Latest / Simply Bitcoin / Lawrence Lepard | Fix the Money, Fix the World | Simply Bitcoin IRL

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Lawrence Lepard | Fix the Money, Fix the World | Simply Bitcoin IRL · Simply Bitcoin

0:06
Hello everybody. Welcome to another episode of
0:08
Simply Bitcoin IRL. Today, we have a very special
0:12
guest. I always enjoy my conversations
0:14
with him. Oh, Lawrence Lepard, but before
0:16
I bring them up on the show, when I give a very special shout
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your tickets. Anyways, that being said,
0:44
Lawrence, welcome back to the show, super happy to have you.
0:47
Last time we had a conversation, I was at Bitcoin magazine
0:52
headquarters in Nashville and it was it was one of my favorite
0:57
podcast that I've had in a long time.
0:58
So I'm very happy that you're back.
1:00
Oh thanks. Thanks for having me back
1:01
because I wasn't Talking to you about a fun.
1:04
Yeah so I'm I always say this every show but you know guys I
1:08
don't like to beat around the bush so just we're going to jump
1:10
straight into it. Skip the small talk Lawrence.
1:14
Where's the recession? Everyone thought there was going
1:16
to be a recession. Everyone was expecting that
1:18
there was going to be a recession.
1:20
Where is it? Is it still coming?
1:22
Did we do so-called soft Landing?
1:24
Yeah it's coming. I don't think we're gonna have a
1:26
soft Landing. I disagree with that.
1:29
Yeah it's basically it depends on where you are on the The in
1:32
the stack, right? I mean for I think for
1:35
middle-income people, it's here, right?
1:37
I mean, they're having a hard time paying the bills.
1:39
You can see the credit card debt growth.
1:42
A lot of people are surviving using the credit cards and, you
1:47
know, even even the growth that we see, I mean, if you have a
1:50
3%, GDP growth, but you've got eight percent inflation that
1:54
really means that you strip 5% less Goods.
1:57
You just the three was the difference.
1:59
It was the inflation rate right here, you know, the grocery.
2:02
Numbers changing, but the unit numbers are going down.
2:04
So, we're in a recession already, you're seeing it
2:07
housing for sure. You're starting seeing cars.
2:10
Although, ironically, I mean, there's a lot of cross currents
2:12
here, right? I mean, there's a certain amount
2:15
of fear and I'm seeing this everywhere, I go, anyone who's
2:18
looking at buying something, there are a little bit afraid
2:22
of, you know, in the past. You think while waiting the
2:24
prices will come down and they're little afraid of that.
2:27
I mean, I just had a friend who just bought a place a house and
2:30
he was like well you know, Gosh, I don't know.
2:33
I, you know, maybe they, maybe things will come down, maybe
2:35
they won't. We're kind of in an inflationary
2:37
environment and prices might continue to go up, so I probably
2:41
ought to just buy it, you know? So it it's it's a tricky tricky
2:46
macro-environment right now. Yeah.
2:49
And absolutely, then how you know, specifically like how are
2:54
people supposed to live? Like you know, the the I was
2:57
looking at the official you know, statistics provided by the
3:01
Fed And housing prices over the last two or three years
3:05
basically if doubled of course if you own assets, you're very
3:10
happy about that. But if you're like the majority
3:12
of people you can't even afford a home which is, you know saying
3:17
oh that's that's right. I mean and you know, I think the
3:21
only way people are able to make it is by taking on more debt and
3:26
and you know that's that's Fiat land, right?
3:28
I mean, Fiat land is built and promised upon putting out
3:31
putting debt on top of Of debt. And, you know, the the biggest
3:35
one of the biggest macro events of the last couple of quarters
3:38
that I've seen is, you know, just the growth in credit card
3:41
debt. It's gone straight up.
3:43
And, and by the way, that's not cheap, Dad, if you're, if you're
3:46
evolving it, if you're not, paying it all off, you know,
3:48
you've got, I mean, this, the average credit card rate is I
3:52
think wrapped up close to twenty percent, whereas it used to be
3:55
substantially below that more like 12 15.
3:57
So, you get deep in debt and you've got, you know, those
4:01
recurring charges. I mean, It's a, it's a death
4:03
spiral and I'm sure we're going to talk about that because the
4:05
federal government's having the same experience.
4:10
So, let's talk about it, what is it?
4:13
What is this dad's file that you speak of Lords?
4:16
Yeah, well I hope you're good at pulling up charge.
4:18
Maybe you can pull up the chart that shows the federal interest
4:22
expense. Absolutely US federal government
4:25
interest expense. I mean, I I love this one,
4:28
right? I mean, the, you know, The FED
4:33
increasing interest rates. I think doesn't necessarily
4:36
understand. The second order effect, which
4:38
is is going to increase their borrowing cost of the government
4:40
as well, and as a result, the government, yeah, that's a good
4:46
one, right? So yeah, take a look at that,
4:49
right? So this is this is US federal
4:51
government current expenditures interest payments.
4:53
Look at what's going on. As a result of the rise in rates
4:56
and you know we're running I think on there it's showing kind
5:00
of a Plus million rate headed to a trillion.
5:04
I mean, look, the the, you know, the federal taxes are on the
5:07
four trillion range. I mean we're getting to the
5:10
point where the deficit is just going to blow out on interest
5:13
alone, not to mention the fact that, you know, cost of living
5:15
adjustments for Social Security. Last year was 8.9% probably be
5:18
high again this year. So, you know, the government is
5:22
in a debt Doom Loop which is what happens when you get to the
5:26
end of sovereign debt crisis. And you know that It's messy.
5:33
And you know, we don't know if this going to be deflation or
5:37
inflation or both. I mean, there's been a little
5:39
bit of deflation in some of the sound money assets, which is
5:41
going to Palmer, plus six months to a year or two.
5:44
But, you know, I think in general, it's safe to say that,
5:50
you know, the the trends are all running heavily inflationary and
5:55
will continue to do. So I mean, I have to say, even I
5:58
have been shocked by how How inflation has persisted?
6:04
I thought we, at least start to see some you're over your comps
6:06
that would bring inflation down and we really haven't seen much
6:09
of that, right? And if it's you know, if they
6:12
raise rates to 5% or they're just below that now, but if they
6:15
get 25 and and that's not doing it, they're going to have to go
6:18
higher. And, you know, things, those
6:20
interest rates are already feeding into the cost of
6:23
everything in the economy and, you know, feeding into
6:26
everybody's pocketbook. And so it's going to be a mess,
6:30
it is going to be a mess and You know, I reject the soft Landing,
6:33
I reject the, you know, the were not in a recession, we're
6:37
definitely in a recession, ask the average person in this
6:40
country, how they feel about the finances.
6:42
And they will say, we are in a recession, no doubt.
6:45
And and the sad part is, I don't think the final shoe has really
6:48
dropped. And in my opinion, the final
6:51
shoe or not, the final shoe, but the next shoe will be the stock
6:54
market. The stock market, you know, we
6:56
were in the largest bubble since well largest Paul ever.
6:59
Really it measured in you know, sir In terms, like, you know,
7:03
asset values to GDP. And as a result of that, you
7:06
know, when it started to burst in December of twenty, twenty
7:09
one until now it's down roughly 20% and that's not the way
7:14
bubbles Burst when bubbles burst, they tend to go back to
7:16
their base. And so in my opinion we've got a
7:19
long way to go until you know, stocks are fairly priced.
7:22
I mean we've got a 19 PE ratio in an economy that's slowing
7:26
down where the cost of everything is going up.
7:29
So you know, and and you can get 5%.
7:32
On a one-year treasury where as, you know, three years ago, you
7:34
got 0% on a one-year treasury. So as a result of that, you
7:39
know, P/E multiples are going to contract, have accosted, a great
7:42
chart, it's up on his threat on Twitter that you can see that
7:45
shows how P/E multiples can track over time and you know,
7:49
it's just it's going to be a mess and so you know, I think a
7:52
lot of people in the country, you know, they determine their
7:55
spending in their lifestyle, to some extent on how their other
7:58
savings are doing, how the portfolio is doing when you're
8:01
down 20%. You know, that's a, that's a,
8:04
that's a dang. But if you've been in this game
8:06
since I'll wait, you know, to buy the dip.
8:08
And so I, my senses are all nervously looking at it
8:11
thinking, well, it'll come back. You know, we'll go back to lower
8:14
interest rates in place. I'll get under control and stock
8:17
market, would go on to make new highs and I vehement Lee believe
8:20
that there's no possibility of that, absolutely, no possibility
8:24
of that rates are not going to go down.
8:27
Inflation is not going to go down and a stock market is going
8:30
to go down and the next B, in the stock market, the next
8:33
twenty to thirty percent, you know, Decline and you're going
8:36
to see people pull back very substantially and then you're
8:39
going to start to get the layoffs and you know, it's just
8:41
going to it's going to daisy chain all the way through, you
8:44
know, the car repossessions. The house has everything.
8:48
It's going to be a mess, it's going to be a complete mess.
8:51
Yeah. And I agree with you, I think.
8:53
But I think a lot of people were anticipating that Lawrence, but
8:57
for some reason, it was a little bit more delayed, they were able
9:00
to squeeze it out. A little bit longer and what
9:04
your the making you're making the case for that.
9:06
That's a facade. That's not true.
9:08
If you actually look at the fundamentals, if you actually
9:11
look behind the hood. So to speak, it's not as sound
9:15
as they would like you to believe.
9:17
At least that's my believe. Yeah, that's my belief that
9:22
people are people are kind of Faking it and there's a lot of
9:27
hopefully I'm going on. And and the the availability of
9:32
credit and credit cards have allowed people to kind of get in
9:35
trouble and that's coming, you know that that'll be a problem.
9:40
So yeah and Bitcoin has been at least acting like a or better
9:47
said, the market has been treating Bitcoin as a risk on
9:51
asset. A lot of people are saying that
9:53
there's a, you know, a decoupling coming especially
9:55
since the having is next year. What's your?
9:58
What's your Thoughts on this is Bitcoin going to be affected by
10:01
this potential recessionary environment that we're entering
10:04
into. No, I mean well yes and no, I
10:07
mean, so if we have another March 20 like event, if we have
10:12
a, you know, a massive sell-off, if the stock market collapses as
10:16
an example, you know, the correlation of everything kind
10:19
of goes to one and Bitcoin could dip back down to its lower
10:22
perhaps even below it slow and everything would and that would
10:25
be you know that would be another Global Margin Call.
10:28
All which, you know, I don't foresee that but I don't I also
10:32
don't think it's a zero probability event.
10:35
I mean it could occur and if it were to occur you know, Bitcoin
10:40
would get hurt but I think we're in the process now and you're
10:43
really starting to see it in my opinion on the charts of Bitcoin
10:47
and gold and sound money, I said separating from the rest of the
10:50
market, you know what I mean? Since last September, when they
10:55
really made a conscious effort to weaken the dollar, and they
10:57
have made a conscious effort. For to weaken the dollar and
11:01
they you know they basically Bitcoin and gold have performed
11:05
pretty well. You know gold was a look as low
11:07
as 1600, went up to 1900 Bitcoin was in the 16,000 areas up in
11:10
the 23 area now. So and I think that separation
11:14
is going to continue and grow as time goes on.
11:18
Yeah so about that would say it was about a week ago but I think
11:22
it's fresh is you know Augustine karstens.
11:26
Who is the head of the bank of international?
11:28
National settlements. He came out in the op-ed,
11:31
basically saying that Bitcoin has failed or specifically.
11:35
He said cryptocurrency to be specific.
11:38
He says fit cryptocurrency has lost against Fiat.
11:41
What would you what would your response be to that?
11:45
Yeah my senses he doesn't know what he's doing.
11:47
I mean he's just you know he's talking his own book and he's an
11:50
idiot. You know, that you know, he
11:54
doesn't know what Bitcoin is. I mean he no look, he's right
11:56
crypto is, you know, fail. Early flawed and FTX
11:59
demonstrated that and as you and I both know every crypto other
12:03
than Bitcoin is a fraud but beyond that, you know, Bitcoin
12:09
is going to work and it's going to work extremely well and, you
12:12
know, he's just throwing sand in our face because, you know, his
12:16
gravy train, his Fiat gravy train is threatened by the one
12:20
form of truly sound money in the world.
12:22
So Some fans of yours Larry and I promised that I would ask
12:31
them. So the first question is, why is
12:33
it under the gold standard? The middle class grew but under
12:36
Fiat wealth disparity. Just continually widens with the
12:39
middle class slowly becoming Instinct.
12:41
So why is that? Why is it under the, why is it
12:44
under the gold standard that that the middle class was
12:48
healthy compared to how the middle class is doing during the
12:52
Fiat standard? Now, Yeah, the simple
12:55
explanation is just the the Cotillion are explanation,
12:58
right? I mean, when you've got Fiat,
13:01
money, people can, you know, the people get the money first
13:04
benefit the most? They can lever themselves up
13:07
when you have gold before, Bitcoin was invented, gold was
13:09
the only form of the best form of honest.
13:11
Money silver was a close second and as a result people couldn't
13:16
print and create money and benefit from The Leverage that
13:21
that printed money gave them and And although there was
13:24
fractional, Reserve Banking and we kind of we've moved from a
13:27
truly sound money standard in the 1800's into a very unsound,
13:32
money standard on a go-forward basis.
13:36
You know, it's really been a huge transition that's taking
13:40
place such that people who you know were financially Savvy have
13:47
figured out how to play the Fiat game and the Fiat game puts
13:51
money in their pockets and takes it out of everybody.
13:53
His pocket. And so we've had all this
13:55
incredible productivity and you know, technology improvements
14:00
and yet all those games have gone to the top and they have
14:05
been evenly distributed and that's why we've got such an
14:07
enormous wealth disparity and and all of that is driven by
14:10
Fiat money. I mean that, you know, the
14:12
people who can control the printing press and can play the
14:15
game and are smart and know how to benefit from the inflation
14:18
they benefit at the expense of everybody else, who pays the
14:21
higher prices. I mean, the class If example of
14:24
this is like, look at a guy, like, Ken Griffin, who runs, you
14:27
know, a big risk, our hedge fund in New York City, you know, he,
14:33
he blew himself up several times and in each case he got bailed
14:38
out by the fed, you know, quietly to the back door and you
14:42
know that's how he's able to buy a 250 million dollar Penthouse,
14:45
you know, and meanwhile you know and BlackRock I mean they borrow
14:49
money at 0%. They buy houses, they run them
14:51
back to people. They bought them from No it at
14:54
higher prices and so the quarter working guy has to pay higher
14:57
rent for house that he couldn't afford to buy because he
15:00
couldn't borrow money at 0% and he was considered a credit risk.
15:03
So he had to pay a much higher rate of interest so he couldn't
15:06
compete with black rock that house.
15:09
And as a result, you know, his excess labor earnings going to
15:13
black rocks pocket. He doesn't get to keep them.
15:15
And this is why, you know, there's just this incredible
15:19
wealth disparity and unfairness and the economic system as it's
15:22
currently constituted. I mean, it's it's criminal.
15:25
I mean, it's literally criminal what's been done and to the
15:29
average people into the working class of this come from this
15:31
country. And unfortunately, the saddest
15:33
part of it all is, you know, people the top have managed to
15:36
get the working class of this country to divide up into team
15:39
blue and team red and throw stones of each other and what
15:42
they really should all become as part of Team orange.
15:44
And as you know, team oranges we should we're throwing stones at
15:47
the central bankers and get back to get back to some currency.
15:51
And when we do that, It will be fair again but right now the
15:56
game is Just horribly. Unfair I don't did I answer that
15:59
question. I think you absolutely nailed it
16:01
and I think you described it perfectly and I completely
16:04
agree. I think that you know what they
16:09
sow geniusly do it, they the orchestration is if a Democrat
16:12
is in office. The Republicans are like all of
16:15
your problems are because of the Democrats Republicans and
16:18
office. You know the Democrats are like
16:21
it's because of the Republican and the entire ER, time they
16:24
continue to print money. The deficit spending, I think
16:27
it's a trillion a year, then they collect, they spend more
16:29
money trillion dollars in a year, then they collect and tax
16:32
revenue. Everyone's just being stolen
16:34
blind, unless you have your money and assets, right?
16:37
Which is the minority of the country, so, yeah.
16:40
But how long could they keep this going?
16:43
And then another thing, Lawrence is Dave, Dave used Wars 2 got to
16:49
get themselves out of this pickle in the past and I'm
16:53
looking over. What's going on in Ukraine and
16:55
I'm like these guys are funding a war with the nuclear-armed
17:00
country. What the hell is going on here
17:02
or am I seeing things? Lawrence 200, 200 billion
17:05
dollars. Two hundred billion dollars has
17:08
gone into we ship to the Ukraine.
17:11
Yeah I know it's look as part of the macro picture.
17:13
I mean I like to try and focus on the monetary piece of the
17:16
picture but you know what the government does in other
17:19
respects informs, you know, the monetary piece and you know,
17:23
Wars are expensive and so how did government's fun Wars?
17:27
You know, they print money to fund them one of things.
17:30
I think is important to point out too is you know, the FED I
17:33
saw this on another podcast. I'm not sure everyone here,
17:36
listening this heard that, you know, it's interesting press and
17:40
push had a really great chart that he put up on Noster.
17:44
It shows it. Actually Global M2 is actually a
17:46
record high and it's still growing and even though the FED
17:50
balance sheet is slowly declining as a result of
17:52
quantitative tightening. The growth in, in the central
17:58
bank balance sheet in Japan, and the central bank balance sheet
18:01
in, in China, has outweighed what the FED has done in terms
18:05
of cutting. So there's almost a little bit
18:08
of date, you know, daisy-chaining going on.
18:11
I see somebody that ukrainians help.
18:12
What should we do? Just that Russia take over
18:14
sovereign states. I don't want to, I don't want to
18:18
go deep down that whole rabbit hole but people who haven't
18:20
taken the time to really understand what's happening in
18:23
the Ukraine. I don't know where to start.
18:26
You know, first of all, I'm some of this morning compared the
18:28
Ukraine to Vietnam. Well, as I recall, the people in
18:32
the Ukraine, who rushes, try to help actually speak Russian and
18:37
the part of the Ukraine that Russia is trying to help
18:39
actually was a part of Russia at one point.
18:42
And those people were also being bombarded by Nazis in the
18:45
western part of the Ukraine, who we supported in a coup in 2014.
18:52
So, you know, it's not As simple as the United States is always
18:56
the good guy and all these bad countries and guys like kunar
18:59
always evil, I mean, I'm not saying Putin's a good guy, he's
19:02
not. But, you know, we have to we
19:05
have to take a look at, you know, the Splinter the log, in
19:08
our eye before we go up to the Splinter and the other guys, I
19:10
mean some of the behavior than I've States.
19:12
I mean the military and get also a complex has been teaching six
19:16
and seven billion are trillion dollars in the past 20 years
19:20
fighting Wars and killing people and you know that benefits Is a
19:24
certain class in the United States but it doesn't
19:27
necessarily benefit the world in world peace and so, you know my
19:31
view is if we had the ability to defund these wars which if you
19:35
had government on a sound money standard that wouldn't be able
19:38
to inflate things in a way where they can pay for these wars we
19:42
would we would have a much safer and much healthier world.
19:45
I mean Ron Paul said it and I really strongly believe it.
19:47
I mean it coincides it's not it's not a happenstance that the
19:54
It's not a happenstance that that Century the 20th century
19:58
was also the century where we had the most Warfare was also
20:02
the century of fiat currency. And these entrenched very
20:14
powerful. Like for example, you brought up
20:16
the military industrial complex, which benefits tremendously, and
20:20
I'm going to use your word and Lawrence.
20:22
I've been using this word because it's stuck with me,
20:25
right? You said they do not want to
20:27
give up this privilege, right? So the military-industrial
20:30
complex, they're they're completely not incentivized to
20:33
give that up, right? That is how you fund the end is
20:36
endless Wars. Without direct taxation because
20:39
with direct taxation. I firmly believe you'd have a
20:42
revolution in the streets. The next day at school.
20:44
People really understood. How much they're paying for this
20:47
thing indirectly, that's correct.
20:50
Yeah, I mean, people want to know people say, inflation is
20:55
hurting me. And inflation is a function of
20:57
the fact that we shipped, you know, billions of dollars to
21:00
Halliburton. So that, you know, basically,
21:04
you know, Dick Cheney could become a multi-billion, a Are so
21:10
yeah, I got to tell you I got to get rid of this thread because
21:12
it's just pissing me off. So much these you know I'm not
21:17
I'm not going to I mean if people don't understand you know
21:21
if people don't understand the geopolitics of the situation
21:25
going on right now, they're thinking and Fiat terms, anyone
21:29
who thinks in Bitcoin terms totally gets the fact that this
21:32
is all just bullshit and that these guys are going to start
21:36
and propagate Wars In order to cover up the fiscal and
21:40
financial, you know, catastrophe that they've created, right.
21:45
And that's what's, you know, that's why she going on is sad
21:47
because, because now we actually have nuclear weapons.
21:50
So, you know, there's the possibility of lots and lots of
21:53
people dying in this fourth. Turning, if, if somebody makes a
21:56
mistake and, you know, to me that's, you know, that's crazy
22:01
and sad. I mean, we should, you know, we
22:03
should basically be negotiating, you know, I would have liked to
22:06
thought that nuclear. Weapons would have been the
22:08
ultimate thing that would cause everybody to realize that we
22:11
have to find a non-lethal way of resolving human conflict and
22:18
sadly, I don't see that. So yeah, so Lawrence do you
22:24
believe, right? So this is a Fiat standard, this
22:28
is what it leads to would, it would it be safe to say that
22:34
this war in Ukraine is A another potentially a distraction
22:41
towards. What is actually going on.
22:43
So that's the first question number two, and of course,
22:46
there's no way to know that speculation but number two is,
22:50
do you have faith in people's ability to wake up to this?
22:55
Because if a lot of, you know, if you're paying attention, you
22:58
understand what's going on. But in my experience, what I've
23:01
noticed is a lot of people just don't care about sound money.
23:07
They are distracted with bread and circuses their contempt with
23:12
what they have their contempt with Ubi, their contempt with
23:16
whatever, you know, whatever it is.
23:18
They don't care. What's the famous line, right?
23:20
Giving up, Liberty for a little bit of security and I've seen
23:23
that specifically over the last couple of years during the
23:27
pandemic and to me it worries me tremendously because the
23:31
peaceful Revolution Bitcoin specifically, it does need an
23:35
element of personal responsibility.
23:37
People do need to take personal responsibility in order to adopt
23:40
something like Bitcoin. So, is that something that keeps
23:43
you up at night? Yeah, it is and it does.
23:45
And you know, I mean, look, the there are always going to be
23:49
those. Who would, you know, sell, you
23:52
know, sell their Liberty for a little bit of security.
23:54
And as Franklin said they deserve neither, you know, and
23:58
then there are those of us who are going to basically say, you
24:04
know, we're going to fight this battle because it's a battle
24:06
that needs to be he fought and we're going to win because it's
24:09
obvious that we're right and it's compelling and you know I
24:14
think it's a I think we've got you know we've got absolutely
24:16
everything on our side and in spite you know, ultimately at
24:21
the margin. You know the fact that some
24:23
people will never get it doesn't really matter what needs to
24:26
happen. Is a very, you know, strong and
24:29
determined Quorum and it doesn't even have to be 50% needs to
24:34
needs to push the issue and push it in the right way.
24:37
You know, I mean if you look at the American Revolution, I mean
24:40
there were a lot of loyalists, you know, there wasn't, it
24:42
wasn't like the whole country was saying, Britain, get out of
24:45
here, you know, it was it started off as less than 5% and
24:48
probably at its peak. Maybe it was 20% or 30%.
24:52
But and I think that's the same thing here.
24:55
The other thing that's going to happen is what's going to
24:57
happen, is the, when the Fiat really collapses, then there's
25:01
going to be, it's going to be like a wake-up call upside the
25:04
head, right? I mean, when, you know, look
25:06
inflation. Is bad now, it's going to get
25:09
worse, right? It's going to get much worse and
25:13
as it gets much worse, you know, people are going to start to
25:17
say, hey, you know what the fuck?
25:19
I mean, you know II can't live, I'm really getting me and people
25:23
are going to start screaming about it and you know, perhaps
25:26
at some point it's going to accelerate, you know, to the
25:28
point where it becomes, you know, Argentinian style, you
25:31
know, 15 20 percent a year. And then after that, the next
25:34
step over that is, complete currency collapse and I think
25:37
both of Those are very realistic probabilities in the system as
25:40
it's now constructive. And so as a result of that you
25:44
know, if and when those things occur, you know, people are
25:47
going to, they're going to open their eyes, they're going to,
25:49
you know, they're not going to, you can't ignore that, right?
25:52
That's could be terribly sad because a lot of people going to
25:53
be very badly hurt by that. Not rooting for that.
25:56
I'm just saying that's the likely event given those systems
26:00
and system as it's currently constructed.
26:02
Its, those are the most likely events in my view and the timing
26:05
of them is certainly, you know, Unpredictable how quickly it
26:09
happens? Because it's a, it's a crowd
26:11
sort of thing. I mean, you know, right now, I
26:14
mean, I will say this though, with every wave of inflation,
26:17
with every move they make, you know, more people are aware of
26:21
the issue, right? I mean some became aware in
26:24
2008, I thought that was it right then and there then some
26:28
followed on, you know, later and some, you know, became aware in
26:31
2020. And so, you know, I mean, more
26:33
and more people become aware with each move on their part.
26:36
I think the Move on the part of the FED is that they're going to
26:40
have to resume a money printing operation of some type because
26:45
the alternative is worse which would be a collapse of financial
26:48
collapse. And I think when that happens,
26:51
the the percentage of the population that says, while
26:54
something they can never stop, you know, it's that percentage
26:58
is going to get larger. And if you study all the the
27:02
hyperinflation, so that her there have been in history and
27:04
I've taken the time to do that as a financial Just what you see
27:09
is that when a majority of the people come to conclude that, oh
27:13
my God, this can never stop these, people are going to
27:19
continue to print money from now until forever.
27:23
Then what they then you know this is gresham's law.
27:26
Then what happens is a naturally say themselves.
27:29
All right. Yeah, that is true.
27:32
I need to get rid of this shit called Cash and so I need to buy
27:36
stuff You know, stuff includes Bitcoin and gold and houses in
27:40
car. I mean anything that's not that
27:41
you can't print and you know and then as that accelerates it
27:45
gets, you know, larger and faster and goes quicker and you
27:49
have what, you know we call an Austrian economics.
27:51
As you know, our crack up boom because everybody's literally
27:54
just trying to get rid of the currency that they know can't,
27:58
you know, can't hold its value. And so that's always the risk
28:03
and and that I think that event is coming.
28:07
Coming but I don't know with certainty the timing nobody does
28:12
but you know, I think it's this decade and I think it's probably
28:15
in the first half of this decade.
28:18
I mean, I used to think it was fat when 2021 when everything
28:21
was melting up, I thought oh here we go.
28:23
This is it. And then amazingly, they you
28:25
know, by slamming on the brakes and doing everything that done,
28:28
they managed to kind of calm it down for a while.
28:30
And so, all right. Maybe, you know, maybe I had 20
28:33
21, I was thinking, all right, I 2425 is all going to be over.
28:37
Somebody asked me on Twitter the other day.
28:40
Do you still believe in that? I think.
28:41
Well, you know, possibly, but it might be a year or two longer
28:44
than that, but but it doesn't matter.
28:46
I mean each each wave shows you, you know where we're going.
28:50
I mean, you know, I mean I've been in Gold since it was a $200
28:53
an ounce and you know I remember fighting to get through 800, I
28:57
remember fighting to get through a thousand, I remember fighting
29:00
to get through 1300, it's 1,800 1,900 today.
29:03
We're going to go through 2000 and it's going to be on its way
29:06
to 2500. And then at 2500 3000 will be in
29:09
view and you know I mean it's just it's inevitable right?
29:15
The way I see it, it's inevitable in the way the system
29:17
is constructed because you know the money printer has to run or
29:22
else the debt, can't get to get service and the economy
29:25
collapses. And so if you look at what
29:26
governments do government's, just try to try to bribe people
29:30
to stay in power really is kind of the simplest way of looking
29:33
at it and, you know, so they look at what the people are
29:36
screaming about the law. Artists.
29:37
And they try to dress it, right? So it was screaming about
29:41
inflation. All right, well, you know,
29:42
tighten things up, try and get this inflation, the control
29:45
fine, he's doing that, and surprisingly, it's kind of
29:48
working. I mean, not the inflation is
29:50
getting under control. But, you know, the hard money
29:52
assets haven't done particularly well, because of the actions
29:56
he's taken, right? But, you know, that will change
29:59
that narrative will change and either inflation will come down
30:02
or it won't. But eventually the economy is
30:04
going to start to hurt because, you know, 5% 6%.
30:07
So And percent interest rates. You know, there's going to be a
30:11
Day of Reckoning here and we're highly leveraged.
30:14
It's a fragile system. Something's going to break.
30:17
And when that happens, you know, the issue is going to be, oh my
30:20
God, the economy is blowing up, you know, forget about inflation
30:24
for a minute, you know, turn the printer back on or else.
30:27
The whole thing is going to collapse, right?
30:29
And at that point in time, that's when that's when that
30:32
psychological shift will take place again, I don't know to
30:35
what extent, I don't want that. Next one up will be the final
30:38
one that will send us in hyperplasia.
30:39
Probably not and we probably you know we probably go two hundred
30:43
thousand hundred fifty thousand dollar Bitcoin at three thousand
30:45
dollar gold and then you know they do some more money.
30:51
They do some more tracks, they raise interest rates, they talk,
30:53
I don't know. They put on weight surprised
30:54
because who knows what they'll do?
30:55
They'll do something to mess it up and you know and we'll have a
30:58
correction but but but he's correction is to a higher level,
31:02
right? And so you know The info and the
31:08
inflation continues to build. I mean, we're not, you know,
31:11
we've got gasoline prices work between three and five, kind of
31:13
find where you are. And what worked well, what level
31:16
of gas you buy. I mean, you know, we're not
31:18
going back to a buck-fifty, we're not going back to to we're
31:20
not go back to three. I mean, I was on a ficus the
31:22
other day. I mean, I remember very clearly
31:24
being a kid and gas was 26 Cents a gallon.
31:27
It was great. We're not going there again.
31:31
I mean they just keep debasing the currency.
31:33
It's what father says they can't stop.
31:36
So, what message would you have for my generation?
31:41
What would you tell us? Because, you know, it was You're
31:48
we were talking about this many, many months ago.
31:50
We were talking about the fourth turning Theory and how every
31:54
generation has, you know, a different role to play.
31:59
I believe that you said the millennial generation is the
32:02
savior generation, please correct me.
32:04
If I phrase that if I for, is that wrong.
32:07
So what message would you have for us?
32:09
What responsibility has been bestowed to US based on this
32:14
irresponsible, you know, No monetary policy, fiscal,
32:19
whatever you want to call it. What would you say to us?
32:21
What would you say? What do we need to do to fix
32:25
things to make things better? Yeah, so so you guys are the
32:28
hero generation in the fourth turning you know terminology
32:32
which is to say that you know the system's about to blow up
32:37
and people can have to step up and fix it and that's going to
32:40
be your generation. So I think the important things
32:44
for your generation to do R2. You know, I'm and one things
32:49
that's great about your generation is you really like to
32:51
work in teams. You're not you're not as
32:53
individualistic as greedy as my generation.
32:56
Once we were all very individualistic.
32:57
We're also all very greedy, you guys actually concerned with the
33:00
common good and I see that my kids are see that new.
33:02
I see and everybody who's in young and in the Bitcoin are and
33:04
I think it's great and so my sense is that what you guys need
33:08
to do is recognize that this isn't the way this country
33:12
always was recognized, what's broken?
33:14
Which is the monetary political Teams and fight like, hell to
33:18
get it fixed. And it's not about blue and red.
33:21
It's about orange and not orange.
33:23
And it's about, you know, and to the extent that it melds into
33:27
the political area, then, you know, we can get in a little bit
33:29
of term limits and the Constitutional Convention and a
33:32
lot of things that would be getting the money out of
33:34
politics. And some things that would maybe
33:36
restore America to, you know, something closer to what the
33:40
founding fathers had in mind when they drafted the
33:42
Constitution because we've gone a long way from that.
33:45
I mean, you get Congress or the Senate and you know, you're
33:48
guaranteed to become a millionaire because it's corrupt
33:50
as can be. And, you know, you could solve
33:52
that with term limits, you could solve that by taking money out
33:55
of politics and publicly funding elections, letting people just
33:59
have to get signatures and then they get a certain amount of
34:01
money and that's all they get. You know, there are ways to
34:04
solve it. You could, you could solve that
34:06
by not, letting people who serve in government then go back into
34:09
the Industries, or supposed to be regulating the way they do in
34:12
the defense, in the banking industry's all those things.
34:15
And so No, I would, but I would like to see would be, you know,
34:19
the a group of the Youth of this country coming together and
34:23
trying to form a third party. That said, you know that it's
34:27
you know, the Reform Party that that really very, very clearly
34:32
picks apart. All of the mistakes that have
34:35
occurred as a result of the Boomers.
34:38
And the Miss correction that, we took this taking place post,
34:42
WWII. I mean, look, we had a really
34:44
great thing going and we'll Ward post-world To, I mean, the 50s
34:47
were on top of the world and we just pissed it away through
34:51
stupidity, and Corruption and and, you know, there's a lot of,
34:55
there's a lot of status. Great me still is great about
34:57
this country, but we also lat, let you know, the, you know, we
35:03
let a certain class of people get control of the political
35:06
mechanism and it's made it just brutal for the average American,
35:11
you know, I mean, look at what? Look, what happen to the
35:13
Midwest. I mean, Ross, Perot was right?
35:16
I mean NAFTA and letting China to the WTO.
35:18
It just it sucked. All those high paying jobs on
35:20
the Midwest, you know, inside of a China, we didn't have any
35:23
reciprocal trade agreement with them.
35:25
I mean, we couldn't sell shit into China, you know.
35:28
And yet, we let them just take all our jobs, you know, you
35:32
know, the military-industrial complex got ahold of, you know,
35:35
that that whole thing. And and, you know, we managed to
35:38
create can kind of continual Wars, you know?
35:41
I mean, why don't we have nuclear power will be 0 because
35:44
the oil, because oil and gas Industries and Although you know
35:46
the industries that make so much money off the power that we do
35:49
have have basically been able to corrupt the political system and
35:53
and make nuclear, you know, kind of a non-starter and yet, you
35:57
know, we should have, you know, serious nuclear power if we want
36:00
to, you know, why is our infrastructure the way it is,
36:03
right? We'd all of these things are a
36:05
function of a broken broken system.
36:08
Having said that, you know, the monetary collapse that I believe
36:13
is coming is going to really be a fourth turning.
36:16
It's going to wipe the Slate clean and it's going to be a lot
36:18
better on the other side because you guys are smart enough to fix
36:23
it. You know, if I mean, if the
36:25
youngest generation Guided by the older, you know, the gray
36:28
generation like myself, will advise you, and you'll do the
36:31
work and you got, you guys are going to fix this thing.
36:34
You're going to stand up and fix it and say, you know, this is
36:37
it's bullshit. The system is totally broken as
36:40
totally bullshit, we can't buy houses, we don't have, you know,
36:43
we don't have a fair system in any way, shape, or form.
36:47
And you know, you'll be the biggest voting Bloc and 10, 15,
36:50
20 years and my generation will be gone.
36:53
So, you know, it's that's why I, that's why I consider you guys
36:58
to be the hero generation. I mean, look at you, I look at
37:01
Marty bent. I look at Jack mall or as I look
37:03
at my see perfect examples of this all over the place, you
37:06
know, guys who are standing up and saying, No, this is wrong
37:11
the way. It's the way it's set up is
37:12
wrong. And so I in terms of what you
37:17
can do day to day, I think it's just spread the word amongst
37:20
your friends, right? So you know you orange pill as
37:26
many people as possible. You try to get them to get out
37:30
of the Matrix, you know, and look at how broken it is.
37:33
Right? Yeah.
37:36
And it's hand-to-hand, you know, it's hand-to-hands.
37:39
It's really about winning over the hearts and Minds one person
37:44
at the time at a time. And it's incredibly difficult
37:48
and you're dealing with a well-entrenched media machine.
37:54
That is I would say their powers fading because more people are
37:59
getting their information via Independent Media sources
38:02
whether it's a podcast or whether it's Twitter I love
38:05
Twitter right? But it's almost as if you had
38:09
this media cartel that was very very successful at controlling
38:15
narratives. So, I remember seeing this
38:17
Twitter this tweets, and it resonated with me and it said
38:20
something like if social media existed in 2003, we would have
38:25
not have gone to war with Iraq. And I saw that and I thought it
38:29
was very, very fascinating. Yeah.
38:31
I hope that's true. I was around 2003, and remember
38:34
all that. I mean, Yeah.
38:37
Now look, I mean, the fact, I mean decentralization, I mean,
38:40
we reached peak centralization in WWII, I mean, you know, we
38:45
kind of and I've talked about this before, I mean
38:48
centralization in the beginning was a good thing.
38:50
I mean, in my view it really kind of started with with, with
38:54
Henry Ford. I mean, you know, the assembly
38:56
line, I mean brought enormous wealth to, you know the middle
39:00
class, right? I mean, we figure out how to
39:02
make things cheaper quicker and it was a role as a result of
39:05
sin. I system and that was good, but
39:08
we ran that sand and, you know, World War 2 was piqued
39:11
centralization in terms of killing people.
39:13
When we figure out, who killed 50 million people really quickly
39:15
with, you know, gas Chambers, and some very nasty weapons,
39:19
including nuclear ones. And, you know, I think what
39:23
we're learning, what we should be learning, is that
39:24
centralization has downside, and that decentralization is
39:28
actually a good thing at a political level at a Food level
39:32
at at a money level, all of it, because As you know, the problem
39:37
with a centralized system is if you get a nut at the top and you
39:40
know, we've had a few of those here and you know, Germany had
39:43
one in the 40s. I mean you know and arguably
39:46
other countries have them as well you know they can do a lot
39:50
of damage right? And so so humankind I think is
39:55
going to have to evolve into a much more decentralized systems
39:58
with a lot more checks and balances.
40:00
I mean it you know I imagine that our grandkids are maybe our
40:03
great-grandkids will say. You know, can you believe they
40:05
let anybody have a Their weapons.
40:06
I mean, those have been banned for so long that nobody would
40:10
ever consider building one because they know that if they
40:12
did, you know, they face the death penalty sort of thing.
40:14
I mean, you know that there's a lot of insanity that has
40:20
pervaded, you know, human thought, I mean, this whole
40:24
tribal country against country people against people.
40:27
It's bullshit. It's total bullshit.
40:29
We're all the same. Yes, and nobody really wants to
40:32
die. I don't think so.
40:34
Most people just want to live their lives.
40:36
In peace and try to add value and is the family and love one
40:40
another and so on so forth. So but you know, it doesn't
40:44
always work out that way because political people are so, should
40:47
a lot of political people are sociopaths a lot of political
40:52
people are sociopaths and you said something in the beginning
40:55
of the of the Pod that really stuck with me and as long as
41:00
they have the money printer, it basically gives them the ability
41:04
to buy votes right in a way. Right.
41:06
Because, yeah. It's absolutely right.
41:10
Yeah, that's how it all works. I mean, it's, you can see where
41:14
they're going with. This do cbc's, they'll do a
41:16
universal basic income, you know, and even social scores, so
41:20
on and so forth. I mean, look at me, there's a,
41:23
you know, there's a real, do you know the other divided, forget
41:27
blue, red, you know, I mean, it was orange and Fiat.
41:30
Another vibe is just kind of statist, you know, libertarian
41:33
and there's a big part of this country that It is statist.
41:37
I mean they actually think the government is a good thing.
41:41
Right? And you know, I think there
41:46
might have been a time when the government was limited when it
41:48
was a pretty good thing. I mean the federal government,
41:50
you know, in the very early days was pretty damn small and didn't
41:53
do much but you know, that has slowly but surely evolved in the
41:57
other direction and it's problematic.
42:01
I mean, I mean my view on government for what it's worth
42:04
is just that it's they ought to be a farewell Referee government
42:07
Auto enforce, the laws have the courts, punish criminals, and
42:11
that's it. All the other stuff can be done,
42:13
you know, in the market, right? Yeah, and I I feel especially
42:21
since becoming a Bitcoin are, you know, I've that belief
42:25
system has just become bigger and bigger smaller government.
42:29
You know, let people figure it out.
42:31
Let people take the personal responsibility over their lives.
42:35
Do you believe that Bitcoin could potentially bring back the
42:39
United because I'm an immigrant, you know?
42:41
So, and I think that a lot of people specifically in this
42:45
country don't understand. How privileged they are in a
42:49
way. Not only because the u.s. is
42:52
isolated on two coasts, right? So it makes it relatively
42:56
peaceful, but also being in the country that is the world
42:59
Reserve currency, right? Being able to print all the
43:03
money in the world, and, you know, all the privilege and all
43:06
the wealth that and all the power really that comes with
43:09
that and I think that's lost in people.
43:13
And then Lawrence, I kind of go through.
43:15
If you look at history, you know, we This times different,
43:18
but this has happened. Many many times, I feel like the
43:21
cycle is is repeating itself in a way and we are on the verge of
43:27
this of you know you said it earlier this crack up, boom.
43:32
So are we repeating history is are we seeing something that has
43:36
happened throughout? It's obviously, it's never
43:40
exactly the same but the pattern is similar.
43:42
I mean, this is kind of a sovereign debt crisis occurred.
43:46
And this kind of a Problem occurred in the early 1900's, I
43:50
mean World War 2 and then we will to really kind of her one
43:53
and we're one kind of continued into World War Two.
43:56
I mean, we've seen this pattern before and you had a lot of
43:59
sovereign currency crisis, then, I mean, the pound was the value
44:02
to a couple of times, you know, Germany had hyperinflation
44:05
Russia did to, you know, it's, you know, we had a depression
44:11
because we tried to stay on a sound money standard even though
44:14
we devalue gold substantially and, you know, it Yes, this is a
44:18
pattern that has repeated itself and you know Empires don't last
44:23
forever, right? I mean they're you know dahlias
44:25
book you can read it on it talks about this how you know the
44:28
reserve currency tends to turn over, you know, over time I mean
44:33
prior to us it was Britain you know prior to Britain.
44:37
It was I guess it was the dodging the and the Spanish and
44:43
at one point in time and you know I mean way back when it was
44:46
it was the Roman currency. See and you know, Empires
44:51
generally die the same way that this one is dying which is, you
44:55
know, they get fat and lazy and they Coast on their reputation
44:59
and they spend too much and they don't, you know, they, I mean
45:02
the politicians have spent way too much money.
45:05
And as a result, they start debasing the money and that
45:08
debasement Trend continues. And then, you know, eventually
45:11
the debasement trend becomes a waterfall.
45:13
And once, once once the currency is no, good, you know, then
45:16
you're then you're nothing. I mean, you know, the United
45:19
States has lived well beyond its means for a lot of years.
45:22
Based on the fact that we were the leading country post-world
45:25
War Two, you know. And we established the, you
45:28
know, the petrodollar and so on, and so forth.
45:29
I mean, in all of those things, it's not like we're going to
45:32
fail tomorrow. But all of those, the Trends on
45:35
all of those things are going in the wrong direction for the
45:38
United States and you know, it's it's sad.
45:43
It's I hate to see how poorly managed this country has been.
45:47
I mean, it's it's it's a very poorly managed in my opinion but
45:51
it is what it is and, you know, I think that like all Cycles it
45:58
will adjust and I don't think it's curtains for the US.
46:01
I just think there's we're going to have a much more multipolar
46:03
world and the, you know, we're going to return around the world
46:07
to sound currencies, and that'll be a really good thing.
46:10
I mean, you know, the bright and I mean, I'm talking about a lot
46:12
of depressing stuff right before.
46:14
Attorneys are ugly and nasty and things, get broken, okay.
46:17
Get broken. But on the other side of that,
46:21
you know, getting broken things will get fixed and forth.
46:23
Tourneys, don't last forever. And once you come out of one,
46:26
you know, you can be quite good. And if we had sound money, the
46:30
world would be a much better place.
46:32
I'm absolutely certain of that. And so, you know, and if we had
46:36
great political leadership, we could have, we could have sound
46:39
money tomorrow. I mean, we could, you know, have
46:41
a have a reset and, you know, conversion to it.
46:45
And I mean, you know, it would be painful.
46:47
Full but it could be done. Sadly though, I don't think
46:51
there's the political will or you know the way the system is
46:54
set up. I don't think anybody's going to
46:55
go there unless the force to go there.
46:58
And so what I think is going to happen is that you know, the
47:01
system is going to break down and that's going to cause
47:04
everyone to realize that the money was the problem and then
47:06
sound money will be adopted. And, you know, our kids and
47:09
grandkids will have much better lives.
47:11
Living under a sound money standard and they'll sit around
47:13
and say, you know, I can't believe these guys allowed you
47:17
know. 10 people sitting in Washington DC to set the
47:20
interest rate and what the hell were they thinking?
47:22
It's ridiculous. So, 100 percent and 100 percent
47:29
and but I'm afraid that, you know, I don't know why I'll be
47:34
afraid but basically yes, our grandkids my generation will
47:39
never forget. Right?
47:41
Like the, you know, the greatest Generation didn't forget the
47:43
lessons of World War Two and then as time progressed, Just
47:48
the lessons of the past were forgotten and then, you know,
47:51
you have this this cycle and then my hope Lawrence is that
47:55
Bitcoin breaks the cycle Bitcoin ends up because golden away.
48:01
And I'm really, really I'm going to pull up this tweet that I
48:04
thought was really fascinating. You were tagged by Matt Foley.
48:07
It says, it seems that every time a gold standard was
48:09
implemented in the past ancient Greece, Roman Empire USA.
48:13
It worked for a while that eventually failed.
48:16
So why would this time be any different?
48:17
Aunt, and then you respond to that.
48:19
But I'd rather ask you, you know, if we do pull this off,
48:24
right? If we do and I think we will, I
48:27
think Bitcoins incentives will win the day.
48:32
How would Bitcoin be different in Gold?
48:36
How would Bitcoin resist? What happened to Gold?
48:40
Yeah, it's a great question. So A couple things.
48:46
I mean, one it's naturally deflationary, whereas gold is
48:50
not. I mean, the gold is the supply
48:52
of gold in the world is growing at about 2% a year and in 50
48:57
years we'll have twice as much gold in the world and gold has
49:01
an alternative usage, which is well, there's some very small
49:04
number of industrial uses, but they're also the jewelry usage
49:07
Bitcoin Bitcoin is pure money based on energy and its really,
49:11
the only form of care money and the amazing thing about Bitcoin.
49:13
That's so unique is, and The only is the price of gold
49:16
response are the supply of gold response to the price.
49:19
It's a commodity and, you know, I can assure you that if the
49:22
price is the price of gold were to Triple tomorrow, we'd my more
49:25
gold, right? And we just Supply, would
49:28
increase, no matter what happens to the price of Bitcoin
49:31
supplying increasing. That's it, we're done.
49:33
So that's the biggest difference that Bitcoin is deflationary and
49:38
and we should live as chaput. This point out we live in a
49:41
deflationary world. We should live in a deflationary
49:43
world because technology is Is improving productivity and the
49:47
reason why the average man has been hurt so bad as that
49:50
productivity has been stolen through the inflation that
49:53
allows people can game the system to get all the wealth but
49:57
back to, you know, Bitcoin and gold in the gold standard and
49:59
then both being sound money. So if we went to a gold
50:02
standard, it would be better than what we're on right now.
50:05
But it wouldn't be as good as a Bitcoin standard and part.
50:08
That's because the nobody really knows how much gold there is.
50:12
Nobody knows where it is. It's hard to move around.
50:15
And it's hard to audit. It's hard to prove.
50:17
There's fake gold in the sense that they've taken people taken
50:20
tungsten and code it, which is close to the same atomic weight
50:23
and coated it with gold. I mean, it's it's difficult to
50:26
verify excetera mean. Bitcoin is very, very easy to
50:28
verify its on a ledger. You can see it, you can prove
50:31
that you've got it by moving a small piece of it, except for
50:33
ETC. The the negative on both of them
50:37
and I said it in the tweet and I don't you pull it up again
50:39
because I think it's important. You know, look at my take away
50:44
my following. Look at my Spots, the coin does
50:48
face some of the same paper problems we have.
50:51
So let's talk about derivatives for a moment.
50:54
And part of the reason, why, the price of gold is worth the price
50:56
of gold is, is because there's a lot of paper gold.
50:59
And you know, if we actually did the math, the way it was done in
51:02
the 70s when we were on a gold standard of semi gold standard
51:05
at least have to get the international level.
51:08
If you took the money supply figure today and divide it by
51:11
the gold of the u.s. holds gold should be at 80 thousand dollars
51:14
an ounce. It's not it's 18,000 are 1800
51:16
announce right now. Shows you how much money we've
51:19
created. And the reason for that
51:20
difference is that we created a lot of paper, gold, Robert
51:23
Rubin, Larry Summers, you know, barsky they did a paper called
51:27
Gibson's Paradox. And, you know, when Clinton was
51:30
President, I recall very clearly James Carville saying, I want to
51:34
come back to the bond markets, have all the power.
51:36
And what these guys figured out was if we can gold is the is the
51:39
alarm Bell that tells you, you're inflating the money
51:41
supply and so they figured out. If we can sell paper gold, we
51:44
can keep Price of gold down and everyone will think there's no
51:47
inflation. When in reality, there is in the
51:49
economy, look, great. I'll get reelected, that's what
51:51
Clinton thought. And so, that was really the, in
51:53
my view, the beginning of the serious gold suppression to the
51:57
sale of paper gold and I think they do it off the balance
51:59
sheet, I'm pretty sure they do it through the exchange
52:02
stabilization fund and a few other things that we can't see
52:05
and we're never be allowed to audit but they've intentionally
52:08
held the price of gold down to keep the Fiat game going.
52:12
And there's nothing that. And so when you get into a To
52:15
when you get into a financial game and everyone's playing and
52:19
betting on the price of something, if you are the
52:21
biggest player, it's like being in a poker game.
52:24
If you're the biggest player with the most money and you can
52:26
put all your money on the table on a bet, and nobody can call
52:30
your bluff. You win by default, right?
52:33
And so in a sense, in some Financial games, the people with
52:36
the biggest balance sheet have got the game rig where they can
52:39
win. I mean, as an example, look at
52:40
the Hunt Brothers, they were able to take the price of silver
52:42
up to 50. They have the silver market
52:44
cornered. They could have ruined.
52:46
Basically, everybody who was a supplier and they could have
52:49
ruined the silver market. And what are the exchange?
52:51
Do they change the rules? They would, they changed it to
52:54
liquidation? Only basically said, sorry Hans.
52:56
We're not going to let you win. And that's that's kind of what,
53:00
you know, these guys do the guys who run the government and and
53:03
so, you know, Bitcoin is a form of sound money, but who's to say
53:09
that somebody couldn't get into a paper contracts?
53:12
A well, well, like look at F DX. As an example, They Carried a
53:16
bunch of Bitcoin in theory, on their balance sheet.
53:18
People gave them money and said, buy Bitcoin for me, right?
53:21
They were they thought if they look at their account statement,
53:23
they own Bitcoin, but the fact of the matter is they didn't own
53:26
any Bitcoin because FTX never went and bought it.
53:29
So they own paper Bitcoin. They had a claim on bitcoin
53:32
against FTX but FTX hadn't actually bought the coins and so
53:36
as a result of that that kind of a paper derivative and they're
53:40
our favorite rooms, you know there's a Futures market for
53:42
Bitcoin in, there are a lot of private Market derivatives as
53:44
well. Glass note is Dick as you know,
53:47
laid this out and Caitlin long. It's not a very good job of
53:49
looking at it as well. And so the fact that matters we
53:52
not only have to move to a Bitcoin standard but we also
53:56
have to add a legal level band derivatives because derivatives
54:00
are tool for financial people to manipulate markets to steal
54:04
wealth from other people. That's all they are the only way
54:09
we should live in. They started it started as you
54:11
know, Futures Contract was for farmer who was producing.
54:15
Corn and General Mills, who was trying to make cereal.
54:17
Say all right, you know, I want to sell my corn to you and you
54:20
want to buy at a fixed price. We'll figure it out.
54:22
And that was a legitimate business contract.
54:24
I'm producing something, you're buying something we're agreeing
54:26
on a contract, but then what happens is, what if, you know,
54:29
the US government's never gotten in the corn Market.
54:31
Not that I'm aware of what happened to you discovered.
54:33
You say, well I'm going to get in the corn market and start
54:34
playing around with you know buying and selling corn.
54:38
And I can manipulate the price because i'm the biggest player
54:40
on the Block and that's what's going on with gold and that
54:43
could go on with Bitcoin hasn't happened yet.
54:45
Because you can see the amount of derivatives outstanding, but
54:48
it's trending in the direction where they're getting more
54:51
involved in it. And so, you know, to your
54:53
generation. I would say, you know, when we
54:55
get bitcoiners and government, when the system has collapsed,
54:58
and we're going to a Bitcoin standard, we get bitcoiners and
55:00
government, you know, and and the new rules get written just
55:03
as the rules, were written post. The 1929 collapse, we have the
55:07
new SEC, you know, I think one of the rules of has to be
55:10
written. Is that derivatives will be bad
55:12
that the only only derivatives allowed will be For legitimate
55:16
commercial purposes. If you're a farmer selling corn
55:18
or your cereal, manufacturer buying corn, you guys can do a
55:21
derivative contract or oil and whatever anything.
55:24
But there's got to be actual physical behind what you're
55:27
buying and selling. You can't have just Financial
55:29
contracts on top of, you know, there has to be a commercial,
55:34
you know, interest in it. Not not just a financial
55:37
interest in it, because if it's all financial interest games,
55:40
the government is the biggest balance, sheet winds, and the US
55:42
government has the biggest balance sheet right now.
55:45
They can manipulate it in their favor and against those of us
55:48
who believe in sound money. And they've done that with gold
55:50
and I think people who believe that, just because all the
55:53
Bitcoin is on a chain, it can't happen with Bitcoin, they're
55:56
being naive because you know who's to prevent party a from
56:00
doing a deal with party be on bitcoin at a fixed price and
56:03
whether they have the coins or not, doesn't matter, you know,
56:06
that that price somehow gets into the marketplace.
56:08
I mean that if I sell, if off, if I off the marketplace you go
56:13
I sell you one coin for 20,000. Buck's you send me 20,000 bucks
56:16
and I say I owe you a Bitcoin, right?
56:19
That's 20,000 that did not go into the system to push the
56:22
price of Bitcoin up. That was a private deal.
56:26
And let's say, I don't have the coin, right?
56:28
I'm just taking up Financial bet against you, you're saying, you
56:31
wanted to go up and I'm saying, I'll pay you.
56:33
If it does go up and, you know, but that didn't move the price
56:37
in any way, shape, or form. So, your demand did not get
56:40
reflected in the supply-demand balance.
56:43
And that's, that's the danger of paper.
56:45
And it's a, it's a big thing, it and it could become an issue.
56:48
So again to your generation when we get to the point of writing
56:51
the laws to fix all this shit, we got a band.
56:53
Derivatives. Yeah.
56:55
And it that was one of Caitlin Long's main concerns, right?
56:59
She calls it. The rehypothecation and she
57:01
keeps doubling down on how dangerous this is.
57:04
And obviously she's someone to pay attention to.
57:07
She comes from the belly of the Beast, so to speak.
57:09
You worked or lived in that world.
57:11
Exactly. And you know, you've noticed
57:16
that after recently because they're trying to close the Barn
57:20
Door after the horse Escape I mean you know FTX I mean you
57:25
look Gary counselor should he should resign in disgrace?
57:28
I mean it's just absolutely ridiculous the way that they
57:32
allowed, you know, everybody to get, you know, taken advantage
57:36
of by all these crypto schemes. That so many smart people,
57:39
including the leader of you know, of swan, you know Cory you
57:43
just did a fantastic job. Of documenting.
57:46
I mean, there's so many of us, a mover.
57:47
I remember being a Madeira talking with a bunch of the
57:49
Bitcoin as we're all like, you know, we just know, Sam bank
57:52
fraud is a fraud. You know, we know he's going to
57:54
get rekt, it's just a matter of time.
57:55
We all could see it knew it, you know, and even Caitlin said she
57:58
was, she was sending things to Regulators that she knew.
58:02
And heard and saying, look, this is not right.
58:04
I can tell you there's bad stuff going on here and nobody was
58:07
paying attention, right? And so you know, here we are,
58:13
right? Here we are, here we are after,
58:17
you know, all the again the I feel bad for the people that put
58:24
Faith in a con man who was not only able to manipulate, you
58:30
know, people, I don't want to name any specific people, but
58:33
let's say very predominant celebrities that have major
58:36
followings but he was also able to fool completely, you know,
58:43
the head of the SEC. See who if you read the end of
58:47
the New York Magazine article where he admitted at least,
58:50
there's a positive to list a list, there's a silver lining
58:53
where he admitted that Bitcoin is in his eyes is different than
58:57
the rest, but in that article, it was stated many times that
59:01
Gary Gensler had one-on-one meetings.
59:04
With Sam Bank been freed. Wow, I didn't read that article.
59:08
And if that's the case and he couldn't smell the fraud there.
59:11
I mean, like I say he should resign and Grace.
59:14
I mean, if I were a senator or Congressman, I would have gone
59:17
berserk. I mean, this is a guy who's in
59:19
charge of protecting investors. And I mean, there were, you
59:23
know, I know of people who had hundreds of thousands of dollars
59:26
at FTX, it just got vaporized and, you know, that's that's
59:30
wrong and that's sad. And, you know, I mean, if, you
59:33
know, and even now he's saying all these cryptocurrencies are
59:37
unregulated security. Okay, fine.
59:39
What are you going to do about it, right?
59:41
So you're going to, you know what, you know, sir, what are
59:43
you going to do? About because that is your job.
59:45
Why aren't you bringing cases against them?
59:48
Why aren't you suing them and making them, you know, provide
59:50
more disclosure? Why aren't you making them
59:53
register as if they were Securities right?
59:56
So 100% so Lawrence. I want to use the, you know, the
1:00:01
end part of the podcast is we were talking about which in my
1:00:05
opinion, I'd you know, and I really believe this in my heart,
1:00:08
I think it's important to talk about the tough subjects, you
1:00:11
have to be real, you have to live in the present.
1:00:14
That's the way that I approach it, but I want to end it on a
1:00:18
positive light, right after we get over this hump, right?
1:00:24
It's inevitable. Hump that I feel.
1:00:26
I know that you your, you know, you feel it as well, you're
1:00:29
anticipating it. What is the world going?
1:00:32
What do you most looking forward to in a world on a Bitcoin
1:00:36
standard? How would that world differ from
1:00:40
today's world? And why would it differ in the
1:00:42
first place? Well, I think I think it will be
1:00:46
incredibly positive and optimistic.
1:00:48
I mean, that's the biggest the biggest difference from today.
1:00:53
I think a lot of people today are, you know, very depressed
1:00:56
about the economic conditions, they're facing and you know, I
1:01:00
mean you look at I mean the the opioid problem so many things
1:01:03
that are reflection of that, you know, I'd be glad to never have
1:01:08
to listen to another Central Banker, you know lying to me
1:01:10
again, you know, And I think, I think, I think it'd be, you
1:01:16
know, it'd be a time where I think people could really feel
1:01:19
good about the future. And, you know, it's interesting,
1:01:24
I mean, I was born in 57 and I grew up in Detroit and the
1:01:29
Detroit area. And, you know, there was a real
1:01:32
positivity. When I was going, we're putting
1:01:34
the whole country on Wheels, and even though the Vietnam War was
1:01:37
a very big, - it was, you know, there's a lot of money flowing
1:01:40
around. It was, it was a very positive
1:01:42
time. I mean, we'd won World War.
1:01:43
To and, you know, we're still the greatest country in the
1:01:47
world, of course and then word of the president 63.
1:01:50
But you know, in general, it was just a very positive place and a
1:01:55
positive time and things were good and you look forward to the
1:01:58
future. You thought things were going to
1:02:00
be better. It's interesting.
1:02:01
I've been to China bunch of times.
1:02:02
I'm not saying they're good, you know, representative of
1:02:06
political leadership, but I will say this, the first time I was
1:02:09
there in the mid-2000s. I remember very in, like, 2005,
1:02:13
Remember very clearly the optimism and the positivity of
1:02:17
the people and the reason for that was because and I got to
1:02:21
know some of the local people. The reason for that was because
1:02:24
their lives were really getting better.
1:02:26
I mean they had great grandparents who would you know
1:02:28
almost starve to death under Mao and you know they had an
1:02:31
apartment and they had you know they had a motorbike and they
1:02:34
had a job and they could eat decent food and I mean it was
1:02:38
just an amazing positivity of it all like life is good and
1:02:41
getting better, you know and And I think that's, that's the way
1:02:46
life is meant to be. I mean, we're all out there, you
1:02:49
know, working hard to make things better and life should
1:02:52
get better. I mean, each generation should
1:02:55
live better than the prior generation and given the
1:02:57
technology is you knows Jeff talks about your food talks
1:03:00
about. I mean some of the some of the
1:03:02
things we're going to see in some of the events and the
1:03:05
quality of Our Lives I think it's going to be I think we're
1:03:06
going to be stunned, you know in the next what?
1:03:09
Occurs, the next 10, 20, 50 years just because of how
1:03:11
rapidly things are changing. So There's a lot to be very,
1:03:15
very positive about. But we've got to shed this
1:03:18
broken system before we can fully enjoy that in my opinion.
1:03:23
Yes, and we're shutting it now, but it's messy, right?
1:03:27
So yeah, to say the least it is and into battle, you know, it's
1:03:34
a battle and it is a battle because there's no one on the
1:03:38
other side, the people who have the privilege, I don't want to
1:03:41
give it up, you know. That's why you see the mongoose.
1:03:43
You know pushing back and that's why you know that's where you
1:03:46
got them in there. A lot of people throwing sand in
1:03:48
our face and you know, and that's because there they
1:03:51
benefit enormously from the system as it is now constructed,
1:03:55
you know, it has served them incredibly well and they think
1:03:58
they're Geniuses, you know, and they're not they just they got
1:04:02
in front of the right way for the right time and and they're
1:04:06
not not Geniuses in there. You know, I think that's going
1:04:09
to that's going to be one of the pleasing things for me to see is
1:04:12
some of these people You know, getting a better understanding
1:04:16
of they were in the right place at the right time as opposed to
1:04:19
being a smart as they think they are.
1:04:22
Are we going to win Laura? No, there's no doubt.
1:04:24
We're going to win. Yeah.
1:04:25
Marty been said at first. He's right.
1:04:26
Yeah. We're going to win.
1:04:27
There's no way it look. It's an idea whose time has
1:04:29
come. I mean it's you know think even
1:04:32
even at today's price I mean this is the best performing
1:04:35
financial asset in the history of the world ever.
1:04:38
You know, on a return basis on a Sharpe ratio basis.
1:04:41
On any way you want to measure is the most asymmetric met ever
1:04:46
and, you know, false and I pound the table on this.
1:04:48
I mean, if you don't have Piece of your net worth and Bitcoin
1:04:52
your nuts and I don't care if it's only 1%.
1:04:55
The only wrong answer is 0 because this thing's going up
1:04:58
100 times 1000 times where it is today.
1:05:01
Yeah, somebody put up their tip of the spear, absolutely Bitcoin
1:05:04
is the tip of the spear we are going to charge up this hill and
1:05:07
we're going to kill all these Fiat Masters.
1:05:09
I mean they I mean there's just no doubt.
1:05:12
I mean there's just absolutely no doubt it's going to happen
1:05:15
and so and that's what's kind of fun about it all.
1:05:17
I mean in spite of the, you know, the ups and downs of the
1:05:20
Bull and Bear markets. All the other crap and all the
1:05:22
noise that they throw in our face is, you know, if you're
1:05:25
really step back a moment. I mean we are winning, you know,
1:05:28
you know, I mean, you know, I was around in 2013 2016, 2017.
1:05:32
I mean, there were a lot of other times when I was more
1:05:35
concerned about whether we're going to win, I mean, now it's
1:05:37
like now the ball is definitely rolling.
1:05:39
So yeah, we're going to win. No down.
1:05:42
I love that Bitcoin is the metaphorical tip of the spear.
1:05:46
Oh, yeah, to slay to slay the Beast.
1:05:48
I love that. I love that.
1:05:50
Anyway. Ways.
1:05:51
Lawrence I don't want to take more of your time.
1:05:53
It's always an honor and a privilege to have you in the
1:05:59
right direction. So it's a lot of fun.
1:06:02
Thank you so much. I'm going to put you back stage
1:06:04
for a second closed out guys. Thank you so much for joining
1:06:07
us. Another episode of Simply
1:06:09
Bitcoin IR. L love you.
1:06:11
All see you tomorrow for the live show.