Latest / Earn Your Leisure / EYL #129 Music Streaming, Art Investing, & Angel Investing

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EYL #129 Music Streaming, Art Investing, & Angel Investing · Earn Your Leisure

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• 1:41
  Speaker 2: back EYL. This is an episode that I'm looking forward to.
• 1:45
  Speaker 2: Me and Troy both looking forward to it. So when
• 1:48
  Speaker 2: I first got introduced to the gentleman Troy Carter, it
• 1:51
  Speaker 2: was on Clubhouse and there was I was on there
• 1:55
  Speaker 2: as a panelist. I got brought in. I think wal
• 1:57
  Speaker 2: Street Trapper brought me in. Somebody brought me in, and
• 1:59
  Speaker 2: it was the conversation with a bunch of people. I
• 2:02
  Speaker 2: think Meek Mill was in there, Swiss Beach was in there, yeah, remember,
• 2:07
  Speaker 2: and and Troy was in there. And that was the
• 2:09
  Speaker 2: first time I actually heard about mister Carta. And you know,
• 2:14
  Speaker 2: I forgot what the conversation was about cryptos something like that,
• 2:18
  Speaker 2: So you know, I said a couple of words, but
• 2:20
  Speaker 2: I was mainly just listening, and he really piqued my
• 2:23
  Speaker 2: interest because he was talking about art and we all
• 2:26
  Speaker 2: know that Swiss is a heavy art investor, and but
• 2:30
  Speaker 2: you know, it's something that we haven't really covered before.
• 2:32
  Speaker 2: So I was like interested in just learning about art.
• 2:35
  Speaker 2: And from my understanding, correct me if I'm wrong, But
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  Speaker 2: I think he's the one that actually got Swiss into art.
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  Speaker 4: Is that true? Mentored him into that?
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  Speaker 5: No, Actually, it's funny enough. Swiss was the Swiss actually
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  Speaker 5: put me onto art early, but before I started collecting.
• 2:53
  Speaker 5: So I went to his house out when he was
• 2:56
  Speaker 5: living in the cat Skills, and he had this incredible
• 2:59
  Speaker 5: collection sho I didn't even know what, what, who anybody
• 3:03
  Speaker 5: was as he was as he named them off. But
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  Speaker 5: I started probably collecting a few years after that. So yeah,
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  Speaker 5: so that was the Swiss put me onto a lot
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  Speaker 5: of stuff.
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  Speaker 4: Okay, what was he living in the Catskills?
• 3:17
  Speaker 6: I might I thought you were gonna say he was
• 3:19
  Speaker 6: living in Jersey.
• 3:21
  Speaker 4: I was.
• 3:22
  Speaker 5: I was in the city and and Swiss said, they
• 3:26
  Speaker 5: come out to see him, and I'm thinking it's going
• 3:28
  Speaker 5: to be, you know, just a short ride out and
• 3:32
  Speaker 5: I go all the way out to the cat Skills
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  Speaker 5: uh to see.
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  Speaker 4: Him shout shout out to Swiss.
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  Speaker 2: So so then I started to do my research and
• 3:41
  Speaker 2: I realized that he's a true renaissance man. So founding
• 3:45
  Speaker 2: the CEO of Q and A, which is a tech
• 3:49
  Speaker 2: and media company, but before that, founding CEO of Adam Factory.
• 3:53
  Speaker 2: So he managed uh, Lady Gaga and John Legend, a
• 3:59
  Speaker 2: few people you might Daniel Spotify, head of Global Creative
• 4:04
  Speaker 2: Creative Services, Entertainment Advisor for the Princess State.
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  Speaker 4: That's big.
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  Speaker 2: And then he's an invested as well, an early investor
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  Speaker 2: into a couple of companies that you might have heard of,
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  Speaker 2: Uber Lyft, Dropbox, Spotify, warby Parker Blavity, Gambling Media shout
• 4:20
  Speaker 2: to John Henry and Phase Clan. That's crazy because I
• 4:26
  Speaker 2: found out about Phase Plan for my son the game
• 4:28
  Speaker 2: shout out and not say it.
• 4:29
  Speaker 4: He's a huge gamer.
• 4:31
  Speaker 7: And about it from my sons too.
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  Speaker 2: Okay, Yeah, that Phase Plan is serious, man.
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  Speaker 4: I think Brownie is part of the Phase Plan.
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  Speaker 2: And then he's also a trustee on uh the aston
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  Speaker 2: Aspen Institute, l a County Museum of Art. He's an
• 4:50
  Speaker 2: art collector and then he had early start with Will
• 4:53
  Speaker 2: Smith and Diddy welcome into Wait.
• 4:56
  Speaker 3: Wait we left one out.
• 4:57
  Speaker 6: He was he was named by the Big Boss, Oprah
• 5:00
  Speaker 6: Winfrey the Super Soul's one hundred lists of influencers and visionaries.
• 5:06
  Speaker 2: So when I was finding out about it, I'm like, Yo,
• 5:07
  Speaker 2: you gotta get him on the show.
• 5:08
  Speaker 4: Earn your Lisha is the big, the biggest, the Big Show.
• 5:11
  Speaker 4: Sound like, we gotta get him on there.
• 5:12
  Speaker 2: But I didn't really know if you had a social
• 5:14
  Speaker 2: media it's kind of a hard guy to track down.
• 5:16
  Speaker 2: So shout out to the good folks at uh thank
• 5:20
  Speaker 2: you Nicole and Black.
• 5:22
  Speaker 4: Effect from connecting the dots on it.
• 5:23
  Speaker 2: So this is going to be a fun conversation, educational conversation.
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  Speaker 2: So first and foremost, thank you for joining us. Appreciate
• 5:29
  Speaker 2: it now listen.
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  Speaker 5: I'm I'm happy to be here, man, I'm loving what
• 5:33
  Speaker 5: you guys are doing. So you know when they hit
• 5:35
  Speaker 5: me last week, I'm definite, definitely wanted to be supportive.
• 5:39
  Speaker 7: This is great.
• 5:40
  Speaker 4: I appreciate it. Appreciate it. So let's jump let's jump
• 5:43
  Speaker 4: right into it. West Philadelphia born and raised.
• 5:47
  Speaker 6: It's very fitting playground if anybody fits that line, it.
• 5:52
  Speaker 2: Is definitely so, so you got an interest in life story. Man,
• 5:57
  Speaker 2: Let's let's start at the beginning. So you you were
• 5:59
  Speaker 2: signed to Will Smith's record label.
• 6:02
  Speaker 5: Yeah, when when I was in in ninth ninth grade,
• 6:05
  Speaker 5: we me and my two best friends started a rap
• 6:08
  Speaker 5: group and and and it was this thing where one
• 6:13
  Speaker 5: of one of the guys said, if we meet Jazzy
• 6:15
  Speaker 5: Jeff and Fresh Prince, they're going to give us a
• 6:17
  Speaker 5: record deal. So we just, you know, would go down
• 6:20
  Speaker 5: to their studio constantly and just wait outside to try
• 6:24
  Speaker 5: to try to meet them. And then one day we
• 6:27
  Speaker 5: were able to so and and you know quickly found
• 6:31
  Speaker 5: out how terrible we were.
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  Speaker 6: But you didn't let that ruin the networking uh chance
• 6:40
  Speaker 6: that you had, because you still started working with Jeff.
• 6:42
  Speaker 5: Right. Yeah, you know what, Like you know what, what
• 6:45
  Speaker 5: I tell my my my sons and my daughter is like,
• 6:49
  Speaker 5: you just never know what path life takes you on.
• 6:52
  Speaker 5: So it's like sometimes you just got to go with
• 6:55
  Speaker 5: the flow. And when things don't necessarily go your way,
• 6:59
  Speaker 5: it doesn't it doesn't necessarily mean it's going the wrong way.
• 7:03
  Speaker 5: It's just not going away that that that you planned
• 7:05
  Speaker 5: on it going. And so you know, meet and Will
• 7:08
  Speaker 5: and those guys. They took me under their wing and
• 7:12
  Speaker 5: and I really was was able to learn uh the
• 7:15
  Speaker 5: business from Will and his manager James Lassiter.
• 7:19
  Speaker 6: Yeah yeah, so that that's interesting. So you stay in
• 7:22
  Speaker 6: contact with James Latti, sir, and that leads you to
• 7:26
  Speaker 6: doing some party promotion.
• 7:29
  Speaker 7: Yeah, that was so that that was like my hustle
• 7:31
  Speaker 7: in Philly.
• 7:32
  Speaker 5: Like so where where I got lucky because a lot
• 7:36
  Speaker 5: of the guys in the neighborhood sort of they they
• 7:39
  Speaker 5: they they protected me from having to do other stuff.
• 7:43
  Speaker 5: So so like guys who used to hustle, and and
• 7:47
  Speaker 5: you had stick up boys from my neighborhood. You had,
• 7:50
  Speaker 5: you know, guys who hustled, You had, you know, people
• 7:52
  Speaker 5: who did all all kinds of things. I was. I
• 7:56
  Speaker 5: was able to do what I love, which was music
• 8:00
  Speaker 5: and just and I had people in my neighborhood. This
• 8:03
  Speaker 5: is like the nineteen nineties version of go fund me
• 8:08
  Speaker 5: was just people from the neighborhood give you some money
• 8:10
  Speaker 5: to throw a party. So I started throwing parties. I
• 8:14
  Speaker 5: bought Wu Tang Clan a Philly for their first time,
• 8:18
  Speaker 5: jay Z's first time, Foxy.
• 8:22
  Speaker 7: Brown, Kim Biggie.
• 8:25
  Speaker 5: So like all of those shows in like the like
• 8:28
  Speaker 5: the mid nineties. It was me and Uh and my
• 8:31
  Speaker 5: big brother Charlie Mack out of Philly that was doing a.
• 8:34
  Speaker 6: Lot of that's a Charlie Mac. That name is legendary
• 8:38
  Speaker 6: and Philly and definitely in the music industry.
• 8:41
  Speaker 5: Yes, so that was my hustle.
• 8:44
  Speaker 4: So any transition to working with Diddy? How did that
• 8:46
  Speaker 4: come about?
• 8:48
  Speaker 5: I actually met I met Puff because I was a
• 8:51
  Speaker 5: big was a no show for one of my concerts
• 8:54
  Speaker 5: and it was actually my first big show, and I
• 8:59
  Speaker 5: was throwing it on Penn's campus, University of Penn's campus,
• 9:03
  Speaker 5: and Big was supposed to go on. And I got
• 9:06
  Speaker 5: a call from his manager, who was Mark Pitts at
• 9:10
  Speaker 5: and telling me that Big was shooting the video for
• 9:13
  Speaker 5: Big Poppa and couldn't make it down. And I got
• 9:16
  Speaker 5: into an argument with Puff on the phone, cursing me
• 9:22
  Speaker 5: out of curse him out. They still come down to
• 9:24
  Speaker 5: Philly for the after party, and and it was and
• 9:28
  Speaker 5: Puff was like a legend and hip and like, but
• 9:32
  Speaker 5: not big at that time. He wasn't huge. But in
• 9:35
  Speaker 5: terms of black culture and entrepreneurship, if you were in
• 9:40
  Speaker 5: the music business, you wanted to be Puff and and
• 9:43
  Speaker 5: and seeing him at that club that night we all
• 9:46
  Speaker 5: went out to an after party. He he basically just
• 9:51
  Speaker 5: commanded the room and I asked him for the internship,
• 9:54
  Speaker 5: and uh he said, you know, get me that girl
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  Speaker 5: from behind the bar's number and that'll be your first job.
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  Speaker 7: And so that was that was my first job I got.
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  Speaker 7: I got Puffed the number.
• 10:05
  Speaker 4: There you have it. He's necessary.
• 10:07
  Speaker 3: It could have been he could have sent you to
• 10:09
  Speaker 3: get a Philly cheese sticks. But that was easy.
• 10:11
  Speaker 2: It's crazy, you say the big story because I don't
• 10:13
  Speaker 2: know if you see the albums that we have in
• 10:15
  Speaker 2: back of us, but that's a big.
• 10:18
  Speaker 7: Yeah, was that it was one of my favorites of
• 10:21
  Speaker 7: all time.
• 10:22
  Speaker 4: That's crazy. So you paid, you paid him and he
• 10:24
  Speaker 4: just didn't show.
• 10:25
  Speaker 7: Huh.
• 10:26
  Speaker 5: Well, what Puff did? He told he told them to
• 10:29
  Speaker 5: give me my money back, and then for the next show,
• 10:32
  Speaker 5: they gave me a discount on the next show. And
• 10:34
  Speaker 5: I probably did maybe three or four biggie shows after
• 10:37
  Speaker 5: that in Philly.
• 10:39
  Speaker 2: So let's let's fast forward a little bit. Because you
• 10:42
  Speaker 2: have extensive resuments. I want to make sure we can
• 10:44
  Speaker 2: cover everything. So how did you get involved in management?
• 10:50
  Speaker 2: Because the story is pretty legendary. I guess she was
• 10:52
  Speaker 2: down on your luck and Lady Gaga comes out of
• 10:56
  Speaker 2: the sky. So how does that story come as far
• 10:59
  Speaker 2: as the management and finding uh Lady Gaga, Well, well.
• 11:04
  Speaker 7: Eve gave me my first shot at management.
• 11:06
  Speaker 5: And and so with Eve, she was I knew I
• 11:09
  Speaker 5: knew her from Philly and I was helping her actually
• 11:13
  Speaker 5: find a manager because she she was kind of looking
• 11:15
  Speaker 5: for a new management situation and she just gave me
• 11:18
  Speaker 5: the opportunity to do it. And so I worked with
• 11:21
  Speaker 5: Eve for about seven, seven or eight years, and then
• 11:26
  Speaker 5: and I sold my the company that I that I built.
• 11:30
  Speaker 5: I sold it to a company called Sanctuary out of London,
• 11:33
  Speaker 5: and and at that time we were managing Beanie Siegull,
• 11:37
  Speaker 5: Eve Freeway, a bunch of acts, and we sold that business.
• 11:42
  Speaker 5: I moved to California to work for the company that
• 11:45
  Speaker 5: I sold it to, and and it it just wasn't
• 11:49
  Speaker 5: a great experience, you know. After about a year and
• 11:51
  Speaker 5: a half in, I'm like, Okay, this isn't the right fit.
• 11:55
  Speaker 5: And and that was my first experience of learning about
• 11:59
  Speaker 5: sort of culture and hot like where money can't buy
• 12:05
  Speaker 5: you certain things. And that was like my first real
• 12:08
  Speaker 5: check that I got, and but it didn't make me happy.
• 12:13
  Speaker 5: And and and I always had this thing. As crazy
• 12:17
  Speaker 5: as it sounds, it was it was unimaginable, like for
• 12:24
  Speaker 5: me to even make one hundred thousand dollars in my
• 12:29
  Speaker 5: like like just because like my goals was like if
• 12:33
  Speaker 5: I could make a thousand dollars a week, I'd be set,
• 12:36
  Speaker 5: you know, Like that was my thing I had in
• 12:39
  Speaker 5: my mind. And I remember writing down just all my
• 12:45
  Speaker 5: goals as a kid, and and like every year I
• 12:47
  Speaker 5: would just would write new stuff. And I had this
• 12:50
  Speaker 5: goal to be to make a million dollars by the
• 12:53
  Speaker 5: time I turned thirty. And for Father's Day of my
• 13:00
  Speaker 5: I think it was thirty when I was thirty one,
• 13:02
  Speaker 5: For Father's Day, my wife and my mom gave me
• 13:06
  Speaker 5: this gift and I opened it up and it was
• 13:08
  Speaker 5: this scrapbook and my mom had saved every single letter
• 13:13
  Speaker 5: that I wrote to myself as a kid. And in
• 13:16
  Speaker 5: that I accomplished every single thing, almost everything that I
• 13:21
  Speaker 5: wanted to do from like like right, literally it is unimaginable.
• 13:27
  Speaker 5: And but what I noticed, I'm like it didn't change
• 13:33
  Speaker 5: my life in terms of happiness. So because working where
• 13:38
  Speaker 5: artists made me happy. Working on music made me happy.
• 13:41
  Speaker 5: Being part of the culture made me happy, and working
• 13:44
  Speaker 5: for this company didn't. So I went and tried to
• 13:46
  Speaker 5: buy the company back. They wouldn't sell it back. Company
• 13:49
  Speaker 5: ended up going their company ended up going bankrupt. I
• 13:53
  Speaker 5: was able to get out of the deal. And when
• 13:55
  Speaker 5: I started over, I put all I had, put the
• 13:58
  Speaker 5: money I made into the new company. I put the
• 14:01
  Speaker 5: money I made into buying a house. I bought a
• 14:04
  Speaker 5: couple of cars.
• 14:06
  Speaker 7: You know.
• 14:06
  Speaker 5: I did everything that you I blew it pretty much.
• 14:11
  Speaker 5: And then Eve fired me right right when I started
• 14:14
  Speaker 5: the new company. So I had to start all over
• 14:18
  Speaker 5: from from scratch essentially. And so around that time, somebody,
• 14:23
  Speaker 5: a friend of mine, introduced me to a new artist
• 14:26
  Speaker 5: that he was going to fly out to audition and
• 14:29
  Speaker 5: and and that artist was was Lady Gaga.
• 14:34
  Speaker 2: Can I can we can we unpack that a little
• 14:36
  Speaker 2: bit as far as the selling the company? All right,
• 14:39
  Speaker 2: So you built up a management company.
• 14:41
  Speaker 3: This is Irving Wonder you're speaking of, right, yeah Wonder?
• 14:45
  Speaker 4: Okay, So you built.
• 14:46
  Speaker 2: Up you build up the management company, and all of
• 14:48
  Speaker 2: the Philly artists free way you said, uh yeah, legends.
• 14:54
  Speaker 2: So you got a nice thing who's on the rocks
• 14:56
  Speaker 2: Philly is Freeway.
• 14:59
  Speaker 5: H Oskino and Sparks. So all of the stuff that
• 15:02
  Speaker 5: was at Rocket the state property on the state property exactly.
• 15:06
  Speaker 5: So we had the whole state property essentially. We had
• 15:09
  Speaker 5: Eve as well. We managed Calise. Then we partner with
• 15:14
  Speaker 5: Tony Davis on Nelly Flow of three. Yeah, so that
• 15:19
  Speaker 5: was that was the roster.
• 15:21
  Speaker 4: Okay, so you got a nice thing I wanted. I
• 15:23
  Speaker 4: got a lot of questions about management. My first question is.
• 15:28
  Speaker 2: What is the percentage that managers get Paid's like five
• 15:30
  Speaker 2: percent of everything that they booked for or is it
• 15:33
  Speaker 2: higher than that? Like what what's the how does that
• 15:35
  Speaker 2: business model work?
• 15:36
  Speaker 5: It's usually somewhere between ten and twenty percent, depending on
• 15:40
  Speaker 5: the size of the artists. So if it's a development
• 15:42
  Speaker 5: artist that you're starting from scratch, usually is twenty percent.
• 15:46
  Speaker 5: If you're coming into a superstars business, usually it's around
• 15:51
  Speaker 5: ten percent.
• 15:53
  Speaker 6: So you're at the height in the early two thousands,
• 15:56
  Speaker 6: we're talking Nelly the height of his career.
• 15:58
  Speaker 3: You're talking about Eve the high of her career.
• 16:00
  Speaker 6: So those percentages changed because when you when you met Eva,
• 16:04
  Speaker 6: was she just starting or had she put out an
• 16:06
  Speaker 6: album ready? She was just starting, okay, so then she
• 16:09
  Speaker 6: probably fits in that scale of that twenty range.
• 16:12
  Speaker 7: Yeah, exactly, exactly.
• 16:14
  Speaker 5: Yeah, I think Eve was probably Eve was fifteen because
• 16:18
  Speaker 5: I was just starting and it's uh, okay, I would
• 16:21
  Speaker 5: have done that one for free, by the way, because
• 16:23
  Speaker 5: she's given me an opportunity.
• 16:24
  Speaker 7: But so yeah, so that was fifteen.
• 16:28
  Speaker 2: So it's fifteen percent roughly, and just on everything that
• 16:31
  Speaker 2: you can get for them to like endorsement deals, shows, whatever,
• 16:34
  Speaker 2: anything that you're responsible for.
• 16:35
  Speaker 4: Is that correct?
• 16:36
  Speaker 5: Yeah, So the manager kind of sits in the center
• 16:39
  Speaker 5: of like you think of it like a hub and
• 16:42
  Speaker 5: spokes essentially, So the manager kind of sits in the
• 16:45
  Speaker 5: center and manages the relationship with the record companies, the
• 16:49
  Speaker 5: music publishers, concert promoters, brands that may pay for endorsements,
• 16:55
  Speaker 5: and so basically you get you is a commission based business,
• 16:59
  Speaker 5: so you commit as.
• 17:01
  Speaker 7: The client makes money. Essentially.
• 17:04
  Speaker 5: You know, the downside is that if the client doesn't
• 17:07
  Speaker 5: doesn't make money, you don't make money. But what's good
• 17:10
  Speaker 5: is that the incentives aren't aligned at the end of
• 17:12
  Speaker 5: the day, so it's not like you're making money when
• 17:15
  Speaker 5: the client doesn't make money.
• 17:17
  Speaker 2: So it's in your best interest to make sure that
• 17:18
  Speaker 2: they're making money, because then you make money.
• 17:21
  Speaker 7: Yeah, or you don't have a job.
• 17:23
  Speaker 3: Right. Did you go into when you created Irving wonder?
• 17:27
  Speaker 5: Uh?
• 17:27
  Speaker 6: Did you go into it saying we're going to build
• 17:29
  Speaker 6: this to a point so that we can sell it.
• 17:31
  Speaker 6: And when you did sell it, what was the type
• 17:34
  Speaker 6: of valuation that you put on on the company?
• 17:36
  Speaker 5: Yeah? So I never I never did. I didn't do
• 17:39
  Speaker 5: it for knowing that I could go I could even
• 17:42
  Speaker 5: build a company, to be honest with you, like like
• 17:45
  Speaker 5: for me, it was the company was me managing Eve
• 17:49
  Speaker 5: out of my living room, you know, with no employees
• 17:52
  Speaker 5: or anything like that or whatever. So it wasn't even
• 17:55
  Speaker 5: it wasn't even an incorporation at that time. So it
• 17:59
  Speaker 5: just was more of let me, let me protect her,
• 18:03
  Speaker 5: let me just see what we could build together. And
• 18:06
  Speaker 5: it was a legendary manager Chris Lighty, who gave me
• 18:09
  Speaker 5: some office space in New York where he said, do
• 18:12
  Speaker 5: you know what, come up and learn from us, you
• 18:14
  Speaker 5: know if you want to as well.
• 18:15
  Speaker 7: And that's so that's what I did. And I didn't
• 18:18
  Speaker 7: even know.
• 18:19
  Speaker 5: And even once we built a company and started managing
• 18:22
  Speaker 5: more clients, honestly, I didn't even know you could sell
• 18:25
  Speaker 5: a management company until Matthew Knowles, Beyonce's dad, approached me.
• 18:32
  Speaker 5: And he had sold his company at the Sanctuary and
• 18:35
  Speaker 5: he was building out their urban division and he approached
• 18:38
  Speaker 5: me about about buying my company and me being his
• 18:44
  Speaker 5: number two over there. And to be honest, I didn't
• 18:49
  Speaker 5: know how to value the company. We didn't keep great records.
• 18:55
  Speaker 7: We didn't you know.
• 18:55
  Speaker 5: They they said we need to start doing due diligence
• 18:59
  Speaker 5: and this is pre Google really, so you know, we
• 19:03
  Speaker 5: you didn't really have a way to even know what
• 19:05
  Speaker 5: due diligence was. So it's like and in hip hop
• 19:08
  Speaker 5: back then, we would take cash. So because I didn't
• 19:14
  Speaker 5: want to if somebody was booking a show, I couldn't
• 19:18
  Speaker 5: trust that the guy in Memphis was gonna not pay
• 19:22
  Speaker 5: me when we showed up or whatever. So it's like or,
• 19:25
  Speaker 5: you know, we took cash and everything. So we didn't
• 19:28
  Speaker 5: have a lot of great records. We you know, it
• 19:30
  Speaker 5: was so they trusted us on a lot of stuff.
• 19:33
  Speaker 5: We had to pull together a lot of stuff and
• 19:36
  Speaker 5: and and to Beyonce's dad's credit, Matthew Knowles, he basically
• 19:41
  Speaker 5: helped us determine what evaluation was. And he he honestly
• 19:47
  Speaker 5: changed my life in my family's life in terms of
• 19:52
  Speaker 5: being able to give me an opportunity and to be
• 19:56
  Speaker 5: able to know what success looked like and what it
• 19:59
  Speaker 5: felt like like and for a black man and make
• 20:05
  Speaker 5: another black man a millionaire.
• 20:07
  Speaker 7: Is just is A is A is a beautiful thing,
• 20:13
  Speaker 7: that is true.
• 20:15
  Speaker 2: A couple of a couple of questions about that. So, artists,
• 20:18
  Speaker 2: are you signing like a manager? Are they signed to
• 20:23
  Speaker 2: like a year two years for you?
• 20:25
  Speaker 4: Like?
• 20:25
  Speaker 2: Are they signed or it's just like a handshake agreement
• 20:28
  Speaker 2: and as long as things go good. But if you're
• 20:31
  Speaker 2: not happy, you just leave. Because I see people leave
• 20:33
  Speaker 2: their managers all the time. And I wasn't sure if
• 20:36
  Speaker 2: there was like contracts in place where you have to
• 20:38
  Speaker 2: stay with this manager for a period of time.
• 20:40
  Speaker 5: Yeah, it depends. Even I worked together for like I said,
• 20:43
  Speaker 5: almost eight years. We never had a contract, and you know,
• 20:47
  Speaker 5: it was just handshake. And and I know a lot
• 20:52
  Speaker 5: of people like I don't think Latifa and shot Kim
• 20:57
  Speaker 5: have a contract. They've been together for thirty something years.
• 20:59
  Speaker 5: And you know Will Smith and James you know, so
• 21:02
  Speaker 5: the same same thing or whatever, and you know, there's
• 21:05
  Speaker 5: a lot of acts that I know that you know
• 21:07
  Speaker 5: that are like that, and so where you just have
• 21:10
  Speaker 5: that relationship and and then sometimes their contracts and that
• 21:15
  Speaker 5: those contracts can be as short as one or two years,
• 21:18
  Speaker 5: or they could be you know, up to six or
• 21:20
  Speaker 5: seven years. So it just sort of depends on the relationship.
• 21:24
  Speaker 5: But there's no there's no real set rules to it.
• 21:28
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 21:28
  Speaker 6: So I mean, obviously you sell the company, but you
• 21:32
  Speaker 6: sit there and I'm wondering the level of regret was
• 21:35
  Speaker 6: did that sit in with you or was it you know,
• 21:37
  Speaker 6: what my family's life has changed now financially, or was
• 21:40
  Speaker 6: there regret in selling it? Knowing that this was my
• 21:43
  Speaker 6: baby that I let go and I don't like how
• 21:45
  Speaker 6: this is going right now?
• 21:46
  Speaker 5: So so I sold. I sold to to management companies
• 21:51
  Speaker 5: and both times I had sellers remorse. And because people
• 21:57
  Speaker 5: always talk about buyers remorse and I and I learned
• 22:01
  Speaker 5: about seller's remorse because you know, where I'm an entrepreneur
• 22:05
  Speaker 5: by nature, It's something about me where I like to
• 22:11
  Speaker 5: control my own destiny in terms of you know, just
• 22:15
  Speaker 5: what I do, the decisions that I make. Honestly, a
• 22:21
  Speaker 5: lot of my personal identity is tied into me being
• 22:26
  Speaker 5: an entrepreneur, and it.
• 22:28
  Speaker 7: Felt like I had a boss and.
• 22:32
  Speaker 5: That really messed with me, like just from a pride
• 22:35
  Speaker 5: standpoint of And I'm not saying anything's wrong with that
• 22:39
  Speaker 5: at all, because I feel like, you know, it's everybody
• 22:43
  Speaker 5: needs to do what they have to do to make
• 22:46
  Speaker 5: a living. But for me, what it was was that
• 22:50
  Speaker 5: I worked really hard to build these companies. I put
• 22:56
  Speaker 5: a lot of pride and love into the work that
• 22:59
  Speaker 5: I do, and then too the clients that I represent,
• 23:03
  Speaker 5: and for people to treat it like a number or
• 23:07
  Speaker 5: a transaction after it's done, that really bothered me. And
• 23:12
  Speaker 5: it's like because what I realized was working with other companies,
• 23:15
  Speaker 5: it was all about money for with those other companies,
• 23:19
  Speaker 5: I've never I've never done anything purely for money, never,
• 23:24
  Speaker 5: and like for that that that to me just it
• 23:26
  Speaker 5: just didn't sit right with me.
• 23:28
  Speaker 4: How much did you sell it for.
• 23:31
  Speaker 5: The first the first company we sold for uh, I
• 23:35
  Speaker 5: think for four and a half something like four and
• 23:38
  Speaker 5: a half million for the first company.
• 23:40
  Speaker 2: Well, that's interesting because it's like, for me, that's a
• 23:43
  Speaker 2: risky proposition for somebody to buy because it's like you're
• 23:47
  Speaker 2: dealing with artists and their careers could be over at
• 23:50
  Speaker 2: any given moment. And if there's not even like a
• 23:53
  Speaker 2: contract in place with these artists, I mean, you're just
• 23:56
  Speaker 2: buying a relationship. But how do you value a relationship
• 24:01
  Speaker 2: because that relationship could be over tomorrow.
• 24:03
  Speaker 7: That's a that's real talk.
• 24:06
  Speaker 5: And and you know, and that's the credit that I
• 24:08
  Speaker 5: give Matthew for, you know, for being able to bet
• 24:10
  Speaker 5: on us. And and the other piece of it too
• 24:14
  Speaker 5: is that they're buying you know, a lot of the
• 24:18
  Speaker 5: companies who buy management companies are buying cash flow, you know,
• 24:22
  Speaker 5: and and there's a good cash flow business. So that's
• 24:24
  Speaker 5: so the companies are essentially buying cash flow.
• 24:28
  Speaker 6: Yeah based and at that time, the artists that you've
• 24:31
  Speaker 6: had with smoking, So that that helps, right, But when
• 24:36
  Speaker 6: it starts to slow down, I guess, and this is
• 24:38
  Speaker 6: like two thousand and six, when when you realize, like,
• 24:40
  Speaker 6: all right, this is not working in the fire as
• 24:42
  Speaker 6: you things are starting to turn real quick. I've read
• 24:45
  Speaker 6: somewhere that you might you might have been facing adviction.
• 24:48
  Speaker 6: So this is what's going through your mindset at that point.
• 24:51
  Speaker 5: Now, Fear, you know, fear and you know, being sort
• 24:58
  Speaker 5: of partially partially paralyzed, you know, temporarily of my world
• 25:06
  Speaker 5: is falling apart, you know, because you know, I went
• 25:09
  Speaker 5: through a real hot streak where nothing could go wrong,
• 25:14
  Speaker 5: and then all of a sudden, everything's going wrong, and
• 25:17
  Speaker 5: it you know, and it turned and it felt like
• 25:18
  Speaker 5: a spiral, and it felt out like where things were
• 25:22
  Speaker 5: out of my control. And you know, you're dealing I
• 25:27
  Speaker 5: was dealing with embarrassment. I was dealing with shame, dealing
• 25:32
  Speaker 5: with depression.
• 25:33
  Speaker 4: You know.
• 25:33
  Speaker 5: I you know, a family now at the you know,
• 25:37
  Speaker 5: at this time, so you know, you could take certain
• 25:41
  Speaker 5: risks when you're twenty two, it's like but you know,
• 25:45
  Speaker 5: midd thirties and you got you know, at that time,
• 25:48
  Speaker 5: we have four kids. We have five now, but you know,
• 25:51
  Speaker 5: having four kids and tuitions and mortgages and car notes
• 25:56
  Speaker 5: and employee responsibilities. You know, it got really scary really quick.
• 26:02
  Speaker 5: And you know, luckily, you know, I was able to
• 26:07
  Speaker 5: come back from it. But while I was in it,
• 26:09
  Speaker 5: you know, it was a very dark time.
• 26:13
  Speaker 4: Why did she fire you?
• 26:15
  Speaker 7: Yeah?
• 26:15
  Speaker 5: She you know, I think she just had other aspirations
• 26:18
  Speaker 5: and and she and I is funny because Eve's like
• 26:24
  Speaker 5: my my sister.
• 26:25
  Speaker 7: Yeah, it's funny.
• 26:27
  Speaker 5: A friend of mine, Tuma Bassa, who I worked with
• 26:30
  Speaker 5: at Spotify, literally just texted me like an hour ago,
• 26:35
  Speaker 5: sending me an article because it's the twentieth anniversary this
• 26:39
  Speaker 5: week of Eve's I think that to let there be
• 26:42
  Speaker 5: Eve album. And it's crazy that it was twenty years ago.
• 26:47
  Speaker 3: What crazy?
• 26:48
  Speaker 5: Yeah, crazy, it was twenty years ago. But you know,
• 26:51
  Speaker 5: so she and I were incredibly close, but she didn't
• 26:57
  Speaker 5: feel like I was focused enough at that particular the time,
• 27:01
  Speaker 5: which you know, maybe she was, but in my mind,
• 27:04
  Speaker 5: I felt like I could get it to the next level.
• 27:07
  Speaker 5: But she felt like she needed to do other things,
• 27:10
  Speaker 5: and she decided that, you know, she wanted to explore
• 27:13
  Speaker 5: other managers, which I didn't. I didn't understand it at
• 27:17
  Speaker 5: that time. It was like a divorce because you know,
• 27:20
  Speaker 5: a heartbreak, you know, because because of the relationship, and
• 27:25
  Speaker 5: and I was mad as as you would normally be
• 27:28
  Speaker 5: mad under those circumstances, and especially while I was going
• 27:31
  Speaker 5: through all of like the terrible stuff, you know, like
• 27:35
  Speaker 5: really mad, but I just didn't. I just would not
• 27:39
  Speaker 5: let the anger consume me, man and like, and that
• 27:44
  Speaker 5: was a big piece of it.
• 27:45
  Speaker 7: It was a big piece of it.
• 27:47
  Speaker 2: So for the second run when you when you get
• 27:50
  Speaker 2: Lady Gaga and John Legend.
• 27:51
  Speaker 4: What did you do different?
• 27:52
  Speaker 2: Did you do anything different as far as the management
• 27:55
  Speaker 2: style or I'm pretty sure you were more respectful with
• 27:59
  Speaker 2: money this time around? And how did that change? Like
• 28:02
  Speaker 2: you have money, you lost it, but then you got
• 28:05
  Speaker 2: an opportunity to you know, get a rebirth.
• 28:07
  Speaker 4: So how what was different the second the second wave?
• 28:10
  Speaker 5: I think I was. I was different, you know, I
• 28:13
  Speaker 5: think in a couple of different ways. It's like humility,
• 28:19
  Speaker 5: for sure, because it's like, you know, uh, you nothing
• 28:22
  Speaker 5: weighs you up, like cold concrete, and so it just
• 28:27
  Speaker 5: it was a very humbling experience to say the least.
• 28:31
  Speaker 5: And then the other piece of it was a friend
• 28:34
  Speaker 5: of mine introduced me to meditation, and that's what really
• 28:38
  Speaker 5: helped me get through that hard situation. And and and
• 28:42
  Speaker 5: it was just exercise that that I learned during meditation,
• 28:47
  Speaker 5: where it basically it's almost like you you imagine yourself
• 28:52
  Speaker 5: out of your own body and you look back at
• 28:56
  Speaker 5: all of your best experiences and your worst experience and
• 29:01
  Speaker 5: what you realize and and your best experiences you really
• 29:08
  Speaker 5: didn't have that much to do with it, so so
• 29:12
  Speaker 5: you could plan for certain things, but you never could
• 29:14
  Speaker 5: plan for specifics.
• 29:16
  Speaker 7: So there's no plan.
• 29:18
  Speaker 5: In my life that I'm gonna meet Eve, that I'm
• 29:21
  Speaker 5: going to meet God, God, that I'm gonna meet.
• 29:23
  Speaker 7: You know, CEOs or you know.
• 29:25
  Speaker 5: It's this is when grace comes into play, and this
• 29:28
  Speaker 5: is when faith comes into play. And so what it
• 29:31
  Speaker 5: taught me through that experience was I didn't although I
• 29:36
  Speaker 5: could take I tried to take credit for a lot
• 29:39
  Speaker 5: of my own success, A lot of it is just
• 29:42
  Speaker 5: grace too, and you and being prepared for it. So
• 29:47
  Speaker 5: I got to have faith that great that I'm gonna
• 29:50
  Speaker 5: be met with grace again, and and and when and
• 29:55
  Speaker 5: when you have that level of faith, it shows up
• 29:58
  Speaker 5: for you time and time and time again, and you'll
• 30:00
  Speaker 5: be testing on it and and to see, you know,
• 30:04
  Speaker 5: whether you run scared again, but it continually continuously shows
• 30:09
  Speaker 5: up and so that you know. So I think those
• 30:12
  Speaker 5: were the two things when I when when I when
• 30:15
  Speaker 5: I did meet Gaga, I had no money. She really
• 30:19
  Speaker 5: didn't have money. Vince who introduced me to her, didn't
• 30:22
  Speaker 5: have money. Jimmy Ivan at Interscope was going through his divorce.
• 30:26
  Speaker 5: So Jimmy was going through a tough time. So I
• 30:29
  Speaker 5: think you got four people all you know, sort of
• 30:32
  Speaker 5: fighting for their lives and all going through tough stuff.
• 30:36
  Speaker 5: So you know, you can't fall off the floor. So
• 30:38
  Speaker 5: it's nowhere else to go but up. So we just
• 30:40
  Speaker 5: hustled and did our did the work.
• 30:43
  Speaker 6: Yeah, So at this point it's almost like the rebirth right.
• 30:46
  Speaker 6: You did it with Eve, you came up together, you
• 30:48
  Speaker 6: starting over. Now you're back in the clubs, you're booking
• 30:51
  Speaker 6: gigs and I'm trying to fix So we got Vince involved.
• 30:55
  Speaker 3: Who introduce you?
• 30:56
  Speaker 6: You got Jimmy Iveen, Akon ends up signing it. Did
• 30:59
  Speaker 6: you bring him? Bring her to Akon? How does that work?
• 31:01
  Speaker 5: No, Jimmy, Jimmy Iveen brought an a Kon to to
• 31:07
  Speaker 5: as an executive producer because a Akon of Fire and
• 31:10
  Speaker 5: he had a producer named red One that was signed
• 31:13
  Speaker 5: to him and and red One did Bad Romance, Just Dance,
• 31:20
  Speaker 5: poker Face, you know, a ton of a ton of
• 31:23
  Speaker 5: our big records. So so bringing Con on board just
• 31:27
  Speaker 5: was you know that that was a blessing as well.
• 31:31
  Speaker 2: So how quickly does that ramp up with Lady Gaga
• 31:33
  Speaker 2: before it becomes like you know who she is like now.
• 31:38
  Speaker 5: Probably you know, from the time we put out her
• 31:42
  Speaker 5: first single to the time it really broke was a
• 31:46
  Speaker 5: little over a year.
• 31:47
  Speaker 7: I want to say. You know, it just was it
• 31:50
  Speaker 7: was a grind.
• 31:51
  Speaker 5: You know, at those moments where you just felt like
• 31:53
  Speaker 5: nothing was happening, you know, you were I felt like
• 31:57
  Speaker 5: I knew the music was great and I felt like
• 32:00
  Speaker 5: she was a superstar. But when nobody was responding, you know,
• 32:03
  Speaker 5: it's like you're questioning yourself like, okay, like is this
• 32:08
  Speaker 5: not as good as we think it is? No, it is,
• 32:11
  Speaker 5: let's you know. So we just kept kept at it,
• 32:13
  Speaker 5: kept at it, kept at it until you know, finally,
• 32:16
  Speaker 5: you know, we got one radio station and I think
• 32:19
  Speaker 5: it was Toronto to play the record. Then we got
• 32:21
  Speaker 5: Buffalo to play it. Then you know, you sort of
• 32:24
  Speaker 5: saw saw the dominoes start falling.
• 32:27
  Speaker 2: So your job as a manager was more than just
• 32:30
  Speaker 2: finding opportunities, is actually helping to push them. What are
• 32:34
  Speaker 2: you doing as a manager everything that needs to be
• 32:36
  Speaker 2: done in the utility, like anything that needs to be
• 32:38
  Speaker 2: done pretty much reaching out the radio station.
• 32:39
  Speaker 4: Is that the job of a manager or no.
• 32:41
  Speaker 5: You do it. The job of a great manager is
• 32:44
  Speaker 5: to do whatever needs to be done to ensure the
• 32:48
  Speaker 5: long term sustainable success of your artists.
• 32:52
  Speaker 7: And for me, that could mean carrying bags.
• 32:56
  Speaker 5: On the road. Sometimes that could be helping a set
• 33:00
  Speaker 5: up gear in a in a club, or that could
• 33:02
  Speaker 5: be negotiating with the CEO of PEPSI you know, so,
• 33:06
  Speaker 5: or like it doesn't matter, it doesn't matter, And that
• 33:09
  Speaker 5: could be all within the same week, by the way,
• 33:12
  Speaker 5: So it's like, do whatever you need to do, and
• 33:15
  Speaker 5: but it's just you, you you. I always felt like
• 33:19
  Speaker 5: I got to set the tone for the level of
• 33:22
  Speaker 5: work ethic so that everybody else can can can follow.
• 33:27
  Speaker 6: So at this point you're you're a talent manager, but
• 33:30
  Speaker 6: you're also building too, right because now you're building the
• 33:34
  Speaker 6: Adam Factory. If I'm not mistaken right that that's now
• 33:36
  Speaker 6: is not just music, it's also it's film, it's television.
• 33:40
  Speaker 3: Is this happening.
• 33:41
  Speaker 5: At the same time, no, so got gay, I was
• 33:43
  Speaker 5: managing out of my living room as well.
• 33:47
  Speaker 8: That's a prestigious living room, different different living room, but
• 33:53
  Speaker 8: needless to say, it was a living room and it
• 33:56
  Speaker 8: wasn't a company, and it was it was managing her.
• 34:00
  Speaker 5: And then as she started to grow a little bit more,
• 34:04
  Speaker 5: I needed to hire somebody to oversee like ticketing for
• 34:08
  Speaker 5: me to make sure that people got into the clubs.
• 34:11
  Speaker 5: And then I had to hire a road manager because
• 34:14
  Speaker 5: I was getting too many emails and phone calls to
• 34:16
  Speaker 5: stay out on the road, and so I had to
• 34:19
  Speaker 5: put somebody on the road. So that ended up turning
• 34:21
  Speaker 5: into after a couple of two three years, you know,
• 34:26
  Speaker 5: thirty thirty people and then you know, other clients and
• 34:29
  Speaker 5: other other verticals. It probably took six years, you know,
• 34:33
  Speaker 5: to get into other verticals, like the investment in things
• 34:37
  Speaker 5: along those lines.
• 34:38
  Speaker 7: But it sort of started.
• 34:40
  Speaker 5: Everything started, like it always starts with this little seed
• 34:44
  Speaker 5: and then you see that seed Germany, you know, And
• 34:47
  Speaker 5: what I tell founders that I work with and you know,
• 34:50
  Speaker 5: or entrepreneurs that that I coach, like Facebook was built
• 34:55
  Speaker 5: with one line. It was starting that line of code.
• 34:58
  Speaker 5: So it wasn't news feed and ad sales and you
• 35:02
  Speaker 5: know Instagram and what's that mark had the right a
• 35:05
  Speaker 5: line of code and and so what's that first step
• 35:09
  Speaker 5: that you can take and then that second step that
• 35:11
  Speaker 5: you could take and sort of you know, build it
• 35:13
  Speaker 5: brick by brick, and and that's the that's the that's
• 35:16
  Speaker 5: the way I know how to build businesses.
• 35:19
  Speaker 2: So so so about investing. How did you get into investing?
• 35:24
  Speaker 2: Especially like, are you an angel investor? Like A F
• 35:27
  Speaker 2: square investments? What exactly is that?
• 35:29
  Speaker 5: Yeah? So so uh the AF square stands for Angel
• 35:33
  Speaker 5: Adam Factory, Angel Fund and and we just called the
• 35:37
  Speaker 5: A F square but for AF square. That actually started
• 35:41
  Speaker 5: from just me getting an opportunity to invest and a startup,
• 35:47
  Speaker 5: and I didn't really know about startups at that time.
• 35:51
  Speaker 5: A friend of mine introduced me to a guy who
• 35:55
  Speaker 5: had invested in the music industry.
• 35:57
  Speaker 7: And this guy was like a pretty big.
• 36:00
  Speaker 5: Tech investor, and he asked me for my advice on
• 36:04
  Speaker 5: the music industry and I said, okay, if if I
• 36:07
  Speaker 5: help you get out of the music industry, well you
• 36:10
  Speaker 5: helped me get into tech because he had invested in
• 36:13
  Speaker 5: some bullshit record label.
• 36:15
  Speaker 7: And I'm like, you gotta get the money out of it.
• 36:19
  Speaker 5: And he introduced me to a bunch of people in
• 36:21
  Speaker 5: tech and that sort of led to me starting to
• 36:27
  Speaker 5: have a little money, like and not a lot by
• 36:29
  Speaker 5: the way, so I wasn't investing like millions of dollars,
• 36:32
  Speaker 5: you know. I started off with investing thousands of dollars
• 36:36
  Speaker 5: and putting it here, and it just was some surplus
• 36:39
  Speaker 5: money that I didn't want to blow because last time
• 36:42
  Speaker 5: I blew my money. So I'm like, okay, Like at
• 36:45
  Speaker 5: least I can, you know, invest and learn right now.
• 36:48
  Speaker 5: So worst case scenario if these investments go to zero.
• 36:52
  Speaker 5: I built some great relationships and learned a lot, but
• 36:56
  Speaker 5: nothing that was going to keep me up at night,
• 36:58
  Speaker 5: you know, in terms of the size of investment.
• 37:01
  Speaker 4: So okay.
• 37:03
  Speaker 2: So and that's how you got into the ubers and
• 37:06
  Speaker 2: the lyfts and just like it's just a domino effect
• 37:08
  Speaker 2: from there.
• 37:09
  Speaker 5: Yeah. So Uber was they were doing they were only
• 37:13
  Speaker 5: in San Francisco at that time, and they were doing, uh,
• 37:16
  Speaker 5: they had just started doing like black cars and and
• 37:21
  Speaker 5: a friend of mine called me up and said, I
• 37:23
  Speaker 5: want you to meet the CEO of Uber And I'll
• 37:27
  Speaker 5: never forget.
• 37:28
  Speaker 7: We were driving I was driving down Santa Monica in
• 37:31
  Speaker 7: l A.
• 37:31
  Speaker 5: And I'm on the phone with him and he's telling
• 37:33
  Speaker 5: me about the business and and I'm like, how in
• 37:37
  Speaker 5: the world are y'all going to afford to buy you know,
• 37:40
  Speaker 5: thousands of these cars, like, because I'm thinking they were
• 37:43
  Speaker 5: going to have to buy you know, individual cars. And
• 37:46
  Speaker 5: as he was explaining what they were going after just
• 37:49
  Speaker 5: made sense. I ended up investing that same week, I
• 37:54
  Speaker 5: want to say, And and then when and when I
• 37:57
  Speaker 5: invested in Lyft, they were called they weren't even called Lyft.
• 38:00
  Speaker 5: They were called zim Ride, and they were a company
• 38:04
  Speaker 5: that took car kids from like college campuses to dorms
• 38:08
  Speaker 5: and so like carpooling. And they later became Lyft, but
• 38:13
  Speaker 5: they were at that time, they were small, I think
• 38:16
  Speaker 5: a sixteen sixteen million dollar valuation somewhere around there, so a.
• 38:22
  Speaker 3: Long away from that.
• 38:22
  Speaker 2: So you still have the stop like, did you keep
• 38:24
  Speaker 2: that ownership all the way to the when they became public?
• 38:26
  Speaker 4: And now you have a right up.
• 38:28
  Speaker 7: I have both companies right up to IPO.
• 38:31
  Speaker 6: One of the other companies you invested in with Spotify,
• 38:33
  Speaker 6: and I know you were you were at Spotify as
• 38:35
  Speaker 6: the head of Creative Services number one. What does that
• 38:38
  Speaker 6: job entail? And do you are you still invested with them?
• 38:42
  Speaker 6: I know they have you as an advisor? Now how
• 38:43
  Speaker 6: does that work?
• 38:44
  Speaker 5: Yeah? Spotify? I met Daniel years ago, but like and
• 38:51
  Speaker 5: I invested right before, but it was before they launched
• 38:55
  Speaker 5: America and became very close with Daniel, the founder and
• 39:01
  Speaker 5: he and I would just talk all the time, just
• 39:05
  Speaker 5: really because he was His thing was, Daniel is a
• 39:09
  Speaker 5: guy that can see ten years ahead, and those are
• 39:13
  Speaker 5: the kind of founders you want to invest in, by
• 39:15
  Speaker 5: the way, because it's like certain people and the record
• 39:19
  Speaker 5: business thinks about think they live quarter to quarter, and
• 39:23
  Speaker 5: they think about what's happening right now, and they make
• 39:26
  Speaker 5: decisions based on what's happening right now. And most of
• 39:30
  Speaker 5: the people who are at record labels, they don't own
• 39:34
  Speaker 5: those record labels. They work there, so their incentives aren't
• 39:39
  Speaker 5: ten years down the line because they might not be there.
• 39:42
  Speaker 5: So when you got somebody like Daniel who was in
• 39:44
  Speaker 5: his twenties and he's looking at building this company that
• 39:48
  Speaker 5: you know he'll be at through his forties fifties, probably he's.
• 39:52
  Speaker 7: Looking at what the future is.
• 39:53
  Speaker 5: And his frust cration was the music industry wasn't moving
• 39:57
  Speaker 5: fast enough, and you had a lot of people who
• 40:00
  Speaker 5: weren't putting their music on streaming. You had a lot
• 40:03
  Speaker 5: of people who were pissed off because they're like, we
• 40:06
  Speaker 5: make money off of CDs and downloads. You know, how
• 40:09
  Speaker 5: dare these people try to make you give us fractions
• 40:12
  Speaker 5: of a cent for streaming and what they didn't understand
• 40:15
  Speaker 5: at that particular time was streaming is the best thing
• 40:19
  Speaker 5: that ever happened to music because you get paid every
• 40:23
  Speaker 5: time people listen to it now, so it's not like
• 40:27
  Speaker 5: back in the day where like you that Biggie record
• 40:31
  Speaker 5: you got behind you. I listened to that so many times,
• 40:36
  Speaker 5: but big only got paid that one time I bought it.
• 40:40
  Speaker 5: Streaming changed everything. It becomes this annuity, and I came
• 40:46
  Speaker 5: on board as somebody to help translate that to the
• 40:50
  Speaker 5: music industry and educate the music industry.
• 40:55
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• 43:45
  Speaker 5: Why this new technology was going to be transformative to
• 43:49
  Speaker 5: the way we do business. And I also had the
• 43:53
  Speaker 5: translate internally at Spotify is like, how do we build
• 43:57
  Speaker 5: a team within Spotify that understand and the goals and
• 44:02
  Speaker 5: motivations of of of musicians and the business around them
• 44:08
  Speaker 5: that that that that support those musicians. So I kind
• 44:12
  Speaker 5: of served as a translator between between those two worlds.
• 44:16
  Speaker 3: How much resistance did you face some artists?
• 44:18
  Speaker 6: I know I had a lot of times when they
• 44:19
  Speaker 6: talk about the percentages that they get off of a
• 44:21
  Speaker 6: stream in the early stages. You know, I could imagine
• 44:25
  Speaker 6: they're looking at my money. Stream has now changed. What
• 44:27
  Speaker 6: kind of resistance did you meet?
• 44:29
  Speaker 5: So so no, no exaggeration. My my first week at Spotify,
• 44:38
  Speaker 5: I went to do a presentation. I told the team
• 44:40
  Speaker 5: to pull together some numbers and and our first meeting,
• 44:47
  Speaker 5: we were doing a meeting with Maverick Entertainment, which is
• 44:51
  Speaker 5: like sal who manages the Weekend and French Montana and
• 44:58
  Speaker 5: Gee Roberson who managed is everybody in the world and
• 45:01
  Speaker 5: everyone so like as their whole staff meet and Guyo
• 45:06
  Speaker 5: Siri manages Madonna YouTube all of them. So I go
• 45:09
  Speaker 5: to their staff meeting and I and I pull up
• 45:14
  Speaker 5: a presentation to show them how much Spotify paid out
• 45:19
  Speaker 5: to all of their artists on streaming that year for
• 45:24
  Speaker 5: the last X amount of years, and then how much
• 45:27
  Speaker 5: they're going to make over the next five years as well.
• 45:30
  Speaker 5: And everybody's jaws dropped because they're like, where's that money?
• 45:39
  Speaker 5: And I said, because you can't blame because I wanted to,
• 45:42
  Speaker 5: I want and I and I did this presentation for
• 45:46
  Speaker 5: a ton of different managers. But what I was showing
• 45:49
  Speaker 5: them was we pay out a lot of money, hundreds
• 45:53
  Speaker 5: of millions of dollars, billions of dollars. Like one artist
• 45:58
  Speaker 5: on the platform, it was one year this artist grossed.
• 46:02
  Speaker 5: I don't know what the artist got but the artist,
• 46:05
  Speaker 5: but I know we paid out close to one hundred
• 46:07
  Speaker 5: million dollars.
• 46:09
  Speaker 7: So I'm like, and that's not.
• 46:11
  Speaker 5: That's not Apple music, that's not all axtream and combined.
• 46:15
  Speaker 5: That's just so any any sort of gripes has the
• 46:21
  Speaker 5: gripes should be with the record labels and the deal
• 46:24
  Speaker 5: structures that the record labels have with with with the
• 46:28
  Speaker 5: with the artists, versus what Spotify paid out to artists.
• 46:32
  Speaker 5: And so that was part of the education process, and
• 46:35
  Speaker 5: that's how we ended up getting a lot of artists
• 46:38
  Speaker 5: onto the platform because they started seeing the importance of it.
• 46:42
  Speaker 5: And then also we shared a lot of data. I'm
• 46:45
  Speaker 5: showing you how to reach your fans. We're showing you
• 46:48
  Speaker 5: where where where your fans are, how they engage, how
• 46:51
  Speaker 5: they engage, engage with your music. And then for the
• 46:54
  Speaker 5: older legacy artists, you know, part of the conversation was
• 46:59
  Speaker 5: I showed a lot of the artists Beatles wouldn't put
• 47:01
  Speaker 5: their music on the platform at one point, and what
• 47:04
  Speaker 5: we did once we got the Beatles onto the platform,
• 47:08
  Speaker 5: we showed them. And you know, in the States, I
• 47:13
  Speaker 5: think it was eighty five percent of or some big
• 47:17
  Speaker 5: percentage of people who were streaming the Beatles were under
• 47:20
  Speaker 5: the age of thirty. So these are people who weren't born.
• 47:23
  Speaker 5: So you got new fans now. So if you're a
• 47:26
  Speaker 5: legacy act and you're thinking about generations and you're thinking
• 47:31
  Speaker 5: about how do you leave your legacy, you have to
• 47:35
  Speaker 5: be on streaming if you want to reach younger consumers.
• 47:38
  Speaker 5: So that was sort of, you know, just the education
• 47:41
  Speaker 5: process we helped put together.
• 47:43
  Speaker 4: So a couple of different things with that.
• 47:47
  Speaker 2: So the record labels wasn't being transparent and the money
• 47:51
  Speaker 2: that they were receiving, and they were kind of like
• 47:54
  Speaker 2: keeping the money, That's what I'm assuming from the conversation
• 47:56
  Speaker 2: and not informing an artist, and I guess kind of
• 47:59
  Speaker 2: just making up reasons why they wasn't getting paid.
• 48:01
  Speaker 4: As far as like you got to spend his money
• 48:02
  Speaker 4: on marketing.
• 48:04
  Speaker 5: But to be clear, they weren't stilling the money. It's
• 48:07
  Speaker 5: the way the deal structures are at work with record
• 48:10
  Speaker 5: labels and artists. So the money was coming in. But
• 48:15
  Speaker 5: if you only get a sixteen percent royalty, and that
• 48:20
  Speaker 5: means eighty eighty four percent of that money goes to
• 48:23
  Speaker 5: the record label. And then out of that sixteen percent royalty,
• 48:26
  Speaker 5: you're paying producers, you're paying mixers. You know, you all
• 48:32
  Speaker 5: the advances are getting have to get recouped, and any
• 48:35
  Speaker 5: money that they might have lost on you in the past,
• 48:38
  Speaker 5: they got to recoup that back as well. So and
• 48:42
  Speaker 5: so the way that they they they the deals are
• 48:44
  Speaker 5: structured aren't structured in a way where the artists are
• 48:49
  Speaker 5: receiving windfalls. And especially the other last little piece, those
• 48:54
  Speaker 5: deals were justified back in the day when you had factories, trucks,
• 49:04
  Speaker 5: plastic CDs, printing press. You know, thousands of employees had
• 49:10
  Speaker 5: who had to you know, get these things around the world.
• 49:13
  Speaker 5: All you got to do is send me a file
• 49:16
  Speaker 5: at midnight before the album comes out.
• 49:19
  Speaker 6: You know what, they're still factoring those costs when in
• 49:23
  Speaker 6: this day and age, those costs don't exist.
• 49:25
  Speaker 7: They don't exist. They don't exist, they don't.
• 49:28
  Speaker 2: We interview, we introduce styles p a legend, and.
• 49:34
  Speaker 7: He said that years that's my man.
• 49:36
  Speaker 4: I love South Okay. He said that.
• 49:38
  Speaker 2: He said, you know, he's been in the game for
• 49:40
  Speaker 2: what twenty five or something like that, and he said
• 49:42
  Speaker 2: that he can't tell you how streaming works. And he
• 49:46
  Speaker 2: said that he would assume that most record label executives
• 49:51
  Speaker 2: can't explain how streaming works. Can you explain how streaming works?
• 49:55
  Speaker 2: Like as far as like, can you is it possible
• 49:57
  Speaker 2: to give a fifth grade education on?
• 49:59
  Speaker 1: Like?
• 49:59
  Speaker 4: Okay, if you stream this you get one that possible?
• 50:05
  Speaker 4: Is it too complicated?
• 50:07
  Speaker 5: I guess the simple way to put it is, there's
• 50:11
  Speaker 5: there's a pool of cash that record labels participate in
• 50:19
  Speaker 5: from subscriptions and and and advertising revenue. And it's not
• 50:25
  Speaker 5: really so Spotify doesn't actually pay per play. It's not
• 50:34
  Speaker 5: as simple as getting paid every time is it's play.
• 50:37
  Speaker 5: Record labels are paid out of that pool based off
• 50:41
  Speaker 5: of market share, and then they divide that and then
• 50:44
  Speaker 5: they pay pay their artists based off of that the
• 50:48
  Speaker 5: pool that they receive. So Universal might have thirty seven
• 50:54
  Speaker 5: percent market share, Sony might have twenty five percent market share,
• 51:01
  Speaker 5: and let's say Warner has fifteen percent market share, and
• 51:06
  Speaker 5: then Maryland that represents a bunch of independents have the
• 51:10
  Speaker 5: remaining market share. So they then break that pod up
• 51:15
  Speaker 5: and then they distribute their revenue based off of their
• 51:18
  Speaker 5: artists royalty structures, and the amount of streams that their
• 51:22
  Speaker 5: artists received.
• 51:25
  Speaker 6: Okay, okay, So what what royalty percentage would be like
• 51:30
  Speaker 6: ideal in this day and age, right, So you said
• 51:32
  Speaker 6: like the sixty percent when there was all those other costs,
• 51:34
  Speaker 6: What should the artists go into to make sure it's
• 51:37
  Speaker 6: a respectable deal as far as royalty percentage, it depends
• 51:41
  Speaker 6: on how.
• 51:41
  Speaker 5: Much leverage you have. And you know, the more usually
• 51:45
  Speaker 5: the less leverage you have, the worst the deal is
• 51:48
  Speaker 5: going to be. More money you take, the worst the
• 51:53
  Speaker 5: deal is going to be. So it's kind of figuring
• 51:57
  Speaker 5: out what type of leverage you want to go in with. So,
• 52:03
  Speaker 5: like a lot of artists that that record companies are
• 52:07
  Speaker 5: signing nowadays are going in with a lot more leverage,
• 52:10
  Speaker 5: so they're getting better deal terms because record companies don't
• 52:14
  Speaker 5: want to take risk anymore. They want to sign what's hot.
• 52:17
  Speaker 5: So if if you're going in hot then you negotiate
• 52:21
  Speaker 5: and ownership of your masters, you negotiate, and you know,
• 52:25
  Speaker 5: a fifty to fifty joint venture deal. And some of
• 52:29
  Speaker 5: the smarter artists are going in negotiate and saying, you
• 52:31
  Speaker 5: know what, I don't really need that much of your money,
• 52:34
  Speaker 5: but I want you.
• 52:35
  Speaker 7: I want you to.
• 52:36
  Speaker 5: Help me with international and I want you to help
• 52:40
  Speaker 5: me on some market. And so I'm just going to
• 52:42
  Speaker 5: give you a fifteen distribution fee and that and that
• 52:48
  Speaker 5: that'll be what you take and then I'm taking a rest. Essentially.
• 52:53
  Speaker 4: When did you leave Spotify?
• 52:56
  Speaker 5: Maybe about two and a half years ago, Yeah, almost
• 53:01
  Speaker 5: almost three years ago.
• 53:02
  Speaker 2: Now, so were you there when they started to make
• 53:04
  Speaker 2: a strong push in the podcast.
• 53:06
  Speaker 4: Yeah, yep, yeah, were you involved with that at all
• 53:09
  Speaker 4: or lightly?
• 53:11
  Speaker 5: Courtney Wholt, who's Who's a brilliant, brilliant guy. Courtney ran
• 53:17
  Speaker 5: podcast for Spotify. So Courtney and I worked together when
• 53:22
  Speaker 5: he was at Innerscope, and then he went to run
• 53:25
  Speaker 5: a division at MTV and then Maker Studios, and then
• 53:29
  Speaker 5: he and I went into Spotify around the same time.
• 53:32
  Speaker 5: But I was an investor in Gimblet Media and and
• 53:36
  Speaker 5: so part of just a Gimblet conversation and working working
• 53:40
  Speaker 5: closely with those guys.
• 53:42
  Speaker 3: Spotify ended up buying Gimblet.
• 53:43
  Speaker 7: Correct, Yes, Spotify bought Gimblet.
• 53:47
  Speaker 4: I have a couple of questions about art.
• 53:48
  Speaker 2: But before that phase, clan like, that's I want to
• 53:51
  Speaker 2: talk about that a little bit because when I saw that,
• 53:54
  Speaker 2: it's like, it's interesting. I wouldn't necessarily assume that they
• 53:57
  Speaker 2: needed Angel investment UNTI Capital investing because they're a gaming crew.
• 54:03
  Speaker 4: But so how did that work? Like, can can you
• 54:06
  Speaker 4: explain that a little bit?
• 54:08
  Speaker 5: Yeah?
• 54:08
  Speaker 7: My my my son, my son, Troy Junior.
• 54:14
  Speaker 5: Sent me. He said, Dad, I'm going to work for
• 54:17
  Speaker 5: this company. I want you to check them out to
• 54:20
  Speaker 5: see you know, if if you if you if you
• 54:22
  Speaker 5: like him because he basically was helping them figure out
• 54:27
  Speaker 5: some of the music initiatives that they were working on,
• 54:30
  Speaker 5: and and he plays games. He he's sort of perfect
• 54:34
  Speaker 5: kid that lived lives between gaming and music and and
• 54:38
  Speaker 5: he sent me some information their deck and I'm like, okay,
• 54:41
  Speaker 5: this sounds really interesting, I said, And I know the
• 54:44
  Speaker 5: CEO he used to manage Kid Rock. I said, tell
• 54:48
  Speaker 5: Lee Trenk to call me. And so when Lee called
• 54:51
  Speaker 5: me and he told me his vision, I ended up
• 54:55
  Speaker 5: making the investment from there, and and then my youngest son, Mike, uh,
• 55:02
  Speaker 5: he's a big time gamer. And when because I went
• 55:04
  Speaker 5: home and I asked Mike about it, and he knew
• 55:08
  Speaker 5: everything about Phase Plan, and what I figured out from
• 55:11
  Speaker 5: my conversation with him was, I said, Okay, I get it.
• 55:16
  Speaker 5: They Phase Clan gets culture because they felt like Wu
• 55:21
  Speaker 5: Tang Clan to me, like where like I looked at
• 55:24
  Speaker 5: like Asap Crew and I looked at Wu Tang. I'm
• 55:27
  Speaker 5: like Phase Clan nailed that the cultural piece of being
• 55:31
  Speaker 5: able to build out a crew and then like people
• 55:36
  Speaker 5: are picking their favorite members of the crew. So they're
• 55:40
  Speaker 5: doing merch phase plans doing merch drops you know that
• 55:43
  Speaker 5: are selling out a million dollars.
• 55:45
  Speaker 7: And like like like this.
• 55:47
  Speaker 5: So I understood right away what they were doing culturally.
• 55:51
  Speaker 5: Gaming wise, I'm not a gamer. I don't know like
• 55:55
  Speaker 5: I understand it a lot, you know, just from what
• 56:00
  Speaker 5: I learned over the last few years. But I'm not
• 56:03
  Speaker 5: a part of the culture. But I understood what they
• 56:06
  Speaker 5: were doing culturally.
• 56:08
  Speaker 2: That's kind of like a retired gam Yeah, it's interesting
• 56:12
  Speaker 2: because I see parallels as far as like what we do.
• 56:15
  Speaker 2: So like the financial literacy movement is like you on Clubhouse,
• 56:20
  Speaker 2: you know, like that's all you see on Clubhouse is
• 56:22
  Speaker 2: everybody's talking about this financial literacy like bitcoin or NFT.
• 56:26
  Speaker 2: I don't want to ask you about that, but real estate
• 56:28
  Speaker 2: stuff like that. So it's like for Ernie Leisha, I
• 56:30
  Speaker 2: feel like it's become a cultural phenomenon and it's.
• 56:35
  Speaker 7: Building because we never.
• 56:39
  Speaker 5: We like, we never talked about money is a culture.
• 56:46
  Speaker 5: Like we talked about aspiration about you know, what we
• 56:49
  Speaker 5: wanted to buy, but we never talked about money as
• 56:52
  Speaker 5: a culture. And I think that's the reason why a
• 56:55
  Speaker 5: lot of first generation people go go broke, coming who
• 57:01
  Speaker 5: come from our culture, because we don't have the lessons
• 57:05
  Speaker 5: and and networks and and cheat codes in terms of
• 57:10
  Speaker 5: understanding how how does banking work? How does interest rates work?
• 57:17
  Speaker 5: How how does uh uh investments work? How do ETFs work?
• 57:23
  Speaker 5: Like we don't. Those aren't culture, Those aren't conversations that
• 57:27
  Speaker 5: we have amongst each other. And what I noticed, like
• 57:33
  Speaker 5: I started having some conversations man with this is the
• 57:39
  Speaker 5: beauty of of of The one good thing I can
• 57:42
  Speaker 5: say that came out of the Trump era was it's
• 57:47
  Speaker 5: scared so bad? What was happening in the country in
• 57:53
  Speaker 5: terms of anti black and and and and seeing these
• 58:01
  Speaker 5: national white nationalists, you know, walk through these college campuses
• 58:04
  Speaker 5: with with tiki torches and and and polo collars, and
• 58:10
  Speaker 5: that a lot of black people who were competitive and
• 58:15
  Speaker 5: in our business started really pulling together and.
• 58:18
  Speaker 7: Talking to each other.
• 58:21
  Speaker 5: And I've had some conversations man where I'm like, I've
• 58:27
  Speaker 5: learned so much from Jay jay Z, from Puff, from
• 58:35
  Speaker 5: Big John, from from like Jay Brown, like you like
• 58:41
  Speaker 5: you you. These are the types of conversations that we
• 58:47
  Speaker 5: should have been having twenty years ago, you know what
• 58:50
  Speaker 5: I'm saying.
• 58:51
  Speaker 7: But we we ship, but we were.
• 58:53
  Speaker 5: Talk coming up that it was like almost felt like
• 58:56
  Speaker 5: zero sum, and it was like this competitive things good
• 59:00
  Speaker 5: to be competitive, but it's it. But it's not zero
• 59:05
  Speaker 5: sum anymore. It's it's we're going to compete and then
• 59:07
  Speaker 5: learn from each other. We're gonna compete then learn from
• 59:10
  Speaker 5: each other. Nothing was better when when Jay Brown and
• 59:14
  Speaker 5: not like it was it was twenty managers competing for
• 59:19
  Speaker 5: UH to sign Shakira and everybody flew to Barcelona within
• 59:23
  Speaker 5: two days. So so when we get off the plane,
• 59:27
  Speaker 5: I get off the plane and as the guys holding
• 59:30
  Speaker 5: up the signs with every manager's name.
• 59:33
  Speaker 7: In the fucking industry that I know.
• 59:35
  Speaker 5: And it's like, oh my god, I thought I was
• 59:37
  Speaker 5: the only person here, but it boiled down to me
• 59:39
  Speaker 5: and Jay Brown. Jay Brown beat me, but I want, like,
• 59:45
  Speaker 5: I rather see it go to Jay. Yeah, but it's
• 59:49
  Speaker 5: other stuff that I beat Rock Nation on that they
• 59:52
  Speaker 5: would rather see it come to me. They put me
• 59:57
  Speaker 5: in the stants, the stants apparel deal, Stance socks and
• 1:00:01
  Speaker 5: Stance apparel. They put me in stands, I put them
• 1:00:05
  Speaker 5: in Uber. They put me in a bunch of different deals.
• 1:00:11
  Speaker 5: I put them in a bunch of different deals. That's
• 1:00:13
  Speaker 5: our network. That's what we do for each other, and
• 1:00:17
  Speaker 5: that's the that like that. But and then even down
• 1:00:21
  Speaker 5: to conversations of mental wellness around this, how do you
• 1:00:27
  Speaker 5: how do you manage your family around this? Because because
• 1:00:31
  Speaker 5: the financial success is one thing, but how do you
• 1:00:35
  Speaker 5: how do you manage your headspace as your as you're
• 1:00:39
  Speaker 5: dealing with this because people my cousin said to me,
• 1:00:43
  Speaker 5: this is what what like my my like and we're
• 1:00:47
  Speaker 5: one of my close cousins who who we've been through
• 1:00:51
  Speaker 5: like a life together. He was laughing at me one
• 1:00:54
  Speaker 5: day because I think it was I was having an
• 1:00:57
  Speaker 5: argument with my wife about something and he said, you
• 1:01:03
  Speaker 5: still got these problems with all this money like that,
• 1:01:06
  Speaker 5: Like that's.
• 1:01:06
  Speaker 7: What that was his comment.
• 1:01:08
  Speaker 5: I said, you think things go away.
• 1:01:12
  Speaker 6: You think you didn't listen to big money more problems. Yo,
• 1:01:17
  Speaker 6: It's just it's just it's different, you know what I'm saying.
• 1:01:21
  Speaker 5: Like the difference is like, certain you become a bigger target,
• 1:01:26
  Speaker 5: You become a bigger target. But I still deal with
• 1:01:30
  Speaker 5: the same problems with like my kids that other people
• 1:01:34
  Speaker 5: deal with with their kids. I probably still have some
• 1:01:37
  Speaker 5: of the same conversations with my wife that other people
• 1:01:40
  Speaker 5: might have with their wife. I still have the same
• 1:01:43
  Speaker 5: conversations with a doctor that other people would have with
• 1:01:46
  Speaker 5: their doctor. Like, So you're still a human being. But
• 1:01:50
  Speaker 5: as a lot of times as black men in these situations,
• 1:01:56
  Speaker 5: you feel isolated and a loan as you're navigating it.
• 1:01:59
  Speaker 5: Because if I can't call some of my friends in
• 1:02:04
  Speaker 5: Philly and complain about certain things when they might be
• 1:02:08
  Speaker 5: dealing with a mortgage issue or you know, or whatever else,
• 1:02:13
  Speaker 5: Like it's certain things that I might want to like
• 1:02:16
  Speaker 5: that might be a real problem to me that they
• 1:02:19
  Speaker 5: might look at me like I'm crazy for talking to
• 1:02:21
  Speaker 5: them about but nevertheless, it's still a problem, so I
• 1:02:24
  Speaker 5: gotta talk to somebody about it. So it's good to
• 1:02:27
  Speaker 5: be able to talk to people who have who are
• 1:02:30
  Speaker 5: living it at the same exact time that can help
• 1:02:33
  Speaker 5: or might have lived it right before you that can
• 1:02:35
  Speaker 5: help you get through it.
• 1:02:38
  Speaker 4: That is a fact. That is a fact.
• 1:02:41
  Speaker 7: Art it's shame is the way of that.
• 1:02:43
  Speaker 5: Not to cut you off, but I think it's important
• 1:02:46
  Speaker 5: because embarrassment and shame will hold us back from sharing
• 1:02:53
  Speaker 5: that with other other brothers assistance, you know what I'm saying.
• 1:02:58
  Speaker 2: Yeah, And it's there's something like you said, it's important
• 1:03:02
  Speaker 2: to speak about because no matter what level of life
• 1:03:04
  Speaker 2: that you're on, you have to have peers, and then
• 1:03:07
  Speaker 2: sometimes you don't have the peers or your peers won't
• 1:03:10
  Speaker 2: communicate if they feel like, you know, they don't want
• 1:03:13
  Speaker 2: to you know, let people in on their business or
• 1:03:16
  Speaker 2: you know, and it's like, you know, unfortunately, as black people,
• 1:03:21
  Speaker 2: the you know, the majority of people are not at
• 1:03:26
  Speaker 2: an economic level where they're peers with millionaires or multi millionaires,
• 1:03:32
  Speaker 2: like you know, majority of people are not peers with that.
• 1:03:34
  Speaker 2: So like now said, my tax bracket not enough blacks haveage.
• 1:03:38
  Speaker 4: Yeah, it's just reality.
• 1:03:40
  Speaker 6: I think I heard you said earlier the cultural conversation
• 1:03:42
  Speaker 6: is changing.
• 1:03:43
  Speaker 3: I like that because it is.
• 1:03:45
  Speaker 6: It is like what you were talking about with Jay
• 1:03:47
  Speaker 6: Brown and talking about with Big John.
• 1:03:49
  Speaker 3: Those things were happening at that level.
• 1:03:51
  Speaker 6: But I feel like that group of guys that we
• 1:03:55
  Speaker 6: looked up to, the Jay's and the Puffs, they showed
• 1:03:57
  Speaker 6: us indirectly, but I felt like nobody hold us that
• 1:04:00
  Speaker 6: gave us the blueprint. We could watch the blueprint, but
• 1:04:03
  Speaker 6: I feel like now the cultural conversation is changing where
• 1:04:05
  Speaker 6: the blueprint is actually there for you now, which is
• 1:04:07
  Speaker 6: about about the clubhouse.
• 1:04:09
  Speaker 5: That's that was one of the things I loved about Clubhouse,
• 1:04:12
  Speaker 5: like where you know, I think it's you know, like
• 1:04:14
  Speaker 5: with any platform, by the way, you're gonna have posers
• 1:04:18
  Speaker 5: and bad information and and you know, and and specialists
• 1:04:22
  Speaker 5: who aren't specialists. But there's a lot of good information
• 1:04:28
  Speaker 5: on there, man, like you know, and a lot of
• 1:04:31
  Speaker 5: conversations that you know, in even a conversation that we
• 1:04:35
  Speaker 5: were referencing earlier, you know, with with Meek and Swiss
• 1:04:39
  Speaker 5: and and and Trap and a few other people or whatever.
• 1:04:43
  Speaker 5: That conversation to me was like I talked offline like
• 1:04:49
  Speaker 5: cause I got I got a group text with probably
• 1:04:54
  Speaker 5: fifteen people who are usually on clubhouse, and it's it's
• 1:05:01
  Speaker 5: a It's such a beautiful thing, man, for when people
• 1:05:06
  Speaker 5: to have a question, to be able to have a
• 1:05:08
  Speaker 5: place to go to ask it without being embarrassed, and
• 1:05:13
  Speaker 5: also for people to be able because like you said, it.
• 1:05:17
  Speaker 7: May not, it does because it's not just this like.
• 1:05:24
  Speaker 5: I don't have as much money as jay Z, you
• 1:05:27
  Speaker 5: know or puff Hopefully I'll get there, but you know,
• 1:05:32
  Speaker 5: just the reality is it's like they're billionaire, they're legit billionaires.
• 1:05:37
  Speaker 5: Now with with with, with with with, But I still
• 1:05:42
  Speaker 5: feel like I can have a conversation with them and
• 1:05:47
  Speaker 5: ask them questions and learn from them, you know what
• 1:05:49
  Speaker 5: I'm saying. And same way it could be somebody who
• 1:05:53
  Speaker 5: might they might only have I talk to some of
• 1:05:56
  Speaker 5: my friends who might have a few thousand dollars left
• 1:06:00
  Speaker 5: over that they get that they could play with that.
• 1:06:03
  Speaker 5: They're like, what should I do? And a couple of
• 1:06:07
  Speaker 5: those friends I put in deals with me. I'm like,
• 1:06:09
  Speaker 5: you know what, put that a little bit of money,
• 1:06:11
  Speaker 5: put that in triller, put that.
• 1:06:13
  Speaker 7: In this place, put that in this place, you know,
• 1:06:16
  Speaker 7: like so.
• 1:06:18
  Speaker 5: Because it's access a lot of times, so it's not
• 1:06:21
  Speaker 5: just about the amount, it's just about access sometimes.
• 1:06:26
  Speaker 4: That's a fact. Can we talk about art? I want
• 1:06:29
  Speaker 4: to talk about art?
• 1:06:32
  Speaker 2: How Yeah, because we haven't really spoke about art at all,
• 1:06:35
  Speaker 2: So artist inter it. This is the question I asked
• 1:06:38
  Speaker 2: you in clubhouse. I was saying, like, because we were
• 1:06:42
  Speaker 2: heavy in stocks. So you know, you buy a stock,
• 1:06:45
  Speaker 2: you buy Apple at one hundred and twenty dollars, it
• 1:06:48
  Speaker 2: goes to two hundred and forty dollars. You double your money, right,
• 1:06:51
  Speaker 2: Like you kind of know Apple is a good company.
• 1:06:54
  Speaker 2: You can look at the bottom line, you can look
• 1:06:55
  Speaker 2: at the revenue, you can look at you know, new releases,
• 1:06:58
  Speaker 2: product lines, and you make it educated decision that this
• 1:07:01
  Speaker 2: is a company that will probably go up in the future.
• 1:07:04
  Speaker 2: I feel like art is just really subjective though. It's
• 1:07:07
  Speaker 2: like one person could look at a painting and say
• 1:07:10
  Speaker 2: that that's terrible. Another person can say that that's the
• 1:07:13
  Speaker 2: best painting in the world, and they're both could.
• 1:07:17
  Speaker 4: Be right, right. It's like it's all subjective. So for
• 1:07:21
  Speaker 4: how do you value art? How is art valued?
• 1:07:24
  Speaker 2: It seems like it's extremely complicated to know if something's
• 1:07:27
  Speaker 2: going to be good or not, Like, how do you
• 1:07:28
  Speaker 2: look at something and say this is a good investment
• 1:07:30
  Speaker 2: to invest in.
• 1:07:32
  Speaker 5: By the way, stocks are very subjective to because when
• 1:07:36
  Speaker 5: you look at price to earnings ratio on some companies
• 1:07:41
  Speaker 5: or you look you know, it's it's it could be
• 1:07:45
  Speaker 5: very subjective. X yeah, yeah, it could be very subjective.
• 1:07:50
  Speaker 5: And you know, I think a lot more information is
• 1:07:55
  Speaker 5: there when you're a publicly traded company in terms of
• 1:07:57
  Speaker 5: the transparency.
• 1:07:59
  Speaker 7: But like you know, one analyst.
• 1:08:01
  Speaker 5: May say this this stock is terrible. Another analyst might
• 1:08:06
  Speaker 5: say this stock is wonderful, you know, and that's why
• 1:08:10
  Speaker 5: you got you know, short sellars and you got you know,
• 1:08:12
  Speaker 5: people who are taking you know, big, big, big bets.
• 1:08:16
  Speaker 5: So so I think it's it's some similarities there for sure. Well,
• 1:08:20
  Speaker 5: art is it's a lot like stock in terms of
• 1:08:25
  Speaker 5: information because like because information is is is everything so
• 1:08:33
  Speaker 5: and so, and art is not as complicated as people
• 1:08:36
  Speaker 5: think when it's when it when it's just access to
• 1:08:39
  Speaker 5: the information is what is what? What's closed a lot
• 1:08:43
  Speaker 5: of times, so the way it works is that safe.
• 1:08:47
  Speaker 5: For instance, there's it's funny I get to turn around
• 1:08:52
  Speaker 5: right here, I got a couple like it's some I
• 1:08:55
  Speaker 5: don't know if you can see it, but there's a
• 1:08:58
  Speaker 5: few paintings right there. So yeah, so so those are
• 1:09:04
  Speaker 5: that's a brand new artists. Uh, Austin Azor is the
• 1:09:11
  Speaker 5: artist's name who I think his work is fantastic, really
• 1:09:17
  Speaker 5: great work, brand new artists. The person, the dealer that
• 1:09:23
  Speaker 5: I that I bought it from is an incredibly talented
• 1:09:29
  Speaker 5: dealer who really is great and has a great track
• 1:09:34
  Speaker 5: record for discovering young artists who end up becoming you know, uh,
• 1:09:40
  Speaker 5: successful artists. And so I'm so a lot of it
• 1:09:45
  Speaker 5: is I like the work, but just because I like
• 1:09:49
  Speaker 5: work doesn't necessarily mean I'm going to invest money into
• 1:09:54
  Speaker 5: and into the work, and because especially when it's expensive.
• 1:10:00
  Speaker 5: His work in particular wasn't that wasn't that expensive. But
• 1:10:04
  Speaker 5: if you're I got friends who are who are gonna
• 1:10:07
  Speaker 5: who They say, Okay, I got twenty five thousand dollars,
• 1:10:11
  Speaker 5: I'm gonna uh that I'm gonna buy I'm gonna buy
• 1:10:14
  Speaker 5: that painting. What I'll tell them is, Okay, if you
• 1:10:17
  Speaker 5: got twenty five thousand dollars to spend on a painting,
• 1:10:20
  Speaker 5: I'm going to send you over thirty artists within that
• 1:10:24
  Speaker 5: price range, who have great work and who have a
• 1:10:30
  Speaker 5: great trajectory in terms of what their career looks like.
• 1:10:35
  Speaker 5: Because the twenty five thousand dollars that you're getting ready
• 1:10:38
  Speaker 5: to spend, you can spend it if you like that artist,
• 1:10:42
  Speaker 5: that's great, but it's probably never going to be a
• 1:10:46
  Speaker 5: resell value on that and in fact, you may not
• 1:10:49
  Speaker 5: be able to ever sell sell it again. But you know,
• 1:10:52
  Speaker 5: because it's like, it's very expensive for artists that no
• 1:10:56
  Speaker 5: one's ever heard of before, and so you got market
• 1:11:00
  Speaker 5: makers who big from from collectors, museums, certain galleries, certain curators,
• 1:11:10
  Speaker 5: certain art critics who can make make or break artists essentially,
• 1:11:15
  Speaker 5: So within that network, they're basically saying, these are the
• 1:11:19
  Speaker 5: next generation of artists that we feel is gonna sort
• 1:11:25
  Speaker 5: of graduate to certain certain levels.
• 1:11:29
  Speaker 2: So it's like music, where you have a gatekeepers that's
• 1:11:32
  Speaker 2: pretty much stamping something like this Bobby Schmurtis song is
• 1:11:38
  Speaker 2: the song that radio should play. We believe in it,
• 1:11:40
  Speaker 2: we're gonna push it. That's a little discouraging though, because
• 1:11:43
  Speaker 2: it's like artists.
• 1:11:45
  Speaker 5: So the only difference in it, though, right is where
• 1:11:48
  Speaker 5: the consumer and music sort of have the last choice,
• 1:11:54
  Speaker 5: Like and the gatekeepers and and our and and and
• 1:11:58
  Speaker 5: and the music business can only get it but so far.
• 1:12:03
  Speaker 5: But then the end of it, the consumer has to
• 1:12:06
  Speaker 5: buy it, and and and and the art In art,
• 1:12:10
  Speaker 5: the art market specifically, is different in the sense of
• 1:12:16
  Speaker 5: as as a collector that has influence, you also can
• 1:12:27
  Speaker 5: influence price and interest. So if Swiss says he goes
• 1:12:35
  Speaker 5: on Instagram and says he's collecting an artist, that artist,
• 1:12:40
  Speaker 5: a lot of people are going to pay attention to
• 1:12:42
  Speaker 5: that artist. If Filma Golden, who runs Studio Museum in Harlem,
• 1:12:48
  Speaker 5: goes on Instagram and says she likes an artist, is
• 1:12:51
  Speaker 5: lights out for that artist at that point. If Goigosian
• 1:12:55
  Speaker 5: Gallery says they're signing an artist, their price on that
• 1:13:00
  Speaker 5: art that artist prices just double automatically. And so as
• 1:13:04
  Speaker 5: a collector who has a bit of influence, I want
• 1:13:09
  Speaker 5: to make sure that prices don't go below what I paid.
• 1:13:13
  Speaker 5: So I'm going to make sure that artists if that
• 1:13:17
  Speaker 5: artist work comes up for auction, you you want to
• 1:13:21
  Speaker 5: make sure that that that price goes more at the
• 1:13:25
  Speaker 5: end of the day, because now all of the work
• 1:13:27
  Speaker 5: in your collection from that artist just went up.
• 1:13:32
  Speaker 6: Yeah, but even in that space right to get into
• 1:13:34
  Speaker 6: a museum or to get in some of these galleries,
• 1:13:36
  Speaker 6: I feel like sometimes the artist has to raise the
• 1:13:39
  Speaker 6: price obviously because if they're in there, there's going to
• 1:13:41
  Speaker 6: be the commission fee. And that's kind of like I
• 1:13:43
  Speaker 6: think what the premise of what Swiss did was having
• 1:13:45
  Speaker 6: no commission, right, one hundred percent of the money goes
• 1:13:47
  Speaker 6: to one hundred percent of the artist. So I mean,
• 1:13:51
  Speaker 6: is it kind of doubles soil where it's like I
• 1:13:52
  Speaker 6: have to do that in order to be in there?
• 1:13:54
  Speaker 5: No? So you really?
• 1:13:55
  Speaker 4: So?
• 1:13:56
  Speaker 5: So is levels right? You don't want to ever go
• 1:13:59
  Speaker 5: in and you don't want to your sole goal you
• 1:14:05
  Speaker 5: want to be in great collections. You want to be
• 1:14:08
  Speaker 5: with people who aren't going to flip your work to auctions.
• 1:14:11
  Speaker 5: You want to be with people who are gonna lend
• 1:14:16
  Speaker 5: your work to museums. You want to be a museum collections.
• 1:14:20
  Speaker 5: So and in order to do that, you don't want
• 1:14:24
  Speaker 5: to overprice your work. So you want to be at
• 1:14:27
  Speaker 5: a reasonable price where good collectors don't feel like what
• 1:14:32
  Speaker 5: I just told you that story about why would I
• 1:14:34
  Speaker 5: buy this for that when I could get this for that?
• 1:14:37
  Speaker 5: So it's like, so you want to go in with
• 1:14:38
  Speaker 5: a good entry level. Once you get to a certain
• 1:14:41
  Speaker 5: point and you're in those collections, then you most people
• 1:14:45
  Speaker 5: end up going with a gallery that could sort of
• 1:14:48
  Speaker 5: take them to the next level and get them into
• 1:14:50
  Speaker 5: even better collections or more or or more global collections
• 1:14:56
  Speaker 5: or more diverse collections, you know, at that point, and
• 1:15:01
  Speaker 5: the value and the work ends up getting pushed up
• 1:15:05
  Speaker 5: at that at that point, And so there is some
• 1:15:09
  Speaker 5: prestige that comes along with being with a Gogosian gallery
• 1:15:13
  Speaker 5: or as Werner or you know, or Houser and Worth
• 1:15:17
  Speaker 5: or one of those big galleries like that too, who
• 1:15:20
  Speaker 5: are going.
• 1:15:20
  Speaker 2: To push So for me personally, let's say you know,
• 1:15:25
  Speaker 2: I'm in stocks real estate and I'm looking to diversify
• 1:15:29
  Speaker 2: my portfolio and I want to get I want to
• 1:15:31
  Speaker 2: start investing in art. Say I have a budget around
• 1:15:34
  Speaker 2: like like you said, twenty twenty five thousand dollars, I
• 1:15:37
  Speaker 2: want to invest in art. What steps should I like?
• 1:15:40
  Speaker 4: What? What what do I do?
• 1:15:42
  Speaker 5: So? So so me personally, I don't invest I don't
• 1:15:45
  Speaker 5: invest in art. That's a big thing for me. So
• 1:15:49
  Speaker 5: I'm a like, I'm a collector. And and that's the
• 1:15:52
  Speaker 5: difference because it's like you know, being somebody that collects
• 1:15:57
  Speaker 5: my you know, I whole long term. So it's like,
• 1:16:02
  Speaker 5: so I'm not I'm not buying the work to sell
• 1:16:04
  Speaker 5: the work. I like the fact that it grows in
• 1:16:07
  Speaker 5: value by the way.
• 1:16:08
  Speaker 2: Well even well maybe not like I want to trade it,
• 1:16:11
  Speaker 2: but I just want to hold something like buy a hole,
• 1:16:13
  Speaker 2: like I want to hold the stock like for twenty.
• 1:16:15
  Speaker 4: Thirty artwork for one million.
• 1:16:17
  Speaker 2: Yeah, like I just you know, I just want to
• 1:16:19
  Speaker 2: buy some art that's going to appreciate.
• 1:16:21
  Speaker 4: How to what should I.
• 1:16:22
  Speaker 5: Do if I'm buying art to appreciate, I'm looking at
• 1:16:29
  Speaker 5: young artists, you know, if and that if I'm if
• 1:16:33
  Speaker 5: my budget's twenty five thousand, I'm probably looking at artists
• 1:16:38
  Speaker 5: and the two to five thousand dollars range, And those.
• 1:16:44
  Speaker 7: Are the artists that I'm collecting.
• 1:16:47
  Speaker 5: I'm looking at curators who are in with incredibly young artists,
• 1:16:53
  Speaker 5: you know, at the at the very beginning, because young
• 1:16:55
  Speaker 5: artists will when you're there in the beginning when they're
• 1:16:59
  Speaker 5: selling five thousand dollar paintings and you're the person that's
• 1:17:03
  Speaker 5: buying those five thousand dollar paintings when their works are
• 1:17:06
  Speaker 5: fifties to two hundred and fifty thousand. You know, those
• 1:17:11
  Speaker 5: are those are collectors who those are artists who are
• 1:17:16
  Speaker 5: definitely going to be looking out for you in the
• 1:17:19
  Speaker 5: future for the most part when you can find it.
• 1:17:21
  Speaker 5: You know people who are loyal like that because they
• 1:17:24
  Speaker 5: appreciate it when they trying, when they're trying to keep
• 1:17:25
  Speaker 5: their lights on. And they are artists that I bought
• 1:17:29
  Speaker 5: their pieces at five five thousand dollars in la At,
• 1:17:34
  Speaker 5: you know, a little gallery, and now it's like, you know,
• 1:17:38
  Speaker 5: their pieces are crazy right now, Like I wouldn't I
• 1:17:45
  Speaker 5: couldn't even buy their pieces on primary market.
• 1:17:48
  Speaker 7: Now I'm like, I don't even feel right. I'm like,
• 1:17:50
  Speaker 7: hold on, this is where they're at right now.
• 1:17:52
  Speaker 5: But it's like, but those are people who who who
• 1:17:57
  Speaker 5: appreciate it. But it's guys like Larry say Mensa as
• 1:18:01
  Speaker 5: a curator out of the Bronx who has an incredible eye.
• 1:18:05
  Speaker 5: He's there super early, and Larry puts me onto some
• 1:18:10
  Speaker 5: artists when it's like before they even have a gallery,
• 1:18:13
  Speaker 5: you're buying work from the studio. And what I and
• 1:18:17
  Speaker 5: what I've been doing is putting all my friends who
• 1:18:21
  Speaker 5: who are taking collecting seriously, who want to collect. We
• 1:18:27
  Speaker 5: we got some guys who build in some great collections
• 1:18:30
  Speaker 5: who just never collected art before. But they're like, you
• 1:18:33
  Speaker 5: know what, they're having fun with it. They're buying young
• 1:18:37
  Speaker 5: artists at great prices, and they're watching those artists appreciate.
• 1:18:42
  Speaker 4: Now, how do you feel about NFTs.
• 1:18:47
  Speaker 5: I think it's I think it's I think right now
• 1:18:51
  Speaker 5: it's like super interesting because it's like is way over hyped,
• 1:18:59
  Speaker 5: but it's it's absolutely here to stay in terms of
• 1:19:07
  Speaker 5: how we think about collectibles and and it's funny. I
• 1:19:14
  Speaker 5: did a call earlier today with UH with with the
• 1:19:19
  Speaker 5: Princess State and and we were talking about, you know,
• 1:19:22
  Speaker 5: just n F T S and I said, you know,
• 1:19:24
  Speaker 5: really the way to think about.
• 1:19:25
  Speaker 7: It is this.
• 1:19:26
  Speaker 5: You know, it's another it's another merch category for us,
• 1:19:31
  Speaker 5: and and so just look at it as simply just
• 1:19:33
  Speaker 5: as another another category. But I think for artists it's
• 1:19:39
  Speaker 5: going to be great in terms of being able to
• 1:19:43
  Speaker 5: track your works, thinking about authenticity of works, to think
• 1:19:50
  Speaker 5: about how about royalties and sort of making sure that
• 1:19:54
  Speaker 5: you still participate financially.
• 1:19:56
  Speaker 7: Along the way.
• 1:19:59
  Speaker 5: But I love what's going I love that it's educating
• 1:20:01
  Speaker 5: people on a space.
• 1:20:03
  Speaker 7: That's the part I like about it the most.
• 1:20:06
  Speaker 5: But but I just I just hope people don't get
• 1:20:09
  Speaker 5: stuck with a lot of bad goods that won't actually
• 1:20:13
  Speaker 5: increase in value.
• 1:20:15
  Speaker 6: I'm glad you brought up the Prince of State because
• 1:20:17
  Speaker 6: it's something I definitely wanted to talk to you about. Obviously,
• 1:20:20
  Speaker 6: you're the entertainment advisor and you said that this is
• 1:20:23
  Speaker 6: one of the things NFT is one of the things
• 1:20:24
  Speaker 6: you're looking into.
• 1:20:25
  Speaker 3: But what are you doing in that role? Is it?
• 1:20:27
  Speaker 6: Are you the one that is making sure that the
• 1:20:29
  Speaker 6: music and the catalogs are being distributed and licensed properly?
• 1:20:33
  Speaker 3: And how did you come into the role?
• 1:20:36
  Speaker 5: Yeah? I got a call for it'll be four years
• 1:20:39
  Speaker 5: ago this month actually from one of the attorneys who
• 1:20:44
  Speaker 5: worked with the state at that time, and they were
• 1:20:46
  Speaker 5: making a change from the previous people who oversaw the
• 1:20:52
  Speaker 5: state and ask what I'll be interested and and speaking
• 1:20:57
  Speaker 5: to co America co America Bank was just started overseeing
• 1:21:03
  Speaker 5: the state and what I'd be interested in working with
• 1:21:05
  Speaker 5: them as an advisor on the entertainment assets. And of
• 1:21:10
  Speaker 5: course the answer is like put me on what what what?
• 1:21:13
  Speaker 4: What?
• 1:21:13
  Speaker 7: Times the flight?
• 1:21:15
  Speaker 5: And you know, I went flew to Minneapolis, did a
• 1:21:19
  Speaker 5: presentation and and ended up started working with him about
• 1:21:23
  Speaker 5: four years ago.
• 1:21:24
  Speaker 7: But it's been amazing.
• 1:21:25
  Speaker 5: So my job is just to figure out, you know,
• 1:21:28
  Speaker 5: was the long term strategy around the entertainment assets, so
• 1:21:32
  Speaker 5: from documentaries to you know, music releases, to partnerships, music licensing,
• 1:21:41
  Speaker 5: and you know, you know, at some point being able
• 1:21:44
  Speaker 5: to turn over.
• 1:21:45
  Speaker 7: Uh uh uh clean.
• 1:21:48
  Speaker 5: Organize beautiful asset over to his family members.
• 1:21:56
  Speaker 6: Probably, so I'm thinking four years of that's around the
• 1:21:59
  Speaker 6: time that Jay put out uh the song on for
• 1:22:01
  Speaker 6: four four when he was talking about the estate. So
• 1:22:03
  Speaker 6: were you a part of that deal when he when
• 1:22:05
  Speaker 6: the music got licensed to the title, I was part
• 1:22:10
  Speaker 6: of the.
• 1:22:11
  Speaker 5: Deal and and and helping to mend J the j
• 1:22:16
  Speaker 5: the title the state relationship. I'm like, we can't can't
• 1:22:21
  Speaker 5: have fights in the family, you know one.
• 1:22:24
  Speaker 2: When the family feuse is a fact, that is a fact. Well,
• 1:22:30
  Speaker 2: mister Carter, it's a pleasure. Thank you, Thank you for
• 1:22:33
  Speaker 2: joining us. Dally enjoyed the conversation. What would you like
• 1:22:36
  Speaker 2: to uh tell the people, any initiatives or anything you
• 1:22:40
  Speaker 2: would like to let the public be aware of.
• 1:22:43
  Speaker 5: No, Look, I just love, love, love what you guys
• 1:22:45
  Speaker 5: are doing and will continue to support and let's just
• 1:22:49
  Speaker 5: keep you know, just the financial literacy out there, for
• 1:22:53
  Speaker 5: the culture, for our people and and continue to push
• 1:22:58
  Speaker 5: each other to the next level.
• 1:22:59
  Speaker 7: But what you guys are.
• 1:23:00
  Speaker 4: Done, appreciate appreciate Troy Housekeeping.
• 1:23:03
  Speaker 6: Right, Yeah, shout with everybody on patreon dot com that
• 1:23:05
  Speaker 6: is our proud to pay program. Obviously TIFI members, you
• 1:23:09
  Speaker 6: have access to the number one school for financial literacy.
• 1:23:11
  Speaker 3: That's ey l University number one, and everything.
• 1:23:14
  Speaker 6: As far as business, entrepreneurism and pretty much anything you
• 1:23:18
  Speaker 6: want as far as careers in the world. So shout
• 1:23:21
  Speaker 6: to all the earners that are part of that and
• 1:23:23
  Speaker 6: everybody that is supporting our merch on eyl dot com,
• 1:23:27
  Speaker 6: Ornelisia dot com.
• 1:23:28
  Speaker 3: We appreciate you for all.
• 1:23:30
  Speaker 6: Your patients and all your diligence in this time of
• 1:23:34
  Speaker 6: getting the merch out to So thank you for all
• 1:23:35
  Speaker 6: your support.
• 1:23:36
  Speaker 4: Yes, thank you guys for rock owners. We'll see you
• 1:23:38
  Speaker 4: next week. Peace.
• 1:23:39
  Speaker 3: Peace.
• 1:23:40
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