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135: Mithula Umakanth - From International Badminton Star to Finance Scholar · Career Clarity with Athletes: A 2ndwind Podcast with Ryan Gonsalves

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: when I was towards the end of my sporting career.
• 0:02
  Speaker 1: That was the hardest for me.
• 0:04
  Speaker 1: That was like the time when I thought, okay, this is the time I should be exploring other things and not just stick to sports, because initially that's what I thought I would be doing for the rest of my life.
• 0:14
  Speaker 1: And so I tried working in public policy, I tried working in a non-profit organization, I tried working with big corporate firms and somewhere I just felt like I wasn't ready for it.
• 0:26
  Speaker 1: And also I felt like I was still in the process of grieving the loss that I just had, with one career ending and then suddenly shifting on to something that you've never thought of in your life.
• 0:39
  Speaker 1: And in this process I lost myself and then found myself again.
• 0:45
  Speaker 1: And now, four or five years down the line since I first got injured, I finally feel like I'm at a place where I'm comfortable with who I am.
• 0:59
  Speaker 2: Hi, I'm Ryan Gonsalves and welcome to a Second Wind Academy podcast, a show all about career transition through the lens of elite athletes.
• 1:10
  Speaker 2: Each week, I invite a guest to the show who shares their unique sporting story.
• 1:15
  Speaker 2: Please join me to delve into the thoughts and actions of athletes through a series of conversations.
• 1:20
  Speaker 2: Don't worry, there's plenty to learn from those of you that aren't particularly sporty.
• 1:25
  Speaker 2: Elite athletes are still people after all.
• 1:28
  Speaker 2: Let's be inspired by the stories of others.
• 1:34
  Speaker 3: Mia, welcome to the show.
• 1:36
  Speaker 1: Thank you, ryan.
• 1:37
  Speaker 1: Thank you for having me today, and I really appreciate it, and I'd love to be a part of such a community, so thank you for welcoming me.
• 1:44
  Speaker 3: Absolutely Listen.
• 1:45
  Speaker 3: The pleasure is definitely all mine.
• 1:46
  Speaker 3: It was good to chat with you well, I guess late last year and good to reconnect with you again to pick a little bit about your story to date.
• 1:55
  Speaker 3: I think there's a lot that well I've taken away from it and I'm sure that others can learn as well.
• 2:00
  Speaker 3: So I appreciate you taking out the time to join us here on the Second Wind Academy podcast today.
• 2:05
  Speaker 3: Now let myself and everyone else who's listening know a little bit about who you are or, more importantly, what you're up to and where you're at today.
• 2:15
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and me.
• 2:16
  Speaker 1: I'm also Mithula Umarkant, who is the international badminton player up until a few years ago.
• 2:21
  Speaker 1: I'm currently pursuing a master's of finance at University of California, irvine.
• 2:27
  Speaker 1: This was a long journey, going from studies court and then back to studies, so we will be covering that shortly, but I don't want to get too much into it right now.
• 2:38
  Speaker 1: I did complete a postgraduate diploma when I was in India, focusing again on finance and entrepreneurship, because those were areas that I'm really interested in, and I just knew that I wanted to get more exposure and see the world and explore everything that is out there, and so I decided to bring to my master's in the United States.
• 2:58
  Speaker 3: And how long have you been there now?
• 3:00
  Speaker 1: It's about five and a half months so far.
• 3:03
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so I'm closing in on my six month anniversary soon.
• 3:07
  Speaker 3: Fantastic.
• 3:07
  Speaker 3: Listen.
• 3:08
  Speaker 3: It's so good to get to chat to you again so early into at least your latest adventures overseas.
• 3:16
  Speaker 3: What do you think has been one of the biggest differences from being at home?
• 3:20
  Speaker 1: let's say oh a lot.
• 3:23
  Speaker 1: I've learned a lot of new things about me itself, which is astonishing for me.
• 3:28
  Speaker 1: I was not a night owl.
• 3:29
  Speaker 1: I used to be at bed at 10 pm and now I'm not in bed until two or three in the morning.
• 3:34
  Speaker 1: That's the biggest change.
• 3:36
  Speaker 1: I've met so many new people, so many new cultures, so many new food, but through all of that I still somehow felt like I was at home.
• 3:44
  Speaker 1: Very surprising for me, because I didn't know I could adapt to change as quickly as I have over here.
• 3:49
  Speaker 1: But it's been a very, very interesting journey, especially because I feel I was prepared for it.
• 3:54
  Speaker 1: I feel like I came with it with the athlete mindset that I always had, but I just changed it in the current world that I am, and that's what made change very easy.
• 4:06
  Speaker 1: That's what made adapting to a new country, to new laws and cultures very easy and making friends in a completely new world very easy.
• 4:15
  Speaker 3: Yeah, do you know I love and we're going to touch on the athlete mindset a little bit more One of the bits that actually astonishes me, if I'll use that word, is sleep.
• 4:24
  Speaker 3: Is one of the bits that actually astonishes me, if I'll use that word is you sleep is one of the most important things when we think about being an athlete.
• 4:30
  Speaker 3: That recovery, that, that sleep pattern and the habits that we would drill into ourselves here.
• 4:36
  Speaker 3: You've just spoken about a complete shift in.
• 4:39
  Speaker 3: Well, what sounds like your body clock and working hours.
• 4:41
  Speaker 3: What do you put that down to?
• 4:43
  Speaker 3: And secondly, how do you think that's impacted your performance or your focus?
• 4:49
  Speaker 1: I would like to think that it hasn't impacted my focus as much, because I'm still doing decently well in my academics, while managing everything else in this new country and the craziness that I've gotten myself into.
• 5:00
  Speaker 1: I have definitely made new friends.
• 5:03
  Speaker 1: I've is like family, and I think that's what really has pushed my bedtime as well, because you usually get time only in the nights to hang out with your friends and also study.
• 5:15
  Speaker 1: That's probably why my bedtime is pushed.
• 5:18
  Speaker 1: I still do workout and I still follow my routine, especially whenever I can as an athlete, what I used to do.
• 5:25
  Speaker 1: I still try and do that and I think that's what's keeping me sane, but I don't think my focus has shifted.
• 5:31
  Speaker 3: That's interesting that we've delved into another topic for me there.
• 5:34
  Speaker 3: I'll have to pick your brain on another call then about this sleep pattern, well, and that shift, just that whole recovery piece.
• 5:41
  Speaker 3: But again, I suppose it leads into this overall change and we're here talking about that career transition, but I suppose there's also I couldn't forget that athletic transition that you've gone through, and here you're talking about social, so even your surroundings, and creating friends like family, so within this or surrounding this shift for you.
• 6:05
  Speaker 1: I guess we've got all of these different factors that that could be considered yes, all of these factors have have been very impactful, and I think that just there's a lot of things that is coming at you at once, a lot of overwhelming things that are not in your control.
• 6:25
  Speaker 1: I think that's also another aspect of change that we as athletes get used to, but also not used to.
• 6:31
  Speaker 1: When we're going through this transition, and especially like when I was towards the end of my sporting career, that was the hardest for me and I'm sure we'll touch on that.
• 6:41
  Speaker 1: But that was like the time when I thought, okay, this is the time I should be exploring other things and not just stick to sports, because initially that's what I thought I would be doing for the rest of my life.
• 6:52
  Speaker 1: And so I tried working in public policy, I tried working in a nonprofit organization, I tried working with big corporate firms and somewhere I just felt like I wasn't ready for it, and also I felt like I was still in the process of grieving the loss that I just had, with one career ending and then suddenly shifting onto something that you've never thought of in your life.
• 7:18
  Speaker 1: And in this process I lost myself and then found myself again, and now, four or five years down the line since I first got injured.
• 7:29
  Speaker 1: I finally feel like I'm at a place where I'm comfortable with who I am and I think that process of change and adaption is what really this whole foreign experience also is.
• 7:41
  Speaker 3: Well, yeah, by going through.
• 7:44
  Speaker 3: Like you say, the process is about change.
• 7:47
  Speaker 3: It's adapting to that change, and you have thrown yourself in another environment or another change by moving countries.
• 7:55
  Speaker 3: It sounds like there's been some great experimentation beforehand, but you've really upped the change and, I guess, tested yourself in terms of that adaptability or your ability to really thrive in this new environment.
• 8:09
  Speaker 3: We'll come back to where you are in the US and some of the lessons that have come out of it To give us context, then, as to what's got you here today.
• 8:17
  Speaker 3: Let's go all the way back.
• 8:18
  Speaker 3: Let's talk a bit about you growing up sport back home.
• 8:22
  Speaker 3: So where was home and how did sport start to influence your life?
• 8:28
  Speaker 1: so home is bangalore in india and I played badminton.
• 8:33
  Speaker 1: So I started playing badminton when I was nine.
• 8:36
  Speaker 1: This was a very how would I say it was an ad hoc event, actually, because one of our family friends used to play badminton herself.
• 8:44
  Speaker 1: She was a national champion and I was a chubby kid and then my parents were looking at ways to get me fit and they suggested why don't you try badminton?
• 8:55
  Speaker 1: She might find it fun, because before that I was doing dancing and everything.
• 8:58
  Speaker 1: It was just not working out for me.
• 8:59
  Speaker 1: So I picked up the racket and within six months I won my first national medal, which was crazy at that time already, and so they were like oh, we found something that she's good at and we're going to do this now.
• 9:12
  Speaker 1: I think I just catapulted my way into badminton like that and it had a huge impact.
• 9:19
  Speaker 1: My whole life was around badminton, including my study schedule, and my whole life schedule was around badminton for all the childhood that I can think of.
• 9:27
  Speaker 1: But it was also a lot of fun.
• 9:29
  Speaker 1: It taught me a lot of lessons.
• 9:30
  Speaker 1: It taught me how to deal with pain, how to deal with with winning, how to deal with losing as well, dealing with how to be dominant throughout, how to be consistent with training every day also how to plan a lot of different things like that.
• 9:49
  Speaker 1: But that's what I really picked up when I was an athlete back home and and so, thinking about you growing up, you found this sport.
• 9:59
  Speaker 3: It sounds like your parents, already by eight, nine, were quite desperate to get you out and active.
• 10:03
  Speaker 3: At what point?
• 10:05
  Speaker 3: So, yeah, okay, nine years old, you win a national championship.
• 10:09
  Speaker 3: At what point did you start to think this is a career?
• 10:14
  Speaker 1: there's something else here I think that would be after my first national championship medal, but I would say the first national championship medal in this senior category.
• 10:26
  Speaker 1: So if I was under 13, I was already winning under 15 national championship.
• 10:31
  Speaker 1: And that's when we realized that, oh, this girl has some talent and even like some renowned coaches in India were seeing that and I was lucky enough to have them as my mentors and coaches all through my life.
• 10:45
  Speaker 1: So I think all of those factors really helped and I also.
• 10:49
  Speaker 1: I fell in love with the sport, and when you fall in love with something that's so interesting and you want to do every day, it just becomes something that you want to do.
• 10:58
  Speaker 3: Yeah, that's right.
• 10:59
  Speaker 3: Well, what is it about the sport that you fell in love with?
• 11:02
  Speaker 1: A lot of things.
• 11:03
  Speaker 1: It was was fast-paced, it was a lot of strategic thinking, it was doing the thing that you're doing, but doing it perfectly, and so this is something that one of my mentors told me when I was very young.
• 11:15
  Speaker 1: His name is Mr Prakash Bhavikon, and this is something that he constantly drills us about, even to this day.
• 11:22
  Speaker 1: So he says that sport, or anything in life, is about the three d's discipline, determination and dedication, and I think those three are the things that also made me fall in love with the sport, because I just fell in love with how you can innovate a stroke, make it a little more perfect, make it a little more accurate.
• 11:43
  Speaker 1: You make it a little more accurate.
• 11:44
  Speaker 1: You can play the same thing in a different way, you can start anticipating the opponent in this way, and for me, all of that was very fascinating.
• 11:52
  Speaker 1: I enjoyed every bit of it, and I think that's why I fell in love with the sport.
• 11:57
  Speaker 3: Brilliant when you were falling in love.
• 11:58
  Speaker 3: 13, 14, 15 years old were you falling in love?
• 12:00
  Speaker 3: Is 13, 14, 15 years old?
• 12:03
  Speaker 3: Were you falling in love with a sport?
• 12:04
  Speaker 3: Where did academia play?
• 12:08
  Speaker 3: What role did that start to play in your life?
• 12:11
  Speaker 1: academia was on the back foot.
• 12:13
  Speaker 1: I'll be completely honest as an athlete in india, especially who's doing decently well, you usually start focusing more on the sport itself because you achieve a state of celebrity around your local surrounding.
• 12:27
  Speaker 1: So everyone's like, oh, this person has to go and win the next championship.
• 12:31
  Speaker 1: Like, if you're not winning that, then what are you?
• 12:33
  Speaker 1: So the entire focus was on the sport and not on my academics.
• 12:37
  Speaker 1: My school was very supportive, actually at that point.
• 12:40
  Speaker 1: They were like you're doing amazingly well in sport, go ahead, yeah, and you just have to come and write your exams and we'll help you in preparing for it, help you learn what you need to learn and progress to the next grade.
• 12:51
  Speaker 1: So all my life, especially all my badminton lives, I was mostly focused on sport itself.
• 12:57
  Speaker 1: It wasn't until I really got injured and then, towards the end of it, where I was almost done with the injury I I was like I want something else.
• 13:05
  Speaker 1: It's when I actually start focusing on academics again.
• 13:08
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 13:08
  Speaker 3: So for you study school, definitely play was second to sport.
• 13:14
  Speaker 3: So at what point does it become full time, or when were you able to leave school and focus or make a decision to focus full time to an extent on sport or make a?
• 13:23
  Speaker 1: decision to focus full-time to an extent on sport.
• 13:25
  Speaker 1: For me again, I was a special case because when I was 13, like I mentioned, I already was winning under-15 titles.
• 13:31
  Speaker 1: So because of that and because they saw that I had the talent, I transitioned into playing full-time from when I was 13 itself.
• 13:38
  Speaker 1: It's not common for someone that early on, but it really depends on your support system.
• 13:44
  Speaker 1: Maybe your parents want you to do it full-time, so maybe they'll hire coaches and everything, but for me that was the case, yeah.
• 13:50
  Speaker 1: So I started playing it full-time when I was 13, and so that's high school like middle school, and high school were spent in badminton.
• 13:58
  Speaker 3: A couple of questions then, to just to give context how far did you dream of going in badminton?
• 14:05
  Speaker 3: What was that dream?
• 14:06
  Speaker 3: What was that target for you?
• 14:07
  Speaker 3: I'm a football player.
• 14:09
  Speaker 3: Football, massive, global, everyone, it's everything, not just Olympics, but across all the sport, the money that's in it.
• 14:16
  Speaker 3: I can see it across all these different sports.
• 14:19
  Speaker 3: Badminton to me, I will watch religiously every four years at the Olympics, right, but I don't know much more about badminton on a global scale or on an India scale.
• 14:31
  Speaker 3: How big is badminton in India and where could it get you to?
• 14:36
  Speaker 1: So badminton is huge.
• 14:38
  Speaker 1: Starting from India, it's the second biggest sport in India right now.
• 14:41
  Speaker 1: It comes just after cricket.
• 14:43
  Speaker 1: Cricket is richer than the international cricket association, so the indian cricket association is richer than the international cricket association.
• 14:51
  Speaker 1: The next richest sport in india is badminton and some of our biggest stars that come out of our indian sport, especially badminton, have landed in the firm's richest athletes section.
• 15:03
  Speaker 1: If that gives you a context of how much money is there in badminton, in India Because it did On a global scale.
• 15:09
  Speaker 3: It's just amazing, those stats, those numbers, as you call it.
• 15:13
  Speaker 3: I just thought it shocked me.
• 15:14
  Speaker 3: I'm sure many of those listening will be like, yeah, didn't everyone know that I'm like this is good?
• 15:18
  Speaker 3: Yeah, so please keep going.
• 15:21
  Speaker 1: Yeah, on a global scale scale, badminton is picking up now.
• 15:27
  Speaker 1: Traditionally it's more of an asian and a european sport, but right now it's picking up in the us as well and obviously it's also moving down south in australia and new zealand and I think, as more people kind of migrate and go on to these different continents, it's just going to grow.
• 15:39
  Speaker 1: Especially with the 2028 la olympics, we're going to see a lot more activity in the US On a global scale.
• 15:45
  Speaker 1: There are a lot of endorsements, there are a lot of tournaments and championships, just like tennis.
• 15:51
  Speaker 1: There's Wimbledon.
• 15:52
  Speaker 1: In badminton there's something known as All England Championships.
• 15:55
  Speaker 1: That's something that happens every year and it's like the biggest championship in the world for badminton other than the World Championship, of course.
• 16:02
  Speaker 1: And there's also something known as the world super series finals.
• 16:06
  Speaker 1: That happens every year.
• 16:07
  Speaker 1: It used to be in dubai, but now it keeps changing, sometimes in china, sometimes in a different asian country, but those are like the biggest events other than the olympics, of course, and the prize money is also in an increasingly high amount these days, but we're not going to get into those numbers.
• 16:25
  Speaker 3: No.
• 16:25
  Speaker 3: So then for you, growing up in India, you a young teenager, you're a national player.
• 16:32
  Speaker 3: Tell me, where were the dreams?
• 16:36
  Speaker 1: What did you want to achieve?
• 16:37
  Speaker 1: For me, I was lucky.
• 16:38
  Speaker 1: I also had the liberty to dream a lot.
• 16:40
  Speaker 1: So for me, I wanted to be an Olympic champion.
• 16:44
  Speaker 1: I wanted to win the gold medal.
• 16:44
  Speaker 1: For our country, that meant to win the Olympic championship.
• 16:48
  Speaker 1: You also would mean winning the All England, winning the world championships, being world number one and all the yada yada that goes with it.
• 16:55
  Speaker 1: That was my dream and I was on the road to reach that dream.
• 17:01
  Speaker 3: I was actually the youngest on the international team it for I used to play doubles and mixed doubles, and I was the youngest women player in the international team when I did join it and I was preparing for it, and so, yeah, I was where I ended up reaching at least yeah, that's brilliant to well get into number one, getting making that national team in the second most popular sport in a country of over a billion people, and for you to be doing that at a young age is clearly fantastic, and I'm sure at the time it was feeling good and you really could see where your career was going.
• 17:36
  Speaker 3: So what happened?
• 17:38
  Speaker 1: Everything was going great.
• 17:39
  Speaker 1: My cardio finally felt like it was getting off to where I wanted it to, but then I ended up getting injured in my wrist.
• 17:45
  Speaker 1: So this was a very rare case.
• 17:47
  Speaker 1: It was called avascular necrosis to my lunate bone, which is a specific bone in the nine bones that are there in the wrist, and that essentially meant that the bone was not receiving enough blood supply and started dying out.
• 18:00
  Speaker 1: There's no stability in your wrist and there's also no given method of solving this problem, so the treatment was all trial and error.
• 18:10
  Speaker 1: I ended up getting two surgeries for it, one in Mumbai and one in Austria.
• 18:15
  Speaker 1: The second one, at least, was a fairly new treatment that they had devised, and by the time I got back, covid also happened, and obviously that set me back in my whole rehabilitation and the entire process of getting back into sport.
• 18:28
  Speaker 1: So I was injured for about five years or so, yeah, and I pushed through it.
• 18:35
  Speaker 1: I played for the majority of those five years, but then towards the end of it I felt like it was a lot.
• 18:42
  Speaker 1: It was too draining, and so I wanted to see what else I can do.
• 18:47
  Speaker 3: So you're number one.
• 18:47
  Speaker 3: You're in the national teams, you're in the Olympic prep teams preparing for that Olympic cycle to come through.
• 18:53
  Speaker 3: This injury sets you back and for someone so young, all you'd known was growing up that badminton at that point.
• 19:00
  Speaker 3: So during that period, what were one of the what probably the biggest challenge mentally that you were facing at that point?
• 19:03
  Speaker 3: So during that period, what were one of the what was probably the biggest challenge mentally that you were facing at that time?
• 19:08
  Speaker 1: there were a lot of challenges.
• 19:10
  Speaker 1: To be honest, um, it felt like something that I knew all my life was just being taken away from me.
• 19:16
  Speaker 1: But actually this is something that mr gopichan he's the chief national coach in india.
• 19:22
  Speaker 1: He told me that if you can't train, if you can't play with your hand, it's okay.
• 19:27
  Speaker 1: Make sure that you continue to train your other body parts, make sure you're still fit and make sure that you're not starting from zero or back, but you're starting from where you left off and just think about what you can do right now, in this particular moment.
• 19:42
  Speaker 1: Don't worry about what you can't control, because I can't do the surgery or I can't make my wrist better myself, but I can work on myself.
• 19:50
  Speaker 1: I can stay positive as much as I can.
• 19:53
  Speaker 1: I can indulge in the activities that I wanted to do.
• 19:57
  Speaker 1: I remember I started doing Zumba during that period because I just wanted to try it.
• 20:00
  Speaker 1: I did Pilates for a while because I wanted to try something new, and then I definitely started watching korean dramas at that point.
• 20:12
  Speaker 1: I think that's how I ended up learning korean too.
• 20:13
  Speaker 1: So I started doing these activities and distracted myself.
• 20:15
  Speaker 1: Oh, another thing was I stayed away from badminton.
• 20:18
  Speaker 1: I never went to the court.
• 20:19
  Speaker 1: I never watched any of my peers play, I just swore off it.
• 20:23
  Speaker 1: I used to just go to the gym and I used to just go back home.
• 20:27
  Speaker 3: During this period of being injured, with the hope of coming back to play, you stayed away.
• 20:32
  Speaker 3: What made you think that was the best approach for you?
• 20:37
  Speaker 1: for me that was the best approach, because when I would see somebody else playing or doing something, I'm someone who, like when I see somebody playing badminton, I want to play, and once I start playing I don't feel any pain, especially when I'm playing.
• 20:52
  Speaker 1: But I know I'll feel the pain afterwards.
• 20:54
  Speaker 1: But when I'm playing I don't feel the pain.
• 20:56
  Speaker 1: So I knew it would be too hard for me to go back on court and see the others playing the sport itself, and so I ended up staying away from it for as long as I couldn't play.
• 21:07
  Speaker 1: So let's say I was the entire process of having the surgery and rehab was around six months.
• 21:12
  Speaker 1: So for those six months I did not go to the court unless I had to go do some footwork drills or like something that really needed me to be back on court.
• 21:21
  Speaker 1: And even at that time I would usually end up going when nobody else was playing, because I don't see others playing, but I'm still doing what I needed to do.
• 21:30
  Speaker 1: And another thing that I did was I used to visualize myself playing on court again when I was good, because I didn't want to see others play, but I wanted to see myself playing again.
• 21:40
  Speaker 1: So I would visualize myself playing at those times and I think that helped a lot, because immediately after my first surgery I played a national championship the senior national championship and I won a bronze medal.
• 21:52
  Speaker 1: That was a trial tournament that we wanted to do, so I ended up winning a bronze medal in that championship and I went on to play in the Asian championship with the team for India again.
• 22:03
  Speaker 1: My race did not get better but I was still injured.
• 22:07
  Speaker 1: But I did end up doing all of that and I felt my approach really helped me at that point.
• 22:12
  Speaker 3: That's an interesting approach to take.
• 22:14
  Speaker 3: It is.
• 22:14
  Speaker 3: It certainly served you, and certainly one I'm going to think about a little bit more as well.
• 22:19
  Speaker 3: So, given that return, the, what is it that made you think now's the time to retire?
• 22:27
  Speaker 1: I was injured for five years and it just felt like it was too prolonged.
• 22:32
  Speaker 1: And I was too young, like at that point when, at the end of my fifth year, I was still just 22.
• 22:39
  Speaker 1: And I was like I can't be doing this for the rest of my life and I felt very stuck in a place where I didn't want to be.
• 22:47
  Speaker 1: And so I was like what else is there that I can do?
• 22:51
  Speaker 1: I wanted to see what else I am capable of as a person, because I thought that it was too restrictive to be just a badminton player.
• 22:59
  Speaker 1: I appreciate it truly, but then I felt like there's more to me than just that and I wanted to explore that side of me.
• 23:05
  Speaker 3: So, given that, when did you start to realise this is going to be the end, and what did you do first?
• 23:13
  Speaker 1: So I started realising this would be the end, towards the end of the first COVID lockdown, like when I started going back to rehab and started playing again, because my wrist still hurt even after that and the only other option that the doctors again suggested was having a third surgery and I'd already had two.
• 23:33
  Speaker 1: I wasn't ready to go on for another surgery either, because it was just taking too much of a toll, mentally as well, because constantly getting surgeries is not easy, and that was also a point when I was like what else can I do right now?
• 23:47
  Speaker 1: That can change my trajectory and I find something that's interesting for me.
• 23:52
  Speaker 1: I love reading, so I started reading a lot of books what did you read?
• 23:58
  Speaker 1: I had phases, but I had this phase where I was reading a lot about Indian history and itihasa.
• 24:06
  Speaker 1: We call it itihasa, so that's the Ramayana and the Mahabharata.
• 24:08
  Speaker 1: I had a phase where I was reading a lot of crime and thrillers and mysteries.
• 24:13
  Speaker 1: I had a phase where I was reading a lot about financial statuses of banks and the crimes that all all happened in the past and through documentary style books.
• 24:24
  Speaker 1: There was this phrase where I used to read these feel-good books like the slice of life books.
• 24:30
  Speaker 1: That's actually a very good suggestion.
• 24:32
  Speaker 1: I would suggest everyone to read this book called the Forest of Wool and Steel.
• 24:36
  Speaker 1: That resonated with me a lot when I was trying and getting out of my fears.
• 24:40
  Speaker 1: I read it again now and was trying and getting out of my phase.
• 24:41
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and I read it again now and I get something totally out of it right, I was going to say what is it about that book recommendation?
• 24:47
  Speaker 3: it's something that we'll have to put in the show notes.
• 24:49
  Speaker 3: So what is it about that book recommendation that others should follow?
• 24:52
  Speaker 3: Gone, we're going to start Mia's book club now okay.
• 24:55
  Speaker 1: So I wouldn't say it's a suggestion.
• 24:57
  Speaker 1: I just feel it's more like an emotion, because when I read it for the first time I was sad with the way that the book was being like, led like, especially when he's going.
• 25:08
  Speaker 1: And so it's about this young guy who's learning how to tune pianos and he goes through the entire forest of wool and steel.
• 25:17
  Speaker 1: He calls it a forest of wool and steel because it's very, very peaceful and very tranquil for him when he's doing that exact work.
• 25:24
  Speaker 1: And getting to that space took him a lot of time.
• 25:26
  Speaker 1: The first time that I read it was very sad for me because I felt like I was exiting from my Forest of Bull and Steel.
• 25:33
  Speaker 1: But the next time I read it, which was pretty recently, I liked the book again because now I felt like I was entering into a new zone and I was entering into a new forest where I was, you know, finding myself again.
• 25:46
  Speaker 1: So it wasn't more about what's a suggestion from that book, but I felt like when you read it at different points of times, you have different perspectives and different relatability to that kind of book.
• 25:56
  Speaker 3: Well, there you go.
• 25:57
  Speaker 3: There's the recommendation.
• 25:58
  Speaker 3: It's something I'm now going to have to get as well.
• 26:00
  Speaker 3: So when we chat again, I'll be able to tell you at least my perspective on what I heard.
• 26:05
  Speaker 3: Coming back to you then, on exiting your forest of wool and steel hopefully, software you are entering it, but for you at that time, you've decided that it's time to exit the sport.
• 26:18
  Speaker 3: You're still young.
• 26:19
  Speaker 3: What did you decide to do?
• 26:23
  Speaker 1: The first thing I did was I got an internship in public policy.
• 26:26
  Speaker 1: Actually, and this is from one of my mentors that I used to speak to a little bit, but not that much.
• 26:33
  Speaker 1: I was just in touch with him and I told him that, hey, I think I'm going to quit sport because it's not working out for me anymore and I don't know what to do.
• 26:41
  Speaker 1: And he was like you should try, you should explore, go see different working spaces, try and understand what you really want to do and who you are as a person.
• 26:50
  Speaker 1: And so the first thing I did was join him and I was doing a lot of research work with him.
• 26:55
  Speaker 1: It was in macroeconomics and in political science so what I'm taking from this is great.
• 27:02
  Speaker 3: You spoke to someone you trusted and with that person you said look, you're ready to leave.
• 27:07
  Speaker 3: They give you what I think is also great advice, which is let's go out and get you trying something different, get you away from the sport, try something new.
• 27:15
  Speaker 3: Through their connections, they got you into public policy.
• 27:19
  Speaker 3: How did you know how to do research, use a computer, do this?
• 27:24
  Speaker 3: Where did you get that type of experience from, so you knew how to at least be effective?
• 27:30
  Speaker 1: so I think the one quality that he really liked was I used to read a lot even before I got into his internship, so we used to discuss about books and we just knew that I liked reading and if you're doing research, then you should know how to read.
• 27:43
  Speaker 1: So I think that was the the biggest skill that I had that he liked, and he also knew that I used to be an athlete and there are a lot of these transferable skills that we don't really know as athletes when we are doing it.
• 27:55
  Speaker 1: But now, when you're transitioning and when you're trying to figure out who you really are, is something that you really need to learn and identify.
• 28:02
  Speaker 1: I had those.
• 28:04
  Speaker 1: I think I was always on time.
• 28:06
  Speaker 1: I was very dedicated.
• 28:08
  Speaker 1: I would make sure I had my notes ready.
• 28:09
  Speaker 1: I was very strategic about whatever I was doing, like if I was doing something.
• 28:13
  Speaker 1: It was documented through and through.
• 28:16
  Speaker 2: There are too many stories of bankruptcies, mental health issues and, unfortunately, suicide, and so I think it's time to act.
• 28:23
  Speaker 2: Every year, we see thousands of athletes that reach a point where they need to consider their life after they leave sport.
• 28:30
  Speaker 2: This might be a retirement injury or the need to juggle dual careers, between sport and a job.
• 28:36
  Speaker 2: As a former English professional footballer, I have somehow managed to transition from sport into banking strategy, innovation and now life coach, career practitioner and founder of the Second Wind Academy.
• 28:50
  Speaker 2: So I want to help those around me find their career.
• 28:53
  Speaker 2: Second wind.
• 28:54
  Speaker 2: Find me on Insta or through my new Facebook group, Second Wind Academy, where I'd love to know your thoughts and suggestions.
• 29:03
  Speaker 3: I'm curious how did you know it wasn't something you wanted to be in?
• 29:13
  Speaker 1: For me it just took on like it felt a little too weighted when I was doing the job, because it was obviously it was more for the people and it felt like I was doing a lot of social work and empathizing with a lot of people.
• 29:22
  Speaker 1: And especially when you start empathizing a lot, you get into this feeling from other person's perspectives right, and when you're doing that, it is you itself and I myself was trying to get out of a very bad situation and then taking on another person's emotions or feelings was just getting too much for me.
• 29:41
  Speaker 1: Obviously, it was macroeconomics and political work, but when you come down, you have to also think about how those policies are going to impact the people that you're trying to reach.
• 29:52
  Speaker 1: And the people that you're trying to reach part was what was really weighing me down and I couldn't take that any longer.
• 29:58
  Speaker 1: So I knew at that point that was not something that I wanted to do for the long term.
• 30:03
  Speaker 3: How did that feel?
• 30:03
  Speaker 3: You're just coming from being a number one injuries stopping you from finalizing the dream.
• 30:10
  Speaker 3: And here you are, a few months into this internship, and you're like, well, this isn't for me, I'm done, is that quitting?
• 30:17
  Speaker 1: It felt like I was quitting and I felt very lost.
• 30:22
  Speaker 1: I'll be very honest I felt very lost.
• 30:24
  Speaker 1: I didn't know what I was doing with my life.
• 30:26
  Speaker 1: I think my biggest vent at that point was journaling.
• 30:30
  Speaker 1: I used to write every day and I used to write pages and pages of paper, but I don't even know what I used to write, but I was just writing it.
• 30:36
  Speaker 1: And, yeah, I was completely and utterly lost, but I had a very good support system.
• 30:40
  Speaker 1: I but I had a very good support system.
• 30:42
  Speaker 1: I thankfully still have a very good support system and I had a lot of people who helped me find other opportunities and find different avenues that I could explore.
• 30:52
  Speaker 1: So I wasn't ever idle at home and I think that was a very important thing for me, because I have this personality where I can't just sit in oneness and dwell on things.
• 31:01
  Speaker 1: I need to be doing something, and I think that's for most athletes too.
• 31:06
  Speaker 1: I don't think we can just stick and do nothing.
• 31:08
  Speaker 1: We need something, we need a game plan, and that was how it was for me, and so I was very lucky in that I had people around me who knew that, who respected that and who helped me get to that.
• 31:20
  Speaker 1: So I had very little transition time from this public policy internship into my next, which was in marketing sports marketing, sports business and sport marketing and that was also very interesting.
• 31:32
  Speaker 1: But again, when it got back into sports, it just came back a circle and I was again feeling weighted down because I couldn't play sports anymore, right?
• 31:41
  Speaker 1: So whatever I did with sport in those in that one year, I felt like I just wasn't ready for it and I was like I'm sorry, as much as I enjoy doing this, I can't go back to that because I just got out of it.
• 31:54
  Speaker 1: So that's how I ended up quitting all of those opportunities that I had, and it never felt like I was quitting, but it just felt like I'm lost and I don't know what to do next.
• 32:07
  Speaker 3: That's completely understandable.
• 32:08
  Speaker 3: I'm perhaps leading you, leading the witness, by using the word quitting, but it's one of those where, as athletes, you always feel you want to push and effectively succeed and, as you said, you were lost and you were therefore exploring a way out or through this current situation that you found yourself in, and I actually commend you because what you were able to do was you had the courage to go and try something public policy or going down in the sports, marketing and business route and been able then to have the courage to be able to say this isn't what I want to do, I'm destined for something else.
• 32:45
  Speaker 3: And then you were able to step out and proactively create your future by saying, right, I'm going to go and try something else.
• 32:51
  Speaker 3: I actually say that's bravo, it is a really good way to approach coming through or navigating a career transition, and so for you coming out then from this marketing, you had that courage to say look, this isn't for me at this moment.
• 33:05
  Speaker 3: How much did you then pause and get a game plan and put one in place?
• 33:10
  Speaker 1: a lot.
• 33:10
  Speaker 1: So at that point I decided that this was, I think, two years ago.
• 33:17
  Speaker 1: That was when I decided that I wanted to go abroad, because that's when I wanted to explore the different cultures and learn some words out there in the world and not just be secluded to what I was and as an athlete.
• 33:30
  Speaker 1: I had that opportunity because I got to travel a lot to Europe and across Asia and I wanted to do that a lot more and I wanted to do it for a longer term, and so I knew that this is what I wanted to do and I obviously needed time to get ready for that as well.
• 33:45
  Speaker 1: So that's why I stopped.
• 33:47
  Speaker 1: I did the postgraduate diploma for a year, which actually it was for a year.
• 33:51
  Speaker 1: So I did that and that was a requirement because that helped me prepare for myself academically, because up until this point, even my undergrad that I did, I was still playing, I was still an athlete, so it was on the back burner.
• 34:04
  Speaker 1: So this was the first original opportunity that I had to really focus on academics and come back with my A game.
• 34:12
  Speaker 1: And because I was back home in India with my support system around me, I always knew if I needed anything.
• 34:18
  Speaker 1: I always had people to fall back on and that just made that whole process of getting back into academics and preparing for a career abroad much, much easier for me than it probably would have been if I yeah.
• 34:32
  Speaker 3: So at that moment you took a pause to say, to figure out you want to go overseas, you wanted to explore something that was abroad.
• 34:38
  Speaker 3: To make that happen, you decided to go and study.
• 34:44
  Speaker 3: You did post a post-grad.
• 34:45
  Speaker 3: What was it in?
• 34:47
  Speaker 1: so it was in finance and entrepreneurship, because I wanted to do something other than that.
• 34:51
  Speaker 1: Like I had done marketing, I had done I had done product management, I had done a little bit of HR work and I didn't want to do operations.
• 34:59
  Speaker 1: So in business that only left with finance and I wanted to try that out.
• 35:03
  Speaker 1: So I ended up joining that course and then I ended up getting another internship in finance and I really enjoyed the finance aspect of that internship and so I knew that this is what I wanted to do, but it wasn't just that function.
• 35:17
  Speaker 1: I wanted to do something else and also explore other areas.
• 35:20
  Speaker 1: And so I honed in on finance at that point and yeah, and then I also knew like that's why I said that one year of the course that I did really helped me pick out what I wanted to do and also helped me come back or at least bring my A game when I'm coming here to study.
• 35:38
  Speaker 3: Yes, yeah, and so was the US.
• 35:40
  Speaker 1: Always that aspiration, yeah actually, I don't think I would call it an aspiration.
• 35:46
  Speaker 1: I think it was more like a goal.
• 35:47
  Speaker 1: I at this point, okay, so ever since, like, yeah, I quit playing sport.
• 35:53
  Speaker 1: I don't think I have any aspirations okay yeah, I don't think I have aspirations.
• 35:58
  Speaker 1: I think I'd rather live on setting short-term goals and achieving those goals and then setting new goals and achieving those.
• 36:06
  Speaker 1: I know this is something that a lot of life coaches and a lot of people will say, like have a long-term goal and then break it down into short-term goals and then break it down into tasks and blah, blah, blah.
• 36:16
  Speaker 1: But I think my perspective on that changed when sport changed, and so I decided that I would rather focus on what I can achieve in a day, in three months, in six months and probably a year than focus on what will happen five years down the line it's interesting.
• 36:33
  Speaker 3: You speak about grieving and you grieved the loss of badminton and what you there.
• 36:42
  Speaker 3: There was that aspiration, but that, that dream that you had, and it's like you then realized well, there's more to life and it's leave to live in the moment and enjoy it and be present, and it your description of that goes hand in hand with that description of grieving.
• 37:00
  Speaker 3: So it moved you away from saying there's no point in setting long-term goals because you never know what's going to happen.
• 37:06
  Speaker 3: I'm going to make the most of what I've got now and set much shorter term goals.
• 37:11
  Speaker 3: So for you then achieving the goal, like you said.
• 37:14
  Speaker 3: Now, I know you're in the US, but I'm curious who did you reach out to?
• 37:18
  Speaker 3: Because you've done a few things between now and where you are today.
• 37:23
  Speaker 3: So talk to me about reaching out to different networks and starting to connect.
• 37:26
  Speaker 3: What was it that started to open your eyes to these networks outside India?
• 37:32
  Speaker 1: We had a family friend who was living here in the US for almost 20, 30 years now.
• 37:37
  Speaker 1: So she was my first point of contact when I even thought of studying abroad, and she worked at Evenwam in California today, and I also have a few cousins in and around the us and I think that's why it we honed on to us, because, even like we have a support system, even though it's not something that we had tapped into before, we still know we at least have people around who can help us.
• 38:03
  Speaker 1: So I think that's why I honed into USA itself.
• 38:08
  Speaker 1: But other than that it was.
• 38:11
  Speaker 1: Usually I said this was something that comes from our culture as well.
• 38:15
  Speaker 1: As Indians, we are people who like communities and we always have a friend of a friend who is willing to help us, and so I think it was just that going out there and being vulnerable and saying I'm going to do this and I don't know if I'm doing the right thing.
• 38:33
  Speaker 1: What do you think?
• 38:35
  Speaker 3: I think that's what really opened up the network yes, yeah, you've mentioned your support network time and time again, both as an athlete and now in in this period of transition, and what's interesting is how that support network has moved and morphed from sporting to mentor family at home and abroad, and so tapping into that sounds like it has been a real well, I guess a strong source of strength for you, but also giving you direction and helped you make some of those decisions.
• 39:07
  Speaker 1: Yes, definitely, and I think my biggest support system, my biggest cheerleaders, my biggest friends whatever you want to call it are my parents.
• 39:19
  Speaker 1: I wouldn't be who I am without them.
• 39:20
  Speaker 1: I wouldn't even have the capability or the courage to do what I am if it wasn't for their encouragement.
• 39:23
  Speaker 1: And I've been very lucky in terms of my support system because, as I mentioned, the mentors that I've had they're all really amazing people and the mentors that I meet every day, even here in the US they're all really amazing people, really kind, and I learn something new from each and every one of them every time I meet them, and I just find that we as people are very interesting and there's always something that I can learn from these people and that's how I get my, my encouragement and my direction, because I'm just keen to learn more super interesting now.
• 40:02
  Speaker 3: So with that that desire to learn more, I'm interested in your time at EY and the program that you applied there.
• 40:12
  Speaker 1: Talk to me about how you found out about it and what you had to do to prepare to get into it basically for elite athletes who are either retired or are currently in the transition of retiring and it is an invitation only program.
• 40:32
  Speaker 1: I heard it through this firm called athlete career transitions.
• 40:36
  Speaker 1: It's led by andy moore.
• 40:38
  Speaker 1: I was introduced to athlete career transitions by one of my friends who himself was with them for a few months and he was like this is probably going to be perfect for you now that you're going abroad.
• 40:49
  Speaker 1: So they introduced me to this evite program and I did the application.
• 40:55
  Speaker 1: There wasn't much that I had to prepare.
• 40:57
  Speaker 1: I just had a conversation with their recruiting team and they liked who I was and they thought that I was a perfect fit for the program and that's how I ended up being a part of it.
• 41:09
  Speaker 1: So I think your story and how you portray, I think that's all that really matters.
• 41:15
  Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah and, and so in that program, because you're still in India at this time.
• 41:19
  Speaker 3: How geographically time-wise.
• 41:22
  Speaker 3: How did that fit in with where you wanted to be?
• 41:24
  Speaker 3: What time was it that you had to do?
• 41:27
  Speaker 3: Remind me the calls and the sessions.
• 41:32
  Speaker 1: So we started the program after I came to the United States.
• 41:35
  Speaker 1: We started it in September, and that was also my first quarter at UCI.
• 41:41
  Speaker 3: All right, okay, crazy, but that's me.
• 41:44
  Speaker 3: This is all coming together, then, for you, so you're doing the EY and doing your study as well.
• 41:50
  Speaker 1: Yes, crazy.
• 41:51
  Speaker 1: So I was okay to give you context.
• 41:54
  Speaker 1: I was a TA in that quarter.
• 41:55
  Speaker 1: I was in my first quarter over here and I had like four different subjects and I also had the EY athlete program to look at.
• 42:04
  Speaker 1: And for the EY athlete program, they used to have these workshops at 5 am.
• 42:09
  Speaker 1: It's not their fault.
• 42:11
  Speaker 1: They're really trying to be inclusive because athletes are going to be across the globe in this particular program and they're just trying to make sure that everyone is able to get on call and, like I said, I'm just glad it was me and not somebody else.
• 42:24
  Speaker 1: But yes, it was a very interesting experience to wake up at 5 am and listen to all of them talk about their experiences as an athlete, to meet some of the leadership at EY, to also learn so many new things from their experiences at being in EY for so long and also transitioning.
• 42:45
  Speaker 1: Some of them were athletes, so transitioning from being an athlete to a full-time corporate employee, so that was a very interesting experience.
• 42:51
  Speaker 3: What do you feel you took out from that experience and how is it helping you today?
• 42:56
  Speaker 1: I think the biggest learning that I had from the EY program was problem solving and critical thinking.
• 43:04
  Speaker 1: These are two aspects that they do cover in the entire course.
• 43:08
  Speaker 1: So, again, the course is broken down into three stages and you get to focus on the leadership track or the technology track, either the leadership track Some people do both the leadership and the technology track and through this course you will have like an introduction where you're doing design thinking, you're learning about microsoft, excel, powerpoint power, bi tableau data visualization isn't that but also like data analysis, like statistics and stuff.
• 43:34
  Speaker 1: Uh, while they're also doing like because I did leadership, then they are also learning about the different kinds of leadership how to lead teams, how to manage conflict within a team and stuff like that.
• 43:45
  Speaker 1: Uh, for me, problem solving was the biggest takeaway, because structuring your problem solving approach in a framework like maybe putting it in a decision tree or an issue tree, or like breaking it down into a fishbone diagram just to get to the root cause, stuff like that is not something that comes very naturally.
• 44:03
  Speaker 1: Like I know problem solving, but how do you do that in the business world?
• 44:07
  Speaker 1: I think that was my biggest takeaway fantastic.
• 44:11
  Speaker 3: I love all of those frameworks.
• 44:13
  Speaker 3: That's exactly where that's my sweet spot.
• 44:15
  Speaker 3: That's great.
• 44:16
  Speaker 3: We're getting to where we are today and I'm interested throughout all of the transition that you're going through To this point.
• 44:26
  Speaker 3: What has been the hardest part for you to navigate?
• 44:31
  Speaker 1: I think it was initially when I had to first move away from sport into something else.
• 44:36
  Speaker 1: Now that I look back I see that was the hardest point when it was for me because I was lost.
• 44:43
  Speaker 1: I didn't know what I wanted to do, I didn't know where I was, I didn't know what I was doing and I didn't know where I was.
• 44:47
  Speaker 1: I didn't know what I was doing and I was just lost.
• 44:49
  Speaker 1: But I think that was the hardest.
• 44:52
  Speaker 1: I didn't know it at that point.
• 44:53
  Speaker 1: But now that I look back I do know that was where I was probably lowest emotionally as well, it's funny you didn't know it at the time, because I can resonate with that.
• 45:04
  Speaker 3: I didn't realize that was a difficult moment in my life until I look back.
• 45:07
  Speaker 3: I'm curious then for you when you do look back, what is it about that situation or that time that tells you it was such a hard time?
• 45:16
  Speaker 1: I think it was just the fact that one I was lost, but two, I was very reluctant to ask for any help.
• 45:23
  Speaker 1: There was this period for probably like six months or a year, where I just didn't want to show anyone that I'm not doing well emotionally or physically at that point.
• 45:33
  Speaker 1: But I'm just like I'm going to tough it out.
• 45:35
  Speaker 1: I'm going to show everyone I'm always smiling and I'm happy and I'm okay, but you're not and it's okay to not be okay.
• 45:42
  Speaker 1: And that was a very hard lesson and it was very hard for me to first ask for help or ask someone like I don't know what I'm doing.
• 45:50
  Speaker 1: Can you tell me, can you teach me what I can probably do next?
• 45:54
  Speaker 1: And yeah, I think when I first did that it was very hard, but then slowly I saw how people were also welcoming and kind and willing to answer my questions and be very open and responsive and I think that kind of opened my mind and it made me more vulnerable.
• 46:15
  Speaker 3: Again, I can definitely see that my world, the bit about not asking for help is something I see at that period in my life as well, whereas typically now I'll just say, hey, can you help me do this?
• 46:26
  Speaker 3: I don't know how to do that and I'll quite naturally do it.
• 46:29
  Speaker 3: It's almost not being our, I'll say, authentic I can't think of a better word right now but not being our true self then at that moment.
• 46:37
  Speaker 3: Yeah, so right now, here you are, you're studying, definitely moving forward at least.
• 46:44
  Speaker 3: Then I'll say what's the short-term goal for you?
• 46:46
  Speaker 3: What are you in the US to achieve?
• 46:48
  Speaker 1: well immediately, right now, is getting a job and and yeah, I think I just want to get a job and pay off my own student loan and explore more of the United States.
• 47:00
  Speaker 1: I definitely want to go and travel across the United States, especially Midwest, and to the east coast from the west coast.
• 47:06
  Speaker 1: I want to like go across the United States, see especially Midwest, and to the East Coast, not on the West Coast.
• 47:09
  Speaker 1: I want to go across the United States, see how every state is different, because I hear a lot about how each state is different and I want to explore that and really see it for myself.
• 47:16
  Speaker 1: I think that's what I want to do in the Shackland right now.
• 47:20
  Speaker 3: And that's it, and I know well there isn't too much that goes beyond that.
• 47:23
  Speaker 3: But what I am going to ask is I asked you what was it about badminton that enabled you to fall in love with it?
• 47:30
  Speaker 3: And you talked about this fast pace and strategic thinking.
• 47:32
  Speaker 3: As I listen to you now looking into that world, in the world of finance problem solving, so that strategic thinking sounds like something that really resonates with you.
• 47:43
  Speaker 3: To what extent have you then considered what environment or workspace you would want to find yourself in?
• 47:50
  Speaker 1: it's something that I think about every day and it's also something that I think about whenever I'm having these conversations and coffee chats with people who are working in those firms.
• 47:59
  Speaker 1: Like I really want to know what kind of culture they have, what kind of people are there on the team, and I really want to know if I would fit into that team, because I feel like if I'm not respected in some place, it's going to be very hard for me.
• 48:15
  Speaker 1: I think it's going to be hard for everyone, but for me that's a very important feeling and I usually get that as soon as I speak with somebody from the team and I understand where the hierarchy lies or how they do things, and that's a very important thing for me.
• 48:32
  Speaker 1: Like I need to know how they do things.
• 48:34
  Speaker 1: If that suits my working style, then I think I'm all in.
• 48:38
  Speaker 3: Yeah, so thinking about your traits and you spoke about discipline, determination and dedication what do you think from your sporting world you have brought with you into this, the study period, this exploration, what are those key traits and skills that you feel you brought with you?
• 49:01
  Speaker 1: I still follow the three d's very sincerely.
• 49:03
  Speaker 1: It's something that's going to be with me for the rest of my life.
• 49:06
  Speaker 1: Discipline especially when I'm studying, I always make sure my assignments are done and dusted before I go hang out or go play or do whatever.
• 49:15
  Speaker 1: I'm very determined in the goals that I have for now, trying to achieve them, but, again, the metrics that I'm using to achieve them are very different.
• 49:24
  Speaker 1: Yes, the end goal is getting a job, but I am satisfied if I know that I've put in my maximum effort and I'm very dedicated.
• 49:32
  Speaker 1: That's why I'm now focused so much on finance and I'm learning a lot in this six months Actually, it's not been six months, it's been like four months since my course started and I've learned a lot.
• 49:46
  Speaker 1: These four months have gone really quickly, but I can see the growth and the change in me as well, especially in my financial knowledge.
• 49:53
  Speaker 1: Like I now understand what they're talking about.
• 49:56
  Speaker 1: I understand when I look at the news or when I'm reading some news article about why the markets are crashing.
• 50:02
  Speaker 1: Then I'm suddenly like oh, why is this happening?
• 50:04
  Speaker 1: Like didn't we discuss this in class?
• 50:06
  Speaker 1: What theory or the concept was this related to?
• 50:09
  Speaker 1: And stuff like that.
• 50:10
  Speaker 1: So it's been very fascinating for me brilliant, brilliant.
• 50:14
  Speaker 3: And so now for you, if you think about your peer group, those athletes who you grew up with playing against, who are now, as we actually haven't mentioned on this call, but, as we've spoken before, are achieving their, their greatness.
• 50:30
  Speaker 3: If they come to you and say, I know it's going to end at some point, what should I be doing to best set me up for a career transition, like you have done?
• 50:40
  Speaker 3: What would you say to them?
• 50:44
  Speaker 1: I would first say congratulations on doing the first step.
• 50:48
  Speaker 1: Just coming and asking somebody else on what I can do itself is huge, and congratulations, you're doing an amazing job.
• 50:57
  Speaker 1: And the next thing I would say is what would you like to know first?
• 51:02
  Speaker 1: Like what is something that really interests you and something that you really want to know how it works?
• 51:07
  Speaker 1: Because for me, that was the case when I first did the public policy internship.
• 51:12
  Speaker 1: It was just like why is the government running like this?
• 51:17
  Speaker 1: Why is economics like this?
• 51:18
  Speaker 1: Why is this the policy?
• 51:20
  Speaker 1: Like we could probably do something better, and so that was how I ended up doing that internship, and so that's what I would say.
• 51:29
  Speaker 1: I would suggest them do, like if you're interested in books, then look into publishing.
• 51:33
  Speaker 1: If you're interested, or maybe write, I'm pretty sure we could end up having really good stories about ourselves.
• 51:40
  Speaker 1: If you're really interested in writing, or if you're interested you know films or Korean dramas or any of these newer dramas that are coming, then explore how that business works or how it is shot, or go into your own creative space.
• 51:53
  Speaker 1: I would just say, look into what interests you the most.
• 51:56
  Speaker 3: I like that You've said one congrats on being open, at least thinking about what you want to be doing.
• 52:04
  Speaker 3: Next, recognizing you will be shifting career.
• 52:06
  Speaker 3: Thinking about what you want to be doing next, recognizing you will be shifting career.
• 52:09
  Speaker 3: Secondly is following what you might be interested in.
• 52:15
  Speaker 3: I think it's the element that you said.
• 52:16
  Speaker 3: I really like that gets me going is, if you're interested in how something works, what is it that you question?
• 52:19
  Speaker 3: What is it that you perhaps complain about?
• 52:22
  Speaker 3: Why does someone do this?
• 52:23
  Speaker 3: Why is the government doing this?
• 52:25
  Speaker 3: Why are roads going this way?
• 52:27
  Speaker 3: Surely they should have done xyz instead and use that as a starting point to explore internship, spend time with people to learn more about that and see well, is that future career path?
• 52:39
  Speaker 3: I like the way you're thinking that through thank you so much yeah.
• 52:42
  Speaker 3: So look, mia, thank you for taking the time out of your I can't even say evening, I'm going to say your night time, as you're now a night owl to continue our conversation.
• 52:53
  Speaker 3: Share it so that other people can watch and learn from your experience so far.
• 53:02
  Speaker 3: You've already stepped now into that second career and on the tipping point of moving into that third one.
• 53:09
  Speaker 3: So from an athlete to a student, to an athlete, sorry and then moving out into that workplace again.
• 53:15
  Speaker 3: I think it's really interesting and fantastic that I get to have this conversation with you whilst you're going through this transition period.
• 53:22
  Speaker 3: So thanks for sharing your story, really your time.
• 53:26
  Speaker 3: The people who are listening and watching, who are going to want to reach out to you, maybe get in a conversation.
• 53:32
  Speaker 3: Where's the best place to find you and get in touch?
• 53:36
  Speaker 1: you can always find me on linkedin.
• 53:37
  Speaker 1: Okay, it's mithula mia omagant.
• 53:39
  Speaker 1: Please reach out to me on linkedin.
• 53:41
  Speaker 1: Otherwise, I'm also a student ambassador right now at uci, so if you go on to UCI, columbia Road School of Business, student ambassadors, you'll find me there.
• 53:50
  Speaker 1: But the best place will be LinkedIn and I can share my LinkedIn with you all.
• 53:55
  Speaker 3: Absolutely.
• 53:55
  Speaker 3: We'll get that in the notes as well, so people can definitely reach out.
• 53:58
  Speaker 3: But, mia, listen, I want to say a massive thank you very much for sharing your story.
• 54:03
  Speaker 1: Of course.
• 54:03
  Speaker 1: Thank you so much for having me today.
• 54:08
  Speaker 1: I really enjoyed speaking with you, ryan, and it was a really nice experience.
• 54:11
  Speaker 3: Thank you for listening to the second wind podcast.
• 54:13
  Speaker 3: We hope you enjoyed hearing insights from today's athlete on transitioning out of competitive careers If you're looking for career clarity for your next step.
• 54:22
  Speaker 2: Make sure you check out second windio for more information or to book a consultation with me.
• 54:28
  Speaker 3: I'd like to thank Claire from Betty Brook Design, Nancy from Savvy Podcast Solutions and Cerise from Copying Content by Lola for their help in putting this podcast together.
• 54:37
  Speaker 3: That's all from me.
• 54:38
  Speaker 3: Take it easy until next time.