Latest / Financial Planner Life Podcast / Becoming a Financial Planner – Ciaran Ruttledge

Transcript

Becoming a Financial Planner – Ciaran Ruttledge · Financial Planner Life Podcast

• 0:04
  SPEAKER_00: Hi, and welcome to the Financial Planner Life Podcast, where we talk to professionals at varying stages in their career about what it's like working in the wonderful world of financial planning and financial advice.
• 0:17
  SPEAKER_00: This podcast is proudly sponsored by Recruit UK, a recruitment consultancy specifically focused on the financial services.
• 0:25
  SPEAKER_00: They have a niche specialism, recruiting, within the financial planning industry.
• 0:29
  SPEAKER_00: So check out their website for the latest job opportunities, hints and tips, and blog articles.
• 0:38
  SPEAKER_00: Today's guest is Kieran Rutledge.
• 0:39
  SPEAKER_00: Kieran joins me today as a fresh financial planner, one year into his role at Ablestoke.
• 0:45
  SPEAKER_00: I knew of Kieran about a year ago.
• 0:47
  SPEAKER_00: He contacted me off the back of the podcast and said that he wanted to become a financial planner.
• 0:51
  SPEAKER_00: And here he is, one year later, and he's going to share his journey, how he got the role, the interview process, hints and tips around what to ask, what to look out for, and how to secure yourself an employed role offer.
• 1:03
  SPEAKER_00: We also talk about the realities versus the expectations of working as a financial planner and what his first year has looked like.
• 1:10
  SPEAKER_00: We talk about transferable skills, why he wants to become a financial planner, and we also talk about his previous experience working as a consultant within wealth management firms.
• 1:19
  SPEAKER_00: I hope you enjoy the episode.
• 1:21
  SPEAKER_00: Kieran, thanks so much for joining me today on the Financial Planner Life podcast.
• 1:25
  SPEAKER_00: My first guest since coming back from my holiday, my first guest at 40 years old.
• 1:30
  SPEAKER_00: Nice, nice.
• 1:32
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:32
  SPEAKER_00: How was the legs?
• 1:34
  SPEAKER_00: Amazing, actually.
• 1:35
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I had an amazing time.
• 1:36
  SPEAKER_00: It rained 24-7, but we had such a good time.
• 1:40
  SPEAKER_00: In fact, my wife said it was the best holiday she's ever been on.
• 1:43
  SPEAKER_00: And um lots and lots of walking.
• 1:45
  SPEAKER_00: Um we went and did that um striding edge.
• 1:51
  SPEAKER_00: And it was um ridiculous weather.
• 1:53
  SPEAKER_00: So it's really cloudy, really misty, really windy, really wet.
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_00: We got up to that striding edge, and I was nervous, I'll be honest with you.
• 2:00
  SPEAKER_00: It it, you know, it's a it's a grade one scramble.
• 2:02
  SPEAKER_00: When you read grade one scramble, you think to yourself, well, this should be quite easy.
• 2:05
  SPEAKER_00: It wasn't easy at all, you know, it was really, really tough.
• 2:08
  SPEAKER_00: And you get to the end of that striding edge and you look up, and it's like a sheer rock face, and you think, well, how am I supposed to get up there?
• 2:14
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 2:14
  SPEAKER_00: My my wife was worried a bit, and then these doctors came along actually behind us who had done it before, and they just said, look, keep on going.
• 2:20
  SPEAKER_00: And so we walked with them.
• 2:21
  SPEAKER_00: So I was really pleased that they came at the right time because I think we would have probably turned back because it looked a bit, yeah, it looks a bit hairy.
• 2:27
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah, nice, nice.
• 2:29
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I don't I anyone who I know who's done hell, and basically, I don't think they've ever had any good weather.
• 2:35
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but you know, it's meant to be a good scramble.
• 2:38
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
• 2:39
  SPEAKER_00: And we had such a good yeah, such a good time.
• 2:40
  SPEAKER_00: And on the very last day, the sun came out for like about an hour.
• 2:43
  SPEAKER_00: So it was kind of like the lakes were saying to me, look, if you've had this much fun in the rain, come back in the sunshine because it looks like this.
• 2:49
  SPEAKER_00: And it honestly, it was beautiful.
• 2:50
  SPEAKER_00: I'm so glad I went and I love my walking.
• 2:52
  SPEAKER_00: I love being outside.
• 2:53
  SPEAKER_00: I think being in nature is so important.
• 2:56
  SPEAKER_00: You know, the Japanese call it a green shower, don't they?
• 2:59
  SPEAKER_00: Get out in nature and it replenishes the soul and makes you feel good.
• 3:02
  SPEAKER_00: And um, it's certainly done that.
• 3:03
  SPEAKER_00: I feel fantastic.
• 3:04
  SPEAKER_01: Ideal.
• 3:05
  SPEAKER_01: Ideal.
• 3:06
  SPEAKER_00: So, my man, thank you for joining me.
• 3:08
  SPEAKER_00: Obviously, you and me have spoken a few times, haven't we, in the past?
• 3:11
  SPEAKER_00: And um, you're one of the earlier, early listeners to the podcast.
• 3:14
  SPEAKER_00: And I think you found it quite useful when you were making that transition from a career outside of financial planning, then into financial planning.
• 3:22
  SPEAKER_00: And a year has gone by, I can't believe how quickly that's gone.
• 3:25
  SPEAKER_00: And I always promise, I always said, look, you know, when you get to that stage where you've got a year under your belt in financial planning, I want to hear about it.
• 3:31
  SPEAKER_00: I want to hear about your journey because I know it's gonna inspire lots of people who have come from another profession or thinking about becoming a financial planner and um really your experience within that first year and how uh beneficial it's gonna be to them to listen to it.
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_00: So thank you very much for joining me today.
• 3:46
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, no, brilliant.
• 3:47
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you for having me.
• 3:48
  SPEAKER_01: Uh yeah, it was, I think it was one of your first podcasts that I listened to.
• 3:53
  SPEAKER_01: And it was while I was kind of looking for the financial advice role and basically done a lot of experience, you know, with the power planning and uh the administrative work prior.
• 4:04
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, but it was that leap that actually was kind of proven quite difficult.
• 4:09
  SPEAKER_01: But uh, you know, it was uh yeah, you spoke to a few financial advisors, and I took a lot of information from that.
• 4:17
  SPEAKER_01: It was really beneficial.
• 4:19
  SPEAKER_00: Fantastic.
• 4:19
  SPEAKER_00: So, Gieran, let's just start at the beginning then.
• 4:21
  SPEAKER_00: So, why did you decide to become a financial planner and what was your sort of transition?
• 4:26
  SPEAKER_00: How did you get into the profession?
• 4:28
  SPEAKER_01: So I suppose when I left uni, uh I yeah, I got into insurance and doing kind of complaints for accident, uh, accident sickness and unemployment.
• 4:40
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, did that for like four four years and then moved on to the financial ombudsman service, which was kind of really the next step up regarding that kind of category of in uh of advice.
• 4:55
  SPEAKER_01: And when I basically got to the Ombudsman service, I then looked around and kind of thought myself, you know, what is this really what I want to be doing?
• 5:05
  SPEAKER_01: And it was actually it was strange as well.
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_01: We were doing hours from like 10 till three, and it was really short hours, and I was kind of looking around and thinking, you know, I'm 20, 25 here.
• 5:16
  SPEAKER_01: Basically, are these the hours I really want to be doing?
• 5:19
  SPEAKER_01: You know, it was ideal, don't get me wrong, but uh yeah, it basically made me think, and I was like, well, you know, I've always wanted to kind of give advice, kind of uh I had spoken to advisors previously and decided, you know, do my qualifications from there, uh, do my, you know, level four.
• 5:39
  SPEAKER_01: And then that allowed me then to move on to wealth management, uh, which basically meant I was, you know, um I took a leap.
• 5:48
  SPEAKER_01: So I left the Ombudsman's service, which was like a gonna be a 24-month contract, yeah, and took a seven-week contract with a footy two fifty company, so wealth management company.
• 5:58
  SPEAKER_01: And that turned out to be 18 months, actually.
• 6:01
  SPEAKER_01: So it was ideal.
• 6:02
  SPEAKER_01: And I worked with basically the best advisors in that Footy 250 company and learned a hell of a lot.
• 6:09
  SPEAKER_01: So basically I learned the the theory while I was studying and then seen the practicality of it and seen it being implemented, and then that really gave me, you know, the buzz for it and kind of really yeah, I seen the value of it.
• 6:22
  SPEAKER_00: Fantastic.
• 6:23
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, so let's just go back to that then.
• 6:25
  SPEAKER_00: So you were working in insurance, moved across to the FOS, so the Financial Norbandsman Service, working around the complaint side of things.
• 6:32
  SPEAKER_00: So obviously, complaints and things was an interest to you at the time?
• 6:35
  SPEAKER_01: Uh it was, it was a bit of interest because I got to see really the back end of it, you know, the back office stuff.
• 6:41
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, but I I I just identified that, you know, what you want to be in front of clients, not really dealing with their complaints.
• 6:48
  SPEAKER_01: And I wanted to basically be handling, you know, helping people rather than helping them with their complaints, essentially.
• 6:56
  SPEAKER_01: So that was then the leap that I took basically into the front office kind of work where, you know, you're actually proactively dealing with clients, not rather than reactively.
• 7:06
  SPEAKER_00: When you were working on the complaint side of things, and obviously there's a sort of higher tension to like emotional intelligence when you're having to deal with clients that have got claims going through that are quite large size, and uh it can be quite an emotional experience, you know.
• 7:21
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I used to work for Aviva, and Aviva had a joint venture with the Royal Bank of Scotland.
• 7:25
  SPEAKER_00: So a lot of the clients that would come through to us might well be making complaints about their mortgage endowment plan, they might be making complaints about their life assurance not paying out, etc.
• 7:33
  SPEAKER_00: So it was highly sensitive.
• 7:34
  SPEAKER_00: But I find within that role, there was a great learning experience for me around customer experience and customer service.
• 7:43
  SPEAKER_00: And I think customer service, customer experience is a great training ground to get to know people and understand people, and also to ensure that when you do end up, say, selling something to somebody or offering a service as a financial planner, that you are able to ensure that you have their interests at heart and you are treating that customer fairly, aren't you?
• 8:04
  SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
• 8:05
  SPEAKER_01: And that's what you get to see, I suppose, from that end is well, what not to do, you know, and you get to see, well, actually what you shouldn't be doing, and that then allows you to see, well, actually what should you be doing.
• 8:17
  SPEAKER_01: And then that gives you that open, you know, it opens your eyes to well, actually, people are upset with, you know, sometimes the advice that they've received.
• 8:27
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, with regards to the payment protection insurance, it sometimes it became pretty much like uh there wasn't really it was kind of you know, this is how a case should be handled and move on to the next one.
• 8:43
  SPEAKER_01: And that was kind of one of the things where I was like, you know, you need to be treating each individual differently, and that is why I kind of was like, you know what, I just want to be going out there and actually dealing with each individual client because of you know the payment protection insurance becomes slightly, you know, you've got to do five of these a day, and it was kind of pretty monotonous.
• 9:04
  SPEAKER_01: So it wasn't much autonomy.
• 9:06
  SPEAKER_01: We're actually, I think, dealing with individuals should be kind of, you know, spent a lot of time actually looking after them.
• 9:12
  SPEAKER_01: And yeah, yeah, and that's basically how it led to, you know, well, actually, that what you want to be doing is looking after in each individual client.
• 9:20
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, getting into that experience side of things.
• 9:22
  SPEAKER_00: So, yeah, absolutely.
• 9:23
  SPEAKER_00: When you see things on the other end of the scale, you think to yourself, well, I could probably do a better job, I could deliver a better service, a better, a better experience for that client or for that customer.
• 9:31
  SPEAKER_00: And it drives you to ensure that you have a higher level of professionalism.
• 9:35
  SPEAKER_00: I can understand that.
• 9:36
  SPEAKER_00: So you moved in as a business consultant then, CRCC Limited, wasn't it?
• 9:39
  SPEAKER_00: That was your you were working as a consultant, but working within wealth management firms, helping out with projects, is that right?
• 9:44
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's right, exactly.
• 9:46
  SPEAKER_01: So it was basically my own limited company, and I went in as a consultant with one of the wealth management firms, well, a few wealth management firms.
• 9:55
  SPEAKER_01: And what that meant was it was basically around the MIFID II.
• 10:00
  SPEAKER_01: So all advisors had to meet their clients within you know 12 months, 18 months.
• 10:06
  SPEAKER_01: Uh some of them, you know, basically hadn't spoken to the clients you know for a couple of years, but MIFID 2 was implemented, and it meant that you had to meet your clients every 12 to 18 months.
• 10:16
  SPEAKER_01: And so I was helping the advisors kind of reach out to the clients, uh, ensure that they dealt with their clients, you know, within that time frame, and actually had reviewed all the products within that time frame as well.
• 10:28
  SPEAKER_01: So I actually spent, you know, probably about six months just reading suitability reports, ensuring that each product had been looked at.
• 10:37
  SPEAKER_01: And that meant, you know, working with the best advisors within that firm.
• 10:41
  SPEAKER_01: I was kind of reading their the detailed suitability reports, looking at each individual product.
• 10:47
  SPEAKER_01: And yeah, it was a hell of a learning curve.
• 10:49
  SPEAKER_01: It was amazing.
• 10:50
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that's really, really cool.
• 10:51
  SPEAKER_00: So working with some of the best financial planners in some of those firms, because I mean some of the firms you were working with, James A.
• 10:56
  SPEAKER_00: Quilter, Bruin Dolphin, for instance.
• 10:59
  SPEAKER_01: Brew and Dolphin, yeah, that's Bruin Dolphin where basically started.
• 11:03
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, and then it was then quilt achieving it, where I basically worked on from the investment management side.
• 11:10
  SPEAKER_01: And that basically let me see the other side of the business, you know, the portfolio construction.
• 11:14
  SPEAKER_01: Uh get to see the analysis that goes into each individual investment.
• 11:19
  SPEAKER_01: And then that opened the door into meeting Scott Stevens, I think Unit Investor.
• 11:25
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 11:25
  SPEAKER_01: We've we've mentioned him before.
• 11:27
  SPEAKER_01: And he opened the door to, well, this is the network of Quilter.
• 11:31
  SPEAKER_01: And then that allowed me then to be introduced to Abel Stoke.
• 11:35
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 11:36
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 11:37
  unknown: Yeah.
• 11:37
  SPEAKER_00: So that chance in Canter with Scott then was it?
• 11:39
  SPEAKER_00: And it was in an elevator, wasn't it?
• 11:41
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 11:42
  SPEAKER_01: So basically he gave a speech, uh Quilt Achieve It, kind of explaining the network, and just on so you're giving kind of you know an induction to basically what Quilter was.
• 11:54
  SPEAKER_01: And, you know, the meeting finished, and I kind of, you know, jumped in the elevator at the same time and basically just gave a bit of a pitch, actually.
• 12:03
  SPEAKER_01: Uh and yeah, we got chatting.
• 12:05
  SPEAKER_01: He, you know, we swapped cards and and then I got in touch with him and he put me in touch with the right people, uh, who then enabled me to get in touch with basically the network within Quilter.
• 12:16
  SPEAKER_01: Uh yeah, so yeah, it's good.
• 12:18
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, cool.
• 12:18
  SPEAKER_00: So at that point then, you were you weren't a financial advisor, you weren't working within financial, um, you weren't working working within a financial planning practice, you weren't competent advisor status, you were really at the beginning of your journey looking for that opportunity to move into financial advice.
• 12:34
  SPEAKER_00: Had you already made the decision, though, that you were gonna become a financial advisor, or really holding on to that being a consultant, because being a consultant, you can earn really great money, can't you?
• 12:42
  SPEAKER_00: It's a great, it's a great place to be.
• 12:45
  SPEAKER_00: But did you make the decision like quite early on, right?
• 12:47
  SPEAKER_00: I'm gonna be a financial advisor, so I'm gonna start my qualifications, or how did the how did that transition from consultant to financial advisor happen?
• 12:55
  SPEAKER_00: I know you spoke to Scott Stevens, obviously, in the in in the lift and you got introduced, and that's a great, you know, great opportunity.
• 13:00
  SPEAKER_00: We all see those opportunities.
• 13:02
  SPEAKER_00: But did you start your qualification first?
• 13:04
  SPEAKER_00: Did you make that mental decision you're gonna be an advisor?
• 13:07
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so that was at the Ombudsman Service.
• 13:09
  SPEAKER_01: So when I made the uh decision, and then that was about four or five years ago, uh 2016.
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_01: Then I made the decision that actually I want to get into financial advice.
• 13:20
  SPEAKER_01: Basically, with regards to the consultant work, that was kind of you know, you're going in fixing a problem, and then you basically after a year, you were then moving on to the next project, and it basically meant that there wasn't really much kind of continuity, or uh, you know, there wasn't really much kind of I didn't, you know, sometimes a project could get pulled, and you know, you've been there 18 months, you started kind of integrating within the company, and then after that, you kind of the contract finished and you kind of felt like you're starting again.
• 13:50
  SPEAKER_01: And so then it was kind of well, actually, what do I really want to do?
• 13:54
  SPEAKER_01: And it was actually, well, I I do want to give financial advice.
• 13:58
  SPEAKER_01: And when I was at Quilt Achieving, I actually had a couple of interviews with the investment managers, spoke to these guys about it, and you know, it we come to the conclusion that, you know, yeah, it's financial advice.
• 14:10
  SPEAKER_01: I come to the conclusion that it's financial advice, that is the area, you know, you've got the investment management side, you've got so many facets to kind of wealth management.
• 14:19
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, and it was, you know, pinning down, well, actually, this is definitely the angle because it's so such a big industry, it's really difficult to kind of sometimes think, well, actually, what do I want to do?
• 14:31
  SPEAKER_01: Where do I fit in this kind of big organization?
• 14:34
  SPEAKER_01: And, you know, it took it probably took four years working in different areas to identify this is exactly what I want to do.
• 14:42
  SPEAKER_01: And then that was when basically I started looking for purely financial advice roles.
• 14:47
  SPEAKER_00: Let's let's talk about that then.
• 14:49
  SPEAKER_00: You know, you made the decision, you've had some great experience of working in these firms.
• 14:53
  SPEAKER_00: You've sat back, you've observed, you've worked in different positions, worked alongside financial advisors, had some great conversations with some investment managers, you steered you in the right direction as well.
• 15:04
  SPEAKER_00: Why did you decide to become a financial planner?
• 15:07
  SPEAKER_00: Why did you decide that that was the career path for you then?
• 15:11
  SPEAKER_01: Uh I think really it's kind of what I really enjoy is some of the technical stuff uh with regards to financial planning.
• 15:19
  SPEAKER_01: And the, you know, it's it's amazing how how people just don't know this information.
• 15:25
  SPEAKER_01: It's incredible, you know.
• 15:26
  SPEAKER_01: I was speaking to a client yesterday and we were talking about how this isn't educated in school.
• 15:32
  SPEAKER_01: And, you know, I think this should become, you know, part of you know, the syllabus of school.
• 15:38
  SPEAKER_01: I actually even reached out to my school yesterday just to kind of think, right, okay, we should have a conversation.
• 15:44
  SPEAKER_01: I could go in, and I really think honestly that this should be become part of you know everyday life.
• 15:50
  SPEAKER_01: Everyone should know about this.
• 15:52
  SPEAKER_01: And so, really, when I kind of you know, when I was reading all the information, when I was doing the exams, I was like, well, why isn't this kind of the norm?
• 16:00
  SPEAKER_01: Why don't people know about this?
• 16:02
  SPEAKER_01: And really, that is why I want to kind of be out of giving advice because it's an education process, first and foremost, before anyone becomes a client, it's making sure that they understand what actually everything is, and you know, when you get into the real complexities of everything, there's so much depth to it, and you know, every you know, everything evolves as well, regulation changes, and you've got to keep on top of it.
• 16:26
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, it's a constant move and massive, massive move, and you know, snowball, I suppose.
• 16:32
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, cool.
• 16:33
  SPEAKER_00: So when you decided then to move into financial advice, so you you moved then into Ablestoke, then, yeah.
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's right, exactly.
• 16:41
  SPEAKER_01: I had okay, yeah.
• 16:42
  SPEAKER_01: I had a few interviews in the process of looking for financial advice role.
• 16:47
  SPEAKER_01: Uh decided to take not take on a couple because it were uh not a few companies, and then I uh Ablestoke come around and I basically took the role.
• 16:56
  SPEAKER_01: Fantastic.
• 16:57
  SPEAKER_00: So what leading up to Ablestoke then, you mentioned there you went out, you interviewed with a few different companies.
• 17:02
  SPEAKER_00: Did you have your level four qualification before heading out to interviews, or did you or were you part qualified?
• 17:10
  SPEAKER_00: I had my level four.
• 17:11
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, fantastic.
• 17:12
  SPEAKER_00: And level four, was that through the CII or anybody else?
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_01: That was through the London Institute of Banking Finance, L IBF.
• 17:19
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 17:20
  SPEAKER_00: Interesting question I'm going to ask you then.
• 17:21
  SPEAKER_00: Your experience of going out and trying to find a job as a financial planner without an experience of a financial of being a financial planner with the LIBF qualification, did you struggle?
• 17:36
  SPEAKER_01: Without having the experience, it was a it was a big struggle.
• 17:40
  SPEAKER_01: Uh without having the experience with regards to the L IBF, I don't think people were that bothered.
• 17:47
  SPEAKER_01: You know, uh with regards to the CII or the CISI, it was actually having a level four was pretty, you know, it was pretty strong on the CV anyway.
• 17:55
  SPEAKER_01: Because I know a lot of these, you know, a lot of companies weren't even looking for level four.
• 18:00
  SPEAKER_01: So recruiters kind of found me kind of it kind of found that level four advantageous anyway to get me in the door.
• 18:07
  SPEAKER_01: So they weren't really bothered about the L IBF or CII.
• 18:10
  SPEAKER_01: And to be honest, the L IBF is pretty more, it's a lot more practical rather than the CII.
• 18:16
  SPEAKER_01: You know, the CII, I think, is a bit of a you know, memory test where actually the L IBF, we had to write suitability reports and everything like that.
• 18:23
  SPEAKER_01: I found a and the way I learn as well, it was just far more useful.
• 18:27
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, sometimes you know I've worked in the profession now recruiting um into financial planning firms, and there's always been this kind of prestige attached to the CII and a bit of a negativity towards LIBF.
• 18:39
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and I know that if I was to retrain and become a financial planner, for instance, I would go down the LIBF route because of the practical side of it.
• 18:46
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 18:47
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and and it's quicker and it's cheaper.
• 18:50
  SPEAKER_00: Um, to me, it seems like a solution to the lack of financial planners that are out there, how quickly we can get them up to level four qualifications to be able to give the financial planning advice.
• 18:58
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, none of these qualifications are going to sit there and teach you how to be an advisor.
• 19:01
  SPEAKER_00: No, exactly.
• 19:02
  SPEAKER_00: That's what you learn on the job.
• 19:03
  SPEAKER_00: And I think a specific certain skill skill set that's then brought to the table is hugely beneficial.
• 19:09
  SPEAKER_00: And I mean, like your background, if you were if you were to come to me and you were level four qualified without any experience and you wanted to become a financial planner, the first thing I do is I look on your CV.
• 19:17
  SPEAKER_00: The first thing I do is I have a conversation with you and I think to myself, has this person got the skill set required to become a financial planner?
• 19:24
  SPEAKER_00: Have they gained any experience in previous roles where that skill set can be transferable?
• 19:29
  SPEAKER_00: Now, working as a consultant, working on projects, having to sit down with people, articulate detailed projects and open them up and uh speak to different stakeholders and win win people over and you know get someone to understand your point of view.
• 19:40
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, they're all incredible skill sets that, as a financial planner, becoming very, very useful when you're sitting down with somebody who needs to be educated, let's say, on a product range or a situation in life that they might not be prepared for before you even start to actually invest their money for them.
• 19:55
  SPEAKER_00: So it's a very personable role, isn't it?
• 19:58
  SPEAKER_00: And then stepping into that financial advice role without that personable experience, I think can be quite tricky.
• 20:02
  SPEAKER_00: Would you agree?
• 20:03
  SPEAKER_00: Or do you think, you know, let's say someone came to me today, right, level four qualified, they studied in their back bedroom, they've done it, they're 21 years old, they've come straight out of university and they said to me, Sam, I want to be a financial advisor right now.
• 20:15
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, without the face-to-face experience, client-facing experience, even sales of customer service, I think it's a struggle for that person.
• 20:26
  SPEAKER_00: What do you think based on your experience of your first year within financial planning?
• 20:30
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, definitely.
• 20:31
  SPEAKER_01: I think you know, you've got to have that kind of uh, you know, you've got to have that bit of experience how to deal with people, even in work kind of situation, you know, coming out of university.
• 20:41
  SPEAKER_01: Well, you know, it um people, you know, the you can be kind of uh I've seen it happen in often where actually a young guy, a young guy straight from uni's come out, but he's actually done the qualifications underneath one of the advisors, and he's basically learned the back with the back office stuff and really and then he's now leaping into uh the advice side.
• 21:06
  SPEAKER_01: Uh he, you know, he's quite young, uh, but he is chartered, he's going to be chartered in the next couple of months.
• 21:13
  SPEAKER_01: But you know, it that is also, you know, if you can it's it might be a tough test because ultimately, you know, if you're 25 and you're advising a 55-year-old person about their finances, then you know what how do they see that?
• 21:28
  SPEAKER_01: And yeah, yeah.
• 21:30
  SPEAKER_00: Have you found that at all?
• 21:31
  SPEAKER_00: Have you found that in the role of a financial advisor where age becomes a bit of a tricky, a tricky area when it comes to trust, perhaps?
• 21:39
  SPEAKER_01: Uh not particularly for myself, because I think I'm at the age where you know mid 30s and kind of you know, you've got a bit of experience and you've got the qualifications behind you, you know what you're talking about.
• 21:51
  SPEAKER_01: Uh that really doesn't become that much of an issue.
• 21:54
  SPEAKER_01: But I I I imagine if I was 23, you know, coming out of university and just kind.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_01: trying to give advice to a retiree, you know, it'd be pretty difficult.
• 22:04
  SPEAKER_01: Uh even with all the with even with all the knowledge, it's kind of well, you know, and it helps, you know, that I've got no hair.
• 22:11
  SPEAKER_01: So that's that's a bonus.
• 22:14
  SPEAKER_00: What you're trying to say, you look you look mature.
• 22:17
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, exactly.
• 22:18
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
• 22:18
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that's it.
• 22:19
  SPEAKER_00: I think I think though it does kind, kind, it does help, I think.
• 22:23
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I think if you're sitting down with somebody, perhaps they're in their 50s or 60s.
• 22:26
  SPEAKER_00: And um I know it shouldn't be, we shouldn't be ageists and it should really be about the individual, their knowledge and their understanding of what they're doing.
• 22:34
  SPEAKER_00: And um but I think sometimes there is that natural kind of curiosity as to whether or not that person is experienced enough to to look after me and whatnot.
• 22:44
  SPEAKER_00: I mean I was in hospital yesterday I told you and in came a medical in came a trainee doctor, you know, and I said how old are you?
• 22:51
  SPEAKER_00: And he was like 20, 21, you know and I'm looking at him he's asking me all these questions and he's obviously learning and everything and I was cool with that.
• 22:57
  SPEAKER_00: But it was like looking at him thinking like you know can you bring in your boss can you bring the doctor in?
• 23:03
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 23:04
  SPEAKER_00: There's a consultant around or yeah exactly.
• 23:07
  SPEAKER_00: But at the same time I understood that he was just practicing essentially you know and and he's learning somewhere um and um actually he was a good guy and as I got to know him and you know he had a you know a lovely lovely manner about him as well and like really quite you know and that was something that perhaps you don't get sometimes from somebody with who's been a bit long in the tooth and done the job for some time you know well that's it exactly you know and people who are eager and kind of want to help people that you know one of the you know the advisor I'm talking about is very bright as well and he's got every qualification that he he's the most qualified you can be within the industry.
• 23:42
  SPEAKER_01: So that doesn't kind of you know it doesn't it's not a disadvantage for age it's you know as you say people who are a bit long in the tooth there's a kind of theory out there where which I learned up from Quilter was actually you know the more knowledge and advisor gets well actually the less they take on with clients and I think sometimes what can maybe happen is that um you know you might sit down with a client and a client kind of gives you some objections and you could be just like look I know more and and you could be a bit frosty with them.
• 24:17
  SPEAKER_01: And I think actually advisors have to kind of watch that and basically be like no you know the everyone has their own opinions and then you just have to kind of not just completely say no you're wrong.
• 24:30
  SPEAKER_01: It's actually listening to that individual and then basically explaining well this is actually how it should go or you know but ultimately everything is down to what someone's in the uh objectives are first and foremost but you just got to show them the most efficient way of getting there.
• 24:45
  SPEAKER_01: And you know I suppose if you're like 65 and you know you've got you know a 30 year old coming up to you and you know they're trying to tell you what they want to do and you know they're not listening to you.
• 24:57
  SPEAKER_01: You know you have to kind of be calm and collective and be like well actually this is this is how you do it.
• 25:03
  SPEAKER_01: And you know if you've been doing it for a while you have to kind of still maintain that you know you've got to maintain that some this is someone's beliefs and you've got to just try and educate them properly.
• 25:13
  SPEAKER_00: Kieran you've been at Ablestoke now haven't you for just over a year?
• 25:18
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah just over a year.
• 25:19
  SPEAKER_00: So let's just talk a little bit about your journey uh within that year.
• 25:24
  SPEAKER_00: So what's been going on for you um so you you went into Ablestoke okay you interviewed there they they offered you the job so what job was it they offered you did you go in straight away as a financial advisor or were you a trainee?
• 25:40
  SPEAKER_00: Did you do administration power planning?
• 25:43
  SPEAKER_00: Was it a baptism of fire?
• 25:44
  SPEAKER_00: You know how did it start when you first joined Ablestoke can you sort of talk us through that year let's go through that because I think that'd be really interesting for somebody who's thinking about becoming a financial planner and what they should really expect from that first year.
• 25:57
  SPEAKER_01: So I went in as a client account manager and what this meant was I was kind of there helping the partners um helping the partners provide advice uh some some of the partners were providing advice to my my network uh and I was then supporting them with documentation you know doing a lot of their work while they were delivering the advice I was obviously sitting in on the meetings and learning a lot from the partners about how they kind of were you know well how they were talking to the clients and also you know the technical knowledge that I hadn't seen when I I've just read it but actually the explanations of the technical knowledge as well which was really important.
• 26:40
  SPEAKER_01: So I kind of was sitting in on these meetings with the clients and yeah it was really really good for the first six months that's what we did and then I'm now moving on to in and then basically going through competent advisor status with Quilter uh that's been the last six months and yeah it's been a hell of a learning curve then we're going through the kind of compliance section with Quilter through the compliant competent advisor status and you get to see what work you were doing previously to other advisors when I was being the back office doing the checks on individuals and yeah it's very interesting actually to see you know how back office is kind of looking upon advisors and and you've got to put flip your hat don't you and be like well actually I used to do that.
• 27:31
  SPEAKER_01: And so I've been doing that for the last six months dealing with my own clients as well got annual reviews coming up for clients who I've introduced to the partners and so I need to do annual reviews with my clients and yeah it's been it's been a pretty uh amazing process been challenging long hours and uh it's you know working during holidays but it's been amazing.
• 27:56
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah and working with the partners getting that knowledge getting that understanding of how to speak to people really has helped you know me push on.
• 28:05
  SPEAKER_01: Okay so having those mentors within the business has been something of a real benefit to you then yeah definitely seeing people who've who've done it and they've been doing it for 14 years doing it for 16 years you know you go in and you you you start again you basically don't know anything and you just got to look absorb every bit of information from these guys and that that's been pretty powerful actually.
• 28:28
  SPEAKER_00: When you went into the role then did you feel like you were like yeah brilliant I'm a financial advisor I know exactly what I'm gonna do I've I've done my qualifications and I'm gonna go out there and give loads of advice I've got a network of people I can introduce was there a bit of an ego check as you came in within the first couple of months did you think oh my God this is so different to what I expected yeah it was a lot different to what I expected but I suppose because that's because I looked for a financial advice for all probably for about a year to actually find the right firm and actually it was very difficult.
• 28:59
  SPEAKER_01: Not many people wanted to take you know someone with back office experience on with no financial advice experience.
• 29:05
  SPEAKER_01: Basically because I looked hard for a year actually when I went in I was just like you know what I'll just do whatever is required in order for me to kind of you know become an advisor.
• 29:17
  SPEAKER_01: So you know I just kind of listened to what the kind of process was believed in the process and that allowed me then to kind of you know not not get too ahead of myself and not be too you know I'm an advisor straight off the bat.
• 29:32
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah it was because I think because the difficulty of actually getting a role and of getting a financial advice role basically with no experience I've given advice that basically allowed me then to kind of take a backward step and go, okay I'm gonna I'm gonna follow you in this process and I'm gonna listen to you guys.
• 29:48
  SPEAKER_00: Let's look at that then because going you know there's a lot of people who get their level four qualification they they do go out and they interview with quite a few companies the companies that will consider interviewing them and they get a lot of knockbacks before they actually get an offer it's a lot harder to find a financial planning role or a company that would take you on without that experience even if you have got back office experience.
• 30:11
  SPEAKER_00: So it's really down to the firm and their uh confidence in their career framework essentially their training in the development program that they know that they can take somebody on without experience and and push them through.
• 30:24
  SPEAKER_00: So what do you think it was about you and what you could bring to the table that really sparked an interest from Able Stoke over you know other companies that turned you down for instance?
• 30:36
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah so I I was I suppose I just consistently sent them emails because there was kind of a bit of it was during COVID as well and there was a bit of there was a few time frames where we didn't have much interaction but I had his direct email address I had his basic phone and I was just sending him kind of I was treating him a bit like a client as in like is it if I was the advisor how would I treat a client and not as in kind of uh pestering but as in kind of providing information you keep on providing information to the client and that's how I kind of tried with Lee because I was like you know what I really want this role it actually was an employed role as well a lot of the roles are self-employed uh and so this was an employed role and I've really seen this as you know advantageous uh and I kind of yeah I just basically sent him emails backing up my credentials and you know that's that's how I kind of did it and built a bit of a relationship back and forth via email first or did you meet him face to face first?
• 31:36
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah were you introduced by a recruiter?
• 31:38
  SPEAKER_00: How did that come about?
• 31:39
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah I was introduced through a recruiter but actually we never met in person we only spoke on the phone obviously because of the situation uh with regards to COVID we only spoke on the phone and uh yeah we built up a relationship first and foremost he kind of you know did a bit of a check on myself understood what I wanted to achieve that is actually one of the big things as well I found I find that a lot of the financial advice firms want to understand is well actually what do you want to achieve and it's kind of it's similar to how you would work with a client as well because you know you need to understand the individual first and foremost before you you know before you can give any advice so you can take them on and that's kind of what leaded with me you wanted to understand me as an individual of the phone and then we kind of had yeah then I did a psychometric test to actually understand my character as well and how I deal with certain situations which was pretty powerful to get the results actually it was my first real psychometric test.
• 32:39
  SPEAKER_01: It was really it was really good I loved it and then and then we spoke then I sent you know the spoke on the phone again and then sent a follow-up email basically with the people who I'd worked with who he potentially could have worked with and sent all that information through and then I think that really sealed the deal.
• 32:56
  SPEAKER_00: Fantastic yeah so yeah providing that I think it's this advice I give to anybody that's coming into the profession a lot of the time I say look you know put your feelers out to some recruitment consultants but don't be 100% banking on those recruitment consultants finding you a role because a lot of the clients they work with unless they specifically have a need for a trainee without experience they don't want to pay a recruitment fee more often than not for somebody without experience.
• 33:22
  SPEAKER_00: They want us to find them the experienced candidates.
• 33:24
  SPEAKER_00: Now that's going to massively change over the next five to 10 years as we get less and less uh financial planners out there that are actually in the role fully qualified.
• 33:32
  SPEAKER_00: And you know I see a lot of financial planning firms having to step outside of the profession as a whole and start attracting new people into their businesses, not just the experienced advisor who can bring two you know 20 million quid with them under management.
• 33:46
  SPEAKER_00: You know, that's that's that's changing.
• 33:47
  SPEAKER_00: But what I always advise anybody is to say look you know build that list of companies within your local area that you can approach and build a relationship directly now you can do that even easier these days can't you via LinkedIn?
• 33:59
  SPEAKER_00: You know it's very easy to follow the companies connect with the person within the company who's the right person be able to display a keenness and an interest via your LinkedIn profile and the posts that you do, the comments that you make on relevant industry posts so you start to get seen by the internal recruiters or the people that are on social media from the financial planning firms that you want to work for.
• 34:23
  SPEAKER_00: You have to market yourself and you have to push yourself out there to be seen and to be heard.
• 34:28
  SPEAKER_00: And you're absolutely spot on you know I'm a business owner when somebody approaches me via email after or before I've even interviewed them something changes in me where I really like that person because I like their approach.
• 34:44
  SPEAKER_00: Because a job like recruitment a job where you have to prospect requires a subtlety and a skill set of actually making contact with somebody and not pissing them off.
• 34:55
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 34:55
  SPEAKER_00: You know and and and that's what I like to see and that's what I like to hear.
• 34:59
  SPEAKER_00: And that's the advice I always give people is that have something of interest to give somebody so it shows them that you are A, have the right skill set, B, are interested and the right person to work for their firm.
• 35:12
  SPEAKER_00: So research their company look at them look at the person you're trying to contact their all their information's on LinkedIn pull some information off their profile if you see they've gone to a certain school or they do a lot of charity work etc try to speak about those things when you're talking to build that rapport and get your foot in the door because nine times out of 10 if somebody does that the right way and it's not pestering in a negative sense tend to go God you know what go on then let's have a chat.
• 35:39
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah exactly exactly once you have that chat then the communicate then it's the relationship side isn't it that's it then there's a connection and then it's like well how do I turn this guy down because actually I really like him now.
• 35:50
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah yeah and that's and that's everything isn't it it's building relationships with people and it's that kind of communication constantly with your you know with your employee your employer or you know just kind of even a prospect.
• 36:04
  SPEAKER_01: You've got to get along with people first and foremost and you've got to enjoy you know having that conversation with them because say if you're gonna work for someone for 10 15 20 years you've got to kind of get along as well it's a massive thing.
• 36:18
  SPEAKER_01: And you know say for example from a recruitment side I know recruitment because my girlfriend does it uh you know basically you've got to get along with the client as well and it's that subtle kind of touch base when I worked with the recruiter actually who got me the role in financial advice he was just constantly checking in on me every three months every six months and just kind of keeping in touch and you know what in certain stages it wasn't the right time but actually it eventually worked out to be the right time to actually do you know find the role for myself and that's the same with any with regards to kind of financial advice as well as you sometimes a client's not ready to do stuff because they've got too much moving too much changing circumstance they actually need to have a settled kind of base and then you can kind of give the advice and you know you with regards to kind of you should never really kind of give up on any relationship as long as you get along with the person and the person obviously respects you then you know you can you can you can still continue relationship even if nothing has come of it first of all.
• 37:24
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely it's like that breadcrumbing isn't it as I always say again I say to people it's look you know they might not be interested enough in you a job right now that's right now pop a bit of information across follow up in a couple of months yeah you know how you doing you know I just wanted to let you know this I've just passed this qualification.
• 37:39
  SPEAKER_00: I just want to let you know I read this really interesting article and I thought you know I thought you might be interested yourself just touching base if you've got anything going on just let me know.
• 37:47
  SPEAKER_00: And I think we uh a lot of the time people just if consider everything whether it's finding a job finding new clients it's being very transactional.
• 37:54
  SPEAKER_00: You know it's like I'm making a call and that's I'm gonna I'm gonna get it done there and then that's it.
• 37:58
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah and it's not it's an ongoing process and there are people out there on social media for example LinkedIn doing incredibly well that are just and I've you know I've given them advice they say continually put yourself out there.
• 38:08
  SPEAKER_00: And it's been beautiful to see these people who come to me without any confidence and no experience and they're putting themselves out there and they're and they're now finding their jobs and I'm getting messages saying Sam that advice you gave me was spot on.
• 38:19
  SPEAKER_00: Now I may not have placed them in the job you know but somebody else has and I'm pleased that they've got that job because they've taken initiative to get out there and do it.
• 38:25
  SPEAKER_00: And it's one of the one things I always say is just use your initiative put yourself out there.
• 38:29
  SPEAKER_00: Yes use recruitment consultants but at the same time don't just bank on those consultants finding you a job you do something about it also as well.
• 38:38
  SPEAKER_00: Kieran with your um uh sort of journey then you were going mentored you were sitting underneath financial advisors you mentioned about your network so did you bring some contacts with you some clients um people that you know that would would get financial advice from you was that something that you you brought to the table and was that part of the interview process as well that they wanted to know that you had a network that potentially you could give advice to yeah so that was actually part of the process it was kind of well you know go away have a think and kind of present who you would kind of uh who you would want to kind of reach out to and I essentially gave cohorts of people so football you know old uni friends kind of friends from back home you know just a whole different cohorts and actually it was interesting uh the MD then turned around and said no no no basically we want individuals I want you to kind of understand how name the individuals as in kind of you know who would be your kind of client list and then I basically went back done a whole presentation on that and then the individuals who I've you know thought I would give advice to and you know that allowed I suppose allowed the MD to understand it whether I've got a network or the whether I can get along with people you know if you you know if you if you just sit in the house or yeah or you know whether I've got a network of people and that was kind of one of the questions that it was asked to me.
• 40:11
  SPEAKER_00: So I think you know again another thing that I always advise anybody that's moving into financial planning or even moving on from financial advice into another financial advice role is to always look at your clients you know the potential clients the prospects that you could work with you know and label them almost simply into A B C clients A being like you know 100% that they would use your services that you've got a hell of a relationship with them.
• 40:32
  SPEAKER_00: You probably get on the pub and have a pint with them.
• 40:34
  SPEAKER_00: You know and then three is like that um the C C list is like well I'm gonna tap into that market but I don't know 100% but it's definitely something that I reckon I'm gonna I'm gonna tap into and B is like prospects like I'm pretty confident I could get in there.
• 40:48
  SPEAKER_00: And you kind of build that list of clients up and you put it into a simple list and that's a great way again is if you ever go to an interview it's just to present and say like I've had a think about this.
• 40:56
  SPEAKER_00: Here's a little business plan that I've got and it just adds such a deeper level of confidence because the interviewer, the business owner, the person who's running that business looking to take on a new advisor can go, ah, this guy's thought about it or this girl's thought about it.
• 41:11
  SPEAKER_00: And I can see the network that they're part of the types of people they brush shoulders with and where they think they can add value in their life and they can then ascertain then also at the same time whether or not you're in cloud cuckoo land or you're being a realist.
• 41:25
  SPEAKER_00: And then again that's a deeper level of conversation but also when you start talking about clients what do what do financial advisors love to do they love to talk about clients.
• 41:33
  SPEAKER_00: Where can they help people?
• 41:34
  SPEAKER_00: Where can they where can they get some money for investments?
• 41:36
  SPEAKER_00: What can they do to add value?
• 41:38
  SPEAKER_00: And again when you bring in say 10 really interesting people to the conversation within an interview there we go.
• 41:43
  SPEAKER_00: There's a great concept there isn't it because they're going to be saying well this is what we can do for that person.
• 41:47
  SPEAKER_00: This is what we can do for that person.
• 41:48
  SPEAKER_00: And if you work for us and all of a sudden the tide sort of you know it's it's shifts doesn't it they're kind of selling their services to you because you've already gone out and established a network that needs advice.
• 41:59
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah exactly and that's two great bits of advice first and foremost the one where it's kind of you know the breadcrumbs always kind of keep in touch base and then also then showing actually you've gone out and thought about it yourself and they're not just probing you questions and they're not just asking you you need to be proactive and kind of go well this is how I envision it anyway.
• 42:18
  SPEAKER_01: And even thinking about your five year plan and presenting that to the kind of to the uh employer and saying look this is how I envision everything going in the next five years.
• 42:29
  SPEAKER_01: And and you know they'll you know they'll they'll love that.
• 42:32
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely well again yeah five year plan that you know the first year plan's always good.
• 42:36
  SPEAKER_00: So if you break down your first year three, six, nine, twelve, what do you think you're gonna be doing within that period I think that always could make someone think again, right, this person's thought about it.
• 42:44
  SPEAKER_00: And then you should say the long term plan, where you want to take your life where you personally want your personal learnings to be what are the big things that are coming up in your life why you know why this job fits around your life what you what you want to take from it.
• 42:56
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that's really really important.
• 42:57
  SPEAKER_00: So that's really really sang quality advice and did you find as well when you went from interview to interview your level of understanding of what was required at the interview stage improved and got better.
• 43:07
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah so much better.
• 43:09
  SPEAKER_01: Every interview seemed to be kind of after the first couple it could become quite obvious what kind of the interview process was going to be like and it was really them diving into you know myself and understanding actually what did I want to achieve myself because uh you know that then gave them the understanding well actually okay we could probably work with this guy.
• 43:32
  SPEAKER_01: And as I say you know there was a few knockbacks and then I got offered a few roles which I turned down but you know it's kind of it was all the same kind of process it was right let's explain let's understand who you are as an individual and then let's understand well actually what qualifications you've got as well post that so for you being employed as a financial advisor sounds like it was a necessity.
• 43:55
  SPEAKER_00: You wanted that you know you wanted to be employed as opposed to self employed I could imagine some of the Jobs you got offered might well have been self-employed roles.
• 44:03
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, exactly.
• 44:03
  SPEAKER_01: Self-employed roles.
• 44:04
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 44:05
  SPEAKER_01: And yeah, yeah.
• 44:07
  SPEAKER_00: Why was employed so important to you?
• 44:08
  SPEAKER_00: Because you've worked in the world of consultancy before.
• 44:10
  SPEAKER_00: So I assume you had your own company and were self-employed.
• 44:14
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I saw and that was that is an interesting question, actually, because I will well, I suppose it was circumstantial.
• 44:20
  SPEAKER_01: I was kind of purchasing my first property.
• 44:22
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 44:23
  SPEAKER_01: And so I I didn't want the concern.
• 44:26
  SPEAKER_01: I I was a bit concerned that actually, you know, I'd want some income coming in.
• 44:32
  SPEAKER_01: Uh and also, you know, I suppose there was a little bit of fear in there as well.
• 44:37
  SPEAKER_01: Maybe that this might not go according to plan.
• 44:41
  SPEAKER_01: It might not actually work out.
• 44:43
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, you know, so it was kind of that, you know, that base.
• 44:47
  SPEAKER_01: Well, actually, you know, just in case it wasn't working out, I still have got an income coming in.
• 44:53
  SPEAKER_01: I know one of the firms basically offered me a loan and kind of I then repaid it back over a six-month period.
• 44:59
  SPEAKER_01: And that seemed just a bit, I've got I've got a pretty adventurous kind of, you know, uh attitude, but that seemed a little bit too risky.
• 45:08
  SPEAKER_01: And so, you know, it was that kind of safety blanket.
• 45:11
  SPEAKER_01: Well, you know, I've just purchased my first property, and I'm also, you know, I who knows, who knows how this was gonna go.
• 45:20
  SPEAKER_00: So that financial security was a concern for you taking a step into a world of the unknown.
• 45:26
  SPEAKER_00: So you've never worked within financial planning before, going self-employed, taking a loan, which a lot of them actually do.
• 45:32
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and um, that was a bit step too far.
• 45:35
  SPEAKER_00: Did you feel as well, though, taking an employed role felt like there was a um a confidence from the company in you as a person, they were investing in you as well?
• 45:45
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah, that's a very good point as well.
• 45:47
  SPEAKER_01: That is kind of you know, well, why would you be paying me if you didn't kind of think you were going to develop me?
• 45:52
  SPEAKER_01: And as an individual, and you know, there was a clear uh structure, there is a clear structure for how to kind of go up through the through the ranks.
• 46:01
  SPEAKER_01: And it's funny actually, because I will eventually go back to being self-employed because uh, you know, becoming a partner of the firm, which is obviously an intention, is then you're becoming self-employed again.
• 46:13
  SPEAKER_01: So it's a bit of a 360.
• 46:15
  SPEAKER_01: Uh so that is an interesting kind of I thought then you know I was gonna be employed then for the rest of my life, but realizing actually to become a part of the partnership, you then go back to self-employed.
• 46:25
  SPEAKER_01: So that is and that's this is the thing with the the industry, not many firms offer their employed uh not as many, not as many as they should.
• 46:38
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I think it will happen over time.
• 46:40
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, um, and we're seeing more and more firms that are now bringing in a better career structure within their business to be able to take somebody on, whether they come in as an administrator to power planners, a financial advisor, or they are transferring their skills from another profession into financial advice.
• 46:55
  SPEAKER_00: And they have to do that because, you know, within the next 10 years, we're losing a huge amount of financial advisors.
• 47:00
  SPEAKER_00: So the pool for good quality financial advisor is going to get less.
• 47:03
  SPEAKER_00: If you look over at accountancy, um, accountancy, solicitor, law, you know, they have those clear structures.
• 47:09
  SPEAKER_00: You can go from university all the way up to partner.
• 47:11
  SPEAKER_00: It's very clear cut.
• 47:13
  SPEAKER_00: Um, financial planning has never really had that.
• 47:15
  SPEAKER_00: Some of the firms have put that in place, and you're starting to see it now come up more and more.
• 47:19
  SPEAKER_00: But what I'm starting to notice also is a lot of the smaller firms, the ones that want to grow, the ones that I consider are in a bit of a startup phase, they're very aware of the um the clear competency framework and the clear career structure required to take somebody from no experience all the way up to financial planner.
• 47:39
  SPEAKER_00: And a lot of them are then using the government funding through the NV, you know, through um apprenticeship.
• 47:45
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, apprenticeship.
• 47:46
  SPEAKER_00: You could call it the financial advisor school or something like that.
• 47:49
  SPEAKER_00: You know, the word apprenticeship has always had negative connotations of like you were a mechanic or something like that.
• 47:54
  SPEAKER_00: 16-year-old, yeah.
• 47:55
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, 16-year-old.
• 47:56
  SPEAKER_00: Whereas actually, you know, a lot of the firms are now using that, getting the benefit from the government, the training, development, taking that and then building that into their programs.
• 48:06
  SPEAKER_00: And that's an excellent route, I see, because not everybody is going to be an advisor within, you know, two, three years.
• 48:14
  SPEAKER_00: And I think, you know, it's a great route starting as an administrator, great route starting as a power planner, and shadowing and listening and observing, because you can't just go from one to the other rapidly.
• 48:27
  SPEAKER_00: You know, some people can, and you know, you'll have the anomaly, but there's a huge amount to learn.
• 48:32
  SPEAKER_00: And you were quite lucky because you saw the other side of the fence when you were doing your consultancy work and worked and had the the kind of exposure, if you like, to working with different financial planners and you understood the importance of good compliance, and now that's coming up with your competent advisor status.
• 48:51
  SPEAKER_00: Let's just quickly touch on competent advisor status then.
• 48:53
  SPEAKER_00: So, being on the other end, now you're the advisor and you're getting everything signed off, looked at, and everything.
• 48:59
  SPEAKER_00: Talk to me about competent advisor status.
• 49:01
  SPEAKER_00: What should somebody expect when they go into a role and someone says, competent advisor status?
• 49:06
  SPEAKER_00: What do you think someone should be aware of?
• 49:09
  SPEAKER_01: Uh the scrutiny that basically advisors come under now.
• 49:15
  SPEAKER_01: Uh obviously, you know, back in the day it wasn't as regulated, which is only for now that it is further uh more regulated, it's better for the client.
• 49:24
  SPEAKER_01: But the scrutiny, the difficulty of actually the the depth that they want to see, the amount of uh the amount of kind of information that you need to be uploading to you know the systems in order to ensure that if anything happened in 10 years, 20 years time, that you've got everything backed up.
• 49:43
  SPEAKER_01: And that is really what is happening with the industry.
• 49:48
  SPEAKER_01: It's taken a lot of time to kind of go through competence advisor status, and it's also taken a lot of you know attention, where actually you've got to be really, really focused, actually ensuring that each detail is kind of documented, each document has been uploaded.
• 50:07
  SPEAKER_01: It is a it's a pretty strenuous process.
• 50:10
  SPEAKER_01: It's yeah, it is, but you know, it's it's only right for the clients and and also you're only gonna get quicker at it as well.
• 50:19
  SPEAKER_01: You know, you just take your time.
• 50:20
  SPEAKER_00: So when you hear about becoming a financial planner and the financial planning firm have got administrators and they've got power planners, etc., you know, is your experience so far of working in the profession that you are doing your own, you know, fact finds and from a competency advice perspective, is there a hell of a lot more um administration on your end, let's say, than you thought there would be?
• 50:44
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, a hell of a lot more.
• 50:45
  SPEAKER_01: I thought it was just going out, meeting clients, you know, handing over the work and then walking off and going to meet another client.
• 50:53
  SPEAKER_01: It sounded ideal.
• 50:55
  SPEAKER_01: And you don't see this side of it, you know, you don't see anyone ringing the provider, you don't see them, right?
• 51:01
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, have you got that information from my client for my client?
• 51:04
  SPEAKER_01: You don't see this side of it.
• 51:05
  SPEAKER_01: And there is a lot more administrative side to the process that I wasn't aware of, and it's really eye-opening.
• 51:12
  SPEAKER_01: It is really eye-opening, and it kind of does, you know, one of the things where people think, you know, financial advice, people think there's a few things, people think it's basically a bit more expensive than what it actually is.
• 51:26
  SPEAKER_01: But also I do think that actually uh, you know, this whole slowing down and uploading everything and making the process pretty lengthy actually does mean that then, you know, you have to value your time cost-wise because it can take, you know, three days to work on one client, and therefore that can increase the cost of advice.
• 51:50
  SPEAKER_01: And what I want to see is really kind of, you know, ideally for myself is uh I get people to do that from the administrative side, you know, get someone in, and then they can do that, they can learn that process, you know.
• 52:04
  SPEAKER_01: And as you say, basically, the best way to learn for sure in this industry, I think, is to start off on the administrative side, then the power planning, uh doing your qualifications as you go along, and then become an advisor.
• 52:16
  SPEAKER_01: And what I would always say with that as well is just be patient, be patient because you know you might think to yourself, I'm gonna be an advisor in two years' time, and actually you're not an advisor in two years' time, don't worry, you know, as long as the there's an obvious clear path that you actually are going to become an advisor, like you said with regards to the law firms, you know, as long as you can see a clear path, then you just gotta be patient and ensure that actually I'm going to be here and I'm going to become an advisor.
• 52:44
  SPEAKER_00: So you were looking for a new job, you were looking to become a financial planner.
• 52:48
  SPEAKER_00: It's important when you're in that position that you don't just take anything that comes along.
• 52:54
  SPEAKER_00: I I truly believe as well.
• 52:55
  SPEAKER_00: And Rita, based on what you just said there, I think it's really important that as the candidate, talking to the client, so the person who's looking to hire, that you question their career structure, personal development plan, and where they will invest time, energy in training and development for you to be able to achieve your goal of, say, becoming an advisor within two to three years, you know?
• 53:22
  SPEAKER_00: And what do they have in place that will support them?
• 53:24
  SPEAKER_00: But I also think one of the big questions to ask is who have you done this with before in the past?
• 53:30
  SPEAKER_00: Is there anybody within your business that I would love to talk to that's gone through the process and has uh a really positive experience?
• 53:38
  SPEAKER_00: Because when there aren't as many financial advice companies hiring somebody without experience, you become sometimes a little desperate and you think you should just take what's thrown at you.
• 53:50
  SPEAKER_00: But I think there's a great way to establish if you a couple of people have come back to me.
• 53:57
  SPEAKER_00: Two people in the last couple of weeks took a job, um, one way more money than I offered than I got him.
• 54:04
  SPEAKER_00: So he took a different job with a different company, way more money, doesn't like it, it's getting no training, no support.
• 54:09
  SPEAKER_00: He's just sat in his back bedroom, had to move and all that kind of stuff as well.
• 54:12
  SPEAKER_00: And he's come back to me and said it.
• 54:14
  SPEAKER_00: And another guy took an employed role um with a company, promised the earth, and he's um had to leave in the first couple of months.
• 54:22
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, exactly.
• 54:23
  SPEAKER_00: Because they can't cope.
• 54:24
  SPEAKER_00: It just doesn't, it doesn't match the expectation um that they had, you know, based on their level of experience.
• 54:31
  SPEAKER_00: So it's very, very important that you know the candidate, the person being interviewed, is also interviewing exactly the employer to make sure that you're not wasting your time because there's nothing worse than wasting your time.
• 54:43
  SPEAKER_00: It is a bit of experience, and you always take that away from it.
• 54:47
  SPEAKER_00: But if it doesn't feel right, it's probably not right, is what I always say.
• 54:52
  SPEAKER_01: That is so true.
• 54:53
  SPEAKER_01: And it's a two-way process, as you say, you've got to interview them as well and to understand and it understand actually what processes they have in place.
• 55:00
  SPEAKER_01: And you you're so right.
• 55:02
  SPEAKER_01: If it doesn't feel right, then yeah, it's probably not right.
• 55:05
  SPEAKER_01: And and that is what it comes to when I basically turned down a couple of roles, you know.
• 55:10
  SPEAKER_01: I was dead, I was pretty, you know, really focused on actually doing this, and actually I had to take a little bit of back step.
• 55:16
  SPEAKER_01: I had a couple of weeks to think about it, and I kind of was like, you know what, let's just have a little bit of time out here just to think and ensure that this is definitely the right role.
• 55:25
  SPEAKER_01: Do I want to be taken on a loan, for example?
• 55:27
  SPEAKER_01: It seemed very adventurous, and yeah, you and then you've got to really ensure that actually it's the company that basically suits you.
• 55:37
  SPEAKER_01: And yeah, I and as you say though, you know, this apprenticeship levy is so important as well.
• 55:43
  SPEAKER_01: That actually get the qualification, you know, the government are going to pay for your qualifications, the company don't have to pay for it.
• 55:50
  SPEAKER_01: And as long as you can see a clear structure, that means that you will give advice eventually.
• 55:55
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, then that is when you, you know, the bite you bite your hand off, you bite their hand off, sorry.
• 56:00
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
• 56:01
  SPEAKER_00: All right, great stuff.
• 56:02
  SPEAKER_00: Um, another area you just touched on a second ago is that you've been on holiday, you were doing a bit of work when you were on holiday.
• 56:08
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 56:09
  SPEAKER_00: You, your expectation, let's say, of the role before you got into it is far different to what it the reality of it actually is.
• 56:17
  SPEAKER_00: Can you just kind of touch on it?
• 56:18
  SPEAKER_00: Because we live in this world now where everybody wants work-life balance and you know, wants to live the life that they want to live and have all the benefits and all the well-being propositions that go with it and a stress-free life.
• 56:30
  SPEAKER_00: And I get that, you know, we do want those types of things.
• 56:33
  SPEAKER_00: But in the role of a financial planner, going into it in those early stages, there is a lot of work, isn't there?
• 56:40
  SPEAKER_00: And there's a lot of your time taken up with learning, a lot of your time taken up with um client development, perhaps some evening work where you can't get hold of clients in the day, so you've got to speak to them in the evening.
• 56:52
  SPEAKER_00: What is the reality, you know, of uh work-life balance within your first year so far?
• 56:59
  SPEAKER_00: Has it been quite tough?
• 57:00
  SPEAKER_00: Have you had to do the extra work?
• 57:02
  SPEAKER_00: And also, is it okay to do that extra work?
• 57:05
  SPEAKER_00: Do you feel good about doing it because it's progressing your skill set and you know that in the end that you're gonna probably know more?
• 57:11
  SPEAKER_00: So therefore, you gain that time back in the future?
• 57:14
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's it.
• 57:15
  SPEAKER_01: Like the first year has been pretty crazy, really.
• 57:18
  SPEAKER_01: Long hours working during holiday, which is, you know, not what I used to do when I was a consultant, was kind of leave everything there.
• 57:26
  SPEAKER_01: And and you know, you're doing long hours, and and you basically think to yourself, well, actually, I was given a couple of snippets of information which were really powerful while interviewing in different uh places.
• 57:38
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, you know, the first two years is going to be the hardest two years, and that then allows you to kind of you know spread your seed and make sure that everyone knows that you're actually doing you know, giving advice.
• 57:51
  SPEAKER_01: And then that then, you know, you um you know you do well off that because you've put in the first two years of of work.
• 58:00
  SPEAKER_01: You've you've really you've and I've got another year of it, and it's kind of something I envision, you know, another year's work, and then after that, hopefully everything should be in place.
• 58:10
  SPEAKER_01: The foundations are built, and you kind of then just grow upon that.
• 58:13
  SPEAKER_01: Uh so yeah, the first year has been yeah, long hours and a lot of work, but you know, it's it's for the for the long term, you know, you've got to perceive beyond the short-term pain.
• 58:23
  SPEAKER_00: And we all have targets within our roles, you know, financial planning is no different.
• 58:28
  SPEAKER_00: It can't be considered a sales role, but you still have income targets to achieve.
• 58:32
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and you still have a certain level of assets under management, for example, to bring in on a fee basis to be able to cover your costs.
• 58:39
  SPEAKER_00: Now, do you sort of do you have you got a plan in place?
• 58:42
  SPEAKER_00: Like you mentioned there, another year.
• 58:45
  SPEAKER_00: Is that because you've got a specific target of assets under management that you want to hit, a goal?
• 58:50
  SPEAKER_00: Or, you know, how have you determined that it's a couple of years of hard work?
• 58:55
  SPEAKER_01: So I've ideally what I want to be doing in a year's time is taking someone on and having then someone to do the administrative side.
• 59:03
  SPEAKER_01: And then that means I can uh you know go out and give further advice, you know, more advice to more clients.
• 59:09
  SPEAKER_01: Uh that is really, you know, the plan.
• 59:13
  SPEAKER_01: Uh and ultimately it means that I have to have a certain amount of clients first and foremost before I do that, and also I have to have a certain amount of assets under management before I do that as well, because then that gives me you know a good foundation.
• 59:27
  SPEAKER_01: And also that means that I'll hopefully be partner as well uh within a year's time.
• 59:33
  SPEAKER_01: So, you know, um it's basically December 2022, that's the goal.
• 59:38
  SPEAKER_01: And setting the setting that goals, you know, um setting a pretty uh stretched target, but that's the aim of the game.
• 59:46
  SPEAKER_00: I think it's hugely important to have a a career-based framework that can you can see in front of you based on your level of performance, whether it be competency-based performance, but also your level of income that you're bringing into the business, the types of clients that you're bringing in, that there is a path for you that can get you all the way to that part of the level, confidently, knowing at each stage and you can review it and you can tweak things and you can change things.
• 1:00:10
  SPEAKER_00: There's nothing worse than starting a job, and then you haven't got a clue where you're going or how long it's gonna get, you know, how long it's gonna take you to get there.
• 1:00:16
  SPEAKER_00: And and as a recruitment agency, I've retweaked ours recently.
• 1:00:20
  SPEAKER_00: So someone can literally start as a trainee, and we've really, we're really not dumbed down the trainee role, that's the wrong word.
• 1:00:26
  SPEAKER_00: We've made it very simple the trainee role.
• 1:00:28
  SPEAKER_00: So they have to achieve certain targets to move up to recruitment consultant, to move up to senior, to move up to the associate, to move up to director.
• 1:00:36
  SPEAKER_00: But in each of those stages, they can clearly see exactly what it is they're going to achieve every step of the way, how much they're potentially going to earn, what it means to them.
• 1:00:44
  SPEAKER_00: Is there a route they can go down management?
• 1:00:46
  SPEAKER_00: Is there a route that they can go down just principal consultant, for instance?
• 1:00:49
  SPEAKER_00: What benefits do they get on top of that?
• 1:00:51
  SPEAKER_00: You know, and it's once I've now I've done that, and where I hadn't had that before, it's like, oh God, like why didn't I have that?
• 1:01:00
  SPEAKER_00: Because these people need it.
• 1:01:01
  SPEAKER_00: I need it, I need a plan.
• 1:01:02
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I need a plan.
• 1:01:04
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:01:05
  SPEAKER_01: You need that visualization, don't you?
• 1:01:06
  SPEAKER_01: You need to see it clearly and right, okay, that's the next step.
• 1:01:09
  SPEAKER_01: That's the next step, that's the next step.
• 1:01:11
  SPEAKER_01: And it's pretty becomes pretty evident, right?
• 1:01:13
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, this is what I need to do.
• 1:01:14
  SPEAKER_00: And that's my advice to any companies that are listening today is make sure you've got your competency framework in place, make sure you've got a career framework in place.
• 1:01:21
  SPEAKER_00: Can it take somebody all the way from administrator, all the way up to financial advisor?
• 1:01:26
  SPEAKER_00: How long will it take?
• 1:01:27
  SPEAKER_00: Build a recruitment model around that, go out there to the market and people who love it, you know, and you'll hire the best talent that way.
• 1:01:33
  SPEAKER_00: And if you can use things like the government levy around apprenticeships, then use it because it's absolutely going to add value.
• 1:01:40
  SPEAKER_00: You know, it's going to save you time, it's going to save you money.
• 1:01:43
  SPEAKER_00: But also, again, it will attract the right people to the business because you've got that confidence in them that you're going to, they're going to have that confidence in you.
• 1:01:49
  SPEAKER_00: Sorry, that you've um you're investing in their personal development and you've put a plan that's clearly defined in front of them.
• 1:01:54
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 1:01:54
  SPEAKER_01: And do you know the apprenticeship levy?
• 1:01:56
  SPEAKER_01: So I know with regards to the qualifications, basically, that they definitely put you through the qualifications.
• 1:02:03
  SPEAKER_01: Do you do you know if it's any further with kind of subsidies regarding kind of uh you know, while they're going through the qualifications, that they would subsidize any wage or anything like that?
• 1:02:12
  SPEAKER_00: Or is that am I it's a specific amount that the government will give?
• 1:02:20
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I can't remember how much it is towards there's like a there's like an there's like a bonus incentive for taking somebody on.
• 1:02:26
  SPEAKER_00: So like that firm might get 2,000, 3,000 quid.
• 1:02:29
  SPEAKER_00: Right, yeah.
• 1:02:30
  SPEAKER_00: And they'll pay like 90% of the qualifications and the training on the side of that as well.
• 1:02:35
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, okay, yeah.
• 1:02:36
  SPEAKER_00: So it's kind of like they might get like 3,000 quid off the salary or something like that.
• 1:02:41
  SPEAKER_00: So it's not like a huge saving.
• 1:02:45
  SPEAKER_00: The saving kind of comes in via the paying the qualification and the training and the development to get them through that that qualification.
• 1:02:53
  SPEAKER_00: So if you're a smaller business and you haven't got the time and energy to do the training as well, because you're an advisor owner, let's say, for instance, then it's perfect because you can have that training program running alongside.
• 1:03:04
  SPEAKER_00: You just focus on the kind of soft skill stuff and they do the qualifications so you don't have to as a business owner.
• 1:03:09
  SPEAKER_00: And also you get like an you know, three, I think it's like three grand or something like that, um, that you get towards like the first salary salary or something.
• 1:03:18
  SPEAKER_00: And hopefully by then they're up and running.
• 1:03:19
  SPEAKER_01: I think it's a it's it's a fantastic incentive from the government, actually.
• 1:03:23
  SPEAKER_01: You know, the whole apprenticeship levy and educating people through rather than just going purely educate uh university, actually, you can go to utilize, you know, uh practical kind of work.
• 1:03:34
  SPEAKER_00: They can also, I think, stand to give a bit more to the financial planning profession.
• 1:03:38
  SPEAKER_00: I think they could probably do more around it because good quality financial planners are required.
• 1:03:43
  SPEAKER_00: Um, therefore, it's only going to have add good quality value to the customers that are out there that are missing out on financial advice and it's an area of growth.
• 1:03:51
  SPEAKER_00: You know, we need more financial planners.
• 1:03:52
  SPEAKER_00: So I think they could probably do with giving a bit more money to that size and helping businesses grow because one of the biggest concerns that people have is the cost of hiring.
• 1:04:00
  SPEAKER_00: Cost of hiring is a lot, you know, whether it's taking on somebody, paying a recruitment agency fee, salaries, you know, an advisor, you know, a trainee advisor isn't paying for themselves for a good year, two years.
• 1:04:11
  SPEAKER_00: So it's a big outlay.
• 1:04:13
  SPEAKER_00: There's that fear attached to it that if they take that person on, that they get good and they just leave, you know, and go and join another firm because they're qualified and they've got experience, and all of a sudden that person's candidature in the market shoots up.
• 1:04:25
  SPEAKER_00: You know, someone's got two years' experience as a financial advisor.
• 1:04:28
  SPEAKER_00: Perhaps that firm took them on for 25 grand.
• 1:04:30
  SPEAKER_00: Once they've got two years' experience, they can go and get a 50 grand salary, you know.
• 1:04:34
  SPEAKER_01: People are after you, really, aren't they?
• 1:04:36
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, it's uh, you know, it's you are uh a commodity, you know, you're a very sought-after commodity.
• 1:04:42
  SPEAKER_01: But then it's cut then again it goes back to the structure, doesn't it?
• 1:04:45
  SPEAKER_01: To ensure that actually the structure's there.
• 1:04:47
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah and then you can see the clear pathway.
• 1:04:50
  SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
• 1:04:50
  SPEAKER_01: That then means exactly, rather than you basically going, well, you know what, someone's contacted me and it's you know, they're offering 20 grand more, but actually, well, what what does that role actually offer?
• 1:05:02
  SPEAKER_01: You know, yeah.
• 1:05:03
  SPEAKER_00: Why would some you know, why would someone stay with your firm if you haven't made it very clear of what they can expect within that role?
• 1:05:11
  SPEAKER_00: If you make it incredibly clear clear, it's transparent and they are working towards something, it's a hell of a lot harder to leave a company because you're leaving it all behind.
• 1:05:20
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
• 1:05:21
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, never chase the cash, let the cash chase you.
• 1:05:25
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 1:05:26
  SPEAKER_01: I've I've I thought that was a good never chase the cash.
• 1:05:29
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 1:05:30
  SPEAKER_00: It's a tough one though, isn't it?
• 1:05:31
  SPEAKER_00: Because we all want more money.
• 1:05:33
  SPEAKER_01: Well, that's it, you know.
• 1:05:34
  SPEAKER_01: But if you keep on doing the right things at the right times, and you know, you then I think it just naturally happens.
• 1:05:40
  SPEAKER_01: Um exactly, exactly.
• 1:05:44
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, and it's been an absolute pleasure talking to you today, and and um it's great to have you on for you talking about your first year because I think it's really beneficial to people listening to this because they don't have a great expectation of what's going to happen within that first year and the you know, the processing that comes to interviews and how long it takes and the realities of the role.
• 1:06:01
  SPEAKER_00: So Able Stokes sound like you know, they're doing a fantastic job, you know, getting somebody like your background skill set, seeing that, and then bringing you into the business and training and developing you up.
• 1:06:10
  SPEAKER_00: So it sounds like you found a really, really good home there.
• 1:06:13
  SPEAKER_00: Um, it's been a while since we've done I've done anything with Able Stokes.
• 1:06:17
  SPEAKER_00: So I perhaps maybe you should do an introduction with me or somebody there because there's plenty of people I know could fit that model really, really well.
• 1:06:24
  SPEAKER_00: Cool.
• 1:06:24
  SPEAKER_00: That'd be good for us to have a little catch-up on that.
• 1:06:26
  SPEAKER_00: A bit of business on the side that, you know, as well as that's it.
• 1:06:28
  SPEAKER_01: Always, always, always find an angle.
• 1:06:31
  SPEAKER_01: Uh yeah, definitely.
• 1:06:33
  SPEAKER_01: Why why not?
• 1:06:34
  SPEAKER_01: And oh, hopefully we can work together in the future as well.
• 1:06:37
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, 100%.
• 1:06:38
  SPEAKER_00: I'm always keen to speak to you, Kieran.
• 1:06:39
  SPEAKER_00: Obviously, we've started the relationship now, and it's um, you know, we've been speaking on me on on and off for the last year, and it's always a pleasure.
• 1:06:44
  SPEAKER_00: It's great to put a face face to you know to a voice as well.
• 1:06:48
  SPEAKER_00: And thank you so much for for coming on the podcast today.
• 1:06:51
  SPEAKER_01: Awesome.
• 1:06:51
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you for having me.
• 1:06:52
  SPEAKER_01: Nice one.
• 1:06:53
  SPEAKER_01: Thanks, Kieran.
• 1:06:54
  SPEAKER_01: Top man.