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Inside The Data: NFL Combine Athletic Testing Reveals PLENTY Of Ideal OTs For Eagles · Inside the Birds: A Philadelphia Eagles Podcast

• 0:09
  Speaker 1: Hello, welcome back to Inside the Data On Inside the Birds.
• 0:13
  Speaker 1: I'm Jeff Mosher with Sam Finkel, our analytics expert. It's
• 0:18
  Speaker 1: been quite a little bit since we've had you on, Sam.
• 0:21
  Speaker 1: A lot has happened, a lot might be happening more
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: in the next few days. Is free agency is about
• 0:27
  Speaker 1: to kick out, but in the new league year is
• 0:30
  Speaker 1: about to get started. But you know, one of the
• 0:33
  Speaker 1: things that we like to do around this time of
• 0:34
  Speaker 1: the year is review the combine, specifically the testing.
• 0:38
  Speaker 2: We know how big the Eagles are on athletic testing.
• 0:42
  Speaker 2: We know that egos have some holes to fill regardless
• 0:44
  Speaker 2: of what they do in free agency, and it's you know,
• 0:48
  Speaker 2: really important that they build their team.
• 0:51
  Speaker 1: To the draft. To them, that's how they believe. And
• 0:53
  Speaker 1: so we're gonna take a look at a couple of
• 0:55
  Speaker 1: different positions over the next I don't know however long,
• 0:58
  Speaker 1: but we'll start off with offensive line, and because that
• 1:00
  Speaker 1: was such a sore spot for the Eagles last year.
• 1:04
  Speaker 1: Now they'll probably, barring anything unforeseen, have the same starting
• 1:09
  Speaker 1: five as they did last year. But they also know
• 1:13
  Speaker 1: that they can't bank on the health of center, left guard,
• 1:16
  Speaker 1: and of course the right tackle could be the last
• 1:19
  Speaker 1: year for him. So with that being said, you put
• 1:22
  Speaker 1: together a testing chart of how the offensive lineman did
• 1:27
  Speaker 1: in at the combine, and we'll pay attention to that
• 1:30
  Speaker 1: and we'll put it all in perspective. What did you
• 1:32
  Speaker 1: overall find when you were doing this compilation of athletic
• 1:36
  Speaker 1: testing about this year's crop of tackles. Well, off of
• 1:40
  Speaker 1: the line, well, we're really focus on tackles here, but
• 1:43
  Speaker 1: in general.
• 1:44
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I felt like there's some pretty athletic offensive lineman
• 1:47
  Speaker 3: overall in this class. It feels pretty top heavy in
• 1:51
  Speaker 3: the sense that I think there's probably ten you can
• 1:54
  Speaker 3: call them, quality starters on offensive line in this draft
• 1:57
  Speaker 3: that I feel pretty confident in actually constitutes like I'm
• 2:01
  Speaker 3: not necessarily saying they're gonna be Pro bowlers, are all pro,
• 2:03
  Speaker 3: but they're like plus starters that you can find in
• 2:05
  Speaker 3: this draft at the top, and they're pretty athletic overall.
• 2:09
  Speaker 1: Yeah. I think what's interesting is that the Eagles have
• 2:12
  Speaker 1: always believed in athleticism at all positions, but on the
• 2:18
  Speaker 1: offensive line they've also succeeded, either in draft or free
• 2:22
  Speaker 1: agency with some offensive linemen who may not are more
• 2:27
  Speaker 1: road graders right than great athletes. I think Mackai Becton
• 2:30
  Speaker 1: was a good example of two years ago. He wasn't
• 2:34
  Speaker 1: necessarily great with his footwork, necessarily greatest in pass pro,
• 2:37
  Speaker 1: but he was a maller, a road grader. You know,
• 2:39
  Speaker 1: they were the ones that Jeff Stoutlin was the one
• 2:42
  Speaker 1: that felt he could play guard and he moved there
• 2:44
  Speaker 1: and he did a great job in Saque had an
• 2:46
  Speaker 1: unbelievable year. But we know two things. One, just Allen's gone. Two,
• 2:52
  Speaker 1: the Eagles are about to change their style of blocking
• 2:56
  Speaker 1: right and it's going to favor linemen who moved well
• 3:00
  Speaker 1: athletically horizontally in many cases right and less north south
• 3:08
  Speaker 1: type blockers. So being a big mauler like Landon Dickerson
• 3:13
  Speaker 1: may not be as important to them going forward right
• 3:17
  Speaker 1: as someone who tests athletically. And if you look at
• 3:22
  Speaker 1: the Eagles offensive line now you kind of a mixture
• 3:24
  Speaker 1: of both. I mean, Lane Johnson and Jordan my Lotta
• 3:26
  Speaker 1: are really good. I think they all tested well athletically
• 3:29
  Speaker 1: and they're also road graders. We know Cam Jurgen's at
• 3:34
  Speaker 1: one spot there center right. We know that he's there
• 3:37
  Speaker 1: because he's a great athlete more so than a road grader.
• 3:40
  Speaker 1: But at your guard spots with Landon, Dickerson, and Steen.
• 3:43
  Speaker 1: I don't remember what Stein's athletic testing was. You probably
• 3:46
  Speaker 1: might might have it, But I feel like those guys
• 3:48
  Speaker 1: are more about being because Stem was a former tackle,
• 3:52
  Speaker 1: more about being just like good athletes, but also are
• 3:54
  Speaker 1: like strong point of attack type players that you know,
• 3:58
  Speaker 1: the whole idea of point of attack now could be
• 4:01
  Speaker 1: a little bit different because when you're moving left and right,
• 4:03
  Speaker 1: it's not about the point of attack. Right.
• 4:05
  Speaker 3: Steen actually did pretty well in athletic testing. He didn't
• 4:08
  Speaker 3: do the forty, he didn't do the three cone, but
• 4:11
  Speaker 3: his vertical jump was twenty nine point five, his broad
• 4:14
  Speaker 3: jump was nine to one, and his twenty yard shuttle
• 4:17
  Speaker 3: was four or five nine and his bench press was
• 4:19
  Speaker 3: thirty one reps.
• 4:20
  Speaker 1: Right. Interesting that he didn't do a short shuttle because
• 4:24
  Speaker 1: that's kind of important for alignment and testing of course. Okay,
• 4:31
  Speaker 1: so again, I don't think that's going to represent a
• 4:34
  Speaker 1: huge change for the Eagles because they already look for
• 4:40
  Speaker 1: good athleticism in offensive linemen and in general in there
• 4:44
  Speaker 1: but in their procurement of players. But there might be
• 4:49
  Speaker 1: a slight change, especially on the interior offensive line, in
• 4:53
  Speaker 1: what they're looking for athletically, and the strengths right of
• 4:57
  Speaker 1: what players coming out of college all are compared to
• 5:01
  Speaker 1: what they might have used to have looked for.
• 5:02
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and the combine is just one of the tools
• 5:05
  Speaker 3: that Eagles and the other teams use. I mean, what
• 5:09
  Speaker 3: you see on film is what is really guiding this,
• 5:12
  Speaker 3: and then the combine is a good tool to check that.
• 5:14
  Speaker 3: It's a confirmation of does that what I see with
• 5:17
  Speaker 3: my eyes actually make sense. It's another way that data
• 5:19
  Speaker 3: is being interpreted to help build what you believe this
• 5:23
  Speaker 3: profile is what the profile could could be in the future.
• 5:27
  Speaker 1: Right now. We always talk about don't be fooled by
• 5:29
  Speaker 1: athletic testing. It's not to be all to end all.
• 5:31
  Speaker 1: It helps. There are there are some you know, forecastings
• 5:35
  Speaker 1: you can make if someone tests well athletically, but it
• 5:38
  Speaker 1: doesn't also mean that they're going to be a great player.
• 5:40
  Speaker 1: But with offensive linemen in particular, I would like you
• 5:44
  Speaker 1: to tell the audience what athletic testing drills you believe
• 5:48
  Speaker 1: or what we know are the most important ones. For example,
• 5:52
  Speaker 1: I'll just throw this right out of the way. Forty
• 5:54
  Speaker 1: yard dash is nice, but it's not you know, like
• 5:57
  Speaker 1: you know who cares if your offensive tackle doesn't run
• 5:59
  Speaker 1: a fast forty.
• 5:59
  Speaker 4: Right, Yeah, I agree with that.
• 6:02
  Speaker 3: I think anything that really shows explosion for an offensive lineman, actually,
• 6:06
  Speaker 3: the bench does a pretty good job of that. It's
• 6:09
  Speaker 3: not the best, but it's a way of metric explosion.
• 6:14
  Speaker 3: I think that the three cone is pretty good, especially
• 6:16
  Speaker 3: for interior offensive line. I also really like the vertical
• 6:20
  Speaker 3: jump because I think that's.
• 6:22
  Speaker 4: A really good metric for explosion.
• 6:24
  Speaker 3: But those are the main ones that I kind of
• 6:26
  Speaker 3: key out to me, and you can kind of tell
• 6:28
  Speaker 3: a lot of the time. And it's interesting, I said
• 6:30
  Speaker 3: the bench, because what the most of the offensive linemen
• 6:33
  Speaker 3: actually do are the ones that seem to actually matter.
• 6:36
  Speaker 3: So what you'll see on these charts that I prepared
• 6:38
  Speaker 3: is a lot of offensive linemen skipped some of these
• 6:41
  Speaker 3: drills or just refused to test, or were injured. There
• 6:45
  Speaker 3: are a bunch of different reasons why they opted out
• 6:47
  Speaker 3: of these certain drills, so you can kind of see
• 6:52
  Speaker 3: sometimes the agents will dictate, they'll be like, you shouldn't
• 6:54
  Speaker 3: do this drill because you're not as good at it,
• 6:56
  Speaker 3: or you don't need to.
• 6:57
  Speaker 4: You already prove that.
• 6:58
  Speaker 3: There's a bunch of different reasons but really anything that
• 7:00
  Speaker 3: shows explosion to me is the most important things for
• 7:03
  Speaker 3: offensive linen.
• 7:04
  Speaker 1: Yes, I agree you mentioned the vertical jump. I actually
• 7:08
  Speaker 1: think for offensive linment, broad jump is even better or
• 7:11
  Speaker 1: just the same because of the lower body explosion element
• 7:15
  Speaker 1: to launch yourself that far. Twenty yard short shuttle is
• 7:21
  Speaker 1: a measurement of agility, lateral movement, that change of direction,
• 7:26
  Speaker 1: which again you've missaid, well how many offensive linemen changed direction.
• 7:30
  Speaker 1: But when you think about, as you said, offensive linement
• 7:32
  Speaker 1: on the inside, like angle blocking one of the things
• 7:35
  Speaker 1: that pre back injury. That Cam Jurgen's really good at
• 7:39
  Speaker 1: kicking out into the second level and then pivoting to
• 7:42
  Speaker 1: get that linebacker who's coming down and making sure you
• 7:45
  Speaker 1: can block him. So those are kind of things that
• 7:47
  Speaker 1: you're looking for out of that twenty yard short shuttle
• 7:50
  Speaker 1: ten yard split. Also, I think it's part of the
• 7:53
  Speaker 1: forty yard dash your first It's just it's a good
• 7:55
  Speaker 1: get off, like how fast can these guys get And
• 7:58
  Speaker 1: especially if you're running screens or you are running a
• 8:01
  Speaker 1: Shanahan slash Midvey slash Kubiak style of run game where
• 8:05
  Speaker 1: somebody's gonna get like kicked out and you want to
• 8:07
  Speaker 1: get them fast off the line of scrimmage. So those
• 8:09
  Speaker 1: are the ones we'll pay attention to here among the
• 8:11
  Speaker 1: others right in your athletic testing as we figure out
• 8:15
  Speaker 1: and start with offensive tackles. Which ones would make a
• 8:19
  Speaker 1: lot of sense, because I think when we talk about
• 8:21
  Speaker 1: offensive tackle here, what we're really talking about is the
• 8:23
  Speaker 1: Eagles potentially finding a replacement for Lane Johnson correct in
• 8:30
  Speaker 1: the in the draft, somebody who may not play this year,
• 8:33
  Speaker 1: but we'll be ready to step in in twenty twenty
• 8:35
  Speaker 1: seven and be your right tackle. Yeah, all right, cool,
• 8:41
  Speaker 1: So let's go. And by the way, this I believe
• 8:44
  Speaker 1: you said this, and I'm gonna i'll echo the sentence.
• 8:47
  Speaker 1: Pretty good draft for offensive linement.
• 8:48
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I feel pretty good about this draft for o line.
• 8:51
  Speaker 1: Awesome. So here we go with I'm going to try
• 8:54
  Speaker 1: to shrink it to the screen for those watching to
• 8:56
  Speaker 1: have all the offensive tackles. See when I do it
• 9:00
  Speaker 1: this way, do you think that that's big enough? Or
• 9:01
  Speaker 1: should I just scroll up and down? I can't quite tell.
• 9:04
  Speaker 3: Sometimes from I think it may it may even be
• 9:07
  Speaker 3: better like seeing it now if I just share you
• 9:10
  Speaker 3: the Excel version of the sheets version of it, I'll
• 9:13
  Speaker 3: look at that, and we just go through the sheets
• 9:16
  Speaker 3: version of it, okay, because then I can kind of
• 9:19
  Speaker 3: minimize things for us.
• 9:21
  Speaker 1: Sure, look at that. We're gonna give it on the
• 9:23
  Speaker 1: fly here. No, I mean while you do that, I
• 9:25
  Speaker 1: will then blow this up for people just to get
• 9:28
  Speaker 1: an idea of the names and the athletic So you
• 9:32
  Speaker 1: color coded this before we get to your other sheet.
• 9:35
  Speaker 1: Explain the color coding of the athletic testing here.
• 9:39
  Speaker 3: Yeah, so the gold color is the best tester, silver
• 9:43
  Speaker 3: is the second best, and the bronze is the third best.
• 9:46
  Speaker 1: Got it gold? You were you an Olympic mood, very Olympic.
• 9:50
  Speaker 4: Ye, yeah, I felt like that was the right time.
• 9:53
  Speaker 1: It certainly all right, and then you get the World
• 9:55
  Speaker 1: Baseball Classic coming up, so that's good too. All right.
• 9:57
  Speaker 1: So now we're looking at tackles here, and we have
• 10:00
  Speaker 1: a different spreadsheet up and we'll go through. There are
• 10:05
  Speaker 1: twenty four of them, but let's put start to go
• 10:07
  Speaker 1: through some of them. Why what jumped out using this
• 10:11
  Speaker 1: sheet here in particular?
• 10:13
  Speaker 3: Yeah, just Spencer Fano from Utah was athletically one of
• 10:19
  Speaker 3: the best tackles, which is not surprising. He was the
• 10:23
  Speaker 3: first in the forty yard dash he was the second
• 10:27
  Speaker 3: in the split, the ten yard split, first in the
• 10:30
  Speaker 3: three cone drill even though that wasn't that many people
• 10:32
  Speaker 3: doing it, first in the shuttle, even though they were
• 10:35
  Speaker 3: only two doing it, and his athleticism score was second
• 10:38
  Speaker 3: right tied.
• 10:40
  Speaker 1: So I've already actually called around a little bit on
• 10:43
  Speaker 1: Fano Sam and his athletic testing is fantastic. And the
• 10:49
  Speaker 1: word I got from him is that he fits his
• 10:52
  Speaker 1: own blocking scheme more than gap or power, so ordinarily
• 10:58
  Speaker 1: he's a well, yes, a fit for what the Eagles
• 11:01
  Speaker 1: are going to be doing. The funny thing is, when
• 11:03
  Speaker 1: you start to talk about that now, it feels like
• 11:05
  Speaker 1: seventy five percent of the league now is running some
• 11:08
  Speaker 1: variation of a Shanahan McVeigh or Kubiak style running game.
• 11:13
  Speaker 1: So I'm it's like, yeah, it's a great fit for
• 11:17
  Speaker 1: the Eagles, and like it's like having a number one
• 11:19
  Speaker 1: wide receiver at this point. Yeah, it's a great for
• 11:21
  Speaker 1: for everybody.
• 11:23
  Speaker 4: No, that's a that's a really good point.
• 11:25
  Speaker 3: He definitely stuck out to me, but he wasn't the
• 11:27
  Speaker 3: only one that stuck out to me. I also think
• 11:31
  Speaker 3: the two above him, both Freeling and Max from Arizona State,
• 11:36
  Speaker 3: both stuck out. They had the similar athletic scores, and
• 11:40
  Speaker 3: they also perform pretty well in testing. And then a
• 11:43
  Speaker 3: guy that I also wanted to kind of shout out
• 11:45
  Speaker 3: is Blake Miller from Clemson.
• 11:47
  Speaker 1: Oh yeah, Clemson, Yeah, go up to him.
• 11:50
  Speaker 3: His athleticism score was the highest, and yet he didn't
• 11:54
  Speaker 3: score very high on all the drills. And that gets
• 11:56
  Speaker 3: us into something that we'd like to talk about once
• 11:58
  Speaker 3: we actually get towards draft. Coun Is size is so
• 12:02
  Speaker 3: important in this and his is benefited a lot by
• 12:05
  Speaker 3: his size, the actual size that I didn't include the
• 12:08
  Speaker 3: measurements in this because I figured it would get kind
• 12:11
  Speaker 3: of convoluted in just talking about it, but he is
• 12:14
  Speaker 3: very much benefited from that, and he did score very
• 12:18
  Speaker 3: well athletically considering his size.
• 12:21
  Speaker 1: Got it all right? I do want to I wanted
• 12:23
  Speaker 1: to go back and make one more point on sure
• 12:25
  Speaker 1: Pano because he is short armed, and the word I
• 12:30
  Speaker 1: got back from Fano is that he's probably a guard
• 12:34
  Speaker 1: at the NFL level because the short arms. Yeah, And
• 12:37
  Speaker 1: so then again that again I'm gonna probably sound like
• 12:42
  Speaker 1: a broken record, but a guy who has the athleticism
• 12:47
  Speaker 1: at college to play tackle, but in the NFL projects
• 12:50
  Speaker 1: at either guard or center. Reminds me a lot of
• 12:55
  Speaker 1: Isaac Samlu sure, and also makes more sense now for
• 13:02
  Speaker 1: the Eagles if they're moving away from road grader to
• 13:07
  Speaker 1: athlete who moves well horizontally. Samla was a good athlete.
• 13:12
  Speaker 1: He was actually, I mean, if you're good enough to
• 13:14
  Speaker 1: play tackle in college and then play garden center, yes,
• 13:17
  Speaker 1: you're a good athlete. And they would use him. They
• 13:20
  Speaker 1: trapped a lot more with their linemen back in the
• 13:22
  Speaker 1: day as opposed to the last few years, and Samara
• 13:25
  Speaker 1: would be a part of that. But Fano I believe
• 13:29
  Speaker 1: isn't even better athletic tester than Samalu. And so you know,
• 13:34
  Speaker 1: I think it sounds like to me like he's a
• 13:37
  Speaker 1: Day two guy. Like early Day two.
• 13:40
  Speaker 4: Fano I could see him going in the first maybe.
• 13:42
  Speaker 1: Even the first round. Actually it could be even first round.
• 13:44
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I wouldn't be surprised to see him in the
• 13:46
  Speaker 4: first round.
• 13:47
  Speaker 1: I know the Penn State, our Penn State friend vegue
• 13:50
  Speaker 1: Ioni is from what I've been told, who's not a
• 13:53
  Speaker 1: great athletic tester by the way, but just an unbelievable
• 13:55
  Speaker 1: lineman and a road grader. He's probably gonna go top
• 13:59
  Speaker 1: twelve to fifteen. Sure, that's how good he is. I
• 14:02
  Speaker 1: think Fano will be probably the second interior offensive lineman
• 14:09
  Speaker 1: right to go off the board.
• 14:10
  Speaker 4: Sure.
• 14:10
  Speaker 1: And the reason why I said day two maybe day one,
• 14:14
  Speaker 1: is only because it's there's a lot of teams that
• 14:16
  Speaker 1: will not take a guard, right, Yeah, a short armed
• 14:20
  Speaker 1: guard slash center in the first round unless it's like
• 14:24
  Speaker 1: I can't miss prospect. The Cowboys were willing to do it.
• 14:27
  Speaker 1: They did it with Booker last year, right, Trevor Booker?
• 14:31
  Speaker 1: Is that Trevor Booker? I think it was Tyler Booker?
• 14:36
  Speaker 4: Tyler?
• 14:36
  Speaker 1: It might be Tyler, but they have so many Tyler's.
• 14:38
  Speaker 3: On that Tyler not really all of them, but no, no,
• 14:42
  Speaker 3: it almost seems sixty of them I believe for Tyler.
• 14:46
  Speaker 1: So so my point was is that the Cowboys were
• 14:49
  Speaker 1: willing to do it because they specifically run a lot
• 14:52
  Speaker 1: of inside power. Like that's what you saw they were
• 14:56
  Speaker 1: able to do with Javonte Williams, Right, they ran the
• 14:59
  Speaker 1: ball extraordinary early. Well, uh, they ran the ball inside
• 15:02
  Speaker 1: a lot And that's what they do. They have big,
• 15:05
  Speaker 1: powerful offensive linemen. They don't run a Shanahan style run game.
• 15:08
  Speaker 1: So that's why it was worth it to them to
• 15:11
  Speaker 1: take a guard that high knowing that that guy is
• 15:13
  Speaker 1: not a tackle, and so maybe there will be a
• 15:16
  Speaker 1: team like that. But I could see for no, no dropping
• 15:19
  Speaker 1: only because he's not gonna play tackle at the end
• 15:21
  Speaker 1: of the level most likely.
• 15:23
  Speaker 3: One hundred agreed that that's a good point. I also
• 15:27
  Speaker 3: have some context if we want to look at specific
• 15:29
  Speaker 3: drills of how historical tackles have performed.
• 15:33
  Speaker 1: Sure, so out a little bit just to give like
• 15:36
  Speaker 1: a yeah, yeah, yeah, okay for those who are watching here.
• 15:40
  Speaker 3: So their top five tackles for the forty yard dash,
• 15:45
  Speaker 3: ever are tarn Armstead at a four to seven to one, okay,
• 15:52
  Speaker 3: a very familiar name in Lane Johnson at four to
• 15:55
  Speaker 3: seven two, Aviante Collins out a TC you in twenty
• 16:00
  Speaker 3: seventeen at a four eight one, Brian O'Neil out of
• 16:04
  Speaker 3: Pittsburgh four eight two okay, and then lastly Tristan Wurf's
• 16:10
  Speaker 3: who everyone should know at four eight five.
• 16:12
  Speaker 1: Okay. So of those five, right, one of them is
• 16:17
  Speaker 1: sort of not I don't want to say irrelevant, but
• 16:19
  Speaker 1: it didn't translate. The third guy you mentioned, Avion.
• 16:22
  Speaker 4: Collins, Yeah, yeah, okay, but you'll notice only one of
• 16:26
  Speaker 4: the five that I was like, I don't really remember
• 16:28
  Speaker 4: him that all right.
• 16:30
  Speaker 1: You'll notice the trend though specifically with Lane Johnson and
• 16:34
  Speaker 1: Brian O'Neill. They were not tackles from day one. O'Neill
• 16:38
  Speaker 1: was a tight end at Pitt, I'm not mistaken, and
• 16:42
  Speaker 1: Lane Johnson started his career as a quarterback, then a
• 16:45
  Speaker 1: tight end, then a d end, and then a tackle.
• 16:49
  Speaker 1: He had an incredible gross burt in college. So you
• 16:52
  Speaker 1: can see much like jaylex Hunt, right from safety to
• 16:55
  Speaker 1: at the end, you can see how someone who was
• 16:58
  Speaker 1: just born with really good athleticism and then just kind
• 17:00
  Speaker 1: of grew and ate themselves into a different position would
• 17:03
  Speaker 1: still be able to run a really good and be
• 17:05
  Speaker 1: a great athlete at that position.
• 17:08
  Speaker 4: YEP.
• 17:10
  Speaker 1: I do wonder if there's anybody on this list here
• 17:12
  Speaker 1: that sort of fits that bill of having started off
• 17:16
  Speaker 1: at a completely different position and then the athleticism just
• 17:20
  Speaker 1: sort of carried over as they moved to offensive line.
• 17:24
  Speaker 3: I would say that that build is very rare, because
• 17:28
  Speaker 3: I mean, there's not many people in the NFL that
• 17:30
  Speaker 3: you can name that had that and especially that have
• 17:33
  Speaker 3: been as extraordinary, especially as Lene Johnson.
• 17:37
  Speaker 1: Yes. So yeah. By the way, Toront Armstead was like
• 17:41
  Speaker 1: a track star also, I believe in high school as well.
• 17:46
  Speaker 4: Certain translated.
• 17:47
  Speaker 1: Yeah, he was actually an undersized a ligneman when he
• 17:51
  Speaker 1: when he was playing in college. I think he went
• 17:53
  Speaker 1: to Arkansas, like Pine Bluff or something.
• 17:55
  Speaker 4: Yes, you're exactly right.
• 17:56
  Speaker 1: Yeah and so and then he just he was on
• 17:59
  Speaker 1: the track team there.
• 18:01
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 18:01
  Speaker 1: So that's why you're finding stories of these tackles who
• 18:05
  Speaker 1: start off some of the rare athleticism involved. What do
• 18:09
  Speaker 1: we got We got a list of twenty four people here.
• 18:12
  Speaker 1: I would think that at least eighty percent of them,
• 18:15
  Speaker 1: you know, we're actually offensive lineman from the start, but
• 18:17
  Speaker 1: you never know.
• 18:18
  Speaker 3: Yeah, that's that's very true.
• 18:21
  Speaker 1: And then Hi, go ahead, no, no please, I was
• 18:24
  Speaker 1: gonna say, I just I had higher hopes for Drew
• 18:26
  Speaker 1: Shelton that when he candopen State. Wasn't he a five
• 18:28
  Speaker 1: star recruit?
• 18:29
  Speaker 3: I think he was either four or five. I think
• 18:31
  Speaker 3: five though sounds right. I should really know that.
• 18:35
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you were there, right, I was there. Yeah, that's okay.
• 18:39
  Speaker 3: But stars never really mattered to us. We were more
• 18:44
  Speaker 3: about like our internal evaluation. It's actually super interesting, I'm
• 18:47
  Speaker 3: sure We could talk about it to add nauseum at
• 18:50
  Speaker 3: a later date. But it was interesting because when Ohio
• 18:53
  Speaker 3: State would offer somebody, they'd go from a three star
• 18:56
  Speaker 3: to a five star overnight a lot of the times.
• 18:58
  Speaker 3: And whether that was just as people didn't scout them
• 19:01
  Speaker 3: properly or just big names where.
• 19:03
  Speaker 4: There's a whole thing with that. I think they've gotten
• 19:05
  Speaker 4: a lot better, I will say. But sure, Yeah.
• 19:10
  Speaker 1: For the Caden Procter fans, by the way, because I
• 19:12
  Speaker 1: know a lot of mock drafts have mocked him, including
• 19:15
  Speaker 1: our own Andrew de Checo to the Eagles in the
• 19:18
  Speaker 1: first round, you'd probably be pretty happy with the combination
• 19:22
  Speaker 1: of size and athletic testing and the fact that he
• 19:26
  Speaker 1: was twenty five in the branch press, so he second
• 19:28
  Speaker 1: best bench press, so good strength there. What do you
• 19:31
  Speaker 1: make of his other stuff? Has split his very I
• 19:34
  Speaker 1: mean he has a relatively high score here at eighty four.
• 19:38
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, look, I like his vertical jump for
• 19:40
  Speaker 3: his size. I also don't mind the broad jump at all.
• 19:44
  Speaker 4: It's not bad.
• 19:45
  Speaker 3: It's pretty solid actually, especially for his size. But I
• 19:50
  Speaker 3: do still think he's a project. I think there's a
• 19:53
  Speaker 3: little bit of work and development he needs and I
• 19:56
  Speaker 3: think he would have been a perfect pick under Stoutlin,
• 20:00
  Speaker 3: and I'm a little apprehensive without Stalin. I mean, we
• 20:03
  Speaker 3: don't know what it's going to be like. To be honest,
• 20:06
  Speaker 3: I don't think you can go wrong by picking him,
• 20:09
  Speaker 3: but I think the expectations are that he needs to
• 20:11
  Speaker 3: sit and develop a little bit first, which, if.
• 20:14
  Speaker 1: You're looking for the Lane Johnson replacement, sort of makes sense, right.
• 20:18
  Speaker 4: It sort of makes sense.
• 20:19
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 20:19
  Speaker 3: So I think it just depends on how this new
• 20:23
  Speaker 3: offensive coaching staff, you know, how they prioritize development, if
• 20:27
  Speaker 3: they're able to develop, you know, talent, even if they
• 20:30
  Speaker 3: can retain seventy percent of what Stoutlin can do, I
• 20:33
  Speaker 3: think that it would be a solid pick.
• 20:35
  Speaker 1: I would agree, and I would say the other two guys,
• 20:39
  Speaker 1: we could just have a quick conversation about who also
• 20:42
  Speaker 1: get mocked to the Eagles and maybe more fit you know,
• 20:47
  Speaker 1: what the offense are going to do would be. I
• 20:49
  Speaker 1: like how you said Max from Arizona State. Max, Yeah,
• 20:52
  Speaker 1: you didn't even try to say aon ankor right.
• 20:55
  Speaker 3: Listen, I did practice some of these names, and I'm
• 20:58
  Speaker 3: not confident that one that's fair.
• 21:01
  Speaker 4: There was a couple I was just like we're gonna
• 21:03
  Speaker 4: call him Big Max.
• 21:04
  Speaker 1: Alright, well big Max, and both him and Monroe Freeling
• 21:08
  Speaker 1: who also from Georgia because he's Georgia. Of course he's
• 21:11
  Speaker 1: gonna get mocked to the Eagles. I mean, these guys
• 21:13
  Speaker 1: were really good testers. But look at Max. I mean
• 21:16
  Speaker 1: he's got a gold of silver and a bronze there, right,
• 21:19
  Speaker 1: two silvers.
• 21:22
  Speaker 3: He does benefit from the fact that only four people
• 21:25
  Speaker 3: did the bench, true, but still pretty incredible numbers considering
• 21:31
  Speaker 3: still right, And I think if he does go to
• 21:34
  Speaker 3: the Eagles, I promise I'll practice the name more. And
• 21:38
  Speaker 3: in the pronunciation what have I think it's a heiny
• 21:42
  Speaker 3: anchor that sounds right. That was the way when you
• 21:45
  Speaker 3: look at the names on the combine thing. There's usually
• 21:48
  Speaker 3: like them doing a drill or them doing an interview
• 21:50
  Speaker 3: and the people talking about them. That's how they pronounced
• 21:52
  Speaker 3: it right. But I'm also, as you can tell, not
• 21:55
  Speaker 3: at home right now, and I normally have like a
• 21:57
  Speaker 3: note sheet where I write down like the you know,
• 22:00
  Speaker 3: expelling of them, and I don't have that luxury because
• 22:03
  Speaker 3: I am in sunny Florida right now.
• 22:05
  Speaker 4: Right now.
• 22:07
  Speaker 1: By the way, that kid is a little bit rang
• 22:08
  Speaker 1: I mean, he's probably got his bet. You know, some
• 22:12
  Speaker 1: guys come out and they're ready to go, like Lan
• 22:13
  Speaker 1: Johnson was ready to go even though he had great
• 22:15
  Speaker 1: years ahead of him too. Sure, Anchor cut could be
• 22:19
  Speaker 1: the same way. I know he's from Nigeria and I
• 22:22
  Speaker 1: don't think he moved to the United States until he
• 22:24
  Speaker 1: was a teenager, and you know he played soccer of course,
• 22:28
  Speaker 1: being from overseas and everything like that. So kind of
• 22:31
  Speaker 1: like what we were talking about with guys who start
• 22:33
  Speaker 1: off playing other positions and then the athleticism translates, like
• 22:37
  Speaker 1: this kid could be the perfect sit for a year
• 22:40
  Speaker 1: play if you need to play autumn if there's injuries,
• 22:43
  Speaker 1: but then really blossom year two, year three or four
• 22:46
  Speaker 1: because he's he's still mouldable.
• 22:48
  Speaker 3: Sure, yeah, I totally agree with that.
• 22:52
  Speaker 1: The other kid is freeling. I don't know much about him.
• 22:57
  Speaker 1: I have to dig in on him. I know he's
• 22:59
  Speaker 1: your played left tackle there, so that's good. What I
• 23:02
  Speaker 1: want to find out is, obviously the athleticism looks pretty
• 23:05
  Speaker 1: good here. Is he a left and right tackle or
• 23:08
  Speaker 1: is the only one side we'll have to have? Is
• 23:11
  Speaker 1: he more fit for you know the scheme that E
• 23:13
  Speaker 1: goals are going to run or the one he they
• 23:15
  Speaker 1: used to run. Do you have his size there?
• 23:18
  Speaker 4: His size? He's six seven, uh three point fifteen.
• 23:23
  Speaker 1: My daughters would have really enjoyed that one.
• 23:25
  Speaker 4: Six to seven six foot seven foot.
• 23:28
  Speaker 1: Wait you said six seven three point fifteen.
• 23:31
  Speaker 4: Yeah, that's where he's Listen, it's.
• 23:32
  Speaker 1: Kind of slim for six foot seven lineman. Oh yeah,
• 23:35
  Speaker 1: A little bit is brief.
• 23:36
  Speaker 4: I have his arm measurements and hand measurements. If you
• 23:38
  Speaker 4: want those two do it?
• 23:40
  Speaker 1: Uh?
• 23:40
  Speaker 3: Thirty four and three quarters uh for arm and ten
• 23:43
  Speaker 3: and three quarters for hand.
• 23:46
  Speaker 1: So arm is thirty four? Is that kind of short
• 23:50
  Speaker 1: for being six seven?
• 23:53
  Speaker 3: I'm bad at that knowing what the what the arm
• 23:55
  Speaker 3: measurement should be relative to the height, but it does
• 23:58
  Speaker 3: seem real, like what is average?
• 24:02
  Speaker 1: I know the ideal arm length is thirty four inches
• 24:05
  Speaker 1: or more. Okay, and you said he's what he's six
• 24:09
  Speaker 1: foot seven, but no, what's his what's his arm?
• 24:11
  Speaker 4: Oh? His arm is thirty four and three quarters.
• 24:13
  Speaker 1: So he's just at what the NFL wants ideal. But
• 24:18
  Speaker 1: he's taller than your average offensive tackle. I mean, I
• 24:23
  Speaker 1: think most tackles are anywhere from six three to sixty six.
• 24:26
  Speaker 1: So he says, just a little bit on the Eagles.
• 24:28
  Speaker 1: He's normal. He fits in right, but but for a
• 24:30
  Speaker 1: normal offensive a little bit taller. So that's but I
• 24:35
  Speaker 1: think that when you're that tall and you do have
• 24:38
  Speaker 1: at least ideal you're a tackle, you're not moving anywhere.
• 24:41
  Speaker 4: Yeah, And I think he.
• 24:45
  Speaker 3: Looking at what they have for his production score, He's
• 24:48
  Speaker 3: is seventy two on production score, and you know, I
• 24:51
  Speaker 3: like those that.
• 24:52
  Speaker 4: I think they're fun.
• 24:52
  Speaker 3: I know they're not the end all be all, and
• 24:54
  Speaker 3: we'll eventually create those charts again when we get closer
• 24:57
  Speaker 3: to the draft. But his athleticism is nine and his
• 25:00
  Speaker 3: production seventy two and his total scores eighty one, which
• 25:04
  Speaker 3: they say is a six point three to one on
• 25:07
  Speaker 3: their scale, which will eventually be a plus starter. And
• 25:09
  Speaker 3: I agree with that. I do think it's important to
• 25:13
  Speaker 3: know if he's just a left tackle or if he
• 25:15
  Speaker 3: is a little bit more versatile. But I was a
• 25:18
  Speaker 3: big fan of everything I've looked into him so far,
• 25:21
  Speaker 3: And of course I'll do a deeper dive eventually, but
• 25:24
  Speaker 3: I do really.
• 25:25
  Speaker 1: Like him, you know what. You know what I think, Sam,
• 25:27
  Speaker 1: just having gone through this year with you between Blake Miller,
• 25:32
  Speaker 1: between Max Big Max from Arizona, Plate between Freeling and
• 25:37
  Speaker 1: Caden Proctor, and then there are some other guys who
• 25:41
  Speaker 1: probably didn't test great athletically but are pretty good. And
• 25:45
  Speaker 1: then there are guys that did test well athletically, you know,
• 25:48
  Speaker 1: like maybe someone like Jude Bowery from BC. Right. Yeah,
• 25:51
  Speaker 1: I think the Eagles are in pretty good shape to
• 25:54
  Speaker 1: draft an offensive tackle, a future one who's going to
• 25:58
  Speaker 1: be a starter in this draft. I think that that
• 26:00
  Speaker 1: we're pretty because if it were, I think was it
• 26:03
  Speaker 1: last year where there weren't that many. Yeah, it was
• 26:06
  Speaker 1: a year recently where it was just slim pickens. But
• 26:08
  Speaker 1: I feel like this is a pretty good good class
• 26:10
  Speaker 1: for the Eagles.
• 26:11
  Speaker 4: Actually last year was pretty good. It was well.
• 26:16
  Speaker 1: I kind of think Campbell's Wartscott really brought to light.
• 26:21
  Speaker 4: He was hurt. I don't He had a tough game.
• 26:24
  Speaker 1: I know in the Super Bowl he had a tough playoffs.
• 26:28
  Speaker 1: It was getting sacked from the start, I mean particularly bad.
• 26:33
  Speaker 1: I'll be fair. I'll be fair. They faced the Chargers,
• 26:36
  Speaker 1: the Texans, the Broncos, and the Seahawks. Those might have
• 26:39
  Speaker 1: been the four best defense. I don't want to put
• 26:43
  Speaker 1: it all on the kids. Shoulders. I know that they're
• 26:45
  Speaker 1: behind him, they're gonna be okay. Yeah, he'll probably be okay.
• 26:48
  Speaker 1: But I but against the long armed pass rushers, you
• 26:51
  Speaker 1: definitely saw the questions about him come out.
• 26:54
  Speaker 3: Sure, but they also had Membo in that class.
• 26:59
  Speaker 1: But he's a right tackle, right he only plays right tackle. Yeah,
• 27:01
  Speaker 1: Usually you want top fifteen guys to be able at
• 27:04
  Speaker 1: least play both.
• 27:05
  Speaker 4: Yeah, that's true, that's true.
• 27:07
  Speaker 1: Do you have the other name?
• 27:08
  Speaker 4: This is just off my head. I'm trying to think.
• 27:10
  Speaker 1: You were going right off the top of the dog.
• 27:12
  Speaker 4: NFL tackles twenty five.
• 27:15
  Speaker 1: I know there was one. More than put a lot
• 27:17
  Speaker 1: of We put a.
• 27:18
  Speaker 4: Lot of time in it. Yeah, bear with me a sec.
• 27:24
  Speaker 1: Okay, I'm looking at it too. Oh, Kelvin Banks from
• 27:26
  Speaker 1: the Saints. He actually had a pretty good rookie year.
• 27:29
  Speaker 1: Kelvin Banks from the Saints. And then the Commanders took
• 27:32
  Speaker 1: connorly late. So four ots is not like normally normally
• 27:37
  Speaker 1: six or seven. Up there I go again.
• 27:39
  Speaker 4: We're just doing it.
• 27:41
  Speaker 1: Yeah it But but you so you got four or
• 27:44
  Speaker 1: five and then one of them is a right tackle only.
• 27:48
  Speaker 3: Yeah, So you're right, that's is a good point. Maybe
• 27:51
  Speaker 3: it wasn't as strong as I was remembering.
• 27:54
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  Speaker 3: There's also a tackle we haven't talked about, okay, that
• 30:03
  Speaker 3: is projected to be a day one or Day two
• 30:06
  Speaker 3: guy that did not test combine uh, and he was
• 30:11
  Speaker 3: in the national championship game on the losing side of it.
• 30:17
  Speaker 1: Let me try to guess this because I can't even
• 30:18
  Speaker 1: I don't even remember at this point who in the
• 30:21
  Speaker 1: national championship game because you know, it's such a bad
• 30:24
  Speaker 1: year for Penn State. It was Ohio State, right and no,
• 30:28
  Speaker 1: hih State wasn't it? It was uh? Oh, it was Indiana,
• 30:30
  Speaker 1: of course, India versus Miami. Oh, the Miami o T
• 30:34
  Speaker 1: He's supposed to be pretty good, right.
• 30:36
  Speaker 4: Yeah, he is pretty good, but he didn't test at all.
• 30:38
  Speaker 1: He just sat on everything like like on his tape.
• 30:41
  Speaker 4: Correct. I think he was, if I remember correctly.
• 30:46
  Speaker 1: Yes, Now he's another guy I think that projects more right,
• 30:49
  Speaker 1: I don't. I don't know what his arm length is,
• 30:51
  Speaker 1: but I think he's more right tackle projection.
• 30:56
  Speaker 4: I believe you're correct on that.
• 30:58
  Speaker 3: Okay, but he is somebody that his athleticism is pretty
• 31:04
  Speaker 3: it's oh, it's like commensurate to what he actually performed
• 31:07
  Speaker 3: on the football field. I'm trying to remember if he's
• 31:10
  Speaker 3: just a I think he's just a right tackle. I
• 31:12
  Speaker 3: don't think he played left at all.
• 31:14
  Speaker 4: Okay, I can look it up, but I'm pretty sure
• 31:18
  Speaker 4: he was just right tackle the entire time.
• 31:20
  Speaker 1: Yep, you're pretty I believe you're correct on that.
• 31:24
  Speaker 4: Yep, durable three year starter at right tackle. Yeah.
• 31:27
  Speaker 3: It says he has a guard's broad build but moves
• 31:30
  Speaker 3: like a tackle in pass sets.
• 31:32
  Speaker 1: H So does that mean what do we know about
• 31:36
  Speaker 1: his athleticism at all? I mean, is he a good athlete?
• 31:38
  Speaker 1: And I assume him not testing means he's not a
• 31:41
  Speaker 1: great athlete and he's just trying to sit on really
• 31:43
  Speaker 1: good tape. Yeah.
• 31:44
  Speaker 3: I think you're probably right, or I can't remember if
• 31:46
  Speaker 3: he was hurt for some reason. I thought there was
• 31:48
  Speaker 3: some injury, but that also could be an excuse to Uh,
• 31:52
  Speaker 3: he's six five and a half three twenty nine. Okay,
• 31:56
  Speaker 3: his arms are thirty three and a quarter. Hands are
• 31:58
  Speaker 3: ten to five eighths, so.
• 32:01
  Speaker 1: You know, not the arms again, give me the arms again.
• 32:04
  Speaker 4: The arm was thirty three and a quarter for six
• 32:06
  Speaker 4: five and a half.
• 32:07
  Speaker 1: So he's that's why he's right. He's a little bit
• 32:09
  Speaker 1: under what the NFL wants at thirty four. Yeah. Yeah,
• 32:13
  Speaker 1: but he's also I sayf that size sounds normal six
• 32:17
  Speaker 1: five three twenty nine, three thirty as opposed to the
• 32:20
  Speaker 1: six seven kid whos only three fifteen.
• 32:22
  Speaker 3: So yeah, but listen, I mean you could put all
• 32:25
  Speaker 3: You're probably gonna put on some weight, I imagine at
• 32:27
  Speaker 3: the NFL level. Look, college weight plans are great, but
• 32:31
  Speaker 3: NFL weight plans are something different.
• 32:33
  Speaker 1: Oh yeah, that is true.
• 32:35
  Speaker 3: No disrespect to any of the Penn State weight crew,
• 32:39
  Speaker 3: because they were some awesome people. Coach low c Coach Gault,
• 32:42
  Speaker 3: awesome people, great, great programs.
• 32:45
  Speaker 1: All right, great stuff. I think we've covered it, right.
• 32:48
  Speaker 1: Is there anybody else you wanted to mention from the
• 32:49
  Speaker 1: OT group?
• 32:51
  Speaker 4: No?
• 32:51
  Speaker 3: I think those are the people that I felt the
• 32:54
  Speaker 3: best on for sure.
• 32:56
  Speaker 1: All right, So when we come back for our next show,
• 32:58
  Speaker 1: we'll do the Interior Offensive.
• 33:00
  Speaker 4: Line perfect, all right.
• 33:02
  Speaker 1: That is a look at the offensive tackle group. They're
• 33:06
  Speaker 1: athletic testing what makes sense for the Eagles, what may
• 33:08
  Speaker 1: not make sense for the Eagles. And again on the
• 33:10
  Speaker 1: next episode we'll do interior Offensive Line. That's gonna do
• 33:14
  Speaker 1: it for this episode of Inside the Data, the leading
• 33:17
  Speaker 1: podcast in Eagles Analytics Intel. You like that. That's a
• 33:22
  Speaker 1: little inside the Birds pod to close out to this,
• 33:25
  Speaker 1: I love that.
• 33:26
  Speaker 4: Let's let's add that in Let's go that is it.
• 33:28
  Speaker 1: That's what we're doing and we'll catch you all on then. Oh,
• 33:32
  Speaker 1: I'm sorry for Sam Finkel. I'm Jeff Mosher. We'll catch
• 33:35
  Speaker 1: you all on the next one.