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Cubs takeaways from the Winter Meetings · North Side Territory: A Chicago Cubs Podcast

• 0:05
  Speaker 1: Welcome into Northside Territory, Foul Territory Networks Cubs Podcast. I'm
• 0:08
  Speaker 1: Sahadev Sharma with my partner Patrick Mooney. We are your
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: Cubs beat writers over at the Athletic.
• 0:15
  Speaker 2: Patrick.
• 0:16
  Speaker 1: We are back home in windy cold Chicago. I've caught
• 0:22
  Speaker 1: up on sleep. I've caught up on my sleep. I
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: don't think cotton is a word. I don't know why
• 0:26
  Speaker 1: I said cotton. I've caught up on my sleep barely.
• 0:33
  Speaker 1: I could probably go, you know what, it could probably
• 0:35
  Speaker 1: go for a few more hours.
• 0:36
  Speaker 2: Actually, yeah, I don't know.
• 0:38
  Speaker 3: If you're on the way back there.
• 0:39
  Speaker 2: Man, It's always a long week.
• 0:43
  Speaker 1: Whenever the winter meetings hit, the Cubs weren't crazy busy.
• 0:48
  Speaker 1: There were some big moves that happened this week. Obviously.
• 0:53
  Speaker 1: I think the last of the big moves would probably
• 0:56
  Speaker 1: say was the Pee Alonzo signing that happened after we recorded.
• 1:00
  Speaker 1: I believe last the Orioles stepping up there. I guess
• 1:06
  Speaker 1: that's what happens. They're they're kind of, you know, you
• 1:09
  Speaker 1: fail to meet expectations. You got to start spending and
• 1:12
  Speaker 1: spending aggressively to get back in it. And it seems
• 1:15
  Speaker 1: like the Orioles are trying to be one of those
• 1:17
  Speaker 1: aggressive teams this winter, along with Toronto every winter. The
• 1:22
  Speaker 1: Dodgers are out there. The Mets are not the aggressive
• 1:27
  Speaker 1: team this winter. It appears, at least so far. We've
• 1:30
  Speaker 1: not seen them aggressively spend, and the Cubs aren't aggressively spending,
• 1:35
  Speaker 1: but they are. It's similar to what we said last episode.
• 1:40
  Speaker 1: They're talking to teams, they're talking i mean representatives, they're
• 1:44
  Speaker 1: talking about higher end free agents, and they've gotten smaller
• 1:48
  Speaker 1: deals done. The bullpen is slowly starting to come together
• 1:52
  Speaker 1: and people are gonna lose their minds about these small moves.
• 1:56
  Speaker 1: But they've made a couple with Coln Snyder, who's a
• 1:59
  Speaker 1: minor league deal, and then of course Hoby Milner, who
• 2:04
  Speaker 1: was linked to the Cubs last winter and is a
• 2:07
  Speaker 1: you know, Craig Council favorite.
• 2:09
  Speaker 3: I mean, it's haide of.
• 2:10
  Speaker 4: Imagine how tired you would be if you actually covered
• 2:14
  Speaker 4: a big market team that acts like a big market team,
• 2:17
  Speaker 4: or if the Cubs actually did anything of substance during
• 2:21
  Speaker 4: our time in Orlando. Obviously, there were some of these
• 2:24
  Speaker 4: smaller moves around the bullpen, and there's a lot of
• 2:28
  Speaker 4: time to go but yeah, it was not exactly a
• 2:33
  Speaker 4: show stopper down there in Orlando from.
• 2:37
  Speaker 3: The Cub's perspective.
• 2:39
  Speaker 4: Who knows, maybe something will pop here before Christmas, but.
• 2:46
  Speaker 2: I don't know.
• 2:47
  Speaker 4: We sort of looked at each other down there of
• 2:49
  Speaker 4: like reminiscing on the John Lester signing when you know,
• 2:53
  Speaker 4: Cubs officials were doing uh.
• 2:56
  Speaker 3: Was it tequila?
• 2:57
  Speaker 4: They're doing shots at the bar at least, so they're
• 3:00
  Speaker 4: doing shots in San Diego there to celebrate their signing
• 3:04
  Speaker 4: of John Lester, and it was, you know, I think
• 3:07
  Speaker 4: performative to an extent, like they definitely enjoyed walking down
• 3:10
  Speaker 4: to the lobby there and being like, yeah, we took
• 3:12
  Speaker 4: this guy away from.
• 3:14
  Speaker 3: The Red Sox.
• 3:15
  Speaker 4: You know, the Giants, the Dodgers were sort of you know,
• 3:18
  Speaker 4: at least there's a perception they were lurking. And now
• 3:21
  Speaker 4: it's a lot of you know, a lot of talking,
• 3:25
  Speaker 4: smaller moves for the bullpen, which I think these moves
• 3:27
  Speaker 4: for the bullpen absolutely makes sense. But there's a lot
• 3:31
  Speaker 4: of closers kind of flying off the board here of
• 3:33
  Speaker 4: like guys that they've been sort of interested or they
• 3:36
  Speaker 4: touched base on and there's still a couple more out there,
• 3:40
  Speaker 4: but you know, going being willing to go three years
• 3:46
  Speaker 4: for Devin Williams is not exactly like you know, unconventional move.
• 3:51
  Speaker 4: And clearly they were not strong enough in there to
• 3:56
  Speaker 4: make him take the cubs that seriously. I guess Pete
• 4:01
  Speaker 4: Fairbanks is still out there. Amliopagan went off the board
• 4:05
  Speaker 4: before the winter meetings. Ryan Helsley, you know they were
• 4:11
  Speaker 4: definitely in on he signed with the Orioles. So I
• 4:15
  Speaker 4: think you feel better about some of those bullpen moves
• 4:17
  Speaker 4: if you had more of a late ending anchor coming
• 4:21
  Speaker 4: in this winner.
• 4:23
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and they're not like you said they're I mean,
• 4:25
  Speaker 1: they're trying to get that guy in. They're aggressively so
• 4:30
  Speaker 1: doing what the market dictates.
• 4:31
  Speaker 2: Not yet, not yet.
• 4:33
  Speaker 1: And I don't know if I fully expect them to
• 4:36
  Speaker 1: at those you know, to meet those top tier prices.
• 4:39
  Speaker 1: I just that's not what they do for especially for relievers, littlone.
• 4:45
  Speaker 2: I mean to separate topic. Is it what they do
• 4:48
  Speaker 2: at all? I don't. I don't know if.
• 4:50
  Speaker 1: We have seen that behavior recently, but it's not what
• 4:53
  Speaker 1: they do with the relievers. There are names there that
• 4:56
  Speaker 1: could make sense. You mentioned Fairbanks, there are others who
• 5:02
  Speaker 1: we haven't heard fully connected that that could work, like
• 5:05
  Speaker 1: Luke Weaver would be like coming off of bad season,
• 5:08
  Speaker 1: we haven't heard his name. That doesn't mean they're not
• 5:11
  Speaker 1: like maybe that's it just hasn't come across for us yet.
• 5:15
  Speaker 1: Onlee Jansen, like the names like that, guys that have
• 5:17
  Speaker 1: closed or had high leverage moments, we haven't heard them yet,
• 5:22
  Speaker 1: but that maybe like that's that's where they pivot after
• 5:26
  Speaker 1: trying for a few others. We'll see where Pete Fairbrank
• 5:29
  Speaker 1: banks his money ends up. I'm curious to see just
• 5:33
  Speaker 1: just where that is because it does sound like he
• 5:35
  Speaker 1: has enough interest that I don't think the Cups are
• 5:37
  Speaker 1: going to get the type of deal that they'd hope
• 5:39
  Speaker 1: for on on him. But I thought it was telling
• 5:43
  Speaker 1: the way Craig Council spoke of the bullpen.
• 5:48
  Speaker 2: You know, they can't, they can't go into.
• 5:51
  Speaker 1: This this season without adding you know, a lot a
• 5:56
  Speaker 1: lot more. Whether that's just a bunch of bullpen fodder
• 6:00
  Speaker 1: and hope it pops.
• 6:01
  Speaker 2: I guess we'll see.
• 6:02
  Speaker 1: Colin Snyder had a really good twenty twenty four Patrick
• 6:05
  Speaker 1: like he this is a find for the Seattle Mariners.
• 6:09
  Speaker 1: A guy went to tread and got you know, figured
• 6:15
  Speaker 1: some things out on how to use his arsenal. Like
• 6:18
  Speaker 1: he was one of those guys when I was looking
• 6:20
  Speaker 1: at his numbers. This was coming into last year. When
• 6:25
  Speaker 1: I was looking at the season he had and his
• 6:27
  Speaker 1: numbers before that, I was like, how does that even happen?
• 6:29
  Speaker 2: Like this guy's.
• 6:30
  Speaker 1: Striking out thirteen percent of batters and jumps to like
• 6:32
  Speaker 1: twenty six or something like that.
• 6:34
  Speaker 2: That's crazy. That's a crazy jump. And it didn't really
• 6:36
  Speaker 2: make sense. But you know, he learned how to use
• 6:38
  Speaker 2: his arsenal.
• 6:39
  Speaker 1: Was a little dropped off in the strikeout range last
• 6:42
  Speaker 1: year and the results were a lot worse. We'll see
• 6:46
  Speaker 1: does he get back to who he was in twenty four?
• 6:49
  Speaker 1: Is it just you know, like there's gonna be many
• 6:51
  Speaker 1: more minor league signings. There have been a handful and
• 6:53
  Speaker 1: there'll be more. We may not talk about him at all.
• 6:57
  Speaker 1: Milner's the guy that I think, you know, I think
• 7:00
  Speaker 1: you can trust him to.
• 7:01
  Speaker 2: Get out lefties.
• 7:02
  Speaker 1: He's going to keep the ball on the ground, comes
• 7:04
  Speaker 1: from a funky angle. It's always nice to have a
• 7:07
  Speaker 1: different look out of the bullpen. They don't have any
• 7:10
  Speaker 1: lefties right now. They have to add some sort like,
• 7:13
  Speaker 1: I don't know if this will be the last lefty,
• 7:15
  Speaker 1: they add, I doubt it.
• 7:16
  Speaker 2: There's going to probably be another one.
• 7:18
  Speaker 1: But they had to do They had to do something,
• 7:22
  Speaker 1: and council trusts them that someone of the council knows,
• 7:25
  Speaker 1: trusts and believes it can get outs when needed. But
• 7:29
  Speaker 1: these are like six seventh inning guys, if that, you know,
• 7:33
  Speaker 1: like mostly like six, I would think like getting the
• 7:35
  Speaker 1: middle get through the middle innings. You know, I'm not
• 7:40
  Speaker 1: sure how often you'd want Milner against a righty.
• 7:43
  Speaker 2: But you did.
• 7:45
  Speaker 1: You know, you can make it work, and I think
• 7:48
  Speaker 1: a council knows how to use him properly.
• 7:52
  Speaker 4: I believe it is our buddy Marknzalaz. I want to
• 7:56
  Speaker 4: make sure I get this one right here.
• 8:00
  Speaker 3: Uh.
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  Speaker 4: You know, Gonzo had covered the Cubs for a long time,
• 8:04
  Speaker 4: covered the White Sox, World Series, Diamondbacks, Giants, and he
• 8:08
  Speaker 4: had been He has a great sense of humor and
• 8:13
  Speaker 4: perspective on us. I can't fight right now. I think
• 8:15
  Speaker 4: he tweeted, you know, Milwaukee wasn't built in a day
• 8:18
  Speaker 4: after they signed Hoby Milner. Uh just was kind of
• 8:24
  Speaker 4: the council factor here of you know, Colin ray as
• 8:27
  Speaker 4: well as a guy they brought back. Always liked that line.
• 8:34
  Speaker 3: But yeah, like that's what farn office do.
• 8:36
  Speaker 4: I you know, it wouldn't be shocked if one of
• 8:40
  Speaker 4: those guys do you know, step forward, whether it's Snyder
• 8:43
  Speaker 4: or someone else they pick up. I guess it wouldn't
• 8:47
  Speaker 4: be shocking either if they brought back one of Pomeranz,
• 8:54
  Speaker 4: theel Bar or Keller, Like I don't think, definitely, don't
• 8:58
  Speaker 4: think they'd go three for three. I think if Brad
• 9:01
  Speaker 4: Keller gets a third a three year deal, or a
• 9:04
  Speaker 4: team sees him as a potential starter and extends, like,
• 9:07
  Speaker 4: I don't think the Cubs are gonna match that, but
• 9:11
  Speaker 4: it wouldn't be crazy to think that. You know, one
• 9:13
  Speaker 4: of those guys said, I had a good, good experience,
• 9:15
  Speaker 4: I like pitching for counsel, like playing at Wrigley Field.
• 9:20
  Speaker 4: That's another way, but still, you know, the the you know,
• 9:25
  Speaker 4: fifteen million dollar closer. I don't think the Cubs are
• 9:29
  Speaker 4: going to go three years on that. But is there
• 9:30
  Speaker 4: a guy that maybe falls through the cracks who has
• 9:34
  Speaker 4: pretty good closing experience?
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  Speaker 3: I think I haven't heard Luke Weaver.
• 9:37
  Speaker 4: I think that's a good name, you know, Kenlee Jansen team,
• 9:43
  Speaker 4: the guy the CUB has been loosely connected to over
• 9:46
  Speaker 4: the years. I don't know if that's really the guy,
• 9:49
  Speaker 4: but I wasn't Counsel's reaction. You allude to this earlier
• 9:53
  Speaker 4: essentially like the bullpen, Yeah, we need one. Wasn't that
• 9:57
  Speaker 4: sort of It was something along those lines, just very
• 10:00
  Speaker 4: dead pan council. And then there was something about like
• 10:05
  Speaker 4: looking back on last year, he just flat out said
• 10:08
  Speaker 4: they were wrong about their bullpen. They got their bullpen
• 10:11
  Speaker 4: to a good place. But reading between the lines, I'm
• 10:15
  Speaker 4: assuming that's what like Ryan Presley thinking Porter Hodge could
• 10:21
  Speaker 4: be a leverage guy again, stuff like that.
• 10:25
  Speaker 2: Yeah, And I mean you have to keep that in mind.
• 10:27
  Speaker 1: You just don't you can feel confident about your bullpen
• 10:31
  Speaker 1: coming in or confident about who you know will be
• 10:34
  Speaker 1: the contributors. And Council knows this council, you know, he
• 10:38
  Speaker 1: he knows that the bullpen's morph over the course of
• 10:41
  Speaker 1: a season.
• 10:41
  Speaker 2: He kind of. I think it's almost preferred in.
• 10:46
  Speaker 1: A way, because you don't want to overuse certain guys
• 10:50
  Speaker 1: and then come September and October their gas because it's
• 10:53
  Speaker 1: the same three guys that you've been leaning on. You
• 10:56
  Speaker 1: almost need it to like kind of go come in
• 10:59
  Speaker 1: waves and go up and down certain guys.
• 11:02
  Speaker 2: Uh, it's really or or.
• 11:04
  Speaker 1: I guess you'd love to have six guys that just
• 11:06
  Speaker 1: are dominant all season long. But it's a it's a
• 11:09
  Speaker 1: it's a puzzle that they're constantly trying to figure out
• 11:14
  Speaker 1: offensively position player wise. I feel like we've come away
• 11:20
  Speaker 1: from the winter meetings. Uh, you know pitching was the priority.
• 11:26
  Speaker 1: It remains the priority.
• 11:28
  Speaker 2: Uh.
• 11:29
  Speaker 1: I do wonder that there's we've heard enough rumblings like
• 11:32
  Speaker 1: are they going to adjust this offense right now? It's
• 11:36
  Speaker 1: the Moyses, bias Teris and Owen Casey have runway.
• 11:39
  Speaker 2: Ah.
• 11:41
  Speaker 1: I find that, you know, to be interesting in one
• 11:44
  Speaker 1: sense because they're they're tantalizing players. Uh, and council seems
• 11:49
  Speaker 1: very comfortable with giving them a ton of runway.
• 11:52
  Speaker 4: Uh.
• 11:52
  Speaker 1: But also, you know you're in this win now mode.
• 11:57
  Speaker 1: You're trying to balance player development with winning now. It
• 12:00
  Speaker 1: seems like a risk, but I thought Biasteros gave you
• 12:03
  Speaker 1: a few weeks to say, like this is what this
• 12:05
  Speaker 1: guy can be. Casey now, we didn't see that. The
• 12:09
  Speaker 1: concussion really impacted that and kept us from maybe seeing
• 12:13
  Speaker 1: him get a runway there, But I'm curious to see
• 12:18
  Speaker 1: what those guys are. I also think if you're trying
• 12:21
  Speaker 1: to win ninety two plus again, it's just a risk.
• 12:26
  Speaker 1: It doesn't mean it won't happen, and that they won't
• 12:27
  Speaker 1: break out. I think you'd like a little more certainty
• 12:31
  Speaker 1: in some way. With Kyle Tucker on his way out.
• 12:36
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I think they realize they have to do something
• 12:40
  Speaker 4: with Biasteros and Casey.
• 12:41
  Speaker 3: They can't just like have.
• 12:44
  Speaker 4: Them sort of rotten Iowa for another year, like there's
• 12:47
  Speaker 4: not a whole lot left for them to prove. I
• 12:50
  Speaker 4: think having two of them helps. I believe they both
• 12:52
  Speaker 4: have options as well, that you can kind of play matchups,
• 12:57
  Speaker 4: maybe play the hot hand, you know, kind of reading
• 13:00
  Speaker 4: and react the way they did with matt Yaw. Like
• 13:03
  Speaker 4: maybe one of those guys would need a reset back
• 13:06
  Speaker 4: in Iowa at some point next year. But Counsel beliefs
• 13:11
  Speaker 4: in young players. He's shown that he's willing to give
• 13:14
  Speaker 4: them the runway and be patient, whether it was Petekow
• 13:20
  Speaker 4: Armstrong's year over year over year development, what we saw
• 13:24
  Speaker 4: out of Shaw after the All Star break, even he's
• 13:28
  Speaker 4: a little older, but Michael Bush really earned every day
• 13:34
  Speaker 4: first base opportunities.
• 13:36
  Speaker 3: It wasn't handed to him.
• 13:38
  Speaker 4: He showed what he can do and obviously did it,
• 13:42
  Speaker 4: you know, at a really high level in the playoffs,
• 13:45
  Speaker 4: which was certainly impressive, and so A don't know, we
• 13:50
  Speaker 4: keep hearing the Cubs in trade rumors and all sorts
• 13:54
  Speaker 4: of kind of vague scenarios. It was really hard to
• 13:59
  Speaker 4: pin down, as we talked about earlier this week.
• 14:01
  Speaker 2: I guess it's.
• 14:04
  Speaker 4: Not out of the question, you know, to think that
• 14:07
  Speaker 4: they would consider moving either by.
• 14:10
  Speaker 3: A Steros or Casey, you know, in a deal for pitching.
• 14:13
  Speaker 5: But they're also at this point now where they're they're
• 14:17
  Speaker 5: very firmly in the major league mix, and it's hard
• 14:20
  Speaker 5: to trade those guys, particularly when they're cost controlled, when
• 14:26
  Speaker 5: they can't hit free agency for a very long time.
• 14:30
  Speaker 4: And you know, they were clearly, uh, you know, willing
• 14:37
  Speaker 4: to move. I think our understanding his own Casey was
• 14:40
  Speaker 4: kind of the guy that Marlins were looking at last
• 14:42
  Speaker 4: offseason and the.
• 14:44
  Speaker 3: Lozardo deal was spiked.
• 14:47
  Speaker 4: You know, now he has a whole nother year, he's older,
• 14:50
  Speaker 4: he's gotten a taste of the majors. Like it's it's
• 14:53
  Speaker 4: harder to to kind of move that for another major
• 14:59
  Speaker 4: league piece. And so I think the other part of
• 15:00
  Speaker 4: it is you wrote it the other day of we've
• 15:03
  Speaker 4: been saying all along, we don't think Kyle Tucker is
• 15:06
  Speaker 4: going to come back, and Craig Counsel basically said that
• 15:09
  Speaker 4: we have our group minus Tucker, and.
• 15:14
  Speaker 3: You know, there's no way to know.
• 15:18
  Speaker 2: What's going to happen.
• 15:19
  Speaker 1: You kind of reset there. I just want to make
• 15:20
  Speaker 1: sure that the that the listeners didn't lose us.
• 15:23
  Speaker 2: But do you you you said, Craig Counsel kind of said,
• 15:25
  Speaker 2: and then and then what were you saying?
• 15:27
  Speaker 3: Patrick, basically saying Kyle Tucker is gone?
• 15:31
  Speaker 2: Yeah?
• 15:31
  Speaker 3: Right, It's not something.
• 15:33
  Speaker 4: That normally club officials are a little more cagey about that.
• 15:40
  Speaker 4: And I think Counsel was just being very plain spoken
• 15:44
  Speaker 4: of just saying out loud what everyone sort of understands here.
• 15:48
  Speaker 1: Yes, yeah, I mean we know we haven't you know,
• 15:53
  Speaker 1: the feeling that Tucker's felt that for a while, like
• 15:56
  Speaker 1: Tucker's not coming back. I think the other value of
• 16:00
  Speaker 1: these young guys and having them under control. I mean,
• 16:03
  Speaker 1: we know how much the front office values them. But
• 16:05
  Speaker 1: then there's the idea that you have Saya Suzuki Ian Hap,
• 16:12
  Speaker 1: Carson Kelly, and Nico Horner all coming up. That's four
• 16:17
  Speaker 1: starters on the position player side with one year remaining.
• 16:22
  Speaker 1: How do you there's two sides to this, right, do
• 16:25
  Speaker 1: you want to replace them all with young players? Or
• 16:29
  Speaker 1: do you need to add a veteran pat that's like
• 16:32
  Speaker 1: you're gonna have. I guess you could just say, like, hey,
• 16:35
  Speaker 1: Michael Bush, if he does this for a third year,
• 16:38
  Speaker 1: that's your anchor of the lineup. If Pete crow Armstrong
• 16:43
  Speaker 1: can show that he can be a little bit more consistent,
• 16:48
  Speaker 1: if Biasteros is what he was for September or close
• 16:52
  Speaker 1: to that, you know, if he was what he was
• 16:54
  Speaker 1: for September, he's the best DCH in baseball or one
• 16:57
  Speaker 1: of the best dhs in baseball.
• 17:00
  Speaker 2: So it's it's just a risk.
• 17:03
  Speaker 1: To not have anybody beyond twenty six and your position
• 17:07
  Speaker 1: player side that is firmly established veteran.
• 17:12
  Speaker 2: You know that can that can hit.
• 17:13
  Speaker 1: Like I'm not saying Dansby Swanson is an affirmily he's
• 17:15
  Speaker 1: obviously a firmly established veteran, but he's a league average bat,
• 17:18
  Speaker 1: he's a he's a great clubhouse guy, and he's an
• 17:20
  Speaker 1: elite defender. We know that, but we know what he
• 17:23
  Speaker 1: is as far as the offense, I'm saying an anchor
• 17:25
  Speaker 1: of your someone that can you can really trust to
• 17:29
  Speaker 1: hit and say has become that. I know we don't
• 17:32
  Speaker 1: need to dive into ian Hap, but he's a very
• 17:36
  Speaker 1: consistent offensive player. You know what you're going to get
• 17:38
  Speaker 1: from him. So how do you how do you kind
• 17:43
  Speaker 1: of maneuver that. I think we should address something that
• 17:45
  Speaker 1: we wrote Patrick, because I think people can take it
• 17:48
  Speaker 1: to extremes. I think most people actually took this the
• 17:52
  Speaker 1: right way, and I was glad to see that because
• 17:54
  Speaker 1: I think we were very careful with the way we
• 17:57
  Speaker 1: said it. We did hear Nico owners name this week.
• 18:03
  Speaker 1: It is not coming from the Cubs are like, this
• 18:05
  Speaker 1: guy's got one year left. We got to move on
• 18:07
  Speaker 1: and sell at a high value. He's incredibly valuable right now.
• 18:11
  Speaker 1: He had his best offensive season. I think everyone saw
• 18:13
  Speaker 1: how good he is defensively, and I think it probably
• 18:16
  Speaker 1: got around the league that this guy is like an
• 18:19
  Speaker 1: incredible leader as well. The way he goes about business
• 18:23
  Speaker 1: is its highly respected around in that Cubs clubhouse, and
• 18:28
  Speaker 1: I think people around the league are well aware of this,
• 18:30
  Speaker 1: Like he's a winner. He's a type of guy that
• 18:33
  Speaker 1: you you know, if he was on like a team
• 18:35
  Speaker 1: that's winning championships, like he'd be in I think he'd
• 18:39
  Speaker 1: be much more like lauded for that type of leadership.
• 18:46
  Speaker 1: But I think this is also a front office that
• 18:49
  Speaker 1: has to listen to those things. He's got one year left.
• 18:54
  Speaker 1: He's incredibly valuable. People are looking for second basement right now.
• 18:59
  Speaker 1: He can also play shortstop. I think you have to listen.
• 19:03
  Speaker 1: I would not trade Nico Horner. I think the clubhouse
• 19:09
  Speaker 1: would be like even if it's a there's another move
• 19:12
  Speaker 1: where you're adding a leader like Alex Bregman. He's imperative
• 19:17
  Speaker 1: to that clubhouse. I think we talk about this when
• 19:20
  Speaker 1: I talk to players about this stuff. You know that
• 19:23
  Speaker 1: they'll say, oh, yeah, that guy's great in the clubhouse,
• 19:25
  Speaker 1: so and so, Like I think they when they talk
• 19:28
  Speaker 1: about Nico they say, no, no, this is different. We
• 19:31
  Speaker 1: talk about sometimes like, oh, that guy's great, he's a
• 19:33
  Speaker 1: good dude, Like there is something different about Nico Horner
• 19:36
  Speaker 1: in that clubhouse. They value him a ton. I think
• 19:39
  Speaker 1: it would be very disruptive and and frustrate, to put
• 19:45
  Speaker 1: it lightly, some people in that clubhouse. I think it's
• 19:48
  Speaker 1: a very, very big long shot, but I also understand
• 19:51
  Speaker 1: why they listen.
• 19:52
  Speaker 2: It's just something that they kind of have to do.
• 19:56
  Speaker 4: Yeah, and I guess sort of explaining to our readers
• 19:59
  Speaker 4: and listen ners, like, we certainly don't write everything we hear.
• 20:05
  Speaker 4: There are lots of stuff that I sort of wind
• 20:07
  Speaker 4: up on the cutting room floor. In order for us
• 20:11
  Speaker 4: to write something like that, it has to clear a
• 20:14
  Speaker 4: pretty high bar in terms of like who we're hearing it, from,
• 20:18
  Speaker 4: where we're hearing it, how frequently we're hearing it, and
• 20:22
  Speaker 4: you know, Nico kind of past that the Nico rumors
• 20:28
  Speaker 4: did of just like how it was being presented. And
• 20:34
  Speaker 4: again we did our best to put it in the
• 20:36
  Speaker 4: context of know, they're not.
• 20:38
  Speaker 3: Looking to move him.
• 20:41
  Speaker 4: Yes, theoretically it could be possible that they could try
• 20:44
  Speaker 4: to extend him beyond his final year of club control.
• 20:50
  Speaker 3: They've already done one.
• 20:52
  Speaker 4: But at the same time, this front office is not
• 20:55
  Speaker 4: particularly sentimental at all. It makes sense to kind of
• 21:02
  Speaker 4: gauge value. There's several second basement kind of out there
• 21:06
  Speaker 4: in trade rumors or trade talks. However you want to
• 21:10
  Speaker 4: characterize that, and you know, maybe it's not Nico this winter.
• 21:17
  Speaker 3: But they've shown that they view this sort of.
• 21:26
  Speaker 4: Calculating heartlessness as an advantage and that one of the
• 21:30
  Speaker 4: you know, that is a way for a team to.
• 21:36
  Speaker 3: Essentially be like the Brewers, be like the Guardians.
• 21:40
  Speaker 4: Like that's it's just yet another example of how the
• 21:43
  Speaker 4: Cubs are being run that they don't view the answers
• 21:47
  Speaker 4: as running to the top of the market and doing
• 21:50
  Speaker 4: deals that get press conferences at the winter meetings. It
• 21:54
  Speaker 4: is sort of, you know, just trolling free agents, trolling
• 21:59
  Speaker 4: for free agents, doing some of those trades that are
• 22:07
  Speaker 4: unpopular in the moment. Not overvaluing intangibles.
• 22:14
  Speaker 3: And you.
• 22:17
  Speaker 4: Very correctly asked Craig Counsel about Nico's intangibles, and I
• 22:21
  Speaker 4: thought he had a good answer there.
• 22:23
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I reconize it.
• 22:24
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, I mean he he said, like he said,
• 22:28
  Speaker 1: kind of what you hear around the clubhouse. People talk
• 22:31
  Speaker 1: about these things and a lot of what Nico's what
• 22:35
  Speaker 1: stands out about Nico is the work he puts it.
• 22:38
  Speaker 2: I mean, this was something that we saw when.
• 22:40
  Speaker 1: He was a rookie, when he was first called up right,
• 22:42
  Speaker 1: it was I think some people thought he was almost
• 22:46
  Speaker 1: like a tryhard, like he was teacher's pet.
• 22:49
  Speaker 2: But it's just who he is. It's just him.
• 22:52
  Speaker 1: He puts in the work and he the attention to
• 22:56
  Speaker 1: detail is is. So it's just to another level with
• 23:00
  Speaker 1: him and and he the council put it, well, it's
• 23:05
  Speaker 1: like other people say, like, oh, yeah, I do that.
• 23:08
  Speaker 1: I do all my work. I get everything done. I
• 23:10
  Speaker 1: know you don't. You don't actually do it all Nico does.
• 23:15
  Speaker 1: Like that's Nico who does it. He's the one, and
• 23:17
  Speaker 1: like it. That's a rare quality. He's a you know,
• 23:23
  Speaker 1: after covering him, I felt like covering him for so long.
• 23:27
  Speaker 1: Now I do believe that this year there was something
• 23:31
  Speaker 1: different about it all. Maybe it's just because it was
• 23:33
  Speaker 1: the first time he was on a winning team, like
• 23:35
  Speaker 1: a playoff team, and it just felt like, oh, this
• 23:39
  Speaker 1: is what he can bring to a truly good team,
• 23:43
  Speaker 1: like intangible wise, this is the type of person he is.
• 23:48
  Speaker 1: It felt like something you can't just give away. I
• 23:50
  Speaker 1: think they understand that. I think they also like, like,
• 23:54
  Speaker 1: we've explained why that listen and I and I get it.
• 23:58
  Speaker 2: I don't like it.
• 23:59
  Speaker 1: I get it though, you know, sometimes I feel like
• 24:03
  Speaker 1: you just have to put the model and numbers out
• 24:06
  Speaker 1: the window for a moment and realize, like what you
• 24:09
  Speaker 1: have here.
• 24:10
  Speaker 2: This is a homegrown guy right.
• 24:13
  Speaker 1: Who wants to be here and enjoys It was thrilled
• 24:16
  Speaker 1: to be a part of a Cubs playoff team and
• 24:18
  Speaker 1: win some games in the postseason, and it really hurt him.
• 24:22
  Speaker 1: You could see that they didn't continue to advance. You
• 24:26
  Speaker 1: kind of want that kind of passion. That doesn't mean
• 24:31
  Speaker 1: that he's going anywhere I'd be I think would both
• 24:34
  Speaker 1: be shocked by anything really happening there. It's just something that,
• 24:37
  Speaker 1: like you said, felt important to mention because we heard
• 24:40
  Speaker 1: it enough what they do to actually make the team better.
• 24:46
  Speaker 1: You know, it's been baby steps since since the offseason started,
• 24:50
  Speaker 1: so we're still waiting for that big move if it
• 24:53
  Speaker 1: comes over the weekend. Hey, I do feel like there's
• 24:56
  Speaker 1: been big moves every weekend after the winter meetings. I
• 25:02
  Speaker 1: believe Dansby Swanson happened the saturday after the Winter meetings.
• 25:06
  Speaker 1: I think Kyle Tucker happened right after we got home
• 25:10
  Speaker 1: or that weekend after, so we'll see. It didn't feel
• 25:14
  Speaker 1: like they were on the verge of something. But it
• 25:18
  Speaker 1: also sometimes trade rumors are hard to to pick up
• 25:22
  Speaker 1: on and and maybe they're they're gonna knock out a
• 25:24
  Speaker 1: trade here, but that's it's yet to come, so I
• 25:29
  Speaker 1: understand if if Cubs fans are getting impatient, but there's
• 25:31
  Speaker 1: a lot of off season left. We'll cover it all.
• 25:33
  Speaker 1: We'll have more next week. Hopefully there's more to talk
• 25:36
  Speaker 1: about Cubs movement wise, otherwise we'll be back at it
• 25:40
  Speaker 1: either way. Thanks so much for listening everyone. This is
• 25:42
  Speaker 1: Northside Territory. Make sure to rate, review, subscribe, subscribe to
• 25:46
  Speaker 1: the YouTube channel, and subscribe to The Athletic where Patrick.
• 25:48
  Speaker 2: And I are on top of all things Cubs. Thanks
• 25:50
  Speaker 2: to everyone, Take anything I do.
• 26:15
  Speaker 1: By le