Latest / The Parenting Podcast / Parenting in a Digital World pt. 2 | Ep. 165

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Parenting in a Digital World pt. 2 | Ep. 165 · The Parenting Podcast

• 0:00
  Cheryl: screens aren't just a kit issue.
• 0:09
  Cheryl: They shape our homes in real and powerful ways, sometimes subtly, sometimes glaringly, but always starting with us today on The Parenting Podcast.
• 0:24
  Cheryl: We're continuing our conversation with Crystal Kon on navigating family life in the digital world.
• 0:32
  Cheryl: This time we're talking about what it means to model tech wisdom, not just manage screen time, because before we ever hand our kids a device, they've already learned so much by watching how we use ours.
• 0:49
  Cheryl: I'm Cheryl Lang, and I'm so glad you're here.
• 0:54
  Cheryl: If you've ever thought I need to do this differently, but I'm just not sure how.
• 1:01
  Cheryl: You are not alone and you are in the right place.
• 1:13
  Cheryl: Christie, we're back here in the recording studio with our friend Crystal Coon Yes.
• 1:18
  Cheryl: Hey guys, and I hope you all listened to the previous episode.
• 1:24
  Cheryl: Crystal is an incredible resource and very knowledgeable about the digital age and about the struggle parents and families have.
• 1:33
  Cheryl: And last time we talked about what the issues and realities that families are actually really facing in real time right now.
• 1:41
  Cheryl: And I want to hear where do we go from here?
• 1:46
  Cheryl: and so Crystal, right, what can we do about it?
• 1:48
  Cheryl: We.
• 1:49
  Cheryl: do have a problem, what is the hope?
• 1:52
  Cheryl: What is the practical reality of what parents and families can do?
• 1:57
  Crystal: well, gosh, first, let me just say, I feel like I'm just a fellow struggler learning these things as I go.
• 2:04
  Crystal: You know, I do have the benefit of having a 24-year-old daughter, and so this time around with my 11-year-old and 8-year-old, I'm ready, but I am just as you know, one step forward, two step back as as the rest of fighting said.
• 2:18
  Crystal: Fight.
• 2:19
  Crystal: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 2:20
  Crystal: I'm
• 2:20
  Cheryl: not fighting the good
• 2:21
  Crystal: fight is what we're talking about, right?
• 2:22
  Crystal: Mm-hmm.
• 2:23
  Crystal: Right, well, I think one of the best phrases that I've heard for wrapping your arms around how do you.
• 2:29
  Crystal: Become intentional is just becoming a tech-wise family.
• 2:34
  Crystal: And that's really from Andy Crouch in his book and all of his research.
• 2:38
  Crystal: And so really it is just stopping and taking stock of where you are with your own device use.
• 2:46
  Crystal: And so the first thing that I would say to parents is you really need to wrap your arms around.
• 2:53
  Crystal: How are you using your phone?
• 2:55
  Crystal: Hmm?
• 2:56
  Crystal: What do your children.
• 2:58
  Crystal: Experience from you.
• 3:00
  Crystal: Mm-hmm.
• 3:00
  Crystal: In tech usage.
• 3:00
  Crystal: Mm-hmm.
• 3:01
  Crystal: Mm-hmm.
• 3:02
  Crystal: When you move through your day, and this, this was a really painful thing for me to realize because I have always been on top of my kids' phone usage and access devices.
• 3:14
  Crystal: We are.
• 3:14
  Crystal: We are a low tech family, uh, and we will delay access to smartphones and all of the things we limit screen time.
• 3:21
  Crystal: You know, we've got passcodes, you know, all of just the standard protocols.
• 3:26
  Crystal: But the reality was what my kids see in me more often than I would like to admit is phone addiction.
• 3:35
  Crystal: Mm.
• 3:35
  Crystal: And how my kids experience me more often than not is.
• 3:41
  Crystal: Constantly seeing me on my device.
• 3:43
  Crystal: Mm-hmm.
• 3:44
  Crystal: Whether I'm driving down the road or whether I'm not paying attention to what they're trying to tell me.
• 3:49
  Crystal: They don't experience me demonstrating and modeling healthy screen and device you usage.
• 3:56
  Crystal: I mean, it's
• 3:56
  Christie: a reality for all of us.
• 3:58
  Christie: If you, if you think of, you know, your news consumption, your grocery list.
• 4:02
  Christie: Your grocery order, all the things that we communication, we manage our lives on them.
• 4:06
  Christie: Right.
• 4:06
  Cheryl: Right.
• 4:06
  Cheryl: Part of the problem is
• 4:08
  Christie: all that's good stuff.
• 4:09
  Christie: Right.
• 4:09
  Christie: But they don't know No.
• 4:10
  Christie: What's happening on the other side of that phone case that they just see mom's face behind.
• 4:15
  Christie: Right.
• 4:15
  Crystal: Right.
• 4:15
  Crystal: Mm-hmm.
• 4:16
  Crystal: No, they don't realize that you may be responding to their soccer coach.
• 4:20
  Crystal: Yeah.
• 4:21
  Crystal: And you've gotta get an answer to them, ASAP, so that we can schedule the game.
• 4:25
  Crystal: So you're doing something for them.
• 4:26
  Christie: Right.
• 4:27
  Christie: But
• 4:27
  Crystal: all they see is.
• 4:28
  Crystal: The back of your phone and you ignoring them.
• 4:31
  Christie: Exactly.
• 4:32
  Crystal: So taking stock, getting really honest, and, and that can be painful.
• 4:37
  Crystal: Um, and one great way to do that is to sit down, you know, with your spouse and just to say, how am I doing in these areas?
• 4:44
  Crystal: How do you experience me, honey?
• 4:46
  Crystal: And, and the same thing with them.
• 4:48
  Crystal: And honestly sitting down with your kids and being open to hearing how they experience you, because we need to invite them into the conversation.
• 4:57
  Crystal: Because guess what?
• 4:58
  Crystal: Once they do get these devices, they're gonna struggle, right?
• 5:01
  Crystal: I mean, they're gonna struggle with them no matter how strong your boundaries are.
• 5:05
  Crystal: And so inviting them into your own humility, Hey, mom really hasn't been doing well in this.
• 5:12
  Crystal: I'm being at your screen time, but I've really recognized.
• 5:15
  Crystal: That you probably aren't seeing me model that well.
• 5:18
  Crystal: Mm.
• 5:18
  Crystal: How am I doing in these areas?
• 5:20
  Crystal: How often do you feel frustrated by me?
• 5:23
  Crystal: I love
• 5:23
  Cheryl: this because this is the kind of thing we talk about all the time here, that and all the other parts of parenting.
• 5:30
  Cheryl: Yeah.
• 5:30
  Cheryl: Keeping the bridge open of conversation so they feel safe.
• 5:33
  Cheryl: Yeah.
• 5:34
  Cheryl: And that humility, you just talk about, I struggle with this, and you're talking to them so that they feel safe to come back later on.
• 5:43
  Cheryl: Not only is it.
• 5:44
  Cheryl: Uh, mirror for you, but you're laying down that wonderful groundwork for them to come across and say, mom, I'm struggling with this.
• 5:51
  Cheryl: Let's talk about it.
• 5:52
  Cheryl: Mm-hmm.
• 5:52
  Cheryl: Yeah.
• 5:52
  Cheryl: years
• 5:53
  Christie: before they even have access.
• 5:54
  Christie: Absolutely.
• 5:54
  Christie: To these devices.
• 5:55
  Christie: They're connecting regulation with the indulgence.
• 5:59
  Christie: Yeah.
• 6:00
  Crystal: Yeah.
• 6:00
  Crystal: Right.
• 6:00
  Crystal: That's absolutely right.
• 6:02
  Crystal: And so, and then, so I would just say giving yourself grace to know it's gonna be a process.
• 6:07
  Crystal: You also are a work in progress and then there are really good resources for families to help them think through how they wanna build tech intentionality.
• 6:17
  Crystal: Um, I will say out of.
• 6:19
  Crystal: Everything that I've read or listened to, Emily Chikin in her book, the Screen Time Solution, Uhhuh is the most practical, nonjudgmental meet you where you are, just meat on the bones.
• 6:34
  Crystal: Here's how you think through these issues, and here's how you make change.
• 6:37
  Crystal: For example, narrating your usage of your phone.
• 6:42
  Crystal: Hmm.
• 6:42
  Crystal: What does that mean?
• 6:44
  Crystal: So the example that I talked about earlier, you may be talking to their soccer coach and doing something for your child, but they're just experiencing you as ignoring them.
• 6:53
  Crystal: So rather than pick up your phone.
• 6:56
  Crystal: And not tell your children, what you're doing.
• 6:59
  Crystal: Anytime I pick up my phone in front of my spouse or my children, I'm telling them what I'm doing.
• 7:07
  Crystal: Oh, that's excellent.
• 7:08
  Crystal: Or I'm asking their permission.
• 7:09
  Crystal: Hey, you're in the middle of telling me about your day.
• 7:12
  Crystal: I've just gotten a text from your Gigi who's getting ready to come pick you up in 15 minutes.
• 7:19
  Crystal: I'm just responding to your Gigi.
• 7:21
  Crystal: Are you okay with that?
• 7:22
  Crystal: Or would you like me to wait until you finish your story?
• 7:24
  Crystal: Oh, love this.
• 7:24
  Crystal: I love that
• 7:25
  Christie: Crystal.
• 7:26
  Crystal: Wow.
• 7:27
  Crystal: I mean, if everybody just did that one thing, right?
• 7:29
  Crystal: Mm-hmm.
• 7:30
  Crystal: Right..
• 7:31
  Crystal: So then when you're narrating your phone usage, not only are you giving your children uh, uh, an example of, Hey, this is a situation where I do need to pause.
• 7:40
  Crystal: Mm-hmm.
• 7:40
  Crystal: And I do need to interact with my phone because of this reason, but also it's giving you pause.
• 7:48
  Crystal: Is this something I really need to do right now?
• 7:50
  Christie: That's really helpful.
• 7:51
  Crystal: Hey.
• 7:52
  Crystal: Susie, I'm gonna interrupt you telling me your story because a really funny reel just popped up, right?
• 7:58
  Crystal: Yeah.
• 7:58
  Crystal: And so I'm gonna choose to do that.
• 7:59
  Crystal: So it's also a check on your own heart.
• 8:02
  Crystal: Mm-hmm.
• 8:02
  Crystal: Do I really need to do this in this moment?
• 8:04
  Cheryl: Look at the respect this brings in to our families.
• 8:07
  Cheryl: Yeah.
• 8:08
  Cheryl: We always talk about treating others with respect.
• 8:10
  Cheryl: Mm-hmm.
• 8:10
  Cheryl: But this is the first time we defined it as let's treat people with respect with our.
• 8:16
  Cheryl: Screen time.
• 8:16
  Christie: Right, right, right.
• 8:17
  Christie: Well, I'm just envisioning you saying this to a 4-year-old.
• 8:21
  Christie: 6-year-old.
• 8:22
  Christie: Wow.
• 8:22
  Christie: And then at 14 and 16, them returning the same to you saying, mom, I want to hear what you're saying to me.
• 8:31
  Christie: Can you give me one second?
• 8:32
  Christie: I need to respond to this.
• 8:33
  Christie: It's my right.
• 8:34
  Christie: Soccer coach.
• 8:35
  Christie: Right.
• 8:35
  Christie: Who would've
• 8:36
  Cheryl: thought what Emily would be introducing this is another level.
• 8:41
  Cheryl: Of a culture of respect within our family.
• 8:44
  Cheryl: Right.
• 8:44
  Cheryl: And then you're talking about a 4-year-old, they've had 10 years.
• 8:48
  Cheryl: Mm-hmm.
• 8:48
  Cheryl: Of you as a mom or dad saying, excuse me just a minute, I don't want to interrupt you, but Oh, our family's doing this, but mm-hmm.
• 8:56
  Cheryl: And they have heard that repeatedly from you, not only are they deeply into the digital culture, but they have a culture of this is interrupting life rather than being life.
• 9:07
  Cheryl: Yes.
• 9:07
  Cheryl: Right.
• 9:08
  Cheryl: Right.
• 9:08
  Cheryl: Wow.
• 9:09
  Crystal: Right.
• 9:09
  Crystal: Go ahead.
• 9:09
  Crystal: That's excellent.
• 9:10
  Crystal: Well, um, it's been something that's been really helpful to me.
• 9:13
  Crystal: In fact, a a week after I started it, my sweet 11-year-old came to me and she was like, okay, I'm trying to say this in a respectful way, but what are you doing?
• 9:23
  Crystal: Why are you telling me everything that you're doing on my, on your phone all the time?
• 9:27
  Crystal: And so it was funny, but it led to a great conversation with her.
• 9:31
  Crystal: Wow.
• 9:32
  Crystal: And she.
• 9:33
  Crystal: Loved hearing that.
• 9:34
  Crystal: And now it's gotten to the point where if I do get distracted and I am ignoring what's happening right in front of me, my kids just stop.
• 9:42
  Crystal: They full stop.
• 9:43
  Crystal: Mm-hmm.
• 9:43
  Crystal: And then I realize that I have just created this awkward silence and so it's just another reminder for me.
• 9:50
  Crystal: Oh gosh.
• 9:52
  Crystal: That's fantastic.
• 9:52
  Crystal: Wow.
• 9:52
  Crystal: I need to put my phone away.
• 9:54
  Crystal: Yeah.
• 9:54
  Crystal: Yeah.
• 9:54
  Crystal: That's excellent.
• 9:55
  Crystal: Yeah.
• 9:56
  Crystal: And then.
• 9:56
  Crystal: Some of us have addiction to certain social media sites and, uh, for me, I love Instagram.
• 10:03
  Crystal: I love looking at pretty things, and so I regularly have to take it off my phone.
• 10:10
  Crystal: When I notice that I'm getting back into a pattern and a habit of using it too much, or, you know, because I lived in the world of current events and political news for so long, mm-hmm.
• 10:22
  Crystal: I very easily can gravitate into checking X every day and staying abreast of everything that's going on.
• 10:30
  Crystal: And when I notice it starts to consume me, then it's time for for me to take that off my phone.
• 10:35
  Crystal: Wow.
• 10:35
  Crystal: So wise.
• 10:36
  Crystal: And I tell my kids about that and I tell them, oh, you know what, i've realized I've really dropped the ball on this again, so you know what I'm gonna do.
• 10:43
  Crystal: I'm gonna take this off my phone for a while.
• 10:45
  Christie: I mean, that's what we talk about a lot here on the podcast is it things are more caught than taught.
• 10:50
  Christie: And so your kids are, like I said, years away from having to practice these things on their own.
• 10:56
  Christie: But you're creating a, Habit, culture of wisdom.
• 11:00
  Christie: Right.
• 11:00
  Christie: And you're role modeling it,
• 11:01
  Cheryl: right?
• 11:02
  Cheryl: Not perfection.
• 11:03
  Cheryl: Mm-hmm.
• 11:04
  Cheryl: But you're role modeling.
• 11:06
  Cheryl: Oh, whoops.
• 11:08
  Cheryl: This is how we handle struggles.
• 11:10
  Cheryl: Right?
• 11:10
  Cheryl: Right.
• 11:10
  Cheryl: This is how we do it, and we do it in community.
• 11:14
  Cheryl: Mm-hmm.
• 11:14
  Cheryl: And that the community includes the children, and this is why I'm doing this.
• 11:19
  Christie: Okay, so you mentioned community Crystal, I want you to share before we're out of time, what you have initiated and led with your daughter's peer group.
• 11:30
  Crystal: Okay.
• 11:30
  Crystal: So before I launch into community-based solutions, I just wanna talk about.
• 11:36
  Crystal: Why we have to have community that comes alongside us because, you know, we live in a hyper individualistic age, right?
• 11:45
  Crystal: Yeah.
• 11:45
  Crystal: Where it's me and my way.
• 11:47
  Crystal: Mm-hmm.
• 11:47
  Crystal: I've got this.
• 11:48
  Crystal: We know we can live in these curated worlds where everything is catered to and tailored to me.
• 11:55
  Crystal: And so we forget the reality that we have to live in community and practice these things in community.
• 12:02
  Crystal: And the reason being.
• 12:03
  Crystal: All of these devices and all of these technologies are designed to war against your humanity.
• 12:11
  Crystal: Wow.
• 12:13
  Crystal: And.
• 12:14
  Crystal: Not living just in a digital reality, but in your actual reality.
• 12:19
  Crystal: Yeah.
• 12:19
  Crystal: As a human being.
• 12:20
  Crystal: As a human being.
• 12:21
  Crystal: Mm-hmm.
• 12:22
  Crystal: To be fully flourishing in this world and to raise kids that are fully flourishing in this world.
• 12:27
  Crystal: And so, you know, just take parental controls for example.
• 12:32
  Crystal: You know, you can put a filtration system on your house.
• 12:36
  Crystal: Um, and your wifi network, but guess what?
• 12:39
  Crystal: That doesn't monitor any of the in-app content.
• 12:43
  Crystal: Mm.
• 12:43
  Crystal: Yeah.
• 12:43
  Crystal: So it's very limited.
• 12:45
  Crystal: Secondly, there is always a workaround for whatever.
• 12:49
  Crystal: Yeah.
• 12:49
  Crystal: Lockdown.
• 12:50
  Crystal: You can give your kids a smartphone and you can have every lockdown feature on it.
• 12:56
  Crystal: Employed.
• 12:57
  Crystal: And guess what?
• 12:58
  Crystal: Your kids could simply go out to Google Maps.
• 13:00
  Crystal: They could Find out about Milk Island, which is a fictitious place that kids go.
• 13:06
  Crystal: To view pornographic and explicit images on Google maps.
• 13:10
  Crystal: Hmm.
• 13:10
  Crystal: But my point is you can't go it alone.
• 13:14
  Crystal: Mm-hmm.
• 13:14
  Crystal: Your kids are always gonna have workarounds, they're always gonna know ways to use the phones in ways that you haven't even thought of.
• 13:21
  Crystal: There's just limits to that.
• 13:23
  Crystal: So then you have to come back to what is my greater purpose in training my kids to be tech wise?
• 13:30
  Crystal: Hmm.
• 13:30
  Crystal: So if we're working on our own tech wisdom and our own intentionality with us, that's the first step.
• 13:36
  Crystal: Mm-hmm.
• 13:37
  Crystal: What am I modeling?
• 13:38
  Crystal: The second step is what do I want my family and my home life?
• 13:44
  Crystal: To look like.
• 13:45
  Crystal: Mm-hmm.
• 13:45
  Crystal: Wow.
• 13:46
  Crystal: When my kids leave my home, what do I want them to look back on?
• 13:50
  Crystal: And how do I want them to have experienced our home life, our family life, and how we utilize these tools and how we incorporated them into our family.
• 14:01
  Crystal: So I think it's taking a step back and really thinking through what do we want them to experience from us.
• 14:07
  Crystal: And then third, it's how did my community.
• 14:12
  Crystal: Model this for us and for our children And so what does that look like?
• 14:18
  Crystal: Well, for me, we go to a private Christian school here in town, which is a wonderful school and I.
• 14:26
  Crystal: In many ways I'm incredibly fortunate because our school is intentionally tech-free, and that's not the case for most moms and dads.
• 14:33
  Crystal: Yeah.
• 14:33
  Crystal: And I wanna come back to the issue of public schools and schools that do use a lot of technology.
• 14:39
  Crystal: So let's come back to that.
• 14:41
  Crystal: But in the fifth grade, we had an incident where, um, our daughters started connecting, um, through FaceTime and group chats.
• 14:50
  Crystal: And, and all of us moms realized, oh, goodness.
• 14:53
  Mm.
• 14:54
  Crystal: We're not ready for this.
• 14:55
  Crystal: Mm-hmm.
• 14:55
  Crystal: We haven't built a plan for how we want our kids to engage.
• 14:58
  Crystal: Mm-hmm.
• 14:59
  Crystal: And so out of that, um.
• 15:01
  Crystal: Moms who were the same grade and the same gender, fifth grade girls at my school, I just hosted two dinners.
• 15:08
  Crystal: We came together, we looked at the realities of screen usage, what these products mean.
• 15:13
  Cheryl: Oh, crystal, this is so exciting because it's not like an example we're streaming online or reading out of a book or from a.
• 15:23
  Cheryl: Ted Talk or TikTok, but you and your community actually did this.
• 15:31
  Cheryl: However, we're running out of time for today's episode.
• 15:34
  Cheryl: Could you stay longer and we'll just keep the mic going and then you tell us how it worked out, what you actually planned and did.
• 15:41
  Crystal: Absolutely I would be glad to!
• 15:43
  Cheryl: Thank you so much.
• 15:44
  Cheryl: Looking forward to hearing the next phase of how you took charge of technology as a family, and as a community for all your benefit as individuals, parents, of course, your children, and then their community and their future.
• 16:00
  Cheryl: so Parents, hang in there.
• 16:03
  Cheryl: Keep loving, keep persevering because it is worth it.
• 16:07
  Cheryl: I don't know about you, but this conversation has me thinking about the quiet patterns in my own life, the ones I never intended to teach, but that my kids are still learning from.
• 16:19
  Cheryl: It's not about guilt, it's about awareness.
• 16:23
  Cheryl: And for me, it starts with something as small as saying out loud what I'm doing when I pick my phone up in front of my family.
• 16:32
  Cheryl: Or asking myself if I really need to do it.
• 16:35
  Cheryl: Our kids are watching how we handle distraction, how we value connection, and whether we're willing to reset.
• 16:44
  Cheryl: So maybe this week you could try one thing.
• 16:48
  Cheryl: Maybe it's beginning to narrate your phone use.
• 16:51
  Cheryl: Maybe it's deleting that app.
• 16:54
  Cheryl: That's starting to take up too much space, not just on your screen, but in your mind.
• 17:00
  Cheryl: Whatever it looks like, know this, you're not alone in this.
• 17:04
  Cheryl: We're walking it with you too, and we're not aiming for perfect.
• 17:09
  Cheryl: We're building something better.
• 17:12
  Cheryl: I love to hear what you thought about all this.
• 17:15
  Cheryl: Reach out anytime at contact@theparentingpodcast.com or on social media.
• 17:22
  Cheryl: And don't miss the show notes.
• 17:25
  Cheryl: We've tucked in some of the resources Crystal mentioned to help you take that next step and be sure to follow us because next time Crystal's back with how she and other parents are creating real practical community standards that are working.
• 17:41
  Cheryl: I can't wait for you to hear it.