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Evelyn & Alex Hernandez Pt. Two · The Path Went Chilly

0:29
Welcome back to the Path Went Chile for part two of our series about the
0:33
murder of Evelyn Hernandez and the disappearance of Alex Hernandez. Robin, do you
0:39
want to catch everyone up on what we talked about in our previous episode?
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Well, this case takes place in San Francisco in two thousand and two.
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Evelyn Hernandez is a thirty six year old immigrant from Alex Salvador who has a
0:51
five year old son named Alex, even though she's raising him as a single
0:54
mother, and she's currently nine months pregnant with a baby boy that she is
0:58
planning to name Fernando. She wound up going missing after failing to drop off
1:02
Alex at his preschool and was not officially reported missing for about six days,
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and it turned out that the father of her unborn child was a man named
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Herman Aguilera, who also happened to be married to another woman. Evelyn did
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not find out that herman was married until she was four months pregnant, and
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even though she was not interested in having a further relationship with him, she
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did say that she was still going to raise Fernando and allow herman to have
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visitation because he was the child's father, but before she could give birth,
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she went missing. And it also turned out that even though herman's wife was
1:37
aware of the affair, she did not find out until the police told her
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that Evelyn was pregnant with herman's child. A couple months later, they finally
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found Evelyn's torso floating in San Francisco Bay, and even though they could not
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determine the exact cause of death, it was obvious that she was the victim
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of foul play. They never found any trace of Alex, and they also
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never found any trace of the fetus, which would have been Fernando, so
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they can't say with certainty that she did not give birth before she was murdered.
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But I know there's an assumption that Alex and Fernando are still in San
2:08
Francisco Bay and they've just never found their remains. But the case didn't get
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any media coverage at first. But as I'm sure you're well aware, at
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the end of two thousand and two, Lacy Peterson went missing from the town
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of A Desto, California, and it became a huge news story, and
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Lacy and her unborn son, Connor, were both found in San Francisco Bay
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three months after she disappeared, and Lacy's husband, Scott would be charged with
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their murders and sent to prison, and it became one of the most famous
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true crime cases of all time. And of course this led to a discussion
2:40
about why would Lacy Peterson's disappearance and murder gets so much coverage from the media,
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whereas Evelyn Hernandez and Alex's disappearances barely got any coverage at all, and
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it was mostly in comparison to the Peterson case. So we're going to talk
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more about this subject in part two. So at the end of our last
2:58
episode, we were making comparisons between the media coverage in the Evelyn Hernandez and
3:04
Lacy Peterson cases, as well as the public perception of each victim. The
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primary source for most of the coverage in the Hernandez case was a San Francisco
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Chronicle, but even they admitted that during the four month time period between Lacy
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Peterson's disappearance and Scott Peterson's arrest, they published thirty two articles about this story,
3:24
and four of them made the front page. By comparison, the Chronicle
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only published four articles in total about Evelyn and Alex's disappearances, and none of
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them were front page news. The first press conference from police to publicize the
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Hernandez case did not take place until over one month after they originally went missing,
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and while a five hundred thousand dollars reward was raised and posted in the
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Peterson case within a few weeks of Lacy's disappearance, there was no reward offered
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for information on Evelyn and Alex until one year after the fact. At one
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point, Evelyn's family attempted to get her story featured on America's Most Wanted,
4:04
who were rejected because there was no active arrest warrant for a suspect. Yet
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during the same period, the show ran a segment about Lacy Peterson's disappearance,
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even though there was not yet an arrest warrant for a suspect in her case
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at that point. America's Most Wanted did finally do a segment on Evelyn and
4:24
Alex during the summer of two thousand three, but of course, this was
4:28
an entire year after they originally vanished. But while it's easy to criticize the
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media for favoring one case over the other, you have to remember that Lacy
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Peterson's family had a lot of money and resources to spread awareness about her case,
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and were always speaking to the press in order to keep Lacy in the
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spotlight. By contrast, Evelyn's friends and family had nowhere near as many resources
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at their disposal, and there was no one who could function as her spokesperson.
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She had two sisters in the US, but one of them lived in
5:00
Virginia, and even though her other sister, Raina, did live in the
5:03
Bay Area, she could not actually hear or speak and had to communicate with
5:09
reporters using sign language and an interpreter. Evelyn herself spoke limited to English,
5:14
and many of her friends only spoke Spanish, so it was very difficult for
5:18
anyone to be an advocate for her in the media. Ironically enough, it
5:23
was Hermann Aguilera, the person who would later be suspected of causing Evelyn and
5:28
Alex's disappearances, who officially reported them missing to the police. Now, once
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Scott Peterson became the prime suspect in his wife's disappearance, every single aspect of
5:40
his life was investigated and analyzed, but the same cannot be said for herman.
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He has never given any interviews to the media, and we only note
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the most basic details about him, so it's tough to gauge Herman's involvement with
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such limited information. This is what really frustrates me about what we talked about
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on the episode one, about that kind of ideal victim or the way that
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the white woman's syndrome, right in the way that we do give so much
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attention to Lacy's case. Herman is a potential murder. He's also potentially innocent,
6:15
but he's a potential murderer. And because of who Evelyn was and because
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she was quote the other woman, nothing was really looked at with Herman.
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Right. They took his statement basically at face value and didn't do much digging
6:30
into who he was, even though he presented as a very dishonest and controlling
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person. Right, we always wanted to control the narrative. So you're letting
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somebody potentially off the hook because of the judgment and attention that you failed to
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give to Evelyn in this case. And so it's kind of this full circle.
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Not only did you fail Evelyn and Alex and that unborn child, but
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you're also giving a pass to someone who's a potential perpetrator. Case by saying
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there's not a whole lot to look at here and moving forward just kind of
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glossing over the case as a whole. It is really frustrating, the whole
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anecdote about America's Most Wanted where they're like, well, we can't feature her
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case because no one's technically wanted, and so it doesn't really fit the show.
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Yet they're more than happy to do that for Lacy Peterson's disappearance, even
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though Scott was not yet an active suspect with an active arrest warrant. But
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you can understand why America's Most Wanted would want to capitalize on that because it
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was the biggest true crime story in the nation at that point. So you
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can just understand like all these obstacles where like the media is just clamoring to
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get every single detail about Lacey, but Evelyn's story is just falling through the
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cracks, and the potential suspect, the potential killer, Herman, is not
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getting any attention at all. But of course, the key difference between the
7:46
Hernandez and Peterson cases is that Evelynce five year old son Alex disappeared alongside her,
7:53
and sadly that poor boy has often been overlooked in this whole saga.
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Well, most people involved in this case don't hold up my hope that Alex
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is still alive. Without a body, we can't be one certain And while
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the fetus for Lacey's unborn son, Connor was found in San Francisco Bay,
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the fetus for Evelyn's unborn son, Fernando was not. It's most likely that
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Fernando did not survive and his fetus has simply not been found. But because
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Evelyn was less than a week away from giving birth and her torso was not
8:22
discovered until over three months later, we technically cannot say with one percent certainty
8:28
that she did not give birth to Fernando before she was killed. Now,
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I know there's been a lot of controversy about Scott Peterson in recent years,
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as he does have his fair share of supporters who believe he is innocent,
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and in twenty seventeen, the A and E Network released an extensive multi part
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documentary series titled The Murder of Lacy Peterson, which attempted to cast doubt on
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his conviction. Well, I'll stay right up front that even though the case
8:52
against him was circumstantial, I still believe that Scott Peterson is guilty as sin,
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and the sheer amount of circumstan angel evidence against him is far too damning
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for me to believe that he was innocent of his wife and unborn sons murders.
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And in spite of what his supporters might say, I want to discount
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the idea that this crime has any connection to the Hernandez case, even though
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both victims were found in San Francisco Bay, the Peterson's lived ninety miles away
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at Maddesto. Though I have considered the possibility that Scott might have intentionally made
9:22
the decision to drive to Berkeley and dump Lacey's body in the bay in order
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to give off the false impression that both she and Evelyn were murdered by the
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same killer. However, the Hernandus case got so little coverage in the media
9:35
that I doubt that Scott would have even heard of it. No, no,
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no, no, And doesn't it make you sick when you hear Scott
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Peterson's supporters like all the evidence is overwhelming, his behaviors, his statements,
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Amber FRI's testimony, all of these different things that we know about Scott and
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what happened after Lacey went missing, and you'd you have a whole band of
10:01
people, you have documentaries out, you have things that are quote trying to
10:05
prove his innocence, and it's it has become almost like we talked about in
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episode one, this sexualization is glamorisation of Scott as this innocent man and hero
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in the story, right, this grieving husband and oh, I just I
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cannot His name shouldn't even be said. It should be Lacy's and they're unborn
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baby, and you know, now Scott's back in the line mine getting this
10:28
attention. It's wild. Yeah. I recently watched this documentary. I can't
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remember what it was called. It was something like The Case for Scott Peterson
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or something along those lines. And I think it was on Netflix, but
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don't quote me. It could have been on Prime. And it went through
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the perspective of Scott potentially being innocent, and it went through that there could
10:50
have been killer who was targeting pregnant women, and also the break in and
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all these different inconsistencies, and we see lots of errors in cases, and
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I think when that happens, it's easy to be like, oh, there's
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all these hidden variables and there's so much mystery. Attached to this case.
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But the reality is you've got a bunch of human beings working on it,
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and human beings are fallible. We can't look at police and investigators and assume
11:18
that they're going to do everything perfectly in every single case. And obviously they
11:22
had to get little things wrong here or there. This happens. We saw
11:26
that in the John Boney Ramsey case, and that's why I believe so much
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mystery swirls around that even though for a long time I personally believed it was
11:37
somebody in the family, and now I look at it and I'm like,
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how could I ever believed that. I believe it's an intruder. And I
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think the fact that people believe that it was Scott. He's very fortunate,
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and that he is good looking. People think that he's attractive. He has
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that whole halo effect going, and that people assume because he's good looking,
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he must be a good person, even though we have his actions that seem
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to be proving to the cause contrary. He seems to have a callous disregard
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for his pregnant wife and also for Amber in the way that he's treating her
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and continuing to lie to her. So he also has the fact that those
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brakens were happening next door, and that it leaves some ambiguity there. People
12:16
believe that maybe Lacey was walking the dog and she was abducted. She's thought
12:20
too much, and then people also connect cases like Evelyn hernandez Is and think,
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well, maybe there was a serial killer who was targeting pregnant women.
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So I think there's a lot of things that are working for Scott Peterson and
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that he got lucky, and that it causes doubt for some people. Oh
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yeah, I watched that series about Scott Peterson, and they put a lot
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of emphasis on that group of burglars who broke into the house across the street,
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but they failed to mention that police did look into them and cleared them
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as suspects relatively quickly. And even if Lacey saw something she wasn't supposed to.
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I don't think these burglars are going to go to the trouble of like
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dismembering her and driving her ninety miles to damp her body in San Francisco Bay.
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So it's all just smoke and mirrors, like somebody saw you committing a
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robbery or a burglary and you're going to then what put a pregnant woman in
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your van and murder her. I don't think that whatever jail time you could
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potentially get when she's likely not going to recognize your face, because if it's
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during the day, like I mean, I don't know, is she going
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to be able to draw a composite sketch of you and you're, you know,
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co defendants if you guys are brought to trial. I don't know.
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I think it's possible, But is that what she's really going to be focusing
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on. She's super pregnant. How many people are going to unless they're absolute
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psychopaths go oh, I don't want to get busted for this robbery. I
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better abduct and murder a woman. It's just not very logical. No.
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If you think that burglar theory is ridiculous, wait till you hear what Jewels
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talks about next. Oh my gosh, bring it on, Jewels. So
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I think the Scott Peters and defense team kind of lucked out into the fact
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that such a similar cry occurred in the Bay Area earlier that same year,
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which gave them the opportunity to point the finger at an outside third party.
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But the problem is that some of Scott's supporters decided to bring an old relic
14:11
from the nineteen eighties into the mix you guessed at ashe it's Satanic panic.
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One of Scott's defense attorneys was Matt Dalton, who was removed from the case
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prior to trial for violating a judge's order not to speak with the media.
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He would later publish a book titled Presume Guilty, which attempted to cast out
14:31
on Scott's conviction, but one of his alternate theories was that Lacey was murdered
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by a Satanic cult from the Berkeley area who had been responsible for the disappearance
14:43
of seven pregnant women over a three year period. Dalton made mention of Evelyn
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Hernandez and pointed out that she went missing on the date of May first,
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which the Satanic calendar apparently refers to as the Grand Climax aka a day of
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sacrifice. Well, a retired California congressman named William A. Danemeyer read Presumed
15:05
Guilty, and in September two thousand and six, he decided to send a
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letter to the California Attorney General stating quote both Lacey and Evelyn disappeared on Satanic
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holy days according to the Satanic calendar, and they both ended up in the
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San Francisco Bay with their hands, feet, and heads missing. I began
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to read everything I could have a vote, Satanism, Satanic cults, and
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ritual abuse. With this mountain of evidence not used to the trial, evidence
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that would have cleared Scott Peterson. Why was it not used? End quote?
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Oh my god, Oh my god. No, he's innocent. I
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didn't know this. No, Okay, William's crazy. He might be a
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very accomplished congressman. But when you look at stuff like this, like,
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is it something to consider if you're investigating the case ab solutely? Like would
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you want to know as a detective these kinds of facts? Sure? Do?
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You also have to make sure that you don't buy into exactly what Jules
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said. The Satanic panic that was happening at the time, we saw this
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with all kinds of different kind of misunderstandings about certain populations. You had the
16:22
San Antonio for the for lesbian women who were targeted for sexual abuse, the
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daycares that were targeted for sexual abuse that were not accurate, and you know,
16:32
the Satanic groups being blamed for all kinds of things. Look at the
16:34
West Memphis three and how Damien was passed as a Satanic worshiper, right,
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and that's why he had to kill these kids. We can go too far
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with information that we received. So should detectives have looked at this? And
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do we know that they didn't? You know, like, it's very possible
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they saw this date and said, oh, it's interesting that it happens to
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be a Satanic holiday. But is this completely ignorant on the congressman's fault to
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then make an assumption of innocence That makes no sense In this case. There's
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a million and one reasons why Scott Peterson was found guilty and this one ironic
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coincidence doesn't change that fact. I'm sorry, William, but you're wrong.
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And so is this crazy man who writes the Matt Dalton who says, oh,
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let me write this presumed guilty and make all these assumptions. Because as
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an author, I feel like we have an obligation to be accurate when we
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portray books like a true crime book, right, you need to be very
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diligent and what you put forth because not everybody is as educated on the topic.
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And when you make these broad claims, and you make these links,
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and you draw these assumptions. I don't know, he's way off base.
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Scott Peterson's guilty. You can't convince me otherwise. Supporter of his or not,
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people, it was fun to hear Jewels say the phrase the grand climax
17:59
with this faced whatever. That's exactly right, Okay. I don't think it's
18:07
going to come as a complete shock for you to hear me say this.
18:08
But no, I do not believe a Satanic cult was responsible for the murder
18:12
of Evelyn Hernandez, and I certainly don't believe they killed Lacy Peterson. But
18:17
on the other side of the coin, I do not believe Scott Peterson was
18:21
responsible for killing Evelyn, even though I have seen that pushed forward as a
18:25
potential theory. After Scott was charged with his wife's murder, I know attempts
18:29
were made to paint him as a remorseless serial killer and link him to other
18:33
unsolved cold cases from California. For instance, you might be familiar with the
18:37
disappearance of nineteen year old Kristen Smart, who vanished from the campus of California
18:41
Polytechnic State University in May of nineteen ninety six, it turned out that Scott
18:47
just happened to be a student at the same university during that time period.
18:52
But even though rumors briefly spread that he might have some sort of connection to
18:56
Kristen's disappearance, a suspect named Paul Flores was finally convicted of her murder last
19:00
year, So the whole thing is nothing more than a coincidence. Since Scott
19:04
lived in Modesto, there is nothing at all to link him to Evelyn Hernandez
19:08
or suggesting he was in San Francisco in May of two thousand and two when
19:11
she went missing. So again, it's likely just a coincidence that two murdered
19:15
pregnant women were adopted San Francisco Bay during that particular year. So I think
19:21
we can now officially close the books on the Hernandez Peterson connections and start focusing
19:26
out what really happened to Evelyn, Alex and Fernando. Yes, please,
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because let's go back really quick to Scott's case and then move on. Or
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actually it's Lacey's case. But when Scott Peterson killed his pregnant wife, he
19:41
did so because it served an important purpose for him. And so when you
19:47
say Okay, listen. He killed Lacey because he wanted to have this life
19:52
with Amber Fry and he had gotten in so deep with Amber. Remember he
19:55
had told her that his wife was dead. She had been to support system.
20:00
She had held his hand while he was grieving. She had helped him
20:03
mourn Lacy. Right, This was an important part of their relationship. I'm
20:08
a widow. I get that connection. When you have someone who loves you
20:12
enough to let you love your late spouse, lets you grieve and lets you
20:18
love them at the same time, it's a very unique intimate relationship. That's
20:22
what Amber was for Scott, and she had no idea the monster she was
20:27
actually dealing with. But Scott solely killed Lacy so that he could pursue the
20:34
life he wanted. Right, She was worth disposing of, as was his
20:38
own blood and child to pursue this life with Amber. What would he have
20:45
to benefit from killing Evelyn. It was such a directed killing that he did
20:48
towards Lacey and his unborn child. He has no need to kill Evelyn.
20:53
Right, This is to me, there's not a motivation. You can see
20:59
that Hermann did have the same motivation that Scott had. Get rid of my
21:03
problem. And so when people try to link Scott as the actual killer of
21:07
Evelyn, I think it's I don't know, I don't know what's dumber that
21:11
more dumb, right, is it Scott killing Evelyn? Or is it a
21:15
Satanic panic actually the Satanic worshipers being responsible for their deaths. I don't know
21:22
which is sillier. I actually think that connecting Scott Peterson to Evelyn's is worse
21:27
than the Satanic panic because at least with the Satanic one, you've got some
21:32
dates, and they seem to have cases where they're making these connections. They're
21:36
obviously looking for connections. But connecting Scott Peterson, you're what then is doing
21:41
that Scott Peterson got together with Lacy, got her pregnant so he could then
21:45
murder her because he's then a serial killer that targets pregnant women. It doesn't
21:49
even make any sense, Like that is just the most preposterous thing that I've
21:53
ever heard. It was clearly a very personal crime, and that he killed
21:57
his pregnant life. Why would he be going and looking for a woman who
22:03
someone else got pregnant to then murder her. Are we supposed to believe that
22:07
he first murdered Evelyn, and he enjoyed it so much that he decided to
22:11
murder his own pregnant wife. Like I don't understand, this doesn't not make
22:17
any sense, and the satanic panic one is also a ridiculous theory. But
22:21
I think that trying to link Scott Peterson to Evelyn Hernandez is just crazy.
22:26
On the surface, the explanation might seem pretty obvious. We have a woman
22:32
that became pregnant with a child of a married man, and he was not
22:36
overly thrilled about the whole situation, and she reportedly told him that she wanted
22:41
to end the relationship a short time before she disappeared. However, herman Aguilera
22:45
has never formerly been named as a suspect, so unlike Scott Peterson, it
22:52
doesn't sound like there's much in the way of actual evidence against him at all.
22:56
And obviously, the murder of a woman, a five year old boy,
23:00
and an unborn child is an incredibly monstrous act. Yet we know so
23:04
little about herman's background that it's difficult to determine if you would be capable of
23:10
something like that. But here's what we know about the timeline. The last
23:14
time Evelyn was confirmed to be alive was at around nine pm on the evening
23:18
of May first, when she finished a phone conversation with her sister. Even
23:23
though she was not reported missing until six days later, the first sign that
23:27
something was wrong was when Evelyn failed to drop off Alex at preschool on the
23:33
morning of May second. For this reason, investigators believe that something happened to
23:37
both of them during this window of approximately nine or ten hours. It has
23:42
to be Evelyn was hurting so badly. Remember she had called her sister and
23:48
said, like, I don't know if I can drive, Like my stomach's
23:49
really hurting. She could have been thinking she was in an early labor or
23:53
going into labor, and Olivia says, well, like, do you have
23:57
anyone that can help you? And she goes, no, I'm just going
24:00
to take him myself. And she drives her baby in pain to daycare.
24:04
The day before she's able to run some errands and go pick him up and
24:08
bring him home, and she's planning things with Olivia on the phone. She's
24:12
saying, Hey, I'm going to this baby shower right I'm making plans for
24:15
the next couple of days before I give birth. And then she doesn't bring
24:19
that baby to school the next day that it is incredibly scary. It's a
24:25
definite sign that's something had already happened to them. This is the kind of
24:29
case where it goes like I now am desperately concerned about what happened to Alex
24:34
because this person clearly didn't dispose of Evelyn in a very effective manner or right
24:38
Evelyn her torso was wash up and discovered. So would the killer have actually
24:45
hidden Alex to a point where he was never discovered. I don't see them
24:48
doing an excellent job with Alex, but not Evelyn. And I also have
24:53
to go back to where Jules you mentioned we know very little about Herman's background,
24:59
so could he became pable of something like this? I'm gonna say this.
25:02
I think many people are capable of far more than we want to give
25:07
them credit for, or we want to acknowledge so that we're not horrified of
25:11
human behavior. But I think a lot of people are capable of a lot
25:15
of depraved things. We just have two bigger consequences to do those, or
25:21
it's like beyond what our current circumstances offer. But I don't know. I
25:25
think human nature is a very scary thing to look at. Herman has shown
25:30
that he is the most important. He has shown that he does not have
25:36
much regard for human life with the people around him, because he was willing
25:41
to ruin his wife's his wife's life by having an affair, by not being
25:48
accountable when called out on that, by continuing to manipulate in line to her.
25:52
So clearly he's not concerned with his wife's well being whatsoever. Because have
25:57
an affair, many people are able to look at their spouse and find tools
26:03
to move forward, and if they do, bravo. But you have to
26:07
have accountability and responsibility. You have to be the one who has to step
26:11
back and say I'll do whatever you need me to do to earn your trust.
26:15
And that is not lying to me yet again, which is exactly what
26:18
Herman did. He said, I'm done with her. We don't have a
26:21
relationship. And he then says, oh, I was buying her son a
26:25
bed and taking her to a doctor's appointment the last time I saw her.
26:29
Like Herman can't have it both ways, but he will always have it to
26:33
where he's in control, where he's the victim. He's the good guy,
26:37
he's the hero. Do I think people like that are capable of getting rid
26:42
of a human being because they're an inconvenience or a danger to their narrative.
26:47
Yes, I think those are the most dangerous type of people. Herman was
26:51
the most important person in his world. He got what he wanted when he
26:55
wanted it, and he never was accountable for his mess ups. He always
27:00
had an excuse. He was always the good guy, and so I think
27:03
he's very capable. Did he do it? Who knows? But is he
27:07
capable? Yeah? I think he is. I think we know so little
27:11
about him, but like you said, we do know that there is a
27:15
pattern of deception and that he acts without integrity, and I think we can
27:19
kind of extrapolate from that that when the walls are closing in on him,
27:23
he may take extreme measures. And I do think that somebody like him is
27:27
a very destructive person. He's being destructive to his wife, his relationship with
27:33
her, and he's also being destructive to Evelyn and Evelyn's life. So somebody
27:37
who is an incredibly destructive person, I think for them to then go and
27:41
do the most destructive act, well, to me, that's plausible. And
27:45
I'm not saying I am not saying an adulter equals a murderer. I'm saying,
27:49
does character lend itself to be willing to slip down moral and ethical and
27:56
sound reasoning. Yes, especially when you're doue deceitful things over and over again
28:00
with that very controlling and manipulative behavior. I've met people who have had an
28:07
affair and are truly humbled and broken by it and become a better spouse after
28:11
the fact. Like that is also very possible, But that is not someone
28:15
who is willing to continue the deceit. That's not somebody who is more important
28:19
than the person that they broke and hurt. You know. It's they put
28:23
that other person first after that, and they're able to say, I mess
28:29
up and I owe them my life for giving me another chance. You know,
28:32
that's a very different person than the one who continues to manipulate and lie
28:36
after they've been caught. Another key clue is the disability check that was inside
28:41
Evelyn's wallet when it was found later that month. Evelyn did not received that
28:45
check until she picked up her mail on the evening of me the first,
28:48
so it's reasonable to assume that if she had been alive for any length of
28:51
time on me the second she would have deposited it. Since the check and
28:55
forty dollars in cash were left in Evelyn's wallet, that would seem to indicate
28:59
that rob was not the motive for what happened to her. But it makes
29:02
you wonder why the wallet was found in that particular parking area. I mentioned
29:07
on her last episode that there are differing sources which state that this location was
29:11
two blocks away from either the limousine company were Herman worked, or a gas
29:15
station that the company often frequented. But of course that's hardly conclusive evidence that
29:19
herman was involved. But it makes you wonder if Evelyn's wallet was intentionally planted
29:25
in that parking area or if she just happened to drop it there when something
29:27
happened to her. Now, we've been critical of the media coverage of this
29:32
case, but the original police investigation wasn't handled much better, since they initially
29:37
assumed that Evelyn had left on her own to give birth to her child in
29:40
privacy because she recently had a fight with herman. Of course, that assumption
29:45
was completely ridiculous since all of Evelyn's personal belongings, including a suitcase she had
29:49
packed for her upcoming hospital state were left behind and she did not even own
29:53
a car, So where exactly was she planning to go to give birth and
29:57
how would she get there? She wasn't She wasn't going anywhere to run away
30:03
and give birth. She again, was making plans. She was fighting to
30:07
make sure to spite her own ailments as she was getting that baby to school,
30:11
and she was getting Alex situated and safe, and you know, she
30:15
had her bags packed to take to the hospital. Her passport was sitting there.
30:19
It's insane. It's absolutely insane to think that Evelyn had any intent other
30:25
than to bring another little one into the world and continue to work hard to
30:29
provide for them. It's also unfortunate that Evelyn and Alex had not been seen
30:37
for six days before they were reported missing, so crucial time and evidence may
30:42
have been lost. Since Evelyn was on disability and not working at this time,
30:48
she did not have a job to show up for, which might explain
30:52
why no one really noticed she was missing. It's a bit weird that during
30:56
her final phone call with her sister, Evelyn mentioned a baby shower she was
31:00
planning to attend, But we still have no idea who was holding the shower
31:04
and when it was supposed to take place. If the shower happened sometime between
31:08
May sec and to seventh, did no one become concerned when she didn't show
31:12
up? Of course, Hermann reported Evelyn missing on the seventh, which makes
31:18
sense since this was her due date and he claimed he had no luck getting
31:21
in touch with her. If Hermann was involved in what happened, I'm sure
31:26
he realized that it would look awfully suspicious if he didn't make any attempt to
31:30
find Evelyn on the day that she was scheduled to give birth to their son.
31:34
Hermann claimed that he last saw Evelyn on April thirtieth, when they met
31:38
at the hospital for a prenatal exam. Even though Evelyn's sister Raina said that
31:44
Evelyn was ending her relationship with Herman, she apparently told him she would still
31:48
allow him to have visitation with Fernando, so I could see why Herman would
31:52
attend this appointment even if things were not great with their relationship. But it
31:57
sounds like Herman was supporting Evelyn financially and she was going to seek additional child
32:02
support payments from him, so this could definitely be a potential motive for him
32:07
wanting to get rid of her. Oh my goodness, that's executor. I
32:10
was thinking as you were describing once she told her sister that she was going
32:15
to end things with herman, but also keep him in the child's life,
32:20
or at least allow him acts such the child's life. Immediately, I thought,
32:22
m custody of formal child support payments, or at least expected financial payments,
32:30
And that's very hard to keep from your wife. Unofficially, if herman
32:36
was taking care of Evelyn and was providing for her, was it these little
32:39
purchases that he could explain away, or was it something he could say,
32:43
oh, I bought that for business, or you know, oh that charge,
32:45
you know, you don't even don't worry about that. But if he
32:49
was ordered to pay money for that child, if she said I expect X
32:53
amount of money and he thought, oh my god, that's too much.
32:57
My wife will automatically know that money's missing, that would definitely be a motive
33:02
to silence that demand. Finances, especially finances within a marriage when you're having
33:08
an extra marital affair, that's a big it's a big scary scenario. And
33:15
I still don't understand the whole baby shower thing. It makes me wonder if
33:19
this could have been like a ploy of some sort to lure somewhere. I
33:22
mean, I don't know if Herman would have done it, but what if
33:24
he said, Oh, I have like a sister, or I have a
33:27
female friend who's going to hold a baby shower for you tomorrow, so I'll
33:30
take you there and then use this as an excuse to kill her and dump
33:32
her body. Now could it have been a friend's baby shower. Could she
33:36
had been like, Hey, I'm gonna go attend this baby shower and it
33:38
wasn't for her. Yeah, I have no idea about that, because no
33:42
one has ever come forward to confirm that, yes, Evelyn was supposed to
33:45
attend a shower this week for herself or for one of her friends. And
33:49
like we said earlier, like it's kind of surprising that when she didn't show
33:52
up that no one became concerned or attempted to record her missing. So I
33:55
still don't know if this shower actually existed. However, it's was like the
34:00
biggest stumbling block against making any sort of case against Herman is that his wife
34:04
provided him with an alibi, maintaining that he came home from work on the
34:07
evening of May the first and spent the entire night with her. Now,
34:12
of course, since Evelyn and Alex were not reported missing for six more days,
34:15
this does not clear herman, but once again says Alex did not show
34:20
up her preschool the following morning. Investigators seemed to believe that the disappearances had
34:23
to occur during a window of time when herman's whereabouts or accounting for. Of
34:29
course, you could easily assume that herman's wife lied to police and fabricated an
34:32
alibi in order to protect him. But the problem is that we know virtually
34:37
nothing about her, not even her name. We know that when Amber Fry
34:40
learned about Lacy Peterson's disappearance, she showed no hesitation about being transparent and coming
34:46
forward to share everything about her affair with Scott. By the sound of things,
34:51
herman's wife did find out about his affair with Evelyn, and he had
34:53
assured her he was ending it, But she had no idea that Evelyn was
34:58
pregnant with herman's child until she was questioned by police. If she had been
35:01
lying for herman in order to cover for him, you would think that revelation
35:06
might have been the turning point which prompted her to come clean and admit the
35:08
alibi was false, but it sounds like she continued to stand by him.
35:14
We really don't know anything about the circumstances of their marriage, so I have
35:17
no idea what kind of person Herman's wife was or if she would have been
35:21
willing to be complicit in a crime. Hell, for all we know,
35:24
Evelyn and Alex's disappearance could have been her idea to begin with, but without
35:29
any more details, that's nothing but brash speculation. If Herman's wife already knew
35:34
about his affair with Evelyn, then there would be no reason for Herman to
35:37
kill Evelyn in order to cover the whole thing up. But if she was
35:39
legitimately unaware of Evelyn's pregnancy, that might have given him the motivation. That
35:45
might have given him the motivation to take the extra step to get rid of
35:47
her, and Alex could have been nothing more than collateral damage. I guess.
35:52
One of the major issues is that the most information we know about Evelyn
35:55
and Herman's relationship was delivered second hand by Raina, and since Herman is elected
36:00
not to speak with the media, and there's no longer talking to the police.
36:05
We really can't hear his side of the story. I also have no
36:07
idea what herman has been up to these past two decades, or if he's
36:10
even still married to his wife. You know, I see a big difference
36:15
though, in amber Fry's position and in his wife's position. Like, yes,
36:19
both women were deceived, Yes both women were betrayed. Yes both women
36:22
could be married or in a relationship with a monster. But amber Fry was
36:29
truly this kind of like, what in the heck is happening? I had
36:34
this angel in my life, and all of a sudden I discover he's a
36:37
devil. And I'm pretty sure he killed his wife an unborn child after telling
36:42
me they were already dead, right, Like, it's this horrible, awful
36:45
thing. Now, herman has put his wife in a very difficult position because
36:50
he has manipulated and abused her and just kind of taken advantage of the dynamic
36:58
of having a trusting wife who believes you to be loyal and what a husband
37:02
is supposed to be. Right, She's been put in a position where she
37:07
finds out he's unfaithful and she stays, and that's a very difficult position for
37:10
a wife to be in. I cannot imagine being in that position. But
37:15
it's very possible she's financially dependent on him. It's very possible herman's reminded her
37:22
she's nobody without him, right, and that she needs him in her life
37:25
right, just quote as much as he needs her. So I could very
37:30
much see a broken, hurt woman who's trying to have integrity and society,
37:39
not just thinks she's this horrific human being herself, try to protect and believe
37:45
that herman has nothing to do with this, right, And if he went
37:49
to sleep with her, and if he woke up next to her, I
37:52
could see someone convincing themselves. I will never question whether or not he left
37:59
the bed that night. He was here when I went to sleep, he
38:00
was here when I woke up. I'm going to say that he was here
38:04
all night because I have to believe that if I'm going to survive the situation
38:07
that I've got myself into. So I don't know, I just see a
38:12
very different dynamic that would be happening there. There would be this almost if
38:15
this is all true, then what does that mean about me? I could
38:20
see that being a psychological kind of torture for his wife, if that makes
38:23
sense. Human beings are incredibly complex, and I think you brought up a
38:29
really important point, Ashley. There's a very real possibility that she was dependent
38:35
upon herman financially. And also we don't know how good her English skills were
38:39
either. We don't know anything about her because we know that Evelyn spoke very
38:45
little English. We can't assume that herman's wife was a proficient English speaker either.
38:51
Maybe she was, maybe she wasn't. But it could be further isolating
38:54
if you're then going to come to terms with the fact that he may have
38:58
done this, and you're going to tell the police this, and then you're
39:01
left to fend for yourself. Well, he's charged with murder and you've got
39:06
nobody to support you financially, and your options are limited because of a language
39:10
barrier. We don't know what she was dealing with, but there are a
39:14
myriad of reasons why somebody who is not a bad person may, in a
39:19
situation such as that, try to protect their own interests, and that's potentially
39:23
what we're seeing here. So are there other alternate scenarios which don't involve herman?
39:30
Being the perpetrator. Well, with a limited information that we have,
39:34
that's certainly possible. Another theory is that Evelyn could have been a victim of
39:38
a fetal abduction. As horrifying as that whole concept is, there are documented
39:45
cases of pregnant women being murdered and having their unborn fetus forcibly extracted from their
39:50
body through a crude cesarean section. In some of these cases, the perpetrator
39:55
turned out to be a woman who wanted a child and actually went to the
40:00
of committing murder in order to steal another woman's fetus to pass off as their
40:04
own. Of course, there's no evidence that this is what happened to Evelyn,
40:07
but since the fetus of her unborn son, Fernando, was never found,
40:12
I guess you can't completely discount the possibility. However, it's worth mentioning
40:17
that there were no signs of noticeable injuries found on Evelyn's torso, and while
40:22
her exact cause of death was never determined, it sounds like investigators have leaned
40:28
towards the idea that her body came apart in the San Francisco Bay because of
40:31
decomposition, not because she'd been cut up and decapitated. As much as I
40:37
would like to believe that Fernando was removed from Evelyn's body before she died and
40:42
that he's outliving his life somewhere under a new identity, I do think the
40:46
most likely explanation is that his fetus was separated from his mother's torso via decomposition
40:52
and is still out there in the water somewhere. It's insane for me to
40:58
think about ever in someone's life. But then when you add the fact that
41:02
whoever did this right clearly did something with Alex and that unborn child as well.
41:08
So you're talking about three human lives that were so valueless to you that
41:15
not only did you kill them, but you also then or let's we know
41:21
Evelin was killed, but you also tortured their body as well. Her torso
41:29
was found, which means she was cut in pieces. I just can't imagine
41:34
when a human loses such value to somebody. So it's so depraved, it's
41:39
so sad. I my god, in a fantasy world, I would pray
41:44
Alex and this baby or living some life with some amazing human who found them
41:50
and is raising them. That's just not the case. I think three people
41:52
lost their lives that day, and my got the fact that someone has not
41:58
been arrested in this case is horrified because who else did they hurt, whether
42:01
it was death or not. Who else did they run into that they were
42:05
so able to hurt with no regard. Well, let's talk more about Alex.
42:12
While investigators have never disclosed much about the condition of Evelyn's apartment after she
42:15
disappeared, they haven't mentioned there being any signs of forced entry, struggle,
42:20
or foul play. So I have to wonder if Evelyn or Alex left their
42:23
apartment voluntarily before something happened, even though most of their personal belongings were left
42:29
behind. Evelyn's wallet was discovered in a parking area, and her cell phone
42:32
has never been found, and those are two items she likely would have had
42:37
on her if she stepped out. It's worth noting that Alex's preschool, Juana
42:40
Vista Elementary School, is located just over three miles from the Crocker Amazon district,
42:46
but since Evelyn did not own a vehicle, it would have taken over
42:50
an hour to walk there. I get the impression that Evelyn usually took the
42:53
bus in order to drop off Alex at school, but what if someone showed
42:58
up at their place during the early more hours of me the second and offered
43:00
them a ride, and then instead of driving to the school, the perpetrator
43:05
took Evelyn and Alex to another location to harm them. If that's what happened,
43:09
that seems a lot more likely that they would have accepted a ride from
43:13
someone they knew. However, like we said numerous times already, certain details
43:17
about this case are just too vague in order to come up with a concrete
43:21
theory that implicates Herman or anyone else as being responsible for this. You know,
43:25
if Herman is innocent, I don't really blame him for not speaking with
43:30
police anymore or not speaking to the media, because, my goodness, we've
43:35
seen even throughout some of the unsolved mystery cases, Robin that you pointed us
43:39
towards, where people that likely don't have a whole lot to do with the
43:43
case still present themselves in a very questionable, bizarre way. Or they lack
43:46
of an affect that we expect them to have, they lack a grief reaction
43:51
that we expect them to have. So once you tell your story, I
43:54
could see stepping aside and saying, you know what, I told you everything
43:58
I know. I told you quote the truth, which I don't think Herman
44:01
is capable of. But if he told him, you know what he knew,
44:05
I could see anybody stepping aside and saying, you'll have to talk to
44:07
my attorney. If you're still going to have to talk to me, because
44:09
I've told you everything I know, and that's all I'm gonna say. Right,
44:14
it doesn't benefit you necessarily as an innocent person to come forward and talk
44:17
about that. And in Herman's case, the more coverage he would have on
44:22
this case is more and more disrespect to his wife. Let's say he is
44:28
innocent and he and his wife did stay together. I don't need for years
44:31
to be talking about my pregnant lover who was killed. You know. It's
44:37
like I don't know, it's this is a very complicated, messy, messy
44:42
case for every single person involved is horrific. Not every person who we likely
44:49
think is guilty is like Jewel kaylor Right. They're not out there and like
44:53
sharing everything just so confidently saying how much better their life is. I mean,
44:58
we would know more about her and if he was out there saying,
45:00
you know, my life's actually been pretty great since Evelyn went missing, but
45:05
we don't have that, So maybe he had the good sense to avoid the
45:09
media, or he's just somebody who really wanted to repair his relationship, which
45:15
I think he likely personally, my opinion, wanted to avoid the media because
45:21
if you're guilty, you're better to say nothing. We're lucky that he even
45:25
went to the police, because it looks like Evelyn didn't have a lot of
45:30
ties with English speakers who were local. Who knows how long it could have
45:34
taken if he didn't do that much, but I guess it's not surprising that
45:37
he didn't go further and like give interviews. Yeah, Like technically, I
45:43
don't know what herman Aguilare looks like. I don't think there are any photographs
45:45
of him on the internets. We don't know what his wife looks like,
45:49
we know nothing about even know her names. So they've been able to go
45:52
on living their lives for the next twenty years and obviously do not get hounded
45:58
about being potential suspect in a murder. Whereas, as a comparison, jul
46:01
Kaylor has his own personal Facebook and people spam it all the time with equal
46:06
comments. Because of that interview. He did it unsolved mysteries over thirty five
46:10
years ago, so regardless of whether he's guilty or innocent, I think Herman
46:15
definitely made the wise choice by neglecting to speak with the media. Now,
46:20
since Alex is technically still a missing person, I'd like to hold out hope
46:22
that maybe he was sold, given away, or raised by someone else.
46:27
Given the circumstances, he theoretically could have been smuggled across the border into Mexico,
46:31
which is why it's been so hard to track him down. But until
46:35
evidence emerges that he's still alive somewhere, sadly, I think it's most like
46:39
that his body was also disposed of in San Francisco Bay and has just never
46:44
been found. But if either of Evelyn's children survive, Alex and Fernando would
46:47
currently be twenty six and twenty years old, respectively. Whatever happened, this
46:52
is a horribly tragic story in which there are no less than three victims,
46:55
and it would be nice to get a resolution at some point. If you
47:00
happen to have any information on the murder of Evelyn Hernandez or the disappearance of
47:04
Alex Hernandez, please contact the San Francisco Police Department at four one three five
47:09
three one zero seven one. That's four one three, five five three one
47:15
zero seven one, Jules Ashley, any final thoughts on this case. It's
47:21
a complex one that I'm very grateful you guys decided to cover on this podcast.
47:28
It's it's one of those that hits on so many issues, right that
47:31
are bigger than Evelyn and Alex and Fernando. It's this idea of victimization of
47:38
pregnant women. It's the idea that win, secrets and manipulation occur within the
47:46
dynamics of a relationship, and when pregnancy is added into relationship, how dangerous
47:54
that becomes for all parties involved and even you know, extra extra partners who
48:00
are involved, how scary that can become. And it's also this conversation about
48:05
why Evelyn and her beautiful five year old baby and her incredible unborn child who
48:14
was weeks away from entering this world are our days away from entering this world
48:19
did not get incredible coverage of their deaths and missing status. Right would we
48:28
be talking about this case had they been the Lacy Peterson of that day,
48:35
Right, if they had been on the front cover of a newspaper, if
48:37
we had given the resources at the department to them, if the community had
48:44
been vigilant and demanded answers, if herman had been questioned more, would we
48:49
be talking about this case? I don't think so. And like I said,
48:52
I could do an hour too long podcast simply talking about the ideal victim
48:57
and the media coverage that they receive and how inaccurate and how much that misrepresents
49:04
violence in our communities. But the reality is is, how do you provide
49:09
every family and every victim with justice. How do you provide them with the
49:14
resources they deserve? Because every single one of them is someone's wife, daughter,
49:22
son, husband, brother, best friend. They're all somebody to some
49:27
body, and so we don't have the ability to solve that problem. But
49:31
could we do better as a media, as a society, Could we do
49:37
better at providing more accurate representation and utilizing the limited resource we have in a
49:44
better way. There's got to be something that we can do. And so
49:49
my heart is broken for Evelyn's family. My heart is broken at the fact
49:52
that it's likely these two little boys had their whole futures taken away from them.
50:00
Most likely, in my opinion, because of selfishness and because of a
50:04
narcissistic desire to have what one wanted right and not what was the right thing
50:12
to do. Oh man, it's one of those of my blood's got to
50:16
calm down when we stop recording, because it's inconceivable to think that this is
50:22
a reality and not just some mystery that I'm reading. It's a real case
50:27
where Evelyn lost her life, where Alex and Fernando likely lost their life.
50:30
So I guess, at the end of the day, if it be a
50:34
miracle if someone came forward with information dynamics change time does allow for answers and
50:38
cases, Man, would it be very powerful to see an arrest made in
50:43
this case. But even more than that, thank you guys for bringing attention
50:47
to these incredibly important conversations. One thing that really strikes me with this case
50:53
is, like you just said, Ash, Fernando and Alex likely lost their
50:58
lives too, even though we don't know what happened to their remains, but
51:02
personally I believe they're likely in the San Francisco Bay, just like their mother.
51:07
But what really gets me is that little Alex was a little human.
51:12
He was in this world, He was of this world and people interacted with
51:16
him, and I really wish that we knew more about him as a little
51:21
boy. I think it would add so much. And I think we know
51:24
so little of each of the individuals in this case, and that's really heartbreaking.
51:29
But I think we know so much more about Evelyn because she was an
51:32
adult. But we see this so often in cases with children, where we're
51:36
given such limited information and all we want is to be able to tell all
51:40
of you about who this little boy was and how he likely would have benefited
51:46
this world. And it's such an injustice that we have this lack of information.
51:52
That somebody decided to take him from this world before he could become an
51:55
adult and have all of those experiences like kissing a girl for the first time,
52:00
going to prom, you know, getting his first job, and the
52:05
same things were likely taken from Fernando, and that is just is so heartbreaking.
52:09
And I think that we have somebody like Herman, who we've discussed throughout,
52:15
is a destructive and potentially dangerous person. I think the walls were closing
52:20
in on him and he did something that was an act of desperation, most
52:25
likely because he wanted to keep his wife from finding out about the affair,
52:30
And we don't know if Hermann told his wife about the affair, if she
52:35
found out about the affair, and what was the timeline for that. Maybe
52:38
after he went to police he told her about the affair because he was trying
52:43
to get ahead of it, but he only told her just enough information,
52:45
not about the pregnancy. It seems that we aren't privy to those exact details.
52:51
But either way, it seems likely that the wife could have potentially given
52:54
a false alibi for a myriad of reasons, because if she is financially dependent,
53:00
she would want to continue that support and her life would change catastrophically if
53:07
she told the police they know he wasn't there or yes, he may have
53:10
potentially done this, So I can understand the reasons that would underlie a potential
53:15
decision to fabricate certain details to the police, and also maybe wanting to distance
53:22
herself from the fact that her husband could have potentially been capable of doing such
53:25
a heinous act. This is just such a travesty. I do not think
53:30
that Scott Peterson had anything to do with it, and I think the connections
53:34
to the two cases are so so tenuous and very very weak, and it's
53:38
just it breaks my heart anything that involves children and involves pregnant women and people
53:44
that are so vulnerable, they're the hardest to cover and the hardest to listen
53:47
to. Yeah, we had a lot of discussions on our episodes about the
53:52
comparison between this and the Lacy Peterson case. By one case got more media
53:57
coverage than the other. But in a way, I think one of the
54:00
silver linings is because of the tenuous connection to the Lacy Peterson case, that's
54:05
why Evelyn's story and Alex's story wound up getting any coverage at all. Because
54:08
I have a feeling that if Lacey had not been murdered nine months later,
54:13
we might not have heard of this at all, like it would have.
54:15
They probably would have reported on Evelyn's torso being found, but we would have
54:17
learned very little about her background, very little about Alex, very little about
54:22
her affair with herman So. At the very least, even though it's completely
54:27
ridiculous that Scott's defense team was trying to blame like a serial killer or a
54:31
satanic cult on murdering Lacey and Evelyn in a group of pregnant women, at
54:37
least it did put Evelyn's case on the spotlight, and that's one of the
54:39
main reasons we know about it today. But still it has gotten nowhere near
54:44
as much coverage as it deserves because we've talked about there are so many pieces
54:47
of the puzzle missing. We don't know a lot about Herman himself, We
54:52
don't know a lot about his wife, and we don't what are many details
54:54
missing about his relationship with Evelyn, And like Jules says, we don't know
55:00
much about Alex as a boy, as a person, and that's kind of
55:02
the sad thing is that this case has been out of the spotlight for many
55:06
years. We don't know Herman's current whereabouts. Police have found pretty much no
55:10
evidence at all linking to any specific suspects, and even though I do think
55:15
that Herman probably is the most likely suspect he was the one who had the
55:20
motive to murder not one, but two, but three people, there is
55:24
just nothing to officially implicate him because there was such a delay reporting Evelyn and
55:29
Alex missing, So who knows how much evidence could have been cleaned up.
55:32
I mean, maybe the big breakthrough is one day, maybe Herman's wife will
55:37
break up with him and decide to come forward. For all we know,
55:40
maybe she knows incriminating information about him that could break this case wide open,
55:45
but until that happens, it's nothing more than speculation. But it is a
55:50
horrific case because not only did Evelyn and Alex likely lose their lives, but
55:54
Fernando probably did as well before he had the chance to be born. So
55:59
we have technically one murder and two missing children who are probably dead. And
56:04
I just hope that one of these days we will get the full truth about
56:07
what happened and that all three of these victims will get justice. Robin,
56:15
do you want to tell us a little bit about the Trail Went Cold Patreon?
56:17
Yes, the Trail Cold Patreon has been around for three years now,
56:21
and we offer these standard bonus features like early ad free episodes, and I
56:25
also send out stickers and sign thank you cards to anyone who signs up with
56:30
us on Patreon. If you join our five dollar tier Tier two, we
56:35
also offer monthly bonus episodes in which I talk about cases which are not featured
56:39
on the Trail Went Cold's original feeds, so they're exclusive to Patreon, and
56:44
if you join our highest tier tier three, the ten dollars. Tier One
56:47
of the features we offer is a audio commentary track over classic episodes of Unsaw
56:53
Mysteries, where you can download an audio file and then boot up the original
56:58
Unsaw Mysteries episode on Amazon Prime or YouTube and play it with my audio commentary
57:04
playing in the background, where I just provide trivia and factoids about the cases
57:07
featured in this episode. And incidentally, the very first episode that I did
57:12
a commentary track over was the episode featuring this case. So if you want
57:15
to download a commentary track in which I make more smartass remarks about Jewel Kaylor
57:21
than be sure to join Tier three. So I want to let you know
57:23
a little bit about the Jewels and Ashley Patreons. So there's early ad free
57:28
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57:35
just too short to turn into a series, and we're really enjoying doing those,
57:38
so we hope you'll check out those. Patreons will link them in the
57:42
show notes. So I want to thank you all for listening and any chance
57:45
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57:49
review is greatly appreciate it. You can email us at the path went Chili
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57:55
So until next time, be sure to bundle up because cold trails and chilly
58:00
pass call for warm clothing. Music by Paul Rich from the podcast Cold Callers Comedy