Latest / Pod Save America / Trump 2.0's Biggest Scandal Yet

Transcript

Trump 2.0's Biggest Scandal Yet · Pod Save America

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Today's presenting sponsor is SimpliSafe Home Security. As the saying goes,
• 0:03
  Speaker 1: March may come in like a lion and go out
• 0:04
  Speaker 1: like a lamb, but your home security should always be
• 0:06
  Speaker 1: steady and reliable.
• 0:07
  Speaker 2: That's how February was. February came in like a lion.
• 0:10
  Speaker 2: It was a month early this year. That's true.
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: Because it got warmer towards the end of February here
• 0:14
  Speaker 1: in Los Angeles. It was nice. And now we're back
• 0:17
  Speaker 1: into it. Either way, whether it's warm or cold, you
• 0:19
  Speaker 1: know what you need?
• 0:20
  Speaker 3: What?
• 0:20
  Speaker 1: SimpliSafe. You do. We trust SimpliSafe to keep our homes
• 0:23
  Speaker 1: safe 24-7.
• 0:24
  Speaker 3: Right, John?
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: You bet we do.
• 0:25
  Speaker 4: I set up a SimpliSafe system.
• 0:26
  Speaker 2: You customize it on the website, and then it comes
• 0:28
  Speaker 2: to your home. You set it up. You can have
• 0:29
  Speaker 2: them help you set it up, but you really don't
• 0:30
  Speaker 2: need to. You can do it yourself in a matter
• 0:32
  Speaker 2: of minutes, and then it's just completely reliable.
• 0:34
  Speaker 1: Highly recommend it. Best part? SimpliSafe's ActiveGuard outdoor protection can
• 0:38
  Speaker 1: help prevent break-ins before they happen. If someone's lurking around
• 0:40
  Speaker 1: or acting suspiciously, those agents see and talk to them
• 0:42
  Speaker 1: in real time, activate spotlights, and even contact the police
• 0:45
  Speaker 1: all before they have the chance to get inside your home.
• 0:48
  Speaker 1: No long-term contracts or cancellation fees. Monitoring plans start affordably
• 0:51
  Speaker 1: at around $ 1 a day, 60-day satisfaction guarantee, or your
• 0:54
  Speaker 1: money back. Visit simplisafe.com slash crooked to claim 50% off
• 0:57
  Speaker 1: a new system with a professional monitoring plan and get
• 1:00
  Speaker 1: your first month free. That's simplisafe.com slash crooked. There's no
• 1:03
  Speaker 1: safe like SimpliSafe. Welcome to Pod Save America. I'm Jon Favreau.
• 1:28
  Speaker 4: I'm Dan Pfeiffer.
• 1:29
  Speaker 1: On today's show, hope none of you are in the
• 1:31
  Speaker 1: market for a new car because they're about to get
• 1:33
  Speaker 1: more expensive thanks to Trump's latest tariffs. We'll talk about
• 1:36
  Speaker 1: the president's ever-expanding trade war and his new threats against
• 1:40
  Speaker 1: America's greatest foes, Canada, Europe, and Greenland, where J.D. and
• 1:46
  Speaker 1: Usha Vance are headed for a trip that no one
• 1:47
  Speaker 1: on the island seems to want. And as the administration
• 1:50
  Speaker 1: continues its campaign of terror against legal immigrants... a campaign
• 1:55
  Speaker 1: that now includes kidnapping college students off the streets and
• 1:58
  Speaker 1: more propaganda videos from the government's torture dungeon in El Salvador.
• 2:02
  Speaker 1: I'll talk to Jasmine Mooney, the Canadian actor and entrepreneur
• 2:05
  Speaker 1: who was detained by ICE for 12 days with no
• 2:09
  Speaker 1: explanation about what it's really like to get swept up.
• 2:12
  Speaker 1: It is a horrifying story. I hope you guys tune
• 2:16
  Speaker 1: in for the end for that. It is wild. You'd
• 2:20
  Speaker 1: be shocked. But first... We got to talk about the
• 2:23
  Speaker 1: continued fallout from the world's most famous group chat that
• 2:26
  Speaker 1: included some of the most powerful imbeciles on the planet
• 2:29
  Speaker 1: planning a military strike with emojis, classified information, and of course,
• 2:34
  Speaker 1: the editor of The Atlantic, Jeffrey Goldberg. Trump is apparently
• 2:38
  Speaker 1: quite frustrated with the situation, according to The Wall Street Journal,
• 2:41
  Speaker 1: but has decided he's better off handling the massive fuck-up
• 2:44
  Speaker 1: like he handles everything else.
• 2:46
  Speaker 3: Do you still believe nothing classified was shared?
• 2:49
  Speaker 5: Well, that's what I've heard. I don't know. I'm not sure.
• 2:51
  Speaker 5: You'll have to ask the various people involved. I really
• 2:53
  Speaker 5: don't know. What it was, we believe, is somebody that
• 2:57
  Speaker 5: was on the line with permission, somebody that was with
• 3:01
  Speaker 5: Mike Waltz, worked for Mike Waltz at a lower level, had,
• 3:06
  Speaker 5: I guess, Goldberg's number or called through the app. And
• 3:11
  Speaker 5: somehow this guy ended up on the call. Hexeth is
• 3:15
  Speaker 5: doing a great job.
• 3:15
  Speaker 4: He had nothing to do with this. How do you
• 3:20
  Speaker 4: bring Hegseth into it? He had nothing to do.
• 3:22
  Speaker 3: Look, look, it's all a witch hunt.
• 3:25
  Speaker 1: It's all a witch hunt. It's all a witch. It
• 3:27
  Speaker 1: always is. It's a witch hunt, but it's Mike Waltz's fault.
• 3:31
  Speaker 1: And there may have been classified information or may not,
• 3:33
  Speaker 1: but he doesn't know. But it's definitely not Hegseth's fault,
• 3:36
  Speaker 1: but it's a witch hunt. That make sense?
• 3:39
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah.
• 3:39
  Speaker 4: Clear as day.
• 3:41
  Speaker 3: So. Yeah.
• 3:43
  Speaker 1: How can you bring Hegseth into this? All he did
• 3:45
  Speaker 1: was provide a constant stream of operationally sensitive information about
• 3:48
  Speaker 1: the attacks without checking on who he was sending them to. Dan,
• 3:51
  Speaker 1: what did you make of Trump's latest comments about this
• 3:54
  Speaker 1: in the Oval on Wednesday?
• 3:56
  Speaker 4: I mean, he said a lot of words, but taken together,
• 4:01
  Speaker 4: those words mean nothing. Some people may have done it,
• 4:05
  Speaker 4: or they didn't do it, or someone called the app
• 4:06
  Speaker 4: and they accidentally ended up in it. It's pretty clear
• 4:08
  Speaker 4: he does not understand how Signal, or basically the internet works,
• 4:11
  Speaker 4: and they wish it performed. This is a guy who
• 4:13
  Speaker 4: according to at least one report I read, started texting
• 4:15
  Speaker 4: last year. That's when he took up the very sophisticated
• 4:19
  Speaker 4: communications technology known as texting.
• 4:22
  Speaker 1: I think there's this one thing that- Everything's computer now.
• 4:25
  Speaker 3: You know?
• 4:26
  Speaker 4: Everything's computer.
• 4:26
  Speaker 1: Everything's computer.
• 4:28
  Speaker 4: It has to be said that the idea that the
• 4:30
  Speaker 4: information shared by Pete Higgseth was not classified is absurd.
• 4:35
  Speaker 4: It's absolutely absurd. The details around when an attack is
• 4:39
  Speaker 4: going to start by the minute which planes are being used,
• 4:43
  Speaker 4: which weapons are being used, is the most sensitive information
• 4:45
  Speaker 4: the government has. Just like think about it this way.
• 4:47
  Speaker 4: Let's say that Jeff Goldberg, he's in this chat. He
• 4:51
  Speaker 4: gets information from Hexath and he says, I have a
• 4:53
  Speaker 4: huge story now. So he calls the Pentagon and says,
• 4:55
  Speaker 4: in between when he gets that text and when the
• 4:57
  Speaker 4: planes are set to take off in that couple hour period,
• 5:00
  Speaker 4: he says, I am going to publish this on the
• 5:03
  Speaker 4: Atlantic website right now because this is a real story.
• 5:05
  Speaker 4: The Pentagon would beg him not to do it. And
• 5:07
  Speaker 4: their argument would be that it would put the lives
• 5:09
  Speaker 4: of US troops in danger. And so this idea that
• 5:12
  Speaker 4: it's not classified or not sensitive is insane. It's an
• 5:14
  Speaker 4: insane thing to say. And it's just not credible by
• 5:18
  Speaker 4: any stretch of the imagination. And you are seeing, like
• 5:20
  Speaker 4: Trump is usually pretty supported by like the group of
• 5:23
  Speaker 4: former special forces podcasters. There's a whole media environment of
• 5:27
  Speaker 4: former special forces types, sort of embodied by Sean Ryan,
• 5:30
  Speaker 4: the guy whose podcast Trump went on during the campaign.
• 5:32
  Speaker 4: And a lot of these guys are on TikTok and
• 5:35
  Speaker 4: Instagram today saying the idea that this information is not
• 5:37
  Speaker 4: classified is impossible to fathom for anyone who has been
• 5:40
  Speaker 4: in these sorts of attacks, impossible to fathom.
• 5:43
  Speaker 1: I mean, are you saying that when the defense secretary
• 5:46
  Speaker 1: puts in the signal messaging app where the editor of
• 5:51
  Speaker 1: The Atlantic is watching the whole thing and has a
• 5:54
  Speaker 1: specific time of day and then says, in all caps,
• 5:57
  Speaker 1: this is when the first bombs will definitely drop, are
• 6:00
  Speaker 1: you saying that that's not just an expression?
• 6:04
  Speaker 4: Yes, not an expression. And also just, it is somewhat
• 6:08
  Speaker 4: funny to, or scary or whatever, that let's say that
• 6:12
  Speaker 4: someone had just gotten that information and they're like one
• 6:14
  Speaker 4: of our adversaries and they're trying to figure out where
• 6:17
  Speaker 4: the attack is coming from. The name of the group
• 6:19
  Speaker 4: chat has the target in it. It's not a mystery.
• 6:25
  Speaker 4: It's not like they think the plane's taking off in Kansas, right?
• 6:27
  Speaker 4: They're going to be able to figure it out pretty quickly.
• 6:29
  Speaker 1: And again, you know, there's a lot of, well, the
• 6:33
  Speaker 1: mission was successful and no harm, no foul. We all
• 6:35
  Speaker 1: learned a lesson and what could have happened anyway? And
• 6:38
  Speaker 1: no one was going to break into say, The problem
• 6:40
  Speaker 1: is not, like, this whole debate is signal secure or
• 6:42
  Speaker 1: signal not secure. The challenge is these people were on
• 6:45
  Speaker 1: likely their personal phones, not government phones, right? And their
• 6:50
  Speaker 1: personal phones, particularly those of them who were outside of
• 6:53
  Speaker 1: the United States at the time, are extremely vulnerable to hacking.
• 6:58
  Speaker 1: And so there are all kinds of foreign actors, state actors, individuals, whoever,
• 7:04
  Speaker 1: who have the capability to hack into your phone without
• 7:08
  Speaker 1: you even knowing that they're in your phone. Again, this
• 7:11
  Speaker 1: is the Pegasus program, especially if you're outside the United States.
• 7:15
  Speaker 1: And then once they're in your phone, they don't have
• 7:17
  Speaker 1: to hack any app. They're watching everything that's happening. So
• 7:21
  Speaker 1: there could have been someone in one of those phones...
• 7:23
  Speaker 1: hacked into one of those phones, just literally seeing everything
• 7:27
  Speaker 1: that was typed in the signal thing and getting all
• 7:29
  Speaker 1: the information about the attack.
• 7:31
  Speaker 4: And just, this is obviously, it just is, is that
• 7:34
  Speaker 4: enough of a coincidence in the world that the one
• 7:37
  Speaker 4: time they use signal on a sensitive information happens to
• 7:40
  Speaker 4: be the one time they invite Jeff Goldberg?
• 7:41
  Speaker 1: None of them are like- It's the small group. What
• 7:44
  Speaker 1: was the Hootie PC large group signal?
• 7:46
  Speaker 4: I mean, that's Facebook.
• 7:47
  Speaker 1: I don't know, it's like- Was the entire fucking staff
• 7:52
  Speaker 1: of the New York Times on there?
• 7:54
  Speaker 4: But at no point were they like, huh, first time
• 7:56
  Speaker 4: you've ever done this on Signal, or how does this
• 7:58
  Speaker 4: thing work? They all just seemed totally normal to be
• 8:02
  Speaker 4: on Signal to have this conversation, which bespeaks the larger
• 8:04
  Speaker 4: problem here.
• 8:05
  Speaker 1: Well, you might all be wondering, will anyone ever be
• 8:09
  Speaker 1: held accountable for all of this? Well, a group called
• 8:12
  Speaker 1: American Oversight is suing the administration over its use of
• 8:14
  Speaker 1: Signal to secretly communicate about official business. which you're not
• 8:18
  Speaker 1: supposed to do in the White House. That's another no-no.
• 8:21
  Speaker 1: Not supposed to communicate about classified information, secret war plans,
• 8:26
  Speaker 1: battle plans. Sorry, not a war, battle plans. Attack plan.
• 8:30
  Speaker 4: Attack plan.
• 8:31
  Speaker 1: Attack plan, right, yeah. You're also not supposed to use
• 8:37
  Speaker 1: personal phones to talk about official business because that's evading
• 8:39
  Speaker 1: the Presidential Records Act. Seems quaint now, doesn't it? But
• 8:44
  Speaker 1: clearly they're doing that. So anyway, they sued. The case
• 8:47
  Speaker 1: randomly but hilariously got assigned to Judge James Boasberg, the
• 8:51
  Speaker 1: same judge that Trump and Republicans want to impeach for
• 8:53
  Speaker 1: blocking them from jailing Venezuelans in El Salvador with no
• 8:57
  Speaker 1: due process. That judge today told them all that no
• 9:01
  Speaker 1: deleting any signal messages between March 12th and March 15th,
• 9:05
  Speaker 1: which good luck with that. I'm sure they're all deleted anyway.
• 9:09
  Speaker 1: If you want to find them all, Jeff Goldberg has
• 9:11
  Speaker 1: them and now all of us do too. A few
• 9:13
  Speaker 1: Republican politicians seem unhappy about about the Signal scandal. Senator
• 9:18
  Speaker 1: Roger Wicker, the chairman of the Armed Services Committee, joined
• 9:20
  Speaker 1: with ranking member Jack Reed to request an expedited investigation
• 9:24
  Speaker 1: by the Defense Department inspector general. Does that person still exist?
• 9:28
  Speaker 1: I don't know if they do. I thought that Trump
• 9:30
  Speaker 1: fired all the inspector generals, so maybe that'll be a
• 9:31
  Speaker 1: challenging investigation to conduct. Lisa Murkowski is saying that she's
• 9:36
  Speaker 1: quite concerned. You got some random, you know, like you said,
• 9:40
  Speaker 1: MAGA pundits and supporters who are out there saying, I
• 9:44
  Speaker 1: don't know about this one. I think they fucked up
• 9:46
  Speaker 1: and they should just admit they fucked up. But most
• 9:49
  Speaker 1: of Trump world is trying to blow this off as
• 9:53
  Speaker 1: a whole lot of nothing. Let's listen.
• 9:56
  Speaker 6: Nobody's texting war plans. I noticed this morning out came
• 10:00
  Speaker 6: something that doesn't look like war plans. And as a
• 10:05
  Speaker 6: matter of fact, they even changed the title to attack plans.
• 10:08
  Speaker 7: If you want to talk about classified information, talk about
• 10:11
  Speaker 7: what was at Hillary Clinton's home that she.
• 10:13
  Speaker 3: Was trying to bleach bit.
• 10:14
  Speaker 7: Talk about the classified documents in Joe Biden's garage that
• 10:18
  Speaker 7: Hunter Biden had access to.
• 10:20
  Speaker 3: Should the defense secretary and the vice- Wait, what country
• 10:22
  Speaker 3: are you from?
• 10:23
  Speaker 1: From the UK.
• 10:23
  Speaker 3: Okay, we don't give a crap about your opinion and
• 10:26
  Speaker 3: your reporting. Why don't you go back to your country
• 10:28
  Speaker 3: where you have a major migrant problem?
• 10:31
  Speaker 8: I mean, I don't mean to be pedantic here, but
• 10:32
  Speaker 8: how did the number- Have you ever had somebody's contact
• 10:35
  Speaker 8: that shows their name and then you have somebody.
• 10:38
  Speaker 4: Else's number there? Oh, I never make those mistakes.
• 10:40
  Speaker 3: Right?
• 10:40
  Speaker 8: You've got somebody else's number on someone else's contact. So
• 10:44
  Speaker 8: of course I didn't see this loser- in the group.
• 10:46
  Speaker 8: It looked like someone else. Now, whether he did it
• 10:48
  Speaker 8: deliberately or it happened in some other technical mean is
• 10:52
  Speaker 8: something we're trying to figure out. So your staffer did
• 10:55
  Speaker 8: not put his contact information, but how did it end
• 10:59
  Speaker 8: up in your phone?
• 11:01
  Speaker 4: That's what we're trying to figure out.
• 11:04
  Speaker 1: Even Laura Ingram is like, uh, what?
• 11:07
  Speaker 4: So I don't understand what he's saying there. Is he
• 11:09
  Speaker 4: saying that he put Jeff Goldberg's number under someone else's initials, JG,
• 11:15
  Speaker 4: who he was going to invite to the group chat?
• 11:18
  Speaker 1: It's fucking preposterous. I know this is like a small
• 11:20
  Speaker 1: thing because he's just lying and we're just like, they
• 11:22
  Speaker 1: all lie. They don't even try to lie well anymore
• 11:26
  Speaker 1: because they feel like they don't have to. That's really
• 11:28
  Speaker 1: where we're at right now. The lies have never been great.
• 11:31
  Speaker 1: They've never been great liars, but now they're barely trying.
• 11:34
  Speaker 1: So that was Mike Waltz himself, that last clip on
• 11:37
  Speaker 1: Laura Ingraham. And yeah, I guess what he's trying to
• 11:39
  Speaker 1: say is sometimes... You put a number in your phone
• 11:43
  Speaker 1: and you mean to name it one person and then
• 11:47
  Speaker 1: you accidentally name it another person with the same initials?
• 11:50
  Speaker 1: It doesn't make any sense. Is it accidental or maybe
• 11:53
  Speaker 1: Jeff Goldberg figured out how to do this? Jeff Goldberg
• 11:58
  Speaker 1: hacked into the phone and made Mike Waltz add himself
• 12:02
  Speaker 1: to the group? What is going on? So just to
• 12:06
  Speaker 1: go back, the first voice we heard, that was Pete Hegseth,
• 12:09
  Speaker 1: really leaning on It was it was attack plans, not
• 12:12
  Speaker 1: war plans. That was Pam Bondi, the attorney general of
• 12:16
  Speaker 1: the United States, whose job it is to investigate potential
• 12:20
  Speaker 1: violations of the Espionage Act, of mishandling of classified information,
• 12:25
  Speaker 1: any kind of crimes involving classified information, and has basically
• 12:28
  Speaker 1: said she will not be investigating, which I guess no
• 12:31
  Speaker 1: one is surprised by. But, you know, in the past,
• 12:34
  Speaker 1: that's what the attorney general is supposed to do, even
• 12:36
  Speaker 1: if it has to do with White House employees.
• 12:38
  Speaker 4: Did that happen? Two years ago, when Merrick Rowland was
• 12:41
  Speaker 4: attorney general, he appointed a special counsel to investigate Joe Biden,
• 12:43
  Speaker 4: his boss, for the misuse of information.
• 12:46
  Speaker 3: Yes.
• 12:46
  Speaker 1: Right, right. Or, I don't know, when James Comey, the
• 12:50
  Speaker 1: FBI director, investigated Hillary Clinton under the Obama administration.
• 12:54
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 12:54
  Speaker 1: Remember that?
• 12:55
  Speaker 4: I do. I do. That's why we're in this situation
• 12:57
  Speaker 4: to begin with.
• 12:58
  Speaker 1: But now.
• 13:00
  Speaker 1: Thanks, Jim. And now we're here. Yeah, so now we
• 13:04
  Speaker 1: don't even... There's not even like a... oh, of course,
• 13:06
  Speaker 1: of course the Attorney General's not even going to investigate
• 13:08
  Speaker 1: this because the Attorney General is not an independent actor anymore.
• 13:12
  Speaker 1: The Attorney General is just a Trump flunky. That's it.
• 13:15
  Speaker 1: So that's done. And then there was Marjorie Taylor Greene, wonderful,
• 13:19
  Speaker 1: wonderful lady, telling a BBC reporter to go back to
• 13:22
  Speaker 1: their country. So that was cool. And then, of course,
• 13:25
  Speaker 1: we heard Mike Waltz. So as for how this loser
• 13:28
  Speaker 1: got on the group chat, it's now come to light
• 13:30
  Speaker 1: through Waltz's public Venmo feed that he.
• 13:34
  Speaker 1: That he has several other journalists on his phone, including
• 13:37
  Speaker 1: Judith Miller and Brianna Keillor from CNN, which MAGA World
• 13:41
  Speaker 1: is not at all happy about. This is what has got,
• 13:45
  Speaker 1: not the classified info on the Signal chat, not including Jeff,
• 13:50
  Speaker 1: like it is the fact that it was Jeff Goldberg
• 13:52
  Speaker 1: and some of these unsavory fake journalists that hate MAGA.
• 13:57
  Speaker 1: That's what they're mad about, that Mike Waltz might know them,
• 13:59
  Speaker 1: even though he's pretending not to know them. What do
• 14:01
  Speaker 1: you make of the Republican reaction so far?
• 14:03
  Speaker 4: So let's separate the White House reaction from the broader
• 14:06
  Speaker 4: MAGA world. The White House reaction, not just Trump, but
• 14:09
  Speaker 4: the way the entire Trump administration is handling this, Pete Hegseth,
• 14:13
  Speaker 4: Pam Bondi, everyone else, is they are teaching a masterclass
• 14:17
  Speaker 4: in how to fuck up a communications crisis. This is
• 14:22
  Speaker 4: such an obvious mistake. You can't discuss sensitive war plans
• 14:26
  Speaker 4: on a group chat. You can't discuss them, as you
• 14:29
  Speaker 4: pointed out, when you're in Russia like Steve Witkoff was.
• 14:31
  Speaker 4: And you really can't deal with Jeff Goldberg. So there's
• 14:34
  Speaker 4: no justification for it. And any normal administration, any normal
• 14:39
  Speaker 4: person would say, we messed up. We learned our lesson.
• 14:43
  Speaker 4: We're going to do everything we possibly can to make
• 14:44
  Speaker 4: sure it doesn't happen again. End of story. And if
• 14:47
  Speaker 4: they did that and promised to do this inspector general investigation,
• 14:51
  Speaker 4: is going to look at it, we're going to look
• 14:52
  Speaker 4: into the use of signal across the government, this story
• 14:55
  Speaker 4: would be over. but they can't do that. To say
• 14:59
  Speaker 4: you were wrong is a sign of weakness and disloyalty
• 15:03
  Speaker 4: in Trump's world. And so no one does it. So instead,
• 15:05
  Speaker 4: they're just like making up insane things, right? As you said,
• 15:08
  Speaker 4: making up conspiracy theories about how Jeff Goldberg got into
• 15:10
  Speaker 4: their phone, like hoaxes, gaslighting, the White House, the White
• 15:15
  Speaker 4: House communication, litigating the difference between a war plan and
• 15:19
  Speaker 4: an attack plan, right? And then on top of that,
• 15:22
  Speaker 4: This is, when you want to know what happens when
• 15:25
  Speaker 4: you appoint Fox News pundits to run your government, you
• 15:29
  Speaker 4: get what Pam Bondi and Pete Hegseth did there. Bringing
• 15:32
  Speaker 4: up the bleach bit, as if she is guest hosting
• 15:34
  Speaker 4: on The Five this week, what are we doing?
• 15:37
  Speaker 1: I mean, I think it is something even darker, which
• 15:40
  Speaker 1: is that they just don't care. And the reason they
• 15:43
  Speaker 1: don't care is because they no longer fear accountability. they're not,
• 15:48
  Speaker 1: they don't fear accountability from Congress because Republicans control Congress
• 15:51
  Speaker 1: and Republicans in Congress have shown that almost to a
• 15:55
  Speaker 1: person with a very few exceptions, they will do literally
• 15:59
  Speaker 1: anything Donald Trump asked them to do. Um, they are
• 16:02
  Speaker 1: in the middle of defying court orders. We'll talk about
• 16:06
  Speaker 1: that in a bit around immigration. They have, you know,
• 16:10
  Speaker 1: bullied the press into submission, law firms, colleges, and they
• 16:16
  Speaker 1: know that, you know, uh, about 40% of the country
• 16:19
  Speaker 1: is going to be with them no matter what the
• 16:21
  Speaker 1: fuck they do. And then a good chunk of the
• 16:24
  Speaker 1: rest of the country is either not paying that close
• 16:26
  Speaker 1: attention or that's it. And then there's just us.
• 16:31
  Speaker 4: I agree with that. Obviously, I agree with your assessment
• 16:35
  Speaker 4: of the reality of the world. They're acting scared. There's
• 16:40
  Speaker 4: flailing happening here. And it's because the White House is
• 16:42
  Speaker 4: handling this poorly. So then all the congressional Republicans are
• 16:44
  Speaker 4: doing after they look like idiots. trying to parrot these
• 16:48
  Speaker 4: talking points. You can even see some of the congressional
• 16:50
  Speaker 4: Republicans I saw a clip, I think it was from CNN,
• 16:52
  Speaker 4: of a bunch of congressional Republicans. They've all decided that
• 16:54
  Speaker 4: their statement is going to be a mistake was made.
• 16:57
  Speaker 4: They're going to do the thing the White House would
• 16:58
  Speaker 4: not do, just admit the mistake and then say, but
• 17:00
  Speaker 4: it's not that big a deal, we're moving on. Yes,
• 17:04
  Speaker 4: they don't fear accountability. There's no shame here.
• 17:06
  Speaker 1: There's no.
• 17:09
  Speaker 4: Sense of responsibility that you might have done something really
• 17:11
  Speaker 4: bad that could have endangered the lives of American troops.
• 17:13
  Speaker 4: I don't give a shit about that. I agree with that.
• 17:15
  Speaker 4: But the way the White House is acting, and maybe
• 17:17
  Speaker 4: they're scared of Trump firing one of them or whatever else,
• 17:20
  Speaker 4: but they are acting desperate here in the way they're doing.
• 17:24
  Speaker 4: Because you could just be like, you could do what
• 17:26
  Speaker 4: Marjorie Taylor Greene, just tell the reporters to go back
• 17:28
  Speaker 4: to their country and move on, and that's not what
• 17:29
  Speaker 4: they're doing. They're spinning ridiculous conspiracy theories and ridiculous excuses
• 17:34
  Speaker 4: and making ridiculous arguments to try to somehow come out
• 17:36
  Speaker 4: on top on this.
• 17:37
  Speaker 1: Yeah, they are definitely flailing. It does feel like the
• 17:40
  Speaker 1: kind of flailing you do when they've done this before,
• 17:44
  Speaker 1: where it's like, all right, we just got to make
• 17:46
  Speaker 1: it through a couple news cycles here. And whenever something
• 17:52
  Speaker 1: really bad happens, this happened around January 6th, of course,
• 17:55
  Speaker 1: a whole bunch of Republicans sort of go off the
• 17:58
  Speaker 1: talking points and say things. Lindsey Graham's like, I'm done.
• 18:01
  Speaker 1: I'm done with Donald Trump. And Mitch McConnell's like, maybe
• 18:04
  Speaker 1: he'll get prosecuted after he leaves. And then They're all
• 18:07
  Speaker 1: on different talking points. And then it takes a couple
• 18:09
  Speaker 1: of days for them to all coalesce around some bullshit excuse.
• 18:12
  Speaker 1: And then they realize that all of our attention is
• 18:14
  Speaker 1: going to get pulled towards somewhere else. And then they're like,
• 18:16
  Speaker 1: all right, we're done. Now, Axios pointed out that this
• 18:19
  Speaker 1: is now the most read and shared story of the year.
• 18:22
  Speaker 1: So this is definitely broken through in a way that
• 18:25
  Speaker 1: nothing else has from Trump's second term. We also have
• 18:28
  Speaker 1: new polling from YouGov that shows 74 percent of U.S.
• 18:32
  Speaker 1: adults are think that what Trump officials did is a
• 18:35
  Speaker 1: very serious or somewhat serious problem, and that includes 60%
• 18:39
  Speaker 1: of Republicans. With that all said, can you make the
• 18:43
  Speaker 1: case that this episode will do any kind of lasting
• 18:46
  Speaker 1: political damage to Trump or to Republicans?
• 18:50
  Speaker 4: I'm not sure if you're aware of this, John, but
• 18:52
  Speaker 4: I'm not in the prediction business.
• 18:53
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I know.
• 18:54
  Speaker 4: But let me make the case, because I do believe
• 18:57
  Speaker 4: that this is the potential here, right? I'm not going
• 19:00
  Speaker 4: to There have been so many people who have said,
• 19:03
  Speaker 4: this is the thing that's going to undo Trump. So
• 19:05
  Speaker 4: I'm not saying that here. But the reason why Trump
• 19:09
  Speaker 4: has been more successful substantively and politically in his second
• 19:13
  Speaker 4: term than his first term was that he has the–
• 19:18
  Speaker 4: his administration thus far has the patina of competency and
• 19:21
  Speaker 4: success that his first did not. His first one was
• 19:24
  Speaker 4: a clown show from the very beginning, just stumbled out
• 19:27
  Speaker 4: of the gates. And here they came out with full force. Now, obviously,
• 19:30
  Speaker 4: there's a lot of really terrible things that have happened.
• 19:31
  Speaker 4: They made a lot of mistakes. But it's just been
• 19:33
  Speaker 4: this show of aggressive action. And the way it's been
• 19:35
  Speaker 4: covered and discussed is they are running roughshod over everyone. Democrats, universities, democracy,
• 19:42
  Speaker 4: everyone else. And they are just doing it. Is it perfect? No,
• 19:45
  Speaker 4: but they are the aggressor. And here in this situation,
• 19:49
  Speaker 4: they look... really stupid. And they look really stupid in
• 19:52
  Speaker 4: a way that's very relatable to people. This is a
• 19:55
  Speaker 4: thing people understand, adding the wrong person to a group chat.
• 19:58
  Speaker 1: And it's not that people- When you're about to bomb
• 20:01
  Speaker 1: the Houthis.
• 20:02
  Speaker 3: Yes.
• 20:03
  Speaker 4: We understand adding people to the wrong group chat.
• 20:04
  Speaker 1: Who among us?
• 20:05
  Speaker 3: Yes.
• 20:05
  Speaker 4: Who among us has not done that? The most comparable
• 20:09
  Speaker 4: thing here, as everyone has pointed out, is Hillary Clinton's emails.
• 20:11
  Speaker 4: Hillary Clinton's emails were quite damaging politically, but not because
• 20:15
  Speaker 4: voters cared passionately about email protocol or which server her
• 20:21
  Speaker 4: stuff in. They cared because it confirmed a suspicion that
• 20:25
  Speaker 4: they had about her, an unfair suspicion in my view,
• 20:27
  Speaker 4: but a suspicion that she was crooked and trying to
• 20:30
  Speaker 4: hide things, right? It fit with the long-running Republican narrative
• 20:34
  Speaker 4: of her as corrupt. Because like, why do you need
• 20:36
  Speaker 4: to do things on private email? Like, what are you hiding?
• 20:39
  Speaker 4: And it went to the question of her honesty. In
• 20:42
  Speaker 4: this case, it goes to a fundamental thing that people
• 20:48
  Speaker 4: worry about with Trump. That he's in over his head, right?
• 20:51
  Speaker 4: That he is incompetent. He's a clown. He's surrounded by
• 20:53
  Speaker 4: a bunch of clowns. He's got the weekend anchor from
• 20:56
  Speaker 4: Fox News running the Pentagon. He's got a Fox pundit
• 20:58
  Speaker 4: as the attorney general. You know, he's got the, there's
• 21:01
  Speaker 4: just all over the place, right? That it's just like,
• 21:03
  Speaker 4: if you lose the narrative of competence, that undermines your strength.
• 21:08
  Speaker 4: And strength is all that Trump has ever had. And
• 21:11
  Speaker 4: that's the difference between being above 50 in the high
• 21:15
  Speaker 4: 40s is where he has been in some polling, although
• 21:17
  Speaker 4: there's been some drops recently, and being back where he
• 21:20
  Speaker 4: was before in the low 40s, in the high 30s.
• 21:22
  Speaker 4: And so like, you can see a world where this
• 21:25
  Speaker 4: is a thing, like there's always one thing that fundamentally
• 21:28
  Speaker 4: ends the honeymoon and shifts the perception of the president.
• 21:32
  Speaker 4: For Biden, that was what happened in Afghanistan. And this
• 21:35
  Speaker 4: has the potential, the potential to do real damage to Trump.
• 21:39
  Speaker 4: It's not going to end his presidency. It's not going
• 21:40
  Speaker 4: to make everyone take off their MAGA hats and send
• 21:42
  Speaker 4: them back. But it shifts the narrative from Trump the
• 21:45
  Speaker 4: winner to Trump the clown. And that is helpful to
• 21:48
  Speaker 4: Democrats on a whole host of issues.
• 21:52
  Speaker 1: And even though I do think we will all forget
• 21:56
  Speaker 1: about this or at least move on from this as
• 21:58
  Speaker 1: we do every Trump crisis. And even if this is
• 22:02
  Speaker 1: not the thing that shifts it, it gives us an opening,
• 22:06
  Speaker 1: I think, to start framing all of the other fuck
• 22:09
  Speaker 1: ups as more and more incompetence. Right. And so it
• 22:13
  Speaker 1: sort of gives us a door to push on as
• 22:15
  Speaker 1: he continues to and his. And I do think it's
• 22:18
  Speaker 1: really important that it's not just about him, but it's
• 22:21
  Speaker 1: about the fucking idiots that he has running the government
• 22:25
  Speaker 1: right now. And the fucking bigger idiots that are running Congress,
• 22:29
  Speaker 1: who are going to be up in two years, less
• 22:32
  Speaker 1: than two years now, for re-election. So I do think
• 22:35
  Speaker 1: that these people were ruled by crooks and morons is
• 22:40
  Speaker 1: as good of a message as any at this point,
• 22:43
  Speaker 1: because there's a lot of evidence for it.
• 22:44
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 22:44
  Speaker 4: It changes the context. If Elon Musk stood up in
• 22:48
  Speaker 4: the cabinet meeting next week and said he accidentally canceled
• 22:51
  Speaker 4: an Ebola prevention program in the middle of an Ebola outbreak,
• 22:54
  Speaker 4: it would be treated differently than it was treated then.
• 22:56
  Speaker 4: Now it confirms a broader suspicion, and that's when things
• 22:59
  Speaker 4: start to hurt.
• 23:09
  Speaker 9: Pots of America is brought to you by CookUnity. Nutrient-dense
• 23:12
  Speaker 9: meals are essential for good health, but they don't have
• 23:14
  Speaker 9: to be boring. CookUnity offers fresh, flavorful meals for every diet,
• 23:18
  Speaker 9: including keto, gluten-free, and GLP-1 balanced. They're all-star chefs, Craft
• 23:22
  Speaker 9: each meal with local in-season ingredients that are high in protein, fiber,
• 23:26
  Speaker 9: and unsaturated fats. Meals are sent fresh, not frozen, and
• 23:29
  Speaker 9: are delivered directly to your door at a fraction of
• 23:31
  Speaker 9: the usual cost and time. And if you're looking for
• 23:33
  Speaker 9: a convenient and affordable meal plan to achieve your health goals,
• 23:35
  Speaker 9: go to cookunity.com slash crooked or enter the code crooked
• 23:39
  Speaker 9: before checkout for 50% off your first week. I can
• 23:43
  Speaker 9: confirm that their meals are delicious. Check out the mole
• 23:47
  Speaker 9: braised chicken with Spanish rice. That one's really good. Then
• 23:49
  Speaker 9: there's the sundae sauce rigatoni with fennel sausage and meatballs.
• 23:52
  Speaker 9: Both excellent, excellent options. They have a roster of all-star
• 23:55
  Speaker 9: chefs that include Food Network alums and acclaimed restaurateurs that
• 23:59
  Speaker 9: balance flavor and nutrition in small batch meals sent fresh,
• 24:02
  Speaker 9: not frozen. For example, Chef Andres Mendez, who made this
• 24:06
  Speaker 9: amazing Mexican chicken bowl with cilantro rice and fresh guacamole.
• 24:09
  Speaker 9: He also made Tuscan butter shrimp with cherry tomatoes and broccolini.
• 24:12
  Speaker 9: CookUnity is easy and effortless. Choose from hundreds of meals
• 24:15
  Speaker 9: prepared by award-winning chefs or let them choose for you.
• 24:18
  Speaker 9: Browse the menu by protein, chef, cuisine, or dietary need
• 24:20
  Speaker 9: to personalize your own menu and find new favorites. Menus
• 24:23
  Speaker 9: are updated weekly, and new chefs are always joining the team,
• 24:25
  Speaker 9: so mealtime will never be boring. No cleanup or meal planning.
• 24:28
  Speaker 9: Meals are delivered fully cooked, just heat in as little
• 24:30
  Speaker 9: as five minutes. They offer flexible, commitment-free subscriptions. Skip deliveries, pause,
• 24:35
  Speaker 9: or cancel at any time. Crush your health goals with mouth-watering,
• 24:38
  Speaker 9: chef-rated meals delivered straight to your door. Go to cookunity.com
• 24:41
  Speaker 9: slash crooked or enter code crooked before checkout for 50%
• 24:44
  Speaker 9: off your first week. That's 50% off your first week
• 24:47
  Speaker 9: by using code crooked or going to cookunity.com slash crooked.
• 24:55
  Speaker 1: So Trump's comments on the group chat came during an
• 24:57
  Speaker 1: Oval Office event where he was focused on his true passion,
• 25:00
  Speaker 1: taxing most of the shit that we buy. The president
• 25:03
  Speaker 1: has announced new 25% tariffs on foreign-made cars and car parts.
• 25:07
  Speaker 1: That's not just cars from foreign automakers. It's also cars
• 25:10
  Speaker 1: from American automakers who make certain vehicles in other countries
• 25:13
  Speaker 1: or use imported components. How much will it cost us?
• 25:16
  Speaker 1: It'll depend on what kind of car you buy and
• 25:18
  Speaker 1: which auto parts are exempted. But several analysts told CNBC
• 25:22
  Speaker 1: that prices consumers pay on the lot could increase by $ 4, 000
• 25:26
  Speaker 1: all the way up to $ 15, 000 per vehicle. One thing
• 25:30
  Speaker 1: they all seem to agree on, the car company most
• 25:33
  Speaker 1: insulated from the price increases will be Tesla. Amazing. Amazing.
• 25:38
  Speaker 1: And Trump's not done yet. Here's the threat he posted
• 25:41
  Speaker 1: on Thursday. Quote, if the European Union works with Canada
• 25:45
  Speaker 1: in order to do economic harm to the USA, large
• 25:48
  Speaker 1: scale tariffs far larger than currently planned will be placed
• 25:52
  Speaker 1: on them both in order to protect the best friend
• 25:55
  Speaker 1: that each of those two countries has ever had. Dan,
• 26:00
  Speaker 1: all this comes as new polling from Navigator shows that
• 26:03
  Speaker 1: Americans have a very negative view of Trump's tariff by
• 26:06
  Speaker 1: a 20 point margin. Only 23% of voters now support
• 26:12
  Speaker 1: Trump's tariffs. What do you make of all this?
• 26:15
  Speaker 4: It's sort of an amazing political choice. Substantively, every expert
• 26:21
  Speaker 4: looks at it and says, it's not going to do
• 26:22
  Speaker 4: anything that Trump says it's going to do. He doesn't
• 26:24
  Speaker 4: understand tariffs. He can't explain them, or he lies about them,
• 26:28
  Speaker 4: or both. But I guess the way I think about
• 26:31
  Speaker 4: it politically is prices are high. People are pissed about
• 26:35
  Speaker 4: prices being high. They elected Trump to fix those prices.
• 26:38
  Speaker 4: And the only time that he talks about the economy
• 26:42
  Speaker 4: in any way, shape, or form is to do a
• 26:43
  Speaker 4: high-profile announcement to raise the cost of American goods.
• 26:47
  Speaker 1: It's insane.
• 26:49
  Speaker 4: And tariffs in particular are sort of like designed in
• 26:52
  Speaker 4: a lab to get a lot of very granular attention
• 26:56
  Speaker 4: about how those prices can be raised. You just went through.
• 27:00
  Speaker 4: The price of a car is going to go up
• 27:01
  Speaker 4: this much. You're going to have... We saw this when
• 27:05
  Speaker 4: he did the Mexico and Canada tariffs that briefly existed
• 27:09
  Speaker 4: a few weeks ago. Local news goes out and they
• 27:12
  Speaker 4: interview the car dealers in your town. Local influencers post
• 27:17
  Speaker 4: on social media about how prices are going to go up.
• 27:19
  Speaker 4: It's very specific and it gets a lot of attention.
• 27:24
  Speaker 4: When we think about things that are dragging down Trump's
• 27:26
  Speaker 4: approval rating, Maybe one day it'll be signal gate and
• 27:29
  Speaker 4: the sort of impressions of incompetence come with it, but
• 27:31
  Speaker 4: it's that they elected Trump for a reason. And he's
• 27:34
  Speaker 4: doing the opposite of that thing. It's not just that
• 27:35
  Speaker 4: he's not focused enough on lowering prices. He is focused
• 27:38
  Speaker 4: like a laser on raising them.
• 27:40
  Speaker 1: Well, and he's also, it is another example of, of
• 27:43
  Speaker 1: incompetence too, because Trump doesn't know what the fuck he's
• 27:46
  Speaker 1: doing with tariffs. He like, there is a case for,
• 27:49
  Speaker 1: as we've said before, targeted tariffs on certain industries in
• 27:52
  Speaker 1: certain countries. All countries do that. We've done that before, but, um,
• 27:57
  Speaker 1: This idea of these universal tariffs, retaliatory tariffs everywhere and everything,
• 28:01
  Speaker 1: and it's the most beautiful word, and it's going to
• 28:03
  Speaker 1: fix everything. Most people don't believe that. Most evidence doesn't
• 28:08
  Speaker 1: show that. Almost all the evidence doesn't show that. He's
• 28:11
  Speaker 1: got people working for him who are like, eh, I
• 28:13
  Speaker 1: don't think this is right, but what else are we
• 28:15
  Speaker 1: going to do? Scott Besson, he's a fucking finance guy.
• 28:19
  Speaker 1: He knows this is bullshit. He's got to go out
• 28:22
  Speaker 1: there every day being like, yeah, the tariffs are going
• 28:24
  Speaker 1: to fix everything. They're all fucking idiots. everyone's going to
• 28:27
  Speaker 1: pay more. They have no other plan to lower people's costs.
• 28:29
  Speaker 1: They're talking a lot about, oh, we're going to give
• 28:31
  Speaker 1: everyone a doge dividend or a tax cut, or maybe
• 28:35
  Speaker 1: we'll cut taxes on more and blah, blah, blah. But
• 28:38
  Speaker 1: they don't know how to make any of it add up.
• 28:40
  Speaker 4: And they can't keep them in place. It's the chaos
• 28:42
  Speaker 4: that comes with it. It's like, we announce the tariffs
• 28:44
  Speaker 4: in the morning, we take them off in the afternoon,
• 28:45
  Speaker 4: then we announce new ones the next day, then we
• 28:46
  Speaker 4: take those off. And this is sort of a smaller thing.
• 28:49
  Speaker 4: And the stock market is not a good barometer of
• 28:54
  Speaker 4: the merits of economic policy in a lot of ways, right?
• 28:57
  Speaker 4: I remember how frustrated we would be when we get
• 28:58
  Speaker 4: a good jobs number in the Obama administration where the
• 29:00
  Speaker 4: stock market would go down because wages went up.
• 29:02
  Speaker 1: Yeah, right.
• 29:04
  Speaker 4: And the same thing in the Biden administration where you
• 29:05
  Speaker 4: get a good jobs number where the stock market would
• 29:06
  Speaker 4: go down because it meant that it may take the
• 29:09
  Speaker 4: Fed longer to lower interest rates. But there is something
• 29:12
  Speaker 4: about the fact that every time Trump talks about his
• 29:14
  Speaker 4: signature economic policy, the market drops and that that is
• 29:17
  Speaker 4: constantly covered in the news that way. He was asked
• 29:19
  Speaker 4: about it at his press avail. He sort of deny
• 29:23
  Speaker 4: knowledge of it, which I'm pretty skeptical he's not paying
• 29:25
  Speaker 4: close attention to the stock market. That just adds to
• 29:30
  Speaker 4: the negative energy around this policy. It's bad substantively, it's
• 29:37
  Speaker 4: bad politically, and it is going to hurt him. And
• 29:39
  Speaker 4: there's no question in my mind about it.
• 29:40
  Speaker 3: That.
• 29:40
  Speaker 1: Well, and it's also why the single issue that is
• 29:45
  Speaker 1: dragging down his approval rating right now is the issue
• 29:48
  Speaker 1: that was propping up his approval rating for most of
• 29:51
  Speaker 1: the campaign and most of his first term, which is
• 29:54
  Speaker 1: the economy. It's his worst issue right now. I think
• 29:57
  Speaker 1: there's a new Gallup poll out today Um, his March
• 30:01
  Speaker 1: numbers were like his approvals now at 43, 53. It was,
• 30:05
  Speaker 1: it had been at 45 and it started at 49.
• 30:06
  Speaker 1: So it was just, it is dropping quite a bit.
• 30:09
  Speaker 1: He's still sort of like, it's weird that the way
• 30:12
  Speaker 1: the press is covering this, that he's like, cause he's
• 30:14
  Speaker 1: more popular than he was at some of the lower
• 30:17
  Speaker 1: points in the first term, but he's pretty unpopular and
• 30:20
  Speaker 1: he's getting more unpopular pretty quickly right now.
• 30:23
  Speaker 4: His honeymoon started lower than anyone else's and it's ending sooner.
• 30:27
  Speaker 8: Yeah.
• 30:28
  Speaker 1: Right. And people aren't really pointing that out as much,
• 30:31
  Speaker 1: but you look at all the different polls and it's happening.
• 30:33
  Speaker 4: Democrats should. There is like a wisdom of the crowds
• 30:37
  Speaker 4: argument for pointing out that Trump is more unpopular than
• 30:40
  Speaker 4: conventional wisdom suggests he is.
• 30:42
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 30:42
  Speaker 1: And you can just look, we don't have to exaggerate it, right?
• 30:44
  Speaker 1: It's not like his presidency is over, but he started
• 30:49
  Speaker 1: in the high 40s, then he's in the mid 40s,
• 30:52
  Speaker 1: and now he's heading towards the low 40s. And we're
• 30:55
  Speaker 1: only a couple months in. So Trump isn't just threatening
• 30:58
  Speaker 1: our allies with economic warfare, but full-on conquest, lest we forget.
• 31:03
  Speaker 1: If for some reason you've forgotten about his quest to
• 31:06
  Speaker 1: take Greenland from Denmark, it's still very much on. Trump
• 31:10
  Speaker 1: said in the Oval this week that, quote, will go
• 31:12
  Speaker 1: as far as we have to go to get Greenland.
• 31:16
  Speaker 1: And that apparently includes what has become a very unwelcome
• 31:18
  Speaker 1: visit by Vice President J.D. Vance and his wife, Usha,
• 31:21
  Speaker 1: who announced an impromptu trip to Greenland this in two
• 31:25
  Speaker 1: very normal, relatable videos. Let's listen.
• 31:28
  Speaker 8: Hello.
• 31:29
  Speaker 10: I'm so excited to share that I'll be visiting Kuala Lumpur, Greenland,
• 31:32
  Speaker 10: next weekend. I'm particularly thrilled to visit during our national
• 31:36
  Speaker 10: dog sled race, which our country is proud to support
• 31:39
  Speaker 10: as a sponsor. I've been reading all about it with
• 31:41
  Speaker 10: my children, and I'm amazed by the incredible skill and
• 31:44
  Speaker 10: teamwork that it takes to participate in this race.
• 31:46
  Speaker 11: Hey, guys, it's Shady Vance, the vice president, and you
• 31:49
  Speaker 11: know there was so much excitement around Usha's visit to
• 31:51
  Speaker 11: Greenland this Friday. that I decided that I didn't want
• 31:54
  Speaker 11: her to have all that fun by herself, and so
• 31:56
  Speaker 11: I'm going to join her.
• 31:57
  Speaker 1: As you know, it's really important.
• 31:59
  Speaker 11: A lot of other countries have threatened Greenland, have threatened
• 32:03
  Speaker 11: to use its territories and its waterways to threaten the
• 32:06
  Speaker 11: United States, to threaten Canada, and of course to threaten
• 32:09
  Speaker 11: the people of Greenland. So we're going to check out
• 32:11
  Speaker 11: how things are going there. We think we can take
• 32:13
  Speaker 11: things in a different direction, so I'm going to go
• 32:15
  Speaker 11: check it out.
• 32:16
  Speaker 1: All that was missing from that Usha Vance video was
• 32:19
  Speaker 1: her holding up a newspaper with today's date on it
• 32:22
  Speaker 1: because it sounded and looked like a fucking hostage video.
• 32:26
  Speaker 1: I mean, we know that she's such a huge fan
• 32:30
  Speaker 1: of dog slide racing, particularly in Greenland, so she must
• 32:33
  Speaker 1: have been sorely disappointed when they were forced to cut
• 32:36
  Speaker 1: back the cultural part of the trip after learning that
• 32:39
  Speaker 1: no one in Greenland wants the would-be colonizers to visit.
• 32:44
  Speaker 1: In fact, apparently before Usha's trip, the U.S. government was
• 32:48
  Speaker 1: going door to door all over Greenland trying to find someone, anyone,
• 32:53
  Speaker 1: who wanted to talk to Usha Vance. They couldn't find anyone,
• 32:56
  Speaker 1: so they canceled that part of the visit.
• 32:59
  Speaker 4: And then look, if you're having trouble appealing to people...
• 33:04
  Speaker 4: What better solution than to bring Mr. Charisma, J.D. Vance,
• 33:09
  Speaker 4: along as well?
• 33:11
  Speaker 1: You know what? We should have all the fun. So
• 33:14
  Speaker 1: now they're visiting a military base where I guess they
• 33:17
  Speaker 1: can avoid any encounters with angry locals. Once again, you know,
• 33:21
  Speaker 1: Danish Prime Minister said that the trip constitutes, quote, unacceptable
• 33:24
  Speaker 1: pressure on Greenland and Denmark. No one in Greenland is
• 33:28
  Speaker 1: too happy about the President of the United States continuing
• 33:30
  Speaker 1: to say, oh, we get Greenland. because you guys got
• 33:33
  Speaker 1: some minerals. And so whether you're not, you want independence,
• 33:36
  Speaker 1: whether or not you want to stay with Denmark. No, no, no.
• 33:39
  Speaker 1: We're going to, what is this? This is crazy. And
• 33:41
  Speaker 1: then Vladimir Putin today was like, Trump's pretty serious about
• 33:45
  Speaker 1: the Greenland thing.
• 33:46
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 33:46
  Speaker 1: He's very serious.
• 33:48
  Speaker 4: I don't really understand what's happening here. I just like,
• 33:55
  Speaker 4: even if you wanted Greenland, which I'm not really sure
• 33:58
  Speaker 4: how you get it. Like that's still not clear.
• 34:01
  Speaker 1: I don't either. Is he just going to send a
• 34:05
  Speaker 1: bunch of troops there and then fucking have Don Jr.
• 34:09
  Speaker 1: plant an American flag wherever there's grass and then just
• 34:14
  Speaker 1: make everyone call it America land? Is that it? Red, white,
• 34:19
  Speaker 1: and blue land.
• 34:19
  Speaker 3: Remember?
• 34:19
  Speaker 1: That's what we're going to call it. Sorry, right. So
• 34:21
  Speaker 1: we're going to call it red, white, and blue land,
• 34:23
  Speaker 1: and then anyone who doesn't will be sent to El
• 34:25
  Speaker 1: Salvador- or banned from the White House press corps, and
• 34:28
  Speaker 1: then that'll be that. And then the Danes will be like, no, no, no,
• 34:31
  Speaker 1: that's ours. And the Green will be like, no, no, no,
• 34:32
  Speaker 1: we're independent. And Trump will just be like, nope, nope,
• 34:34
  Speaker 1: you're part of the United States.
• 34:35
  Speaker 4: I just don't understand how the Greenland small group PC
• 34:37
  Speaker 4: chat came up with the idea to send Usha Vance.
• 34:42
  Speaker 4: If your goal is to take over Greenland, what part
• 34:46
  Speaker 4: does Usha Vance in a dog sled race play in that?
• 34:50
  Speaker 1: I mean, hopefully we'll find out when David Remnick, who
• 34:52
  Speaker 1: was accidentally added to the Greenland.
• 34:55
  Speaker 4: That's the editor of the New Yorker for those of you.
• 34:58
  Speaker 4: He's the guy who edits the magazine sitting on a
• 35:00
  Speaker 4: lot of your bedside tables that you haven't read.
• 35:01
  Speaker 1: Yes. I don't know, man. What's the meeting in.
• 35:07
  Speaker 4: Usha Vance's office? We need our first thing, our first
• 35:11
  Speaker 4: big public event. What's it going to be? And they're like,
• 35:14
  Speaker 4: you know what? Let's do advance on the Greenland invasion.
• 35:17
  Speaker 1: I just... Like this is a, Usha Vance is, was
• 35:23
  Speaker 1: like a very serious accomplished person, Supreme Court law clerk.
• 35:28
  Speaker 1: Like how, I would watch like an entire reality series
• 35:32
  Speaker 1: about like Usha Vance and how she got into this
• 35:34
  Speaker 1: whole thing and how she's dealing with it, what she thinks.
• 35:38
  Speaker 1: Maybe she's like fully on board and she's just quiet,
• 35:40
  Speaker 1: you know? Maybe she thinks it's fucking crazy. Maybe, who knows?
• 35:44
  Speaker 1: It's wild.
• 35:45
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I just, yeah, I would, I'd love to just,
• 35:48
  Speaker 4: get a core sample of what's happening inside her brain
• 35:51
  Speaker 4: right now.
• 35:51
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 35:51
  Speaker 1: We're going to take a quick break, but before we
• 35:53
  Speaker 1: do that, a reminder for all of you who live
• 35:55
  Speaker 1: in Wisconsin or near Wisconsin, you guys have a super
• 35:58
  Speaker 1: important state Supreme Court election this coming Tuesday, April 1st,
• 36:02
  Speaker 1: between an excellent qualified judge named Susan Crawford and an
• 36:06
  Speaker 1: Elon Musk-backed MAGA loser. This is the first major race
• 36:10
  Speaker 1: since Trump won in November, and it'll determine the majority
• 36:13
  Speaker 1: on the Wisconsin Supreme Court. Remember, it's a liberal majority
• 36:16
  Speaker 1: right now because of all the work we did over
• 36:18
  Speaker 1: the last couple of years. But if Susan Crawford loses,
• 36:21
  Speaker 1: it'll be a conservative majority again with implications for abortion,
• 36:24
  Speaker 1: redistricting and the 2028 elections. So get everything you need
• 36:28
  Speaker 1: to make your plan to vote or volunteer before Tuesday
• 36:30
  Speaker 1: at VoteSaveAmerica.com. Paid for by VoteSaveAmerica. You can learn more
• 36:34
  Speaker 1: at VoteSaveAmerica.com. This ad has not been authorized by any
• 36:37
  Speaker 1: candidate or candidates committee. Pod Save America is brought to
• 36:49
  Speaker 1: you by Quince. Vacation season is nearly upon us. This year,
• 36:53
  Speaker 1: I'm treating myself to the luxe upgrades I deserve with
• 36:56
  Speaker 1: Quince's high-quality travel essentials at fair prices, like lightweight shirts
• 37:01
  Speaker 1: and shorts from $ 30, pants for any occasion, and comfortable
• 37:04
  Speaker 1: lounge sets, with premium luggage options and durable duffel bags
• 37:07
  Speaker 1: to carry it all. The best part? All Quince items
• 37:09
  Speaker 1: are priced 50% to 80% less than similar brands by
• 37:13
  Speaker 1: partnering directly with Top Factories. Quince cuts out the cost
• 37:16
  Speaker 1: of the middleman and passes the savings on to us.
• 37:19
  Speaker 1: And Quince only works with factories that use safe, ethical,
• 37:21
  Speaker 1: and responsible manufacturing practices and premium fabrics and finishes. Gotta
• 37:25
  Speaker 1: love that. I love Quince and just got some t-shirts
• 37:28
  Speaker 1: for the spring. I didn't even know they also have
• 37:30
  Speaker 1: luggage and duffel bags. I could use a new duffel bag.
• 37:32
  Speaker 1: You could use a new duffel bag. But their shirts
• 37:34
  Speaker 1: are great. Their pants are great. I have some of
• 37:36
  Speaker 1: those as well. For your next trip, treat yourself to
• 37:39
  Speaker 1: the luxe upgrades you deserve from Quince. Go to quince.com
• 37:42
  Speaker 1: slash cricket for 365-day returns. Plus free shipping on your order.
• 37:46
  Speaker 1: That's Q-U-I-N-C-E dot com slash crooked to get free shipping
• 37:50
  Speaker 1: and 365 day returns. Quince dot com slash crooked. So
• 37:58
  Speaker 1: one media outlet not in the Oval to cover the
• 38:00
  Speaker 1: tariffs announcement was, of course, the Associated Press, which has
• 38:02
  Speaker 1: been banned from the White House for referring to the
• 38:05
  Speaker 1: Gulf of Mexico as the Gulf of Mexico. The AP
• 38:08
  Speaker 1: was in federal court Thursday trying to get their access back.
• 38:12
  Speaker 1: They are arguing that being required to print certain words
• 38:15
  Speaker 1: or face a penalty is a gross violation of freedom
• 38:17
  Speaker 1: of the press. Seems pretty obvious. At least it did
• 38:19
  Speaker 1: in the old world. The government argued that the AP
• 38:22
  Speaker 1: hasn't shown that it suffered, quote, irreparable harm because they
• 38:25
  Speaker 1: can still go to events in the East Room, something
• 38:28
  Speaker 1: the AP says isn't always true. And they can also
• 38:31
  Speaker 1: report on who enters and leaves the White House. Isn't
• 38:34
  Speaker 1: that nice? In the meantime, the White House Correspondents Association
• 38:37
  Speaker 1: is trying to rally behind the Associated Press with the
• 38:40
  Speaker 1: audacious strategy of encouraging their members to wear First Amendment pins.
• 38:47
  Speaker 1: The pins are going to do it. I know we're
• 38:51
  Speaker 1: in a post-legacy media world, but can you talk about
• 38:53
  Speaker 1: how big a deal it is for the AP not
• 38:56
  Speaker 1: to be able to report on what the president is
• 38:58
  Speaker 1: doing and to go to court over this?
• 39:00
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 39:01
  Speaker 4: The AP is one of those news organizations that most
• 39:04
  Speaker 4: people pay no attention to, but It may not have
• 39:07
  Speaker 4: the cultural relevance of The New York Times or even
• 39:09
  Speaker 4: The Washington Post, but it's way more impactful. It reaches
• 39:13
  Speaker 4: more people. It is the wire service for the world.
• 39:17
  Speaker 4: Local news, foreign newspapers, local TV stations, local radios all
• 39:21
  Speaker 4: subscribe to the AP. And most of the reporting that
• 39:24
  Speaker 4: people read or hear about from Washington in this country
• 39:28
  Speaker 4: comes from the Associated Press. Because there is essentially no
• 39:32
  Speaker 4: local press presence in Washington anymore. The media economics don't
• 39:35
  Speaker 4: support it. So if you're sitting anywhere in this country
• 39:38
  Speaker 4: that is not New York or maybe Los Angeles, then
• 39:43
  Speaker 4: what you're hearing about on your local radio, your local news,
• 39:46
  Speaker 4: or on your local websites is from the AP. And
• 39:48
  Speaker 4: so when the White House keeps the AP out, that
• 39:53
  Speaker 4: has a major impact on what everyone is learning about politics.
• 39:57
  Speaker 4: And at this hearing today, Zeke Miller, who you and
• 39:59
  Speaker 4: I both know, who's the chief White House correspondent for AP,
• 40:01
  Speaker 4: testified that it's incredibly hard to do their job. They
• 40:04
  Speaker 4: have to come. They're reporting later because they can't be
• 40:07
  Speaker 4: in the room at the time. They are depending on
• 40:10
  Speaker 4: reports written by other people, in some cases by pro-MAGA
• 40:14
  Speaker 4: pool reporters because the White House now controls who's in
• 40:16
  Speaker 4: the pool. The photographers can't get access to take the
• 40:18
  Speaker 4: pictures they were taking before. And this is really– I
• 40:22
  Speaker 4: don't know. I can't speak to the definition of irreparable harm.
• 40:26
  Speaker 4: But the way that– if he doesn't send stuff out free,
• 40:30
  Speaker 4: their business is that people pay them to get this information.
• 40:33
  Speaker 4: And if they are not allowed to get the best information,
• 40:37
  Speaker 4: it is likely going to damage their business. They don't
• 40:39
  Speaker 4: only do– like they do sports. They do everything. But
• 40:42
  Speaker 4: politics is a huge part of it. If you can't
• 40:44
  Speaker 4: cover the President of the United States the same way
• 40:45
  Speaker 4: as everyone else, that's going to impact your business in
• 40:48
  Speaker 4: a pretty damaging way. And it affects the public discourse
• 40:50
  Speaker 4: in this country because people are getting less good information
• 40:53
  Speaker 4: because Donald Trump is mad that, as you said, they
• 40:55
  Speaker 4: called the Gulf of Mexico the Gulf of Mexico.
• 40:58
  Speaker 1: And of course, that is the result that the Trump
• 41:00
  Speaker 1: administration intended, or if they didn't intend it, they are
• 41:03
  Speaker 1: certainly happy with it. Julie Pace, we also know who's
• 41:07
  Speaker 1: AP editor, she has a piece in the Wall Street
• 41:12
  Speaker 1: Journal on the op-ed page making the case that, look,
• 41:16
  Speaker 1: this isn't this isn't just about the Gulf of America,
• 41:19
  Speaker 1: Gulf of Mexico flap. This is much bigger. And if
• 41:23
  Speaker 1: other journalists and other media outlets think this can't happen
• 41:26
  Speaker 1: to them, they should think again. We should be standing
• 41:29
  Speaker 1: together on this. And I thought it was really compelling.
• 41:31
  Speaker 1: And I don't know what you think. I mean, look,
• 41:34
  Speaker 1: I know that everyone right now, including journalists and people
• 41:38
  Speaker 1: in the press, are struggling with how to deal with
• 41:42
  Speaker 1: the fact that we have an administration that is pushing
• 41:46
  Speaker 1: this country rapidly towards like full authoritarianism. And that's a
• 41:51
  Speaker 1: hard thing to fight. And there's not a lot of
• 41:54
  Speaker 1: easy answers. I don't know that the first amendment pin
• 41:57
  Speaker 1: is what I would have landed on.
• 42:00
  Speaker 4: I know it's what you would not have landed on.
• 42:04
  Speaker 1: But I don't like, what do you make of that?
• 42:07
  Speaker 1: I guess it's a start. I don't know what else.
• 42:09
  Speaker 1: I want to criticize it also, but I actually don't know.
• 42:12
  Speaker 1: I guess I do know what else they could do.
• 42:14
  Speaker 1: I mean, they could all, they could all, use all
• 42:16
  Speaker 1: of their questions to Trump to like fight for the AP.
• 42:19
  Speaker 1: But I guess that would be, you know, then he'd
• 42:20
  Speaker 1: kick all of them out too. And it would just
• 42:22
  Speaker 1: be Marjorie Taylor Greene's boyfriend and a bunch of Newsmax.
• 42:26
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 42:26
  Speaker 1: Who's asking questions. I don't know. I don't know what
• 42:28
  Speaker 1: to do.
• 42:29
  Speaker 4: The most sympathetic or generous thing I can say about
• 42:31
  Speaker 4: this issue or the pins is they don't have, they
• 42:33
  Speaker 4: don't have a lot of other options, especially the white
• 42:36
  Speaker 4: house correspondence associated as organization has no leverage, no power. Their,
• 42:39
  Speaker 4: their main piece of leverage was that they control the
• 42:41
  Speaker 4: pool and they don't control the pool anymore. And so
• 42:43
  Speaker 4: they're just like looking for something they can do. And
• 42:45
  Speaker 4: a lot of the AP's colleagues have sort of abandoned
• 42:48
  Speaker 4: them here, right? And they're not necessarily because they are
• 42:53
  Speaker 4: being sops to Trump, although some of them are being,
• 42:55
  Speaker 4: I think, overly friendly. Like when Axios volunteered to take
• 42:59
  Speaker 4: the pool duty when they kicked out the Huffington Post
• 43:03
  Speaker 4: reporter that they did not like from the pool and
• 43:05
  Speaker 4: the Axios just volunteered to do that. They could have
• 43:06
  Speaker 4: made us think about that. But they also feel like
• 43:10
  Speaker 4: someone's got to get in to watch what's happening. And
• 43:12
  Speaker 4: if they all leave the AP, then Trump's going to
• 43:14
  Speaker 4: get exactly what he wants. But this is just a
• 43:17
  Speaker 4: reminder that the media, by definition, both in terms of
• 43:24
  Speaker 4: the way they do their business, the culture of the media,
• 43:27
  Speaker 4: the personalities of the people involved, is they are just
• 43:29
  Speaker 4: ill-suited to fight these battles. They have made a choice
• 43:33
  Speaker 4: to to be chroniclers of what's happening, not participants in it.
• 43:39
  Speaker 4: And that's a very important choice they made, a very
• 43:40
  Speaker 4: important role, but so whenever they get in fights like
• 43:43
  Speaker 4: this or whenever they get into a PR crisis, they
• 43:45
  Speaker 4: fail miserably. And the idea of wearing First Amendment pins
• 43:49
  Speaker 4: is something that, you know, if a Democratic politician did
• 43:52
  Speaker 4: something like that, they would ridicule them for it, but
• 43:53
  Speaker 4: they can't see that they're doing the exact same thing.
• 43:56
  Speaker 1: That was my first thought. I was like, you know,
• 43:59
  Speaker 1: people make fun of Democratic politicians. This is the most
• 44:02
  Speaker 1: Democratic politician move ever. The pin?
• 44:06
  Speaker 4: They just wrote a gazillion stories about how everyone was
• 44:10
  Speaker 4: mad at Democrats for what the clothes choices they wore
• 44:14
  Speaker 4: for Trump's day of the union. And their response to
• 44:17
  Speaker 4: this is, we're going to do something even lamer.
• 44:20
  Speaker 1: I just, you know, and it stems from, look, there's
• 44:23
  Speaker 1: financial issues with the industry and they're all struggling and
• 44:27
  Speaker 1: it's a scary time and he's targeting journalists, but they
• 44:31
  Speaker 1: are not in a political environment anymore. where they are
• 44:35
  Speaker 1: supposed to be neutral arbiters between two political parties. We
• 44:40
  Speaker 1: are now in a system where there is a government
• 44:44
  Speaker 1: that is acting more like a regime and an authoritarian
• 44:48
  Speaker 1: regime and who sees their enemy as the press, a
• 44:52
  Speaker 1: free press and free expression and free assembly and every
• 44:57
  Speaker 1: freedom that the country holds dear. And so like if
• 44:59
  Speaker 1: you're a reporter and you're a journalist in that system,
• 45:03
  Speaker 1: you kind of have to act like journalists do in
• 45:05
  Speaker 1: other places where there are authoritarian governments.
• 45:08
  Speaker 4: It's like they're on a boat with a hole in
• 45:12
  Speaker 4: it and they've decided to write about the expanding hole
• 45:14
  Speaker 4: instead of trying to plug the hole.
• 45:16
  Speaker 1: Yeah. And they're acting like some of these colleges and
• 45:20
  Speaker 1: law firms and other media outlets that are settling with them.
• 45:25
  Speaker 1: He's trying to pick off the weakest links, make examples
• 45:31
  Speaker 1: of people and keep people divided so that there is
• 45:36
  Speaker 1: no unified opposition to his rule. That's what he's doing.
• 45:41
  Speaker 1: All right, before we get to my interview with the
• 45:43
  Speaker 1: Canadian actress who ICE detained without explanation for two full weeks,
• 45:48
  Speaker 1: let's talk about the latest in Trump's campaign of terror
• 45:50
  Speaker 1: against immigrants, which very much includes legal immigrants, foreign students,
• 45:56
  Speaker 1: even visitors. Thanks to reporting from Mother Jones, the Miami Herald,
• 45:59
  Speaker 1: and other places, we are getting a better idea of
• 46:02
  Speaker 1: who the government is disappearing to the Salvadoran torture dungeon.
• 46:06
  Speaker 1: A young Venezuelan baker in Dallas who has an autism
• 46:10
  Speaker 1: awareness tattoo in honor of his little brother that other
• 46:15
  Speaker 1: ICE agents had already cleared sent him to El Salvador
• 46:20
  Speaker 1: in prison. A Venezuelan musician with no criminal record who
• 46:24
  Speaker 1: came here legally and thought he was at least being
• 46:27
  Speaker 1: deported back to his own country to be with his family.
• 46:30
  Speaker 1: A married father with no criminal record and no tattoos,
• 46:34
  Speaker 1: no tattoos, who the government apparently confused for someone else
• 46:39
  Speaker 1: because of a paperwork error. None of them got trials.
• 46:43
  Speaker 1: None of them got to see a judge or talk
• 46:45
  Speaker 1: to their lawyers or say goodbye to their families. A
• 46:48
  Speaker 1: federal judge has tried to temporarily block the administration from
• 46:52
  Speaker 1: using the Alien Enemies Act to imprison these men in
• 46:55
  Speaker 1: El Salvador without due process. Trump has responded by threatening
• 46:59
  Speaker 1: that judge with impeachment. Mike Johnson, the Speaker of the
• 47:03
  Speaker 1: fucking House, has threatened to eliminate entire district courts. The D.C.
• 47:09
  Speaker 1: Circuit Court of Appeals, which is the second most powerful
• 47:12
  Speaker 1: court in the country after the Supreme Court, has now ruled,
• 47:16
  Speaker 1: just this week, they decided to agree with the federal
• 47:19
  Speaker 1: judge in a 3-2 ruling. One of the Court of
• 47:22
  Speaker 1: Appeals judges actually said, quote, Nazis got better treatment under
• 47:27
  Speaker 1: the Alien Enemies Act than these Venezuelan migrants. And what's
• 47:33
  Speaker 1: the administration's response to all this? They sent Homeland Security
• 47:37
  Speaker 1: Secretary Kristi Noem to visit the El Salvador prison so
• 47:40
  Speaker 1: that she could pose in front of a crowded cell
• 47:42
  Speaker 1: full of prisoners and make this propaganda video.
• 47:46
  Speaker 7: I also want everybody to know if you come to
• 47:47
  Speaker 7: our country illegally, this is one of the consequences you
• 47:50
  Speaker 7: could face. First of all, do not come to our
• 47:53
  Speaker 7: country illegally. you will be removed and you will be prosecuted.
• 47:57
  Speaker 7: But know that this facility is one of the tools
• 47:59
  Speaker 7: in our toolkit that we will use if you commit
• 48:02
  Speaker 7: crimes against the American people.
• 48:04
  Speaker 1: Wearing her $ 60, 000 Rolex watch in front of those men
• 48:08
  Speaker 1: in prison. I have been ranting about this on every
• 48:11
  Speaker 1: platform I can find this week. I have run out
• 48:13
  Speaker 1: of words to describe how disgusted and horrified I am.
• 48:18
  Speaker 1: How is this not a bigger story right now? I
• 48:20
  Speaker 1: don't know.
• 48:21
  Speaker 4: It's hard to fathom why it's not. It is one
• 48:24
  Speaker 4: of the biggest, most important stories in the modern history
• 48:28
  Speaker 4: of this country. One of the fundamental things that separates
• 48:31
  Speaker 4: democracy from dictatorship is due process for everyone, not just citizens,
• 48:37
  Speaker 4: not just the innocent, for every single person is you're
• 48:40
  Speaker 4: gonna have some due process that the government cannot decide
• 48:43
  Speaker 4: on their own who goes to prison, who stays here.
• 48:46
  Speaker 4: They have to present the evidence to a judge. They
• 48:49
  Speaker 4: have to prove that the person that they are trying
• 48:51
  Speaker 4: to deport is the person they say did the things
• 48:54
  Speaker 4: that he or she did, met the qualifications for deportation,
• 48:57
  Speaker 4: were actually here illegally, were actually undocumented. That is gone.
• 49:02
  Speaker 4: That is not happening. And we are sending people to
• 49:05
  Speaker 4: a foreign prison, infamous for torture and starvation. And what
• 49:10
  Speaker 4: happens next? There is no answer to that. How these people,
• 49:14
  Speaker 4: if they've sent the wrong people, which from plenty of reporting,
• 49:16
  Speaker 4: it seems like they have sent many of the wrong people,
• 49:19
  Speaker 4: how do those people come back? How do they get
• 49:20
  Speaker 4: out of that prison? How do they get sent back?
• 49:24
  Speaker 4: Even if they were here illegally, but they are not
• 49:25
  Speaker 4: El Salvadorian gang members, how do they get sent back
• 49:28
  Speaker 4: to the right place? We already know that this administration
• 49:31
  Speaker 4: does not believe that judges' orders apply outside of America.
• 49:38
  Speaker 4: That was the entire reason why they kept that plane going.
• 49:41
  Speaker 4: So what happens when a judge says that this person
• 49:43
  Speaker 4: has to come back to be presented, like I think,
• 49:46
  Speaker 4: what do you call it, a habeas hearing? Are they
• 49:47
  Speaker 4: going to bring him back or are they just going
• 49:49
  Speaker 4: to leave him in the El Salvadorian prison?
• 49:51
  Speaker 1: I just, everyone's like, oh, well, they're, you know, they're non-citizens.
• 49:55
  Speaker 1: And if you're here and you're a non-citizen, even if
• 49:58
  Speaker 1: you're a legal resident, like, you know, we can revoke
• 50:00
  Speaker 1: your visa and blah, blah, blah. It's like, how do
• 50:01
  Speaker 1: we know they're all non-citizens? We don't because the government
• 50:05
  Speaker 1: now has decided that they can, plainclothes agents can pick
• 50:09
  Speaker 1: someone up off the street, throw them in a fucking van,
• 50:12
  Speaker 1: put them on a plane, send them to a prison
• 50:15
  Speaker 1: in a foreign country where they could be starved and
• 50:18
  Speaker 1: tortured and no one's going to know. No one's going
• 50:22
  Speaker 1: to know. So like I just it is un-fucking-believable. I
• 50:27
  Speaker 1: don't understand why I was looking through like my feed
• 50:31
  Speaker 1: of Democratic politicians to like see what is going on. And,
• 50:34
  Speaker 1: you know, I see some statements from the usual people
• 50:37
  Speaker 1: that you would suspect make statements. You're Chris Murphy's and
• 50:41
  Speaker 1: Veronica Escobar and other people who've been great immigration advocates.
• 50:44
  Speaker 1: But like I haven't heard a lot of speeches about this.
• 50:47
  Speaker 1: I haven't heard a lot of events about this. I
• 50:49
  Speaker 1: know everyone's fucking scared of their own shadow on immigration
• 50:52
  Speaker 1: in our party. I get it. We have fucked up
• 50:55
  Speaker 1: on immigration and like we have fucked up around the border.
• 50:58
  Speaker 1: Totally get that. But you can't tell me that the
• 51:03
  Speaker 1: American people think it's cool to just round people up
• 51:08
  Speaker 1: with no due process and send them off to a
• 51:10
  Speaker 1: prison because you know what? It could fucking happen to you.
• 51:14
  Speaker 4: This sort of bespeaks both how sort of cow Democrats
• 51:19
  Speaker 4: are by the election results, particularly on immigration and border
• 51:21
  Speaker 4: security issues, but also speaks about what is fundamentally wrong
• 51:24
  Speaker 4: with our approach to messaging and politics, frankly, in the last,
• 51:29
  Speaker 4: you know, eight years or so, which is like everyone
• 51:33
  Speaker 4: has read. We talked about last week that David's your report.
• 51:35
  Speaker 4: And it says what everyone cares about is inflation, cost
• 51:39
  Speaker 4: of eggs, Medicaid cuts, tax cuts, and that is a
• 51:41
  Speaker 4: hundred percent true. I guarantee you that's where you had
• 51:43
  Speaker 4: a vote. You have first group of any group of voters, Democrats, Republicans, independent,
• 51:47
  Speaker 4: new Trump voters, Gen Z, whatever else, they're going to
• 51:50
  Speaker 4: tell you that's what people care about and the best message.
• 51:54
  Speaker 4: But if you start with what people care about now
• 51:57
  Speaker 4: and you are not willing to look at what you
• 51:59
  Speaker 4: care about and convincing other people to care about it,
• 52:01
  Speaker 4: you are doomed to fail. It just feels ridiculous. We've
• 52:05
  Speaker 4: read the David Shore thing. We've talked about it. I
• 52:08
  Speaker 4: agree with him on a lot of things. I agree
• 52:09
  Speaker 4: with what our campaign ads in June of 2026 should say.
• 52:16
  Speaker 4: But right now, if you're talking about the price of
• 52:19
  Speaker 4: eggs when people, potentially American citizens, are being deported, when
• 52:23
  Speaker 4: people are being snatched off the street, as we'll talk about,
• 52:27
  Speaker 4: for things they wrote in this college newspaper, and all
• 52:31
  Speaker 4: you talk about is the price of eggs and not
• 52:32
  Speaker 4: the crumbling of democracy– what are we standing for? Who
• 52:35
  Speaker 4: are we fighting for? It has to be our job.
• 52:38
  Speaker 4: If Trump wants to make this an authoritarian country, we're
• 52:41
  Speaker 4: not going to stop him by beating him in the
• 52:44
  Speaker 4: next election on an inflation message. Because none of the
• 52:47
  Speaker 4: stuff that's really bad that's happening right now is happening
• 52:49
  Speaker 4: in Congress.
• 52:51
  Speaker 1: Also, as we've talked about the whole campaign, if inflation
• 52:56
  Speaker 1: gets worse, prices get higher, then the people who don't
• 53:00
  Speaker 1: pay attention to politics that closely, which is unfortunately most voters,
• 53:04
  Speaker 1: they're going to feel the pain of that and be angry,
• 53:07
  Speaker 1: much like they were in the Biden administration. And they're
• 53:10
  Speaker 1: not going to need a bunch of Democrats screaming about
• 53:12
  Speaker 1: it to be angry about it, right? Like, what we
• 53:15
  Speaker 1: do need is a bunch of Democrats getting really angry
• 53:18
  Speaker 1: and screaming about this. And there is a way to
• 53:22
  Speaker 1: talk about it. Like, look, I said when Trump won
• 53:26
  Speaker 1: that unfortunately on immigration— The president has a ton of power.
• 53:30
  Speaker 1: That is just the way our immigration laws are written.
• 53:33
  Speaker 1: That is the way that the courts were ruled about it.
• 53:35
  Speaker 1: And you know what? Deport gang members, deport criminals, like
• 53:41
  Speaker 1: dangerous people should not be in this country, whether they
• 53:43
  Speaker 1: are undocumented, like dangerous people should not be on the streets,
• 53:47
  Speaker 1: whether they are undocumented or not, right? We should get
• 53:51
  Speaker 1: criminals and we should prosecute them to the fullest extent
• 53:53
  Speaker 1: of the law, for sure. And unfortunately, if the president
• 53:56
  Speaker 1: wants to revoke visas, wants to deport people, undocumented people
• 54:01
  Speaker 1: back to their country. Then like, I'm going to disagree
• 54:04
  Speaker 1: with some of that, but he's going to have the
• 54:05
  Speaker 1: power to do that too. A lot of these, a
• 54:07
  Speaker 1: lot of these people, a lot of their families were
• 54:09
  Speaker 1: being interviewed. They're like, we just expected them to get
• 54:12
  Speaker 1: deported back to Venezuela or back to the country that
• 54:16
  Speaker 1: where they started. Why is they being held in a
• 54:19
  Speaker 1: prison in some foreign country that is known for human
• 54:23
  Speaker 1: rights abuses where they know they're not even serving a
• 54:26
  Speaker 1: sentence because they haven't had a trial. I mean, this
• 54:28
  Speaker 1: is insane. And you're hearing like, look, if you think
• 54:33
  Speaker 1: this is where it ends, then ask yourself, why? Why
• 54:38
  Speaker 1: did Kristi Noem go to film that video? Why did
• 54:43
  Speaker 1: they not correct the mistakes they're making with some of
• 54:46
  Speaker 1: these Venezuelans who clearly are not members of Trend de Aragua?
• 54:51
  Speaker 1: Why are they not presenting evidence to the judges? Why
• 54:54
  Speaker 1: are they not imprisoning or detaining these people in the
• 54:58
  Speaker 1: United States in our very, very secure prison? Why did
• 55:01
  Speaker 1: they have to send them to El Salvador and send
• 55:03
  Speaker 1: the wrong people to El Salvador and then not correct themselves?
• 55:06
  Speaker 1: This is not just like a bunch of oops. They're
• 55:09
  Speaker 1: doing this on purpose because they want people to be afraid.
• 55:14
  Speaker 1: And it's not just Venezuelans getting rounded up by the government.
• 55:16
  Speaker 1: As you said, some of you may have seen the
• 55:18
  Speaker 1: footage of Tufts graduate student Rumesa Ozturk, a Turkish citizen
• 55:23
  Speaker 1: here on a legal student visa, screaming as she's grabbed
• 55:27
  Speaker 1: off the street by ICE agents in masks and hoods
• 55:30
  Speaker 1: while on her way to break the Ramadan fast. Last year,
• 55:35
  Speaker 1: Ozturk co-wrote an op-ed in the tough student paper criticizing
• 55:39
  Speaker 1: the university's statements on Gaza. So far, more than 300
• 55:44
  Speaker 1: foreign students have had their visas revoked in what the
• 55:48
  Speaker 1: State Department is calling, they're labeling this as the program,
• 55:51
  Speaker 1: It's called their Catch and Revoke program, which is focusing now,
• 55:55
  Speaker 1: for the time being, on students who protested the war
• 55:58
  Speaker 1: in Gaza. State and DOJ officials also told Axios that, quote,
• 56:03
  Speaker 1: the Trump administration is discussing plans to try to block
• 56:07
  Speaker 1: certain colleges from having any foreign students if it decides
• 56:11
  Speaker 1: that too many are, quote, pro-Hamas. Secretary of State Marco Rubio,
• 56:16
  Speaker 1: he was asked about this on Thursday, and he openly
• 56:18
  Speaker 1: defended the move. He basically said, acknowledged tacitly that they
• 56:24
  Speaker 1: didn't have any evidence beyond the op-ed that this person wrote,
• 56:28
  Speaker 1: but then decided to say, well, you know, if you,
• 56:30
  Speaker 1: he said, quote, if you invite me into your home
• 56:32
  Speaker 1: and I start putting mud on your couch and spray
• 56:34
  Speaker 1: painting your kitchen, I bet you're going to kick me out.
• 56:36
  Speaker 1: We're going to do the same thing if you come
• 56:37
  Speaker 1: into the United States as a visitor and create a ruckus.
• 56:40
  Speaker 1: We don't want it. Notice what he's trying to do here. Like, oh, well,
• 56:44
  Speaker 1: You know, if you're vandalizing buildings or do all this,
• 56:48
  Speaker 1: but there's no evidence that this person did that. This
• 56:50
  Speaker 1: person signed their name to an op-ed criticizing the war
• 56:56
  Speaker 1: in Gaza. That's it. And instead of getting what they
• 56:59
  Speaker 1: could have done too, even if they still wanted to
• 57:01
  Speaker 1: revoke this person's visa, which unfortunately they have the power
• 57:04
  Speaker 1: to do, they could have sent a notice and said,
• 57:08
  Speaker 1: your visa is hereby revoked. You have 10 days to
• 57:10
  Speaker 1: leave the country or else then we're going to detain you.
• 57:12
  Speaker 1: They could have done all that. They could have visited
• 57:16
  Speaker 1: the dorm room. They could have tried to contact them.
• 57:18
  Speaker 3: No.
• 57:19
  Speaker 1: Plainclothes officers with masks on jump her in the street?
• 57:25
  Speaker 3: Why?
• 57:26
  Speaker 1: Why did they do it that way? No answers from anyone?
• 57:29
  Speaker 1: No one in the administration wants to know that? No
• 57:31
  Speaker 1: one's demanding the administration tell them that? No one's asking
• 57:34
  Speaker 1: the administration that?
• 57:36
  Speaker 5: I don't know.
• 57:37
  Speaker 1: What did you think watching that?
• 57:38
  Speaker 4: I read the op-ed today. She wrote it with, I think,
• 57:42
  Speaker 4: 34 other students. And the point of the op-ed, which
• 57:46
  Speaker 4: is critical of Israel's conduct at war in Gaza, is
• 57:49
  Speaker 4: they are mad at Tufts University for not taking the
• 57:52
  Speaker 4: recommendations of the student union, basically, which had a vote
• 57:57
  Speaker 4: and called for a bunch of things, including divestment, university
• 58:00
  Speaker 4: divesting from Israeli-related financial interests. But that's it. It reads like, honestly,
• 58:06
  Speaker 4: any college op-ed you've ever read. It's not pro-Hamas. It's
• 58:11
  Speaker 4: not calling for violence or vandalism or damage. It's just
• 58:16
  Speaker 4: calling the university to live up to the principles that
• 58:18
  Speaker 4: the students believe it has. And to be kicked out
• 58:21
  Speaker 4: of the country for that, right? It is a widely
• 58:25
  Speaker 4: held belief, the constitutional belief that everyone in this country,
• 58:29
  Speaker 4: citizens or not, has freedom of speech rights. And we're
• 58:35
  Speaker 4: now like after cancel culture, freedom of speech, we've ended
• 58:38
  Speaker 4: government censorship. We are now kicking people out of that
• 58:40
  Speaker 4: country for signing their name to an op-ed in a
• 58:43
  Speaker 4: college newspaper. This is not someone who, by any count,
• 58:47
  Speaker 4: organized violent protests or vandalism, simply put their name on
• 58:52
  Speaker 4: a piece of paper. And they do this because they
• 58:54
  Speaker 4: want to send a message. And it's not just a
• 58:56
  Speaker 4: message to people who are protesting the war in Gaza.
• 59:03
  Speaker 4: It's not just a message to foreign college students. It's
• 59:06
  Speaker 4: not just a message to people here who are immigrants
• 59:09
  Speaker 4: documenting or otherwise. It's a message to everyone who wants
• 59:12
  Speaker 4: to criticize the Trump government.
• 59:15
  Speaker 1: And they are starting with what they believe is the
• 59:18
  Speaker 1: low-hanging fruit. And this is why Venezuelans with tattoos are
• 59:24
  Speaker 1: That if you're not paying close attention to the news,
• 59:26
  Speaker 1: you just assume are members of this violent gang. And
• 59:31
  Speaker 1: college students who, if you're not paying close attention, maybe
• 59:33
  Speaker 1: you think that they were burning down buildings or vandalizing
• 59:37
  Speaker 1: them or do all kinds. And so they're starting here,
• 59:40
  Speaker 1: but then they keep pushing. And they keep pushing the
• 59:44
  Speaker 1: bounds of the law. And it keeps getting worse and worse.
• 59:47
  Speaker 1: And if you want to know where they're headed, you know,
• 59:49
  Speaker 1: Stephen Miller has said many times that... We started a
• 59:53
  Speaker 1: denaturalization program in the first Trump term that they didn't
• 59:57
  Speaker 1: get very far on and that they want to do
• 59:59
  Speaker 1: it again. Denaturalization. So they want to take people who
• 1:00:02
  Speaker 1: are immigrants, who've become citizens, and then denaturalize them. And
• 1:00:08
  Speaker 1: usually people are only denaturalized when they have committed fraud,
• 1:00:12
  Speaker 1: when they tried to become a citizen, or they have
• 1:00:16
  Speaker 1: committed some heinous crime and renounced their citizenship or joined
• 1:00:20
  Speaker 1: a foreign terrorist group or whatever it may be. Very
• 1:00:22
  Speaker 1: rare that someone is denaturalized. Like Nazis were denaturalized in
• 1:00:26
  Speaker 1: this country. And now Stephen Miller wants to expand that program.
• 1:00:31
  Speaker 1: The birthright citizenship thing. The idea that if you're born here,
• 1:00:35
  Speaker 1: that's how you have citizenship. And they want to challenge that.
• 1:00:38
  Speaker 1: Because what they ultimately want is they want to decide
• 1:00:42
  Speaker 1: who gets to be a citizen and who doesn't. Whether
• 1:00:44
  Speaker 1: you are a citizen now or you're not. They're already
• 1:00:46
  Speaker 1: talking about, oh, now if you vandalize a Tesla, you're
• 1:00:49
  Speaker 1: a domestic terrorist. And if you're a domestic terrorist, then
• 1:00:52
  Speaker 1: maybe you should lose your citizenship. Have you been an
• 1:00:55
  Speaker 1: American your whole life? They don't really care. Maybe they'll
• 1:00:57
  Speaker 1: send you to El Salvador. Someone asked Trump about that.
• 1:01:00
  Speaker 1: What did he say? Did he say, no, of course
• 1:01:01
  Speaker 1: I'm not going to send an American citizen to El Salvador? No,
• 1:01:04
  Speaker 1: he didn't say that. He said, well, I shouldn't, a
• 1:01:06
  Speaker 1: domestic terrorist, you shouldn't burn a Tesla. So this is why, like,
• 1:01:09
  Speaker 1: if you think right now that this is just about
• 1:01:12
  Speaker 1: students who were creating a ruckus, as Marco Rubio said,
• 1:01:15
  Speaker 1: about Gaza or gang members who were here illegally and That's,
• 1:01:20
  Speaker 1: that's how it starts, but they are rapidly moving towards
• 1:01:24
  Speaker 1: trying to really target their enemies, their political opponents. And that,
• 1:01:28
  Speaker 1: and I just, again, I, you know, I, I did
• 1:01:32
  Speaker 1: a video of this for this on, uh, on social
• 1:01:35
  Speaker 1: and like 90% of the comments were like, well, what
• 1:01:39
  Speaker 1: can we do? This is horrible. What can we do?
• 1:01:41
  Speaker 1: And I don't like, I don't know right now, other
• 1:01:44
  Speaker 1: than I do think that more leaders have to speak
• 1:01:48
  Speaker 1: out and more of us have to be unafraid to
• 1:01:50
  Speaker 1: speak out and, and not like get all wrapped up
• 1:01:54
  Speaker 1: in like, what is the most, you know, politically viable
• 1:01:57
  Speaker 1: message of the day. But like fundamental rights are being
• 1:02:01
  Speaker 1: trampled on here. And like, we all have to fucking
• 1:02:03
  Speaker 1: wake up.
• 1:02:05
  Speaker 2: I don't know.
• 1:02:05
  Speaker 1: Am I just going crazy?
• 1:02:07
  Speaker 4: No, no, you're right.
• 1:02:10
  Speaker 3: All right.
• 1:02:10
  Speaker 1: So we wanted to spotlight one of these stories, Canadian actor,
• 1:02:14
  Speaker 1: Jasmine Mooney, uh, was detained for 12 days trying to
• 1:02:17
  Speaker 1: cross into the country. She had had work visas. She
• 1:02:21
  Speaker 1: had worked here for a long time. It's a horrific story.
• 1:02:24
  Speaker 1: I spoke to her Thursday afternoon about what happened. So
• 1:02:27
  Speaker 1: you're going to hear that interview next. Pod Save America
• 1:02:39
  Speaker 1: is brought to you by Aura Frames. We all know
• 1:02:41
  Speaker 1: someone who loves taking photos, but all of those pictures
• 1:02:43
  Speaker 1: are just wasting away on their phone. or in the cloud.
• 1:02:46
  Speaker 1: Start putting them to good use with the unique, stylish
• 1:02:48
  Speaker 1: digital picture frame from Aura Frames. It was named the
• 1:02:51
  Speaker 1: number one digital picture frame by Wirecutter and for good reason.
• 1:02:54
  Speaker 1: It's so easy to set up and they have different
• 1:02:56
  Speaker 1: frame options. Share photos or videos from any device and
• 1:02:59
  Speaker 1: they will instantly appear on the frame wherever it is
• 1:03:01
  Speaker 1: in the world. No memory card required. Add unlimited photos
• 1:03:05
  Speaker 1: and videos and invite as many people as you want
• 1:03:06
  Speaker 1: to a frame. There are absolutely no hidden fees or subscriptions.
• 1:03:10
  Speaker 1: upload videos up to 30 seconds long and your favorite
• 1:03:13
  Speaker 1: live iPhone photos will play right on the frame. The
• 1:03:15
  Speaker 1: embedded speaker can play audio on demand. I got my
• 1:03:18
  Speaker 1: parents one of these for Christmas and preloaded it with
• 1:03:22
  Speaker 1: a ton of pictures of our kids and they absolutely
• 1:03:25
  Speaker 1: love this and constantly bug me to ask if I
• 1:03:29
  Speaker 1: can remember to upload more photos to the frame, which
• 1:03:33
  Speaker 1: as soon as they do, I do. And it takes
• 1:03:35
  Speaker 1: like 10 seconds to pick a bunch of pictures and
• 1:03:37
  Speaker 1: just put it in the frame and then They're really happy.
• 1:03:39
  Speaker 1: So it's a great gift. Very cool. The best part
• 1:03:42
  Speaker 1: is that it comes with unlimited storage. All you need
• 1:03:44
  Speaker 1: is the free Aura app and a Wi-Fi connection, and
• 1:03:47
  Speaker 1: you can upload as many photos and videos as you
• 1:03:49
  Speaker 1: want year-round. Right now, you can save on the perfect
• 1:03:51
  Speaker 1: gift that keeps on giving by visiting AuraFrames.com. For a
• 1:03:55
  Speaker 1: limited time, listeners can get $ 20 off their best-selling Carver
• 1:03:58
  Speaker 1: mat frame with code Aura20. That's A-U-R-A-Frames.com, promo code Aura20.
• 1:04:05
  Speaker 1: Don't forget to mention that we sent you to show
• 1:04:07
  Speaker 1: your support for the show. Terms and conditions apply. Jasmine Mooney,
• 1:04:14
  Speaker 1: thanks for coming on and sharing your story.
• 1:04:16
  Speaker 3: Thank you for having me.
• 1:04:18
  Speaker 1: I'd love to start by asking you to just talk
• 1:04:21
  Speaker 1: about the ordeal you've been through for people who aren't familiar.
• 1:04:24
  Speaker 1: You're a Canadian actress and entrepreneur who's spent a lot
• 1:04:28
  Speaker 1: of time working in the U.S. You were trying to
• 1:04:30
  Speaker 1: apply for a new work visa earlier this month. And
• 1:04:35
  Speaker 1: then what happened?
• 1:04:36
  Speaker 3: So I'll give you a little backstory of how I
• 1:04:39
  Speaker 3: got into this situation in the first place. So a
• 1:04:42
  Speaker 3: year ago, I had been offered a job working for
• 1:04:46
  Speaker 3: a health and wellness company in Los Angeles. So I
• 1:04:49
  Speaker 3: had originally applied for my TN visa at the Canadian border,
• 1:04:54
  Speaker 3: which weirdly got denied over a letterhead. They said we
• 1:05:00
  Speaker 3: weren't professional and we're missing the letterhead. And he denied
• 1:05:04
  Speaker 3: me and said I had to reapply. And obviously super annoying.
• 1:05:08
  Speaker 3: But I truly didn't think it was that big a
• 1:05:10
  Speaker 3: deal because you can keep reapplying. And so my lawyer
• 1:05:15
  Speaker 3: was actually based in San Diego. And he said, Jasmine,
• 1:05:18
  Speaker 3: just come on down San Diego. We'll go to the
• 1:05:20
  Speaker 3: San Diego border. I'll come with you to ensure that
• 1:05:23
  Speaker 3: there are no issues with your paperwork. So I ended
• 1:05:27
  Speaker 3: up going there, went into the immigration office, got my
• 1:05:31
  Speaker 3: visa within half an hour, and I was working and
• 1:05:35
  Speaker 3: living in California. So fast forward to about four months ago,
• 1:05:41
  Speaker 3: I had been traveling back and forth, absolutely no issues
• 1:05:45
  Speaker 3: until I got stopped. And one of the agents was like,
• 1:05:51
  Speaker 3: why were you originally denied? And then you went to
• 1:05:54
  Speaker 3: that border that seems really shady. And I explained my
• 1:05:57
  Speaker 3: story and he said, well, you're not allowed to process
• 1:06:00
  Speaker 3: visas there. And I said, well, I'm sorry, I did.
• 1:06:04
  Speaker 3: Like they did process my visa. My lawyer's been doing
• 1:06:08
  Speaker 3: this for 20 years. I have many friends that have
• 1:06:10
  Speaker 3: done it there. And then he said, well, it wasn't
• 1:06:13
  Speaker 3: processed properly. So it was just like this weird back
• 1:06:16
  Speaker 3: and forth. And then they took me to secondary. It
• 1:06:19
  Speaker 3: just seemed like they were trying to find anything to
• 1:06:22
  Speaker 3: revoke my visa. And then as they were going through
• 1:06:26
  Speaker 3: the company that I was working for, one of the
• 1:06:28
  Speaker 3: beverages has hemp in it. And he said, you can
• 1:06:33
  Speaker 3: work for them in Canada, but you're not allowed to
• 1:06:35
  Speaker 3: work for them in America. And he revoked my visa.
• 1:06:39
  Speaker 3: So I ended up staying in Canada for the next
• 1:06:45
  Speaker 3: few months. And then I didn't want to have to
• 1:06:49
  Speaker 3: appeal it. I just didn't want to have to deal
• 1:06:51
  Speaker 3: with any issues moving forward at the border. So I
• 1:06:54
  Speaker 3: ended up getting another job offer with another health and
• 1:06:58
  Speaker 3: wellness brand. And I call my lawyer. I'm like, can
• 1:07:02
  Speaker 3: I just reapply the same way? And he said, yes,
• 1:07:04
  Speaker 3: of course, you're allowed to reapply. Worst thing that can
• 1:07:07
  Speaker 3: happen is they just deny you like you were the
• 1:07:10
  Speaker 3: first time. I'm like, OK, great. And because I was
• 1:07:13
  Speaker 3: so familiar with the office previously, I was like, I'm
• 1:07:17
  Speaker 3: just going to go back to the office that they
• 1:07:21
  Speaker 3: gave it to me before. So that was, I guess, great.
• 1:07:24
  Speaker 3: three weeks ago now. And so when I entered, I
• 1:07:29
  Speaker 3: had like 50 pages of my paperwork applying for my
• 1:07:33
  Speaker 3: TN visa. And the woman goes, you're not eligible for
• 1:07:37
  Speaker 3: this visa. And I said, well, I just had this visa.
• 1:07:40
  Speaker 3: I was just living in America with this visa. And
• 1:07:44
  Speaker 3: sure enough, she calls her supervisor. Oh, OK. Yes, you are.
• 1:07:47
  Speaker 3: You are eligible for this visa. And then they accepted
• 1:07:51
  Speaker 3: my visa. And then while they were processing my visa,
• 1:07:54
  Speaker 3: they were just going back and forth. And they're like, oh,
• 1:07:57
  Speaker 3: your passport is going to expire in a couple of years.
• 1:08:00
  Speaker 3: And I'm like, well, can I just because the visa
• 1:08:03
  Speaker 3: I was applying for was three years. And she said,
• 1:08:07
  Speaker 3: I'm like, well, can you just give me this visa
• 1:08:09
  Speaker 3: and then I'll come reapply for the last year? They
• 1:08:12
  Speaker 3: said yes. And then I went back and sat down.
• 1:08:15
  Speaker 3: And then she called me back over and she said...
• 1:08:19
  Speaker 3: I'm so sorry, but we messed up. Because you had
• 1:08:24
  Speaker 3: a denial and because you had your visa voided, you
• 1:08:29
  Speaker 3: need to apply for your visa through the consulate. And
• 1:08:32
  Speaker 3: I said, no one has ever told me that. My
• 1:08:35
  Speaker 3: lawyers did not know that. I'm sorry. I will go
• 1:08:38
  Speaker 3: do that. And she goes, you didn't do anything wrong.
• 1:08:42
  Speaker 3: You're not in trouble. You're not a criminal. And that
• 1:08:45
  Speaker 3: was a really weird thing that she said, because I'm like,
• 1:08:49
  Speaker 3: of course, I'm not a criminal. And she goes, but
• 1:08:52
  Speaker 3: we have to send you back to Canada. And in
• 1:08:55
  Speaker 3: my head, I was like, okay, I was planning on
• 1:08:57
  Speaker 3: going back anyway. And I sat down and I started.
• 1:09:00
  Speaker 3: looking at flights. And then next thing you know, this
• 1:09:02
  Speaker 3: man comes out and he said, Jasmine, can you please
• 1:09:04
  Speaker 3: come with me? And I followed him. And they ripped
• 1:09:08
  Speaker 3: my stuff out from my hands. They took my cell phone.
• 1:09:11
  Speaker 3: They put me up against the wall. This woman started
• 1:09:13
  Speaker 3: patting me down. They ripped off my shoes, ripped out
• 1:09:16
  Speaker 3: my shoelaces. And I got put into a jail cell
• 1:09:20
  Speaker 3: for 48 hours. And that's where my journey begins.
• 1:09:25
  Speaker 1: I was going to say, so you're in the jail
• 1:09:28
  Speaker 1: down in San Diego for 48 hours. When you asked questions,
• 1:09:33
  Speaker 1: what kind of answers did you get? Were you able
• 1:09:35
  Speaker 1: to contact a lawyer? What happened next?
• 1:09:38
  Speaker 3: So right before I was put into the cell, they said,
• 1:09:41
  Speaker 3: who do you want us to contact? And I gave
• 1:09:44
  Speaker 3: them my best friend's phone number. And then every single
• 1:09:47
  Speaker 3: time I asked an officer, they said, I don't know.
• 1:09:52
  Speaker 3: We're not on your case. We're not with ICE. We're
• 1:09:55
  Speaker 3: just doing what we're told. So I wasn't able to
• 1:09:58
  Speaker 3: talk to anyone until the third day. So then on
• 1:10:03
  Speaker 3: the third day, they took me out and I sat
• 1:10:06
  Speaker 3: down with this officer and they told me, you are
• 1:10:09
  Speaker 3: being banned for five years. Sign here, sign here, sign here.
• 1:10:14
  Speaker 3: You are allowed to apply, like to appeal this ban
• 1:10:19
  Speaker 3: and we need to detain you and you are going
• 1:10:22
  Speaker 3: to be sent back to Canada. And I said, when
• 1:10:25
  Speaker 3: is that going to be? And they said, I don't know.
• 1:10:28
  Speaker 3: And that is literally what I was told over and
• 1:10:31
  Speaker 3: over and over. I don't know. And then from there,
• 1:10:35
  Speaker 3: I was placed into a real prison. And then I
• 1:10:39
  Speaker 3: spent almost two weeks in two different prisons, actually.
• 1:10:44
  Speaker 1: And so one prison was a detention center near San Diego.
• 1:10:49
  Speaker 1: And then that's when they sent you to the prison
• 1:10:52
  Speaker 1: and you were like on a floor with a paper blanket.
• 1:10:56
  Speaker 3: So that, so that was in what I'm like, I've
• 1:11:00
  Speaker 3: learned all the prison lingo now. So I, the first
• 1:11:05
  Speaker 3: few days it's, it's, they call it holding. So I
• 1:11:08
  Speaker 3: was put in a small freezing cold jail cell on
• 1:11:11
  Speaker 3: this tiny mat sleeping on the cement and they don't
• 1:11:15
  Speaker 3: give you pillars or blankets. They give you this weird
• 1:11:17
  Speaker 3: aluminum sheet that wraps over your body like a dead
• 1:11:21
  Speaker 3: body and And there were about five other girls in there.
• 1:11:24
  Speaker 3: And then on the third day, that's when they process
• 1:11:28
  Speaker 3: you into prison. So it's a full day of fingerprints, interviews, medical,
• 1:11:33
  Speaker 3: psychological tests. And you're sitting in a jail cell in
• 1:11:38
  Speaker 3: between those. It's freezing cold. They made us shower and
• 1:11:42
  Speaker 3: change into the prison outfit. So then you're sitting in
• 1:11:45
  Speaker 3: this prison cell with wet hair, And then late at night,
• 1:11:50
  Speaker 3: they put me into the prison where it's literally like
• 1:11:55
  Speaker 3: the movies, like two levels, rows of cells, common area
• 1:11:58
  Speaker 3: in the middle. And that was in San Diego.
• 1:12:02
  Speaker 1: And at this point, you originally contacted your best friend.
• 1:12:09
  Speaker 1: Now you're not able to talk to anyone anymore. You
• 1:12:11
  Speaker 1: don't have your phone. You don't have anything. What is
• 1:12:13
  Speaker 1: going through your mind at this point?
• 1:12:15
  Speaker 3: You know what? It's so weird because when I got
• 1:12:17
  Speaker 3: out of there, it just felt like, I'm like, did
• 1:12:21
  Speaker 3: that even just happen? Because when you're put into this system,
• 1:12:24
  Speaker 3: you're in fight or flight. I think, honestly, I just
• 1:12:27
  Speaker 3: went into shock. Um, I tried to just sleep. I'm like,
• 1:12:31
  Speaker 3: I'm not going to be in here long. Let's just
• 1:12:33
  Speaker 3: sleep this through. And I meditated. And, um, then when
• 1:12:38
  Speaker 3: I got into the real, okay, actually I'll tell you
• 1:12:41
  Speaker 3: this story. So before I was placed into real jail,
• 1:12:46
  Speaker 3: I was begging anyone to give me answers. And one
• 1:12:49
  Speaker 3: of the officers goes to me, he's like, listen, I
• 1:12:52
  Speaker 3: don't know your case. You could be in here for days.
• 1:12:54
  Speaker 3: You could be in here for weeks, but you need
• 1:12:56
  Speaker 3: to prepare yourself mentally right now to be in here
• 1:12:59
  Speaker 3: for months. So that can you imagine someone saying that
• 1:13:03
  Speaker 3: to you? That is when I started like having serious,
• 1:13:07
  Speaker 3: serious panic and anxiety. And then when I got placed
• 1:13:12
  Speaker 3: into real prison, I kind of like I was in
• 1:13:16
  Speaker 3: shock still barely slept. And I think I just like
• 1:13:20
  Speaker 3: I didn't leave myself for the first day because I
• 1:13:23
  Speaker 3: was just in utter disillusion of what was going on.
• 1:13:27
  Speaker 1: And then. I think I really would have lost it
• 1:13:32
  Speaker 1: when you were transferred to a second, or I guess
• 1:13:35
  Speaker 1: at this point it would be the third, detention center.
• 1:13:38
  Speaker 1: And that one was in Arizona?
• 1:13:40
  Speaker 3: In Arizona, yes.
• 1:13:42
  Speaker 1: So when they transferred you there, were you like, what
• 1:13:44
  Speaker 1: the hell is going on? Why am I going to
• 1:13:46
  Speaker 1: another detention center? Why am I getting shackled and thrown
• 1:13:49
  Speaker 1: in a van?
• 1:13:50
  Speaker 3: So it was, I think, on the third day from
• 1:13:53
  Speaker 3: the original jail, and I got woken up at 3 a.m.,
• 1:13:57
  Speaker 3: and the guard was like, Pack your bags. You're leaving.
• 1:13:59
  Speaker 3: And in my head, I was like, oh, my God, finally,
• 1:14:01
  Speaker 3: I get to go home. And then I went downstairs
• 1:14:05
  Speaker 3: and there was about 10 other girls standing there and
• 1:14:08
  Speaker 3: everyone was crying, but like not happy tears. And that's
• 1:14:12
  Speaker 3: when I learned about the term transfer. So that process.
• 1:14:18
  Speaker 3: is one of the worst experiences of the entire duration
• 1:14:23
  Speaker 3: of my stay. Um, what they do is they have
• 1:14:27
  Speaker 3: to transfer you out of the jail. So you're put
• 1:14:30
  Speaker 3: back into the holding cells. You have to change into
• 1:14:33
  Speaker 3: your clothes that you came in. And, um, there was
• 1:14:36
  Speaker 3: about 10 girls and like 50 guys, and they have
• 1:14:40
  Speaker 3: to go through every single person, transfer them out and,
• 1:14:43
  Speaker 3: And then we were put in chains. So what they
• 1:14:47
  Speaker 3: do is they put chains around your waist. They put
• 1:14:49
  Speaker 3: handcuffs on your hands that are attached to your waist
• 1:14:52
  Speaker 3: and handcuffs on your feet. And they loaded us all
• 1:14:56
  Speaker 3: into this big prison bus. And then drove us from
• 1:15:01
  Speaker 3: San Diego to Arizona. So you're in chains for about
• 1:15:04
  Speaker 3: five hours. And then once you get to the prison,
• 1:15:08
  Speaker 3: they have to do the entire onboarding process again. So
• 1:15:12
  Speaker 3: you have to go through medical tests, psychological tests, fingerprints.
• 1:15:16
  Speaker 3: By the time we actually got to our cell, it
• 1:15:19
  Speaker 3: was exactly 24 hours. And you do not sleep the
• 1:15:23
  Speaker 3: whole time.
• 1:15:25
  Speaker 1: And I think in your essay, you mentioned that the
• 1:15:28
  Speaker 1: conditions changed. in the detention center in Arizona were much worse.
• 1:15:33
  Speaker 3: It was odd. That is when morale was at an
• 1:15:36
  Speaker 3: all time low walking into that. So they put 30
• 1:15:40
  Speaker 3: of us into one jail cell. There's no, um, no daylight.
• 1:15:45
  Speaker 3: The beds were missing sheets. There's no pillows. Each person
• 1:15:49
  Speaker 3: had one blanket. It was freezing cold. Um, they had
• 1:15:52
  Speaker 3: nothing to do in there and I wasn't allowed a
• 1:15:56
  Speaker 3: phone call. in that jail. There's no commissary. There's no
• 1:15:59
  Speaker 3: phone call. They gave us one plastic spoon, one styrofoam
• 1:16:03
  Speaker 3: cup that we had to reuse for every single meal.
• 1:16:06
  Speaker 3: The food was not food. The bathrooms are just like
• 1:16:10
  Speaker 3: 30 people sharing this open bathrooms, like toilets and showers.
• 1:16:16
  Speaker 3: It was insane honestly i could not i couldn't believe
• 1:16:20
  Speaker 3: it and that's when i really started freaking out again
• 1:16:24
  Speaker 3: um and that's when my friends and i really like
• 1:16:28
  Speaker 3: how do i get out of here i need to
• 1:16:31
  Speaker 3: get out of here.
• 1:16:33
  Speaker 1: So after two weeks one day they just say okay
• 1:16:39
  Speaker 1: you're out you're getting released.
• 1:16:41
  Speaker 3: Um, so my entire stay, I was not talked to
• 1:16:46
  Speaker 3: once by an officer about my case. I had no
• 1:16:50
  Speaker 3: idea how long I was going to be in there.
• 1:16:52
  Speaker 3: There was no answers from anyone I had requested at
• 1:16:57
  Speaker 3: the previous jail. There's these like little tablets that they
• 1:17:00
  Speaker 3: give you, um, if you want to request something. So
• 1:17:03
  Speaker 3: I requested to speak to my ice officer. I told
• 1:17:06
  Speaker 3: them that I would pay for my flight home. Um,
• 1:17:08
  Speaker 3: Please just give me any answers. I need information for
• 1:17:12
  Speaker 3: my lawyer that I was giving my friends. And then
• 1:17:17
  Speaker 3: what happened at the second jail, there was another like
• 1:17:21
  Speaker 3: weird tablet on the wall that we figured out how
• 1:17:24
  Speaker 3: to use. And I thank God was able to use email.
• 1:17:29
  Speaker 3: So I actually, one little tip, memorize phone numbers and
• 1:17:34
  Speaker 3: memorize emails because you don't realize that you don't know
• 1:17:39
  Speaker 3: anyone's information until you're in a situation like this. So
• 1:17:45
  Speaker 3: I ended up emailing my CEO who then got in
• 1:17:49
  Speaker 3: contact with my friend. And so my friend and I
• 1:17:52
  Speaker 3: were emailing back and forth and I was like, You
• 1:17:56
  Speaker 3: need to contact the media because she had already been
• 1:17:59
  Speaker 3: working with the lawyers, with my family, with friends, with resources,
• 1:18:04
  Speaker 3: and nothing was happening. So I was like, I cannot
• 1:18:08
  Speaker 3: be in here. Contact the media. So what ended up
• 1:18:11
  Speaker 3: happening is, of course, like you become friends with everyone
• 1:18:15
  Speaker 3: in the cell and everyone knew each other's stories. And
• 1:18:20
  Speaker 3: so one of the girls ended up giving me her
• 1:18:24
  Speaker 3: call that she was she had been in there for
• 1:18:26
  Speaker 3: a while. So she was able to use calls and.
• 1:18:28
  Speaker 3: And so she gave me her call and I called
• 1:18:31
  Speaker 3: my friend who then got me in contact with a reporter.
• 1:18:34
  Speaker 3: And then the second that my story came out, I
• 1:18:39
  Speaker 3: called my lawyer and was like, Jasmine, yeah, yeah. Oh,
• 1:18:45
  Speaker 3: she's here. We weren't aware that she would pay for
• 1:18:49
  Speaker 3: her own flight home. No problem. We're going to get
• 1:18:51
  Speaker 3: her out right away. And then I was released the
• 1:18:55
  Speaker 3: next day. And when I was released, they transferred me
• 1:18:59
  Speaker 3: back to San Diego. So I had to do that
• 1:19:02
  Speaker 3: whole transfer process twice in the five-hour chain ride. And
• 1:19:07
  Speaker 3: then I got to go home.
• 1:19:12
  Speaker 1: So, horrifying. Since you've been released and have gotten back home,
• 1:19:18
  Speaker 1: have you gotten any answers or learned anything new about
• 1:19:22
  Speaker 1: why you were detained, why it took two weeks to
• 1:19:25
  Speaker 1: get you out or, or anything else about your case?
• 1:19:28
  Speaker 3: No, you know, it's funny. So when I was, um,
• 1:19:32
  Speaker 3: at the airport, I had two officers that were actually
• 1:19:35
  Speaker 3: extremely kind and they looked through all of my files
• 1:19:41
  Speaker 3: and all of my paperwork and they couldn't even quite
• 1:19:44
  Speaker 3: understand what was going on there. Like there's no notes.
• 1:19:46
  Speaker 3: It's so vague. Um, you need to appeal this. Um,
• 1:19:51
  Speaker 3: and then, uh, And they told my lawyer that I
• 1:19:56
  Speaker 3: didn't have proper documents or I don't even know what
• 1:20:01
  Speaker 3: they said, but it really just didn't make sense. And
• 1:20:04
  Speaker 3: the fact that I told them that I would pay
• 1:20:06
  Speaker 3: for my flight the second I got there was I've
• 1:20:09
  Speaker 3: had many lawyers reach out to me because stuff like
• 1:20:13
  Speaker 3: this is happening a lot right now and they don't
• 1:20:18
  Speaker 3: understand what's going on. And so I truly don't have
• 1:20:23
  Speaker 3: the answers.
• 1:20:25
  Speaker 1: Do you have any plans to sue the U.S.
• 1:20:26
  Speaker 3: Government? I don't. I've been asked that a lot. I'm
• 1:20:31
  Speaker 3: just really trying to get my bearings right now and
• 1:20:35
  Speaker 3: trying to get a grasp of everything that's happened. I'm
• 1:20:38
  Speaker 3: definitely going to be appealing my ban because five years
• 1:20:43
  Speaker 3: is insane. But right now, I'm just really trying to
• 1:20:47
  Speaker 3: be a voice for what is happening in there because
• 1:20:50
  Speaker 3: a lot of people are scared to talk about what
• 1:20:53
  Speaker 3: is happening. And, or they're just so traumatized. Like I
• 1:20:56
  Speaker 3: had this lawyer call me a couple of days ago
• 1:20:59
  Speaker 3: and he's like, I cannot believe how well you're handling this.
• 1:21:02
  Speaker 3: He's like, I've grown men that were in there for
• 1:21:04
  Speaker 3: three days and they are in absolute shambles. It's like
• 1:21:07
  Speaker 3: when you're in there, everything that they do is meant
• 1:21:10
  Speaker 3: to break you, like truly break you. Yeah.
• 1:21:14
  Speaker 1: I was going to ask just how you're processing all this.
• 1:21:16
  Speaker 1: Cause you seem so calm and good natured about everything.
• 1:21:20
  Speaker 1: And I think I would be in a constant state
• 1:21:23
  Speaker 1: of rage every minute?
• 1:21:25
  Speaker 3: So I tell a lot of people this, if this
• 1:21:28
  Speaker 3: happened to me a year ago, I would not be
• 1:21:30
  Speaker 3: talking to you right now. I would be very, I
• 1:21:33
  Speaker 3: would be in absolute shambles. I've been through a lot
• 1:21:36
  Speaker 3: in my life and I've done a ton of healing
• 1:21:38
  Speaker 3: work in the past year. And I, um, and they're
• 1:21:42
  Speaker 3: very spiritual. I meditate, I pray, I am extremely healthy and, And, uh,
• 1:21:49
  Speaker 3: literally just like a month before this happened, I was
• 1:21:52
  Speaker 3: attacked and robbed in Guatemala. It's a long story. So
• 1:21:56
  Speaker 3: I was like, I've just been dealing with a lot
• 1:21:58
  Speaker 3: of things that I'm like, this has prepared me for this.
• 1:22:03
  Speaker 3: So coming out of it, and I'm going to just
• 1:22:06
  Speaker 3: say this as well. When I was in there for
• 1:22:09
  Speaker 3: the first few days, I was in shock and just meditating,
• 1:22:14
  Speaker 3: trying to get through it. But what really I think.
• 1:22:19
  Speaker 3: Saved me was the other women in there. When I
• 1:22:24
  Speaker 3: went around and started talking to that, I probably met
• 1:22:27
  Speaker 3: 200 women and not a single one of us for
• 1:22:31
  Speaker 3: the record has a criminal record. Okay. These women are teachers,
• 1:22:35
  Speaker 3: they're nurses. Everyone's story is different. A lot of them
• 1:22:39
  Speaker 3: are seeking asylum. A lot of them had visas and
• 1:22:42
  Speaker 3: overstayed because when they went to reapply they got denied
• 1:22:47
  Speaker 3: so everyone has a different story but the community that
• 1:22:50
  Speaker 3: was in there was one of the most beautiful things
• 1:22:54
  Speaker 3: I've ever witnessed and just going around and meeting everyone
• 1:22:58
  Speaker 3: and hearing their background and what they have gone through
• 1:23:02
  Speaker 3: I was like I am literally never allowed to complain
• 1:23:06
  Speaker 3: about anything again in my life and so I was
• 1:23:11
  Speaker 3: just just in awe of their strength and everything that
• 1:23:16
  Speaker 3: they had been through. And I just sat in gratitude
• 1:23:20
  Speaker 3: of my life. And, um, that's why I am so
• 1:23:25
  Speaker 3: vocal about this because they don't have a voice and,
• 1:23:28
  Speaker 3: you know, it was at the second jail, um, When
• 1:23:31
  Speaker 3: morale was at an all-time low and we weren't able
• 1:23:34
  Speaker 3: to use the phone, all the women were writing letters
• 1:23:37
  Speaker 3: to their families because they knew that I was most
• 1:23:40
  Speaker 3: likely going to be getting out first. And so they
• 1:23:42
  Speaker 3: were like all rooting for me to get out. And
• 1:23:45
  Speaker 3: then I promised every single one of them that I
• 1:23:48
  Speaker 3: would do everything I can to be a voice for
• 1:23:50
  Speaker 3: this because what I saw was so deeply disturbing and
• 1:23:54
  Speaker 3: as such a broken system that should not happen. be
• 1:23:58
  Speaker 3: happening and there's such easy changes so that this doesn't
• 1:24:03
  Speaker 3: need to happen.
• 1:24:05
  Speaker 1: Yeah i mean i was going to ask because you
• 1:24:07
  Speaker 1: know i've been talking about a lot of these cases
• 1:24:10
  Speaker 1: um for a while now in our last couple weeks
• 1:24:13
  Speaker 1: since it's really been happening a lot and everything that's
• 1:24:15
  Speaker 1: going on with sending venezuelans to el salvador with no
• 1:24:18
  Speaker 1: criminal records and no due process and um you know
• 1:24:22
  Speaker 1: the most common question i get is this is horrifying
• 1:24:25
  Speaker 1: what can i do about it what can we do
• 1:24:27
  Speaker 1: Have you thought about how you want to be a
• 1:24:30
  Speaker 1: voice for reform here? and what people can do?
• 1:24:34
  Speaker 3: So, uh, obviously this is shooting for the stars and
• 1:24:39
  Speaker 3: the moon. Um, but in a perfect world, I would
• 1:24:43
  Speaker 3: love to be able to talk or get to the top,
• 1:24:47
  Speaker 3: to the administration, to really tell them what is truly
• 1:24:52
  Speaker 3: going on behind closed doors. Because you have to remember
• 1:24:54
  Speaker 3: these institutions, they're privately owned and publicly traded, right? They're, they're,
• 1:25:00
  Speaker 3: They are given grants from the government. And I think
• 1:25:04
  Speaker 3: they are completely abusing. I know they are abusing the system.
• 1:25:09
  Speaker 3: They are cutting costs everywhere they can to make money
• 1:25:12
  Speaker 3: because it is a business. And I know this because
• 1:25:17
  Speaker 3: the jails actually emailed my lawyer and asked me to
• 1:25:19
  Speaker 3: take my essay down. So that was, you know, I
• 1:25:25
  Speaker 3: was like, okay, I'm definitely.
• 1:25:27
  Speaker 1: And you told them to fuck off.
• 1:25:28
  Speaker 3: Yeah. I said, no, thank you. And so I just
• 1:25:36
  Speaker 3: want to give the administration the benefit of the doubt because,
• 1:25:41
  Speaker 3: as you know, they hate wasting money. And this is
• 1:25:44
  Speaker 3: an extreme, extreme waste of resources. And I'm coming at
• 1:25:51
  Speaker 3: it as... Listen, I do not support being in the
• 1:25:55
  Speaker 3: country illegally. I went to America trying to do it legally.
• 1:26:00
  Speaker 3: And all the women that I met who were getting deported,
• 1:26:04
  Speaker 3: they were like, Jasmine, we're not mad about getting deported.
• 1:26:09
  Speaker 3: What we are upset about is the process in which
• 1:26:12
  Speaker 3: we are taken away. From our homes, off the streets,
• 1:26:16
  Speaker 3: put into this system that makes it literally impossible to
• 1:26:21
  Speaker 3: get out. Why are we stuck in here for months? Listen,
• 1:26:25
  Speaker 3: I am Canadian. I am white. I have a Canadian passport.
• 1:26:29
  Speaker 3: I have resources. I had politicians. I have a lot
• 1:26:33
  Speaker 3: of connections. And it took me nearly two weeks to
• 1:26:37
  Speaker 3: get out of there. Can you even imagine what these
• 1:26:40
  Speaker 3: women are going through? And then they're getting shipped back
• 1:26:43
  Speaker 3: to their countries and they don't have an opportunity to
• 1:26:47
  Speaker 3: get any of their belongings. And I asked all of them,
• 1:26:49
  Speaker 3: what are you doing with all your stuff? And they're like,
• 1:26:51
  Speaker 3: we can't afford to send it back to our countries.
• 1:26:53
  Speaker 3: So we were literally just leaving it. Everything they own
• 1:26:56
  Speaker 3: just left. And these women had been working in America
• 1:27:00
  Speaker 3: for five, 10 years. I mean, like I said, everyone's
• 1:27:03
  Speaker 3: story is different, but yeah, There just has to be
• 1:27:06
  Speaker 3: a better process for non-criminals. And that's what I'm trying
• 1:27:11
  Speaker 3: to be a voice for.
• 1:27:13
  Speaker 8: Yeah.
• 1:27:13
  Speaker 1: And look, I'll just, you know, speak from having experienced
• 1:27:18
  Speaker 1: the immigration policy and immigration system here in the United States,
• 1:27:21
  Speaker 1: both inside of government and outside of government. And in
• 1:27:24
  Speaker 1: a normal administration, it is true that the immigration system
• 1:27:28
  Speaker 1: here is broken, that we have these for-profit private detention
• 1:27:32
  Speaker 1: centers and that absolutely abuse the system because it is
• 1:27:35
  Speaker 1: for profit. And I do think it is tough enough
• 1:27:39
  Speaker 1: to fix this system in an administration that is trying
• 1:27:43
  Speaker 1: to fix the system, but can't, like I would say
• 1:27:45
  Speaker 1: the Biden administration. But, you know, unfortunately, the Trump administration
• 1:27:50
  Speaker 1: has now seen a lot of these stories. They've read them,
• 1:27:52
  Speaker 1: they've responded to them. And basically their response is, we
• 1:27:55
  Speaker 1: don't fucking care. And in some ways they're trying to,
• 1:27:59
  Speaker 1: it feels like, scare people from coming here. and using
• 1:28:03
  Speaker 1: it as a lesson, you know?
• 1:28:04
  Speaker 3: I mean, there's just so many layers to what I
• 1:28:07
  Speaker 3: saw and what I witnessed. And again, so many different
• 1:28:10
  Speaker 3: stories because you have people who are getting deported and
• 1:28:12
  Speaker 3: then you also have people seeking asylum. And so I don't,
• 1:28:17
  Speaker 3: don't have the answers of how we can make change
• 1:28:21
  Speaker 3: but i am trying i am trying to use my
• 1:28:24
  Speaker 3: voice i think the more people that come forward and
• 1:28:28
  Speaker 3: speak out because again like i said a lot of
• 1:28:31
  Speaker 3: people are really scared to use their voice on purpose
• 1:28:34
  Speaker 3: right They want us to live in fear. And that
• 1:28:39
  Speaker 3: is why I'm reaching out or you reach out to me,
• 1:28:43
  Speaker 3: but people like you with big platforms. that see this
• 1:28:49
  Speaker 3: and hear this and they're like, okay, how do we
• 1:28:52
  Speaker 3: actually make a change? Because again, this is wasting so
• 1:28:58
  Speaker 3: many taxpayer dollars that is so unnecessary. And completely inhumane.
• 1:29:05
  Speaker 3: I saw a lot of comments where they thought that
• 1:29:09
  Speaker 3: I was lying about being in chains. And it was funny,
• 1:29:15
  Speaker 3: when I got taken to the airport, I could hear
• 1:29:18
  Speaker 3: them on the radio because my story had been out.
• 1:29:20
  Speaker 3: So there was media waiting for me at the airport.
• 1:29:23
  Speaker 3: And I could hear them on the radio being like,
• 1:29:25
  Speaker 3: do not let the media see her in chains. And
• 1:29:28
  Speaker 3: the car kept circling and circling. And they ended up
• 1:29:30
  Speaker 3: sneaking me into the airport so no one would see me. So, yeah,
• 1:29:39
  Speaker 3: it's a lot. And listen, I had it easier than
• 1:29:42
  Speaker 3: everyone else, right? This other Canadian actually just reached out
• 1:29:47
  Speaker 3: to me and he was in there for 32 days.
• 1:29:50
  Speaker 3: And he had a passport and everything. So, I truly believe...
• 1:29:55
  Speaker 3: I would still be in there right now. Like, truly,
• 1:29:58
  Speaker 3: I would still be in there. So I don't know.
• 1:30:02
  Speaker 3: What do you what do you think? Like you've worked
• 1:30:04
  Speaker 3: in politics. What do you think?
• 1:30:06
  Speaker 1: I mean, I've never been at more of a loss
• 1:30:09
  Speaker 1: than I am right now, especially on this issue. And
• 1:30:11
  Speaker 1: I do think, like you said, I think we just
• 1:30:14
  Speaker 1: everyone needs to start speaking out. Everyone needs to realize
• 1:30:17
  Speaker 1: that when this happens, you might think, oh, this could
• 1:30:19
  Speaker 1: never happen to me. Or, you know, I'm a legal resident.
• 1:30:23
  Speaker 1: I have a visa. I'm doing this the right way. Look,
• 1:30:26
  Speaker 1: they're even talking about, you know, denaturalizing citizens in this
• 1:30:30
  Speaker 1: country now. And so I think that people need to
• 1:30:33
  Speaker 1: get loud and speak up and talk to their members
• 1:30:36
  Speaker 1: of Congress. And, you know, at some point, peaceful protests,
• 1:30:40
  Speaker 1: I think, are going to be in order. And so. Yeah,
• 1:30:43
  Speaker 1: we're going through a lot here south of the border,
• 1:30:44
  Speaker 1: as you guys know. Because now it's affecting all of
• 1:30:50
  Speaker 1: you as well.
• 1:30:50
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, it's working. The amount of people that
• 1:30:53
  Speaker 3: have said that they're scared to travel right now is
• 1:30:57
  Speaker 3: so alarming. And it's so sad because we're your neighbors. Yeah.
• 1:31:04
  Speaker 3: And no one, I'm talking no one, deserves what they
• 1:31:08
  Speaker 3: do to you in there. It's sick. I just... Thank
• 1:31:14
  Speaker 3: God I have done so much work on myself. What
• 1:31:18
  Speaker 3: I witnessed in there was so gut wrenching. Just these
• 1:31:22
  Speaker 3: women haven't seen their children in months and I'm just
• 1:31:25
  Speaker 3: trying to console whoever I can. And you're like, I
• 1:31:31
  Speaker 3: don't understand how this is happening. Like truly there were
• 1:31:34
  Speaker 3: moments where I'm like, falling being like i don't understand
• 1:31:39
  Speaker 3: this this doesn't make sense how can this be happening
• 1:31:44
  Speaker 3: and uh there has something has to change this this
• 1:31:49
  Speaker 3: is it has to.
• 1:31:50
  Speaker 1: Yeah well jasmine i'm i'm i'm so glad that that
• 1:31:53
  Speaker 1: you're okay and that you're back home and on behalf
• 1:31:57
  Speaker 1: of uh as many americans as as possible hopefully most
• 1:32:01
  Speaker 1: people in this country i apologize for how you were
• 1:32:03
  Speaker 1: treated and um Thank you for sharing your story and
• 1:32:06
  Speaker 1: thank you for speaking out. And please let me know
• 1:32:10
  Speaker 1: how we can help here.
• 1:32:11
  Speaker 3: Yeah, truly. Honestly, I'm trying to get my essay in
• 1:32:14
  Speaker 3: as many hands and ears and eyes as possible. And
• 1:32:18
  Speaker 3: podcasts like this, just the more people that... see it
• 1:32:23
  Speaker 3: and are aware that this is happening. And then I
• 1:32:25
  Speaker 3: encourage other people who have gone through this to start
• 1:32:28
  Speaker 3: speaking out, you know, numbers count. And so I think
• 1:32:33
  Speaker 3: that's our best bet on something like this.
• 1:32:35
  Speaker 1: I agree. Thank you. Thank you for coming on and
• 1:32:38
  Speaker 1: sharing your story. Of course.
• 1:32:40
  Speaker 3: Thank you so much for having me.
• 1:32:47
  Speaker 1: That's our show for today. Everyone have a great weekend. Oh,
• 1:32:50
  Speaker 1: we will be in your feed on Sunday for a
• 1:32:54
  Speaker 1: special bonus episode. I interviewed Ezra Klein and Derek Thompson
• 1:32:58
  Speaker 1: about their new book, Abundance. They came here to LA
• 1:33:00
  Speaker 1: and they came to the studio and we had a
• 1:33:01
  Speaker 1: nice long conversation that was going to be the interview
• 1:33:04
  Speaker 1: on this episode, but it ended up being so long
• 1:33:07
  Speaker 1: and interesting. We decided, all right, we're going to do
• 1:33:09
  Speaker 1: a whole bonus episode about it. So you will hear
• 1:33:11
  Speaker 1: that on Sunday and then Love it, and Tommy and
• 1:33:14
  Speaker 1: I will be back in your feed with a brand
• 1:33:16
  Speaker 1: new PSA on Tuesday. Bye, everyone. If you want to
• 1:33:20
  Speaker 1: listen to Pod Save America ad-free or get access to
• 1:33:23
  Speaker 1: our subscriber Discord and exclusive podcasts, consider joining our Friends
• 1:33:27
  Speaker 1: of the Pod community at cricket.com slash friends or subscribe
• 1:33:30
  Speaker 1: on Apple Podcasts directly from the Pod Save America feed. Also,
• 1:33:34
  Speaker 1: be sure to follow Pod Save America on TikTok, Instagram, Twitter,
• 1:33:37
  Speaker 1: and YouTube for full episodes, bonus content, and more. And
• 1:33:41
  Speaker 1: before you hit that next button, you can help boost
• 1:33:42
  Speaker 1: this episode by leaving us a review and by sharing
• 1:33:45
  Speaker 1: it with friends and family. Pod Save America is a
• 1:33:48
  Speaker 1: Crooked Media production. Our producers are David Toledo and Saul Rubin.
• 1:33:52
  Speaker 1: Our associate producer is Farrah Safari. Reid Cherlin is our
• 1:33:55
  Speaker 1: executive editor and Adrian Hill is our executive producer. The
• 1:33:58
  Speaker 1: show is mixed and edited by Andrew Chadwick. Jordan Cantor
• 1:34:02
  Speaker 1: is our sound engineer with audio support from Kyle Seglin
• 1:34:05
  Speaker 1: and Charlotte Landis. Madeline Herringer is our head of news
• 1:34:07
  Speaker 1: and programming. Matt DeGroat is our head of production. Naomi
• 1:34:11
  Speaker 1: Sengel is our executive assistant. Thanks to our digital team,
• 1:34:14
  Speaker 1: Elijah Cohn, Haley Jones, Ben Hethcote, Mia Kelman, Molly Lobel,
• 1:34:18
  Speaker 1: Kirill Pelleviv, and David Tolles. Our production staff is proudly
• 1:34:21
  Speaker 1: unionized with the Writers Guild of America East.