Latest / She Speaks to Scale / 2. Finding your Authentic Voice on Camera, with TV Reporter, Presenter Sangeeta Kandola
Transcript
- Sarah Collins: Hello, Sangeeta. Thank you so much for joining me today. Sangeeta Kandola: Thank you for having me. Sarah Collins: So I just wanted to put into a little bit of context. Sangita and I worked together at ITN. Sangita be a studio presenter and I would be the senior producer sitting in the gallery talking into your ear. And it always such a joy to work with you. It really was. I'm excited for this because... Thank you for listening to this episode of She Speaks to Scale. If you liked the episode or you think it will be useful for someone else, please follow and leave a review. If you've got any questions, do let me know via the social handles in the show notes. And remember to speak with intention, not hesitation, and let your voice be heard. My guest today is TV reporter, presenter and broadcast journalist Sangeeta Kandola. Sangeeta is a mum of three children from London who has been on our screens and radio airwaves for the last 20 years, mainly working for ITN and Channel 5 News. More recently, she went back to radio at News UK where she can be heard on talk radio, Virgin and Talk Sport. Let's get going. Hello and welcome to She Speaks to Scale with me, Sarah Collins. The podcast that empowers women in business to own their voice, be heard and create impact, one communication insight at a time. I'm a media trainer and communication coach and a former senior television producer. It's my mission to bring the communication skills we need to thrive in today's world of business to the generation of women who simply weren't taught them. You actually mentioned just a minute ago that you've never been on the other end. So this is a first for you. How are you feeling about it? Sangeeta Kandola: quite nervous actually because I've always been in your position where I'm asking the questions, you feel far more in control, know I can guide it and command it and this is I feel a bit vulnerable. ⁓ Sarah Collins: Today's guest has spent years reporting the news, but like so many of us, using her own voice didn't always come naturally. That's what we're talking about in this episode. But before we dive in, if nerves on camera are something you struggle with, then I've got a free five-minute camera confidence audio you might just be interested in. I'll pop the link in the show notes. What an interview. took such a lot away from this conversation with Sangita, but the main takeaways were how having authentic confidence on camera comes with practice and with being comfortable in your own skin. Becoming a trusted voice is more important now than ever in this digital era. And composure comes with training your brain to banish the inner chatter, deep breathing and visualizing a positive outcome. I'm so grateful that you've allowed me to be able to do this, first of all, I begin every podcast guest interview by asking, you've had a fantastic career in broadcasting today. ⁓ However, you called just a girl from Essex in the notes that sent over me. Can you share that moment when you realized that your voice truly mattered? Whether it's scaling your voice to step into thought leadership in a media interview, speaking with confidence on camera, on stage and beyond, or scaling the way you communicate when it really counts. This podcast will help you use your voice to be heard in the moments that matter. Sangeeta Kandola: I'm just this girl from Essex that's, done good. And I say that because at every stage when I was trying to become a broadcast journalist, I felt like most of the people I went to university with had connections. They had an inn, they had a foot in the door already. I remember working at Rise on Channel 4, I was the all-TQ girl, and our pick-up time was at 3.20 in the morning. I would live the furthest out and then you'd go in and all the runners were living like in Kensington or Richmond and I was like, wow, ⁓ really just someone that's just, went to a normal school just wanted to the and tell people stories. I don't think there was a particular moment where I thought, actually, no, maybe there was a moment when I first got London tonight because that's what I always wanted to do. I loved show. ⁓ I loved the format. It's a new show, but it's very magazine as well. And I wanted be part of it. And when I got the call to say, yes, we'd love you as a freelancer. I think that probably the moment I thought, ⁓ my God, I've done it. I've made Sarah Collins: This girl from Essex is living out her dream. I mean, what an amazing moment for you. spoken, haven't we, very briefly previously about just your journey as a TV reporter. Tell me little bit more about that specifically that journey around using your voice. Did you ever feel like you needed put on a different voice at all? Sangeeta Kandola: Yeah. Yeah, I definitely felt that. I think with my voice in particular my accent, like I say, I'm from Essex, it is even to date that people comment on most days. So, and I don't notice it because, you know, that's just my voice, but I definitely, had it in my mind, especially when I started doing ITV news. ⁓ Sarah Collins: and Sangeeta Kandola: or when I started doing Sky News and I was anchoring, I think there must have been this preconception in my own head that a newsreader has bobbed hair, they sit very still and they're very serious and speak the Queen's English. I definitely that. And I only realize now that I did that, I didn't realize it at the time, but I was putting on that kind of broadcast telephone accent, probably. for about four or five years. I ⁓ I upheld it. But only when I was reading the news, not when I was reporting. I was like a different person reporting. I was more me. But one of these TV news cap ⁓ organisations me a clip of myself ⁓ from 20 years ago I was doing the ITV Morning News and I didn't recognise the and it was me. Sarah Collins: Wow! Sangeeta Kandola: And it's because I was, it was the way I was reading and holding myself is not me at all. it was very, I was very posh. It was like, hello, I'm Singita Kandola and this is ITV Morning News. And I was like, ⁓ my goodness. So some point in my journey, and I think it was through the reporting that I realized, or I didn't realize it probably just happened that I was. more authentic being myself and I could do that by having the interactions with people, especially on the red carpet, especially human interest stories, that's what I just love doing. And you can't help if you're engaging with someone, you cannot help but being you. It's like being at the Big Brother house, initially they all go in, they're on their best behaviour, they will speak in a particular way, but actually you can't keep that up 24-7 and at some point you are going to revert to yourself and you're always better doing that. Sarah Collins: Mmm. Sangeeta Kandola: because actually reporting is better as a result of it. Sarah Collins: It's really interesting and having spoken to so many women the last 18 months, there's a recurring theme about not being able to feel like they can be authentic on camera. So it's interesting what you said there about the authenticity comes out more when you're actually having a conversation with other people. Now, in your career, you're permanently speaking to camera. What do you think is the key to being yourself? Sangeeta Kandola: it's very easy to you need to be authentic, you need to be yourself, but it is really difficult. ⁓ And, when you suddenly lights, action, ⁓ you do go into a different persona. only comes with time and experience. that's ⁓ being with yourself. And that does take time. like I say, that probably took me years, years and years and years to be kind of not offended when people said, ⁓ you're from Essex, you sound like you're from Essex. I actually to take offense to it. But I love coming from Essex, it's a brilliant place. had an amazing experience, a brilliant childhood here. ⁓ Sarah Collins: you Sangeeta Kandola: It is just a time thing. It takes time to feel comfortable in your own skin and that only really for me came with age. And I always carry, even to this day, this kind of imposter syndrome where I just think, ⁓ I'm going to get found out. They don't know I can't really do this. I'm just faking everything. But it's that whole fake it till you make it. And I think a lot of us do, not just in broadcasting, but across the board in many industries. Sarah Collins: Yeah. Sangeeta Kandola: A lot of us carry this kind of, you you think you're pretending, but actually somewhere along the line, are actually authentic and you are actually doing your job and you can actually do your job. But being comfortable on camera, for me anyway, in a TV studio, if I'm down the barrel of a camera, I do try now to imagine that I'm just talking to one of my friends, because that's how want to relay the story. ⁓ Be as as you can, as clear as you can. ⁓ Sarah Collins: Yes. Yes. Sangeeta Kandola: I very fast just in day-to-day life. So for me, ⁓ always an element in my head saying, right, slow down, don't speak too fast, people have to digest this ⁓ take it in. ⁓ I think in the studio, you are more prone to ⁓ being yourself just because there's more things to think about, there's people in the studio. For me, it was always about the reporting, that's where I ⁓ could comfortable because you can have that engagement and that's fine to do, it's actually really nice. Sarah Collins: Mm. Yep. Sangeeta Kandola: It translates really well on screen as well. Sarah Collins: I found really interesting there is your journey. was really resonating with that myself because ⁓ having been the camera for best part of kind of 20 years, if you had put me in front of a camera, ⁓ I literally so petrified. And similarly to what you're saying, actually, I just had to force myself to do it. I just thought, you know, I'm building a business here. I need to be the face of the brand. Sangeeta Kandola: Yeah. Sarah Collins: had to force myself to do it as much as it felt uncomfortable. And actually, it has been through that practice and that kind of just repetition of keeping doing it, even when it feels it does feel uncomfortable, where I felt more natural. it's funny, isn't it, how we're coming from two different places, but the journey is very similar. Sangeeta Kandola: Yeah. Yes. Sarah Collins: So I read an article that called you a trusted voice in UK broadcasting and I would completely agree with that. And that trust, especially in this digital era, is so important. What does being a trusted voice truly mean to you? Sangeeta Kandola: think it's really important now more than ever because you have got the introduction of AI, you've got citizen journalists, you've got all sorts of things appearing online on social media and a lot of it isn't true, a lot of it is fake. We're always questioning everything now whereas we didn't so much before because it wasn't so wide before. So I think to be in news, broadcasting, working for ITV, working for Channel 5, ⁓ I work for News UK as well. It is very important me as a person and as a journalist to be authentic in that respect, to make sure that, you know, I don't speculate. I'm reporting and presenting everything as fact and checking it and verifying stuff. With going on in the world now, ⁓ it's been more important. And it's to for broadcasters that share those same values. you want to be seen as somebody that is, trusted honest. And I do feel like we bring that to the table. Sarah Collins: And I think from a perspective of, perhaps a business owner listening to this, actually, ⁓ we've so reliant, haven't we, on platforms like ChatGBT, that those same apply, whether you're using that for, perhaps content it's always really important, isn't it, to double check your facts, make sure that what you're saying is true. So it's interesting, again, that there's those kind different Sangeeta Kandola: Yes. Sarah Collins: parallels isn't there? And all of that just really helps to kind of raise your credibility. Sangeeta Kandola: It really does. You don't want to be caught out where you think you may have said something that's incorrect. You've used one of these AI tools and it's not true. I was having a conversation with my children about this and in fact I did a story for Good Morning Britain a few weeks ago about university students, undergraduates, 95 % in the UK now use an AI tool of some sort for their assessed work. which I found quite shocking that in universities went down to some students and they say actually they, know, most universities now have to introduce AI for them because it's, that's part of the fabric of day-to-day life now, obviously only to a limit. And ⁓ have been very careful with my kids because actually if people become too reliant on it at a young age, it's not allowing you to develop your own skills, your own skills set to write properly. Sarah Collins: Yeah. Sangeeta Kandola: There's so many downfalls to it. So I said to my kids, of course you can use it to assist you with stuff, but if you want to learn to write properly, you need to do it yourself. If you want to find out about whatever historical event, go and find it out how I did, go to the library. It is really important. And I think I'm worried about this younger generation because they could become too reliant on it. And actually sometimes when I hear these things my kids say to me, I'm like, that's not true. What did you hear that or what did you see that? and it's normally from a friend who's saw it on an AI tool or something or the other. it's worrying. And we've to do it the old fashioned way. Sarah Collins: Hmm. Well, you said something about your voice, you have no power. And that in some of the notes that you sent across to me. But actually, I feel like it's a similar thing, isn't it? Because you've got almost this ⁓ AI that could become the voice for you. ⁓ it's taking away, isn't it, from having your own opinion? Sangeeta Kandola: Yeah, and your friend. That's true. That is true. Because you can ask it to give you an opinion and that suddenly becomes your opinion. mean we tell our children at a young age, as soon as they start talking it's like, use your voice. Or if something happens in school it's like, did you use your voice? Did you speak to your teacher? Did you raise this? ⁓ voices are so powerful. It's ⁓ of our most distinctive tools. And have to be able to use it properly. My husband always says, don't ask, don't get. You're using your voice to do that. Sarah Collins: you Yeah. And what I find interesting is, so I'm a mum to two kind of linear teenage girls, and they're very much using their voice at school. They're being taught tools that I don't feel like I was taught and that I just from my own experience in talking to other women, we're kind of a generation that weren't taught those skills. things like podcasts didn't exist. Networking for women didn't exist. Social media didn't exist. Sangeeta Kandola: But. No. Yeah. Sarah Collins: So actually, it's great that our children are coming through and using their voices, but I feel like, and this is the gap for this podcast really, because I feel like we're a generation of women where we weren't taught to use our voice. you think about ⁓ on screen, again, I saw something where you were described as a natural on-screen presence, ⁓ I thought was absolutely brilliant. Sangeeta Kandola: it was finally put together by an AI tool. Sarah Collins: I think it's true anyway, and I'm sure a lot of people would agree with me. But do you feel like that is something you're born with? I mean, is that something you could be taught? What are your thoughts? ⁓ Sangeeta Kandola: Ha Like I said, for me, and everybody's journey is different, but because I have this imposter syndrome, ⁓ then all that means is lack of confidence. It's taken me a long time. mean, I've been in broadcasting for 20 years, ⁓ and it's probably only now, probably I passed my ⁓ 40s, was I suddenly like, do know what? I don't care. I am just me. what you see is what you get. And I can't be anything other than me. What's impressive about the younger generations is, and what is impressive about how it's expanded and all, the social media and people posting videos and Instagram and all of this stuff, is that people are probably more authentic at a younger age now than it's taken my generation to be. Because I think a lot of my peers are very similar to me. We have these conversations all the time. And that's one amazing part about Sarah Collins: Yeah. Sangeeta Kandola: I see my kids and my kids are 13, 11 and 8 and they are super confident and sometimes I'm in awe of that myself and actually sometimes I go to them for advice about how should I do this and what should I put on it. Even I'm posting online they're like don't do that, you can do that and that's actually also given me a boost because they got to an age where they can say right mum. Sarah Collins: Yeah. Yeah Sangeeta Kandola: we see it like this, somebody else will view it like this, this is what you need to do. And actually that feeds into my confidence well. But for me on my own personal journey, it's me years, that's probably being a woman and having to that shift because it's definitely a world when I first entered that was male dominated and ⁓ also being a woman of ethnicity, of ethnic Indian and you didn't definitely when I started now it's really changed which is amazing when I first came into actually a lot of the broadcasters I was working for I was one of maybe one or two Asian and it in ways was like that was a positive in other ways it was a negative and I've had I've been in the industry 20 years and watched it changed and it has changed for the better but it's still got a long way to go. Sarah Collins: Yeah. Yeah, I would completely agree with that as well, actually. mentioned there about imposter syndrome, which wanted to touch on because I think this is something so many women of our generation suffer from. ⁓ most have got syndrome, haven't they? ⁓ Do ⁓ you feel that imposter syndrome? Sangeeta Kandola: 100%. Yeah. Yes. Sarah Collins: Because from what you're saying, it doesn't feel like it did, but do you think that Pimposter Syndrome held you back from using your voice in any way? Sangeeta Kandola: 100%. Yes. when I look back at it now, just think, God, ⁓ I wish had more confidence. I got my foot in the door, I got into ⁓ ITV, I working for Sky News, but I was still thinking, ⁓ I'm gonna get found out, I'm gonna get found out. And I turned so many opportunities. There were things that people were offering me, but because I didn't believe in I thought, ⁓ no, no, no. I won't go and do that live and I'd make an excuse and I've done that many, many times. know, nobody would know about it, apart from my husband. I'd come back and go, ⁓ he sent this and he'd be like, you can do it. And I'm like, I can't, I can't do it. And so I would actually not take particular jobs because I thought I'm going to do a bad job. You think I'm going to do a great job. Let's just leave it there. Let's just leave you on a positive note with me and I'll make an excuse as why I can't do it. You know, at the beginning of this, we said, this is my first podcast. My first really, and it's because I've always avoided doing things like this. And ⁓ that feeds me being scared to be authentic, being scared to be me, being scared to put it on the line, being scared to just talk. But like I say, once I turned 40, things have changed. Because I ⁓ just suddenly got this of like, yeah, I don't care, this is it. This is what you're getting. ⁓ And I've said yes to many, many more things. For me, I really think if anyone's thinking about doing anything in any industry, it doesn't have to be broadcasting. Even you think you're going to fail, even if you do fail, that's part of the success that will help you become better the next time you have to fall to get up again. ⁓ So wish said yes to more things than I didn't. And that's why I've got two girls and I'm very pushy about, they're saying, just do it, just go and do it. Why not? And they've naturally got it. They've naturally got things that I didn't have at their age. That's why I'm so amazed by that younger generation because they really do, they are born with this confidence. Sarah Collins: It's amazing, isn't it? Because things that they're learning now and the way they're acting now, I feel like we didn't act until our kind of late ⁓ early ⁓ We've ⁓ of missed out, haven't we, of 20 years of, feeling that imposter syndrome, of not using our voice in a way because we're too scared it's wonderful that they do feel like that at such a young age. But also I kind of feel sad for our generation that, Sangeeta Kandola: No. Died. Sarah Collins: going be the lessons now. ⁓ Sangeeta Kandola: But I think things have changed at school as well because the world has changed. most I did at school, you might have got a part in one of your plays or you might have read out loud ⁓ in your class because were chosen to read a chapter. ⁓ That's the most you But because jobs have changed, because there's more presentations, ⁓ there's hardly any ⁓ now where you're at some point asked to present to a boardroom or present to, ⁓ whatever industry conference they've That's become part of it now. with COVID, because people were online more, actually they were presenting more. And I think that has fed back to the education system where children are expected to now perform. And that actually speaking will help them later on in life. They are life skills that they need. Sarah Collins: Yeah, I completely agree. So let's switch it a little bit more now and talk about, you as a TV reporter. ⁓ When you conduct interview with a guest, what kind of great qualities are you looking for? Sangeeta Kandola: In the guest, just to be engaged, to listen what you're saying. But that part of that comes from what you're asking. So that will be me in the background, having either been briefed by a producer, then my own research, finding out little quirky bits that they may not get asked. ⁓ And what I'm looking for in someone is to just keep the conversation going, keep it natural. Sarah Collins: Yes. Sangeeta Kandola: and be engaged in what you're talking about. That's really kind of the greatest thing, because once you've got that connection, you'll always have a good interview. And if it's their subject, they're the expert. Sarah Collins: Absolutely. One of the big bug bearers that I talk about, which I saw time and time again, was people reading from scripts. Sangeeta Kandola: ⁓ Sarah Collins: ⁓ I you've come across that several times, haven't you, in your career? Sangeeta Kandola: Yes, I have. And actually, do feel for these people because it's not easy to be interviewed. Even if it's your, subject and your, ⁓ knowledge depth is this, ⁓ it's really difficult to, look in the eye, keep that eye contact, make sure you're dressed properly. You're sitting, you're composed, but you're kind of trying to be natural as well and trying to be authentic. It's quite a lot to take in. broadcast journalists have had training, we have had training and years of experience. So it's hard for someone just to come to it if they've never done an interview before. But I do kind of understand it. going through perimenopause, which I think I am, I wouldn't be without a script. So even when I'm doing a live, I will... have my notes written down, just in case I go blank. And may not look at but it's a safety thing. But for most people, in terms of advice, they're doing an interview, just go with the flow. You'll ⁓ often find that if you've got your notes actually, ⁓ you're more prone to look at your notes think you have to rely on them because brain will tell you that. ⁓ It's kind of a trick. If you've got nothing you've just got to go. You're not going to go blank. Unless you've got perimenopause, maybe. Sarah Collins: the mind blanking thing ⁓ is something that so many, think again, women are worried about. ⁓ So in that sense, they don't even themselves into those situations. know for some people I've spoken to, even doing a podcast is petrifying ⁓ because they're worried about freezing and not what to say. So in those moments, because obviously you come across, Sangeeta Kandola: Hmm Yeah. Sarah Collins: incredibly composed, incredibly calm on screen. In those moments when you're really panicking about what you're saying, have you got any kind of strategies or coping mechanisms that you use that you could share with listeners? Sangeeta Kandola: To be honest, sometimes when I'm panicking, that's when I perform the best. Sometimes, the early days I was like petrified and I'd be in a studio and I've got an auto-cue, but my leg would be shaking. But nobody would know and I was like, and I would be thinking, I'm breathing so well. It's because I'm petrified. So again, it's a personal journey. For some people that will push you through, that adrenaline will get you through. And times, for no reason at all you're nervous and to compose myself, I'm a ⁓ believer in deep breathing. So ⁓ to compose yourself beforehand, that's through everything in my life, know, whatever stress is, it's always like, right, just stop for a minute, just take a breath, it's gonna be okay. ⁓ also a great believer in the secret. So you think about, you bring about. it's just getting into that mindset, imagining the end of the broadcast and going. That was fantastic, that was brilliant. I've already done it. ⁓ wow, didn't I do so well? Wasn't it a great show? It's a mind over matter thing. It really is. And that's about training your brain. Sarah Collins: And I think a lot of athletes do that, don't they? They envision the finish line. So it's a similar kind of thing, just looking at that outcome rather than actually you're coming from now. ⁓ Sangeeta Kandola: I do. it's imagination. already playing it out and going, ⁓ that was that was amazing. know, playing with your dolls or whatever it is that, know, ⁓ children are incredible like that, they? Because ⁓ everything's so positive and that's you have to be. ⁓ And that's how you get positive outcome. But as you get older, ⁓ negativity always sets in. You've got all little doubts, you've got your little devils on your shoulders. And it's trying to get rid of that, really. Sarah Collins: the inner chatter is such a huge thing, isn't it? I think, again, as women, ⁓ it's something can stop us from taking opportunities, like you said, ⁓ perhaps not going through with something or not putting ourselves in those situations because we're talking ourselves out of it. ⁓ Obviously, when you're the studio and you need to banish that inner chatter, you can't have that coming when you've got all these other things, guests, or Tokyo. ⁓ Sangeeta Kandola: Yes. Sarah Collins: everything you've got to deal with, how, again, is that through the breathing or is there anything else that you do to kind of stop? Sangeeta Kandola: Again, it's the mind training. It's, you're sink or swim. If you're in a studio and you're not quite ready for live broadcast, well, it doesn't matter because, the TV schedule is not going to stop for you. often it's like sink or swim, let's do this. Let's just do it. it's kind of that power talk. It's like, right, guys, you ready? Let's go. It's a convincing yourself. But like I say, everybody's different. there's some people that are just... born confident and that doesn't even enter their thoughts. I have to banish them. And that's before every broadcast. Because like say, I've been doing this a long time, but I'm never complacent. Every makes me nervous. I'm working tonight and I will be nervous before I go on, just because you never know what's going to happen or how I'm going to perform. Sometimes I'm like, please let my brain connect to my mouth. going to fluff a line, you're going to forget something, you're going to stumble ⁓ and it's at the end of it not going, ⁓ my God. Because in the early days, I would beat myself up if, I'd messed up a line in a story, be like, ⁓ my God, that was awful and I'd watch it back. And as I've gone on over the years, I'm like, that was nothing. People in everyday conversation stumble. ⁓ They... the wrong thing, they correct themselves and it's being a little bit easy on yourself. You're not a robot. People make mistakes, it's part of life and actually it's, ⁓ ⁓ quite in some I remember doing a red carpet live with Ray Winston a couple of years ago and I think I fluffed a line actually in asking him a question or, ⁓ forgot the pronunciation of a word. And I spoke to my boss after and went, oh, sorry about that. And she went, no, it was lovely. I loved the fact that that happened. It just makes you, you, it's just so nice because you're just so normal. And I'm like, do you know what? That's really nice. Sarah Collins: That is really lovely to hear because I think there's this pressure that we need to get things right. And it also normalises you. We're worried, aren't we, about stumbling over our words, saying the wrong thing. But actually, someone, a trusted voice like yours, and you're stumbling, but actually that's okay. It just makes it seem more normal to other people. And I love the fact that you reference there that you get nervous before every time you go live. Sangeeta Kandola: Bye. Yeah. Yeah. Sarah Collins: Because I think from our perspective, watching someone, particularly on the TV, you just assume they are absolutely fine. ⁓ But I think there is an element, isn't it? Again, it's normalizing that the nerves are normal. The nerves are always going to be there. It's just whether you can push yourself to use your voice or to do that thing that is a bit scary, Sangeeta Kandola: I'm sure most people are, maybe it's just me. Yeah. Sarah Collins: to wrap up every episode, I like to ask guests to fill in the blank. So if you could encourage listeners to speak with and then add a word or a phrase, just to leave them with a little bit of inspiration, what would that be and why? Sangeeta Kandola: I would say people should speak with honesty confidence ⁓ themselves. In telly we would just say, you know what, it's only telly, just be you, just be yourself. You ⁓ only be you. You're the best person at it, you're the expert. Sarah Collins: I absolutely love that. Thank you so much. It has been an absolute pleasure to speak to you. Thank you. ⁓ Sangeeta Kandola: Thank you so much, Sarah.