Latest / Nightmare Success In and Out / “Criminal Law, Politics, and Redemption” Meet Lawrence Blackmon

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“Criminal Law, Politics, and Redemption” Meet Lawrence Blackmon · Nightmare Success In and Out

0:01
What happens when your worst fear becomes your reality?
0:04
Hi, I'm Brent Cassidy, welcome to the Nightmare Success In and
0:07
Out podcast where we explore how to overcome your fears and
0:10
nightmares that set yourself free.
0:13
We're going to be exploring this topic with guys that was in
0:15
Leavenworth with and others who survived their own nightmare.
0:20
These stories can be inspiring, sometimes sad.
0:23
There's some humor, but hopefully you can come away with
0:26
a nugget of something that'll help you knock down some of the
0:28
prisons you built up in your own mind.
0:31
All right, welcome back. I'm our success in and out.
0:34
Listeners, this is where you come from.
0:35
What happens when your worst fear becomes your reality?
0:37
How do you adapt, survive, overcome, set yourself free.
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And folks, I know I sound like a broken record, but don't forget
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to follow, subscribe, share this thing out, like it up really
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helps the show and I really appreciate it.
0:48
So who are we talking to today? Well, I just, it's interesting,
0:54
interesting guy. Where?
0:55
So it's Lawrence Blackman. He's a defense attorney.
0:59
He's currently serves as a representative in the
1:02
Mississippi House. So he is in politics.
1:05
He is in politics, making things happen.
1:07
Not to laugh. He's also the CEO of Legalese
1:12
and we were just talking about this before we got on.
1:15
He's behind the team is it's bringing out expungement AI.
1:20
And we're going to talk about that because this is something
1:22
that Lawrence was personally involved with when he was
1:25
applying to Life Law school, figured out that it was really
1:29
something that he could make it a lot easier for people.
1:33
And he was getting a lot of phone calls about expungement.
1:35
So he said, hey, why don't I just figure out how to make this
1:37
happen and he's making it happen.
1:40
So I can't wait to jump into all this with Lawrence.
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he went through to get exonerated.
3:01
So let's jump into this. Lawrence Blackman, How are you
3:05
my man? I'm doing well Brett.
3:07
Thank you for having me on. Looking forward to a live in the
3:11
conversation. Well, I appreciate, I want to go
3:13
back a little bit in your in in your background because in
3:18
reading up on you, I know your dad was a guy that was in
3:21
politics. So you kind of grew up in that
3:23
world. Can you take us back a little
3:25
bit about what it was like as little Lawrence Blackman growing
3:28
up and and what that household was like at that time?
3:31
Yeah. So my, my dad wasn't, my dad is
3:34
an attorney and he was also a representative in the
3:38
Mississippi House of Representatives for 40 years.
3:41
And so it's a long time. Yes, a long time.
3:44
My dad started practicing law in 1973.
3:49
And so here in Mississippi, especially back then, there
3:52
weren't a lot of black attorneys, right?
3:54
And so he was kind of like an anomaly in our community.
3:57
And so growing up with her, with a father who is has that kind of
4:03
standing in the community was really a unique position for me
4:06
in Mississippi. But it showed me the value of
4:11
hard work, right? And how much of a difference one
4:14
person can make if they prepare themselves to be of use and of
4:19
value to the community. And so, you know, I always
4:23
wanted to emulate that as much as possible.
4:25
And it was really a guiding force for me as I, as I grew up.
4:29
You know, I knew that I had to finish high school because I had
4:32
to get to law school, right? I know I had to get into
4:35
undergrad and I had to finish undergrad because I had to get
4:37
to law school. So I always had this kind of
4:39
North star of who I wanted to be and, and where I wanted to be in
4:42
life. And so that was that was really
4:44
impactful. For me, that's interesting
4:45
because as a young kid, you know, you know, your dad is
4:49
bigger than life. Obviously he was an attorney.
4:52
Did you automatically think that's what I want to do?
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I want to be an attorney? I want to get into all that that
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just. Kind of, yeah.
4:59
I never, you know, I think that people kind of spoke that over
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me before I had an opportunity to have an idea of anything else
5:09
that I maybe, you know, so people always say, oh, you look
5:11
just like you did. Oh, you speak just like, oh,
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you're going to be an attorney just like him.
5:15
And so I kind of adopted that. You just took that on.
5:18
I took it on and so I never, I never thought that I wanted to
5:22
be anything else outside of a veterinarian.
5:25
I wanted to be a veterinarian for a while, and I worked on a
5:28
farm when I was young, and we had a veterinarian that would
5:32
come every few months, and he would check the cattle and sheep
5:35
and things. And so I was speaking to him
5:38
when I was a junior in high school.
5:40
And so he asked me to make a list of the things that were
5:42
important to me. And so I really see, you know,
5:45
helping people, helping animals, making money.
5:48
And he said, well, how important is that one making money?
5:50
And I said, that's really important.
5:52
He said OK, go to law school. I love it.
5:58
And so that was. Rearranged.
5:59
After that, yeah, after that I said I was going to go to law
6:02
school and and I and I did. Let's talk about that.
6:05
Going to law school because you had something happened to you
6:10
that you thought was not ever going to come up because it was
6:15
dismissed. Can you tell us this, that
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because a lot of people have something like that happen where
6:20
they have something, a suspended imposition sentence where they
6:23
think that it's gone and then it comes back and it wasn't
6:27
expunged and they thought it was over and, and, and squeezed out
6:31
of there. But you had something happen to
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you that happened earlier in your life that when you're going
6:36
to law school, all of a sudden it reappears.
6:39
That's right. Yeah.
6:40
So I went to undergrad at Howard University and I saw we all, I
6:45
know, we all know that Howard University is in Washington, DC
6:48
Washington, DC is a it's a really great and beautiful city
6:52
outside of Capitol Hill where all of the politics is
6:54
happening. And so, you know, I was in
6:56
undergrad. I'm having a good time like
6:58
folks in undergrad do. I'm on New Street one Friday
7:02
night. We're partying, we're bar
7:03
hopping and taking shots. And so I hit an alley to take a
7:06
leak right quick, right. And next thing I know, blue
7:08
lights on me, my upstate right. And I actually got arrested for
7:12
that. I was like, man, this has got
7:13
harsh, you know, But anyway, I spent a night in jail.
7:17
The next day they're rounding us all up in the in the waiting
7:22
area and, and they made 2 lines, right?
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And so they had a list of people who had to go in front of the
7:27
judge and then this other line, it was just like three of us.
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And they said you 3, your charges are dismissed.
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And I was like, oh great. No explanation as to why, no
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anything. They just you.
7:37
Didn't have to do anything, they had already decided they were
7:40
going to dismiss you out of there.
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That's right. So I guess, and as an attorney
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now I know that they probably presented it to a prosecutor and
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they were like, get this out of here.
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This is there's nothing. Here I need to deal with this.
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I was like, oh, my God. You know, thank God.
7:54
No harm, no foul. I didn't tell my dad at that
7:57
point because I felt like I didn't need to, right?
8:00
This is right in my past. I'll never tell anybody about
8:03
this. Yeah, Fast forward, I'm applying
8:05
to law school and on the application they're asking me to
8:09
list everywhere I've ever lived, everything I've ever done, every
8:12
day of my life. I've had any interactions with
8:14
the police listed. And I'm like, Oh my God, I had
8:18
that arrest. And so I'm like Googling, you
8:21
know, can this stop me from getting to law school?
8:23
I'm on these Reddit threads and they're like, maybe.
8:26
And I'm like, Oh my God. Because all I ever wanted to be
8:28
was a lawyer. And so here I had this thing
8:31
from my past catching up to me in a way that I'd never imagined
8:35
it. So I sat down with my dad and I
8:37
finally come came clean about what happened all those years
8:39
ago. And he said, son, you need to
8:41
get an expungement. And so that that opened up that
8:44
world of record clearing to me, right?
8:46
And gave me my own personal experience.
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I paid 25, $500. I thought that was a deal
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because the first guy who I reached out to quoted me $5000.
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And I was like, man, this must be some really serious work,
8:58
right? And so I paid and I, I got it.
9:00
I got it off my record. But as I came into practice
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myself, Brit, I'm getting calls from people all the time, like,
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hey, you know, do you do expungement?
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It's cold calling the way I did. I did when I needed one myself.
9:11
And I'm like, yeah. And I realized that the work is
9:14
so formulaic, right? You know, you fill out the form,
9:18
it's always the same information, name, date of
9:20
birth, Social Security number, arresting agency.
9:23
And it takes about 5 minutes. And I said to myself, wow, you
9:27
know, millions of people are having interactions with the
9:32
police every single year, and all of them are not resulting in
9:36
convictions. So all of those are going to be
9:38
eligible for expression. Some are resulting in
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convictions, but even maybe up to half of those are going to
9:45
become eligible for expungement at some point.
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But nobody is speaking to this huge swathe of the American
9:51
public who need record clearing assistance from attorneys.
9:54
We all just kind of take of them as they come, right?
9:57
And I'd say, well, if anybody was doing this at scale, this
10:01
can be huge. This could be huge.
10:03
And so I called up my good friend from undergrad and I
10:05
said, man, if we could just build something that would allow
10:07
us to assist people with expungement work all across the
10:11
United States, we could be the Morgan and Morgan of record
10:15
clearing, right? And so that was a huge
10:16
opportunity, which represented a huge blind spot in the legal
10:20
market. And so we just began to tackle
10:22
that about three years ago. And and and since then we've had
10:25
some amazing, amazing results. So Lawrence, if somebody I'm I'm
10:31
assuming that you like you said, this is this is not just in
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Mississippi, this is something that's a national for platform
10:39
that the people can go to. Is it called expungement AI dot
10:43
AI? Yeah.
10:44
So expungement dot AI is the flagship platform for Legal
10:49
ease. Legal ease is the startup and
10:52
you can use expungement.aioryoucangothroughlegalese.com.
10:57
Or go to legalese.com, because there's a lot of people that
11:00
listen to this show that have had issues with, you know, and
11:06
expungement is a big one of the things you and I were talking
11:09
about is, is that I think there's 49 states that have some
11:12
form of expungement. I don't think Alaska does.
11:15
I'm not even sure why they don't, but.
11:17
Alaska and Alabama don't. Alabama doesn't OK, so there's
11:22
there's the vast majority of states has some form of
11:27
expungement. So this, you know, 48 states out
11:29
of 50 and there's a lot of people that are and there's a
11:35
lot of newer legislation that's gone on.
11:38
This made it easier for especially California passed
11:41
something recently within the last couple of years, I know
11:44
Missouri has gotten into making it easier for people.
11:48
And so these this form that you have people just go to legalese
11:55
or they go to expungement dot AI and they can just get involved
11:58
with whatever it is. I'm assuming Lawrence, it just
12:03
walks them through, just walks them through what they've got to
12:05
do. Yeah.
12:06
And so we use artificial intelligence as a guide, right?
12:10
And so your personal legal assistant with legalese is
12:14
Wilma. Wilma is a personal guide
12:16
through the expungement process. And So what she does is exactly
12:20
what a lawyer would do if somebody called my office right
12:23
now or came into my office and they needed an expungement, I
12:26
would start off with a set of questions, right, to determine
12:28
whether or not they're eligible. Once I determine that a person
12:32
is eligible, then I would begin with a different set of
12:35
questions that would then go into a petition to be printed
12:38
out and submitted to the clerk's office for expungement right on
12:45
a platform. Wilma will ask you the same
12:48
questions that an attorney would ask you and she'll help you to
12:50
determine your eligibility. Once eligibility is determined,
12:54
then a second set of questions will then be asked that will
12:59
generate A petition for a person to submit.
13:01
Now, Mississippi is unique in that in a lot of our
13:04
jurisdictions, your paperwork has to actually be submitted
13:07
directly to the clerk. But in some other jurisdictions,
13:10
we're working with a company that is going to give us direct
13:13
access to the online filing systems that the court used that
13:17
would allow people to file directly online.
13:19
And so that's going to be a really revolutionary addition to
13:22
our platform. Well, I love this because, you
13:24
know, a lot of people have the ability to be considered for
13:30
expungement. They don't do it because they
13:32
don't know the steps or how to do it.
13:33
So I love this is, it's just a platform you can go in and just
13:37
get into it. You can just start doing it
13:39
without an attorney and, and get a long ways down the road to get
13:44
into what you want to get. And expungement is such a big
13:47
deal. I mean, it's, it's, you know, we
13:49
talk about when people are released from prison, you know,
13:53
the, the, the top three things that, that when they've done
13:56
these, you know, surveys, you know, obviously getting a job,
14:01
obviously finding a place to live and, and community is
14:05
number 3. But that thing of getting a job
14:08
and, and getting a place to live, it's a place also where
14:12
you can legally discriminate against people if they have a
14:15
record, right. And expungement really truly
14:19
allows people to get a fresh, real start so that they don't
14:24
have to go over that wall, that gigantic barrier wall when
14:27
they're just trying to get a place to live or they're just
14:30
trying to get any job. And expungement can help that
14:35
process. Just like, you know, it's like a
14:37
turbo shot for somebody when they're they're, you know,
14:41
looking to get the best opportunity they can to get
14:43
their second opportunity. I think one of the unfortunate
14:46
things, Brett, is that, you know, any interaction with
14:50
police, whether it results in a conviction or not, and kind of
14:53
you walk away from that almost with like a scarlet letter,
14:56
right? I mean, it goes on to your
14:58
record. There's no context about what
14:59
happened. And so anytime somebody looks
15:02
you up, whether it's for getting an apartment or rent your own
15:06
housing, or if you want to coach a Little League team, or if
15:08
you're looking to get into professional school or you're
15:12
getting a promotion at a job, these things pop up.
15:15
And you have some instances where a person has been living
15:17
their life, they've got other jobs and had other opportunities
15:21
and it never came up. And now all of a sudden, for
15:24
whatever reason, with, with, with this opportunity is, is
15:28
popping up something old. And they didn't even know it was
15:30
still there. And it, they, they've become
15:33
almost desperate, right, Because they're right on the verge,
15:36
right on the cusp of, of, of moving up, right, of making some
15:40
type of, of move in their life. And now all of a sudden they're
15:44
stopped from doing that because someone is saying, hey, this is
15:46
on your record. You, you know, you need to get
15:48
that cleared up before you can move forward.
15:50
And I think that's so unfortunate, right?
15:52
It's so unfair. And So what we're doing is using
15:55
technology, you know, using AI for good to kind of level the
15:58
playing field because, like you said, so many people who are
16:01
eligible don't even take that first step because they don't
16:04
know what to do or because they assume they don't, that they
16:06
don't have the money to. Affordable fear, the unknown,
16:09
It's all unknown. I'm going to have to get an
16:11
attorney. I'm going to have to figure this
16:13
out. I don't know if I have of the
16:14
dollars, I don't know if I can figure out the paper and this
16:16
allows them to get involved and figure it out and I love it.
16:21
I'm also curious, Lawrence, with, with you being a defense
16:27
attorney and, and dealing with the cases that you deal with and
16:32
then also being a state representative, does that play
16:39
into how you approach that job, the state representative job of
16:44
what you bring to the table of what you have over here as a
16:47
defense attorney? Yeah.
16:49
So one thing that I say in terms of your representative, right,
16:53
no matter where you live in the United States, you have,
16:56
everybody knows they have congressional representatives,
16:58
but you also have your local state representatives who
17:01
develop state legislation and state laws, right?
17:04
And so I say that you, you in a representative, you get whatever
17:08
area of expertise, whatever domain expertise they carry with
17:11
them, right? So if you elect a farmer,
17:14
they're going to bring that that knowledge of agriculture and
17:17
farming to the table in the state legislature.
17:20
For me as a defense attorney, as a tech founder, that's what I
17:23
bring to the table and intimate knowledge of the criminal
17:26
justice system for both the good and the bad, right?
17:29
So I understand what works and I understand what doesn't work.
17:32
And so as I legislate on behalf of my district, that's always in
17:35
the back of my mind. You know, I may not know
17:38
everything about every piece of legislation that comes across,
17:41
but that's what I have colleagues for, right?
17:43
And so my, my good friend from across the aisle, Lance Warner,
17:47
he's a farmer, right? And so when agriculture related
17:50
legislation comes up, I look to him, I say, hey, is this good
17:53
for the farmers or is this bad for the farmers?
17:55
And in the same token, a lot of my colleagues look to me when we
17:58
have legislation that comes up about the justice system,
18:01
whether it be in the criminal context or family law.
18:04
And so I try to offer that, you know, that that that insight
18:07
that I have in order to craft and draft better legislation,
18:11
and then also to be able to fight against legislation that I
18:13
know doesn't work. And that has happened before,
18:16
you know, on the floor where, you know, you have somebody who
18:18
is presenting a bill, they're not an attorney.
18:21
It involves the criminal justice system or the justice system.
18:24
And they're kind of advocating for this.
18:26
And I'm saying, you know, ideally in a perfect world, what
18:29
you're saying what makes sense. But let me tell you how this
18:31
would play out in reality and why this is not a good thing for
18:34
Mississippi. And so, you know, that's that's
18:36
what I bring to the table. Well, you know, it's a big topic
18:39
of discussion, the criminal justice system, both on the
18:44
state and federal level and and you're in it.
18:48
What do you think, Lawrence, of, of seeing what you see day in
18:53
day out? What are some of the fixes that
18:56
could make it better? I know we know there there's
18:59
pieces that are broken. Are there, are there real world
19:03
solutions to some of the things that you see daily that if you
19:07
tweaked it that this could, we could take it a step forward and
19:14
a system that most people say has to be fixed, but not
19:18
everybody's wanting to go in and and make the fixes.
19:22
It's a huge undertaking, so I understand why it would be
19:25
intimidating to some people and and some of the things that
19:28
would need to be done are not necessarily things that are
19:31
popular. But one thing I think is that we
19:35
need to do a better job of separating people who can be
19:38
reformed from people who cannot be reformed.
19:41
And we also need to separate the people who are simply criminal
19:45
minded from people who suffer from mental illness, Right.
19:49
The unfortunate thing about mental illness in the United
19:51
States, and this is just across the board, is that we just do
19:53
not have the systems in place to, to, to cater to people who
19:59
have mental illness, right? And so as a result, you know, a
20:03
lot of them are, are just left to be out here in the world
20:06
until they do something that is against the law.
20:08
And then they're thrown into the system that is not necessarily
20:11
equipped to assist them with, with, with coping with a mental
20:16
illness, right? And so they just get thrown into
20:18
the same pile with everybody else.
20:20
And I think that that's bad both, you know, from for the
20:23
people who suffer from mental illness.
20:25
Is bad for the people who have to work in the jails because
20:28
they are exposed to greater danger because they don't are
20:31
not trained or given the proper equipment to deal with certain
20:35
types of inmates. And then the people who are
20:38
incarcerated with them who don't suffer from mental illness or
20:42
put in a position to where they all have to kind of blend and I
20:44
have seen some really bad outcomes with that right you see
20:47
people who are are in the in the system who suffer from mental
20:51
illness. You know, the way that some of
20:53
them are treated in jail, they're left to do the chores
20:56
for other inmates and, you know, really get a bad, a bad
21:01
experience, right? That only exasperates the mental
21:03
illness more. And so I think that we could
21:05
just do a better job of, of separating the situations and,
21:10
and, and of, of, of giving people exactly what they need in
21:13
the system to be able to come out and then become productive
21:17
members of society. And also in addition to that,
21:20
and you kind of alluded to this earlier, you know, when people
21:22
come out of the out of the system, right?
21:24
They've gone in, they served their time and they come back
21:27
into the free world. They're so far behind they,
21:30
they, they have a trouble getting houses, they have
21:32
trouble getting transportation. And if you don't live in a, in a
21:35
metropolitan area where you have sufficient public
21:38
transportation, what is a person left to do right, other than to,
21:42
to try to get it right here, try to get it right there?
21:45
And there's so much pressure on people coming out of the system.
21:48
And I think that that contributes to the, to the high
21:51
level of recidivism that we see in our society.
21:53
And so I just think that from from beginning to end, we have
21:57
to rework our system. I don't think that we ever built
21:59
it to be, to have the capacity that it does for so many people
22:04
caught up. And I think that we need to
22:05
rework the system in a way that, that, that, that caters.
22:09
And, and that's a funny word when you're talking to lawmakers
22:12
about, about people, but, but also they cares to the needs of,
22:17
of, of people who come to the system because reform used to be
22:20
a real thing, right? And I don't hear as much about
22:22
that anymore. But I think we need to get back
22:24
to to reform, reforming people who can be reformed and making
22:28
sure that we distinguish the ones who can from the ones who
22:30
can't so that we can deal with them accordingly.
22:33
And I think you bring up a good point to that.
22:36
The Scarlet Letter everybody if they have a record, they're
22:41
basically put all in one bucket there's no differentiation
22:45
whatsoever. Somebody that has a non, let's
22:49
say they have a non violent offense and it was a one time
22:54
deal that they're in the same bucket as somebody that was did
22:59
something very violent and the the discrimination is basically
23:04
the same. There is no differentiation.
23:06
When you try to go get a house or or housing or a car or
23:11
banking, you know that that's the other thing that we have
23:13
that a lot of people don't take into account is this de banking
23:16
thing. Banks don't have to give a
23:18
reason for just saying no, we won't do business with you
23:23
because of your record. You have a record, you know,
23:26
there's 80 million plus people that have a record.
23:29
So those are people that are having trouble and there's
23:32
there's starting to be some people that are these online
23:35
banks that'll do business with somebody that has, you know, a
23:40
felony record. But that's another equation that
23:44
somebody's dealing with. Lawrence when they get out that,
23:47
Oh my gosh, I can't bank. You know, what do I do that
23:50
that's that's something getting back into society people don't
23:53
think about, but that's pushes people to, you know, these cash
23:56
checking places and other things that are just, you know, with
23:58
the high fees and all that. So you've got, you've got de
24:01
banking, you've got places that you can't get a loan from or
24:07
what does that affect getting a car, getting a place to live?
24:12
And, and those places might just say that they don't want to do
24:15
business with you because they've done a background check.
24:17
And that's just it. So it's like a double, it's like
24:20
a double dip. You know, you got to, you get
24:22
debanked over here, you try to get yourself a car, you try to
24:25
get yourself housing and all of it just layers up into what you
24:28
just LED into was recidivism. And, and, and it, it, it's, it
24:34
becomes like I'm not able to get back into society.
24:39
So I fall back into a place. And that's another thing, a lot
24:44
of people, when they fall back into a place that'll give them
24:46
housing, is in a place that probably isn't the best place
24:48
for them to be. Right.
24:50
That's right. Yeah.
24:51
And it's a place that is, it makes it more likely, right,
24:57
that you're going to get into more of that same kind of stuff,
25:00
you know, And so it's, it's, it's a real conundrum.
25:03
But I really think that we have got to get serious about
25:06
treating mental illness in this in this country because, you
25:10
know, I did a I did a thing last legislative session where I
25:14
started touring the prisons in Mississippi and I didn't get to
25:17
see all of them, but I saw a good number of them.
25:19
And it's just so many people who are or just straight up off of
25:23
their rocker. They, they, they.
25:24
Need so Lawrence on on that basis, do you divide up the
25:28
prison system and people who have mental disorders, mental
25:32
conditions do do they do we house and treat them differently
25:37
so they can be treated Is that is that a is that what should be
25:41
done? I, I think so.
25:43
I think so. I think that we should, we
25:45
should differentiate people who are just like I said, criminally
25:49
minded from those who are mentally ill.
25:53
And that is the driving force between behind, you know, the
25:56
things that they've done to end up in the system.
25:59
I think we should separate them and give them the treatment that
26:02
they need so that they can have a greater likelihood of being
26:06
able to come out and, and, and, and overcome their mental
26:09
illness. I don't think that it does them
26:10
any good to be thrown into the pot with everybody else and then
26:14
go to jail and have this this over stimulating experience that
26:18
leaves them worse off when they're getting out in terms of
26:21
of their mental health than they were when they came in.
26:24
Yeah, because everything that we're talking about, everybody
26:26
wants a safer society. So if, if we can take somebody
26:30
that has a mental illness and treat them and not just throw
26:35
them into prison environment, but actually have them treated
26:39
and they could get better, then when they're released back into
26:43
society, you have a safer society again.
26:45
So I, I think everything, the, the guiding light should be most
26:50
of these people are going to go home.
26:52
So how do we get these people home where everybody has a safer
26:57
society? That's, you know, that's the the
27:00
secret, you know, ingredient that I think.
27:02
We also have to like we have to bring back the deterrent, the
27:06
deterrent factor some, you know, and one thing that I have
27:09
noticed is that, you know, so many people in independence
27:12
history now have access to cell phones, They're on social media,
27:16
they're gambling on Sundays with, with the games and stuff
27:19
like that. And I think that if, if, if the
27:21
word in society is that, you know, if you go to prison, you
27:25
could pretty much you don't have your life hanging out with your
27:28
homeboys and you're can gamble online gambling and be on
27:32
Facebook and Instagram all day, then I don't think that there
27:35
would be enough hesitation, right?
27:38
People won't necessarily think twice before they do certain
27:40
things because they've already calculated in a prison
27:43
experience, right? I can go to prison, I can make
27:46
it. It won't be that bad.
27:47
I can still make money. I can still be on social media
27:50
all day, which is what far too many people are doing all day
27:52
anyway. And so I think that that's
27:55
another another piece of that we have got to figure out how we
27:58
can bring the deterrent factor and put that back into into the
28:02
into the penal system. Any ideas on that?
28:07
So I have had some discussions with some of my colleagues in
28:11
the House about introducing legislation that would disable
28:17
contraband cell phones on the prison yards in Mississippi.
28:21
That would, that would disable people from being able to get
28:24
online and to be online. Because I just, I think that
28:26
that is such a again, when you have, when you have people who
28:31
can take a look into prison, right into what's going on and
28:36
say, you know, it's not that bad.
28:37
Maybe I can make it, Maybe I can survive.
28:39
Then I think that you run the risk of those people saying, you
28:42
know, maybe I'll take a chance and, and steal this car.
28:45
Maybe I'll take a chance and shoot up this, this house.
28:48
Maybe I'll take a chance at taking my enemy out, you know,
28:51
because maybe prison is not that bad.
28:53
And so I can imagine, you know, I, I don't know of a world
28:57
where, where, where social media pretty much didn't exist, But I
29:00
can imagine that in times before this, maybe there was a little
29:04
bit of fear of what's going on in prison.
29:06
And I think that that that fear of the unknown is probably a
29:10
healthy element of, of, of the Terence when it comes to the
29:13
penitentiary and the penal justice system.
29:15
Yeah, let's take a break there because when we get back, I want
29:18
to talk about what your plans are going forward with this
29:24
platform that you have and, and, and how that can make a huge
29:28
impact and what's going on with everybody else in this world
29:31
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30:46
So Lawrence, how long have you been?
30:50
How long have you been in the the as a state Rep?
30:55
So I would be going into my third session, right?
31:00
This is my first term, third session.
31:02
So I guess I'm a little bit a little bit more than halfway
31:06
through my first term. What's been your biggest
31:12
surprise going in to your first term?
31:16
Well, I'll be honest, I thought that it would be a lot easier to
31:20
get things done. That makes sense.
31:25
But you learned that the political process, it's, it's a
31:27
long process. Right.
31:28
Yeah, it is it. Takes a long time to get things
31:30
done, even if they make sense. You have to get so many people
31:33
on board and there are so many things that that go into
31:38
bringing something from idea to draft legislation to the
31:43
governor's desk, right? There's so much mileage so much.
31:46
And so I guess really getting involved in seeing what it takes
31:50
to get something from from beginning to finish.
31:53
That's that's that's been an eye opening experience.
31:56
So do you have like a passion project that you're trying to
32:00
move as, as the new guy on the block?
32:03
Yeah. And so I'm working to get
32:05
education fully funded in Mississippi, but we have never
32:08
had a fully funded education formula in Mississippi.
32:13
And so I, I, that's, that's what I wake up every day thinking
32:16
about how I can better position us to get more monies into the
32:21
public education system. Education that is.
32:24
My youngest daughter is a high school teacher and and man,
32:29
those teachers, you know, getting good teachers and
32:31
teachers that are passionate, they can change people's lives,
32:33
but they also have to have money in that system to make it work.
32:36
That's right, yeah. And so too many schools in my
32:39
district and others are just they're behind the 8 ball in the
32:43
things that they need, right? And so everything is evolving so
32:46
quickly these days, right? Until it's, it's really easy for
32:50
for, for schools, districts and students to fall behind, right?
32:53
Because the the haves, they have so much, right?
32:56
So much of the new technology and so much access to this and
32:59
that, that they become very advanced very quickly.
33:02
And so we really want to even that playing field to make sure
33:05
that all students all across Mississippi have access to the
33:09
best. That's that's a, that's a good
33:13
passion project for sure. It's a It's a big one.
33:17
So with this expungement program that you've got with legalese
33:22
and the platform that is it something that that you push out
33:30
and work with Lawrence with? Like I'm wondering how like do
33:37
you work with state institutions that they know about the
33:41
expungement? Do you work with re entry
33:43
people? How does how does this get out
33:45
to people so that they know about it?
33:48
So we work with a lot of grassroots organizations who
33:51
already are servicing our ICP. Our ICP is our ideal customer.
33:55
Ideal customer profile isn't ICP, but our ideal customer,
33:58
right. And so we work with people who
34:00
already have boots on the ground and communities and who are
34:03
already working with the people who need the service most.
34:08
I like that. Well, I hope a lot of people
34:10
that are listed today can find out that this is something that
34:13
they didn't know about and they can go to it and, and get
34:16
involved because I didn't know about it.
34:18
And, you know, I, I like to think that, you know, I've this,
34:23
I've almost done 200 interviews here over Four Seasons and I
34:26
feel like I should know about this.
34:27
So, you know, I think it's, I think it's absolutely
34:31
outstanding what you're doing because it's, it's a needed
34:35
service. It's a service that so many
34:37
people like you said, there's millions of people that can take
34:40
advantage of this. And you recognized as an
34:43
attorney, it's something that can be done a lot easier than
34:48
people think. And you can you can automate it,
34:52
make a system out of it. You know, the secret is, and I'm
34:55
going to tell you on a secret, there is so much that we do as
34:59
attorneys that people could do on their own with just a little
35:02
bit of film, you know. And So what are we as lawyers?
35:04
We are, we are guardians of the process, right?
35:08
We have knowledge of the process and we have knowledge of the
35:11
language, right? The language that has to go onto
35:14
these forms, all that magic, magic language that you have to
35:17
put in to get something done right.
35:20
And so that's what lawyers doing.
35:21
So traditionally lawyers have been gatekeepers of that
35:24
information, gatekeepers of the process, gatekeepers of the
35:28
language, right, of the lingo of the legal leads.
35:30
And So what we're doing is empowering people using
35:34
artificial intelligence to get some of this stuff done without
35:37
an attorney, right. And so our our our our
35:40
overarching goal, our North Star as a company is to empower
35:45
people to handle non complex legal matters on their own
35:49
without an attorney. And so we're beginning in this
35:51
record clearing space because it's very black or white, either
35:54
you meet the prescribed legislative conditions to be.
35:58
Early. Don't write it.
35:59
So there's not a lot of room for error.
36:02
But as the technology matures, as the technology becomes more
36:06
ubiquitous and people get a little bit more accustomed to
36:09
using AI in their daily lives, we envision a future where
36:13
people can bypass attorneys all together for some things, right.
36:18
And so when you talk about complex litigation, you'll
36:20
you'll need an attorney for now, I won't say always, but when it
36:23
comes down to these non complex legal things, you know, no fault
36:27
divorce, expungement, some of your soft tissue injury stuff,
36:31
We think that these things can be done by people on their own
36:34
with the assistance of artificial intelligence without
36:37
an attorney at all, which would save people billions of dollars
36:40
a year. It's a big deal, big deal.
36:43
I usually ask people at the end of the interview their biggest
36:47
take away through the nightmare that they went through.
36:49
But in this situation, we don't have that Lawrence.
36:52
So I I wonder what your advice would be for people.
36:56
You'll want to get in. They want to advocate for
36:59
change. What would be your because
37:01
you've been somebody that's been there and you've advocated
37:04
you've been in a criminal defense district.
37:07
What how's the best way for people to get involved?
37:11
I think that there are so many things that need that need work
37:15
right within the criminal justice system.
37:18
And so I would say to somebody who wants to advance the cause
37:22
of making this a better and more ideal system to find an area,
37:28
find a silo that you think that you can be a best assistance in
37:33
and two and really work that get involved, find other people in
37:37
other organizations who are already tackling that same
37:39
issue. Go out to the conventions, into
37:41
the meetings and so that you can collaborate with like minded
37:44
people. And although the wheels turn
37:48
very slow, don't give up. You know, stay motivated, stay
37:51
passionate, stay connected with other people so that they can
37:55
help you to stay motivated and stay passionate and know that
37:57
together we are moving the needle.
37:59
That's great advice. Don't give up on it because it
38:02
does move slow, but it, it, it takes a lot of voices to make
38:06
the change. And I, I love that.
38:08
I want to give a shout out to Homestead Financial Home
38:10
mortgage lets me use this podcast room and all the fancy
38:13
lights and stuff. If you got home mortgage and
38:15
he's out there, Greg Aftiav is your guy.
38:18
Hey, if you're looking for a book, I got one right back here.
38:22
It's called diamond success, loyalty portrayal, life behind
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bars, adapting, finally breaking free.
38:25
Check it out. Go to Amazon, Barnes and Noble.
38:29
If you got time, leave me a review on on Apple.
38:31
Those really help out. If you want to know what I'm
38:33
doing, go to brettcassidy.com. I spell it wrong.
38:36
I spell it with ATY, not a DY. And as I used to say to my
38:40
people as I was writing my emails back and forth from level
38:42
where stay strong, I'll do the same.
38:44
Lawrence Blackman, man, thanks so much.
38:47
And go to legalese.com to get started with getting yourself a
38:53
fresh start. It was, it was it, it was a
38:57
process for us to get that domain.
38:59
That's like a really premium domain.
39:01
I like it. Owned by the same person from
39:03
backsincethe.com. Boom.
39:05
And we wanted it, man. We wanted it and we negotiated.
39:10
It took about a year to get that worked out.
39:12
But we are now the proud owners of legalese.com.
39:15
So please visit us there if you are looking for assistance.
39:18
If you're looking for a fresh start, then we are there to help
39:21
you. Have a chat with Wilma, she'll
39:23
let you know if you're eligible and from there she'll guide you
39:26
right on through the process the same way that a lawyer would,
39:29
but that at a fraction of that cost.
39:31
Love it, love it. Check it out. legalese.com.
39:35
Lawrence Blackman. Thank you man, I appreciate it.
39:38
Thank you, Brett. Thank you all for tuning in.
39:40
It's been wonderful and I look forward to doing it again.
39:43
Now I'm your success in and out.