Latest / The Good Builder Podcast / The Daily Dose #328 | Josh Tyrrell: Ten Years, 250 Homes. The Journey From Builder To Businessman

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The Daily Dose #328 | Josh Tyrrell: Ten Years, 250 Homes. The Journey From Builder To Businessman · The Good Builder Podcast

• Aaron Ng (00:57) Good morning and welcome to the Good Builder Podcast. Today I'm sitting with a bloke that I've known for a while and I've actually wanted to talk to for a while. And he was one of the most impressive builders in my time at GJ Gardner Homes. I remember him entering into our franchise group, and was like Thank God we've got a good one coming in. And the results that you kind of see from this gentleman and the way he operates his business, you can see, you know, the results of how good he is, how proactive he is, and all that sort of thing. Josh Tyrrell is the owner of GJ Gardner Homes Warrigal. And I hope I've said that right, Josh, because I'm not from Victoria. Got it, mate. But he's one of those franchisees who actually did the work himself. And I think that's pretty cool. We supported him, of course, but he was proactive, always one step ahead of us, one step ahead of the game. And I have actually just learned that he has his own podcast now, which I am happy to promote because I think he's a very good builder. We'll put all the links below. And I'd love all you guys and girls out there to listen to. But anyway, along the way of working at GJ Gardener Homes, we had a lot of fun. Hawaii comes to mind. I think that was my first junket with you and a few of the team there. And that was a lot of fun. But since then, and we put him up there at the time too. He's been a bit of a poster boy, if you don't mind me saying, for the GJ Garden brand. That's how much respect he has, and he still is to this day. He builds homes all across Warrigal. this one's gonna be hard. Druin, Morwell, and Tralbon. And finally we are catching up. So welcome to the show, Josh. How are you, mate? Good, mate. Good to see you. It's been a been a while. Yeah, it has, mate. But I have, as you know, because we've been talking over Messenger and Instagram and things like that, mate. I have watched you the whole time since I've known you. And I I knew when you came into the GJ business how good you are. But mate, I probably didn't know how good you are. And from what I can see is you're just, you know, succeeding and flying and, you know, doing what you need to do and you you run a really tight ship there in Victoria, mate. It's really cool. it's been a journey. I wasn't I was a kid when I came in, I was only twenty nine. Really? And I signed with G J so I think I was I'm technically like one of the younger or youngest like soul franchises. Like there's been a few people younger but have been in you know partnerships. Yeah. Yeah, no, I was 29. So I'm still technically in my 30s. I'm in the death knock, but I'm I'm 10 years of GJs we've been going now and I'm still th I'm calling myself 30. So my God, mate. And in 10 years, like one of the things we've learned at the Goodbuilder is many building businesses don't even last 10 years. You know what I mean, Josh? Like you've done a great freaking job from twenty nine w I didn't realise you were 29 because I remember you coming into the into the network and your your approach the way you were. You were very serious about your business. You were very proactive about your business. I I I had no idea you were twenty nine, mate, because twenty-nine I was in Sydney hanging at King's Cross and just partying away and I had no intention to create anything as as as good or as You know, a bit of a legacy like you have in the area, mate. That's phenomenal. So don't think I would have anticipated the what we've grown into. You know, like it was a it was a an o good opportunity. But when you sit back now after ten years and go, It's yeah, it's it's gotten big, it's got arms and legs for sure. Like it's mm yeah, I was I was still a builder then I thought I love building. That's that's all I've ever done. Yeah. Finished school, went and did my apprenticeship. So think probably then I was a builder. Now I'm probably more of a business person. You know, like building's what we do. I I genuinely enjoy the the business side of it these days. wow. This is going to be a fascinating podcast, mate. We haven't talked in a while and what we try and do here at The Good Builder is, as you know, we try and we know that lots of builders can can build pretty well and they're pretty good at the craft, but it's the business side of things that either lifts you up or lets you down. And so that's pretty phenomenal that the evolution of Josh and and team Warrigal. I think that's and and I mate, it's no surprise to me. Like I I saw it in you from when I first saw you and all right, we're gonna learn a bit more about you then. All right. Well, we take me back a bit back then, please. Josh. Where did it all start? Like how did you get into the industry? Why did you get into the industry? Do you have a family history in it? And and yeah. I I for like to me I finished school, actually finished year twelve. I I was one of those kids, didn't really know what I wanted to do, but I'd always said like I wasn't just gonna leave if I didn't have something. Yeah, right. I finished actually got into union, got into civil engineering. But I was just like, I I can't I can't do this anymore. Like I'm not I'm not doing another four years. Wow. So sort of it did a little bit of travelling and you know, just you know, went to the States and went snowboarding and a few bits and pieces and I worked with one of Dad's mates who was a boilermaker. you know, it wasn't really for me, did a bit of plumbing, same deal. And I I think even when I was a little kid, I sort of wanted to be a builder. Yeah. So I like you did back then, I mean, this is like early two thousands, you know, you you you you knocked on someone's door and you know, asked for an apprenticeship. And I I did that and it was the old school thing of who's your dad? He said, Neil, and it's like, you can start on Monday. wow. Okay. So I sort of fell into it that way. and and and here I am, you know, 22 years later. I started my friendship when I was 18 and I turned 40 soon. realistically. You're a young buck, mate. I'm older than you. I must say that. But mate, that is a phenomenal story. And then coming along 22 years you know, in the game. and The business you've created is is phenomenal. What was it about like Warrigal and all of that? Why did you why did you choose G J Gardener Homes actually? And why did you end up being in in Warrigal and and kind of cementing the touch there? The location is just that's where I've grown up. Like we've been here, you know been here forever, you know, don't I don't live in Warrigal, I live just out. We're just in a little country town, like five K's out. So it's all the same. But G J's came to us. realistically. So Stu Rate at the time was he approached us. I was building mine and my wife's first house. and it was it was pretty cool house. And at the time he was talking to a manager at the local Reese store. Certainly in Victoria. And so they Stu was obviously doing what he does and you know, who should we talk to? And the the manager said, you should should talk to these guys. Wow. I was pretty dismissive of it initially. Because I was I I was never into the volume builder thing. I was like, nah, not interested, mate. Like what happened I you know, I didn't want to fall into the into that same category of the volumes. We won't name names, but you know, that's I love it. No. Not who we were and I spoke. And to this day I think you're still not, hey Josh, look you still got that philosophy about you. You build damn good homes, mate. Yeah. So I spoke to Dad, it like Dad's an accountant and he goes, I've looked at that quite a few times in the past for other people. It's actually pretty good, but they always tap on the shoulders of people at the other end of their career, people who want to wind down because they're the only ones who can afford to do it. 'Cause the reality is it's expensive to set up and back a business like that. And it's like, if you if you're serious, I'll I'll back you. 'Cause I yeah, I was a say I was probably twenty eight at that time, not even having money. So Yeah, we were building our first house, we tipped everything into that. And he's like, Yeah, we'll we'll back it. So we sort of you know he went down the path and obviously with Ross time and the master and jumped through the hoops and Roscoe Maker jumps through some serious hoops to he would to be permitted through the door if you like. Yeah. And yeah, we signed and and opened in October twenty sixteen. So just short of ten years now. Fire out. 10 years, 250 hours on the ground, I think we've done. Jeez, mate. The I was thinking about, you know, what I love building, Josh, too, is like I was thinking about the communities you create, you know, and 250 homes in Warrigal is no, like you would know a lot of people, you would have built for a lot of local families. A lot of local people know you. You're putting your reputation on the line every time you do it, mate, and you're doing it two hundred and fifty times. Yeah. That's a and been around ten years, mate. That's a strong business. That's very cool. Like, we've got a big name on the door. You know, we've got the biggest builders in the country's names on our door, but at the end of the day, it's still owned by me. It's my builder's license and it's my reputation. Like I live here. Like fundamentally to get it wrong too many times. yeah. We don't get me wrong, we have in the past. But like like everyone does and you learn from the mistakes. But yeah, it's that's that big name, but it's still a small locally owned business. And you know we were fortunate that we bought the franchise area for what is the Balbore Shire, which is Wireville. and then we also managed to buy the next door which is the Trobe, which is the Taralgan Wall area. So we We combine that into into a bigger area. So we sort of cover that Borball La Trobe. but we're pretty lucky in the fact that we've always been surrounded by vacant areas. So like the Bass Coast area, Gary and Jill at the time had that. They retired, but it hasn't been replaced. So we we're lucky. So we cover Borball, La Trobe, South Gibbs Land and Bass Coast. So quite a big geographical area. which has really helped us in the time where like 'cause it's been Not so much now, but you go back eight of months, it was it slowed right up. But so we could spread across and pick up the builds that we needed to to keep growing. So it's we've been pretty fortunate in that sense. Wow. And was that purposeful and strategic, Josh? Like you talk about being a builder and then putting that business sort of hat on and and starting to enjoy that more. Is that where that sort of stuff came from? Were you always kind of that sort of looking at is that what builders should look at? You know what I mean, Josh? Like Yeah, absolutely. Like with the with the Latrobe franchise thing, in the early days it was just a free territory. So we could build in there. but we started to to build a few in there. I like, I don't want to lose this, I need to formalise this. And I suppose that's where that business side comes in and go, Okay, now we need to make sure that we we can acquire this area formally. So we we we did that and could consolidate that into our franchise area. So it's Yeah. No wonder Roscoe let you through. For everyone out there who listens to us, there's a gentleman named Ross Morley, and both Josh and I have a lot of love for him. I still stay in contact with him, actually. Josh, I and I know you do too, just over Instagram, but he was the master franchisee for Victoria and Tasmania. And I would say he was one of the coolest guys to work with. I learned a lot, but he was one of the hardest guys to work with in terms of you had to show that you could add value to his business. in order for him to even listen to you, man. I remember my first marketing meeting. Josh, you remember me. I was the marketing manager with no marketing budget. So I'd be begging and pleading for everything. And, you know, Ross I remember my first one and Ross gave me a call after hours and was like, mate, you know, pick up your game here. I didn't understand that. We've already tried that. Don't think you know about this. But it was from a place of better yourself, become better, come back to me. think about things. And I grew a lot of respect out of that for Ross, even though it was one of the hardest phone calls I took. I think I was a week into the job. And I earned his trust probably two years later. But you know, like that sort of hoops you know, and then for it was his business at the time, really, Victoria, then to let a builder in, I was just a marketing manager that was supporting the entire brand, to let a builder into his fold. Mate, you must have had to build a fair bit of trust and obviously it shows how good you are, mate. Yeah. You definitely had to jump through herbs. I think he he tried to make me shave my beard off and I had some things I've I think I remember that. Yeah. Yeah. And you gotta know for him too. Yep. And a lot of tattoos, but you do, you do. I remember because I I yeah, I kind of I know this might sound weird, but I kind of like the alternative kind of guys and the guys that go pretty hard. You can kind of see like, you know, you This is gonna sound even weirder, mate. You're a good looking bloke, but you look, you know, pretty mean and all that sort of stuff and things like that. And I like that. And I know I remember Josh. I'm sorry, I remember Ross. Ross was always suit and tie, clean shave. And and even me, I was the bloke in head office that would only wear polo shirts and they and he hated it. Every time I went to his office, he'd be like, Where's your tie? I can tell you right now, mate, to this day, in my top drawer. There you go. There is a tie. I love it. The memories of Ross. He would never spring it on you, but if he did, you'd be like, shit, where's the time? Yeah, yeah. And by the way, everyone, I said the memory of Ross. Ross is not dead. He's around. He's over in New Zealand. He's a freaking legend. but yeah, like I just wanted to iterate, you know, what kind of guy Josh is, really, and how how successful we are, mate, and how proactive you are. It's freaking set that standard high. Didn't he? Didn't he? I reckon to be honest with you, Josh, and and you'd fall into this category too, mate. I reckon he could have run the good builder. Do you know in a way of educating builders on how to become a good builder? Like he was he he had so much knowledge. so anyway, we'll stop talking about Ross and more about you, mate, because you're the guest and you are a freaking legend as well. And as I said at the beginning of the pod, one of the things that really stood out for me, Josh, was how proactive you were when you came into the network and all that sort of thing. And and where does that where did that come from in you? Are you have you got some sort of sporting background that you're some you know, you I always find people that are high achievers in sport or other areas bring that into business or wh where does that come from you, mate? I I think with what I've learned over the years now, especially around like personality types, it's my personality type. I'm you know, as far as disc profile, Pie D. So for that and that, you know, like That'll that'll make a lot of sense. Yeah, look, like most of you know, team played a lot team sport. always have, you know, football and AFL football down here, obviously, not yeah. Yeah, rugby or whatever you call it. Do I be so yeah, I think all that and just I suppose a a drive to always want to succeed, really. Yeah I was pretty lucky, like when we started, it was like I didn't have kids at the time, so we could really focus just the the energy and the attention into the business and you know you you do seventy, eighty, nine hours, whatever was needed. Seven days a week, you just tip it in. But I also knew that I wanted to grow up to a point where when we did have kids and family, that you didn't have to do that. Yeah, well didn't want to be in that be that dad that was never going to be home. So, you know, grow the business, grow the business, grow the business, and and employ the right people to then grow the business. Yeah. Now I'm lucky with you know I've got two kids, you know, Rib's seven, my daughter turns four next week. wow. And I and I'm really lucky that I've built a business now where you know I pick her up from kinda yesterday, take Rib to school, you know, whatever. If if someone's not around, I'll just spend a day with with my daughter, you know, I because I can because the business can still function. Yeah, wow. Mate. It's Exactly what we want for most builders in Australia. You know what I mean, Josh? Like th you are probably one of the first builders. This is the truth. And we've done over 300 episodes and we've got lots of listeners and things like that. And I'm sorry for anyone I offend who have been previously on the podcast. But the truth is a lot of people we've had on the podcast talk about striving toward that. And and like it it should be that way. If you're a business owner, I Yeah, the first few years are gonna be hard. I don't know if there's any avoiding. You talk about seventy, eighty, ninety hour weeks, and I know you're the guy that would freaking do that and you've done it. But like you're the first one that I think has actually done all of that, been through it, and then set up that business where you are able to do this and you are the director and you are the owner of the business and you've done that. How did that transition look, Josh? Like you talked about coming into being a business person. What's what's your day to day look like and how was it different? when you started it. What do you focus on now then? And how did you do it? My day to day now is purely on working on the business, strategic things moving forward. Like give you a bit of background and context. You I've got we've got 18 staff now. Far out, mate. So, you know, like we've got a general manager. So Trav realistically runs he runs the business, you know, from an operational day to day standpoint. construction manager and a sales manager, you know, internal accountant. So you sort of form that high level piece. We've then got two sales consultants, a sales admin, contract admin, receptionist, two estimators. We're one of the few GJ businesses that I've got drafting in-house. So we've always drafting in-house. And that's sort of like our We call that the downstairs team because our office is two stories. So that that sort of forms part of the sales team. and like I say from the construction side then, yeah, construction manager, three supervisors, a fourth supervisor, Erin, who handles all of our aftercare, maintenance, handover, that side of the business. And and manages that whole process through till it's complete. Yeah, yeah. So she'll get involved in the build at about fixed stage and then carry it all the way out through in the maintenance. Fire out. Touch wood, we don't have much limits, ideally, is the is the end goal, but there's always little bits and pieces, especially when you get involved in the houses on the ground, you'll always have things. and then we've got a labourer and a chipping full time on staff. So yeah, we're we're sitting at like eighteen at the moment. Mate, that is a setup. So I have not talked for you to you in years. And I'll tell you what, we know a lot of builders and a lot of builders out there don't have a setup like you, mate. Tell me about the I'm sorry I'm going off. You I'm going off on tangents now, but I'm pretty shit anyway, and I'm more interested like you're doing you doing some cool stuff. An internal accountant. Yeah. so our we our accounts was always external. And we we got to the point where we're like, Okay, we we need to you know, with the the turnover and the revenue that we're starting to generate, we it's a big it's a big beast and we needed we wanted tighter controls and better reporting and We just couldn't get that with our external like Mel had been with us from day dot. Mel McKinnist, you probably might remember from Yeah. So and was absolutely sensational. But we got to the point where with what we needed, we were starting to demand a lot from her and we wanted more. And so we pulled the trigger and and brought inside. So Kate has come in as a senior account, but she's yeah, accountant, you know, qualified, you know, Bass agent. So we bought everything. inside the business and that's been a massive turn in the last sort of six months with cash flow forecasting and you know revenue targets and reporting and you know like GJ's has a pretty strict reporting regime that you need to follow every certain dates and you know we're always to the death knock and you know so just and like I say just getting tighter controls across everything because you know the bigger that bucket gets some of those holes get pretty big too that's stuff just pouring out the bottom. So we you know you've got to start plugging them. Yeah. So that's been a massive shift, but you've also got to get the business to a size that it can support that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So it's it's yeah, it's been a real push and growth and you know, we're not we're certainly not done yet. I'm pretty keen, like I say, ten years now, and ideally I want to double the size of this business over the next five years. Wow. From a from a revenue, like from a dollars perspective. Everything's builds a way more expensive now too mate like when we started for under 200 000 watts i remember remember the average contract price of gj i look back at it the other day josh and i remember it was like 300 grand or 275 grand and i was just like whoa dude like and times have changed mate our average based on the last financial year's site starts was eight hundred grand jeez so we we Whilst we sit in a regional area, we have a really disproportionately high contract price. It's more comparable to Metro guys. but we're also pushing volume in that space. So we're not not like we're doing five or ten, you know, like we're we're trying to push thirty, forty, fifty builds into that type of route. So And so sorry Josh, we're gonna go off on tangents, man. Are they mostly are you doing a lot of custom? We do a lot of custom. You're doing custom pretty much at scale. Yeah, so we which is I mean, like Pete Leotta, Pete Tweed is that, you know, plays in that space really, really well. that's yeah, that's where we've we've predominantly played. We when we went in, I was like, there's no point in trying to go toe to toe with with the Metricons or Simmons of the Worlds on dead flat, you know, Greenfield style sites, because like it's it's brutal to compete, but they can't with me when we start talking about 10 metres of fall. You know, that and and they will actively send clients to us because that they know there's their marketplace and they just like they're not going to waste their time. So we we pursued that. We wanted to be the the volume builder if you like for difficult. Of difficult builds. my god. That's what we've always gone after. Yep. And and like I said we still pick up lot lots of normal stuff. We've actually been doing a lot of SDA like special accessibility accommodation. Far out, man. As well. yeah, but we're we're kinda like I say, trying to grow some some more scale. We've we've got the staff to be able to do that now and and really try and turn it up on scale. I can't stop smiling, mate, because I'm so happy for you. Like you well, as I said, I haven't really caught up over with you for the last few years and seen how your business has gone. But mate, when you came in the business, we all were so pumped. Like being real honest with you. And like the here we are up to now is just phenomenal because we know a lot of builders, man, and like even mid-tier ones we know don't have or aren't thinking about things you were thinking about, Josh. And I think that's what makes you so impressive. I I I rarely hear that I've got an internal accountant and drafting, for example. I know very big volume builders that are outsourcing drafting to India still. and I'm not banning anyone. I'm just kind of like I think you've got to control like my my view and and and I'd love to hear yours actually, Josh, because you are the dude doing it, man. Like the more you can control, the better and and keep things Not trying to be a control freak, but whatever you can control, control, and then the external factors you kind of don't have to worry about. I I I don't know. That's kind of my try and we want to try and control as much as we can to be able to control the client experience. At the end of the day, everyone's at your end goal. Everyone on my team is on the same same path, if you like. It's what can we do to provide the best client experience and then make it better every single time? So always constantly every job we do, okay. What can we learn from that? How can we evolve? What can we do better? So the primary thing is when anything we look in business is is that going to increase our client experience and our customer and our journey? And if the answer's no, well then it's not something that's probably relevant to bring in. If it's yes, we can we can improve our customer experience by pulling that lever, then then we'll do it. It's got a you still need to have a cost analysis and make sure that it stacks up. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But Primarily everything is is based around that that client experience. We've always employed early to my detriment sometimes. Yeah. So you can't if you're drowning and you're behind that wave and you're trying to play catch up and onboard new staff, it's it's brutal. It makes it really hard. So we've always tried to go early, you know, like I think we're gonna need a new supervisor soon. Let's get them in now and get them up to speed, rather than be like, We needed a new supervisor six months ago, the boys are at bursting capacity. You know try and get that wrong. We we've got that wrong a few times. We've pushed our construction boys way beyond what was probably, you know, the right amount of work. I think the whole industry has in fairness though, Josh, because if you ever come up to Queensland, mate, supervisors were just charging what they wanted for the last few years because they weren't, you know, same sort of thing. they would go anywhere they sort of wanted to go or or they were in need, in desperate need, because people weren't proactive and getting them early enough. So people were just paying them whatever. Okay, for us then, and the way I look at it now is I employ people who do their job way better than I can it. Like every single person that works for me does their job better than I could do it. Could I do their job? Yes. Are they better at it? Absolutely. So I try and sit in a spot now, like I say, with with having a a GM in in place and then having the construction manager and sales manager sort of split the business in half. It's then just my job is just to make sure that they can do theirs. That's that's really all that I'm trying to do is making sure that Trav in the GM role, Lockie is a sales manager, Dallas is a construction manager, are set up to succeed. That's you know, that's really just what we're doing. You know, come up with your the broad p piece on the business plan, what are we trying to hit? What are you know, what are our targets? And then supporting those guys to ensure that we can hit them. Yeah, wow, Josh. Man. But ideally then spend spend as much time as I can with my kids while they're little. I can say I haven't been able to do it this year, but last year, you know, I spent every Thursday, I was just with Nicoletta. Yeah, wow. Yeah. Good on you. No. And there there's peaks and troughs in it, isn't there, Josh? You take the good with the bad and you do what you need to do and you're that type of guy that does that, mate. That's I would rather work, add five years onto my working career to spend a a day or two a week with my kids now while they're young, you know, like Rivers at school, but London's still in kinda, so you know, spend that time 'cause you can never get that back. I can't find that back. So I'll take any opportunity I can to to do that now. And if that means that I like say if I need to work you know, longer into my career and retire later, so be it. Your kids are only little, they're only little ones. Yeah. Yeah. And yeah. I I I you seem like the type of guy that doesn't really think about retirement too much. But in the end, mate, you're gonna have a good nice little nest egg with that business there, mate. Like, you know what I mean? You're building a really good asset for you and your family. And whether it stays in the family or whatever, mate, I'm so like I I shouldn't say I'm proud because I don't don't mean to be condescending or anything because I couldn't do what you do. But I am freaking to hear what what you're up to, mate. I in my wildest dreams I didn't think. as I said, we've talked to mid tier builders who don't have setups like you and doing the sort of volumes in a local area that you're doing. So that's a testament to who you are, mate. That's so cool. That's freaking cool. It's like I say, it's been a journey. Yeah, awesome. Well, mate On that journey, you know, the obviously the the franchise system, GJ Gardner, who we love, is is being a part of that story. What what has it meant to you? What did you think that GJ Gardner was able to bring to you as a a builder, Josh, that you might have seen a bit of an advantage from? The reality is, mate, I you could never build to the level I have in the time frame without, in my opinion, without that brand awareness and and You know, like don't get me wrong, we've got to a point now where it's a it's a big beast on its own and and you know, some of the supply stuff and bits and pieces, you know, we can we can negotiate locally and push beyond that. But in the early days, like to have that name on your door, you know, the marketing side of things, the the access to suppliers. And at the end of the day, the access to the other people in the group is the biggest thing. And in the early days, you'd be constantly, you know, who's Who's paying what for brickies or chippies or panes or plasters and you know the reality is that someone in that group would have tried what you were thinking and could say that does not work, trust me, you know, like the community that you get if you like inside of that franchise network is second to none. Yeah, yeah. And and you know what, Josh, I'd probably cause I came from retail marketing, I was a Kmart and came in and Murvac and came into GJs. And I remember putting out a survey after one of our conferences, and it it probably disappointed is the wrong word, but kind of disappointed me in a way. Cause you know, I was the marketing guy and thought I was making a difference. and and you know, I did to a degree, but I'd put out a survey and be like, what's the best part of being part of GJ Gardener and all that sort of thing? And pretty much 99% was the network and having that community around you. And obviously you've now done 10 years, mate. New franchisees are coming in and and and ones that are going through the same issues. You're probably that guy now that people are leaning on and you're passing on some of that knowledge. And they're probably one of the old ones. yeah, yeah. Well, old young will call you because mate, you're not even 40 yet. I'm over 40. But like, you know, all the stuff that you do and been through, and as I said, it's phenomenal that you've internal drafting, internal accounting, all those things that they can kind of talk to you about. Yeah, that's really powerful, mate. And I think that's yeah, really cool. So who's who's your neighbour now, Josh? There, actually. Who's the neighbouring franchise? so there's a new franchise that's just gone into Packingham. They would love you. There you go. So Adam Adam's gone in there recently. Otherwise we're down to as you keep saying with Nick, who's been in who's been in for he's been twelve years. Yeah. So yeah, there's there's quite a few newer guys in the group. Is it It's a bit of a different model too now in some of the stuff with what they're doing, the way they're setting up their the areas. Okay. It's yeah, it's it's different. I'm I'm lucky or not lucky, but because we're now the master's gone and it's national, we run a franchise advisory council, so each state has a couple of reps. So I actually chair that nationally. Doesn't surprise me. So I'm actually up on the Southern Coast sporadically with Chris and Trent and bits and pieces. So mate, you're coming over for a barbecue. Well please I live five minutes from the AR office. Yeah. So I was actually up two two weeks ago. so we we sort of sit collectively, you know, like I said, there's a couple of reps out of Vic, New South, South Australia, Queensland, that represent the entire network, and and then we meet with obviously with Trent, Chris. and and quite a few of the the head office or the franchise or team on a quarterly basis. which I've actually really enjoyed that. It I I threw my hand up to chair it as a bit of a a stretch. You know, push development, sort of push myself outside of my comfort zone, I suppose. it's it's been really cool. Really you know cool thing to be involved in and like I say, just learn and evolve. I started off a podcast with your proactive mate, you know, and I'm not I'm not, you know, saying you're doing everything at GJ's, but now you're advising and and helping advise G J Gardener across the nation and what's going on in Victoria and all that sort of stuff. That is so cool, Josh, mate. That and I think that just defines you, mate. Like that little thing that you just told me I didn't know about. And that is you. You're the guy that'll put his hand up, you'll support your your peers and your team. And and you'll do what you can to better whatever you're involved in. And and that makes a good builder, man. Like you you said you're starting a podcast. I'm almost about to get out of this chair and just go, Mate, do you want it? And I don't mind, mate. I don't care. Like you are a good builder. You you know a lot about building, you know a lot more than me. This is why we got you on as well. But mate, I'd be happy to get out of here. You want to push yourself, you can have this. Yeah, I I'm happy to do the podcast we've come up with, but I don't come up with the the creative. Yeah. I'll do that. I'll sit in the background and do that, mate. You can handle it. It was thrown at me as a challenge from one of the girls that does all their social media. She's like, I'd I'd really like to do a podcast, would you do it? I You know what? You organise it, I'll I'll do it. I I'm happy to talk, I'm happy to go through, but I'm not I'm not gonna organise and chase in bits and pieces. So you take control of it and we'll facilitate it. So that's how we end up in the podcast. But I think like when I look at the group though, like I I was really fortunate when I came in there, some really, really good guys that took me out of their wing now, like Rowan and Chris and Daniel from Benigo and Rob from Bellavan. There's some serious serious operators there who sort of, you know a and Ross as well, you circled back, yeah, took me out of my wing and and you know, you really looked up to those guys. And now it's great to go, you know, I'm I'm considered the player on the same level as them. Which is Which is so humble, mate. Very cool. Is Rowan still around? Yeah. Yeah. mate. I used to love that bloke. I haven't talked to him since I left. I I yeah, I had a good relationship with him, but not a personal one. And so I've all I've lost contact with him. But I I remember I spent I think three days in his office, and he was a serious operator. That's where I learnt a lot about building. He was like, Let me take you around and show you how this works. And I'm like, okay. And I remember being exhausted by the end of it and going, Is that what you do? That's what Ross sent me there before we started part of the onboarding, and I still remember it today, and I passed the same advice on other people. He said, Rowan said to me, The quicker you realise that this is a sales business and not a building business, the better. Yeah, wow. That's great advice. If if you can't sell, you'll have nothing to do. So you don't have to worry about the building side it. Fire art. And and it took I think it still took me about five or six years to probably that in. But yeah, he he's right, building's a a process, yeah, like once it's on site, you just follow and process step by step. Yeah. But if you can't actually if you can't get people to trust you and and commit to working with you, then there's nothing to do. Yeah, wow. I mean, at the end of the day, we we sell the single largest individual purchase that anyone will make in their life. Yeah, true. Very true, Josh. Yeah, so like yeah, all everyone is a builder at the end of the day is trusted with their clients hard earned. It's their life savings. Yeah. Other than someone maybe going buying a business of some description, that they will never make a single purchase larger than you know, building or buying a house. Yeah, yeah. And and they probably won't be as emotional around it. too. You know what I mean, Josh? Like it is the hardest game in the world. And that's why I'm so impressed with what you've done. You know, it's cool, man. Like it's cool to see. It takes a lot. you know, I again I kicked off the podcast with many businesses. You know, I think it's building businesses. I think it's two in ten, or no, I think it's more than that. maybe it's four or five in ten businesses that don't last. Building businesses don't last 10 years in construction. You know, you're one of the and and you're flourishing. You know, so that's that in itself is phenomenal, mate. At the end of the day, it's a it's a tough game, and I'm sure that anyone in this industry would say there's way easier things you could do to make money than be a builder. yeah. And at the end of the day, you'd you know, even if I wanted to stop today, I've got ten years of liability to carry on as well. Yeah. You know it's it's certainly not easy. Certainly in Victoria with with you know the the requirements from N C C twenty two and being The only state in its wisdom that decided to adopt it in its entirety. Yeah. So shock. We you look at the the increase in costs and things like that over the years. It's yeah. We were fortunate that we were in and established before the COVID boom, if you like, happened so we could ride that out. But some tough times for some guys that might have been in for five or six years, you know, to come in and start a business and take off at that. And at the end of the day, no one made any money through that, period. Yeah. Everyone just everyone across the country just hung on. Yeah. They did, didn't they? It was just a warrior. Yeah. And I think the ride still goes, doesn't it, Josh, to some degree. You know, people are still it's gonna take still take people a lot of time, even if they've come through it, to actually fill the hole that they dug in. Yeah, to to be able to keep moving forward. Fire out, man. Fire out, Josh. Fun ride. Especially Victoria being locked down and mate. Yeah, you guys had it the absolute hardest, didn't you? Like it was the hardest period. And yeah, and then even like and and Victoria fell in a slump because everyone was moving up north. Everyone was we've got a lot of I saw a lot of Victorian number plates come up this way too. So there was you know, there was less people that you're building for, you're dealing with everything else, Josh mate. would have been a ride and you know and then the Iraq war starts or no sorry Iran war with the the later stuff and then you you're in it again aren't you Josh? So you the building game is no days the same mate and you you met with new challenges man. Do you love it for that reason? Is is that part of your DNA man? Yeah yeah I I like the challenge. I think like the the Iran war was was interesting. What was really good to see from our side is that as a group we'd learnt a lot From COVID and a lot of we made a lot of things and a lot of decisions differently coming into that to protect us. So like you go through COVID and we that you were just accepting price rises left, right, and centre. And this came in and and Jazz, who's the head of procurement for GJs now, was was really instrumental in it that we all agreed we're not accepting price rises. We talk about temporary surcharges with with a reversal point. Okay, now concrete was one of the biggest ones. Yeah. At what point does it come backwards? Because we all know that if we put the rate up, it'll never come back. Yeah. If we accept a temporary a temporary fuel surcharge, yeah, we're not we're not changing the rate, we're paying the same for concrete and we're just paying extra over here, but that comes off. And so everyone learn a lot through that and it we we're able to protect ourselves through that period. Wow. So that was really good to see that there'd actually been some massive learnings from the past. Yeah. And do you think the collective thinking of the group helped that too, Josh? You know, you're all kind of you've got you've all got your own experiences. You're bringing it together with the advisory board and kind of you know pushing that back into national office. And I'm sure they see it too. I know Trent very well, he's a good operator, and I'm sure they see it, but you know, that you guys are validating everything and going, hey, this is what's going on, you know, as a group, let's Let's help it. That's very true. And yeah, just having that in access to that information. I mean, like to go back to our local concrete supplier and be like, You realize the surcharge you're putting on here is the highest in the country. Like, come on. yeah. That intelligence. Let's have a chat about that. So, you know, you had you had information because you can go here, here's you know, eighty different franchises across Australia with the same thing and you know, you're trying to charge eighteen dollars a cubic meter and Tweetheads getting charged four. Like let's you know Talk about it. Can't dispute the data. And that's probably what that franchise network is is handy. And that's probably been one good thing that has happened with the master removal is we used to operate pretty you know individually estates. Yeah. We it it it has created a a bigger, broader national network now. Very cool. Which is yeah, cool and you know, exposed to some some really cool operators and you know. Great businesses, you know, the Nathan Faye and Sean Vickery sort of Shoalhaven guys and the Pete the Otters of the World and Yeah. Sam Pierce and Rod from South Australia. Like there's some there's some amazing businesses inside of of the network. absolutely. Yeah, yeah. I remember the yeah, Nathan Faye and Sean Vickery, they're they're serious operators in Shoalhaven. I think Nathan's moved up here. To Sunrise Beach. So I've heard that and I think I sent him a message the other day. So I think we're gonna catch up. But yeah, they were great operators, guys to avoid if you're at a conference though. I had I went to a Queenstown conference with them and I I was carried out of their hotel room by Nathan Fay and but he carried me back to the to my room, but I don't think I eventually got my room. I was so drunk so I fell asleep on the floor, but They take good care of you, but they were freaking, you know, they they that's the cool thing about the network as well. And you you talk about the support and that, yeah, you celebrate the good times and you can I celebrated maybe harder than others and that's why I don't drink anymore. I fell into a slump of drinking every day, but you know, 'cause I enjoyed it. But you know, you know, you have that camaraderie in it too. And I used to get so everyone gets so pumped after seeing each other and you know who you're doing it for, you know, and and that's like you, Josh, like Why I'm so pumped for this podcast and I'm so appreciative of your time, mate, was that when I met you I was like, Whoa, this guy's gonna be a beast and then I've just watched you and you've just grown this thing and and mate, just to you know, see that thing happen within a group that that I was part of. I was not part of your success at all. It's all you and and the other G J's guys, but man, it's just yeah, really cool to do that. So I think yeah, everyone plays a part. You you everyone c you know, cross bars and you pick up bits and pieces from different people and early in the early days I probably wouldn't have yeah you you just there's that much going on that you just you don't truly grasp the the scale of what you're you're playing with. So it's no it's it's it's it's good times these days. Like I say still has it absolutely has its moments. Yeah. As does any business, you know, like it's it's ups and downs and you just have to be able to get in and and sometimes just keep chewing the to get through that smell, you know, like not every year's a great week. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Nah, good advice, mate. Well, you know, you you talked about, you know, the the sort of how things have changed and and how you've sort of changed and what you knew back in the past. What is different about this version of Josh Terrell that I'm talking to now that's different to the 29 year old Josh Terrell that I met? I don't think there's like I I I can see there's I can actually just talking to you honestly and I hope this doesn't sound any other way than complimentary, mate, but I can see you've evolved a lot, like definitely into a businessman and and and what you're doing. But you know, what are what is what's the difference in the versions? Well, I think twenty nine year old me was was all about me. Yeah. That's as nice looking at people are like I say to me like Two things. I I just want to give the opportunities to my team that they couldn't get anywhere else and you know, be able to provide them with a with a working, you know, environment and area that, you know, that just they can't get anywhere else and be able to expose them to opportunities they can't get. And at the end of the day, it's it's for me it's about kids now. It's you know, when you're when you're young and single and you well I wasn't single, but you know, your primary focus is is really it's just on you. Life changes, life's pivots and I could have easily been the person who said I could not have kids and just work. Really? Well and just you know, just all about you know yourself. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Now that I've had them, you could never not have them. Yeah. True I could I could just never not to to be able to walk around remember walking around with my son one day and he's like, Dad, that's one of your houses. You know, like and e even the other day and I hate it but he's He's playing Minecraft and I I hate I hate it. But as I dad, I I built I built GJ Gardner. man. In Minecraft. You know, so like to have him proud of of what you do and and again, like with my daughter, that that's pretty cool. But yeah, for me now it it's about the people. You know, yeah. We can't you can't do this without the people. Yeah. Yeah, I love it. Like I say, we try and give them, you know, an environment that they can flourish and succeed and now we we try and do as much, you know, extra external training and bits and pieces as we can. You know, we've put a pretty flexible work environment around here. you know, like we we build our own office and it's a it's an amazing place to work. Come down, I want to say it, man. Yeah, it it's it's been really, really cool. it's out it's ours too, which is good so from business perspective, it's It's a good asset to have, but you know, like we went from you know renting an office that was that was a 300 square meter factory that sort of fitted out, I think. Our office now is like 550 square meters, you know, we're prominent location. and then we're actually just about to open it or get a property for a second office. So we're gonna open another office in the Terralban area. Wow. Have we got the exclusive on that one? I think I think I think our regional manager and Chris Noel, Trent probably he might have wind of it, but yeah, we're we're just looking at a few properties. We we know that for us to to build a better presence in that Latrobe Valley area, we need to be there. And so we're gonna we're gonna put an office in it there and and you know go toe to toe with with with some solid competitors that are down there. You know, like we we we compete with some genuine, you know, really high quality business. Wow. So you're always reinvesting in your business too, Josh. And looking at, as you said, how to serve your customers better. Having a presence there, having an office, having a place they can go, all that sort of thing. That's yeah, you're a fascinating blake, mate. Like Yeah. You've got to keep yeah, you have to keep tipping it back in. If there's any left sometimes, like That's the thing, hey. Like you talk about two hundred and fifty harms and talk about all of that. And a lot of the public too, they think, they're making a killing. Mate, like the he the the but also the liability, the ten year liability later on after everything said and done, you are in a marriage with these people. Like it is a marriage. a lot of marriages don't last ten years nowadays, Josh. No. Yeah, like wow. Yeah, they're they're almost throwaways, if you like. Yeah, yeah, mate. Yeah, we've we've always been a pretty like especially with our team, it's a pretty transparent thing as far as you know, like what we need to do from revenue targets and and bits and pieces. You know, like the reality is it costs us like three and a half million dollars a year just to open the doors and turn the lights on. Yeah, like so lots of people will want to look and and And go, you've got a nice car or you've got this, and they're they're pretty quick to point their finger, but they're not prepared to do the work that you have to do to get it or the risk that's involved in it. You know, like especially in us, and you'll be familiar with this in the building industry, you know, like I have to we leverage everything we have to be able to build. Yeah. If we can't if we don't have insurance, we we can't build. So like the reality is, you know, our our family home, everything we have is anchored to it. So If it goes wrong, it goes really well. Yeah, wow. And it's not just me and my family, it's the the eighteen families, you know, that we directly employ and the hundreds of trades and you know, like like wow. Can be a real house of cards. You know, no one's talked about that on here, Josh. Yeah. Which is really interesting. And sometimes it's not necessarily from your own fault. Yeah, like we've we've had really challenging periods over the years. We looked one year and yeah, we had like thirty jobs to to go to site and like twenty five of them triggered planning permits. So we couldn't we've got all this work, but we can't touch any of it. Wow. And here it for us, our local council is absolutely horrific. But if it goes into a planning permit, it's probably going to take twelve months. So you sort of sit there going, got all this work in the pipeline, can't touch any of it, can't I don't really want to, you know, lay off stars. So strap in and and we just at that point we just plowed a big hole because we weren't prepared to get rid of that people. We knew that the work was there. Wow. And so you know you you you dig some big holes and we've done that a couple of times, but you it's all a cycle, it's what you have to do. But you know, we're lucky that we've been able to build a business that we could we could sustain that, whereas a lot of people couldn't. No. And then it just you pull that bottom card out and just thousand cars. Absolutely. Like I say, it's not it's not just us, then it's when you look at the the ripple effect across, you know, all of your trades and suppliers and things like the the rents you have and the amount of people you touch is massive. Yeah. yeah. Yeah. Huge. Huge, Josh. Absolutely huge. And yeah it it frustrates me because you know we have to have the insurance, but the things that we have to do to get it, the insurers actually have no risk. Yeah. So we have to find a deed of priority that I mean they take first pick over everything ahead of the bank. Yeah. But they they they make us put Westpac as number two on the priority list. So the reality is they're gonna pick the bones out of everything you've got and not really have any risk in in that point. Yeah. I could like I could go down that rabbit hole forever. You know what you're doing. You know what you've done this podcast, Josh, actually, which we've never done before. And I'm I'm I've realized it when you first started talking. This is kind of like the first podcast where showing the pathway to a good builder. You know, from the 29-year-old Josh, what you did, what you implemented along the way to the great builder that you are now. We've never had an interview like this. This is freaking cool. You know what I mean? Like he's fucking cool, man. Like we We haven't had someone that had been able, and this is why I said I didn't want to offend anybody, but we haven't had someone that has been able to talk through it like you have. And you've made some, I qu think, quite significant changes, changes that other people wouldn't do, but you know, like the accountant and things like that. But they're all things that people should assess and look at. But I don't think they're looking at they're building businesses like you have. So this is the coolest podcast, man. It is wild to see you know, the evolution of you, man. That's because like the reality is and I always wondered them, most people will just look and go, cash flow, I'm making money. If there's money coming in, but is there more coming in than's going out? Yeah, like where's where's the deal? And like I say, that's what a lot of people see. They they see that yeah, we we turn over a huge amount of money. That's necessarily like it's not like we get to keep it. You know, like building businesses don't run on they don't run on thirty, forty percent profit margins, you know, like Yeah, you need to you need to move a lot of money to be able to make money. That's wow. Yeah, the reality is for us most of what we do is paying out to trades and suppliers. Hmm. Yeah. Yeah. That's what we do. We're not selling a product that we've bought, you know, we can put a four hundred percent markup on and and flog it out the other side. Like an e-commerce site. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. You're not drop shipping. We have to be competitive then too against the rest of the market. Yeah. Wow. And you've got big boys down there too. And you know, you've got footholds like Metricon and things like that that have great reputations in Victoria and they flood the market with their marketing and Henley and all that. Not not I'm not bagging them. You know, I know the guys, but like you're up against it, Josh? Yeah. And but like the market needs that too. Like Yeah, absolutely. You need to have those guys and like I say that's why we've got we don't talk about having to be the builder for everyone. 'Cause you can't you you just you physically can't do it. We want to build people who want to work with us. They can see past the the base price. We we never talk base prices. We want to look at Aaron's house, show me a block, let's check it out, and let's give you a price on what it's gonna cost to build your house your way on your block. Now, like we we try not to get caught in the smoke and mirrors. Yeah. Yeah. Like I say, there there's a It's clearly a place in the market for them because they're the biggest builder in the country. Yeah. Yeah. So Yeah. Yeah. Either that or, you know, the smoke and mirrors works really well. That's my opinion, not yours. But, you know, I think, you know, it's part of that. But I think, you know, what do I see? What why I think you're successful, Josh, to be honest and and that sort of thing is everything you've talked about in this podcast. But I think and I think as in the future, I think your next ten years are gonna be really phenomenal to watch. And I you know, I'm sure we're gonna stay in contact and I want to do more interviews with you. But mate, like people are de risking their builds now. They're doing a lot more research on what's going on. They're a lot cluerier around these. Like I'm a I'm an avid Reddit fan. I'm always on Reddit, which is a bunch of weirdos like me. And I jump in the boards and you see the guys talking about home building and they're like, they offered us a free pool and everyone's like, Yeah, free. Yeah. You know what I mean? It's getting it's getting like that. So I reckon your next ten years are gonna be really interesting. And what we see kind of Australia wide is a lot of that more the the luxury market, the custom market seems to be getting a bit bigger. People are starting to want to spend a bit more, like they're they're a bit more like understanding that you know, building a forever home costs and all that sort of thing. So mate, yeah, really interesting. and I love the way you you you building your philosophy on just being transparent and how we build how we actually build what you want on your block. Like hey, it's freaking cool. The reality is it's it's one of the things that we sort of link in through our podcast that we're starting to do and and any conversation if if you talk to any builder and they haven't come out to your block of land, how do they know what to they're even doing it? What they're happy. Yeah. The the reality is for us either myself Locking or Dallas Air Construction Manager will go to every potential block. So like our sales girls know if if my diary is empty and you need me, you just book me and and meet that client on site. And really for us, that's that's like stop number one. Let's let's meet you on the block so that we can pick up any anomalies, bits and pieces, and actually make sure that we're doing it right. If you haven't been there or you haven't had someone there, they're just guessing. Yeah. price they're giving you is not gonna be up. Yeah, no. Good advice, mate. And as I said, I am not pr I actually think you're gonna have a boomer of a podcast with a lot of good information. So I'm gonna put all the the stuff below. I I think a lot of you builders out there and as I said clients that do follow us, jump on and check out Josh's podcast because I think you're gonna have some really interesting discussion on I'm gonna be an avid listener. I'll be the I'll be your first subscriber when it launches, I reckon. I'll keep my eye on you. It is launched, it is live with like the first two are out. yeah, and we we're like, this is actually not bad. We probably should get a little bit more serious about it and work it out properly. So yeah, we're filming the next couple episodes in a couple of weeks. So mate, all right. We'll we'll make sure we put everything below and share your episodes. I think there's gonna be a lot of valuable information on there, and then also. I think builders are gonna get a few clues about how you do things. And if you're gonna follow a builder, I'd follow you, mate. You're a you're a freaking good builder. And that kind of leads me to my last question, unfortunately. because I think I could talk to you forever. And I th but then I think we've already gone an hour, which has flown, mate. but you know we're called the good builder, Josh. What do you think makes a good builder? I I think for us and for me personally, i it's it's a good builder will just take responsibility for what they do. If they get it wrong, they're gonna own it and not try and stick the boots in for it. They get it right. I'll take you know, all that's it's for us what we're trying to constantly do is just take responsibility. The reality is any any bad situation that would come up, we could still probably stop in and reflect on that and go, you know what? We played a part in that. So let's Let's try and solve it. So I think anyone, as long as they're taking responsibility for what they're doing constantly, in the end it'll all work out. You will have challenging conversations and difficult times. And don't get me wrong, we've we've made massive mistakes and you know built houses for free pretty much. But you also have to look and go, you know, did I play a part and get into that point? And if I did, well I I should probably cover my part of that and not just stick the boots in the U to deal with it. Fire out. After the three hundred odd episodes we've done, this is the first that someone said that, Josh. Just responsibility. I mean, and and I don't want to take words out of your mouth, but when you when you take responsibility, you you take ownership of everything. You know, you it really and it's interesting. Like a lot of people have talked about traits in terms of, you know, a builder's gotta know how to do this and they've got to know how to do that. And it's more technical or operational side of things. What you said, I think, is a bit more of a personal trait. And I think that's really interesting in a way. and a behavioral trait rather than a technical skill trait. And I think you're completely right. Like, part of being a good builder is not just the technical aspect, it's actually about, you know, who you are. Do you take pride in your work? Will you take accountability if something goes wrong? And like you said, just that incremental like. You know what, I look at businesses all around the world. You look at Toyota, for example, and they talk about Kaizen. And a few guests have jumped on here. We've had some sort of psychologist on here who was great and he's got a great business. And he talks about Kaizen. And it reminded me a bit of you, Josh. And he talked about like no matter how small the change is, if it makes it for the better, make it. Like if it just keeps improving your business. And it seems like you've just got this mindset of that responsibility, accountability, but incremental improvement off the back of that, which is just, you know, gradually put your business there. You haven't gone, how do we get from here to there? You've kind of assessed what you're doing, tweaking things along the way. Maybe I'm completely wrong here, Josh, but you know, I think absolutely it's a really cool way to think of it. If you're not continually evolving, like for me, I get bored really easily. So if we weren't continually evolving and pushing, I I probably wouldn't do it. Like I Yeah, so it's it's about that constant that one percent better every day type, you know, methodology, if you like, that people talk about. But that's really all it is. Okay, well, what did we learn from that potential mistake? What can we do better next time and and constantly evolve? You know, yeah, this business continually evolves. I think sometimes the staff think geez, they just they always just push, push, push, but it's for the for the greater good. And I think that's That's an important thing to say, Josh. It was like my story about Roscoe. You know, some people can take that. It depends on who you are. And I think we've got to work on ourselves as individuals to be a bit more resilient to take feedback and and have that push to be better. But it was like Roscoe. I remember that, as I said in this podcast, the first conversation stung. But when you think about where that comes from, it comes from a place of, you know, wanting you to be better. And then when you take that mindset on and you and you do that. You're not taking it as criticism, it's and you didn't say it in any other way, but you could have easily taken it. That's when you become a better person and all that sort of thing. And I think that's some wise advice from you, mate. And obviously, look at you, mate. Like, you know, I've watched the evolution of you, and that's why I was so keen to have you on. I didn't know half the things you were doing, such as the advisory board and stuff like that. But mate, you are yeah, you are a good builder, you are a very good. Mate, I love this episode has been the most practical and the most it actually has been almost a timeline or a blueprint to becoming a good builder. And we have never been able to do that, mate. So thank you so much. Hey, like it's freaking cool. Full of surprises, mate. Full of surprises. mate, you're you're freaking wonderful. Well, mate, I'll end it there. But when you do have time and when you are next up on the advisory board for GJ Gardener Homes, I do cook a pretty mean smoked brisket, about seven kilos and there's only three of us in the family. So please come on over, mate, and I will serve you some dinner. In November. mate, please come up, give me the dates. I would love to hang out with you a bit more. And if you don't mind, I might do an episode in another month or two, see what's going on when you maybe maybe launch a new office and That all goes through and stuff like that. But we'd love to keep in touch with you, mate, because I think everything you shared today is so valuable to our community. I don't think you understand what you just did. Like honestly, mate. All we want to see is just the building industry gets tired with a with a pretty rough brush a lot of the times and it's we're not all bad, you know, like no. We just want to see the industry grow and and succeed and yeah, like so I I'm passionate about it 'cause It's it's all I know. I'm I'm I'm just a builder. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Not just the builder, mate. You're freaking good. Yeah, I know you would. I know you would, Josh. Well, mate, once again, thank you so much, everyone. we're gonna put his website below for anyone in Warregal that listens to us and wants to build, go and see Josh. Other than that, all you builders out there, all you traders out there. We'll put all links below to his podcast as well. so you can go and check that out. So I like and subscribe to his podcast and tune into a good builder, I reckon, because I think I'll be probably learning a little bit and taking a bit of your material and spitting it back out here. But you can be damn sure, Josh, you know who I am, man. I won't say I made it up and this is my advice. I'm gonna go, hey, I was listening to Josh's pod. This is what he said, guys. This was pretty cool. Go and listen to it. so thank you so much for everything you do for the industry. Thank you so much for hanging out with me, man, and staying in contact over the last 10 years. And I am just yeah, over the moon with how things are going for you, mate. So yeah, it's freaking. Okay, it's been good. All right, mate. I will end it there, unfortunately. because I would talk to you all day. There you go, Josh. That's it, mate. That was