Latest / The Bridge by Sammy Chand / October 21, 2026 — "Sammy talks to Amaal Mallik, Part One"

Transcript

October 21, 2026 — "Sammy talks to Amaal Mallik, Part One" · The Bridge by Sammy Chand

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: South Asian music and culture can be found around the world.
• 0:06
  Speaker 2: We track them best and present it here for you
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  Speaker 2: on Ruckus Avenue Radio.
• 0:16
  Speaker 3: Hi everybody, this is Nayab Vidhara and you're listening to
• 0:19
  Speaker 3: The Bridge with Sami Shah.
• 0:21
  Speaker 4: Hi, this is Anup Jain and you're listening to Ruckus
• 0:23
  Speaker 4: Avenue Radio.
• 0:25
  Speaker 5: Hi, this is Akshay Kumar and you're listening to The
• 0:27
  Speaker 5: Bridge only on Ruckus Avenue Radio. Yeah!
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  Speaker 6: Welcome to the big show, everybody.
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  Speaker 3: My name is Sammy John, and you have found an
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  Speaker 3: October 21st edition of The Bridge. And certifiably, folks, the
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  Speaker 3: most entertaining hour in all of South Asian music.
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  Speaker 6: Got a really special hour for you today.
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  Speaker 3: And when you talk about the foremost Indian composers and
• 1:01
  Speaker 3: writers in our business, in the world, you're looking at
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  Speaker 3: Amal Malik. And Amal Malik will be joining us today
• 1:12
  Speaker 3: in what has been agreed to, a two-part interview session.
• 1:18
  Speaker 3: Not only today, but tomorrow we will complete this interview.
• 1:23
  Speaker 3: And listen, I have never done this before. I have
• 1:26
  Speaker 3: never sat down with a guest and said, you know what,
• 1:29
  Speaker 3: let's do.
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  Speaker 6: This over two shows. Never happened before.
• 1:34
  Speaker 3: So not only is this a first for The Bridge,
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  Speaker 3: but I'm just really looking forward to the breadth of
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  Speaker 3: this conversation today. We're going to talk to Amal Malik
• 1:47
  Speaker 3: about not only all the great.
• 1:49
  Speaker 6: Things that he has accomplished.
• 1:51
  Speaker 3: But to me, there's a human story in here that
• 1:54
  Speaker 3: I'm really looking forward to exploring. So folks, buckle your
• 2:01
  Speaker 3: seatbelts for a Wednesday episode of The Bridge. We'll be
• 2:04
  Speaker 3: joined today by Amal Malik. We'll be joined by the
• 2:08
  Speaker 3: Ruckus Avenue Radio All-Stars, as we usually do. Today we'll
• 2:11
  Speaker 3: be joined by Dr.
• 2:12
  Speaker 5: Roy.
• 2:14
  Speaker 6: She'll stop by and give us a word on the avenue.
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  Speaker 3: But ladies and gentlemen, today it's all about Amal Malik.
• 2:22
  Speaker 3: And we'll dive into his music and really prep you
• 2:24
  Speaker 3: for this conversation today.
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  Speaker 6: This is going to be special. I'm really excited about it.
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  Speaker 3: So folks, Amal Malik is on deck. This song is
• 2:35
  Speaker 3: called Body Body and Welcome.
• 2:37
  Speaker 5: To the Bridge.
• 2:42
  Speaker 7: Zulfan de jaal weh Janati na chaahoon main Tujho mere naal.
• 2:52
  Speaker 8: Weh Bari bari nakre dekhaan tehri Aaye kaat lana yeh
• 3:01
  Speaker 8: adhaan tehri Duniya cheh ne lo ki vas de weh
• 3:05
  Speaker 8: Tujh pe ruki hain kyun ne gaayen.
• 3:07
  Speaker 4: Meri Bari Bari Nakhne Dikhae Teri Hai Katlana Ye Adhae
• 3:18
  Speaker 4: Teri Duniya Che Enne Loh Ki Vas Deve Tujh Pe
• 3:24
  Speaker 4: Ruki Tere bina dil lage na kalyan Nahi ve katt
• 3:42
  Speaker 4: diyan ratan Mildiyan.
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  Speaker 9: Jado jado tu te.
• 3:48
  Speaker 10: Main ve Hundiyan pir barsatan Mausam yeh saari yeh hawaan
• 3:56
  Speaker 10: te reen Aashik hai saari fezaan te reen Thank you.
• 4:46
  Speaker 6: Yeah, the song is called Badi Badi.
• 4:49
  Speaker 3: Amal Malik collaborating with his brother, Arman Malik, on that song.
• 4:55
  Speaker 3: One of the few forays into Punjabi music that Amal
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  Speaker 3: has made. And as he put it back in 2025
• 5:01
  Speaker 3: when the song came out, it's a new territory for
• 5:03
  Speaker 3: me and I want to get it right. And I
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  Speaker 3: think he did excellent with that one for sure. We're
• 5:08
  Speaker 3: going to cover the story of Amal Malik today. And
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  Speaker 3: this song right here that we've got for you is
• 5:13
  Speaker 3: called Tumila Tohena.
• 5:16
  Speaker 6: One of the hit songs.
• 5:17
  Speaker 3: That I think that came out from Dodo Pyade back
• 5:21
  Speaker 3: in 2019. This song right here, he collaborates with Arijit Singh,
• 5:26
  Speaker 3: a partnership that would continue. And back then in 2019,
• 5:31
  Speaker 3: my goodness, Ajay Devgn, the star of this movie, it
• 5:35
  Speaker 3: was a big moment in Indian cinema.
• 5:40
  Speaker 1: I have seen your light in my dreams. My heart
• 5:50
  Speaker 1: has also seen you somewhere.
• 5:53
  Speaker 5: I wake up every.
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  Speaker 11: Day with your golden face in my eyes. Kya jaanata tha,
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  Speaker 11: tu bhi tha mera Ab jo mila toh laga.
• 6:10
  Speaker 1: Dher se hi sahi, magar tu mila Mila toh hai
• 6:18
  Speaker 1: na dheera dheera sahi, magar faasla Mita to hai naa,
• 6:26
  Speaker 1: dher se hi sahi, magar tu mila Mila to hai naa,
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  Speaker 1: dheer dheere.
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  Speaker 5: Sahi, magar faasla.
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  Speaker 11: We've got your hand now Oh.
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  Speaker 5: Oh, oh, oh.
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  Speaker 12: I will meet you everyday for any reason I will
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  Speaker 12: know myself as well as I will know you.
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  Speaker 13: See the eyes, whatever you tell me, I will listen.
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  Speaker 13: There is no need for breath now, I will live
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  Speaker 13: with your trust.
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  Speaker 4: It is right from you, but you have met.
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  Speaker 1: You have met slowly, but the distance is right. But
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  Speaker 1: you have found me.
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  Speaker 4: You have found me.
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  Speaker 6: Slowly, slowly.
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  Speaker 13: True, but the distance.
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  Speaker 2: You have found me. Oh, oh, oh. Oh, oh, oh.
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  Speaker 2: Rene laga aaj kal hoon Main paas etna tere.
• 9:00
  Speaker 1: Sari tere aati jaati Main gimsakoon dharkane Aakhon me tere
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  Speaker 1: naate khatam ho Bahon me ho har subaar Phir bhi
• 9:16
  Speaker 1: na apni baate khatam ho Chalta rahe silsilaar Dher se
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  Speaker 1: hi sahi I have not met you slowly, but the
• 9:34
  Speaker 1: distance is right I have not lost you, but the
• 9:40
  Speaker 1: distance is right I have not met you slowly, but
• 9:46
  Speaker 1: the distance is right Amal Malik comes from a very
• 9:52
  Speaker 1: rich musical heritage.
• 9:57
  Speaker 6: His grandfather, his father and uncle.
• 9:59
  Speaker 13: And you would expect that those very, very deep expectations
• 10:01
  Speaker 13: in a family.
• 10:04
  Speaker 6: Would take an effect on you.
• 10:19
  Speaker 3: And I think that they certainly have played a part
• 10:21
  Speaker 3: in Amal's story. And so I'm going to explore that
• 10:24
  Speaker 3: with Amal today. There's a lot going on and people
• 10:27
  Speaker 3: throw nepotism around, but I don't think it's that easy.
• 10:29
  Speaker 6: So we'll talk. Here's Dr. Roy for you.
• 10:32
  Speaker 1: Hey guys, this is Dr.
• 10:33
  Speaker 14: Roy with today's Word on the Avenue. In film and
• 10:36
  Speaker 14: TV news, Tamil's sociopolitical thriller, Inna Vilay, directed by Sajeev
• 10:40
  Speaker 14: Basoor and starring Nimisha Sajayan and Garnas, has won the
• 10:44
  Speaker 14: Best Cinematography Award at the Atlanta Indian Film Festival, recognizing
• 10:48
  Speaker 14: cinematographer Albi Antony's visual storytelling. Set in coastal Rameshwaram, the
• 10:53
  Speaker 14: film follows a fisherman's fight to protect his livelihood and dignity,
• 10:57
  Speaker 14: with his personal struggle growing into a larger legal battle
• 11:01
  Speaker 14: exploring justice, resilience, and human dignity. In media news, Indian
• 11:07
  Speaker 14: actress Anushka Sen is taking Indian talent to the global
• 11:10
  Speaker 14: stage as her Korea-India co-production Jeju-Oli, co-starring South Korean actor
• 11:16
  Speaker 14: Kang Hyun-Seok, prepares for its North American premiere at the
• 11:20
  Speaker 14: Newport Beach Film Festival. Selected for the festival's Korean Spotlight program,
• 11:26
  Speaker 14: the film follows an Indian star grieving the loss of
• 11:28
  Speaker 14: her cousin, a longtime manager who travels to Jeju Island,
• 11:33
  Speaker 14: where an unexpected encounter with a former K-pop idol sparks
• 11:37
  Speaker 14: a story of healing, connection, and cross-cultural discovery. In event news,
• 11:43
  Speaker 14: FBI Director Kash Patel and country singer and conservative commentator
• 11:47
  Speaker 14: Alexis Wilkins have announced their engagement after dating for about
• 11:51
  Speaker 14: three years. Sharing the news on social media with a
• 11:54
  Speaker 14: photo of the couple and Wilkins' engagement ring, people have
• 11:57
  Speaker 14: said Kash is officially off the market. That's it for
• 12:01
  Speaker 14: today's Word on the Avenue.
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  Speaker 5: Until next time.
• 12:04
  Speaker 6: Thank you so much, Dr.
• 12:05
  Speaker 5: Roy.
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  Speaker 6: Thank you very much for that.
• 12:07
  Speaker 3: And folks, we have just got word that Amal Malik
• 12:10
  Speaker 3: has called in and he is on hold as we speak.
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  Speaker 6: So we'll pull him into.
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  Speaker 3: This conversation right after this song. Part one of our
• 12:19
  Speaker 3: exclusive interview with Amal Malik.
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  Speaker 6: Stand by.
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  Speaker 5: Stand by.
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  Speaker 4: Who are they are the family bar Joe is a
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  Speaker 4: most korea.
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  Speaker 9: Oh, yeah, they got to John. I think you do me.
• 12:47
  Speaker 14: I'm a.
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  Speaker 4: Today is the first time I have smiled like this.
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  Speaker 9: When I saw you, I understood why I have come
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  Speaker 9: to this world.
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  Speaker 2: Take me with.
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  Speaker 5: You and go.
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  Speaker 4: I have come to live with you.
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  Speaker 9: I have got permission to love you from God.
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  Speaker 2: Oh Oh Oh Oh.
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  Speaker 9: Zameen se aasma tak hum dhund aaye jahan saara Bana.
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  Speaker 15: Paya nahin ab tak khuda tumse koi pyara From the
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  Speaker 15: earth to the sky, I have searched for the whole world.
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  Speaker 15: I have not been able to make anyone dearer to
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  Speaker 15: you than God.
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  Speaker 2: I will write.
• 14:45
  Speaker 5: On the sky.
• 14:48
  Speaker 4: That the whole world will read.
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  Speaker 16: There won't be anyone here now, we are two hundred
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  Speaker 16: and twelve.
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  Speaker 4: I have brought the praises of the whole world.
• 15:02
  Speaker 5: In your prayers.
• 15:08
  Speaker 9: I have been given permission to love you.
• 15:13
  Speaker 15: I have been given permission to love you.
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  Speaker 16: Tu hai jo roo baru mere Bada mehfuz rehta hoon
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  Speaker 16: Tere milne ka shukrana Khuda se roz karta hoon Tu hai.
• 15:59
  Speaker 2: Jo roo baru mere.
• 16:07
  Speaker 4: I am very safe. I thank you for meeting me.
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  Speaker 5: I pray to God.
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  Speaker 10: I know that this is an unknowable thing.
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  Speaker 15: It is a delusion of the heart. This heart has
• 16:29
  Speaker 15: become mad, now you only.
• 16:31
  Speaker 16: Make it understand.
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  Speaker 4: You see my world in you, you become my world.
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  Speaker 4: I have found you like this with good luck. I
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  Speaker 4: have got permission.
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  Speaker 15: To love you from God.
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  Speaker 3: And ladies and gentlemen, it is my true honor and
• 17:03
  Speaker 3: indeed a pleasure to announce into the show Amal Malik.
• 17:07
  Speaker 6: Sir, how are you? What's up, Sami?
• 17:10
  Speaker 5: How are you doing? Thank you for having me.
• 17:12
  Speaker 6: We're doing well, brother.
• 17:13
  Speaker 3: Thank you so much for taking time for us here
• 17:16
  Speaker 3: on a Wednesday night to join us.
• 17:18
  Speaker 6: How's everything there in India? How's the weather?
• 17:21
  Speaker 5: It's kind of hard, but it's not bad. It's manageable.
• 17:25
  Speaker 6: We are so excited to be talking to you. I
• 17:29
  Speaker 6: think we've all had.
• 17:30
  Speaker 3: Yeah, we're up on our phones on repeat for at
• 17:33
  Speaker 3: least several days at a time at some point in
• 17:36
  Speaker 3: the summer. As you can tell by the statistics, I'm
• 17:38
  Speaker 3: sure you're keeping track of all of it.
• 17:41
  Speaker 5: I do keep track. I like to check data, but
• 17:45
  Speaker 5: it doesn't interfere with my art. But I love to
• 17:48
  Speaker 5: just check where it's being streamed every time a song releases.
• 17:51
  Speaker 5: It's a good thing to know. Sure, sure.
• 17:54
  Speaker 6: Keep track of all those things for sure.
• 17:56
  Speaker 3: My man, I guess my first question to lead things off,
• 17:59
  Speaker 3: just to get things going. At what point in that
• 18:02
  Speaker 3: entire process did you know you had a hit song?
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  Speaker 5: So this is Something which I never know. I've always
• 18:12
  Speaker 5: tried to make music from the heart and tell my
• 18:15
  Speaker 5: own story, what I've been through in life, my own experiences,
• 18:19
  Speaker 5: from my friendships, relationships, everyday life. And I sprinkle the
• 18:24
  Speaker 5: script alongside so that it maintains, you know, the storyline. Yeah.
• 18:28
  Speaker 5: And also goes, you know, my aim is really simple.
• 18:33
  Speaker 5: You know, when I try to make a song, It
• 18:35
  Speaker 5: should fit into the narrative of the movie 100%. That
• 18:38
  Speaker 5: is the effort. And in spite of that, when someone
• 18:43
  Speaker 5: hears it on the radio or just streams it and
• 18:45
  Speaker 5: listens to it, it should feel like a personal story
• 18:47
  Speaker 5: as well. It should feel like to the listener, like, okay,
• 18:51
  Speaker 5: this is my song. This is my story. If that
• 18:54
  Speaker 5: is possible, then I think you have a winner. Then
• 18:56
  Speaker 5: you can say super, hate, hate, whatever you want to say.
• 19:00
  Speaker 5: If it can connect to someone on a human level,
• 19:05
  Speaker 5: the numbers and everything are just secondary then. I think
• 19:07
  Speaker 5: the song should be able to tell the story of
• 19:10
  Speaker 5: everybody in some way. Because the way we feel love,
• 19:13
  Speaker 5: the way we feel heartbreak, even the way we, you know,
• 19:16
  Speaker 5: let our hair down and enjoy, that euphoria, that excitement
• 19:20
  Speaker 5: is common. It's simple an emotion. You know, when you're happy,
• 19:26
  Speaker 5: there's only a certain way you get happy. You enjoy,
• 19:30
  Speaker 5: you dance, do your thing. And when you're sad, you
• 19:32
  Speaker 5: tear up, you get into your own shell. And you're
• 19:35
  Speaker 5: sitting alone with your thoughts. I think these are feelings
• 19:38
  Speaker 5: that I never try to run from my own feelings
• 19:42
  Speaker 5: and thoughts and emotions. So as real as I can
• 19:45
  Speaker 5: be with myself, I try to be that. And that's
• 19:48
  Speaker 5: what somehow... beautifully translates into the music and I think
• 19:52
  Speaker 5: that's why people relate to my music on a very Simple,
• 19:55
  Speaker 5: heartfelt human level. You know, the numbers keep changing, the
• 19:58
  Speaker 5: charts keep changing. But I'm here to win hearts. That's
• 20:01
  Speaker 5: about it.
• 20:02
  Speaker 6: You're doing an amazing job of it.
• 20:03
  Speaker 3: To call yourself the Shah Rukh Khan of romance in
• 20:06
  Speaker 3: one of your interviews that I heard, that's saying something.
• 20:08
  Speaker 6: And that's a.
• 20:10
  Speaker 3: Really funny comment, but I think it's something that alludes
• 20:13
  Speaker 3: to the dedication to the process that you have.
• 20:16
  Speaker 6: There's something that I picked up about you.
• 20:20
  Speaker 3: You obviously hear it to certain degrees in different artists
• 20:23
  Speaker 3: that I speak to, but with you specifically, I felt
• 20:26
  Speaker 3: that there is an extraordinary personal relationship with the music
• 20:30
  Speaker 3: that you're making. There's this kind of feeling that the
• 20:35
  Speaker 3: audience gets that You know, you are rinsing your emotions
• 20:40
  Speaker 3: onto the song. And it comes across like the product
• 20:45
  Speaker 3: that you have made there is actually a product of
• 20:49
  Speaker 3: whatever was going on in life that applied to that.
• 20:51
  Speaker 6: Song to you.
• 20:52
  Speaker 5: For sure. You got it bang on.
• 20:53
  Speaker 3: That's pretty involving. Does that get tiring ever? Do you
• 20:56
  Speaker 3: ever feel like, man, I have to dump myself into
• 20:59
  Speaker 3: this song again? Or does it, when you sit down
• 21:01
  Speaker 3: and you know the scenario, the lyrics flow? How does
• 21:04
  Speaker 3: that work for you, Amal?
• 21:07
  Speaker 5: So firstly, I'd say that, I don't know, I always
• 21:10
  Speaker 5: say I'm a very big Shah Rukh Khan fan. And
• 21:12
  Speaker 5: I know he has no relation to being a music
• 21:16
  Speaker 5: composer or producing music or anything. But that comes out
• 21:20
  Speaker 5: in my personality. When I create music, it's always larger
• 21:25
  Speaker 5: than life. It's bigger than my studio space. It's bigger
• 21:28
  Speaker 5: than me as a human being. It's the emotion of life.
• 21:33
  Speaker 5: a young musician sitting somewhere in Mumbai in a small studio,
• 21:36
  Speaker 5: since the age of 16 and just creating. So I
• 21:39
  Speaker 5: think the ability for a song to do what it's doing,
• 21:44
  Speaker 5: today Yeh Awarapan is doing it, back in the day
• 21:46
  Speaker 5: when I did Suraj Duba, I did Hero, all the
• 21:49
  Speaker 5: music from MS Dhoni, Airlift, all of this is not
• 21:53
  Speaker 5: something that I ever thought would be this big, but
• 21:56
  Speaker 5: I always thought that, you know, I've approached myself as
• 22:01
  Speaker 5: an artist that wants to do heartfelt music. Obviously, that
• 22:05
  Speaker 5: comes naturally to me. But even when I've touched upon
• 22:07
  Speaker 5: some dance tracks, whether you see Suraj Dubai or Saw Aspan,
• 22:11
  Speaker 5: or even a Kargai Chul with, you know, Abad Shah
• 22:13
  Speaker 5: and Neha and all of them. There is an utmost
• 22:19
  Speaker 5: care taken care for good melody in spite of all
• 22:22
  Speaker 5: the sound and the new age gear and everything. in
• 22:26
  Speaker 5: times of, you know, even AI and, you know, we
• 22:29
  Speaker 5: all are using them smartly learning, adapting. I still keep
• 22:33
  Speaker 5: the human element alive through my lyrics, through the melody, through,
• 22:38
  Speaker 5: you know, I even involve a lot of live musicians
• 22:40
  Speaker 5: back in India. There's so many talented musicians who are
• 22:44
  Speaker 5: like 20, 30 years older to me also who are
• 22:46
  Speaker 5: beautiful violin players or viola players and just live instrumentalists
• 22:51
  Speaker 5: who used to play in the era of maybe last
• 22:55
  Speaker 5: you could say the times of Rehman, Vishal Shekhar and
• 22:58
  Speaker 5: Preetam where they were the newcomers at one point now
• 23:01
  Speaker 5: they're legends but somewhere I think I want to keep
• 23:05
  Speaker 5: that legacy intact of keeping a fine balance of you
• 23:08
  Speaker 5: know orchestration that's happening live as well and little bit
• 23:12
  Speaker 5: electronic stuff that I produce myself so that balance I
• 23:17
  Speaker 5: think is really important and there is a larger than
• 23:20
  Speaker 5: life element in everything that I do like I work
• 23:24
  Speaker 5: on a song in a way as if it's my
• 23:25
  Speaker 5: first and last. And nothing feels bigger than that. I think,
• 23:30
  Speaker 5: I believe that, okay, this is my first film, this
• 23:32
  Speaker 5: is my first song, this is my first independent release.
• 23:35
  Speaker 5: I never believe that I've done anything good or great
• 23:39
  Speaker 5: or super hit before that. So that sincerity somewhere, I think,
• 23:44
  Speaker 5: reaches the audience, reaches the listeners. And, you know, this
• 23:49
  Speaker 5: line that you've said is stuck on. Everyone's not calling
• 23:51
  Speaker 5: me SRK of music. No, no, no.
• 23:54
  Speaker 6: It's a joke.
• 23:54
  Speaker 5: Yeah, I get it. But it's beautiful. I think I
• 23:59
  Speaker 5: was happy to say that also because not many people...
• 24:02
  Speaker 5: Not many people bare their hearts out the way on
• 24:06
  Speaker 5: the acting side that Shah Rukh Khan does. I think
• 24:08
  Speaker 5: on music, no one tells their story of where they
• 24:11
  Speaker 5: are at that current timeline in their life and gives
• 24:15
  Speaker 5: even pain such a larger than life feeling. The song
• 24:18
  Speaker 5: Yeh Aarapan comes from a very dark space, a very
• 24:20
  Speaker 5: difficult time in my life, which is, you know, two,
• 24:23
  Speaker 5: three years back when I was, you know, making melodies
• 24:28
  Speaker 5: and these kind of notes were coming through. And when
• 24:32
  Speaker 5: I wrote this song, uh, with my writer, Rashmi and Virag, uh,
• 24:36
  Speaker 5: the lyricist, it was about two years ago, much, much, uh, uh,
• 24:43
  Speaker 5: before that, you know, even released people think it must've
• 24:45
  Speaker 5: just been made 20, 30 days ago. But it's been,
• 24:49
  Speaker 5: it's been a two year journey, a two year beautiful struggle,
• 24:53
  Speaker 5: I would say, because this particular song validated me in
• 24:58
  Speaker 5: my own eyes after really long, you know, there was,
• 25:01
  Speaker 5: a 16-year-old me that would stand outside Vishesh Films, which
• 25:04
  Speaker 5: is Mukesh Bhatt and Mahesh Bhatt's office and see young directors,
• 25:09
  Speaker 5: Imran Hashmi, a lot of people walk in, walk out.
• 25:12
  Speaker 5: And I have this legacy that I wear very lightly
• 25:14
  Speaker 5: and I never like to use my surname. And I
• 25:17
  Speaker 5: come from a great legacy of music. Yes. From my
• 25:19
  Speaker 5: grandfather in 1951, my uncle in 1977. Father debuted in
• 25:21
  Speaker 5: 2001 and then Armaan and I came in 2014. That's right.
• 25:22
  Speaker 5: But there is A lot of hope that I had,
• 25:34
  Speaker 5: you know, I've had this in my heart that, okay,
• 25:36
  Speaker 5: when Vishesh Films or Mukesh Bhatt and these guys call me,
• 25:39
  Speaker 5: that's when I'll feel like, okay, I've arrived. And now
• 25:41
  Speaker 5: I actually feel after 12 years of doing music, almost
• 25:45
  Speaker 5: 143 songs later, now I feel that, okay, now I
• 25:48
  Speaker 5: have a medal on my chest which says, okay, you
• 25:51
  Speaker 5: are a composer for Vishesh Films. Because this is one
• 25:55
  Speaker 5: production house that for years and years, even today, from
• 25:59
  Speaker 5: the era of the 90s, has done impeccable music. You
• 26:03
  Speaker 5: take Aashiqui, you take any album of theirs, even Aashiqui 1,
• 26:07
  Speaker 5: Aashiqui 2, Hamari, Adhuri. So there was a dream of
• 26:10
  Speaker 5: this 16-year-old used to stand there with his keyboard and
• 26:13
  Speaker 5: be like, once this gate will open and once I
• 26:16
  Speaker 5: will go in and play a song. I never even
• 26:18
  Speaker 5: had songs. I don't know what I was thinking. I
• 26:20
  Speaker 5: just used to stand there and say, okay, pick me,
• 26:22
  Speaker 5: choose me, I can do this. Even without knowing how
• 26:24
  Speaker 5: to make a good song. But that dream took 20
• 26:28
  Speaker 5: years to realize. There are so many questions which I'd
• 26:33
  Speaker 5: like to touch upon through this that a lot of
• 26:35
  Speaker 5: people have so much to say that, you know, I
• 26:37
  Speaker 5: come from this legacy. So it's been really easy for
• 26:40
  Speaker 5: the both of us, but it's impossible. The kind of
• 26:43
  Speaker 5: music that has happened in my family, we still haven't
• 26:45
  Speaker 5: even touched one fourth of that. The kind of legacy
• 26:49
  Speaker 5: my grandfather, my dad and uncle have given the music industry.
• 26:54
  Speaker 5: We are just beginning there. But somewhere I feel, you know,
• 26:58
  Speaker 5: I never looked for validation, but this was really important
• 27:01
  Speaker 5: to me because I kept this in my heart for
• 27:03
  Speaker 5: too long. 20 years is a long time for someone,
• 27:07
  Speaker 5: you know, who people believe, okay, he must, someone must
• 27:09
  Speaker 5: have made a phone call and he must have got
• 27:11
  Speaker 5: his first film or someone must have made a phone
• 27:13
  Speaker 5: call and this must have happened for him. It's actually,
• 27:16
  Speaker 5: it's been reversed nepotism. You know, that's true. Yes. Yes.
• 27:21
  Speaker 5: nothing worked out for me because of my surname I
• 27:23
  Speaker 5: actually lost a lot of jobs as a kid at
• 27:25
  Speaker 5: that age because people knew I'm from a musical legacy
• 27:28
  Speaker 5: even studios where I was an assistant engineer they would
• 27:30
  Speaker 5: like get me out and say you know you belong
• 27:33
  Speaker 5: from a musical family other composers aren't too comfortable and
• 27:37
  Speaker 5: I understood that very early that this fight is going
• 27:40
  Speaker 5: to be a solitary one obviously I have my brother
• 27:42
  Speaker 5: in this with me he's a terrific singer and he's
• 27:44
  Speaker 5: seen my pain my journey so I think a lot
• 27:47
  Speaker 5: of setbacks a lot of heartbreaks a lot of Realization,
• 27:51
  Speaker 5: obviously through my dad's own rise and fall, my own beginning,
• 27:55
  Speaker 5: all of that has been poured, all those 20 years
• 27:57
  Speaker 5: of pain, all the 35 years of existence of this
• 28:00
  Speaker 5: man that you're talking to is in this one song.
• 28:03
  Speaker 5: And this defines my life because I live much of
• 28:07
  Speaker 5: a non-disciplined, vagabond life and I'm always here and there,
• 28:12
  Speaker 5: making music at odd hours. never on my phone it's
• 28:16
  Speaker 5: just i am this kind of person when and when
• 28:20
  Speaker 5: i was creating this song i was still having this
• 28:23
  Speaker 5: feeling in my heart that okay it's been 20 years
• 28:25
  Speaker 5: i hope i get this if this goes away i'll
• 28:27
  Speaker 5: not be able to believe in myself again that's because
• 28:29
  Speaker 5: i was really fighting i'm fighting and i'm fighting an
• 28:32
  Speaker 5: entire system on this side of not doing too many
• 28:34
  Speaker 5: remixes doing so many things that only A community should
• 28:39
  Speaker 5: be doing together but I think I'm standing alone and
• 28:41
  Speaker 5: today I'm proud that maybe I'm the first one who
• 28:44
  Speaker 5: began this as a baby. When I debuted in 2015,
• 28:48
  Speaker 5: I never knew even then that it would take still
• 28:52
  Speaker 5: 10 more years. I thought I've done Suraj Dubai, I've
• 28:54
  Speaker 5: done MS Dhoni, now these guys will call me. But
• 28:56
  Speaker 5: it never ever happened. And a lot of people, recently
• 29:00
  Speaker 5: someone asked me in an interview, sorry if I'm making
• 29:02
  Speaker 5: this long.
• 29:03
  Speaker 6: No, this is incredible. Carry on, brother. The stage is
• 29:07
  Speaker 6: all yours, my friend. Please.
• 29:08
  Speaker 5: Recently, in some interview, someone asked me that how advantages
• 29:14
  Speaker 5: or disadvantages does the surname mean for you? So I
• 29:16
  Speaker 5: was like, I don't know. I think I've lost more
• 29:18
  Speaker 5: than I've gained. Because if you see it as an
• 29:21
  Speaker 5: advantage or if you see it as like, okay, it
• 29:23
  Speaker 5: must have happened easily, then let me tell you a
• 29:26
  Speaker 5: small story because In the 50s, my grandfather has worked
• 29:30
  Speaker 5: with the father of Mukesh and Mahesh Bhatt, which is
• 29:34
  Speaker 5: Nana Bhai Bhatt. Then in the 70s and 80s, my
• 29:38
  Speaker 5: uncle has worked with both the sons of Nana Bhai Bhatt,
• 29:40
  Speaker 5: which is Mukesh and Mahesh Bhatt. Then my father got
• 29:45
  Speaker 5: to work with them in 2001. If it was that easy,
• 29:50
  Speaker 5: why did it take 20 years for a man like
• 29:52
  Speaker 5: me with good music and successful music to get this chance?
• 29:56
  Speaker 5: So I think time is the answer. And I've also
• 29:59
  Speaker 5: come to realize whatever happens, it happens in good time.
• 30:03
  Speaker 5: And in Hindi, if you have to say, you know,
• 30:06
  Speaker 5: a lot of people do listen to Hindi language songs
• 30:09
  Speaker 5: in the US. I think they would get this, that
• 30:16
  Speaker 5: before your time and before fate plays its part, I
• 30:19
  Speaker 5: don't think anyone gets anything. Maybe you can get a
• 30:22
  Speaker 5: foot in the door moment here and there. Okay. You'll,
• 30:25
  Speaker 5: Maybe people know you're this and this one's son or
• 30:28
  Speaker 5: nephew and all of that. But it's the music. I
• 30:31
  Speaker 5: think I never had a song this good. Maybe that's
• 30:34
  Speaker 5: why they didn't reach out to me. Maybe this was
• 30:37
  Speaker 5: meant to happen now. So, Yeh Awarapan, if I had
• 30:40
  Speaker 5: created in 2015, maybe I would have done it then.
• 30:44
  Speaker 5: But it came to me at an age where I
• 30:46
  Speaker 5: had managed to soak in all the feeling, all the happiness,
• 30:51
  Speaker 5: all the sadness and spin it off and create something
• 30:55
  Speaker 5: that is magical like this. It can't happen if you
• 30:58
  Speaker 5: don't go through this grind. I think 20 years is
• 31:00
  Speaker 5: a long time coming, but it's magical. If it had
• 31:04
  Speaker 5: to happen this way, I'm really grateful. It's the number
• 31:07
  Speaker 5: one song in the country. It's in global charts. It's magical.
• 31:10
  Speaker 5: I'm just too happy to be here with this song.
• 31:13
  Speaker 3: Brother, first of all, congratulations on the song. I think
• 31:16
  Speaker 3: that I wanted to thank you for sharing all of that. there,
• 31:19
  Speaker 3: there's so much deep story, personal story.
• 31:24
  Speaker 6: No, no, no, it's great.
• 31:26
  Speaker 3: I have more questions lined up, but you did answer
• 31:28
  Speaker 3: like eight of them in a really great way for me.
• 31:31
  Speaker 3: But there was something here that, and now I'm going
• 31:33
  Speaker 3: to go off script because I think that our conversation
• 31:35
  Speaker 3: has hit.
• 31:35
  Speaker 5: A, an interesting point.
• 31:39
  Speaker 6: Now it's a conversation.
• 31:41
  Speaker 3: So my, listen, I think that to your point, the, the,
• 31:45
  Speaker 3: and I'm, putting air quotes when I say nepotism. The
• 31:48
  Speaker 3: word nepotism gets you in the door in terms of
• 31:51
  Speaker 3: a meeting at the most. At some point, as we
• 31:53
  Speaker 3: say in here, in the music industry, and we all
• 31:56
  Speaker 3: say this here, your chops, your talent, and the actual music,
• 32:00
  Speaker 3: the output is what's going to get people to call you.
• 32:03
  Speaker 3: But to your point, yeah, people don't know this. The
• 32:05
  Speaker 3: nepotism only gets you the meeting at that table.
• 32:08
  Speaker 5: That's it.
• 32:08
  Speaker 6: And beyond that, it's all you.
• 32:10
  Speaker 3: And I feel that listening to your story, you, as
• 32:14
  Speaker 3: an onlooker, You almost needed this two decades of separation
• 32:19
  Speaker 3: from what was the past and the reputation and the
• 32:24
  Speaker 3: legacy of your previous generations.
• 32:28
  Speaker 6: It's a very heavy suitcase to carry with you.
• 32:31
  Speaker 3: It really is. A lot of people don't understand, as
• 32:33
  Speaker 3: you said, there are judgments made before you even sit
• 32:36
  Speaker 3: down with people, right? And so, I think that what
• 32:39
  Speaker 3: you have done is, and I would like to really
• 32:42
  Speaker 3: characterize this for the audience, is that what you have
• 32:44
  Speaker 3: done is... Probably twice as hard as what an individual
• 32:48
  Speaker 3: would probably have to do without that legacy. I know
• 32:50
  Speaker 3: that sounds weird to people, but there is this constant challenge,
• 32:54
  Speaker 3: even on a personal level that people don't get to
• 32:56
  Speaker 3: see because you're.
• 32:57
  Speaker 6: Constantly in this.
• 32:59
  Speaker 3: Fight or flight, I got to prove myself kind of
• 33:01
  Speaker 3: way where people would say, it's very.
• 33:04
  Speaker 5: Easy for people to cut you off and say, Oh,
• 33:07
  Speaker 5: this must have happened. Let me tell you, my father
• 33:11
  Speaker 5: never picked up the phone on any composer and said,
• 33:14
  Speaker 5: please try my younger son for this song.
• 33:16
  Speaker 6: That's correct.
• 33:16
  Speaker 5: And neither did he call Salman Khan who gave us
• 33:19
  Speaker 5: our first break and say, that okay you have to
• 33:21
  Speaker 5: work with my kids he never picked up the phone
• 33:24
  Speaker 5: my dad is.
• 33:25
  Speaker 6: Because he knew the business it doesn't depend on that.
• 33:28
  Speaker 5: Yeah he saw he saw his side of success and
• 33:32
  Speaker 5: he saw majority of lows because he himself is i
• 33:36
  Speaker 5: call him my winnie the pooh he's a cutie and
• 33:39
  Speaker 5: he is not political at all and he didn't know
• 33:42
  Speaker 5: how to navigate his way through this really rigid and
• 33:45
  Speaker 5: difficult industry And I saw him bear the brunt of
• 33:48
  Speaker 5: being such a big superstar composer's younger brother. So this
• 33:51
  Speaker 5: industry works in a very, even forget nepotism, it works
• 33:55
  Speaker 5: on groupism or campism or likability. It works on who
• 33:59
  Speaker 5: people are comfortable working with. People feel my stars align
• 34:02
  Speaker 5: with a so-and-so actor or a singer. Some actors are
• 34:06
  Speaker 5: very specific. Okay, they want this particular singer only. They
• 34:09
  Speaker 5: feel lucky about him. There are many such things within, obviously,
• 34:12
  Speaker 5: Indian setups and mindsets Which the film industry also follows.
• 34:16
  Speaker 5: So it's never been easy for my dad himself. He
• 34:19
  Speaker 5: could never take advantage of being a Malik.
• 34:22
  Speaker 3: And.
• 34:23
  Speaker 5: The only thing that today is that the narrative somehow,
• 34:25
  Speaker 5: because of our good work and Armaan's good voices, managed
• 34:29
  Speaker 5: to make it from Anu Malik's nephews to Amal Armaan's uncle.
• 34:32
  Speaker 5: So that's life. And I think we are just trying
• 34:36
  Speaker 5: to take the legacy forward of Sardar Malikji, like what
• 34:39
  Speaker 5: Anu uncle did for his father, we are doing for
• 34:42
  Speaker 5: our dad. And I think that's all that matters to us.
• 34:45
  Speaker 5: You know, people will keep saying something or the other.
• 34:48
  Speaker 5: I used to always fight. I still do stand up
• 34:50
  Speaker 5: for the artist community. But now when people say, okay,
• 34:53
  Speaker 5: get a product of nepotism. My brother stood with, my
• 34:58
  Speaker 5: mom just figured out from dad, just location advantage you
• 35:02
  Speaker 5: can have because you're in Mumbai city, you're in India,
• 35:05
  Speaker 5: you know where the offices are, you know where certain
• 35:07
  Speaker 5: stars live or shoot. But my younger brother with his
• 35:10
  Speaker 5: debut album, went and stood outside a van of a
• 35:15
  Speaker 5: superstar called Salman Khan, sir, and waited for seven, eight
• 35:18
  Speaker 5: hours for him to come out And then he played
• 35:21
  Speaker 5: him some songs and he liked the production, liked the music.
• 35:24
  Speaker 5: This is back in 2012 or 13. And then two
• 35:28
  Speaker 5: songs from there randomly. I was working on Cocktail with
• 35:30
  Speaker 5: Salim Suleiman as an assistant, doing songs for other composers
• 35:34
  Speaker 5: as a music producer. I was not even ready. In
• 35:37
  Speaker 5: my head, I was going to debut at 35, 36
• 35:39
  Speaker 5: because I was like, I don't know shit about making
• 35:41
  Speaker 5: a good song yet. I know only how to produce
• 35:44
  Speaker 5: music for those and they are making the song and
• 35:46
  Speaker 5: I'm making the beat and the environment. I was not
• 35:48
  Speaker 5: looking to debut. It was Salman Khan who heard the
• 35:51
  Speaker 5: songs and asked my younger brother, okay, who's the guy
• 35:54
  Speaker 5: who's made the music? So he said, it's my brother.
• 35:56
  Speaker 5: He's like, where is he? He's like, he's working in
• 35:58
  Speaker 5: Salim Suleiman's studio right now. And he then called me
• 36:02
  Speaker 5: and said, okay, let's take this for this movie. So
• 36:05
  Speaker 5: there was nothing planned. And that foot in the door,
• 36:09
  Speaker 5: you know, I want people to realize the statement that
• 36:12
  Speaker 5: I'm just going to make that there is no problem.
• 36:16
  Speaker 5: Everyone in the world recommends someone or the other. Nepotism
• 36:20
  Speaker 5: is an easy word that some newcomer can use and say, okay,
• 36:23
  Speaker 5: I didn't get this. But if nepotism really works, this
• 36:27
  Speaker 5: music industry has given so many people at an opportunity
• 36:31
  Speaker 5: who are not even remotely related to this place. You
• 36:34
  Speaker 5: can see a Jubin Naughty, I'll come through, do stupendously well.
• 36:37
  Speaker 5: You can see an Arijit Singh who's not from here,
• 36:40
  Speaker 5: who's not any star kid or any musician family. That's right.
• 36:42
  Speaker 5: There is Vishal Mishra. There is, there are many of
• 36:46
  Speaker 5: us like Shreya Ghoshal who have come in from reality shows.
• 36:49
  Speaker 5: My own brother being from a musical family went on
• 36:51
  Speaker 5: Saregam of our little champs and tried his luck there.
• 36:55
  Speaker 5: And when he was, Removed from that show, obviously, due
• 36:58
  Speaker 5: to whatever reason, judgment, you know, judges decide that. A
• 37:01
  Speaker 5: statement was made that you belong from a musical heritage
• 37:05
  Speaker 5: and a legacy. You'll have many chances later, so we
• 37:07
  Speaker 5: cannot take you ahead from here. You know how much
• 37:09
  Speaker 5: that hurts a nine-year-old kid? Do you know how much
• 37:12
  Speaker 5: it matters to him that he was not judged on
• 37:14
  Speaker 5: his talent but on just a surname? That's right. So,
• 37:17
  Speaker 5: we have had a very difficult fight. And I'm not
• 37:19
  Speaker 5: taking away from a newcomer. Anyone, but I think when
• 37:23
  Speaker 5: it's written, when it's time and you're prepared, I think
• 37:27
  Speaker 5: all three things matter. And that's how you get an
• 37:29
  Speaker 5: opportunity and that's how you get that one shot. And
• 37:31
  Speaker 5: I got that shot, no doubt. But I failed. I
• 37:34
  Speaker 5: didn't deliver in Jai Ho maybe. And I did some
• 37:36
  Speaker 5: different electronic music and I didn't know what was working.
• 37:40
  Speaker 5: No idea at all. Whatever Salman Khan sir felt in
• 37:43
  Speaker 5: his gut, he took those two songs, I produced it,
• 37:45
  Speaker 5: released it. the film tanked the music tanked and we
• 37:48
  Speaker 5: were back to square one and even lesser yeah and
• 37:51
  Speaker 5: no one would know that in 2014 we were losing
• 37:54
  Speaker 5: our house we lost all our cars we lost like
• 37:56
  Speaker 5: there was just two but we lost everything yeah and
• 37:59
  Speaker 5: nine months later and somewhere in between came songs like
• 38:02
  Speaker 5: Naina from Surat and Suraj Dubai which changed everything for
• 38:06
  Speaker 5: me that is my star song so if you feel
• 38:09
  Speaker 5: that A debut with such a big superstar could have changed.
• 38:13
  Speaker 5: It should have changed. What could go wrong? Salman Khan
• 38:16
  Speaker 5: is launching you. You don't need anything. That's what people think.
• 38:19
  Speaker 5: But I utterly failed. And I didn't deliver maybe to
• 38:23
  Speaker 5: what his audience likes or what people like. I didn't
• 38:25
  Speaker 5: know the pulse of the people. And from there, I
• 38:29
  Speaker 5: picked myself up. And it was difficult. I almost quit music.
• 38:33
  Speaker 5: I went back to studying economics and MCOM and all
• 38:38
  Speaker 5: of that. I had books with me when I used
• 38:40
  Speaker 5: to go and stand outside a T-series or a Vichesh film.
• 38:44
  Speaker 5: And I even went back to Salim Sir and I
• 38:46
  Speaker 5: went back to other composers and said, you know, I
• 38:48
  Speaker 5: need a job and I want to be an assistant
• 38:50
  Speaker 5: again because nothing is working out for me. And there
• 38:53
  Speaker 5: were newspapers. I had no PR. I had no understanding
• 38:56
  Speaker 5: of these things. And they were writing me off in
• 38:58
  Speaker 5: just two songs. One song, they were like, not a
• 39:01
  Speaker 5: chip of the old block. Can't make music like border refugee,
• 39:04
  Speaker 5: which are my uncle's goals or a little love like
• 39:07
  Speaker 5: the father. So I was done. And I called up
• 39:11
  Speaker 5: my mom's sister, my aunt in New Zealand. And I
• 39:14
  Speaker 5: told her, I said, I'd come work in a McDonald's there.
• 39:18
  Speaker 5: I'll work in a petrol station, but I don't want
• 39:21
  Speaker 5: to do this nonsense. Yeah, I've said this quite a
• 39:23
  Speaker 5: few times.
• 39:24
  Speaker 6: No, but this is like, it's so important.
• 39:26
  Speaker 5: It's something the US audience may have never heard. They
• 39:28
  Speaker 5: need to know.
• 39:29
  Speaker 6: Please tell us.
• 39:30
  Speaker 5: Yes. So they should know that this kid had already
• 39:33
  Speaker 5: gone back to being a, nothing that I looked down upon.
• 39:37
  Speaker 5: I was ready to do it. And a job is
• 39:39
  Speaker 5: a job. I was like, I don't want to do music.
• 39:41
  Speaker 5: These guys are writing me off without even knowing what
• 39:43
  Speaker 5: I'm capable of. So why even try? Because everywhere I'm trying,
• 39:48
  Speaker 5: People were just not giving an opportunity. The doors were
• 39:50
  Speaker 5: not opening. Media was writing you off. Every news channel
• 39:54
  Speaker 5: was saying, okay, not a chip of the old block,
• 39:56
  Speaker 5: not a chip of the old block. How do you
• 39:57
  Speaker 5: deal with that? It can break you. And it did
• 40:00
  Speaker 5: break me. And I, I am a rebel like that.
• 40:04
  Speaker 5: And I, until today, I never gave interviews to those portals.
• 40:07
  Speaker 5: I've always been like, you guys wrote me off when
• 40:09
  Speaker 5: I was a baby. Sure. It's going to take me
• 40:12
  Speaker 5: 30 years to forgive that. Yeah. But, you know, these
• 40:15
  Speaker 5: things affect the musician. These things destroy a young musician's mind.
• 40:20
  Speaker 5: A lot of media in India is not quite careful
• 40:22
  Speaker 5: or maybe globally also, they're not careful of what can
• 40:25
  Speaker 5: happen to a pure artist, someone who feels so much,
• 40:28
  Speaker 5: wants to do so much for the scene, wants to
• 40:30
  Speaker 5: change up a few things. So they broke me. But
• 40:33
  Speaker 5: I think from within those cracks came the music. And
• 40:38
  Speaker 5: the determination comes from the journey of my father. And,
• 40:42
  Speaker 5: you know, if you see... What I believe, if I
• 40:45
  Speaker 5: had a terrifically pathetic singer at home, which I don't,
• 40:49
  Speaker 5: I have a superstar in my brother.
• 40:50
  Speaker 6: That's right.
• 40:51
  Speaker 5: And I have an amazing singer who's managed to do
• 40:54
  Speaker 5: Vishara at the age of 14. That takes talent. That
• 40:58
  Speaker 5: takes hard work. If I'm giving him an opportunity, it
• 41:01
  Speaker 5: never comes to him also on a plate. If he
• 41:04
  Speaker 5: had sung songs like Sochna Sakhe, which is... That song
• 41:07
  Speaker 5: was Armaan. before it became Arijit. Wow. There is a
• 41:16
  Speaker 5: song called Chal Vaha Jaate Hai, which is an independent release,
• 41:21
  Speaker 5: which featured Tiger Shroff and Kiriti Sanen. Armaan had sung it.
• 41:25
  Speaker 5: It went to Arijit again. Because for me, the texture,
• 41:28
  Speaker 5: the voice, the song, is very important. No singer is important.
• 41:32
  Speaker 5: No actor is also important for me. Obviously, there are
• 41:34
  Speaker 5: dreams to work with stars like Shah Rukh Khan and
• 41:37
  Speaker 5: all of those things for every young music director in
• 41:39
  Speaker 5: that time. Today, Bollywood is not the only game. But
• 41:43
  Speaker 5: when I entered, it was the only game in town.
• 41:44
  Speaker 6: That's right.
• 41:45
  Speaker 5: But there was nothing in my mind, only the song.
• 41:48
  Speaker 5: If the song needs this, a particular singer, that's the
• 41:52
  Speaker 5: one that's going to come. And I work hard with
• 41:54
  Speaker 5: each one of them. Even with a senior singer like
• 41:56
  Speaker 5: Sonu Nigam, he also respects me on a beautiful level
• 42:00
  Speaker 5: yeah you know we did a recreation of married whole
• 42:03
  Speaker 5: life you've heard so he also understands the passion i
• 42:08
  Speaker 5: come with even he works hard with me so i
• 42:11
  Speaker 5: leave no one and imagine if i have if i'm
• 42:15
  Speaker 5: working with legends like sonu nigam kk so i really
• 42:19
  Speaker 5: go through an extreme grinding process with an arijit and
• 42:22
  Speaker 5: an arman because they are brothers they Armaan is literally
• 42:25
  Speaker 5: my brother and Arijit is a brother from another mother.
• 42:28
  Speaker 5: And we have worked very closely. Most of my romantic
• 42:31
  Speaker 5: catalogue of music, if you see 50% of it is
• 42:34
  Speaker 5: sung by both of them. The rest of it is
• 42:37
  Speaker 5: KK or Sonuji or Vishal Dadlani and others. So they
• 42:41
  Speaker 5: have also earned those songs. It's never been like, okay,
• 42:44
  Speaker 5: Arijit is the numero one singer, let's give it to
• 42:46
  Speaker 5: him and it'll work. It never works like that for me.
• 42:49
  Speaker 5: It may have worked sometimes for some songs, but the
• 42:52
  Speaker 5: intent was never to bring this particular artist to make
• 42:55
  Speaker 5: the song work. The song should first work. Tonally, the
• 42:58
  Speaker 5: singer should be able to do what I need for
• 43:00
  Speaker 5: the song and then they get the song. So no
• 43:02
  Speaker 5: one's getting a free lunch from me on my song
• 43:04
  Speaker 5: because I've lived it, breathed it. Every particle of my
• 43:08
  Speaker 5: soul has made that piece of music. So even my brother,
• 43:11
  Speaker 5: poor guy sitting at home doesn't get the song just
• 43:13
  Speaker 5: sitting at home. He's gone through insane number of recordings
• 43:17
  Speaker 5: and sessions with me to earn that one single song
• 43:20
  Speaker 5: and he has 30-40 with me. So, I don't understand
• 43:23
  Speaker 5: when people even tell him and now we laugh about it.
• 43:25
  Speaker 5: You know, sometimes people tell him, oh, you must have
• 43:27
  Speaker 5: got a song so easily from your brother, he's a composer.
• 43:30
  Speaker 5: Some people tell me, oh, your song's working because he's
• 43:32
  Speaker 5: the numero, you know, singer in the new lot, in
• 43:35
  Speaker 5: the youngsters. So, these things, these debates, these accusations will
• 43:39
  Speaker 5: keep happening. And I think the music speaks louder. I
• 43:43
  Speaker 5: also speak as loud as the music sometimes because I
• 43:47
  Speaker 5: am the front of this family. I don't like anyone
• 43:49
  Speaker 5: saying anything to my brother because I know the talent
• 43:51
  Speaker 5: he holds today. Today, everyone may collaborate with foreign musicians
• 43:57
  Speaker 5: from India. But if you hear the boy sing in English,
• 44:00
  Speaker 5: you can't figure out if that's an English pop singer from...
• 44:04
  Speaker 5: London or like he's from New York. His accent is
• 44:08
  Speaker 5: so on point. But when he sings Hindi, you can't
• 44:10
  Speaker 5: believe it's the same guy. That's right. And he stood
• 44:13
  Speaker 5: tall without me. Obviously, my music has been a building
• 44:16
  Speaker 5: platform for him to stand and take himself to the world.
• 44:19
  Speaker 5: But someone like Ed Sheeran or someone like, you know,
• 44:23
  Speaker 5: The Weeknd and Taylor Swift and he's sitting there with
• 44:26
  Speaker 5: all these guys with Post Malone and all. How? On
• 44:28
  Speaker 5: his own legacy, on his own accord and his own talent.
• 44:31
  Speaker 5: So it's not like we took him and put him there.
• 44:34
  Speaker 5: That's his own journey. In India, obviously the music helped,
• 44:37
  Speaker 5: but he has earned every song. I have put my
• 44:40
  Speaker 5: heart out on the table every time to grab a
• 44:42
  Speaker 5: project somehow.
• 44:43
  Speaker 6: It's not that easy, for sure.
• 44:45
  Speaker 5: It's the same. It's the same for everyone. It's a
• 44:48
  Speaker 5: little more difficult for someone who's not from the city,
• 44:51
  Speaker 5: who doesn't understand from, you know, where to meet, what
• 44:54
  Speaker 5: to do. That advantage you can have. But there are
• 44:57
  Speaker 5: so many talented kids of unknown musicians who are getting
• 45:02
  Speaker 5: a chance in this place. And there are so many
• 45:04
  Speaker 5: musicians who may be talented coming from a legacy who
• 45:06
  Speaker 5: have still not gotten a chance. So the music speaks.
• 45:09
  Speaker 5: If today I choose to work with Armaan and if
• 45:14
  Speaker 5: he was not a good singer and I'm taking... away
• 45:17
  Speaker 5: the opportunity from a singer who's credible, who's incredible as
• 45:20
  Speaker 5: a singer and giving it to someone who doesn't deserve it.
• 45:23
  Speaker 5: That's where nepotism goes wrong. What is the problem if
• 45:26
  Speaker 5: I give my brother a song and he deserves it?
• 45:28
  Speaker 3: People forget that there's so many other eyes and ears
• 45:32
  Speaker 3: on the situation. So you just can't necessarily just slide
• 45:35
  Speaker 3: your brother into anything without anybody noticing.
• 45:37
  Speaker 5: The song doesn't even come to me easily. Even I'm
• 45:39
  Speaker 5: not signed up to the movie till the last minute.
• 45:42
  Speaker 5: Which is something that I'm trying to change now after
• 45:44
  Speaker 5: our upon reaching such a big position. But we as
• 45:48
  Speaker 5: composers today on the Hindi side are not on the
• 45:51
  Speaker 5: level and respect and love as the South Indian film industry.
• 45:54
  Speaker 6: That's right.
• 45:56
  Speaker 5: They're given the keys. Right. Now, we all are together
• 46:00
  Speaker 5: in Indian film industry because after the lockdown, COVID and
• 46:03
  Speaker 5: the whole mixing and churning of, you know, a Pushpa
• 46:07
  Speaker 5: has worked or a KGF has worked or a Bahubali
• 46:09
  Speaker 5: has worked. We're all one industry. But still, there is
• 46:12
  Speaker 5: a very big difference in the way music directors are
• 46:15
  Speaker 5: treated here and they're treated there. I don't get to
• 46:18
  Speaker 5: choose my singer alone. A label is involved, a director
• 46:21
  Speaker 5: is involved, a choreographer decides whether the music should be
• 46:25
  Speaker 5: a certain way. There are actors, there are actors, teams,
• 46:28
  Speaker 5: there are so many layers of supervisors. So it's not
• 46:32
  Speaker 5: that Armaan got a song easily. I didn't even get
• 46:35
  Speaker 5: that film easily. So, you know, these conversations are really
• 46:39
  Speaker 5: important to have for them to know that we guys
• 46:43
  Speaker 5: are here to do music, whatever you say, whatever you feel.
• 46:46
  Speaker 5: At the end of the day, we're doing God's work
• 46:48
  Speaker 5: and music is not easy to come through. And doing
• 46:52
  Speaker 5: original music is really difficult. Today, no one can tell
• 46:56
  Speaker 5: Armaan or Amal Malik that, okay, you picked up someone's
• 46:58
  Speaker 5: song or you stole someone's idea or you did something
• 47:01
  Speaker 5: wrong to a new artist and took it for yourself.
• 47:04
  Speaker 5: We don't work like that. We're very kind-hearted. We're very simple.
• 47:08
  Speaker 5: But somewhere, because I'm the elder one, I always stand
• 47:11
  Speaker 5: as the rock of Gibraltar.
• 47:13
  Speaker 6: That's right. You have to.
• 47:15
  Speaker 5: I don't let anyone mess with them. That's all.
• 47:17
  Speaker 6: Amal, I wanted to talk about the, and you just
• 47:20
  Speaker 6: touched on this.
• 47:21
  Speaker 3: My next question has to do with the creative element.
• 47:25
  Speaker 3: I was listening to Harvey Mason Jr., who is the
• 47:30
  Speaker 3: CEO of the Recording Academy. And he said something very
• 47:33
  Speaker 3: interesting out there. He said that I am now seldom
• 47:37
  Speaker 3: in a recording studio in a recording session where AI
• 47:40
  Speaker 3: is not being used. He says that it's happening in
• 47:44
  Speaker 3: every session in some sort of way everywhere.
• 47:47
  Speaker 5: Okay. Yeah.
• 47:49
  Speaker 6: My question to you.
• 47:50
  Speaker 5: Harvey Mason's the drummer, right?
• 47:52
  Speaker 3: His father was the drummer. Harvey Mason Jr. is the
• 47:56
  Speaker 3: music producer, right?
• 47:57
  Speaker 6: His son.
• 47:57
  Speaker 5: Okay, he's the junior. He's the younger. He's the son.
• 48:00
  Speaker 5: That's right. He's the legendary drummer's son.
• 48:02
  Speaker 6: That's right.
• 48:02
  Speaker 3: And he's a legendary music producer in his own right.
• 48:05
  Speaker 3: Many Grammys and all kinds of amazing accolades. And of course,
• 48:08
  Speaker 3: now he runs the Recording Academy. And so he's very
• 48:12
  Speaker 3: plugged into the artist community as probably as much as
• 48:15
  Speaker 3: anyone out there. His observation was that AI is being used,
• 48:20
  Speaker 3: albeit very strategically, in these studios on an everyday level.
• 48:25
  Speaker 3: My question to you is, as a composer, writer, as
• 48:30
  Speaker 3: someone that is so deeply entrenched in what I would
• 48:34
  Speaker 3: consider the root of the song, What kind of effect
• 48:38
  Speaker 3: has AI had on you? And then my second part
• 48:41
  Speaker 3: of this question is, what is AI not able to
• 48:44
  Speaker 3: do that Amal Malik is able to do right now?
• 48:51
  Speaker 5: Actually, AI is still learning from me. I think it's
• 48:55
  Speaker 5: AI versus AM.
• 48:57
  Speaker 6: That's right.
• 48:57
  Speaker 5: There's nothing that I can't do that AI can do yet.
• 49:02
  Speaker 5: It's just I'll take five minutes for AI. It may
• 49:04
  Speaker 5: take about five hours for me. That's about it. So
• 49:08
  Speaker 5: it's about the patience level of the producers, whether it's
• 49:11
  Speaker 5: on the film side or the label. It's actually helpful
• 49:14
  Speaker 5: also because if you want to quickly put down an idea, see,
• 49:16
  Speaker 5: I'll tell you, if you can explain your emotion to
• 49:21
  Speaker 5: this AI world which is Suno and 11 labs and
• 49:26
  Speaker 5: all these things that people use if you can write
• 49:30
  Speaker 5: the right prompt and express yourself it will give you
• 49:32
  Speaker 5: back what you need but there is a certain finesse
• 49:35
  Speaker 5: that the human element brings the number of human hours
• 49:39
  Speaker 5: that go into mixing mastering recording every instrument or even
• 49:44
  Speaker 5: producing it on your own on just a you know
• 49:47
  Speaker 5: software and contact and libraries and DAWs and all of
• 49:50
  Speaker 5: those so it is just the time so people are
• 49:56
  Speaker 5: obviously impatient it's an impatient world AI would not be
• 49:59
  Speaker 5: here if we weren't impatient right it It's something to
• 50:03
  Speaker 5: help you calm down, maybe just get things done quickly and,
• 50:07
  Speaker 5: you know, present something. So, I don't think it's wrong
• 50:09
  Speaker 5: sometimes because people are like completely blacklisting it and saying, oh,
• 50:13
  Speaker 5: it's taking away this. Yes, I understand if you start
• 50:16
  Speaker 5: giving royalties to something that's completely AI designed, then that
• 50:19
  Speaker 5: gets somewhere unfair to the human side of people. You know,
• 50:23
  Speaker 5: because the kind of heart and pain that if you
• 50:26
  Speaker 5: just take Yabarapan, Can you tell the software to go
• 50:28
  Speaker 5: through 35 years of pain and understand what I went through?
• 50:32
  Speaker 5: I doubt it can. Can it understand what a first
• 50:35
  Speaker 5: breakup feels like? Can it understand what a father's journey
• 50:38
  Speaker 5: and his highs and lows and how that suffering built you?
• 50:42
  Speaker 5: Can it understand that you have to build a world
• 50:44
  Speaker 5: from scratch in spite of coming from such a big legacy?
• 50:46
  Speaker 5: It cannot. So how will those thousand, million, zillion emotions
• 50:51
  Speaker 5: be put there? Obviously, if you can express them how
• 50:55
  Speaker 5: I do, then maybe AI can understand certain things. But
• 50:58
  Speaker 5: it cannot straight up understand the emotion a heart has
• 51:02
  Speaker 5: felt all these years. Any musician is better than AI.
• 51:05
  Speaker 5: But there are limitations within the musician also. Sometimes someone
• 51:11
  Speaker 5: is just a guitarist but he wants to play the
• 51:14
  Speaker 5: EP or wants the keys to be played. So why
• 51:16
  Speaker 5: can't he use AI and get a section of his
• 51:20
  Speaker 5: song played by AI and it's fine and I think
• 51:24
  Speaker 5: labels are in on this and they're just figuring out
• 51:27
  Speaker 5: what the royalty structure would be which is very bleak
• 51:29
  Speaker 5: as we say in India still but globally it's a
• 51:32
  Speaker 5: big problem because They don't know how to pay out.
• 51:35
  Speaker 6: That's right.
• 51:36
  Speaker 5: They don't know what DSPs are going to do. What
• 51:37
  Speaker 5: will a Spotify or an Apple... How will you pay
• 51:40
  Speaker 5: back to a label if they do not tag it
• 51:42
  Speaker 5: as maybe AI or AI-assisted or completely AI? There are
• 51:47
  Speaker 5: some AI artists and musicians that I listen to and
• 51:51
  Speaker 5: I like their work because it sounds finesse. Because I
• 51:55
  Speaker 5: can hear that once they prompted and got those structures
• 51:57
  Speaker 5: and stems out from the software, they worked hard on
• 52:00
  Speaker 5: it again. You can hear the difference between AI and... Yes. Obviously,
• 52:05
  Speaker 5: there'll be a time in the next two, three years
• 52:06
  Speaker 5: that you'll not be able to hear it. Right now,
• 52:09
  Speaker 5: we are at a point that musicians can hear it.
• 52:11
  Speaker 5: Audience too can hear it somewhere because there are artifacts
• 52:14
  Speaker 5: and sibilance in the voice or the beats. It sounds like, okay,
• 52:17
  Speaker 5: this sounds quite auto-generated. But there'll be a time maybe
• 52:21
  Speaker 5: you can't also. But the importance is that Why do
• 52:26
  Speaker 5: you get afraid of this? Someone like Lucian Green just
• 52:29
  Speaker 5: said that I'm not afraid of AI, right? He's the
• 52:32
  Speaker 5: head of universal music. He says there were so many
• 52:35
  Speaker 5: things that have come into this world long back. There
• 52:38
  Speaker 5: was like LimeWire. There was like illegal downloads. There were
• 52:42
  Speaker 5: thousand things happening. Music has been sadly a thing that
• 52:47
  Speaker 5: people never wanted to pay for, you know, even in
• 52:49
  Speaker 5: the West at some point. It was something like, oh,
• 52:51
  Speaker 5: you just play guitar. That's fine. Just play me something.
• 52:54
  Speaker 5: The understanding what an artist does is now going to
• 52:58
  Speaker 5: become more valuable because the more AI comes, the more
• 53:01
  Speaker 5: people will yearn for a true heart. They'll yearn for
• 53:04
  Speaker 5: truer words, truer emotions. They will start looking for music
• 53:07
  Speaker 5: which is human. And that time will come when you
• 53:11
  Speaker 5: will be like, damn, I need to hear something human, man.
• 53:13
  Speaker 5: What the hell is this?
• 53:13
  Speaker 6: Some natural dissonance, you know, something.
• 53:16
  Speaker 5: Right. Yes. It's like when you see CGI from 20
• 53:21
  Speaker 5: years ago in MI2, and then you see it in MI8,
• 53:25
  Speaker 5: you will now spot the difference because your eyes got
• 53:28
  Speaker 5: used to the CGI developing and improving. You can see
• 53:32
  Speaker 5: Transformers 1 and Transformers 3, Dark of the Moon. You'll
• 53:35
  Speaker 5: be like, wow, one had certain things. I can now
• 53:38
  Speaker 5: figure that Bumblebee looked like AI or looked like too
• 53:41
  Speaker 5: much CGI. But now he looks more realer. So it's
• 53:45
  Speaker 5: an advancement. The human mind is only teaching it. Now,
• 53:49
  Speaker 5: if you leave it outside music, I don't know. It's
• 53:51
  Speaker 5: chaotic when you let it lose and it's going crazy.
• 53:54
  Speaker 5: It's learning its own algorithm.
• 53:56
  Speaker 6: It might kill us. You let it out of the studio.
• 53:59
  Speaker 5: It's coming into the minds of robots. Different AIs are
• 54:03
  Speaker 5: conversing with each other. Those things I'm not too educated
• 54:06
  Speaker 5: about to see. But when I see music being like today,
• 54:10
  Speaker 5: I use mixing mastering on AI, even though an engineer
• 54:14
  Speaker 5: worked with me and everything in Awarapan is completely human.
• 54:17
  Speaker 5: There are times when I put my mix into an
• 54:19
  Speaker 5: AI software and say, come on, show me what you got.
• 54:22
  Speaker 5: And it sends me something back. Sometimes it's shit. Sometimes
• 54:25
  Speaker 5: it's terrific. So when it's terrific, I put it back
• 54:28
  Speaker 5: into my session and see. Like, okay, what are you doing? So,
• 54:31
  Speaker 5: I'm relearning back from the AI. So, the AI is
• 54:35
  Speaker 5: helping AM also improve. Amal Malik is improving through AI
• 54:38
  Speaker 5: as well. So, I'm also ready to beat it. I
• 54:42
  Speaker 5: think it's only about the patience and the manners that
• 54:45
  Speaker 5: take for a song to happen. See, magic in a
• 54:48
  Speaker 5: melody or a lyric happen in five seconds, in five minutes.
• 54:51
  Speaker 5: But the effort can go on for hours, for months,
• 54:54
  Speaker 5: for years. You have no idea how much pain and
• 54:58
  Speaker 5: thoughts and How much level of hard work and how
• 55:01
  Speaker 5: many musicians, not just me, my music producers along with me,
• 55:04
  Speaker 5: my mixing engineer, the live instruments, we have all put
• 55:07
  Speaker 5: in two years of work to create this and now
• 55:10
  Speaker 5: it's getting its due. But does an AI song that
• 55:14
  Speaker 5: come and does the same numbers affect me? Maybe not.
• 55:18
  Speaker 5: If it's good on a melody, good on a lyrics
• 55:20
  Speaker 5: and as long as the public enjoys it, they enjoy it.
• 55:23
  Speaker 5: You cannot tell the audience what to like. You cannot
• 55:25
  Speaker 5: tell the audience, okay, don't listen to AI. If they
• 55:28
  Speaker 5: like it, they like it. If they like a certain song,
• 55:31
  Speaker 5: you cannot tell them, okay, this is AI and I
• 55:33
  Speaker 5: don't want you to hear it. That's not, if you
• 55:35
  Speaker 5: are a better musician than the AI, then tell the
• 55:38
  Speaker 5: AI to bring it on. Come face me, I'm better
• 55:40
  Speaker 5: than you. You should have that. If that attitude is there,
• 55:44
  Speaker 5: it's great. And I think even people who are not musicians,
• 55:47
  Speaker 5: I would like to say my certain friends who are directors,
• 55:50
  Speaker 5: who are doing ad films, who are doing short films,
• 55:53
  Speaker 5: they have such stringent budgets that they cannot even afford
• 55:56
  Speaker 5: sometimes a musician to come and do something. So why
• 55:59
  Speaker 5: can't someone who's completely shot his film in like pittance
• 56:03
  Speaker 5: can just go to an AI company or an AI
• 56:05
  Speaker 5: software and say, this is my picture, this is the footage,
• 56:08
  Speaker 5: and this is the kind of score I'm looking at.
• 56:10
  Speaker 5: So his job becomes easier, right? So what is the problem?
• 56:14
  Speaker 5: If it's easing someone's job, it's fine. I know it
• 56:17
  Speaker 5: takes away a lot of people's job as well. But
• 56:19
  Speaker 5: if you keep improving, you keep learning from the software again,
• 56:22
  Speaker 5: you'll keep beating it time and again. I don't think
• 56:26
  Speaker 5: As long as a human being can express, we still
• 56:28
  Speaker 5: got to prompt it, right? It's not like I can
• 56:30
  Speaker 5: play it on audio or send it a copyrighted piece
• 56:32
  Speaker 5: of music and say, okay, make me an Amal Malik
• 56:34
  Speaker 5: song from this Amal Malik song or make me a
• 56:37
  Speaker 5: Rehman song from this Rehman song. Right now, that's not happening.
• 56:41
  Speaker 5: And when that does happen, I hope that copyrights will
• 56:44
  Speaker 5: be maintained and people's IPs will be maintained. You cannot take...
• 56:48
  Speaker 5: If I tell a software today, make Drake meet Rehman
• 56:50
  Speaker 5: meet Amal Malik, the engine will blast. They'll be like, boss,
• 56:55
  Speaker 5: we cannot do that. We don't know how to do this.
• 57:01
  Speaker 5: I will be like, I gave up. That's what it
• 57:04
  Speaker 5: will send you back.
• 57:05
  Speaker 6: It would have consumed all this.
• 57:07
  Speaker 3: It would have consumed all this water or whatever they
• 57:09
  Speaker 3: say that machines are using.
• 57:11
  Speaker 6: Uh, that's so funny.
• 57:13
  Speaker 5: But sometimes now when I've done an AI, AI indulging,
• 57:17
  Speaker 5: like there were times when some producer of mine wanted
• 57:19
  Speaker 5: to immediately shoot something. So I prompted because I was sick.
• 57:24
  Speaker 5: Now you can understand. I was not well. I was hospitalized.
• 57:27
  Speaker 5: And I had to send a song for shooting for
• 57:29
  Speaker 5: a movie. So I told my brother to completely sing it,
• 57:32
  Speaker 5: play the guitars, and just send me a vocal and
• 57:34
  Speaker 5: a guitar line. And then I put it into the
• 57:36
  Speaker 5: software and... Because I was able to prompt so expressively
• 57:40
  Speaker 5: and define, I could bring it close to my heart
• 57:43
  Speaker 5: and express to the software what I really want. It
• 57:46
  Speaker 5: gave me four, five options. I liked two of them.
• 57:49
  Speaker 5: I built on them in the hospital on a laptop
• 57:52
  Speaker 5: and I made my own version and sent it. Now
• 57:54
  Speaker 5: when it comes back from shooting, I will replace all
• 57:57
  Speaker 5: of those instruments with live musicians. So the guitar parts
• 58:00
  Speaker 5: that the AI has played, I'll delete it and get
• 58:02
  Speaker 5: someone to play it. So it's at least helping me ideate.
• 58:05
  Speaker 5: It's not wasting time for an actor who's waiting on set.
• 58:08
  Speaker 5: Suddenly music in our industry works at the 11th hour.
• 58:12
  Speaker 5: There are songs being changed in a night. That's right.
• 58:14
  Speaker 5: That's right. These things may help musicians. Why not? If
• 58:17
  Speaker 5: you're going to be intimidated by it, then you're always
• 58:20
  Speaker 5: going to be intimidated by new stuff.
• 58:22
  Speaker 6: I agree, Amal. I certainly agree. And in this world
• 58:25
  Speaker 6: of change, you definitely have to adapt.
• 58:28
  Speaker 3: And I think that AI is certainly a tool that,
• 58:30
  Speaker 3: as I mentioned to you, we're seeing a lot more
• 58:32
  Speaker 3: out there. And so really curious to get your thoughts
• 58:35
  Speaker 3: on that. And folks, what we're going to do here
• 58:38
  Speaker 3: is we'll end day one of our two-day interview with
• 58:42
  Speaker 3: Amal right here.
• 58:44
  Speaker 6: And tomorrow, we'll talk about the industry.
• 58:48
  Speaker 3: We'll talk about, you know, the label that he started
• 58:51
  Speaker 3: for kids who can't get into Sony's lobby.
• 58:54
  Speaker 6: And most importantly, we'll ask.
• 58:56
  Speaker 3: Him tomorrow one of my famous questions that I like
• 58:58
  Speaker 3: to ask folks. What advice would he give his young self,
• 59:03
  Speaker 3: maybe that 16-year-old that used to stand outside the studios?
• 59:07
  Speaker 6: We'll see you tomorrow, everybody.
• 59:08
  Speaker 5: Bye, honey.
• 59:26
  Speaker 6: These are not.
• 59:27
  Speaker 4: The words Now the night is gone, I felt so
• 59:32
  Speaker 4: When I met.
• 59:33
  Speaker 13: You in the morning.
• 59:41
  Speaker 2: When I met you, I
• 59:47
  Speaker 11: Met Satsang to hawa Subha Subha Kujo Mila