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Jehovah Rapha — The Lord Who Heals · Main Thing Podcast

• 0:02
  SPEAKER_00: Main Thing Podcast with Pastor Steve, equipping you to respond and thrive in the world we live in today.
• 0:08
  SPEAKER_00: Keep the main thing the main thing has been a saying that Pastor Steve has told for decades.
• 0:13
  SPEAKER_00: It means no matter what is happening around us, Jesus is what we need to have front and center in our lives.
• 0:18
  SPEAKER_00: There couldn't be a more powerful reminder for us to recall in today's divisive and dark culture.
• 0:24
  SPEAKER_00: From foundational truths and scripture to the hot topics of today's culture.
• 0:28
  SPEAKER_00: Allow this podcast to inspire and motivate you on your faith journey.
• 0:34
  SPEAKER_01: Alright, well, welcome back to the Main Thing Podcast.
• 0:36
  SPEAKER_01: Glad you guys are with us, and uh glad Pastor Steve's back with us.
• 0:40
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you.
• 0:41
  SPEAKER_01: Good to be here.
• 0:42
  SPEAKER_01: As always.
• 0:42
  SPEAKER_01: Uh so I know we've been talking about the names of God these last few episodes.
• 0:46
  SPEAKER_01: And so today we want to talk about Jehovah Rapha, the God who heals.
• 0:50
  SPEAKER_01: God who heals.
• 0:52
  SPEAKER_01: Before I start, I want to read some scripture here, and this is what we'll kind of go off today.
• 0:57
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, but this is Isaiah 53, verse 4 and 5.
• 1:00
  SPEAKER_01: It says, Yet he himself bore our sicknesses, and he carried our pains, but we in turn regarded him stricken, struck down by God and afflicted.
• 1:10
  SPEAKER_01: But he was pierced because of our rebellion, crushed because of our iniquities.
• 1:14
  SPEAKER_01: Punishment for our peace was on him, and we are healed by his wounds.
• 1:19
  SPEAKER_01: Uh Steve, you just start off.
• 1:21
  SPEAKER_01: Talk about um how how does God heal us?
• 1:24
  SPEAKER_01: What what what are the different ways uh I think God heals us?
• 1:27
  SPEAKER_02: Well, God has the ability to heal us first of all spiritually.
• 1:32
  SPEAKER_02: Um and and I think that's what Isaiah 53 is saying.
• 1:37
  SPEAKER_02: Um every time somebody commits their life to Christ and God comes into their life and the Holy Spirit enters into their world, uh it's a miracle.
• 1:49
  SPEAKER_02: They've been healed spiritually.
• 1:51
  SPEAKER_02: And uh so He He does that for us.
• 1:54
  SPEAKER_02: He also heals us physically.
• 1:57
  SPEAKER_02: I probably offend some people here, it's not my intention.
• 2:01
  SPEAKER_02: I do not believe in faith healers.
• 2:04
  SPEAKER_02: Uh I think most of them unfortunately have some issues, but I I do believe in the God who heals.
• 2:12
  SPEAKER_02: Uh I know people he has healed and know some of them very well.
• 2:18
  SPEAKER_02: And so he heals us physically also.
• 2:22
  SPEAKER_02: Of course, that's at his discretion.
• 2:25
  SPEAKER_02: Um his sovereignty, whether or not it's in his will to heal someone or not.
• 2:33
  SPEAKER_02: Uh that's that's above our pay grade.
• 2:36
  SPEAKER_02: We we don't always understand that.
• 2:38
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, but he certainly heals us physically as well.
• 2:43
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 2:44
  SPEAKER_01: So I I kind of want to take all three of those uh in this time we have, but I want to start with the big one, uh spiritually.
• 2:51
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 2:51
  SPEAKER_01: How does how does Jesus heal us spiritually?
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_01: What what is what does that kind of look like in your life?
• 2:58
  SPEAKER_02: Well, the contrast of the saved life and the unsaved life.
• 3:05
  SPEAKER_02: When one comes to Christ and they commit their life to Christ, uh the Holy Spirit of God comes into them, and so there's a radical transformation that takes place.
• 3:16
  SPEAKER_02: Um God changes the way we think, He changes our hearts, uh, He changes our dispositions, He changes our attitudes.
• 3:27
  SPEAKER_02: Um and so uh all of a sudden we are a spiritual creature, um, hopefully in love with the Savior, Jesus, who saved us and transforms our life.
• 3:43
  SPEAKER_02: We are a new creation.
• 3:46
  SPEAKER_02: We're not a renewed creation, we're a new creation, we're not an improved, better model, we're a new creation, and so the entire being of our soul, our mind, who we are, is transformed by Christ uh into something that looks more like him instead of looking like us.
• 4:10
  SPEAKER_01: You know, one of the big words that you hear a lot today is trauma.
• 4:14
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, you know, everybody's gone through trauma, and I'd be the first to say there is very legitimate things that people have gone through trauma-wise spiritually, and I think uh some things are probably not quite as legitimate.
• 4:26
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, but how does God work through legitimate trauma in our lives?
• 4:31
  SPEAKER_01: Things that are have deeply hurt us, you know?
• 4:34
  SPEAKER_02: Oh my goodness, yes.
• 4:36
  SPEAKER_02: Um I you know, Rick Warren had a saying that that I've used many times.
• 4:42
  SPEAKER_02: Um he said, you never know what's in a teabag until you're dropping in the hot water.
• 4:48
  SPEAKER_02: And boy, isn't that true.
• 4:50
  SPEAKER_02: I I mean, it we we can sit in church and smile, sing the songs, raise our hands, uh, and say we believe in God and we trust him and he's our everything.
• 5:00
  SPEAKER_02: But it's when you're in the hot water you find out what you believe.
• 5:04
  SPEAKER_02: That's when you're tested.
• 5:06
  SPEAKER_02: That's when you you find out if if you really are serious about your relationship with holy God.
• 5:15
  SPEAKER_02: And unfortunately, what I see quite often is this scenario of somebody uh they uh they say they're committed to God, they say they trust God, they they say they've that you know their whole life belongs to Him, and then a trauma happens.
• 5:33
  SPEAKER_02: Uh and boom, they're gone.
• 5:36
  SPEAKER_02: They no longer believe in God.
• 5:37
  SPEAKER_02: They no longer well, what trauma does is it will sift the believers and the non-believers.
• 5:47
  SPEAKER_02: Because I don't mean this mean in any way, but there are a lot of counterfeit believers, and they're there as long as it's good, they're there as long as church is what they want it to be, life is what they want it to be.
• 6:03
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, there's no sickness, they're wet, they're employed, they they got a home to live in, these kind of things.
• 6:10
  SPEAKER_02: But the real test comes when those things are challenged in your life.
• 6:15
  SPEAKER_02: You know, uh Jesus came and scripture tells us he didn't even have a place to lay his head.
• 6:23
  SPEAKER_02: And yet we believe that we deserve certain things.
• 6:28
  SPEAKER_02: And the truth is we don't deserve anything, we deserve death and hell.
• 6:33
  SPEAKER_02: That's what scripture teaches us.
• 6:36
  SPEAKER_02: But we have westernized the scripture.
• 6:40
  SPEAKER_02: And so um we trauma trauma is the sifting.
• 6:46
  SPEAKER_02: You know, Jesus uh told Peter he was sifting him.
• 6:51
  SPEAKER_02: So when you're sifted, when you go through the traumas of life, you come out one of two ways.
• 6:58
  SPEAKER_02: You're you're you're gonna be exposed and you're gonna walk away, or you're gonna come away stronger in your relationship than the Lord than you had ever been before.
• 7:09
  SPEAKER_01: You know, years ago, I preached a sermon on forgiveness.
• 7:12
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 7:13
  SPEAKER_01: And I remember as I got to the end of the sermon, we're getting ready for invitation.
• 7:17
  SPEAKER_01: I'm looking out and I remember seeing two separate people on separate sides of the worship center that I knew both who had experienced great hurt in their life where somebody had hurt them specifically.
• 7:30
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 7:30
  SPEAKER_01: And I remember thinking at the time, one, it scared me a little bit, you know.
• 7:34
  SPEAKER_01: I'm up here talking about forgiveness, and I I hope I didn't make it sound like, oh, it's no big deal.
• 7:38
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but I remember thinking, you know, if if it is real in their life, that's something that they would have done, or that's something God can convict them about because they have that the ability to forgive and move on.
• 7:50
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 7:51
  SPEAKER_01: You know, that that he they were spiritually healed that way.
• 7:53
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 7:54
  SPEAKER_02: Well, uh, this is something we need to learn in the church.
• 7:58
  SPEAKER_02: Uh we pray that God'll move every week in people's lives.
• 8:03
  SPEAKER_02: But, you know, Peter told us that if a husband and wife are at odds with one another, the prayers don't get past the ceiling.
• 8:11
  SPEAKER_02: And so you just got to wonder how many are sitting in church on the average Sunday and they're harboring unforgiveness or hurt they refuse to give to him or whatever else that they've not dealt with.
• 8:27
  SPEAKER_02: And here we are praying God's gonna work today.
• 8:30
  SPEAKER_02: And what they don't realize is not only are they hindering God's blessings in their own lives, I believe they're hindering the movement of the Holy Spirit in the congregation because we've come together cooperatively to worship holy God, but all throughout the sanctuary, you've got all these people with anger and resentment and unresolved issues they refuse to give to him.
• 8:56
  SPEAKER_02: Um, you just know that God moves in obedience, and being able to forgive is an obedience factor.
• 9:06
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, uh, but in that obedience, God will heal us spiritually.
• 9:13
  SPEAKER_01: We can have a totally different outline, huh?
• 9:16
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, we've become masters at deflection.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_02: This I said this a few weeks back.
• 9:20
  SPEAKER_02: You know, it's easy for me as a Christian to say, isn't that great that uh Erica Kirk forgave the man that killed Charlie Kirk?
• 9:31
  SPEAKER_02: Isn't that amazing?
• 9:33
  SPEAKER_02: But I can't forgive my sister who got mama's bedroom suit when she passed, right?
• 9:39
  SPEAKER_02: So it makes me sound spiritual to talk about what Erica Kirk could do because of her faith.
• 9:46
  SPEAKER_02: But wait a minute, what what am I able to do because of my faith?
• 9:51
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and it's it's funny.
• 9:52
  SPEAKER_01: So many people would say, oh, that that's really not fair to say somebody gets off scot-free, so to speak, for hurting me.
• 9:58
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 9:59
  SPEAKER_01: And um, what they don't realize is that that's the process of healing.
• 10:03
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 10:03
  SPEAKER_01: You know?
• 10:03
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 10:04
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I think one of the best definitions of forgiveness, or at least one of the ones I like best, is I give up my right to hurt you for hurting me.
• 10:11
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 10:11
  SPEAKER_01: You know, that's right.
• 10:12
  SPEAKER_01: It's in God's hands.
• 10:13
  SPEAKER_01: That's good.
• 10:13
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, that's right.
• 10:14
  SPEAKER_01: I wish I could remember who said that.
• 10:16
  SPEAKER_02: There's an old story about the Eskimos that they would um, because wolves would attack, you know, whenever they were out.
• 10:26
  SPEAKER_02: And so when they would bed down at night, uh, they would usually whatever they were cleaning, they had killed to eat, leave the blood on the knife and bury a couple of knives on the outskirts of their camps.
• 10:39
  SPEAKER_02: And the wolves would come to that knife and begin to lick that blood on that blade, not realizing that they were actually killing themselves uh by doing that.
• 10:52
  SPEAKER_02: And and that's what unforgiveness does to you.
• 10:55
  SPEAKER_02: It's it's um it's the death nail that you bring upon yourself and you don't even realize it.
• 11:02
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 11:02
  SPEAKER_01: You know, that that's amazing.
• 11:04
  SPEAKER_01: I remember you probably shared that story 18, 20 years ago, and I remember when you did that.
• 11:08
  SPEAKER_01: It was so such a powerful story there.
• 11:10
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 11:10
  SPEAKER_01: Well, look, if we can move, uh move, uh, switch gears just a little bit.
• 11:14
  SPEAKER_01: I want to talk about physical healing.
• 11:15
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 11:16
  SPEAKER_01: You know, um, there's a book, there's a guy named Philip Yancey, who's an author.
• 11:20
  SPEAKER_01: Uh can't recommend him enough.
• 11:22
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, but before he started writing uh Christian nonfiction, um, he he wrote for Reader's Digest.
• 11:29
  SPEAKER_01: And and probably very few people listen to this will remember this, but back in the 70s, uh, Reader's Digest had an article that was a regular occurrence called Drama in Real Life.
• 11:38
  SPEAKER_01: And he wrote those stories.
• 11:40
  SPEAKER_01: He would interview people with uh, you know, something terrible had happened and how they made it through or how, you know, they were saved and so on.
• 11:46
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, and because of that, he started to be very interested as a Christian why is there so much pain?
• 11:53
  SPEAKER_01: Why does God uh let some things happen and some things not?
• 11:57
  SPEAKER_01: And so uh he visited a guy named Brian Sternberg, a name that's been lost to history, but in the early 60s, Brian Sternberg was a pole vaulter uh for the United States, fixing ahead of the Olympics, ranked number one pole vaulter in the world, and had an accident during training and was paralyzed.
• 12:14
  SPEAKER_01: And he visited Brian Sternberg and his family, strong Christians who who prayed for 30 years that he would be healed, and he never was.
• 12:23
  SPEAKER_01: And so that was kind of the basis of this book he wrote called Where's God When It Hurts?
• 12:28
  SPEAKER_01: So I think this is one of the hardest questions people have about Christianity.
• 12:32
  SPEAKER_01: Why does God, you know, allow us to suffer physically?
• 12:35
  SPEAKER_01: Why doesn't he always heal?
• 12:36
  SPEAKER_02: You know, well, I I tell people you you gotta learn to ask the right questions.
• 12:42
  SPEAKER_02: You never ask why.
• 12:44
  SPEAKER_02: Why will drive you crazy?
• 12:46
  SPEAKER_02: Uh why has no answer.
• 12:48
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 12:49
  SPEAKER_02: But you ask what?
• 12:51
  SPEAKER_02: What is it in this season of life God is doing?
• 12:55
  SPEAKER_02: How?
• 12:56
  SPEAKER_02: How does He want me to respond to this?
• 13:00
  SPEAKER_02: And anybody who's been a Christian more than 20 minutes should understand that whatever season we're in in life, we're here to give God honor and glory, right?
• 13:11
  SPEAKER_02: Joni Erickson Tata is the best example I know.
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_02: Paralyzed as a teenager in a swimming accident.
• 13:20
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, she's in her 70s now, still very active for the Lord in her ministry.
• 13:26
  SPEAKER_02: And I heard her tell the story of she used to go to these healing crusades, and they would always take the wheelchairs and put them over on one side of the room out of the way.
• 13:39
  SPEAKER_02: And she would sit there and people would come up and be healed and be healed and be healed.
• 13:45
  SPEAKER_02: And she said, I found myself asking, hey, we we could use a healing in the wheelchair section over here, if you don't mind.
• 13:53
  SPEAKER_02: We're over here, you know.
• 13:56
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and that's why I say a lot of faith healers got some issues.
• 14:01
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but she said she had to come to the reality that God wanted to use her as a quadriplegic to minister to people in hurt and pain, to understand that God was still real even when you were not complete uh as you thought you should be.
• 14:22
  SPEAKER_02: Um, he still had a purpose for you.
• 14:25
  SPEAKER_02: And so I think the ability to survive trauma, uh, for example, is all in your understanding of your relationship with holy God.
• 14:38
  SPEAKER_02: You know, I mean, uh you take Charles Stanley, for example, preached for 60 years, and the last 10 years of his life he preached sitting on a stool.
• 14:50
  SPEAKER_02: I I know a lot of churches that would have said, there's no way we're gonna have a preacher sitting on a stool, you know.
• 14:59
  SPEAKER_02: But God used him probably more in those last 10 years than he did all the previous years.
• 15:04
  SPEAKER_02: Um, so I I think we have to just realize that we have all these expectations of what it means for God to love us.
• 15:16
  SPEAKER_02: And they're probably shallow on their best day.
• 15:20
  SPEAKER_02: You know.
• 15:21
  SPEAKER_02: Uh Job, my goodness, everybody knows that story.
• 15:27
  SPEAKER_02: Uh and Job gave God honor and glory regardless of how bad it got.
• 15:33
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, and and here's here's the wonderful truth in that.
• 15:37
  SPEAKER_02: God brought him through it and rewarded him for his faithfulness.
• 15:41
  SPEAKER_02: So, what do what does the Bible tell us?
• 15:44
  SPEAKER_02: Joni Erickson Tata in heaven won't be a paraplegic, quadruplegic.
• 15:50
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, she'll be made whole.
• 15:52
  SPEAKER_02: And so sometimes God heals us here on planet earth, but we gotta remember, and these people that focus on healing here, just here and now, they gotta remember you still gotta die to go to glory.
• 16:11
  SPEAKER_02: I met Lazarus anywhere lately.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_02: Uh God brought him back from the dead, but he still had to die again in order to transfer to heaven.
• 16:22
  SPEAKER_02: And so we it's our human nature was short-sighted, I think, in in God's uh plan for us, and we tend to think God can only use us in certain boxes, and that's just not true.
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 16:41
  SPEAKER_01: Well, and on the flip side though, what what are some healings you have seen God do?
• 16:47
  SPEAKER_01: Not necessarily physically, but spiritually or emotionally, you know?
• 16:51
  SPEAKER_02: Well, uh spiritually, I have seen uh everything you can imagine.
• 16:57
  SPEAKER_02: Um there's a man in our church right here, John Levins, and his own testimony, he'll tell you he was a vile, evil man, and he fought the idea of God half his life.
• 17:11
  SPEAKER_02: And one day God got a hold of him and he gave his life to Christ, committed himself to Christ.
• 17:20
  SPEAKER_02: And today people are offended by him because they think he's crazy, because he's so in love with Jesus, right?
• 17:27
  SPEAKER_02: I I've seen people with addictions uh healed, I've seen marriages healed, uh you you name it, I've seen it.
• 17:38
  SPEAKER_02: God certainly heals in all aspects of our lives.
• 17:42
  SPEAKER_02: It's not just physical healing, but I myself was healed physically as a child, and I kind of break all the mold for what the faith healers teach.
• 17:55
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 17:56
  SPEAKER_02: I'm a problem for them because in the first grade, I woke up one morning, I was paralyzed, had scoliosis, and my spine was twisted and it was pressing on the nerves, going to my legs.
• 18:09
  SPEAKER_02: I couldn't walk.
• 18:10
  SPEAKER_02: I got up and hit the floor.
• 18:11
  SPEAKER_02: And so I went through three years in a wheelchair going to rehab three days a week.
• 18:17
  SPEAKER_02: And um one day I just got up and walked.
• 18:22
  SPEAKER_02: And I remember Dr.
• 18:23
  SPEAKER_02: Kaiser was my doctor.
• 18:26
  SPEAKER_02: Um and he looked at my mother and said, he shouldn't be able to do that.
• 18:31
  SPEAKER_02: But I was not yet a Christian.
• 18:34
  SPEAKER_02: Uh my parents were not Christians.
• 18:37
  SPEAKER_02: If somebody was praying for me to be healed, I don't know who it was.
• 18:41
  SPEAKER_02: All I can tell you is I I believe in God's sovereignty.
• 18:45
  SPEAKER_02: That was part of his plan, right?
• 18:48
  SPEAKER_02: And so I got this funky body I've got today with these underdeveloped legs.
• 18:53
  SPEAKER_02: People make fun of my legs all the time.
• 18:55
  SPEAKER_02: Look at them skinny legs.
• 18:56
  SPEAKER_02: Well, and and I don't ever bother to tell them the story.
• 19:00
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but he told my mother, uh, don't let him do anything physical.
• 19:06
  SPEAKER_02: Because he, if he took the wrong lick in his spine, um, he would be paralyzed again for life.
• 19:13
  SPEAKER_02: Well, the only thing me and my poor old daddy ever agreed on was when I got home that day.
• 19:19
  SPEAKER_02: They were signing up for baseball across the street from my house, and I wanted to play.
• 19:24
  SPEAKER_02: And I remember him saying, You gotta let a boy be a boy.
• 19:28
  SPEAKER_02: And I took off out the door.
• 19:31
  SPEAKER_02: And I went on to play baseball and football all the way through high school.
• 19:34
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, did martial arts for about seven years, um, heavy into weightlifting as a young man, and um never, never had any issues for anything.
• 19:46
  SPEAKER_02: But there's no doubt in my mind, God healed me uh for a reason, for a purpose.
• 19:54
  SPEAKER_02: I believed he had a plan for my life.
• 19:58
  SPEAKER_02: And so Sometimes his plan is not to heal you, it's to use you in the pain because a lot of people are in pain and he uses you to minister to them.
• 20:12
  SPEAKER_02: And so, yeah, I can I can I can go on for days about healings that I've seen.
• 20:17
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
• 20:18
  SPEAKER_01: So is it a good thing to ask God for healing?
• 20:21
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 20:22
  SPEAKER_02: I would encourage anyone to ask for healing.
• 20:26
  SPEAKER_02: Um, the Lord tells us to come to him.
• 20:29
  SPEAKER_02: We're told to ask for healing.
• 20:31
  SPEAKER_02: Look, and I don't buy this garbage that if you don't get healed, you didn't believe enough.
• 20:37
  SPEAKER_02: I I told somebody not long ago, okay, God hadn't healed you, your cancer, and you've been told by some preacher that you just don't believe enough.
• 20:46
  SPEAKER_02: So here's what I believe.
• 20:49
  SPEAKER_02: If I got cancer and I'm terminal, then you're not gonna tell me that I don't believe enough because my last resource is holy God.
• 21:04
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm all in at that moment.
• 21:07
  SPEAKER_02: Anyone that thinks somebody dying of a disease is not all in in their prayers has never dealt with anything difficult.
• 21:17
  SPEAKER_02: That's very superficial.
• 21:19
  SPEAKER_02: And um, you and I both know of some people that I think it was a tragedy bought into that.
• 21:26
  SPEAKER_02: Uh certainly we have to believe to be healed.
• 21:29
  SPEAKER_02: Scripture tells us that.
• 21:31
  SPEAKER_02: But uh, we gotta know that God also heals permanently.
• 21:37
  SPEAKER_02: And we know that is death on planet earth.
• 21:41
  SPEAKER_02: And if we really believe what scripture teaches, we receive our just reward and our body that God has prepared for us in heaven.
• 21:54
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, but it's almost like in Christianity a lot of us fight the idea uh that that could be better than what we have here.
• 22:03
  SPEAKER_02: And um, and so that that's a bit troubling.
• 22:06
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 22:07
  SPEAKER_02: Uh funerals ought to be celebrations in the Christian church, but so many are not, you know.
• 22:15
  SPEAKER_01: You know, we've come to a place in our country, uh, in Canada, uh really all over the world now, where the idea that if you are not physically well, it's go ahead, it might be you need to go ahead and end your life on your own.
• 22:28
  SPEAKER_01: You know, we've come to that.
• 22:29
  SPEAKER_01: It's such a uh we've come to such a despairing place that if you are in pain, if you are terminal, let's go ahead and end now.
• 22:36
  SPEAKER_01: There's no reason to go on.
• 22:38
  SPEAKER_01: How does God heal in those situations?
• 22:40
  SPEAKER_01: You know, in other words, why do we why do we want to say we we let God decide when our life ends and we don't do that?
• 22:48
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 22:48
  SPEAKER_02: You know, I struggle with that myself.
• 22:51
  SPEAKER_02: You know, what what is ethical and loving?
• 22:55
  SPEAKER_02: There's a whole study of bioethics uh that deals with that, euthanasia, all these sort of things.
• 23:03
  SPEAKER_02: I remember one of my, well, it was my first class in seminary.
• 23:09
  SPEAKER_02: Professor had written a book called Agape Love, and his understanding of agape love was if grandma's nine, he's sitting in the chair all day, and she really doesn't do anything.
• 23:20
  SPEAKER_02: The loving thing to do is give her a shot and let her go.
• 23:23
  SPEAKER_02: Um I I disagree with that premise totally.
• 23:28
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 23:29
  SPEAKER_02: I think the greatest blessing an adult child can have is the opportunity to care for their parent uh in the later stages of life.
• 23:39
  SPEAKER_02: Uh it it's it's the cycle of life coming full circle, you know?
• 23:45
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and today we just want to shove them off at nursing homes or whatever and let me know when they die and we'll get a funeral together.
• 23:53
  SPEAKER_02: Uh we we don't value life anymore, and that's the problem.
• 23:59
  SPEAKER_02: My wife and I went to a foreign country last year on a trip, and one of the things I noticed was there were no nursing homes.
• 24:11
  SPEAKER_02: And you can hate the Muslims all you want, but they take care of their elderly.
• 24:17
  SPEAKER_02: Uh they're required by God to do so.
• 24:20
  SPEAKER_02: By the way, so are Christians.
• 24:22
  SPEAKER_02: Um, you know, uh, but we got a nursing home on every corner.
• 24:26
  SPEAKER_02: Uh they don't have any because they keep them at home and they they do what is dignified for their loved one, you know.
• 24:34
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm not being I don't want to be harsh.
• 24:37
  SPEAKER_02: I realize there are some situations that the the adult child is just not physically able to provide what the parent needs.
• 24:47
  SPEAKER_02: I I get that.
• 24:49
  SPEAKER_02: There are some situations it's warranted.
• 24:52
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 24:52
  SPEAKER_02: But we it's become too easy uh in Western culture to shove the elderly off to the side.
• 24:59
  SPEAKER_02: Uh and and we don't we don't value their lives uh as I think scripture teaches that we should.
• 25:06
  unknown: Yeah.
• 25:07
  SPEAKER_01: Well, you know, to to kind of wrap things up, if you had somebody sitting in front of you in your office, whether it was they're emotionally hurt, they're physically hurt, spiritually hurt, um, and they say, you know what, I just don't feel like God is healing me or will heal me.
• 25:21
  SPEAKER_01: What what what do you tell them?
• 25:23
  SPEAKER_01: You know, where do you go from there as far as this is how we trust God, that He is Jehovah Rapha?
• 25:30
  SPEAKER_02: Well, I usually go through those questions with them.
• 25:32
  SPEAKER_02: Stop asking why.
• 25:34
  SPEAKER_02: Because why is a selfish question.
• 25:37
  SPEAKER_02: See?
• 25:38
  SPEAKER_02: And it has no answer.
• 25:39
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 25:40
  SPEAKER_02: This side of heaven, it has no answer.
• 25:42
  SPEAKER_02: Uh and and I try to help them ask the pertinent questions.
• 25:46
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, what does God want to do with me through this season?
• 25:49
  SPEAKER_02: How does he want to use me?
• 25:52
  SPEAKER_02: Um, you know, what what can I do to give him honor and glory in this time?
• 25:58
  SPEAKER_02: Because that's why I'm here.
• 26:00
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, we say it from the pulpit all the time.
• 26:03
  SPEAKER_02: Your purpose for being here is to glorify holy God.
• 26:07
  SPEAKER_02: That's why you were created.
• 26:08
  SPEAKER_02: Well, that that's your purpose if you're well or if you're sick.
• 26:13
  SPEAKER_02: That's your purpose if you're rich or if you're poor.
• 26:17
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and so the purpose, the reason we're here doesn't change because of our circumstances.
• 26:24
  SPEAKER_02: And we see it all the time as ministers.
• 26:26
  SPEAKER_02: One person is terminally ill and and and they're going out with a smile on their face looking forward to seeing Jesus.
• 26:35
  SPEAKER_02: Another person's terminally ill and they're bitter and they're angry and they can't believe this is happening to them.
• 26:42
  SPEAKER_02: Um, yeah, you know, it's the ability to have that personal relationship with God.
• 26:50
  SPEAKER_02: And it goes back to your theology.
• 26:52
  SPEAKER_02: Do you believe what you say you believe?
• 26:55
  SPEAKER_02: Do you believe Jesus is who he said he was?
• 26:58
  SPEAKER_02: Is he really your savior?
• 27:00
  SPEAKER_02: Do you really believe he can care for you?
• 27:03
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, as scripture tells us he can.
• 27:06
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, the problem is you want to determine how he does that.
• 27:10
  unknown: Yeah.
• 27:11
  SPEAKER_02: And we don't get that privilege.
• 27:13
  SPEAKER_02: That's in his sovereignty how he chooses to do that.
• 27:17
  unknown: Yeah.
• 27:18
  SPEAKER_01: All right.
• 27:18
  SPEAKER_01: Well, that'll wrap things up for us today.
• 27:21
  SPEAKER_01: Steve, thanks so much as always.
• 27:22
  SPEAKER_01: My pleasure.
• 27:23
  SPEAKER_01: Appreciate it.
• 27:23
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 27:23
  SPEAKER_01: Thank y'all for joining us, and we'll uh we'll see you or listen to you next time on the main thing podcast.