have?
• 24:59
  Speaker 1: And if you... Tend to forget things.
• 25:01
  Speaker 2: Write it down. Yeah. Okay.
• 25:11
  Speaker 1: What is a health rule? I put the air quotes
• 25:15
  Speaker 1: around the rule. What's a health rule that you used
• 25:18
  Speaker 1: to believe and have since changed your mind about?
• 25:22
  Speaker 2: Yeah. So one health rule that I used to believe
• 25:25
  Speaker 2: is that you had to have 10,000 steps a day.
• 25:28
  Speaker 2: Like we have a whole campaign. around 10,000 steps a day.
• 25:32
  Speaker 2: And then really learned in good data that suggests, you know,
• 25:36
  Speaker 2: even 7,000 to 8,000 steps a day can be good.
• 25:40
  Speaker 2: And if you're at 3,000 steps a day, then getting
• 25:43
  Speaker 2: to 4,000 steps a day and building over time is good.
• 25:47
  Speaker 2: So I kind of moved away from that role as
• 25:51
  Speaker 2: well as that you had to have three meals a day, right?
• 25:54
  Speaker 2: And that basically was the gist. So sometimes I do
• 25:58
  Speaker 2: intermittent fasting. Sometimes I might skip a meal or I
• 26:02
  Speaker 2: might just have smaller meals throughout the day. So some
• 26:04
  Speaker 2: of it's dependent upon your lifestyle as well. So try
• 26:09
  Speaker 2: to move away from those two hard and fast rules.
• 26:12
  Speaker 1: I love what you said before about food is medicine.
• 26:16
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 26:17
  Speaker 1: And we don't think about that. We certainly don't think
• 26:20
  Speaker 1: about that when we're just fed, you know, fast food
• 26:24
  Speaker 1: commercials and convenience food.
• 26:29
  Speaker 2: There's a great phrase in French. I'm not going to
• 26:32
  Speaker 2: say it in French. It says, show me what you
• 26:36
  Speaker 2: eat and I'll tell you who you are. And what
• 26:41
  Speaker 2: I like about that, because if you show me all
• 26:44
  Speaker 2: these unhealthy foods that you're eating, candies, sandwiches, lunch meats,
• 26:53
  Speaker 2: other things, I'm going to have a sense of how
• 26:57
  Speaker 2: healthy or unhealthy you are. You are. Because that really
• 27:01
  Speaker 2: demonstrates to us the role of food and this broader
• 27:06
  Speaker 2: concept of food is medicine. So is the food going
• 27:11
  Speaker 2: to help you keep your blood sugar under control, help
• 27:13
  Speaker 2: you build bone mineral density, help you with inflammation? Or
• 27:19
  Speaker 2: is it going to be something that's going to make
• 27:20
  Speaker 2: your blood sugar go sky high? Is it something that
• 27:25
  Speaker 2: perhaps could be carcinogenic in terms of promoting cancer? Those
• 27:29
  Speaker 2: are the types of things that you want to think
• 27:30
  Speaker 2: about before you put things in your mouth. And that's
• 27:33
  Speaker 2: not how we think about things here. But that's a
• 27:37
  Speaker 2: mindset that has to change because food really is medicine.
• 27:42
  Speaker 1: Yes, I fully believe that. I mean, I eat really clean.
• 27:47
  Speaker 1: And I do think of food as fuel.
• 27:51
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 27:52
  Speaker 1: So that helps me. But I still get those cravings
• 27:56
  Speaker 1: for some bread. You know, or some cookie dough.
• 27:59
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Bread's my weakness. Yeah. But you're consciously choosing that.
• 28:07
  Speaker 1: Yes. It's not an all the time thing. It's like
• 28:09
  Speaker 1: a once in a while.
• 28:11
  Speaker 2: And you don't deny yourself, right? That's what makes people,
• 28:14
  Speaker 2: you know, abandon healthy eating because they feel like they
• 28:17
  Speaker 2: can never have this. But the other big change I
• 28:19
  Speaker 2: tell people is you have to stop buying the foods
• 28:23
  Speaker 2: that you're trying to avoid. And a lot of times
• 28:26
  Speaker 2: people say, but that's for their kids. That's for their spouse.
• 28:29
  Speaker 1: I'm sure your wife buys your boys snacks.
• 28:31
  Speaker 2: That's you got that.
• 28:33
  Speaker 1: And you're like, well, it's in there.
• 28:36
  Speaker 2: So. And when you're looking to eat something, if there's
• 28:39
  Speaker 2: only potato chips in your pantry and, and, you know, cookies,
• 28:44
  Speaker 2: that's what you're going to eat. But if there's wheat crackers,
• 28:48
  Speaker 2: if there's other, you know, some, the, I eat these
• 28:51
  Speaker 2: fiber cookies, uh, That's going to be the healthier choice. Oh, man.
• 28:56
  Speaker 1: But don't put them on the shelf next to each
• 28:57
  Speaker 1: other because the fiber cookies are going to lose every time.
• 29:01
  Speaker 2: Yeah, because we don't need enough fiber. And sometimes it's
• 29:04
  Speaker 2: hard for people to do so. So what I found
• 29:07
  Speaker 2: is there actually are these wafers, these fiber wafers that
• 29:10
  Speaker 2: I find that you can buy that actually help you
• 29:13
  Speaker 2: get to the amount of fiber that you should be having.
• 29:16
  Speaker 1: Hot topic conversations around protein and fiber.
• 29:20
  Speaker 2: Which one?
• 29:21
  Speaker 1: If you had to pick one, which would you hold
• 29:25
  Speaker 1: out on? Which would you like say, this is the.
• 29:27
  Speaker 2: One you need to focus on? You know, it's hard
• 29:28
  Speaker 2: because everyone is talking about protein nowadays. You know, I
• 29:32
  Speaker 2: was just looking online and, you know, celebrities are coming
• 29:35
  Speaker 2: out with protein soda. I mean, proteins in everything. Proteins
• 29:38
  Speaker 2: in rice. Right. I'm getting stressed over, does this product
• 29:43
  Speaker 2: have protein? I think we're overdoing it a little and
• 29:47
  Speaker 2: you can have too much protein. But what I like
• 29:50
  Speaker 2: about protein is typically we have not focused enough on
• 29:53
  Speaker 2: protein and protein helps with muscle mass. Protein helps you make,
• 29:58
  Speaker 2: it makes you feel fuller sooner. And that's important too.
• 30:03
  Speaker 2: So we don't eat a whole bunch of sugar and carbs.
• 30:06
  Speaker 2: So I'd say protein gets the edge. Fiber though is
• 30:10
  Speaker 2: still important too because fiber is going to help in
• 30:13
  Speaker 2: terms of our GI mobility and symptoms. That's also going
• 30:18
  Speaker 2: to help with blood sugar control. So there's a role
• 30:21
  Speaker 2: for both. And that's what we want people to think
• 30:25
  Speaker 2: about a complete healthy diet. It's not just one thing
• 30:30
  Speaker 2: Or the others. And I think some days we're a
• 30:33
  Speaker 2: little too focused on protein. Yeah.
• 30:37
  Speaker 1: And also, what about like factory made protein? How do
• 30:43
  Speaker 1: you know you can trust it?
• 30:46
  Speaker 2: That's a great question. It is a challenge. Absolutely.
• 30:50
  Speaker 1: Because there's a million protein companies out there putting, like
• 30:54
  Speaker 1: you said, protein in everything.
• 30:56
  Speaker 2: That's right. And protein and cereal. And you really don't know.
• 31:01
  Speaker 2: You really have to do a little bit of your homework.
• 31:02
  Speaker 2: You have to use your common sense. You want to
• 31:05
  Speaker 2: think about whole foods. That's always a better choice. And
• 31:11
  Speaker 2: you want to do a little bit of research as well. Yeah.
• 31:15
  Speaker 1: You got to listen to your instincts. And if you
• 31:17
  Speaker 1: need more information, get it. Find it. It's out there
• 31:20
  Speaker 1: for you. But you have to weed through all the
• 31:24
  Speaker 1: jibber-jabber to find the good stuff.
• 31:28
  Speaker 2: Okay.
• 31:28
  Speaker 1: Bottom line, I'm not feeling good today. Something's off.
• 31:33
  Speaker 2: What should I do? Yeah. And this goes back to
• 31:36
  Speaker 2: an earlier point that we said, you want to listen
• 31:38
  Speaker 2: to your body so you don't push yourself. So if
• 31:42
  Speaker 2: you're working, if you can, you try to stay home
• 31:45
  Speaker 2: from work and you should have an environment nowadays that
• 31:48
  Speaker 2: encourages that. You don't want to make other people sick.
• 31:51
  Speaker 2: You want to take the day off if you can
• 31:55
  Speaker 2: in terms of some other duties that you might have.
• 31:57
  Speaker 2: Most things can wait. I get it. That's not always
• 31:59
  Speaker 2: the case with caregiving responsibilities, parenting responsibilities. But if it's
• 32:05
  Speaker 2: persisting for three days or so, that's usually kind of
• 32:09
  Speaker 2: my limit. Then I think people usually need to get checked.
• 32:13
  Speaker 2: Everyone can have a bad day. You have a virus
• 32:16
  Speaker 2: that is going around. you ate something that didn't agree
• 32:21
  Speaker 2: with you, but if it's going on two or three days,
• 32:24
  Speaker 2: that's the time to get checked out. And what you
• 32:27
  Speaker 2: don't want to do, Jenny, is you don't want to
• 32:29
  Speaker 2: push yourself. You don't want to try to be superhuman
• 32:32
  Speaker 2: and be like, I'll just muscle through this.
• 32:35
  Speaker 1: That's what we do though. Let's be honest.
• 32:40
  Speaker 2: That's not helping anyone.
• 32:42
  Speaker 1: No. Well, I think, you know, there's just such a,
• 32:47
  Speaker 1: You have such a base of knowledge, given all your
• 32:51
  Speaker 1: experience in the medical industry. And as a doctor, I'm
• 32:55
  Speaker 1: just so happy that we were able to talk today
• 32:58
  Speaker 1: and share some of this great information. And I'm going
• 33:01
  Speaker 1: to be honest with you, I'm probably still going to
• 33:03
  Speaker 1: search a symptom here and there. But now maybe I
• 33:08
  Speaker 1: won't panic as much. And I'll remember what you said
• 33:12
  Speaker 1: that just... Look at it, listen to my instincts, and
• 33:17
  Speaker 1: know when it's time to call the doctor. And more importantly,
• 33:21
  Speaker 1: what to go in there prepared to ask your doctor
• 33:24
  Speaker 1: so that your 11 minutes aren't wasted saying, oh, I
• 33:27
  Speaker 1: feel great. Yeah, I've got no problems.
• 33:30
  Speaker 2: You got your questions ready.
• 33:31
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Well, thank you so much, Dr.
• 33:34
  Speaker 2: White. Thanks for having me.
• 33:35
  Speaker 1: Even doctors need to take care of themselves.
• 33:37
  Speaker 2: They do.
• 33:38
  Speaker 1: So, Dr. John White, what was your last I choose
• 33:41
  Speaker 1: me moment?
• 33:42
  Speaker 2: My last I choose me moment was actually this morning, Jenny.
• 33:46
  Speaker 2: So what happened is my 8 a.m. meeting got canceled.
• 33:52
  Speaker 2: So I dropped my son off from school and I
• 33:54
  Speaker 2: was getting ready to go into the office.
• 33:56
  Speaker 1: Don't you love that when you get a cancellation?
• 33:58
  Speaker 2: Yes. It doesn't happen much. So it's really exciting. And
• 34:01
  Speaker 2: it's not me doing a cancellation. It got canceled. So
• 34:04
  Speaker 2: I said, you know what? I'm going to go to
• 34:06
  Speaker 2: the gym instead. Whoa. Because I hadn't been able to
• 34:10
  Speaker 2: go in a couple of days. And I did a
• 34:13
  Speaker 2: little detour. And I went to the gym for 40 minutes.
• 34:17
  Speaker 2: Didn't have a full hour or everything. And I felt
• 34:20
  Speaker 2: good about it. And I got in a little later
• 34:23
  Speaker 2: to the office than normally I would. But I chose
• 34:27
  Speaker 2: me to focus on in the morning. I don't do
• 34:31
  Speaker 2: that enough. And I thought to myself, oh, I need
• 34:33
  Speaker 2: to do this more often.
• 34:35
  Speaker 1: So. Well, I'm very happy that you chose yourself this morning.
• 34:39
  Speaker 2: Well, thank you.
• 34:40
  Speaker 1: Stay healthy. Help us all stay healthy with all your
• 34:43
  Speaker 1: great work. I'm trying. Thank you so much.
• 34:46
  Speaker 2: Sure. Thank you.