Latest / In These Times with Rabbi Ammi Hirsch / Guy Vaknin

Transcript

Guy Vaknin · In These Times with Rabbi Ammi Hirsch

0:01
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm Rabbi Ami Hirsch of the Stephen Wise Free Synagogue in New York, and you're listening to in these times.
0:11
[SPEAKER_02]: By Veknan is the creative, culinary powerhouse behind a family of inventive plant-based restaurants like Beyond Sushi, Kaleda, and Willow that have redefined what vegan food can be.
0:24
[SPEAKER_02]: His passion, his for hospitality, artistry, and feeding people will.
0:29
[SPEAKER_02]: Guy grew up in Stairroat and lived on Kibut's Bay Area, after his military service he came to the United States and built a life here, restaurant by restaurant, risk by risk.
0:40
[SPEAKER_02]: Since October 7th, Guy has been targeted not for his politics, but for his identity.
0:47
[SPEAKER_02]: His businesses have faced boycotts in vandalism.
0:49
[SPEAKER_02]: People have threatened his family.
0:52
[SPEAKER_02]: The vegan community that once celebrated his work turned on him simply because he's
0:57
[SPEAKER_02]: I asked God to join me last week because He represents the best of us.
1:02
[SPEAKER_02]: He's someone who's had to start over and over again who built something from nothing, who leads by example under pressure, and who refuses to seed ground to the forces of hatred.
1:20
[SPEAKER_02]: I've octane it's a pleasure to have you welcome to end these times.
1:24
[SPEAKER_02]: Thank you for having me.
1:25
[SPEAKER_02]: Thank you for the invite.
1:27
[SPEAKER_02]: I appreciate it.
1:28
[SPEAKER_02]: It's a great honor because I love chefs.
1:32
[SPEAKER_02]: I travel the world and on vacation and we try and seek out, you know, the in thing and it's just very impressive to see what you've done here.
1:43
[SPEAKER_02]: How many years now have you been in New York or the United States?
1:46
[SPEAKER_02]: First of all, I appreciate it.
1:48
[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you.
1:50
[SPEAKER_01]: I have moved here in 2005, April of 2005, so almost 21 years now, and the food business, since the moment I got here, my father has been in this before me.
2:08
[SPEAKER_01]: He was a chef.
2:09
[SPEAKER_01]: He's a chef now.
2:10
[SPEAKER_01]: He owned restaurants kosher restaurants, so you probably know them if you've been around New York City for a long I had Moroccan restaurants in the city called village cram and the village uh, yeah, a glad kosher restaurants Yeah, a bunch of them opened up and up a reside and whatever whatever and then ended up in catering.
2:31
[SPEAKER_01]: That's where I ended up as well right before I started this journey
2:36
[SPEAKER_02]: how old were you when when you got to the state?
2:39
[SPEAKER_01]: So I moved here when I was 22.
2:41
[SPEAKER_01]: I got released from the army on March 19 and April 5th landed here and I mean I went back but stayed here built a life here kids you know businesses all that stuff so I'm uh it's half and half you know.
3:01
[SPEAKER_02]: So you focused on vegetarian restaurants.
3:05
[SPEAKER_02]: Are you yourself a vegetarian?
3:07
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm vegan.
3:08
[SPEAKER_01]: So the restaurants are not just vegetarian.
3:11
[SPEAKER_01]: They're 100% plant-based.
3:13
[SPEAKER_01]: But before that, I was not.
3:15
[SPEAKER_01]: So I opened the restaurants, not vegan, not vegetarian.
3:20
[SPEAKER_02]: And was that for kosher reasons, religious reasons, health reasons?
3:24
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I got out of the kosher company, my dad's company.
3:30
[SPEAKER_01]: There's a lot of restrictions in kosher, and I want to believe that we were when I was the chef at his restaurant at the front front of making it interesting, modern, fun, and we did a lot of events all over the city, and the company did really well.
3:49
[SPEAKER_01]: but the transition to something that is restrictive, like vegan vegetarian felt natural.
3:55
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I did a lot of parv and it looked different.
3:58
[SPEAKER_01]: And so on and so on, but it felt natural.
4:03
[SPEAKER_01]: And I didn't do it because of just did it because my wife was vegetarian vegan.
4:08
[SPEAKER_01]: And I jumped into it and I saw the business opportunity, but
4:13
[SPEAKER_01]: Six months into the journey.
4:15
[SPEAKER_01]: I became my self-flime base, but they influenced of my customers, and since then, it's just, that's my lifestyle.
4:22
[SPEAKER_02]: So that's what you do.
4:23
[SPEAKER_02]: You don't need meat and no, neither.
4:26
[SPEAKER_01]: I just wanted to try it out and see because I was, I was, when you lead something.
4:33
[SPEAKER_01]: If it doesn't feel right to do something on the other side, you're leading it.
4:37
[SPEAKER_01]: So I wanted to try it out.
4:38
[SPEAKER_01]: I never thought that it would last this long and become my lifestyle and the way I see things too.
4:46
[SPEAKER_01]: And I tried it out six months into it and then it's just, that's how we, that's how we, however, I do cook.
4:54
[SPEAKER_01]: still like I eat me.
4:57
[SPEAKER_01]: So everything in my restaurants is basically giving the customer opportunity or the vegetarian customer, the vegan customer or the non-vegan customer to come in and enjoy a full meal with no
5:13
[SPEAKER_01]: with no discounts to the quality food, the taste, the way you feel about the experience and so on.
5:20
[SPEAKER_02]: And do you have non-vegans who come to the restaurant on a regular basis, too?
5:25
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, without them, I'm dead.
5:27
[SPEAKER_01]: So 80% of our customers are non-vegans, a lot of kosher, because by default, we are kosher, but 80% are non-vegans.
5:38
[SPEAKER_01]: And for the vegans that do come to the restaurant,
5:43
[SPEAKER_01]: the non vegetarian non vegan to a restaurant that will give them the same experience on par experience sometimes even better.
5:51
[SPEAKER_01]: They won't feel like, oh, you're taking me to a vegetarian restaurant or vegan restaurant.
5:55
[SPEAKER_01]: There's nothing for me to eat over here.
5:56
[SPEAKER_01]: What am I going to eat just salad or whatever whatever you know.
6:01
[SPEAKER_02]: So you get here.
6:01
[SPEAKER_02]: You're 22 years old.
6:04
[SPEAKER_02]: You immediately start in the food business.
6:08
[SPEAKER_02]: And what happens first?
6:09
[SPEAKER_02]: Does beyond sushi happen first?
6:11
[SPEAKER_01]: Now, so food business, I joined my dad's company and then like every 22 year old you want to see the world, you want to test the waters, you want to steer dad, the dominance and all that stuff.
6:26
[SPEAKER_01]: So you step out, you go to the world, I worked in a lot of restaurants all over the city, a manager, bus, or a waiter, bartender, clubs, did that for a little while when I was young.
6:41
[SPEAKER_01]: went back to the family and told my dad a story about how one day I want to go become a chef because that's my passion food.
6:49
[SPEAKER_01]: He said, why not?
6:50
[SPEAKER_01]: I'll send you right now.
6:51
[SPEAKER_01]: I didn't know that he was tricking me.
6:53
[SPEAKER_01]: He said, let me do a culinary school.
6:55
[SPEAKER_01]: As soon as I got out, he fired his hair executive chef and said, okay, you're the chef.
7:00
[SPEAKER_01]: Good luck.
7:00
[SPEAKER_01]: I was 23.
7:03
[SPEAKER_01]: And he left to Israel for a year and a half.
7:05
[SPEAKER_01]: So I was 23 here in the city running catering company by myself.
7:10
[SPEAKER_01]: Did that from 2008 to 2012 in between did a stunt at Hell's Kitchen with Gordon Ramsay in 2010?
7:22
[SPEAKER_01]: told him about my life story, the army, the dish that got really appealed to them, went over to Hollywood, got selected to be on season 10 of Hell's Kitchen.
7:35
[SPEAKER_01]: was fun, ate episodes over there, didn't want to make a full out of myself, my mom thought me better.
7:40
[SPEAKER_02]: I then, when you appeared on Hell's Kitchen, you were, you were already a very accomplished chef.
7:49
[SPEAKER_01]: I was young, I was young, I wasn't, I worked in the kitchen, I worked all around the city, but I wasn't.
7:59
[SPEAKER_01]: you know, being a chef is not just about cooking and people think that that's what what you do it's being able to manage systems and operate system and use the tools or the people that you have within the kitchen and how to operate and so on.
8:13
[SPEAKER_01]: I was in a hundred percent I've accomplished to run a business.
8:17
[SPEAKER_01]: 2012 decided to go on my own took everything I had that I saved over the seven years that I was here in the US.
8:26
[SPEAKER_01]: loan the same amount from my dad and opened a 280 square feet hole in the wall on 14 street between second and third serving beyond sushi.
8:38
[SPEAKER_01]: That was my first venture.
8:40
[SPEAKER_01]: So that was all vegetarian sushi, all grains, vegetables, fruit and other people doing that or was that you're not an hours the first.
8:48
[SPEAKER_02]: You were the first to do the first in the world.
8:53
[SPEAKER_01]: sushi that wasn't really fish it wasn't sushi but I mean not at all I mean I went like all on the creative side so there was only vegetables only fruit there was not even imitation I wouldn't use the biggest thing was tofu yeah
9:08
[SPEAKER_01]: But the idea was to use your creativity combinations that we put in the sushi, create this beautiful package of consistency, so everybody is the same, you know, sushi is very, it's methodical and it's really, it's a great vessel for packaging food perfectly.
9:38
[SPEAKER_02]: was broken down in my head of, okay, how do I layer this flare is how long did it take you to perfect, you know, that kind of Beyonce was a trial and error and experimentation and week after week.
9:50
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, I get obsessed about the food.
9:53
[SPEAKER_01]: So I don't, I don't spend a lot of time planning it.
9:56
[SPEAKER_01]: I think that spending a lot of time planning you never actually do things.
10:01
[SPEAKER_01]: You do them and then I perfect them.
10:03
[SPEAKER_01]: So I have the general idea of how I do, like I wrote the menu for beyond sushi maybe three weeks before we open.
10:10
[SPEAKER_01]: I didn't have time too, I was working.
10:11
[SPEAKER_01]: So there was no time to do that.
10:13
[SPEAKER_02]: And there were no investors that this was all your money and you risked everything you had.
10:17
[SPEAKER_02]: Everything.
10:18
[SPEAKER_01]: We had a thousand dollars lift over.
10:20
[SPEAKER_01]: to open.
10:22
[SPEAKER_01]: I went to Chinatown with my only employee that they before he got some ingredients and opened.
10:28
[SPEAKER_01]: Like stories that you hear like, you know, 1980s and 1990s of people like doing crazy stuff just to make things happen.
10:38
[SPEAKER_01]: And it really was like that.
10:40
[SPEAKER_01]: Like if it didn't work for like two weeks, I'm done.
10:43
[SPEAKER_01]: I didn't have anything back up, but I didn't have anything.
10:45
[SPEAKER_01]: I was like, I need to get out of the family business.
10:48
[SPEAKER_01]: And I really, I truly believed in myself, or maybe I was a little bit cocky, which is important at some point in life to go and start things and try things.
10:59
[SPEAKER_01]: I was cocky to myself about my abilities.
11:01
[SPEAKER_01]: And I wouldn't quit no matter what.
11:05
[SPEAKER_01]: So I knew that no matter what, I'll make it work.
11:07
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, I'll work the 18 hours a day.
11:09
[SPEAKER_01]: I'll do whatever it needs to be done.
11:11
[SPEAKER_02]: And you had, eventually, how many outlets did you have in New York?
11:18
[SPEAKER_01]: So I had seven beyond sushi.
11:19
[SPEAKER_01]: Seven beyond sushi.
11:21
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
11:21
[SPEAKER_01]: Right before the pandemic, I must before the pandemic, I opened my last beyond sushi.
11:27
[SPEAKER_02]: And there's still two of them left in the city.
11:30
[SPEAKER_01]: The longest standing one is 11 years old.
11:33
[SPEAKER_01]: It's on 56th street between five and six.
11:42
[SPEAKER_01]: Also, about 10 years old, it's on 37th Street.
11:46
[SPEAKER_01]: Darwin is big.
11:47
[SPEAKER_01]: So more of a full service restaurant, 56 is a smaller place.
11:51
[SPEAKER_01]: We have a full service menu there, full restaurant, whole nine yard bar and so on, and that's the world we're in right now.
12:00
[SPEAKER_02]: And now you, I know you, you, you set up a city room to us, Patelity, which I want to ask you about and you have, uh, Oh, range.
12:09
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I agree.
12:10
[SPEAKER_02]: I agree.
12:10
[SPEAKER_02]: I agree.
12:10
[SPEAKER_02]: Restaurants.
12:11
[SPEAKER_02]: Restaurants.
12:12
[SPEAKER_02]: But beyond sushi was the first, right?
12:15
[SPEAKER_02]: And did you have everything else when you appeared on the Shark Tank episode?
12:19
[SPEAKER_02]: I saw that episode.
12:20
[SPEAKER_01]: No.
12:21
[SPEAKER_01]: So when I appeared on Shark Tank, I had just opened my six,
12:28
[SPEAKER_01]: My sixth one, beyond sushi.
12:31
[SPEAKER_01]: All very street.
12:31
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
12:32
[SPEAKER_02]: It was all beyond sushi.
12:33
[SPEAKER_02]: There was nothing else.
12:34
[SPEAKER_01]: So the concept was to to open a bunch of beyond sushi's all over the city, expand outside the city as well.
12:43
[SPEAKER_01]: Get it as efficient as possible.
12:46
[SPEAKER_01]: And the idea was to grow it, right?
12:49
[SPEAKER_01]: And eventually that was the thing back then.
12:52
[SPEAKER_01]: All the companies that you see today, the sweet greens of the world chopped,
12:56
[SPEAKER_01]: all the fast casual, that was the trend, not the full service.
13:01
[SPEAKER_01]: I always wanted to do the full service.
13:03
[SPEAKER_01]: That's why I got into this business.
13:04
[SPEAKER_01]: I said, okay, I'll open a small beyond so she's saving enough money, open my own restaurant afterwards.
13:10
[SPEAKER_01]: The creativity poured takes a big chunk of my heart.
13:15
[SPEAKER_01]: For me, it's artistry at the end of the day also, not just a business.
13:20
[SPEAKER_01]: and then beyond sushi became more of like a format, which is good.
13:27
[SPEAKER_01]: I learned a lot from it, but beyond sushi was a copy-paste, basically.
13:33
[SPEAKER_01]: When I went to Sharkton, I had six.
13:35
[SPEAKER_01]: I was opening my seventh one.
13:38
[SPEAKER_01]: The seventh one, I opened once, they do diligence with the sharks and did, and it ended with us splitting and not.
13:50
[SPEAKER_02]: It seemed to me that the two sharks that offered you the support, they were in from the beginning, it seemed to me.
13:59
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, they were very excited.
14:00
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I'm not supposed to talk about edits and stuff, but let's say that things get edited, right?
14:07
[SPEAKER_01]: I said in front of them for,
14:10
[SPEAKER_01]: more than an hour, right?
14:11
[SPEAKER_01]: So you see only, oh, really?
14:13
[SPEAKER_01]: The only apportion of it.
14:15
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, we talk, we talk, we talk about everything, we talk about plans, we talk about what it's happening.
14:21
[SPEAKER_01]: There's more sharks that are really interested than what you see on the.
14:25
[SPEAKER_02]: So they're really sharks, they're really thorough and they're good at what they do.
14:29
[SPEAKER_01]: forget about it.
14:30
[SPEAKER_01]: They do diligence afterwards, seven months of work, lawyers, everything.
14:35
[SPEAKER_01]: And it's a learning process.
14:37
[SPEAKER_01]: And you learn every aspect of everything.
14:39
[SPEAKER_01]: And you get ideas from people that actually have been doing it.
14:43
[SPEAKER_01]: But I spent a lot of time with them afterwards.
14:45
[SPEAKER_01]: And they're on it.
14:46
[SPEAKER_01]: Like they after phone call text messages a week after both of them in the restaurant, meeting blah, blah, blah, social media.
14:55
[SPEAKER_01]: They're really on it.
14:57
[SPEAKER_02]: But in the end, you didn't want to go through with it in the album.
15:01
[SPEAKER_02]: You didn't, or they didn't, you didn't want to go.
15:03
[SPEAKER_01]: I did, because there is, um, when you, I, I, I bootstrapped everything up until today, everything is bootstrapped.
15:12
[SPEAKER_01]: There's nothing I didn't take a dollar from, from anybody, right?
15:19
[SPEAKER_01]: I sold a small portion of the company when I was younger, just to somebody that has been advising me, which is great.
15:27
[SPEAKER_01]: But I didn't take money as an investment or as like for growth.
15:32
[SPEAKER_01]: Everything that we did was within the company.
15:35
[SPEAKER_01]: Company does well, we grow.
15:37
[SPEAKER_01]: No, we don't.
15:39
[SPEAKER_01]: And looking back, you don't regret that.
15:41
[SPEAKER_01]: You think that was fun?
15:42
[SPEAKER_01]: No, I made the best choice.
15:44
[SPEAKER_01]: Because,
15:45
[SPEAKER_01]: If I, not even looking back, you'd test things according to factual stuff, when COVID hit one of the investors had a lot of investment in in other restaurants and a lot of them closed.
16:02
[SPEAKER_01]: You can be a slug when it comes to things like that.
16:05
[SPEAKER_01]: When there is
16:08
[SPEAKER_01]: emergency.
16:09
[SPEAKER_01]: Somebody's got to move things.
16:11
[SPEAKER_01]: Got to take responsibility right on the fly.
16:13
[SPEAKER_01]: Make decisions.
16:14
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, we're firing this much people.
16:15
[SPEAKER_01]: We're hiring this much people.
16:17
[SPEAKER_01]: We're opening a new location.
16:18
[SPEAKER_01]: We're moving money from here.
16:19
[SPEAKER_01]: The here and funds are going over there.
16:21
[SPEAKER_01]: We're going to invest in the year.
16:23
[SPEAKER_01]: I have that ability.
16:25
[SPEAKER_01]: There's no one that is going to say for the good and the bad, right?
16:28
[SPEAKER_01]: I can make mistakes too.
16:29
[SPEAKER_01]: I've made mistakes in the past.
16:30
[SPEAKER_01]: I've lost money in the past.
16:32
[SPEAKER_01]: But I was able to say, okay.
16:35
[SPEAKER_01]: Hey, we're at this situation.
16:37
[SPEAKER_01]: We were 125 employees the next day we became six.
16:43
[SPEAKER_01]: Because if not, the company's gone, right?
16:45
[SPEAKER_01]: And now you have to prove that with, uh, we'd be dead, you know, next week we can pay, you know, COVID happened.
16:51
[SPEAKER_01]: This is what it is.
16:53
[SPEAKER_01]: Uh, so we went from 125 to 6.
16:55
[SPEAKER_01]: Today we're at 300 in change.
16:56
[SPEAKER_01]: Which is amazing.
16:57
[SPEAKER_02]: You have 300 employees now.
16:59
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
17:00
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
17:00
[SPEAKER_02]: So you have this city with hospitality.
17:02
[SPEAKER_02]: You've developed, you've got, I think you said seven or eight.
17:06
[SPEAKER_01]: I got
17:11
[SPEAKER_01]: All, all thanks to COVID, meaning, meaning it will not shut down seven locations.
17:20
[SPEAKER_01]: And I'm an operator that I used to just go, go, go, go, go, go.
17:24
[SPEAKER_01]: And now I've got nothing to do.
17:26
[SPEAKER_01]: I said in my office and wrote the plan for the next five years, wrote all the menus for all the concepts, wrote how it's gonna be, which departments are gonna open, how are gonna fund it, what's the pace of it?
17:41
[SPEAKER_01]: and just went for it and it all worked out according to the original most part yes for the most part yes I I have a tendency to wield things I mean it comes with a cost with sacrifice with pain with a lot of stuff that is along the way and you don't see but um but I have a tendency to wield things to what I wanted to be at the end.
18:07
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
18:08
[SPEAKER_02]: I always say the same thing to people's area.
18:10
[SPEAKER_02]: You need two elements to be a success.
18:12
[SPEAKER_02]: You need the vision and you need the execution and very often these different attributes don't actually exist fully in the same person.
18:23
[SPEAKER_02]: So you actually need other people around you who are good at stuff that you're not necessarily so good at.
18:29
[SPEAKER_02]: Tell us about all of the restaurants
18:35
[SPEAKER_01]: Then we have Willow on 20th and 8th Avenue.
18:38
[SPEAKER_01]: That's the American bistro comfort food, hamburgers, sandwiches, cool entres, appetizers.
18:47
[SPEAKER_01]: You wouldn't know that it's vegan.
18:49
[SPEAKER_01]: Then we have Colletta, Italian, American Italian.
18:52
[SPEAKER_01]: We do everything from scratch, all the fundamentals, pasta, pizza, fermented dos,
18:59
[SPEAKER_01]: really good stuff.
19:00
[SPEAKER_01]: Again, everything plan based on third avenue between 26 and 27, then I opened a nixie as our flagship.
19:08
[SPEAKER_01]: I found this beautiful place on 8th Avenue between 24 and 25.
19:12
[SPEAKER_01]: All marbles on the walls Mediterranean restaurant influenced by the north east of the Mediterranean.
19:20
[SPEAKER_01]: So
19:20
[SPEAKER_01]: Syrian, Turkish Greek food, all combined together, um, plan base again, Chachapuris, Pides, uh, Lachma Jun, Kababs, chicken Kababs, steak Kababs, OVIG.
19:37
[SPEAKER_01]: March 2024, open, my Mexican restaurant called Senteer, 19th Street between 5th and 6th.
19:45
[SPEAKER_01]: everything Mexican under the sun in there.
19:48
[SPEAKER_01]: And then I opened another flagship on 15 street and union square and it's called La Basque.
19:55
[SPEAKER_01]: Two floors French Spanish fusion.
19:58
[SPEAKER_01]: My biggest project to date.
20:00
[SPEAKER_01]: And then the last one, sorry for the big tell of restaurants.
20:04
[SPEAKER_01]: The last one I opened is then William Spurke.
20:08
[SPEAKER_01]: It's called Reverry, which means daydreaming, and that's what it's about.
20:13
[SPEAKER_01]: It's like all the crazy stuff that I wanted to ever do, and restaurants I do over there, take all applied over there to fun, bite-size, cool food, you know.
20:36
[SPEAKER_02]: So can I ask you, you have Mexican and you have French and you have Spanish and you're Israeli.
20:44
[SPEAKER_02]: Is it first of all, is there such a thing as Israeli cuisine?
20:50
[SPEAKER_02]: If so, what is it?
20:51
[SPEAKER_02]: And do you at least glean from all of the restaurants and all that you have and all the cooking that you do, do you glean something that is uniquely Israeli?
21:03
[SPEAKER_01]: I think that there is rarely cuisine is in form, right?
21:07
[SPEAKER_01]: It's forming.
21:08
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not something it's always evolving.
21:11
[SPEAKER_01]: And it's influenced by so many cultures, right?
21:15
[SPEAKER_02]: Some people say, oh, you appropriate this and that and... Yeah, I want to ask you about, you know, what's going on now with this really now.
21:23
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, but we are made of so many cultures.
21:26
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I'm a rocket.
21:28
[SPEAKER_01]: I ate in Persian house holds when I was a kid.
21:33
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, Turkish, and then one is Tunisian, and all the one is Polish, and there's Jewish food that comes from Eastern Europe.
21:44
[SPEAKER_01]: It's all mixed up, so it's still foaming.
21:47
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think that the beauty is the diversity.
21:50
[SPEAKER_02]: I imagine you go back to Israel on a regular basis.
21:53
[SPEAKER_02]: Listen, every time I got Israel was just there two weeks ago, the more restaurants,
22:00
[SPEAKER_02]: the restaurants are amazing.
22:01
[SPEAKER_02]: The chefs are amazing.
22:04
[SPEAKER_02]: I remember the time that, you know, you used to eat echelwood.
22:09
[SPEAKER_02]: Remember that little echel that people used to eat in the morning.
22:12
[SPEAKER_02]: And if maybe there was some toast and cheese or something.
22:16
[SPEAKER_02]: And it's like, in the last, I guess it's been the last 10 to 15 years.
22:21
[SPEAKER_02]: There's this explosion of culinary excellence.
22:25
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
22:25
[SPEAKER_02]: Where did it come from?
22:27
[SPEAKER_01]: I think that, look, that show and all that stuff it came from a time where they didn't have any many resources and so on.
22:36
[SPEAKER_01]: So everybody ate as little as possible, made things work and there was no time for culinary or thinking about it.
22:44
[SPEAKER_01]: I think with the prosperous times that Israel is experiencing in the past 20 years, there is this,
22:52
[SPEAKER_01]: need for finer things and people want to try new things and the corner is seen is very creative so it brings all this creativity, but I think it all relates to
23:06
[SPEAKER_01]: who how financially sound a country is or a culture is.
23:12
[SPEAKER_01]: It's the same thing here.
23:13
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, New York, not for no reason is the hub of like culinary in the States.
23:20
[SPEAKER_01]: You cannot talk about restaurants if you don't know how to feed your family, you know?
23:25
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
23:26
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm just saying I like when people Israel is like off the hook.
23:30
[SPEAKER_01]: They're like there's just amazing what amazing amazing chefs amazing chefs what they can produce Is like I'm saying I would I would never go out there and compete
23:47
[SPEAKER_02]: It's too much to watch for me, I mean, apropos chefs, what's it like to be a chef?
23:53
[SPEAKER_02]: Most of us, you know, if we're going to cook, we're going to cook pasta in a bowl or whatever.
23:59
[SPEAKER_02]: We're never going to be, we're never going to rise to the level that
24:02
[SPEAKER_02]: Like, you devote your entire life, your entire energies, all of your creative capacities into feeding people, creating dishes and feeding people.
24:13
[SPEAKER_02]: What's that like?
24:14
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, for me, it always been about hosting, right?
24:19
[SPEAKER_01]: I grew up in a Moroccan household, big family dinners.
24:23
[SPEAKER_01]: People coming in, the door is always open.
24:25
[SPEAKER_01]: My grandma was cooking,
24:29
[SPEAKER_01]: It's just like something that is in my blood, but being the cook, being the chef, being obsessed with food, I was a fat kid, I loved food and I, I, I just, I, I just, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I,
24:46
[SPEAKER_01]: wanted to always understand how and why and how those slaves are coming.
24:52
[SPEAKER_01]: It always inspired me to learn more and more of this ingredient that ingredient, how I can alter the flavors and what combinations will work together.
25:01
[SPEAKER_01]: I think it's a chase to one host and make people happy and see them enjoy your
25:16
[SPEAKER_01]: how many people I can do, like how many people can I make happy and it's become a chase of the number and the quality at the same time and of course, living a thing behind and
25:40
[SPEAKER_01]: harm free meals, which is like a big thing for us.
25:45
[SPEAKER_01]: We serve about half a million people a year.
25:47
[SPEAKER_02]: There's something about chefs in my sense that they get some kind of unique satisfaction out of people pleased by the food that they cook, right?
26:02
[SPEAKER_02]: There's something unique about that about laboring over a dish, giving it to somebody
26:10
[SPEAKER_01]: To be honest, I'm a little creepy, I stand in the, in the, you watch people dining room and watch people, you know, take the first bite, you know, that's my way of, I can tell by now after all these years, I can tell by now by the way of their face gestures.
26:31
[SPEAKER_01]: If they like the food, if they don't like the food, if it's like, ah, if it's great, I can tell by the first bite, you know, then I know that table is okay or that table is okay.
26:42
[SPEAKER_01]: It's like, it's creepy a little bit, but that's what I do, you know?
26:46
[SPEAKER_01]: That's right.
26:47
[SPEAKER_01]: It's my way.
26:48
[SPEAKER_01]: And I love feedback.
26:49
[SPEAKER_01]: So I'm on a lot of shifts have.
26:54
[SPEAKER_01]: join enormous egos.
26:56
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't.
26:57
[SPEAKER_01]: I love feedback.
26:59
[SPEAKER_01]: I read reviews like it's my religion, you know.
27:02
[SPEAKER_01]: I actually have someone designated in the company just to summarize reviews for them, which is you get good reviews.
27:10
[SPEAKER_01]: I do.
27:10
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't care about them.
27:11
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't want to hear about them.
27:13
[SPEAKER_01]: I want the bad ones.
27:14
[SPEAKER_01]: So.
27:15
[SPEAKER_01]: Aha.
27:16
[SPEAKER_01]: get because because the good reviews can tell you too much.
27:18
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it's good.
27:20
[SPEAKER_01]: Why are you going to improve on, right?
27:22
[SPEAKER_02]: So the bad ones is I feel the same way.
27:25
[SPEAKER_02]: I saw what I tell younger colleagues here as well.
27:27
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, rabbis, we don't get enough feedback from people.
27:30
[SPEAKER_02]: So.
27:31
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, the compliments are nice.
27:33
[SPEAKER_02]: They're always nice.
27:34
[SPEAKER_02]: But give me the criticism.
27:37
[SPEAKER_01]: You're eager to the compliments.
27:38
[SPEAKER_01]: I think that those bad ones teach you things, right?
27:43
[SPEAKER_01]: It's painful as it is because people will go and shit on your food and use my language would say certain things that are not nice.
27:54
[SPEAKER_01]: But you got to hear it, you know?
27:55
[SPEAKER_01]: And if you see patterns, you got to fix them.
27:58
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
28:00
[SPEAKER_01]: Look at the mirror.
28:02
[SPEAKER_02]: That's great.
28:02
[SPEAKER_02]: I love that.
28:03
[SPEAKER_02]: I love that approach.
28:04
[SPEAKER_02]: That's a good approach.
28:06
[SPEAKER_02]: The last area that I want to raise with you is what it's like to be in Israeli chef at this point in time outside of Israel, in particular post October 7.
28:17
[SPEAKER_02]: You yourself have been targeted.
28:20
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah,
28:22
[SPEAKER_02]: I don't even want to characterize who they are, they're opponents of Israel.
28:27
[SPEAKER_02]: I think I saw something about vegans for Palestine.
28:31
[SPEAKER_02]: I didn't even know there was a group called Vegans for Palestine, and that they targeted you.
28:36
[SPEAKER_02]: This vegans for everything.
28:38
[SPEAKER_02]: What's it like?
28:39
[SPEAKER_02]: What's it like being?
28:41
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, how is your life changed since October 7th and has the opposition to what you're doing in intensified?
28:50
[SPEAKER_02]: Simply by virtue of you being, I mean, you don't even serving as really food, you're just as chef who was born in Israel.
28:59
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, I was in the idea, so, and it's, I mean, it's all over because I am proud of it and forever will be.
29:08
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
29:09
[SPEAKER_02]: So what did, just, just, describe to us what you're, what you've undergone.
29:13
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, we've worked over seven.
29:15
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, just like everybody else.
29:18
[SPEAKER_01]: Of course, there was opposition to Israel and
29:21
[SPEAKER_01]: and everything that it sends for.
29:23
[SPEAKER_01]: And but it was very small dormant, not, not like it is right now.
29:28
[SPEAKER_02]: You did have protests before October 7th, too.
29:33
[SPEAKER_01]: I did have some people that, you know, mentioned things, but never, I never felt it, funny enough in the vegan community.
29:41
[SPEAKER_01]: Our pro powerstein, whatever not in peace and so on, and that's fine.
29:45
[SPEAKER_01]: And they used to come dying in the restaurants after their rallies and so on.
29:51
[SPEAKER_01]: It's okay, I mean, people are people are, and you can be for, you can be for powerstein, fine.
29:57
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, you can't be for Palestine break the doors to my restaurant or graffiti or threaten my kids, uh, and send me pictures of them and telling me that you hope that they're going to die like the kids at Gaza.
30:10
[SPEAKER_01]: All of which has happened.
30:12
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
30:12
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
30:13
[SPEAKER_01]: You can't do those kind of things.
30:14
[SPEAKER_01]: You can't call the restaurants.
30:15
[SPEAKER_01]: I hope you burn and your restaurants burn and, you know, uh, scaring my employees.
30:21
[SPEAKER_01]: You can't do that.
30:22
[SPEAKER_01]: Uh, and
30:24
[SPEAKER_01]: And you can't do that, especially because I made it a point, not to say anything political, when I have such a close connection to what happened.
30:36
[SPEAKER_01]: I grew up in the road, which is 500 meters outside of Gaza Strip.
30:41
[SPEAKER_01]: I saw all of this unfold in the town that I grew up in.
30:46
[SPEAKER_01]: I have friends that I got killed, murdered,
30:50
[SPEAKER_01]: in pieces.
30:51
[SPEAKER_01]: I have friends that got kidnapped.
30:53
[SPEAKER_01]: I know probably a hundred people out of the thousand that died that day.
31:01
[SPEAKER_01]: I live two years in Barry, just a keyboard's right outside that got almost 300 people there killed.
31:09
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, and you knew some you know off you knew some of the kill and I knew every like I knew almost everybody.
31:16
[SPEAKER_01]: I was there when I was a kid.
31:18
[SPEAKER_01]: We're connected to that area.
31:21
[SPEAKER_01]: Uh, you know, my family lives in the road.
31:25
[SPEAKER_01]: Like I have cousins.
31:26
[SPEAKER_02]: I don't just stay road many times.
31:27
[SPEAKER_02]: I was in stay road just two weeks ago.
31:29
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
31:30
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, that's that's my hometown.
31:31
[SPEAKER_01]: That's why I grew up, you know.
31:36
[SPEAKER_01]: I served in Gaza.
31:37
[SPEAKER_01]: So, I know it from the inside before we left Gaza.
31:41
[SPEAKER_01]: So, no one can tell me stories about the army and what they do and how they do and how they operate.
31:46
[SPEAKER_01]: I've been in it.
31:48
[SPEAKER_01]: I know.
31:49
[SPEAKER_01]: It was a 180 transition.
31:55
[SPEAKER_01]: So, the people that are when after me are the people that celebrated me prior October 7.
32:04
[SPEAKER_01]: Like the same people, the same people that celebrate that used to come to the restaurant be, you know, push me ahead.
32:12
[SPEAKER_01]: Are the same people that flipped the switch?
32:15
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, wait.
32:16
[SPEAKER_01]: Is this really?
32:17
[SPEAKER_01]: Is Jewish done?
32:19
[SPEAKER_01]: Did they tell you why have you figured out?
32:21
[SPEAKER_01]: They didn't denounce because I wouldn't denounce.
32:27
[SPEAKER_01]: that Israeli government, or I didn't put a statement down, denouncing Israel.
32:33
[SPEAKER_01]: I feel like that's one, it's crazy for me to, for you to even ask me to do that.
32:40
[SPEAKER_01]: And two, where are we, are we in, like, uh,
32:44
[SPEAKER_01]: communist Soviet Union in the 1950s that you need to be hung and say in front of everybody that you're in America.
32:53
[SPEAKER_01]: It's a free world.
32:55
[SPEAKER_01]: I can believe think of whatever I want, and say whatever I want, and I didn't say anything.
33:00
[SPEAKER_01]: What if I said, and if I was vocal, and I don't know what, they're okay.
33:06
[SPEAKER_01]: But I made sure that everybody I allow everybody to have their space to believe whatever they want.
33:14
[SPEAKER_01]: And I believe whatever I want, what I do privately has nothing to do.
33:18
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm a chef, I try to offer a restaurant.
33:21
[SPEAKER_01]: What did they do?
33:22
[SPEAKER_01]: Try to boycott, I mean, they boycotted the restaurant for a while, which hurt not necessarily me, but my employees more than anything.
33:32
[SPEAKER_01]: And then I had to speak about it, because if not, where we're going to go to a bad place.
33:39
[SPEAKER_01]: Once I spoke about it,
33:42
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm happy that there is a strong community of good people in the city that came and supported and pushed back and and helped me make out of the lemon extra sweep lemonade and we bounce back and
33:57
[SPEAKER_01]: went to a place where I'm doing much better than what I did before.
34:02
[SPEAKER_01]: And they let off.
34:05
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I'm sure they still don't like me.
34:06
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm sure they still would love it if because I'm Israeli, I won't have a business in this city.
34:15
[SPEAKER_01]: But, you know, there are a lot of businesses to go through if they want that.
34:20
[SPEAKER_02]: Do you, you, you, you, you have 350 or so employees to answer and change 300 and change.
34:27
[SPEAKER_02]: There was, uh, uh, I still not totally clear about what's going on at breads, which is another is really, uh, owned enterprise.
34:36
[SPEAKER_01]: uh... but apparently some of the employees uh... are trying to be or organized before we continue let's clarify it's not is really owned right like i'm not a american yeah i'm a man i have a passport i can show it to everybody i'm american i've been here for twenty one years uh... i was born in Israel it's like saying somebody that that is black now we're not we're gonna boycott him because he's black
35:04
[SPEAKER_01]: That wouldn't go over well to no one, but it's okay because I'm from Israel, you know?
35:10
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I take that point.
35:11
[SPEAKER_02]: That's a very good point.
35:13
[SPEAKER_01]: With respect to your embrace is not owned by an Israel.
35:15
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, owned by somebody that came from Israel.
35:17
[SPEAKER_02]: It was some, yeah, some connection at some point, uh, which kind of shows you how
35:26
[SPEAKER_02]: is fanatical, the right word, you know, like any kind of connection, present or past, raises their irds at such a level and creates them a kind of fanaticism that is unbreachable.
35:43
[SPEAKER_02]: You can't, you can't reason with it.
35:46
[SPEAKER_01]: No, and in with without knowing cause in all reality,
35:50
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm the one that, like, all my life, I was on the left side of things.
35:55
[SPEAKER_01]: I think that there should be peace.
35:57
[SPEAKER_01]: I think that we should eventually have two states, because there is no solution if there is it.
36:02
[SPEAKER_01]: I think that, my thoughts, people ask me, actually, and do what I think.
36:09
[SPEAKER_01]: They would say okay, but it doesn't matter because once you hate someone, it doesn't matter.
36:14
[SPEAKER_01]: It doesn't matter what they think, matter what their actual thoughts are.
36:18
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't believe that.
36:19
[SPEAKER_02]: Jonathan Swift wrote, you can't reason somebody out of something they haven't reasoned themselves into in the first place.
36:27
[SPEAKER_02]: But my question related to your employees.
36:31
[SPEAKER_02]: So apparently there were some employees at breads who wanted to pressure the company.
36:37
[SPEAKER_02]: Have you experienced any of that in the...
36:41
[SPEAKER_01]: I have.
36:42
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I have had lost some talent.
36:50
[SPEAKER_01]: in the last two years.
36:51
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
36:52
[SPEAKER_02]: People are just, you know, they wouldn't say it in our loud, but they left.
36:58
[SPEAKER_02]: They left, they said for various reasons, but the real reason was, we know why it's about what it's about.
37:03
[SPEAKER_01]: But it doesn't matter, I mean, for me, look,
37:09
[SPEAKER_01]: I can't change where I can't change, I know who I am, I know I stand for, I know I know the difficulties of running a business in this city, yeah, you can hurt the business at the end of the day.
37:29
[SPEAKER_01]: I have 300 families that I'm responsible for.
37:32
[SPEAKER_01]: That what keeps me moving all the time.
37:35
[SPEAKER_01]: And there's people that have been with me for from day one or a month after, not day one, but a month after.
37:42
[SPEAKER_01]: They're still in the company and they're a brother and they're a sister and whatever.
37:46
[SPEAKER_01]: It's like it's a big, it's a big team.
37:49
[SPEAKER_01]: And that's why, you know, when all of that happened, my wife asked me,
37:55
[SPEAKER_01]: why do we act like because it's all in at the end of the day, it's me.
38:00
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not like I have this team that
38:04
[SPEAKER_01]: Uh, that is going to back me up.
38:06
[SPEAKER_01]: So she asked me why will why are you doing all of that?
38:09
[SPEAKER_01]: And the answer was that.
38:11
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it's the team at the end of the day.
38:13
[SPEAKER_01]: It's the people around you, you know, and that what I was scared about the most when all of that happened.
38:19
[SPEAKER_02]: Do you find that it's starting to diminish?
38:22
[SPEAKER_02]: Sure.
38:22
[SPEAKER_01]: It's as, you know, yeah, for the most part.
38:26
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think that
38:28
[SPEAKER_01]: the value that you give certain things, also, or like the voice that you give certain things, hate like that.
38:39
[SPEAKER_01]: And I haven't paid attention to it for a long time, but I don't give it a, I don't give it credence anymore.
38:45
[SPEAKER_01]: And I just love a beat, whatever.
38:47
[SPEAKER_02]: Are you personally fearful for your safety or your family's safety?
38:58
[SPEAKER_01]: not at the moment as much as I was when it was like a day, heat of it, right?
39:03
[SPEAKER_01]: Because you see the door to your restaurant breaks and it actually happened.
39:08
[SPEAKER_01]: The heat of it was at the time where like the whole Charlie Kirk thing happened and blah, blah, blah, and it was like, say, say to yourself, okay, they're crazy enough people in this world.
39:20
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think there are.
39:21
[SPEAKER_01]: I walked around with a knife on me for a long time.
39:28
[SPEAKER_01]: There is the second amendment, which is great, and I'm trained.
39:33
[SPEAKER_01]: So if anybody wants to come.
39:35
[SPEAKER_01]: Self-defense, listen, I'm not.
39:37
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I still feel like America is the best place to be said.
39:42
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
39:43
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
39:44
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, that's a great, great way to end.
39:47
[SPEAKER_02]: Guy Valkney, Master Chef.
39:50
[SPEAKER_02]: I urge everybody to visit one of the restaurants that are just terrific and keep up the good work.
40:01
[SPEAKER_02]: We're proud of you.
40:03
[SPEAKER_02]: And I urge everyone to go and visit and dine and experience.
40:08
[SPEAKER_02]: And if you, if you are fortunate, look around and see if guy is actually looking at you.
40:14
[SPEAKER_01]: Take a guy looking, making sure they're eating.
40:19
[SPEAKER_01]: I appreciate it.
40:20
[SPEAKER_01]: All the best.
40:20
[SPEAKER_01]: Good luck.
40:21
[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you very much.
40:31
[SPEAKER_02]: I'll go and die in a guy-vac-nance restaurant, tell him I sent you.
40:35
[SPEAKER_02]: First, because he's a master of his craft, you will enjoy the experience immensely.
40:41
[SPEAKER_02]: Guy is one of those young Israeli chefs who have emerged in the past 20 years to impact so dramatically on the food culture of the West.
40:50
[SPEAKER_02]: These Israeli culinary artists are like so many of their cutting-edge compatriots and other fields.
40:55
[SPEAKER_02]: relentlessly creative intuitively in genius and boldly unafraid of failing.
41:02
[SPEAKER_02]: The result is excellence.
41:05
[SPEAKER_02]: Second, go and die in at Guy's restaurants because it is the best response to those who threaten Israeli or Jewish-owned businesses.
41:13
[SPEAKER_02]: Every time they bully an Israeli restaurant or bakery or author, go out and support them.
41:23
[SPEAKER_02]: People ask me all the time, you talk a lot about anti-Semitism, but what can we do?
41:28
[SPEAKER_02]: So here's an example of doing.
41:30
[SPEAKER_02]: Every time you learn of boycotts and protests against Jewish businesses, go out and patronize them tenfold, and urge your friends to join you, Jewish or not.
41:40
[SPEAKER_02]: Whenever you learn of protests against synagogues, go to synagogue.
41:44
[SPEAKER_02]: The solution to anti-Semitism is to double down on Jewish life.
41:48
[SPEAKER_02]: It's always been this way.
41:50
[SPEAKER_02]: It's why we Jews are still around.
41:52
[SPEAKER_02]: Who do they think they are these so-called vegans for Palestine?
41:57
[SPEAKER_02]: You threaten the safety of an American chef because it was born in Israel?
42:01
[SPEAKER_02]: Because you don't like views you attribute to him without actually knowing what he believes.
42:07
[SPEAKER_02]: Because he's Jewish.
42:09
[SPEAKER_02]: And so what if you disagree with him on Israeli, domestic American politics or any other righteous or self-righteous cause you concoct in your head?
42:18
[SPEAKER_02]: What does that have to do with plant-based lamb dumplings?
42:23
[SPEAKER_02]: What these folks are trying to do is to kick his railies and choose out of public spaces.
42:30
[SPEAKER_02]: We need to make them scared where the chance outside Park East synagogue in Manhattan in November.
42:34
[SPEAKER_02]: It was shouted repeatedly and emphatically.
42:37
[SPEAKER_02]: We need to make them scared.
42:38
[SPEAKER_02]: We need to make them scared.
42:39
[SPEAKER_02]: We need to make them scared.
42:42
[SPEAKER_02]: Don't let them.
42:44
[SPEAKER_02]: I cannot tell you not to be afraid because fear is an emotion connected to but also existing outside the realm of
42:52
[SPEAKER_02]: But I can urge you to overcome your fear and do the right thing.
42:57
[SPEAKER_02]: We respond to hate with fortitude and steely conviction.
43:02
[SPEAKER_02]: The streets of Manhattan, the restaurants of America, are ours too.
43:08
[SPEAKER_02]: And we will not let you intimidate us out of these public spaces.
43:13
[SPEAKER_02]: I was moved by Guy Vacknett's description of how he sometimes discreetly watches his patrons as they first taste his dishes.
43:21
[SPEAKER_02]: It dawned on me that this is so typical of cooks, whether master chefs like guy or your mother, placing her snitzle in front of you as she watches you eat.
43:29
[SPEAKER_02]: Cooks want a please to bring enjoyment to others.
43:33
[SPEAKER_02]: Yes, restaurants are businesses, and yes, they require considerable management and organization, but at the end of the day, it's about people wanting to please others, through food, ambiance, and personal attention.
43:50
[SPEAKER_02]: It's about a chef conveying to his guests I care about you.
43:54
[SPEAKER_02]: You are important to me.
43:56
[SPEAKER_02]: I want to nourish your body and your soul.
43:59
[SPEAKER_02]: This is a good recipe for addressing the moral and political morass we now find ourselves in.
44:05
[SPEAKER_02]: Do for others so that they may recover a measure of joy in this challenging world.
44:12
[SPEAKER_02]: The best reward is when you see that the fruits of your laborers have brought happiness
44:21
[SPEAKER_02]: Until next time, this is in these times.