Latest / Contractor Business Builder Podcast / Be the Lobster The Secret to Standing Out in the Construction Industry with Mark Harari

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Be the Lobster The Secret to Standing Out in the Construction Industry with Mark Harari · Contractor Business Builder Podcast

• 0:00
  Welcome to another great episode of the Contractors Business
• 0:02
  Builder Podcast. We have the honor of hosting
• 0:05
  Mark Ferrari. He is the Vice president of
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  Remodelers Advantage. Most contractors struggle to
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  stand out both to potential clients and great employees.
• 0:13
  Yet Mark Ari has helped thousands break free from being
• 0:17
  just another builder to becoming in demand high margin experts
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  that attract top tier clients and top performing team members
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  alike. How you doing today?
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  Mark, good. How are you there?
• 0:27
  Doing great, looking forward to diving into this.
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  SO can you just give us a quick little history background on
• 0:33
  yourself, who you are, what you do and and how you got here?
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  Yeah, the quick version started in the industry with 84 Lumber.
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  I did the whole management thing with them and got into sales
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  always had. I went to college for marketing
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  and psychology. So I always had that bug in the
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  back of my head. And I actually started doing
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  kind of a side gigs and things with with the clients, the
• 0:55
  remodelers, the builders that were coming in, doing some
• 0:58
  marketing work for them too. And said my side hustle started
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  then and I was able to scratch that itch.
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  And you know, Fast forward, I always stayed in the industry,
• 1:06
  my marketing, everything is around remodeling, construction
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  industry. Been well over 30 years now and
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  owned a small remodeling company for a few years, about six or
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  seven years until the bubble burst and I was done with that.
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  And I found my way to remodelers advantage.
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  And the best thing that ever happened to me, love it here.
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  I love the people, I love all the members and all the work we
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  do to help them. And it's just a wonderful thing.
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  So that's 30 years and 30 seconds.
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  Like, say, good, good history and track record there working
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  with, you know, multiple companies now, every mother's
• 1:41
  advantage. You wrote a book a little while
• 1:42
  back called Lobster on a Cheese Plate, an interesting, catchy
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  name there. Can you tell us a little bit
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  about, you know, what that means and how it would benefit, you
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  know, remodelers and GC's? Yeah, absolutely.
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  Lobster and cheese plate had a standout.
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  Attract the best clients and win every sale that comes your way.
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  It's funny, I I tell the story, people ask me how I came up with
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  the name and really it was just had a working title, right?
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  Marketing book and one day kids were little, they said they were
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  gonna go play PlayStation. So my wife and I said, hey, we
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  got the night to ourselves as watch a movie, pop some popcorn
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  and all that. And she said, you know what,
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  forget the popcorn. Let's get some cheese, some wine
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  and all that. And I love cheese.
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  I mean, I am a cheese guy. So Long story short, that's
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  where the name of the book came from because I was struggling
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  with it when she brought the plate of cheese over.
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  I was just struggling. I couldn't decide which which
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  cheese I was gonna eat first. You know, it was like I eat the
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  Gouda or the, you know, do I go with the cheddar or what And and
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  blue cheese. And I'm sitting there with all
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  these great choices. And that's when it hit me.
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  It's like, you know, that's what most, you know, unless you got
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  really small guys just getting started, you got established
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  companies. You're not going against bad
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  people or bad companies are going against good companies.
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  You know, the, the, the prospects, the homeowners,
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  they're faced with a lot of good choices, just like I was with my
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  cheese plate. And so the only way to get
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  through that is to stand out. You gotta be that piece of
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  cheese that stands out, right? So lobster was like, well,
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  lobster stands out on a cheese plate.
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  So there you go. And that's kind of how the title
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  of the book came. But it's really about being
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  different. You got to stand out in your
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  market. And you know, they all have tons
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  of good choices. It's not you're the only good
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  choice and everybody else, it's an obvious thing.
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  So that's what the book helps you do.
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  It's what I've really pushed on is, is putting the steps
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  together so that you do stand out and attract the best clients
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  for you. Right on.
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  Can you dive into that a bit about how contractors can stand
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  out? You know, the many contractors,
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  you know, they don't have a marketing background and they're
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  sort of like, you know, I build houses, they build houses, I do
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  rentals, they they do remodels, whatever, right?
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  Like what, how, how do you differentiate yourself or what,
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  what advice would you give to start thinking about that for,
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  for the, the business owners out there?
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  So really I broke it down into the six stones of positioning.
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  I kind of borrowed the idea from the Marvel Universe with all
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  that, with the Infinity stones and, and such.
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  I like to have some fun. I'm a big movie guy.
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  See a lot of movie quotes in the book.
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  But you know, if you get all 6 stones, you're going to rock it,
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  you're going to own your market. And the number one stand, the
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  one that's the most important, it's the first stone.
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  And it's really what kind of gets to the root of all this is,
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  is identifying your target. And you know, I know that's
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  something that everybody always hears you who's your target
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  market. But you gotta get a lot deeper
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  and a lot more granular than just, you gotta get beyond the
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  demographic stuff. You know, so many people I talk
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  to, it's like, well, does anyone that may has a household income
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  of, you know, over $200,000 a year and they live in this area
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  and blah, blah, blah. And that's just way too broad.
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  That's not a target. In order to stand out, you have
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  to connect with people. You know, we all like people
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  that are like us, right? You know, we're attracted to
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  people that are like us. So you really gotta get deep
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  into it. Some people have talked about,
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  you know, identifying your avatar or what have you, but you
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  gotta get deep into the the psychographic stuff.
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  You know, what are their interests?
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  Do they, what music do they listen to?
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  What kind of do they, are they homebodies or do they like to,
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  to hike? And it may seem silly or it also
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  may seem like I don't want to get that narrow focused on my
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  market, right? But the truth of the matter is
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  that's how you communicate. It's hard to communicate.
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  I'm talking to you right now, right?
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  I mean, this is what it is. It's it's a one-on-one
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  conversation and even your website, your website is a
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  one-on-one conversation with people, right?
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  Unless people are huddled around a computer with you navigating
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  through websites. The truth of the matter is one
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  person is reading your website and your websites talking to
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  that person. And so when you're having a
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  one-on-one conversation with someone, you have to talk about
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  things that they want to listen, they want to hear about, you
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  know, and if, if people you are into hiking and, and all that
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  stuff, aren't you gonna do better if you're into it too,
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  You know, So having the ideal client that is zoned in and
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  identified and all your communication, everything you do
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  targets that type of a person. You're going to be attracting
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  the right people. And it comes down to that.
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  It's like they're going to say this guy or this girl, this gal,
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  this person gets me. You know, I'm going with them.
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  They, they understand, they, we're, we're one in the same.
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  They know my things. They know the things that keep
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  me up at night, you know, the fears and all that stuff.
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  And that's all part of the psychographic stuff as well,
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  right? I mean, is your target someone
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  that's, that's afraid that they're going to get hustled,
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  they're going to find a bad hire?
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  Or are they just concerned with being the envy of the
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  neighborhood? You know, what are these
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  emotional things that you're trying to fill?
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  What are the emotional needs you're filling for the for your
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  target? For sure.
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  And there's like layers to it, right?
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  As you mentioned, like you start a little broader with your
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  demographics and things like that.
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  And then you really, I always say like whoever knows the
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  client best is going to win the sale at the end of the day.
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  Essentially, like you want to do business with people that get
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  you, they understand you, you know, there's that no trust like
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  thing. And the more in line you can be
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  with your ideal client, the more you're likely to attract those
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  people at the end of the day. And you know, make your life
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  easier as running the business, But typically, you know, better
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  margins and, and easier sales and all that kind of stuff that
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  goes with it. It just popped in my head.
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  Have you ever seen the movie Multiplicity?
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  So Michael Keaton movie. I know the movie.
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  I can't. I don't know if I've actually,
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  you know, before. I don't think I've actually seen
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  it, but I I remember when it was out, yeah.
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  Multiplicity. I've used this before.
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  It's a perfect example of the importance of this really
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  quickly. It's Michael Keaton.
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  He's a GC, he's a contractor, super busy, new time for his
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  family, all this stuff. They happen to be working at a
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  place that's doing experimental stuff and they do cloning,
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  right? So Long story short, they do
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  this side little thing and they clone Michael Keaton and he
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  clones himself so that he can get more done.
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  And nobody knows that this tool. And then he clones himself again
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  and there ends up being like 4 of them.
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  OK, the reason I bring it up is because these are 4 Michael
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  Keatons. They're clones.
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  So from a demographic perspective, they all fit
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  perfectly. They all make the same amount of
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  money, they the same height, same religious beliefs,
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  everything. But each of the clones ones like
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  a macho beer slug and womanizing sport not.
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  And the other one is very effeminate and likes everything
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  prim and proper and doesn't like a lot of language.
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  And so the psychographic stuff stands out in this movie and it,
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  I use it as a great example of This is why it's so important to
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  get beyond demographics, because if you were to see the movie or
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  any of your listeners have seen it, they should be clicking.
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  I can't say the same thing to all four of those guys.
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  I'm only going to make friends with one of them, right?
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  Because they have completely different beliefs, different
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  ideas. So that's why it's so critical
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  to understand your ideal client, your perfect client
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  psychographics so that you can communicate and win that sale.
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  Great analogy there. If you know there's a difference
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  and and to have a lot of nuanced to people and and knowing that
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  that I ideal clients so important.
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  So bring this like understanding.
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  It is one thing. Obviously you need to know that
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  and but more in a practical sense, you hear about like
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  positioning or messaging in marketing.
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  What does that look like or how should should should GC's be
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  thinking about that as far as getting their their message or
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  positioning their business for attracting those people?
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  Yeah. So really you're messaging comes
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  from it. It starts with your positioning
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  statement, right? Your positioning statement is
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  the thing most of your listeners, if not all of them
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  have probably have a, a mission statement.
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  I'd say less, but many will probably have the vision
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  statement for their company. So all companies should have a
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  mission, they should have a vision.
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  You should also have a position statement.
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  And the the positioning statement drives all of this.
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  It basically identifies who your target is, what you provide
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  them, and how you do it in a way no one else does it right.
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  And when you have a good positioning statement, it drives
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  the messaging because, you know, you identify what the unmet need
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  of the client is. And that's one of the things
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  that I think is missed when you try to do messaging is you're
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  just saying, hey, you know, we do decks, you need a deck, call
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  us, right. It's not about the functional
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  need. Yeah, somebody may need a deck,
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  but you're not selling the functional need.
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  You're you're selling the emotional needs you're
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  fulfilling. What's the emotional component
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  of the reason they want the deck?
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  Is it because they want a safe place for the kids to play?
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  Is it because they wanna show off to the neighbors, Right?
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  There's always an emotional component to it.
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  And when you find that emotional component, you can drive the
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  messaging you're trying to do. But, you know, one of the
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  examples I've used with clients and in the book is with the
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  deck. You know, if you're Target is a
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  mother in her 30s with two young kids, right?
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  The emotional need for this particular Target customer is
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  that her kids will always be safe, right?
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  And if you have ever seen the Subaru car commercials, they're
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  big on safety, right? There's a, it's a perfect
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  example of how that's what you're communicating in your
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  messaging. Subaru is not like, hey, buy a
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  car. There's one commercial that
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  stands out to me. It's bad accident.
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  A woman pulls up, runs out of the car panicked, and she sees
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  her husband and daughter come running over and the cars wreck.
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  And she says the best part of something like the best thing
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  when I had my Subaru was when my family walked away from it.
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  And that was it, right? Subarus like we're here to sell
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  you not your functional need A4 wheeled vehicle that gets me
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  from point A to point B reselling you the emotional
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  component. We're selling you the safety
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  that you want your family to have, right.
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  So messaging is directly tied to that psychographic stuff, the
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  emotional leads and all that. And then you start dialing that
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  in. That's when you get the strong
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  you're the differentiator again, right?
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  You're you want people to hear what you're saying or read your
• 11:55
  messages on your website and be nodding their head in agreement
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  while they're reading, it said, yeah, that's me.
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  Yeah, I'm getting getting back to your, your, your previous
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  point of the lobster on the cheese plate of like standing
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  out. That's where people are looking
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  at a few different builders to work with.
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  If your messaging is on point like that, it's not even going
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  to be a conscious thing for them.
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  They're just gonna feel right for them essentially.
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  And you and you're more likely for them to get to reach out to
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  you and to go with you ultimately.
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  And, and that's where works and nowadays mean with, with AI and
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  everything, you want to have all this stuff documented, like
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  think through it, put it in a document and then you can give
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  that to your marketer or, you know, whether that's internal,
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  external AI, whatever. And it can use all that
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  information about psychographics, demographics,
• 12:41
  anything that you've written, essentially your mission
• 12:43
  statement vision, like give it every all that information so
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  that, you know, you can align your, your marketing
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  specifically with that. Now we've we've talked about,
• 12:51
  you know, attracting clients, how about like good employees
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  because, you know, your team members are another, you know,
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  you need to differentiate yourself again because they, you
• 13:00
  know, couple dollars an hour more somewhere else.
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  They, you know what's gonna keep them from jumping ship, right.
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  So how do you attract the, the right people?
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  Yeah, using these types of concept.
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  Yeah, 100%. You see, you're, you're very
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  advanced thinker there, Derek. That's what I'm talking about.
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  Because it's the exact same thing.
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  You're, your employees are a different type of customer that
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  you're trying to attract, right? You you're trying to attract the
• 13:21
  right people, The right people they're gonna fit.
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  It's not about just a job description.
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  Here's the things I need you to do.
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  That's the functional stuff that they're providing.
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  But what else do you need from the employee?
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  They got to be a good fit, cultural fit, right?
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  They gotta, if it's not going to matter how great someone is, if
• 13:37
  there's just there's no alignment in, in culture and
• 13:41
  beliefs and values and all that stuff.
• 13:43
  So similar to what you would do with your target customer.
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  You want to do avatars, you want to do your ideal client or
• 13:51
  customer for, for the employees, right?
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  This role, this position, here's what I'm looking for.
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  They have kids, they don't have kids.
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  They they believe in this, they believe in that.
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  I mean, you know, within reason, Obviously you can't do things
• 14:04
  that are against hiring practices, right?
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  But you want to identify because then you're just going to
• 14:10
  naturally attract the right people.
• 14:12
  Once you've identified it, you're ads, you're you're
• 14:15
  messaging that when you're trying to promote the opening
• 14:19
  position you have is going to be connecting with them because
• 14:22
  you're going to be saying things that they resonate with the
• 14:25
  right people you want. So by default, that's really
• 14:28
  what it comes down to, whether it's employees or customers or
• 14:31
  clients. If the messaging is talking to
• 14:34
  that person, that target of 1, then the people way outside on
• 14:37
  the outer limits that just completely opposite the type of
• 14:41
  person you're talking to, they're not even going to call
• 14:43
  you because they're not, they're not connecting with you, right.
• 14:46
  So you're kind of built in auditing, you know, you've,
• 14:49
  you've got a built in system to make sure that the wrong people
• 14:53
  don't call you and they call others.
• 14:56
  But hiring is 100%. You want to do the exact same
• 14:59
  steps you would do with with trying to hire clients.
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  And I, I know it can be scary, like narrowing your knee or
• 15:05
  nailing your niche down and you're like, well, now I'm
• 15:08
  excluding all these other jobs and you're like, get less work
• 15:11
  and things like that. But typically speaking, there's
• 15:14
  hundreds, thousands of people looking for your service and
• 15:18
  they're looking, you know, at more than one company and you're
• 15:21
  just helping funnel the right people to your company that's
• 15:24
  going to be the best fit, essentially.
• 15:26
  To that point, it's I always say you should be talking to to a
• 15:29
  target of 1. You know, it's, it's one
• 15:31
  specific person. I mean, nail it down it 32 and a
• 15:35
  half years old, 3 1/2 kids, right divorce went to Cornell
• 15:39
  drives the BMW makes I mean, get it that granular.
• 15:44
  If you're talking to one person, it's much easier because you
• 15:47
  know who you're talking to and then it's if it's a bullseye,
• 15:51
  you go to the next ring out OK, they only have one kid, not
• 15:53
  three. That's OK.
• 15:54
  Most of your messaging still going to resonate and you go out
• 15:57
  another thing Well, OK, they didn't get a Cornell, but they
• 16:00
  went to Harvard, right? OK, well, they're still and you
• 16:03
  keep going out rings and you just because you're talking so
• 16:06
  specifically doesn't mean you alienate everyone on the outer
• 16:09
  rings. It's just when you get way out
• 16:11
  here that now you're alienating. But that's a good thing.
• 16:13
  That's not the kind of person you wanted anyway, right.
• 16:15
  So it works out. It's fine.
• 16:18
  It's not a thing to be afraid of.
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  And you know, sorry, I I get I get all like amped up about it
• 16:25
  because it's it's not something to be scared of.
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  You can't be everything to everybody.
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  If you try to be, you're nothing to nobody.
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  And it's not that you're not going to do work with people
• 16:33
  that don't fit that specific, you know, person of 1.
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  The, the idea is to be really sharp and refined with your
• 16:40
  marketing and you'll, you'll work with people kind of like
• 16:43
  you mentioned in those rings or that, that bubble, if you will,
• 16:45
  like, of people. But the likelihood of bringing
• 16:48
  the right people is it makes the world of difference both in
• 16:51
  margins is, and just like, as far as like stress levels and
• 16:54
  dealing with it, the right people.
• 16:55
  And one thing I've found helpful, whether it's a client
• 16:58
  or employee is if you've been in business for a few years, who's
• 17:01
  the best employee that you ever had for this position or role in
• 17:04
  your company? And then you can kind of
• 17:06
  typically that type of person is going to be very similar to the
• 17:10
  ideal type of person you want. Same with clients.
• 17:12
  If you have like an amazing clients like I want more of
• 17:14
  those people, then that's you need to how can I message and
• 17:17
  market to to that type of person specifically?
• 17:20
  Yeah, absolutely, 100%. I say it all the time, Go go in
• 17:23
  and find your best. And not only that, I'll say go
• 17:25
  find your worst nightmare clients, pull them out, pull
• 17:28
  them out and then start comparing and look at the
• 17:31
  differences. Right.
• 17:31
  OK, well, you'll start to see this person was a heavy metal.
• 17:35
  They listen to heavy metal, this person listens to classical.
• 17:37
  I mean, just look at all that stuff and you start to see some
• 17:40
  similarities and the things you want to avoid.
• 17:42
  And you also see how if the messaging was geared toward this
• 17:45
  person, that person probably wouldn't have called you anyway
• 17:47
  and saved you a lot of headache, right?
• 17:49
  And it's, again, it's not about alienating anything.
• 17:51
  I mean, look at Apple. Apple's target is not 80 to 90
• 17:54
  year old women. There's 80 to 90 year old women
• 17:56
  that have iPhones, but they're not trying to sell to them,
• 18:00
  right? That's not their target.
• 18:02
  So you can sell to people outside of your target, but
• 18:04
  refining your message so you have a clear path to the right
• 18:09
  people. Definitely.
• 18:10
  So as far as like mistakes or, you know, outdated mindsets or
• 18:16
  things around marketing, what, what do you see if you could,
• 18:19
  you know, dispel some myths or if you see, you know, mistakes
• 18:22
  that contractors make when they're thinking about the
• 18:24
  marketing? Well, the obvious one that we've
• 18:26
  pretty much beat to death is, is everybody's my customer.
• 18:30
  So that's a big one. I know it's scary because you
• 18:33
  know, you want to just say anybody within 60 miles of my
• 18:37
  office I will sell. So that's a big one.
• 18:39
  You know, I think the other thing is just thinking of
• 18:42
  marketing as an expense. It's not an expense, it's it's
• 18:45
  an investment. You know, and with any
• 18:47
  investment, whether you're putting it into the stock market
• 18:49
  or into your company, you should expect a return on the
• 18:52
  investment. So this isn't an expense.
• 18:54
  You're putting $100.50 dollars, $50,000, whatever number you're
• 18:59
  putting in, you should expect 235, whatever X return on that
• 19:04
  investment. And when you just get your head
• 19:06
  around that, it makes it easier because there's so many people.
• 19:09
  I don't wanna waste my money on marketing, but you shouldn't.
• 19:13
  I agree. Don't waste your money on
• 19:15
  marketing. You know, let's let's invest it
• 19:18
  in the right things and get a return on that.
• 19:21
  And that's how you grow and that's how you prosper.
• 19:23
  So that's the biggest thing, man.
• 19:26
  Definitely, yeah. I mean, depending on the size of
• 19:28
  your business and sort of how long you been in the business,
• 19:29
  but typically you're going to have a percentage of your, your
• 19:32
  revenue, which would be overhead, you know, maybe one to
• 19:35
  two, 3% of of your revenue typically would go to marketing
• 19:39
  for a company, depending on how aggressive you wanna be here.
• 19:42
  Again, if, if it, if you have those checks and balances in
• 19:44
  place and you know that it's, you know, driving more sales
• 19:47
  and, and you're making more money.
• 19:49
  And it is that, you know, multiple X investment, then, you
• 19:52
  know, depending on how, how fast you want to grow, it's, you
• 19:55
  know, you just continue to invest in what's working and
• 19:57
  double down on it. So every model is advantage.
• 20:00
  You guys have a lot of, you know, peer groups.
• 20:02
  Can you, can you tell us a little bit more about that?
• 20:04
  And then what are some would like to top traits that you see
• 20:07
  from you know the really successful remodelers GC's?
• 20:10
  That you've worked with. Yeah, great question.
• 20:12
  So the cornerstone of what we do, what we're built on is the
• 20:16
  roundtables program. It's the peer-to-peer mentoring
• 20:19
  groups. We have over 25 groups.
• 20:21
  They're non competing business owners.
• 20:24
  We also have what we call the tactical groups where it's
• 20:27
  groups for production managers or marketers or office managers
• 20:31
  and they all get together and it's a board of advisors, right.
• 20:34
  It's your own board of advisors. You, you meet twice a year in
• 20:37
  person and, and you meet monthly virtually.
• 20:41
  And you know, they just support each other.
• 20:43
  They, they help each other. It's because they're non
• 20:46
  compete. They open their books, they look
• 20:47
  through each other's financials. They, you know, nine other
• 20:51
  companies looking at you. They see things you missed.
• 20:54
  And it's a strong thing for sure.
• 20:56
  The thing that makes the most impact the, the well, the answer
• 21:00
  your question as far as what's, what's the common traits, the,
• 21:03
  the most successful ones. It's hard, but they, they have
• 21:07
  the humility to and the openness to be able to take hard
• 21:10
  feedback. You know, it's, it's not about
• 21:12
  getting defensive. The, the, the people that come
• 21:15
  in don't last long when they're constantly defending some reason
• 21:19
  that they did this or that. You need to take the advice
• 21:23
  you're getting from a lot. You know, all of us is smarter
• 21:26
  than one of us is kind of our thing, right?
• 21:29
  So let's take all that and having that humility and thick
• 21:32
  skin to be able to, to understand that people are
• 21:35
  trying to help you. Those are the guys and gals that
• 21:38
  really go far and they continue to invest in themselves and
• 21:41
  their company. So, you know, we do a lot of
• 21:43
  things besides this. We have master classes and
• 21:46
  things. And really one of the biggest
• 21:47
  reasons why we offer all that is because it's not just about
• 21:50
  helping the owner. We are beyond the owner.
• 21:52
  He you want to have your team grow, you know, invest in your
• 21:55
  team, have them develop and, and learn.
• 21:58
  And so given investing in their team is another big trait
• 22:02
  because that's, that's what really helps you differentiate
• 22:05
  yourself and your business because you then you, you, it's,
• 22:08
  it's rare that you hire an A player, but a players, you can
• 22:11
  grow a players, you know what I mean?
• 22:13
  Perfect. Yeah, it makes a lot of sense
• 22:15
  having having that open mind, that humility, realizing, you
• 22:18
  know, you're not the smartest person ever.
• 22:20
  And then other people, you know, you don't have to take every
• 22:23
  feedback and and run with it, but but you need to be open
• 22:26
  that, hey, maybe maybe I haven't been doing this, you know, to
• 22:30
  the best that I could. And and somebody else, you know,
• 22:32
  can can see stuff that I don't because often we're so close to
• 22:35
  our own businesses and it's all we do kind of, you know, day in,
• 22:38
  day out that you just you don't have the experience other people
• 22:41
  have and you can't really see things from the inside, but
• 22:43
  sometimes that other people can, you know, from the outside end.
• 22:46
  So we are. Gonna do you know?
• 22:47
  Yeah, and and meters meters build people that you know,
• 22:51
  that's part of it like investing in the team.
• 22:53
  Definitely that's that's how you can build a business that isn't
• 22:56
  just, you know, totally reliant on you is by building the people
• 22:59
  around you and, you know, giving them the ability to, to lead and
• 23:03
  manage themselves and other people and things like that.
• 23:05
  So we're going to put the links to your book as well as
• 23:07
  remodelers advantage in the in the show notes and description
• 23:10
  here. Depending where you're
• 23:11
  listening, watching this, What's the best way for people to reach
• 23:14
  out or to learn more about you and every mother's manager?
• 23:17
  Yeah, so Remodelers Advantage is simple as Remodelers
• 23:21
  advantage.com, you can find out about our programs about, you
• 23:25
  know, we have a lot of resources, there's a lot of
• 23:28
  guides you can download for free and all that kind of stuff.
• 23:30
  So go check it out. We have one-on-one consulting.
• 23:33
  We have master classes, some of them are just a one day class,
• 23:36
  some of them are six week classes.
• 23:38
  So we have all that. So we have a little something
• 23:40
  for everybody. And if you have any questions
• 23:42
  for me, I mean, I'm pretty open my emails,
• 23:44
  mark@remodelersadvantage.com with a K.
• 23:47
  So you know, I have no problem. My members e-mail me all the
• 23:50
  time. Hey, what do you think of this?
• 23:52
  What do you think of that? So you know, I might not get
• 23:54
  back to you within seconds, but I try to respond to everybody.
• 23:57
  So we're all about it here. So reach out, we're happy to.
• 24:01
  Help wonderful yeah go click the link and go check out you know,
• 24:04
  remodelers bandage gets free resources.
• 24:06
  Reach out to Mark here if you got a question, any last words
• 24:09
  of wisdom or or or final point that you want to touch on Mark.
• 24:12
  Well, when faced with the choice, leave the gun and take
• 24:15
  the cannolis. Perfect.
• 24:18
  Thanks so much for coming on here Mark and sharing all your
• 24:21
  your knowledge and expertise. Yeah, cool.
• 24:23
  Thanks Sir.