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Bruce Dorn on Saying Yes to Life and Adventure · The Overland Journal Podcast

• 0:05
  Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to the Overland Journal podcast. I am
• 0:08
  Speaker 1: your host, Scott Brady, and I'm here with my co
• 0:10
  Speaker 1: host Matt Scott and we have we have a very
• 0:13
  Speaker 1: special guest today, one of my closest personal friends in
• 0:17
  Speaker 1: extremely experienced photographer, director, videographer and overlander Bruce Dorn.
• 0:23
  Speaker 2: Thanks so much. It's Uncle Brucey in the house. Yeactly, No,
• 0:27
  Speaker 2: I prefer to be addressed this Uncle Zusie.
• 0:29
  Speaker 3: So here's what we're going to talk about today, as
• 0:31
  Speaker 3: we're going to talk about somebody that's had I think
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  Speaker 3: one of the coolest lives of anybody that I know,
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  Speaker 3: has taught me a lot, has taught a lot of
• 0:38
  Speaker 3: people a lot of things, from humble beginnings to Hollywood
• 0:43
  Speaker 3: racing to you know, driving around the world with Exhibition
• 0:47
  Speaker 3: seven with Scott and all the trips that we've done.
• 0:49
  Speaker 3: Let's start in Indiana.
• 0:53
  Speaker 1: This content is brought to you by Overland Journal, our
• 0:56
  Speaker 1: premium quality print publication. The magazine was founded in two
• 1:00
  Speaker 1: thousand and six with the goal of providing independent equipment
• 1:05
  Speaker 1: and vehicle reviews, along with the most stunning adventures and photography.
• 1:11
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• 1:15
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• 1:49
  Speaker 2: Born very close to the race day of the India
• 1:51
  Speaker 2: YEA five hundred.
• 1:52
  Speaker 3: I remember you saying that, like there was a particular engine.
• 1:57
  Speaker 3: I know that Oftenhauser had something to do with when
• 2:00
  Speaker 3: those in particular were running. You could hear them from
• 2:02
  Speaker 3: this speedway.
• 2:03
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I lived about twenty seven miles from the speedway.
• 2:06
  Speaker 2: As the crow flies and when the nova, the supercharge
• 2:09
  Speaker 2: nova's no running. Yeah, they did it even back then.
• 2:12
  Speaker 2: I born in fifty one, but as a kid in
• 2:15
  Speaker 2: the fifties I could hear them they do two hundred
• 2:18
  Speaker 2: and fifty on the streets, and then you'd hear them
• 2:20
  Speaker 2: just shut off and try to You knew somebody was
• 2:22
  Speaker 2: frantically sawing away the steering wheel and then back down
• 2:24
  Speaker 2: the backstretch. So yeah, I sort of got methanol in
• 2:28
  Speaker 2: my blood from growing up near the home of motorsports. Ye.
• 2:33
  Speaker 3: I mean, for those that don't know, two hundred and
• 2:35
  Speaker 3: fifty mile hour in the fifties and the sixties, they
• 2:38
  Speaker 3: don't do any faster than that.
• 2:40
  Speaker 2: Now on ridiculously narrow tires, biasupply tires, cone's oh my gosh.
• 2:46
  Speaker 2: And the roll bar came up to mid back. Yeah,
• 2:48
  Speaker 2: you know, none of this nonsense of having it above
• 2:50
  Speaker 2: your head. Yeah.
• 2:51
  Speaker 3: Well, your spine's compressible to a certain extent.
• 2:53
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I mean, at least.
• 2:55
  Speaker 3: From from my perspective. You know, motorsports has always been
• 2:59
  Speaker 3: a common theme in the life of Bruce Dorn. You've
• 3:02
  Speaker 3: always had.
• 3:03
  Speaker 1: Cars, race cars, fast cars.
• 3:05
  Speaker 3: I mean, growing up in Indianapolis, I think, you know,
• 3:08
  Speaker 3: I don't want to say that Indianapolis kind of gets
• 3:11
  Speaker 3: maybe the cold shoulder these days, but it was, it
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  Speaker 3: was for decades the center of motorsports in the world.
• 3:18
  Speaker 2: It was one of the stops on the Formula One circuit. Yeah,
• 3:21
  Speaker 2: back in the day. I think in their corner le Mons,
• 3:23
  Speaker 2: it's called Indianapolis. It's a hard ninety degree left hander,
• 3:26
  Speaker 2: one of the tracks has a corner called Indio Indianapolis
• 3:29
  Speaker 2: because India is a two and a half mile oval,
• 3:31
  Speaker 2: it's basically three straightaways. It was always a big part
• 3:35
  Speaker 2: of my life growing up there. I spent the summers
• 3:38
  Speaker 2: on my grandmother's farm in southern Indiana and there was
• 3:41
  Speaker 2: a short track, little dirt bowl ring not too far away,
• 3:44
  Speaker 2: and my grandmother worked at the concession stand. If you
• 3:47
  Speaker 2: looked hungry, she'd fry up a chicken for you. And
• 3:49
  Speaker 2: I stood outside turned four dodge in the dirt clots.
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  Speaker 2: So I didn't get to race early. Well, I raced
• 3:55
  Speaker 2: motorcycles earlier. I started running hare and hound and motocross.
• 3:58
  Speaker 2: Motocross was different then. Bikes had three inches of travel. Yeah,
• 4:02
  Speaker 2: you know, it mostly your spine. That was the suspension,
• 4:04
  Speaker 2: which explains a lot, explains a lot about my physical condition.
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  Speaker 2: But now I started racing at about age fourteen.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah, because it used to be about six eight right.
• 4:13
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that's right, that's right. Yeah, yeah, and your legs
• 4:17
  Speaker 2: were one hundred percent of the suspension. But now ran
• 4:20
  Speaker 2: u gosh Huskvarna's, Hodaka's, botacos, a lot of stuff. I
• 4:26
  Speaker 2: mostly ran one twenty five's because I just wasn't fast enough,
• 4:30
  Speaker 2: quick enough for the really big fast stuff, but once
• 4:33
  Speaker 2: in a while ran a four hundred two stroke or
• 4:35
  Speaker 2: something like that. The bikes back then, throttle was like
• 4:38
  Speaker 2: Satan's light switch. It was all or nothing. Yeah, I
• 4:41
  Speaker 2: still miss the smell of castro. Maybe maybe we snart
• 4:46
  Speaker 2: some afterwards.
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  Speaker 3: I have two strokes in microagro and ize, oh that's right,
• 4:50
  Speaker 3: you do well.
• 4:51
  Speaker 1: And I remember one of the stories that you talked
• 4:53
  Speaker 1: about was it was I think you were in New
• 4:56
  Speaker 1: Zealand where you you flipped a mini about eighty times.
• 5:00
  Speaker 2: So I was on the US team Team USA ninety
• 5:03
  Speaker 2: four ninety five on TQ midgets. Its usack the midget
• 5:08
  Speaker 2: and the TQ series three quarter midget goes back to
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  Speaker 2: the nineteen thirties, I think, And actually it was all midgets.
• 5:15
  Speaker 2: Racing midgets does sound sort of start.
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  Speaker 3: And I really became friends as we both raced midgets
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  Speaker 3: in Indianapolis.
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  Speaker 2: And I know there's a more culturally appropriate sprint cars.
• 5:26
  Speaker 2: So the hierarchy was quarter midgets, which which is where
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  Speaker 2: I started at, and thens.
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  Speaker 3: Which were going to talk about that.
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  Speaker 2: Okay, So there was quarter midgets, which great, big giant
• 5:35
  Speaker 2: and the reason he won Is because you're long torsoed
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  Speaker 2: and you could plan.
• 5:39
  Speaker 3: I could put all of my ways.
• 5:41
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I saw you do that when we were racing
• 5:43
  Speaker 2: up the go carts out there. Remember we're running with
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  Speaker 2: what's her name though, Yeah, yeah, yeah, quarter midgets tq's,
• 5:50
  Speaker 2: which were seven fifties, and then there were full midgets,
• 5:54
  Speaker 2: and then there were Silver Crown cars which were long
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  Speaker 2: wheelbase no sprint cars, and then Silver Crown which were
• 6:00
  Speaker 2: long wheelbase sprint cars, and then there were Gold Crown
• 6:04
  Speaker 2: which were Indy cars. You and I were both in
• 6:06
  Speaker 2: the ladder system to go to Indian YEP. Neither of
• 6:09
  Speaker 2: us quite made it, but I was on Team USA
• 6:12
  Speaker 2: went down to New Zealand to race against the Kiwis
• 6:15
  Speaker 2: and the Aussies, and I think I last used my
• 6:20
  Speaker 2: last motor up but with three or four races go
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  Speaker 2: in the six week series and I got fourth in
• 6:25
  Speaker 2: the series, so I was running good. I was running good. Yeah,
• 6:28
  Speaker 2: opening so our cars went down ahead of us. I
• 6:32
  Speaker 2: got on on whatever. It was a twenty one hour
• 6:34
  Speaker 2: flight down there, and didn't have any ambience, so I
• 6:37
  Speaker 2: didn't sleep a wink. We got off their plane. The
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  Speaker 2: guys from the local TQ club met us and they said,
• 6:43
  Speaker 2: which ones are your gearbags? Oh? This one, start putting
• 6:47
  Speaker 2: on your fire suits. They drove us directly to the track,
• 6:49
  Speaker 2: put us on a podium out in the middle of
• 6:51
  Speaker 2: the track, shut off fireworks, and our cars were idling
• 6:55
  Speaker 2: and ready to go. I mean, I was going, wait
• 6:57
  Speaker 2: a minute, you know. And because we were the Yanks,
• 7:02
  Speaker 2: you know, and supposedly we had some I don't know advantage,
• 7:05
  Speaker 2: they started us in the back and we ran four
• 7:08
  Speaker 2: main events a night, so four thirty lap features a night,
• 7:12
  Speaker 2: and we ran about three nights a week. I guess
• 7:14
  Speaker 2: it was opening night. I think I ran from dead
• 7:18
  Speaker 2: last up to maybe third, and then in the second race,
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  Speaker 2: still they didn't move us up. In air, I was
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  Speaker 2: passing guys, passing guys, passing guys, and I remember just
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  Speaker 2: trying to squeak by the sky on the outside on
• 7:31
  Speaker 2: the front straight and I ran up his back wheel.
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  Speaker 2: It turned out it was the white flag lap and
• 7:36
  Speaker 2: I was passing the leader. I just passed guys. I
• 7:39
  Speaker 2: don't know shere I'm at, and I just snapperrolled a
• 7:43
  Speaker 2: whole bunch of times. And it was just like Skyground, Skyground, Skyground, Skyground,
• 7:47
  Speaker 2: and the lap at the cross belt was like really
• 7:49
  Speaker 2: getting my attention. And then I'm doing like this and
• 7:53
  Speaker 2: I'm feeling the cross built, you know, is not so tight.
• 7:56
  Speaker 2: The shoulders are tight and the engines running wide open.
• 7:58
  Speaker 2: I go, oh yeah, I take my foot off the
• 8:00
  Speaker 2: gas just as some track worker comes in. The car
• 8:03
  Speaker 2: was upside down on the cage. He undoes my belts
• 8:06
  Speaker 2: and I go straight down onto my head and the
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  Speaker 2: g forces. Actually my vision went dark. That's when I
• 8:13
  Speaker 2: did a bunch of tears in my retina, which four
• 8:16
  Speaker 2: or five years later fully detached. But I remember I was.
• 8:19
  Speaker 2: I get out of the car, and you know how
• 8:21
  Speaker 2: when the guy gets tackled and he's woozy, he stands
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  Speaker 2: up in waves to the crowd. So I'm waving to
• 8:26
  Speaker 2: the crowd and one of the guys grabs me by
• 8:28
  Speaker 2: the shoulders and turns me around. I was waving at
• 8:31
  Speaker 2: the darkness, and the crowd was over here, so instantly
• 8:36
  Speaker 2: they loved me. I was that guy, always that guy,
• 8:40
  Speaker 2: you know. I go back to the pits and my
• 8:42
  Speaker 2: vision is dark. It was like suddenly I had on
• 8:44
  Speaker 2: six stops of neutral density and I'm kind of looking
• 8:47
  Speaker 2: and I noticed that they're working on my car, and
• 8:49
  Speaker 2: I'm going They're sending me back out. They were circulating
• 8:54
  Speaker 2: and they were holding a position for me up like
• 8:56
  Speaker 2: the second row something like that, waving me up there.
• 8:59
  Speaker 2: I'm going now. Because I knew that the car wasn't
• 9:01
  Speaker 2: set up, they just threw parts at it. So I
• 9:03
  Speaker 2: went to the back, got up there. I don't know
• 9:05
  Speaker 2: if I want it or not, but I ran good,
• 9:07
  Speaker 2: ran really good. We ended up touring the island. We
• 9:10
  Speaker 2: were on the South Island racing Ruapuna Graymouth. But a
• 9:15
  Speaker 2: wonderful experience, except when we ran into the bees. That's
• 9:19
  Speaker 2: another story. But there was a whole problem with honey
• 9:21
  Speaker 2: bees and a third world windshield that shattered, and then
• 9:24
  Speaker 2: we ran into a whole lot of bees.
• 9:27
  Speaker 3: Is that is that where you gave me the advice?
• 9:29
  Speaker 3: When I went to New Zealand to get the yeastely
• 9:33
  Speaker 3: we got to stop the windshield.
• 9:37
  Speaker 2: We didn't either and were it was boxing day and
• 9:40
  Speaker 2: the windshield shattered. I was in the back seat behind
• 9:42
  Speaker 2: the driver. I see the windshield spider web and then
• 9:44
  Speaker 2: thank god it on some glasses. There was not safety glass.
• 9:47
  Speaker 2: We all got a million shards in our face and
• 9:50
  Speaker 2: a lot of bees because the bee hives are over
• 9:54
  Speaker 2: here and the Marrigold field was over here, and we
• 9:57
  Speaker 2: drove right through, you know, sort of a super highway
• 10:00
  Speaker 2: bees and we spent the next six hours getting stung,
• 10:03
  Speaker 2: you know, stuff that found its way down into our pants.
• 10:06
  Speaker 2: It was it was pretty special. But I really enjoyed that. Yeah,
• 10:10
  Speaker 2: so Tmosa go Tsa.
• 10:13
  Speaker 3: So let's go back to Indy. I think one of
• 10:15
  Speaker 3: the interesting things where we first crossed paths, but we
• 10:19
  Speaker 3: didn't know as you started talking about shooting the Indy Mile. Yeah, well,
• 10:24
  Speaker 3: we used to run at the little racetrack.
• 10:26
  Speaker 2: You were in that. Yeah, you were in that little swimming.
• 10:28
  Speaker 3: Pool, a little swimming pool at like age five, turning
• 10:31
  Speaker 3: left and pulling three g's.
• 10:34
  Speaker 2: I was there to shoot. Well, actually, I was actually
• 10:37
  Speaker 2: there when Kenny Roberts ran the TZ seven point fifty
• 10:40
  Speaker 2: that you know, two stroke bike that he rode once
• 10:43
  Speaker 2: and I watched him work in a groove on the
• 10:46
  Speaker 2: outside and come from the back to win that race.
• 10:48
  Speaker 2: It was unbelievable. I went back there to revisit that
• 10:51
  Speaker 2: spot and actually document where that dirt cloud hit me
• 10:54
  Speaker 2: in the nuts and one hundred and forty miles an
• 10:55
  Speaker 2: hour you know. And then I went over to turn
• 10:58
  Speaker 2: four because I turned two because the sun was setting
• 11:01
  Speaker 2: down the back stretch and I was right by.
• 11:04
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it was right by turned too, by the little.
• 11:06
  Speaker 2: Track, and I watched I watched some guys in there,
• 11:09
  Speaker 2: and I think it was two and a half seconds.
• 11:10
  Speaker 1: Elat unbelievable.
• 11:12
  Speaker 3: It was unbelievable.
• 11:13
  Speaker 2: And the kids one to say, it's closer to four.
• 11:15
  Speaker 2: But that was in your era. This is when I
• 11:17
  Speaker 2: was out there more recently, when they were quick. But
• 11:21
  Speaker 2: uh yeah, you see him set up and do slide
• 11:23
  Speaker 2: jobs and everything, and it's just like watching a race
• 11:26
  Speaker 2: like this. Yea, you know, they are beautiful. I admired
• 11:30
  Speaker 2: quarter madgets when I was growing up, and a couple
• 11:31
  Speaker 2: of my grade school buddies raced them, and you know,
• 11:34
  Speaker 2: they'd have them on the table in the basement, you know,
• 11:36
  Speaker 2: a little tiny.
• 11:37
  Speaker 3: It was a fully suspended race car that a five
• 11:39
  Speaker 3: year old could drive.
• 11:40
  Speaker 2: Wow, yeah, it sounds.
• 11:42
  Speaker 3: So you learned a lot about car control, and you
• 11:44
  Speaker 3: learned how things reacted, and you learned stagger, and you
• 11:47
  Speaker 3: learned whaite jack, and you learned everything.
• 11:48
  Speaker 2: You weren't in the sleepy trip era were you did?
• 11:51
  Speaker 2: You ever because he was. He started in quarter midgets
• 11:53
  Speaker 2: and he got his nickname Sleepy Big Times Midget and
• 11:55
  Speaker 2: sprint car Guy because he'd fall asleep. He was so
• 11:58
  Speaker 2: so relaxed when they were set up the starting grid.
• 12:01
  Speaker 2: They have to wake him up. Oh, I would for
• 12:02
  Speaker 2: sure fall asleep.
• 12:04
  Speaker 3: Like there's pictures that my dad has of me, like
• 12:06
  Speaker 3: sitting ready to race, falling asleep, and then slaps me
• 12:09
  Speaker 3: on the helmet, wake up, picks the thing up, runs
• 12:11
  Speaker 3: with it, drops it, because that's how you started, and
• 12:14
  Speaker 3: then hopefully by then you'd be fully awake. I think
• 12:18
  Speaker 3: that was pretty common for five and six year olds
• 12:21
  Speaker 3: that were being made to race at ten pm.
• 12:23
  Speaker 2: You know, my buddy Eli and I are thinking about
• 12:25
  Speaker 2: building a quarter midget and just finding some kid and kid,
• 12:28
  Speaker 2: you know, talk to my dad.
• 12:29
  Speaker 3: We still have all the parts.
• 12:30
  Speaker 2: So yeah, No, it was fun. When I started racing,
• 12:33
  Speaker 2: Oh gosh, I was. I had started to do really
• 12:35
  Speaker 2: well in Hollywood, so when I started to race, you know,
• 12:37
  Speaker 2: you got to have cubic money and just be prepared
• 12:40
  Speaker 2: to throw it in a check shredder. And at one point,
• 12:42
  Speaker 2: I think I was racing in seven divisions and had
• 12:45
  Speaker 2: a full race shop and some guys that maintained the cars.
• 12:48
  Speaker 2: Sponsoring a Formula Atlantic car too, that's right, sponsored a
• 12:51
  Speaker 2: Formula A line.
• 12:52
  Speaker 3: But let's go back. I'm going to stop you there.
• 12:53
  Speaker 3: I'm going to stop you from talking about racing. Let's
• 12:56
  Speaker 3: let's go back to Mademoiselle magazine and Conde nost.
• 13:00
  Speaker 1: That's such a great story.
• 13:01
  Speaker 3: Age twenty twenty one.
• 13:03
  Speaker 2: Oh gosh, so between my celphomore and junior.
• 13:06
  Speaker 3: Year at heron designs junior.
• 13:09
  Speaker 2: And senior year. Yeah, so that would have been I
• 13:11
  Speaker 2: would have been just twenty twenty one something like that.
• 13:14
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 13:15
  Speaker 3: This is really where you kind of spread your wings
• 13:18
  Speaker 3: and fly.
• 13:19
  Speaker 2: So yeah, I I I had picked up photography when
• 13:23
  Speaker 2: my brother in law loan me a camera for this
• 13:25
  Speaker 2: summer trip going to art school with the intention of
• 13:28
  Speaker 2: being an illustrator or graphic designer. There was a minor
• 13:32
  Speaker 2: in photography available, and of course I was going to
• 13:35
  Speaker 2: do that. I was dating a girl that worked at
• 13:37
  Speaker 2: the mall. I was working at a Texaco station, and
• 13:40
  Speaker 2: I was doing oil changes and loop jobs and all that,
• 13:43
  Speaker 2: and we're kind of running out of common stuff to
• 13:45
  Speaker 2: talk about. I was over at the magazine standbying some
• 13:48
  Speaker 2: car magazines and the women's interests magazines were here. I
• 13:51
  Speaker 2: picked up a magazine it fell open to call for
• 13:56
  Speaker 2: entries for college competition, bought the magazine, went home and
• 14:00
  Speaker 2: read it up, applied. It was a protracted process. It
• 14:04
  Speaker 2: was you had to do a whole bunch of creative projects,
• 14:07
  Speaker 2: and it was a whole series of questionnaire questions there
• 14:11
  Speaker 2: were clearly focused on women. This competition went back to
• 14:14
  Speaker 2: the nineteen thirties as a kind of asked college board,
• 14:18
  Speaker 2: and they picked twelve students from around the nation. There
• 14:21
  Speaker 2: was no social media. You couldn't tell what kids were thinking,
• 14:24
  Speaker 2: You couldn't tell what the up and comers were interested in,
• 14:27
  Speaker 2: and they had long since created this college board, so
• 14:31
  Speaker 2: they had never had a guy enter it before. So
• 14:34
  Speaker 2: all the questions were aimed toward women. And I just
• 14:37
  Speaker 2: went crazy on that, you know, because I was can
• 14:40
  Speaker 2: you type one finger each hand a shorthand no, both
• 14:43
  Speaker 2: normal lengths to the other side, and I drew a
• 14:45
  Speaker 2: picture around my hand. They found me mildly amusing, sent
• 14:49
  Speaker 2: a junior fashion editor out to check to see if
• 14:51
  Speaker 2: I was a total creep or not, and I ended
• 14:54
  Speaker 2: up winning the guest art directorship. So first time ever
• 14:58
  Speaker 2: on an airplane was to Manhattan to check into the
• 15:01
  Speaker 2: Biltmore to start work on Monday. And that first week
• 15:05
  Speaker 2: they sent me to Raykovic to art direct a sweaters
• 15:09
  Speaker 2: shoot with Arthur el goert Anselo o Gourt's dad, the
• 15:12
  Speaker 2: guy that's the star of Baby Driver.
• 15:15
  Speaker 1: Wow.
• 15:15
  Speaker 2: His dad was a photographer I art directed. I went
• 15:18
  Speaker 2: from Raykovic to Paris and shot Kenzo Betsy Johnson, I
• 15:23
  Speaker 2: forget which collections, and then I went to Rome and
• 15:26
  Speaker 2: shot out Runway on the Spanish Steps. So I went
• 15:29
  Speaker 2: from it like literally from Friday at the Texco to
• 15:32
  Speaker 2: the following Friday. I was seeing supermodels changing clothes backstage,
• 15:38
  Speaker 2: you know, and I was said, I was hacking to
• 15:41
  Speaker 2: take a jump. I was digging the fashion industry really quick, you.
• 15:45
  Speaker 3: Know, didn't you say that he went to some champagne
• 15:49
  Speaker 3: champagne estate.
• 15:50
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so everybody, because we were representative of all college
• 15:54
  Speaker 2: students and they just happened to have well, actually another
• 15:57
  Speaker 2: guy entered that year and he was guest fiction editor.
• 16:00
  Speaker 2: So there were two of us and then ten girls,
• 16:03
  Speaker 2: and they wanted to entertain you and pick your brains.
• 16:05
  Speaker 2: So Levi's put on a big show for us Quantro
• 16:10
  Speaker 2: dom Perignon. We went to the dom Perignon vineyards family
• 16:15
  Speaker 2: at the family estate, and I mean.
• 16:17
  Speaker 3: The first time you drink Champagne probably is not only
• 16:20
  Speaker 3: Don Perrion, but it's in Champagne, France. Yeah, the Champerion estate.
• 16:25
  Speaker 2: Yeah. So I always had on a caterpillar hat, you know,
• 16:28
  Speaker 2: a cat diesel hat, and you know, jeans, and my
• 16:31
  Speaker 2: hair was about as long as it is now. I
• 16:34
  Speaker 2: went to makeovers. They had makeovers for the girls, and
• 16:37
  Speaker 2: they didn't know what to do with me. So, by
• 16:38
  Speaker 2: the way, my son, I am a summer in terms
• 16:41
  Speaker 2: of my life. And yeah, Clinique worked me over and
• 16:45
  Speaker 2: had my haircut by some high end haircutter. It was surreal.
• 16:50
  Speaker 1: You know, Bruce. What's fun is because I've heard most
• 16:54
  Speaker 1: of these stories, and first of all, they remain the
• 16:57
  Speaker 1: same stories, which means that there's a high probability accurate.
• 17:01
  Speaker 1: And then I've also heard a bunch of people repeat
• 17:04
  Speaker 1: them with the same degree of accuracy. But one of
• 17:06
  Speaker 1: the things that I remember from this trip that you
• 17:09
  Speaker 1: did to Europe that stuck out to me was that
• 17:12
  Speaker 1: there was this older gentleman that happened to be in
• 17:15
  Speaker 1: Europe and I think it's an important lesson about having
• 17:19
  Speaker 1: mentors in our life. So would you mind sharing that?
• 17:21
  Speaker 2: Yeah? I love that. I love that. Yeah. I was
• 17:23
  Speaker 2: crushing on three sisters back in Indianapolis. One of the
• 17:28
  Speaker 2: girls was in my one of my art classes, and
• 17:30
  Speaker 2: she had an older sister and a younger sister, and
• 17:33
  Speaker 2: their dad was a lovely fella. I mean, he wanted
• 17:36
  Speaker 2: me to photograph all the girls for the you know,
• 17:38
  Speaker 2: some portraits of them at that age for the wall.
• 17:41
  Speaker 2: I think he secretly kind of wanted to have a son.
• 17:44
  Speaker 2: I had a good relationship with him. I put that
• 17:48
  Speaker 2: on the side. I fly over to Europe. I'm checking
• 17:50
  Speaker 2: into the hotel the first night in Paris and running
• 17:53
  Speaker 2: into my first snarky Parisian best clerk, and I'm checking
• 17:58
  Speaker 2: in and he goes on and he hands me an
• 18:01
  Speaker 2: envelope that was, you know, in a box for me
• 18:03
  Speaker 2: along with my key and as a sealed envelope. I
• 18:06
  Speaker 2: tear it open and it's a note from the father
• 18:08
  Speaker 2: of these girls, and he says, I'm in Paris, I
• 18:11
  Speaker 2: want to take you out to dinner tonight. He was
• 18:13
  Speaker 2: a patent lawyer. He was actually the company he worked
• 18:15
  Speaker 2: for was the guys that created powder coating so that
• 18:19
  Speaker 2: electrostatic paint baking paint baking, and he went around the
• 18:23
  Speaker 2: world suing people that were mess around with that. So
• 18:27
  Speaker 2: he picks me up. We go out to dinner. I mean,
• 18:29
  Speaker 2: I had never seen so many forks, I'd never seen
• 18:31
  Speaker 2: so many spoons, I had never seen so many glasses,
• 18:34
  Speaker 2: and he, very gently, without humiliating me, worked me through
• 18:38
  Speaker 2: the process of how you behave like a gentleman. I'm
• 18:43
  Speaker 2: paying very close attention, and I'm also pretty mesmerized because
• 18:48
  Speaker 2: just beyond him was an old, older guy that had
• 18:52
  Speaker 2: hair like I have, and he was surrounded by supermodels
• 18:56
  Speaker 2: and he was delicately eating a Caesar salad one leaf
• 18:59
  Speaker 2: at a time while the girls all fluttered around, And
• 19:01
  Speaker 2: I was going, I like this guy, and I really
• 19:03
  Speaker 2: like that guy too. I got some sort of brick
• 19:07
  Speaker 2: and mortar ways to behave from the father of my
• 19:11
  Speaker 2: gal pals, and then I sort of got a goal
• 19:14
  Speaker 2: for where I wanted to go in terms of being
• 19:16
  Speaker 2: a wacky old artist. Yeah, and you achieved both. I'm
• 19:19
  Speaker 2: trying to fusell that somehow.
• 19:21
  Speaker 1: I think the thing that I like about that story
• 19:24
  Speaker 1: and appreciated you sharing it was that we often all
• 19:28
  Speaker 1: need that person when we go to a new country
• 19:32
  Speaker 1: and we have a chance to spend time with someone
• 19:34
  Speaker 1: that's local, ask them the things that you can do
• 19:37
  Speaker 1: to best, you know, respect their culture, and maybe do
• 19:41
  Speaker 1: some research ahead of time. So I think that that
• 19:43
  Speaker 1: experience that you had not only was it very beneficial
• 19:46
  Speaker 1: for you, but based upon how I've known you, is
• 19:49
  Speaker 1: that you have spent a lifetime doing the same for
• 19:52
  Speaker 1: others and mentoring others. And I want to get into
• 19:54
  Speaker 1: mentoring with you a little bit later in the conversation.
• 19:57
  Speaker 1: But that's such a great story. Pay it forward, guy.
• 20:01
  Speaker 1: My dad worked his butt off to support his family,
• 20:05
  Speaker 1: and I didn't see him a whole lot.
• 20:07
  Speaker 2: You know, I really would have liked to have had
• 20:10
  Speaker 2: the experience growing up, going fishing with your dad and
• 20:14
  Speaker 2: doing this and that with your dad. You know, you've
• 20:15
  Speaker 2: got to spend a lot of time with your sp
• 20:18
  Speaker 2: racing and stuff. Where I grew up, there was a
• 20:20
  Speaker 2: father of girls on one side and the father of
• 20:22
  Speaker 2: girls on the other side, and they both kind of
• 20:25
  Speaker 2: liked having a boy around, especially one that was enthusiastic
• 20:29
  Speaker 2: about stuff. So I got some really great guidance from
• 20:33
  Speaker 2: those guys, and then I have run into people all
• 20:37
  Speaker 2: my life. I'm going to call him benevolent adult males,
• 20:41
  Speaker 2: you know, who would just notice that I was trying,
• 20:45
  Speaker 2: or that I was had some potential, And a number
• 20:49
  Speaker 2: of occasions, my life's direction has changed because somebody noticed
• 20:54
  Speaker 2: and bothered to give me a bit of guidance. So absolutely,
• 20:57
  Speaker 2: I've I've always tried to do that great pleasure in it.
• 21:01
  Speaker 1: Well, and Bruce, you've done that for me, You've done
• 21:03
  Speaker 1: that for Matt. I can think back, even within moments
• 21:07
  Speaker 1: of meeting you, you were already freely giving unsolicited advice.
• 21:11
  Speaker 1: That's right, but the things we needed to hear.
• 21:15
  Speaker 3: That's why we're talking the other day about an AI
• 21:17
  Speaker 3: app Uncle Brucey that offers you advice exactly. Just have
• 21:20
  Speaker 3: to save Bruce's mind into a ask mister new at all.
• 21:25
  Speaker 3: Let's go from gallivanting around Europe and Mademoiselle magazine, you're
• 21:29
  Speaker 3: back in Indiana. Yeah, you decide, not right? You know,
• 21:33
  Speaker 3: the second time you get on a plane is to
• 21:35
  Speaker 3: move into a studio apartment off of Fifth Avenue.
• 21:38
  Speaker 2: No, I'm not a studio house loft. Yeah, yeah, I
• 21:42
  Speaker 2: had a nice gig with a local department with a
• 21:46
  Speaker 2: Midwest department store chain that I came back to after
• 21:49
  Speaker 2: the experience with Kindon asked, but it was, you know,
• 21:53
  Speaker 2: that was really how you're going to keep them down
• 21:55
  Speaker 2: after the on the farm, after in Paris, you know.
• 21:58
  Speaker 2: So uh. At the first opportunity, I joined a fledgling
• 22:03
  Speaker 2: glam rock band that was going to try to make
• 22:05
  Speaker 2: it in New York and it was the glam Rock Era,
• 22:08
  Speaker 2: and I helped them with promotion and staging. And we
• 22:11
  Speaker 2: lived in a four thousand square foot penthouse loft and
• 22:15
  Speaker 2: they didn't want the front. I had the fifth Avenue
• 22:17
  Speaker 2: front view. I built a wonderful dark round and a
• 22:21
  Speaker 2: rehearsal hall in the back. I was the only one
• 22:23
  Speaker 2: that knew how to use a hammer and a nail.
• 22:24
  Speaker 2: We renovated that loft. We sanded down the floors that
• 22:28
  Speaker 2: had been a button factory. It was in the garment district.
• 22:31
  Speaker 2: I remember My life was sleep until four in the
• 22:34
  Speaker 2: afternoon or three in the afternoon, run around the fashion
• 22:37
  Speaker 2: magazines and get an assignment, and then stay up all night.
• 22:41
  Speaker 2: All the little fashion editors and all the beautiful people
• 22:45
  Speaker 2: are loft was one of the stops on their deal
• 22:47
  Speaker 2: New York dolls would come over. We'd go to Maxis
• 22:49
  Speaker 2: Kansas City and CBGB's and Andy Warhol's loft.
• 22:53
  Speaker 3: You've been to Andy Warhol's loft, of course, see come on,
• 23:00
  Speaker 3: all right, come on.
• 23:03
  Speaker 1: It's like do we dare ask for any And you
• 23:05
  Speaker 1: were all and you were all.
• 23:07
  Speaker 2: Like Elton John, you know, always with copying my glasses,
• 23:11
  Speaker 2: you know, always yeah. No, So it was I was
• 23:14
  Speaker 2: living the nightlife thing there and it was it was
• 23:18
  Speaker 2: pretty fabulous. They got the band to the point that
• 23:21
  Speaker 2: they were going to sign for a TV. It's kind
• 23:24
  Speaker 2: of a follow up to The Monkeys, which is going
• 23:27
  Speaker 2: to resonate with no One. That's a reference from way
• 23:29
  Speaker 2: back there was they wanted to do another variation on
• 23:32
  Speaker 2: this band was going to be yet don Kershner recognized
• 23:35
  Speaker 2: that's the drummer, that's the bass player, that's the lead guitarist,
• 23:38
  Speaker 2: that's a rhythm guitarist, and who are you? I went,
• 23:40
  Speaker 2: don't need you. So everybody got signed into a multi
• 23:43
  Speaker 2: year contract where they gave up like some ludicrous percentage
• 23:47
  Speaker 2: of what they'd make for the rest of their lives.
• 23:49
  Speaker 2: And I didn't, and I think, you know, thank Buddha,
• 23:52
  Speaker 2: because I was able to go my own way, and
• 23:54
  Speaker 2: they got stuck. Even if they were doing paper routes,
• 23:57
  Speaker 2: they still had to she had some commissions. I had
• 23:59
  Speaker 2: a really great time in New York. And then I
• 24:02
  Speaker 2: guess I should mention that when I won the guest editorship,
• 24:06
  Speaker 2: I had applied to Missoula and I was going to
• 24:09
  Speaker 2: go get my master's degree. I had gotten a bachelor's degree.
• 24:11
  Speaker 2: I was going to go to Missoula, and I think
• 24:14
  Speaker 2: I was going to be going to study jewelry making
• 24:17
  Speaker 2: for my master's and I was going to go. I
• 24:19
  Speaker 2: wanted to be a smoke jumper, so I was going
• 24:21
  Speaker 2: up there to do that, and it was going to
• 24:23
  Speaker 2: go to National Outdoor Leadership School at that summer, and
• 24:26
  Speaker 2: then I was going to go to Missoula, and I
• 24:28
  Speaker 2: thought I'll be a smoke jumper, and instead I was
• 24:32
  Speaker 2: a fashion photographer in New York, Paris and Rome. Who
• 24:36
  Speaker 2: knows how it would have gone the other way.
• 24:37
  Speaker 1: And at what point in time did you study type setting?
• 24:40
  Speaker 1: Because you even studied that at some point in time.
• 24:42
  Speaker 1: So I've given us, I mean, Overland Journal, a lot
• 24:45
  Speaker 1: of the type face that we use is because of you.
• 24:48
  Speaker 2: So yeah, my degree, I thought I'd be an illustrator,
• 24:51
  Speaker 2: and I got It. Was a very interesting program I
• 24:53
  Speaker 2: went through. It was the old world master and apprentice
• 24:57
  Speaker 2: kind of a program was in effect, and that was
• 25:01
  Speaker 2: being sort of changed over to the new conceptual kind
• 25:05
  Speaker 2: of a free associative art. I was in a program
• 25:08
  Speaker 2: called Visual Communications, which had typography, three D design, two
• 25:13
  Speaker 2: D design. I did. We built fine art furniture, we
• 25:16
  Speaker 2: did color theory. I understand the Bauhause theories of design
• 25:20
  Speaker 2: and so on, and yeah, typography is about as pure
• 25:23
  Speaker 2: design as you can do. The most important thing that
• 25:26
  Speaker 2: came out of that really was well the school we'd
• 25:29
  Speaker 2: in just about three hundred students would go into the
• 25:32
  Speaker 2: sophomore program and about twenty two would graduate. It was
• 25:36
  Speaker 2: before schools survived by being diploma mills, so if you
• 25:42
  Speaker 2: got through it, you for sure got an education, and
• 25:44
  Speaker 2: you for sure had an opportunity for a job. They
• 25:46
  Speaker 2: hired all the three D designers out of the school
• 25:49
  Speaker 2: to go to Detroit to do play modeling for Body
• 25:52
  Speaker 2: by Fisher or you know, before there was CG, there
• 25:55
  Speaker 2: was Clay.
• 25:55
  Speaker 3: So there's still Clay and Automotive Design and Design Center
• 26:00
  Speaker 3: they're still is.
• 26:01
  Speaker 2: Amazing it's real hands on stuff. And you know, I
• 26:05
  Speaker 2: think I had shared with you that I was accepted
• 26:08
  Speaker 2: to Art Center. I was going to get a full
• 26:10
  Speaker 2: ride at Art Center to do automotive design. But I
• 26:14
  Speaker 2: was poor and I had to work. I wouldn't be
• 26:17
  Speaker 2: able to eat or buy gasoline to get to school,
• 26:20
  Speaker 2: and they had a mandate that you couldn't work, you
• 26:23
  Speaker 2: had to dedicate yourself one hundred percent to your studies.
• 26:26
  Speaker 2: So I had to walk away from Art Center in
• 26:28
  Speaker 2: Pasadena and ended up at a local fine art institution.
• 26:33
  Speaker 2: That is, I'm glad I had that education. I'll fight
• 26:37
  Speaker 2: anybody that says that going to college is worthless, because
• 26:40
  Speaker 2: it was really worthwhile for me. No illustration. Although I
• 26:44
  Speaker 2: can draw, I'm pretty good at that. The application of
• 26:47
  Speaker 2: that is.
• 26:47
  Speaker 1: Yeah. In fact, you have a bunch of your art
• 26:50
  Speaker 1: going into the next issue of the magazine.
• 26:52
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, well if this breaks before the next issue
• 26:55
  Speaker 2: in the magazine comes out, that'll make perfect sense. Yeah, you're
• 26:58
  Speaker 2: absolutely right. Actually I did those in conjunction with one
• 27:04
  Speaker 2: of my students from back then, a fellow that was
• 27:06
  Speaker 2: in one of my very when I taught. So I
• 27:09
  Speaker 2: guess I should mention that I ended up teaching at
• 27:11
  Speaker 2: the university level full time for about five years and
• 27:15
  Speaker 2: still very close to a lot of students. Yeah, yep, yep.
• 27:19
  Speaker 2: After doing a stint that stint in New York, was
• 27:22
  Speaker 2: drifting west. Just wanted to get out of Manhattan. I
• 27:25
  Speaker 2: love that experience, but I'm a little bit more of
• 27:27
  Speaker 2: an outdoorsman and Central Park wasn't quite enough. On my
• 27:31
  Speaker 2: way west, I stopped off in Indianapolis to see some
• 27:34
  Speaker 2: friends and I was offered a sabbatical position and that
• 27:38
  Speaker 2: turned into a full time position until about nineteen eighty
• 27:43
  Speaker 2: when I headed further west and.
• 27:45
  Speaker 3: He ended up in Phoenix.
• 27:46
  Speaker 2: Yep. I was married to Gal and she got a
• 27:49
  Speaker 2: job as a creative director at a new agency in Phoenix.
• 27:53
  Speaker 2: It was great advertising, I believe, and there was a
• 27:57
  Speaker 2: note on the refrigerator moved to Phoenix, come on out.
• 28:00
  Speaker 2: And I was still in the middle of a teaching contract.
• 28:03
  Speaker 2: So I was a bachelor for a minute, more than
• 28:05
  Speaker 2: a minute, and then I eventually I didn't re sign
• 28:08
  Speaker 2: my next contract and I joined her in Phoenix and
• 28:11
  Speaker 2: then set around watching a lot of cartoons.
• 28:14
  Speaker 1: You've seen Phoenix change, Holy cow? Oh yeah, Phoenix in
• 28:18
  Speaker 1: the eighties would be unrecognized.
• 28:20
  Speaker 2: No one oh one, No fifty one Freeway. It was
• 28:22
  Speaker 2: just this straight grid of streets where you could get
• 28:25
  Speaker 2: killed at every left turn intersection. A horrible place to
• 28:28
  Speaker 2: own a motorcycle because there no corners.
• 28:30
  Speaker 1: Is that where you got run over by a guy
• 28:33
  Speaker 1: on a bicycle. You've had a lot of clothes calls
• 28:35
  Speaker 1: with bicys.
• 28:35
  Speaker 2: I got run over by a guy on a bicycle
• 28:37
  Speaker 2: with you when we were in Amsterdam. Oh no, that
• 28:39
  Speaker 2: was in The one you're referring to was when I
• 28:41
  Speaker 2: was coming out of a photo lab in Hollywood and
• 28:43
  Speaker 2: a guy on a mountain bike, a big, burly West
• 28:46
  Speaker 2: Hollywood guy hit me like a ton of bricks. I mean,
• 28:49
  Speaker 2: look at me. Me flying through the air means there's
• 28:51
  Speaker 2: a lot of inertia that meant to me. But I
• 28:54
  Speaker 2: remember looking down at this guy and you know, wham,
• 28:58
  Speaker 2: and then he comes over home. Mystery okay, And then
• 29:01
  Speaker 2: he realized he just may have injured a guy, and
• 29:04
  Speaker 2: so then I had this other vision of him with
• 29:06
  Speaker 2: the potato chipped front wheel, trying to run away on the.
• 29:11
  Speaker 1: But I didn't you end up like through a plate
• 29:14
  Speaker 1: glass and on top of a oh that was little
• 29:15
  Speaker 1: table that was something different.
• 29:17
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that was Yeah, that was on my normal commute
• 29:20
  Speaker 2: to work. I had a four hundred Honda f with
• 29:24
  Speaker 2: a beautiful little four cylinder that would run about eleven
• 29:27
  Speaker 2: thousand r pm, and I had this one set of corners. Well,
• 29:30
  Speaker 2: that corner was the one where I was sitting at
• 29:32
  Speaker 2: the traffic light where my arms folded and I saw
• 29:34
  Speaker 2: Buick Skylark logo right here. Car landed on my front
• 29:37
  Speaker 2: wheel and I flew through there. I never unfolded my arms.
• 29:39
  Speaker 2: I just landed on my head and I woke up
• 29:42
  Speaker 2: and a big biker guy picked me up through me
• 29:44
  Speaker 2: in the back of his truck. My Honda was already
• 29:46
  Speaker 2: in there, and he drove me home. The one you're
• 29:49
  Speaker 2: talking about was that same intersection. I had this series
• 29:52
  Speaker 2: of corners, and the night before it had rained, and
• 29:55
  Speaker 2: somehow somebody had dumped a bunch of transmission fluid and
• 29:57
  Speaker 2: there was a nice river of slickness across the road.
• 30:00
  Speaker 2: So I low sided the bike between oncoming traffic. It
• 30:04
  Speaker 2: went up the handicapped ramp. No, we hit the curb
• 30:08
  Speaker 2: and started doing the rag doll. I went up the
• 30:10
  Speaker 2: handicapped ramp onto the wet lawn and through the plate
• 30:13
  Speaker 2: glass window and onto the pool table of the drug
• 30:15
  Speaker 2: halfway house. And the drug halfway guys were very annoyed
• 30:19
  Speaker 2: that I was bleeding on their felt fool table and
• 30:23
  Speaker 2: then and then they go, oh, biker, what you got?
• 30:25
  Speaker 2: And then they saw I was on hot and out.
• 30:28
  Speaker 2: So yeah, I have an endless stream of crash stories,
• 30:34
  Speaker 2: but I do need triggers to remember. But yeah, that
• 30:37
  Speaker 2: one was that one was pretty special.
• 30:39
  Speaker 3: Yeah, well, let's let's talk a little bit more about
• 30:42
  Speaker 3: Phoenix and then let's then let's talk about Brucey going
• 30:44
  Speaker 3: to Hollywood Phoenix.
• 30:46
  Speaker 2: I figured it out pretty quick. I was, uh, my
• 30:51
  Speaker 2: rent was nothing. I had my stee it was like
• 30:53
  Speaker 2: three hundred.
• 30:53
  Speaker 3: And fifty bucks a month for your big studio commercial studio.
• 30:58
  Speaker 2: Yeah, well, you know, it wasn't that huge, but it
• 31:00
  Speaker 2: was adequate and it was downtown. And then I lived
• 31:03
  Speaker 2: in the Squaw Peak Lodge. I think my housing was
• 31:07
  Speaker 2: all in for a studio and home was four hundred
• 31:09
  Speaker 2: and fifty a month. I was pulling down one hundred
• 31:11
  Speaker 2: and twenty five thousand a year working a day of month,
• 31:14
  Speaker 2: you know, and the rest of the time I was
• 31:16
  Speaker 2: either running dirt bikes, crashing and breaking my back on
• 31:19
  Speaker 2: dirt bikes, raising hoby cats or skiing it tell your ride,
• 31:23
  Speaker 2: or running three wheelers in the dunes.
• 31:25
  Speaker 3: Oh yeah, oh favorite story, favorite story.
• 31:28
  Speaker 2: This one.
• 31:29
  Speaker 1: These are all true stories. You're not being This is
• 31:32
  Speaker 1: not April First. You got to tell the story.
• 31:35
  Speaker 3: So you're there in Glenis.
• 31:36
  Speaker 2: So they invented these three wheelers, remember those diabolical three wheelers.
• 31:40
  Speaker 2: The very first ones had no suspension.
• 31:42
  Speaker 3: Did they end up banning them or did they just
• 31:44
  Speaker 3: stop making them because they were getting souk the lawsuits? Yeah,
• 31:47
  Speaker 3: I think there were, yeah, lawsuits. Your legs would go
• 31:49
  Speaker 3: underneath them and you would die.
• 31:51
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's like a wishbone. Where's That's what happened when
• 31:54
  Speaker 2: I broke my back. My legs both went under both
• 31:56
  Speaker 2: wheels and it kind of made a wish Before and
• 32:00
  Speaker 2: before that, we were they Hana came out with a
• 32:03
  Speaker 2: CR two fifty, so it was a two to fifty
• 32:05
  Speaker 2: motocross bike, two stroke in this nice little compact three wheeler.
• 32:10
  Speaker 2: And they were fun. You just slide them and you
• 32:12
  Speaker 2: can bicycle them, you know, do whatever you want. They
• 32:14
  Speaker 2: were only dangerous if you were an idiot and didn't
• 32:17
  Speaker 2: know how to slide and you know, a flat tracker.
• 32:20
  Speaker 2: So we were having a blast. So a buddy and
• 32:23
  Speaker 2: I had them and we got them, and it was
• 32:25
  Speaker 2: it was during the wrong time the season to go
• 32:27
  Speaker 2: over to the Yuma Dunes. It was hot because it
• 32:31
  Speaker 2: was too early, or hop because it was too late,
• 32:34
  Speaker 2: I don't remember, but it was hot. It was hot,
• 32:36
  Speaker 2: and there was nobody there and we're very excited. We
• 32:40
  Speaker 2: just picked them up from the Haunted Dealership through them
• 32:41
  Speaker 2: in the back of my We had a trailer and
• 32:44
  Speaker 2: I had one of those toyotas that everybody wants, the
• 32:46
  Speaker 2: little slid slid SR five long long bed, a single cab,
• 32:52
  Speaker 2: four wheel drive. Yeah, twenty two hour, yeah, perfect slug slow. Anyway,
• 32:56
  Speaker 2: we race out to Yuma, Uh, and we get off
• 33:00
  Speaker 2: this place where we used to always run dune buggies
• 33:02
  Speaker 2: and we unload them and it's we got an hour,
• 33:05
  Speaker 2: you know, before it gets dark. Hell that we're going
• 33:07
  Speaker 2: and you were roosting out there, and we knew our
• 33:10
  Speaker 2: way around and we're heading to the Bowl of Death.
• 33:13
  Speaker 2: It was the highest sand and at the bottom there
• 33:16
  Speaker 2: was a circle about the size of a paper plate
• 33:18
  Speaker 2: that was the hard pack of the desert floor. But
• 33:20
  Speaker 2: other than that, it was just this astonishing deep bowl
• 33:24
  Speaker 2: and once you got in it, you had to kind
• 33:26
  Speaker 2: of get out of it this way. There was no.
• 33:28
  Speaker 3: Corse tornado way out or whatever.
• 33:30
  Speaker 2: Yeah, a reverse toilet flush. And so I come up
• 33:33
  Speaker 2: that roost over the edges and I double take because
• 33:36
  Speaker 2: there's a flipping flying saucer hovering down there about twenty
• 33:40
  Speaker 2: feet off the ground. And I, you know, my momentum
• 33:44
  Speaker 2: carried me around and I come back around and I.
• 33:47
  Speaker 3: And it's this is where we start talking about how
• 33:49
  Speaker 3: aliens are real and we've seen them.
• 33:51
  Speaker 2: It's there. Well, this is the story I always do
• 33:53
  Speaker 2: when if ebody says, anybody ever see an alien? You know?
• 33:56
  Speaker 2: But I mean I'm doing. And I waved my buddy
• 33:59
  Speaker 2: over and I getting to stop, and we marine crawl
• 34:01
  Speaker 2: over and peek over the edge, you know. And we
• 34:03
  Speaker 2: studied that thing for a while, and it was floating
• 34:06
  Speaker 2: in the air down the space. It was big, it
• 34:08
  Speaker 2: was substantial, but it was weird because it kind of
• 34:11
  Speaker 2: looked like an ironclad it kind of like, I don't
• 34:13
  Speaker 2: know anybody even learns this stuff anymore, but it looked
• 34:15
  Speaker 2: like the monitor and the Merrimack kind of the Civil
• 34:17
  Speaker 2: War era about a space. It was like tooles versions
• 34:21
  Speaker 2: flipping thing. And we were watching it and listening for
• 34:24
  Speaker 2: sounds and seeing no activity, and finally we got up
• 34:26
  Speaker 2: the balls to go down there. We go down and
• 34:30
  Speaker 2: we were getting closer and closer to it, and it
• 34:32
  Speaker 2: was even more and more scary because here this thing
• 34:35
  Speaker 2: is and there's no tire tracks, there's nothing, nothing. It
• 34:38
  Speaker 2: was just hovering down there. Where would you hide if
• 34:40
  Speaker 2: you were a spaceship hiding in a dune bowl, you know,
• 34:43
  Speaker 2: it'd be perfect. But we get down there and then
• 34:46
  Speaker 2: I see that there there in the center there was
• 34:49
  Speaker 2: a switchback staircase and it was built on a bunch
• 34:51
  Speaker 2: of tell foam poles.
• 34:53
  Speaker 3: Uh.
• 34:53
  Speaker 2: And it was job of the Huts Sand Cruiser, and
• 34:57
  Speaker 2: that movie was being made and they had finish the shoots.
• 35:00
  Speaker 2: Every day. At the end of the day they would
• 35:02
  Speaker 2: come in with the I learned later they're coming in
• 35:04
  Speaker 2: with a helicopter and blow all the tracks out. And
• 35:06
  Speaker 2: so we climbed all over that thing. It had the
• 35:09
  Speaker 2: trap door for the sand I'll kill you, yeah, And
• 35:13
  Speaker 2: I mean I knew a little bit about showbiz and
• 35:16
  Speaker 2: props and things like that, and the scenic painting on
• 35:18
  Speaker 2: It was astonishing. They had dressed in sand at the
• 35:21
  Speaker 2: base of at the hide all. But you really had
• 35:22
  Speaker 2: to be in the right position to be able to
• 35:24
  Speaker 2: see that.
• 35:25
  Speaker 1: It was a prop Wow.
• 35:27
  Speaker 2: We climbed all over that thing, and then we were
• 35:29
  Speaker 2: wanting to bring some folks back to it, and it
• 35:30
  Speaker 2: was gone. It was gone.
• 35:33
  Speaker 3: Hey, man's see this picture is.
• 35:34
  Speaker 2: And then a couple of years later here came Star Wars.
• 35:37
  Speaker 2: There was the time I built a two story house
• 35:39
  Speaker 2: out in the middle of those same dunes and put
• 35:41
  Speaker 2: in a blue grass lawn and it was for Scott's
• 35:44
  Speaker 2: turf builder or something. And I remember seeing this desert
• 35:47
  Speaker 2: bird fly over and he does the same kind of
• 35:49
  Speaker 2: double take I did, you know. And he lands and
• 35:52
  Speaker 2: he's rolling around on the grass and chirping and everything,
• 35:56
  Speaker 2: and I'm going, bro, go get your friends, you know,
• 36:00
  Speaker 2: and we're out of there in a couple of hours.
• 36:01
  Speaker 2: And I just imagined him going, no, I swear it
• 36:04
  Speaker 2: was right here. Bluegrass was right here, Kentucky bluegrass. Yeah,
• 36:08
  Speaker 2: oh way. I brought in several flatbed trailers of Kentucky bluegrass,
• 36:12
  Speaker 2: which turned to Bacon in about an hour and a half.
• 36:15
  Speaker 2: Because of the son just completely destroyed it. But I
• 36:18
  Speaker 2: digressed that was that was one of the many, many
• 36:22
  Speaker 2: fun ones.
• 36:23
  Speaker 3: So let's just imagine you riding that little three wheeler
• 36:25
  Speaker 3: all the way to Hollywood, and let's transition to there.
• 36:28
  Speaker 2: Now I went. The way I got to Hollywood was
• 36:29
  Speaker 2: in my Persian Sand colored nineteen sixty Cadillac convertible, which
• 36:34
  Speaker 2: was some kind of a magnet. I'm trying to remember
• 36:36
  Speaker 2: what kind of a magnet was it was. I was
• 36:39
  Speaker 2: very popular when I drove Sunset Strip with the top
• 36:41
  Speaker 2: down and that thing. I remember. I'd be sitting at
• 36:43
  Speaker 2: a traffic light and the suspension would gently settle, and
• 36:46
  Speaker 2: I'd look back and there'd be three young ladies that
• 36:48
  Speaker 2: had decided to hop in. I recommend nineteen sixty Cadillac
• 36:53
  Speaker 2: for any scenario in Persian sand, which is code for
• 36:55
  Speaker 2: metallic pink. And I drove it with the gangster leans,
• 36:58
  Speaker 2: steering at like.
• 36:59
  Speaker 3: You know, you know what all these stories of people
• 37:01
  Speaker 3: like having cars and then ladies being attracted to them,
• 37:05
  Speaker 3: But the only people who talk to me about my
• 37:07
  Speaker 3: cars are guys.
• 37:08
  Speaker 2: Yeah, well see it looks like some people can ruin
• 37:11
  Speaker 2: even the sexiest car. What can I say? Leave the
• 37:15
  Speaker 2: Porsches alone. Would you please just leave them alone? I
• 37:18
  Speaker 2: am the Porsche people. My dad warned me about. The
• 37:21
  Speaker 2: move to Hollywood came out of the blue. I was
• 37:23
  Speaker 2: went from having nothing to do in Phoenix to develop
• 37:27
  Speaker 2: them the Phoenix for the Arizona Phoenix Art Director's Club
• 37:30
  Speaker 2: and got a lot of work. My kind of photography
• 37:34
  Speaker 2: was different. They did a lot of tabletop in large
• 37:36
  Speaker 2: format and I was more loose, handheld and you know,
• 37:40
  Speaker 2: sort of lifestyle kind of stuff. Started shooting motion picture
• 37:44
  Speaker 2: stuff there. Worked for another guy who was a producer
• 37:47
  Speaker 2: director and he needed a cameraman. I said yes. Recurring
• 37:51
  Speaker 2: theme in my life is say yes even if I shouldn't,
• 37:54
  Speaker 2: and then figuring out how to make that yes turn
• 37:57
  Speaker 2: out okay. Did a few spots, started my own product company.
• 38:00
  Speaker 2: Ended up in the Cleo Awards, which is kind of
• 38:03
  Speaker 2: like the Tony's Emmys. It's a big deal marcial sits yeah,
• 38:07
  Speaker 2: and so I was in the finals for a you know,
• 38:10
  Speaker 2: I forget what category it was in, but I was
• 38:12
  Speaker 2: up against the biggest special effects house in the world,
• 38:15
  Speaker 2: and with my little tiny holds it was like.
• 38:18
  Speaker 3: A million dollar budget. There were twenty five thousand dollars budget.
• 38:21
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and then my stuff. If it need to set,
• 38:23
  Speaker 2: I built it. If it needed hand talent, poor beer,
• 38:25
  Speaker 2: I'd get a manicure and pour the beer and I'd
• 38:28
  Speaker 2: did everything I could possibly do. Anyway, I was up
• 38:30
  Speaker 2: against something. Pretty sure they beat me. Within a few
• 38:32
  Speaker 2: weeks of the awards ceremony, I got a phone call
• 38:35
  Speaker 2: from the big effects house and they wanted me to
• 38:37
  Speaker 2: come over and interview. So I flew over fifty five
• 38:41
  Speaker 2: minute fly. I had an interview. They offered me a job,
• 38:44
  Speaker 2: an independent contractor job.
• 38:46
  Speaker 3: And this was Robert Able and a sober table, which
• 38:48
  Speaker 3: is a big deal if you look at I mean,
• 38:50
  Speaker 3: they were like the pioneering motion graphics special effects house.
• 38:54
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it was Industrial Light and Magic and Digital Productions
• 38:59
  Speaker 2: and rob Able and the ILM was the ILM guys,
• 39:03
  Speaker 2: Industrial line match guys were kind of specializing in feature
• 39:05
  Speaker 2: stuff because it was Lucas George Lucas and Lucasfilm. We
• 39:09
  Speaker 2: were doing commercials and Robert abeless. She really couldn't do
• 39:12
  Speaker 2: any couldn't bed the big jobs because they didn't have
• 39:15
  Speaker 2: any directors. They had a ton of really talented uh
• 39:19
  Speaker 2: special effects people or graphics people. That's where I met Mara.
• 39:23
  Speaker 2: She's in the history books for her work that she
• 39:25
  Speaker 2: did at Robert Abeles as a designer.
• 39:28
  Speaker 1: And wasn't she somehow involved with the Beam Me Up Scottie. Yeah,
• 39:32
  Speaker 1: yeah she did, which is amazing.
• 39:33
  Speaker 2: Yeah, she did the wormhole sequences and that hyperspace thing.
• 39:38
  Speaker 2: That's my wife. Yeah. She she's literally in the history
• 39:41
  Speaker 2: book for her.
• 39:42
  Speaker 3: Yeah, we should have had her, and she's a lot better.
• 39:46
  Speaker 2: And she would be here telling me. She'd be you
• 39:47
  Speaker 2: can you can hear her eye rolls from here because
• 39:51
  Speaker 2: she I'm telling stories. I told one not too long
• 39:54
  Speaker 2: ago that she had never heard, which which I saw.
• 40:00
  Speaker 2: It was a really cool place to work. I went
• 40:04
  Speaker 2: in there and I figured out special effects pretty quick
• 40:07
  Speaker 2: because I'm a mechanic, right number one. I was a
• 40:09
  Speaker 2: mechanic number two as a designer artist. And so here's
• 40:13
  Speaker 2: this confluence of cameras and logical thinking. You know, we
• 40:17
  Speaker 2: invented the first motion control camera there where the camera
• 40:20
  Speaker 2: shoots and moves and shoots and moves, and we also
• 40:23
  Speaker 2: did and I'm saying we because as a company I
• 40:26
  Speaker 2: was kind of around the edges. But I remember advising
• 40:29
  Speaker 2: the computer guys when they were doing the first mocap suit,
• 40:32
  Speaker 2: you know, like in that guy Andy Serkis who does
• 40:35
  Speaker 2: goll Them and the Monkeys and Planet of the Apes
• 40:38
  Speaker 2: and everything. They were trying to figure out how to
• 40:40
  Speaker 2: not have to use a classic Disney cell flop animator
• 40:43
  Speaker 2: to do animal locomotion. They were trying to figure out
• 40:45
  Speaker 2: how to shortcut actually having a proper illustrator. So I
• 40:50
  Speaker 2: had taken drafting in high school. I knew you could
• 40:53
  Speaker 2: describe any object with three angles front view, top few,
• 40:55
  Speaker 2: inside view. So we took these old Mitchell Rockover cameras
• 41:00
  Speaker 2: that were used to document the nuclear tests and we
• 41:04
  Speaker 2: put we put a Geiger counter on them, and they
• 41:07
  Speaker 2: were like we went off the charts, So I mean
• 41:09
  Speaker 2: we were bikini. Yeah, they were half a fifty million
• 41:12
  Speaker 2: year half life and we're putting our eyes on them
• 41:14
  Speaker 2: all day long and it would fog the film. We're going,
• 41:17
  Speaker 2: what is the film fogged? Because you're putting it in a
• 41:19
  Speaker 2: nuclear You're putting in a radioactive box front the top
• 41:22
  Speaker 2: of the inside view. And we went down to the
• 41:24
  Speaker 2: office store and got those little avery dots like you
• 41:26
  Speaker 2: used to put on file folders, red one for the screen,
• 41:29
  Speaker 2: one for that, put one on every joint and then
• 41:32
  Speaker 2: had the three cameras shoot it and then play that
• 41:34
  Speaker 2: stuff back and physically track the elements. And then you
• 41:37
  Speaker 2: could create a skeleton on which you could a hierarchical
• 41:41
  Speaker 2: animation upon which you could skin. You know, you could
• 41:44
  Speaker 2: then put for or texture or so on, and then
• 41:47
  Speaker 2: we had to figure out how to light stuff. And
• 41:48
  Speaker 2: because I had a little bit of knowledge in all
• 41:50
  Speaker 2: these areas, I was handy. You know. There were people
• 41:53
  Speaker 2: that were mathematicians that were staying at blackboards, whiteboards just
• 41:56
  Speaker 2: working out the original vector graphics and then raster graphic,
• 42:00
  Speaker 2: and I was all coming from there. They were doing
• 42:02
  Speaker 2: something similar at ILM. I went from doing some little
• 42:05
  Speaker 2: tiny jobs to doing the biggest clients on Earth. You know.
• 42:09
  Speaker 2: Another it was like going from the Texaco station to Rakovic.
• 42:13
  Speaker 2: But now I'm going from small town production to biggest
• 42:17
  Speaker 2: budgets there ever were. It was the eighties and you know,
• 42:22
  Speaker 2: I was doing Super Bowl spots and I launched the
• 42:25
  Speaker 2: C four Corvette.
• 42:27
  Speaker 3: Oh I didn't know about that one.
• 42:28
  Speaker 2: Turbo Turbot, Mustang Thunderbird, Turbo coop. Yeah, and not all
• 42:33
  Speaker 2: of them as I director on but either, you know,
• 42:36
  Speaker 2: either I became creative director of the company, and so
• 42:41
  Speaker 2: any job that came in, and I think it was
• 42:44
  Speaker 2: the visual communications and the brainstorming and free association. That's
• 42:47
  Speaker 2: kind of what actually what I would like to be
• 42:49
  Speaker 2: doing going forward with the AI is is kind of
• 42:52
  Speaker 2: teach creative thinking, you know, because a lot of stuff
• 42:56
  Speaker 2: that comes natural to me. I'll look at something, I'll
• 42:58
  Speaker 2: go But a lot of people just can prime that pump,
• 43:02
  Speaker 2: you know, and there are technologies and systemologies that can
• 43:06
  Speaker 2: allow you to kickstart a idle brain.
• 43:10
  Speaker 1: Well, let's talk about let's unpack that a little bit.
• 43:13
  Speaker 1: Like if someone's listening and they want to be more creative,
• 43:16
  Speaker 1: or they want they want to come up with new
• 43:19
  Speaker 1: original ideas or better ideas, what are some of the
• 43:21
  Speaker 1: basics that you used to mind.
• 43:23
  Speaker 3: Expanding drugs portion of the podcast, you.
• 43:26
  Speaker 2: Know, brainstorming, free association and synectics. Synectics is one of
• 43:31
  Speaker 2: my areas that I think is really interesting and you
• 43:33
  Speaker 2: can you jump on the bot and read up on them,
• 43:37
  Speaker 2: because what I could tell you now could be done,
• 43:39
  Speaker 2: you know, in the next hour twelve seconds for a
• 43:43
  Speaker 2: bot to go into But there there are ways to
• 43:45
  Speaker 2: break down a problem by analyzing it's just like the
• 43:49
  Speaker 2: answer is always in the question, right, So if you
• 43:53
  Speaker 2: can properly ideate and articulate to yourself what it is
• 43:57
  Speaker 2: you're trying to do, then within there are actually technology
• 44:01
  Speaker 2: systemologies that can allow you to fire it up. And
• 44:05
  Speaker 2: it's just kind of like prime and a pump. A
• 44:07
  Speaker 2: dry hand pump will never do anything unless you pour
• 44:09
  Speaker 2: a little something. In a synectics in particular, you take
• 44:13
  Speaker 2: keywords and then you elaborate from that. But I think
• 44:15
  Speaker 2: it'd be easier to just kind of research that stuff.
• 44:18
  Speaker 2: You know, I spent four or five years full time teaching.
• 44:20
  Speaker 2: I taught visual communications and all levels of photography. In
• 44:24
  Speaker 2: the process of doing that, there was no syllabus, there
• 44:27
  Speaker 2: was no They just dumped me in there, and so
• 44:29
  Speaker 2: I sort of created my own way of teaching. And
• 44:33
  Speaker 2: anybody in an art school was generally the best artists
• 44:37
  Speaker 2: in their high school. And it's just like being the
• 44:40
  Speaker 2: tallest kid in your high school. You're going to play basketball,
• 44:43
  Speaker 2: you're the tallest kid. They volleyballer basketball, you're the artistic kid.
• 44:46
  Speaker 2: You're going to be an artist. But they're never challenged
• 44:49
  Speaker 2: and they're never taught high school art, middle school, grade
• 44:53
  Speaker 2: school art, you're the one that can handle staying within
• 44:55
  Speaker 2: the lines or going outside lines, whichever is sort of appropriate,
• 44:58
  Speaker 2: and you have a sensibility for color to then actually
• 45:01
  Speaker 2: study that stuff and be challenged. So anybody that came
• 45:05
  Speaker 2: in there was whatever they produced the first semester was average,
• 45:09
  Speaker 2: you know, and then from there on they had to grow.
• 45:11
  Speaker 2: Because I had a high school art teacher that did
• 45:14
  Speaker 2: that to me. I mean, I was always the you know,
• 45:17
  Speaker 2: best with the crans or the pencil or the airbrush
• 45:19
  Speaker 2: or whatever, and he just he just shut me down.
• 45:22
  Speaker 2: He just goes, eh, see, what a minute. I've never
• 45:25
  Speaker 2: gotten anything less than a plus. Yeah, but that's average
• 45:28
  Speaker 2: for you. So you got to impress me. You got
• 45:30
  Speaker 2: to improve. And that got me off my got me
• 45:32
  Speaker 2: off my ass, honestly, you know. And that's what I
• 45:35
  Speaker 2: try to do in mentoring is number one. Well, when
• 45:37
  Speaker 2: I was teaching, I'd always try to identify the strength
• 45:40
  Speaker 2: of the particular student, and then I would try to
• 45:43
  Speaker 2: force multiply that because you can try to jam at
• 45:46
  Speaker 2: square peg into a round hole, but it's better to
• 45:48
  Speaker 2: just really make it a more precise fit in the
• 45:51
  Speaker 2: round hole, you know. So whenever i'm mentoring or when
• 45:55
  Speaker 2: I went from what I learned teaching made me really
• 45:59
  Speaker 2: good at a film set. As a director, you're it's
• 46:02
  Speaker 2: a benevolent dictatorship. It's your vision. Everybody is there to execute.
• 46:07
  Speaker 2: But everyone in that room is the best at what
• 46:09
  Speaker 2: they do, or they don't make it to that set.
• 46:11
  Speaker 2: You know, you can either work with them or you
• 46:14
  Speaker 2: can struggle against them. And one of the things I
• 46:18
  Speaker 2: learned when I was teaching was to listen, watch and learn,
• 46:21
  Speaker 2: and then figure out the best way to move everything forward.
• 46:24
  Speaker 2: So on my sets, I appreciate what the makeup artists
• 46:27
  Speaker 2: had to say, I appreciate what the key grip had
• 46:29
  Speaker 2: to say. I made the decisions, but the fact that
• 46:32
  Speaker 2: I respected all the players made us all sort of
• 46:35
  Speaker 2: elevate the game. Never had more joy and fulfillment than
• 46:39
  Speaker 2: running a set. You know, being out in the middle
• 46:41
  Speaker 2: of somewhere getting ready to shoot at dawn and you
• 46:44
  Speaker 2: got twenty grip trucks and caterers all this. I'm going,
• 46:47
  Speaker 2: I cannot believe they're paying me to do this. Sure,
• 46:51
  Speaker 2: but yeah, a lot of automotive, a lot of special effects,
• 46:55
  Speaker 2: every category. It was just I was in the right
• 46:57
  Speaker 2: place at the right time, you know.
• 46:59
  Speaker 3: And it's that kind of recurring theme of the love
• 47:02
  Speaker 3: for educational, love for mentoring, you know, seems to have
• 47:06
  Speaker 3: been the next phase, you know, as we continue to
• 47:08
  Speaker 3: unwrap the onion, it's the next phase of Bruce's life.
• 47:12
  Speaker 2: You know. I don't think you ever learn anything as
• 47:14
  Speaker 2: much as when you have to explain it to somebody else. Yeah,
• 47:16
  Speaker 2: you know, that's I was not prepared to teach, and
• 47:19
  Speaker 2: I'm a teaching degree. I couldn't teach high school or
• 47:21
  Speaker 2: grade school. But I was able to be a college professor,
• 47:24
  Speaker 2: not a professor luturer. You got to really earn a
• 47:26
  Speaker 2: professorship on. I'm DGA director Director's Guild of America. Yeah,
• 47:32
  Speaker 2: so to be an assistant director you have to go
• 47:35
  Speaker 2: through layers and layers of education and you have to
• 47:39
  Speaker 2: understand all of these things. But as a director, you
• 47:41
  Speaker 2: just have to come in there with a vision and
• 47:43
  Speaker 2: somebody who's backing that vision. I would never qualify to
• 47:46
  Speaker 2: be an assistant director or a production manager. Maybe I
• 47:49
  Speaker 2: would because I've been around them so much and I
• 47:52
  Speaker 2: learned from everybody I work with over and over again.
• 47:55
  Speaker 2: It's been a combination of confidence and a crude experience
• 48:00
  Speaker 2: that allowed me to just step into the highest level
• 48:03
  Speaker 2: of something. My life's not been just like this rocket
• 48:06
  Speaker 2: sled ride to the top. I've had plenty of backsliding
• 48:09
  Speaker 2: and all that stuff. When an opportunity has come up
• 48:11
  Speaker 2: to be in charge, I grab that, you know. And
• 48:16
  Speaker 2: when I have a bunch of people to work with,
• 48:18
  Speaker 2: I look at them as assets. I'm not going to
• 48:20
  Speaker 2: just push them around. I want to harness and direct
• 48:25
  Speaker 2: all that stuff. Robert Abele and Associates was really like this.
• 48:29
  Speaker 2: It was really great. We were doing all the best clients,
• 48:32
  Speaker 2: and I was shooting two hundred and seventy days out
• 48:34
  Speaker 2: of the year, and I cut a pretty good day rate.
• 48:38
  Speaker 2: My day rate had a lot of zeros in it.
• 48:40
  Speaker 2: And then I participated in the mark up on the jobs.
• 48:42
  Speaker 2: And more importantly, I've benefited when I would bring a
• 48:46
  Speaker 2: job in under budget. That was unheard of when I
• 48:48
  Speaker 2: cut my deal, nobody had ever heard of a director
• 48:51
  Speaker 2: who would come in under budget. But I'm the kind of.
• 48:53
  Speaker 3: Person, Yeah, you've told me about the angry South African
• 48:57
  Speaker 3: that would wreck the portion and just go hang out
• 48:59
  Speaker 3: on it. Where you were kind of like, you know what,
• 49:02
  Speaker 3: I'm going to work for this. I'm going to I
• 49:03
  Speaker 3: was the guy in Phoenix that would bring things under budget. Yeah,
• 49:07
  Speaker 3: I'll take less money, but I want to cut.
• 49:09
  Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, yeah. So I have no business degree, and
• 49:12
  Speaker 2: certainly anybody in the commercial arts, you know, you make
• 49:14
  Speaker 2: your money from the commercial side of the arts. You know,
• 49:17
  Speaker 2: a talent and eight bucks will get you a small latte.
• 49:21
  Speaker 2: I guess I have a fair amount of street smarts,
• 49:23
  Speaker 2: you know. I think of myself as a problem solver,
• 49:25
  Speaker 2: and some guys in my capacity just go, oh, we've
• 49:29
  Speaker 2: got three million bucks, six million bus to do this.
• 49:31
  Speaker 2: They spend it all. What I try to do is
• 49:33
  Speaker 2: figure out the smartest way to do it and come
• 49:36
  Speaker 2: away with a lot of profit. Now I don't leave
• 49:39
  Speaker 2: any production value on the table. I get it on
• 49:43
  Speaker 2: the screen. I had to build the inside of a
• 49:45
  Speaker 2: spaceship one time. It was like this whatever this name
• 49:48
  Speaker 2: of the spaceship is in Aliens. That's sort of real
• 49:52
  Speaker 2: gritty looking, you know, working spaceship. I had to do
• 49:55
  Speaker 2: that for some Tycho commercial or something. The budget for
• 49:59
  Speaker 2: the set was three quarters a million dollars because it's
• 50:02
  Speaker 2: you know, I have this really spectacular set. I got
• 50:06
  Speaker 2: a scout and found a defunct hydro damn up in
• 50:10
  Speaker 2: British Columbia, and I run it for six hundred bucks,
• 50:12
  Speaker 2: and I put a bunch of Christmas tree lights all
• 50:14
  Speaker 2: over the background out of focus, and got all those
• 50:17
  Speaker 2: dynamos painted up and everything. I think I spent five
• 50:21
  Speaker 2: grand out of that seven hundred and fifty grand on
• 50:23
  Speaker 2: the set. And the client was just this is awesome.
• 50:25
  Speaker 2: You know, got problem solving and doing that kind of stuff.
• 50:28
  Speaker 2: Would I was doing that at Robert Abele and Associates.
• 50:32
  Speaker 2: One day.
• 50:32
  Speaker 3: They was a bit of drama happened, and yeah, fishermen
• 50:36
  Speaker 3: came in.
• 50:36
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I was an independent contractor, but the guy
• 50:39
  Speaker 2: owned the company represented me as an employee and created
• 50:43
  Speaker 2: an annual report that was not exactly honest and sold
• 50:47
  Speaker 2: me like a football player to another league, and.
• 50:51
  Speaker 3: That you were a free agent.
• 50:52
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that that deal couldn't go down. A bunch of
• 50:55
  Speaker 2: stuff happened. They were very surprised that they weren't buying
• 50:58
  Speaker 2: me and every but he went away mad and I
• 51:02
  Speaker 2: opened Brucetorn Films the next day and took all the
• 51:04
  Speaker 2: clients that were suddenly abandoned Robert abel and Associates. A
• 51:08
  Speaker 2: lot of people scattered to the wind. I opened Brucetarn
• 51:11
  Speaker 2: Films out of my producer's garage and then found the
• 51:13
  Speaker 2: space and then a lot of building in Hollywood and
• 51:16
  Speaker 2: proceeded from there. I had really good fortune with finding
• 51:20
  Speaker 2: good people who like to work with me. Number of
• 51:22
  Speaker 2: people have worked with me, have won Academy Awards and
• 51:25
  Speaker 2: multiple Academy Awards going on to work in long form.
• 51:27
  Speaker 2: I never went into long form. I regret it to
• 51:30
  Speaker 2: a degree. But I also didn't spend my life on
• 51:34
  Speaker 2: three movies. You know. I did a lot of interesting
• 51:36
  Speaker 2: and different stuff, and I was around a bit for
• 51:38
  Speaker 2: my kids growing up. Yeah, So I was doing all
• 51:42
  Speaker 2: that stuff up until I had a big physical surprise.
• 51:47
  Speaker 2: I was racing a lot. I had a lot of
• 51:50
  Speaker 2: race cars and a lot of different divisions, and I
• 51:52
  Speaker 2: was sitting in a race car and my legs went numb.
• 51:54
  Speaker 2: I thought the belts were too tight. We were waiting
• 51:56
  Speaker 2: to go on the track, wait and go on the track,
• 51:58
  Speaker 2: starting the engines, killing them. The race that was on
• 52:00
  Speaker 2: the track before us was having a lot of accidents.
• 52:04
  Speaker 2: So we were sitting in staging and just in there,
• 52:06
  Speaker 2: and I'm feeling my legs go the numb. The kind
• 52:09
  Speaker 2: of ten thousand needles kind of thing when you know,
• 52:11
  Speaker 2: sleep wrong on your arm and you lose blood circulation.
• 52:14
  Speaker 2: Well that didn't go away, so I was the guys
• 52:17
  Speaker 2: had to put a tie down strap under my arms.
• 52:20
  Speaker 2: I won the race with my with my foot like clubs.
• 52:23
  Speaker 2: Somehow tell manage to have enough throttle control. I won
• 52:26
  Speaker 2: the race, but the guys had to pull me out
• 52:28
  Speaker 2: of the car and I couldn't stand up. So that
• 52:31
  Speaker 2: and that lasted for quite a while, and I had
• 52:34
  Speaker 2: to in the business of being an it girl an
• 52:39
  Speaker 2: it boy doing creative stuff. They call you, you say yes,
• 52:43
  Speaker 2: and in the day you can't say yes, they have
• 52:45
  Speaker 2: to get someone else, and they go back to that
• 52:47
  Speaker 2: someone else. So I had to. I had to say
• 52:50
  Speaker 2: no to an awful lot of people, and that sort
• 52:52
  Speaker 2: of killed my momentum. Ultimately, after tons and tons of
• 52:55
  Speaker 2: tests thinking I had late on set ms and all
• 52:59
  Speaker 2: this stuff, that turned out that at some point and
• 53:01
  Speaker 2: I had my insurance would not cover anything if it
• 53:04
  Speaker 2: was motorsports related. And I had had some wheels fail
• 53:08
  Speaker 2: and I'd hit the wall, drove straight into the wall
• 53:10
  Speaker 2: at one hundred and twenty a couple of times, you know,
• 53:12
  Speaker 2: and so I had had some pretty solid whiplash and
• 53:15
  Speaker 2: maybe concussions. But I'm going to the doctor and I'm going,
• 53:18
  Speaker 2: He's going, what's wrong with you? I'm describing what's wrong.
• 53:20
  Speaker 2: He goes, well, what do you? I go, Well, I
• 53:22
  Speaker 2: fall off ladders a lot, and I snapped my head
• 53:24
  Speaker 2: forward like this when I fall off those ladders. You know,
• 53:26
  Speaker 2: I have making up stories. Eventually, after multiple spinal taps
• 53:30
  Speaker 2: and trips through into the scanners and all that stuff,
• 53:36
  Speaker 2: one of the guys goes, do you work near a generator?
• 53:38
  Speaker 2: Do you work near a gasoline generator? I go, I
• 53:40
  Speaker 2: do on the weekends. I spend all weekend next to
• 53:43
  Speaker 2: a really big gasoline generator. It was kind of carbon
• 53:48
  Speaker 2: monoxide poisoning was the last thing they were looking at.
• 53:51
  Speaker 2: Heavy metals build up in my system and stuff. But
• 53:55
  Speaker 2: while we're still screening around trying to figure out my
• 53:57
  Speaker 2: legs kind of came back and it was reinvention time.
• 54:03
  Speaker 2: I was doing a lot of teaching myself computer skills
• 54:06
  Speaker 2: because you got to keep going.
• 54:07
  Speaker 3: That was when you were starting to do the Correl stuff.
• 54:09
  Speaker 2: Yeah, Corel painter photoshop, and.
• 54:13
  Speaker 3: How do you describe Correl painter? I vaguely remember it.
• 54:17
  Speaker 2: They called a mark making program, and basically you can
• 54:20
  Speaker 2: make brushes. You can replicate an oil brush at this
• 54:26
  Speaker 2: scumble and all these kinds of stuff that relate to
• 54:30
  Speaker 2: a natural media brush. They have handful of brushes. But
• 54:34
  Speaker 2: then you can design your own, so it's it's not
• 54:36
  Speaker 2: a push a button thing. You're using a stylus like
• 54:39
  Speaker 2: a walk them stylust, and you stroke by stroke renders
• 54:43
  Speaker 2: so it's as much time as doing an oil painting
• 54:45
  Speaker 2: or a watercolor butt no paint drying time, and you
• 54:48
  Speaker 2: can hit an undo button, but I avoided the undo button.
• 54:51
  Speaker 2: I like a traditional painter. If you paint yourself in
• 54:55
  Speaker 2: the corner, paint yourself out of the corner, you know.
• 54:57
  Speaker 2: I approached it as a guy had nothing better to do,
• 55:00
  Speaker 2: and I became one of the earliest painter masters, and
• 55:04
  Speaker 2: I was at that time considered to be one of
• 55:06
  Speaker 2: the best in the world. In international competitions against the
• 55:09
  Speaker 2: Chinese and Russians and all that did neoclassical looking ballet
• 55:13
  Speaker 2: imagery and motorsport airbrushy looking stuff won the Kodak Innovator's Award,
• 55:19
  Speaker 2: which is that was that was funny.
• 55:21
  Speaker 3: Mar Kodak was a company that made fil.
• 55:23
  Speaker 2: Yeah, they were big at one point, back when the
• 55:25
  Speaker 2: cameras wanted to put something in the care. But that's funny.
• 55:28
  Speaker 2: Mar Actually I was my wife, Maria. I was introduced
• 55:32
  Speaker 2: to Correll because my wife was messed around with it
• 55:34
  Speaker 2: and she and I go, what are you doing there?
• 55:36
  Speaker 2: She goes, go away, leave me alone, stop looking, and
• 55:39
  Speaker 2: I go, no seriously. She does no seriously, and I go, well,
• 55:42
  Speaker 2: at least tell me what it is, Correll. So we're
• 55:44
  Speaker 2: working on it separately, and uh, I don't know how
• 55:47
  Speaker 2: it was that we came to enter the Kodak and
• 55:49
  Speaker 2: the Innovator's Award. But one day the phone rang and
• 55:53
  Speaker 2: mar picks it up, and she's increasingly excited and she goes,
• 55:55
  Speaker 2: I won the Kodak Innovators Award and rubbing my face
• 55:59
  Speaker 2: in and dancing and everything. The phone rang again and
• 56:02
  Speaker 2: they it was the only year they gave two people,
• 56:04
  Speaker 2: and they had no idea that we were related. Left
• 56:06
  Speaker 2: alone married. So after she had had rubbed my nose
• 56:10
  Speaker 2: and it really severely, I went, sorry. It was since
• 56:15
  Speaker 2: I moved here, you know, I was doing a lot
• 56:18
  Speaker 2: of different kind of stuff, Western imagery and so on.
• 56:21
  Speaker 2: I was awarded a artists and residency with the Idol
• 56:24
  Speaker 2: George Museum and I showed alongside Angel Adams Uh. I
• 56:29
  Speaker 2: entered the this is a big Western Art competition that
• 56:32
  Speaker 2: happens here on Memorial Day weekend that the fipp And
• 56:36
  Speaker 2: Museum and the Western Art Magazine show on the town square.
• 56:39
  Speaker 2: I entered that once and want it. So I was
• 56:42
  Speaker 2: actually licensing imagery. This is some of the stuff I
• 56:46
  Speaker 2: was doing before we stumbled into each other. Yeah, that's right,
• 56:48
  Speaker 2: And so I was ditch you guys meet.
• 56:56
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I won't explain that one.
• 56:58
  Speaker 2: Yeah, you have to explain that one. Nice dry no.
• 57:03
  Speaker 2: Scotti called one day won some advice on some camera gear.
• 57:07
  Speaker 2: I was. I was actually designed a line of camera equipment,
• 57:11
  Speaker 2: that's right. And at one point we had three hundred
• 57:14
  Speaker 2: part numbers that I had designed and I won some
• 57:17
  Speaker 2: design industrial design awards and it was kind of good
• 57:20
  Speaker 2: h for a while, and Scotti called and was talking
• 57:23
  Speaker 2: about it, and we realized we were in the same town.
• 57:26
  Speaker 2: I mean yeah, it was crazy. I mean yeah. So
• 57:30
  Speaker 2: then it was just the.
• 57:31
  Speaker 1: Coolest looking follow focus out there. It just looked it
• 57:34
  Speaker 1: was very robust and minimalists, which we needed for being
• 57:38
  Speaker 1: in the field and next thing you know, you.
• 57:40
  Speaker 2: Know, it was like when one of mahan to use
• 57:43
  Speaker 2: many another reference nobody understands. But when the Hanna gold
• 57:45
  Speaker 2: Wing came out, it was.
• 57:46
  Speaker 3: This Porsche style flat six water cool engine.
• 57:50
  Speaker 2: Yeah, a boxer engine and a motorcycle and it was spectacular.
• 57:53
  Speaker 2: And and then some of the people started designing saddle
• 57:56
  Speaker 2: bags and windscreens and everything and it was the platform
• 57:59
  Speaker 2: of choice. And then Honda created all that stuff and
• 58:03
  Speaker 2: put all of these accessory companies out of business. My
• 58:06
  Speaker 2: accessory company, which I designed, I was a preferred vendor
• 58:10
  Speaker 2: for Panasonic, Sony, Cannon, and Nikon, and Sony actually approached
• 58:16
  Speaker 2: me to design some components for them, which is pretty
• 58:19
  Speaker 2: interesting because normally with the Japanese company, it's not invented
• 58:23
  Speaker 2: here forget it. Yeah, I was doing all this stuff
• 58:25
  Speaker 2: and then they just created their own versions or they
• 58:28
  Speaker 2: added features to the camera that made my stuff irrelevant.
• 58:33
  Speaker 2: So that was another arc of doing something kind of fun.
• 58:37
  Speaker 2: We had some coffee, I think, and then you're getting
• 58:39
  Speaker 2: ready to do the original The Loneliest Loneliest Place.
• 58:43
  Speaker 1: That's right.
• 58:44
  Speaker 2: That was over Thanksgiving and you said I'm not going
• 58:47
  Speaker 2: to sit and watch football. I never do, And I said,
• 58:49
  Speaker 2: I got sons in law I don't really like, and
• 58:51
  Speaker 2: they're going to sit at my house and watch football.
• 58:53
  Speaker 1: Can I come with you?
• 58:54
  Speaker 2: That's right, exactly.
• 58:56
  Speaker 1: Think you had about two days notice.
• 58:57
  Speaker 2: Oh, and I didn't know we were going on an
• 58:59
  Speaker 2: actual get out of the car thing. I was, as usual,
• 59:03
  Speaker 2: in the wrong clothes. And I remember when we stopped
• 59:05
  Speaker 2: at flag Staff, I bought a Leader water bottle just
• 59:09
  Speaker 2: because I thought it was cool. And then next thing
• 59:11
  Speaker 2: you know, we're marching up the fifty eight mile bench. Yeah. Yeah,
• 59:15
  Speaker 2: I thought we were going to just go for a drive,
• 59:17
  Speaker 2: and then we're we didn't quite have to make a
• 59:19
  Speaker 2: snow cave, but we were huddled under a rock ledge.
• 59:22
  Speaker 1: Yeah that's right. Oh, that was such a fun trip,
• 59:25
  Speaker 1: trying to get to the most remote point in the States.
• 59:29
  Speaker 3: I did a similar trip. I guess I did an
• 59:31
  Speaker 3: EV to a similar spot.
• 59:33
  Speaker 2: I did so.
• 59:34
  Speaker 1: I when Bruce and I did this trip with Cam
• 59:37
  Speaker 1: from Nemo and Ray Highland and everybody, the goal was
• 59:41
  Speaker 1: to actually get to the physical location that was the
• 59:43
  Speaker 1: most remote, which included trekking for hiking for many miles.
• 59:47
  Speaker 1: But what we recently did was we took an ev
• 59:50
  Speaker 1: to the most remote point that you can access on
• 59:53
  Speaker 1: a dirt road in the lower forty eight, which is
• 59:55
  Speaker 1: in the same area, which is slightly different location.
• 59:58
  Speaker 2: I remember when we were doing the original trip, and
• 1:00:00
  Speaker 2: that's ten years ago. I realized I was the oldest
• 1:00:04
  Speaker 2: guy by twenty years, and I figured it's going to
• 1:00:08
  Speaker 2: take him extra time to get my corpse out of here.
• 1:00:11
  Speaker 2: So I just volunteered to do everything first, the repelling
• 1:00:13
  Speaker 2: and ring and all that was. Yeah, no, that was
• 1:00:17
  Speaker 2: That was a lot of fun, a lot of it.
• 1:00:19
  Speaker 1: I do have some great photos of you repelling.
• 1:00:21
  Speaker 2: Do you think that repelling artist made my butt look
• 1:00:23
  Speaker 2: bit the honest? You know?
• 1:00:26
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you were fantastic. Yes, you're fantastic. So that started
• 1:00:30
  Speaker 1: that started some. And you I mean, you had jeeps
• 1:00:33
  Speaker 1: and you'd done a lot of off road driving and
• 1:00:37
  Speaker 1: dirt driving and writing and everything else like that, but
• 1:00:40
  Speaker 1: not combining that with travel really well.
• 1:00:43
  Speaker 2: And not having chums. You know, that's that's the thing
• 1:00:46
  Speaker 2: about the overlanding community versus having a four wheel drive
• 1:00:49
  Speaker 2: and driving and around the mall and all that stuff.
• 1:00:51
  Speaker 2: You know, it's super valuable to me. I mean, obviously
• 1:00:54
  Speaker 2: that chance meeting we then led to the opportunity for
• 1:00:58
  Speaker 2: me to join you on expeditions.
• 1:01:00
  Speaker 3: That's where the romance really started. That was the big
• 1:01:03
  Speaker 3: spoon Little spoon mom was sleeping together.
• 1:01:07
  Speaker 2: Yeah not why joking when we say we spend more
• 1:01:09
  Speaker 2: time sleeping with each other than with our wives. And
• 1:01:12
  Speaker 2: he is incredibly snugly.
• 1:01:15
  Speaker 1: Record saying that I'm a snugly guy.
• 1:01:17
  Speaker 2: And the most annoying thing is that he'll trick me
• 1:01:20
  Speaker 2: into telling the story just so he'll fall asleep. You know,
• 1:01:25
  Speaker 2: you know, I have a way didn't do that.
• 1:01:28
  Speaker 3: And then the way told me the story about the
• 1:01:29
  Speaker 3: Playboy model Again.
• 1:01:30
  Speaker 2: No, it would be about how the carburetor float bowl works,
• 1:01:33
  Speaker 2: you know. And then I mean this tentile, this sweet
• 1:01:37
  Speaker 2: gentle snoring. But yeah, no, that was that was a
• 1:01:41
  Speaker 2: lot of fun.
• 1:01:42
  Speaker 3: We don't peg the snory And just on Scott I
• 1:01:44
  Speaker 3: I was on a brief portion of that trip to
• 1:01:46
  Speaker 3: y'all both snore like change.
• 1:01:48
  Speaker 1: Actually, we need to put into this.
• 1:01:50
  Speaker 3: Podcast very large like industrial chain saws. Yes, I mean,
• 1:01:56
  Speaker 3: I mean maybe early industrial age locomotives, something something just
• 1:02:01
  Speaker 3: post steam.
• 1:02:03
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I think we do. We do have to put
• 1:02:05
  Speaker 1: in the YouTube video Matt actually asleep with his fingers
• 1:02:09
  Speaker 1: still on the type on the on the laptop trying
• 1:02:12
  Speaker 1: to write while we were driving across the United States.
• 1:02:15
  Speaker 2: Oh. My, My favorite picture of Matt and I probably
• 1:02:17
  Speaker 2: still have that was we were up in Vegas for
• 1:02:20
  Speaker 2: for the car show or whatever it is. And those
• 1:02:23
  Speaker 2: guys that you stand outside the convention center with the porn.
• 1:02:26
  Speaker 3: Oh. I love collecting this. I'm always trying to find
• 1:02:28
  Speaker 3: one that says Laura, that's my wife's name, and I've
• 1:02:31
  Speaker 3: never found.
• 1:02:32
  Speaker 2: Well, I got all of them and then Matt was
• 1:02:34
  Speaker 2: asleep and I just poured them one in the bed.
• 1:02:37
  Speaker 3: It was a mansion, that's yeah.
• 1:02:41
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that was the weirdest place we ever rented. It
• 1:02:43
  Speaker 1: was like a ten thousand foot now think hard.
• 1:02:46
  Speaker 2: The weirdest.
• 1:02:46
  Speaker 3: Let me back, wasn't just rebranded Chinese things?
• 1:02:50
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so yeah we did.
• 1:02:51
  Speaker 1: I mean we drove Alaska, We drove across the US together.
• 1:02:58
  Speaker 2: He stopped in New York for a minute, right, We
• 1:03:00
  Speaker 2: did feather boa moment.
• 1:03:02
  Speaker 1: Yeah, we have that can go in the show notes
• 1:03:05
  Speaker 1: as well.
• 1:03:06
  Speaker 3: Bruce Bruce time that I will ever have a feather
• 1:03:08
  Speaker 3: boa on my hand while eating a hot dog next
• 1:03:10
  Speaker 3: to the Commissioner of the NBA and the owner of
• 1:03:13
  Speaker 3: the Utah Jazz people worked with. People were interesting.
• 1:03:15
  Speaker 2: I'm not going to name names, but people were messing
• 1:03:18
  Speaker 2: with me on the trip across the US, and so
• 1:03:21
  Speaker 2: I arranged for a trap in New York. Well, first
• 1:03:24
  Speaker 2: I arranged to have all the police officers personal vehicles
• 1:03:27
  Speaker 2: towed from in front of b and AH, so we
• 1:03:30
  Speaker 2: had some eighty feet of parking.
• 1:03:32
  Speaker 1: Try to make that happen in New York City.
• 1:03:34
  Speaker 2: Yeah. And then because I was the one who theoretically
• 1:03:38
  Speaker 2: knew his way around Manhattan because I had lived there,
• 1:03:41
  Speaker 2: I happened to have a in the Bruce Dorn Girlfriend Network,
• 1:03:45
  Speaker 2: which is why I mentioned THEFDGF. Called up one of
• 1:03:50
  Speaker 2: the members of the local chapter the BDGFN and had
• 1:03:54
  Speaker 2: her curbside somewhere in midtown with a pink cowboy hat
• 1:04:01
  Speaker 2: that I can fit Greg Miller and I had one. No, no,
• 1:04:07
  Speaker 2: I had one and had a diamond Tierra built into
• 1:04:09
  Speaker 2: it because Greg had tried to get me one in
• 1:04:11
  Speaker 2: a truck stop somewhere in Colorado and they were all
• 1:04:13
  Speaker 2: children's size of so I called ahead and made sure
• 1:04:16
  Speaker 2: I had one. And then this girl I am I
• 1:04:20
  Speaker 2: got us down the street ambushed us, put on my
• 1:04:23
  Speaker 2: properly fitting hat and wrapped Greg in a pink feather bow,
• 1:04:27
  Speaker 2: which emotionally overwhelmed him for a moment. And then from
• 1:04:30
  Speaker 2: then on the pink feather bow was either punishment or reward.
• 1:04:33
  Speaker 2: It was and weren't some of the feathers plucked to
• 1:04:37
  Speaker 2: me and flies.
• 1:04:38
  Speaker 1: I think so.
• 1:04:41
  Speaker 2: Exactly.
• 1:04:42
  Speaker 1: I wonder whatever happened to the pink You know, there
• 1:04:44
  Speaker 1: is some sadness. That's probably one of the great losses
• 1:04:46
  Speaker 1: of Expedition seven. We actually lost the pink feather bow somewhere,
• 1:04:51
  Speaker 1: probably in Russia.
• 1:04:52
  Speaker 2: I don't know, but yeah, probably that are on the ferry.
• 1:04:56
  Speaker 2: Maybe one of my girlfriends on the ferry.
• 1:04:58
  Speaker 1: Go. This is a story that has to be told.
• 1:05:01
  Speaker 1: So Bruce and I were traveling through Europe with Expedition seven.
• 1:05:05
  Speaker 1: We arrive at at nord Cap in these land cruisers
• 1:05:09
  Speaker 1: and Greg Miller and I are standing up and underneath
• 1:05:12
  Speaker 1: the the you know, the art installation Atlas holding up
• 1:05:17
  Speaker 1: the world at nord Cap and we're getting all these
• 1:05:20
  Speaker 1: photos thinking that we're looking fog, thinking that we're looking cool.
• 1:05:23
  Speaker 1: And then Bruce is like, hey, I want a photo too,
• 1:05:26
  Speaker 1: So I you know, I grab my camera and there's
• 1:05:29
  Speaker 1: it's totally socked in with fog, and Bruce stands up
• 1:05:32
  Speaker 1: there and this is an absolutely true story. So Bruce
• 1:05:38
  Speaker 1: is up there in a you know, in his all
• 1:05:41
  Speaker 1: of his Arctic gear and his green glasses, and out
• 1:05:45
  Speaker 1: of the fog, this woman is running. She's running through
• 1:05:48
  Speaker 1: the fog. I mean, you hear it. You hear the crunch, crunch, crunch,
• 1:05:51
  Speaker 1: And I turn and I look, and this woman runs
• 1:05:54
  Speaker 1: out of the fog and she is wearing a fleece
• 1:05:58
  Speaker 1: jacket the exact same color or a is Bruce's glasses.
• 1:06:02
  Speaker 1: She runs up the steps, she hugs Bruce and kisses Bruce.
• 1:06:08
  Speaker 1: She turns and looks and smiles for the photograph, which
• 1:06:11
  Speaker 1: we'll put in the video, and then she runs back
• 1:06:14
  Speaker 1: into the fog. She said no words to Bruce or anyone.
• 1:06:19
  Speaker 1: She ran out of the fog, kissed him, hugged him,
• 1:06:23
  Speaker 1: smiled for the photo, and then ran back into the fog.
• 1:06:26
  Speaker 2: That's your messed with the rest of the guys on
• 1:06:29
  Speaker 2: the crt.
• 1:06:29
  Speaker 1: On nobody could figure it out. Well, then we use
• 1:06:33
  Speaker 1: that to our advantage for the rest of the adventure.
• 1:06:35
  Speaker 1: For sure.
• 1:06:36
  Speaker 2: One of my favorites was when we got on the
• 1:06:39
  Speaker 2: Oceanic Ferry. Yeah, and I tricked the.
• 1:06:41
  Speaker 1: From Stockholm to Talon in Estonia.
• 1:06:45
  Speaker 2: As you and I were in line first, we're waiting
• 1:06:47
  Speaker 2: for the ticket booth to open to get on the
• 1:06:50
  Speaker 2: ferry with all the semis and this stuff, and the
• 1:06:54
  Speaker 2: rest of the seven guys are behind us, and they're
• 1:06:57
  Speaker 2: getting ready to open up to the booth and I
• 1:06:58
  Speaker 2: see there's obviously a senior kind of guy there and
• 1:07:00
  Speaker 2: I really attractive young woman who seemed like might she
• 1:07:04
  Speaker 2: might have been in training. And they finally opened the
• 1:07:06
  Speaker 2: window and I am, you know, it's on my side
• 1:07:10
  Speaker 2: and Scott, he's driving on the right, and I'm going,
• 1:07:12
  Speaker 2: would you would you mind helping me with a little
• 1:07:14
  Speaker 2: little choke? She goes what I said, So, the last
• 1:07:17
  Speaker 2: time you saw me was in the in the lift
• 1:07:19
  Speaker 2: line at Aspen and I ditched you. I ditched you
• 1:07:22
  Speaker 2: for another chick, and uh, you're really happy to see me,
• 1:07:26
  Speaker 2: but you're also pissed, you know, And so I said,
• 1:07:30
  Speaker 2: could you just play that up when we drive away?
• 1:07:33
  Speaker 2: And as we drove away, I could hear her saying
• 1:07:35
  Speaker 2: to her boss that was Bruci that's and we I go,
• 1:07:41
  Speaker 2: ha ha, ha, that was fun. That was the beginning of it.
• 1:07:44
  Speaker 2: It was after we got through there and and radio
• 1:07:48
  Speaker 2: tohead and every woman that worked on the ship, you know,
• 1:07:50
  Speaker 2: the ones that have the flashlights doing this. They go, hey,
• 1:07:52
  Speaker 2: brucey as I go by, and the whole rest of
• 1:07:55
  Speaker 2: the team. As we're walking our way through the ship.
• 1:07:58
  Speaker 2: We went by a bar and one of them handed
• 1:08:00
  Speaker 2: me a gin and ton. That's right.
• 1:08:02
  Speaker 1: She turned and said, Bruce, here's your here's your drink
• 1:08:05
  Speaker 1: of choice or something and handed you.
• 1:08:08
  Speaker 2: I just I just went thanks, babe, and we went on.
• 1:08:11
  Speaker 2: It was shot and I'm going BDGFM there everywhere, everywhere, everywhere.
• 1:08:17
  Speaker 2: By the way, all women are you're the head of
• 1:08:19
  Speaker 2: your local branch. I've got you know, you know, stationary
• 1:08:24
  Speaker 2: and stuff. Just reach out.
• 1:08:25
  Speaker 1: Speaking of that, where where can people follow you so
• 1:08:28
  Speaker 1: they can become an inductrinated member of the Bruce Dorm.
• 1:08:32
  Speaker 2: I have a website and that's all stupid. I'm on
• 1:08:34
  Speaker 2: you have Bruce Dorn dot com. Yeah, but I never updated.
• 1:08:37
  Speaker 2: It's a million years old. I'm on the gram and
• 1:08:40
  Speaker 2: I want to try to get Bruce dot dorn, and uh,
• 1:08:43
  Speaker 2: somebody got it, and so I got Dorn dot Bruce,
• 1:08:46
  Speaker 2: and then later I remembered I had gotten Bruce. You.
• 1:08:49
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I.
• 1:08:52
  Speaker 2: Totally forgot about the first dot dorn, So I only
• 1:08:54
  Speaker 2: put stuff on doornot Bruce. But I want to go
• 1:08:56
  Speaker 2: back and put some other stuff.
• 1:08:57
  Speaker 3: You know, you can, you can swap them and keep
• 1:08:59
  Speaker 3: your audience. Can I can help you with that?
• 1:09:01
  Speaker 2: You are magical? Yeah?
• 1:09:05
  Speaker 1: Well, so I've got some questions because I think, okay,
• 1:09:08
  Speaker 1: people are still people that are listening must have many
• 1:09:11
  Speaker 1: many questions right now. But one of the ones that
• 1:09:14
  Speaker 1: that I like. One of the things that I love
• 1:09:16
  Speaker 1: about you is the fact that you do say yes
• 1:09:19
  Speaker 1: to opportunities in your life. How do you determine what
• 1:09:22
  Speaker 1: to say yes to?
• 1:09:23
  Speaker 2: I say yes to everything everything, Yeah, and a sort
• 1:09:26
  Speaker 2: of okay, some money. I figure the universe is is,
• 1:09:31
  Speaker 2: you know, is trying right. I mean, stuff comes along,
• 1:09:35
  Speaker 2: and especially stuff that I try to have a general
• 1:09:39
  Speaker 2: knowledge about a little bit of everything, and I'm interested
• 1:09:41
  Speaker 2: in everything, and so I figure I can always say
• 1:09:44
  Speaker 2: no later, you know, if an opportunity presents itself, I
• 1:09:47
  Speaker 2: think that's a universe saying, you know, pay attention to this.
• 1:09:50
  Speaker 2: So so I do, and more often than not, it
• 1:09:54
  Speaker 2: turns out well. I think there's a something something I
• 1:09:56
  Speaker 2: refer to as the persistence of the river. You can
• 1:09:58
  Speaker 2: take buckets of water out of the over all day
• 1:10:00
  Speaker 2: long and you don't really change its course. You know,
• 1:10:03
  Speaker 2: I think, I think that our trajectories are kind of
• 1:10:06
  Speaker 2: I don't want to be about it, but I kind
• 1:10:09
  Speaker 2: of feel like the you pick positivity, pick positivity, and
• 1:10:15
  Speaker 2: for the most part things go well. It's like, you know,
• 1:10:18
  Speaker 2: I'm not saying fake it till you make it, but
• 1:10:20
  Speaker 2: I am saying, if you see an opportunity, deserve it,
• 1:10:24
  Speaker 2: do the work to deserve it. And that served me
• 1:10:27
  Speaker 2: extremely well. You know, it's it still does. I mean,
• 1:10:29
  Speaker 2: I'm fifty, this marks fifty years is the full time
• 1:10:33
  Speaker 2: creative and I continue to be astonished that stuff comes
• 1:10:37
  Speaker 2: my way. You know, I got nothing better to do, right,
• 1:10:41
  Speaker 2: this is fantastic. And I also make a point of
• 1:10:45
  Speaker 2: trying not to be stuck in my generation. You know,
• 1:10:48
  Speaker 2: in fact, you've done a great job of that. I
• 1:10:50
  Speaker 2: don't know too many people my age, and most of
• 1:10:53
  Speaker 2: the ones I do, you know, they don't do that much.
• 1:10:56
  Speaker 2: And if I wake up, I'm gonna I'm gonna get
• 1:11:00
  Speaker 2: out there and do something. You know, and I love
• 1:11:02
  Speaker 2: being around younger people and I love annoying them. That's
• 1:11:07
  Speaker 2: kind of a normal, normal thing.
• 1:11:09
  Speaker 1: We were we were having lunch the other day and
• 1:11:12
  Speaker 1: it was just before I turned the big five zero,
• 1:11:16
  Speaker 1: and you just kind of turned to me and that,
• 1:11:18
  Speaker 1: you know, we've spent a lot of time together and
• 1:11:20
  Speaker 1: you just said, you know, Scott, every decade just gets better.
• 1:11:24
  Speaker 1: And you said, I'm not so sure about the seventies yet.
• 1:11:26
  Speaker 1: But it was to me that was really it was
• 1:11:29
  Speaker 1: really thoughtful to say, because when you're looking at you know,
• 1:11:33
  Speaker 1: I mean, I did turn fifty just in the last
• 1:11:35
  Speaker 1: few weeks. But to hear someone that I respect and
• 1:11:38
  Speaker 1: admire say, you know what it's like, every it just
• 1:11:41
  Speaker 1: got better and better. No doubt things get different, But
• 1:11:44
  Speaker 1: when I look at your life that you like your
• 1:11:46
  Speaker 1: sixties are like most people would be lucky to live
• 1:11:49
  Speaker 1: an entire life doing so. That was good advice, you.
• 1:11:52
  Speaker 2: Know, Going back to that thing where I was standing
• 1:11:55
  Speaker 2: out there in the dark and the sand dunes with
• 1:11:57
  Speaker 2: all the grip trucks and everything and just gone, I
• 1:11:59
  Speaker 2: cannot believe that. I cannot believe it. Be grateful. The
• 1:12:03
  Speaker 2: more grateful you are, the more the universe smiles on you.
• 1:12:06
  Speaker 2: I really think so. I would certainly love to be
• 1:12:09
  Speaker 2: younger and have the physical, physicality and energy that I had,
• 1:12:14
  Speaker 2: but I didn't have. I didn't have I'm not going
• 1:12:17
  Speaker 2: to say wisdom. I'm going to say I didn't have
• 1:12:19
  Speaker 2: the the crual of experiences at the younger age. Thank goodness,
• 1:12:24
  Speaker 2: I had energy and physicality because that compensated for the
• 1:12:30
  Speaker 2: lack of common common sense and experience. You know, so
• 1:12:35
  Speaker 2: now I you know, uh, gile and and what was it? Yeah?
• 1:12:40
  Speaker 2: I heavily depend on that.
• 1:12:43
  Speaker 3: Am I supposed to ask him a question or something?
• 1:12:44
  Speaker 1: If you want to? I don't really want to, Okay,
• 1:12:47
  Speaker 1: I don't want you to. Have you gotten onto second beer, Matt,
• 1:12:50
  Speaker 1: And I've been to the second beer for a while. Yeah, glass, I'm.
• 1:12:55
  Speaker 3: Sampling Paps, Ribbon and Medello today. I have an affinity
• 1:12:59
  Speaker 3: for cheap beer, cheap beer, fine wines.
• 1:13:03
  Speaker 2: That's kind of your news. You need to turn that into.
• 1:13:06
  Speaker 3: A website, your logo, my juxtapost person.
• 1:13:09
  Speaker 2: Well, I'm so here we are beginning of twenty three.
• 1:13:14
  Speaker 2: I was kind of wrapping up twenty two, thinking, you know,
• 1:13:19
  Speaker 2: time to slow down a little bit, maybe do a
• 1:13:21
  Speaker 2: little more of the grand kids stuff and that kind
• 1:13:23
  Speaker 2: of thing, and twenty.
• 1:13:24
  Speaker 1: You just had a big announcement just that we could
• 1:13:26
  Speaker 1: probably time so we can time it with that.
• 1:13:29
  Speaker 2: Yeah, do you want to tell everybody well, Canon brought
• 1:13:32
  Speaker 2: me on as an explorer of light. Yeah.
• 1:13:36
  Speaker 3: We didn't even talk anything about Canon. And that's been
• 1:13:38
  Speaker 3: a huge part of the last decade of your life.
• 1:13:41
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I was. I was when I was doing my
• 1:13:43
  Speaker 2: digital art stuff, doing the painting and so on. I
• 1:13:46
  Speaker 2: was doing you know, the big trade shows. You know,
• 1:13:49
  Speaker 2: I would get a room with five hundred people in
• 1:13:51
  Speaker 2: it and I would do live demos. I'd bring in
• 1:13:53
  Speaker 2: a model and I'd light it and i'd shoot it,
• 1:13:55
  Speaker 2: and then i'd use that as a reference to a
• 1:13:57
  Speaker 2: digital painting, and then I would out In ninety minutes,
• 1:14:01
  Speaker 2: I got so I was really fast. You normally you
• 1:14:04
  Speaker 2: do this stuff rather slowly. But I invited the guy
• 1:14:07
  Speaker 2: that was head guy at Cannon at the time, Canon
• 1:14:10
  Speaker 2: USA guy. Whenever I said I'm doing a show, I'd
• 1:14:12
  Speaker 2: love it if you came and caught it. And at
• 1:14:14
  Speaker 2: that time, they were just starting to push the pigment
• 1:14:18
  Speaker 2: jet printers. You know, ink jet printers suck pigment jet
• 1:14:22
  Speaker 2: or g clay printers are actually for simplest explanation would
• 1:14:26
  Speaker 2: be it's like acrylic paint, tiny micro paintballs. So a
• 1:14:30
  Speaker 2: proper pigment jet print will outlast the MoMA Lisa, you know,
• 1:14:34
  Speaker 2: in terms of the color fastness. And they needed cool
• 1:14:37
  Speaker 2: looking stuff to promote that. He created a program on
• 1:14:42
  Speaker 2: the spot with me and another guy called the print Masters,
• 1:14:44
  Speaker 2: and I joined Cannon's rank as a print master, and
• 1:14:48
  Speaker 2: then they put me on the road teaching the wonders
• 1:14:51
  Speaker 2: of maintaining your you know, all our digital stuff and
• 1:14:55
  Speaker 2: go you know, in one sort of electronic burst. Ye.
• 1:15:00
  Speaker 2: So the only thing that really is going to outlast
• 1:15:02
  Speaker 2: it would be if you do make prints. You know,
• 1:15:05
  Speaker 2: a magazine will be there, but electronic footprint is going
• 1:15:08
  Speaker 2: to be gone. The formats will change. I was in
• 1:15:11
  Speaker 2: and then I was the only person. Well. So the
• 1:15:14
  Speaker 2: Explorers of Life program was one of the very first
• 1:15:16
  Speaker 2: sponsored artists program and they took a lot of pride
• 1:15:19
  Speaker 2: in the fact that they located the best in a
• 1:15:21
  Speaker 2: particular genre. And if they used Cannon, then great they
• 1:15:25
  Speaker 2: would approach him to become an explorer light and as
• 1:15:27
  Speaker 2: they go, this is the best underwater guy in the
• 1:15:30
  Speaker 2: world and he uses cannon and they never threw equipment
• 1:15:33
  Speaker 2: at people and said, you know, you're super good, use
• 1:15:36
  Speaker 2: our stuff and then you know, we'll brag about you.
• 1:15:39
  Speaker 2: They moved me over into that program. And I'm a
• 1:15:42
  Speaker 2: general practitioner, you know, I'm not. I don't specialize in areals,
• 1:15:45
  Speaker 2: I don't specialize in high fashion. I've done a little
• 1:15:49
  Speaker 2: bit of everything, so I'm kind of an oddfit in
• 1:15:51
  Speaker 2: the program. But because I'm also a cinematographer, done as
• 1:15:55
  Speaker 2: much or more cinematography as I have still work that
• 1:15:58
  Speaker 2: made me the right guy at the right time. When
• 1:16:02
  Speaker 2: the first hdslrs came out. You know, he had film
• 1:16:06
  Speaker 2: cameras and you had digital cameras, and that was the
• 1:16:08
  Speaker 2: whole thing. And then there was suddenly when the five
• 1:16:10
  Speaker 2: D happened. The D five D happened, and that's when
• 1:16:13
  Speaker 2: I started my parts manufacturing. I was doing twenty six
• 1:16:17
  Speaker 2: city tours talking about doing, you know, how to use
• 1:16:22
  Speaker 2: this stuff for cinema. I think it was ILM that
• 1:16:25
  Speaker 2: reached out to me one time when they were doing Redtails,
• 1:16:27
  Speaker 2: the story of the African American Mustang squad Tuskeg Eramin,
• 1:16:34
  Speaker 2: and they needed to be able to film inside the
• 1:16:36
  Speaker 2: cockpits of these P fifty ones, and I was a
• 1:16:39
  Speaker 2: consultant on that. So I was inducted into the Explorers
• 1:16:45
  Speaker 2: of Light in eighteen years ago. Every year you requalify,
• 1:16:49
  Speaker 2: they were all fired at the end of the year,
• 1:16:53
  Speaker 2: and then they rejigger the group. So it's the best supposedly,
• 1:16:57
  Speaker 2: you don't know if you qualify. It's all about mid
• 1:17:00
  Speaker 2: January they announced the new stable, and every year i've
• 1:17:04
  Speaker 2: I've made that cut. Certainly, the nature of a social
• 1:17:07
  Speaker 2: media sponsored artist has changed dramatically. Everybody has a.
• 1:17:13
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it's more about the following these days.
• 1:17:16
  Speaker 2: And yeah, yeah, it certainly is a big component. It's
• 1:17:19
  Speaker 2: a big and legitimate component. I'm not going to say
• 1:17:22
  Speaker 2: it isn't. I've always felt that my responsibility was to
• 1:17:26
  Speaker 2: build followings for my customers, for my clients. Who cares
• 1:17:30
  Speaker 2: if anybody knows who I am, or recognizes my name
• 1:17:33
  Speaker 2: or gives a whot about my opinion? So I don't
• 1:17:36
  Speaker 2: have I have very few social media followers. I just
• 1:17:40
  Speaker 2: I don't, but I feel responsible for a lot of
• 1:17:43
  Speaker 2: the followers of some pretty big name companies. This year,
• 1:17:46
  Speaker 2: they have decided that I'm a legend so they moved
• 1:17:49
  Speaker 2: me into the Legend program. Well you are a legend, Brucie. Yeah. Right.
• 1:17:53
  Speaker 2: So they have another program which is I don't know
• 1:17:57
  Speaker 2: if I've been kicked into the Attic, but it's it's
• 1:18:00
  Speaker 2: got some pretty big some pretty pretty big name people
• 1:18:04
  Speaker 2: in it. And I'm humbled and thrilled that they have
• 1:18:09
  Speaker 2: moved me into that. I'm in it for life now,
• 1:18:11
  Speaker 2: so actually beyond life, so I'll always be in the
• 1:18:15
  Speaker 2: canon Legend program. Yeah.
• 1:18:17
  Speaker 1: That's fantastic person, so deserved. Man, it's just amazing.
• 1:18:21
  Speaker 2: Well, more importantly, they said, you know, and we're sick
• 1:18:24
  Speaker 2: of you not doing projects. I haven't done anything really
• 1:18:27
  Speaker 2: cool for him in a while because they have to
• 1:18:30
  Speaker 2: spread it around among all the you know, the people
• 1:18:33
  Speaker 2: that they bring in the fresh horses, you know, so
• 1:18:35
  Speaker 2: to speak. But I'm getting ready to go out and
• 1:18:39
  Speaker 2: do some really good work for him. Yeah. It'll very excited.
• 1:18:42
  Speaker 1: It'll be amazing to see what you come up with.
• 1:18:44
  Speaker 2: Exciting, Yeah, very exciting. I'm I'm chuffed, as the Brits
• 1:18:48
  Speaker 2: would say, I got a big fat assignment to go
• 1:18:53
  Speaker 2: make a camera look awesome. It is an awesome camera.
• 1:18:56
  Speaker 2: I'm thrilled to be the it's like having a Kentucky
• 1:19:00
  Speaker 2: Derby capable winning horse and they called the oldest jockey
• 1:19:05
  Speaker 2: in the world to ride it. I couldn't be couldn't
• 1:19:08
  Speaker 2: be more excited, couldn't be more excited. And all my
• 1:19:11
  Speaker 2: mentees are doing great. You know, I've spent a lot
• 1:19:15
  Speaker 2: of time trying to help people, and every time they
• 1:19:18
  Speaker 2: have a victory, it's a victory for me.
• 1:19:20
  Speaker 1: Yeah, if you were to ask something of our audience,
• 1:19:22
  Speaker 1: how can our audience support some of the mentorship work
• 1:19:28
  Speaker 1: that you're doing or is there a challenge that you
• 1:19:30
  Speaker 1: have for the audience around that because you've made a
• 1:19:33
  Speaker 1: difference in so many people's lives.
• 1:19:34
  Speaker 2: Well, you know, we were talking before about trying to
• 1:19:40
  Speaker 2: sort of magnify that or increase it. But and I
• 1:19:45
  Speaker 2: had the sort of the conceptual name elevate one. You
• 1:19:48
  Speaker 2: don't know everything in the world. I don't know everything.
• 1:19:50
  Speaker 2: There is no about everything, but I know something and
• 1:19:53
  Speaker 2: there's somebody that's one rung down on the ladder for me.
• 1:19:56
  Speaker 2: And I don't care how new you are at your
• 1:20:00
  Speaker 2: art form. You're writing, your music, your image making, you're
• 1:20:05
  Speaker 2: somewhere and there's someone else who could use benefit from
• 1:20:10
  Speaker 2: your wisdom you know at every level. So elevate one,
• 1:20:13
  Speaker 2: find one person, elevate them. You know, a rising tide
• 1:20:18
  Speaker 2: raises all boats. I love it, and I absolutely guarantee
• 1:20:22
  Speaker 2: you will understand what you do much better when you
• 1:20:26
  Speaker 2: have to explain it. When you have to make someone
• 1:20:28
  Speaker 2: else understand it thoroughly. Is when you understand it thoroughly.
• 1:20:32
  Speaker 2: You know what my passion is now, I want to
• 1:20:36
  Speaker 2: get this Heroes Network idea going. The next thing I've
• 1:20:41
  Speaker 2: written for you is a pretty pretty heavy piece of writing,
• 1:20:46
  Speaker 2: but it led me to an idea about trying to
• 1:20:51
  Speaker 2: organize our community into being being there, being there. And
• 1:20:54
  Speaker 2: I don't know whether we want to talk about that
• 1:20:56
  Speaker 2: now or talk about it.
• 1:20:57
  Speaker 1: More later, but I think once we get it off
• 1:20:59
  Speaker 1: the ground a little bit more. But the next couple
• 1:21:02
  Speaker 1: issues of Overland Journal, Bruce has the opportunity or had
• 1:21:05
  Speaker 1: the opportunity to share a story of Aslisa, who was attacked,
• 1:21:10
  Speaker 1: viciously attacked in South America. And it's just an awareness
• 1:21:15
  Speaker 1: that we have within Overlanding that things are not always safe,
• 1:21:20
  Speaker 1: and that there's a way for us as a community
• 1:21:23
  Speaker 1: to be supportive when someone needs it, or someone is
• 1:21:26
  Speaker 1: or someone is fearful of their safety or someone has
• 1:21:29
  Speaker 1: had a compromise to their safety.
• 1:21:31
  Speaker 2: So we're all you know, a big part of the
• 1:21:34
  Speaker 2: adventure community is that we're all individuals and we all
• 1:21:37
  Speaker 2: want to have our little individual adventures. But there's so
• 1:21:39
  Speaker 2: much more we can share. We don't have to turn
• 1:21:41
  Speaker 2: it into a homogenized, cookie cutter type of thing. To
• 1:21:45
  Speaker 2: be out there exploring the world, and for women to
• 1:21:48
  Speaker 2: be able to go out there and have adventures and
• 1:21:54
  Speaker 2: be strong and fulfilled all their potential, and we just
• 1:22:01
  Speaker 2: need to make the world a little safer. So I've
• 1:22:04
  Speaker 2: got a cautionary tale, and the takeaway on it is
• 1:22:08
  Speaker 2: very positive, but it's really easy to fool ourselves into
• 1:22:13
  Speaker 2: thinking that that everything is sort of prepackaged and safe.
• 1:22:18
  Speaker 2: We know better, we got out there.
• 1:22:19
  Speaker 3: And yeah, there's almost an attitude with travelers that if
• 1:22:23
  Speaker 3: they say something isn't safe, it means that they're not
• 1:22:26
  Speaker 3: like they're not worthy, they're not part of the club,
• 1:22:28
  Speaker 3: Like they don't want to.
• 1:22:29
  Speaker 1: We don't have to be reckless to be a travel.
• 1:22:31
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it almost it does trend towards that reckless thing.
• 1:22:35
  Speaker 2: Whenever I see the tagline, and I never felt a
• 1:22:38
  Speaker 2: moment I never felt that I was in danger for
• 1:22:41
  Speaker 2: a moment. I'm going then your situational awareness is not
• 1:22:44
  Speaker 2: quite finely tuned. I would never want to talk anybody
• 1:22:48
  Speaker 2: out of I mean risk and danger is a seasoning
• 1:22:52
  Speaker 2: to some degree.
• 1:22:54
  Speaker 1: And we can never fully escape it even in our
• 1:22:55
  Speaker 1: day to day life.
• 1:22:56
  Speaker 2: You know, no matter how gorgeous the the shot is
• 1:23:00
  Speaker 2: of you out there in the middle of nowhere, you're
• 1:23:02
  Speaker 2: out there in the middle of nowhere. And and I
• 1:23:04
  Speaker 2: I feel like there's an opportunity for us to as
• 1:23:08
  Speaker 2: a community share information. You know, this area is not
• 1:23:12
  Speaker 2: quite so good right now, maybe it's a little sketchy.
• 1:23:16
  Speaker 2: Maybe you could caravan through this area, maybe you could
• 1:23:19
  Speaker 2: sidestuff this area. I want to organize us to be
• 1:23:24
  Speaker 2: on call good Samaritans, you know.
• 1:23:26
  Speaker 3: And there's so many people in the community that would
• 1:23:29
  Speaker 3: always help, you know, I mean from everybody that we've
• 1:23:32
  Speaker 3: part of the joy in the over world.
• 1:23:34
  Speaker 2: I mean yeah, I mean it's it is a community,
• 1:23:36
  Speaker 2: and a part of the part of the community isn't
• 1:23:38
  Speaker 2: just you know, going down to the pitching dinner and
• 1:23:42
  Speaker 2: and you know everybody's watching the skyroks. You've got to
• 1:23:45
  Speaker 2: be there when when the tornado comes in, you know,
• 1:23:48
  Speaker 2: and I think we could do it. I think we could.
• 1:23:50
  Speaker 2: I'm not going to say do a better job of it,
• 1:23:52
  Speaker 2: do a job of it, you know. I mean, I
• 1:23:54
  Speaker 2: feel like I know from the story that that that
• 1:23:58
  Speaker 2: we'll appear in the journal that my friend was caught
• 1:24:02
  Speaker 2: in a terrible situation and then what was worse, she
• 1:24:05
  Speaker 2: had no one to turn to. And I know, I know,
• 1:24:08
  Speaker 2: I just I don't know. But every part of cole being,
• 1:24:13
  Speaker 2: every particle of my being, is absolutely sure that there
• 1:24:17
  Speaker 2: was somebody from our community within a couple hundred miles.
• 1:24:20
  Speaker 2: There's somebody in our community within a couple hundred miles
• 1:24:23
  Speaker 2: of all of us.
• 1:24:23
  Speaker 3: There was probably somebody within a couple miles. You know,
• 1:24:26
  Speaker 3: there's only so many routes right that most people go on.
• 1:24:29
  Speaker 2: I don't know how you could how you could find
• 1:24:31
  Speaker 2: any place on Earth where there isn't somebody in the
• 1:24:33
  Speaker 2: overland community kind of nearby. And if if we had
• 1:24:36
  Speaker 2: a way to be able to send up a flare
• 1:24:39
  Speaker 2: and call in the cavalry to be there when somebody
• 1:24:41
  Speaker 2: is absolutely in need and has no one to turn to.
• 1:24:46
  Speaker 2: Because a big part of being solo is being solo,
• 1:24:48
  Speaker 2: and a big part of being out there in the
• 1:24:50
  Speaker 2: middle of nowhere. As you're in the middle of nowhere,
• 1:24:52
  Speaker 2: there aren't emergency services, you know, And so I think
• 1:24:56
  Speaker 2: it will be a small but big thing to organize
• 1:25:00
  Speaker 2: organize us into a community that is on call, you know.
• 1:25:04
  Speaker 2: I mean, how many times have we seen it. Somebody
• 1:25:06
  Speaker 2: busts an axle on the White Rim trail where they
• 1:25:09
  Speaker 2: are out of water and everybody. But we need to
• 1:25:12
  Speaker 2: have that for those of us who actually find ourselves
• 1:25:16
  Speaker 2: in a vulnerable position, you know. And there's plenty of
• 1:25:20
  Speaker 2: times when you not plenty of times, but there are
• 1:25:23
  Speaker 2: those odd occasions when it can go so horribly wrong
• 1:25:27
  Speaker 2: that you can barely cope. And you know, we can fix.
• 1:25:32
  Speaker 1: That, Yeah, or at least be community can be present
• 1:25:35
  Speaker 1: to help and be a support and get some get
• 1:25:41
  Speaker 1: a mechanism for that. So, you know, let's plan on
• 1:25:44
  Speaker 1: having a future podcast where we talk in more detail.
• 1:25:48
  Speaker 1: We are working on it. Bruce has got an incredible
• 1:25:51
  Speaker 1: idea and has done a lot of effort to flesh
• 1:25:55
  Speaker 1: it out, and he's pulled a bunch of people together.
• 1:25:57
  Speaker 3: And now you're committed to we've talked about it, Yeah, exactly.
• 1:26:00
  Speaker 2: Well, I'm tenacious I will, I will, and treacherous and treacherous, tenacious,
• 1:26:05
  Speaker 2: all the tea words Tall that's really the thing, t Rex. Yeah, yeah,
• 1:26:11
  Speaker 2: but it just kind of goes along with trying to
• 1:26:14
  Speaker 2: stay involved. You know, the more you stay involved, the
• 1:26:17
  Speaker 2: more that you choose the positive, the better things go.
• 1:26:20
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so it seems like it choose the positive path. Well,
• 1:26:24
  Speaker 1: we could spend another two hours talking to Bruce. Well,
• 1:26:26
  Speaker 1: actually I spent four years traveling around the world with
• 1:26:29
  Speaker 1: Bruce and I never ran out of Bruce's stories, So
• 1:26:33
  Speaker 1: hopefully we'll get you back on for some more. Bruce,
• 1:26:36
  Speaker 1: I just as a as a friend. I am so
• 1:26:39
  Speaker 1: grateful that I called you that one day in Prescott
• 1:26:43
  Speaker 1: and that we've been able to have this decade's long friendship.
• 1:26:47
  Speaker 1: You've taught me so much, and I've learned so much
• 1:26:51
  Speaker 1: about life and about travel and about being thoughtful of
• 1:26:55
  Speaker 1: others from you. It's just been an incredible joy, Bruce,
• 1:26:59
  Speaker 1: to have you as a friend.
• 1:27:00
  Speaker 2: So I'm gonna get all sappy, but you know it
• 1:27:05
  Speaker 2: flips around, right When you develop a deep friendship, everybody benefits.
• 1:27:10
  Speaker 2: And I've learned from both of you guys. I learned
• 1:27:13
  Speaker 2: from Matt to pick better beer.
• 1:27:16
  Speaker 3: But there's nothing wrong with a good, solid, paid Western beer.
• 1:27:22
  Speaker 3: Please sponsor me, absolute chance.
• 1:27:27
  Speaker 2: If it's a Canon Explorer, it would be a past
• 1:27:30
  Speaker 2: lush lush legend. See, I think we could. We could
• 1:27:35
  Speaker 2: come up with a marketing campaign and take it to them.
• 1:27:38
  Speaker 3: Yeah, they've got to come to me.
• 1:27:43
  Speaker 2: I taught you nothing. You've got to attack.
• 1:27:46
  Speaker 3: You've taught me a lot more than more than I
• 1:27:50
  Speaker 3: think you'd know. And I don't think that I would
• 1:27:52
  Speaker 3: be in the position I am in life without you.
• 1:27:55
  Speaker 3: So I deeply care about you.
• 1:27:57
  Speaker 2: Gosh, what a love fest. Yeah, let's do this again.
• 1:28:00
  Speaker 2: I will Strea, don't stop.
• 1:28:04
  Speaker 1: All right, So you can find out more about Bruce
• 1:28:08
  Speaker 1: at dorn dot Bruce.
• 1:28:09
  Speaker 3: Don't go to Bruce dorm because you also have that.
• 1:28:12
  Speaker 1: I'm going to show you how to connect them both.
• 1:28:14
  Speaker 1: Switch your on Instagram. An incredible career, a lot of
• 1:28:20
  Speaker 1: beautiful images out there, a lot of them have been
• 1:28:22
  Speaker 1: in Overland Journal, and they're going to continue there. You're
• 1:28:25
  Speaker 1: going to see his art and his incredible writing here
• 1:28:28
  Speaker 1: in the next couple issues as well. So, Bruce, thanks
• 1:28:31
  Speaker 1: so much for being on the podcast.
• 1:28:32
  Speaker 2: Thanks for coming, my pleasure and for my dancing go
• 1:28:36
  Speaker 2: to write to TikTok because that's that's where I keep
• 1:28:38
  Speaker 2: all the love you guys.
• 1:28:40
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I love you, Brucey, thanks for being on the podcast,
• 1:28:43
  Speaker 1: and thank you all. We love you guys too, and
• 1:28:45
  Speaker 1: thank you all for listening and we'll talk to you
• 1:28:48
  Speaker 1: next time.