Latest / 22 Panels - A Comic Book Podcast / 22 Panels Episode #239 - Ronin

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22 Panels Episode #239 - Ronin · 22 Panels - A Comic Book Podcast

• 0:02
  Ty-Fighter: Hey everyone, welcome back to 22 Panels. This is the podcast that aims to examine, explore.
• 0:09
  Ty-Fighter: and elevate the medium of comics. I almost forgot. I am Tyler, and across…
• 0:14
  Tad Eggleston: Elevate's the important one. Like, the other two can go in.
• 0:18
  Ty-Fighter: Yeah, elevate.
• 0:19
  Tad Eggleston: You can flip them over, you, like, explore, examine, examine, explore, whatever.
• 0:26
  Phil: Well, it was also… it was funny, because it sounded like…
• 0:28
  Tad Eggleston: You even came up with a.
• 0:29
  Ty-Fighter: Different people.
• 0:31
  Ty-Fighter: And he's flying, but…
• 0:32
  Tad Eggleston: Elevate is important. You're a comic shop owner, Tyler. Elevate is the important word.
• 0:40
  Ty-Fighter: Guys, I'm so tired.
• 0:42
  Phil: Oh, okay, it's tiredness. I thought, I thought you had an elevated, air about you as you were saying that. Like, I could hear your pinky in the air, there was some bindings.
• 0:53
  Ty-Fighter: Elevate.
• 0:54
  Phil: Indeed, we can take it back up there, guys.
• 0:56
  Ty-Fighter: So, nope, that pause was… what's the other word? Elevate.
• 1:00
  Ty-Fighter: Okay. Thanks for listening, you guys. I've got across the interwebs from me.
• 1:05
  Tad Eggleston: See, you've got… you've got this…
• 1:06
  Ty-Fighter: Lastly, blank phone.
• 1:07
  Tad Eggleston: forehead, we could just.
• 1:09
  Ty-Fighter: That's what we could do.
• 1:09
  Tad Eggleston: tattoo it across the forehead, and then you could just look at yourself on screen and have the words… Reflected.
• 1:16
  Phil: We'll need to get.
• 1:17
  Tad Eggleston: Elevate.
• 1:18
  Phil: I need to get them, like, ambulance texts, or else, or else, you know, I don't worry about that one.
• 1:24
  Phil: Yeah. Ordering coffee will be a nightmare for you, but you'll remember for the podcast.
• 1:29
  Ty-Fighter: No, it's funny. Alright, so, it's, it's the weekend again. How's it going, guys?
• 1:37
  Tad Eggleston: It's, it's, it's going good,
• 1:42
  Tad Eggleston: It's been a good week. I went up to Duluth in Minneapolis on Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday.
• 1:49
  Phil: 22 panels on the road.
• 1:52
  Tad Eggleston: I mean, for the most part, it was just Tad on the road, but I did wind up meeting with both Tom Kaczynski of Uncivilized and Emily Mayer of the, insert name…
• 2:05
  Phil: Oh, awesome.
• 2:06
  Tad Eggleston: best while I was in Minneapolis. So… that… that did some… 22 panels.
• 2:14
  Tad Eggleston: Float over, and there's actually at least…
• 2:17
  Phil: I'd love to imagine that, y'all record it in your car, you know, while driving around the city.
• 2:22
  Tad Eggleston: I have… I have done that sort of thing.
• 2:26
  Tad Eggleston: I mean, not where everybody was in my car, but…
• 2:30
  Tad Eggleston: where I was traveling and recorded from the car.
• 2:35
  Phil: Wow.
• 2:35
  Tad Eggleston: Tyler and I, I think, did a regular episode once while I was driving during the… the…
• 2:44
  Tad Eggleston: Ill-advised comic shop tour.
• 2:47
  Ty-Fighter: Yeah, you just talked from your car, yeah. Yeah.
• 2:49
  Tad Eggleston: And I know at least once I've done an episode while Kelly was driving the car while we were going somewhere for, like, an interview or book club, I forget which.
• 3:03
  Tad Eggleston: So… so it's… it has happened.
• 3:08
  Tad Eggleston: It's not overall the idea.
• 3:10
  Tad Eggleston: Deal.
• 3:12
  Tad Eggleston: I know…
• 3:16
  Tad Eggleston: we, shifting gears, I know we kinda had something picked out for next week for great responsibility, but I kinda wanna…
• 3:27
  Phil: Already ready to… You're throwing a wrench? You're throwing a wrench before.
• 3:31
  Tad Eggleston: I, I, I am, because,
• 3:36
  Tad Eggleston: We lost Marjane Setrapi this week.
• 3:39
  Phil: Oh, hmm.
• 3:40
  Tad Eggleston: and… I haven't read Persepolis in many, many years, and I think it's worth…
• 3:47
  Phil: Oh, yeah.
• 3:47
  Tad Eggleston: Hawk?
• 3:48
  Ty-Fighter: Okay.
• 3:49
  Phil: Absolutely.
• 3:49
  Tad Eggleston: And depending on how we feel, we might even, because everybody knows Persepolis, we might even take
• 3:58
  Tad Eggleston: The following week to do embroideries, or…
• 4:07
  Tad Eggleston: I can't remember the names of the other books right now.
• 4:10
  Phil: Gotcha. I was wondering,
• 4:12
  Tad Eggleston: or other comics.
• 4:13
  Phil: Should we… should we split it up into Books 1 and 2 like it is? Or.
• 4:17
  Tad Eggleston: Mmm…
• 4:18
  Phil: All in one.
• 4:19
  Tad Eggleston: Trying to do the full Persepolis is worthwhile. I don't know if I have the energy to do…
• 4:26
  Phil: Two weeks of precipice.
• 4:27
  Tad Eggleston: of Persepolis right now.
• 4:29
  Phil: It'd be like, it'd be like doing two weeks of mouse, almost.
• 4:32
  Tad Eggleston: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like, if we were gonna do math…
• 4:36
  Ty-Fighter: It's heavier.
• 4:36
  Tad Eggleston: I'd rather do it in one week.
• 4:38
  Ty-Fighter: Get it over with.
• 4:42
  Tad Eggleston: And in some ways, like, and I have many of her other works and haven't actually managed to read.
• 4:48
  Phil: Oh.
• 4:49
  Tad Eggleston: many of them as I'd like, but I've heard that, well, they have the same
• 4:55
  Tad Eggleston: The same eye, and the same…
• 4:59
  Tad Eggleston: like, critical look at society and whatnot. Some of the other stuff is not…
• 5:04
  Tad Eggleston: Not heavy in the same ways.
• 5:07
  Tad Eggleston: That's one of the reasons that I wouldn't mind trying to do a two-week thing.
• 5:12
  Tad Eggleston: Mr. Strappy. Particularly because, like…
• 5:16
  Tad Eggleston: And I've only… I've only looked at a handful of the…
• 5:20
  Tad Eggleston: the… the tributes so far, but what I've noticed just from this podcast is…
• 5:28
  Tad Eggleston: Satrapi had an outsized influence on… both…
• 5:37
  Tad Eggleston: A generation of women, and specifically a generation of colored women.
• 5:43
  Tad Eggleston: Getting into comics.
• 5:46
  Tad Eggleston: Y-you know.
• 5:50
  Tad Eggleston: the, the…
• 5:53
  Tad Eggleston: you know, I mean, Alison Bechtel also had the huge influence on getting women into comics, etc, but, like.
• 6:00
  Tad Eggleston: I very… we very rarely have a conversation right, you know, lately.
• 6:06
  Tad Eggleston: with… Women under the age of 30.
• 6:14
  Tad Eggleston: Where Citroppi doesn't come up.
• 6:16
  Phil: Right.
• 6:18
  Tad Eggleston: You know.
• 6:21
  Tad Eggleston: And I just know I haven't spent enough time with her work, and I would like to, and this seems like a good excuse, so I'm using my benevolent dictator powers to say.
• 6:32
  Tad Eggleston: I'm throwing out whatever our idea for next week was, which is, like.
• 6:36
  Phil: No!
• 6:37
  Tad Eggleston: mind, anyway.
• 6:39
  Phil: Oh, how could you forget about that incredible work?
• 6:43
  Tad Eggleston: What was it?
• 6:44
  Phil: It, it was, it was the seeds.
• 6:46
  Ty-Fighter: The C.
• 6:47
  Tad Eggleston: Oh, it is an incredible work, and I love David Aja, and I love.
• 6:51
  Phil: Yeah.
• 6:52
  Tad Eggleston: But I mean, it would essentially be something that we were reading just because it was an incredible work, not because of immediate relevance.
• 7:01
  Phil: I mean, aliens are in the news a lot these days.
• 7:04
  Tad Eggleston: fair, but… but, I mean, even Ronin for this week, I picked it out because I'm reading advanced copy of…
• 7:13
  Tad Eggleston: miller's upcoming prose autobiography. Oh, okay. And when I read the Ronin chapter, I went.
• 7:22
  Tad Eggleston: Oh… I need to go revisit this, because…
• 7:27
  Phil: So I'm…
• 7:27
  Tad Eggleston: looking… among other things, I didn't have it in the right place in the Miller timeline, even.
• 7:33
  Phil: Okay, yeah.
• 7:35
  Tad Eggleston: And when I realized where it was in the timeline.
• 7:38
  Tad Eggleston: wrote about it and whatnot, I'm like, I…
• 7:41
  Tad Eggleston: I haven't read this book in 20 years, I need to go…
• 7:45
  Tad Eggleston: re-look at it, because this is… this is a… this is one of the things to, like, sell the graph… or sell the… sell the… the autobiography with. The, is…
• 7:56
  Phil: the missing link between Daredevil and Batman, kind of.
• 8:00
  Tad Eggleston: It is, kind of.
• 8:01
  Phil: Yeah.
• 8:01
  Tad Eggleston: And that's part of what I had, and we'll get more into it before, but that's part of what I hadn't fully…
• 8:08
  Tad Eggleston: internalized, is that.
• 8:10
  Phil: in case.
• 8:10
  Tad Eggleston: before Batman Returns.
• 8:12
  Phil: Okay.
• 8:13
  Tad Eggleston: Or Dark Knight Returns.
• 8:16
  Tad Eggleston: you know, for whatever reason, in my head, it was something they let him do after Dark Knight.
• 8:22
  Phil: Interesting.
• 8:24
  Phil: And…
• 8:24
  Tad Eggleston: Yo.
• 8:25
  Tad Eggleston: Whereas…
• 8:27
  Tad Eggleston: in reality, he had managed to make a big enough name for himself from Daredevil that Jeanette Kahn gave him
• 8:35
  Tad Eggleston: the space. But again, we'll get into that in a little bit. Otherwise, I will say, oh, the other thing with Marjane Sitropi and, like.
• 8:51
  Tad Eggleston: I don't need more details, and I don't care about more details, and it can absolutely… I mean, I've worked enough in senior care, I've lived long enough, etc, but the official word from her
• 9:04
  Tad Eggleston: Family is that she died of sadness.
• 9:07
  Phil: Oh, wow.
• 9:08
  Tad Eggleston: Her husband died about a year ago, and, like, the world without him was just…
• 9:19
  Tad Eggleston: not.
• 9:20
  Tad Eggleston: And again, like, I've certainly seen… in older groups.
• 9:25
  Tad Eggleston: you know, one partner goes, and then the other almost, you know, follows quickly. Which is why I'm not trying to say, oh, this means that there's something nefarious or whatever, and it may or may not even have a ton to do with the world, other than the fact that…
• 9:43
  Tad Eggleston: The, the, the person that, that most helped her
• 9:47
  Tad Eggleston: navigate. The world was no longer there.
• 9:53
  Tad Eggleston: But it's, it's like that reality of, of how… How valuable, human connection can be.
• 10:04
  Phil: Yeah.
• 10:05
  Tad Eggleston: So… On much brighter news…
• 10:09
  Tad Eggleston: Dark Horse voluntarily recognized their union this week.
• 10:15
  Phil: That's, you know, a step in the right direction, you know? Always like to hear that, as opposed to the,
• 10:20
  Phil: Non-acknowledgement, that's, that's always awkward.
• 10:23
  Tad Eggleston: I mean, that's… that's the standard for… for most industries, is, like, they acknowledge their union when they're legally required to.
• 10:33
  Tad Eggleston: You know, how they work in collective bargaining, obviously, is the next question, but, like, it's a massive thing that they voluntarily recognized the union, rather than…
• 10:48
  Tad Eggleston: Forcing elections, and… Any kind of intimidation and or pseudo-intimidation on the way.
• 10:55
  Phil: Right.
• 10:57
  Phil: Gosh, it is wild how, deeply baked in anti-union sentiments are to… to…
• 11:04
  Phil: just the American workforce, to where, like, I know in…
• 11:08
  Tad Eggleston: Well, and particularly considering how huge unions were.
• 11:13
  Tad Eggleston: Not long before the three of us were alive.
• 11:17
  Phil: Exactly.
• 11:18
  Phil: That, you know, helping to…
• 11:20
  Tad Eggleston: The shift from unions being baked into the American workforce to anti-union sentiment being baked into the American workforces has practically happened during Tyler and I's lifetime.
• 11:34
  Ty-Fighter: -
• 11:35
  Ty-Fighter: Yeah, a complete reversal, yeah.
• 11:37
  Tad Eggleston: Y-you know, like, Nixon and Ford started planting some seeds, but, like, it was… it was Reagan…
• 11:47
  Tad Eggleston: And, and the first bush, And the fact that
• 11:51
  Tad Eggleston: Clinton certainly didn't go the other way.
• 11:55
  Phil: Yeah.
• 11:57
  Tad Eggleston: And then the second bush.
• 11:59
  Tad Eggleston: And Obama started to go the other way, but didn't… like, it wasn't a high priority of his.
• 12:07
  Tad Eggleston: you know, I mean, I just like to call it the way I see it. Obama was, hands down, the greatest president of my lifetime, but he wasn't the greatest union president of my lifetime. That absolutely goes to Biden. Biden's probably the best union president since…
• 12:23
  Tad Eggleston: Roosevelt.
• 12:24
  Phil: Wow.
• 12:26
  Phil: Strong words.
• 12:27
  Tad Eggleston: the downside is, like, Biden had some…
• 12:30
  Tad Eggleston: Other glaring deficiencies that made the strength he had for unions…
• 12:37
  Tad Eggleston: I mean, the problem with presidents is, like.
• 12:42
  Tad Eggleston: The problem with presidencies is often, like, that one major deficiency can wind up derailing all of the good things that you do.
• 12:53
  Phil: Yep. I mean, that's… in my mind, that's… that's Jimmy Carter, you know?
• 12:57
  Tad Eggleston: That's Jimmy Carter, that's Joe Biden.
• 13:00
  Phil: Damn.
• 13:01
  Tad Eggleston: Only there's slightly more than one blaring deficiency. Yeah.
• 13:06
  Phil: Yeah. I'd also love to say that when you said, both the first bush and the second bush, literal… Literal shrubbery popped into my head.
• 13:14
  Ty-Fighter: It's it.
• 13:14
  Phil: So…
• 13:15
  Ty-Fighter: Same, I went, bush, and then you went second bush. I went, oh!
• 13:18
  Phil: I'm like, okay.
• 13:20
  Ty-Fighter: That's exactly what I did, because then you went… you said second bush, I'm like… The second bush? I'm like, there's a dirty joke there.
• 13:26
  Phil: Let's!
• 13:27
  Ty-Fighter: Second bush. Of course.
• 13:30
  Phil: Drawberry, too.
• 13:31
  Tad Eggleston: perfectly into what kind of week has it been, and I don't know if it was Tyler or Phil that wants me to not even ask.
• 13:38
  Phil: I mean, I just…
• 13:40
  Tad Eggleston: I will just toss out… well, I just noticed that somebody typed it, like, in the last couple of minutes.
• 13:47
  Phil: We did something, we did it.
• 13:48
  Tad Eggleston: The tagline, I'm sorry.
• 13:49
  Phil: Check it out.
• 13:50
  Tad Eggleston: but,
• 13:54
  Tad Eggleston: the one thing I will say that's, like, just emblematic of, like.
• 13:59
  Tad Eggleston: So, Jared and Ivanka have…
• 14:03
  Tad Eggleston: bought an island in the Mediterranean that they're… they want to develop for, like.
• 14:10
  Phil: Hmm.
• 14:11
  Phil: No.
• 14:12
  Tad Eggleston: luxury resort…
• 14:14
  Phil: I just… that's… I mean…
• 14:16
  Tad Eggleston: But… but, no, no, Phil, that's… that's almost not the worst part.
• 14:20
  Phil: Okay, okay.
• 14:22
  Tad Eggleston: Because Ivanka actually did an interview where, like, she talked about how she'd been thinking a lot about how people like to, er, want to live right now, and how she wants to live, and blah blah blah, and I'm like…
• 14:37
  Tad Eggleston: Yes, everybody would love to live on a deserted island, but… or secluded island, but you understand that for most people, that's dream thinking, right?
• 14:48
  Phil: Right, right.
• 14:49
  Tad Eggleston: Like, when you're giving an interview, talking like that, in such a way that you were, like…
• 14:57
  Tad Eggleston: it wasn't Lifestyles of the Rich and Famous, it was like…
• 15:01
  Phil: It might have been Fox News.
• 15:04
  Tad Eggleston: or whatnot, but, like, the audience was people that were going,
• 15:09
  Tad Eggleston: Which people are you talking about?
• 15:13
  Phil: Right? Holy crap. I mean, that's… And then on…
• 15:16
  Tad Eggleston: And then on top of that, all of that, they're kind of shocked that, you know, it's closest to Albania, it's officially Albanian territory, they're kind of shocked at the level of protest the Albanian people have been…
• 15:31
  Tad Eggleston: doing, even though… even though… until… until, like, 2024-5, when they started talking to the Albanian president, this island was protected. It has both plant and animal species that aren't seen anywhere else in the world.
• 15:50
  Phil: How am I not surprised? That's…
• 15:52
  Ty-Fighter: Yes, let's let the Trumps live there, please.
• 15:54
  Phil: Right? Oh, no, please.
• 15:56
  Tad Eggleston: Well, and, like, she starts out, like, oh, we were just on a friend's yacht, or… she didn't even call it a yacht. We were on a friend's boat in the Mediterranean, we just came across this nice place, and we went swimming, and then we looked into it, and…
• 16:10
  Phil: Yeah, I… I… that was literally the.
• 16:12
  Tad Eggleston: Like, she… covered the island.
• 16:15
  Phil: Right, and that was the clip I saw. I didn't recognize it was her that was talking, because, you know, I don't like looking at these people's faces.
• 16:23
  Tad Eggleston: Yeah, yeah.
• 16:23
  Phil: And then… and then… but the title of the video was, this is gonna be Epstein Island 2.0, and it was.
• 16:29
  Ty-Fighter: Oh, yes.
• 16:30
  Phil: And it's just like, well, that's horrifying, I don't really need that in…
• 16:35
  Tad Eggleston: I mean, I don't actually even know if that's true, because they…
• 16:38
  Phil: I don't.
• 16:39
  Tad Eggleston: They seem to be wanting to develop it at a level that, like…
• 16:43
  Tad Eggleston: it would be really hard to actually turn it into Epstein.
• 16:47
  Phil: Sure.
• 16:47
  Tad Eggleston: Because part of what made Epstein Island
• 16:50
  Tad Eggleston: Work was the absolute level of…
• 16:54
  Ty-Fighter: security.
• 16:56
  Ty-Fighter: Yeah, I mean…
• 16:57
  Tad Eggleston: how few people were allowed there, and how few people were allowed there at a time. And if they're talking, like, a thousand villas.
• 17:04
  Phil: Right.
• 17:05
  Tad Eggleston: Yeah, that's not exactly… You've probably crossed the threshold where you can keep Anything secret-secret.
• 17:13
  Phil: Yeah, and instead, when you were talking about that, the thing that popped in my head was, do rich people not have enough, like, vacation spots already? Like, are they really like, I'm tired of all of the wonderful places in the world.
• 17:27
  Tad Eggleston: Well, I mean, this is… this is where you get into exactly how separated they are.
• 17:34
  Tad Eggleston: Or how… how… how… like, cause their answer would be, oh, but the type of people that are there.
• 17:42
  Phil: I'm sure… yes, I'm sure there would be all kinds of abhorrent bullshit that they would spew as to why they need.
• 17:47
  Tad Eggleston: By the way, when they…
• 17:49
  Tad Eggleston: The people that they're there, they're not even talking like there might be colored people or whatnot, they're like…
• 17:54
  Phil: people.
• 17:55
  Tad Eggleston: Tyler and his beard might be there.
• 17:58
  Phil: I mean, I know I haven't been within 100 feet of Tyler and his beard, so…
• 18:03
  Tad Eggleston: I mean, I mean, they're not, they're not talking about, like, they're not even necessarily talking about poor people. They're talking about people who have to think about money.
• 18:17
  Phil: Yeah.
• 18:18
  Tad Eggleston: Ever.
• 18:19
  Phil: They're talking about an ecosystem that, is not 1,000% directed towards the ultra-wealthy, you know?
• 18:26
  Tad Eggleston: Right.
• 18:27
  Phil: That's what they're wanting. They're wanting.
• 18:28
  Tad Eggleston: Right.
• 18:28
  Phil: They're wanting to, like…
• 18:29
  Tad Eggleston: Because the people who aren't ultra-wealthy, well, why aren't they? I mean, why did they decide to be ultra-wealthy?
• 18:35
  Phil: I mean, it's crazy.
• 18:36
  Tad Eggleston: Fun!
• 18:38
  Ty-Fighter: I want to be.
• 18:39
  Phil: when I went… born with a billion dollars. That… that… I should have been born…
• 18:42
  Tad Eggleston: They work hard for their money, Phil.
• 18:47
  Phil: It's hard to be a child of a monster.
• 18:50
  Ty-Fighter: Why don't you work hard, Phil?
• 18:52
  Phil: That's what I ask myself every day. Why don't I work hard?
• 18:56
  Ty-Fighter: I mean, if you don't have a million dollars.
• 18:58
  Tad Eggleston: If you wanted to go to these islands, you just need to dedicate yourself to working hard.
• 19:03
  Phil: Yup, that's it.
• 19:05
  Phil: Just, just, need to live and breathe it.
• 19:07
  Tad Eggleston: You should, you should get into real estate.
• 19:10
  Phil: Put down the comics and pick up the paperwork.
• 19:13
  Tad Eggleston: You should get into real estate, you know? I mean, if you just drop a few hundred million here.
• 19:22
  Phil: It's on.
• 19:22
  Tad Eggleston: into a billion.
• 19:24
  Phil: Naturally, yeah.
• 19:25
  Tad Eggleston: Almost overnight. I just have to…
• 19:27
  Phil: hedges.
• 19:27
  Tad Eggleston: do that, Phil.
• 19:29
  Phil: Just hedge my funds, you know?
• 19:32
  Phil: I heard… I heard they had bushes in the White House, so hedges can do a lot these days, right?
• 19:37
  Tad Eggleston: There we go.
• 19:38
  Ty-Fighter: world.
• 19:38
  Tad Eggleston: Let's… let's talk.
• 19:41
  Tad Eggleston: Some new-to-order comics.
• 19:44
  Tad Eggleston: Initial orders are due June 25th. We'll start with, some new comic series. Denver! Number 1, the, the, the writing team behind,
• 19:56
  Tad Eggleston: One of the most fabulous runs of Jonah Hex is back together, Jimmy Palmiati and Justin Gray with art from Pure Burrito at Mad Cave in a near-future world, drowned by rising oceans.
• 20:09
  Tad Eggleston: That's the other, like, danger of, like, the whole island living thing. Maybe we should convince more of them to do the island living thing.
• 20:17
  Phil: Wait, don't… don't islands float?
• 20:20
  Tad Eggleston: I mean, we should tell them that.
• 20:25
  Tad Eggleston: If we tell them that all evidence to the contrary is fake news, they might believe us.
• 20:32
  Phil: You just get enough floaty… floaty toys and water wings under it?
• 20:35
  Tad Eggleston: Right.
• 20:36
  Phil: Float your island, yeah.
• 20:38
  Tad Eggleston: In a near-future world drowned by rising oceans, Denver survives as one of the last tightly controlled safe zones on the planet, where every resource is rationed and every citizen is monitored. Max Flynn, a veteran border officer struggling to protect his family under these unforgiving rules, is shattered
• 20:56
  Tad Eggleston: When his wife is suddenly kidnapped, a mysterious enemy forces him to betray Denver from within or lose her forever.
• 21:04
  Tad Eggleston: As Mack is assembles a trusted crew and descends into the city's underbelly, his desperate hunt threatens to expose the cracks in Denver's rigid order and ignite a reckoning that could end the last safe city on Earth.
• 21:19
  Tad Eggleston: This is Final Order Cut Off August 3rd, and released August 26th for Mad Cave Comics.
• 21:27
  Phil: Alrighty, next up we've got Dream Math, a one-shot from Tom Herpich at Floating World.
• 21:34
  Phil: A day in the life of the author becomes a meditation on rote…
• 21:38
  Phil: round trips, both physical and psychological, shining a light on the joy of boredom, the magic of repetition, and the beauty of solitude. It's gonna be, final order cutoff of June 29th, in shop September 30th from Floating World Comics.
• 21:56
  Ty-Fighter: Next up, you guys, we have EC's Shell Shock from Julio Anta and Tom Fowler. New wars, new soldiers, same old price to pay. Kiss your rifle and swallow your fear, because EC Comics is rotating back into combat
• 22:12
  Ty-Fighter: For the 21st century's first dose of two-fisted fury with staggering new tales of war and fighting men in our next giant-sized special, meet mankind's greatest enemy of all…
• 22:24
  Ty-Fighter: Himself.
• 22:25
  Ty-Fighter: From Oni Press, this will be, final order coming off June 13th, and in shops August 19th.
• 22:32
  Phil: Alright, then there's Ghost of a Ghost number 1 from Mike Mignola and Michael Avon Oving and Takisoma on Colors over at Dark Horse. After being exposed to Enkelidite in Giant Robot Hellboy, Super Spy Agent Jian uses her newfound powers as part of a mysterious spy ring, entrusted to investigate Enkelodite stores and keep the powerful material out of the wrong hands.
• 22:56
  Phil: But just whose hands are the wrong ones? It's harder to determine than she thought.
• 23:00
  Phil: It's gonna have a final order cutoff of August 17th in stores September 23rd from Dark Horse Comics as part of the Hellboy universe.
• 23:09
  Ty-Fighter: Alright, guys, we have Hillbilly, the Treason of 12, of 12 Toe Maggie. Excuse me.
• 23:16
  Tad Eggleston: Yeah, I was about to say.
• 23:17
  Ty-Fighter: Instead of 12-toe Maggie.
• 23:18
  Phil: You guys don't Totos?
• 23:20
  Ty-Fighter: From Eric Powell, from Dark Horse. There are many tales of Rondle the Wandering Hillbilly. This is but one. Some years after the Great Witch War, Rondle, in order to save an old friend, finds himself in an uncomfortable situation.
• 23:36
  Ty-Fighter: In the service of his former captor, 12-toed Maggie. Well, will he break the magical tie that binds him to the 12-toed witch, or will the wielder of the Devil's Cleaver be at her service forever?
• 23:50
  Ty-Fighter: This is from Dark Horse, final order cut off of August 24th, and in shop September 30th.
• 23:58
  Tad Eggleston: Regicide number 1, or Regicide number 1, depending on which country you're speaking in. Patrick Kinden Ludovac?
• 24:06
  Tad Eggleston: Laliat from Image Comics, a doomed march through Transylvania. A farmhand lives a simple life until village elders insist he set out for the capital with a dangerous stranger. Their mission?
• 24:22
  Tad Eggleston: Kill the Murderous Viceroy of Transylvania. This is from Image Comics, final order cutoff, July 20th, and in stores on August 12th.
• 24:32
  Tad Eggleston: Let's talk some graphic novels. I think you're up first, Mr. Tyler.
• 24:37
  Ty-Fighter: Mr. Tyler, Bite Me, Tad! No, that's what the book's called. Bite Me, Jennifer Dugan and Kit Seton, or Seton.
• 24:44
  Tad Eggleston: See?
• 24:44
  Ty-Fighter: From Penguin, Poe never imagined that during her senior year of high school, she would be attacked by a pair of vampires and turned into one herself.
• 24:54
  Ty-Fighter: And she never dreamed her longtime crush, Jolie, who seemed to maybe actually like Poe back, would turn out to be a slayer. This is gonna be in shops, or excuse me, final order cutoff of July 27th, and in shops August 25th from Penguin.
• 25:15
  Ty-Fighter: Wow.
• 25:16
  Tad Eggleston: Frostbite by Ian Boothby and Pia Guerra.
• 25:21
  Tad Eggleston: of Why the Last Man and political cartooning fame from Scholastic Books. Siblings Jen and Dante are social media influencers and post videos of themselves doing extreme sports.
• 25:35
  Tad Eggleston: But when they jump out of a helicopter to ski down a mountain, the stunt goes awry. Dante's ankle gets slashed, and the helicopter crew, who were supposed to be waiting at the bottom of the mountain, are nowhere to be found. As the confusion
• 25:49
  Tad Eggleston: Confused teens seek answers. They meet up with some locals and soon find themselves flesh to fang with a group of frost vampires. Their only hope for survival is to make it to sunrise when the vampires become dormant under the snow.
• 26:04
  Tad Eggleston: Once again. This is the final order cutoff of June 29th, and in stores August 5th from Scholastic.
• 26:12
  Phil: Alrighty, now we've got, I'm gonna preemptively apologize for any mispronunciations here. Huegla, the stories of Dolores Huerta and Sal Castro.
• 26:23
  Phil: Did you… did you have a… was that okay?
• 26:25
  Tad Eggleston: Nope, that's all good.
• 26:27
  Phil: Gotcha, alright, from, Henry Braz, Louis Chin, and Gab Contreras over at Good Trouble.
• 26:32
  Phil: 1968 was a turning point in American history. Countless activists were at the forefront of fighting for the rights of migrant farmworkers and East LA students, with two in particular standing out, Dolores Huerta and Sal Castro. Originally.
• 26:47
  Phil: created for classrooms. Cuegla highlights Latin history figures who revolutionized the American farm worker, and these stories are now available for all.
• 26:57
  Phil: That's gonna have a final or a cutoff of June 29th in stores, August 5th. And now, next up, it is,
• 27:05
  Tad Eggleston: No, no, no, I'm gonna jump in really quick.
• 27:09
  Phil: Jump in! Do it!
• 27:10
  Tad Eggleston: Be… be… because, Henry will be joining us on the podcast this week.
• 27:18
  Phil: Excellent.
• 27:18
  Tad Eggleston: Which is the only reason that I didn't highlight this. I'm totally cool with you highlighting it.
• 27:22
  Phil: Of, yeah.
• 27:22
  Tad Eggleston: I was gonna talk about it when I could say, and go listen to the issue with Henry Barajas. But now I'll say, look out for the episode
• 27:33
  Tad Eggleston: coming. I will be talking with Henry Barajas, I think tomorrow, actually.
• 27:38
  Phil: Nice.
• 27:38
  Tad Eggleston: So yeah.
• 27:40
  Phil: There we go. So now, next up, is a graphic novel adaptation of a classic, Macbeth by Kay Briggs over Avery Hill, a vivid graphic novel adaptation of Shakespeare's Macbeth, faithful to the original text with a new, lavish rendition, when three witches prophecy to Macbeth that he will one day become the King of Scotland. An epic of unhappiness, treachery, and blood begins.
• 28:04
  Phil: Macbeth and Lady Macbeth's ambitions lead to an ever-growing path of murder as Macbeth grows ever closer to the throne. But wherewolves all end? Only with death, and with madness. Influenced by the witches and magic of Macbeth, Kay Briggs' lush new graphic novel rendition of the classic provides a new interpretation of the Scottish play.
• 28:23
  Phil: Gonna have a final order cutoff of July 13th in stores August 12th.
• 28:27
  Ty-Fighter: That's turn.
• 28:30
  Tad Eggleston: On their front lines, Marina Elisa Kamiya at Fanta Graphics. After Japan lost the war, the country was thrown into devastation.
• 28:41
  Ty-Fighter: has reached.
• 28:41
  Tad Eggleston: No one felt his devastation as much as.
• 28:43
  Ty-Fighter: chapter.
• 28:44
  Tad Eggleston: Best friends, and possibly more before the war, Haru and Yuriko are separated in the evacuation of their towns during the air raids. As they search for each other afterward, Haru gets by as a waitress while Yuriko sells her body at a brothel.
• 29:01
  Tad Eggleston: Their fortunes change when they each meet respectful American soldiers who take their hand.
• 29:08
  Tad Eggleston: Arthur, a Japanese-American, grapples with the inner conflict of his dual identity, while Scott is at once fascinated by Japanese culture and wracked with guilt over the destruction American forces have Ross.
• 29:20
  Tad Eggleston: rot. Amidst the post where desolation, love finds a way. Final order cutoff is July 20th, and this will be out from Fanagraphics on August 26th.
• 29:33
  Tad Eggleston: Alright.
• 29:34
  Phil: good.
• 29:34
  Tad Eggleston: I get to lead off with the collections, too.
• 29:38
  Tad Eggleston: The Blood Brothers Mother from Brian Azzarello and Eduardo Rizzo, one of the fantastic
• 29:44
  Tad Eggleston: Fantastic books has come out from Distillery. In the old American West, three children set off across the wild Texas frontier to rescue their mother, kidnapped by ruthless outlaws who gunned down their preacher father. Throughout their journey, they'll face the harsh elements of the unforgiving landscape, deadly animals hungry for blood, merciless bounty hunters, and so much more.
• 30:05
  Tad Eggleston: All in a relentless quest to rescue their family.
• 30:09
  Tad Eggleston: Along the way, they'll learn the terrible cost of revenge, not just in lives, but in how it stains a soul. While revenge may be satisfying in the moment, it leaves a yearning behind that lasts a lifetime. And once you taste it, nothing else is ever so sweet. This is…
• 30:25
  Tad Eggleston: Final order cut off of July 6th, in stores September 15th from Distillery.
• 30:31
  Ty-Fighter: Alright, next up is No Plays from Tim Seeley and Stefano Simone.
• 30:36
  Ty-Fighter: from Ignition. Mariposa Montiel is having a cruel homecoming. As the daughter of immigrants, the outcast teenager is no stranger to scrutiny, but this is another level. Years after vanishing from her Chicago neighborhood, Mari has returned to a traumatized family.
• 30:56
  Ty-Fighter: And a media circus with nothing but a tiger-striped feather, and an extraordinary tale of her time away as the champion of a magical jungle land called Maya Hula? Is that correct, Maya Hula?
• 31:10
  Phil: Majuela?
• 31:10
  Ty-Fighter: My Huela. Man is met, excuse me, Mari is met as a fluid… as a fraud.
• 31:16
  Ty-Fighter: And her story makes her a stranger in her own life until an eccentric, high-tech organization known as No Place emerges from the shadows and welcomes her home. Led by a legend of the Land of Oz, the secret agency has its finger on the pulse of so-called fictional worlds, and as its newest recruit, Mari is now called upon to save our own
• 31:41
  Ty-Fighter: world from a creeping Lovecraftian nightmare. Final order cutoff of July 13th, and will be in shop September 1st.
• 31:53
  Phil: Oh.
• 31:54
  Phil: Alrighty, next up there's Viking Moon by Joe Pruitt and Marcelo Frusen over at Image Comics. Vikings vs. Werewolves. Leif Erikson established a Viking settlement in present-day Newfoundland, a strange new world or plenty, but populated by an
• 32:11
  Phil: Indigenous people and something else. Something unnatural.
• 32:15
  Phil: 20 years after the original exploration ended in disaster, a new attempt to settle this wilderness is made. Ulf and his hardened tribe of Vikings soon discover that the whispers of creatures who are both human and beast are not primitive legend, but death-bringing reality. The real reason the Vikings fled North America.
• 32:32
  Phil: We're gonna have a final order cutoff of July 20th in stores August 26th. And now, it is time for the final order cutoff with Ted.
• 32:43
  Tad Eggleston: Final order cut off for the week of Monday? Well, this week.
• 32:47
  Tad Eggleston: cutoff date is Monday, June 15th. We have banana number 1,
• 32:53
  Tad Eggleston: number one, from Joshua Dysart and Kevin McGuire at Bad Idea,
• 32:59
  Tad Eggleston: out on July 15th. The super rare variant cover on this that, that is, like, it comes with an actual banana.
• 33:09
  Tad Eggleston: Duct tape to the, to the comic.
• 33:12
  Phil: I would love if there was…
• 33:14
  Ty-Fighter: Like the artwork, right? The stupid artwork. Right, right, right, right.
• 33:17
  Phil: I, I…
• 33:18
  Tad Eggleston: I think that…
• 33:19
  Phil: Interesting travel.
• 33:20
  Tad Eggleston: to something low, like, 7. You know, but… but, like, I love… I love it.
• 33:28
  Phil: their own bananas to copies to increase market value.
• 33:31
  Tad Eggleston: I love that… that… oh, that actually just… I don't even think we should…
• 33:36
  Phil: It's too late, it's a bad idea, it's out there.
• 33:39
  Tad Eggleston: No, no, no, we shouldn't tape them, but I need to tell Edgar and Lee that, like, on July 15th, we need to have free bananas for anybody who buys banana number one.
• 33:50
  Phil: There you go. That's a pretty good one.
• 33:52
  Tad Eggleston: And then… I mean, you can get bananas for, like, 30 cents apiece.
• 33:57
  Phil: I think there are only, like, 15 at Trader Joe's.
• 33:58
  Ty-Fighter: Hey, Chuck.
• 33:59
  Tad Eggleston: Tape is available should they decide they want to attach it.
• 34:03
  Ty-Fighter: Doug tape it to the wall so that it looks like the art installation that we all laughed at, and then…
• 34:08
  Ty-Fighter: And then, yeah.
• 34:11
  Tad Eggleston: Clayface Celebrity Dirt No. 1 from Jude Ellison S. Doyle and Fran Gallin at DC Comics, out on July 8th.
• 34:20
  Tad Eggleston: Exquisite Corpses, Randy Rascal No. 1 from Tyler Boss, at Image Comics, out on July 8th. Godzilla vs. America, San Diego.
• 34:32
  Phil: My birthplace.
• 34:33
  Tad Eggleston: from various artists out from IDW on July 22nd, and I just gotta say.
• 34:41
  Tad Eggleston: You know, there have been some, like…
• 34:44
  Tad Eggleston: interesting decisions in terms of who does stuff for, like, the Chicago one, everybody had a Chicago connection.
• 34:52
  Tad Eggleston: But, like… Half of them weren't currently living in Chicago.
• 34:57
  Phil: Mmm.
• 34:58
  Tad Eggleston: This one, I think, Essentially, it's like… It's not quite… if you've… been to San Diego, like.
• 35:10
  Phil: If you've ever been to Comic-Con.
• 35:12
  Tad Eggleston: I don't think it's quite that, like, I think there's at least one creator that, like, has real ties to San Diego, but, like.
• 35:21
  Tad Eggleston: Greg and Fake have a story, and they're not tied to San Diego at all, except for the Eisner Award that the Santos sisters won. Right, right.
• 35:31
  Phil: We'll get him there. We'll get him there somehow.
• 35:34
  Tad Eggleston: So, I mean… and that's cool, because the stories are definitely supposed to be more… they're about the area, they don't have to be from creators at the area, but I just laughed when I saw that, I'm like, but…
• 35:46
  Tad Eggleston: But they're from Chicagoland, and Greg's now in Milwaukee, and Fake is in Mexico. How do… and not… and not Western Mexico, like, the east coast of Mexico.
• 36:00
  Phil: Is he… is he in Baja, California? No! No?
• 36:03
  Tad Eggleston: Okay.
• 36:05
  Phil: It was close. We tried. We tried.
• 36:09
  Phil: Couldn't get there.
• 36:12
  Tad Eggleston: But, you know, I mean, still cool. I mean, I've been loving this series through and through. Like, these are the things that make my autistic brain laugh, not the reasons why people
• 36:22
  Tad Eggleston: should go, oh, false advertising! Don't buy that! They don't know San Diego. I'm pretty certain that Godzilla vs. America San Diego might as well be Godzilla vs. America San Diego Comic Con. Yeah. So…
• 36:41
  Tad Eggleston: Yeah. But… but that did…
• 36:43
  Tad Eggleston: It made me smile. Made me smile. Lovers of the Empire Volume 1 from Udori at Fanographics, out August 19th, and Sicko No. 1 from Teeny Howard and Emil Pena.
• 36:56
  Tad Eggleston: at Ignition Press, out July 22nd. Phil, you want to take us through a pretty extensive list of crowdfunding right now?
• 37:06
  Phil: Oh yeah, come with me! We have a.
• 37:08
  Tad Eggleston: Really, really fantastic.
• 37:09
  Ty-Fighter: Fantastic.
• 37:10
  Tad Eggleston: Really fantastic.
• 37:11
  Ty-Fighter: Do it like Mr. Rogers, like one of the arm waves.
• 37:15
  Tad Eggleston: Really quickly, I'm gonna say 1, 2… 3…
• 37:23
  Phil: I was gonna say.
• 37:24
  Tad Eggleston: 4, 5, 6, 7, 8 of the… 8 of the 12, we've already had people on specifically for this Kickstarter.
• 37:35
  Phil: Right.
• 37:36
  Tad Eggleston: I swear to God.
• 37:37
  Phil: this list is to talk to Tad.
• 37:38
  Tad Eggleston: a ninth… We had the creator on for one of the earlier volumes of the thing being kickstarted here.
• 37:51
  Tad Eggleston: And a tenth… I will be talking to this afternoon.
• 37:57
  Phil: There we go. Trying to keep the, the percentage up, you know?
• 38:00
  Tad Eggleston: So, so yes, that is, like, you want to get mentioned weekly in our Kickstarters? The best way to do that…
• 38:08
  Tad Eggleston: is to have been on the show. And then I'll also plug the episode, which will make people that much more interested in your Kickstarter, so… There we go!
• 38:15
  Phil: There we go.
• 38:16
  Phil: you know.
• 38:17
  Tad Eggleston: We've got Kickstarter Synchronicity.
• 38:20
  Phil: Oh.
• 38:22
  Tad Eggleston: Take it away, Phil.
• 38:23
  Phil: There we go, so we've got Lab Zero Remix, a comics magazine hacking pop culture from Ronald Wimberly on Kickstarter through June 9th, so get it while you can, when you're… if you're listening to this right after drop.
• 38:35
  Phil: After that, there's that one Matt Boers comic, with… from Matt Boers and Glenn Fleischman on Kickstarter through June 11th. Go listen to that talk, Tad had with, Matt and Glenn, I believe.
• 38:49
  Phil: John of the Night, by Daryl Cunningham with Avery Hill on Kickstarter through June 19th.
• 38:56
  Phil: Nighthawks by Jimmy Lee with Goat's Flying Press on Kickstarter through June 25th.
• 39:03
  Phil: The 2026 Insert Name Comics and Zine Fest from Emily Mayer and Ryan Carey, throwing that one, on Kickstarter through June 29th. The fest is Sunday, August 30th, from noon to 6pm at Audmark 2520 Lindale Avenue, South Minneapolis.
• 39:23
  Tad Eggleston: And this is where I'm gonna jump in really quick, because, like, Tyler, the next time you're bored and have…
• 39:30
  Tad Eggleston: 5 hours, you need to drive to Minneapolis and back just to go to Odd Mart for an hour. Because it is one of the best curated…
• 39:42
  Tad Eggleston: Like, indie alternative, progressive… graphic novel selections I have ever seen.
• 39:53
  Phil: Wow, that's some high praise.
• 39:55
  Tad Eggleston: I was there… I was there on Thursday, and I was…
• 39:58
  Tad Eggleston: I was blown away. Like, the amount of money I wanted to spend… like…
• 40:06
  Tad Eggleston: was on par… and this was even… even… even setting aside the fact that there was an issue of raw number 8 for $100 that I wanted.
• 40:17
  Phil: Wow.
• 40:18
  Tad Eggleston: The amount of money that I wanted to spend was, like, on par with stores 5 or 6 times its size.
• 40:26
  Phil: Wow.
• 40:27
  Ty-Fighter: That's crazy.
• 40:28
  Phil: Impressive.
• 40:29
  Tad Eggleston: You know, what they have is really great, and it's well organized, well… Yeah, they're…
• 40:41
  Phil: shop at Walmart. Yeah.
• 40:42
  Tad Eggleston: I…
• 40:43
  Ty-Fighter: I am… odd mark.
• 40:43
  Tad Eggleston: is very cool.
• 40:45
  Ty-Fighter: I am certainly, going to check it out. I'm on their Facebook right now. It's… here's the description. Store of the Strange, Gum, comics, art, t-shirts, Vintage. That's what they have listed. That's funny.
• 41:00
  Phil: facility.
• 41:01
  Ty-Fighter: Typically.
• 41:01
  Phil: Makes, makes the headline. Next up, there is The Goblin Throne by Mel Gilman with Iron Circus on Kickstarter through June 30th. Ted, it is, is, I mean, I…
• 41:15
  Tad Eggleston: It's a spike yesterday, and that'll go up sometime today or tomorrow.
• 41:19
  Phil: There we go. Then there's the Comics Courier number 4, by Tiffany Babb on Kickstarter through July 1st.
• 41:28
  Tad Eggleston: Talk to Tiffany about this volume of the Comics Courier, but…
• 41:31
  Phil: So, previous ones, they have to…
• 41:32
  Tad Eggleston: I talked to her about a previous comics courier, and I need to reach out, because, like, she's one of my baseball buds.
• 41:38
  Phil: Oh, nice. Next up, Stellar Remnant number 2 from Damon, George, and Hampton on Kickstarter through July 15th. The Forgotten…
• 41:48
  Tad Eggleston: the discussion with Damon.
• 41:50
  Phil: There we go. The Forgotten Divine, by Mark Russell and Russ Brown, from Ahoy. Braun, thank you.
• 41:58
  Phil: from Ahoy on Kickstarter, launching soon, that's, that's a little bit of further back conversation Tad's had, hyping up this one.
• 42:06
  Tad Eggleston: Yeah, no, and two of them, both a conversation with Mark and Russ, and a conversation with, Tom Pyre and Stuart Moore.
• 42:18
  Phil: The, founders of Ahoy?
• 42:21
  Tad Eggleston: Yeah.
• 42:22
  Tad Eggleston: Two of the founders of Ahoy, and, like, the head editorial people. Nice.
• 42:30
  Tad Eggleston: And both, both with, the vertigo.
• 42:34
  Phil: Right, right. Resumes. From back in the day, that's true. I've also heard that Ahoy is one of the better-paying comics publishers out there, so if you're an artist, then there's.
• 42:43
  Tad Eggleston: And pays on time.
• 42:46
  Phil: Also, right.
• 42:47
  Tad Eggleston: Word is that this one will launch this week.
• 42:50
  Phil: Oh, okay, there we go.
• 42:51
  Tad Eggleston: fine.
• 42:52
  Phil: The soon is indeed soon. Next there's Nerd Emergencies and Other Misunderstandings, a comic showcase of neurodivergent perspectives from Andrew Coltrane, Paltry Robot, and Zuzu Cartoons. Partly. Partly.
• 43:07
  Phil: Partly Robot and Zuzu Cartoons, thank you. On Kickstarter, also launching soon, I'm assuming that you talked to…
• 43:14
  Tad Eggleston: I talked to Andrew.
• 43:15
  Phil: Not a robot?
• 43:16
  Tad Eggleston: For a couple hours on… Friday?
• 43:21
  Phil: Hmm.
• 43:21
  Tad Eggleston: And that should go up in the next couple of days.
• 43:25
  Phil: And then there's the Tezuka, God of Manga, documentary by Jason Cohn on Kickstarter, launching soon. Tad has talked to him. Go check out that episode.
• 43:37
  Tad Eggleston: Hang cock.
• 43:38
  Phil: Nice, and then there's scar tissue.
• 43:40
  Tad Eggleston: And they're all fun talks.
• 43:42
  Tad Eggleston: Right.
• 43:43
  Phil: Why don't.
• 43:43
  Tad Eggleston: You guys listen to them all. How is it that my mom listens to more episodes than my cohort?
• 43:49
  Phil: She's…
• 43:49
  Tad Eggleston: co-workers.
• 43:50
  Phil: birthed you!
• 43:52
  Tad Eggleston: And she's retired.
• 43:54
  Phil: Okay, that's the outcome.
• 43:55
  Tad Eggleston: Yeah, before she was retired, she had, like, a 45-minute drive to and from work every day.
• 44:00
  Phil: There you go. That'll do it.
• 44:02
  Tad Eggleston: So, okay. I get it!
• 44:05
  Tad Eggleston: Still!
• 44:05
  Phil: But still.
• 44:06
  Phil: Scarge.
• 44:07
  Tad Eggleston: You guys are the co-hosts, you're supposed to be supportive.
• 44:10
  Phil: I don't… I need to listen to this one, because… my neck of the woods.
• 44:15
  Ty-Fighter: My mom doesn't listen at all. She does not really get what I'm into.
• 44:19
  Tad Eggleston: Well, of course not, because, like, if you don't even listen, why should she listen? Because she wouldn't have anything to talk… she'd be like, Tyler, so I was listening to your podcast, and Tad was talking to so-and-so, and you'd be like, right?
• 44:33
  Phil: Hi, Mom! I sent my mom the interviews I've done. I don't think… she hasn't told me she's listened to him yet, though, so that's okay. It's clear Tad's mom loves him the most out of all our moms. Here's the thing, you know.
• 44:43
  Ty-Fighter: And here's the thing, it's not that, Ted, it's that she really doesn't care about this at all.
• 44:51
  Phil: Oh, the knife in the heart!
• 44:53
  Ty-Fighter: I'm not kidding.
• 44:54
  Phil: Oh, boy.
• 44:54
  Ty-Fighter: You guys, you guys, my mom is a very, direct person, like.
• 44:59
  Phil: Alright.
• 45:00
  Ty-Fighter: She will not do things out of sentimentality, because it's her boy.
• 45:05
  Tad Eggleston: Yeah, yeah, yeah, see, see, like…
• 45:07
  Ty-Fighter: This show is about comic books, and it's left-wing, she doesn't want anything to do with it.
• 45:12
  Tad Eggleston: Left wing, I forgot that part, yeah.
• 45:15
  Ty-Fighter: Part of it.
• 45:15
  Tad Eggleston: I'm sorry.
• 45:16
  Phil: Do you need to ask Tyler's mom where she was on January 6th? Oh, no. Oh, no.
• 45:22
  Tad Eggleston: Well, this year, she was just throwing a party for… to celebrate all the pardons.
• 45:28
  Ty-Fighter: No, no, no.
• 45:29
  Tad Eggleston: I made a cake.
• 45:30
  Ty-Fighter: I'm gonna be very clear. My mom is anti-Trump.
• 45:34
  Tad Eggleston: Okay.
• 45:35
  Ty-Fighter: Definitely… she is definitely not where I'm at, though.
• 45:39
  Tad Eggleston: Okay.
• 45:39
  Phil: Yeah, so she… She is… she doesn't like Trump.
• 45:42
  Tad Eggleston: More of a Lincoln Republican, or a bulwark bulwark… bulwark person.
• 45:49
  Ty-Fighter: she's still…
• 45:50
  Phil: Terrified.
• 45:51
  Ty-Fighter: Hold on one second, I'm getting a message.
• 45:53
  Phil: There we go. So yeah, so go listen to Tad's conversation with Stephen Fox about Scar Tissue Bargains, which is a Kickstarter that's launching soon. Steven is a creator from Mount Juliet, Tennessee, I believe.
• 46:07
  Tad Eggleston: of the woods.
• 46:07
  Phil: Yeah, so is this next time up?
• 46:09
  Tad Eggleston: I get Jenna from there a couple times. Yeah, I got a, I got a, I got a…
• 46:13
  Tad Eggleston: I gotta connect the two of you, I keep forgetting.
• 46:14
  Phil: Right? He appeared to me in a dream. If he looks like how he appeared in my dream, then, yeah, we'll know. We'll know.
• 46:22
  Tad Eggleston: weird.
• 46:23
  Phil: It was, it was, it was a very weird one. I have met several people in Dreams. Let's not get into that. Let's get into Humble Bundles. Tyler, what Humble Bundles do we have?
• 46:31
  Ty-Fighter: Not very good ones.
• 46:33
  Tad Eggleston: What!
• 46:35
  Tad Eggleston: I've actually paid for two of these already, and a third one will almost certainly be paid for, and I'm still debating the fourth.
• 46:43
  Ty-Fighter: really good. I just went through and rechecked to make sure that we were still up-to-date on our humble bundles. So…
• 46:49
  Ty-Fighter: Infinite Dread Horror Comics from Oni Press is, $18, you guys, and gets you 23 different items, including Cemetery Kids Don't Die, Dwellings, and Meat Eaters.
• 47:02
  Ty-Fighter: This is, the Book Industry Charitable Foundation, and it's now been extended through June 13th. So, more time to get on that.
• 47:12
  Ty-Fighter: Hot Mess Express, a bundle of Misfit Heroes and hilarious hijinks from Image, is $18, really good deal, you get 49 items, including 8 Billion Genies, God Hates Astronauts, I Hate Fairyland, Monkey Meat, Shirtless Bear Fighter, and Snot Girl.
• 47:31
  Ty-Fighter: This goes towards Book Industry Charitable Foundation as well, and this is now through June 9th.
• 47:39
  Ty-Fighter: Which is coming up, so make sure that you are out there and you buy your Hot Mess Express Bundle. Next up, Kadansha Presents BL, Yuri and more from Ichi Nijincha? Is that correct?
• 47:55
  Tad Eggleston: Did you eat?
• 47:56
  Phil: Did you intro?
• 47:57
  Tad Eggleston: Itchy Jinsha is one of their imprints.
• 48:01
  Ty-Fighter: Okay.
• 48:02
  Ty-Fighter: $30 will get you 61 items. That's more than 100 volumes of their stuff.
• 48:08
  Phil: True.
• 48:09
  Tad Eggleston: the items are, like, volumes 1 through 5, or volumes 6 through 10. I mean, it's…
• 48:16
  Phil: It's interesting… it's interesting that they're… they're combining BL and Yuri here, because I imagine that those are kind of opposite, audiences, but you never know.
• 48:25
  Tad Eggleston: I mean…
• 48:26
  Phil: I mean, I'm sure.
• 48:27
  Tad Eggleston: It all fall… I think it all falls into most popular among teenage girls.
• 48:33
  Phil: Fair. Fair.
• 48:34
  Ty-Fighter: And then last, for Humble Bundles is the Ablaze Manga Collection, which…
• 48:41
  Tad Eggleston: And, and…
• 48:42
  Ty-Fighter: more.
• 48:42
  Tad Eggleston: Really quickly, though, we haven't defined… BL is boy's love.
• 48:47
  Phil: Yes.
• 48:48
  Tad Eggleston: It is a major, major… manga…
• 48:55
  Tad Eggleston: thing to have… have… have boys in love with each other. Like, romance comics involving… involving two boys.
• 49:02
  Phil: it's got, quite the reputation as well as, you know, kind of being a little bit of, like, trashy romance. Like, that's how people look down on the readers of it, even though the community is, like, quite vibrant and, inclusive.
• 49:16
  Tad Eggleston: Right.
• 49:17
  Tad Eggleston: Wow. So…
• 49:19
  Ty-Fighter: We've got some boys…
• 49:20
  Tad Eggleston: Tyler's favorite stuff.
• 49:22
  Phil: Nothing but the best.
• 49:24
  Ty-Fighter: what? My favorite stuff, like the…
• 49:28
  Tad Eggleston: Boys love.
• 49:29
  Ty-Fighter: The Boys Love? I actually… yeah, I had a magazine when I was a kid called Boy's Life, not too different.
• 49:36
  Phil: Sure, sure.
• 49:37
  Tad Eggleston: No, I mean, yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 49:38
  Phil: There is love in life, that is for sure.
• 49:41
  Ty-Fighter: Okay, a Blaze manga collection and more. $18 gets you 61 items, and it's going to the Starlight Children's Foundation, and that is running through June 20th.
• 49:54
  Tad Eggleston: And that… that includes a number of Tezuka books.
• 50:01
  Phil: Some of which I'm… do they have any of the hard-to-find ones, or…
• 50:06
  Tad Eggleston: kind of? Let me pull it up, because what they've done a lot of is, like, he did Shakespeare adaptations, so there's, like, the.
• 50:15
  Phil: I didn't know that.
• 50:16
  Tad Eggleston: Shakespeare.
• 50:17
  Phil: Wow.
• 50:18
  Tad Eggleston: Here, let me… let me pull it up really quick.
• 50:22
  Phil: That is indeed wild.
• 50:23
  Tad Eggleston: to highlight this a little bit more at some point, and I…
• 50:26
  Tad Eggleston: forgetting.
• 50:27
  Tad Eggleston: So… There's… there's Tezuka's 100 Tales, there's Tomorrow, the Birds,
• 50:45
  Tad Eggleston: his Shakespeare manga theater.
• 50:48
  Phil: Fascinating.
• 50:49
  Tad Eggleston: and Neo Faust.
• 50:52
  Phil: Oh, interesting.
• 50:52
  Tad Eggleston: Those are the four Tezuka.
• 50:56
  Tad Eggleston: Included in this collection.
• 51:03
  Tad Eggleston: So… Also, it has, has,
• 51:07
  Tad Eggleston: I don't know if it's pronounced Trisse or Tresse. Hmm.
• 51:12
  Tad Eggleston: which is actually, I think, a Korean comic, but is considered one of the… Best.
• 51:19
  Tad Eggleston: crime comics of… of, like… I mean, I've only read the first couple of… couple of volumes, but it's one of… one of the best recorded
• 51:27
  Tad Eggleston: Crime comics. Oh, Filipino. Award-winning.
• 51:30
  Phil: I'm Filipino.
• 51:31
  Tad Eggleston: comic book, and soon-to-be Netflix anime series. When the sun sets on the city of Manila, don't you dare make a wrong turn and end up in that dimly lit side of the metro, where blood-sucking.
• 51:41
  Tad Eggleston: Aswang run the most wanted kidnapping rigs, where gigantic capre are the kingpins of crime, and magical encontos slip through the cracks and steal your most present…
• 51:52
  Tad Eggleston: Precious Possessions. When crime takes a turn for the weird, the police call Alexandra Tresse. Volume 1 Murder at the Ballet Drive features all-new redrawn artwork throughout, and includes a substantial bonus section with behind-the-scenes sketches, info, and details, making
• 52:11
  Tad Eggleston: Of the book and further insight into the world.
• 52:13
  Tad Eggleston: So yeah, all 6 volumes of that are part of this as well.
• 52:19
  Tad Eggleston: Yeah. Nice. It's, it's, it's a…
• 52:22
  Phil: That sounds fun.
• 52:23
  Tad Eggleston: Ablaze doesn't… I mean, Ablaze does original work, they brought us,
• 52:31
  Tad Eggleston: Mark Russell's traveling to Mars.
• 52:34
  Phil: Oh, right, right, that was cool.
• 52:36
  Tad Eggleston: They probably do… most… Bringing European work to the United States, but their, their, their selection of…
• 52:50
  Tad Eggleston: East Asian work is… very good. It's limited, but what they have is…
• 53:00
  Phil: capitalized.
• 53:01
  Tad Eggleston: Like, like, when Ablaze does anything East Asian, I assume I'm gonna like it.
• 53:08
  Phil: Nice.
• 53:09
  Tad Eggleston: So… Yeah. And, all of that stuff's available for $18 right now.
• 53:15
  Tad Eggleston: So… 18.
• 53:16
  Phil: whole dollars.
• 53:17
  Tad Eggleston: Yep. Yeah.
• 53:19
  Tad Eggleston: Anyway, three books I… Fucking adored this week.
• 53:27
  Tad Eggleston: FML number 8 from Kelly Sudakonic and David Lopez. It's been a long time coming, but oh my god, was it a satisfying end to this chapter. I can't wait till the next chapter.
• 53:40
  Tad Eggleston: this chapter, like, centered… I mean, it had the whole family, but it essentially centered on the mom and son.
• 53:49
  Tad Eggleston: The next chapter's gonna be written by Matt, and center on…
• 53:54
  Phil: Really?
• 53:55
  Tad Eggleston: dad and daughter.
• 53:56
  Phil: Wow.
• 53:57
  Tad Eggleston: So I can't wait for that.
• 54:01
  Phil: That's fascinating.
• 54:02
  Tad Eggleston: it was… It was… it was always bittersweet to know that, oh, this is such a… Such a, like…
• 54:12
  Tad Eggleston: wonderfully wrapped up thing, but now I don't know when I get to see these characters again.
• 54:17
  Phil: Right?
• 54:18
  Tad Eggleston: miss them.
• 54:19
  Phil: Oh, I actually put off reading, issue 7 until this one was out, and I still need to pick it up, so, I need to catch up and read the finale, but I'm excited for it.
• 54:29
  Tad Eggleston: On the other end of the spectrum, I got to meet, and I can't remember the character's name, because I'm terrible with names, but… but Junk Punch Number 1 from Paul Tobin, Carlos Javier Olivares, and Colleen Coover, where we've got a future…
• 54:47
  Tad Eggleston: semi-near-future society, where… where, among other things, people… people… Some people have, like…
• 54:56
  Tad Eggleston: One part superpowers, one part compulsions, and our main character has that compulsion to occasionally just punch people in the junk.
• 55:06
  Tad Eggleston: And she does good in the world with it?
• 55:14
  Phil: I mean.
• 55:15
  Tad Eggleston: And hilarity ensues.
• 55:17
  Phil: I'm gonna assume everyone's…
• 55:18
  Tad Eggleston: That's… that's the way I'll put it. Right.
• 55:22
  Tad Eggleston: And great to see, like, like, Colleen,
• 55:28
  Tad Eggleston: teamed with her husband on the backstories, too. I mean, Colleen might be doing more of the writing on the backstories, too, but the character is clearly one that they came up with together. Because the backup story is almost like,
• 55:42
  Tad Eggleston: Earlier in the life of Junk Punch?
• 55:46
  Phil: Is that… is that the name of the character, too? That's how she's referred to?
• 55:49
  Tad Eggleston: I mean, that's how some people know her.
• 55:52
  Phil: Okay.
• 55:55
  Tad Eggleston: again, I should… I should pull it up so I get the name of the character right, but I'm…
• 56:00
  Tad Eggleston: if I do that, we're already, we're already,
• 56:04
  Tad Eggleston: leaning long this week, so… so I don't want to do that. But… but yes, anybody who has read Bandette, and anybody who hasn't read Bandette should go check
• 56:17
  Tad Eggleston: dig up Bandette, because, both Paul Tobin and Colleen Coover are… like, absolutely… phenomenal…
• 56:36
  Tad Eggleston: Phenomenal comic creators in their own right.
• 56:40
  Tad Eggleston: But this book that they did together is, like, one of the best things ever. It's just… it's… it's… it's…
• 56:50
  Tad Eggleston: It's both silly and noirish.
• 56:54
  Phil: Hmm, that's a… that's a difficult combo to pull off.
• 56:57
  Tad Eggleston: You know… Yeah.
• 57:03
  Tad Eggleston: So, I, I, I…
• 57:06
  Tad Eggleston: have been, we've had Tobin on a couple of times, and I'm gonna have to reach out again, because this one's so good. Maybe Colleen will come, too, this time.
• 57:14
  Tad Eggleston: But, but yeah.
• 57:19
  Tad Eggleston: Such, such a fan of their work.
• 57:22
  Tad Eggleston: And then my, my, my final pick this week was The Ring, The Man Who Beat the Man, from Gail Simone and Lisa Romboli. Yep.
• 57:32
  Tad Eggleston: You know, boxing is on the list of things that, like, I have zero interest in in real life, and so often like comic stories about it.
• 57:42
  Ty-Fighter: It's fun. Like wrestling, right?
• 57:44
  Tad Eggleston: I still haven't… I think it's more likely that I could eventually get hooked on wrestling at some level, though it still hasn't happened.
• 57:55
  Tad Eggleston: I don't think I'll ever be able to watch real boxing and not think about the head injuries, so I can't imagine.
• 58:00
  Phil: myself.
• 58:01
  Tad Eggleston: ever getting into boxing for real.
• 58:04
  Tad Eggleston: But… Lots of the stories that come out of this are…
• 58:09
  Tad Eggleston: are, really fantastic. So… so those are… those are… those are my 3 amazing books.
• 58:16
  Phil: Nice.
• 58:18
  Tad Eggleston: Alright, Phil, take a walk.
• 58:20
  Phil: Tom.
• 58:21
  Ty-Fighter: Dark.
• 58:22
  Phil: I am tired, you know? It's… I am old.
• 58:25
  Phil: But yeah, I didn't, I didn't get to reading much this week, although I'm, I'm hoping to sit down with the small pile after this. I just flipped through the first few pages of In Your Skin by Adichi Bedekar and Sam, and it, it started to suck me in, so yeah, so I think that'.
• 58:43
  Tad Eggleston: That's so good.
• 58:44
  Phil: Yeah, I'm excited. That's the first thing I'm gonna be, catching up on. But no, I, I also… I changed my pace a little bit. For the one-week race, I checked out the first volume of Die Dark by Q, okay.
• 58:58
  Tad Eggleston: See, like…
• 59:00
  Tad Eggleston: And I haven't been doing chapters as well lately, but in part because if I'm gonna do chapters, we need to have clear, like, delineation. So you can't just go changing pace for One Piece race. You need to introduce the One Piece Race race!
• 59:22
  Phil: That's fair. That's a good point.
• 59:25
  Phil: One piece race first, okay, okay, okay.
• 59:28
  Phil: Did you read… did you read any one piece this week, Tad?
• 59:31
  Tad Eggleston: I read 3 pages while I was waiting for you guys to log on.
• 59:35
  Phil: I see, I see. The, not, not quite, not quite fast enough for a chapter.
• 59:40
  Tad Eggleston: Right.
• 59:41
  Phil: Yeah, yeah, no, and it's… It is…
• 59:45
  Ty-Fighter: It's entertaining to just listen to this, right?
• 59:47
  Phil: Right, right.
• 59:49
  Tad Eggleston: I mean, I mean, I, I, like…
• 59:52
  Ty-Fighter: I'm just sitting here…
• 59:53
  Tad Eggleston: Really, really meant to read One Piece this week.
• 59:58
  Phil: So…
• 59:59
  Tad Eggleston: I traveled, I wound up having more fun and conversations while I was on the road, and doing less time reading than I expected.
• 1:00:07
  Tad Eggleston: I know, I know.
• 1:00:09
  Ty-Fighter: Real life. Real life actually feels good.
• 1:00:12
  Phil: That old thing?
• 1:00:14
  Tad Eggleston: I know, I know… I… I don't… I don't quite live in my bedroom.
• 1:00:19
  Phil: Right, if I could entice you, I kind of realized while reading it that Dy Dark is a little bit of an inverse One Piece, because it's about one guy who, named,
• 1:00:32
  Phil: Zaha, Soko.
• 1:00:33
  Tad Eggleston: one.
• 1:00:34
  Tad Eggleston: Not quite. But…
• 1:00:36
  Phil: The thing is, is that, is that he, he's, like, just some weird dude. I don't really… I'm only 3 chapters in, so I don't quite know, what he does for a living here, but,
• 1:00:47
  Phil: They're… he's, like, known throughout the galaxy as, like, oh, he's this… he's this guy that if… if you…
• 1:00:53
  Phil: take his bones, you can get any wish. So he's like a walking treasure that everyone else is hunting.
• 1:00:59
  Phil: And instead, he just, he kills them and takes their bones. It's… it's weird. It's weird, darkly humorous hijinks. The… the chapter that I just finished reading, they, you know, they give two chapters of intro for this, this strange dude, and then they flash back to when he's an 8-year-old child, running around with an axe.
• 1:01:16
  Phil: who, again, is also presumably being hunted by people who want to take his bones. And the chapters of the book are referred to as bones. So it's weird.
• 1:01:23
  Tad Eggleston: he own… Only has 3 bones?
• 1:01:27
  Phil: Well, I only read…
• 1:01:28
  Tad Eggleston: Oh, I see. You're getting all cute in your notes.
• 1:01:33
  Phil: Well, because…
• 1:01:33
  Tad Eggleston: I think that we're autistic, and like…
• 1:01:35
  Phil: I don't.
• 1:01:36
  Phil: I just…
• 1:01:37
  Tad Eggleston: understand what that means. I didn't realize until right now that the title of the book wasn't Three Bones of Die Dark.
• 1:01:45
  Phil: No, not quite. It's okay, I am willing to confuse for my own amusement.
• 1:01:50
  Tad Eggleston: Okay.
• 1:01:50
  Phil: Let's see.
• 1:01:52
  Tad Eggleston: Let's see how it is.
• 1:01:53
  Phil: Yep.
• 1:01:54
  Phil: Yep.
• 1:01:54
  Tad Eggleston: There will be retribution.
• 1:01:56
  Phil: Absolutely, I count on it.
• 1:02:00
  Phil: Speaking of retribution, what are our great responsibilities?
• 1:02:04
  Tad Eggleston: responsibility.
• 1:02:05
  Phil: Yeah.
• 1:02:06
  Tad Eggleston: So I have…
• 1:02:08
  Ty-Fighter: little book called A Ronin.
• 1:02:11
  Tad Eggleston: Yeah, no, as I was telling.
• 1:02:12
  Phil: Not just anywhere.
• 1:02:13
  Tad Eggleston: off air, I've been… I've been reading an advanced reader of, frank Miller's upcoming autobiography, course, like…
• 1:02:24
  Phil: That might have even been on air.
• 1:02:26
  Phil: I don't quite remember.
• 1:02:27
  Tad Eggleston: I, I, I need to, to, to, like… it's called Push the Wall, My Life, Writing, Drawing, and…
• 1:02:35
  Tad Eggleston: The Art of Storytelling.
• 1:02:37
  Phil: Hmm.
• 1:02:38
  Tad Eggleston: And honestly, it reminds me… In tone and whatnot…
• 1:02:44
  Tad Eggleston: a lot. Have either of you read Bob Dylan's Chronicles?
• 1:02:49
  Phil: I have not.
• 1:02:50
  Ty-Fighter: Nope.
• 1:02:50
  Tad Eggleston: It's like… it's like every chapter is somewhat on a theme, but… but what comes out isn't necessarily… linear…
• 1:03:00
  Tad Eggleston: Or…
• 1:03:05
  Tad Eggleston: Yeah, that's the best The way it comes out isn't necessarily linear.
• 1:03:11
  Tad Eggleston: And it's a really enjoyable read, I like it, but when I read the chapter on Ronan, I'm like.
• 1:03:17
  Tad Eggleston: the first thing I realized is, like, for whatever reason, I had always assumed that Ronan was the book he got to make because Dark Knight Returns had been so successful, and it wasn't. Ronan was the book that he got to make because Daredevil was so successful that DC was willing to give him carte blanche.
• 1:03:36
  Tad Eggleston: to jump.
• 1:03:39
  Tad Eggleston: You know, I don't know if you guys read the introduction.
• 1:03:44
  Tad Eggleston: or if you had the versions that had introductions from Jeanette Kahn, but he told the meeting in his book, and she tells it in the introduction to Ronan, like, essentially, they had lunch one day, and like…
• 1:03:57
  Tad Eggleston: She's like, if you could do anything, what would it be? And he started describing Ronin, and he started to explain what a Ronin was. She's like, no, no, no, no, I know what a Ronin is, I've seen.
• 1:04:06
  Tad Eggleston: I've seen all of this stuff. So, you know, that's when he got excited. It's like, oh, wait, I'm talking to somebody who might really know what I'm talking about.
• 1:04:17
  Tad Eggleston: And, like, at the end of it, like, the hardest thing was that he had to keep copyright and that sort of thing, but, like, they managed to pull everything off for him, and…
• 1:04:30
  Tad Eggleston: He was given, essentially, carte blanche to go make… Make this book.
• 1:04:36
  Tad Eggleston: And thinking of it that way, I was able to also, like, compare it to the journey through…
• 1:04:50
  Tad Eggleston: Fourth World, Kirby's Fourth World, that we've recently taken in the book club.
• 1:04:56
  Phil: That's interesting.
• 1:04:57
  Tad Eggleston: Where I think… This book could be infinitely better with a good editor.
• 1:05:03
  Tad Eggleston: It doesn't need a lot of tw… you know, the bones are in… Incredible.
• 1:05:10
  Tad Eggleston: And some of the… some of the part is fleshed out too much, and some of the time…
• 1:05:15
  Tad Eggleston: It's not fleshed out enough, you know…
• 1:05:18
  Phil: Yeah.
• 1:05:19
  Tad Eggleston: It takes 2 or 3 issues to really understand what the story is, and just as you're understanding what the story is, you hit the twist, which means the twist isn't as impactful, because you hadn't fully groked.
• 1:05:37
  Tad Eggleston: What was going on before they go, oh, except that that's not what's really going.
• 1:05:43
  Phil: Oh, yeah.
• 1:05:44
  Tad Eggleston: But also, sitting there and reading it in 2026, where AI is on our… Tongues all the time.
• 1:05:55
  Tad Eggleston: And, and essentially seeing this, this cautionary tale 4…
• 1:06:02
  Tad Eggleston: And, and not like, Asimov, I mean, certainly, inspired…
• 1:06:09
  Tad Eggleston: somewhat by an Asimov iRobot or whatever, but…
• 1:06:15
  Tad Eggleston: But still a very different type of…
• 1:06:18
  Tad Eggleston: Cautionary tale of, of, like, yeah, you know, automating everything could be problematic.
• 1:06:27
  Phil: Right, yeah. I mean…
• 1:06:30
  Phil: I'd… I'd even be… so, the…
• 1:06:37
  Phil: The thing that strikes me most about this one of Frank Miller's works, are either of you guys familiar with, Orientalism?
• 1:06:45
  Phil: which was a book by Edward Said, in… published in 1978. Basically, it's, it's, it's important. It's, it's…
• 1:06:55
  Tad Eggleston: I feel like I know it, but I haven't read it.
• 1:06:58
  Phil: It's a term that gets thrown around a lot, but what it ultimately boils down to is, you know, the patterns in which Western authors and philosophers and artists have, depicted the Eastern world, throughout history. And so this…
• 1:07:16
  Phil: You know, it's often used with, negative connotations, and so…
• 1:07:24
  Phil: it's… it's something that I try to consider a lot in terms of, like.
• 1:07:31
  Phil: I am absolutely the kind of person, you know, a white person living in America who wants to write about, you know, the things that I've seen in
• 1:07:40
  Phil: from Japan, you know, anime and samurai and ninjas and stuff, but doing it in a way that's respectful and not, you know.
• 1:07:50
  Ty-Fighter: Hittering.
• 1:07:50
  Phil: Yeah, yeah, not, cultural appropriation, not…
• 1:07:54
  Ty-Fighter: Yeah.
• 1:07:54
  Phil: You know, depicting…
• 1:07:56
  Ty-Fighter: I'm the white guy who wants to write about ninjas. Yes. You know what I mean? Yes.
• 1:08:00
  Phil: I don't want to be a Kira Yoshida. And like… It, it's…
• 1:08:04
  Phil: it's the kind of thing that, I think there's elements of this in Ronin, but it's not…
• 1:08:11
  Phil: A typical, it's not a typical depiction, you know? It's leaning…
• 1:08:17
  Ty-Fighter: Obviously not with the time change of going from feudal Japan.
• 1:08:22
  Phil: Dude.
• 1:08:23
  Ty-Fighter: Right? This.
• 1:08:24
  Phil: This far future.
• 1:08:25
  Ty-Fighter: dystopian.
• 1:08:26
  Phil: Cyborg landscape.
• 1:08:27
  Ty-Fighter: type future.
• 1:08:29
  Phil: Yeah, yeah.
• 1:08:31
  Ty-Fighter: We switched locations. We're in, I think, New York City, right? Yeah. Versus… versus Japan. It's…
• 1:08:39
  Ty-Fighter: it is completely different, but so I get what you're saying, though, about Frank Miller. Yeah. In my opinion, maybe not being the most culturally appropriate person to be writing
• 1:08:50
  Ty-Fighter: stories.
• 1:08:52
  Phil: But, well, and I guess it's especially interesting when I… because I'm just trying to look up here real quick, when Akira was first,
• 1:09:01
  Phil: first brought to the U.S, you know, first translated here, because, like, It… it's… Because I also…
• 1:09:10
  Phil: Kind of temporally…
• 1:09:11
  Tad Eggleston: And I'm gonna quickly point out, because I had to go check it and look it up.
• 1:09:19
  Tad Eggleston: To make certain that it was what you were referencing. I don't think we should…
• 1:09:24
  Tad Eggleston: reference Akira Yoshida without making, like, Actual point that that's… Marvel editor-in-chief.
• 1:09:34
  Tad Eggleston: C.B. Sabolsky?
• 1:09:36
  Phil: Yeah.
• 1:09:37
  Tad Eggleston: Using a pseudonym to write.
• 1:09:42
  Tad Eggleston: Marvel.
• 1:09:44
  Tad Eggleston: Manga.
• 1:09:45
  Phil: Yeah.
• 1:09:49
  Phil: And it's… it's the kind of behavior that…
• 1:09:51
  Tad Eggleston: Which is… which is way more extreme.
• 1:09:54
  Phil: Oh, yeah.
• 1:09:54
  Tad Eggleston: done here, because I do… Absolutely. I do have kind of a response to that, and then I definitely want to talk about some of the art style, specifically with the artist here. I'm sorry, I didn't mean to…
• 1:10:04
  Phil: Oh, you're fine.
• 1:10:05
  Tad Eggleston: Too much.
• 1:10:06
  Phil: No, it's okay. I was just leaning towards… So I was just thinking about… so this book, I had also temporarily misplaced it as being after Dark Knight Returns, and maybe in the early 90s, but the fact that it came out in 83, 84, before Dark Knight Returns, is like, this is also a book that was heavily influenced by
• 1:10:23
  Phil: the history of Japan, as well as manga in general, that was kind of like a… if, you know, this book is unfortunately
• 1:10:33
  Phil: there's, like, an audience of American comics readers that this was their introduction to manga. You know, this was one of the first manga-like books that hit the market and people read and really took off.
• 1:10:46
  Phil: And… and that they absorb.
• 1:10:48
  Tad Eggleston: I think… I think Lone Wolf and Cub was being printed by first already.
• 1:10:53
  Phil: So, I actually read at least a note on Wikipedia is that,
• 1:10:58
  Phil: Miller was heavily influenced by Lone Wolf and Cub, but it hadn't been translated yet, so he was just reading the pictures. He wasn't able to read the text.
• 1:11:06
  Phil: So, yes, that's the thing, is that it was, you know, he was doing a lot of research on samurai and the ethics of Bushido, for Daredevil, you know, and that's where a lot of this was born into. So it's… it's one of those things that…
• 1:11:24
  Phil: the way I look at it, I think that…
• 1:11:26
  Phil: you know, aspects of Orientalism… of Orientalism are going to be unavoidable as someone who was born in the West that is now interested in and trying to understand this other culture. It's just that…
• 1:11:40
  Phil: you know, what I think separates a book like Ronin from…
• 1:11:48
  Phil: I mean, I'm trying to think of any… any clearly, like, from even…
• 1:11:53
  Phil: 10, 20 years before, I guess something like Green Hornet, even, that, you know, depicted Cato as, like, this silent martial arts badass. It's, it's different because it is directly referencing the culture, and not just trying to,
• 1:12:13
  Phil: take the elements and commercialize them. I don't think. I hope not.
• 1:12:18
  Tad Eggleston: Yeah, I mean, I guess my overall response…
• 1:12:22
  Tad Eggleston: Cause, cause I, I, I often have a pretty…
• 1:12:25
  Tad Eggleston: big radar for cultural appropriation, and it didn't really get set off by this, as Daredevil also doesn't set it off, but I could see it setting off
• 1:12:36
  Tad Eggleston: For some people, and I think there are two reasons why it never really sets off my appropriation
• 1:12:44
  Tad Eggleston: radar. The first is…
• 1:12:52
  Tad Eggleston: That there's a sense of reverence without, like, pedestal worship.
• 1:13:00
  Tad Eggleston: If that makes sense.
• 1:13:02
  Tad Eggleston: But, but the second is that…
• 1:13:08
  Tad Eggleston: They don't try to assert… Knowledge that they don't have.
• 1:13:16
  Phil: Right. That's… that's a… that's a huge piece.
• 1:13:19
  Tad Eggleston: Yeah, they're not making a.
• 1:13:21
  Ty-Fighter: Assumptions based on numbers.
• 1:13:22
  Tad Eggleston: Right. There, there is a… there is a limited amount of direct cultural ref…
• 1:13:29
  Tad Eggleston: Reference, and then the character is…
• 1:13:37
  Tad Eggleston: Put in an environment that… that…
• 1:13:40
  Tad Eggleston: It's either completely fictional, or… or one in which… the…
• 1:13:46
  Tad Eggleston: The author knows the environment better.
• 1:13:49
  Phil: Right, and I think.
• 1:13:50
  Tad Eggleston: So that sometimes means that the characters don't have the same level of depth that they might have if they were, but they also are not primary characters for that reason. I mean, this is called Ronin.
• 1:14:02
  Phil: Yeah.
• 1:14:02
  Tad Eggleston: But Casey is the main character in the book, which is something that I think I'd also really kind of forgotten, that this is way more a Casey McKenna story than it is a Ronan story.
• 1:14:18
  Phil: Which, along those lines, I don't think it's come out yet, but how do you feel about expanding this book into, you know, a series, where I think they did a prequel, and now a sequel is…
• 1:14:32
  Tad Eggleston: I mean, I… I read… at least a couple of issues of, of the, the Ronin 2.
• 1:14:41
  Tad Eggleston: And, like, I thought about, like, having it be the next thing we read, but A I'd have to dig up my copies, or it's not available digital anywhere.
• 1:14:49
  Phil: Yeah.
• 1:14:49
  Tad Eggleston: You know, so I'd either have to dig up my copies or buy a trade, and I didn't think that I wanted to do that right away.
• 1:15:00
  Tad Eggleston: I enjoyed the issues, but because I did them as issues mixed in between other stuff, because they didn't come out on a strict month-to-month schedule.
• 1:15:14
  Tad Eggleston: I don't have, like, any deep thoughts regarding…
• 1:15:18
  Phil: Yeah.
• 1:15:19
  Tad Eggleston: the second volume of Ronin that has been released so far. I don't have a problem with him doing more work in the universe. Again, it always comes down, like, because
• 1:15:34
  Tad Eggleston: I don't think it's appropriation just for somebody who is not… that… background.
• 1:15:48
  Tad Eggleston: to write.
• 1:15:50
  Phil: I agree. I agree, because otherwise, you would then, you know, basically force everyone into a corner of white supremacy. Oh, white people can only write about white people. That's not… that's not the future we want.
• 1:16:02
  Phil: And I think a good… But I think…
• 1:16:04
  Tad Eggleston: I think the how you do it matters a lot.
• 1:16:08
  Phil: It does.
• 1:16:08
  Tad Eggleston: And historically, whether it's this or 300.
• 1:16:15
  Tad Eggleston: I mean, because in some ways, there are even more arguments about 300, because historically, you know, historically, Miller doesn't do the other Greeks that were there, and it was their retreat that Athens…
• 1:16:32
  Tad Eggleston: Or that Sparta and some of the other ones were covering, that sort of thing.
• 1:16:36
  Phil: Right.
• 1:16:37
  Tad Eggleston: Justice, but… But he doesn't claim to be strictly a historical story.
• 1:16:43
  Tad Eggleston: And most of his depiction of the culture is pretty…
• 1:16:49
  Phil: So I think… I think the… I think the, the… the real Orientalist gem in… in… in Miller's work is Holy Terror.
• 1:16:58
  Phil: Like, that's… that's the…
• 1:16:59
  Tad Eggleston: That's… that's a whole…
• 1:17:01
  Phil: Yeah, that's crystallized, that's like…
• 1:17:03
  Tad Eggleston: I am mostly.
• 1:17:05
  Phil: Pretty much the worst example of that.
• 1:17:07
  Tad Eggleston: I am mostly willing… I mean, I would be willing to have a conversation of Xerxes.
• 1:17:14
  Tad Eggleston: Sure. The follow-up to 300, because… I haven't read that one, but yet. Certainly not one of his best works, and… and… and I think falls a little bit more towards Orientalism than… than…
• 1:17:28
  Tad Eggleston: than true… .
• 1:17:31
  Phil: than 300 dead, or even…
• 1:17:33
  Tad Eggleston: depiction, right? Yeah. Holy Terror, I view as…
• 1:17:42
  Tad Eggleston: A nervous breakdown that somebody was willing to print.
• 1:17:46
  Phil: That's probably a good… that's the most charitable interpretation of it that I can imagine.
• 1:17:50
  Ty-Fighter: That's a good one.
• 1:17:51
  Tad Eggleston: But more and more, like, since he's finally managed to recover from that nervous breakdown, he seems to be much more himself, and have slid back into the comics community, and the stuff that he's putting out doesn't resemble the Holy Terror-type stuff.
• 1:18:09
  Phil: Right.
• 1:18:09
  Tad Eggleston: Anymore, you know,
• 1:18:13
  Tad Eggleston: like, so I view that as, like, somebody who was traumatized because, like, this major thing happened, like, in his neighborhood.
• 1:18:24
  Phil: Yeah.
• 1:18:24
  Tad Eggleston: That's something that has to be, like, I think it's worth pointing out. This isn't the guy…
• 1:18:31
  Tad Eggleston: the rich guy from California that became…
• 1:18:34
  Phil: Right.
• 1:18:35
  Tad Eggleston: anti-Muslim after the towers came down. This is the guy that lived close enough, watched the towers come down.
• 1:18:44
  Phil: Right, and I mean, and that's… and while that's, you know, hardly an excuse, it's absolutely… Amazing.
• 1:18:51
  Tad Eggleston: Explanation.
• 1:18:52
  Phil: Of how it happened, yeah.
• 1:18:53
  Tad Eggleston: Right, right, and, like, as things go, if the worst thing you do is draw and publish a terrible story, but you don't
• 1:19:02
  Tad Eggleston: Hurt anybody, you don't…
• 1:19:05
  Phil: I mean, and this is where…
• 1:19:06
  Tad Eggleston: Yes, No, no, the story… I understand the ripple effects of the story.
• 1:19:13
  Tad Eggleston: But when you're not doing huge amounts of other stuff, and you have ripple effects from other stories that counter… I mean, like, I'm sorry. The Batman of the Dark Knight Returns, and certainly the Daredevil of his run, would kick the shit
• 1:19:31
  Tad Eggleston: out of the character in Holy Terror who had to have the bat ears.
• 1:19:36
  Phil: Well… Yeah. Sanded off.
• 1:19:37
  Tad Eggleston: Yeah. I mean, I've never even managed to get all the way through the book. Yeah.
• 1:19:44
  Tad Eggleston: In part because it doesn't feel like Frank Miller, it feels like…
• 1:19:51
  Tad Eggleston: Frank Miller in ridiculous anger and pain.
• 1:19:57
  Phil: I… I mean…
• 1:19:58
  Tad Eggleston: Yeah, he knew.
• 1:19:58
  Phil: Understood.
• 1:19:59
  Tad Eggleston: So, I mean, really where I'm going with this is, if his name wasn't Frank Miller.
• 1:20:05
  Phil: Yeah.
• 1:20:05
  Tad Eggleston: We never would have seen it.
• 1:20:07
  Phil: Right.
• 1:20:08
  Phil: Correct. I mean, well… Yeah, I'm trying to think.
• 1:20:12
  Tad Eggleston: I mean, there are a handful of other names that he could have where we would have.
• 1:20:16
  Phil: Sure.
• 1:20:16
  Tad Eggleston: But… but, like…
• 1:20:18
  Tad Eggleston: Given the years… I mean, in the year that it came out, even if his name has been Brian Bendis, we wouldn't have seen it.
• 1:20:25
  Phil: Yeah, that's a good point, and I mean, I think what I was gonna say.
• 1:20:29
  Tad Eggleston: And Bendis was big, some people would actually say Bendis was peaking, but he did not have the clout to have that sort of…
• 1:20:36
  Phil: No.
• 1:20:37
  Tad Eggleston: And again, remember, DC ditched it.
• 1:20:40
  Tad Eggleston: We do the art, legendary, who had no comic book publishing at the time, and has been in and out of comics ever since.
• 1:20:48
  Phil: Yeah.
• 1:20:50
  Phil: And I think…
• 1:20:51
  Tad Eggleston: And who had done the 300 movie.
• 1:20:53
  Phil: Yeah, I just…
• 1:20:55
  Tad Eggleston: That's the one that comes.
• 1:20:56
  Phil: I think that, ultimately, the hero in the meta-story of Holy Terror is the fans of Frank Millers and the audience that
• 1:21:05
  Phil: I think rejected it pretty heavily at the time, and saw it for what it was.
• 1:21:10
  Phil: that, you know… I mean, there are people out there who say, but it's a good book, and I… I mean, I don't really care what they have to say, but, like.
• 1:21:18
  Phil: I mean, I haven't… I haven't met anyone personally who… who holds it up as, like, oh, it's actually good. Like, no. I… I think…
• 1:21:25
  Tad Eggleston: I mean, I actually… It's a lot better than I thought it was the first time I read it.
• 1:21:29
  Phil: It's possible, yeah.
• 1:21:31
  Tad Eggleston: Most of what I've heard… Unlikely.
• 1:21:34
  Ty-Fighter: possible.
• 1:21:36
  Tad Eggleston: Most of what I've heard in terms of it selling
• 1:21:40
  Tad Eggleston: And we're talking Ronin, not Holy Terror, right?
• 1:21:42
  Phil: Right, right, right.
• 1:21:43
  Ty-Fighter: Yes, yes.
• 1:21:44
  Tad Eggleston: I just wanted to make certain, because…
• 1:21:45
  Ty-Fighter: Get back to topic here.
• 1:21:46
  Phil: Oh, okay, no, I was talking about Holy Care at the moment.
• 1:21:49
  Tad Eggleston: Oh, yeah, no, okay, yeah, yeah. I meant that one. Holy Terror is not a good book.
• 1:21:54
  Phil: Exactly, yeah, and that's what I'm saying, is I think people recognize that at the time.
• 1:21:59
  Tad Eggleston: No, I mean, like, like, I ref… like…
• 1:22:03
  Tad Eggleston: I would actively not sell it. We kept… we had one copy at the comic shop that I worked at for a long time, because I would talk…
• 1:22:10
  Phil: way in the back. Right, yeah.
• 1:22:12
  Tad Eggleston: Regularly move it away from.
• 1:22:15
  Phil: No. Yeah.
• 1:22:17
  Tad Eggleston: major…
• 1:22:18
  Phil: And I think… I see exactly what you mean of if it was anyone other than Frank Miller, someone who at the time could sneeze on a piece of paper and people would buy it.
• 1:22:26
  Phil: It would never have seen the light of day.
• 1:22:28
  Tad Eggleston: Well, and the fact that it was Frank Miller, and it still had to find a publisher.
• 1:22:32
  Phil: Yes. Yes.
• 1:22:35
  Tad Eggleston: is another huge sign that, like, even at the time, people were looking at it and going, Frank.
• 1:22:42
  Phil: Yeah.
• 1:22:43
  Tad Eggleston: Maybe…
• 1:22:46
  Phil: Maybe so…
• 1:22:47
  Tad Eggleston: I don't know if he deals with it in his book. I'm kind of curious as to whether there will be a chapter on that.
• 1:22:52
  Phil: Because, like…
• 1:22:53
  Tad Eggleston: Not, not… I'd be interesting.
• 1:22:54
  Phil: Everybody has the same.
• 1:22:55
  Tad Eggleston: None of what I've seen so far, again, indicates that… I mean, like, one of the things about this, one of the things about Martha Washington, which comes… which this also, you know, it clearly paves the way to Dark Knight Returns, but it also paves the way to Martha Washington in Sin City.
• 1:23:11
  Tad Eggleston: He was one, you know, way before you were seeing them.
• 1:23:16
  Tad Eggleston: you know… Casey is black.
• 1:23:20
  Phil: Yeah.
• 1:23:21
  Phil: Yeah, yeah, that's…
• 1:23:23
  Tad Eggleston: Washington is black.
• 1:23:25
  Phil: Right.
• 1:23:25
  Tad Eggleston: You know, way before other people were, he was putting…
• 1:23:31
  Tad Eggleston: serious, both color and gender representation into his books. That's the other thing. Casey is in no way, shape, or form like the damsel in distress.
• 1:23:41
  Phil: Right, she's a very.
• 1:23:44
  Tad Eggleston: winds up getting commented on when we discover that the Ronin is like a manifestation of…
• 1:23:52
  Tad Eggleston: This character that has, like, telekinetic powers, but, like.
• 1:23:58
  Tad Eggleston: Oh, he's obsessed with you, but he's not obsessed with you in a he-wants-to-save-you way. He's obsessed with you in a he-wants-to-be-your-equal way.
• 1:24:08
  Phil: Yeah.
• 1:24:10
  Phil: And the few images I've seen of a kid with telekinetic powers for Ronin 2 is kind of where I'm drawing the connection between that and Akira a little bit.
• 1:24:20
  Tad Eggleston: Right.
• 1:24:21
  Phil: Because that was one of the first big manga to be translated into…
• 1:24:24
  Tad Eggleston: Yeah. Into English. Yeah, which I still had to read all of. I now have all of the, the, the, the.
• 1:24:30
  Phil: They won't.
• 1:24:30
  Tad Eggleston: hardcover…
• 1:24:32
  Phil: I ate delicious.
• 1:24:33
  Tad Eggleston: Next editions that have come out.
• 1:24:35
  Phil: I kind of want to get the color.
• 1:24:36
  Tad Eggleston: came out. Nice. I don't know if all of them are color… I can't remember the color.
• 1:24:41
  Phil: heard that there's.
• 1:24:42
  Tad Eggleston: They're left.
• 1:24:43
  Phil: It's.
• 1:24:43
  Tad Eggleston: Right, and… and…
• 1:24:45
  Phil: Okay, good.
• 1:24:45
  Tad Eggleston: I know the pages that are color are.
• 1:24:47
  Phil: Oh, no.
• 1:24:48
  Tad Eggleston: Because there were pages that were color originally.
• 1:24:51
  Phil: Yeah.
• 1:24:51
  Tad Eggleston: Yeah, I'll have to figure that out.
• 1:24:54
  Tad Eggleston: Yeah. But,
• 1:24:58
  Tad Eggleston: But yeah, I do want to, before we start wrapping up, because we need to, I do want to pivot, though, and particularly to Art… er, to Tyler,
• 1:25:09
  Tad Eggleston: Talk to me about the art, because this really does bridge Between a…
• 1:25:18
  Tad Eggleston: He was starting to push boundaries, but he was still well within the boundaries of traditional… Superhero comic art.
• 1:25:28
  Tad Eggleston: In his time on Daredevil. And this brings in…
• 1:25:34
  Ty-Fighter: Okay, so…
• 1:25:35
  Tad Eggleston: manga influences, this brings in Band-Aidus Nay influences, this creates some things…
• 1:25:41
  Tad Eggleston: I can't even say specifically this is influenced here or there, like, it's… it's, like, created by Miller from his influences, like…
• 1:25:51
  Phil: Right.
• 1:25:52
  Tad Eggleston: And I honestly, overall, with this book, I think that's the biggest reason that it didn't have great initial sales, is as much as people loved Miller, people didn't know what they were looking at.
• 1:26:04
  Phil: Right, he was definitely more abstract than previously.
• 1:26:07
  Tad Eggleston: And as we talked about, the first couple of issues, it's that much harder to really wrap your head around, so I imagine that there was, like, a serious fall-off.
• 1:26:17
  Phil: And leadership…
• 1:26:18
  Tad Eggleston: between issues. Okay.
• 1:26:19
  Phil: Stick with it.
• 1:26:20
  Ty-Fighter: So, my opinion is that, you know, Miller was greatly influenced by Japanese manga, right? That's really prevalent, right? Lone Wolf and Cub, you can see that he adapted the, like, the similar pacing and the large panels.
• 1:26:36
  Ty-Fighter: But then also, right, incorporating this European-style sci-fi, with surreal, detailed.
• 1:26:44
  Ty-Fighter: stuff going on, right? Kind of, like, do you guys.
• 1:26:48
  Tad Eggleston: Well, the, I mean, it was just Farley doing the cover, but the, the, the, yeah, the… The French artist.
• 1:26:54
  Ty-Fighter: The French are…
• 1:26:54
  Tad Eggleston: much more of Mobius and…
• 1:26:56
  Phil: Thanks, for sure.
• 1:26:57
  Tad Eggleston: Thank you, yes. Band-Aid Snay.
• 1:26:59
  Ty-Fighter: Yes, the French artist is who I was going… Mobius, yeah.
• 1:27:03
  Ty-Fighter: John Garo, yeah.
• 1:27:04
  Phil: Yep.
• 1:27:04
  Ty-Fighter: Because it's so… it's so, you know, visible and chaotic and organic, and…
• 1:27:09
  Tad Eggleston: Hmm.
• 1:27:10
  Ty-Fighter: melting cyber structures, right? And it's just…
• 1:27:14
  Ty-Fighter: beautiful, but yet this, you know, conglomeration of, like, two different styles. And then I like that,
• 1:27:23
  Ty-Fighter: He used his own pencils instead of a traditional ink.
• 1:27:27
  Phil: Oh, okay.
• 1:27:28
  Ty-Fighter: in sort of a traditional comic book inker, right? So it looks a lot more raw and gritty and, like, more expressive, right? Like a Jeff Lemire drawing.
• 1:27:38
  Phil: Yeah.
• 1:27:38
  Ty-Fighter: Jeff Lemire is really fluid, right? Just all over the place, and not that Frank Miller is.
• 1:27:45
  Tad Eggleston: This is definitely way looser than Miller had been before this. I don't know if that's strictly because of the Klaus Jansen-Terry Austin inks, or if he was… I mean, he seems to indicate in his writing that he also allowed himself…
• 1:28:03
  Tad Eggleston: To become looser, that he was trying to… Yeah. To breathe.
• 1:28:10
  Ty-Fighter: Try different things.
• 1:28:11
  Tad Eggleston: Storytelling things, and…
• 1:28:12
  Ty-Fighter: This is before it got really bad. I mean, before all of his characters were squished, you know?
• 1:28:19
  Ty-Fighter: But anyway, the line work in this is huge, because it really relies heavily on those black shadows and jagged lines, and the imperfections were on purpose. It wasn't because he can't draw, it was because he's trying to give this psychological instability
• 1:28:35
  Ty-Fighter: Create this whole, like, vibe for the characters.
• 1:28:39
  Ty-Fighter: And then also, it works amazing with all of the action going on, right? The combat scenes are so…
• 1:28:47
  Ty-Fighter: Crazy, and frantic, and violent, and the speed lines, and the asymmetry panels, and all of it just…
• 1:28:55
  Ty-Fighter: Yeah. I think, I think…
• 1:28:57
  Phil: works really well.
• 1:28:58
  Ty-Fighter: Yeah, you know, and then the coloring, let's just get to the coloring, right? Lynn Burley is much different, right? It was revolutionary for 1983.
• 1:29:06
  Phil: Oh, yeah.
• 1:29:07
  Ty-Fighter: Because at the time, they were restricted to cheap, you know, like, Dot matrix-type printers, right?
• 1:29:16
  Ty-Fighter: And so, Varley was using all kinds of different watercolor tinting techniques and things like that.
• 1:29:23
  Ty-Fighter: that DC was… was doing, you know?
• 1:29:25
  Phil: Yeah, I'm wondering, because I think…
• 1:29:28
  Phil: I know originally, there were a limited number of colors that could be done. I forget how many it is, if it's, like, 28 or 36 or so? I think so.
• 1:29:40
  Ty-Fighter: war.
• 1:29:41
  Phil: 64, okay, okay. I think…
• 1:29:42
  Ty-Fighter: I think so.
• 1:29:43
  Phil: Yeah, but I'd wonder if…
• 1:29:46
  Phil: for the printing of this book, if this was the start of, you know, advancements in printing technology, to where they moved on from, like, the newsprint, dot, like you said, the dot matrix printing, to, being able to do gradients, even. Correct.
• 1:30:01
  Ty-Fighter: Yep, so he… he is very lush, moony watercolors, right, to separate the two separate worlds, right? And,
• 1:30:11
  Ty-Fighter: just different tones that he used in… in the earthy, natural tones, while the, you know, the future stuff was definitely a more yuckly, neon, kind of sick…
• 1:30:22
  Ty-Fighter: to me, it felt like it was poisoned, diseased a little bit, because, right? I don't know if that's the right word, but just the colors and the way… the way you're bathed in the neon light sometimes, you're like.
• 1:30:33
  Phil: It was smog, and definitely felt a little toxic.
• 1:30:36
  Ty-Fighter: It… the coloring definitely went a long way to the oppressive nature of the cyberpunk city.
• 1:30:44
  Ty-Fighter: You know?
• 1:30:45
  Ty-Fighter: But…
• 1:30:48
  Ty-Fighter: I love it, because this is definitely a precursor to what would become Sin City, or The Dark Knight Returns.
• 1:30:56
  Phil: Yeah, I mean, I think…
• 1:30:58
  Ty-Fighter: So this is… to me, this was great, because it shows, like, where he was, and then we already know where he's going.
• 1:31:05
  Ty-Fighter: Years later, you know.
• 1:31:08
  Phil: I definitely think that the coloring for Dark Knight Returns, feels like it takes these techniques and evolves them, you know, and really helps, like.
• 1:31:18
  Ty-Fighter: It's tough to get into, like, Dark Knight Returns, right? Because you have all of these talking head panels, right? And they're all line drawings with a background of watercolor. And so after a while, it does look kind of…
• 1:31:33
  Ty-Fighter: I don't know… too similar, but I know that's what they're going for with that 9-panel grid, just to…
• 1:31:40
  Phil: They do 16? Yeah, it's 4x4.
• 1:31:43
  Ty-Fighter: Okay, okay.
• 1:31:44
  Phil: It's the wall of sound, is how they refer to it.
• 1:31:47
  Ty-Fighter: Yeah, but it's constant throughout that book, you know, and it's just over… sometimes it's overwhelming.
• 1:31:52
  Phil: Oh yeah, it definitely is.
• 1:31:53
  Ty-Fighter: You know,
• 1:31:56
  Ty-Fighter: Just the amount… because I had a… I had a customer yesterday get me, or get… not me, get from me… from me, the compact edition of the Dark Knight Returns that I have in stock.
• 1:32:08
  Phil: That'd be too much for me.
• 1:32:09
  Ty-Fighter: those little compact things. And he says, do you like them this small? I said, no, not really.
• 1:32:14
  Tad Eggleston: I feel like some…
• 1:32:16
  Ty-Fighter: And I said, listen, it's great if you want to throw this in your backpack. Yeah. And you just want it. But I said, I cannot read all of those panels, when they're this small now, because we're reading this compact thing.
• 1:32:28
  Phil: Yeah.
• 1:32:28
  Ty-Fighter: So, this was just a conversation I had yesterday, so that was kind of funny.
• 1:32:34
  Phil: It might be good for people getting into comics, and people, especially people more familiar with the manga trim size, you know? But yeah, I can't imagine, because I think I've seen…
• 1:32:45
  Ty-Fighter: I'm selling a lot of those, like, Superman Red Sun, Gotham by… Gotham by Gaslight, The Dark Knight Returns, I mean, DC is doing a ton of classic stories in that format, and they're selling really well, because they're done on newsprint, so they're cheap.
• 1:33:03
  Phil: Oh, okay. Yeah, All Star Superman. I think I saw that, at least for All-Star Superman, they had to, like, increase the size of the bubbles, the speech balloons, in a few areas, just because… and I don't know if they do that for everything, because, yeah, it'd be hard to read if it was straight shrunk.
• 1:33:19
  Ty-Fighter: It does, and I pointed this out to the kid, I'm like, listen, if you want to read this story, it's dense. It's great, but…
• 1:33:26
  Ty-Fighter: you know, reading it in a compact form, I think, would be annoying.
• 1:33:30
  Phil: Yeah, no.
• 1:33:32
  Phil: Yeah.
• 1:33:32
  Ty-Fighter: I just can't do it, because I have to carry… because I don't like bifocals at all.
• 1:33:37
  Phil: So…
• 1:33:37
  Ty-Fighter: I'm wearing my regular glasses, and then I also carry around my reading glasses, so I'm constantly switching.
• 1:33:45
  Tad Eggleston: I've gone to progressive lenses at this point.
• 1:33:48
  Ty-Fighter: I couldn't do it. It gave me such a headache, Ted. I had a pair of fragat Sieves for a while, and I'm just like, ugh, gave me a headache. So now, when I realize, oh, I can't read that, then I just switch glasses.
• 1:34:00
  Phil: Huh.
• 1:34:01
  Tad Eggleston: Gotcha.
• 1:34:01
  Ty-Fighter: That's… that's all I do. And it's gotten to the point where I have to carry them with me in my backpack, so…
• 1:34:08
  Tad Eggleston: Alright.
• 1:34:09
  Tad Eggleston: Any parting words on Ronan?
• 1:34:11
  Ty-Fighter: It was awesome. I know we kind of… we kind of, like, picked on Frank a little bit, whether he did some cultural appropriation, but I think we came to the conclusion that he did not.
• 1:34:22
  Tad Eggleston: Or at least… Severely so.
• 1:34:25
  Phil: I think… I think… so here's the thing, is that the way I think of it is that…
• 1:34:29
  Phil: I mean, cultural appropriation, again, it's a term that has a lot of negative connotation, but I think it's the first step to cultural exchange.
• 1:34:38
  Ty-Fighter: understanding.
• 1:34:39
  Phil: Yeah, is that… and so the important thing, is that if, oh, okay, I've taken something from this other culture, it's important to give back or respect in some way as well. And I… at least for the time, for what he had,
• 1:34:53
  Phil: I do think that this was done with appreciation and, honor, you know, hopefully. Yeah, I agree. Not with Hayden.
• 1:35:01
  Tad Eggleston: I'm… I'm somebody who thinks that… that… Frank has two…
• 1:35:08
  Tad Eggleston: Two great masterpieces where he was the writer and artist.
• 1:35:15
  Tad Eggleston: And, and those are… Daredevil and Sin City.
• 1:35:20
  Phil: Oh, okay.
• 1:35:22
  Tad Eggleston: And I absolutely…
• 1:35:26
  Tad Eggleston: see, you know, and frankly, the two best works that he's ever done are Daredevil Born Again and Batman Year One, but Mazza Kelly was the artist on both of those.
• 1:35:38
  Phil: Yep, right.
• 1:35:38
  Tad Eggleston: Right?
• 1:35:43
  Tad Eggleston: But I think that this was a necessary step.
• 1:35:49
  Tad Eggleston: Oh, for sure. Between… The greatness that was Daredevil.
• 1:35:54
  Tad Eggleston: and the equally but very different greatness of Sin City.
• 1:36:01
  Tad Eggleston: You know, where he was… he was not only clearly reading.
• 1:36:07
  Tad Eggleston: comics that were way outside of the American norm, but then playing with both trying to recreate them, but trying to recreate them
• 1:36:19
  Tad Eggleston: With his own flourish, and… and… and, like…
• 1:36:25
  Tad Eggleston: pushing the boundaries of American comics with them, rather than, oh, I'm gonna go make a manga, or oh, I'm gonna go make a band-aid to Snee.
• 1:36:36
  Phil: Yeah.
• 1:36:38
  Tad Eggleston: You know. So this, this book…
• 1:36:42
  Tad Eggleston: like, when I read that it was experimental, it had me come back to it with a different…
• 1:36:50
  Phil: Right.
• 1:36:52
  Tad Eggleston: And it's like, oh, I can see how he's… He's working on things.
• 1:36:59
  Phil: Sometimes.
• 1:37:00
  Tad Eggleston: It works better than others.
• 1:37:02
  Tad Eggleston: And I almost wonder if, like, he got… you know, and he didn't hit on this hard, but I almost wonder if there's a level in which… I mean, because I don't know if you guys felt like it, I felt like the last three issues had way better overall storytelling than the first 3 issues.
• 1:37:17
  Phil: Oh, for sure.
• 1:37:18
  Ty-Fighter: I thought the pacing was better, yes.
• 1:37:20
  Tad Eggleston: pacing was better, I thought the dialogue was better, I thought… I thought that they were better at making certain that you knew the things that you needed to know.
• 1:37:30
  Phil: Correct.
• 1:37:30
  Ty-Fighter: It wasn't.
• 1:37:31
  Tad Eggleston: I'm sorry.
• 1:37:32
  Tad Eggleston: things that I could possibly glean from the art in the early issues that I just couldn't…
• 1:37:37
  Tad Eggleston: Or if I'd, like, immediately reread it, knowing everything, I could go, oh, this was supposed to tell me that.
• 1:37:44
  Tad Eggleston: Right.
• 1:37:45
  Tad Eggleston: But, like…
• 1:37:48
  Tad Eggleston: There's a certain level, for me anyway, and you guys correct me if you had a different experience, but for me, even… and again, this is my first read in 20 years, but it's probably my fourth or fifth read
• 1:38:00
  Tad Eggleston: Entirely, I mean, there were things that were totally unlocked from having Having seen him…
• 1:38:08
  Tad Eggleston: write about it. Like, like…
• 1:38:10
  Phil: Yeah.
• 1:38:10
  Tad Eggleston: So it's like the joke that has to be explained, right?
• 1:38:14
  Tad Eggleston: But even with that, those first 3 issues, I'm like, I know that this is supposed to be…
• 1:38:22
  Tad Eggleston: this stuff going on, but I'm not feeling it entirely. I don't start feeling the corporate…
• 1:38:33
  Tad Eggleston: Satire's not even quite the right word, the, the, the…
• 1:38:37
  Tad Eggleston: The social commentary on corporations as heavily in the, you know, in the first three issues as you do in the last three issues.
• 1:38:45
  Phil: Right, right.
• 1:38:46
  Tad Eggleston: Yo!
• 1:38:47
  Tad Eggleston: The… the… the dying world.
• 1:38:56
  Phil: Yeah.
• 1:38:57
  Tad Eggleston: Same way until later on, you know?
• 1:39:00
  Tad Eggleston: So I wonder if, like, he was…
• 1:39:06
  Tad Eggleston: Doing so much in terms of…
• 1:39:11
  Tad Eggleston: experimentation and playing with tools and playing with whatnot, that he almost lost track of the story early on, and as he became more comfortable in the style that he was creating.
• 1:39:26
  Tad Eggleston: I was able to also go, oh… This isn't clear, I gotta…
• 1:39:32
  Phil: The thing is, though, is that there…
• 1:39:33
  Tad Eggleston: Yes, sir.
• 1:39:34
  Phil: That, like, sort of… like… Slow-paced, very, like, space-oriented, kind of a lot of… a lot of…
• 1:39:46
  Phil: calmness and openness is, there's a Japanese storytelling principle that's, like, their five-act structure, or, I think it's called, like.
• 1:39:56
  Phil: Ja… like, Ja Hyukio? I'm… I'm butchering the pronunciation, but, the principle is it means, like, begin, rest, conclude. The idea that you open something slowly and take your time, but then you, conclude it rapidly and with precision. So, like, he's even…
• 1:40:16
  Phil: influenced by Japanese storytelling techniques of, you know, having that more freeform beginning that then takes a minute to come together and conclude
• 1:40:27
  Phil: very thrillingly and quickly at the end there, you know? So, yeah, I mean, I think for me, because I read this for the first time in college, I think it… I didn't get that it was, like, an experimental sort of work. I was expecting a straightforward action comic.
• 1:40:44
  Phil: In the way that I had expected, you know, like Dark Knight Returns, kind of, which even that's not a fully straightforward action comic, but but yeah, so I think it's a book that I definitely… I am getting more and more…
• 1:40:56
  Phil: intrigued by it, the more you talk about how… how he had talked about it, and the… the couple of points I read of, like, you know, kind of realizing that, oh yeah, this is the… the missing link between Daredevil and Batman, and, that, you know, I… I'd love to place it, read… when I finally do get around to reading Akira, I'd love to reread this again afterwards, and kind of… as well as Lone Wolf and Cub, and kind of, you know… so it's… I guess I would put it at…
• 1:41:19
  Phil: I didn't, I definitely, the first time I read it.
• 1:41:21
  Phil: didn't really enjoy it, and I.
• 1:41:24
  Tad Eggleston: Yeah, again, I haven't read it in 20 years.
• 1:41:27
  Phil: Yeah. I definitely want to get…
• 1:41:29
  Tad Eggleston: I didn't… I didn't think about it on nearly the level that I think of it now.
• 1:41:34
  Phil: It's a book I think I would continue to enjoy.
• 1:41:36
  Tad Eggleston: Here's actually something interesting. It was coming out somewhat… Contemporaneously with Akira.
• 1:41:43
  Phil: That is very interesting.
• 1:41:45
  Phil: Yeah.
• 1:41:47
  Tad Eggleston: So, I mean, Lone Wolf and Cub is definitely… the… the more…
• 1:41:53
  Tad Eggleston: I mean, it wouldn't be… it wouldn't surprise me if Miller, by that point, was getting contemporary.
• 1:42:02
  Tad Eggleston: Okay, not, not… this started in July of 83.
• 1:42:07
  Tad Eggleston: Akira started in December of 82.
• 1:42:10
  Phil: Right, and that's what I'm trying to check out when it was translated and published, but because, I mean, if he was.
• 1:42:16
  Tad Eggleston: Oh, yeah, no, tran… translation to the U.S. was, I think, significantly later than that, even though it was…
• 1:42:23
  Phil: Well, it was first published…
• 1:42:24
  Tad Eggleston: than most things.
• 1:42:26
  Phil: Right, published by Marvel, of all places, originally. Yeah. But but no, I would imagine that even if it wasn't translated, he was possibly influenced by it, because, I mean, it's the same thing with Lone Wolf and Cub, he was… he was.
• 1:42:38
  Tad Eggleston: Right.
• 1:42:38
  Phil: Reading the story of that, so, for sure.
• 1:42:43
  Tad Eggleston: Yeah, first ink… well, actually, it looks like, Kadansha… Matt… with… Marvel in 83.
• 1:42:53
  Phil: Oh, wow, so that's pretty early on.
• 1:42:54
  Tad Eggleston: quick.
• 1:42:55
  Phil: Yeah.
• 1:42:56
  Tad Eggleston: Well, met with them, I'm trying to find the publication date.
• 1:43:02
  Phil: Oh, here we go, okay.
• 1:43:03
  Phil: Yeah, it said MET in 83, okay.
• 1:43:12
  Phil: It was colored by Steve Olaf.
• 1:43:15
  Tad Eggleston: Right.
• 1:43:15
  Phil: So that was the thing is, I was also,
• 1:43:20
  Phil: Gosh, that's… okay. A Cure began being published in the American comic book format in the US in 1988 by Epic Comics, an imprint of Marvel. Okay. Colorized version ended its 38-issue run in 95. So, okay, so it was…
• 1:43:35
  Tad Eggleston: Alright.
• 1:43:36
  Phil: So that… so even if… if Miller was being influenced by the art of Akira, it didn't come out until…
• 1:43:42
  Tad Eggleston: was.
• 1:43:43
  Phil: A few years later.
• 1:43:44
  Tad Eggleston: Managing to get, you know, somebody.
• 1:43:46
  Phil: pretty quickly.
• 1:43:46
  Tad Eggleston: Sending him the… the…
• 1:43:48
  Phil: Does either…
• 1:43:49
  Tad Eggleston: It was your.
• 1:43:50
  Phil: Either mailing him.
• 1:43:51
  Tad Eggleston: Young Magazine.
• 1:43:51
  Phil: Volumes, yeah.
• 1:43:52
  Tad Eggleston: he was having volumes of Young Magazine either being mailed to him directly, or he knew where to get them in New York.
• 1:44:00
  Phil: Something like that, yeah, that's wild.
• 1:44:01
  Tad Eggleston: Right.
• 1:44:02
  Phil: That's fascinating to think about.
• 1:44:07
  Tad Eggleston: And I know, I know that he knows and loves Akira, because I know that I've heard it mentioned, I think he even mentioned it in the Ronin chapter, but the lone wolf and Cub is definitely the one that made him…
• 1:44:19
  Phil: the bigger.
• 1:44:20
  Tad Eggleston: Fall in love with manga.
• 1:44:22
  Phil: For sure, yeah.
• 1:44:23
  Tad Eggleston: And… and Mobius is… is what, you know, Mobius and Heavy Metal.
• 1:44:28
  Phil: Well, I think.
• 1:44:28
  Tad Eggleston: what made him start seriously looking at European?
• 1:44:32
  Phil: Nice.
• 1:44:32
  Tad Eggleston: bomb.
• 1:44:35
  Tad Eggleston: So… But yeah.
• 1:44:39
  Tad Eggleston: Like, when you think of this as, like, this artifact of…
• 1:44:44
  Ty-Fighter: Good word, artifact. If it's time.
• 1:44:47
  Tad Eggleston: Well, not just of its time, but of, of… of the American expansion.
• 1:44:56
  Tad Eggleston: into… Appreciation of international comics.
• 1:45:00
  Phil: Right, yeah, yeah.
• 1:45:01
  Tad Eggleston: Yeah, no.
• 1:45:05
  Tad Eggleston: I mean, yeah, I can totally see this not selling particularly well out of the gate, and it didn't… it didn't come anywhere near meeting their expectations for it. Anybody's expectations for it.
• 1:45:16
  Tad Eggleston: But, I can also see… a… a lot… of… I'm reading an original Comics Journal.
• 1:45:31
  Tad Eggleston: editorial on it from 1983. This is.
• 1:45:36
  Phil: Wow.
• 1:45:36
  Tad Eggleston: Thompson finished.
• 1:45:37
  Tad Eggleston: Ronin is a gorgeous package produced and controlled by a single creator. In that, it is a step in the right direction for American comics. Ronin will teach the mainstream companies that they can make a huge amount of money without stealing their creators' ideas, saddling them with unsympathetic and reactionary editors, and printing the material on toilet paper.
• 1:45:58
  Tad Eggleston: He deserves credit for using his clout to effect this kind of change, and he deserves credit for trying to do something different.
• 1:46:05
  Phil: Wow.
• 1:46:05
  Tad Eggleston: I just wish I thought it was any good.
• 1:46:08
  Phil: Oh, that's a classic, classic comics journal.
• 1:46:15
  Tad Eggleston: Alright. Three books I hope will be spectacular next week. Skate Ali, number one, from Sam Humphreys, Kelly Sudakonic, and Natasha Bustos. Forge, number 11, from Greg Rucka, Eric Trout, and Mike Henderson, and Daredevil, number 3, from Stephanie Phillips and Lee Garbit.
• 1:46:33
  Tad Eggleston: at… Odd.
• 1:46:37
  Ty-Fighter: Ted, are you loving this new Daredevil? I am just… I…
• 1:46:41
  Tad Eggleston: The first two issues I adore.
• 1:46:43
  Ty-Fighter: Yeah, it's so good. We haven't really talked about it, but it is really.
• 1:46:47
  Tad Eggleston: Yeah.
• 1:46:47
  Ty-Fighter: looking good.
• 1:46:48
  Tad Eggleston: Yeah. While I was at Odd Mart, I already got Ape.
• 1:46:52
  Tad Eggleston: Because they had it out, which means they probably got it direct from Floating World, rather than… so Ape is on my list of books that I know are great. Wow.
• 1:47:04
  Tad Eggleston: You know, those… and those people who've been waiting on, like, Space Counts and Good is Dead, we've got collections right now, and probably the collection I'm most looking forward to this… er, graphic novel I'm most looking forward to this week is Love and Desire in the Promised Land.
• 1:47:22
  Tad Eggleston: the private lives of Israelis and Palestinians. Wow. Rashidi, and Dalupi, out from Fana Graphics. So, Phil, what is your giant-sized trade waiter slash graphic novel pick?
• 1:47:37
  Phil: That is gonna be a little book called Orphan and the Five Beasts, Bath of Blood by James Stoko over at Dark Horse, the second volume in the Orphan and the Five Beasts, series. Great kung fu, mythic adventure. Yeah, still need to read this one, but, but yeah, I love Stoko's.
• 1:47:55
  Tad Eggleston: I haven't read the first one yet, but it sounds like you have, at least.
• 1:48:00
  Phil: At least Like, I think of, like, an issue. Yeah, I need to read them both.
• 1:48:04
  Tad Eggleston: I need to go read them both.
• 1:48:06
  Phil: Yeah, too many good books out there.
• 1:48:07
  Tad Eggleston: Get on that, dude.
• 1:48:08
  Phil: Right?
• 1:48:10
  Ty-Fighter: Let you know.
• 1:48:12
  Tad Eggleston: 180.
• 1:48:14
  Tad Eggleston: See, right?
• 1:48:15
  Tad Eggleston: is out?
• 1:48:16
  Ty-Fighter: I would. I have, my wife and daughter waiting to go… get going with the day, so I'm gonna get going. But, thanks for listening, you guys. As a… what episode is this, Ted? Do you know?
• 1:48:27
  Tad Eggleston: This is episode number… 239!
• 1:48:34
  Ty-Fighter: 239 episodes behind us, thanks for listening, and we will catch you guys after the next page.
• 1:48:40
  Tad Eggleston: 6, 7… 11.
• 1:48:42
  Ty-Fighter: 6, 7…