Latest / The Right Time with Bomani Jones / Pat Forde on Chauncey Billups Gambling Scandal, College Football Coaching Chaos | 10.24

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Pat Forde on Chauncey Billups Gambling Scandal, College Football Coaching Chaos | 10.24 · The Right Time with Bomani Jones

0:05
Speaker 1: Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the right time, a wave original.
0:09
Speaker 1: My name is Beaumont Jones. Thanks for listening wherever you
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Speaker 1: get your podcast. Thanks for watching us on YouTube. Subscribe, like,
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Speaker 1: rate us, review us, give us five stars. You only
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Speaker 1: give us four stars. I'm inclined to believe you are
0:21
Speaker 1: a hater. It is 40 Friday, Pat40ofSI.
0:24
Speaker 2: Com. My man, how are you? I'm doing great, Beaumont.
0:30
Speaker 2: Good to see you again. Great to be on with you.
0:32
Speaker 1: I got to tell you, I don't know. I just
0:33
Speaker 1: realized I was like, I have no idea. The last
0:35
Speaker 1: time I did something with Pat and I do this
0:37
Speaker 1: to embarrass him because he doesn't like it when I
0:39
Speaker 1: do it. But I always tell people I'm not here
0:41
Speaker 1: without Pat Forty. Forty was the first like legitimate person
0:44
Speaker 1: that I recall to really like put an arm around
0:47
Speaker 1: me and help me out through this. encouraged me when
0:49
Speaker 1: I lost jobs and all of those things. So I get,
0:51
Speaker 1: I always say one of the, one of my most,
0:53
Speaker 1: I feel the jet moments ever is at the 2007
0:55
Speaker 1: ACC tournament, sit next to you, watch the selection Sunday,
0:58
Speaker 1: filling out the bracket. Like that is an all time
1:00
Speaker 1: highlight of me doing this. So it's like, I'm thrilled
1:03
Speaker 1: to have you on with us on this one.
1:06
Speaker 2: Well, I got to give some backstory there, Bo. We were,
1:10
Speaker 2: I was working at ESPN and you freelanced, I believe
1:14
Speaker 2: a piece for us. From North Carolina. It was at
1:17
Speaker 2: a press conference, I think. And I was like, holy shit,
1:20
Speaker 2: who is this guy? He's a great writer. We need
1:22
Speaker 2: to use more from him. And, geez, things worked out
1:26
Speaker 2: pretty well for you from there. But, yeah, I remember
1:28
Speaker 2: also seeing you at that ACC tournament. And you looked
1:31
Speaker 2: at me and you said, I think we're probably both
1:34
Speaker 2: taller than we thought the other one was.
1:36
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's what I saw. I saw you at the
1:38
Speaker 1: D-Dome on that one. And I was like, yep, that
1:40
Speaker 1: is exactly.
1:41
Speaker 2: What checked out.
1:42
Speaker 1: We were definitely in the front court in that room.
1:44
Speaker 2: Yeah.
1:46
Speaker 1: Like, but so I originally had wanted to have Pat
1:50
Speaker 1: on to talk about like the changing basically personnel structure
1:53
Speaker 1: in college football coaching where everybody seems to get fired
1:56
Speaker 1: really fast. And then as we were getting ready to
1:58
Speaker 1: do this and preparing to record. The world set on fire.
2:02
Speaker 1: And we get this report that Damon Jones and Chauncey
2:06
Speaker 1: Billups have been arrested. Also, Terry Rozier. And I think
2:09
Speaker 1: Rozier actually for the sporting part of it is the
2:11
Speaker 1: most interesting one, because Rozier has basically been accused of
2:15
Speaker 1: shaving points, providing insider information to gamblers. And, you know, hey,
2:20
Speaker 1: my foot hurts. Come out of the game. A whole
2:22
Speaker 1: lot of people had bet the under. Damon Jones is
2:24
Speaker 1: in a similar place because he has been accused of
2:27
Speaker 1: trading on insider information to gamblers because he had a
2:32
Speaker 1: gambling problem, but he was also participating in illegal poker games.
2:37
Speaker 1: Where Chauncey Phillips is also participating in illegal poker games.
2:40
Speaker 1: And that's how these two things are tied together. And
2:43
Speaker 1: I need you to understand that the illegal poker games
2:45
Speaker 1: are accused to have been rigged and run by the
2:48
Speaker 1: five families. Like we're not talking about like a movie.
2:51
Speaker 1: We mean the actual five mafia families that I will
2:54
Speaker 1: be honest with you. I didn't know it still worked
2:56
Speaker 1: like that. Like, I didn't know that they had all, like,
2:59
Speaker 1: persisted and it remained just fine. Like, you know, it
3:01
Speaker 1: used to be the Power Six, and now it's, like,
3:03
Speaker 1: really the Power Four conferences, but it's really the Power Two.
3:05
Speaker 1: I thought that by now there would have been some
3:07
Speaker 1: sort of mergers.
3:12
Speaker 2: That's the only place where we haven't had realignment, I guess,
3:15
Speaker 2: is in the mafia in New York. It's a wild story. Incredible.
3:21
Speaker 2: Been following it since March of 2024 when– All of
3:27
Speaker 2: a sudden, we started getting word about suspicious bets on
3:31
Speaker 2: a Temple UAB basketball game. And lo and behold, Temple
3:36
Speaker 2: lost by 28 and was getting housed in the first half.
3:39
Speaker 2: And there were all these bets against Temple on the
3:42
Speaker 2: first half spread. And that was kind of this first
3:46
Speaker 2: inclination of, hey, there's this gambling ring out there. And
3:50
Speaker 2: it has rippled from there. And then we started finding
3:53
Speaker 2: about the NBA game. impact on it. And obviously, Jonte Porter,
3:59
Speaker 2: his situation, getting banned from the NBA and being charged.
4:02
Speaker 2: And it's believed, Bomani, obviously, that the people involved in
4:07
Speaker 2: the NBA game fixing are also the people involved in
4:11
Speaker 2: some of the poker game rigging and in the college game. Now,
4:15
Speaker 2: the college game charges have not come out yet. That's
4:19
Speaker 2: being run by the Eastern District of Pennsylvania. The rest
4:22
Speaker 2: of this is Eastern District of New York. So it's
4:25
Speaker 2: going to be a little while before we know more
4:28
Speaker 2: about that. But this is all interconnected. And it's an
4:32
Speaker 2: incredible bombshell headache for pro basketball and college basketball.
4:38
Speaker 1: I mean, this sounds like Jack Molina's 1960s sort of stuff. Like,
4:42
Speaker 1: am I wrong or is that too simple?
4:45
Speaker 2: Yeah. It's like throwback to the, yeah, like CCNY 1950s
4:50
Speaker 2: mobsters running around New York fixing stuff. rigged poker games.
4:55
Speaker 2: It's an incredible, vivid story, which is probably why we
4:59
Speaker 2: had some of the characters grandstanding in Brooklyn that we
5:03
Speaker 2: did today at this press conference.
5:05
Speaker 1: That was a circle jerk of epic proportions. Like if
5:07
Speaker 1: you did not see that press conference, I'm convinced the
5:10
Speaker 1: director of the FBI, that's just, I got to be
5:13
Speaker 1: there for it, right? Like there's going to be pictures.
5:15
Speaker 1: There's going to be all of this. I've seen people
5:17
Speaker 1: who have raised the questions about whether this is like
5:19
Speaker 1: kind of targeted by the Trump administration, or this is
5:22
Speaker 1: somehow cooked up by Kash Patel. And I suppose that's possible.
5:26
Speaker 1: But I think as you just pointed out, people have
5:28
Speaker 1: been in on this for a while, like the timing
5:30
Speaker 1: of the announcement may be its own thing. But this
5:33
Speaker 1: is something that predates this current regime.
5:36
Speaker 2: Absolutely. Yeah, this goes back and I think they've said
5:38
Speaker 2: maybe like four years that they've been looking into this
5:41
Speaker 2: and the genesis of it, as I understand it, and
5:45
Speaker 2: we don't have complete information at this point, but these
5:48
Speaker 2: were guys that were attempting to rig games and making
5:52
Speaker 2: bets offshore and the offshore places started shutting them down.
5:56
Speaker 2: Then they go domestic here and get a little over aggressive.
6:01
Speaker 2: And all of a sudden where the regulators and the
6:03
Speaker 2: watchdogs can monitor your bets more easily. Oh, there's problems here.
6:07
Speaker 2: What's going on? And things start getting examined more closely.
6:12
Speaker 2: So this does go back. It does predate certainly the election.
6:16
Speaker 2: It certainly predates, Kash Patel's work as the FBI director,
6:20
Speaker 2: you know, he was standing there front and center and
6:22
Speaker 2: he got the microphone and talk. I can't imagine he
6:24
Speaker 2: had much to do with this. I think this was
6:26
Speaker 2: largely run by boots on the ground in New York
6:29
Speaker 2: and elsewhere that predated his entry into the bureau.
6:33
Speaker 1: I mean, I watched that press conference and I guess
6:36
Speaker 1: the first 12 minutes or so, maybe even get around
6:39
Speaker 1: 15 were useful. And then as you said, after that,
6:42
Speaker 1: it was just people making sure that they were on
6:45
Speaker 1: the program. Like it was almost like the funeral of
6:46
Speaker 1: a dignitary where everybody's got it. Like this is your
6:49
Speaker 1: chance and the world is going to see you or
6:51
Speaker 1: the preachers come from all the other churches and now
6:53
Speaker 1: they're going to show out. And I wonder if you
6:56
Speaker 1: enjoy this as much as I do. So I got
6:58
Speaker 1: a buddy of mine that used to sell a bunch
7:00
Speaker 1: of weed, right? And they got popped for something. I
7:03
Speaker 1: can't remember what, but he decided to fight it. And
7:05
Speaker 1: so he like he took some law classes and started,
7:07
Speaker 1: you know, putting in the paperwork that you can get
7:09
Speaker 1: to look at, you know, look at the documents that
7:12
Speaker 1: they have for these different cases. And I remember a
7:14
Speaker 1: point that he always made was. they really impressed themselves
7:18
Speaker 1: with the names of these operations. Like somebody always sits
7:22
Speaker 1: around and comes up with a cute name. And the
7:24
Speaker 1: cute name in this case is Operation Royal Flush. They
7:28
Speaker 1: had all these betting metaphors they were using and everything
7:31
Speaker 1: that they were saying. Like people knew that this was
7:33
Speaker 1: their opportunity to be on television.
7:36
Speaker 2: Without question. Yes, it was Operation Royal Flush was the
7:39
Speaker 2: rigged poker games and Operation Nothing But Bet. was the
7:46
Speaker 2: Terry Rozier part of this thing. I mean, you know
7:50
Speaker 2: they were very pleased with themselves. And did they sit
7:52
Speaker 2: around workshopping these names? You know, what's the best pun
7:55
Speaker 2: we can come up with? The best play on words?
7:59
Speaker 2: And I would love to know, yes, who was the
8:03
Speaker 2: speech writer and who was the copy editor that went
8:05
Speaker 2: into this of like, yeah, let's see if we can
8:07
Speaker 2: slip in a little sports analogy here, a little betting
8:10
Speaker 2: analogy there, and Oh, they were very pleased with themselves
8:13
Speaker 2: at the microphone today.
8:15
Speaker 1: And there's somebody that walks around the office and is like, hey,
8:17
Speaker 1: that was mine. Like, for example, and I'm not exaggerating,
8:20
Speaker 1: I know the dude who in the meeting at the
8:23
Speaker 1: office came up with the term Wi-Fi. Really? And he'll
8:28
Speaker 1: let you know. Like, just so you know. Just imagine that. Like,
8:33
Speaker 1: somebody says Wi-Fi every time you hear from a new person. Hey,
8:35
Speaker 1: you know, that was me. I came up with that.
8:40
Speaker 3: Yeah.
8:41
Speaker 2: No, that's yeah. This guy who would go a woman, whoever,
8:44
Speaker 2: whoever came up with these names, they they're, they're having
8:47
Speaker 2: rounds bought for him tonight at some bar in Brooklyn
8:50
Speaker 2: after this.
8:51
Speaker 1: So as this goes, and I feel, you know, confident
8:56
Speaker 1: saying that this is only the beginning and it's going
9:00
Speaker 1: to have some very interesting offshoots that I kind of,
9:04
Speaker 1: I'm doing my best to wait, you know, before talking
9:06
Speaker 1: about some of the things, some of them seem fairly obvious,
9:08
Speaker 1: but we have to be careful here, but, It's shocking
9:12
Speaker 1: that this happens and the day before, the NCAA announces
9:17
Speaker 1: that they will allow their players at all divisions to
9:20
Speaker 1: gamble on professional sports. And look, I've been talking about
9:23
Speaker 1: this for a while and I acknowledge that I work
9:26
Speaker 1: for people and I put my voice to things that
9:29
Speaker 1: advertise for these gambling companies. Like I have spoken to
9:31
Speaker 1: the caution that needs to be had and I make
9:34
Speaker 1: the point that it's got a warning label, right? Like
9:36
Speaker 1: we need to be honest about what it is that
9:38
Speaker 1: we're doing, but I also recognize that They're paying the
9:41
Speaker 1: bills in our business. There's a measure of complicity. And
9:43
Speaker 1: it'll be curious to see how people decide that they
9:47
Speaker 1: want to handle this. But at the same time, how
9:50
Speaker 1: badly have we lost the plot here?
9:53
Speaker 2: Yeah, no, this is astounding timing. It really feels like
9:59
Speaker 2: to me, Bo, that. that college and pro basketball have
10:05
Speaker 2: been whistling past the graveyard on this for a year
10:08
Speaker 2: and a half. And just like, yeah, well, you know,
10:11
Speaker 2: there's something going on. It's not going to be that bad.
10:13
Speaker 2: How bad could it really be? Well, yeah, we need
10:15
Speaker 2: the money from these gambling outfits. Sure, we're just going
10:17
Speaker 2: to keep going down that path. And this is not
10:22
Speaker 2: to say directly that DraftKings created this scandal. This is
10:27
Speaker 2: a mafia scandal. This is, you know, on a different
10:32
Speaker 2: kind of level to a degree of how this thing
10:35
Speaker 2: has operated. But there is no doubt that the permeation,
10:42
Speaker 2: I guess, of gambling throughout sports is just basically a
10:47
Speaker 2: partner thing. and a side effect is problematic. And yes,
10:53
Speaker 2: for the NCAA to have just finally announced, and this
10:56
Speaker 2: has been going on for a few months, but to
10:58
Speaker 2: come out with it this week, that yeah, our athletes
11:02
Speaker 2: can go ahead and bet on pro football, pro basketball. Sure,
11:06
Speaker 2: you know, if you played... I'm just going to throw
11:09
Speaker 2: out this example. This is not to implicate anybody, but
11:12
Speaker 2: if you played with Jace Richardson last year at Michigan state,
11:16
Speaker 2: and now he's in the league and you call him up,
11:18
Speaker 2: Hey Jace, you know, who's got an ankle, you know,
11:21
Speaker 2: who's got a bad knee there. You know, what's who's
11:23
Speaker 2: going to play tonight. Not saying Jace Richardson would give
11:26
Speaker 2: that information, but boy, there's pathways there. This is, I
11:30
Speaker 2: think you are creating way more problems than you're solving
11:33
Speaker 2: by trying to simply lower caseload. That's what they're trying
11:36
Speaker 2: to do is like, look, We're tired of chasing around
11:38
Speaker 2: guys that bet $ 50 on the NFL. I get that.
11:42
Speaker 2: Just don't chase them. But allowing this, I think, just
11:45
Speaker 2: opens up the doorway for so many more problems.
11:48
Speaker 1: You know, I think you just made an interesting point
11:50
Speaker 1: there because I was talking to someone, and I forget
11:51
Speaker 1: which story. The NCAA brought the hammer down to somebody
11:55
Speaker 1: on some real old school NCAA type stuff. I can't
11:58
Speaker 1: remember exactly who it was, but it dawned on me.
12:00
Speaker 1: They got a lot more free time on their hands
12:02
Speaker 1: now in the investigative department over there because there's not
12:06
Speaker 1: money to chase in the same way. But there would
12:09
Speaker 1: be this. And this would actually, when you talk about
12:12
Speaker 1: the caseload, that's very, very important. The prevalence of betting
12:16
Speaker 1: on campuses is so strong and it's so easy to
12:19
Speaker 1: find somebody that'll do whatever the thing is for you.
12:22
Speaker 1: And then it goes and obviously it gets to these players.
12:25
Speaker 1: And I hadn't quite thought about it the way you did.
12:27
Speaker 1: The interconnectivity of these worlds all these guys have access
12:31
Speaker 1: to staggering levels of inside information in professional sports. Like
12:35
Speaker 1: nevermind the fact how easily it is for them to
12:38
Speaker 1: get strung out on this, especially a lot of these
12:40
Speaker 1: kids who got, they now got some money in their
12:42
Speaker 1: pockets for the first time. In some cases, a lot
12:45
Speaker 1: of money in their pockets, but then also, yeah, I
12:49
Speaker 1: can call up and just be like, Hey, what's it
12:51
Speaker 1: looking like down there? Tell me what it is. And
12:53
Speaker 1: that becomes full on catastrophic.
12:56
Speaker 2: Absolutely.
12:56
Speaker 1: Yeah.
12:56
Speaker 2: No, I mean, Look, I think we're probably all happy
12:59
Speaker 2: the players are finally getting some money. But as most
13:03
Speaker 2: college kids and myself included, how responsible will they be
13:07
Speaker 2: in terms of saving it versus spending it? And then, yeah,
13:11
Speaker 2: you start getting backwards. You start getting in trouble there.
13:13
Speaker 2: And it's like, oh, my gosh, I better. Yeah, I
13:15
Speaker 2: better see if I can get some insider information. Or,
13:18
Speaker 2: you know, the other direction is you start getting into
13:21
Speaker 2: debt and somebody comes in and says, hey. All you
13:25
Speaker 2: got to do is play a crappy first half against
13:27
Speaker 2: Toledo and we'll get you, you know, we'll take care
13:31
Speaker 2: of you here. And the other thing I would like
13:33
Speaker 2: to bring up with the college part of this thing,
13:37
Speaker 2: the truly, in my mind, evil genius of it, allegedly,
13:43
Speaker 2: is that they went to these gamblers, gambling ring, went
13:47
Speaker 2: to players who were involved, who were playing at mid
13:50
Speaker 2: to low level schools. They're not getting much NIL. They
13:54
Speaker 2: don't have much in the pocket. They're like, hey, this
13:58
Speaker 2: is how you can do it. And nobody's going to
14:00
Speaker 2: notice because nobody pays attention to your games or the
14:02
Speaker 2: line movement on your games. Just dump a half for us.
14:06
Speaker 2: And I think that's where the majority of this, when
14:08
Speaker 2: it comes out from an NCAA standpoint, is going to
14:11
Speaker 2: be at those level schools.
14:12
Speaker 1: But the irony of it to me, and you tell
14:15
Speaker 1: me if I'm crazy, but... the reason that nobody, or
14:20
Speaker 1: you would think that nobody would pay attention is also
14:23
Speaker 1: the reason that you get caught, right? Like nothing happens
14:26
Speaker 1: on these games and now suddenly something happens. Like I
14:29
Speaker 1: think of Rozier, Rozier had some crazy under, and I
14:32
Speaker 1: think somebody likes like hundreds of thousands of dollars. come
14:35
Speaker 1: in on him with this under in the first half
14:37
Speaker 1: and i'm like who's sitting around thinking about putting this
14:38
Speaker 1: much money on an under for terry rosier like that
14:42
Speaker 1: that seems crazy that in order for this to truly
14:44
Speaker 1: be effective for somebody and maybe a lot more people
14:47
Speaker 1: get away with it than we realize right but it
14:49
Speaker 1: sounds to me that for a scheme like this to
14:51
Speaker 1: be effective you have to give away that it's a scheme.
14:54
Speaker 2: Yeah no i mean that's a great point is that
14:56
Speaker 2: that yes it doesn't take much to move the needle
14:59
Speaker 2: if you're going to bet on a southland conference game
15:02
Speaker 2: right right so i think the key is hey, bet
15:07
Speaker 2: 500 here, bet 500 there, bet 500 over here. Don't
15:10
Speaker 2: bet 5,000 or try to bet 5,000 and have the
15:14
Speaker 2: casino say, hell no. But then it does reach a
15:17
Speaker 2: point where it trips a wire, and all of a
15:19
Speaker 2: sudden everybody's like, wait a minute, there is way too
15:21
Speaker 2: much action on a personal over-under for a player who
15:24
Speaker 2: doesn't play that much, like a Jonte Porter or a
15:27
Speaker 2: Rozier who doesn't play as much as he used to, or,
15:30
Speaker 2: you know, an obscure college game. So, you know, they...
15:35
Speaker 2: One of the good parts of having so much legalized
15:38
Speaker 2: gambling is the ability to monitor. There is much greater
15:44
Speaker 2: technology and access to technology that will monitor all the bets.
15:49
Speaker 2: I mean, Big Brother knows who you're betting on and
15:51
Speaker 2: knows how much. And if it gets fishy, they can
15:55
Speaker 2: turn it in.
15:56
Speaker 1: Now, on the college level, in your conversations with coaches,
16:00
Speaker 1: what is their level of concern?
16:04
Speaker 2: Not much because you know how college coaches are. You
16:07
Speaker 2: know how they are. They all live in this box
16:10
Speaker 2: that's as big as their eyeballs, and that's it. Does
16:12
Speaker 2: it affect me?
16:13
Speaker 3: No.
16:13
Speaker 1: All right, cool.
16:14
Speaker 2: We're done. Oh, this is a University of New Orleans problem?
16:19
Speaker 2: This is Mississippi Valley? We don't care. Screw them. It's
16:25
Speaker 2: uncanny to me the lack of curiosity, the lack of
16:29
Speaker 2: concern from the coaching staff fraternity about this sort of
16:34
Speaker 2: thing and it does just go to show you know
16:36
Speaker 2: college sports are so every man for himself or every
16:39
Speaker 2: conference for themselves that's like yeah that's a mid-major problem
16:43
Speaker 2: I'm at a high major school let's just keep going.
16:47
Speaker 1: Yeah and for the NBA Adam Silver will always have
16:53
Speaker 1: that op-ed he wrote in the New York Times in
16:56
Speaker 1: 2014 saying the sports gambling should be legalized and maybe
17:02
Speaker 1: he was right that this improved monitoring and everything else,
17:05
Speaker 1: but he's always going to have that one on his back.
17:08
Speaker 1: Cause to me, the issue is, um, and I've been
17:11
Speaker 1: doing a lot of doom and gloom reading about the
17:12
Speaker 1: internet that informs us to a degree, but the truth is,
17:15
Speaker 1: is having legalized gambling is one thing, allowing you to
17:18
Speaker 1: gamble on a cell phone is another. And that is
17:21
Speaker 1: a greatly complicating factor in all of this. It makes
17:25
Speaker 1: it very easy for people to get behind gambling. in
17:27
Speaker 1: all kinds of ways but the real issue is is
17:30
Speaker 1: one thing if you have to go to the casino
17:31
Speaker 1: or you have to go to the otb or you
17:33
Speaker 1: got to go wherever it is to meet the bookie
17:35
Speaker 1: when the casino follows you around the stakes of all
17:39
Speaker 1: of this just have just changed completely.
17:42
Speaker 2: Totally yeah when the casino's in your pocket and sending
17:46
Speaker 2: you alerts hey you know i mean boy it's right
17:49
Speaker 2: there no doubt about it and if you go to
17:51
Speaker 2: games now somebody pointed this out to me last year
17:53
Speaker 2: like And especially you look at student section, but otherwise too.
17:57
Speaker 2: During the games, there's a lot of people that are
17:59
Speaker 2: on their phones placing in-game bets. They're not looking at
18:02
Speaker 2: the game as much as they're looking at what the
18:03
Speaker 2: line movement is and where can I get down and
18:06
Speaker 2: try to make some money. So the availability of it
18:10
Speaker 2: all is a major amplifier in this.
18:15
Speaker 1: Do you have any concern? Because basketball really had to
18:20
Speaker 1: fight to save its reputation coming out of like the 40s, 50s,
18:22
Speaker 1: and 60s. and people kind of almost believing like it
18:25
Speaker 1: was wrestling, like it was a game that could not
18:27
Speaker 1: be believed in. Is it dramatic to say that that's
18:31
Speaker 1: a concern that we'll have in this game going forward
18:36
Speaker 1: if we have more of these?
18:40
Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't think it's that dramatic. I really don't.
18:42
Speaker 2: I think this is a major reputational hit, and it
18:47
Speaker 2: gives some people the fodder they want to have for
18:50
Speaker 2: how they feel about NBA players or even college players
18:53
Speaker 2: to a degree, um, you know, irresponsible, uh, you know,
18:59
Speaker 2: prone to problems, that sort of thing. And, and you
19:03
Speaker 2: are feeding ammunition to people who generally speaking are wrong,
19:09
Speaker 2: but you're giving them ammunition for preconceived notions that they
19:13
Speaker 2: may have. And, uh, that's, that's out there and yeah,
19:18
Speaker 2: we'll see where this goes. And if there's a bunch
19:20
Speaker 2: of other players involved, but you know, whether how much
19:24
Speaker 2: is acknowledged or not, I don't know, but the, you know,
19:26
Speaker 2: there is a lot of gambling that goes on the
19:29
Speaker 2: NBA amongst the players. Most of it's legal, I believe,
19:33
Speaker 2: you know, but, but like big poker games for in
19:36
Speaker 2: casinos in Vegas, uh, And some story, you know, like
19:41
Speaker 2: people losing lots of money. And it's just, it's a concern.
19:44
Speaker 2: I think if the, if you're the leagues, like, Hey,
19:46
Speaker 2: you know what?
19:47
Speaker 1: Yeah.
19:47
Speaker 2: Rich people of all persuasions can go to Vegas and
19:50
Speaker 2: do the same damn thing. But if everybody's out there saying, Oh,
19:53
Speaker 2: the NBA is full of gambling addicts. That's bad. Right.
19:56
Speaker 1: I'll tell you two things right fast before we go
19:58
Speaker 1: to break one, I was in Vegas this summer and
20:01
Speaker 1: an NBA player, I will not name was at the
20:03
Speaker 1: same table as me, but he was kind of blending
20:06
Speaker 1: in just playing blackjack. And he, I tried to acknowledge
20:10
Speaker 1: him without blowing his cover and he was dedicated to
20:15
Speaker 1: holding on to his cover. Right. And then the pit
20:18
Speaker 1: boss comes over and says, nah, he's here a lot.
20:22
Speaker 1: And I was like, Oh yeah, yeah. That's number one.
20:25
Speaker 1: Number two, there's a video going around of get up
20:28
Speaker 1: on Thursday on ESPN. Um, and while they're talking about
20:33
Speaker 1: this story, the ESPN bet logo was in the bottom
20:36
Speaker 1: right corner, and apparently somebody was like, hey, maybe we
20:39
Speaker 1: should take that down. And then, ixnay, it was gone.
20:43
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25:57
Speaker 1: We are here with Pat Forty of SI.com. Ryan and
26:01
Speaker 1: I were talking just before we got on the air,
26:03
Speaker 1: and we were just saying it is so interesting. Firing
26:06
Speaker 1: season now starts in September, and it literally did. Like
26:09
Speaker 1: it used to have back in the day, Jack Crow
26:11
Speaker 1: gets fired because he lost to the Citadel, and then
26:13
Speaker 1: something crazy like that happens. Now we've got the James
26:16
Speaker 1: Franklin firing, even if understandable, firing a guy like that
26:20
Speaker 1: after 34 of his last 42 games were wins in
26:23
Speaker 1: the middle of the season. is kind of crazy now
26:27
Speaker 1: it feels like the predominant story and I guess this
26:30
Speaker 1: is a side effect of the playoff that people didn't
26:32
Speaker 1: think about I haven't given that much thought to who
26:34
Speaker 1: the 16 teams are I just spent all my time
26:36
Speaker 1: trying to figure out who's going to get fired.
26:39
Speaker 2: You know what I'll tell you this much readership is
26:42
Speaker 2: very high for coaching carousel stuff not as high for
26:45
Speaker 2: the playoffs so that tells you you're not alone in
26:48
Speaker 2: that uh it's it's wild it really is and it's
26:52
Speaker 2: funny so Late 20-teens, we were trending this direction where
26:58
Speaker 2: you were getting some guys. Willie Taggart got fired early
27:00
Speaker 2: at Florida State and a few other guys. But then
27:05
Speaker 2: that kind of cooled down. Maybe that was pandemic related.
27:07
Speaker 2: And then it virtually stopped last year because everybody was
27:11
Speaker 2: scared to death about what the house settlement was going
27:13
Speaker 2: to do to their budgets. Like, no, we got to
27:16
Speaker 2: save our acorns for the winter, you know. Now, oh no,
27:19
Speaker 2: we're back. We're back. Every time you hear an AD
27:22
Speaker 2: say we don't have enough money, they find enough money
27:24
Speaker 2: to do something like this. So it is wild. This
27:28
Speaker 2: year's really pretty shocking, but I guess we could to
27:31
Speaker 2: a degree see it coming because there were so few
27:33
Speaker 2: firings last year. And, you know, I think they're obviously, look,
27:38
Speaker 2: it's a copycat industry. And it's like, oh, somebody else
27:41
Speaker 2: is getting ahead. They're being proactive. You know, they're getting
27:44
Speaker 2: into the market early. We better do it too. And
27:47
Speaker 2: so you've seen Virginia Tech and you've seen Arkansas and
27:49
Speaker 2: you've seen UCLA and now you've seen Florida State. I'm sorry,
27:52
Speaker 2: Florida and Penn State. And those jobs are going to
27:56
Speaker 2: there's going to be domino effects from there. And it
27:59
Speaker 2: is just amazing how fast people want to give up
28:03
Speaker 2: on the current season to get to the next season.
28:06
Speaker 1: Now, I feel like the catalyzing agent was when they
28:09
Speaker 1: got that bright idea about the early signing day, right?
28:12
Speaker 1: Because now it became a matter of we got to
28:14
Speaker 1: do this because once the recruiting class doesn't look like
28:16
Speaker 1: it's going to be good and the guys have a
28:18
Speaker 1: greater chance of being off the table, then we started writing.
28:21
Speaker 1: What we've seen more of, and I think Florida did
28:23
Speaker 1: this twice, right? No, Florida didn't. Florida State didn't. No, no. Okay.
28:28
Speaker 1: It happened to Jimbo at Texas A & M. We
28:30
Speaker 1: fire you after a win. You beat Mississippi State, and
28:33
Speaker 1: we still decide to fire you because actually we had
28:35
Speaker 1: decided to fire you already, but we just needed a
28:38
Speaker 1: little time to pass the hat and actually make sure
28:40
Speaker 1: that we got the money together. And then it goes
28:43
Speaker 1: from there. And so I am interested in your thoughts
28:47
Speaker 1: about kind of the jobs and what is available. So
28:49
Speaker 1: the Florida job, which I think you and I would
28:51
Speaker 1: have agreed 20 years ago that Florida is one of
28:53
Speaker 1: the two or three best coaching jobs. that you could have,
28:56
Speaker 1: it doesn't feel that way anymore. And it's interesting because 10,
28:59
Speaker 1: 20 years before that, you also wouldn't have said that
29:02
Speaker 1: about Florida. Where do you think this stands? Because I think, look, man,
29:06
Speaker 1: Lane Kiffin seems to be the spiritual successor to Steve Spurrier.
29:12
Speaker 1: But I don't know how great an idea that is
29:14
Speaker 1: for either of them.
29:16
Speaker 2: Yeah, real quick, I have to say, yes, beating Mississippi
29:19
Speaker 2: State ain't what it used to be because it gets
29:20
Speaker 2: you fired now.
29:22
Speaker 1: They used to be a losing tool that got you fired.
29:25
Speaker 2: Yeah, right. Sylvester Croom got a bunch of people fired
29:28
Speaker 2: because he kept beating them. But now, yeah, it's gone
29:31
Speaker 2: the other way. And now you get fired even if
29:33
Speaker 2: you win. The Florida job is fascinating, Bomani, and you
29:39
Speaker 2: bring it up. There's a debate, and I don't know
29:42
Speaker 2: what's right, between it's a phenomenal job. They've won three
29:46
Speaker 2: national championships with two different coaches versus, eh, it's not
29:51
Speaker 2: that good a job, and it took two of the
29:52
Speaker 2: greatest coaches ever to win there, and everybody else has
29:55
Speaker 2: been kind of mid. So.
29:57
Speaker 2: What's the right answer? I don't know. Look, if we
29:59
Speaker 2: look at the theory of what makes a good job,
30:03
Speaker 2: Florida checks every box, right? You back out of the
30:07
Speaker 2: driveway and you go past a five-star. There's players all
30:10
Speaker 2: over the state of Florida. You have a massive, rabid
30:14
Speaker 2: fan base. You seat 90,000 in the stadium. You have
30:18
Speaker 2: membership in one of the two richest conferences. So all
30:22
Speaker 2: those things are there. It's just a question– Now, one
30:27
Speaker 2: of the amazing things about the flattening of the sport,
30:31
Speaker 2: is Indiana now a good job? I mean, maybe it
30:35
Speaker 2: is because all you need is NIL money and a
30:37
Speaker 2: great coach, and they've apparently got both. Vanderbilt, if you
30:42
Speaker 2: get a great coach and NIL money, can it be
30:43
Speaker 2: as good a job? Maybe not for the long term,
30:45
Speaker 2: but if you're trying to win a national title in
30:47
Speaker 2: three or four years, is Florida that much better than
30:50
Speaker 2: somewhere else? I still think it probably is, but... You
30:54
Speaker 2: could argue the other way, that now anything could be
30:58
Speaker 2: a good job in the right circumstance.
31:02
Speaker 1: I got a whiff in that you're still coming to
31:05
Speaker 1: terms with the reality that Indiana is what it is
31:08
Speaker 1: right now, huh? It hasn't really landed with me either.
31:11
Speaker 2: Dude, I've been covering games there since 1990, and.
31:16
Speaker 2: The apathy was incredible. The teams were terrible. They couldn't
31:19
Speaker 2: get the students to come in the stadium. They would
31:21
Speaker 2: go tailgate and then they'd go back to the dorms
31:23
Speaker 2: or go to the bars. None of them would come
31:25
Speaker 2: into the stadium. So for them to be this good,
31:28
Speaker 2: like Kirk Cignetti may be the greatest single coach in
31:30
Speaker 2: the history of the human race. I don't know. I
31:33
Speaker 2: cannot figure it out.
31:35
Speaker 1: Well, I mentioned Florida. I am shocked that Florida State
31:37
Speaker 1: put out a statement that said that they would not evaluate.
31:40
Speaker 1: They would evaluate Mike Norvell at the end of the season.
31:43
Speaker 1: And look, that is clearly over.
31:45
Speaker 2: Right.
31:45
Speaker 1: Like the one thing I will say is it's the
31:47
Speaker 1: Jeremy Foley quote from 2004. That which will be done
31:50
Speaker 1: eventually should be done immediately. It is clear that Norvell
31:53
Speaker 1: is not going to stick around. Do you understand why
31:56
Speaker 1: Florida State would decide that they were going to wait?
32:00
Speaker 2: I think the subtext to that is we ain't got
32:02
Speaker 2: that much money right now. We're hoping we'll have that
32:06
Speaker 2: much money by the end of the season, but this
32:09
Speaker 2: one's going to take a while. We don't have the
32:11
Speaker 2: Texas oil man booster. You know, this is going to
32:13
Speaker 2: wave 50 million and tell him to go away or
32:16
Speaker 2: something like that. So that's my sense. They have spent
32:20
Speaker 2: a lot of money on facilities here recently, which I
32:23
Speaker 2: think is a very bad decision because facilities don't win
32:26
Speaker 2: you anything anymore. And everybody could see this day coming when, well,
32:30
Speaker 2: you know, for the last couple of years, the house settlement,
32:32
Speaker 2: eventually you were going to have to start paying players
32:34
Speaker 2: a lot of money. They blew through all the warning signs, said, no,
32:37
Speaker 2: we're going to keep building things and refurbishing and whatever.
32:41
Speaker 2: But I do think that you're right. It's done, right?
32:44
Speaker 2: There is no, you can't go back and massively reboot
32:47
Speaker 2: again after you did that last off season, blow out
32:50
Speaker 2: the coordinators, bring in new ones, bring a new transfer
32:52
Speaker 2: portal class and say, here's a new Mike Norvell. You
32:55
Speaker 2: can't do that twice. But I think that it is
32:58
Speaker 2: a matter of, We need to find the money or
33:01
Speaker 2: Mike needs to find another job and help us out.
33:04
Speaker 1: I really think a very underrated part of college sports
33:07
Speaker 1: that we don't talk about is the idea of we
33:10
Speaker 1: have to find the money, right? Colorado, when they hired
33:13
Speaker 1: Deion Sanders, that famously didn't have the money. They're just like, OK,
33:17
Speaker 1: we'll work that part out later. We saw that in
33:20
Speaker 1: the early, more unstructured NIL days. Like, do we have
33:23
Speaker 1: the money? Yeah.
33:25
Speaker 2: Kind of. Not really. Don't worry.
33:28
Speaker 1: We'll work that out later. And I guess that's it
33:30
Speaker 1: with the timing on some of these moves. Because I
33:32
Speaker 1: think we've seen some other schools with the, yeah, we'll
33:34
Speaker 1: just wait until the end of the year. And it's
33:36
Speaker 1: just like, oh, you guys just don't have the money.
33:40
Speaker 2: Yeah.
33:41
Speaker 1: Yeah.
33:41
Speaker 2: I think it's Arkansas. I'm sorry. Wisconsin right now. Yes.
33:44
Speaker 2: Same thing. Like that's unsalvageable, I think, for Luke Fickle.
33:47
Speaker 2: But and their numbers smaller. It's like 27 million. But Arkansas.
33:52
Speaker 2: I keep saying Arkansas. Wisconsin is kind of a frugal state.
33:55
Speaker 2: Athletic department. They've never been lavish spenders. And so for
33:58
Speaker 2: them to come up with $ 27 million, I think it's
34:01
Speaker 2: going to take a while to figure that out. But
34:03
Speaker 2: I would be shocked if we see Mike Norvell or
34:06
Speaker 2: Luke Fickle coaching at those schools again in 2026.
34:11
Speaker 1: Do you think Lincoln Riley will be coaching at USC
34:13
Speaker 1: in 2026? I do.
34:17
Speaker 2: That's a buyout number that's crazy. And USC does have
34:20
Speaker 2: rich people, but that's like $ 90 million. I mean, that's
34:23
Speaker 2: plus Jimbo. Oh, wow. Yeah.
34:25
Speaker 1: Yeah.
34:25
Speaker 2: It's it's higher than Jimbo. And so it's almost impossible
34:30
Speaker 2: to go there. You know, he's he hadn't delivered on
34:34
Speaker 2: what they thought he was going to be. But he
34:36
Speaker 2: also he has not been a complete train wreck. And so,
34:40
Speaker 2: you know, where do you land in the middle of that,
34:42
Speaker 2: especially when you owe that much? I think that they're
34:45
Speaker 2: kind of they're stuck with each other for the time being.
34:48
Speaker 1: Not what they want him to be, but not a
34:51
Speaker 1: train wreck seems to be the description. of my buddy Ryan's,
34:56
Speaker 1: LSU Tigers head coach, Brian Kelly, with the added component being,
35:01
Speaker 1: and we talk about this all the time, people don't
35:03
Speaker 1: like him. Like, I think LSU actually is a bit
35:07
Speaker 1: underrated in the sense that that is not an impatient job.
35:10
Speaker 1: They give people time to get themselves out of things,
35:13
Speaker 1: and it's been okay with Kelly. It's honestly been around
35:17
Speaker 1: the general level of LSU success outside of a couple
35:20
Speaker 1: of outlier seasons, but nobody seems to be having a
35:22
Speaker 1: good time.
35:24
Speaker 2: No, they don't. And, you know, it is funny. Yeah,
35:27
Speaker 2: they played in the SEC championship game. Jaden Daniels won
35:30
Speaker 2: the Heisman Trophy. It's not like they're just, you know, horrible.
35:34
Speaker 2: But they've kind of decided to a degree, yeah, we're
35:37
Speaker 2: done with this guy. His likability is a factor as well.
35:44
Speaker 2: It's interesting. You bring up him and Lincoln Riley. That
35:47
Speaker 2: was the same time in the cycle. You know, these
35:51
Speaker 2: bombshell moves. Lincoln Riley going from Oklahoma to USC, Brian
35:54
Speaker 2: Kelly going from Notre Dame to LSU. And the belief was,
35:59
Speaker 2: and I was probably in that camp, geez, these guys
36:01
Speaker 2: are going to win huge. They're going to be winning titles.
36:04
Speaker 2: They're going to be in the playoff every year. Guess
36:06
Speaker 2: who was the best coach out of that cycle? Marcus Freeman,
36:09
Speaker 2: the defensive coordinator who hadn't been a head coach who
36:12
Speaker 2: moved up at Notre Dame. So you never fully know,
36:15
Speaker 2: especially when you make a big swing and that big
36:17
Speaker 2: an investment, but A huge game for Brian Kelly Saturday,
36:21
Speaker 2: huge against Texas A & M at home. Can't lose
36:24
Speaker 2: that one. And then you got to turn around and
36:26
Speaker 2: play Alabama in Tuscaloosa after that. So he better win.
36:30
Speaker 1: I would say if you are at the point where
36:32
Speaker 1: you are at, you better win against the number four
36:34
Speaker 1: team in the country. It is over.
36:37
Speaker 2: Yeah, you can absolutely make that argument. Yes. And, and
36:41
Speaker 2: I think the fans there have kind of hit that
36:44
Speaker 2: saturation point. You know, I, I, I think that, uh,
36:49
Speaker 2: They've certainly got very good talent. They absolutely do. I
36:52
Speaker 2: thought Garrett Nussmeyer has always been a little bit overrated
36:54
Speaker 2: as a quarterback and they just haven't quite fitted in
36:58
Speaker 2: around him. Young offensive line this year and now an
37:00
Speaker 2: injured offensive line. The defense gets better. The offense gets worse.
37:04
Speaker 2: They just haven't done a complete program, you know, rebuild
37:09
Speaker 2: with Kelly.
37:12
Speaker 1: One of our running topics here on the show is
37:16
Speaker 1: how fast the Alabama hot seat gets in that Saban
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Speaker 1: was so good that there's an entire generation that doesn't
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Speaker 1: understand how Alabama actually works. They started to get a
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Speaker 1: whiff of it after the Florida State loss, but Ty
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Speaker 1: Simpson apparently now looks like he's the number one pick
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Speaker 1: in the draft. They are rolling, but all it would
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Speaker 1: take is that LSU game, huh?
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Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, look, that's a great point. The underrated
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Speaker 2: insanity of Alabama fans. And here's a good story for
37:45
Speaker 2: you on that front. So this is Saban's Third season
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Speaker 2: down there. First season, not that good. Second season, they
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Speaker 2: break through. They play in the SEC championship game, nearly
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Speaker 2: beat Florida. Third season, they're undefeated, and they're playing Tennessee,
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Speaker 2: the huge rivalry game. It's in Bryant-Denny Stadium. It's a
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Speaker 2: complete slog. It goes down to the end. Tennessee has
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Speaker 2: a field goal to tie on the last play. Terrence
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Speaker 2: Cody breaks through, blocks it, wins the game. 90% of
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Speaker 2: the stadium's in euphoria, but I'm walking down to the
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Speaker 2: field and some old guy grabs me and says, Saban
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Speaker 2: ain't going to cut it. You can't come that close
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Speaker 2: to losing to Tennessee. Bear wouldn't do that. Saban cut
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Speaker 2: it pretty good. But that's exactly who you're dealing with there.
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Speaker 1: And DeBoer, I mean, I think getting Ryan Grubb back mattered.
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Speaker 1: The offense, like those two guys running an offense together, right?
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Speaker 1: That is a thing that goes. And when I've watched them,
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Speaker 1: It's not like the old days, but they do still
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Speaker 1: have players.
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Speaker 2: Oh, they do. They've got really good talent on this team.
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Speaker 2: I mean, it's a very talented team, probably the most talented,
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Speaker 2: I think, in terms of experience and ability in the SEC.
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Speaker 2: And bringing in Grubb has been huge. Ty Simpson has
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Speaker 2: been tremendous. Defense has been very good. You know, I
39:09
Speaker 2: think Kalen DeBoer can and will win a national championship,
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Speaker 2: you know, and it'll happen at Alabama. I don't know when,
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Speaker 2: possibly this year. But remember the woman that got interviewed
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Speaker 2: after the Florida State game that was going to try
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Speaker 2: to play the power ball. And she said, if she won,
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Speaker 2: she was going to use the money to buy out
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Speaker 2: to bore and then get on with the rest of
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Speaker 2: her life. I, I don't think she needs to do
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Speaker 2: that anymore.
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Speaker 1: So staying in that world, a point that I've made
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Speaker 1: many times. And if you only like kind of follow
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Speaker 1: college football, you don't realize this at Alabama college, you
39:45
Speaker 1: got two outcomes, greatest coach of all time, or they're
39:48
Speaker 1: going to run you out. Like there's, there's really kind
39:50
Speaker 1: of no in between like Ohio state is a job.
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Speaker 1: You're going to get fired. Nobody really gets to, even
39:55
Speaker 1: urban Meyer didn't really get to walk on his own terms.
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Speaker 1: Woody Hayes got fired, right? Every Jim Trestle got fired
40:01
Speaker 1: one way or another. You're going to get fired at Auburn.
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Speaker 1: You are guaranteed to leave in one form of disgrace
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Speaker 1: or another. So which form is Hugh freeze going to
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Speaker 1: leave in? Because that one also appears to be old.
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Speaker 2: Yeah. Disgrace is inevitable. I should write that on the
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Speaker 2: top of your contract when you sign it. He's going
40:25
Speaker 2: to go down this year for not winning. That's another one.
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Speaker 2: I think that's inevitable at this point. It's year three.
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Speaker 2: It hasn't happened. They're bad on offense, which is supposed
40:35
Speaker 2: to be Hugh's thing. They made a bad decision to
40:37
Speaker 2: make Jackson Arnold their centerpiece quarterback and they've got several
40:42
Speaker 2: more losses to come. So I think Hugh Freeze gets
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Speaker 2: blown out at some point this year. Do they let
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Speaker 2: him go through the Alabama game at the end of
40:50
Speaker 2: the Iron Bowl? We'll see. But I think that's another
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Speaker 2: one where the writing is on the wall.
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Speaker 1: That Jackson Arnold, that Oklahoma told Dylan Gabriel that he
40:58
Speaker 1: needed to find a new place to play because Jackson
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Speaker 1: Arnold was coming, and then this is what happens if
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Speaker 1: Jackson Arnold gets to Auburn.
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Speaker 2: It's incredible. You know... It's not easy to look at
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Speaker 2: 18-year-olds and say, you're going to be really good or
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Speaker 2: really bad. But it's amazing how often they miss, considering
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Speaker 2: the money, the brainpower, and the effort put into finding
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Speaker 2: the ones that you think won't miss. But look at
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Speaker 2: who we're talking about right now. Ty Simpson was a
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Speaker 2: big time dude. Fernando Mendoza may be the second quarterback pick.
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Speaker 2: He was committed to Yale at one point and then
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Speaker 2: ended up at Cal. He was a three-star at best.
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Speaker 2: He was the number 134 quarterback. in the class of
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Speaker 2: 2022 so it's hard to do to figure out who
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Speaker 2: these guys are.
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Speaker 1: All right we got a couple more things for you
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Speaker 1: uh i have not gotten to uh my old stomping
41:45
Speaker 1: grounds north carolina and what is going on with bill
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Speaker 1: belichick they got they just have to find the money
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Speaker 1: right like like this just has this just has to stop.
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Speaker 2: It's it's astounding it really is like the not just
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Speaker 2: the level of bad play but the chaos that seems
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Speaker 2: to be going on the sloppiness the The disorganization, the arrogance,
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Speaker 2: the hubris, the complete whiff on personnel decisions and player
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Speaker 2: grading and deciding who could play. It's unbelievable. But that's
42:21
Speaker 2: another place. I don't know. Do they want to have
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Speaker 2: the money? I think there's some people that have enough
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Speaker 2: ego invested. They're like, we got to bring him back
42:29
Speaker 2: for another year and see if he can get better.
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Speaker 2: But there's so much negativity and so much apathy. I mean,
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Speaker 2: I went to the first game. Fans were flying out
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Speaker 2: of there in the third quarter of the first game.
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Speaker 1: Oh, it takes nothing. It takes nothing. At the first
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Speaker 1: sign of trouble, somebody can hear a basketball bouncing somewhere. Like,
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Speaker 1: don't you worry about that. They're going to be upset,
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Speaker 1: but they're not necessarily going to stick around. The thing is,
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Speaker 1: one thing that I know is going to have to
42:56
Speaker 1: take place at some point in the not distant future
42:59
Speaker 1: around that athletic department is they're going to need to
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Speaker 1: figure out something for a new basketball building. And I
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Speaker 1: wonder how all that ties when you start talking about
43:06
Speaker 1: we're going to need to pony up $ 30 million. Remembering
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Speaker 1: that that's a building that they built with private funds.
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Speaker 1: They did not build that with state funding. I don't
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Speaker 1: know how they're going to do it when it comes
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Speaker 1: down the line. But needing to come up with $ 30
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Speaker 1: million to get Belichick out of there, I wonder how
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Speaker 1: that's going to be. And I wonder how well Bill
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Speaker 1: Belichick can withstand pain of just being in an obviously
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Speaker 1: miserable situation.
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Speaker 2: Well, that's the other thing. Talk about a guy with
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Speaker 2: some ego. If he can pull the ripcord and save
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Speaker 2: some face out of this as opposed to coming back
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Speaker 2: next year as a punchline, I wouldn't be shocked at
43:43
Speaker 2: all if he made the move as much as North
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Speaker 2: Carolina did. But we'll see.
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Speaker 1: I could not. I watched the first possession of that
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Speaker 1: game against TCU, and I was like, hey, man, these
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Speaker 1: guys look like they're executing. I think this is going
43:54
Speaker 1: to be okay. I've never been wronger.
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Speaker 2: I was there in the stadium and I said the
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Speaker 2: exact same thing. Yeah, I was like, man, these.
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Speaker 1: Guys are rolling. They seem to be making something happen.
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Speaker 1: They did not. Before we let you go, we have
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Speaker 1: talked a lot on this show about the idea of
44:13
Speaker 1: the Big Ten taking money from private equity. And my
44:17
Speaker 1: line always is, show me the thing that private equity
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Speaker 1: has ever made better. But it is worth noting the
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Speaker 1: two schools in the Big Ten that have stopped this
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Speaker 1: from happening are the ones that have the most money.
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Speaker 1: Ohio State and Michigan. Do you think that this is inevitable,
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Speaker 1: that the day is just going to come where this
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Speaker 1: money gets taken? And what do you think happens if
44:33
Speaker 1: it comes down to that?
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Speaker 2: Well, and USC, too, which also has more money than God,
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Speaker 2: is against this. I keep having people tell me private
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Speaker 2: equity is inevitable. It's smart. You need to do it.
44:47
Speaker 2: There's so much unrealized potential, da-da-da-da-da-da. But I'm with you,
44:51
Speaker 2: that the people that welcome in Private capital, does it
44:54
Speaker 2: improve your actual product of what are your businesses? Almost never.
44:58
Speaker 2: Sure as hell hasn't in the media world, and probably
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Speaker 2: a lot of other places as well. I just, you know,
45:07
Speaker 2: it just bothers me, I guess, that we have the
45:12
Speaker 2: Big Ten, which signed by far the richest media deal
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Speaker 2: in history three years ago, $ 7 billion, and continues to
45:25
Speaker 2: rake that in and continues to fill stadiums while charging
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Speaker 2: more for tickets and more for parking and more for
45:30
Speaker 2: popcorn is still like, oh, we need the money. Oh
45:33
Speaker 2: my God, we need the money. It's insulting, I think.
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Speaker 2: It's indicative of completely irresponsible fiscal leadership, but they might
45:43
Speaker 2: do it. Yeah, they'll probably do it, if I had
45:45
Speaker 2: to guess. If you've got 16 out of 18 schools
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Speaker 2: or 15 out of 18 saying we need to do it,
45:50
Speaker 2: you probably wear down the other ones and eventually- It happens.
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Speaker 1: And by the way, they have a media deal where
45:55
Speaker 1: they are fleecing their network partners. Have you seen these
45:59
Speaker 1: numbers that have shown that the highest rated games are
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Speaker 1: all SEC games, basically? Mostly games that are on ABC
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Speaker 1: and ESPN. The Big Ten partners are not, maybe they're
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Speaker 1: getting their money's worth, but they are not getting nearly
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Speaker 1: the steal of a deal that Disney is getting over
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Speaker 1: on the SEC.
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Speaker 2: It's true. I mean, the SEC, like you got to
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Speaker 2: be sitting there with one hand saying, gosh, we are
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Speaker 2: killing it. And the other hand saying, we're giving them
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Speaker 2: too good a bargain. We need to renegotiate here.
46:29
Speaker 1: Yeah, no, this is a wild time. And, you know,
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Speaker 1: you and I have been talking about these things. You've covered,
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Speaker 1: you know, college football obviously longer than I have. But
46:36
Speaker 1: it is amazing to watch now where we are, where
46:39
Speaker 1: the stakes feel so high around your actual winning and losing,
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Speaker 1: but it generates a world where our conversation is barely
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Speaker 1: around the actual winning and losing.
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Speaker 2: It's true. You know, I mean, like, I can't believe
46:52
Speaker 2: the amount of time I spend listening to people talk
46:56
Speaker 2: or covering, you know, or researching things like private equity
47:00
Speaker 2: and media deals and sponsorships and, you know, how much
47:05
Speaker 2: you pay a GM now to run your front office
47:09
Speaker 2: staff in a college situation. It's just, it is, you know, very,
47:14
Speaker 2: very bottom line driven now. And I can You know,
47:17
Speaker 2: I get it. I understand it. I also like writing
47:20
Speaker 2: about like North Carolina versus Duke or Alabama versus LSU.
47:24
Speaker 2: You know, I mean, that's fun. I like to cover
47:28
Speaker 2: the games.
47:29
Speaker 1: I'll also note, and this is something I wonder if
47:31
Speaker 1: the powers that be over there kind of understand it.
47:33
Speaker 1: And maybe maybe these things don't transfer over as neatly
47:36
Speaker 1: as my brain says. But one of the chief criticisms
47:39
Speaker 1: of the NBA in recent times, and it's fair, is
47:42
Speaker 1: that it became a league where we covered the transactions
47:44
Speaker 1: and the scuttlebutt more than we covered the actual action.
47:48
Speaker 1: And here we are. And by the way, I don't
47:49
Speaker 1: feel bad about having done this for this show. This
47:51
Speaker 1: stuff is really interesting. But it can't be like that forever,
47:56
Speaker 1: one would think.
47:58
Speaker 2: I don't think. And I do know there are people
48:01
Speaker 2: that still want to hear about the games. But boy,
48:03
Speaker 2: oh boy, yes, we spend a lot of time. I
48:06
Speaker 2: guess you would say the... The market on speculation is
48:09
Speaker 2: through the roof, okay? Who's going to be the next coach?
48:12
Speaker 2: Who are we hiring? Who are we firing? When's it
48:15
Speaker 2: going to happen? Same as it was with recruiting. Are
48:17
Speaker 2: we getting the five-star? And then is the five-star going
48:20
Speaker 2: to be any good? And da-da-da-da-da. There's so much more
48:24
Speaker 2: that's energy, and especially on the college level, that seems
48:28
Speaker 2: to be put into projecting what's going to happen. Are
48:33
Speaker 2: we going to be better with this new coach? Are
48:35
Speaker 2: we going to be worse? I like to, again, like
48:38
Speaker 2: sit there on Saturday and actually watch the games play
48:40
Speaker 2: out and then say, oh, maybe Arch Manning isn't as
48:43
Speaker 2: good as we thought. Or golly, Fernando Mendoza is unbelievable.
48:47
Speaker 2: Where the hell did he come from? You know, that
48:49
Speaker 2: sort of thing.
48:50
Speaker 1: Well, but at least we're not where the NBA is
48:52
Speaker 1: right now. Just wondering who might go to jail next.
48:57
Speaker 1: Take the wins as you get them. That is my guy,
48:59
Speaker 1: Pat Forty. Check him out at SI.com. My man, I
49:02
Speaker 1: can't believe this is the first time that we have
49:04
Speaker 1: had you as a Right Time guest. I apologize for
49:07
Speaker 1: waiting so long, and I thank you for everything, my man.
49:11
Speaker 2: My pleasure. Always happy to talk to you, Beaumont. Pleased
49:14
Speaker 2: to be on with you. All right, man.
49:16
Speaker 1: And ladies and gentlemen, thanks so much for joining us
49:17
Speaker 1: here on The Right Time. We do this three times
49:20
Speaker 1: a week. Ryan Brumley handles everything behind the scenes. Thank you, sir.
49:23
Speaker 1: Hit the voicemail line, 323-596-7767. Whatever you want to talk about,
49:29
Speaker 1: I'm up to hear about it.
49:29
Speaker 2: 323-596-7767.
49:30
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