Latest / Indie Film Hustle® - A Filmmaking Podcast / IFH 862: The Filmmaker Who Turned Failure Into a Feature Film with Mark Phillips

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IFH 862: The Filmmaker Who Turned Failure Into a Feature Film with Mark Phillips · Indie Film Hustle® - A Filmmaking Podcast

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Speaker 2: Welcome to the Indie Film Muscle Podcast, Episode number eight
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Speaker 2: sixty two. You try to do it, and you do
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Speaker 2: it honestly, you can't control people's responses.
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Speaker 3: Really, Edgar Wright.
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Speaker 1: Broadcasting from the back Alley and Hollywood. It's the Indie
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Speaker 2: Welcome, Welcome to another episode of the Indie Film Huscle Podcast.
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Speaker 2: That's film bizbook dot com. Enjoy today's episode with guest
1:52
Speaker 2: host Dave Bullis.
1:55
Speaker 4: With me today is is Mark Phillips. Mark Phillips is
2:00
Speaker 4: the star and director of The Walking Full documentary, where
2:03
Speaker 4: he attempts to actually walk from New York all the
2:06
Speaker 4: way across the country to California. Mark, how are you?
2:09
Speaker 3: I'm doing fabulous? How are you doing, Dave?
2:12
Speaker 4: Pretty good?
2:12
Speaker 3: Thanks?
2:13
Speaker 4: Pretty good? So you know, Mark, why don't you tell
2:16
Speaker 4: us a little bit about yourself?
2:18
Speaker 5: Well, I'm from the New York City area all my life,
2:23
Speaker 5: and I was one of those people that was sort of,
2:27
Speaker 5: you know, always interested in acting, never really pursued it actively.
2:31
Speaker 3: So I did what most people did.
2:33
Speaker 5: I just got a job working in the office in
2:36
Speaker 5: front of a computer where I could juster to sort
2:39
Speaker 5: of think about dreaming of being a performer on stage.
2:44
Speaker 5: And they did that for about ten years and finally
2:48
Speaker 5: it's sort of kind of snapped and I thought about
2:51
Speaker 5: doing something different, and that's sort of how we evolved
2:54
Speaker 5: into what I'm you know, doing now in the documentary
2:57
Speaker 5: is walking across the country.
3:00
Speaker 4: So Mark, how long have you been a filmmaker?
3:02
Speaker 1: For?
3:03
Speaker 3: Well? I was that goes back to high school.
3:06
Speaker 5: I was sort of, you know, I got to I
3:08
Speaker 5: remember getting a video camera, one of those big DHS things,
3:12
Speaker 5: you know, top loading VHS things. It was probably about
3:16
Speaker 5: twenty pounds for Christmas and just started making little, you know,
3:20
Speaker 5: short films. And back in the nineties that evolved before YouTube,
3:25
Speaker 5: that evolved into what was known as the public access show,
3:29
Speaker 5: which is you know, all the cable networks for those
3:31
Speaker 5: who might not know those the cable networks had to
3:34
Speaker 5: have these public access stations where people were allowed to
3:38
Speaker 5: put their own local content on there, so that kind
3:42
Speaker 5: of evolved. The gave me an outlet also for that
3:44
Speaker 5: actor in me to sort of perform and be silly.
3:48
Speaker 4: You know, that's funny to mention that, because I don't
3:50
Speaker 4: think there's any more public access shows around.
3:53
Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't know.
3:54
Speaker 5: I mean, I mean I'm in New York and I
3:56
Speaker 5: don't have cable anymore. So, but I'm assuming they still
3:59
Speaker 5: exist because it was actually written in as a law.
4:02
Speaker 5: I believe when cable stations started developing, people were, you know, saying, well,
4:06
Speaker 5: we don't want to have you guys digging holes and
4:08
Speaker 5: putting all this power lines in and all that. So
4:11
Speaker 5: they made a compromise saying, well, we'll allow you to
4:13
Speaker 5: put up your little, you know, your little shows and
4:16
Speaker 5: your little public community shows in exchange for that. So
4:20
Speaker 5: they may still be built into it, but no one
4:22
Speaker 5: probably really watches them.
4:24
Speaker 4: Yeah that could be the case, because I actually I
4:26
Speaker 4: do work for local township and Verizon and Comcast actually
4:31
Speaker 4: helped foot the bill for like upgrades and stuff. Oh yeah, yeah,
4:35
Speaker 4: so that way, yeah, so that way we can build
4:37
Speaker 4: new stuff. But so so work. When you started making
4:41
Speaker 4: this documentary walking full. But you know what job were
4:44
Speaker 4: you working at well when when you decided to make
4:47
Speaker 4: this to make walking forward.
4:48
Speaker 5: Yeah, I was sort of working in graphic design, So
4:52
Speaker 5: I was originally working at Macy's and then I started
4:57
Speaker 5: working then for one of the vps of Macy's left
5:01
Speaker 5: and start her own design firm, so I just basically
5:03
Speaker 5: worked with her. And that's in a sort of Westchester County,
5:08
Speaker 5: which is just north of New York City, so I
5:11
Speaker 5: was kind of doing the reverse commute. I was sort
5:12
Speaker 5: of going up into sort of the suburbs to work
5:15
Speaker 5: in the day. And it was actually when I was
5:18
Speaker 5: working there that I came up with the idea of
5:20
Speaker 5: walking across the country. Because the one of the bosses,
5:25
Speaker 5: who was a notorious alcoholic, was late to work one morning,
5:29
Speaker 5: so I was locked out of the building and I
5:31
Speaker 5: know way to get me in, So when I called him,
5:33
Speaker 5: he's like.
5:34
Speaker 3: Oh, yeah, yeah, I'll be there in ten minutes.
5:37
Speaker 5: Of course, he lived on Long Island, which is about
5:39
Speaker 5: an hour and a half away, so I knew it
5:41
Speaker 5: was going to be there too quickly.
5:43
Speaker 3: So instead of like sort of it was like October,
5:45
Speaker 3: so it.
5:46
Speaker 5: Was getting kind of cold, and I was like well,
5:47
Speaker 5: I don't want to just sort of sit on the sidewalk,
5:49
Speaker 5: I'll just go for a little walk. And on that
5:52
Speaker 5: little walk around the town, I sort of discovered things
5:55
Speaker 5: that I never really had the chance to look at.
5:58
Speaker 5: Those of this house, those on a the main thoroughfare
6:01
Speaker 5: that I've driven by many times, but never you know,
6:04
Speaker 5: looked at too closely. When I got close to it,
6:07
Speaker 5: I noticed that it was actually the home of Madam C. J. Walker,
6:11
Speaker 5: who was the first African American woman millionaire, and that
6:16
Speaker 5: was her first mansion, so it was basically the first
6:18
Speaker 5: black woman's mansion in America. And I've been driving by
6:23
Speaker 5: it and if I didn't walk by, I never would
6:25
Speaker 5: have noticed that plaque and figured out what it was,
6:27
Speaker 5: and just sort of it sort of sparked that excitement
6:30
Speaker 5: of like, oh, you know, when you're really walking, it's
6:33
Speaker 5: the macrocosm becomes a microcosm.
6:35
Speaker 3: You really get to find the details. And I started
6:39
Speaker 3: sort inspired me to.
6:40
Speaker 5: Say, well, you know what, I just just just keep
6:42
Speaker 5: on doing this and just go from one town to
6:44
Speaker 5: the other and then one stay to the other end,
6:46
Speaker 5: add infinitum.
6:48
Speaker 4: So when you decide to do this, Mark, did you
6:51
Speaker 4: tell anybody about it.
6:53
Speaker 5: Yeah, Well, the story is that I actually this is
6:57
Speaker 5: going back to the year two thousand and and I
7:02
Speaker 5: told lots of people about it. I was so excited,
7:04
Speaker 5: but I was also wary that people were going to,
7:07
Speaker 5: uh insure of my mom. I thought my mom for
7:10
Speaker 5: sure was going to say, Mark, now, that's just not
7:14
Speaker 5: very reasonable. I think she's going to offer something a
7:17
Speaker 5: little bit more reasonable, like why don't you just go
7:19
Speaker 5: for a walk, you know, to along out Long Island?
7:22
Speaker 3: How about that?
7:23
Speaker 5: But she was actually very enthusiastic, and she embraced it
7:27
Speaker 5: pretty wholeheartedly, so and pretty much. I was kind of
7:31
Speaker 5: surprised because almost everyone was enthusiastic. I think there was
7:36
Speaker 5: a few people that were a little you know, suspicious
7:39
Speaker 5: I was going to make it, and but almost everyone
7:43
Speaker 5: said go ahead and do it, which is actually a
7:44
Speaker 5: little disturbing because I was hoping for a few like naysayers,
7:47
Speaker 5: because I think it motivates you to sort of like
7:49
Speaker 5: prove people wrong kind of.
7:53
Speaker 4: So, So, did you have a lot of racers at
7:55
Speaker 4: all or was there just mainly everyone was very supportive.
7:58
Speaker 3: I think almost everyone's supporting.
8:00
Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean, I'm trying to think, I mean I
8:03
Speaker 5: had one friend who you know, I remember, we are
8:06
Speaker 5: sort of working on the route I was going to take,
8:09
Speaker 5: and when I said, okay, you know, I think I
8:11
Speaker 5: think this is the route I should take after I
8:12
Speaker 5: go to Chicago. And as soon as I said Chicago,
8:14
Speaker 5: he gave me a look like, come on, you're not
8:16
Speaker 5: going to make it to Chicago.
8:18
Speaker 3: It wasn't really him a naystare.
8:20
Speaker 5: It is just him saying being a realist, saying you're
8:22
Speaker 5: not gonna And then he actually said I'll get you know,
8:24
Speaker 5: I tell you, I'll give you five hundred bucks if
8:25
Speaker 5: you make it to Chicago. So that was probably the
8:28
Speaker 5: most sort of kind of like challenge that I got.
8:31
Speaker 5: But I remember my dad actually said that. He was
8:33
Speaker 5: like actually jealous. He's like, ah, I wish I could
8:36
Speaker 5: do that too, Like, Dad, Sure.
8:41
Speaker 4: Did you ever tell that alcoholic boss that? Did you
8:43
Speaker 4: ever say to him thank you because for you being
8:45
Speaker 4: an alcoholic I had this idea of this journey.
8:49
Speaker 5: No, I haven't done that, but though that might be
8:51
Speaker 5: part of the documentary. Because part of the documentary which
8:54
Speaker 5: I'm working on now, all the footage has been shot
8:57
Speaker 5: on the road, but I'm interviewing other people walked across
9:00
Speaker 5: the country, and I want to interview other family and
9:04
Speaker 5: friends to sort of just paying a serve, you know,
9:06
Speaker 5: just get a general picture. And I thought about maybe
9:09
Speaker 5: I should interview him, but I don't know if I would
9:10
Speaker 5: necessarily want I don't know if he's gonna want to
9:12
Speaker 5: be portrayed as the alcoholic employee slash motivator.
9:18
Speaker 3: So I don't know.
9:18
Speaker 4: So when you did go across the country, how much
9:23
Speaker 4: before you went though, how much planning actually went into
9:26
Speaker 4: you know, you walk across the country, did you map
9:28
Speaker 4: out each city you wanted to visit?
9:31
Speaker 3: Yeah?
9:31
Speaker 5: And actually again, maybe to clarify for the audience that
9:36
Speaker 5: I actually did do it twice.
9:38
Speaker 3: I back in two thousand.
9:39
Speaker 5: And one, I attempted and I failed, and then ten
9:46
Speaker 5: years later I built up the courage to finally do
9:49
Speaker 5: it again, and I started from scratch and I made
9:51
Speaker 5: it across.
9:54
Speaker 2: We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor,
10:00
Speaker 2: and now back to the show.
10:03
Speaker 5: So on the first one, I immediately decided not to
10:08
Speaker 5: do very much planning at all, because I was already
10:12
Speaker 5: dubbing myself the walking fool, and part of the I thought,
10:15
Speaker 5: the part of the charm was sort of sort of
10:16
Speaker 5: kind of go in headfirst and try to figure it
10:19
Speaker 5: out along the way.
10:22
Speaker 3: I did do a little bit you know, planning.
10:23
Speaker 5: I sort of like, back then there was no Google
10:26
Speaker 5: Maps for those map quests, so I was sort of
10:29
Speaker 5: mapping it out, was printing out all the maps. But
10:32
Speaker 5: then by day two of my walk, I ended up
10:35
Speaker 5: throwing them all out because it was too heavy.
10:36
Speaker 3: I'm like, oh, I don't need this, so I uh.
10:41
Speaker 5: And at that point, I think I was about two
10:43
Speaker 5: days into the walk, I was already pretty much sure
10:46
Speaker 5: I wasn't going to make it, so I the idea
10:50
Speaker 5: of me having maps of you know, South Dakota seemed
10:54
Speaker 5: kind of absurd, so I immediately desert tossed all those
10:58
Speaker 5: But I mean, you know you do. And actually, my
11:01
Speaker 5: friend who did the challenge to get the Chicago he
11:06
Speaker 5: was definitely a firm but he did a lot of
11:08
Speaker 5: camping and hiking, and so he was definitely a firm
11:10
Speaker 5: believer of like Mark, once you prepare a little bit,
11:12
Speaker 5: once you go for a little test run or something,
11:14
Speaker 5: and I was.
11:15
Speaker 3: Like, nah, I put on the backpack once I'm like, okay,
11:18
Speaker 3: this is good.
11:19
Speaker 5: I walked around the city for about you know, an hour,
11:21
Speaker 5: I'm like, oh, this is good. And then it changed
11:24
Speaker 5: very much on the day one of the first walk,
11:26
Speaker 5: because all of a sudden, you're putting in more stuff
11:28
Speaker 5: in your pack than you thought you were going to
11:29
Speaker 5: put in because you're like, oh, wait, I need this,
11:31
Speaker 5: Oh I need that, And then all of a sudden
11:32
Speaker 5: you got like an extra ten pounds on your back
11:34
Speaker 5: that you weren't expecting.
11:35
Speaker 3: So it was definitely a rude awakening.
11:39
Speaker 4: And you did have that camera you got for Christmas, right,
11:42
Speaker 4: that's have you recorded this with?
11:44
Speaker 5: No actually that the old vhs that went to the
11:47
Speaker 5: electronic graveyard by that point, but it was when it
11:52
Speaker 5: was right at the beginning of sort of the mini
11:54
Speaker 5: DV tapes that were coming out I think in the
11:57
Speaker 5: thing around nineteen ninety nine is when they started coming
11:59
Speaker 5: out with him. So it was kind of like a
12:00
Speaker 5: high eight camera, so was small in compact, but still
12:03
Speaker 5: definitely much bigger than the cameras are today. And it
12:07
Speaker 5: used these little miniature tapes, which were digital tapes that
12:11
Speaker 5: you could sort of actually in theory transfer to digital
12:14
Speaker 5: material straight onto your computer.
12:18
Speaker 3: So it was technology wise.
12:20
Speaker 5: It's kind of funny how technology is changing so rapidly
12:23
Speaker 5: in the film industry right now. But back then it
12:27
Speaker 5: was like kind of a big deal to have like
12:29
Speaker 5: this kind of small and decent quality camera that you
12:32
Speaker 5: could bring on a trip.
12:34
Speaker 4: Well, that's good, you know. That's because when I was
12:36
Speaker 4: reading about the documentary, that's something I was wondering, because
12:39
Speaker 4: I said, man, if he had to carry that thing
12:40
Speaker 4: around by the by I mean after he got into
12:44
Speaker 4: you know, Pennsylvania, he probably just wanted to throw into
12:46
Speaker 4: the river because I th those big heavy vhs toploading,
12:50
Speaker 4: top loading our cameras.
12:52
Speaker 3: Right, yeah.
12:53
Speaker 5: No, Fortunately, technology wise, by that point we did make
12:56
Speaker 5: a slight advancement, and but it was in that period,
13:00
Speaker 5: like I said, where it wasn't very common. You know,
13:03
Speaker 5: it was before smartphones obviously, and before video was easily
13:08
Speaker 5: compressed onto a small little.
13:09
Speaker 3: Device or a disc.
13:11
Speaker 5: So it was really the idea of sort of bringing
13:14
Speaker 5: a camera back in two thousand and one was kind
13:16
Speaker 5: of a novel idea, and I heard of other people
13:19
Speaker 5: who walked across the country, but no one at that
13:22
Speaker 5: point had filmed it as far as I knew.
13:24
Speaker 4: So just to ask right now, Walking Full is your
13:28
Speaker 4: first documentary? Is there any I mean, this is before
13:31
Speaker 4: crowdfunding and everything, and even before you know, social media
13:34
Speaker 4: got big, because this is still two thousand. Is there
13:37
Speaker 4: anything that you want to, like recommend filmmakers first time
13:40
Speaker 4: filmmakers were making their maybe their documentary or even their
13:43
Speaker 4: first feature film project or short. Is there anything you
13:46
Speaker 4: want to share with them that you've learned at this point?
13:50
Speaker 3: You mean in sort of relationship with your audience.
13:52
Speaker 4: I mean, yeah, exert because if you if you with
13:56
Speaker 4: this project of yours, is there anything because I mean
13:58
Speaker 4: I'm just stopping right now and just you know, before
14:01
Speaker 4: we get onto the journey, is there anything that you
14:03
Speaker 4: actually learned about filmmaking that you wanted to share because
14:06
Speaker 4: this is your first documentary?
14:08
Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean what's interesting also, is is it I
14:12
Speaker 5: think I mentioned this to you earlier before the show,
14:15
Speaker 5: is that I when I did this, I wasn't intending
14:18
Speaker 5: it to be a documentary. So it's difficult to sort
14:21
Speaker 5: of get that my perspective of how I was approaching it.
14:24
Speaker 5: I was approaching it as a public access show kind
14:26
Speaker 5: of like a web series, if you will, without really
14:30
Speaker 5: much intention of a of a mass audience. And I'm
14:34
Speaker 5: definitely learning more now as i'm sort of completing the project.
14:40
Speaker 5: It's just changed very dramatically where you definitely want to
14:43
Speaker 5: constantly be communicating with your audience and trying to get
14:46
Speaker 5: your audience as involved as possible. It is great that
14:51
Speaker 5: we have I mean, if I had Twitter on my
14:52
Speaker 5: first walk, we've it would have been a perfect venue
14:55
Speaker 5: to sort of give updates of my walk and then
14:58
Speaker 5: you know, build a following there. So then when you're
15:01
Speaker 5: ready to sort of do either you know, campaign you know,
15:06
Speaker 5: to raise money, or if you're trying to do screenings,
15:09
Speaker 5: you already have your audience because they're interested in the
15:12
Speaker 5: project itself, the subject matter itself. So I think that's
15:16
Speaker 5: the key is to sort of find your audience or
15:18
Speaker 5: just have an interest in that and not necessarily maybe
15:20
Speaker 5: in films, but just like what you're what you're interested in,
15:24
Speaker 5: what the documentary is about.
15:26
Speaker 4: Okay, very good points. And so to go back to
15:29
Speaker 4: your first journey. You know it's two thousand and you're
15:32
Speaker 4: about to start your first journey, So take us back
15:34
Speaker 4: to that first day. You know, where did you start
15:37
Speaker 4: your journey? And also you know what was going through
15:40
Speaker 4: your mind when you first started?
15:42
Speaker 5: Yeah, I started in New Jersey, and anyone who is
15:49
Speaker 5: from the New York area knows that's the best place
15:51
Speaker 5: to start any journey.
15:54
Speaker 3: No, so it was it was mainly because of convenience.
15:57
Speaker 5: It's like, if I wanted to start in New York,
15:59
Speaker 5: I wanted to start with the Atlantic Ocean. Putting your
16:01
Speaker 5: hands in the Atlantic Ocean was sort of the you know,
16:04
Speaker 5: ocean to ocean was the main parameters of the walk.
16:08
Speaker 5: So if I had to start in New York, I
16:10
Speaker 5: would have had to start way into Brooklyn, like Coneyellans,
16:12
Speaker 5: would have taken me like two days just to get
16:14
Speaker 5: out of you know, the New York City area. So
16:17
Speaker 5: I figured, well, let's do a shortcut that start in
16:20
Speaker 5: New Jersey. I had a bunch of so I took
16:23
Speaker 5: a ferry with a bunch of friends and family. They
16:25
Speaker 5: came over to Sandy Hook, New Jersey, which is just
16:28
Speaker 5: north shore, and it was it was great because it
16:32
Speaker 5: was you know, it's kind of like you sort of
16:33
Speaker 5: felt like a celebrity for a brief moment there and
16:36
Speaker 5: then ten minutes later on my walk and by myself,
16:39
Speaker 5: I'm like, oh boy, I'm really doing this. It's just
16:42
Speaker 5: like it seemed kind of surreal where you're like it
16:46
Speaker 5: was like a joke before and now it's like, Okay,
16:48
Speaker 5: now it's I'm really doing it, and like, am I
16:51
Speaker 5: really going to be doing this for the next you know,
16:52
Speaker 5: six to nine months of my life. It's like it
16:56
Speaker 5: weighs on you really quickly, but it doesn't hit you
16:58
Speaker 5: until you're actually making those first steps.
17:02
Speaker 4: And then when you first started, was there anybody in particular,
17:06
Speaker 4: like when you want to traveling that you specifically wanted
17:09
Speaker 4: to meet or did you just wanted to go town
17:11
Speaker 4: to town and whoever I meet is that's who would
17:13
Speaker 4: be in a documentary?
17:15
Speaker 3: Yeah.
17:15
Speaker 5: I mean again, it's like I was approaching it sort
17:18
Speaker 5: of as you know, I'm just gonna put together some goofy,
17:21
Speaker 5: you know, fun you know video of me walking. And
17:25
Speaker 5: I mean I used to enjoy just videotaping anything. If
17:27
Speaker 5: I was like had a you know trip, you know
17:30
Speaker 5: to the museum, I'd film it and make it into
17:32
Speaker 5: a little goofy you know, five minute video. So I
17:36
Speaker 5: was sort of seeing this like, oh, it's the same
17:37
Speaker 5: thing I've been doing, you know, kind of for the
17:40
Speaker 5: last ten years of my life, but now, you know,
17:41
Speaker 5: times one hundred or whatever. So I didn't really have
17:44
Speaker 5: any real goals of meeting anybody. It was just more
17:47
Speaker 5: like I just wanted to sort of go on an
17:48
Speaker 5: adventure and just be able to share it in a
17:51
Speaker 5: humorous way with maybe only a small audience, but you know,
17:56
Speaker 5: hopefully try to, you know, have my pain and suffering
17:59
Speaker 5: be the comical fodder for somebody else.
18:04
Speaker 4: So in the first trip, you you actually made it
18:07
Speaker 4: all way to South Dakota. Yeah, and that's where you quit.
18:10
Speaker 4: Now that's not a spoiler for anybody listening, I said,
18:12
Speaker 4: with a spoil or anything that's on Mark's blog, But
18:16
Speaker 4: you actually quit in South Dakota. Was it just too
18:20
Speaker 4: much at the first time and you just said I
18:22
Speaker 4: can't take us anymore?
18:23
Speaker 3: Or yeah. It's one of those things.
18:25
Speaker 5: It's it's one of those questions that people ask me,
18:28
Speaker 5: and it's one of those it's a difficult question to
18:30
Speaker 5: answer because it's hard to know what the factors are.
18:36
Speaker 5: It's I mean, you can name the things like, okay, yeah,
18:38
Speaker 5: I mean I was I was getting lonely, I was
18:40
Speaker 5: getting bored. I was actually running out of money, So
18:45
Speaker 5: it was you know, the mosquitoes were bothering me. So
18:48
Speaker 5: it's a lot of things that you know, we're sort
18:50
Speaker 5: of building up, building up, and you do become reflective
18:55
Speaker 5: and you're like, okay, why am I doing this? And
18:57
Speaker 5: like I said, my original approach was just like, okay,
19:00
Speaker 5: I want to go on an adventure and film it
19:01
Speaker 5: and make it, you know, funny for people.
19:04
Speaker 3: And I sort of felt like, well I did accomplish that.
19:07
Speaker 5: I think I've you know, back then, we had you know, blogs,
19:11
Speaker 5: so they're like Twitter but longer, and so I mean
19:17
Speaker 5: we so my friend was doing a blog, so I
19:18
Speaker 5: felt like, okay, I got it.
19:19
Speaker 3: You know, a bunch of people, they enjoyed it.
19:21
Speaker 5: But part of it also then got to a point
19:23
Speaker 5: where I was like I didn't like the idea people
19:27
Speaker 5: knowing what I was doing. It's sort of they were conflicting.
19:30
Speaker 3: With each other.
19:31
Speaker 5: The walk itself is a very personal, private kind of
19:34
Speaker 5: thing in a sense, but then also you know, you
19:37
Speaker 5: want to turn it into something that's you know, public entertaining,
19:41
Speaker 5: but they don't really work well together. So when you're walking,
19:44
Speaker 5: when you're really embracing the walk, you don't really want
19:46
Speaker 5: to feel. You don't want to feel about how am
19:48
Speaker 5: I going to do a joke? How am I going
19:49
Speaker 5: to get this camera? Angle, should I film this thing?
19:52
Speaker 5: You know, all these sort of logistical things to make
19:55
Speaker 5: a TV show or eventually a documentary.
19:59
Speaker 2: We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor,
20:05
Speaker 2: and now back to the show.
20:08
Speaker 5: You don't think about those when you're walking, So I
20:11
Speaker 5: think at that point I was like, I was too
20:13
Speaker 5: focused on the other thing, and I wasn't focused enough
20:16
Speaker 5: on me and a personal journey. So it kind of
20:20
Speaker 5: made sense at that point for me just to go
20:22
Speaker 5: back home.
20:23
Speaker 4: And how did you get home?
20:26
Speaker 3: I walked home. Oh no, wait a minute, no, I
20:31
Speaker 3: actually I took a bus.
20:33
Speaker 5: And there's probably nothing more depressing than taking a bus
20:36
Speaker 5: in general. And when you're taking a Greyhound bus after
20:40
Speaker 5: deciding to quit, you know, a magnificent, sort of massive undertaking.
20:47
Speaker 5: It's it's it's, you know, deeply, you know, saddening. But
20:53
Speaker 5: it was, it was kind of it was kind of
20:57
Speaker 5: I had to make that decision at that point because
20:59
Speaker 5: it was as I sort of saw it as the
21:01
Speaker 5: point of no return. It was the South Dakota border
21:03
Speaker 5: was kind of the halfway point in the walk. I
21:07
Speaker 5: always tell people, if you take an atlas the United
21:08
Speaker 5: States and open it up, it's usually the Crease.
21:10
Speaker 3: It's right about where I quit.
21:13
Speaker 5: So it was kind of I had to make that
21:15
Speaker 5: decision at that point, and I knew that it was
21:17
Speaker 5: either continue all the way to uh the Pacific Ocean
21:21
Speaker 5: or go home.
21:22
Speaker 3: So I went home.
21:23
Speaker 4: So then at that point, you know, you come you
21:26
Speaker 4: know years later, years later, you sort of feel relate
21:29
Speaker 4: to play and do this again.
21:31
Speaker 3: Yeah.
21:31
Speaker 5: It was one of those things that I sort of
21:34
Speaker 5: as enjoying, you know, the excitement of the of the travel,
21:37
Speaker 5: but you know, telling people about it was it was
21:39
Speaker 5: a great conversation piece.
21:40
Speaker 3: But in the back of my head, it was it
21:44
Speaker 3: was it was always.
21:45
Speaker 5: It started praying in my mind, you know, almost immediately,
21:47
Speaker 5: I started having those anxiety dreams, similar to like when
21:52
Speaker 5: you're back in high school and you're late for that
21:54
Speaker 5: you know, you didn't study for the exam or something.
21:57
Speaker 5: I had the things where I would be all of
21:59
Speaker 5: a sudden back walking across the country in some distant
22:03
Speaker 5: state like Wyoming, and I would be all of a sudden,
22:06
Speaker 5: I would accidentally get on a train back home and
22:08
Speaker 5: I'd be like, oh.
22:09
Speaker 3: No, I ruined it again.
22:11
Speaker 5: So it was one of these things just like, oh,
22:13
Speaker 5: I got to get this done. Because I have to
22:15
Speaker 5: do it for myself.
22:18
Speaker 4: Did you have a day job at this time too?
22:20
Speaker 5: Yeah, I went back to the same job I had
22:24
Speaker 5: before I did my walk, And then it continued on
22:27
Speaker 5: and me and graft design moved around from one job
22:30
Speaker 5: to the other. I fortunately got into working for an
22:34
Speaker 5: ad agency, a decent ad agency that paid very well.
22:37
Speaker 5: So part of the inspiration was that I was able
22:40
Speaker 5: to save up a lot of money, or a decent
22:42
Speaker 5: amount of money, so that was kind of key. I
22:45
Speaker 5: knew that if I was going to do the walk
22:46
Speaker 5: again that I wanted to build up a bigger nest egg,
22:51
Speaker 5: just to have a bigger safety net in case I
22:53
Speaker 5: just want I didn't have to worry about. That's one
22:55
Speaker 5: thing I didn't want to worry about, like, oh, can
22:57
Speaker 5: I afford this hotel? Are going crazy? Like I want
23:01
Speaker 5: to take a break for two days? Can I afford
23:02
Speaker 5: this hotel?
23:03
Speaker 3: Yes? You don't want to worry about that.
23:06
Speaker 4: So did you just have cash and no credit cards?
23:09
Speaker 3: No? I basically had Uh.
23:10
Speaker 5: Yeah, I carried ten thousand dollars and no happy brilliant move.
23:17
Speaker 5: It's funny people ask that question. I always think I
23:19
Speaker 5: always think the answer is obvious. I just had a
23:21
Speaker 5: debit card, so I just you know, saved it up,
23:23
Speaker 5: put it in my checking account, and just sort of
23:26
Speaker 5: you know, Unfortunately in America now you can find it,
23:29
Speaker 5: you know, an ATM machine pretty much anywhere, and McDonald
23:34
Speaker 5: still have a usually an ATM machine there. So I
23:38
Speaker 5: was just you know, take out money as you needed it,
23:39
Speaker 5: and yeah, and sometimes you're lucky if you were low
23:44
Speaker 5: on cash, I looked pathetic enough that you just sort
23:47
Speaker 5: of sat in front of a store.
23:49
Speaker 3: Someone probably eventually give you money. So that helped too,
23:54
Speaker 3: because you know.
23:55
Speaker 4: I know it does seem like an obvious question, but
23:57
Speaker 4: when I was thinking, when I was reading about your documentary,
23:59
Speaker 4: I'm thinking, what if he did just take a lot
24:01
Speaker 4: of cash around? What we What if we just threw
24:05
Speaker 4: caution to the wind and just decided to walk around
24:07
Speaker 4: with like, you know, fifteen k.
24:09
Speaker 5: Yeah, that would probably be impractical in many levels, one
24:13
Speaker 5: being you know, being robbed, and then too the weight
24:17
Speaker 5: just like oh paper, you know you're always thinking about.
24:20
Speaker 3: Poundage and ounces.
24:21
Speaker 5: You're like, oh, I mean you really make it really
24:23
Speaker 5: makes a big difference between one tent and another tent.
24:26
Speaker 5: It's like a medical well this tent is like one
24:29
Speaker 5: hundred dollars more, but it's three ounces lighter. You're gonna
24:32
Speaker 5: go over that one of three ounces lighter because every
24:34
Speaker 5: little bit helps.
24:36
Speaker 4: So when did you officially start the second journey? What
24:40
Speaker 4: year was that?
24:43
Speaker 5: Well, I'm not I'm not revealing the year only for
24:46
Speaker 5: dramatic purposes on the documentary, but we'll say it was
24:49
Speaker 5: it was approximately you know, it was a few years ago.
24:53
Speaker 3: So it was about ten years after the first one.
24:55
Speaker 4: Okay, So and then you know, did you also just
25:00
Speaker 4: you had to quit that job and then obviously you
25:03
Speaker 4: started across the country. So what were I without giving
25:06
Speaker 4: away too much, what were some of the craziest stories
25:09
Speaker 4: you have from filming?
25:11
Speaker 5: Well, certainly, yeah, I mean it's one of those things
25:16
Speaker 5: that's like, oh you can think about all that, all
25:18
Speaker 5: the different crazy things, like every day is like a.
25:20
Speaker 3: Crazy day because what's not quite the answer what you're
25:24
Speaker 3: looking more.
25:24
Speaker 5: But one interesting thing is that when you're walking, time
25:27
Speaker 5: moves extremely slow. So when you are thinking back of
25:32
Speaker 5: what happened earlier that same day, it feels like it
25:35
Speaker 5: was several days ago. It really it boggles the mind.
25:39
Speaker 5: Sometimes you're like, oh, when I did that? You know,
25:41
Speaker 5: on Tuesday or Wednesday. I'm like, no, women, that was
25:43
Speaker 5: this morning. So all this sort of the craziness gets
25:47
Speaker 5: sort of jammed in there, and like I said, it's
25:49
Speaker 5: like a microcosm, so every little bit becomes magnified in
25:53
Speaker 5: your mind. But I got a shotgun poll on me, me
25:58
Speaker 5: in West Virginia. So that's was crazy and rather unnerving.
26:05
Speaker 4: Well, you know, I was actually just watching a documentary
26:07
Speaker 4: about West Virginia too.
26:08
Speaker 3: Yeah. Was it a positive or was it a negative?
26:11
Speaker 4: Negative? Very negative? And it was actually called the Uh
26:15
Speaker 4: well it wasn't. It wasn't about West Virginia per se,
26:19
Speaker 4: but it was about the people of West Virginia and
26:22
Speaker 4: you know, just about the mining operation there and uh
26:25
Speaker 4: and some of the locals. So I could totally believe.
26:28
Speaker 4: It's just saying that documentary, I can totally believe you're
26:29
Speaker 4: getting a shotgun pulled on you in West Virginia.
26:31
Speaker 2: Yeah.
26:31
Speaker 5: I don't want to cast dispersions upon the good folks
26:34
Speaker 5: in West Virginia.
26:35
Speaker 3: But it's all good.
26:36
Speaker 4: Yeah, obviously, you know, I'm just kidding, But yeah, I know.
26:38
Speaker 5: But uh, but I mean one thing I did notice
26:41
Speaker 5: in in West Virginia. I mean when you're walking. One
26:43
Speaker 5: of the keys is you got to find a place
26:45
Speaker 5: to camp out. And so you got to find that
26:48
Speaker 5: right sweet spot where it's like a patch of woods
26:50
Speaker 5: you're sort of hidden, but also you don't want to
26:52
Speaker 5: be like obviously on someone's land, uh, you know, because
26:56
Speaker 5: you know, I mean, you're going to be trespassing, but
26:58
Speaker 5: you really just don't want to be invasive in your trespassing.
27:01
Speaker 5: So you try to find that nice, sort of sweet
27:03
Speaker 5: piece of land that's hidden but also a nice buffer
27:06
Speaker 5: from anyone's you know, sort of obvious home and where
27:09
Speaker 5: they could see you. But in West Virginia, I noticed
27:12
Speaker 5: that it was very difficult to find any spot that
27:16
Speaker 5: wasn't somehow occupy with some sort of hovel structure. Like
27:22
Speaker 5: in West Virginia, like land I don't know, just seemed
27:24
Speaker 5: to be a lot of sort of squatters on the
27:26
Speaker 5: land where you think, oh, that's be perfect and camp
27:29
Speaker 5: right here. And obviously you see a little box made
27:32
Speaker 5: out of like you know, piece of pieces of sheet
27:35
Speaker 5: metal and and like you know, a barrel with a
27:37
Speaker 5: fire going there Like okay, I guess that's some Moonshiner's
27:41
Speaker 5: you know, a residence there or something.
27:43
Speaker 3: So it's a very it's.
27:47
Speaker 5: A very interesting different kind of mentality there, and I
27:51
Speaker 5: think they're certainly a little bit more wary of sort
27:54
Speaker 5: of strangers coming into their area.
27:57
Speaker 4: I mean that is that is you know, pretty scary
27:59
Speaker 4: that I have a shack pulled on you. But again
28:01
Speaker 4: that you know, thanks for sharing it with us. Again,
28:03
Speaker 4: I want to give too much away. If there was
28:04
Speaker 4: some kind of you know, uh, you know, incredibly crazy
28:07
Speaker 4: story because documentary is coming out. Uh well, we'll get
28:11
Speaker 4: to that soon, but when the document's going out, but.
28:14
Speaker 5: Right, yeah, no, I mean yeah, I mean I think uh,
28:16
Speaker 5: I mean also part of the fun is I mean
28:18
Speaker 5: there's also some stories that you know, which is we're crazy,
28:21
Speaker 5: but you didn't didn't capture on video, So that's also
28:25
Speaker 5: that's part of it too. So I mean I did
28:27
Speaker 5: get the it again goes with sort of the filmmaking,
28:30
Speaker 5: and I did happen to get the audio of the
28:33
Speaker 5: guy when he pulled the shotgun, but I didn't get
28:35
Speaker 5: the video of it.
28:36
Speaker 3: So it's one of those things.
28:38
Speaker 5: It's like, uh, you don't know how that's going to
28:40
Speaker 5: work out when it comes to the final you know,
28:42
Speaker 5: the final cut of the film, whether even to use
28:44
Speaker 5: it or not, because if you don't have the video,
28:47
Speaker 5: I mean, if you don't have the you know, it's
28:49
Speaker 5: just a shot of the ground basically, But there's also
28:52
Speaker 5: a certain charm and I think too sometimes in a
28:55
Speaker 5: documentary we don't have that perfect shot. I'm always a
28:57
Speaker 5: little bit suspicious of those documentaries that has nothing but
29:00
Speaker 5: beautiful shots.
29:03
Speaker 3: So I think that's something to go with as well.
29:06
Speaker 4: Yeah, you can always just super impose the text on
29:09
Speaker 4: the on the the on the shot too as well.
29:12
Speaker 4: So if you have a shot point to the ground.
29:13
Speaker 4: I've seen that before too, you know where they yeah,
29:15
Speaker 4: they don't have the perfect shot, so they just super
29:17
Speaker 4: imposed the audio just in case.
29:19
Speaker 5: Yeah, I'm actually and I'm toying with the idea because
29:22
Speaker 5: I do. I'm working with it an animator to to
29:26
Speaker 5: basically do graphics of the map more or less to
29:28
Speaker 5: show the progress, because I find it's very important to
29:31
Speaker 5: sort of get a you know, a bird's eye view
29:34
Speaker 5: of like the.
29:34
Speaker 3: Progress you're making.
29:36
Speaker 5: But I'm also toying with the idea of some of
29:38
Speaker 5: these moments that weren't captured on film to sort of
29:42
Speaker 5: do a little animated little sequence of them, especially if
29:46
Speaker 5: I have the audio of it. It might be kind of
29:47
Speaker 5: entertaining to actually do a little cartoon with the actual audio,
29:51
Speaker 5: but that's one of those things that you sort of
29:53
Speaker 5: developed when it gets closer to the final edit.
29:57
Speaker 2: We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor,
30:04
Speaker 2: and now back to the show.
30:07
Speaker 4: Yeah, I told you where you're coming from, and yeah,
30:10
Speaker 4: I wish you the best animation stuff. I know that
30:12
Speaker 4: can be tricky sometimes just to find the other right
30:14
Speaker 4: animator and everything.
30:16
Speaker 5: Yeah, exactly. I mean, you know, I have a friend
30:18
Speaker 5: who well sort of a friend of a friend who's in.
30:21
Speaker 5: I think he's a fantastic editor. But yeah, it's also
30:24
Speaker 5: a matter of like, you know, when you're doing a
30:25
Speaker 5: low ultra low budget, you know, documentary, it's like you
30:29
Speaker 5: want to you want to spend you want to make
30:31
Speaker 5: the best film you can, but also you want to
30:33
Speaker 5: know where to spend your money to priorities, so where
30:36
Speaker 5: you need to spend the money first.
30:38
Speaker 4: Exactly, And I think that's another you know, a trait
30:40
Speaker 4: that of having a good producer comes in even for
30:43
Speaker 4: your documentary or future film what have you. It's just
30:47
Speaker 4: knowing how to allocate budgets properly. Yeah, that's a skill
30:50
Speaker 4: all of in itself.
30:51
Speaker 3: Yeah.
30:51
Speaker 5: Absolutely, And it's certainly one of those ones as a
30:54
Speaker 5: you know, as a director, you don't want to think
30:56
Speaker 5: about as much because you want to think more about
30:58
Speaker 5: how can I, you know, how can I make this
31:01
Speaker 5: a great entertaining film that's gonna maybe have some meaning
31:05
Speaker 5: to an audience out there. And it's hard to sort
31:08
Speaker 5: of put on the different hats. And that's why I
31:10
Speaker 5: agree it's it's good to have a producer that has
31:12
Speaker 5: the enthusiasm but also has the ability to be able to,
31:17
Speaker 5: you know, pull away and say, listen, we can't do that.
31:19
Speaker 3: You know, we can do this, you know.
31:22
Speaker 4: Yeah, exactly. So, Mark, do you want to take some
31:25
Speaker 4: questions right now from the audience?
31:27
Speaker 3: Sure?
31:27
Speaker 4: From our Twitter audience.
31:29
Speaker 3: Sure.
31:30
Speaker 4: The first question I have, and this comes from at
31:34
Speaker 4: Emily Russell act, is where is the weirdest place you
31:38
Speaker 4: ever prooved? Any lot of Lizard story experiences?
31:43
Speaker 5: Okay, I don't understand what the second one means.
31:46
Speaker 4: I don't know what that means either.
31:48
Speaker 3: Okay, I know what the first one means.
31:53
Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean it's funny on the first walk, I
31:57
Speaker 5: h I never, I never, uh should we use the
32:02
Speaker 5: the verb poop.
32:04
Speaker 4: I don't know, I'd pretty use whatever whatever verb you'd like.
32:07
Speaker 5: Okay, no holds bar no. I mean I never went
32:11
Speaker 5: to number two. We never defecated, uh, other than in
32:14
Speaker 5: public restrooms. But on the second walk, you sort of
32:17
Speaker 5: learned at some point you're like, okay, you know what.
32:21
Speaker 5: I remember the first time I actually uh shit in
32:24
Speaker 5: the woods and felt like a bear, And I was
32:28
Speaker 5: like it was actually rather liberating because you're like, Okay,
32:31
Speaker 5: you know this is you know, this is part of
32:34
Speaker 5: what we're doing here. I mean, you know, it was
32:36
Speaker 5: always very careful, but not being on again in someone's property.
32:40
Speaker 5: But I'm glad we were able to finally get that
32:44
Speaker 5: controversy out in the open.
32:48
Speaker 4: Surprise Is that surprising me? That's the first question.
32:51
Speaker 3: It is sort of the as it's an opener.
32:53
Speaker 5: Yeah, that was more would be a closer type of thing,
32:55
Speaker 5: you know, where I could just laugh it off.
32:58
Speaker 3: Anyway. It's great, been talking.
33:00
Speaker 4: And ask you later. Uh yeah. The second question is, uh,
33:06
Speaker 4: this is by Zia Taylor and at May Underscore by
33:09
Speaker 4: underscores how many pairs of shoes did it take to
33:13
Speaker 4: walk across the country.
33:15
Speaker 5: That's funny, I mean, that's actually that was usually like
33:19
Speaker 5: when I was walking and people had the questions while
33:22
Speaker 5: I was walking, that's the question they'd loved, asking how
33:24
Speaker 5: many pairs of shoes? And I always, for some reason,
33:27
Speaker 5: I don't know why, I was resentful with that question.
33:29
Speaker 3: I'm like, who cares? You know. I kind of was like, yeah,
33:32
Speaker 3: who cares about that?
33:33
Speaker 5: And I never had a good answer because also you're
33:35
Speaker 5: always sort of rotating your your your shoes, so you're
33:39
Speaker 5: going kind of you have your main pair and you
33:41
Speaker 5: have your your backup pair. But I would say I
33:44
Speaker 5: had probably three main pairs of shoes that sort of
33:48
Speaker 5: got me across, and then probably another two or three
33:51
Speaker 5: secondary pairs I sort of had as back up. And
33:55
Speaker 5: I can even I can name it out of Marrol's
33:58
Speaker 5: and uh, and then up with the Columbia's, which were
34:02
Speaker 5: super cheap. Actually I got in Casper, Wyoming, and they
34:05
Speaker 5: got me all the way from Casper, Wyoming to to
34:08
Speaker 5: the to the sunny shores of California.
34:12
Speaker 3: Oh nice, Yeah, as.
34:13
Speaker 5: I mean then they were pretty cheap, and I was like,
34:15
Speaker 5: I was kind of surprised they're getting they were getting
34:18
Speaker 5: kind of you know, getting kind of holy and uh
34:21
Speaker 5: or you know, torn apart by by that time.
34:24
Speaker 3: But they did make me there. They make me get
34:26
Speaker 3: me there, So you.
34:28
Speaker 4: Know, it's interesting if you try. I wonder if you
34:30
Speaker 4: ever pitched this to a shoe company. I wonder what
34:32
Speaker 4: the response would have been like if you pitched you
34:34
Speaker 4: like a Nike or an Adidas.
34:36
Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean, I'm still I mean, of course you're
34:37
Speaker 5: still open to that because I mean we're you know,
34:40
Speaker 5: only just now sort of you know, entering post production,
34:43
Speaker 5: which can actually be very costly part oh absolutely, especially
34:48
Speaker 5: on a documentary because that's where kind of the storytelling
34:51
Speaker 5: is being developed. So we're still we're not closed the
34:56
Speaker 5: idea of finding any sort of any sort of corporate
34:58
Speaker 5: sponsorship if they're willing. But I mean, again talking to
35:03
Speaker 5: about being first time directors, it's a little bit more
35:07
Speaker 5: difficult when you don't have a big resume under your
35:10
Speaker 5: belt to be able to get some of those corporate sponsors.
35:14
Speaker 5: But that's also the advantage of sometimes getting a good producer,
35:17
Speaker 5: because if can get a good producer, even if it's
35:19
Speaker 5: only a name that has a decent amount of credits,
35:22
Speaker 5: I definitely found to find that that will open up
35:25
Speaker 5: more doors at least get you to talk to some
35:28
Speaker 5: people and maybe pitch some ideas.
35:30
Speaker 4: Oh yeah, absolutely. And the best question that comes in
35:34
Speaker 4: from at Google bartle, which is any trouble from police
35:39
Speaker 4: or hostile locals.
35:44
Speaker 3: Well, we talked about the hostile local.
35:47
Speaker 5: There were a couple other hostile locals, but actually not
35:49
Speaker 5: many hostile locals. It was mostly but I did encounter
35:52
Speaker 5: the police, believe it or not. Pretty much every state
35:56
Speaker 5: you walk through you get stopped by the police. It
36:02
Speaker 5: just it's they always claim that just because they give
36:05
Speaker 5: a lot of different reasons. Why sometimes they give false reasons,
36:08
Speaker 5: you know, oh we got to complain about this or that.
36:11
Speaker 5: But a lot of times it's just strictly you look
36:13
Speaker 5: a little strange. They want to write your name down.
36:17
Speaker 5: And actually a couple of the encounters encounters do make
36:19
Speaker 5: it into well should make it into the final cut
36:22
Speaker 5: of the film.
36:22
Speaker 3: So I did get a couple on a video, so.
36:27
Speaker 5: Definitely, you know, I mean, I I built a certain
36:31
Speaker 5: resentment towards our law enforcement people, but I mean I
36:34
Speaker 5: sort of also understood, you know, why they were doing it.
36:37
Speaker 5: So half the time I was usually okay, without the
36:40
Speaker 5: other half the times I was like.
36:42
Speaker 4: Don't be bugging me, man, I'm just doing my thing,
36:46
Speaker 4: so it's not gonna be like a police brutality incident
36:49
Speaker 4: in the documentary or anything.
36:50
Speaker 3: Yeah, y'all been brutalizing me every single day, Dobbs.
36:54
Speaker 5: Sorry, it's a David Cross thing. Yeah, y'all been rutalizing me, so,
36:59
Speaker 5: I mean, but it is. I mean, it does sort
37:01
Speaker 5: of ruin the flow sometimes. Again, if it's the timing
37:05
Speaker 5: is off, you're like wow. It also sort of is
37:08
Speaker 5: a good interesting comment about how things change sometimes from
37:12
Speaker 5: one count to the other. When I was county from
37:14
Speaker 5: the other cause I was in Kentucky, I was in
37:17
Speaker 5: this one county with this one town.
37:18
Speaker 3: Everyone was wonderful.
37:20
Speaker 5: There was just I was going to stay in this
37:21
Speaker 5: town for like just a few minutes, just to pick
37:23
Speaker 5: up a package at the post office. But all the
37:25
Speaker 5: people were amazing. They were just like so enthusiastic. They
37:28
Speaker 5: had a great sense of humor. You know, they understood,
37:32
Speaker 5: you know what my walk was about. It was just
37:34
Speaker 5: like this instantaneous like understanding. And then you go over
37:38
Speaker 5: just the county line and the next thing you know,
37:39
Speaker 5: you're getting called on by the police by you know,
37:43
Speaker 5: a nosy neighbor or something, and you're getting this sort
37:45
Speaker 5: of real, sort of negative attitude. So just a matter
37:48
Speaker 5: of a couple miles makes a difference in America, which
37:51
Speaker 5: is very unexpected.
37:54
Speaker 4: Yeah, you know, just to the side, and I think
37:55
Speaker 4: a lot of people in front of European listeners, so
37:59
Speaker 4: you know, I we say this is that fifty that
38:02
Speaker 4: America really is like fifty different mini countries, because really
38:06
Speaker 4: I've been all over this country too, and you you know,
38:09
Speaker 4: just going from state to state, you know, not only
38:11
Speaker 4: does each state that they make up its own laws,
38:13
Speaker 4: but you know also you find like different customs, different locals.
38:16
Speaker 4: I mean, really, it's just it is amazing how different
38:19
Speaker 4: this country is.
38:20
Speaker 5: Right, And I always sort of understood that and then,
38:22
Speaker 5: but it was very fascint when you discover how it
38:24
Speaker 5: works on it even on a smaller level. Just I'm
38:26
Speaker 5: going from one township to the next township can make
38:29
Speaker 5: a difference too, And it's like you notice there's certain
38:32
Speaker 5: rivalries going out between these towns, like it's a service.
38:35
Speaker 5: It's a weird like understated thing where like they won't
38:38
Speaker 5: even acknowledge the next town over.
38:40
Speaker 3: I'm like, oh, how far is it? The Lewisbourg.
38:41
Speaker 5: They're like I've never heard of Louisbourg, and I'm like,
38:44
Speaker 5: it's the next town over. Well, I don't know anything
38:47
Speaker 5: about that, so it's like, okay, so you it's it's
38:51
Speaker 5: very people are very uh and on that one is
38:54
Speaker 5: the sort of nationalism on a very local level.
38:57
Speaker 3: So I don't know township ism.
39:00
Speaker 4: So our next question is what was the biggest pain
39:03
Speaker 4: you experienced along the way? Mental or physical and specific incidents?
39:08
Speaker 3: Please?
39:08
Speaker 4: And that was from at the I think the Heatherington
39:12
Speaker 4: I'm sorry a Heatherington. Uh so again, tretor rate that
39:15
Speaker 4: that was what was the biggest pain you experienced along
39:18
Speaker 4: the way? Mental, physical and incidents?
39:20
Speaker 3: Please?
39:21
Speaker 5: Oh m, that's now we're getting Now, we're getting into
39:25
Speaker 5: deep sadness.
39:27
Speaker 4: You want me you want me to come back to
39:28
Speaker 4: that one?
39:29
Speaker 3: Yeah, maybe we can come back to that one.
39:30
Speaker 4: Okay. Now I have about two or three more questions
39:33
Speaker 4: about you, uh, you know, dropping a deuce or your
39:36
Speaker 4: bathroom habits. Okay, want me to skip those?
39:40
Speaker 3: Yeah? Well we well, I'll tell.
39:41
Speaker 5: One little mini story of actually there's not much of
39:45
Speaker 5: a mini story. I just have actually two words for you,
39:47
Speaker 5: tackle bell. We'll leave it at that. So, uh, that
39:53
Speaker 5: caused that that caused a couple uh close calls.
39:57
Speaker 2: If you will, we'll right back after a word from
40:01
Speaker 2: our sponsor and now back to the show.
40:08
Speaker 3: And then and then the solution usually is a bridge.
40:13
Speaker 5: So going underneath the bridge is sort of your kind
40:17
Speaker 5: of is like a little safe haven which actually continues
40:21
Speaker 5: on honestly, not just to you know, dropping a deuce.
40:25
Speaker 5: It's also it applies to sometimes when it's raining and
40:28
Speaker 5: you want to escape the rain, or you want a
40:31
Speaker 5: place to camp out, you can't find a place a
40:33
Speaker 5: lot of times, just go underneath the bridge. I found
40:37
Speaker 5: a certain amount of comfort, and that's something I discovered
40:39
Speaker 5: more on the second walk. And the first walk I
40:40
Speaker 5: didn't really do that very much, but on the second
40:42
Speaker 5: walk I sort of started embracing the bridge concept that
40:46
Speaker 5: maybe I was more hoboie or at that point. But
40:51
Speaker 5: you found a certain comfort and you sort of got
40:53
Speaker 5: used to that sound, that whirring sound of the car
40:56
Speaker 5: is going over the bridge above you. You sort of
40:58
Speaker 5: kind of it was almost like a lulla bi I
41:00
Speaker 5: would send you to sleep.
41:03
Speaker 4: So okay, so your advice was, you know, taco bell,
41:05
Speaker 4: which is you know, a good run for the border
41:07
Speaker 4: and then bridges.
41:09
Speaker 5: Yeah, well, yeah, I had to talk about run for
41:11
Speaker 5: the bridge border, you know or whatever.
41:13
Speaker 3: So that's that's usually what you have to do if
41:15
Speaker 3: you eat Taco Bell.
41:17
Speaker 5: So I would highly recommend not eating Taco Bell when
41:20
Speaker 5: you're walking across the country.
41:21
Speaker 3: But to each their own.
41:24
Speaker 4: And uh cool, Saint three is where did where in
41:28
Speaker 4: the hell did you charge your phone?
41:31
Speaker 5: Actually it goes back a lot to the fast food
41:34
Speaker 5: uh sort of world, a lot of fast food restaurants,
41:39
Speaker 5: and McDonald's was actually one of my favorite places to
41:43
Speaker 5: go for multiple reasons.
41:45
Speaker 3: One was cheap food.
41:47
Speaker 5: Two was a lot of times they would have an
41:49
Speaker 5: outlet where you could charge your phone and my camera batteries.
41:53
Speaker 5: I had to you know, I had to charge my
41:54
Speaker 5: battery the batteries of my camera as well, and it
41:58
Speaker 5: was usually run by, you know, a bunch of teenage
42:01
Speaker 5: kids didn't really care that much, so you could sort
42:03
Speaker 5: of sit there if you wanted to for hours and
42:05
Speaker 5: hours and no one would ever, you know, give you
42:08
Speaker 5: a hard time.
42:08
Speaker 3: So those were also really nice places to sort of go.
42:12
Speaker 5: It was kind of like your little, uh pit stop
42:15
Speaker 5: where you can sort of regroup and do a little
42:17
Speaker 5: quick I don't know, you would call it a little quick,
42:20
Speaker 5: mini mini bath in the bathroom and they get ready
42:24
Speaker 5: for your next leg at the walk.
42:26
Speaker 4: That's cool, at least you know that. It's always helpful
42:29
Speaker 4: when you finding proup of kids who were just like, yeah,
42:30
Speaker 4: you know, we're not gonna take this too seriously.
42:33
Speaker 3: Yeah no, And even the adults didn't.
42:35
Speaker 5: I mean, so, I mean I spent a lot of
42:36
Speaker 5: times in like fast food places, and I remember actually
42:39
Speaker 5: I was at a subway and I was like I
42:44
Speaker 5: was in the corner and I was like looking for something.
42:46
Speaker 5: So I was like pulling everything out of my bag.
42:48
Speaker 5: It was just like I had like, you know, dirty socks.
42:51
Speaker 5: I had just like you know, I had chords for
42:53
Speaker 5: my you know, my camera all, you know, all over
42:56
Speaker 5: the place. I'm like looking for them, and the manager
42:58
Speaker 5: sort of steps up and it's like, uh, what's going on,
43:01
Speaker 5: And I'm like.
43:01
Speaker 3: Oh no, I'm gone, I'm gonna get in trouble. I'm
43:04
Speaker 3: gonna get hassled.
43:05
Speaker 5: And he's like, I'm walking across the country and I'm
43:08
Speaker 5: looking for my battery. And it's like, oh my god,
43:10
Speaker 5: that's so great, And so let me give you some
43:11
Speaker 5: coupons for some pre sandwiches you can use along the way,
43:15
Speaker 5: and he was like so excited. So you find most
43:19
Speaker 5: people are so excited about when you tell him what
43:21
Speaker 5: you're doing because two things. One, it's a great adventure.
43:25
Speaker 5: But also I think they appreciate your exploration of our
43:30
Speaker 5: country because they just know, hey, this is someone who's
43:32
Speaker 5: taking the time to not just know about Chicago and
43:36
Speaker 5: New York and LA and you know, maybe Dallas or whatever.
43:40
Speaker 5: You know, it's someone who's like learning all the little
43:43
Speaker 5: bits and pieces of America.
43:45
Speaker 3: So I think a lot of people really appreciate that.
43:49
Speaker 4: Yeah, definitely, I agree with that. So that is the
43:53
Speaker 4: end of the question. Because a lot of the questions
43:55
Speaker 4: Mark just repeats to what we've already been over and
43:57
Speaker 4: again there's a lot of guys seem to want to
44:00
Speaker 4: really know what you did with it for a bathroom wise, yeah,
44:04
Speaker 4: it seems to be number one question.
44:06
Speaker 3: It's a number one question about number two. So yeah,
44:12
Speaker 3: I know it.
44:12
Speaker 5: It's funny because it does seem like, again one of
44:14
Speaker 5: those kind of obvious questions. It's like, well, you know,
44:17
Speaker 5: you were in college at one point, and at least
44:19
Speaker 5: you know how to do You know how to do
44:20
Speaker 5: number one. So I'm surprised that people are asking about that.
44:24
Speaker 5: But you know, it's a.
44:26
Speaker 4: I think someone's hoping you're just gonna say, like, yeah,
44:29
Speaker 4: I just there a crap right in the middle of
44:30
Speaker 4: the street. That's what someone's hoping out there.
44:34
Speaker 3: Maybe that's what they're hoping.
44:35
Speaker 5: But I not to disappoint, but I did feel like
44:40
Speaker 5: taking a dump in the middle of a Las Vegas
44:42
Speaker 5: when I was in there, so only because it's just
44:46
Speaker 5: it's not a town you want to necessarily walk through.
44:49
Speaker 5: It's not some towns are definitely more geared towards walking,
44:54
Speaker 5: and Las Vegas is not one of the ones that
44:56
Speaker 5: sort of it doesn't really open in its arms to
45:01
Speaker 5: you know, to walkers. But it wasn't terrible, but just
45:03
Speaker 5: it just you just felt it just didn't feel right.
45:06
Speaker 5: You didn't you didn't quite mesh in there quite well, which.
45:09
Speaker 4: Is gambling away at college funds or anything.
45:11
Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly, I wasn't, you know. And it was interesting.
45:14
Speaker 5: At one point I was walking, you know, I had
45:15
Speaker 5: the whole stick and walking through there, and someone just
45:19
Speaker 5: I definitely got a few stairs and I actually remember
45:22
Speaker 5: it reminds me when I was walking through New Jersey.
45:25
Speaker 5: I was like just in Newark, New Jersey, just outside
45:27
Speaker 5: of New York, New Jersey, walking with a stick and
45:30
Speaker 5: it's a big black dude in a football jersey was walking,
45:35
Speaker 5: you know, coming towards me, and he just pointed me
45:37
Speaker 5: and goes Mountain Man and just kept them walking. So
45:40
Speaker 5: I was like, hey, you know again, it was that
45:44
Speaker 5: was things like that actually boost your energy because it's
45:47
Speaker 5: just like it's just somewhat acknowledging that you're doing something
45:50
Speaker 5: and it's like a little moment that you just share
45:52
Speaker 5: it with somebody.
45:53
Speaker 3: It's it's it's it's kind of exciting and rewarding.
45:57
Speaker 4: And as we were talking about before, for the show
46:00
Speaker 4: actually started, you actually we're on weeding it on, but
46:04
Speaker 4: you actually try to get on the prices, right, correct?
46:07
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, I was hoping. I was hoping that.
46:09
Speaker 5: You know, some people actually one time I remember seeing
46:12
Speaker 5: on the prices right. So one said I drove two
46:15
Speaker 5: thousand miles to be on the prices, right, So I thought, well,
46:18
Speaker 5: I walked four.
46:18
Speaker 3: Thousand and it's like, how could that? How could I
46:21
Speaker 3: not get picked on there?
46:23
Speaker 5: So it's one of those things where you know you're
46:26
Speaker 5: dealing with TV producers and you never know what's going
46:29
Speaker 5: through their minds, and and it's just one of those
46:33
Speaker 5: things that you deserve. You hope, I hope you're going
46:35
Speaker 5: to get some mixed I mean, and I got you know,
46:38
Speaker 5: I got a lot of definitely a lot of people
46:39
Speaker 5: that were interested in it. So I always, like a
46:42
Speaker 5: lot of times the host of the show was very
46:43
Speaker 5: interested in it, but the producers were never so keen
46:46
Speaker 5: of putting me on. I don't know exactly why, but
46:49
Speaker 5: it's one of those things where it's like, I think
46:51
Speaker 5: it's just sort of a creative sort of rivalry going
46:54
Speaker 5: on there a little bit.
46:55
Speaker 4: Yeah again, yeah, you ever know if those TV producers,
46:58
Speaker 4: you know, what if they were thinking at the moment.
47:00
Speaker 5: And so because Bonnie Hunt, I was in the audience
47:03
Speaker 5: of Bunny Hunt when she had her daytime show, and
47:06
Speaker 5: she you know, she did a little Q and A
47:09
Speaker 5: and she found out that I was walking. She was like,
47:11
Speaker 5: oh my god, you got to.
47:12
Speaker 3: Get on the show. We got to put you on
47:13
Speaker 3: the show.
47:14
Speaker 5: So then I went and I talked to one of
47:16
Speaker 5: the producers and then she was like a junior producer.
47:18
Speaker 5: She's like, Okay, I'm gonna go and see what they think.
47:21
Speaker 5: And then she came back. When she came back, I
47:23
Speaker 5: saw that she had a Bonnie Hunt sweatshirt with her,
47:26
Speaker 5: So I'm like, uh, oh, that's a consolation prize.
47:29
Speaker 3: They're not gonna want to put me. Yeah, well we
47:32
Speaker 3: can't really youth right now, but here's a sweater so whatever.
47:37
Speaker 5: So but yeah, I mean that's also part of the
47:40
Speaker 5: perseverance you need in general making a movie. I mean,
47:43
Speaker 5: talking about producing films is you have to be confident
47:46
Speaker 5: in it and you're gonna you're gonna sometimes hit roadblocks
47:51
Speaker 5: for maybe no real apparent reason, so you have to
47:55
Speaker 5: just sort of keep on going and being confident that
47:57
Speaker 5: what you're producing, the you know, content and the story
48:00
Speaker 5: you're telling is something that you think is worthwhile.
48:05
Speaker 4: Yeah. Absolutely, And now you have you and your producers
48:10
Speaker 4: are forming an Indian Google campaign for the end of
48:12
Speaker 4: the summer to cover post production, uh, post production on
48:17
Speaker 4: the film.
48:17
Speaker 3: Correct, Yes, that's correct.
48:19
Speaker 4: Do you have an exact date when they'll be India
48:21
Speaker 4: goog campaign is supposed to start.
48:23
Speaker 5: We don't have exact date yet because we're we want
48:26
Speaker 5: to finish up our the interview, so we're trying to
48:31
Speaker 5: finish up sort of the production of filming these people. So,
48:34
Speaker 5: but we are anticipating end of the summer, so we're
48:36
Speaker 5: thinking either end of August or beginning of September. So
48:40
Speaker 5: it's coming up soon. But we're gonna hopefully have a
48:44
Speaker 5: solid date by you know, by July, we'll know when
48:47
Speaker 5: we're gonna be launching that, all.
48:48
Speaker 4: Right, excellent, And then obviously after that you'll know exactly
48:50
Speaker 4: when the film's gonna be released.
48:53
Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean, you know, certainly then we'll I mean,
48:55
Speaker 5: we have a timetable. But again, when it comes to
48:58
Speaker 5: the editing, especially on a documentary, you never know exactly
49:03
Speaker 5: you know, where it's going to be. I mean, there's
49:07
Speaker 5: a great documentary called Quting the Boxer, which was nominated
49:11
Speaker 5: for an Academy Award last year, and they they spent
49:16
Speaker 5: almost I think they spent almost a year editing. They
49:20
Speaker 5: first started off, you know, doing it for seven months.
49:22
Speaker 5: They thought they were ready, but then they all of
49:23
Speaker 5: a sudden got some new footage that they weren't expecting
49:26
Speaker 5: to get, and then it sort of just changed the
49:28
Speaker 5: editing process again for another three months.
49:31
Speaker 3: So that's the one scary thing.
49:34
Speaker 5: One good thing about My Walk is that there's a
49:36
Speaker 5: sort of temporal story there where we are sort of
49:39
Speaker 5: going from one end to the other, you know, the country,
49:42
Speaker 5: so you can't really mix around with the time, you know,
49:47
Speaker 5: the narrative of the time. You can't really jump from
49:49
Speaker 5: California to back to Pennsylvania.
49:52
Speaker 3: It doesn't really make much sense.
49:55
Speaker 2: We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor
50:01
Speaker 2: and now back to the show.
50:05
Speaker 5: In most instances, so hopefully it will streamline the editing process.
50:09
Speaker 3: But we are looking for.
50:13
Speaker 5: Beginning twenty fifteen to start shopping around with some festivals
50:18
Speaker 5: and look for a distributor.
50:20
Speaker 4: All right, excellent, and you know when everything's up, when
50:23
Speaker 4: you your crowdfunding campaign up, let me know and I'll
50:25
Speaker 4: definitely tweet it out for you.
50:26
Speaker 5: Oh yeah, I appreciate that. Yeah, I mean, it's one
50:28
Speaker 5: of those things. It's like you're hoping, you know, you're
50:31
Speaker 5: hoping that you have an interesting enough story that at
50:33
Speaker 5: least bring people to the Indiegogo campaign page and sort
50:36
Speaker 5: of at least check it out, and then hopefully from
50:39
Speaker 5: that get enthusiastic to maybe drop a bill or two.
50:45
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, you never know, and you know, maybe even
50:48
Speaker 4: by then one of those shoe companies might even hear
50:51
Speaker 4: about this project. Be like, hey, yeah, that guy walked
50:54
Speaker 4: through the country with our shoes.
50:55
Speaker 3: Yeah.
50:55
Speaker 5: And what's also the greatest when you're walking, you have
50:59
Speaker 5: all the little things that you might be able to,
51:01
Speaker 5: which we're also very handy.
51:02
Speaker 3: Like mountain dew was handy too, So I drank a
51:04
Speaker 3: lot of mountain dew.
51:05
Speaker 5: So I'm always looking towards maybe getting on sponsorship from that.
51:11
Speaker 4: And it can't hurt because a lot of some of
51:12
Speaker 4: these companies they're always looking for a new way to
51:15
Speaker 4: just get you know, sponsorship out there, marketing out there,
51:18
Speaker 4: and even something organic like that. It'll be beneficial.
51:21
Speaker 3: Yeah, And there's a little teaser.
51:22
Speaker 5: I do have a video, a short video which is
51:25
Speaker 5: basically a montage of me drinking mountain dew across the country.
51:30
Speaker 5: So it's kind of a time lapse thing like as
51:32
Speaker 5: you've probably seen before, but instead it's me a guzzling
51:35
Speaker 5: mountain dew across the country.
51:37
Speaker 3: So look forward to that.
51:39
Speaker 5: It's going to be hopefully I'm going to try to
51:41
Speaker 5: release that leading up to the Indiegogo campaign, get a
51:45
Speaker 5: little interest from there.
51:47
Speaker 4: And I wish you the best, Mark and you know,
51:50
Speaker 4: I thank you very much for coming on. The show
51:52
Speaker 4: is in closing, Is there anything that you'd like to
51:54
Speaker 4: mention or that I haven't gone to we haven't talked
51:56
Speaker 4: about already.
51:57
Speaker 5: Well, also, you know they're interested, go to Walking Fool
52:00
Speaker 5: dot com.
52:01
Speaker 3: Which is the name of the movie. Did we mention
52:02
Speaker 3: the name of the movie?
52:03
Speaker 5: Yeah, okay, I was Yeah, I'm sure you did in
52:05
Speaker 5: the inshow, but to remind people, it is called the
52:07
Speaker 5: Walking Fool, And you can go to walkingfool dot com,
52:10
Speaker 5: which does have a trailer on there, so they can
52:12
Speaker 5: they can sort of see it, and just from there,
52:17
Speaker 5: you know, try to spread the word if you're if
52:19
Speaker 5: you're excited about it, you know, just try to spread
52:21
Speaker 5: the word because, like like we've talked about, when you're
52:24
Speaker 5: on a small level, it's it's important to sort of
52:26
Speaker 5: get your audience, you know, not just people who like
52:30
Speaker 5: documentaries and independent films, but also people that are interested
52:33
Speaker 5: in the actual subject, so hikers and walkers and lovers
52:38
Speaker 5: of America.
52:39
Speaker 4: Yeah, camping enthusiast, stuff like that, you know. And again
52:41
Speaker 4: it's called it's at Walking Full doc as you're on
52:45
Speaker 4: Twitter again, I'm a big Twitter guy, and you know,
52:48
Speaker 4: just discussed with a lot of filmmakers Twitter. You know,
52:50
Speaker 4: it always comes up in conversation. Yeah, he when they
52:53
Speaker 4: were building a campaign, when they were building an audience
52:56
Speaker 4: about just getting the word out there.
52:57
Speaker 5: Absolutely, And what's great is pretty much walking fool. The
53:00
Speaker 5: phrase walking fool is pretty much your number one hit
53:03
Speaker 5: anywhere you go and Google or such, so you can
53:06
Speaker 5: always find it just by you know, doing a search
53:10
Speaker 5: for a walking fool. But yeah, walkingfool doc is. The
53:12
Speaker 5: Twitter handle on the website is walkingfool dot com, which
53:16
Speaker 5: you can then you can find Twitter account from there.
53:19
Speaker 4: Okay, excellent, and again Mark, thank you very much for
53:22
Speaker 4: coming on.
53:23
Speaker 3: Thanks Dave for having me. I appreciate it.
53:25
Speaker 4: Oh, no problem. Again, like if you ever need anything
53:27
Speaker 4: from me, so let me know again. Everyone, thanks for listening.
53:30
Speaker 4: Please subscribe to this on either Potomatic or iTunes when
53:33
Speaker 4: it's over there. You can reach me at Dave Bullus
53:36
Speaker 4: dot com and again find me Twitter at Dave Underscore Bullets. Again, Mark,
53:40
Speaker 4: thanks a lot for coming on, and have a great day.
53:42
Speaker 3: Keep on walking, Dave.
53:44
Speaker 4: I'm starting to walk more and more now because the
53:47
Speaker 4: weather is starting to get nicer here in Pennsylvania. You know,
53:49
Speaker 4: we've had a brutal winner again and I'm finally starting
53:52
Speaker 4: to get outside more and starting to walk.
53:54
Speaker 3: Yes, enjoy it.
53:55
Speaker 5: That's and that's also I'd love to be able to
53:56
Speaker 5: do that. Just inspire some people to go for a
53:58
Speaker 5: walk every once in a while, it'd be great.
54:00
Speaker 4: Yeah, I'm just usually stuck in from my laptop trying
54:02
Speaker 4: to work on like eight million things. And yeah, then
54:04
Speaker 4: you know, I was out in the sun yesterday and
54:07
Speaker 4: I got sunburned from a little bit of sun, and
54:09
Speaker 4: I go, man, I have been written doors way too long.
54:12
Speaker 4: But I'm a ginger anyway, so it kind of happens, right.
54:14
Speaker 5: Yeah, I don't see what you look like by I
54:16
Speaker 5: see what your little cartoon avatar looks like. So I
54:19
Speaker 5: assume that you were a little sensitive to the skin
54:22
Speaker 5: and the skin section.
54:23
Speaker 4: Yeah, like I get burned by like heat lighter. It's
54:25
Speaker 4: a buffets and I'm just like I'm just getting crispy.
54:29
Speaker 4: So it's a constant you know, I'd be constantly on
54:33
Speaker 4: my guard.
54:33
Speaker 5: Wow, you can never work never work the fry station
54:36
Speaker 5: at McDonald's, then, I guess.
54:37
Speaker 4: Or Taco bell I can't work there either.
54:39
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's probably that's probably all of the best, Dave.
54:44
Speaker 4: So all right, Mark, thank you very much. Buddy, and
54:46
Speaker 4: again everyone check out Mark at Walking Full Documentary. Please
54:49
Speaker 4: google that and look him up. And again there are
54:51
Speaker 4: any Google campaign hits on very soon, most likely the
54:56
Speaker 4: beginning of August or late July. And again Mark, thanks
55:00
Speaker 4: a lot for that coming on all right, solong day,
55:02
Speaker 4: Thanks figure, Buddy.
55:04
Speaker 2: I want to thank Dave so much for doing such
55:06
Speaker 2: a great job on this episode. If you want to
55:07
Speaker 2: get links to anything we spoke about in this episode,
55:09
Speaker 2: head over to the show notes at Indie film Hustle
55:12
Speaker 2: dot com Forward slash eight sixty two and if you
55:14
Speaker 2: have it already, please head over to Filmmaking podcast dot com.
55:18
Speaker 2: Subscribe and leave a good review for the show. It
55:22
Speaker 2: really helps us out a lot.
55:23
Speaker 3: Guys. Thank you again so much for listening to guys.
55:25
Speaker 2: As always, keep that hustle going, keep that dream alive,
55:28
Speaker 2: stay safe out there, and I'll talk to you soon.
55:32
Speaker 1: Thanks for listening to the Indie Film Hustle Podcast at
55:35
Speaker 1: Indie film Hustle dot com. That's I N D I
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55:40
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