Latest / We Are For Good Podcast - The Podcast for Nonprofits / 501. Building Thriving Teams + Crafting Strategic Plans for Success and Retention - Kishshana Palmer

Transcript

501. Building Thriving Teams + Crafting Strategic Plans for Success and Retention - Kishshana Palmer · We Are For Good Podcast - The Podcast for Nonprofits

• 0:01
  Speaker 1: Hey, I'm John.
• 0:02
  Speaker 2: And I'm Becky.
• 0:03
  Speaker 1: And this is the we Are For Good podcast.
• 0:06
  Speaker 2: Nonprofits are faced with more challenges to accomplish their missions and the growing pressure to do more, raise more and be more for the causes that improve our world.
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: We're here to learn with you from some of the best in the industry, bringing the most innovative ideas, inspirational stories, all to create an impact uprising.
• 0:23
  Speaker 2: So welcome to the Good Community.
• 0:24
  Speaker 2: We're nonprofit professionals, philanthropists, world changers and rabbit fans who are striving to bring a little more goodness into the world.
• 0:34
  Speaker 1: So let's get started, becky, it's such a good day on the podcast.
• 0:39
  Speaker 2: I am grinning from ear to ear because my sister from another mister is here.
• 0:42
  Speaker 2: Kish is in the house.
• 0:44
  Speaker 2: If you are new to the we Are For Good podcast, let us introduce you to the Kishana Palmer and you probably know Kish already because her brand is fire out there not just in the nonprofit category but in the leadership category and management, and today she is here to help us build that leadership retention and crafting that strategic plan that's going to set your team up for success in the new year.
• 1:10
  Speaker 2: But I got to talk about all the things Kish because she is a part of my sustainable sisterhood.
• 1:15
  Speaker 2: I love her so dearly and she is the person that we go to in this community for elevated leadership management.
• 1:24
  Speaker 2: She is the founder of Management M-I-N-T, which we're going to be going into.
• 1:29
  Speaker 2: She is a podcaster, a trainer, a coach and multi-author and keynote speaker, and I love her mantra to live well, you have to lead well, and that is baked into absolutely everything that she does.
• 1:41
  Speaker 2: She's also founder of the Rooted Collaborative and host of the Management Made Easy podcast and to us and I think to a lot of the sector she is the foremost expert on the future of collaborative leadership and building thriving, high-performing teams, and I just got to brag on her just a little bit because we love her ethos so much, because it stems from this belief that we have to build together and it starts by looking within.
• 2:07
  Speaker 2: She is an evangelist in her belief that having amazing talent is the number one competitive advantage in your business, and her focus ensures that the talent found at the highest and lowest levels of the org can build the most vibrant cultures of philanthropy Boom jish For those in the back.
• 2:24
  Speaker 1: that's so good.
• 2:25
  Speaker 1: No kidding.
• 2:26
  Speaker 2: Welcome back to the we Are For Good podcast for about the upkeep time.
• 2:29
  Speaker 3: We're glad you're back friend, welcome, oh my gosh.
• 2:32
  Speaker 3: First of all, every time you, in particular Becky, like say my intro, I'm always like well, becky kind of wrote that when they are at that, becky, I was like I don't have anything pitiful to say about myself.
• 2:43
  Speaker 3: What would you say about me?
• 2:43
  Speaker 3: Becky was like say less.
• 2:47
  Speaker 2: And then, I like, sent a bomb of an email.
• 2:50
  Speaker 2: She was like, I didn't need a 22 page bio, but thank you for writing.
• 2:54
  Speaker 3: Oh, my gosh Postpensings is 16 through 23.
• 3:01
  Speaker 2: So glad you're here.
• 3:02
  Speaker 2: Okay, so for new community members, like, take us back, tell us a little bit of your story, which I love so, so, very much, and tell us about what it's done to lead you to this moment.
• 3:13
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I remember an interview for a chief development officer job that I had years ago and the person who was interviewing me was like the chief people officer and he asked me to tell him about myself.
• 3:24
  Speaker 3: Now, up to that point, yeah, I was very like went to this school, did this thing, but something in the way he asked the question to me I inferred telling me origin story.
• 3:34
  Speaker 3: I want you to know I ain't get that job y'all.
• 3:37
  Speaker 3: He didn't understand it.
• 3:42
  Speaker 3: You know, when you're in development and you're in market particular, you're in the business of people and it business of relationship building, and so sometimes you got to be chatty.
• 3:49
  Speaker 3: You know I am very verbose, so now I've kind of gotten to a point where I'm like what part you want to know?
• 3:55
  Speaker 3: So tippy top y'all.
• 3:57
  Speaker 3: I am a Queens, new York girl, born and raised.
• 4:00
  Speaker 3: I'm a first gen American.
• 4:02
  Speaker 3: My parents are from Jamaica.
• 4:04
  Speaker 3: As in these, I'm oldest of four.
• 4:06
  Speaker 3: That's really important.
• 4:07
  Speaker 3: I'm a solo mom to oh my gosh college freshman.
• 4:10
  Speaker 3: You're rocking it.
• 4:12
  Speaker 3: Folks who have been around the block with me know they've grown up with me in the Queen age or she just turned 18.
• 4:18
  Speaker 3: She's flies a button, lord, I can't take it.
• 4:20
  Speaker 3: She's driving all of this.
• 4:22
  Speaker 3: So I started on investment banking, went to business school and then somehow ended up in a grant writing job.
• 4:32
  Speaker 3: That was a miss, but I really can write.
• 4:35
  Speaker 3: My 22 year old obnoxious self went to the CEO and said you know, I don't really think this is a job for me and I really just want to figure out what I should be doing next here, you know, and he I was probably so obnoxious that he looked at me and said go talk to the other VPs and figure out what you want to do.
• 4:51
  Speaker 3: So I had the unique opportunity to be able to talk to into shadow senior level executives pretty early on and what I discovered was that a lot of the executive directors who are out in the organization was decentralized organization.
• 5:05
  Speaker 3: They were racing to raise money to keep their staff.
• 5:09
  Speaker 3: They weren't raising capital to deliver on their programs with excellence.
• 5:15
  Speaker 3: Many of us who are sitting in that chief executive seat are racing to keep our staff and if I'm going to keep it, a thousand.
• 5:24
  Speaker 3: I have been there a time or, two, or three, I see, of my own small company, right.
• 5:28
  Speaker 3: And so what I discovered during that time that was very formative for me is that people power the way we think, the way we act.
• 5:39
  Speaker 3: They activate our beliefs.
• 5:41
  Speaker 3: They can crush us.
• 5:44
  Speaker 3: Right, you can.
• 5:45
  Speaker 3: Your whole world can be undone through relationship.
• 5:47
  Speaker 3: And so, as opposed to focusing on raising money and you hear me say raising money, raising capital, interchangeably I focused on the business of building relationships with people.
• 5:58
  Speaker 3: I didn't always do it well, I didn't always get it right.
• 6:01
  Speaker 3: I'm not gonna lie to y'all and say that my gender and my race and my background, and when I was in my younger years, maybe I had on too much makeup, my heels were too high, my suit was too tight who could say I was doing all the things?
• 6:14
  Speaker 3: Look, beth, you're making that face.
• 6:15
  Speaker 3: But let me tell you, in a year of our Lord, 2002 and three, these things that I know, I know it just hurts me to hear you say it.
• 6:21
  Speaker 3: It hurts, right, Basically that face, it's a I grew up professionally in that phase and so it really taught me that my gift and my superpower is being able to see you.
• 6:35
  Speaker 3: And it doesn't always work well.
• 6:38
  Speaker 3: It could always be a kryptonite y'all, because when folks who are not rooted and fortified in themselves and in their leadership recognize and realize, holy kajole, this broad could see me, oh your shenanigans.
• 6:55
  Speaker 3: Read Tom Fulory and foolishness.
• 6:56
  Speaker 3: Now.
• 6:57
  Speaker 3: I'm not gonna out you now, but I can see Some folks get very uncomfortable with that.
• 7:02
  Speaker 3: And so I've also had the kind of career where I've had some really high highs, lots of money, raise amazing teens I've been able to bring in young professionals who are now senior executives in their career and also some really low lows, getting fired because I didn't hit the mark.
• 7:17
  Speaker 3: That was that kept moving, or there were unstated and unspoken expectations that I was to meet without the runway to do it, or that every time I left an organization my role would be split in two, when all I was asking for was a donor assistant so I could keep track of my receipts on myself.
• 7:33
  Speaker 2: Man, I'm feeling this.
• 7:35
  Speaker 3: So to know me and to understand my story is to know that I am a Gen Xer who grew up in the 80s and 90s in the concrete jungle.
• 7:45
  Speaker 3: I am first in family to go to school.
• 7:47
  Speaker 3: I have gotten it out the mud, and so my resilience is hard one.
• 7:53
  Speaker 3: My scar tissue is pretty deep but my smile is dazzling.
• 7:58
  Speaker 3: I just want y'all to know.
• 7:59
  Speaker 2: And your style is off the charts.
• 8:01
  Speaker 3: I would say that too, because I have a deep rooted belief in the good of people and I am fortified in my faith and have been lucky enough to have family and friends who have been able to buoy me at times that I couldn't didn't always get that professionally.
• 8:15
  Speaker 3: I do now I got my crew, but that is sort of like the long, the slow shutter snapshot of who I am today.
• 9:00
  Speaker 1: I mean thank you for bringing us back to there.
• 9:03
  Speaker 1: I mean you hit on a lot of the reasons why we are just love you so much as a human, but also look to you as a mentor and as such a leader in this space for how to show up more as our authentic selves and how we can start bucking systems that are still in place, that are repressing that in places, and so anytime we get you on the mic, I love that you're gonna tell us the truth and love, even when it hurts, even when it is awkward even when it's all these things.
• 9:26
  Speaker 1: So we gotta start by saying what are you seeing across the landscape in the sector, specifically around leadership and hello, staff retention?
• 9:34
  Speaker 1: If this is a recurring theme, we're gonna be talking a lot about this this year because it's painting us.
• 9:39
  Speaker 1: I mean, our sector needs these heartwired individuals to stay in these places and thrive in these places.
• 9:45
  Speaker 1: So start with some tone setting.
• 9:47
  Speaker 1: What are you paying attention to?
• 9:47
  Speaker 1: What do we need to lean into?
• 9:49
  Speaker 3: So what I'm looking at right now are our executive leaders actually paying attention to their staff and their teams.
• 9:57
  Speaker 3: What I found is that during the pandemic years gosh it seems like it was 10 years ago it was literally yesterday and now we got another search.
• 10:05
  Speaker 3: It's ridiculous.
• 10:05
  Speaker 3: During the pandemic space, that time period, I felt like there was a lot of full concern around people's health and wellbeing.
• 10:15
  Speaker 3: It just looked like another version of not wanting to get fined.
• 10:20
  Speaker 3: And so what we're seeing now are that team members, our workers, our support networks, our senior leaders got used to and accustomed to that level of space.
• 10:31
  Speaker 3: And now you want me to do things business as usual.
• 10:35
  Speaker 3: Well, I don't know if anybody noticed, but business as usual wasn't working before and it's gone.
• 10:40
  Speaker 3: Hello, forever more and goodnight.
• 10:43
  Speaker 3: And so leaders who do not check themselves and I mean that in the best way where are you in your life right now?
• 10:52
  Speaker 3: What's happening at the house?
• 10:54
  Speaker 3: People are getting divorced, people's parents are passing, people's children are saying the hell with this mess, you gotta have your house in order.
• 11:03
  Speaker 3: So you have to be willing to take a moment, take a beat and assess where you are, because that self-awareness is peg one in being emotionally intelligent.
• 11:14
  Speaker 3: And so what I'm seeing is the unraveling of leaders who do not have real emotional intelligence.
• 11:23
  Speaker 3: They can tap dance like they got it.
• 11:25
  Speaker 3: It look good, but do they actually really understand the four tenets of having solid emotional intelligence?
• 11:33
  Speaker 3: Do you get how you show up in the room.
• 11:36
  Speaker 3: Are you able to read the room?
• 11:38
  Speaker 3: So trend-wise leaders who are able to read the room, the temperature?
• 11:44
  Speaker 3: If you're unable or unwilling to do that work, then you are gonna continue to lose not just your best team members, but the fair to middling ones too.
• 11:57
  Speaker 3: Those are the folks to me that have potential to really show up and show out.
• 12:03
  Speaker 3: The second thing I'm seeing are that folks are more willing to hang out their own shingle, regardless of where they are in their career arc, then to put up with what they believe and or have experienced as at the workplace foolishness.
• 12:21
  Speaker 3: And so what I have tried to counsel folks on people particularly people who come to me for mentorship or advice is don't do that, not yet.
• 12:33
  Speaker 3: Like, your employer is your first investor, and so before you decide to go out and do something else, you need to make sure that you are stewarding that investment.
• 12:46
  Speaker 3: The same way you were steward a donor, you gotta steward your career.
• 12:50
  Speaker 3: So if you're trying to break bad and go left, did you steward that investment?
• 12:54
  Speaker 3: I wish somebody would have said that to me in my earlier years, because I've always had the hankering for entrepreneurship my ex-husband to say it from when we were in college.
• 13:04
  Speaker 3: He was like, why are you even applying for a job?
• 13:06
  Speaker 3: We should just do our own thing.
• 13:07
  Speaker 3: And I was like, who is gonna pay your loans, you know?
• 13:10
  Speaker 3: So I wish somebody would have said that to me, right?
• 13:13
  Speaker 3: Because I would have thought about the engagement, what I asked, the questions, the assignments, the way I approached my work, how I navigated discrimination, how I navigated sexism, how I navigated all of it.
• 13:25
  Speaker 3: If I just had somebody whisper a word, a kernel in my ear about that, about investing, because I came into that when I was probably like 31, 32, right, but in the early years, I wish somebody would have said something to me.
• 13:38
  Speaker 3: Instead I got oh Kashana, you know, your perfume might be too strong.
• 13:42
  Speaker 3: Oh, kashana, we just, you know, folks are uncomfortable with, and it would be something made up, you know, as opposed to just giving me the real deal.
• 13:51
  Speaker 3: So the third thing I would say that I think is a must do I don't think it's a trend yet, but I think it's a must do for leaders is to talk to your people, give them that feedback good, bad or ugly.
• 14:06
  Speaker 3: First of all, don't talk to them crazy, okay, because people will lie about it, sue you and cuss you out.
• 14:10
  Speaker 3: I just want you to know.
• 14:11
  Speaker 3: But give them real feedback.
• 14:14
  Speaker 3: And also, if you're going to offer feedback, we are beyond the boss, as the way we lead, leaders are now advisors and coaches and mentors, and so that is a softer place to land.
• 14:29
  Speaker 3: It doesn't mean the information is softer to hear, and so being able to create that space for that give and take allows you, as a leader, to grow.
• 14:40
  Speaker 3: It gives you space to stay in vision.
• 14:42
  Speaker 3: It gives you space to stay in innovation.
• 14:44
  Speaker 3: It gives you space to stay in strategy, because if your team member can tell you, get your hands out my operational pockets and let me do my job, our job as leaders, particularly for running organizations, businesses, et cetera, you got to lay track.
• 15:00
  Speaker 3: So if you look at a job, think of a job description.
• 15:03
  Speaker 3: Y'all.
• 15:03
  Speaker 3: A lot of job descriptions are multiple pages.
• 15:05
  Speaker 3: Why?
• 15:06
  Speaker 3: Because we spend a whole lot of time talking about ourselves.
• 15:08
  Speaker 3: No one cares.
• 15:09
  Speaker 3: You can take off half a page if you just remove passion for the mission.
• 15:14
  Speaker 3: But what?
• 15:15
  Speaker 3: Because who cares?
• 15:17
  Speaker 3: If you have passion for the mission, do you have passion for accounts, payable and receivables?
• 15:21
  Speaker 3: Because that's what you're going to be doing all day, friend.
• 15:23
  Speaker 3: You can learn to have passion for the mission.
• 15:27
  Speaker 3: You can grow into it.
• 15:29
  Speaker 3: It's a relationship you grow into.
• 15:31
  Speaker 3: So if you spend all your time in your job description, in your interviews, focusing on how someone should do something, you have gotten in the wrong boat.
• 15:39
  Speaker 3: Leaders need to focus on the what and the why and the outcome.
• 15:45
  Speaker 3: How will I know I'm successful?
• 15:47
  Speaker 3: And you've got to allow your team members to nurture and to create and to expand on the how, and so leaders who can do that, coming into this year this is going to be a hard year are going to see their team members really get creative about how to solve now challenges and how to prevent later problems.
• 16:10
  Speaker 3: So that's kind of what I see.
• 16:13
  Speaker 3: And then, lastly, folks are really struggling with retiring transition.
• 16:17
  Speaker 3: Talk about that.
• 16:18
  Speaker 3: So right before we went into the pandemic, there was this massive outcry and rightfully so that there was going to be a mass exodus of senior leaders, and what had happened was that folks did not prepare younger professionals who are now made to senior professionals for that point no succession planning, no shadowing.
• 16:37
  Speaker 3: Feeling like your job is at risk.
• 16:39
  Speaker 3: You are the one in charge, friend.
• 16:41
  Speaker 3: It is not at risk.
• 16:42
  Speaker 3: What are you talking about.
• 16:43
  Speaker 3: And so in the season right now where 70% of CEOs, whether they're for-profit or nonprofit, their number one concern at night is not getting fired, you already are off track because your mentality has now circle back to yourself, and that's human nature.
• 16:59
  Speaker 3: But those of us who take a more outward approach to that are going to have a whole different set of results, because you're not going to be focused on the pain point of not being able to retire, not having succession planning, not having young professionals and mid-career professionals in pipe, but you'll be focusing on the opportunities for co-leadership, for how to do job overlap so that people can transition out successfully, for how folks can move into other roles when they move out of that particular spot and not feel like they failed.
• 17:32
  Speaker 3: If you allow for that give and take, then all of a sudden you have a different experience, and so does your team.
• 17:39
  Speaker 3: So, anyway, y'all know I'm longwinded, so I will stop there.
• 17:42
  Speaker 2: I mean, I don't know what we expected Kish to come out on here and talk about, but that right, there was just a masterclass in elevated leadership and management and I just think there are so many tenets that spin out from that.
• 17:58
  Speaker 2: Healthy cultures, like your retention culture goes through the roof because people feel seen and known and valued.
• 18:05
  Speaker 2: I also think we, just as a sector I've said this many times on the podcast we put so much emphasis on those hard skills.
• 18:12
  Speaker 2: We did not put anything into those soft skills of what you're talking about emotional intelligence, having self-awareness, knowing how to read a room which is got to be 50% of the first time you're going to meet a donor is that first impression and how you're able to understand and sort of guide that conversation.
• 18:33
  Speaker 2: And so I want to talk about the future of collaborative leadership, because I feel like you were doing this before and talking about it before it was ever mainstream.
• 18:43
  Speaker 2: And I just think this is something that we're seeing.
• 18:47
  Speaker 2: We've had on Tulane Montgomery, we've had on Abby Faye, like we've had many co-CEOs on, and we're watching the way that leaders can sort of learn from each other.
• 18:56
  Speaker 2: Talk about what's the most important thing that leaders at any level of an organization can focus on this year, as we're talking about collaborative leadership Really moving out of the skills area and moving into the talent area.
• 19:12
  Speaker 3: Very few of us get to operate in our gifts.
• 19:14
  Speaker 3: I'll just give a quick rundown on that if you haven't heard this before.
• 19:17
  Speaker 3: Yalla Repeated so most of us get hired, hire for and operate in our skills area.
• 19:23
  Speaker 3: We're always trying to build skills.
• 19:25
  Speaker 3: Skills are those things that you learn and typically monetize.
• 19:29
  Speaker 3: What I want to encourage people to do is go up one focus in your talent area and those are things that come naturally to you and then you can decide if you want to monetize it or not.
• 19:40
  Speaker 3: A very small percentage of us rare air get to focus on our gifts, and those are things you are born with and you get to decide whether you monetize them or not.
• 19:54
  Speaker 3: Because so many of us spent most of our career in our skills area and every now and again we get to show out in our talent area, we forget what our gifts actually are, even if we don't monetize them.
• 20:09
  Speaker 3: So, in thinking about collaborative leadership and thinking about what I would consider to be old miles because co-leadership is not new thinking about revisiting what I would call the Birkenstock and the granola crunchy types of leadership that folks used to look at sideways.
• 20:26
  Speaker 3: That's where it was.
• 20:27
  Speaker 3: The reality is, being able to return to that, to those types of models, means being able to release the need and the desire for control, which means you have to really be fortified fortified is one of my favorite words.
• 20:44
  Speaker 3: You have to really be fortified in your skills and the gaps, but also be clear on what your talent areas are, because you're going to need that give and take.
• 20:55
  Speaker 3: Co-leadership is hard, right, it is very challenging.
• 20:58
  Speaker 3: I'm working with a client right now within a co-leadership model and the step forward step back.
• 21:04
  Speaker 3: I have to help them get really clear what is in your circle and then what's over here in this circle and then what's in the Venn diagram, so that we can understand where we come together and then how do we make decisions when we're there.
• 21:17
  Speaker 3: So you have to be willing to apply some more rigor.
• 21:22
  Speaker 3: You can't just wing it not to me, but I'm also a person and a leader and a consultant who operates in those level of like.
• 21:31
  Speaker 3: If you put guardrails and you have tight systems and you have order, then it allows you to be more free, because if there's chaos guess what you can return to order.
• 21:42
  Speaker 3: If you try something new and it don't work.
• 21:45
  Speaker 3: What do y'all have?
• 21:46
  Speaker 3: You have standard operating procedures, hello.
• 21:49
  Speaker 2: Falling asleep.
• 21:57
  Speaker 3: He's like I'm teaching a three part workshop right now, y'all, on strategy, right.
• 22:01
  Speaker 3: So we have about 15 of us are in there, so it's a small cohort this time and I love them.
• 22:05
  Speaker 3: And yesterday we were talking about strategy versus tactics, right.
• 22:09
  Speaker 3: And so I had this whole conversation about the difference and at one point one of the executive directors his eyes were like rolling them back in his head I said I'm going to do a SWAT analysis and the way I must have broken it down in like two sentences.
• 22:22
  Speaker 3: All of a sudden his eyes lit up, right, and he's like so you can put SWAT in two sentences to explain to us that?
• 22:29
  Speaker 3: He said you know what done?
• 22:30
  Speaker 3: He said I'm good.
• 22:32
  Speaker 3: So when you start having conversations about strategy and then operationalizing that strategy, those things, you have to really understand that, to come into collaborative leadership models, you have to understand who leads, who guides, who steps forward, who steps back, who has veto rights, who has decision making rights.
• 22:53
  Speaker 3: You've got to get really clear on those things that make us want to fall asleep because the creative in me is like to hell with this mess.
• 22:59
  Speaker 3: But we need it Correct, Got to come back down.
• 23:02
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so I'm seeing that.
• 23:04
  Speaker 3: So I think that folks who can live in the gray but kind of crave black and white, I think will do really well in any of the new, the, the revisited, the refreshed collaborative leadership models.
• 23:19
  Speaker 3: I'm not sure that five years ago, even six years ago, I could have done a co anything.
• 23:25
  Speaker 3: Okay, I have been in charge since I was in kindergarten, I believe that.
• 23:29
  Speaker 3: And like, wake up, and they are the one in front.
• 23:33
  Speaker 3: That is me, you know if I'm, if I'm gonna be somewhere, I'm gonna be the best, and so that you know, like, literally is how I've always been.
• 23:40
  Speaker 3: So that would be a struggle for me, right?
• 23:42
  Speaker 3: Because I am used to delegating out, I'm not used to seeding decisions but that are not by my choice, and so you've got to really get in there with yourself.
• 23:53
  Speaker 3: So if y'all are trying to do collaborative leadership in any way, shape or form, please get a therapist.
• 23:58
  Speaker 2: You're going to need it Seriously.
• 24:00
  Speaker 2: That is not tongue in cheek, Please.
• 24:01
  Speaker 2: No, I'm real serious.
• 24:03
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I know you are.
• 24:05
  Speaker 3: You need to get a coach you have, or an advisor, so I do a lot of advising because you need someone to help bring y'all back to the table.
• 24:11
  Speaker 3: It is worth that investment.
• 24:13
  Speaker 3: So you're actually going to seek and you're going to get more capital, more private philanthropy, more social impact If you decide to have a social enterprise, when you have intervention at the foundation of how you run your organization.
• 24:31
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that makes so much sense and I think I feel like all your conversations always come back to healing on the inside Some of these things that we kind of talk about surface level things.
• 24:39
  Speaker 1: We're talking about bigger, deeper issues and I'm really honed in on staff retention and so I hate to be a broken record.
• 24:46
  Speaker 1: I want to talk about this because I feel like there's internal systems of how our organizations operate that is driving people out of our sector, and so I wonder what would you say?
• 24:55
  Speaker 1: What's on your mind of things that we could focus on internally as teams to build a retention type of culture?
• 25:02
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I would say.
• 25:03
  Speaker 3: A lot of times when I facilitate a retreat, folks come to the retreat exhausted and are angry.
• 25:13
  Speaker 3: So one of the first things that I talk to my executive leaders about when we start talking about getting together A retreat involves retreating to one's room, to the beach, to the forest, to the desert, wherever y'all have convened.
• 25:32
  Speaker 3: It involves actually leaving your team the heck alone.
• 25:36
  Speaker 3: Yes, seriously, retreat.
• 25:40
  Speaker 1: Retreat Websters.
• 25:42
  Speaker 3: It's not the time to plan a darn thing.
• 25:45
  Speaker 3: It's the time to reflect, it's the time to vision cast, it's the time to dream, it's the time to whiteboard, it's the time to set the things we're going to have to work on and committee.
• 25:58
  Speaker 3: When we get back, maybe you might have to add some stuff out, which is why you need the trees, the bees, the leaves, the forest you need out.
• 26:07
  Speaker 3: If what you want to do is have a long strategy discussion that you force your team members to run, then what you are having is typically a long ass meeting with snacks and food.
• 26:22
  Speaker 3: Hello, that's it.
• 26:24
  Speaker 1: Which is table stakes.
• 26:25
  Speaker 1: I mean you require that.
• 26:27
  Speaker 3: So if you want to talk about culture retention, get clear on how you actually want your team members to show up to work, how you understand what motivates them in this season of their life and there is no wrong answer and what you are willing to put on the line to ensure that they are healthy.
• 26:51
  Speaker 3: And if your team members' health does not cross your mind as a leader, please resign today.
• 27:00
  Speaker 3: Yes, because there is a widget job for you that you can excel at if you do not care about your people.
• 27:08
  Speaker 3: And so when I think about retention, I think about what are the ways in which I step back.
• 27:12
  Speaker 3: So I will give you a quick example using my own company.
• 27:14
  Speaker 3: So one of my team members is in Mexico, one of my team members here in Atlanta with me.
• 27:19
  Speaker 3: Now we have other team members in California, now back in New York, so we are pretty spread out.
• 27:23
  Speaker 3: So I have to be thinking about planning for and budgeting for us to get together.
• 27:29
  Speaker 3: We do not use that time to get together to do a darn thing For me.
• 27:33
  Speaker 3: I need to get a tan to get bronze.
• 27:35
  Speaker 3: Somebody else can get from their babies, because all my staff members have children, young children and babies.
• 27:41
  Speaker 3: We plan other parts of the year On.
• 27:44
  Speaker 3: Zoom DoorDash goes to people's houses.
• 27:47
  Speaker 3: Yep, we have built-in breaks with music.
• 27:51
  Speaker 3: I don't make them do any kind of forced activities.
• 27:55
  Speaker 3: We focus.
• 27:56
  Speaker 3: And so, if you want to think about retention, making sure your team members understand the flow of the business and that you design opportunities for them to step back and to look at the business and when I say the business, I mean if you're in front-raising as a business, you're in operations business unit I know people don't like to hear it you're in program hello business unit, probably largest one.
• 28:20
  Speaker 3: Whatever your it is having the space to step back to say what's working, what's not working.
• 28:26
  Speaker 3: Do we actually set the mark this way?
• 28:28
  Speaker 3: Do we have the right people sitting at the right place?
• 28:30
  Speaker 3: Am I the right person, not penalizing your team members for realizing they're not the right person, giving them space to find happiness someplace else and not using it as an opportunity to save money on your books?
• 28:41
  Speaker 3: I will stop there, because I can keep going on and on and on.
• 28:44
  Speaker 3: Don't put a quarter in me and wind me up.
• 28:49
  Speaker 1: You're getting me riled up because at the core of it, I think it is creating space, like the intention to reflect, but it's also like leaning into some of these humans, like we are humans, like we're not bots, we're people you know, and like how do we center being human in this and so we can treat people in a better way?
• 29:08
  Speaker 1: I feel like it's very elementary.
• 29:09
  Speaker 2: And I think you saying like, if you don't care for your people, I bet a lot of people, a lot of leaders, care for their people.
• 29:16
  Speaker 2: But I would say to your point do they know?
• 29:19
  Speaker 2: Do they feel it?
• 29:21
  Speaker 2: Do they feel empowered?
• 29:22
  Speaker 2: Do they see you coming by and not just talking work all the time?
• 29:27
  Speaker 2: I mean there's just little things I think that you can do to be a light to somebody else that is going to put currency into your retention bank, because people wanna stay in wholesome environments like that.
• 29:41
  Speaker 2: And I just think it's great that we're having this conversation at the top of the year because we're talking about how things are not going back to the way they ever were before.
• 29:52
  Speaker 2: This whole notion of that's the way we've always done it is not going to work for you this year.
• 29:57
  Speaker 2: So I think it's a healthy exercise to go back and say are we all in the right place?
• 30:02
  Speaker 2: Are in the right chairs?
• 30:03
  Speaker 2: Do we have the right projects?
• 30:04
  Speaker 2: What's not working for us?
• 30:06
  Speaker 2: Are there ways that we can reimagine it?
• 30:08
  Speaker 2: And that kind of a group and community conversation is a healthy exercise.
• 30:13
  Speaker 2: So I wanna get into the strategic planning piece, because I think crafting a strategic plan that can set your team up for success in the new year is really gonna give people some exhale this year.
• 30:24
  Speaker 2: So everybody's back new year, starting back at zero on our fundraising goals.
• 30:30
  Speaker 2: We're ready to take off.
• 30:31
  Speaker 2: We got new energy.
• 30:33
  Speaker 2: Can you walk our audience through what you think is gonna be the most important things about building a plan for this unique?
• 30:41
  Speaker 3: year.
• 30:41
  Speaker 3: So one of our tenants for marketing keep the kiss method right.
• 30:45
  Speaker 2: Keep it simple, Yep kiss it.
• 30:47
  Speaker 3: Silly, stupid, what's the word you wanna say?
• 30:49
  Speaker 3: We can't talk to people, but, silly, keep it simple.
• 30:50
  Speaker 3: I was talking to our client who asked me to step in because they have a strategic plan that is gone left, and I simply said that thing should be on five slides.
• 31:00
  Speaker 3: If your staff can't tell you what the strategic plan is and what your embeds are too long.
• 31:06
  Speaker 1: Yep, five slides of big type case.
• 31:07
  Speaker 1: You start drifting off from your writing.
• 31:09
  Speaker 1: You're wrong.
• 31:11
  Speaker 3: You had a consultant write it for you and not guide you through it.
• 31:14
  Speaker 3: Incorrect Strategy at its simplest term is we have decided that this is the horse we're betting on and in order for us to get that for round the track and get to the prize, we're gonna train in this particular way.
• 31:32
  Speaker 3: In order to train in this particular way, we're gonna need this particular type of track of stable hands.
• 31:40
  Speaker 3: See where I'm going.
• 31:40
  Speaker 3: I took a horse analogy and I'm gone.
• 31:42
  Speaker 1: I set off the races earlier.
• 31:43
  Speaker 1: Get it get it.
• 31:46
  Speaker 3: The horse is gonna need certain type of food.
• 31:47
  Speaker 3: So, as you think about strategy and breaking it down to tactics, and then breaking it down to activities, and then breaking it down to resources, and then breaking it down to what we are not willing to do, that also should be in your strategic plan.
• 32:04
  Speaker 3: So, really thinking about how we get to the heart of what matters for our team and, honestly, what gets to the heart of the matter for us, I think to me is also something that we just don't wanna think about cause we don't associate it.
• 32:21
  Speaker 3: Even in 2020, it's four, oh my gosh.
• 32:25
  Speaker 1: It's four we don't associate it.
• 32:27
  Speaker 3: So strap lands simple, easy to read.
• 32:30
  Speaker 3: I will give it to a teenager and ask them to tell you what's in it.
• 32:33
  Speaker 3: If they can't tell you what's in it, it's too complicated, because what you're doing is saying these are the things that we feel committed to, these are the resources we're willing to put behind what we feel committed to.
• 32:45
  Speaker 3: Here is the length of time we're willing to stay with it and here is how much it's supposed to cost.
• 32:52
  Speaker 3: So if your strategic plan doesn't have a dollar amount on it, it is not a strategic plan, it's an operational plan or it's just a wish list.
• 33:00
  Speaker 2: Ooh.
• 33:00
  Speaker 1: Ooh.
• 33:01
  Speaker 2: Where were you?
• 33:02
  Speaker 2: My entire career, friend.
• 33:04
  Speaker 1: I mean, I needed you to coach me.
• 33:06
  Speaker 2: I needed you to advise me, I needed you to mentor me and I know it's just.
• 33:12
  Speaker 2: We learn these things as we go and I don't want anyone.
• 33:16
  Speaker 2: If you felt like you've seen yourself in some of these examples, don't be hard on yourself.
• 33:23
  Speaker 2: We are all human beings, we're all works in progress and I just think that I hope this is gonna give you the fuel you need to really focus in on yourself, on your team, on that strategic plan and, heck, all of that is gonna help with the retention culture.
• 33:41
  Speaker 2: It's gonna help with every part of what is in that strategic plan, because people feel good, people feel seen, they feel empowered, they feel like they're in the right seat, they know where we're going, they can articulate it, they feel like they're a part of moving, whatever the thing is forward.
• 33:58
  Speaker 3: But also Becky.
• 33:59
  Speaker 3: One thing I wanna really say about strat planning, because I don't wanna oversimplify what organizations are going through change management and they're at an inflection point in their organization's growth arc where they have to really make some big decisions and they have to dig in deeper around the role that they plan to take and the bets they're willing to make.
• 34:17
  Speaker 3: In the most simplified form, for folks who are not in their third quarter right now of their fiscal year, but they're in first quarter, this is a good opportunity to say at minimum.
• 34:28
  Speaker 3: Am I talking about showing up mediocre?
• 34:30
  Speaker 3: Okay y'all, but at minimum, these are the things we must do.
• 34:35
  Speaker 3: This is how it aligns to the vision Notice, I didn't say the mission, because most of us cannot repeat the mission.
• 34:41
  Speaker 3: How to the vision that I have set?
• 34:44
  Speaker 3: And if I have my leaders who are on the line right now like hell, vision, vision.
• 34:49
  Speaker 3: You better jump into my class so you can learn how to do it real quick, because it is not hard.
• 34:54
  Speaker 3: But what is challenging is that it requires you to slow down just enough to allow your brain to ease so that you can think, and that's a really critical component.
• 35:05
  Speaker 3: And a good and simple strategic plan is actionable by your staff, which means if you are providing solid, clear big S strategy, then every one of your direct reports I'm talking to my chief executives should be able to action on small S strategy, because they are the decision maker of their vertical, so good yeah.
• 35:31
  Speaker 2: I mean Kish, you just always have a way of just making it feel so tenable, like we can do it.
• 35:37
  Speaker 2: And I would say the biggest bet, friends, that I want you to make this year is like bet on yourself, and it's gonna start inside.
• 35:43
  Speaker 2: So you know how we end all of our conversations.
• 35:46
  Speaker 2: We're gonna kick it to you for a one good thing.
• 35:49
  Speaker 2: You can pull the one good thing into leadership and to management.
• 35:53
  Speaker 2: It can be whatever you want.
• 35:54
  Speaker 2: What are you thinking about right now?
• 35:56
  Speaker 3: I want folks to be able to incorporate being healthy into how they lead.
• 36:04
  Speaker 3: It is a drum I'm never gonna stop beating, cause I had to learn the hard way, so the one good thing that I want folks to do for themselves is to figure out and to create for yourself what I call your five star wellness, and that, for me, is what your physical wellness looks like.
• 36:24
  Speaker 3: What does it look like when you're physically well?
• 36:25
  Speaker 3: When you are mentally and spiritually well, what does that look like?
• 36:31
  Speaker 3: Those are three.
• 36:32
  Speaker 3: When you're financially well, what does that look like?
• 36:37
  Speaker 3: And lastly, when you are well in community, what does that look like?
• 36:44
  Speaker 3: And to design for yourself, simple and easy, what does that look like for you for this year?
• 36:53
  Speaker 3: That's my one good thing.
• 36:57
  Speaker 1: I mean you snuck five in there, so we're four.
• 37:02
  Speaker 3: Five star wellness.
• 37:04
  Speaker 3: Okay, thank you.
• 37:05
  Speaker 3: Thank you very much.
• 37:05
  Speaker 3: It'll be in my book, don't worry, it'll be in my book.
• 37:07
  Speaker 3: It'll be in my book.
• 37:08
  Speaker 3: It'll be in my book.
• 37:08
  Speaker 3: It'll be taking a tape walk coming out in the fall through Wiley, I'm the same, okay, I just love all the things going on in your world.
• 37:16
  Speaker 1: I mean that comes down to everything.
• 37:17
  Speaker 1: I mean I do feel like that's everything.
• 37:18
  Speaker 1: That's how it is sustainable, that's how it's fun, that's how we find joy in this work and how we don't look back at the end of the year.
• 37:24
  Speaker 1: It's like man, I'm so out of balance in these areas, so I love how you brought it, and why would we want to stay in the work too?
• 37:29
  Speaker 1: Yeah, all of it.
• 37:30
  Speaker 1: So okay, kish.
• 37:32
  Speaker 1: I mean you do have a lot going on and we want to hype it all, so you have your book coming.
• 37:37
  Speaker 1: That's later this fall.
• 37:37
  Speaker 1: Talk about management, talk about how people can find you, and alongside all your tens of thousands of followers everywhere, where do you want people to find you now?
• 37:45
  Speaker 3: So, first off, shout out to Wiley I am going to be delivering, finally, on my first book.
• 37:51
  Speaker 3: Tink your Cape Off From my.
• 37:55
  Speaker 3: Did I say it right?
• 37:56
  Speaker 3: I think I did.
• 37:56
  Speaker 3: So I you know, this is what I said in the room.
• 37:59
  Speaker 3: Oh my God, I knew.
• 38:01
  Speaker 3: I did Tink off your cape Off of my tenet.
• 38:03
  Speaker 3: Women talk Basically how to be a leader but live a healthier, happier life with ease, and so I'm excited about that and I'm sure I'll come back on when it's time for pre-sales and all the good things you bet you will.
• 38:19
  Speaker 3: We did a rebrand from Koshana and Co late last year and we are now management, because we are putting a fresh take on management and leadership and working on all manner of collaborative design and coaching and retreats and board development and strategic planning and change management and interim assignments.
• 38:43
  Speaker 3: So I have a badass crew, I have to say it, like that of consultants and coaches and advisors who are committed to ensuring that as you grow in your leadership journey, wherever you start, that you do it in a very healthy way.
• 38:56
  Speaker 3: So really excited about how we show up this year.
• 39:00
  Speaker 3: And of course, y'all know I'm on the road and so this year I'm looking to hit my number of.
• 39:04
  Speaker 3: I'm gonna be a lady of a certain age and so I would like to hit my lady with a certain age number and speaking years, and so I wanna do 45 this year, which is actually less than I've done in other years, but I'm gearing myself back up and so always happy for the community to tell me where I should speak next and to recommend me.
• 39:23
  Speaker 3: And, last but not least, we are in the middle of ready set implement, which is my strategy workshop for executive leaders, whether you're in development or marketing or you're sitting in the chief executive role.
• 39:35
  Speaker 3: Right now we are rolling into week two.
• 39:38
  Speaker 3: You have not missed anything If you hit the replay not too late to join us.
• 39:41
  Speaker 3: Just go to managementco, click right at the top and you'll be able to jump on in, and our sessions are on Wednesdays from 12 to 130 Eastern time.
• 39:51
  Speaker 3: So y'all are right this multi hyphenate sent a baby to college and then got busier.
• 39:56
  Speaker 3: Oh my gosh.
• 39:57
  Speaker 3: It's like we're tired of people who have busier schedules than when they were working.
• 40:01
  Speaker 2: My friend, you've blown our minds once again.
• 40:04
  Speaker 2: You are at the forefront of what's going on.
• 40:06
  Speaker 2: We are so excited about your book and we're just grateful for you to just kind of reset the community and tell us where we need to go in the new year.
• 40:15
  Speaker 2: And do it with kindness, do it with humanity and prioritize your health and your mental health.
• 40:22
  Speaker 3: Thank you, I appreciate that and I just want to say, give y'all a shout out, if I can and if it can live in the broadcast that from the day I met y'all, life has just been better.
• 40:30
  Speaker 3: Y'all check on me, y'all pray for me, you hype me up, you ask me for help, so I feel valued and valuable and I know you do that for so many other people and that there are so many people who care for you and about what you do, and that your decision to do good and to do it in a way that is full of integrity, full of joy, allowing for the pain and the stress of life to help you to make good decisions so that people can see you, and to live out loud through all of the stuff that life is throwing at y'all, that is what this community that I'm so blessed to be a part of our friendship, that I am so happy and so grateful to have, and this work that this podcast has done.
• 41:22
  Speaker 3: And I think that, if people are not saying that and seeing that I don't give a coogly boogly about the downloads, put some money in these people's pocket, okay, because, listen, this stuff is not free and I love y'all.
• 41:34
  Speaker 3: I really do.
• 41:36
  Speaker 2: There goes the mascara.
• 41:37
  Speaker 2: Yeah, thank you, buddy, thank you.
• 41:41
  Speaker 1: It takes all of us.
• 41:42
  Speaker 1: It takes the village.
• 41:43
  Speaker 2: So, thank you my friend, Thank you my friend.
• 41:46
  Speaker 1: I love you, dear friend.
• 41:47
  Speaker 1: Thanks so much for being here.
• 41:50
  Speaker 1: Friends, and you probably hear it in our voices, but we love connecting you with the most innovative people to help you achieve more for your mission than ever before.
• 41:58
  Speaker 2: We'd love for you to come join our good community.
• 42:00
  Speaker 2: It's free and you can think of it as the after party to each podcast episode.
• 42:04
  Speaker 2: Sign up today at weareforgoodcom.
• 42:07
  Speaker 2: Backslash hello.
• 42:08
  Speaker 1: And one more thing if you love what you heard today, would you mind leaving us a podcast rating interview?
• 42:12
  Speaker 1: It means the world to us and your support helps more people find this community.
• 42:16
  Speaker 1: Thanks so much, friends.
• 42:17
  Speaker 1: Can't wait to our next conversation.