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Resource Report 3 - First Things First · Resource Report

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Hello and welcome to Resource Report where we share with you important information about
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local nonprofits and resource organizations that support the community we share produced
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by Pathways to Agency.
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I am your host Rainmaker.
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For today's episode I spoke with Tony Bartlett of First Things First, a drug and alcohol
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rehab center across from Ralph's at 1905 4th Avenue East.
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Okay I am here at First Things First, a recovery center with Tony.
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Tony Bartlett, I'm co-owner of First Things First.
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We're an outpatient treatment center.
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We do referrals and outpatient groups, individual counseling, assessments, and alcohol and drug
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information school for those who are the court orders that they have to do the school.
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Cool, what types of recovery services do you all provide here?
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We get people into inpatient, get people into detox.
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We work closely with an agency down in Longview, Kelso and send people to inpatient and if
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need be medically monitored detox services for alcohol, fentanyl, and also benzodiazepine
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which is like Xanax.
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So what is the process if somebody comes in to receive treatment?
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What is the process that they go through?
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When someone starts the process they call, we schedule them in for a comprehensive assessment
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which is you know we look at all areas of their life and figure out their treatment
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needs and then from there it's decided that they need and especially that they want treatment.
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We try not to make anyone, it really has to be, they have to make the decision that they
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want treatment.
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That's a huge part of this.
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Then if they decide that they're ready to do some type of treatment either we'll send
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them off to inpatient services or detox if that's their need or if they are appropriate
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for an outpatient setting we do an intake, put together a treatment plan and then we
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set them in to outpatient groups.
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We offer both morning and night outpatient groups, 10 to 12 Tuesday through Thursday
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and then we have night groups from 5 to 7, 730 for those who work or one night groups.
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That's more of an educational and gives people the recovery skills that they need.
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All of our clients also do individual counseling with our experienced counselors.
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Okay, do you work with other treatment places as well?
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We do, we work with multiple inpatient facilities.
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We get people inpatient treatments if they have private insurance, we have places that
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we can send them like Discovery Recovery and then if it's Apple Health which is state
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insurance we primarily work with college family but we have sent people to Prosperity, Kitsap
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Recovery and anywhere where we can get them a bed.
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It's our goal to get someone from setting their appointment into treatment within 7
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days.
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The window can close very quickly with an addict and if they want help we want to facilitate
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this in a quick manner before something happens and they change their mind because this can
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be life or death.
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Tell me about the kinds of people, the different kind of people that you have, the different
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types of recovery that you all work with.
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We work with all types but generally what we see here and I think in most treatment
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centers now are people that are court ordered from DUIs.
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It can be a drug or an alcohol DUI, they're sent here to the courts, they're ordered
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to do an assessment and when I first started I've been a counselor for 14 years now.
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Drugs were also, the court was ordering people into treatment for drugs but today we rarely
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see if ever anyone that's court ordered for drugs.
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They've kind of closed the eyes and they let that one know, people are no longer court
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ordered for drugs.
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Do you know anything about that, like why that might be?
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There was a law, it's called the Blake law and they decriminalized or I don't know if
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it's decriminalized, they quit charging people with possession of substances.
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Okay, okay.
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When you're talking about laws, there's the WAC laws, W-A-C, regarding food assistance
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for individuals residing in drug treatment centers.
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Does it work any differently for your clients, like if they're residing at home?
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Yeah, definitely if they're in our outpatient it would not affect their food stamps.
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I have been a counselor for 14 years so I know when people go to inpatient often there's
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something with the food stamps but yeah we have no, and most of our clients when they
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first begin treatment are getting food assistance which is great so it's very much needed in
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this day and age.
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Things are very expensive.
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Yeah, how aware do you think your clients are about being able to receive that assistance
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and how easy is the process?
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I think that most of them already are receiving them when they come here.
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80% of our clients are on Apple Health which is the state insurance so therefore they are
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already been looked at and seeing if they're eligible for food assistance.
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How do you work with Medicaid?
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How does the billing work?
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Medicaid works, it goes through our system.
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They're actually, out of all the insurance companies that we work with, Medicaid is by
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far the best.
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They pay their bills.
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They get into large private insurances and they want to deny, delay, and defend and they
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are very slow if they pay their bills at all.
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Medicaid has been wonderful to work with.
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It's the only reason that we're still open.
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Oh wow, wow that's amazing to hear.
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Good to know.
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Yeah they're doing well.
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Yeah.
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What about people that don't have Medicaid?
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For those, either if they have the ability to pay cash, they do.
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We have several programs that we work with.
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The Thurston County BHO has provided us funding and we've had many people that have come through
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and people that are on Medicare, people that do not have insurance, and the county has
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helped us pick them up or we will set a sliding scale for anyone that needs.
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Okay right on.
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What does the sliding scale look like?
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It's per the group and it's set depending on their wages.
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So it's like based on your income?
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So you'd fill out a form?
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Yeah we do have something.
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Then once the forms filled out, we turn that over to the Thurston and Mason behavioral
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health and they will decide if they will fund them through treatment.
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Okay.
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How do they decide?
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I'm not the financial person.
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My partner Lisa does most of that.
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But it's on income, house size.
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Okay.
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You mentioned before alcohol and drug information school at one point.
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Right.
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Yeah, can you tell me about that?
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It's an eight hour class that we teach once a month.
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People with their first driving under the influence are more often than not ordered
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by the court to go through that school.
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And these are the people that we feel do not need full on drug treatment, but they could
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benefit from information and education on the disease of addiction and the progressive
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nature of addiction.
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Yeah.
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How long does that program take?
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It's a one day class.
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Oh, that's it.
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Yeah.
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And then we also do a victims impact panel where we have either community members or
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we use videos from Mothers Against Drunk Driving to really get people to look at the impact
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they can have on others from their drinking and driving or their drugging and driving.
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We're seeing an increase in cannabis DUIs recently.
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Interesting.
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Yeah.
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Can you tell me more about the different programs?
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What they look like?
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We have intensive outpatient.
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It meets three times a week.
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They're two and a half hour classes.
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They're educational.
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You know, it has a lot of education on the disease of addiction, the progressive nature,
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building healthy coping skills, how to deal with guilt and shame.
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Recently, you know, a lot of our focus has been on the holidays and building relapse
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prevention plans for the alcoholic and the addict to get through the holidays without
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returning to their old coping skill, which was drugs and alcohol.
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And, you know, relapse prevention is a huge part.
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We do seeking safety, which is a program and it deals with PTSD and trauma for those who
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may have that, which is most of our clients.
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And we have an outpatient group also, and it meets up to two times a week.
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It has more education, but it's specific on relapse prevention and, you know, looking
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at different scenarios and educating them and just giving them the tools to recover.
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So I had gone a little while back and interviewed you for my class, and I remembered we were
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in a different room and there are some drawings that were put up.
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Absolutely.
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Yeah, can you tell me about that?
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That's art therapy.
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That's one both me and Lisa do.
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We gave them the supplies and had them do two.
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One was their recovery and one was their addiction and they made different pictures out of it.
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Yeah, and tell me about the experiences that your clients have had doing the art therapy.
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It gets the left side of the brain, so, you know, and it really makes it clear the difference
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between recovery and addiction.
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And especially when you're doing an art type of therapy, change often happens in the left
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side of the brain.
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It taps into that ability to visualize, you know, yourself and what's going on so that
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you can see it, then it makes it more real to you.
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Absolutely.
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You know, one of the things that we really stress here is changing external motivation,
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which someone led you into treatment.
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It might have been the court, it might have been, you know, your husband, your wife, whoever,
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and then really getting the client to see the benefit of a program of recovery and making
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the choice for themselves and seeing their lives changed for the positive and saying,
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wow, that was then, this is now.
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And one of the terms that we use is the price of admission, you know, because every person
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has choice and once they leave treatment, you know, they're going to do, you know,
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whatever they choose.
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But with that comes consequences, both negative and positive.
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So really it's called motivational interviewing where we lead them to see the decision and
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make it for themselves rather than tell them, you need to do this, you need to do this.
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It's like, no, what I want to do as a clinician, and I use a lot of motivational interviewing,
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is to them to see the good and the less goods of their addiction.
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You know, we don't even call it bad when we're using motivational interviewing because,
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you know, it's their decision and what they see is their own perception and their own
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reality.
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You know, so if we can really get them to see how their life is changing in a positive
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direction, and it always does once, you know, a substance is taken over your life, is, you
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know, you get that out.
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It's kind of a no-brainer where things are going to get better.
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Yeah, leading them to an objective view of themselves without judgment.
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Absolutely.
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That's so important.
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Right, and you know, one of the things too we stress here at First Things First is community,
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just getting the people to work together.
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We have a lot of people that go to meetings together.
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You know, we have, you know, like on Christmas, we're going to have a Christmas brunch here,
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you know, where, you know, no one has to come.
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You know, it's not even part of treatment or anything.
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There'll be no attendance taken or anything, but, you know, me and a couple clients are
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going to get together and we're going to make a really nice breakfast.
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We started this last year and for so many people, it was the highlight of their day
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because they didn't have anywhere to do breakfast, and that just fosters a sense of community
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and knowing that you're not doing this alone because boredom and loneliness is a huge part
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of the addictive process.
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And then, you know, people will tend to, you know, if they feel part of something, they
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will not be willing to give up that recovery.
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Absolutely.
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Absolutely.
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Why do you think some people do not go for treatment?
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I think that, you know, it becomes the norm.
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It becomes their identity.
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You know, it is their coping skill.
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To give up your coping skill when things go good, when things go bad, and, you know, many
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of them were raised in an addictive family unit, and it becomes their norm.
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And a lot of people think that recovery isn't possible.
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And, you know, we have a very strong recovery community in Olympia.
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What are some barriers that you've seen that people have to receiving treatment?
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For me, it's been one of the biggest barriers.
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You know, there are clean and sober houses here in Olympia, but most of them are filled
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up and the ability to afford housing, the cost of rent in Olympia, it is not definitely
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not, it's not good at all.
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Prices are really inflated on rent and if you can't have that safe environment, it's
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really hard to recover.
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Absolutely.
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You know, if you're living in a house full of people that are drinking and using and
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you're trying recovery, it's nearly impossible.
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You know, that's one of the first things that we treat.
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The environment, for so many people, you know, they don't have that safe environment.
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You can't say, well, you need to, you know, move out of there if that's their only housing
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and that's how they're staying warm or that's their shelter.
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You know, but, you know, having that environment has been one of the biggest barriers since
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I've been a counselor.
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How do you support people in changing that environment?
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We, you know, we definitely access any programs that we have.
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There's several housing programs.
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You know, one in particular is HARPS and, you know, they'll pay for people that just
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got out of inpatient treatment.
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For many years, they used to send people to inpatient treatment and they would go back
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to the same environment and the relapse rate was, you know, at about 90 percent because,
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you know, if you send someone right back to the same environment, everyone in the household
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is drinking and using and it comes down to willpower, you know, that's a tough thing.
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Yeah, peer pressure is a big deal.
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It really is.
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Yeah, and drugs and alcohol are not cheap either.
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You're spending your money on that.
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It's hard to save for housing.
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Right.
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Yeah.
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And, you know, before those coping skills and recovery skills are taught and developed,
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you know, it doesn't happen overnight.
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Yeah, yeah.
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It takes time.
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What's the longest recovery time and the shortest recovery time you've seen?
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I'm in recovery myself.
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I'll have 25 years in February.
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Congratulations.
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Thank you.
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And my sponsor, Doug, he has 40 years and the shortest time, you know, can be a day.
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We had a gentleman and I certainly won't say names, but, you know, he went to inpatient
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a couple weeks back or a couple months or about a month back.
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He got out and he did not have housing and was living in his car and eventually he started
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drinking again.
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So, you know, it's that environmental part that is huge and he's back there now.
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You know, we sent him back the other day.
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He's going to do another 30 days and we're really going to try to focus on getting him
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into housing.
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You know, once he got out, we tried.
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You know, he says, oh, I'm fine in my car and, you know, we're like, well, let's look
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into Oxford Housing or other clean and sober housing options.
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He says, well, I really want my own place and didn't have the money.
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So he stayed in his car and eventually, you know, was alone and made a choice to drink.
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But you know, the thing is, is he came back here.
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He felt safe here and, you know, we're going to get him the help that he needs.
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What is the size of your groups?
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They're 10 to 12 people.
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10 to 12 people.
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So you don't like that's like your cap and then you have another group.
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We're capped at 16.
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16.
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Yeah.
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But rarely do we get to that number.
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Oh, okay.
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We want to keep it where, you know, one clinician can run the group effectively.
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Yeah.
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If you have 16 people, it's really tough.
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How many clinicians do you have here?
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We have two and a trainee.
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Yeah.
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She's just at the beginning.
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She's been in school for the last six months and she just has applied for her training
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license.
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We'd like more, but economically we can't do it at this time.
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Yeah.
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I remember you've told me before that y'all have Narcan here.
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Can you talk about that?
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We have it in case we need it.
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We talk about it also in alcohol and drug information school.
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And, you know, anyone that wants one or needs one, we'll give it to them.
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You know, we've been getting it from a gal from the street outreach and yeah, it's definitely
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necessary.
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It's a very good thing, you know, and we have it and, you know, we haven't had to use it
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yet, but it's there.
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Right on.
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Like anybody needs Narcan just can come on in and just get some.
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We're not going to go that far, but, you know, any of our clients that want it or anything,
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we don't want just, you know, people, you know, we have just a limited supply of it.
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But if someone came in and wanted some, yeah, they would say, I'm worried about my son or
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my daughter or my husband.
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You know, I would certainly, you know, we, you know, definitely give it to them.
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Yeah.
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And I think it's truly about keeping people alive until we can get them the help that
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they need.
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Absolutely.
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Everyone is someone's son or daughter and they matter and people are dying and it's,
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you know, I've been doing this for 14 years and at first, you know, and they would say,
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well, you're going to die if you keep doing it.
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And now with fentanyl, people truly are dying and all over the place.
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You know, I've recently, you know, known three people that have passed myself that we do
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recover, you know, that's the thing.
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And like I said, Olympia does have a very strong recovery community.
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We have a new Alano club on 10th and East side where, you know, they start at seven
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o'clock in the morning.
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You know, there's meetings throughout the day.
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There's online meetings.
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There's NAA, you know, and recovery is strong, but so is the disease.
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And you know, that's the thing that we're, you know, we're trying to do as an agency
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is get these people to join the recovery community because strangely enough, in addiction, that's
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a community also.
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And that's, you know, there's all kinds of communities about all kinds of things.
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It's finding what community you're drawn to and what community you need to be in.
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All of our employees are in recovery.
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You know, Mary, you know, she's really the face of that.
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Mary and Judy, they greet people in and they treat them kindly because they've been there
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themselves.
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Yeah.
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And then our other front desk person, Judy, she's many, many years in recovery.
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She's, you know, once retired and she came here to be a guest speaker in a group and
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we were like, we need to hire you.
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You are wonderful.
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And we, you know, she's like, okay.
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So she works three hours a day.
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She's in her mid seventies and she's a firecracker and everyone just loves her.
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She's like a grandma.
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You know, she, you know, and just someone walks in.
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You know, they don't want to be met and felt judged.
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You know, it's, you know, that was one of the things that I know we do well.
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It's like, Hey, I've been there.
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And you know, this is what we did.
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This is how we, you know, do this still, you know, come join our community.
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Tell me about the speakers, getting guest speakers.
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You know, we do have a guest lecturers come in and they're from different walks of recovery.
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You know, we have people from different fellowships.
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We've had Alan on command, had AA speakers.
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We've had NA speakers.
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We've had just a variety and it kind of breaks it up.
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And you know, people hearing other people's journey and recovery, we find that's very
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therapeutic.
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Yeah.
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Knowing that it's, you're not the only one and there's, it's relatable.
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Yeah.
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Do you, do y'all do like zoom meetings at all for any?
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No, we do not.
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If inclement weather were to happen, we would do zoom meetings.
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If we ended up in a snowstorm.
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We did zoom during the pandemic and you know, that was full time zoom, but we find it far
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more therapeutic and having that hands on approach of building that community.
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If people are in the same room together.
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Definitely.
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Yeah.
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In person, it's, it's, it's a different vibe.
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Yeah.
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It is.
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How do you work with the department of corrections or the court system?
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What we do is we have to have a release of information to even talk to them because they
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hit the laws, which is privacy laws.
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And then we send them with the permission of the client.
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We send them the information that we gathered from the assessment and then our recommendations
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and then we send out monthly reports to let them know.
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And that, you know, there, there can also be an incident report rules.
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We wouldn't wait the whole month if someone quit coming or something like that, because
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we are mandatory reporters, you know, once there's a release of information filed.
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So we deal with them, you know, send those reports out and occasionally we'll talk with
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them if need be, you know, someone's struggling or even if someone's doing well, we'll let
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them know, hey, we have a few department of corrections people that are, there's four
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of them that came in right around the same time and they're about ready to graduate.
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January 5th, there's four of them that are graduating and they're all doing well.
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They've had clean UA's since they've been here, just doing excellent and have blended
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right into our community and their perception and attitude is certainly really good.
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That's fabulous.
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Yeah, it's really good.
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They're on the reentry program, GRE.
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Yeah.
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Yeah.
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Tell me a little bit of history.
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So how is it that you were here doing what you were doing and how did you get here?
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Okay, so for 20 years I was a roofer and in February of 2000 I got clean and sober, you
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know, continued to roof and then I decided that I wanted to go back to school and get
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a degree.
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It was something that I'd always wanted to do.
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So I was in early recovery and started taking the placement test and, you know, I had a
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few of them in a row come back that I should be a counselor.
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So I went to Pierce College and got started.
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I went to school for two years to become a counselor.
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I learned a lot of things that I never would have known, you know, just as an addict in
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recovery, you know, all the therapeutic tools and became a counselor.
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I was a trainee counselor out in Shelton.
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Was it just for recovery counseling or just general like psychological kind of counseling?
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It was drug and alcohol.
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I did take mental health classes but I never got a degree in it, you know, which, you know,
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helps, you know, to be able to see the signs.
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But you know, I'm not a mental health counselor.
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Just drugs and alcohol.
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It was a two-year class.
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Went to work as a trainee.
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I worked for a couple years out in Shelton.
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Finished 2,500 hours worth of training and took the state test and went to work for Department
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of Corrections for a year inside the prison system.
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And then I went to work for six more years at an agency called Pierce County Alliance.
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Very big treatment provider out of Pierce County and they also run the Thurston County
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Drug Court Program.
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I worked in Thurston County and Pierce County as a drug court counselor and was able to
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start an in-custody jail program there that's still running today.
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And then the opportunity came up to purchase a treatment agency in Olympia.
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It was just after the pandemic.
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I hated to drive to Tacoma every day.
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And so decided to go all in and bought First Things First.
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It had been here before.
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Was able to hire a lady that I worked with who I thought was the best counselor I ever
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worked with.
31:55
She was working out in Shelton for an agency.
31:57
Is that Lisa?
31:58
It is Lisa.
32:00
And together, you know, we put together, you know, what we thought was effective.
32:06
Between the two of us, we're both 14 years.
32:08
We started as trainees together and have built a really, what we feel is a really strong
32:15
program.
32:16
We're both extremely experienced counselors.
32:21
You know, we're both clinical supervisors, which doesn't mean a whole lot other than
32:25
we can supervise new people.
32:28
And it means also not only have we put in all of our training hours past the state test,
32:35
we've also have another 10,000 hours worth of experience.
32:40
So you know, what you're going to get here at First Things First is experienced counselors
32:45
that have been through it.
32:47
Absolutely.
32:48
There's different approaches, but I know if I had open heart surgery, I would certainly
32:56
want to have someone who's went through medical school operating on me.
33:22
I remember in the previous interview with you, you said how long First Things First
33:28
was here before you got here and it was like a mess.
33:32
It was, yeah, definitely.
33:34
It was definitely a different type of treatment center, you know.
33:42
Yeah.
33:43
And it was, I'm trying to choose the right words.
33:49
I think a mess might be that.
33:52
Yeah.
33:53
Yeah.
33:54
And how long, so it was here for a good while before you got it.
33:58
Correct.
33:59
Yeah.
34:00
I think there were times along the way where it was a decent little treatment center and
34:05
just changes in staff and whatnot.
34:09
But we have totally revamped everything.
34:11
Yeah.
34:12
And you know, took our experiences from, you know, working at big agencies and have built
34:18
a nice little treatment center here.
34:21
And how long have you been here now?
34:23
It'll be three years.
34:26
I took over the day after New Year's three years ago.
34:31
Wow.
34:32
Yeah.
34:33
So you're coming up on your third, fourth?
34:36
Third year.
34:37
Third year.
34:38
Yeah.
34:39
So that's important to know because I'm sure that, you know, word of mouth and there are
34:44
people who might like have this idea about this place because of before.
34:49
Right.
34:50
And haven't heard yet that it's new management, new people.
34:55
Yeah.
34:56
So that's important.
34:57
And that has certainly happened.
34:58
The phone rings off the hook.
34:59
We're, you know, we're extremely busy and a lot of it is word of mouth.
35:05
Yeah.
35:06
So any business, word of mouth is the best advertisement you'll ever get.
35:29
You've mentioned outreach patients.
35:31
Do you, do you do home visits at all?
35:34
No, we do not.
35:35
You're not yet?
35:36
No.
35:37
You're not yet?
35:38
No.
35:39
So that's part of, you know, just being a licensed counselor is, you know, the outside
35:46
relationships is not encouraged for a counselor.
35:50
Right.
35:51
You know, especially going to their house or anything.
35:54
Right.
35:55
There's that transference.
35:56
You bet there is.
35:57
Yeah.
35:58
Are you, are you by appointment only?
36:01
Are you drop in?
36:02
Both?
36:03
By appointment only.
36:04
Yeah.
36:05
But one of the things we do is we definitely try to get people in within a week of calling.
36:13
Like I said earlier in the interview, the window of opportunity closes and someone calls
36:21
and says, today they say I need help.
36:24
Well, I can see you January 22nd.
36:27
Yeah, I know.
36:28
By the time January 22nd rolls around, usually they're on to something else or possibly they
36:41
might be dead.
36:44
It feels good to help others.
36:45
It does.
36:46
It does.
36:47
I'm doing what I'm doing.
37:06
And you know, when I got cleaning, my journey began.
37:13
I was living in my truck.
37:17
I went to DSHS and I asked for help.
37:20
DSHS sent me to all places.
37:23
The place where I send people now, at the time it was called DAPC, but now it's Callen's
37:28
Family.
37:29
They sent me down there and it changed my life.
37:34
Now I get to help people much in the manner that I was helped.
37:38
It feels good.
37:39
Pain forward.
37:40
It truly does.
37:41
Absolutely.
37:42
When things come on, someone who's been struggling is the most rewarding thing ever.
37:48
It ain't about money.
37:50
Yeah.
37:51
You know, what we do is we help people.
37:53
Yeah.
37:54
Tell us who you are.
38:01
Oh, I'm Mary.
38:14
Mary.
38:15
Yeah.
38:16
Yeah, the receptionist.
38:17
The receptionist.
38:18
And soon to be trainee.
38:22
And we're going to train her for a year while she finishes up school.
38:27
We're not going to push her into it.
38:29
And you know, when she's ready to start as a counselor, she's going to be an excellent
38:34
one.
38:35
I think so.
38:36
Yeah.
38:37
She'll have a couple of years of experience before she starts.
38:41
She's pretty spectacular.
38:42
Well, I graduated and they couldn't get rid of me.
38:46
I just stayed around.
38:49
And this is what worked for her.
38:52
Yes, I did.
38:53
And now she's going back to school to pay it forward.
38:56
Oh, yeah.
38:57
She's been to how many treatment centers?
39:00
Well, I think there's only four in Olympia.
39:03
So BHR, Northwest Resources, St. Peter's.
39:10
And then also, I know there's one more.
39:15
But yeah, for some reason, this one worked for me.
39:18
Yeah.
39:19
And it was the community part just for her.
39:22
It was a factor of when you came in here, it felt like a home.
39:26
Rather than like court order.
39:30
You know, it was more like a family and the presence of God is definitely felt here.
39:36
And where other facilities, it just seemed like they were.
39:40
Before, you know, she had been through all the court systems and anything, but that community
39:45
thing that I talk about and treating people with positive regard, treating people like
39:50
they matter.
39:51
Yeah, y'all are doing really good work here.
39:54
We try.
39:55
We really do.
39:56
Yeah, definitely.
39:57
A lot of people graduate.
40:02
Yeah.
40:03
At other facilities, there was one facility I was at for two years and I don't think I
40:23
ever was a part of a graduation until I came here.
40:27
So yeah, that is strange.
40:30
You know, having a ceremony and recognition that like actually physiologically, people
40:38
release serotonin and oxytocin for that.
40:41
You know, it gives people like this positive feeling, emotions, you know, having that recognition.
40:49
If you just get like a little card that says, congratulations, you did it, you know, that's
40:56
not the same effect as like physically having like a big to do about something.
41:03
Yeah, we have a community dinner on graduation night where, you know, people, if they can
41:09
bring in to a potluck, if not, we'll make sure that they have everything.
41:13
And then they're given a really nice certificate, a coin that says first things first on it.
41:20
And then we have a recovery plant that's in the other room and we run it and give them
41:28
a part of the plant so they can take a part of first things first home with them.
41:33
You know, that's the one thing is my job as a clinician is to get people ready for life
41:39
after treatment.
41:40
Yeah.
41:41
You know, and make sure that they have the tools that they need to be successful outside
41:46
of treatment.
41:47
Yeah.
41:48
You know, because it comes to an end then if, you know, if they're still not active
41:53
in their recovery, the chances are that they're going to return to substance use.
42:01
And you know, one of the things Mary has done real effectively and she's working with others,
42:07
you know, and all of her other treatment attempts, she shied away from AA and NA and now she's
42:15
very much a huge part of our local thing.
42:19
She's sponsoring ladies that came in struggling.
42:23
She's taken them through the 12 steps and, you know, she's part of this and she knows
42:29
if, you know, that people depend on her for recovery now.
42:35
And then if you're standing in a spot and you feel that you ain't got nothing to lose,
42:38
I might as well have a drink.
42:40
But you know, if you have that person that's like, well, you know, for example, these are
42:44
made up names, Joe and Pete need me.
42:46
I'm their sponsor.
42:47
What are they going to do if, you know, you know, so yeah, we're, yeah, working with others
42:54
is a huge part of it.
43:10
So you're not just the receptionist, Mary, you also run a group?
43:15
No, I don't.
43:17
I haven't run a group yet, but I do sponsor a couple of girls through the AA.
43:22
So you're a sponsor?
43:24
Yeah, I'm about ready to get my SUDPT, which is the trainee certification to start doing
43:30
groups and being trained.
43:32
Cool.
43:33
Yeah.
43:34
So eventually.
43:35
She's been in school for how long?
43:36
A year out of January.
43:39
You know, she initially did, looked at peer counseling, but, you know, we as an agency
43:47
think people need more experience.
43:49
Yeah, definitely.
43:50
Yeah.
43:51
Well, there's only so much you can get from a classroom.
43:55
You've got to be out there and actually doing the thing.
43:58
Right.
43:59
And the length of class, like she's been in there a year, she's learned a lot of good things,
44:03
you know, and, but to take a class that lasts a week long is not enough, you know, and there
44:08
are wonderful peer counselors out there that are really good and that's really ties into
44:15
the AA theme and everything.
44:17
And, you know, I admire what they're doing and anyone that's helping anyone I'm for,
44:21
I'm not, I'm not against peer counselors, but, you know, I just know that this thing
44:27
is very complex and people are dying.
44:31
And I, like I said earlier, if I had heart surgery, I would certainly want a surgeon
44:35
who went to medical school.
44:37
I see the peer counseling as a good thing.
44:40
Like, you know, you want to be a sponsor, that'd be something that you should, you know,
44:45
do for education-wise because it would really, really help sponsors, you know, but yeah,
44:51
definitely knowing the science of addiction is really, really important.
44:55
Yeah.
44:56
So that you know, can I help?
44:58
And also, with peer counseling, it's, a lot of it is having that self-awareness, you know,
45:05
and what your, what your capabilities and your, what your limitations are with your
45:11
own issues.
45:12
And like I said, anyone that's helping anyone I'm for.
45:16
Yeah.
45:17
You know, you know, they see a lot of people in the trenches, you know, and people that
45:23
are struggling in the tent cities and whatnot.
45:25
And you know, my hat's off to anyone that's trying to help anyone, but you know, as a
45:31
business owner and a clinician, you know, I really think that, that it's important that,
45:39
you know, like you said, that they're referred to the right people.
45:45
Mental health is, it's hard to get people into mental health.
45:49
Yeah.
45:50
You definitely don't send someone with bipolar to the police.
45:53
No.
45:54
No, that's not going to help.
45:56
And you know, and someone who's been using methamphetamine for years is slightly schizophrenic.
46:02
You know, someone who's, you know, done a large amount of methamphetamines for breakfast
46:09
and you send them to a mental health assessment is going to present as very schizophrenic or
46:15
bipolar or, you know, it's, you know, we got to get a person clean before we can figure
46:21
out what part does the mental health play.
46:24
Find out the baseline.
46:25
Right.
46:26
And you know, and we're, mental health's getting a lot of, you know, attention out there, but
46:32
we got to get them clean before we can decide.
46:35
I have a brother who has had struggles with both mental health and substance abuse.
46:41
And the second he uses substance, you know, and he likes methamphetamines and marijuana,
46:48
second that he uses them, he becomes extremely sick mentally.
46:55
But when he's clean and sober, he manages just fine.
46:59
So you know, that's one of the challenges that we have going on is co-occurring disorders.
47:07
Dealing with the environment and the mental health and quite often the mental health and
47:11
the environment are tied together.
47:13
Absolutely.
47:14
And once the substance is out of the system, a lot of people's mental health will improve.
47:21
I'm not saying that their mental health ain't real.
47:23
I know it is.
47:24
Yeah.
47:25
And you know, it needs to be dealt with, but we have to get someone clean before we can
47:32
really give an accurate diagnosis.
47:34
And you know, we don't do mental health here.
47:36
We do send them out and we know work with other clinicians.
47:57
You know, I got another guy that lives in a car and I feed him dinner most every night,
48:03
you know, because he's a big man.
48:07
He's like six foot five, about two fifty, you know, and he doesn't get enough to eat
48:13
at the mission.
48:17
You go down and you visit him?
48:19
No he comes in the group.
48:20
Oh he comes here?
48:21
Oh in the group.
48:22
Yeah.
48:23
And our leftovers from lunch, you know, we keep him for him and say hey, you know, and
48:31
he feels like family.
48:32
I've talked to his mom, you know, he put me on the phone and you know, he's from North
48:37
Carolina and his family is and he got caught up on legal charges.
48:43
And you know, he's part of our family and this is where he comes for support and he's
48:49
part of the community.
48:52
And you know, glad to have him.
48:53
He'll be here for Christmas breakfast and he'll take all the leftovers because boy can
48:58
he eat.
48:59
Yes he can.
49:00
He's over there.
49:01
He's doing really good.
49:03
Yeah he is.
49:04
Absolutely.
49:05
He's been sober now since, you know, he had a couple beers on the fourth of July but since
49:12
then, you know, he's been completely and totally sober and you know, he's working and he's
49:17
about ready to finish up and once he's done with his legal charges he's going to head
49:21
back to his family, you know, and if he takes that back with him, you know, the tools that
49:28
he's learned, he'll stay sober.
49:30
That's fabulous.
49:31
Yeah.
49:32
What would you just say to people who are hesitant to get involved in treatment?
49:55
I would tell them to really just give it a chance, come sit in even, you know, before
50:00
you get clean.
50:01
You know, come and get an assessment and meet with us.
50:05
You know, I've let people sit in on groups, you know, they fill out confidentiality forms
50:12
and kind of see what it is and every time I've ever, it's a lot like being at a college,
50:18
you know, what do you call that when you sit in on a class?
50:22
Like a seminar?
50:23
Yeah.
50:24
Or a visitor.
50:25
Yeah, we'll let them come visit and see if they want to do it.
50:29
Because this really...
50:30
Observing.
50:31
Yeah, you bet and see if they feel that it would benefit them and anyone we've ever let
50:35
sit in and there's been like four people this year, they've all decided to join group because
50:40
it's a very positive group of people.
50:44
Right on.
51:03
Is there anything else that you might think of to share?
51:08
No, not really.
51:10
Other than, you know, if you have a loved one who is struggling with this thing, it's
51:18
progressive.
51:19
It's never going to get better.
51:20
It's only going to get worse.
51:21
So if you can encourage them to, you know, give this thing a shot and, you know, come
51:31
in and see us if that's what the person wants.
51:35
You know, just pressuring someone is...
51:37
It never works.
51:39
It's stressful.
51:40
Absolutely.
51:41
Yeah.
51:42
I'm really glad to be here with you.
52:00
I really appreciate you sharing what you do here.
52:05
Everybody will be glad to know this.
52:07
Yeah.
52:08
Thank you.
52:28
I hope you enjoy today's show and my interview with Tony Bartlett and Mary at First Things
52:33
First.
52:34
First Things First is located at the corner of 4th Avenue and Fairview at 1905 4th Avenue
52:42
East across from Ralph's at the bus stop.
52:45
You can reach them at 360-338-0600.
52:52
Tune in on New Year's Day for our next show.
53:07
That's it for today's resource report produced by Pathways to Agency.
53:12
At Pathways to Agency, we are driven by the belief that everyone should have the tools
53:16
and support to achieve their goals and thrive in their communities.
53:21
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53:28
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53:47
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53:54
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53:56
Till next time and thanks for listening.