Latest / 360 with Katie Woolf / Aboriginal Medical Services Alliance NT CEO John Paterson explains why they're against the use of spit hoods on children in the Territory

Transcript

Aboriginal Medical Services Alliance NT CEO John Paterson explains why they're against the use of spit hoods on children in the Territory · 360 with Katie Woolf

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Now we know that there has been quite a bit
• 0:02
  Speaker 1: of discussion over the recent days about the use of
• 0:05
  Speaker 1: spit hoods and Aboriginal leaders and the community sector advocates
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  Speaker 1: are calling for the Northern Territory government. Says, stop playing
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: politics or stop playing games, I should say on the
• 0:14
  Speaker 1: detention and protection of children. They say that revelations at
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  Speaker 1: spit hoods and restraints are still being used on children
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  Speaker 1: in the Northern Territory years after the Chief Minister Michael
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  Speaker 1: Gunner and the Northern Territory Government promised they'd be banned,
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  Speaker 1: are both shocking and concerning. Joining me on the line
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  Speaker 1: is the CEO of AM Sant, John Patterson. Good morning
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  Speaker 1: to you, John, and.
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  Speaker 2: A very good morning to you Katie. John.
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  Speaker 1: What needs to happen here from your perspective, Katie, let.
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  Speaker 2: Me say from the outsets, we take our head off
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  Speaker 2: and we applaud all those frontline service workers, including the police.
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  Speaker 2: I mean, we've had a very good understanding and relationships
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  Speaker 2: throughout this whole COVID pandemic period. For the last couple
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  Speaker 2: of years. They have helped us with roadblocks, keeping the
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  Speaker 2: borders safe, checkpoint Charlie type arrangements, helping out with those
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  Speaker 2: breakouts that we had at Robinson River, Binjari and the
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  Speaker 2: cast Religion and obviously others since then. So and we
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  Speaker 2: you know, like I say, nurses, police, all those on
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  Speaker 2: the front line emergency people, a big applaud for their
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  Speaker 2: efforts sometimes you know, under strenuous situations throughout the period.
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  Speaker 2: So I just wanted to say that up, Katie. The
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  Speaker 2: next thing I want to say is that you know,
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  Speaker 2: I don't want to focus on individuals or others. I
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  Speaker 2: think what's required here is the appropriate leadership to step
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  Speaker 2: up and look at other alternative approaches and models when
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  Speaker 2: dealing with children when they're taking into custody or a
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  Speaker 2: put into other holding arrangements. And from our perspective that
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  Speaker 2: it came from, the Royal Commission finds, of course that
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  Speaker 2: the use of any restraints, the chairs and the split
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  Speaker 2: hoods ought to be banned and removed from being used
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  Speaker 2: on children. So i'd see the Police Minister has come out.
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  Speaker 2: I haven't seen that statement yet, but have you got
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  Speaker 2: something I do?
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, well, she had said that they have asked police
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  Speaker 1: to advise if there are alternative practices to keep officers
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  Speaker 1: as safe as possible. It may include investigating whether additional
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  Speaker 1: penalties could be considered for offenses against officers, and whether
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  Speaker 1: protective equipment or other measures can be provided to staff
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  Speaker 1: to further mitigate against the risk of injury caused by
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  Speaker 1: spitting and biting. And it is like it's quite extensive.
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  Speaker 1: There's some other There is certainly other parts of that
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  Speaker 1: statement as well, saying that they are committed to obviously
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  Speaker 1: keeping police safe from spitting and also want them to
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  Speaker 1: be safe from any accusation for not providing proper care
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  Speaker 1: to people in custody, including at watch houses. And John,
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  Speaker 1: I think you know, it is such a difficult situation.
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  Speaker 1: Nobody wants to see kids in spin hoods. Nobody wants
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  Speaker 1: to see them restraints, But equally, you know, nobody wants
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  Speaker 1: to see them in a situation where they're in the
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  Speaker 1: watch house in the first place.
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  Speaker 2: And that's right, Katie. Look, kids come from all sorts
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  Speaker 2: of backgrounds, and you know, it's unfortunate that there are
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  Speaker 2: a few that coming to contact with the justice system
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  Speaker 2: and find themselves in various you know, watchrooms or other
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  Speaker 2: detention centers, et cetera. So look, we've got to deal
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  Speaker 2: with it. This is where I want to focus on
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  Speaker 2: the leadership and the appropriate stakeholders meeting with governments or
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  Speaker 2: their representatives along with the other stakeholders that have joined
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  Speaker 2: yesterday's in essay's press and there are a few others
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  Speaker 2: that ought to be involved in sitting down round tabling
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  Speaker 2: discussing various scenarios situations. If it can be done another jurisdictions, Katie,
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  Speaker 2: you're going to understand other states and jurisdictions police prisons
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  Speaker 2: and mental health facilities have privative the use of spitals.
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  Speaker 2: I mean, if it takes looking at what sort of
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  Speaker 2: legislative frameworks and other processes.
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  Speaker 3: That they've implemented, and other jurisdictions, I think we ought
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  Speaker 3: to look at that seriously and see whether we get
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  Speaker 3: implementity in the order separtary rather than using these restraints that,
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  Speaker 3: particularly when it comes to childrement, it's just unacceptable.
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  Speaker 1: John, what I mean. I guess it's really tough because
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  Speaker 1: yesterday we spoke to the Police Association and they said
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  Speaker 1: that you know, these are used as a last resort
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  Speaker 1: and it is a situation where they're using split hoods
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  Speaker 1: and restraints as an absolute last resort, and that it
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  Speaker 1: is if somebody is at risk of self harm or
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  Speaker 1: or I guess of harming an officer as well. So
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  Speaker 1: how do you know, like, how do you get past that?
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  Speaker 1: Because if you've got whether it's a young person or
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  Speaker 1: an adult who's who's at risk of hurting themselves without
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  Speaker 1: using those restraints, what do the police do?
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, Katie, I've been given this some thought overnight and
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  Speaker 2: thinking through you know, and I don't know what watchhouse
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  Speaker 2: you know, these rooms or these facilities or these spaces
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  Speaker 2: that where they hold people. But maybe we look at
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  Speaker 2: maybe we need to look at the press. And this
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  Speaker 2: is why there needs to be around to able to
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  Speaker 2: discussion to find out a bit more of the detail
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  Speaker 2: what's involved here. But from the time of you know,
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  Speaker 2: police coming into contact with the culprits to and then
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  Speaker 2: between there and the putting them into these watchhouse cells,
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  Speaker 2: et cetera, I mean, are there rather alternative strategies that
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  Speaker 2: we can approach that we can consider during that process
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  Speaker 2: there rather than you know, and look, I can't I
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  Speaker 2: don't know the specific incidences other the like I say,
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  Speaker 2: you know, not across those sorts of specific issues. But
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  Speaker 2: even if it requires and I'm thinking putting those that
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  Speaker 2: come to contact with the justice system into a safe, safe,
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  Speaker 2: secure cell that can be monitored, you know, on a.
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  Speaker 4: Regular basis until such time as whether you know the
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  Speaker 4: the the the person who's perhaps under alcohol or other
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  Speaker 4: drugs or whatever the reason why that's triggering the golf.
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  Speaker 4: I mean, let them settle and if it means contacting
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  Speaker 4: appropriate you know, social workers, psychiatrists, psychologists that might be available.
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  Speaker 2: I don't know whether the police employee those sorts of
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  Speaker 2: professional workers that can take over the rest of the
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  Speaker 2: made and put in these watch houses. So I think
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  Speaker 2: we need to and that's why I think we need
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  Speaker 2: to review that process to see if we can get
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  Speaker 2: a more, a all better approach rather than this you
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  Speaker 2: know of you know, if you get get out of
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  Speaker 2: water or you know, I want to give us a
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  Speaker 2: hard time, we're going to strap you in chairs and
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  Speaker 2: put us on your I think we need to focus.
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  Speaker 2: I want to have a discussion around with relevant stakeholders
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  Speaker 2: and experts to see what is to model, and maybe
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  Speaker 2: we look at those other jurisdictions to see what that
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  Speaker 2: processes and see whether we want that done.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, well, John Patterson, I always appreciate your time. You know,
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  Speaker 1: I've got plenty of respect for you. And I know
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  Speaker 1: that sometimes our opinions can be different, but what I
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  Speaker 1: like is that by the sounds of it, you want
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  Speaker 1: to sit down and you want to you know, you
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  Speaker 1: want to try and make sure that there's the best
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  Speaker 1: possible outcome for everybody, a.
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  Speaker 2: Win win for everybody. So it keeps the police safe,
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  Speaker 2: it keeps the people that they're taking the custody is safe,
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  Speaker 2: you know, and rather than everybody being put at risk
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  Speaker 2: or you know, being put in serious sort of situations.
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  Speaker 2: So and I think we can do it. I think
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  Speaker 2: we can do it here, kat And that's why I
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  Speaker 2: want to focus. You know, the leadership needs to rise
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  Speaker 2: here and focus on the issue and the process. So
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  Speaker 2: I think that's where we need to go.
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  Speaker 1: Well, John Patterson, it's always good to speak with you,
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  Speaker 1: the CEO of am SAND Thank you for your time
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  Speaker 1: this morning.
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  Speaker 2: Good on you, Katy.
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  Speaker 1: Thank you