Latest / QUESTION EVERYTHING / PRETTY FEELINGS: The Joy of Being Sensitive with R&B Star Sinéad Harnett

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PRETTY FEELINGS: The Joy of Being Sensitive with R&B Star Sinéad Harnett · QUESTION EVERYTHING

0:00
Speaker 1: The following podcast is a Dear Media production. Hi, new friends,
0:05
Speaker 1: I'm Jackie Shimmel, philanthropist, motivational speaker, glowing wife, animal rights activists,
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Speaker 1: haven't listened to my podcast, The Bitch Bible, brace yourself,
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Speaker 1: your ass off or cry. Make sure you subscribe yourself
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Speaker 1: to The Bitch Bible podcast right now.
0:28
Speaker 2: You're going to effing love it. Big things happen when
0:40
Speaker 2: you're pretty, pretty bold, pretty clever, pretty strong. I'm Danielle
0:45
Speaker 2: Robe and each week my guests and I have conversations
0:48
Speaker 2: that put a new spin on pretty. This is pretty smart.
0:55
Speaker 3: I've always been too in my fields. Sometimes people call
0:59
Speaker 3: me like this R and bago.
1:03
Speaker 2: I love me a good love song R and B
1:06
Speaker 2: sensation Shaneade Hardnett knows how to write and sing one.
1:10
Speaker 2: I found her on YouTube a few years ago and
1:13
Speaker 2: was taken by the British star. How did everyone in
1:16
Speaker 2: America not know about her? Yet? They're about too? She
1:20
Speaker 2: has over three hundred and twenty million streams online and
1:23
Speaker 2: her sophomore album, Ready is Always Too Late just dropped.
1:27
Speaker 2: It's even been lauded by Elton John. I loved learning
1:30
Speaker 2: her story of being discovered after uploading a random YouTube video,
1:35
Speaker 2: how she's learned to love herself in an industry that
1:38
Speaker 2: just has so many built in parameters for women, and
1:41
Speaker 2: how she's used her acute sensitivity to her advantage.
1:44
Speaker 3: What's the point in not celebrating yourself? That's why we're
1:47
Speaker 3: here to heal and then share ourline.
1:51
Speaker 2: While the love songs are usually about other people, Shanade
1:54
Speaker 2: has this way of making fans feel like they're with
1:57
Speaker 2: her on a journey of loving themselves. So about two
2:03
Speaker 2: and a half years ago, a friend in New York
2:06
Speaker 2: who's a manager for Z posted a clip of you
2:09
Speaker 2: from a radio station in London, and it was this
2:13
Speaker 2: crazy clip. Someone asked you to do something off the
2:15
Speaker 2: cuff and you had soul Like I want to watch
2:19
Speaker 2: that video fifteen times. You were in the pocket of
2:23
Speaker 2: this song that like, I'm not like that musical obviously,
2:26
Speaker 2: but it was incredible and I've been a huge fan
2:31
Speaker 2: ever since. And then I went through a breakup and
2:34
Speaker 2: I started listening to all of your love songs and
2:37
Speaker 2: so I have to know, do you love love? Or
2:41
Speaker 2: have you been heard a lot? Where do all of
2:42
Speaker 2: these love songs come from?
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Speaker 3: Definitely both yes to both of those questions. Honestly, it's
2:49
Speaker 3: just over here, we say. When things are hard or
2:52
Speaker 3: like very challenging and just feels like they're taking over,
2:57
Speaker 3: we say, oh, that's long, man, And I feel like
3:00
Speaker 3: for me, love has been long. You know, it's just
3:03
Speaker 3: been like a battle, but not just romantically like. Also,
3:07
Speaker 3: many different sorts of relationships inspire me, challenging ones with
3:13
Speaker 3: friends or family members. So I think that romantically like,
3:17
Speaker 3: I definitely kept meeting the same sort of person because
3:22
Speaker 3: I truly believe that we only learn a lesson when
3:25
Speaker 3: we've been tested regarding it over and over and over again,
3:29
Speaker 3: and then once you actually fix it and be like, ah,
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Speaker 3: this is what I need to change, Like this is
3:34
Speaker 3: a bad pattern that I need to change. Do you
3:36
Speaker 3: stop meeting that sort of person? I feel like people
3:38
Speaker 3: are just lessons in packages. So it's a little bit
3:42
Speaker 3: of like idiots, and then a lot of me just
3:45
Speaker 3: loving love in all ways.
3:48
Speaker 2: I think that's why your music resonates with me so much.
3:51
Speaker 2: Is I love love too? And I think like even friendships,
3:53
Speaker 2: I feel very deeply and your music same.
3:56
Speaker 4: You know, yeah, and your.
3:58
Speaker 2: Music really portrays that. It's cool because do you consider
4:02
Speaker 2: yourself in the pop category?
4:03
Speaker 4: I don't know.
4:04
Speaker 3: I feel like every artist would love to love their name,
4:08
Speaker 3: to be their own genre, but I don't know.
4:11
Speaker 4: I don't really know.
4:12
Speaker 3: Obviously I love R and B and soul, but to
4:15
Speaker 3: be popular would be great. I think I just consider
4:19
Speaker 3: myself someone who's so influenced by soul music.
4:25
Speaker 2: I'm glad you mentioned that because I want it before
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Speaker 2: we get into your music. I am dying to know
4:30
Speaker 2: who you were as a kid, Like you grew up
4:32
Speaker 2: in London, and you strike me as one of those
4:35
Speaker 2: people that probably sang before they worked. Is that the case?
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Speaker 3: Maybe I only remember singing when I was like aged
4:42
Speaker 3: six and being like, Oh, what's this, what's going on here?
4:46
Speaker 4: And literally thinking.
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Speaker 3: That I was singing exactly the same as Whitney, Like
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Speaker 3: i'd be like, oh, it's coming out exactly the same
4:53
Speaker 3: as I don't know why. I was obviously deluded, but yeah,
4:57
Speaker 3: it was definitely in my veins, like there was no question,
5:00
Speaker 3: it was just like I loved it. It was the
5:04
Speaker 3: cathartic release and just making those trills the same as
5:09
Speaker 3: like some of the greats that I just became obsessed
5:11
Speaker 3: with super young.
5:12
Speaker 4: But I do think I learned to walk first.
5:13
Speaker 2: Who were the grades that you listened to besides Whitney.
5:16
Speaker 3: Well, Tina Turner was always on in the house, and
5:20
Speaker 3: Etta James and Celine Dion so like the big Belta vocalists,
5:25
Speaker 3: and then obviously Whitney. I Will Always Love You was
5:29
Speaker 3: such a huge moment when I was a kid. Obviously
5:32
Speaker 3: I didn't watch the Dolly Parton documentary, but I only
5:35
Speaker 3: found out recently that that song was like twenty years
5:37
Speaker 3: old before Whitney did it, which is just mad to me.
5:40
Speaker 3: Obviously went to the right home, and then as I
5:42
Speaker 3: grew up, I got into Amy Winehouse and Lauren Hill
5:47
Speaker 3: and DiAngelo and yeah, I know it's like everyone says
5:51
Speaker 3: these people, but it's just because they're just sick so good, and.
5:55
Speaker 2: Not everybody says that. I think you really do fuse
5:59
Speaker 2: R and B and soul into part music, which it's
6:02
Speaker 2: hard to do that in a not corny way.
6:04
Speaker 4: Yeah, I guess.
6:05
Speaker 3: So that's such a compliment to me because I think
6:08
Speaker 3: I do overthink a lot like you and think and
6:12
Speaker 3: feel too deeply, and sometimes I just think, or I've
6:15
Speaker 3: thought along the way, like what am I doing? And
6:17
Speaker 3: does like does this make sense? But I think one
6:21
Speaker 3: thing that really helped me is remembering that if something's real,
6:25
Speaker 3: and if it's like true to you, then can it
6:30
Speaker 3: really be?
6:30
Speaker 4: Maybe it is cringe, but at least it's real, you know.
6:33
Speaker 2: I like that because I look back and I do
6:36
Speaker 2: have some cringe moments in my life, but they came
6:38
Speaker 2: from my heart, so it's okay, right.
6:40
Speaker 5: Yeah, And I know that you're you're asking me questions,
6:43
Speaker 5: but how do you feel now in terms of like
6:46
Speaker 5: you loving love and like do you feel like you've
6:50
Speaker 5: gotten to a healthier place, because that's the journey I'm trying.
6:52
Speaker 4: To be on as well.
6:53
Speaker 2: So interesting. I used to sort of dislike that I
6:58
Speaker 2: felt so deep, because you know, I wasn't whenever one
7:02
Speaker 2: of those people that jumped into a relationship. It took
7:04
Speaker 2: me a minute. But once I care, I really care,
7:07
Speaker 2: and then it's hard to uncare. And now I sort
7:10
Speaker 2: of think that weaknesses are maybe misdirected superpowers, and so
7:16
Speaker 2: I try to think of it in a different way.
7:18
Speaker 4: Okay, Yeah, amazing.
7:20
Speaker 3: So you basically saw the feeling deeply as like maybe
7:24
Speaker 3: a bit of a bad thing and then realized, actually,
7:26
Speaker 3: if I look at it in a different way than
7:29
Speaker 3: it's actually good.
7:30
Speaker 4: Yeah.
7:30
Speaker 2: I think it helps me with my job. I can
7:32
Speaker 2: like really, I can like feel somebody when I interview them.
7:35
Speaker 3: You know, which Have you ever seen the Thandy Newton
7:39
Speaker 3: Ted Talks, No, Oh, You've got to watch it because
7:42
Speaker 3: she talks about like how if you feel other people's
7:46
Speaker 3: pain or joy or whatever, it is like even strangers.
7:49
Speaker 3: There's a reason for it, and it's that we're all connected,
7:53
Speaker 3: and it's when we try to isolate ourselves.
7:56
Speaker 4: And like be other that we're not happy.
7:59
Speaker 3: And when I will I was like, oh my gosh, yeah,
8:01
Speaker 3: because I remember growing up and if I saw someone
8:04
Speaker 3: eating alone in a restaurant or I don't know, just
8:07
Speaker 3: something random like an old woman like walking with her
8:10
Speaker 3: shopping and no one's helping her, she would just make
8:13
Speaker 3: me like, oh, like crying, like relapse.
8:16
Speaker 2: You had that even as a kid.
8:18
Speaker 4: Yeah, I've always been to in my fields.
8:22
Speaker 2: Wow, are your parents like that or is it just you?
8:26
Speaker 4: Well, my dad was in Australia, so I didn't.
8:29
Speaker 3: I only really got to know him in more recent years,
8:33
Speaker 3: and he's definitely a softie. My mom, I don't know.
8:37
Speaker 3: My mom was like very reserved. She's the thaie one
8:41
Speaker 3: in my family. My dad's Irish, And yeah, maybe it
8:45
Speaker 3: was actually her reservedness that made me. You know, when
8:49
Speaker 3: you overcompensate to like get something that you you really
8:53
Speaker 3: or feel something that you want to feel. So I
8:56
Speaker 3: don't think I necessarily got it from either of them,
8:58
Speaker 3: but yeah, I remember when I.
9:00
Speaker 4: Discovered Coldplay really young, and I was.
9:03
Speaker 3: Like listening to this when other people were listening to
9:06
Speaker 3: whatever would have been like a TikTok trending back then,
9:09
Speaker 3: and thinking why am I so into this?
9:11
Speaker 4: Like this is a bit deep and dark, But.
9:14
Speaker 3: I just I always naturally was drawn to that sort
9:17
Speaker 3: of thing, which is probably why sometimes people call me
9:20
Speaker 3: like the sad R and B girl.
9:23
Speaker 2: Actually, do you ever feel like you perpetuate sadness? Because
9:28
Speaker 2: the great music comes from that? Are you ever in
9:30
Speaker 2: that cycle?
9:31
Speaker 3: I don't try, Like I believe if you try to
9:34
Speaker 3: force anything, it's just not good. But I definitely have
9:39
Speaker 3: noticed that it can be easier when there's something really
9:44
Speaker 3: like on your chest weighing you down. To get stuff out.
9:47
Speaker 3: Having said that, I do have like more celebratory songs.
9:51
Speaker 3: There's like a few on the album coming out soon.
9:53
Speaker 3: And I don't think you have to be sad to write.
9:57
Speaker 3: It just can be quite because of the therapy of
10:01
Speaker 3: it maybe feels easier at times.
10:04
Speaker 2: Were you writing as a kid, Oh yeah, but like.
10:07
Speaker 3: Really bad stuff, like as in I would never be
10:11
Speaker 3: able to if I found an old book, I could
10:14
Speaker 3: never show anyone because it definitely wasn't my best wife.
10:18
Speaker 2: Well, it's okay, you were a kid. You had to
10:19
Speaker 2: start somewhere, yeah, And I was wondering how you were discovered.
10:24
Speaker 2: I couldn't find that anywhere. What's the story of that?
10:28
Speaker 4: Okay.
10:28
Speaker 3: So there's this rapper that was like, he's considered the
10:33
Speaker 3: godfather of grime, right, And when I was finishing university,
10:38
Speaker 3: which you guys call college, he just started tweeting about
10:43
Speaker 3: a video I'd stuck on YouTube of missing into like
10:46
Speaker 3: a neo soul beat.
10:49
Speaker 4: And then that's how it started. Really. I was just like, oh,
10:52
Speaker 4: why is he tweeting about?
10:53
Speaker 3: I mean, people in college were like, oh my gosh,
10:57
Speaker 3: this is mad, and I just that's when the world
10:59
Speaker 3: was and begone because I didn't understand what the industry was.
11:03
Speaker 3: I didn't understand like when I started doing gigs in London,
11:07
Speaker 3: what all these like men with folded arms, who were they? Like,
11:10
Speaker 3: they were obviously industry guys, but to me, it was
11:13
Speaker 3: just like this is weird.
11:15
Speaker 4: So yeah, it all started from this rapper doing a tweet.
11:18
Speaker 2: And so you weren't really trying to make it, so
11:22
Speaker 2: to speak, or you were.
11:24
Speaker 4: I didn't really believe that it was a possibility.
11:27
Speaker 3: Like you know, I was brought up working club, we
11:30
Speaker 3: didn't have money, and I just always assumed that, I mean,
11:35
Speaker 3: it's definitely not an easy industry, but I always assumed
11:37
Speaker 3: it would be like an up hill mountain whatever i'd
11:41
Speaker 3: work in. And to be honest, this is an uphill
11:44
Speaker 3: mountain sometimes with rocks falling down onto your face. But
11:49
Speaker 3: it's something I love and I never thought you could
11:52
Speaker 3: do something that you love. So yeah, I wasn't like
11:55
Speaker 3: saying to people, yeah, I'm going to be a big
11:56
Speaker 3: star or anything like that. But I definitely was putting
12:00
Speaker 3: all my energy into writing and recording. From about sixteen
12:05
Speaker 3: maybe fifteen, what.
12:06
Speaker 2: Were you studying in college or in university?
12:09
Speaker 3: I was going to do psychology, and then last minute
12:12
Speaker 3: I was like, nah, I'm doing acting.
12:15
Speaker 4: I need to do something where I can perform.
12:17
Speaker 2: Wow.
12:17
Speaker 3: So I did that and that was like a good
12:20
Speaker 3: way to build confidence. I think on stage.
12:24
Speaker 2: Were you ever nervous on stage? Because when I watch
12:27
Speaker 2: you now, it seems like you're just breathing. It's one
12:31
Speaker 2: of those Well, to.
12:33
Speaker 3: Be honest, it's taken so long to like find my
12:39
Speaker 3: I don't know, to find my confidence. And I remember
12:42
Speaker 3: the first few shows, even the first few years, like
12:46
Speaker 3: i'd gone from acting, which is one thing you can
12:48
Speaker 3: be someone else, but when it's just you on a
12:51
Speaker 3: stage like singing your diary, I guess like it was
12:55
Speaker 3: years of really hard man like anxiety and and just
13:00
Speaker 3: being like a lot of imposter syndrome, which I know
13:03
Speaker 3: is so common for everyone, like thinking, oh what, so
13:08
Speaker 3: I'm just supposed to be good because if I'm lucky
13:12
Speaker 3: enough to be on the stage, I've got to be good.
13:13
Speaker 3: And I just yeah, I was scared, but now I'm
13:16
Speaker 3: just like, look, man, you've got to what's the point
13:19
Speaker 3: in not celebrating yourself. That's why we're here to like
13:22
Speaker 3: heal and then share our life. That's what I really believe.
13:26
Speaker 2: I appreciate your honesty with that because I think a
13:29
Speaker 2: lot of people think of creatives as just kind of
13:32
Speaker 2: like having it and making it happen, and it really does.
13:37
Speaker 2: It's like any other industry. It takes years to perfect
13:40
Speaker 2: your craft.
13:41
Speaker 4: Yeah.
13:42
Speaker 3: I remember seeing one of the Weekend's first shows and
13:46
Speaker 3: he was super nervous and shy, and then you see
13:51
Speaker 3: him at the super Bowl and you're like, yo, you.
13:58
Speaker 4: Did that, you know so.
14:01
Speaker 3: And also Lana del Ray spoke openly about being really
14:04
Speaker 3: nervous on stage, and Adele doesn't like doing big shows.
14:07
Speaker 3: So it's so common and we always expect stars to
14:12
Speaker 3: just be invincible, but when we realized that they're human,
14:16
Speaker 3: it kind of makes you think, oh, nice, all right,
14:19
Speaker 3: Like we're all the same.
14:20
Speaker 2: You wrote something on your Instagram page that I loved.
14:22
Speaker 2: You said, I'm in LA because I feel like I
14:24
Speaker 2: have a chance to become the artist I dreamed of
14:26
Speaker 2: when I was a little girl, and I was thinking
14:28
Speaker 2: to myself. You had this beautiful smile and you could
14:32
Speaker 2: feel the glow, your arms were up, you were in
14:34
Speaker 2: front of your billboard, and I was wondering who you
14:39
Speaker 2: dreamed of becoming. Who did you look to.
14:43
Speaker 3: When I was in my like R and B discovery mode,
14:49
Speaker 3: it was Aliyah and like TLC Destiny's Child. I never
14:55
Speaker 3: looked at anyone and thought I want to be you,
14:57
Speaker 3: but I would see the life and see the getting
15:01
Speaker 3: to perform and write your music as this, I don't know,
15:06
Speaker 3: just dream like it amazed me.
15:08
Speaker 4: Maybe there's a.
15:09
Speaker 3: Part of everyone that I love that I that I
15:13
Speaker 3: take inspiration from, even just like their guts to carry
15:17
Speaker 3: themselves the.
15:18
Speaker 4: Way they do.
15:18
Speaker 2: Was there a moment where you thought like, maybe this
15:21
Speaker 2: won't work for me. Did you ever think about giving
15:25
Speaker 2: up having an alternative career?
15:27
Speaker 3: I think you know, I mentioned twenty sixteen. I think
15:30
Speaker 3: I did. That was like a year where I feel
15:33
Speaker 3: like me on my own was born as an artist,
15:36
Speaker 3: like my solo career, because I've done a lot of
15:38
Speaker 3: collaborating before then, and just before that moment, like when
15:42
Speaker 3: I wrote the song that actually got me any attention
15:46
Speaker 3: from America before, which is if you let Me. I
15:49
Speaker 3: remember when I wrote that, I was just like, oh,
15:52
Speaker 3: I can write because I'd spent so many years like
15:55
Speaker 3: with the men in suits like saying yeah, you know
15:58
Speaker 3: you need to get in this room because they've been
16:01
Speaker 3: doing this for years and they've got this amount of
16:03
Speaker 3: hits and blah blah blah. And then just like it
16:06
Speaker 3: was like the first time, almost like coming up for air,
16:10
Speaker 3: where I was like I didn't need anyone, I just
16:12
Speaker 3: needed myself.
16:14
Speaker 4: So yeah, just before then I was.
16:16
Speaker 3: Like what am I doing? Like why am I doing this?
16:19
Speaker 3: And then it was when I wrote that song that
16:21
Speaker 3: I actually didn't give up. I'd been like partying and
16:25
Speaker 3: just running away from the fact that I felt like
16:28
Speaker 3: a failure, I guess. And I don't know if that's
16:31
Speaker 3: too honest, because we're supposed to be like, oh, I'm
16:33
Speaker 3: a star, but I think you really go through it
16:36
Speaker 3: as an artist. But then it's good because that writing
16:39
Speaker 3: about those experiences and sharing them is what connects to
16:42
Speaker 3: your fans.
16:43
Speaker 2: Yeah. So you're saying when you were you left the
16:47
Speaker 2: label and it was kind of this like dark time
16:50
Speaker 2: and also a rebirth. Yeah, and out of that came
16:54
Speaker 2: You're a hit song.
16:55
Speaker 3: Well when you put it like that, that's interesting, isn't it.
17:00
Speaker 4: Yeah, I know it was. I had to fall back
17:02
Speaker 4: in love with music.
17:03
Speaker 2: Yeah, the men in suits took it out of you. Huh.
17:06
Speaker 4: Yeah.
17:06
Speaker 3: I think just like being in the doing the rounds
17:09
Speaker 3: of writing with every single person who's alive in the
17:12
Speaker 3: music industry. It burns you out and then you think
17:16
Speaker 3: what am I even doing? Like what am I writing?
17:18
Speaker 2: So when you were in that place, like what was
17:21
Speaker 2: the alternative? Are you like, I'm going to go back
17:22
Speaker 2: to school and be a psychologist or what was going
17:25
Speaker 2: through your mind?
17:26
Speaker 3: That wasn't a plan. B. I think I was just
17:28
Speaker 3: gonna be really sad. That was I hadn't thought that
17:32
Speaker 3: far ahead. It was just okay, ultimate sadness is what
17:35
Speaker 3: will prevail. Now, let's worry about how how you live
17:39
Speaker 3: in that sadness after.
17:41
Speaker 2: It's so interesting you say that because anybody I've ever
17:44
Speaker 2: interviewed who has like, quote unquote made it that I've
17:48
Speaker 2: asked that question to has the same answer, like, if
17:52
Speaker 2: you can think of doing anything else, you're gonna do
17:55
Speaker 2: it because it's so hard. Yeah, it's really interesting. I
18:00
Speaker 2: have kind of a weird question for you. I hope
18:01
Speaker 2: you're okay with it, and if you're not, you could
18:03
Speaker 2: tell me. So when I found you, I showed my
18:06
Speaker 2: friend your Instagram and we were like going through all
18:09
Speaker 2: the songs and all your photos and he said, wow,
18:13
Speaker 2: she's so beautiful. I wonder if that's ever hindered her.
18:20
Speaker 2: And I thought, what an interesting statement. How focused on
18:24
Speaker 2: your appearance have you been as you? Because you have
18:27
Speaker 2: to craft an image, and so I think it's difficult
18:30
Speaker 2: to kind of find that middle ground. How has your
18:33
Speaker 2: appearance affected your work and your life in that way?
18:38
Speaker 4: That's a very interesting question because you're.
18:42
Speaker 3: A woman, right, and you know that we have a
18:45
Speaker 3: very up and down relationship with ourselves. Like sometimes you're like,
18:49
Speaker 3: I love cute, and then other days.
18:51
Speaker 4: You're like nah.
18:53
Speaker 3: I think that, like the expectation to look like a
18:59
Speaker 3: star whole time isn't something that I really understood, and like,
19:04
Speaker 3: isn't something I really conformed to. It wasn't necessarily for
19:08
Speaker 3: good reasons. Like I just didn't have a good relationship
19:10
Speaker 3: with myself. I didn't know how to look after myself
19:13
Speaker 3: until like maybe the last three years. So the whole
19:17
Speaker 3: lead up to that being in this industry for like,
19:20
Speaker 3: I don't know, five years prior to that, I just
19:22
Speaker 3: I don't know.
19:23
Speaker 4: There were times.
19:24
Speaker 3: Where I didn't really want to go to events because
19:28
Speaker 3: I just didn't feel good. And like you see people
19:32
Speaker 3: and they're looking at you and they're like, what is
19:33
Speaker 3: she wearing, Oh she's put on weight or whatever. For
19:37
Speaker 3: your friend to perceive what he perceived as, oh, she
19:41
Speaker 3: she looks good like I've never felt like, you know,
19:44
Speaker 3: that pretty privileged thing that people talk about. And this
19:47
Speaker 3: is just your friend's opinion, like to Tom down the road,
19:51
Speaker 3: I might not be attractive, because obviously that's all in
19:55
Speaker 3: the eye of the beholder. But in answer to your
19:58
Speaker 3: friend who assumes that, or no, I never felt like
20:02
Speaker 3: people wouldn't take me seriously if they thought that I
20:05
Speaker 3: looked good. Like equally, if people thought that I didn't
20:09
Speaker 3: look good, I didn't feel like I wouldn't count as
20:12
Speaker 3: an artist. I can see where I wasn't taking care
20:15
Speaker 3: of myself, like even in some music videos, like I
20:18
Speaker 3: might look underweight and stuff. So I never thought that
20:21
Speaker 3: appearance had an effect. I thought that a song would
20:25
Speaker 3: always speak more than anything else. I might be naive
20:28
Speaker 3: in that assumption, but yeah, that's just been my experience
20:31
Speaker 3: with it.
20:32
Speaker 2: I appreciate your candidness. I know it's kind of a
20:35
Speaker 2: strange thing to discuss, but I think it's something women
20:39
Speaker 2: think about all the time, like how much emphasis to
20:43
Speaker 2: put on it or not, and so yeah, thank you
20:46
Speaker 2: for answering that.
20:47
Speaker 4: Oh of course.
20:48
Speaker 3: And yeah, I think that a lot of women that
20:51
Speaker 3: I know say things like, you know, she's only got
20:54
Speaker 3: to hear because of how she looks, or if I
20:58
Speaker 3: didn't look like this would a I even I don't know.
21:01
Speaker 4: It's just some feminist people that I know.
21:04
Speaker 3: They're kind of like a bit cynical about how they're viewed,
21:08
Speaker 3: mostly by men, and it's like a huge topic that
21:12
Speaker 3: doesn't really have a conclusion. But for me, I just
21:15
Speaker 3: want to be respected musically, and like that's what I
21:18
Speaker 3: care about the most, and I think the only way
21:21
Speaker 3: to get there is to just keep being myself and
21:23
Speaker 3: being honest in the writing.
21:26
Speaker 2: Yeah, and to be great at your craft.
21:27
Speaker 3: Do you know someone who I love so much and
21:30
Speaker 3: everyone loves is Lizo Because when she's.
21:32
Speaker 4: Glam, I'm like oof, like yes, get it.
21:36
Speaker 3: And then when she's wearing no makeup and just being
21:40
Speaker 3: like meditating at home on IG Live.
21:42
Speaker 4: I just love that as well.
21:44
Speaker 3: Like relatability has become so huge with all this reality
21:48
Speaker 3: TV and stuff, and I think celebrating our normalities is
21:53
Speaker 3: such a great thing.
21:54
Speaker 4: And yeah, that's it.
21:57
Speaker 2: I agree with you, And it's something people think about
21:59
Speaker 2: more because of it. Instagram, You're right on that with
22:01
Speaker 2: social media and reality TV. I have a friend who's
22:05
Speaker 2: a musician and he has this big voice, and I
22:08
Speaker 2: was on the phone with him a few weeks ago
22:10
Speaker 2: and he said, you know, it's been interesting navigating the
22:13
Speaker 2: last year or two because big voices aren't in right now.
22:17
Speaker 2: That's not something i'd ever thought about. You have a
22:20
Speaker 2: huge voice. Is that something you've thought about? And if so, like,
22:23
Speaker 2: do you tailor your music to what's in or you
22:27
Speaker 2: always just you know, this is me, this is the
22:31
Speaker 2: R and B pop music I want to make.
22:33
Speaker 3: So was he saying that, like it's more whispery that's
22:36
Speaker 3: in at the moment. Yeah, yeah, that's true. I hadn't
22:39
Speaker 3: even thought about that, But it is in, isn't it?
22:42
Speaker 2: Isn't it interesting? Yeah, I'd never thought about it till
22:45
Speaker 2: he said that. He was like, I think I have
22:47
Speaker 2: to wait another year for big voices to come back
22:49
Speaker 2: in style.
22:50
Speaker 4: Well, I don't know.
22:51
Speaker 3: Like I've been a fan of j Justmine Sullivan, like
22:55
Speaker 3: since forever. I can't even that first album was like
22:59
Speaker 3: who is this? And she just stayed in my heart
23:01
Speaker 3: forever after that and she's just dropped a project and
23:05
Speaker 3: you know her and her opened the super Bowl and
23:08
Speaker 3: they have huge voices.
23:10
Speaker 2: So that's true.
23:11
Speaker 4: I don't know how much I agree.
23:12
Speaker 3: I definitely have seen incredible Whispery artists as well coming through.
23:19
Speaker 3: But for me personally, I think from earlier earlier on,
23:23
Speaker 3: like trying to write in these rooms that I just
23:26
Speaker 3: felt uncomfortable in and stuff, I learned how to go
23:29
Speaker 3: with my gut and that when you try and do
23:31
Speaker 3: anything that isn't you, it doesn't work. Because if I
23:34
Speaker 3: tried to become a Whispery singer now, it's like it
23:37
Speaker 3: will be so obvious, just like doing something different that
23:42
Speaker 3: isn't me. And I'm always up for experimenting, but only
23:45
Speaker 3: if it feels right, only what comes organically.
23:48
Speaker 2: Yeah, I remember back in the day, like techno or
23:51
Speaker 2: dance music was really in, and all of a sudden,
23:53
Speaker 2: all of these artists with like beautiful voices started doing
23:56
Speaker 2: dance music and I was like, no, make it start, please, No,
24:00
Speaker 2: I hear you.
24:01
Speaker 3: You know.
24:02
Speaker 2: I want to go back to an Instagram post that
24:05
Speaker 2: you made because you talked about relatability. You said if
24:08
Speaker 2: Lessons in Love was the prologue the beginning of me
24:10
Speaker 2: becoming comfortable in my artistry and in my skin. Then
24:13
Speaker 2: ready is always too late is part of the main storyline.
24:16
Speaker 2: Like most of us, rock Bottom has been a friend
24:18
Speaker 2: of mine. I can't tell you what it feels like
24:20
Speaker 2: to be out here making music. I'm proud of and
24:23
Speaker 2: okay with being myself, to be in a good place
24:25
Speaker 2: in my mind and spirit. The single hardest day as
24:29
Speaker 2: a singer, what was rock Bottom as a singer? As
24:34
Speaker 2: a musician, Yeah.
24:36
Speaker 3: Probably just literally being like, yeah, I'm going to stop
24:40
Speaker 3: doing this.
24:42
Speaker 2: Did you tell other people that?
24:44
Speaker 4: No? I didn't.
24:45
Speaker 3: But watching the film Soul really helped me understand why
24:51
Speaker 3: it was so sad. And it was because my whole everything,
24:55
Speaker 3: my whole identity, I had shaped around being a music
25:00
Speaker 3: and actually, yes, I love music and that is in
25:03
Speaker 3: my makeup, but my value should not be my whole
25:09
Speaker 3: value of existence should not be placed on music. So
25:13
Speaker 3: I think back then it was just like, because I
25:15
Speaker 3: had made that a thing, the thought of giving up
25:19
Speaker 3: was like, what the hell am I?
25:22
Speaker 4: What is the point in living? Then? Because I have
25:25
Speaker 4: no purpose? That's what I felt.
25:28
Speaker 3: So probably then and then as a human Gosh, I
25:31
Speaker 3: don't know how to answer that, But as a musician,
25:33
Speaker 3: definitely that day.
25:35
Speaker 2: I won't ask you as a human. I'm actually going
25:37
Speaker 2: to ask you the flip side because I think the
25:39
Speaker 2: joy of it all is important to what's been the
25:42
Speaker 2: most celebratory magical moments so far.
25:45
Speaker 4: That's such a good one and hard to answer.
25:48
Speaker 3: This is probably like a trick answer, but every single
25:52
Speaker 3: day that I.
25:55
Speaker 4: Just wake up knowing that I have.
25:57
Speaker 3: The privilege of at least having a chance to do
26:00
Speaker 3: something that I love. Yeah, because like I don't think
26:05
Speaker 3: many people believe that they can do stuff outside of
26:08
Speaker 3: the limits of what they've seen. So yeah, every day
26:11
Speaker 3: I'm so grateful to It's not easy, but to get
26:15
Speaker 3: to I'm not working in a sewers you know.
26:18
Speaker 2: Yeah, I know, so good. Okay, I have a little
26:22
Speaker 2: game to play based on some of your music.
26:26
Speaker 4: Okay, this is great love.
26:27
Speaker 2: It'll be fun, so it can be as rapid fire
26:30
Speaker 2: as you want. Which track do you wish you'd been
26:33
Speaker 2: asked to jump on? A song from twenty twenty one?
26:36
Speaker 4: Do you know what? Yes, this is very easy Jasonne Sullivan.
26:40
Speaker 2: Which one I want to be?
26:42
Speaker 3: I want to be on her hotels? I want to
26:47
Speaker 3: sing pick up your feelings with her.
26:50
Speaker 2: I listen to that on the way here in my car.
26:53
Speaker 4: Yes, because it's lit.
26:55
Speaker 3: I want to sing anything with her. I would sing
26:58
Speaker 3: bah bah black sheet with her. I would sing nursery rhymes.
27:02
Speaker 3: I was saying ABC with her. I just want to
27:04
Speaker 3: sing with her so bad.
27:05
Speaker 2: Okay, we'll put that out into the universe, going bad.
27:09
Speaker 2: Really have you met her?
27:10
Speaker 4: No, I've just been loving her since I was a ute.
27:14
Speaker 2: Good. Your album was titled Lessons in Love. What was
27:17
Speaker 2: the biggest lesson from your last relationship?
27:21
Speaker 3: To put all my energy into accepting and loving myself?
27:28
Speaker 4: Because using someone else.
27:30
Speaker 3: As a some sort of crouched and excuse and destruction from.
27:35
Speaker 4: That is not the one I've done that. Yeah, I
27:39
Speaker 4: think we all have it.
27:41
Speaker 2: So a little birdie comes in tells you, not only
27:45
Speaker 2: are you going to the Grammys, but you're about to
27:47
Speaker 2: win a Grammy. Who are you taking as your date?
27:49
Speaker 2: You have to take another musician?
27:52
Speaker 4: Do you know what? I find Doja cats so hilarious.
27:56
Speaker 3: I would invite her and just dress up like twin
27:59
Speaker 3: outfit and just laugh with her the whole night.
28:03
Speaker 2: Romey and Michelle, I like it. What song of your
28:06
Speaker 2: album best describes your love life.
28:08
Speaker 3: The album that's coming out, Yeah, well, I'm very happy
28:11
Speaker 3: to say that it will be like this, really yeah,
28:15
Speaker 3: And that's because it's a song where for the first time,
28:18
Speaker 3: I'm like, you're lucky.
28:20
Speaker 4: All right, it's not just me who's lucky. You're lucky.
28:24
Speaker 4: And I've never written like that. I don't remember writing
28:26
Speaker 4: like that.
28:27
Speaker 3: It's always like how happy I feel about finding someone.
28:30
Speaker 3: But on that one, I'm just like, you better recognize.
28:34
Speaker 2: That's I think, a mirror image of who you are now.
28:37
Speaker 2: So that's very cool. Okay, so you're single. Hard for
28:40
Speaker 2: me to love you just dropped. If we're being honest,
28:44
Speaker 2: what's the hardest thing to love about you?
28:48
Speaker 3: I think my inability to switch off. Like if you
28:53
Speaker 3: and me went on holiday and you're like, come on,
28:56
Speaker 3: hot girl, summer, let's do it. I'd just be like,
28:59
Speaker 3: I'd be off there with you, and then I'd be like, babe,
29:02
Speaker 3: I'm going to go home, and then I'd go and
29:03
Speaker 3: sleep and then wake up and try and do something
29:05
Speaker 3: that would inspire me.
29:07
Speaker 2: I would do the same thing. That's such a go.
29:10
Speaker 2: That's good, that's so good. Okay, when you're not making music,
29:13
Speaker 2: what can we find you doing, Like, what's something that
29:16
Speaker 2: we wouldn't know? Are you into gardening or cooking?
29:19
Speaker 4: Meditating?
29:21
Speaker 3: Very important because this thing ticking too much. And I
29:26
Speaker 3: love I'm a big fan of cuddles, so you know,
29:30
Speaker 3: when we're when we're allowed to do that, I'll be
29:33
Speaker 3: cuddling everyone that I love, like at all times.
29:36
Speaker 4: And also, you know what, just like time on.
29:39
Speaker 3: My own out in nature, like I was saying about
29:42
Speaker 3: the hiking, maybe go to the beach. I feel like
29:45
Speaker 3: when I'm walking alone in nature, I actually feel the
29:48
Speaker 3: least alone.
29:50
Speaker 2: Do you ever do karaoke? What's the go to song?
29:53
Speaker 3: I never do karaoke, but the go to song is
29:57
Speaker 3: I said this the other day, killing me softly.
30:00
Speaker 2: That's it's a crowd pleaser, Like you're gonna win with that.
30:03
Speaker 3: I just always if someone asked me like this cab
30:05
Speaker 3: driver asked me in la so I just started singing
30:09
Speaker 3: the fujis and I was just pretending.
30:11
Speaker 4: That I was Lauren and he was loving it.
30:13
Speaker 3: It's just that song that like you can sound good
30:16
Speaker 3: singing it and it's not high, it's not hard.
30:19
Speaker 2: Yeah. And also Lauren, it's just you're gonna win with
30:21
Speaker 2: Lauren Hill Okay. Best piece of advice from another artist.
30:27
Speaker 3: Khalid said to me. He said to me, just keep going,
30:35
Speaker 3: and before you know it, you'll miss the days that
30:40
Speaker 3: you didn't have to keep going. It was something along
30:42
Speaker 3: those lines. It was just like, just keep just keep going,
30:45
Speaker 3: just keep doing it. And I remember being like, do
30:47
Speaker 3: you get any time to relax? And he was on
30:49
Speaker 3: tour and I was in his dressing room at the time,
30:51
Speaker 3: and he was like, Nah.
30:54
Speaker 2: You're praying for that, right, Like you don't want any
30:56
Speaker 2: time to relax. I can feel that in you. You
30:58
Speaker 2: just want to work.
30:59
Speaker 4: Yeah. Yeah, Yeah. It's just an addiction, isn't it.
31:03
Speaker 3: I just I'm so excited to do the stuff that
31:05
Speaker 3: I've always watched growing up, like the TV stuff and
31:10
Speaker 3: I've never been to the Grammys.
31:12
Speaker 4: Like it's just manifestation mode.
31:15
Speaker 2: It's going to be really cool for me to watch
31:17
Speaker 2: you do all those things. Now that we've chatted, I'm
31:19
Speaker 2: really excited for you.
31:21
Speaker 4: Oh thank you.
31:22
Speaker 2: Okay, last few a book you read that changed your life.
31:25
Speaker 4: We Are Water by Wally Lamb.
31:28
Speaker 2: The smartest decision you've ever made.
31:32
Speaker 4: Waking up early?
31:34
Speaker 2: How is it coffee? How do you do it? And
31:38
Speaker 2: what's early do you not do it? I really try.
31:40
Speaker 2: I want to be one of those morning people. I
31:42
Speaker 2: want to be the person that they talk about in
31:45
Speaker 2: the Forbes list that's like she wakes up at four
31:47
Speaker 2: thirty am and works out, and I'm just not that girl.
31:50
Speaker 4: I wasn't that girl for ages.
31:52
Speaker 3: And then when the pandemic hit, I was literally going
31:55
Speaker 3: to sleep at four am and waking up at eleven
31:57
Speaker 3: pm and achieving nothing. And it would be like six
32:00
Speaker 3: pm and I'd be like, have I showered today? I
32:03
Speaker 3: don't think so. And then just one day in that
32:06
Speaker 3: time of like quarantining alone, I just was like, nah,
32:09
Speaker 3: I have to fix up. So then I started getting
32:12
Speaker 3: up between seven or eight and you just have a
32:15
Speaker 3: whole day before lunchtime, and it's so good for my mind.
32:19
Speaker 3: Like that sense of achievement is what helps keep away
32:22
Speaker 3: feelings of like anxiety and worry.
32:25
Speaker 4: So that was the best decision for me. And just
32:28
Speaker 4: times you get up, I'm.
32:29
Speaker 2: Like, I really like seven am. I'm good at seven.
32:32
Speaker 2: That's early, it is, yeah, I mean good for the
32:36
Speaker 2: music industry. It's early, right, Yeah, exactly.
32:39
Speaker 3: Yeah.
32:40
Speaker 2: I feel like if I could be like a six
32:41
Speaker 2: o'clock girl, I would feel like I would be winning.
32:44
Speaker 2: I just can't do it. I get too tired.
32:46
Speaker 4: What time do you go to sleep?
32:48
Speaker 2: Ten thirty eleven?
32:49
Speaker 4: That's so good. You're on a roll. You can easily
32:52
Speaker 4: turn it to six if you wanted to.
32:53
Speaker 2: By the way, should I try Maybe that'll be like
32:56
Speaker 2: the next three weeks. I'll try it.
32:58
Speaker 3: Yeah for me, I think six is just a bit extra.
33:02
Speaker 3: If you want to do that, then like, I praise
33:05
Speaker 3: you girl.
33:06
Speaker 2: Okay, I'll let you know how that goes to. So
33:08
Speaker 2: I have a pretty smart card deck which I'm going
33:10
Speaker 2: to send you the fifty for deeper conversation, and I
33:14
Speaker 2: always pick one at random.
33:16
Speaker 4: This is so sick.
33:18
Speaker 2: Thank you.
33:19
Speaker 4: Come on, Danielle with tricks and games. We love to
33:22
Speaker 4: see it.
33:23
Speaker 2: Okay. One thing you're trying to or need to let
33:26
Speaker 2: go of, doubts?
33:29
Speaker 4: Hell yeah, they're the only thing that ever stands in
33:32
Speaker 4: our way of anything.
33:33
Speaker 2: Have you always been this inspirational? You should have seen
33:39
Speaker 2: your face.
33:41
Speaker 4: That's such a compliment.
33:43
Speaker 3: I've always been a spiritual deep deep if they say
33:48
Speaker 3: if they call.
33:48
Speaker 2: Them deep, okay, well spiritual sanade. I'm so grateful for
33:54
Speaker 2: your time. All right, Today is a good day to
34:13
Speaker 2: have a good day. I'll see you next week. H