Latest / The Uplifters / EPISODE #60: Sandy Samberg is Finding Problems and Crafting Compassionate Solutions

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EPISODE #60: Sandy Samberg is Finding Problems and Crafting Compassionate Solutions · The Uplifters

• 0:05
  SPEAKER_01: An uplifter is a compelling leader who tries to breathe life and hope into people around them.
• 0:12
  SPEAKER_02: Who listen and care and guide and help.
• 0:17
  SPEAKER_03: Whose way of being in the world inspires.
• 0:20
  SPEAKER_03: Who uplifts with humor and understanding.
• 0:23
  SPEAKER_03: Who leads by example.
• 0:24
  SPEAKER_01: Don't judge.
• 0:26
  SPEAKER_01: Vulnerable.
• 0:26
  SPEAKER_01: Bold.
• 0:27
  SPEAKER_01: Determination.
• 0:29
  SPEAKER_01: Who are here to create a better world.
• 0:33
  SPEAKER_01: Who can learn and teach.
• 0:35
  SPEAKER_01: Who encourages you.
• 0:36
  SPEAKER_01: Who shines their light to lead other people.
• 0:40
  SPEAKER_03: Who uses their best self in order to help others.
• 0:42
  SPEAKER_00: I found the life that I liked and I worked toward that.
• 0:46
  SPEAKER_00: We are all uplifters.
• 0:47
  SPEAKER_00: Big love.
• 0:51
  SPEAKER_00: I'm Leah DeFeo, and I'm nominating Sandy Samberg.
• 0:55
  SPEAKER_00: I'm grateful to her for the work she was doing a few years ago,
• 0:58
  SPEAKER_00: connecting young women diagnosed with breast cancer to those who are in treatment
• 1:02
  SPEAKER_00: or remission.
• 1:03
  SPEAKER_00: Sandy has continued to live a life of the ultimate uplifter by doing groundbreaking
• 1:08
  SPEAKER_00: work to ease end of life for the terminally ill.
• 1:12
  SPEAKER_00: Her new line of work will surely bring peace and comfort to many individuals and
• 1:17
  SPEAKER_00: the people who love them.
• 1:18
  SPEAKER_00: For her uplifting spirit, I'm nominating Sandy Samberg.
• 1:23
  SPEAKER_02: Welcome to the Uplifters podcast.
• 1:25
  SPEAKER_02: I'm Aranza Savas, and I'll be your host.
• 1:27
  SPEAKER_02: But most of what you'll get to do today is hear the story of Sandy Samberg.
• 1:32
  SPEAKER_02: Sandy is a nurse practitioner, but she has done so much more than just work in clinical settings.
• 1:39
  SPEAKER_02: She's looked for ways to truly serve her community.
• 1:44
  SPEAKER_03: Sandy, thank you for being here.
• 1:47
  SPEAKER_03: Thank you.
• 1:48
  SPEAKER_03: Thanks for such a warm welcome.
• 1:49
  SPEAKER_03: This whole concept of an uplifter is just really inspiring and really resonates pretty deeply with me.
• 1:55
  SPEAKER_03: I always try, it's actually part of my self-care to surround myself with positive people.
• 2:00
  SPEAKER_03: And it also brings me back to this children's book that was like my favorite book to read to the kids.
• 2:04
  SPEAKER_03: It was called Have You Filled a Bucket Today?
• 2:06
  SPEAKER_03: I don't know if you've heard of it.
• 2:07
  SPEAKER_03: But yeah, it's about bucket fillers and bucket dippers.
• 2:10
  SPEAKER_03: And so, you know, we need more bucket fillers in this world to make it a better place.
• 2:14
  SPEAKER_03: And so the whole uplifter concept really kind of brought me back to reading that book to my kids.
• 2:19
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, I love that.
• 2:20
  SPEAKER_02: night after night after night.
• 2:22
  SPEAKER_02: I love that.
• 2:22
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, my husband's in TV news and he spends a lot of time sad about the stories he has to tell.
• 2:29
  SPEAKER_02: And we always dreamed of a platform where we could just share the bucket fillers stories.
• 2:34
  SPEAKER_02: And yeah,
• 2:35
  SPEAKER_02: so to get to sit with one another in our ears and remember all of the love and the
• 2:43
  SPEAKER_02: heart and the genuine goodness in the world.
• 2:47
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I agree.
• 2:49
  SPEAKER_03: I mean,
• 2:50
  SPEAKER_03: the timing was wild,
• 2:51
  SPEAKER_03: but I feel really honored to be able to have this conversation with you and to be
• 2:56
  SPEAKER_03: recommended by Leah,
• 2:57
  SPEAKER_03: whose podcast episode of yours was amazing.
• 3:00
  SPEAKER_03: I literally turned on my phone as I went to work out this morning on the treadmill
• 3:04
  SPEAKER_03: and I barely even remember exercising,
• 3:06
  SPEAKER_03: which is very rare for me.
• 3:08
  SPEAKER_03: So...
• 3:08
  SPEAKER_03: She is just such an inspiring woman.
• 3:11
  SPEAKER_02: She's incredible.
• 3:12
  SPEAKER_02: I'm so grateful to her.
• 3:13
  SPEAKER_02: I'm so grateful for her bravery.
• 3:15
  SPEAKER_02: It's a story that needs to be heard and shared because I think it is like so many of our stories.
• 3:20
  SPEAKER_02: It's something that can leave us feeling a sense of shame and isolation.
• 3:25
  SPEAKER_02: And it is a time in our lives when more than ever, we need connection and truth and compassion.
• 3:34
  SPEAKER_03: So how, Sandy, did you end up a nurse practitioner?
• 3:38
  SPEAKER_03: It's a good question.
• 3:40
  SPEAKER_03: It actually all started when I was pretty young.
• 3:42
  SPEAKER_03: My dad is a pediatrician and I started working in his office.
• 3:45
  SPEAKER_03: I think it was in fifth grade.
• 3:47
  SPEAKER_03: And I was like, yeah, and he would take me on Sundays.
• 3:50
  SPEAKER_03: It was like this special treat to get to go to the nursery with him at the hospital
• 3:53
  SPEAKER_03: and see all the babies.
• 3:54
  SPEAKER_03: And then I became a candy striper.
• 3:56
  SPEAKER_03: and, you know, was always interested in healthcare.
• 3:59
  SPEAKER_03: And then when I was 16,
• 4:00
  SPEAKER_03: I was actually involved in a pretty traumatic accident and I was physically fine,
• 4:05
  SPEAKER_03: but my sister was very badly injured.
• 4:07
  SPEAKER_03: And so she was in the hospital all summer.
• 4:09
  SPEAKER_03: And so I spent a lot of time there and I really took in the different roles of all
• 4:12
  SPEAKER_03: the different healthcare professionals.
• 4:14
  SPEAKER_03: And I remember saying to my parents that, you know, the role of the nurse really just kind of
• 4:19
  SPEAKER_03: felt right to me, but I wanted to do more than, you know, a regular nurse.
• 4:23
  SPEAKER_03: And it was my dad who told me about nurse practitioners.
• 4:26
  SPEAKER_03: And this was like in the late 80s.
• 4:28
  SPEAKER_03: And nobody knew what a nurse practitioner was then.
• 4:30
  SPEAKER_03: And so, but I was intrigued.
• 4:32
  SPEAKER_03: And so I did some research.
• 4:33
  SPEAKER_03: And then I said,
• 4:34
  SPEAKER_03: you know what,
• 4:34
  SPEAKER_03: I'm just going to find like,
• 4:35
  SPEAKER_03: what's the best school that I could go to where I could become a nurse practitioner.
• 4:39
  SPEAKER_03: And so my research landed me at the University of Pennsylvania.
• 4:42
  SPEAKER_03: I went down there when I was 16 years old.
• 4:45
  SPEAKER_03: and made a decision right there and then that that's what I wanted to be.
• 4:48
  SPEAKER_03: And even though some of my teachers couldn't believe it and some relatives and,
• 4:52
  SPEAKER_03: you know,
• 4:52
  SPEAKER_03: oh,
• 4:52
  SPEAKER_03: I want to be a doctor.
• 4:54
  SPEAKER_03: But I was pretty determined for a handful of reasons that this was the path I wanted to go down.
• 4:59
  SPEAKER_03: When I started out at Penn in undergraduate, I was kind of going between primary care and mental health.
• 5:05
  SPEAKER_03: and decided to go the primary care route just to get like a good foundation.
• 5:09
  SPEAKER_03: And also I was a little concerned with knowing my personality with mental health
• 5:14
  SPEAKER_03: that I wouldn't,
• 5:14
  SPEAKER_03: especially at that age,
• 5:15
  SPEAKER_03: I wasn't very good at drawing boundaries.
• 5:17
  SPEAKER_03: And I just felt like I would take some of that stuff home with me.
• 5:20
  SPEAKER_03: So I could always go into mental health later on.
• 5:23
  SPEAKER_03: So anyways, I did a handful of things.
• 5:24
  SPEAKER_03: I worked in a pediatric practice and then saw a need there that I ended up leaving
• 5:29
  SPEAKER_03: to create a starter kit for new parents.
• 5:31
  SPEAKER_03: And so that was a whole exciting chapter.
• 5:34
  SPEAKER_03: Started a company, was bought by another company.
• 5:37
  SPEAKER_03: Everything was going great.
• 5:38
  SPEAKER_03: And then 9-11 happened and
• 5:40
  SPEAKER_03: It's a sad long story from there.
• 5:42
  SPEAKER_03: But in any case, we had lost, unfortunately, two of my husband's closest friends.
• 5:47
  SPEAKER_03: And so it was a really difficult time.
• 5:49
  SPEAKER_03: And the loss of a business was hard, but the loss of friends was much harder.
• 5:52
  SPEAKER_03: And so it was all about perspective.
• 5:54
  SPEAKER_03: And so then we had two little babies.
• 5:56
  SPEAKER_03: I took no maternity leave.
• 5:57
  SPEAKER_03: I was a complete workaholic.
• 5:59
  SPEAKER_03: And we just decided we needed a new chapter.
• 6:01
  SPEAKER_03: So we moved out of New York City.
• 6:02
  SPEAKER_03: We moved to Westchester.
• 6:04
  SPEAKER_03: And I just took some time to be home with the kids.
• 6:07
  SPEAKER_03: And that was definitely...
• 6:09
  SPEAKER_03: challenging and that it was a big identity shift.
• 6:12
  SPEAKER_03: And then I started to volunteer and I had volunteered a lot as a kid.
• 6:16
  SPEAKER_03: So I kind of felt like I was back at home with volunteering and I was at a
• 6:20
  SPEAKER_03: community center for the underserved.
• 6:23
  SPEAKER_03: And I volunteered at a caregiver center at a hospital.
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_03: And my husband and I started talking about starting a philanthropic foundation, which we ultimately did.
• 6:31
  SPEAKER_03: And then back in 2000, I'd had a friend who had breast cancer and
• 6:37
  SPEAKER_03: I wanted to do something to help.
• 6:38
  SPEAKER_03: And there was the Avon Walk for Breast Cancer,
• 6:40
  SPEAKER_03: which at that time was a 60 mile walk from Bear Mountain to New York City.
• 6:44
  SPEAKER_03: And so I registered to do that.
• 6:46
  SPEAKER_03: And I had a heart condition at the time.
• 6:47
  SPEAKER_03: And so I went to my cardiologist and he said, are you crazy?
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  SPEAKER_03: Like you shouldn't be walking one mile and then the last 60 miles, you definitely can't do this.
• 6:55
  SPEAKER_03: So I was disappointed,
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  SPEAKER_03: but I went to the finish line with my friend and made a promise to myself that
• 6:59
  SPEAKER_03: someday I would do this walk.
• 7:01
  SPEAKER_03: So that was in 2000.
• 7:03
  SPEAKER_03: Fast forward to 2006, my friend sadly passed away in February.
• 7:07
  SPEAKER_03: And another friend was diagnosed in March and I had just had had open heart surgery
• 7:11
  SPEAKER_03: in 2005 and it changed to a 40 mile walk.
• 7:14
  SPEAKER_03: So I'm like, all the stars are aligned.
• 7:15
  SPEAKER_03: I'm going to do this walk.
• 7:16
  SPEAKER_03: And so I registered to do it by myself, sent out my fundraising letter.
• 7:20
  SPEAKER_03: A couple of friends of mine received the fundraising letter and said, oh, I'll walk with you.
• 7:24
  SPEAKER_03: And so I was like, great, you know, I was planning on doing it myself, but that's great.
• 7:27
  SPEAKER_03: So the three of us did it together.
• 7:29
  SPEAKER_03: And during the walk, I was like, this is amazing.
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_03: Like, what do you think about starting a team from our community?
• 7:34
  SPEAKER_03: I live in Rye, New York.
• 7:35
  SPEAKER_03: You know, I think there's like a lot of women who would really like this.
• 7:39
  SPEAKER_03: And I think they thought it was an okay idea, but they weren't like, let's go do it.
• 7:42
  SPEAKER_03: So I was because I was kind of in this transitional stage of my life.
• 7:46
  SPEAKER_03: Anyways, I was like, you know, I'll give it a try.
• 7:48
  SPEAKER_03: So I started a team in 2007 and then it continued to grow in numbers and the amount that we raised.
• 7:55
  SPEAKER_03: And then I ended up,
• 7:56
  SPEAKER_03: there were some needs in our community and some people in our community who were
• 8:00
  SPEAKER_03: diagnosed with cancer.
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  SPEAKER_03: And I felt like all of our money was going to the Avon Foundation and we had
• 8:04
  SPEAKER_03: friends and neighbors who needed help.
• 8:06
  SPEAKER_03: And so long story short,
• 8:07
  SPEAKER_03: decided to turn this team into an organization and started a nonprofit cancer
• 8:12
  SPEAKER_03: support organization,
• 8:13
  SPEAKER_03: which I led for
• 8:14
  SPEAKER_03: Over a dozen years, created a lot of really unique programs.
• 8:18
  SPEAKER_03: Through that, had an amazing experience, great team of people, our leadership team there.
• 8:23
  SPEAKER_03: And through that experience, I saw a lot of end of life.
• 8:26
  SPEAKER_03: And honestly, like a lot of end of life that just was not done very well, in my opinion.
• 8:30
  SPEAKER_03: You know, there's so much emphasis and joy around the beginning of life, right?
• 8:35
  SPEAKER_03: And bringing kids into this world.
• 8:37
  SPEAKER_03: And then on the other end of the life cycle,
• 8:39
  SPEAKER_03: I just felt like there were things for the physical suffering,
• 8:42
  SPEAKER_03: but not a lot for the emotional suffering.
• 8:45
  SPEAKER_03: And that was really hard to see.
• 8:46
  SPEAKER_03: I saw some deaths that were done really beautifully and they really stick out in my mind.
• 8:50
  SPEAKER_03: It's kind of like when you see parents doing a really good job and you're like,
• 8:53
  SPEAKER_03: ooh,
• 8:53
  SPEAKER_03: note to self,
• 8:54
  SPEAKER_03: that's what I want to do when I'm a parent.
• 8:56
  SPEAKER_03: So I have a few of those situations where I kind of made notes to myself that this was done really well.
• 9:02
  SPEAKER_03: But then end-of-life issues hit home when a loved one of ours was diagnosed with terminal cancer.
• 9:07
  SPEAKER_03: And he spiraled into a really deep depression and was diagnosed as a
• 9:11
  SPEAKER_03: treatment-resistant depression because nothing was working.
• 9:14
  SPEAKER_03: And it was my husband who had suggested psilocybin.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_03: And I was like, this was in 2019.
• 9:20
  SPEAKER_03: And I was like, psilocybin?
• 9:22
  SPEAKER_03: I'm like, we're not giving magic mushrooms to...
• 9:25
  SPEAKER_03: to this loved one.
• 9:27
  SPEAKER_03: And he said, no, I read Michael Pollan's book, which is called How to Change Your Mind.
• 9:31
  SPEAKER_03: You know, when it came out the year before, he's like, I've been following the research.
• 9:34
  SPEAKER_03: Keep an open mind.
• 9:35
  SPEAKER_03: I'll send you some information.
• 9:37
  SPEAKER_03: Long story short,
• 9:37
  SPEAKER_03: this loved one had two sessions of psilocybin and it was just completely
• 9:42
  SPEAKER_03: life-changing for him,
• 9:44
  SPEAKER_03: for his loved ones.
• 9:45
  SPEAKER_03: He was able to come to terms with his ultimate passing.
• 9:48
  SPEAKER_03: He mended some relationships that needed mending.
• 9:51
  SPEAKER_03: He knew what was important in life and what wasn't and how he wanted to spend the
• 9:54
  SPEAKER_03: remaining time that he had.
• 9:56
  SPEAKER_03: it had a profound impact on me a little bit later.
• 9:58
  SPEAKER_03: But while he was still alive,
• 9:59
  SPEAKER_03: but he had stopped treatment at this point,
• 10:02
  SPEAKER_03: I had a conversation with my son.
• 10:04
  SPEAKER_03: And one night, my son, this particular one isn't a very outwardly emotional young adult.
• 10:10
  SPEAKER_03: And he got really sad and started crying, actually, and said, you know, I wonder, you know, like,
• 10:16
  SPEAKER_03: How is he doing this?
• 10:17
  SPEAKER_03: How is he getting up every morning knowing that he's going to die so soon?
• 10:20
  SPEAKER_03: What's going through his mind?
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_03: What does he regret?
• 10:22
  SPEAKER_03: What does he wish he could just get up and get out of bed and go do that he didn't
• 10:26
  SPEAKER_03: get to do during his life?
• 10:27
  SPEAKER_03: And then he turned inward and he said,
• 10:29
  SPEAKER_03: it makes me think if I were diagnosed with a terminal illness tomorrow,
• 10:32
  SPEAKER_03: what would I regret?
• 10:33
  SPEAKER_03: The next morning, I woke up and I was laying in bed kind of processing the conversation.
• 10:37
  SPEAKER_03: I was like, that's actually a good question for anyone to ask themselves.
• 10:41
  SPEAKER_03: So I'm laying there and I asked myself the question,
• 10:43
  SPEAKER_03: you know,
• 10:43
  SPEAKER_03: if I were diagnosed with trauma illness,
• 10:45
  SPEAKER_03: what would I regret?
• 10:46
  SPEAKER_03: And a lot of things came to my mind.
• 10:48
  SPEAKER_03: And I was really surprised because I'm happy and life is great.
• 10:51
  SPEAKER_03: I feel really fortunate for so many things.
• 10:54
  SPEAKER_03: And so I thought, wow, you know what?
• 10:56
  SPEAKER_03: I should probably like unpack some of these things and kind of pay attention to them.
• 11:01
  SPEAKER_03: And so over the course of the next three months or so,
• 11:03
  SPEAKER_03: I took each one of the things that came to my mind that morning and just dug a
• 11:07
  SPEAKER_03: little deeper and decided to make some significant changes.
• 11:11
  SPEAKER_03: And so one of them was just like, I have all these other interests.
• 11:14
  SPEAKER_03: I have so many things I want to do in this life.
• 11:16
  SPEAKER_03: And the way I was, I was a total workaholic.
• 11:19
  SPEAKER_03: 24-7 with this cancer support organization,
• 11:21
  SPEAKER_03: which I loved,
• 11:22
  SPEAKER_03: but I just couldn't do anything else beyond that.
• 11:24
  SPEAKER_03: And so I decided to pass the torch as executive director and start a new chapter.
• 11:30
  SPEAKER_03: And that mental health interest of mine that had started when I was young was looming there.
• 11:34
  SPEAKER_03: And then this whole experience with psilocybin and this loved one was kind of
• 11:40
  SPEAKER_03: hanging in this part of my head.
• 11:41
  SPEAKER_03: And so I decided, okay, this next chapter, I'm going to explore mental health.
• 11:45
  SPEAKER_03: I'm going to cast a wide net.
• 11:46
  SPEAKER_03: And then just I had no set plan at the time.
• 11:49
  SPEAKER_03: And so I cast a wide net and started to look into a handful of different things.
• 11:54
  SPEAKER_03: And as soon as I started to look into psychedelic assisted therapy, I just went down the rabbit hole.
• 11:58
  SPEAKER_03: And that's what I've dedicated my time to since then.
• 12:02
  SPEAKER_03: My husband and I did end up starting that philanthropic foundation back in 2007.
• 12:07
  SPEAKER_03: And so prior to this,
• 12:09
  SPEAKER_03: we were primarily donating to causes for the underserved for physical and mental health.
• 12:14
  SPEAKER_03: food insecurity, employment, education.
• 12:17
  SPEAKER_03: And now we've kind of taken the mental health part of that and expanded it and are
• 12:22
  SPEAKER_03: supporting a lot of different nonprofits in the psychedelic assisted therapy space.
• 12:28
  SPEAKER_02: I'll tell you the thing, there's so much I am moved by in here.
• 12:31
  SPEAKER_02: This question you asked yourself about end of life and not just asking the question,
• 12:39
  SPEAKER_02: but doing something about it.
• 12:40
  SPEAKER_02: You are an unusually activated person.
• 12:44
  SPEAKER_02: You are really good at starting things.
• 12:48
  SPEAKER_02: And I think many of us have ideas.
• 12:51
  SPEAKER_02: We see problems, but we don't take the next step to create solutions.
• 12:56
  SPEAKER_02: Maybe we don't feel the permission.
• 12:57
  SPEAKER_02: Maybe we don't know the process.
• 12:59
  SPEAKER_02: We get overwhelmed by the scale of the problem.
• 13:02
  SPEAKER_02: But you are remarkably good at moving past any of those thoughts you might have into action.
• 13:08
  SPEAKER_02: So I'm just really curious.
• 13:11
  SPEAKER_02: As somebody who's done this a lot of times,
• 13:14
  SPEAKER_02: I mean,
• 13:15
  SPEAKER_02: you moved,
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_02: you started the foundation,
• 13:17
  SPEAKER_02: you changed careers,
• 13:19
  SPEAKER_02: you started a startup.
• 13:20
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, that was sort of a mile by mile, 40 mile journey.
• 13:25
  SPEAKER_02: So what does that process look like for you, Sandy, in reflection?
• 13:32
  SPEAKER_03: Well,
• 13:32
  SPEAKER_03: put it this way,
• 13:33
  SPEAKER_03: I've learned a lot more from my mistakes and from any successes that I've had,
• 13:37
  SPEAKER_03: which I think is important.
• 13:38
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I agree.
• 13:40
  SPEAKER_03: Self-reflection, self-awareness.
• 13:42
  SPEAKER_03: I mean,
• 13:43
  SPEAKER_03: and in my phone,
• 13:43
  SPEAKER_03: I have a list that every time when I kind of go away or have some time to do some
• 13:47
  SPEAKER_03: deep thinking,
• 13:48
  SPEAKER_03: I'm always putting what are my weaknesses?
• 13:50
  SPEAKER_03: How can I work on them?
• 13:51
  SPEAKER_03: Setting goals for myself and then kind of checking in X amount of months later.
• 13:56
  SPEAKER_03: But it all starts with,
• 13:57
  SPEAKER_03: it's a very organic process and I've done it a handful of times now between the
• 14:01
  SPEAKER_03: starter kit and then the cancer support organization and then this chapter that I'm
• 14:05
  SPEAKER_03: in right now and some of the projects I've started in the psychedelic space.
• 14:09
  SPEAKER_03: So it all starts with just identifying a need
• 14:12
  SPEAKER_03: And then figuring out some sort of creative way to fill that need.
• 14:16
  SPEAKER_03: And then it's a matter of finding the right people to collaborate with because you
• 14:19
  SPEAKER_03: can never do anything by yourself.
• 14:21
  SPEAKER_03: You'd never want to do anything or I would never want to do anything by myself.
• 14:24
  SPEAKER_03: You just, you know, bringing in diverse opinions and thoughts and backgrounds and professional skills.
• 14:30
  SPEAKER_03: And so, yeah, so one...
• 14:32
  SPEAKER_03: company was a for-profit,
• 14:33
  SPEAKER_03: one was a nonprofit,
• 14:34
  SPEAKER_03: and now I'm just,
• 14:35
  SPEAKER_03: it's a bunch of different projects and then our foundation.
• 14:38
  SPEAKER_03: So yeah,
• 14:39
  SPEAKER_03: I think it's a lot of trial and error and being willing to like,
• 14:42
  SPEAKER_03: when something's not working,
• 14:43
  SPEAKER_03: I always say like,
• 14:44
  SPEAKER_03: instead of win or lose,
• 14:45
  SPEAKER_03: it's win or learn.
• 14:47
  SPEAKER_03: And so those learnings are key.
• 14:49
  SPEAKER_03: And I, from each chapter, I've learned things that have then helped me with the next chapter.
• 14:54
  SPEAKER_03: And I also try to mentor others and inspire them.
• 14:58
  SPEAKER_03: Like if when people have an idea, it's like, go for it, try it.
• 15:01
  SPEAKER_03: You know, if you don't try, you'll never know.
• 15:03
  SPEAKER_03: You know,
• 15:04
  SPEAKER_03: like,
• 15:04
  SPEAKER_03: for example,
• 15:04
  SPEAKER_03: within the cancer support organization,
• 15:06
  SPEAKER_03: I was getting a lot of people who were calling who needed a wig and they were like,
• 15:11
  SPEAKER_03: I can't afford them.
• 15:12
  SPEAKER_03: They're so expensive.
• 15:13
  SPEAKER_03: My insurance doesn't cover it.
• 15:14
  SPEAKER_03: And where do I go and how do I get,
• 15:15
  SPEAKER_03: you know,
• 15:16
  SPEAKER_03: lots of questions around wigs,
• 15:17
  SPEAKER_03: lots of people who needed them.
• 15:19
  SPEAKER_03: and a lot of barriers.
• 15:20
  SPEAKER_03: And then there was a woman who had this beautiful $3,000 wig that she didn't need anymore.
• 15:25
  SPEAKER_03: And so, and she had her husband work with exchanges at work.
• 15:29
  SPEAKER_03: And so we said, wait a second, let's get together and kind of brainstorm this idea.
• 15:33
  SPEAKER_03: I have people who need wigs.
• 15:34
  SPEAKER_03: You have a wig that you don't need.
• 15:36
  SPEAKER_03: Your husband works with exchanges.
• 15:37
  SPEAKER_03: And so we created the wig exchange,
• 15:39
  SPEAKER_03: which is probably our largest program at the cancer support organization that started.
• 15:45
  SPEAKER_03: So survivors are those who no longer need their wigs.
• 15:48
  SPEAKER_03: donate them to the organization.
• 15:49
  SPEAKER_03: And then they're either brand new or gently used.
• 15:52
  SPEAKER_03: If they're gently used, we have them professionally cleaned and reconditioned.
• 15:54
  SPEAKER_03: And then we loan them out to those who need them, who might not otherwise be able to get one.
• 15:59
  SPEAKER_03: Or maybe they would.
• 16:00
  SPEAKER_03: I always say if it's about spending money on a vacation or...
• 16:03
  SPEAKER_03: I'd much rather you take that vacation and we can give you a wig.
• 16:08
  SPEAKER_03: But in addition, so that was where the idea started.
• 16:12
  SPEAKER_03: But then I've also had this experience of
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_03: how it's so nice when you're going through any sort of adversity to talk to
• 16:18
  SPEAKER_03: somebody who's on the other side of it,
• 16:19
  SPEAKER_03: who's been through it,
• 16:20
  SPEAKER_03: is on the other side.
• 16:21
  SPEAKER_03: So we have wig advisors who are all cancer survivors themselves.
• 16:25
  SPEAKER_03: So they've been through chemo,
• 16:27
  SPEAKER_03: lost their hair,
• 16:27
  SPEAKER_03: worn a wig,
• 16:28
  SPEAKER_03: and they're matched up one-on-one with a newly diagnosed woman to help them
• 16:32
  SPEAKER_03: So again, it's just like identifying a need.
• 16:34
  SPEAKER_03: There was a need.
• 16:34
  SPEAKER_03: Here's a creative way.
• 16:35
  SPEAKER_03: But I remember when we were first thinking about starting it,
• 16:38
  SPEAKER_03: I was like,
• 16:38
  SPEAKER_03: I have no idea if this is going to work or not.
• 16:41
  SPEAKER_03: I don't know why no one else in this country is doing this because I looked around
• 16:44
  SPEAKER_03: to see,
• 16:44
  SPEAKER_03: you know,
• 16:44
  SPEAKER_03: well,
• 16:45
  SPEAKER_03: this has to exist was what I said to myself initially.
• 16:48
  SPEAKER_03: So I'm thrilled that we tried.
• 16:49
  SPEAKER_03: It's grown.
• 16:50
  SPEAKER_03: And now we have Wigs Without Borders and developing countries around the world with our wigs.
• 16:54
  SPEAKER_03: And then we have one out in San Francisco, too.
• 16:56
  SPEAKER_03: So it was worth the risk.
• 16:58
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, my gosh.
• 17:00
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 17:01
  SPEAKER_02: And I guess I think what an amazing idea.
• 17:04
  SPEAKER_02: And like you said, maybe kind of obvious.
• 17:08
  SPEAKER_02: And yet, again, the solutions had not been created.
• 17:11
  SPEAKER_02: And there's a good chance you weren't the first person to see the problem or the solution.
• 17:17
  SPEAKER_02: One of the things that strikes me in this process that you've outlined,
• 17:19
  SPEAKER_02: and I so appreciate you making it so clear,
• 17:22
  SPEAKER_02: which is identify a need,
• 17:24
  SPEAKER_02: look for a solution and team up with diverse collaborators and then keep learning
• 17:30
  SPEAKER_02: and stay focused on learning.
• 17:33
  SPEAKER_02: And one of the things I noticed in your mindset that is unique here that I think we
• 17:37
  SPEAKER_02: can all benefit from a reminder of is I don't hear you focusing on failure.
• 17:42
  SPEAKER_02: at any of these points.
• 17:43
  SPEAKER_02: What if this doesn't work?
• 17:44
  SPEAKER_02: What if people don't want this?
• 17:47
  SPEAKER_02: It's just, let's put it out there and learn from doing.
• 17:51
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm just a huge believer in that approach,
• 17:54
  SPEAKER_02: the learn from action,
• 17:56
  SPEAKER_02: learn from experimentation approach.
• 17:58
  SPEAKER_02: But the other thing I hear in what you're saying is a strong filter for which
• 18:04
  SPEAKER_02: problems to go after,
• 18:06
  SPEAKER_02: which needs to go after.
• 18:07
  SPEAKER_02: So I'm curious how you think about those.
• 18:10
  SPEAKER_03: That's a really good question.
• 18:11
  SPEAKER_03: I feel like they just... When I'm able to do the kind of deeper thinking...
• 18:17
  SPEAKER_03: which is not in my everyday.
• 18:19
  SPEAKER_03: I'm sort of like, I have my to-do list.
• 18:21
  SPEAKER_03: I'm just going and doing.
• 18:23
  SPEAKER_03: But then I take some time to do deeper thinking.
• 18:26
  SPEAKER_03: And when I'm doing that deeper thinking,
• 18:27
  SPEAKER_03: I feel like there's certain things that keep coming up in my mind,
• 18:30
  SPEAKER_03: like problems that I've identified.
• 18:32
  SPEAKER_03: And what's the solution?
• 18:33
  SPEAKER_03: I was just doing this yesterday with something.
• 18:36
  SPEAKER_03: And I was like, okay, I need to get away from my desk.
• 18:38
  SPEAKER_03: I need to get away from all distractions, my phone.
• 18:40
  SPEAKER_03: And I need to just sit and think deeply about a solution here.
• 18:44
  SPEAKER_03: And I kind of came up with an outline, which will need to be tweaked, I'm sure.
• 18:48
  SPEAKER_03: But that's the beauty of it, right?
• 18:49
  SPEAKER_03: You have to start somewhere.
• 18:50
  SPEAKER_03: And that's where getting input from other people is so valuable.
• 18:54
  SPEAKER_03: Just kind of putting feelers out there.
• 18:56
  SPEAKER_03: And I've had a lot of ideas that have not, you know, panned out.
• 18:59
  SPEAKER_03: But that's okay, right?
• 19:00
  SPEAKER_03: It's kind of like, you know, leaves growing on a tree, right?
• 19:03
  SPEAKER_03: And then some of them fall off and then some kind of blossom.
• 19:07
  SPEAKER_03: And so I'm not afraid to fail, I guess, is an important piece here.
• 19:11
  SPEAKER_01: Mm-hmm.
• 19:12
  SPEAKER_03: I'm willing to look at myself in the mirror and say, you know what?
• 19:15
  SPEAKER_03: I tried and it just didn't work.
• 19:16
  SPEAKER_03: And that's okay.
• 19:17
  SPEAKER_03: I'll move on to the next thing.
• 19:19
  SPEAKER_03: So without being too attached to any sort of outcome, I think that's helpful too.
• 19:23
  SPEAKER_03: It's a little bit of like stoicism and that there's,
• 19:26
  SPEAKER_03: yeah,
• 19:27
  SPEAKER_03: that like,
• 19:27
  SPEAKER_03: and I'm not doing this for anything for me.
• 19:30
  SPEAKER_03: Like I'm doing this to better the world, right?
• 19:33
  SPEAKER_03: And if my idea of a way to better the world isn't working,
• 19:37
  SPEAKER_03: if that particular idea isn't working,
• 19:38
  SPEAKER_03: that's okay.
• 19:39
  SPEAKER_03: There's many other ways to...
• 19:41
  SPEAKER_03: make this world a better place.
• 19:42
  SPEAKER_03: So I'll just move on to the next one without letting myself get too down on myself.
• 19:47
  SPEAKER_03: I just, again, use it as an opportunity to learn any sort of adversity.
• 19:50
  SPEAKER_03: I always just flip the script.
• 19:52
  SPEAKER_03: It's not adversity.
• 19:53
  SPEAKER_03: It's like, what's the opportunity here?
• 19:55
  SPEAKER_03: I do a lot of this, like flipping in my head.
• 19:57
  SPEAKER_03: So things like, Oh, I have to do this.
• 19:59
  SPEAKER_03: I changed it to, I get to do this.
• 20:01
  SPEAKER_03: And you know,
• 20:02
  SPEAKER_03: like,
• 20:02
  SPEAKER_03: and that was like a lot when I was bringing up our children who are now in their twenties,
• 20:06
  SPEAKER_03: but it was like,
• 20:07
  SPEAKER_03: Oh,
• 20:07
  SPEAKER_03: I have to drive the carpool.
• 20:09
  SPEAKER_03: I have to do the laundry.
• 20:10
  SPEAKER_03: I have to, you know, whatever.
• 20:11
  SPEAKER_03: And then as soon as I flipped it, I get to, you know, like even picking the kids up late at night.
• 20:16
  SPEAKER_03: You know, why is it always me?
• 20:17
  SPEAKER_03: I love my husband, but why does he get to sleep?
• 20:19
  SPEAKER_03: And so I was kind of resentful.
• 20:21
  SPEAKER_03: And then I just flipped the script.
• 20:22
  SPEAKER_03: And I was like, you know what?
• 20:23
  SPEAKER_03: I get to pick them up.
• 20:24
  SPEAKER_03: I get to see where I'm picking them up, have the conversations in the car, take their friends home.
• 20:28
  SPEAKER_03: And as soon as I flipped that,
• 20:30
  SPEAKER_03: it was like,
• 20:31
  SPEAKER_03: I mean,
• 20:31
  SPEAKER_03: I was like this happy little Uber driver picking everybody up.
• 20:35
  SPEAKER_02: Well,
• 20:35
  SPEAKER_02: and it seems to there,
• 20:37
  SPEAKER_02: the distinction was not just the I get to,
• 20:40
  SPEAKER_02: but what you did was so much more specific.
• 20:42
  SPEAKER_02: You thought about, well, what do I get to do?
• 20:46
  SPEAKER_02: within this?
• 20:47
  SPEAKER_02: What are the rewards of getting to do this, right?
• 20:50
  SPEAKER_02: So have to versus get to,
• 20:52
  SPEAKER_02: I think,
• 20:52
  SPEAKER_02: yes,
• 20:53
  SPEAKER_02: it does start the shift,
• 20:55
  SPEAKER_02: but it can also just feel a little bit like glossed over until you get to like,
• 20:59
  SPEAKER_02: well,
• 21:00
  SPEAKER_02: as human beings,
• 21:01
  SPEAKER_02: we are wired to want what is best for ourselves.
• 21:05
  SPEAKER_02: And that underlying question of what's in it for me is there, whether we're conscious of it or not.
• 21:10
  SPEAKER_02: And I think as you're pointing out, the more specific we can be about what's in it for us,
• 21:15
  SPEAKER_02: the more genuine buy-in and power we get from that shift.
• 21:19
  SPEAKER_02: The other thing you mentioned that is so cool is you said,
• 21:23
  SPEAKER_02: not exactly in this way,
• 21:25
  SPEAKER_02: but so I'll summarize it.
• 21:26
  SPEAKER_02: You said, it's not about me.
• 21:29
  SPEAKER_02: It's about the idea.
• 21:31
  SPEAKER_02: Because in my head, I was like, how is she so okay with risk?
• 21:36
  SPEAKER_02: And that's why I think in large part is because you're not risking your identity.
• 21:41
  SPEAKER_02: You're not risking, am I smart?
• 21:44
  SPEAKER_02: Am I a good founder?
• 21:45
  SPEAKER_02: Am I impactful?
• 21:47
  SPEAKER_02: It's, is this the right solution for this problem?
• 21:51
  SPEAKER_03: My passion is to help other people.
• 21:53
  SPEAKER_03: I am so much happier and more comfortable helping other people than doing something for myself.
• 21:59
  SPEAKER_03: Like it just,
• 21:59
  SPEAKER_03: I don't know,
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_03: it's just...
• 22:01
  SPEAKER_03: So if I'm trying to help someone else and it's not working,
• 22:05
  SPEAKER_03: the idea isn't working...
• 22:07
  SPEAKER_03: That's OK.
• 22:08
  SPEAKER_03: It's almost like a ball of clay that I'm just molding and like,
• 22:11
  SPEAKER_03: OK,
• 22:11
  SPEAKER_03: so let me just mold it a little differently.
• 22:13
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 22:14
  SPEAKER_03: And then maybe I can still achieve that same goal of helping that person.
• 22:17
  SPEAKER_03: It's like there was I read an article recently which had this great line that I've
• 22:21
  SPEAKER_03: been has really helped me structure when I'm trying to help people,
• 22:25
  SPEAKER_03: whether it's an individual or a larger problem or whatever.
• 22:28
  SPEAKER_03: But this specifically is for helping with an individual.
• 22:30
  SPEAKER_03: But the question that I ask is, does this person want to be helped, heard or hugged?
• 22:36
  SPEAKER_02: Mm hmm.
• 22:37
  SPEAKER_03: It is such a great structure.
• 22:38
  SPEAKER_03: I get calls pretty much every day,
• 22:41
  SPEAKER_03: calls or emails from people,
• 22:42
  SPEAKER_03: whether they have cancer or mental health issues or other,
• 22:45
  SPEAKER_03: you know,
• 22:46
  SPEAKER_03: just questions or problems or whatever.
• 22:47
  SPEAKER_03: And when I use that framework, like some people definitely want to be helped.
• 22:52
  SPEAKER_03: They want that tangible.
• 22:53
  SPEAKER_03: Who do I call?
• 22:53
  SPEAKER_03: Where do I go?
• 22:54
  SPEAKER_03: What do I do?
• 22:55
  SPEAKER_03: Some people, they just want to be heard.
• 22:57
  SPEAKER_03: They want to be validated.
• 22:58
  SPEAKER_03: They want to vent.
• 22:59
  SPEAKER_03: They want to complain.
• 23:00
  SPEAKER_03: They want to feel like it's okay to feel crappy about this,
• 23:03
  SPEAKER_03: you know,
• 23:03
  SPEAKER_03: and then others just need a hug,
• 23:06
  SPEAKER_03: you know?
• 23:06
  SPEAKER_03: And so,
• 23:07
  SPEAKER_03: so yeah,
• 23:08
  SPEAKER_03: that's something that's been helpful for me when I'm trying to figure out the best
• 23:12
  SPEAKER_03: way that I can help an individual.
• 23:14
  SPEAKER_03: And I use that framework a little bit when I'm kind of thinking of larger, larger issues to help.
• 23:19
  SPEAKER_02: Interesting.
• 23:19
  SPEAKER_02: Say more on that.
• 23:20
  SPEAKER_03: An example I would say is that when people have come to me with various mental
• 23:24
  SPEAKER_03: health problems and I've,
• 23:26
  SPEAKER_03: you know,
• 23:27
  SPEAKER_03: as I had mentioned,
• 23:28
  SPEAKER_03: become very involved in psychedelic assisted therapy.
• 23:31
  SPEAKER_03: It's not legal in our country yet beyond clinical trials.
• 23:34
  SPEAKER_03: But in 2024, if all goes well,
• 23:37
  SPEAKER_03: well or according to plan, hopefully the first medicine MDMA will be approved for PTSD.
• 23:43
  SPEAKER_03: But when people come to me,
• 23:45
  SPEAKER_03: they know that this is an area that I'm,
• 23:47
  SPEAKER_03: you know,
• 23:48
  SPEAKER_03: fairly deeply involved with now,
• 23:49
  SPEAKER_03: but it's not right for everybody.
• 23:51
  SPEAKER_03: And there's
• 23:52
  SPEAKER_03: risks to it.
• 23:53
  SPEAKER_03: And so I use that structure in my mind when someone comes to me with a mental
• 23:58
  SPEAKER_03: health issue,
• 24:00
  SPEAKER_03: because you can access these medicines in other countries legally.
• 24:03
  SPEAKER_03: So I do have resources for them if they are interested in going down this path.
• 24:07
  SPEAKER_03: But I think to myself about this specific person, do they want to be helped, heard or hugged, right?
• 24:13
  SPEAKER_03: And if they want to be helped, then that's something then I kind of go through in my mind, whether it's
• 24:18
  SPEAKER_03: asking myself whether psychedelic assisted therapy would be good for that particular person.
• 24:23
  SPEAKER_03: But oftentimes it's that they just need to be heard or they want to be hugged, right?
• 24:28
  SPEAKER_02: What a beautiful question and practice and how our world would change if we were
• 24:33
  SPEAKER_02: all asking that question in every interaction,
• 24:36
  SPEAKER_02: especially those of us who are wired for service.
• 24:39
  SPEAKER_02: We've talked a lot about on this show that one of the biggest challenges for
• 24:43
  SPEAKER_02: uplifters is the writing reflex.
• 24:46
  SPEAKER_02: And the desire to help even when the type of help being offered is not necessarily
• 24:51
  SPEAKER_02: aligned with the type of help being desired.
• 24:55
  SPEAKER_02: And so I think that that framework is really valuable for uplifting in general, for service oriented
• 25:02
  SPEAKER_02: folks to help us remind ourselves that there are different ways of service and that
• 25:08
  SPEAKER_02: people are often pretty clear about what they want.
• 25:11
  SPEAKER_02: If we open ourselves to listening to that is certainly through asking that question,
• 25:17
  SPEAKER_02: but also just through hearing the truth of the response.
• 25:20
  SPEAKER_03: And even with the polarization in our society these days, I feel like that framework works too.
• 25:26
  SPEAKER_03: Sometimes people just need to be heard, right?
• 25:28
  SPEAKER_03: Like, and it's not all black and white.
• 25:30
  SPEAKER_03: Let's start a dialogue.
• 25:31
  SPEAKER_03: Let's respect each other's different opinions and see if we can come to some sort
• 25:35
  SPEAKER_03: of agreement on at least certain things,
• 25:37
  SPEAKER_03: right?
• 25:38
  SPEAKER_03: And that there's probably more overlap and similarities than we think it is.
• 25:42
  SPEAKER_03: Because everything kind of is made out to be so black and white today.
• 25:45
  SPEAKER_03: But if you actually take the time to listen,
• 25:47
  SPEAKER_03: as you're suggesting,
• 25:48
  SPEAKER_03: and make somebody feel heard,
• 25:49
  SPEAKER_03: then I think we could have better outcomes.
• 25:53
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I think so too.
• 25:54
  SPEAKER_02: And I think it is a time for that, maybe more than...
• 26:00
  SPEAKER_02: any other time because we are pulled apart in so many ways and it is up to
• 26:06
  SPEAKER_02: uplifters to bring us back together.
• 26:09
  SPEAKER_02: So we get to practice that wherever we are in the world,
• 26:12
  SPEAKER_02: whatever problems we see,
• 26:13
  SPEAKER_02: we get to learn through the experience how we can truly be most of service.
• 26:19
  SPEAKER_03: And then also when we are of service, right?
• 26:22
  SPEAKER_03: Like,
• 26:22
  SPEAKER_03: I mean,
• 26:23
  SPEAKER_03: I'm sure that you and everyone else that you've interviewed on this podcast feel
• 26:27
  SPEAKER_03: this way,
• 26:28
  SPEAKER_03: but like giving back feels good,
• 26:29
  SPEAKER_03: right?
• 26:31
  SPEAKER_03: And so I feel so fortunate that I've been able to give back for basically all of my
• 26:36
  SPEAKER_03: life and that it has in a large part contributed to my happiness.
• 26:41
  SPEAKER_03: And so what I like to do also is to kind of help the next generation see and feel
• 26:46
  SPEAKER_03: that and learn it firsthand.
• 26:47
  SPEAKER_03: And so like through the Cancer Support Organization,
• 26:50
  SPEAKER_03: Soul Writers,
• 26:52
  SPEAKER_03: we do a lot of volunteering and multi-generational projects too,
• 26:56
  SPEAKER_03: which is really nice.
• 26:57
  SPEAKER_03: Like
• 26:58
  SPEAKER_03: Just seeing like three generations in a room together, right?
• 27:01
  SPEAKER_03: Working on creating mastectomy pillows or drain pockets or whatever it is and having conversations.
• 27:07
  SPEAKER_03: That's so rare these days, right?
• 27:09
  SPEAKER_03: To have grandparents, parents and children all in the same room working towards a single purpose, right?
• 27:15
  SPEAKER_03: And helping others.
• 27:16
  SPEAKER_03: So a lot of my experiences with volunteerism,
• 27:19
  SPEAKER_03: I love bringing in others into whatever project I'm working on.
• 27:24
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 27:24
  SPEAKER_02: There must be something too about the way you invite people in that makes them want to participate.
• 27:29
  SPEAKER_03: I try and do it in a very non-pushy way.
• 27:33
  SPEAKER_03: I think it's sometimes just when I'm passionate about something,
• 27:37
  SPEAKER_03: and then I kind of reach out to friends to see if they're interested.
• 27:40
  SPEAKER_03: I think, yeah, I never want to put pressure on anyone.
• 27:44
  SPEAKER_03: And I always am very clear about
• 27:45
  SPEAKER_03: that.
• 27:46
  SPEAKER_03: And even with donating money on the same way,
• 27:48
  SPEAKER_03: it's like,
• 27:48
  SPEAKER_03: I only want you to donate money if this resonates with you,
• 27:51
  SPEAKER_03: because there's lots of great organizations and causes you can donate your money to.
• 27:55
  SPEAKER_03: If sharing is a passion that I have, great.
• 27:58
  SPEAKER_03: And if not, I totally get it.
• 27:59
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 28:00
  SPEAKER_03: And same thing with volunteering,
• 28:01
  SPEAKER_03: hands-on stuff,
• 28:02
  SPEAKER_03: you know,
• 28:02
  SPEAKER_03: but it's so neat when you invite someone in and then they have a positive experience.
• 28:07
  SPEAKER_03: And then even like through Soul Riders,
• 28:08
  SPEAKER_03: the cancer support organization,
• 28:10
  SPEAKER_03: the amount of friendships that have taken off
• 28:12
  SPEAKER_03: from people volunteering together or meeting through the organization is amazing.
• 28:16
  SPEAKER_03: So, and that was how I met Leah.
• 28:19
  SPEAKER_03: Ah, yes.
• 28:20
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 28:20
  SPEAKER_02: I also hear in what you're saying that you mentioned reflection early on,
• 28:26
  SPEAKER_02: but it's also,
• 28:27
  SPEAKER_02: it's not just reflection on what's working,
• 28:29
  SPEAKER_02: what isn't,
• 28:29
  SPEAKER_02: but reflection on the ripple effects.
• 28:32
  SPEAKER_02: Yes, definitely.
• 28:34
  SPEAKER_02: What does your reflection practice look like?
• 28:36
  SPEAKER_03: Well, so I do keep notes in my phone and go back to those, you know, every couple of months.
• 28:42
  SPEAKER_03: I also, I went on a retreat, a wellness retreat.
• 28:46
  SPEAKER_03: And as part of that process,
• 28:48
  SPEAKER_03: there was some homework before you went on the actual retreat and it was kind of
• 28:52
  SPEAKER_03: identifying some patterns and
• 28:54
  SPEAKER_03: that you wanted to change or things about yourself that you wanted to improve upon.
• 28:58
  SPEAKER_03: And so I did a lot of soul searching and I came up with 13 things that I wanted to work on.
• 29:05
  SPEAKER_03: And then one of the exercises encouraged you to kind of pull the layers back and like,
• 29:09
  SPEAKER_03: why do these problems exist?
• 29:11
  SPEAKER_03: And why do these patterns exist in the first place?
• 29:13
  SPEAKER_03: And it was really eye-opening.
• 29:15
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, some of them went all the way back to childhood.
• 29:17
  SPEAKER_03: I had never connected those dots before.
• 29:19
  SPEAKER_03: And just to tease apart certain things,
• 29:23
  SPEAKER_03: I mean,
• 29:23
  SPEAKER_03: for example,
• 29:24
  SPEAKER_03: one of them was that I wanted to just drink a little bit less.
• 29:27
  SPEAKER_03: I was having an habit of having a couple of glasses of wine every night.
• 29:31
  SPEAKER_03: And so...
• 29:32
  SPEAKER_03: And I'm on Coumadin, which is a blood thinner.
• 29:34
  SPEAKER_03: And so I would kind of justify it that I needed to drink because I have vitamin K and I balance them out.
• 29:40
  SPEAKER_03: But that's ridiculous because there's three levers, the medicine, vitamin K and alcohol.
• 29:44
  SPEAKER_03: And so anyways,
• 29:46
  SPEAKER_03: when I really kind of started to think about why I drink that two glasses of wine a
• 29:49
  SPEAKER_03: night or whatever,
• 29:50
  SPEAKER_03: I broke it down into...
• 29:52
  SPEAKER_03: I drink.
• 29:52
  SPEAKER_03: Part of it was ritual.
• 29:53
  SPEAKER_03: So my husband and I, during the pandemic, started a new ritual because work was blending into home.
• 29:58
  SPEAKER_03: So we started to do yin yoga,
• 30:01
  SPEAKER_03: which is like basically a meditative stretch at the end of the workday to break up
• 30:06
  SPEAKER_03: work from home.
• 30:06
  SPEAKER_03: And then after yin yoga,
• 30:08
  SPEAKER_03: I would go into the kitchen,
• 30:09
  SPEAKER_03: turn on the music,
• 30:10
  SPEAKER_03: pour myself a glass of wine and cook dinner.
• 30:12
  SPEAKER_03: And I loved that.
• 30:13
  SPEAKER_03: But I was like, wait a second.
• 30:14
  SPEAKER_03: But could I have kombucha or could I have seltzer with a fresh squeezed lime?
• 30:18
  SPEAKER_03: Like, did I really need the alcohol?
• 30:19
  SPEAKER_03: You know, so that was one reason.
• 30:21
  SPEAKER_03: A second, so I got rid of that.
• 30:22
  SPEAKER_03: A second reason was stress.
• 30:25
  SPEAKER_03: And I was like, you know what?
• 30:26
  SPEAKER_03: That's probably not the best reason to drink.
• 30:27
  SPEAKER_03: Like, what else could I do?
• 30:28
  SPEAKER_03: Could I do some deep breathing?
• 30:30
  SPEAKER_03: Could I turn on some spa music, light a candle, go outside, take a walk, just sit in nature?
• 30:34
  SPEAKER_03: So I got rid of that glass.
• 30:36
  SPEAKER_03: So that was done.
• 30:37
  SPEAKER_03: The third was social, you know, and I was like, you know what?
• 30:40
  SPEAKER_03: That's okay.
• 30:40
  SPEAKER_03: Like, I can go out and drink socially, but have a drink.
• 30:43
  SPEAKER_03: I don't need two or three drinks.
• 30:45
  SPEAKER_03: And then my last was like, if I've like accomplished something or, you know, to celebrate.
• 30:49
  SPEAKER_03: And I was like, well, that doesn't happen that often.
• 30:51
  SPEAKER_03: So I can keep that glass.
• 30:53
  SPEAKER_03: So anyways, so there were, yeah, so 13 different patterns, behaviors.
• 30:57
  SPEAKER_03: And so that took a lot of self-reflection.
• 30:59
  SPEAKER_03: And sometimes it's hard to look at those things.
• 31:01
  SPEAKER_03: You have to be vulnerable and willing to kind of, it's raw, right?
• 31:05
  SPEAKER_03: Like you're looking at your shadows and trying to dissect them.
• 31:09
  SPEAKER_03: But I have to say, I've made improvement.
• 31:11
  SPEAKER_03: This is now, it'll be a year in March since I did that.
• 31:14
  SPEAKER_03: And I've actually, I think pretty much, I mean, I do hold myself accountable.
• 31:18
  SPEAKER_03: So I will go back to that journal and kind of check in soon at the one year anniversary.
• 31:22
  SPEAKER_03: But I think I'm like making some decent progress on almost all of them.
• 31:27
  SPEAKER_02: Wow.
• 31:28
  SPEAKER_02: Somebody said today, life is not about learning, it's about remembering.
• 31:31
  SPEAKER_02: Because so much of it is just us reminding ourselves again and again.
• 31:35
  SPEAKER_02: But you had the courage and did the work to create that list and to be really
• 31:42
  SPEAKER_02: honest with yourself and then revisited it.
• 31:46
  SPEAKER_02: And I think for all of us, that is an immeasurably important practice.
• 31:51
  SPEAKER_02: So one of the things we always talk about in every episode is self-care practices
• 31:56
  SPEAKER_02: for uplifters while we're so busy taking care of everyone and everything else.
• 32:00
  SPEAKER_02: And certainly your life is so led by service.
• 32:04
  SPEAKER_02: Tell me in under a minute your top self-care practices.
• 32:09
  SPEAKER_03: My morning self-care practice is probably the key for me.
• 32:13
  SPEAKER_03: I get up between usually 4.30 and 5.
• 32:17
  SPEAKER_03: I go clear out my emails from the night and then I work out.
• 32:20
  SPEAKER_03: I come downstairs.
• 32:22
  SPEAKER_03: My husband's made coffee at that point.
• 32:23
  SPEAKER_03: We sit, we chat every morning just to kind of have that connection again.
• 32:27
  SPEAKER_03: And then I read my newsletters.
• 32:31
  SPEAKER_03: and a little bit of the newspaper.
• 32:32
  SPEAKER_03: And then it's usually like around 7.30, 7.30 to 8.
• 32:34
  SPEAKER_03: And I feel like I have taken care of myself.
• 32:38
  SPEAKER_03: I've filled my bucket.
• 32:39
  SPEAKER_03: I feel strong and I'm like ready to take on the day and help people for the rest of my day.
• 32:44
  SPEAKER_03: So without that, it's definitely harder for me.
• 32:47
  SPEAKER_03: And so I really put a lot of weight in that and I kind of bookend my day.
• 32:51
  SPEAKER_03: And then at the end of the workday, my husband and I do yin yoga.
• 32:54
  SPEAKER_03: And that kind of helps me downshift from the day.
• 32:57
  SPEAKER_03: And it just kind of turned my brain off for a
• 33:00
  SPEAKER_03: It helps me transition into the time that my husband and I then have the rest of the night.
• 33:05
  SPEAKER_03: Sleep is hugely important.
• 33:07
  SPEAKER_03: When I was younger,
• 33:08
  SPEAKER_03: when I was doing the starter kit for new parents,
• 33:11
  SPEAKER_03: I and I had two little kids and no maternity leave.
• 33:14
  SPEAKER_03: I used to be able to get away with like
• 33:17
  SPEAKER_03: I don't know, I would sleep like three to four hours a night.
• 33:19
  SPEAKER_03: That was it.
• 33:20
  SPEAKER_03: And I could do that for like eight to 10 nights in a row.
• 33:22
  SPEAKER_03: And then I needed one good night and then I could do it again.
• 33:25
  SPEAKER_03: And it was kind of like a badge of honor, right?
• 33:26
  SPEAKER_03: Like, oh, I don't need that much sleep.
• 33:28
  SPEAKER_03: I have completely come full circle on sleep.
• 33:31
  SPEAKER_03: I feel like my brain is like a hard drive and it just crashes at a certain point.
• 33:35
  SPEAKER_03: And a good night's sleep is so important in order to kind of feel fresh in the
• 33:39
  SPEAKER_03: morning and be able to give back and do what I do throughout the day.
• 33:43
  SPEAKER_03: And then,
• 33:44
  SPEAKER_03: you know,
• 33:44
  SPEAKER_03: I also,
• 33:46
  SPEAKER_03: whenever I'm stressed,
• 33:46
  SPEAKER_03: I kind of have,
• 33:47
  SPEAKER_03: well,
• 33:47
  SPEAKER_03: in my phone,
• 33:48
  SPEAKER_03: I keep a list of like my joy triggers.
• 33:50
  SPEAKER_03: And so if I'm ever like kind of struggling or in a funk or whatever,
• 33:54
  SPEAKER_03: I'll just go into my phone and look up that list.
• 33:58
  SPEAKER_03: And inevitably there's something on there that resonates at that moment that will
• 34:01
  SPEAKER_03: help me get out of my funk.
• 34:03
  SPEAKER_03: Or if I'm stressed, I always, I turn on spa music.
• 34:06
  SPEAKER_03: I love like being in a spa, like that feeling.
• 34:09
  SPEAKER_03: And so I kind of recreate that at home.
• 34:11
  SPEAKER_03: I, you know, my office, I,
• 34:13
  SPEAKER_03: light candles, listen to spa music.
• 34:15
  SPEAKER_03: Sometimes I'll lie down for a few minutes with an eye pillow.
• 34:17
  SPEAKER_03: I'll do some deep breathing.
• 34:19
  SPEAKER_03: Delicious.
• 34:20
  SPEAKER_03: And I take walks sometimes with friends, sometimes by myself.
• 34:23
  SPEAKER_03: Sometimes I'll listen to podcasts.
• 34:25
  SPEAKER_03: Other times I just need a clear brain.
• 34:28
  SPEAKER_03: I don't want any distractions.
• 34:30
  SPEAKER_02: Such a robust and well-balanced set of practices.
• 34:34
  SPEAKER_02: Sandy, thank you so much for being here.
• 34:37
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you for all you do in the world.
• 34:38
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you for sharing your story and your mindset.
• 34:41
  SPEAKER_02: And for all of you listening,
• 34:43
  SPEAKER_02: I hope you hear in Sandy's story,
• 34:46
  SPEAKER_02: maybe some inspiration to go solve some problems that you see,
• 34:51
  SPEAKER_02: to get out there and see what happens when you show up for the challenge and get
• 34:58
  SPEAKER_02: curious about what might be possible if you find yourself a diverse team of
• 35:05
  SPEAKER_02: collaborators to go make a difference.
• 35:07
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you for listening to the Uplifters podcast.
• 35:11
  SPEAKER_02: If you're getting a boost from these episodes,
• 35:14
  SPEAKER_02: please share them with the Uplifters in your life and then join us in conversation
• 35:20
  SPEAKER_02: over at theuplifterspodcast.com.
• 35:23
  SPEAKER_02: Head over to Spotify,
• 35:25
  SPEAKER_02: Apple Podcasts,
• 35:26
  SPEAKER_02: or wherever you get your podcasts and like,
• 35:29
  SPEAKER_02: follow,
• 35:30
  SPEAKER_02: and rate our show.
• 35:31
  SPEAKER_02: It'll really help us connect with more uplifters and it'll ensure you never miss
• 35:37
  SPEAKER_02: one of these beautiful stories.
• 35:41
  SPEAKER_01: Big love.
• 35:43
  SPEAKER_01: painted water sunshine with rosemary and thyme dwell in the perplexing though you
• 35:50
  SPEAKER_01: find it vexing toss a star and hover be your own best lover relish in a new prime
• 35:59
  SPEAKER_01: and a dream springtime dance with idle hindsight bring the sun to twilight
• 36:07
  SPEAKER_01: lift you up lift you up lift you up lift you up lift you up
• 36:40
  SPEAKER_01: Lift you up.
• 36:41
  SPEAKER_01: Beautiful.
• 36:43
  SPEAKER_01: I cried.
• 36:45
  SPEAKER_01: It's that little thing you did with your voice.
• 36:54
  SPEAKER_01: Right, in the pre-chorus, right?
• 36:59
  SPEAKER_01: I was like... Mommy, stop crying.
• 37:01
  SPEAKER_01: You're disturbing the peace.