Latest / Drawn of History / Sen. JD Vance _ This Past Weekend w_ Theo Von _540(M4A_128K)

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Sen. JD Vance _ This Past Weekend w_ Theo Von _540(M4A_128K) · Drawn of History

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: We have some upcoming tour dates there in Colorado Springs
• 0:04
  Speaker 1: in Colorado, Casper, Wyoming, Billings, Montana, and Missoula, Montana, Bloomington, Indiana, Columbus, Ohio, Champaign, Illinois,
• 0:16
  Speaker 1: over there in the Fighting Illini area, Grand Rapids, Michigan, Lafayette, Louisiana,
• 0:22
  Speaker 1: and Beaumont, Texas. You can get all your tickets at theovon.com
• 0:27
  Speaker 1: slash T-O-U-R And thank you so much for the support.
• 0:33
  Speaker 1: I want to start by saying that we have reached
• 0:36
  Speaker 1: out to Governor Walz and Vice President Harris, and we
• 0:40
  Speaker 1: would love to have them in studio as well. Today's
• 0:45
  Speaker 1: guest is a senator from the state of Ohio. He's
• 0:50
  Speaker 1: currently on the Republican ticket for vice president. He's a
• 0:55
  Speaker 1: Yale graduate. He's a Marine. He's an author. He wrote
• 1:00
  Speaker 1: the book Hillbilly Elegy. I've read about half of it.
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  Speaker 1: And I'm really grateful to spend time with him today
• 1:07
  Speaker 1: to discuss some issues and get to know him. Today's
• 1:10
  Speaker 1: guest is Mr.
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  Speaker 2: J.D.
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  Speaker 1: Vance.
• 1:16
  Speaker 2: I know me, and I will follow.
• 1:30
  Speaker 1: But then it starts to become more interesting. Like the
• 1:32
  Speaker 1: last woman we had on trains cats around the country.
• 1:36
  Speaker 2: Really? With a traveling cat circus, yeah. That's pretty amazing.
• 1:38
  Speaker 2: So that's who you're following up, you know?
• 1:40
  Speaker 1: That's right.
• 1:42
  Speaker 2: That's way more interesting than a politician, man.
• 1:45
  Speaker 1: Just so you know where you are, you know, Mr.
• 1:48
  Speaker 2: Vance. Call me JD, please.
• 1:51
  Speaker 1: Just so you know where you are, JD, in the
• 1:54
  Speaker 1: existence of things. JD Vance, thanks for coming in today, man.
• 1:58
  Speaker 2: Yeah, man. It's good to be here. I really appreciate it.
• 2:00
  Speaker 1: I just went to Lambeau Field the other day.
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  Speaker 2: You ever been there? I don't think I ever have
• 2:06
  Speaker 2: been to Lambeau Field, but I think I'm going to
• 2:07
  Speaker 2: Lambeau Field tomorrow. Nuh-uh. Yeah. Yeah. I'm pretty sure. I mean,
• 2:12
  Speaker 2: running for vice president, you never know where you are
• 2:14
  Speaker 2: day to day, but I'm pretty sure we're going to
• 2:16
  Speaker 2: the Packers game tomorrow. Wow. Yeah. It was so good.
• 2:20
  Speaker 2: Did you have fun? It's amazing. Yeah.
• 2:22
  Speaker 1: Um, we, we just went, I had a show there
• 2:23
  Speaker 1: the night, uh, on a Saturday night last Saturday. So
• 2:26
  Speaker 1: we just got to go do a tour.
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  Speaker 2: Okay.
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  Speaker 1: But, um, yeah, it's just so wild. You drive into this,
• 2:32
  Speaker 1: you know, it's a small city and you're like, wait,
• 2:35
  Speaker 1: there's an NFL team here. It doesn't make sense really.
• 2:39
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Like the NFL team in some ways. Right. I mean,
• 2:41
  Speaker 2: the Packers are so popular, but no, I'm looking forward
• 2:44
  Speaker 2: to going. I mean, it's, it's kind of like a
• 2:46
  Speaker 2: political rite of passage, uh, Because, like, I have a
• 2:49
  Speaker 2: guy who served with the Senate, Ron Johnson, really good dude.
• 2:52
  Speaker 2: He's a senator? He's a senator. From Wisconsin? From Wisconsin.
• 2:56
  Speaker 2: And he's just talking about, like, you know, you go to,
• 2:59
  Speaker 2: you do the tailgate thing at Lambeau Field if you're
• 3:01
  Speaker 2: running for office in Wisconsin. And Wisconsin's like a big
• 3:04
  Speaker 2: battleground state. Yeah. So I'm going to go and check
• 3:05
  Speaker 2: it out. We're bringing our kids with us, actually, which
• 3:08
  Speaker 2: I don't know what we're going to do with our
• 3:09
  Speaker 2: kids because they're 7'4 and 2. I don't think they're
• 3:11
  Speaker 2: going to be that into a tailgate. Fill them with cheese, dude.
• 3:15
  Speaker 2: You know what I'm saying? So maybe my wife will
• 3:17
  Speaker 2: take them somewhere and I'll go like have fun at
• 3:19
  Speaker 2: the tailgate. But I'm looking forward to it. Because I'm
• 3:21
  Speaker 2: a pretty big football fan.
• 3:22
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 3:23
  Speaker 2: Lambeau Field is like, you know.
• 3:24
  Speaker 1: Oh, yeah.
• 3:25
  Speaker 2: When we saw it. It's a big deal. Oh, I
• 3:26
  Speaker 2: didn't know what to do when we saw it. I
• 3:29
  Speaker 2: didn't know.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah. Like, and there was some kids were crying and stuff.
• 3:32
  Speaker 1: And the parents were like kind of wiping their cheeks
• 3:34
  Speaker 1: with cheese or whatever. But it was like.
• 3:38
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it was really interesting.
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  Speaker 2: Wait, they were crying because they were so excited to
• 3:42
  Speaker 2: be at Lambeau Field? Yeah, they were crying. Oh, man.
• 3:45
  Speaker 2: So are you a big football guy? Yeah. Okay. I'm
• 3:48
  Speaker 2: a big college football guy. Yeah, I'm more of a
• 3:50
  Speaker 2: college football guy, but I like both. So I'm an
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  Speaker 2: Ohio State guy. I went to Ohio State, you know,
• 3:56
  Speaker 2: born and raised in Ohio. But, you know, there's like
• 4:00
  Speaker 2: the Ohio State-Michigan rivalry is one of the big rivalries.
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  Speaker 2: And this happens, of course, after the election. So I'm
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  Speaker 2: hoping to go to the game. but you talk about
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  Speaker 2: like a kid crying at a football field. This is,
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  Speaker 2: this reminds me of a story is like one of my,
• 4:13
  Speaker 2: my dear friends. And he's like, otherwise a nice guy,
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  Speaker 2: but Ohio state Michigan just turns into a, he turns
• 4:19
  Speaker 2: into a total animal. So this is 2006. Who is he?
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  Speaker 2: The Senator you're talking about? No, no, no. It was
• 4:24
  Speaker 2: totally different guy. This is a buddy I've known. So
• 4:26
  Speaker 2: I was like five years old. Okay. Just a guy
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  Speaker 2: back home. We go to the Ohio state Michigan game. Uh,
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  Speaker 2: we're number one. They're number two. I think we win
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  Speaker 2: that game like 42, 39. It was very, very tight game.
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  Speaker 2: I don't remember the exact score, And we're leaving, and
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  Speaker 2: there's this family, and this kid is like– it's a
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  Speaker 2: family of Michigan fans. And this kid is crying. And
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  Speaker 2: my buddy goes up to him, and I'm like, oh,
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  Speaker 2: Bill's going to be sweet to this family. Like, welcome
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  Speaker 2: to Ohio. Glad you guys come to the game. Sorry
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  Speaker 2: it didn't work out. And my buddy goes, are you
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  Speaker 2: sad that Michigan lost? And the little boy goes, yeah.
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  Speaker 2: And he says, well, maybe next time you won't root
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  Speaker 2: for a team that sucks and walks all out. And
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  Speaker 2: I was like, oh, shit, Bill. We should try to
• 5:08
  Speaker 2: be nicer to the new cars. But then, like, you
• 5:12
  Speaker 2: realize that's actually. Bill is not a concierge. No, no.
• 5:16
  Speaker 2: But that's why Ohio State and Michigan hate each other, right?
• 5:18
  Speaker 2: Because that kid was probably nine years old. So this
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  Speaker 2: is 2006. I mean, he's, I don't know, close to
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  Speaker 2: 25 now. He probably still remembers that asshole from Ohio
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  Speaker 2: State when he was crying after a game. And, like,
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  Speaker 2: that's what makes the rivalry the rivalry. And now that
• 5:34
  Speaker 2: kid is Tom Brady.
• 5:35
  Speaker 1: That's right.
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  Speaker 2: Exactly. That's how it gets.
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  Speaker 1: Oh, dude, I remember the craziest thing I ever saw
• 5:41
  Speaker 1: was there was a Mexican father and son bawling, crying
• 5:46
  Speaker 1: when The Rock came back one night at WWE.
• 5:48
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 5:50
  Speaker 1: Standing there together, same height, bawling, crying. They both had
• 5:56
  Speaker 1: belts on.
• 5:57
  Speaker 2: And it was like, yeah. Yeah. I mean, those are–
• 6:01
  Speaker 2: It's like the little rituals that actually make life worth it, man. Oh, yeah.
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  Speaker 2: But definitely– I mean like my son, he's seven now,
• 6:08
  Speaker 2: but I took him to the Ohio State-Michigan game. I
• 6:10
  Speaker 2: think the last– I took him to the game last year,
• 6:14
  Speaker 2: but then we watch it even when he's like four
• 6:17
  Speaker 2: years old. And Michigan has beat Ohio State the last
• 6:21
  Speaker 2: three years. And so it's just like the first time
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  Speaker 2: I ever saw my kid cry over a sports event
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  Speaker 2: was last year at the Ohio State-Michigan game. When they
• 6:29
  Speaker 2: beat him? When Michigan beat Ohio State. Yeah.
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  Speaker 1: Oh, when you cry when your team wins, that means
• 6:34
  Speaker 1: something is probably– you have parenting issues in your home,
• 6:38
  Speaker 1: I feel like.
• 6:39
  Speaker 2: That's right. That's definitely right. That's definitely right. But, I mean,
• 6:43
  Speaker 2: it's like– I mean, Ohio State just lost to Oregon
• 6:45
  Speaker 2: a couple– like a week ago, I guess. And you
• 6:48
  Speaker 2: sort of realize– like I get so much joy out
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  Speaker 2: of watching sports and like taking my son to the
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  Speaker 2: Ohio State-Michigan games, like one of the coolest moments of
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  Speaker 2: my life as a father. But then it almost always
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  Speaker 2: ends in heartbreak. Because only one team actually wins the championship.
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  Speaker 2: And I sometimes wonder, why do we put ourselves through this?
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  Speaker 1: It's so true. At a certain point, the odds are
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  Speaker 1: you're going to face not feeling great.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely. That it's going to end. Right. I guess
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  Speaker 2: the one team in my lifetime, like the Bulls in
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  Speaker 2: the 90s, the Chicago Bulls in the 90s, and the
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  Speaker 2: Patriots when they had the Brady-Belichick run, most of the
• 7:26
  Speaker 2: time you're actually happy if you're a fan of that team. But,
• 7:29
  Speaker 2: I mean, I'm a Bengals fan in pro sports. And, like,
• 7:34
  Speaker 2: they made the Super Bowl a few years ago, and
• 7:36
  Speaker 2: it was so cool. Yeah, I remember that. Against the 49ers.
• 7:40
  Speaker 2: Wasn't it against the 49ers? It's funny. I don't even
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  Speaker 2: remember who they were playing against. But I remember they
• 7:44
  Speaker 2: lost at the very end. It was a very close game.
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  Speaker 2: We almost put it off. But then it's like all
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  Speaker 2: the joy turned into complete sadness. Like, I'm a grown
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  Speaker 2: man on the verge of tears because– fucking sports team
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  Speaker 2: that I root for lost a game. Wake up, man.
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  Speaker 2: I wonder what it is.
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  Speaker 1: Maybe it's just like... Sorry, I have to.
• 8:04
  Speaker 2: Not say the F word. No, it's okay, dude. Make
• 8:06
  Speaker 2: sure people still vote for me. If it's too many
• 8:08
  Speaker 2: F bombs, I'm going to lose too many votes, so
• 8:10
  Speaker 2: I'll try to tone it down. Okay.
• 8:12
  Speaker 1: Yeah, if you say more than seven or eight, I'll
• 8:15
  Speaker 1: tap you on the shoulder.
• 8:16
  Speaker 2: Thank you. I appreciate it. Dude, oh, actually, my ribs, dude,
• 8:19
  Speaker 2: I've been on almost just on bed rest the past
• 8:24
  Speaker 2: eight days because I I was at the Vanderbilt game
• 8:27
  Speaker 2: when they beat Alabama two weeks ago. That was a
• 8:32
  Speaker 2: big one.
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  Speaker 1: And some guy, I don't even know him. I got
• 8:36
  Speaker 1: a little bit of a look at him. And he
• 8:39
  Speaker 1: squeezed me so hard. He kept squeezing me. And I
• 8:42
  Speaker 1: was like, don't squeeze me anymore. And then he squeezed
• 8:45
  Speaker 1: me even more.
• 8:47
  Speaker 2: Was it a happy squeeze? You could hear my ribs. Like, dude,
• 8:51
  Speaker 2: they really. Like the oxygen leaving your lungs? Yeah. Please
• 8:55
  Speaker 2: don't go. That's all. I love you. Ribs.
• 8:58
  Speaker 1: It had never been away from it. Like they were
• 8:59
  Speaker 1: leaving home for the first time. But was he squeezing you?
• 9:02
  Speaker 2: Cause he was happy. He was happy. Okay. So this
• 9:03
  Speaker 2: wasn't like a.
• 9:04
  Speaker 1: So I was smiling, dude. My smile hit. I mean,
• 9:08
  Speaker 1: the more he squeezed my, the edges of my smile,
• 9:11
  Speaker 1: you could hear him ding against my earlobes. Yeah. I mean,
• 9:13
  Speaker 1: he squeezed me as much as somebody could be squeezed.
• 9:16
  Speaker 1: His wife is not doing well. If that guy has
• 9:18
  Speaker 1: a wife, I'll tell you that. Because that– anyway, my ribs,
• 9:22
  Speaker 1: I've been having to ice them. Dude, it's been– Oh, really?
• 9:24
  Speaker 2: It's been miserable. So you've, like, actually cracked a rib.
• 9:25
  Speaker 2: I mean, it's so– It.
• 9:27
  Speaker 1: Sucks, but it was awesome. But it's like, yeah, the
• 9:29
  Speaker 1: pain you go through to be associated with it.
• 9:33
  Speaker 2: I mean, look, my– so, like, I've only been to
• 9:37
  Speaker 2: the game in Ann Arbor once. And, you know, Ohio
• 9:41
  Speaker 2: State fans, again. Oh, is it weird going up in
• 9:43
  Speaker 2: that territory? People throwing beer bottles at us, sometimes full
• 9:46
  Speaker 2: beer cans at us. I had some kid– Run up–
• 9:49
  Speaker 2: he was like a 19-year-old kid. Run up from behind me,
• 9:53
  Speaker 2: and it had been raining a lot that day, and
• 9:54
  Speaker 2: he had like– like he'd taken a chunk of mud
• 9:57
  Speaker 2: out of the ground and shoved it in my mouth. Oh,
• 9:59
  Speaker 2: my gosh. I mean, this, again, this is like what
• 10:01
  Speaker 2: the sports rivalries are built around is, is moments like this. But, uh, we,
• 10:05
  Speaker 2: we had, we had, I guess, won four years in
• 10:08
  Speaker 2: a row. That's reforestation, isn't it? That's right. But man, we,
• 10:13
  Speaker 2: we'd won four years in a row. And, uh, this,
• 10:16
  Speaker 2: this girl, she's like, you know, 22 years old. She
• 10:19
  Speaker 2: gets in my buddy's face and she said, this is
• 10:21
  Speaker 2: my senior year. You ruined my college career because you
• 10:25
  Speaker 2: guys beat us four years in a row. And then
• 10:28
  Speaker 2: she takes a swing at him and a cop tackles
• 10:31
  Speaker 2: this 22-year-old girl down the bleachers. And I'm just, you know, like, man, again, yeah.
• 10:36
  Speaker 2: People get injured. People get injured at sporting events. It's crazy. Oh, yeah.
• 10:40
  Speaker 1: I thought for a second you were describing a wedding
• 10:42
  Speaker 1: in Appalachia. That's what I thought for a second. We've
• 10:45
  Speaker 1: had– We've had some of those, too. I'm just joking.
• 10:50
  Speaker 1: I'm just joking. We had Billy Strings in. He's a
• 10:53
  Speaker 1: guy who does a lot of picking. He does, like,
• 10:56
  Speaker 1: a lot of guitar picking and stuff.
• 10:57
  Speaker 2: Oh, that's cool. Okay.
• 10:58
  Speaker 1: He talked a lot about his environment where he grew up.
• 11:01
  Speaker 1: He grew up in, like, his area had a lot
• 11:03
  Speaker 1: of addiction in it and stuff like that. What part
• 11:05
  Speaker 1: of West Virginia is he from?
• 11:08
  Speaker 2: Who's this guy? He's from Lansing, Michigan. He's from Lansing, Michigan. Okay.
• 11:10
  Speaker 2: But he grew up. I grew up in Kentucky. I'm
• 11:13
  Speaker 2: ruining it. Well, but a lot of people, this is
• 11:15
  Speaker 2: like the story of my life, but a lot of
• 11:16
  Speaker 2: people from Michigan, Ohio, Pennsylvania, their families are all from
• 11:21
  Speaker 2: West Virginia, East Kentucky to East Tennessee. And then they
• 11:24
  Speaker 2: moved up for the factory jobs. Oh yeah. Like there's
• 11:26
  Speaker 2: a really cool song by Dwight Yoakam called a reading,
• 11:29
  Speaker 2: writing route 23. And it's like, in some ways it's
• 11:32
  Speaker 2: like the story of my family because he came from
• 11:36
  Speaker 2: like two counties over. He moved to central Ohio instead
• 11:39
  Speaker 2: of Southern Ohio. But I mean, it's like millions of people.
• 11:42
  Speaker 2: It's a massive, massive thing. So I wouldn't be surprised,
• 11:44
  Speaker 2: even that guy's from Michigan, if he's got like West
• 11:46
  Speaker 2: Virginia family. I don't know that guy, though.
• 11:48
  Speaker 1: Yeah, Billy Strings, he's great. And he's a new guy, too.
• 11:51
  Speaker 1: And he'll take you fishing if you want to go.
• 11:52
  Speaker 1: But he just has a fascinating story of just like
• 11:57
  Speaker 1: growing up and what his life was like and playing
• 12:00
  Speaker 1: music through it all and learning music and how that
• 12:03
  Speaker 1: kind of kept him going and gave him.
• 12:05
  Speaker 2: Something to do, really.
• 12:07
  Speaker 1: Um, yeah. Why was that migration? Why did people migrate
• 12:10
  Speaker 1: from there to, um, yeah, it.
• 12:12
  Speaker 2: Was, it was, I mean, at least the, the, the
• 12:15
  Speaker 2: biggest thing is you think about it. So world war
• 12:17
  Speaker 2: two ends, right? America is the biggest industrial power in
• 12:20
  Speaker 2: the world. And a lot of these factories are coming
• 12:23
  Speaker 2: online close to where they had, you know, access to waterways.
• 12:27
  Speaker 2: Cause you got to ship iron ore and coal and
• 12:29
  Speaker 2: all that stuff. So a lot of stuff around the
• 12:31
  Speaker 2: great lakes, that's Michigan, Ohio. Um, you know, a lot
• 12:34
  Speaker 2: of coal in Pennsylvania. And so, um, You had all
• 12:37
  Speaker 2: these steel mills and textile factories and automobile plants, of course,
• 12:44
  Speaker 2: in Michigan. And all this stuff is getting built. And
• 12:47
  Speaker 2: then it's actually– what's interesting about it is you had
• 12:50
  Speaker 2: a lot of black people come from the deep south.
• 12:52
  Speaker 2: And then a lot of primarily white people come from Appalachia.
• 12:56
  Speaker 2: And they sort of migrated together to all these factories.
• 13:00
  Speaker 2: And like there are books written in Detroit about the–
• 13:04
  Speaker 2: you've got like basically– the hillbillies from Appalachia, the black
• 13:09
  Speaker 2: people from the deep South. And they're just kind of
• 13:10
  Speaker 2: like tossed into Detroit. And like a lot of what
• 13:13
  Speaker 2: we think of as sort of modern Detroit culture is
• 13:17
  Speaker 2: like the fusion of those two groups of people who
• 13:19
  Speaker 2: just dropped in, in massive, massive numbers. And, uh, it's
• 13:23
  Speaker 2: like one of the stories of like, why is Chicago
• 13:25
  Speaker 2: such a big blues town? Cause all the black folks
• 13:27
  Speaker 2: from the deep South were moving in and they were,
• 13:29
  Speaker 2: you know, bringing their music with them. And that's why
• 13:32
  Speaker 2: Chicago became such a capital for blues is it's not
• 13:34
  Speaker 2: really like It's because all those folks who came from
• 13:36
  Speaker 2: the Delta. But basically jobs, man. My mamaw talked about this.
• 13:42
  Speaker 2: That's what I called my grandmother. She talked a lot
• 13:45
  Speaker 2: about how if you were growing up in eastern Kentucky
• 13:48
  Speaker 2: in the 30s and 40s, it was like basically you
• 13:51
  Speaker 2: go work in the mines or get out. That was
• 13:53
  Speaker 2: all there was at that time. And so my grandfather
• 13:57
  Speaker 2: went and worked at a steel mill, built a pretty
• 13:59
  Speaker 2: good life, was a union welder for 40 years. Oh, yeah.
• 14:03
  Speaker 1: We just had a union president on.
• 14:05
  Speaker 2: Oh, yeah. I listened to that one. I like that guy.
• 14:08
  Speaker 2: Sean O'Brien. Yeah. He's wild, dude. Yeah, he is wild.
• 14:11
  Speaker 2: I mean, it's funny, man. You can tell he's from Boston.
• 14:12
  Speaker 2: He's got that thick Boston accent. Oh, yeah, he does.
• 14:17
  Speaker 2: But he's a cool dude. I actually– I've talked to
• 14:20
  Speaker 2: Sean a couple times, and it's like normally– it's like
• 14:24
  Speaker 2: normally Democrats are considered sort of the pro-union, and then
• 14:28
  Speaker 2: 30 years ago Republicans were the anti-union. And one of
• 14:30
  Speaker 2: the things I've been talking a lot about people like
• 14:33
  Speaker 2: Sean is– You know, a lot of union members are
• 14:36
  Speaker 2: coming over the Republican side. And I think the Republican Party,
• 14:39
  Speaker 2: we got to do, you know, frankly, a better job
• 14:41
  Speaker 2: at kind of welcoming people. But I think Trump is
• 14:44
  Speaker 2: doing a really good job of making union voters feel
• 14:47
  Speaker 2: at home in our coalition, which is like an interesting
• 14:49
  Speaker 2: part of what, you know, what we're all about. I mean,
• 14:51
  Speaker 2: I think Sean's the head of the Teamsters, I think.
• 14:54
  Speaker 2: And there was some poll they did just of Teamsters
• 14:57
  Speaker 2: members where it's like 65 percent of Teamsters in Pennsylvania
• 15:01
  Speaker 2: are going to vote for Trump. That's a crazy turnaround
• 15:04
  Speaker 2: from even 15 years ago. Yeah, they couldn't endorse.
• 15:06
  Speaker 1: There's only been two times where they haven't endorsed a
• 15:09
  Speaker 1: candidate in the past 30 years, I think, or maybe
• 15:11
  Speaker 1: past 50 years. But this would be one of those times,
• 15:16
  Speaker 1: they said, I think, because it's too split. So do
• 15:19
  Speaker 1: you have to ask Trump places you can go to
• 15:22
  Speaker 1: promote or to campaign? What is that relation? How does
• 15:27
  Speaker 1: that work?
• 15:28
  Speaker 2: Yeah, no, it's... it's actually mostly driven at like the
• 15:32
  Speaker 2: staff level. Right.
• 15:33
  Speaker 1: And so a strategy kind of, yeah, it's like strategy.
• 15:36
  Speaker 2: So, so, okay. There are seven big battleground States. It's
• 15:40
  Speaker 2: the three in the Midwest or Michigan, Wisconsin, Pennsylvania, and
• 15:43
  Speaker 2: then Georgia, Arizona, Nevada, and North Carolina. And so it's like,
• 15:47
  Speaker 2: you look at a little bit, it's driven by polling
• 15:50
  Speaker 2: a little bit. It's driven on just like, where do
• 15:52
  Speaker 2: you think this guy's going to do the best? And
• 15:55
  Speaker 2: I've spent a ton of my time. Like, I think
• 15:57
  Speaker 2: I did like six or, five or six events just
• 15:59
  Speaker 2: in Pennsylvania the past week and a half. Wow. So
• 16:02
  Speaker 2: I've spent a lot of time in Pennsylvania, a lot
• 16:03
  Speaker 2: of time in Michigan, a lot of time in Wisconsin.
• 16:06
  Speaker 2: I'm actually trying to get Kid Rock to go with
• 16:07
  Speaker 2: me to Michigan in a couple of days because he's
• 16:09
  Speaker 2: a Michigan guy. Oh, he'll go. Yeah, he probably will.
• 16:12
  Speaker 1: Yeah, he'll go, dude.
• 16:15
  Speaker 2: He texted me last night. I mean, you know, you
• 16:18
  Speaker 2: can't see, but my cousin, for those of you who
• 16:19
  Speaker 2: are watching, my cousin's here. She's more like my big sister. Um,
• 16:23
  Speaker 2: but like we're, we're hanging out. I went to a
• 16:25
  Speaker 2: wedding last night. Oh, nice. My, my, my little cousin
• 16:28
  Speaker 2: got married and, um, kid rock sends me a text message.
• 16:31
  Speaker 2: He's like, Hey, if you're in Nashville, cause I think he,
• 16:33
  Speaker 2: I guess he knew I was doing this podcast.
• 16:34
  Speaker 1: People were going over there. What do you mind?
• 16:36
  Speaker 2: I was texting.
• 16:37
  Speaker 1: He's like, Hey, we're going over to Bob's. And I
• 16:38
  Speaker 1: was like, I got to prepare for this podcast tomorrow.
• 16:42
  Speaker 1: Vance is coming on.
• 16:43
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Maybe that's how he knew. Cause he texted me
• 16:46
  Speaker 2: and I was like, Oh man. I want to fly
• 16:48
  Speaker 2: to Nashville right now just so I can party with
• 16:50
  Speaker 2: Kid Rock, right? I mean, like that's an experience of
• 16:53
  Speaker 2: a lifetime. So now I'm trying to get him to
• 16:56
  Speaker 2: go to Michigan with me. Oh, I'm sure he probably would, man.
• 16:59
  Speaker 1: Oh, yeah, dude.
• 17:01
  Speaker 2: He's one of a kind, man.
• 17:02
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 17:02
  Speaker 2: But anyway, to answer your question, it's basically you go
• 17:04
  Speaker 2: where the campaign needs you to go. And like, yeah,
• 17:08
  Speaker 2: I could say no, but I'm like running for vice president.
• 17:10
  Speaker 2: So I try to do as much as I can
• 17:12
  Speaker 2: just to be helpful.
• 17:13
  Speaker 1: And do y'all have, do you go with Donald Trump?
• 17:15
  Speaker 1: Do you guys go separately a lot of times? Do
• 17:18
  Speaker 1: you guys have like strategy talks in the mornings and stuff?
• 17:21
  Speaker 1: Like is it, what is it like?
• 17:22
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's more informal. Is it like doubles tennis kind of?
• 17:26
  Speaker 2: It's more divide and conquer, right? So it's like you
• 17:29
  Speaker 2: got two people and you can be in two places,
• 17:32
  Speaker 2: so you might as well do it. But if we
• 17:33
  Speaker 2: got like a really big event, like, you know, the
• 17:35
  Speaker 2: president got shot in Bucks County or sorry. Which time
• 17:38
  Speaker 2: are you talking about? The first time. Okay. The first time.
• 17:42
  Speaker 1: You're going to say, really?
• 17:43
  Speaker 2: He got shot in Pennsylvania. And so we went out
• 17:49
  Speaker 2: to Pennsylvania together to do a big rally. And then
• 17:51
  Speaker 2: Elon Musk was there. In Butler? In Butler, Pennsylvania. And then,
• 17:57
  Speaker 2: you know, like I was in Bucks County, Pennsylvania, like
• 18:00
  Speaker 2: a week earlier, but that was just me. Right. Right.
• 18:02
  Speaker 2: So you sort of go, you know, some places you
• 18:03
  Speaker 2: go together, but most of the time we're sort of
• 18:05
  Speaker 2: dividing and conquering.
• 18:06
  Speaker 1: How with the attempts that they've had on Trump's on
• 18:11
  Speaker 1: Trump's life and safety, how much of a concern has
• 18:15
  Speaker 1: that been for you? Like it's like because if I'm
• 18:18
  Speaker 1: standing next to a guy and they're shooting at him,
• 18:21
  Speaker 1: I'm next to him.
• 18:22
  Speaker 2: Yeah. You know? Yeah. I know what you mean. I mean,
• 18:24
  Speaker 2: I try to think about it, man, because really. Yeah,
• 18:27
  Speaker 2: it's just– it's one of these things you can't control.
• 18:30
  Speaker 2: And if you're going to do this job, like you're
• 18:32
  Speaker 2: going to go out and talk to a lot of
• 18:33
  Speaker 2: people and you're going to go try to win, right?
• 18:35
  Speaker 2: I mean like I fundamentally believe that we're trying to
• 18:37
  Speaker 2: win to help the country. So either you either do
• 18:42
  Speaker 2: it or you don't do it. And if you do it,
• 18:44
  Speaker 2: you just kind of accept it. I mean I don't
• 18:46
  Speaker 2: think there's– I don't know. Maybe I'm just– this is
• 18:48
  Speaker 2: just me rationalizing it. I don't feel like there's that
• 18:50
  Speaker 2: big of a target on my back, but who the
• 18:52
  Speaker 2: hell knows. Well, you're tall.
• 18:53
  Speaker 1: Are you a little taller than him or not?
• 18:55
  Speaker 2: Yep. We're about the same height. Okay.
• 18:56
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 18:57
  Speaker 2: Which is funny, man. The weird shit people say about
• 18:59
  Speaker 2: you on the internet. Like the thing, there was a
• 19:01
  Speaker 2: long time, maybe even still today, if you Google how
• 19:04
  Speaker 2: tall is JD Vance, it would say five foot seven.
• 19:07
  Speaker 2: And I, oh, it says six feet now. Somebody updated
• 19:11
  Speaker 2: it then. Somebody updated it. Yeah. Okay. The first headline
• 19:14
  Speaker 2: is JD Vance is tall, but Americans are getting shorter.
• 19:17
  Speaker 2: What the hell is, the internet's a weird ass place.
• 19:18
  Speaker 1: It also says Joe Biden is six foot sleep. I
• 19:22
  Speaker 1: don't know if that's a height.
• 19:23
  Speaker 2: Well, see, this is the thing, though. How tall is
• 19:25
  Speaker 2: JD Vance? There was like a conspiracy on the internet
• 19:27
  Speaker 2: that I was a really short guy, but no, I'm
• 19:30
  Speaker 2: about 6'2.
• 19:31
  Speaker 1: I think, yeah, once you get better, people help, and
• 19:33
  Speaker 1: you get your height. You're pretty tall. You're 6 feet tall.
• 19:36
  Speaker 1: I'm 6 feet tall, yeah. I'm 6 feet tall. If
• 19:38
  Speaker 1: this rib gets back in place, I'm 6 foot and
• 19:41
  Speaker 1: a half inch, brother. I'll tell you that. So did
• 19:45
  Speaker 1: you have to ask your wife about that? Like, say, hey,
• 19:48
  Speaker 1: like did she have to weigh in because that's a
• 19:51
  Speaker 1: little because i'm trying to think of other jobs where
• 19:53
  Speaker 1: you get shot at really military um domestic violence i
• 19:59
  Speaker 1: guess and then politician.
• 20:01
  Speaker 2: Politician i mean normally politicians don't get shot at that
• 20:03
  Speaker 2: much but Apparently it's coming back. Apparently it's coming back, man.
• 20:06
  Speaker 2: That's not, that's not like a good thing to come
• 20:08
  Speaker 2: back to. You know what I mean? But I also,
• 20:10
  Speaker 2: I mean, it's, it's, I definitely grew up, um, like,
• 20:13
  Speaker 2: and I grew up in Ohio, but I spent a
• 20:14
  Speaker 2: lot of time in Eastern Kentucky. Yeah. And if you
• 20:16
  Speaker 2: go to like, there's a courthouse in breath of County, Kentucky,
• 20:18
  Speaker 2: I mean, beautiful part of the country, like kind of
• 20:20
  Speaker 2: in the mountains. And there's like a plaque, like a
• 20:22
  Speaker 2: historical plaque. That's basically like, you know, on this site,
• 20:26
  Speaker 2: multiple people were killed in the breath of County blood
• 20:28
  Speaker 2: feuds of the early, you know, the early 20th century. So,
• 20:32
  Speaker 2: I don't know, you just kind of accept it as
• 20:36
  Speaker 2: bad as it is. I mean, I want us to
• 20:37
  Speaker 2: get away from it, right, as a country, but as
• 20:39
  Speaker 2: an individual candidate, I think you just have to kind
• 20:41
  Speaker 2: of accept it. I mean, I'll tell you.
• 20:44
  Speaker 1: But I guess if you're going into battle, you're going
• 20:45
  Speaker 1: into battle.
• 20:46
  Speaker 2: That's right. That's right. You just got to do what
• 20:48
  Speaker 2: you got to do. Yeah. But again, you know, I'm
• 20:52
  Speaker 2: a person of faith. I don't talk about it that much.
• 20:54
  Speaker 2: I don't wear it on my sleeve. I always sort
• 20:56
  Speaker 2: of mistrust people who wear it too much on their sleeve,
• 20:58
  Speaker 2: but I feel like, you know, if God wants me
• 21:00
  Speaker 2: to be vice president. I'll be vice president. If not,
• 21:04
  Speaker 2: then I won't. You just got to work your ass
• 21:06
  Speaker 2: off and let the chips fall where they may. Yeah.
• 21:10
  Speaker 1: I saw where you had, your mom was out and
• 21:12
  Speaker 1: you congratulated her on, she almost has 10 years of sobriety,
• 21:15
  Speaker 1: you said?
• 21:16
  Speaker 2: That's right. Yeah. She's- In January? January of 2025, she
• 21:19
  Speaker 2: will be 10 years clean and sober. And that's really
• 21:22
  Speaker 2: funny because you notice she's standing next to you there.
• 21:24
  Speaker 2: That's Mike Johnson, the Speaker of the House. Oh, yeah. And, like,
• 21:28
  Speaker 2: my family's not very political. So they bring her up
• 21:31
  Speaker 2: to this booth, and, like, two chairs over is Donald Trump.
• 21:34
  Speaker 2: Of course she knows who that is. But she shakes
• 21:36
  Speaker 2: Mike Johnson's hand, and he's like, you know, lovely to
• 21:39
  Speaker 2: meet you. And she says, lovely to meet you, too.
• 21:41
  Speaker 2: Who are you? Do you work in politics? I was like, Mom,
• 21:47
  Speaker 2: that's the Speaker of the House. Okay. She's like, well,
• 21:51
  Speaker 2: I'll take a McDouble. That's right. Um, what, um, Diet
• 21:57
  Speaker 2: Coke with, with extra ice.
• 22:02
  Speaker 1: What was, uh, yeah, I know your mom's, your mom's
• 22:05
  Speaker 1: struggled with alcoholism, right?
• 22:06
  Speaker 2: Um, addiction. Mostly. Yeah. Mostly non-alcohol drugs. I never saw her,
• 22:12
  Speaker 2: you know, drink that much, but I mean, you know, pills, opioids, heroin, um,
• 22:18
  Speaker 2: What's it been like to watch her get sober? What's
• 22:19
  Speaker 2: that been like? It's amazing, man. It's, it's amazing. I
• 22:22
  Speaker 2: know you're, you're, What are you– you're a recovery, right? Yeah,
• 22:25
  Speaker 2: I'm a recovery.
• 22:26
  Speaker 1: Yeah, a lot of my family is in it too.
• 22:27
  Speaker 1: So I think that, yeah, I can relate a lot
• 22:29
  Speaker 1: to your story to be honest with you.
• 22:30
  Speaker 2: Yeah, but I mean– look, I mean there was a
• 22:33
  Speaker 2: time– like I always wanted to grow up and have
• 22:36
  Speaker 2: a family. And I remember when I was a teenager
• 22:38
  Speaker 2: thinking to myself, there's no way mom is going to
• 22:41
  Speaker 2: be around to meet– like if I have kids, there's
• 22:43
  Speaker 2: no way my mom is ever going to meet them.
• 22:45
  Speaker 2: And she's now like– she's now a great-grandmother to the
• 22:49
  Speaker 2: three grandkids. But I don't know, man. It's just– If
• 22:53
  Speaker 2: you've known anybody in this circumstance, it sounds like you
• 22:55
  Speaker 2: know very well what it's like is there's like this–
• 22:58
  Speaker 2: there's two feelings that you have or at least always
• 23:01
  Speaker 2: two feelings I had when mom was going through it.
• 23:03
  Speaker 2: It's like on the one hand, she's so smart. She's
• 23:06
  Speaker 2: so funny and you're just like kind of rooting for
• 23:09
  Speaker 2: her because you just want her to get better. Then
• 23:11
  Speaker 2: on the other hand, you're just pissed off. It's like–
• 23:13
  Speaker 2: because you don't quite understand it. I think if you're
• 23:15
  Speaker 2: not in recovery yourself, it's hard to fully understand. And,
• 23:18
  Speaker 2: you know, so that you'd be frustrated with her one
• 23:21
  Speaker 2: moment and then just desperate for her to get better
• 23:23
  Speaker 2: the next moment. You're constantly bouncing back and forth. But, man,
• 23:26
  Speaker 2: it's amazing. It really is. I mean, she was at
• 23:29
  Speaker 2: the wedding we were at last night and just having
• 23:31
  Speaker 2: a good time and being her like funny, quirky self.
• 23:34
  Speaker 2: She has a good sense of humor. She's a very
• 23:35
  Speaker 2: good sense of humor. I mean, you know, like the
• 23:39
  Speaker 2: bride and groom have this really cool tradition where they
• 23:42
  Speaker 2: had like at each table a wine bottle with a
• 23:44
  Speaker 2: number on it. And then like at the table one,
• 23:47
  Speaker 2: they'd open that bottle of wine, their first anniversary. And
• 23:50
  Speaker 2: table two, the second anniversary. And so they had people
• 23:52
  Speaker 2: write stuff in Sharpies on the wine bottle. I'd never
• 23:56
  Speaker 2: seen that. I thought it was a pretty cool little thing.
• 23:59
  Speaker 2: And my mom, I forget what table she was in, but,
• 24:01
  Speaker 2: you know, like 10 years down the road. And she
• 24:04
  Speaker 2: writes something on her bottle like, hey, I love you.
• 24:08
  Speaker 2: Hopefully I'm still alive when you're drinking this. Yeah. She's
• 24:12
  Speaker 2: just got like it again. It's like a kind of
• 24:13
  Speaker 2: a morbid, quirky sense of humor. But yeah, man, it's
• 24:17
  Speaker 2: it's it's really amazing because I get I just never
• 24:20
  Speaker 2: I never thought she'd be alive. Wow. I was 40
• 24:22
  Speaker 2: years old.
• 24:23
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 24:23
  Speaker 2: And she is. And she's got a good relationship with
• 24:25
  Speaker 2: her family and her grandparents or her grandkids. And that's
• 24:29
  Speaker 2: just a very cool thing. Yeah. It's a blessing, man.
• 24:32
  Speaker 2: That's awesome. It is a blessing.
• 24:33
  Speaker 1: It was really cool to see that. Did you ever
• 24:35
  Speaker 1: go to meetings with her? Did she go to you
• 24:38
  Speaker 1: have been before? Yeah, I've been to a lot of N.A.
• 24:40
  Speaker 2: Meetings. When you were growing up, did you ever go
• 24:42
  Speaker 2: or no? Yeah, I went when I was a kid.
• 24:44
  Speaker 2: I went when I was a teenager. I mean, I've
• 24:47
  Speaker 2: been to a lot, actually, just in the past few years.
• 24:49
  Speaker 2: Now that she feels like she's really on the other
• 24:52
  Speaker 2: side of it, she does a lot with her local N.A.
• 24:55
  Speaker 2: I think she's the treasurer, the secretary of her local N.A. chapter.
• 24:59
  Speaker 2: Do you ever go to meetings or anything? Oh, yeah.
• 25:02
  Speaker 2: I went to one. I was at one last night
• 25:03
  Speaker 2: at 8. Okay. I mean, there's actually a really special
• 25:07
  Speaker 2: community around it, which I really like. And it almost
• 25:10
  Speaker 2: kind of reminds me of church, right? A hundred percent.
• 25:13
  Speaker 2: Where you say these prayers and you talk about what's
• 25:16
  Speaker 2: going on. And there's like this sense of fellowship and
• 25:19
  Speaker 2: community that I think is really awesome. And it's like
• 25:24
  Speaker 2: one of these things where you see just human nature
• 25:28
  Speaker 2: and all of its good sides and its bad sides, right?
• 25:31
  Speaker 2: Because sometimes you have people who come in And they're
• 25:34
  Speaker 2: getting their 24-hour medallion, right? Which is like this is
• 25:38
  Speaker 2: the first real period of sobriety I've had in a
• 25:40
  Speaker 2: very long time. And then sometimes you have people celebrating 15, 20,
• 25:44
  Speaker 2: 25 years. And it's just amazing to see. But I
• 25:48
  Speaker 2: don't know if you noticed this, but something I noticed,
• 25:51
  Speaker 2: and it's not to get too political here, but, you know,
• 25:54
  Speaker 2: like five, six, seven years ago, you know, you start
• 26:02
  Speaker 2: noticing this and then it really started picking up a
• 26:04
  Speaker 2: few years ago where you have somebody who's been say
• 26:08
  Speaker 2: six months or nine months sober and then they don't
• 26:11
  Speaker 2: come to a couple of meetings and then they're just dead.
• 26:15
  Speaker 2: And you realize like when people relapse, when mom was
• 26:19
  Speaker 2: in the worst of it, yeah, there was some dangerous
• 26:21
  Speaker 2: shit out there, but it wasn't nearly as deadly as
• 26:24
  Speaker 2: the stuff that's out there today. Oh yeah. And I,
• 26:26
  Speaker 2: I really worry about that. Right. Cause you know, think
• 26:28
  Speaker 2: about the second chance I got with my mom, And
• 26:31
  Speaker 2: I really worry that the poison that we've got in
• 26:34
  Speaker 2: the streets now is so dangerous that a lot of
• 26:37
  Speaker 2: people would have that second chance. But, you know, you
• 26:40
  Speaker 2: fall off the wagon once. Fifteen years ago, it's like, oh,
• 26:43
  Speaker 2: that sucks. I'm going to climb back on. Today, you
• 26:46
  Speaker 2: fall off that wagon. It might kill you. Yeah. And
• 26:49
  Speaker 2: I really worry about that because I think a lot
• 26:50
  Speaker 2: of good people, you know, like mom, it didn't happen
• 26:53
  Speaker 2: like once, right? It's not like she got clean and
• 26:55
  Speaker 2: sober and that was it, right? It's a process.
• 26:56
  Speaker 1: Sometimes you have to fall off a few times. Yeah.
• 26:58
  Speaker 2: And you got to get back on. It's a process, man.
• 27:00
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I've had relapses over the years and had to
• 27:02
  Speaker 1: get back on. And it's tough. And one of the
• 27:05
  Speaker 1: tougher things to do is to get back on. But
• 27:07
  Speaker 1: it's funny because I think if– I don't know if
• 27:12
  Speaker 1: I'd be sober if this stuff weren't killing people, to
• 27:15
  Speaker 1: be honest with you. I know that's sad to say.
• 27:18
  Speaker 1: But that keeps me out of the risk of it.
• 27:20
  Speaker 1: It just makes it too– Makes it a little scarier. Yeah,
• 27:22
  Speaker 1: that's the thing. It makes it scarier. But it's also
• 27:25
  Speaker 1: sad that somebody– I mean, this is ridiculous to say
• 27:28
  Speaker 1: probably– that somebody can't. you know, you can't even do
• 27:32
  Speaker 1: cocaine in this country anymore, you know? And that seems
• 27:36
  Speaker 1: like a crazy thing to say. And don't say that.
• 27:39
  Speaker 1: Don't say that. But I said it, but, but yeah,
• 27:42
  Speaker 1: but don't say that anymore.
• 27:43
  Speaker 2: I'm going to steal that line after the election though.
• 27:46
  Speaker 2: And I, no, no, we had to win first. It's
• 27:49
  Speaker 2: unfortunate to be clear to those watching. I've never done
• 27:52
  Speaker 2: cocaine before. Yeah. And nobody made many mistakes, but not
• 27:55
  Speaker 2: that one. Nobody's saying, yeah, but it's just, it's unfortunate.
• 27:59
  Speaker 1: That's that.
• 28:01
  Speaker 2: I don't even know where to go. It's unfortunate that, like, look,
• 28:06
  Speaker 2: everybody makes mistakes. Right. Everybody makes mistakes, right? And, like,
• 28:10
  Speaker 2: I know, as a buddy of mine told me about this, hell,
• 28:15
  Speaker 2: this has got to have been three years ago. It's
• 28:20
  Speaker 2: been a while. But basically what happened is his daughter
• 28:24
  Speaker 2: was like a bridesmaid in a wedding. And they were
• 28:28
  Speaker 2: going to this wedding, and... Like the wedding got canceled
• 28:32
  Speaker 2: because a couple of the groomsmen like had terrible overdoses
• 28:36
  Speaker 2: the night before at the bachelor party because they took something.
• 28:39
  Speaker 2: I mean, like, you know, you can judge and say, oh,
• 28:41
  Speaker 2: they shouldn't have been taking something. But everybody takes something
• 28:44
  Speaker 2: at some point in their lives. Like we don't want
• 28:46
  Speaker 2: it to kill people. We don't want stupid mistakes to
• 28:48
  Speaker 2: kill people. That's sort of like live and learn. Live
• 28:50
  Speaker 2: and learn from stupid mistakes. Right. You should be able
• 28:52
  Speaker 2: to live and learn. Yes. Now it becomes a death sentence.
• 28:55
  Speaker 2: That's what's really, I think, changed about from now to
• 28:58
  Speaker 2: when my– my mom was struggling with addiction.
• 29:01
  Speaker 1: Why do, why is it so bad? Like what, do
• 29:04
  Speaker 1: you know a lot about the fentanyl crisis?
• 29:06
  Speaker 2: I mean, I know a fair amount about it. You know, I've, I've,
• 29:09
  Speaker 2: I've worried about it for a long time. I've, I've,
• 29:11
  Speaker 2: you know, worked on bills related to it. I mean, there,
• 29:14
  Speaker 2: there are two basic issues, right? And it's, it's like,
• 29:17
  Speaker 2: you know, any business, there's a manufacturer, there's a wholesaler,
• 29:20
  Speaker 2: and then there's the retail, right? And, you know, with,
• 29:24
  Speaker 2: with fentanyl, it's, it's not you can't like make fentanyl
• 29:28
  Speaker 2: in a trailer in somebody's basement, right? That's like, it's
• 29:31
  Speaker 2: not like meth. It takes a really complicated, pretty sophisticated
• 29:34
  Speaker 2: pharmaceutical process. So we know that a lot of it,
• 29:37
  Speaker 2: maybe even most of it, the Chinese are making meaning
• 29:39
  Speaker 2: Chinese condoms, not like necessarily the Chinese government, but they
• 29:42
  Speaker 2: sure as hell know about it. And then they bring
• 29:45
  Speaker 2: it in primarily through the Southern border. And the Mexican
• 29:49
  Speaker 2: drug cartels are like the wholesalers, right? Of the Chinese pharma,
• 29:54
  Speaker 2: pharma is the manufacturer. The drug cartels are bringing in
• 29:57
  Speaker 2: wholesale style. And then it makes it in the street level.
• 30:01
  Speaker 2: And I mean, it's really crazy, man. Like I was
• 30:03
  Speaker 2: talking to a DEA agent about this a couple of
• 30:05
  Speaker 2: years ago. And I think this was in 2022. He
• 30:09
  Speaker 2: was like, look, a few years ago, the cartels were
• 30:13
  Speaker 2: making less than a billion dollars a year. And he's like,
• 30:16
  Speaker 2: in 22, 23, we think they'll make $ 14 billion a year.
• 30:20
  Speaker 2: So like an explosion of drug trafficking in this country.
• 30:24
  Speaker 2: And you hear about stories and I don't think it
• 30:26
  Speaker 2: happens that much. Thank God. But somebody smokes a joint.
• 30:29
  Speaker 2: It's laced with fentanyl. They go into a coma. Yeah.
• 30:32
  Speaker 2: I mean, I have seven friends that have that.
• 30:35
  Speaker 1: I have seven friends and not even just like estranged people,
• 30:38
  Speaker 1: you know, like but not all best friends.
• 30:40
  Speaker 2: Sure.
• 30:42
  Speaker 1: But I have seven friends that that overdose and died
• 30:45
  Speaker 1: from fentanyl. Yeah.
• 30:47
  Speaker 2: Yeah. That's me. Right. Yeah, and with harder stuff, it
• 30:50
  Speaker 2: happens a lot. I think you hear about it being
• 30:53
  Speaker 2: laced in marijuana, but not that much. But your point
• 30:57
  Speaker 2: about cocaine, pills, you have to be careful. It's a
• 31:03
  Speaker 2: huge thing. It's an unbelievable crisis.
• 31:05
  Speaker 1: And it's like, yeah, you'd think that we'd– I don't
• 31:08
  Speaker 1: know how you fight something like that. Maybe we need
• 31:10
  Speaker 1: to have like a– head of like the DEA.
• 31:14
  Speaker 2: Or something on, maybe he would be able to help,
• 31:16
  Speaker 2: or she would be able to help us figure that
• 31:18
  Speaker 2: out a little bit. I think it'd be, that'd be
• 31:19
  Speaker 2: a very interesting conversation, but I think, I think you've
• 31:21
  Speaker 2: got to, I think you got to go to it
• 31:23
  Speaker 2: at the heart and something, you know, Trump did towards
• 31:26
  Speaker 2: the end of his administration, doesn't get a whole lot
• 31:28
  Speaker 2: of headlines. Obviously I'm biased. I think it should get
• 31:30
  Speaker 2: headlines as he was using economic leverage to try to
• 31:34
  Speaker 2: convince the Chinese to crack down on fentanyl manufacturing and,
• 31:37
  Speaker 2: Because if you get it at the source, right, that's,
• 31:40
  Speaker 2: I think, really the way to address it.
• 31:42
  Speaker 1: Oh, there's fentanyl in half the bookshelves they make over there, dude.
• 31:45
  Speaker 1: You put a fucking half a set of dictionaries and
• 31:48
  Speaker 1: that bitch will give way.
• 31:53
  Speaker 2: I mean, I absolutely believe that. Oh, man. What's in
• 31:58
  Speaker 2: the furniture here? Are we okay?
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• 35:52
  Speaker 2: See site for details. Uh, but you, you, I mean, you,
• 35:56
  Speaker 2: you do that. You go after the drug cartels. The
• 35:59
  Speaker 2: other thing that people don't realize about the cartels, man, is,
• 36:01
  Speaker 2: is one, we're talking about some very dark and dangerous people.
• 36:05
  Speaker 2: Like this is not some guy who's like dealing, you know,
• 36:08
  Speaker 2: selling joints on a college campus. These are like, they're
• 36:11
  Speaker 2: doing sex trafficking. They're, they're, they're, they're, they're getting 11,
• 36:14
  Speaker 2: 10 year old girls involved in the sex trade. Yeah.
• 36:17
  Speaker 2: They're like very evil people. Dictator type of, Oh, just
• 36:21
  Speaker 2: absolutely vile. And it's like why are we making it
• 36:25
  Speaker 2: easier for these like massive criminal organizations to get richer
• 36:30
  Speaker 2: and richer and richer? Like we should be trying to
• 36:32
  Speaker 2: make them poor and, I mean, help people who actually
• 36:36
  Speaker 2: need it.
• 36:37
  Speaker 1: Well, it's also– it's obviously one of the biggest enemies
• 36:39
  Speaker 1: that's– it's like if there were an enemy that were
• 36:42
  Speaker 1: killing– if there were somebody shooting into your country every
• 36:48
  Speaker 1: day– and killing people, at a certain point you go
• 36:51
  Speaker 1: over there, or you send your military there, or do
• 36:54
  Speaker 1: something to say, hey, we're not going to let you
• 36:57
  Speaker 1: do this anymore. That's basically what's happening.
• 37:00
  Speaker 2: That's right. Can you imagine if Mexico sent gunmen across
• 37:05
  Speaker 2: the border and killed 70,000 Americans a year? Because that's
• 37:08
  Speaker 2: about what dies from fentanyl. We would be in a
• 37:11
  Speaker 2: major war, right? It just absolutely would be the case.
• 37:15
  Speaker 2: So the other thing that's crazy about this is, So
• 37:18
  Speaker 2: these cartels– and you see this graphic that's pretty interesting there.
• 37:21
  Speaker 2: But the cartels are going to start to destabilize the
• 37:24
  Speaker 2: country of Mexico. Like do you know– do you know
• 37:28
  Speaker 2: the name Pablo Escobar? Yeah, I do. OK. So like
• 37:32
  Speaker 2: the Colombian cartels in the 70s were as powerful as
• 37:35
  Speaker 2: like the Colombian government, right? It was a narco state.
• 37:39
  Speaker 2: You don't want that to happen like right at the
• 37:40
  Speaker 2: American southern border. where the drug cartels have more power
• 37:44
  Speaker 2: than the Mexican government, that's just going to be chaotic.
• 37:46
  Speaker 2: It's going to be basically a warlike atmosphere on our
• 37:49
  Speaker 2: southern border. That's bad news.
• 37:51
  Speaker 1: Well, it's bad news, but it'd be great to figure
• 37:53
  Speaker 1: out a way to shut it down. I mean, it
• 37:55
  Speaker 1: just feels like, yeah, if that many people are dying
• 37:57
  Speaker 1: each year, if there were actual people shooting at these people,
• 38:01
  Speaker 1: we would send people there in a heartbeat.
• 38:02
  Speaker 2: Right. And I think that's what we have to do.
• 38:08
  Speaker 2: But I think that we actually have to have a
• 38:10
  Speaker 2: military response at the southern border. A hundred percent. Because
• 38:13
  Speaker 2: these are such vicious people. And I think local law enforcement,
• 38:17
  Speaker 2: they're telling us they're overwhelmed by some of these guys.
• 38:20
  Speaker 2: And we've got to be willing to send our best people,
• 38:22
  Speaker 2: our best fighters to get control of the southern border.
• 38:25
  Speaker 2: I think that's the most important issue confronting the country. Because, look,
• 38:28
  Speaker 2: I mean, how do you even measure the human cost
• 38:32
  Speaker 2: of 70,000 people, many of them in the prime of
• 38:35
  Speaker 2: their life?
• 38:36
  Speaker 1: And the ripple effect of it too, in their families.
• 38:38
  Speaker 2: The orphans, the parents that are heartbroken. I mean, how
• 38:41
  Speaker 2: many kids are like, this is my story, right? That's
• 38:44
  Speaker 2: why my grandmother raised me is because my mom struggled
• 38:47
  Speaker 2: with addiction. Luckily, my mom got clean. You've got hundreds
• 38:49
  Speaker 2: of thousands of children who are being raised by their
• 38:52
  Speaker 2: grandparents or their aunts and uncles. Like that is an
• 38:54
  Speaker 2: unspeakable human tragedy, man. Especially when we can do better.
• 38:58
  Speaker 2: We could do so much better and we're failing right now.
• 39:01
  Speaker 2: And that's one of the reasons why I'm here. One
• 39:03
  Speaker 2: of the reasons why I'm running. Yeah.
• 39:06
  Speaker 1: Um, what, what, what, what was it like growing up?
• 39:08
  Speaker 1: Like with an alcoholic mother, like, and no judgment against
• 39:11
  Speaker 1: your mother. This is just to look at it. Right.
• 39:13
  Speaker 2: Yeah, sure. I appreciate that. Yeah.
• 39:15
  Speaker 1: What, um, what is that like? Like, is it hard
• 39:17
  Speaker 1: to make a connection with your mom? Like what are
• 39:20
  Speaker 1: some of the side effects of that, uh, on a child?
• 39:23
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I mean, I, I definitely think there's a, um,
• 39:27
  Speaker 2: you get very careful about who you allow yourself to
• 39:29
  Speaker 2: get close. to. That's one big part of it. You're
• 39:32
  Speaker 2: never quite sure whether you can trust the particular situation
• 39:36
  Speaker 2: that you're in. So am I still going to be
• 39:38
  Speaker 2: living in this house three months from now? If I
• 39:40
  Speaker 2: have somebody– if I give somebody my address– because this
• 39:42
  Speaker 2: is back in the 90s, right? People still wrote letters, postcards,
• 39:44
  Speaker 2: things like that, at least a lot more than they
• 39:47
  Speaker 2: do today. If I give somebody my address, are they
• 39:49
  Speaker 2: going to send me a letter? And I'm not even
• 39:50
  Speaker 2: going to live in this place anymore because we moved
• 39:53
  Speaker 2: around a fair amount. But I think that the thing
• 39:59
  Speaker 2: that I took away from it is I very– even
• 40:04
  Speaker 2: as a young kid, I sort of very neatly divided
• 40:06
  Speaker 2: the world into like three categories of people, right? There
• 40:09
  Speaker 2: were the helpless people, the victims, the people who needed
• 40:11
  Speaker 2: to be helped. There were the bad guys who were
• 40:14
  Speaker 2: preying on the victims and then there were the strong
• 40:17
  Speaker 2: people who sort of stood up for everybody else and
• 40:20
  Speaker 2: stood up to the bad guys. That's like– that's overly simplistic.
• 40:26
  Speaker 2: But definitely, I saw my mom growing up very much
• 40:31
  Speaker 2: as this person who was kind of a victim and
• 40:35
  Speaker 2: was being preyed on by bad people, right? And then
• 40:38
  Speaker 2: the person who was sort of looking up for us
• 40:40
  Speaker 2: and standing up for me especially was my grandmother. And
• 40:43
  Speaker 2: I think that attitude of some people are just not
• 40:49
  Speaker 2: as strong as we wish them to be and bad
• 40:52
  Speaker 2: people are going to prey on them. But it's kind
• 40:54
  Speaker 2: of up to– try to make yourself the person who
• 40:57
  Speaker 2: can look out for people, who can protect people. And
• 41:00
  Speaker 2: that's always what I wanted to be. That's one thing
• 41:03
  Speaker 2: I think I took from it.
• 41:04
  Speaker 1: Were you able to be that for your mom, did
• 41:06
  Speaker 1: you feel like?
• 41:06
  Speaker 2: You know, not always, certainly. I mean, when I was
• 41:09
  Speaker 2: a- It's a lot of responsibility for a kid. When
• 41:11
  Speaker 2: I was a teenager, man, I was definitely very, very selfish.
• 41:14
  Speaker 2: I think I got pretty resentful just with the situation.
• 41:16
  Speaker 2: It's like, oh, other people have more money than I do.
• 41:18
  Speaker 2: Other people have more stability than I do. You know,
• 41:20
  Speaker 2: other people, you know, they've got nice cars. We don't
• 41:23
  Speaker 2: have that. So there's definitely like a resentment that comes
• 41:27
  Speaker 2: from it, I think. But, you know, I left high school,
• 41:31
  Speaker 2: enlisted in the Marine Corps, spent four years in the
• 41:34
  Speaker 2: Marine Corps. And I think that what You know, that
• 41:36
  Speaker 2: really did for me was just like gave me a
• 41:39
  Speaker 2: cool perspective. And I probably went into the Marine Corps.
• 41:43
  Speaker 2: I was pretty whiny, pretty resentful kid, was pissed off
• 41:46
  Speaker 2: at my mom, was pissed off at all these other
• 41:48
  Speaker 2: people because I didn't have the things that I thought
• 41:49
  Speaker 2: I should have. And then eventually, yeah, there's me when
• 41:52
  Speaker 2: I was much, much skinnier, much better looking. Oh, yeah.
• 41:55
  Speaker 2: The Marines. That was the original Ozempic. That's right. That's right.
• 41:58
  Speaker 2: That's right.
• 42:01
  Speaker 1: That's bro.
• 42:02
  Speaker 2: That is good. That is good. Marines. The original is epic.
• 42:04
  Speaker 2: I'm going to steal that one. Um, but, but man, yeah,
• 42:09
  Speaker 2: I know. I say this all the time, dude. If
• 42:10
  Speaker 2: I went back to bootcamp for two months, bootcamps, three months,
• 42:13
  Speaker 2: if I went back to bootcamp for two months, I'd
• 42:14
  Speaker 2: come out with a six pack. Yeah. Um, but, but
• 42:17
  Speaker 2: you know, I've, I've anyway, so. Semper fat, dude. Sorry,
• 42:24
  Speaker 2: that was stupid.
• 42:25
  Speaker 1: And I don't even know if you can even joke
• 42:27
  Speaker 1: about Semper Fi and I'm, No offense to any Marines.
• 42:29
  Speaker 2: Not at all. No, I'm sure no Marines took offense
• 42:31
  Speaker 2: to that. Yeah.
• 42:33
  Speaker 1: We've done a lot of shows on military bases and stuff.
• 42:36
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah.
• 42:37
  Speaker 1: It's usually the Army just waiting for the Marines to
• 42:39
  Speaker 1: get there to tell them what to do.
• 42:40
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that's right. That's right. I know the chain of command.
• 42:43
  Speaker 3: Oh, man.
• 42:43
  Speaker 2: But anyway, so we had a– yeah, I think that–
• 42:49
  Speaker 2: the way that I noticed it, I mean, not to
• 42:50
  Speaker 2: get too personal, but like when I– so I met
• 42:54
  Speaker 2: my wife in law school, and it was like– I
• 42:59
  Speaker 2: dated girls in the past, but for her, it was like, oh,
• 43:01
  Speaker 2: my God, this is I'm in love with this girl. Right.
• 43:05
  Speaker 2: Like I'd known her for a week and I was like,
• 43:07
  Speaker 2: I want to marry this girl. Yeah. And there was
• 43:10
  Speaker 2: definitely just an element of like it took a long
• 43:13
  Speaker 2: time for me to get to a place where I
• 43:15
  Speaker 2: was like, oh, I can actually trust this person. I
• 43:18
  Speaker 2: actually rely on this person because that's not really the
• 43:20
  Speaker 2: experience that I had growing up is the people you trusted,
• 43:23
  Speaker 2: trusted the people you relied on. they would just kind
• 43:25
  Speaker 2: of disappear. Yeah. Sometimes through no fault of their own,
• 43:27
  Speaker 2: but sometimes they would just disappear. And so, you know,
• 43:31
  Speaker 2: I don't know if you've said attachment issues and that's,
• 43:35
  Speaker 2: that's something that definitely I think comes from growing up
• 43:37
  Speaker 2: in a pretty tough, pretty chaotic environment. But, you know,
• 43:41
  Speaker 2: the other thing, the flip side of it is, and again,
• 43:43
  Speaker 2: this is, this is what I talk about the Marine
• 43:44
  Speaker 2: Corps is you have for four years in the Marine Corps,
• 43:47
  Speaker 2: you know, like, like one of the best Marines, maybe
• 43:49
  Speaker 2: the best Marine that I served with is this kid
• 43:51
  Speaker 2: who grew up. He was a Puerto Rican guy from
• 43:53
  Speaker 2: the Bronx and, was a drug dealer, was just a
• 43:56
  Speaker 2: rough- Did he wear jewelry or not? Did he wear jewelry?
• 43:59
  Speaker 2: I mean, not with uniform, right?
• 44:00
  Speaker 1: Okay.
• 44:00
  Speaker 2: Because that's, yeah, maybe he did, but by the time he,
• 44:03
  Speaker 2: you know, by the time I met him as a Marine, yeah,
• 44:05
  Speaker 2: he did. But he was like, he had had a
• 44:08
  Speaker 2: much harder life than I had, and there was no bullshit,
• 44:11
  Speaker 2: there was no complaining, no whining. He was just doing
• 44:14
  Speaker 2: his job, and he was a good dude. And you
• 44:17
  Speaker 2: meet a lot of people like that, and you start
• 44:18
  Speaker 2: to realize, like in some ways, you know, not having
• 44:22
  Speaker 2: everything handed to you is actually a blessing- Right. And
• 44:24
  Speaker 2: grown up in a tough circumstance and be able to
• 44:26
  Speaker 2: understand that not everybody's always had it easy. I used
• 44:30
  Speaker 2: to be annoyed by that, kind of complaining about it.
• 44:34
  Speaker 2: Now I sort of see it as like a good thing. Yeah. Right.
• 44:37
  Speaker 2: Because I think I have a different perspective than than
• 44:39
  Speaker 2: a lot of people I spend my life around where.
• 44:42
  Speaker 2: They were born to a rich family. They went to
• 44:44
  Speaker 2: a private school. Everything was kind of laid out for them.
• 44:47
  Speaker 2: It's kind of good to not have everything laid out
• 44:49
  Speaker 2: for you because you have to work for it a
• 44:50
  Speaker 2: little bit more.
• 44:51
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that was going to be my next– my follow-up
• 44:53
  Speaker 1: question to that was just like, yeah, what are the positives?
• 44:56
  Speaker 1: And also so we don't get stuck in like– just
• 44:58
  Speaker 1: in like a– Debbie Downer spiral kind of, you know,
• 45:04
  Speaker 1: because it's okay to talk about stuff, but sometimes, you know,
• 45:07
  Speaker 1: it's like things can get kind of like where you're
• 45:09
  Speaker 1: just looking at the negative things, but there's usually something
• 45:11
  Speaker 1: positive in everything.
• 45:12
  Speaker 2: Exactly right.
• 45:13
  Speaker 1: And yeah, that's what I was thinking. What were some
• 45:15
  Speaker 1: of the positives of having a childhood like that and
• 45:19
  Speaker 1: of being, and I guess it would be some self-reliance.
• 45:23
  Speaker 2: I think it's definitely some self-reliance.
• 45:25
  Speaker 1: Awareness probably, which is probably a curse when you're young
• 45:28
  Speaker 1: because it feels like you have to be kind of
• 45:30
  Speaker 1: scared of stuff, but, or, but when you get older, being,
• 45:33
  Speaker 1: having awareness can be pretty helpful sometimes.
• 45:36
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I've got my head on a swivel, right? I'm
• 45:37
  Speaker 2: always looking around corners. I'm always kind of worried that
• 45:41
  Speaker 2: things that aren't exactly what they seem, but I think
• 45:43
  Speaker 2: that's made me a little less comfortable, which is a
• 45:45
  Speaker 2: good thing, especially in the, in the political life that
• 45:48
  Speaker 2: I'm not with these days. It's good to have your
• 45:50
  Speaker 2: head on a swivel.
• 45:51
  Speaker 1: Hey, now everybody's an alcoholic.
• 45:55
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Everybody has, everybody in politics has a vice that's
• 45:57
  Speaker 2: much worse than alcoholism is the way that I put it. Um,
• 46:01
  Speaker 2: but we, we, um, release the list. Seriously, we need
• 46:07
  Speaker 2: to release the Epstein list. That, that is an important thing. Um,
• 46:10
  Speaker 2: we go down that, that rabbit hole. But anyway, I,
• 46:13
  Speaker 2: I guess the other thing that I gained from it is,
• 46:17
  Speaker 2: you know, I, I think that I'm just much, I
• 46:23
  Speaker 2: see people as people. And one thing I've picked up on,
• 46:27
  Speaker 2: like I went to law school at Yale and, And
• 46:30
  Speaker 2: a lot of my classmates are good people. You're a
• 46:32
  Speaker 2: lawyer also? Yeah, but I sort of– as soon as
• 46:34
  Speaker 2: I went from law school, I went into the business world.
• 46:36
  Speaker 2: So I never really practiced law. I was mostly a
• 46:38
  Speaker 2: business guy. But like a lot of my friends, they
• 46:41
  Speaker 2: look at people as like where did you go to school?
• 46:45
  Speaker 2: What do your parents do? What job do you have?
• 46:48
  Speaker 2: What credential do you have? I've never had that, right?
• 46:52
  Speaker 2: And so when people like talk about politics or policy,
• 46:55
  Speaker 2: they'll be like, oh, well, this person has a PhD.
• 46:57
  Speaker 2: I don't give a shit.
• 46:59
  Speaker 1: They may be smart, but I don't care about– Yeah,
• 47:01
  Speaker 1: PhD is only three– it doesn't even spell anything.
• 47:03
  Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly. I don't even– but I don't care about
• 47:06
  Speaker 2: the letters. But like I meet somebody and, oh, they
• 47:11
  Speaker 2: don't have a fancy degree or they don't have a
• 47:13
  Speaker 2: fancy job. I still just naturally care about what they
• 47:16
  Speaker 2: think because the way that I grew up, I just
• 47:17
  Speaker 2: sort of see people as people. And I think that's
• 47:19
  Speaker 2: just a very– it's a perspective that I'm glad that
• 47:22
  Speaker 2: I have. I think it's very much a product of
• 47:24
  Speaker 2: how I grew up. Yeah, I like people that have
• 47:27
  Speaker 2: their own thing.
• 47:30
  Speaker 1: I don't dislike somebody if they inherited everything, but I
• 47:37
  Speaker 1: gravitate more towards people that haven't had that experience, I think, because, yeah,
• 47:47
  Speaker 1: I don't know. There's just something a little bit more
• 47:49
  Speaker 1: abnormal about it. I didn't like it when things were
• 47:51
  Speaker 1: handed to people. I guess maybe the truth is I
• 47:54
  Speaker 1: got upset when other people had stuff that was handed
• 47:57
  Speaker 1: to them, which probably was just normal stuff to be
• 47:59
  Speaker 1: handed to a kid or to a, to, you know,
• 48:02
  Speaker 1: but that made me like, Oh, screw that. You know,
• 48:05
  Speaker 1: I'll figure this shit out.
• 48:06
  Speaker 2: You know what I'm saying? Fuck them or whatever. You
• 48:09
  Speaker 2: know what I'm saying? I'll, you know, I had that
• 48:11
  Speaker 2: exact attitude when I was like 13, 14. Yeah. Yeah.
• 48:14
  Speaker 1: And some of that is, it's just that rebellion at
• 48:16
  Speaker 1: that age. Um, what would you say? And cause we
• 48:19
  Speaker 1: have a lot of, uh, audience members that, uh, have
• 48:22
  Speaker 1: struggled with addiction or, or, and these days everybody's, you
• 48:26
  Speaker 1: can't even like who doesn't have somebody that's in their
• 48:30
  Speaker 1: family or something that struggle with addiction, but what, what
• 48:33
  Speaker 1: suggestion or like just advice or thoughts would you give to, um,
• 48:39
  Speaker 1: a young person who has a parent who's, uh, who
• 48:44
  Speaker 1: has alcoholism as to how to navigate that? Cause I
• 48:47
  Speaker 1: even get messages a lot from people that are like, Hey,
• 48:50
  Speaker 1: my dad is struggling or this, what do I do?
• 48:52
  Speaker 2: I don't know what to do here. You know?
• 48:54
  Speaker 1: Um, do you have any thoughts on that? And it's
• 48:57
  Speaker 1: not like you're a specialist.
• 48:58
  Speaker 2: I know that. Yeah, I'm not a specialist. I mean,
• 49:01
  Speaker 2: here's what I try to do. I mean, take this
• 49:05
  Speaker 2: for what it's worth. But number one is you got to,
• 49:11
  Speaker 2: if you're a kid and you're in an environment where
• 49:13
  Speaker 2: there's a lot of addiction, you got to make sure
• 49:15
  Speaker 2: that you're taken care of, right? Like, don't get yourself
• 49:20
  Speaker 2: in such a situation where it's not just your parent
• 49:22
  Speaker 2: that is struggling but it becomes you that's struggling too, right?
• 49:25
  Speaker 2: Because you can't help them out. You can't help them
• 49:27
  Speaker 2: out unless you're able to take care of yourself first, right?
• 49:31
  Speaker 2: That's number one. I think number two is as hard
• 49:34
  Speaker 2: as it is, man, and shit, I know this very
• 49:37
  Speaker 2: well because there were times when I had some very
• 49:39
  Speaker 2: angry– moments with my mom, don't get resentful and try
• 49:44
  Speaker 2: to keep your heart as open as possible, right? You
• 49:46
  Speaker 2: got to compartmentalize a little bit, right? There's, yeah, there's
• 49:49
  Speaker 2: the addict version, but then there's the version that, you know,
• 49:53
  Speaker 2: that read you a book when you were a kid,
• 49:54
  Speaker 2: or there's the version that took you to, you know,
• 49:56
  Speaker 2: your favorite movie or try to hold onto the memories
• 50:00
  Speaker 2: that are completely divorced from the addiction. Because I think
• 50:03
  Speaker 2: if you allow yourself to become totally resentful, then it
• 50:07
  Speaker 2: doesn't just affect them. It starts to affect you too, right? Um, don't,
• 50:11
  Speaker 2: don't allow your parents addiction to become something that destroys
• 50:14
  Speaker 2: your life too. In other words, as you've got to
• 50:16
  Speaker 2: kind of, you got to kind of keep your soul
• 50:18
  Speaker 2: intact here. Um, I mean, I just, just practically go
• 50:23
  Speaker 2: to those in a meetings and I learned more about
• 50:26
  Speaker 2: mom and her addiction going to those in a meetings.
• 50:28
  Speaker 2: And I didn't always, you know, it's not like it
• 50:31
  Speaker 2: was like some Eureka moment. Oh, there's, you know, I'm
• 50:33
  Speaker 2: not pissed off at you anymore, but you at least
• 50:35
  Speaker 2: understand it a little bit more. And you gain some
• 50:37
  Speaker 2: appreciation for what's going on in their life because that's a,
• 50:40
  Speaker 2: that's a big part of it. Yeah. And you also
• 50:43
  Speaker 2: think about NA meetings is, is just, again, it is
• 50:46
  Speaker 2: human nature and all of its splendor, its virtue and
• 50:50
  Speaker 2: its vice, man.
• 50:51
  Speaker 1: Oh yeah. The last one I went to, some dude
• 50:53
  Speaker 1: selling a fucking boat at one of them.
• 50:55
  Speaker 2: Exactly.
• 50:56
  Speaker 1: And we're like, you can't do, we're trying to get
• 50:58
  Speaker 1: off of drugs, dude.
• 51:01
  Speaker 2: And yeah.
• 51:01
  Speaker 1: And some guys started bidding on the boat. I'm like,
• 51:03
  Speaker 1: and they had made them take it outside.
• 51:04
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 51:04
  Speaker 1: Because it's outside issues or whatever. But it was like,
• 51:07
  Speaker 1: what is even happening here? Dude, I was in a meeting.
• 51:10
  Speaker 1: Some guy had a fish hook stuck in his freaking cheek, dude.
• 51:13
  Speaker 2: Really? Yeah. Wow. Yeah. Wow. Man. But he had two
• 51:18
  Speaker 2: weeks clean. Yeah. He either had a really bad night
• 51:21
  Speaker 2: or a really good night.
• 51:21
  Speaker 1: Maybe both.
• 51:26
  Speaker 2: Jesus.
• 51:27
  Speaker 1: God dang. It's just like, all right, dude. Catch and release, brother.
• 51:33
  Speaker 1: Catch and release. He probably tried to come across the border.
• 51:35
  Speaker 2: Well, dude.
• 51:39
  Speaker 1: And I only say that because we had a couple
• 51:40
  Speaker 1: of border patrol agents on here. And so we've learned
• 51:42
  Speaker 1: a good bit about it over the years.
• 51:43
  Speaker 2: No, I admit I had a border patrol agent who's,
• 51:46
  Speaker 2: he's clearly before you go.
• 51:49
  Speaker 1: No, but I just, that, that, that, that statement about
• 51:52
  Speaker 1: trying not to be resentful against your parent, because yeah,
• 51:55
  Speaker 1: once you, that resentment is the seed that can lead
• 51:58
  Speaker 1: you down some of this or activate some of the
• 52:01
  Speaker 1: same behaviors in you. It's not, and I'm not preaching that, but,
• 52:06
  Speaker 1: it can activate a lot of, resentment is just, it's
• 52:09
  Speaker 1: an evil seed.
• 52:10
  Speaker 2: No, that's right.
• 52:10
  Speaker 1: And so many bad things can happen there because it's just,
• 52:12
  Speaker 1: that's an important message.
• 52:14
  Speaker 2: I never thought of that or heard it before. Well,
• 52:16
  Speaker 2: and what you said earlier about not getting into a
• 52:18
  Speaker 2: negative spiral, I think is really important. Just psychologically, I mean, look, man,
• 52:22
  Speaker 2: I know you had a tough life in a lot
• 52:24
  Speaker 2: of ways. There are certainly some moments in my life
• 52:27
  Speaker 2: that were pretty tough, but I've never, again, I'm not
• 52:31
  Speaker 2: an expert. I've, you know, I've read some books on
• 52:34
  Speaker 2: this stuff. This is not J.D. Vance's expert opinion. This
• 52:37
  Speaker 2: is just a guy talking is I really worry that
• 52:40
  Speaker 2: a lot of the mental health stuff in 2024 is
• 52:45
  Speaker 2: about like focusing so much on what's bad in your
• 52:49
  Speaker 2: life that you end up wallowing in it and it
• 52:52
  Speaker 2: becomes a sort of self-reinforcing spiral. Like there's only so
• 52:56
  Speaker 2: much you can. I mean, if bad shit has happened
• 52:58
  Speaker 2: to you. There's only so much you can do to
• 53:01
  Speaker 2: think about it and process it. And, you know, sometimes
• 53:03
  Speaker 2: bad shit happens because it just happens.
• 53:06
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 53:07
  Speaker 2: There's no like rationalizing. There's no like thinking through it. And,
• 53:11
  Speaker 2: you know, what I've always found like is most helpful
• 53:14
  Speaker 2: is getting outside and going for a walk. Like that
• 53:17
  Speaker 2: made me feel way better than trying to understand why
• 53:21
  Speaker 2: did mom do this thing when she was 13 or
• 53:23
  Speaker 2: when I was 13 years old and she was, you know,
• 53:25
  Speaker 2: I guess 39. Yeah. uh, 30, 36 would have been
• 53:29
  Speaker 2: when I was 13, but like, why, why? Right. Still
• 53:33
  Speaker 2: harping on it. Yeah.
• 53:35
  Speaker 1: I got to go for some walks then. I mean,
• 53:36
  Speaker 1: I go for them, but still, sometimes you got some ghosts, man, but.
• 53:40
  Speaker 2: I mean, yeah.
• 53:40
  Speaker 1: And I've got ghosts too, man, but it's like, the
• 53:42
  Speaker 1: longer you sit there and look for ghosts, all you,
• 53:45
  Speaker 1: it's still go, you still go.
• 53:46
  Speaker 2: And it's almost like you find more ghosts and you
• 53:49
  Speaker 2: keep on finding them. And then it's like, all right, man,
• 53:51
  Speaker 2: I just, I didn't feel like hanging out with my buddies,
• 53:53
  Speaker 2: go for a walk and have a drink. Well, you know,
• 53:55
  Speaker 2: not if you're, dealing with addiction, but like have a
• 53:59
  Speaker 2: drink of coffee, just like go, you know, go hang
• 54:02
  Speaker 2: out because I really worry that like the constant wallowing
• 54:06
  Speaker 2: is bad for us. Yeah. We've gotten into this.
• 54:08
  Speaker 1: It definitely, you know, a constant into a heavy self-help
• 54:11
  Speaker 1: type of vibe, you know, like every book is a
• 54:14
  Speaker 1: self-help book because self-help is great. But also you're saying the,
• 54:18
  Speaker 1: the other side of that is that you're saying that
• 54:19
  Speaker 1: something's wrong with me.
• 54:21
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 54:22
  Speaker 1: And so if you're always looking for ways to improve yourself,
• 54:25
  Speaker 1: which it can be positive to do that. I've noticed
• 54:27
  Speaker 1: in my own life, it's also a way where you're
• 54:30
  Speaker 1: also kind of saying there's always something wrong with you.
• 54:33
  Speaker 2: That's interesting.
• 54:34
  Speaker 1: So I'm in the same way that I'm always trying
• 54:36
  Speaker 1: to get better. It's like I've obviously created then there's
• 54:43
  Speaker 1: something unachievable because I'm always trying to get better. I've
• 54:46
  Speaker 1: set this impossible course. So really part of me is
• 54:49
  Speaker 1: telling me, oh, there's something wrong with you. So it
• 54:51
  Speaker 1: becomes a little bit more about finding ways to accept myself.
• 54:54
  Speaker 1: You know, you got to balance it, right?
• 54:55
  Speaker 2: You got to balance, like, obviously there's all things we
• 54:57
  Speaker 2: can work on, but you know, it can become a
• 54:59
  Speaker 2: self-defeating cycle of people. And I try to, I try
• 55:02
  Speaker 2: to just balance it. I mean, you know, like I, I, um,
• 55:07
  Speaker 2: like about, about two years ago, uh, at the end
• 55:10
  Speaker 2: of my Senate campaign, I was just like, I had
• 55:13
  Speaker 2: gotten very overweight and it's like, I mean, the campaign
• 55:17
  Speaker 2: is hard on the body. You eat, you know, Chick-fil-A
• 55:19
  Speaker 2: for breakfast, you eat Wendy's for lunch, you eat, you know,
• 55:21
  Speaker 2: Waffle House for dinner, right? After a while, that starts
• 55:24
  Speaker 2: to catch up with you. And, you know, like, I
• 55:28
  Speaker 2: think the self- What'd you get at Waffle House, just
• 55:29
  Speaker 2: so we know it? Oh, man, I'm an All-America special,
• 55:31
  Speaker 2: sub grits for home fries, or hash browns. Yeah, that's... God,
• 55:36
  Speaker 2: I didn't even know they had home fries. Well, they
• 55:38
  Speaker 2: have hash browns. Sorry, they have hash browns, not home fries. Well,
• 55:41
  Speaker 2: they have homeless fries over there, dude. Okay, that second
• 55:49
  Speaker 2: photo from the top, that is the All-America special. But again,
• 55:52
  Speaker 2: I'm not a grits guy. So if you swap out
• 55:54
  Speaker 2: the grits for hash browns, they don't charge you anything. Oh, look, dude. Dude,
• 55:57
  Speaker 2: that is a meal of champions right there. Well, your
• 56:00
  Speaker 2: arteries are paying a high tariff, brother. I'll tell you that. Yes,
• 56:03
  Speaker 2: they are. Yes, they are. But anyway, the point– Do.
• 56:06
  Speaker 1: You get raisin toast or stick with that regular toast?
• 56:08
  Speaker 2: I get regular toast. Yeah, I just put a lot
• 56:10
  Speaker 2: of jam on it. Wow. I'm not a big raisin guy. Yeah.
• 56:12
  Speaker 2: You like raisins?
• 56:14
  Speaker 1: I like– I mean, because I like grapes that have
• 56:15
  Speaker 1: been through something. It's just who I am. So yeah,
• 56:20
  Speaker 1: I guess I do like it.
• 56:22
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I guess I like my grapes, you know, nice
• 56:25
  Speaker 2: and clean. Oh, I like grapes of rat, which are
• 56:29
  Speaker 2: basically raisins. Those are basically raisins. But anyway, I bring
• 56:36
  Speaker 2: that up because it's like you can get into a
• 56:38
  Speaker 2: spiral where it's like, oh, I'm unhealthy and you beat
• 56:41
  Speaker 2: up on yourself about it. But like there's a good
• 56:44
  Speaker 2: balance where you recognize you got to, you know, go
• 56:47
  Speaker 2: for a run every now and then and take care
• 56:49
  Speaker 2: of yourself. And that's what I've tried to do is,
• 56:51
  Speaker 2: you know, just balance the good and the bad. Yeah. Yeah.
• 56:54
  Speaker 2: Life's balanced, man. It's a good point. Yeah. Things aren't
• 56:57
  Speaker 2: going to be exactly. Yeah. Things aren't going to be perfect.
• 57:00
  Speaker 2: You know? Yeah.
• 57:01
  Speaker 1: I always was like, I always, yeah, I created when
• 57:04
  Speaker 1: I was a kid, like I have to be perfect
• 57:05
  Speaker 1: and to be like accepted or whatever, you know?
• 57:08
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 57:08
  Speaker 1: That was like a, that was like a way that
• 57:10
  Speaker 1: I created in my life.
• 57:12
  Speaker 2: I think. Yeah. Like I. Well, what did that look?
• 57:14
  Speaker 2: So give me like, what would you try to be
• 57:16
  Speaker 2: perfect at? Like school or work or, or just like,
• 57:21
  Speaker 2: you know, getting in shape or like what, like what, what,
• 57:23
  Speaker 2: like what's your, if you're trying to get perfect, what
• 57:25
  Speaker 2: are you trying to get perfect at?
• 57:26
  Speaker 1: Well, that's the crazy part is it was almost this
• 57:28
  Speaker 1: blind thing. I never even asked the question, Hey, what
• 57:31
  Speaker 1: am I trying to be perfect at? It was just this,
• 57:34
  Speaker 1: like you, like the only way you're going to be seen,
• 57:39
  Speaker 1: you have to do everything perfect, you know?
• 57:41
  Speaker 2: And then you'll get the, you'll, I don't know.
• 57:45
  Speaker 1: It was just this missing thing inside of myself. I
• 57:47
  Speaker 1: wanted to, I wanted to be seen. So it was like,
• 57:49
  Speaker 1: you have to do it perfect.
• 57:50
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Right.
• 57:51
  Speaker 1: If you, cause if you do it perfect, then there
• 57:53
  Speaker 1: would be no way it wouldn't mathematically make sense that
• 57:57
  Speaker 1: you wouldn't be seen then.
• 57:59
  Speaker 2: Sure.
• 57:59
  Speaker 1: Because that would have to be seen.
• 58:02
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Right.
• 58:03
  Speaker 1: Nobody would not see something that was done perfectly, but,
• 58:07
  Speaker 1: but perfection was, is impossible. And so it was always,
• 58:11
  Speaker 1: I'd always set myself up for this. Like, you'd always
• 58:15
  Speaker 1: come up short no matter what it was. And it
• 58:17
  Speaker 1: could be in anything, something I was presenting at school,
• 58:19
  Speaker 1: the way I was, the way I looked while you
• 58:21
  Speaker 1: were talking to me. It just, everything had to be
• 58:23
  Speaker 1: like this. So it was this constant, like, I just
• 58:27
  Speaker 1: never let my breath go, you know? And then I
• 58:32
  Speaker 1: was always falling short. And so then- That can be
• 58:35
  Speaker 1: a tough way to live, man. Yeah.
• 58:36
  Speaker 2: Oh, it was horrible.
• 58:37
  Speaker 1: And it fulfilled this prophecy in my head. Oh, we
• 58:38
  Speaker 1: fell short. You're not enough. Which, which is what you
• 58:41
  Speaker 1: thought in the beginning anyway.
• 58:43
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 58:43
  Speaker 1: And I'm not saying that now, like now I have
• 58:45
  Speaker 1: different thoughts and feelings, but those were things that I
• 58:48
  Speaker 1: now I'm able to look back and see, oh, that
• 58:49
  Speaker 1: that's how I was operating.
• 58:51
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 58:51
  Speaker 1: And just how, even when I talk about it, it
• 58:54
  Speaker 1: sounds fucking impossibly stressful.
• 58:56
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, it does. I mean, that's, yeah.
• 58:58
  Speaker 1: Did you ever go to ACA meetings or anything like that?
• 59:01
  Speaker 2: ACA meetings. Like adult children of alcoholics. Did you ever
• 59:04
  Speaker 2: go to? No, no. I guess it's interesting. No, I
• 59:06
  Speaker 2: never did. Yeah. Some people don't need it. Yeah. I mean,
• 59:10
  Speaker 2: I think frankly, it probably would have helped me. Would
• 59:12
  Speaker 2: have been useful to go to. We did sometimes like
• 59:15
  Speaker 2: there was one very long-term treatment facility that mom went to.
• 59:20
  Speaker 2: And I guess it was kind of like that because
• 59:22
  Speaker 2: part of that was that we would go to meetings
• 59:24
  Speaker 2: every couple of weeks with all the kids of the
• 59:26
  Speaker 2: people who were in. Oh, that's pretty cool. That may
• 59:28
  Speaker 2: have been an ACA meeting. I just didn't know the
• 59:29
  Speaker 2: name of it, but that was definitely interesting. And again,
• 59:33
  Speaker 2: it's like you go to the meetings with some of
• 59:35
  Speaker 2: these kids and you think your life is tough and
• 59:37
  Speaker 2: you realize, man, there's always somebody who's got it much
• 59:40
  Speaker 2: worse than you do. Yeah. And that's, again, I think
• 59:42
  Speaker 2: that's a good attitude to have because then you feel
• 59:45
  Speaker 2: grateful for what you have. That's another thing, man. Like
• 59:48
  Speaker 2: the feeling of gratitude is so empowering. like if you're
• 59:52
  Speaker 2: just grateful for what you have, you know, like, yeah,
• 59:56
  Speaker 2: you know, you and your wife have an argument, but
• 59:57
  Speaker 2: if you're just grateful for her, for her existence, that's
• 1:00:01
  Speaker 2: such a better attitude. Your kid does something that's annoying
• 1:00:03
  Speaker 2: to you, but I'm just so grateful that I have
• 1:00:05
  Speaker 2: this beautiful little baby that I get to take care of.
• 1:00:07
  Speaker 2: I don't know. The feeling of gratitude, I think is
• 1:00:09
  Speaker 2: a very powerful thing. Yeah.
• 1:00:11
  Speaker 1: I mean, people say that a lot. Um, did, was
• 1:00:14
  Speaker 1: being a parent scary for you?
• 1:00:16
  Speaker 2: Were you scared? Like, absolutely. Yeah. Terrifying to me. Yeah, man. I, um, Yeah,
• 1:00:22
  Speaker 2: I was taught by my childhood that most people really
• 1:00:25
  Speaker 2: screw up parenting. And, you know, it's not just like
• 1:00:30
  Speaker 2: you make a mistake, you get a bad grade, or,
• 1:00:32
  Speaker 2: you know, your boss is pissed off at you. It's
• 1:00:33
  Speaker 2: like you make a mistake, and you're, like, screwing up.
• 1:00:36
  Speaker 1: You get a bad grade, that stays alive. That stays alive, right?
• 1:00:39
  Speaker 1: You're like, damn, this C-plus is having a tough week. Yeah,
• 1:00:41
  Speaker 1: this C-plus is having a really tough week. And, you know, like,
• 1:00:45
  Speaker 1: do you have kids? Mm-mm, I don't have any children yet. So,
• 1:00:48
  Speaker 1: I mean, you just... You just love your kids so much, right?
• 1:00:51
  Speaker 1: I mean, you really think the sun shines out their ass.
• 1:00:53
  Speaker 1: You know, that's kind of how you see children.
• 1:00:55
  Speaker 2: Oh, yeah, like care bears or whatever? That's right. Like
• 1:00:59
  Speaker 2: a care bear, but a living, breathing care bear that
• 1:01:03
  Speaker 2: you have to take care of. And so I was
• 1:01:05
  Speaker 2: just really terrified because, you know, this has certainly gotten
• 1:01:08
  Speaker 2: a lot better. But, you know, I was 27, 28.
• 1:01:12
  Speaker 2: I had like a pretty bad temper. You know, like
• 1:01:14
  Speaker 2: if somebody cut me off, I'd be really pissed off.
• 1:01:17
  Speaker 2: Now I don't drive anymore because I have a Secret
• 1:01:18
  Speaker 2: Service detail, which is probably a good thing. But I,
• 1:01:22
  Speaker 2: you know, like I just think to myself, oh, my God,
• 1:01:24
  Speaker 2: is my kid going to do something bad? And I'm
• 1:01:25
  Speaker 2: going to, you know, fly off the handle like, you know. Oh, yeah,
• 1:01:28
  Speaker 2: I worry about that.
• 1:01:29
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 1:01:30
  Speaker 2: And yeah, I mean, look, certainly kids can be frustrating
• 1:01:33
  Speaker 2: from time to time. But for whatever reason, I think
• 1:01:36
  Speaker 2: it's partially because my wife's so patient. It's in part
• 1:01:38
  Speaker 2: just because I'm older and a little wiser. is, you know,
• 1:01:42
  Speaker 2: it's really worked out. And I've, you know, I've screwed
• 1:01:45
  Speaker 2: up and I've made mistakes as a parent. And certainly
• 1:01:47
  Speaker 2: there are days where you're like, oh man, I can't
• 1:01:48
  Speaker 2: believe that I did this or that. But, you know, one,
• 1:01:52
  Speaker 2: kids are much more resilient than people give them credit for.
• 1:01:56
  Speaker 2: And two, it's just, it's a learning process, man. And
• 1:02:00
  Speaker 2: it's amazing. I mean, kids are so, so crazy. Like
• 1:02:05
  Speaker 2: the difference between our two-year-old and our seven-year-old just in
• 1:02:10
  Speaker 2: personality and what they say. And, you know, kids have
• 1:02:14
  Speaker 2: no filter. Yeah. Right. So like one of the things
• 1:02:16
  Speaker 2: that we call and our, our side of the aisle
• 1:02:18
  Speaker 2: is that we'll like, you know, we'll call the news journalists,
• 1:02:21
  Speaker 2: the corporate media, I call them fake news. Right. You
• 1:02:24
  Speaker 2: gotta be careful about that shit. Cause my kids getting
• 1:02:26
  Speaker 2: on the plane with me, my four year old to
• 1:02:28
  Speaker 2: come to an event, And.
• 1:02:30
  Speaker 1: Somebody gets on the loudspeaker. They're saying where to sit
• 1:02:33
  Speaker 1: or whatever. And he's like, fake news.
• 1:02:35
  Speaker 2: Oh, no. He sees all these people taking photos of
• 1:02:37
  Speaker 2: us and videos. Because I get photographed and video. I'm
• 1:02:41
  Speaker 2: constantly being photographed wherever I go. And he sees these
• 1:02:43
  Speaker 2: people with cameras. He goes, Daddy, is that the fake news?
• 1:02:48
  Speaker 2: And you realize you got to be a little bit
• 1:02:51
  Speaker 2: more careful about what you say. You're like, no, that's grandma.
• 1:02:53
  Speaker 2: Now smile.
• 1:02:54
  Speaker 1: OK, that's just grandma's getting a picture of us.
• 1:02:56
  Speaker 2: That's right. Yeah. Uh, but yeah, I mean, it's, it's,
• 1:03:00
  Speaker 2: it's the most rewarding thing that I've ever done. Uh, it's,
• 1:03:03
  Speaker 2: it's definitely changed my perspective.
• 1:03:04
  Speaker 1: It surprised you as to, as to what it surprised
• 1:03:06
  Speaker 1: you against your fears.
• 1:03:07
  Speaker 2: Kind of. It did. It did. I mean, one, it's
• 1:03:09
  Speaker 2: just not as, it's not as hard, I guess, as
• 1:03:12
  Speaker 2: I thought it would be. Yeah.
• 1:03:13
  Speaker 1: Cause I, that's what I just, yeah, I guess.
• 1:03:14
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:03:14
  Speaker 1: I don't know if I think about it being hard.
• 1:03:16
  Speaker 2: I don't know. It just feels like it would be
• 1:03:17
  Speaker 2: so scary. That's the word that comes into my head, man.
• 1:03:20
  Speaker 2: It is, it is scary, but it's like one of
• 1:03:22
  Speaker 2: those things where you just, you know, you just deal
• 1:03:24
  Speaker 2: with it. Right. And it's kind of good to confront
• 1:03:26
  Speaker 2: that fear. And then you realize it's not as bad.
• 1:03:28
  Speaker 2: I mean, you know, most people will tell you like
• 1:03:30
  Speaker 2: the first kid gets completely babied, right? And you know, you, oh,
• 1:03:35
  Speaker 2: you've got to put hand sanitizer on before you touch,
• 1:03:37
  Speaker 2: touch the baby when they come home from the hospital.
• 1:03:39
  Speaker 2: And by the third kid, you're like, I don't, you know,
• 1:03:42
  Speaker 2: you just played in the mud. Fine. Come up, come
• 1:03:44
  Speaker 2: over here. And, and you realize that kids are, again, they're,
• 1:03:48
  Speaker 2: they're much more resilient than people give them credit for,
• 1:03:51
  Speaker 2: but you also, you just learn a lot about yourself and,
• 1:03:55
  Speaker 2: like the coolest thing, right? Think about my mom. I
• 1:03:56
  Speaker 2: didn't think my mom would be alive when I was
• 1:03:58
  Speaker 2: 40 years old. And now I see her play Pokemon
• 1:04:01
  Speaker 2: with my little seven year old and build a relationship
• 1:04:03
  Speaker 2: with these little kids. And it's just a really, it's
• 1:04:06
  Speaker 2: a really, really rewarding thing.
• 1:04:08
  Speaker 1: I mean, does it feel like a gift that you
• 1:04:09
  Speaker 1: were able to give your mom almost like not you
• 1:04:11
  Speaker 1: were able to give it to her, but that like,
• 1:04:13
  Speaker 1: you know, God gave you this series of events in
• 1:04:15
  Speaker 1: your life where you get to see your mom play
• 1:04:17
  Speaker 1: with this kid. And you're like, man, that almost could
• 1:04:19
  Speaker 1: have been me, but it, it does get to be
• 1:04:21
  Speaker 1: me like in a weird way.
• 1:04:22
  Speaker 2: Like, yeah, that's, that's, that's exactly right. I feel like
• 1:04:24
  Speaker 2: it's a gift that God gave to us where we
• 1:04:26
  Speaker 2: get to have this second chance with mom. Yeah. And
• 1:04:30
  Speaker 2: you know, we get to wouldn't necessarily relied on mom
• 1:04:33
  Speaker 2: when I was 12 or 13 cause she was still,
• 1:04:35
  Speaker 2: you know, still caught up in addiction. But now like
• 1:04:37
  Speaker 2: we'll leave our kids with mom. Wow. Like being able
• 1:04:41
  Speaker 2: to rely on her is just a very, it's a
• 1:04:43
  Speaker 2: very cool thing. You know, my, my, um, My wife,
• 1:04:46
  Speaker 2: I remember when our kids were first born, or for
• 1:04:48
  Speaker 2: all this was born in 2017. And at that point,
• 1:04:51
  Speaker 2: mom had been clean and sober for about a year
• 1:04:53
  Speaker 2: and a half, I guess. And like, I remember talking
• 1:04:56
  Speaker 2: with my wife and she's saying like, I love your mom.
• 1:04:59
  Speaker 2: I hope that she stays clean and sober. But Like,
• 1:05:01
  Speaker 2: we're never letting her babysit. Yeah, it's a little early. Right,
• 1:05:03
  Speaker 2: a little early. A little early. But now, like, we
• 1:05:05
  Speaker 2: trust her with all three of them. Wow. And it's
• 1:05:07
  Speaker 2: an amazing thing, man. Oh, yeah.
• 1:05:09
  Speaker 1: And now with three kids, you'll give them to anybody
• 1:05:11
  Speaker 1: to watch. You know what I'm saying?
• 1:05:13
  Speaker 2: If you got three kids, bro. That's true. That's true.
• 1:05:15
  Speaker 2: Anybody can watch them, dude. Yeah, that's right.
• 1:05:17
  Speaker 1: No, we– But, no, I think that's really cool. I
• 1:05:20
  Speaker 1: could have just imagined– I could imagine, like, you getting
• 1:05:22
  Speaker 1: to see, like, your kids be with your mom in
• 1:05:24
  Speaker 1: this– it just, like– Completing the eight or whatever.
• 1:05:28
  Speaker 2: You know what I'm saying?
• 1:05:29
  Speaker 1: Like that symbol or whatever, you know, infinity symbol or whatever.
• 1:05:32
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah. I can really see that. That's pretty powerful. Yeah.
• 1:05:35
  Speaker 2: It's important.
• 1:05:36
  Speaker 1: That's the power of like things you see through recovery
• 1:05:38
  Speaker 1: and stuff too, you know? It's like that people get
• 1:05:41
  Speaker 1: to just have a different life, you know?
• 1:05:44
  Speaker 2: That's right.
• 1:05:44
  Speaker 1: It's like you witness it all the time in the
• 1:05:47
  Speaker 1: meetings and stuff.
• 1:05:47
  Speaker 2: I do anyway. Yeah, there's something very redemptive about it, man. Yeah,
• 1:05:51
  Speaker 2: if you want to hear a miracle or something, you
• 1:05:52
  Speaker 2: want to see a miracle, go to a meeting. Yeah.
• 1:05:55
  Speaker 2: You know what I'm saying? Seriously. I mean.
• 1:05:57
  Speaker 1: Um, and it very much is like church. It's like,
• 1:05:59
  Speaker 1: sometimes people are like, you don't go to church. Sometimes
• 1:06:02
  Speaker 1: I'm like, dude, I go to four, I go to
• 1:06:04
  Speaker 1: church four times a week at least.
• 1:06:06
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Right.
• 1:06:07
  Speaker 1: I go, I go, it's like that's those meetings. It
• 1:06:10
  Speaker 1: really is. It's like, you get everything you could get
• 1:06:13
  Speaker 1: out of, um, I mean, you witness God's work just
• 1:06:16
  Speaker 1: through other people, you know?
• 1:06:18
  Speaker 2: I mean, much less outside of, uh, possibly in your
• 1:06:21
  Speaker 2: own life.
• 1:06:22
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:06:22
  Speaker 2: And they're the testimonials you hear at meetings. I mean,
• 1:06:25
  Speaker 2: the courage it takes somebody who's been clean for two
• 1:06:28
  Speaker 2: days to walk in. And bid on a boat. And
• 1:06:32
  Speaker 2: bid on a boat. Yeah. Or to sell a boat. Like, hey,
• 1:06:36
  Speaker 2: I've got. No, I'm joking. I didn't mean to interrupt
• 1:06:40
  Speaker 2: you there. I got rid of my cocaine and now
• 1:06:42
  Speaker 2: I've got a boat. You want to buy it? Oh, man.
• 1:06:45
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  Speaker 3: To every elected official and politician in America, the people
• 1:09:18
  Speaker 3: stand united desperate for you to listen. If you're not
• 1:09:22
  Speaker 3: advocating for prices and transparency in healthcare, you are compromising
• 1:09:28
  Speaker 3: every single American across this country. Because when we can't
• 1:09:32
  Speaker 3: see prices, hospitals, insurance, and their middlemen charge us whatever
• 1:09:38
  Speaker 3: they want. Our very own healthcare system is robbing all
• 1:09:43
  Speaker 3: of us. We just need the prices. That's how our
• 1:09:48
  Speaker 3: economy works. If you want to do right by workers, employers,
• 1:09:54
  Speaker 3: and unions, then you've got to do right by the
• 1:09:57
  Speaker 3: people they represent and the families who depend upon them.
• 1:10:01
  Speaker 2: And we've got to hear it.
• 1:10:03
  Speaker 1: Price is now.
• 1:10:04
  Speaker 2: Power to the patients.
• 1:10:14
  Speaker 1: Oh, dude, did you ever listen to Jelly Roll?
• 1:10:18
  Speaker 2: It's funny. I met Jelly Roll at the United States Senate. Really?
• 1:10:23
  Speaker 2: Because I'm with the Banking Committee. He came and gave.
• 1:10:25
  Speaker 1: And what was he trying to get pardoned for something?
• 1:10:27
  Speaker 2: No. No. I don't think so, at least. But he was...
• 1:10:30
  Speaker 2: He did a... Like, he was a witness at a
• 1:10:34
  Speaker 2: hearing of the Senate Banking Committee. Oh, I think I
• 1:10:37
  Speaker 2: saw that on C-SPAN or something. And that was a joke, Jelly.
• 1:10:40
  Speaker 2: He knows it was. He was... He was really good.
• 1:10:43
  Speaker 2: I talked to him briefly. I'm sure he doesn't remember.
• 1:10:46
  Speaker 2: He does remember. But I thought a... I thought he
• 1:10:49
  Speaker 2: gave like some very interesting testimony. He talked about the
• 1:10:53
  Speaker 2: fentanyl issue a little bit. I want to say he
• 1:10:54
  Speaker 2: maybe talked about homelessness a little bit, but I remember
• 1:10:58
  Speaker 2: him talking about fentanyl and yeah, I mean, he's got
• 1:11:01
  Speaker 2: an amazing life. I mean, talk about a guy who
• 1:11:02
  Speaker 2: had a much tougher life than I did. That's jelly roll. Yeah.
• 1:11:06
  Speaker 2: That's a great point. Yeah.
• 1:11:07
  Speaker 1: Yeah. He's a magic man. When you, and when you
• 1:11:09
  Speaker 1: talk to him, it's just like watching pure. It's just genuine.
• 1:11:14
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:11:15
  Speaker 1: That's what it is. It's like a, It's like clean water.
• 1:11:18
  Speaker 1: It's like what we used to have in a lot
• 1:11:20
  Speaker 1: of our rivers. It's like that's what he is. He's
• 1:11:24
  Speaker 1: just genuine. He's a genuine human being. He'll tear up
• 1:11:27
  Speaker 1: at anything. It's just because what's in him is just real.
• 1:11:31
  Speaker 1: He's a genuine guy. That actually leads me pretty good
• 1:11:34
  Speaker 1: into this next part I want to talk about. Some
• 1:11:36
  Speaker 1: stuff I wrote down because I wanted to be clear,
• 1:11:40
  Speaker 1: and this is important. You're from a region that was
• 1:11:45
  Speaker 1: firsthand devastated by the money lizard Sackler family.
• 1:11:48
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 1:11:49
  Speaker 1: Um, which like, uh, you know, which Purdue pharma and,
• 1:11:55
  Speaker 1: and everything that happened with Oxycontin, like over 500,000 people, um,
• 1:11:59
  Speaker 1: died at the hands of them.
• 1:12:00
  Speaker 2: Yeah. And, um, big, big problem. Yeah. Unbelievable.
• 1:12:04
  Speaker 1: Right. And it compromised like, you know, they use loopholes,
• 1:12:07
  Speaker 1: all types of stuff to, uh, to be able to
• 1:12:10
  Speaker 1: keep that company going.
• 1:12:11
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 1:12:11
  Speaker 1: And really to keep killing people. I mean, it seemed
• 1:12:14
  Speaker 1: undeniable at a certain point that, they were murderers.
• 1:12:18
  Speaker 2: It was legalized drug dealing is what it was on
• 1:12:20
  Speaker 2: an industrial scale. I mean, made billions and billions of dollars.
• 1:12:24
  Speaker 1: They just got like a slap on the, like they
• 1:12:26
  Speaker 1: got a financial slap on the wrist. Right.
• 1:12:28
  Speaker 2: Very tiny.
• 1:12:28
  Speaker 1: But why, why can't we, shouldn't they be kicked out
• 1:12:32
  Speaker 1: of our country? It feels like, like if we can
• 1:12:34
  Speaker 1: let in 20 million people in our country, right.
• 1:12:38
  Speaker 2: That shouldn't be here. Yeah.
• 1:12:39
  Speaker 1: Or that are not like vetted properly to be here.
• 1:12:43
  Speaker 2: Legal right to be here. Right. I agree. I would
• 1:12:45
  Speaker 2: say they shouldn't be here, but.
• 1:12:46
  Speaker 1: Why can't we put those motherfuckers on a boat and
• 1:12:49
  Speaker 1: send them back to wherever the fuck they came from?
• 1:12:52
  Speaker 2: That's a good question, man. Look, I think that, frankly— And.
• 1:12:56
  Speaker 1: I don't mean that angrily at you, but it's like— No, man.
• 1:12:59
  Speaker 2: I'm pissed off about it, too.
• 1:13:00
  Speaker 1: Like, at what point do people lose the opportunity to
• 1:13:03
  Speaker 1: be here? It seemed like if you killed— 500,000 people,
• 1:13:07
  Speaker 1: you wouldn't be able to hang out anymore.
• 1:13:10
  Speaker 2: Or maybe at least you should have a criminal investigation, right?
• 1:13:13
  Speaker 2: Because that's the thing that's always, I've always, I mean,
• 1:13:16
  Speaker 2: like the Sackler family clearly got rich off of an
• 1:13:21
  Speaker 2: extraordinary amount of human misery and death. Where are they from?
• 1:13:24
  Speaker 2: Bring it up real quick. I want to say they're
• 1:13:26
  Speaker 2: from New York maybe, or they're from the Northeast. I'm
• 1:13:29
  Speaker 2: pretty sure.
• 1:13:31
  Speaker 1: The Sackler family originated from Galacia in Poland, and their
• 1:13:34
  Speaker 1: ancestors were Jewish immigrants. Isaac Sackler.
• 1:13:37
  Speaker 2: Brooklyn, New York. Oh, and then they lived in Brooklyn,
• 1:13:39
  Speaker 2: New York. That's why I thought they were from New
• 1:13:40
  Speaker 2: York or Connecticut. I mean, look, the thing that I've
• 1:13:44
  Speaker 2: never understood about them is that they did get fined,
• 1:13:46
  Speaker 2: but the fine was such a tiny amount. It was
• 1:13:48
  Speaker 2: a couple billion bucks or something, right? But they made
• 1:13:50
  Speaker 2: tens and tens of billions of dollars. And these guys
• 1:13:52
  Speaker 2: were absolutely rolling in the dough. But they, like, why
• 1:13:58
  Speaker 2: isn't there a criminal investigation into this? Right. Like if
• 1:14:03
  Speaker 2: I sold drugs on the street and some person has
• 1:14:06
  Speaker 2: an overdose and died, like you can get felony prosecuted
• 1:14:09
  Speaker 2: for that or at least investigated for it. And there
• 1:14:12
  Speaker 2: was never a criminal, at least as I understand it,
• 1:14:14
  Speaker 2: never a criminal investigation into what was known.
• 1:14:17
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I think they had breached a plea deal of
• 1:14:19
  Speaker 1: some sort.
• 1:14:20
  Speaker 2: OK.
• 1:14:21
  Speaker 1: As the nation continues to grapple with that, the Sackler
• 1:14:23
  Speaker 1: family had agreed to pay $ 6 billion to families and
• 1:14:26
  Speaker 1: states as part of an agreement to wind down Purdue Pharma.
• 1:14:30
  Speaker 1: the maker of Oxycontin in exchange of saccharin would be
• 1:14:32
  Speaker 1: immunized from future civil liability claims.
• 1:14:35
  Speaker 2: Unreal. Because here's my understanding about it. And by the way,
• 1:14:38
  Speaker 2: I think that like, you always got to be worried
• 1:14:40
  Speaker 2: about this stuff when you're the child of addiction is like,
• 1:14:43
  Speaker 2: are there, whether it's drugs, alcohol, whatever, you got to be,
• 1:14:46
  Speaker 2: you kind of, you're worried about making sure you do
• 1:14:48
  Speaker 2: yourself don't get hooked on anything, right? Like I had
• 1:14:51
  Speaker 2: a minor surgery once and like a very minor surgery
• 1:14:54
  Speaker 2: and I was prescribed Oxycontin and I took it for like,
• 1:14:58
  Speaker 2: you know, 12 hours. Got any left? Sorry. No, because
• 1:15:02
  Speaker 2: of my wife, because of what I'm about to tell you. Okay.
• 1:15:04
  Speaker 2: And my wife, who was like giving me my meds,
• 1:15:07
  Speaker 2: she was like, hey, are you ready for your next dose?
• 1:15:09
  Speaker 2: And I was like, yeah, you know, the pain's not
• 1:15:10
  Speaker 2: really that bad anymore. I don't really want to take one.
• 1:15:13
  Speaker 2: But yeah, just give me one because I feel really
• 1:15:14
  Speaker 2: good when I take it. And then she and I
• 1:15:16
  Speaker 2: both had this like moment of realization, like, oh, shit, right?
• 1:15:20
  Speaker 2: That is where this whole thing starts. Wow. Because she,
• 1:15:22
  Speaker 2: you know, took it to wherever some disposal site and
• 1:15:24
  Speaker 2: we got rid of it and that was it. But
• 1:15:26
  Speaker 2: the problem with OxyContin, as I understand it at least,
• 1:15:30
  Speaker 2: is that it's supposed to be delayed release oxycodone. But,
• 1:15:35
  Speaker 2: you know, the problem is people figure it out if
• 1:15:39
  Speaker 2: you just crush it up. Yeah. Then you can just
• 1:15:41
  Speaker 2: get it all at once.
• 1:15:42
  Speaker 1: All released right now. All released right now.
• 1:15:44
  Speaker 2: And then the Sackler family, as I understand it, knew
• 1:15:47
  Speaker 2: about it, right? Purdue Pharma knew this was going on
• 1:15:50
  Speaker 2: and they should have been like, oh, no, no, okay,
• 1:15:52
  Speaker 2: we're going to stop this because people are getting killed.
• 1:15:55
  Speaker 2: by overdosing all this stuff because they're taking too high
• 1:15:57
  Speaker 2: of a dose and they didn't do anything. Yeah. Like that,
• 1:15:59
  Speaker 2: that is my understanding fundamentally of what happened is, is
• 1:16:02
  Speaker 2: they didn't want to stop it because they were getting
• 1:16:03
  Speaker 2: rich from it. Oh yeah. It's man, it's, it's really gross.
• 1:16:06
  Speaker 1: I just couldn't imagine that. Imagine people dying and you're
• 1:16:09
  Speaker 1: making money, but they're dying. People are dying. Family, the
• 1:16:11
  Speaker 1: ripple effect of that in this country is still, it's
• 1:16:14
  Speaker 1: still haunting people.
• 1:16:16
  Speaker 2: Absolutely. And that's where the heroin epidemic, which is now
• 1:16:18
  Speaker 2: a fentanyl epidemic came from. It started there as a
• 1:16:21
  Speaker 2: pill epidemic.
• 1:16:22
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:16:22
  Speaker 2: And it actually was like, I always used to think
• 1:16:24
  Speaker 2: it was okay. kind of like me, like, oh, you
• 1:16:26
  Speaker 2: have a surgery and you get too many drugs and
• 1:16:28
  Speaker 2: then eventually you get hooked. What it actually was is
• 1:16:31
  Speaker 2: they were overprescribing it so much that it was just everywhere, right?
• 1:16:35
  Speaker 2: And so like, oh, you know, your nephew comes over
• 1:16:38
  Speaker 2: and he's 17 and he takes some to his buddies
• 1:16:40
  Speaker 2: and now they're all hooked on Oxy. And that's like,
• 1:16:43
  Speaker 2: that's what actually happened. And there was just so much
• 1:16:46
  Speaker 2: of this drug everywhere that it started the epidemic we
• 1:16:49
  Speaker 2: have now. Yeah.
• 1:16:51
  Speaker 1: And the outside, it was like candy coat. It was like,
• 1:16:53
  Speaker 1: you just had to slurp off the outside a little bit.
• 1:16:56
  Speaker 1: And then you could party.
• 1:16:57
  Speaker 2: Oh, I didn't realize that. Yeah.
• 1:16:59
  Speaker 1: I think you just had to slow.
• 1:17:00
  Speaker 2: I heard about people crushing. I didn't know if you
• 1:17:02
  Speaker 2: just had to slurp off the outside. Yeah, I think
• 1:17:04
  Speaker 2: you did. And yeah. Yeah. And yeah.
• 1:17:09
  Speaker 1: And one of the worst things about it was that
• 1:17:11
  Speaker 1: like medicine used to be a term that was like,
• 1:17:13
  Speaker 1: it was for help.
• 1:17:14
  Speaker 2: Right. Yes.
• 1:17:15
  Speaker 1: It was like, and it was in our brains, I
• 1:17:17
  Speaker 1: think as, as humans and citizens in our society and culture,
• 1:17:22
  Speaker 1: medicine was help.
• 1:17:23
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 1:17:23
  Speaker 1: Yes. And that, that whole thing with them kind of
• 1:17:28
  Speaker 1: tripped that word where it made it, it made people
• 1:17:31
  Speaker 1: question the value of medicine.
• 1:17:33
  Speaker 2: It made people.
• 1:17:35
  Speaker 1: Just question then who's prescribing the medicine. It made health,
• 1:17:40
  Speaker 1: it made like your doctors seem untrustworthy. It just, it
• 1:17:46
  Speaker 1: ruined so much trust.
• 1:17:48
  Speaker 2: That's absolutely right. Ruined a lot of social trust. And
• 1:17:51
  Speaker 2: I agree. I think they deserve a ton of blame
• 1:17:54
  Speaker 2: for that. And it's interesting though, that was maybe the
• 1:17:59
  Speaker 2: first point, the oxy epidemic was sort of the first
• 1:18:03
  Speaker 2: point where I started to question like the mainstream big
• 1:18:07
  Speaker 2: pharma narrative a little bit. And I always ask myself,
• 1:18:10
  Speaker 2: and I think this is something, you know, like I'm Republican,
• 1:18:12
  Speaker 2: I'm conservative, but one of the things that I think
• 1:18:14
  Speaker 2: the old left was pretty smart about is like recognizing that,
• 1:18:20
  Speaker 2: you know, when money gets involved, when the profit motive
• 1:18:23
  Speaker 2: gets involved in health, That can lead to good things, right?
• 1:18:27
  Speaker 2: It can lead to people trying to cure cancer because
• 1:18:30
  Speaker 2: they know they're going to make a lot of money
• 1:18:31
  Speaker 2: if they cure cancer. I'm fine with that, right? Put
• 1:18:32
  Speaker 2: people making money if they cure cancer. That's a great thing.
• 1:18:35
  Speaker 2: But then also sometimes it can lead to manipulation of
• 1:18:39
  Speaker 2: the health system that doesn't actually benefit people's health but
• 1:18:42
  Speaker 2: does get people hooked on a lot of drugs that
• 1:18:44
  Speaker 2: they wouldn't otherwise need. And this was something, again, the
• 1:18:47
  Speaker 2: old left understood this, that like, well, you got to
• 1:18:50
  Speaker 2: be careful. Like, are we prescribing this medication because it's
• 1:18:53
  Speaker 2: good for people? Because that's good. Or are we prescribing
• 1:18:56
  Speaker 2: it because some big pharmaceutical company is getting rich if
• 1:18:59
  Speaker 2: we do, and they're putting pressure on the government or
• 1:19:02
  Speaker 2: somebody else to encourage us to prescribe this medication? And
• 1:19:05
  Speaker 2: I think there are a whole host of ways in which,
• 1:19:07
  Speaker 2: you know, frankly... The old left was right about that
• 1:19:11
  Speaker 2: and I've tried to persuade modern conservatives that we should
• 1:19:16
  Speaker 2: be more concerned about that issue. It's like Bobby Kennedy
• 1:19:19
  Speaker 2: makes this point all the time, right? Like good. Some
• 1:19:21
  Speaker 2: pharmaceuticals are good for us, but some actually it's not
• 1:19:23
  Speaker 2: totally clear whether we're taking them just because it makes
• 1:19:26
  Speaker 2: people money. And this is– let me give you a
• 1:19:29
  Speaker 2: concrete example, right? So there's obviously this big like debate
• 1:19:34
  Speaker 2: about transgender issues and you don't have to wade into that.
• 1:19:38
  Speaker 2: But what really worries me is when you've got pharmaceutical
• 1:19:43
  Speaker 2: companies that are making billions of dollars on hormonal therapies
• 1:19:47
  Speaker 2: for kids, and are we really being smart about whether
• 1:19:51
  Speaker 2: this is good for the kids, about whether it causes
• 1:19:54
  Speaker 2: long-term consequences, and Why is nobody saying, well, wait a second,
• 1:19:58
  Speaker 2: the people who are lobbying us to give these drugs
• 1:20:00
  Speaker 2: to kids are also getting rich off of it, right?
• 1:20:03
  Speaker 2: And I just, I worry about that. I mean, you
• 1:20:05
  Speaker 2: need to follow the money motive. Yeah, man.
• 1:20:07
  Speaker 1: It definitely, of course they would want that because it's
• 1:20:08
  Speaker 1: just another way. It's like, well, how do we split
• 1:20:11
  Speaker 1: the atom here again to make even more money off
• 1:20:14
  Speaker 1: of somebody? Well, why not your gender? You know what
• 1:20:16
  Speaker 1: I'm saying? You're not using it. You know, you're like,
• 1:20:18
  Speaker 1: what do you mean? I'm not using my gender. Like
• 1:20:20
  Speaker 1: I'm trying, I'm trying to, I'm still developing it. You
• 1:20:24
  Speaker 1: know what I'm saying? But I agree. It's like a
• 1:20:28
  Speaker 1: couple of my buddies secretly low-key date trans people, right?
• 1:20:31
  Speaker 1: And I don't care if somebody's trans or Neapolitan or whatever.
• 1:20:35
  Speaker 1: I don't care.
• 1:20:36
  Speaker 2: You know what I'm saying?
• 1:20:37
  Speaker 1: Hell, if I had a vagina, I probably wouldn't go
• 1:20:39
  Speaker 1: looking for women, you know? So there's probably some up
• 1:20:43
  Speaker 1: to it. But what I'm talking about is– Shit, I
• 1:20:47
  Speaker 1: don't know.
• 1:20:48
  Speaker 2: What I'm talking about. Look, man, if you're an adult.
• 1:20:51
  Speaker 1: But look where the money... Follow the money. When we're
• 1:20:54
  Speaker 1: talking about kids, follow the money. Think about what's going on. Like,
• 1:20:57
  Speaker 1: are the people pushing this? What is their real... Or
• 1:21:01
  Speaker 1: do they have some other motive? You have to think
• 1:21:03
  Speaker 1: about that, you know?
• 1:21:04
  Speaker 2: Well, that's why, I mean, like you mentioned Ozempic earlier, which...
• 1:21:09
  Speaker 2: A couple of friends have taken it. I've never taken
• 1:21:11
  Speaker 2: an ozimbic or any weight loss kind of drug.
• 1:21:14
  Speaker 1: It ended up having a black market. There was somebody
• 1:21:16
  Speaker 1: selling it outside of a Vineyard Vines illegally or something
• 1:21:19
  Speaker 1: over there outside of Charlottesville.
• 1:21:20
  Speaker 2: Outside of Vineyard Vines? It breaks my heart. That's the
• 1:21:23
  Speaker 2: perfect encapsulation. It breaks my heart, yeah. Vineyard Vines selling ozimbic.
• 1:21:28
  Speaker 2: Somebody said she was a Cappadelt. Oh, my God. But
• 1:21:31
  Speaker 2: it's just that kind of stuff. It shakes me to
• 1:21:35
  Speaker 2: my core, J.D. Oh, that's really, that's dark shit, man.
• 1:21:38
  Speaker 2: That's dark. That's darker than a lot of what goes
• 1:21:41
  Speaker 2: on in politics. A cap of Delta selling Ozempic black
• 1:21:45
  Speaker 2: market off out of the side of vineyard vines. I'm
• 1:21:47
  Speaker 2: going to have nightmares. They call it faux Zempic. But I,
• 1:21:51
  Speaker 2: you know, I like worry. Okay. So America has a
• 1:21:53
  Speaker 2: terrible obesity problem. Okay. And I'm not, look, I'm not
• 1:21:56
  Speaker 2: a doctor. I'm not telling if your doctor tells you
• 1:21:58
  Speaker 2: to take Ozempic, follow your doctor's advice. Not, you know,
• 1:22:01
  Speaker 2: what you're hearing from me on a podcast.
• 1:22:02
  Speaker 1: I don't mind it a little, you know.
• 1:22:06
  Speaker 2: What I worry about is, okay, you know, you create
• 1:22:10
  Speaker 2: a problem and then you medicate to solve the problem
• 1:22:13
  Speaker 2: instead of like maybe solving the underlying problem, right? Like,
• 1:22:17
  Speaker 2: why don't we try to understand why it is that
• 1:22:19
  Speaker 2: we have a terrible obesity epidemic rather than just giving
• 1:22:22
  Speaker 2: people another pill to pop?
• 1:22:24
  Speaker 1: Well, it's also, we get used to that then after
• 1:22:25
  Speaker 1: a while, and then it's hard to put the toothpaste
• 1:22:27
  Speaker 1: back in the tooth.
• 1:22:28
  Speaker 2: That's exactly right.
• 1:22:28
  Speaker 1: That's one of the tough, that's one of the, and
• 1:22:30
  Speaker 1: that's more of like a kind of a bigger look
• 1:22:32
  Speaker 1: at that.
• 1:22:32
  Speaker 2: Like, um, Yeah.
• 1:22:34
  Speaker 1: It's like how much personal responsibility it's like, that's something
• 1:22:39
  Speaker 1: I struggle with. Sometimes my brother and I talk about
• 1:22:41
  Speaker 1: this sometimes, like, you know, people have problems and specifically
• 1:22:46
  Speaker 1: even like thinking about the Oxycontin thing, like they created
• 1:22:48
  Speaker 1: a medicine that was so strong that even your ability,
• 1:22:54
  Speaker 1: your God given ability to be able to battle against it,
• 1:22:58
  Speaker 1: like you'd be in AA rooms and you'd see people
• 1:23:01
  Speaker 1: that came in from opioid and it was something different
• 1:23:03
  Speaker 1: than alcoholism.
• 1:23:04
  Speaker 2: Exactly right.
• 1:23:05
  Speaker 1: It wasn't alcohol. It wasn't, it was addiction, but it
• 1:23:07
  Speaker 1: was something different. It was like, that's right. These people, it's,
• 1:23:10
  Speaker 1: it's zombied these people. It's like, it's like they created this, um,
• 1:23:15
  Speaker 1: this skip card in Uno or something. It was like,
• 1:23:18
  Speaker 1: so at that point, like, um, shit, what are we
• 1:23:21
  Speaker 1: talking about?
• 1:23:21
  Speaker 2: I had a good idea. Talking about, opioids, the effect
• 1:23:26
  Speaker 2: it has on people's brains, pharmaceutical companies making money from...
• 1:23:30
  Speaker 2: We're talking about Ozempic, putting the toothpaste back in the tube. Right, right. Oh,
• 1:23:34
  Speaker 2: personal responsibility. Yeah. Yes, okay. You were almost there. Sorry.
• 1:23:37
  Speaker 2: You helped me.
• 1:23:38
  Speaker 1: You laid all the breadcrumbs, dude. That's good, man.
• 1:23:41
  Speaker 2: So... But yeah... I'm here to help, man. As your
• 1:23:44
  Speaker 2: next vice president, I'll live to serve however I can.
• 1:23:48
  Speaker 1: You just helped me right there. But yeah, it's like...
• 1:23:52
  Speaker 1: But then they created something that was so powerful, it
• 1:23:54
  Speaker 1: kind of exceeded our ability, our natural ability to be
• 1:23:57
  Speaker 1: able to fight against it.
• 1:23:58
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 1:23:58
  Speaker 1: So at that point, personal responsibility kind of isn't it's
• 1:24:05
  Speaker 1: it's still there, but it's not exactly fair because you're
• 1:24:08
  Speaker 1: allowing a company to create something that you can't naturally
• 1:24:13
  Speaker 1: compete against.
• 1:24:14
  Speaker 2: It turns you into a zombie, man. Yeah.
• 1:24:16
  Speaker 1: I mean, it really took so long. My brain.
• 1:24:19
  Speaker 2: No, it's, it's, I know exactly what you mean. And it's, it's, it's,
• 1:24:23
  Speaker 2: it's like one thing to sort of take a pill.
• 1:24:25
  Speaker 2: So your pain goes away or you take a pill.
• 1:24:27
  Speaker 2: Cause you know, you've got a lung infection, lung infection
• 1:24:29
  Speaker 2: goes away or like whatever, when something can so fundamentally
• 1:24:33
  Speaker 2: transform your personality and your sense of, you know, ambition
• 1:24:38
  Speaker 2: and reward, like, what are you, what are you going after? It's, it's, yeah,
• 1:24:41
  Speaker 2: it's not a medicine. It's very, it's very, very weird. Um,
• 1:24:44
  Speaker 2: like that's the thing. It's not a medicine. That is
• 1:24:46
  Speaker 2: a drug. Yeah. And I, I mean, my, my mom,
• 1:24:49
  Speaker 2: like to her great credit, man, I don't know how
• 1:24:51
  Speaker 2: she does this because like, look, there are some things
• 1:24:53
  Speaker 2: where you really do need a strong pain medication. Right.
• 1:24:56
  Speaker 2: And I forget something that happened a couple of years
• 1:24:58
  Speaker 2: ago where they were like, you know, maybe she had
• 1:25:01
  Speaker 2: some infection, but they really wanted to give her Oxy.
• 1:25:05
  Speaker 2: And she was just like, no, I refuse to take it.
• 1:25:07
  Speaker 2: So she, for a couple of days, I mean, she
• 1:25:08
  Speaker 2: was in agonizing pain, but she just took Advil, took Tylenol.
• 1:25:13
  Speaker 2: And she was fine. Yeah. And she persevered through it.
• 1:25:16
  Speaker 2: But man, you're right. The stuff, it's just, yeah. It's
• 1:25:20
  Speaker 2: like it changes not just your personality, but it changes
• 1:25:24
  Speaker 2: whether you can take care of yourself and other people, right?
• 1:25:27
  Speaker 2: Like for most normal people, there's this thing where it's like, oh,
• 1:25:30
  Speaker 2: oh crap. I'm not taking care of my kids. My
• 1:25:33
  Speaker 2: kids need me. I got to change something, right? But
• 1:25:36
  Speaker 2: if you're on opioids, it's like it flips a switch
• 1:25:39
  Speaker 2: off where, yeah, I'm not taking care of my kids,
• 1:25:42
  Speaker 2: but maybe I don't give a shit because the drugs
• 1:25:44
  Speaker 2: have so affected my brain.
• 1:25:46
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:25:47
  Speaker 2: I think that's it, man.
• 1:25:48
  Speaker 1: Um, and with that, so staying in the hell in
• 1:25:52
  Speaker 1: like medical and healthcare thoughts. Yeah. Um, one of the major,
• 1:25:56
  Speaker 1: and I wrote this down so I could say it
• 1:25:57
  Speaker 1: clearly and to just save everybody time was listening. Um,
• 1:26:01
  Speaker 1: one of the major bipartisan issues that's plaguing Americans is
• 1:26:04
  Speaker 1: the healthcare system, which has become, um, outrageously expensive, right?
• 1:26:08
  Speaker 2: Sure.
• 1:26:09
  Speaker 1: It's unaffordable. It's inaccessible by millions of Americans. We're overpaying
• 1:26:14
  Speaker 1: hospitals and insurance companies that hide their prices and they
• 1:26:18
  Speaker 1: charge us whatever they want. Patients overpay, workers overpay, companies overpay,
• 1:26:24
  Speaker 1: the taxpayers overpay. On this podcast, Bernie Sanders came on
• 1:26:28
  Speaker 1: and he stressed the need for a healthcare price transparency.
• 1:26:32
  Speaker 1: Donald Trump did the same thing. He had an executive order.
• 1:26:36
  Speaker 1: I think it's still in place that demands price transparency.
• 1:26:40
  Speaker 1: Mark Cuban stressed the need for healthcare price transparency. How
• 1:26:44
  Speaker 1: do we not have real prices and transparency in healthcare
• 1:26:47
  Speaker 1: knowing that it's exactly what America needs so that our
• 1:26:50
  Speaker 1: healthcare system will be honest and affordable and accessible?
• 1:26:55
  Speaker 2: Well, you're right that we should have it. And the
• 1:26:58
  Speaker 2: reason that we don't is unfortunately, because there are a
• 1:27:00
  Speaker 2: lot of powerful people who get rich off of keeping
• 1:27:02
  Speaker 2: these things secret. And so they don't want transparency. They
• 1:27:06
  Speaker 2: don't want sunshine. You can say Chuck Schumer if you want.
• 1:27:10
  Speaker 2: I won't say that. Well, I mean, look, you're right, though. Obviously,
• 1:27:12
  Speaker 2: Bernie and I are on the same team politically. But
• 1:27:15
  Speaker 2: there are some health care things like price transparency where
• 1:27:17
  Speaker 2: actually I think he and President Trump are both right
• 1:27:19
  Speaker 2: that there's nothing that– I mean, you go to Starbucks, right?
• 1:27:22
  Speaker 2: You buy coffee. You know how much you're getting. You
• 1:27:24
  Speaker 2: know how much it's costing you. I remember when my
• 1:27:29
  Speaker 2: wife– I think it was her second baby where– you know,
• 1:27:33
  Speaker 2: you get like pain medications because when you're delivering a baby,
• 1:27:35
  Speaker 2: at least most people do, because it's like a very
• 1:27:37
  Speaker 2: painful experience. And there was some weird thing where the
• 1:27:41
  Speaker 2: doctor that she chose was out of network and she
• 1:27:45
  Speaker 2: didn't really, I mean, you know, you're not checking whether
• 1:27:47
  Speaker 2: the doctor's in network at the time, right? You just
• 1:27:49
  Speaker 2: sort of choosing a doctor. And then we come home
• 1:27:51
  Speaker 2: and we have like a $ 15, 000 unexpected bill because she
• 1:27:55
  Speaker 2: chose the wrong doctor an hour before she delivers a
• 1:27:58
  Speaker 2: baby and And it's like, this is totally crazy. And
• 1:28:02
  Speaker 2: we're in a situation where that was not a big
• 1:28:04
  Speaker 2: deal for us. We were able to afford it. But
• 1:28:06
  Speaker 2: think about like a normal middle-class family goes and has
• 1:28:09
  Speaker 2: a baby and comes home to a medical bill that's
• 1:28:12
  Speaker 2: like a fifth of their entire take-home pay that year, right?
• 1:28:16
  Speaker 2: That's crazy.
• 1:28:16
  Speaker 1: Oh, the number one cause of bankruptcy in America is
• 1:28:20
  Speaker 1: medical debt.
• 1:28:21
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's a huge, huge problem. And I think the
• 1:28:24
  Speaker 2: price transparency is a big part of it. But you
• 1:28:26
  Speaker 2: ask like, why hasn't it happened? Because every time that
• 1:28:29
  Speaker 2: we try to force price transparency, the service providers, the
• 1:28:35
  Speaker 2: insurance companies, or the pharmaceutical companies don't actually want that transparency.
• 1:28:39
  Speaker 2: Here's one of the reasons why the pharmaceutical companies don't
• 1:28:41
  Speaker 2: want transparency. It's because if Americans, if we realized how
• 1:28:46
  Speaker 2: much more we were paying for pharmaceuticals over the Europeans,
• 1:28:49
  Speaker 2: there would be a revolution in this country. We pay
• 1:28:51
  Speaker 2: a lot more than them. We pay way more than them.
• 1:28:54
  Speaker 2: And again, my attitude is I am fine with people
• 1:28:58
  Speaker 2: You know, if you invent a lifesaving cancer drug, I'm
• 1:29:02
  Speaker 2: fine with people earning a great profit for doing something
• 1:29:06
  Speaker 2: amazing like that. You want to motivate people to do
• 1:29:08
  Speaker 2: it in the first place, right? And a lot of
• 1:29:11
  Speaker 2: people are obviously motivated by that profit motive. But if
• 1:29:15
  Speaker 2: you take certain drugs that are, you know, they cost
• 1:29:18
  Speaker 2: $ 100 in the United States of America, and they're way,
• 1:29:22
  Speaker 2: way cheaper in Europe, or some of these really expensive
• 1:29:24
  Speaker 2: multi-thousand dollar cancer. Bring something up for me. Yeah. These
• 1:29:28
  Speaker 2: really expensive, like, next-generation cancer therapeutics, they cost way less
• 1:29:33
  Speaker 2: in Europe. Okay.
• 1:29:35
  Speaker 1: This says, in 2022, U.S. prices across all drugs, brands,
• 1:29:38
  Speaker 1: and generics were nearly 2.78 times as high as prices
• 1:29:42
  Speaker 1: in the comparison countries.
• 1:29:44
  Speaker 2: U.S.
• 1:29:45
  Speaker 1: Prices for brand drugs were at least 3.22 times as
• 1:29:49
  Speaker 1: high as prices in the comparison countries, even after adjustments
• 1:29:52
  Speaker 1: for estimated U.S.
• 1:29:53
  Speaker 2: Rebates. Wow.
• 1:29:55
  Speaker 1: Does it show those countries? Is there a chart with
• 1:29:56
  Speaker 1: that or no?
• 1:29:58
  Speaker 2: I love a chart. It's OECD countries, which is mainly Europe.
• 1:30:02
  Speaker 2: Those are like the advanced economies, basically. Okay, that's what
• 1:30:05
  Speaker 2: that means.
• 1:30:05
  Speaker 1: The rich countries, basically. OECD. So first world countries, probably?
• 1:30:10
  Speaker 2: Basically, yeah. So Canada, probably Israel's in there. A lot
• 1:30:14
  Speaker 2: of the European countries, I think, are all in OECD.
• 1:30:17
  Speaker 1: Okay, United States, Germany, Canada, Japan, Switzerland.
• 1:30:23
  Speaker 2: I can't see that. Switch to Ireland. I haven't heard
• 1:30:27
  Speaker 2: of that. Comparable county average. You're screwing with me. Austria.
• 1:30:39
  Speaker 1: Well, I think they misspelled it, dude. There's not that
• 1:30:42
  Speaker 1: many zits in it. Australia, United Kingdom, and Sweden.
• 1:30:47
  Speaker 2: Wow.
• 1:30:47
  Speaker 1: So we pay per capita spending on prescription drugs in
• 1:30:50
  Speaker 1: 2019 $ 900. And what does per capita mean?
• 1:30:53
  Speaker 2: Just per person. Okay, per person.
• 1:30:55
  Speaker 1: $ 963 per person, whereas in Sweden, $ 270. United Kingdom, $ 273, dude. Yeah,
• 1:31:03
  Speaker 1: that's crazy, right? Yeah, that's not fair, dude.
• 1:31:05
  Speaker 2: That's not fair.
• 1:31:05
  Speaker 1: They colonize everybody and they're paying cheaper for dope?
• 1:31:09
  Speaker 2: That's exactly right. Unfair, bro. But again, the reason we
• 1:31:14
  Speaker 2: don't really know what we're paying here is because... Because
• 1:31:17
  Speaker 2: they hide it. They hide it. They hide it. And
• 1:31:19
  Speaker 2: they don't want to let people know because if you...
• 1:31:22
  Speaker 2: let people know, then they would demand to pay less.
• 1:31:26
  Speaker 2: Something President Trump proposed, for example, I think is a
• 1:31:28
  Speaker 2: very good idea, is that he proposed re-importing drugs from Europe. Basically,
• 1:31:34
  Speaker 2: if they're selling it in Sweden or wherever for $ 270
• 1:31:38
  Speaker 2: per person, and we're paying $ 963 per person, then we'll
• 1:31:43
  Speaker 2: just buy it in Sweden and bring it in the
• 1:31:44
  Speaker 2: United States. I love that.
• 1:31:45
  Speaker 3: Right?
• 1:31:46
  Speaker 2: That was a big, big thing. Of course, the pharmaceutical
• 1:31:48
  Speaker 2: companies don't like that. And that's why they tried to
• 1:31:50
  Speaker 2: assassinate him twice, probably. Well, that's probably one of the
• 1:31:53
  Speaker 2: things that could have happened. I, of course, have no idea,
• 1:31:56
  Speaker 2: no inside knowledge into what drove the motives of the assassins. Oh, yeah.
• 1:32:02
  Speaker 2: I'm just joking. But I wouldn't be shocked. It's a
• 1:32:04
  Speaker 2: lot of money. And I wouldn't be shocked if there's
• 1:32:06
  Speaker 2: some really dark stuff out there. Because, look, two separate
• 1:32:09
  Speaker 2: people have tried to take a swing at this guy
• 1:32:12
  Speaker 2: in about three months. Yeah. Like, well, you know they
• 1:32:15
  Speaker 2: didn't like Donald Trump, right? Because they wouldn't try to
• 1:32:17
  Speaker 2: shoot him if they liked him. But I wouldn't be–
• 1:32:20
  Speaker 2: the first guy who went after Trump– I hate to
• 1:32:23
  Speaker 2: put on the tinfoil hat here, but we've not been
• 1:32:25
  Speaker 2: able to get– unable to get into his phone. We
• 1:32:27
  Speaker 2: know that he had all these like foreign encrypted apps
• 1:32:30
  Speaker 2: on his cell phone. It is crazy to me that
• 1:32:34
  Speaker 2: we don't know the guy's motive. It's nuts. He almost
• 1:32:38
  Speaker 2: killed the president. Yeah. And we don't know why he
• 1:32:40
  Speaker 2: did it. We don't know anything about the guy.
• 1:32:42
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, they're like, he had a lunchbox or something.
• 1:32:45
  Speaker 1: It's like the vaguest information they keep putting out about
• 1:32:47
  Speaker 1: the guy, you know? He'd been using a library card.
• 1:32:50
  Speaker 1: We're like, who gives a shit?
• 1:32:52
  Speaker 2: Exactly. Yeah. His mom's name was Sharon. It's like, great.
• 1:32:55
  Speaker 2: Thank you. Yeah, dude. Yeah.
• 1:32:58
  Speaker 1: They're like, oh, he, yeah. They're like, oh, he was
• 1:33:01
  Speaker 1: a Colts fan.
• 1:33:02
  Speaker 2: You're like, who gives a fuck? Who gives a shit? Yeah.
• 1:33:05
  Speaker 2: That's exactly right. Give us the information. Yeah. You know.
• 1:33:08
  Speaker 1: So how do we stop that? Do you get, do
• 1:33:10
  Speaker 1: you get approached by lobbyists and stuff like that?
• 1:33:12
  Speaker 2: Like all the time. Do you really? And what does
• 1:33:14
  Speaker 2: that look like? Who are they?
• 1:33:15
  Speaker 1: What are they wearing?
• 1:33:18
  Speaker 2: Uh, they're, they're, they're so lobbyists. Here's how you spot them. Okay. Um,
• 1:33:23
  Speaker 2: they're always wearing poorly fitted suits with extremely ugly ties.
• 1:33:29
  Speaker 2: So if you go out and you see a guy
• 1:33:31
  Speaker 2: with a poorly fitting suit and extremely ugly tie, he's
• 1:33:33
  Speaker 2: definitely a lobbyist. Okay. Okay.
• 1:33:35
  Speaker 1: It's like, it's like an happy Gilmore. It's a lobbyist
• 1:33:37
  Speaker 1: for big fabric. Huh?
• 1:33:39
  Speaker 2: It sounds like it's like an happy Gilmore where the
• 1:33:42
  Speaker 2: guys like, uh, uh, you know, the, The coach is
• 1:33:46
  Speaker 2: trying to get Happy Gilmore to play golf, and Happy's like,
• 1:33:49
  Speaker 2: you know what you need to play golf is goofy
• 1:33:53
  Speaker 2: pants and a fat ass. That's what you need to
• 1:33:56
  Speaker 2: be a lobbyist is goofy pants and that.
• 1:33:59
  Speaker 1: But why can't we– if everybody knows– By the way,
• 1:34:01
  Speaker 1: I like golf.
• 1:34:01
  Speaker 2: I'm going to be clear. I like golf. Do you
• 1:34:03
  Speaker 2: like golf?
• 1:34:05
  Speaker 1: I'm not that good at it.
• 1:34:06
  Speaker 2: Okay.
• 1:34:06
  Speaker 1: I'll play when I get a little bit older. I
• 1:34:08
  Speaker 1: don't want to slow people down right now.
• 1:34:10
  Speaker 2: Fair point. You know?
• 1:34:11
  Speaker 1: But anyway, yeah. I like Brooks Koepka.
• 1:34:14
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I do too. He's cool. Yeah, he's a cool dude.
• 1:34:18
  Speaker 1: And I like that girl that smokes that.
• 1:34:20
  Speaker 2: Plays, dude.
• 1:34:22
  Speaker 1: Poffer McGavin or whatever her name is.
• 1:34:24
  Speaker 2: I have eyes only for one woman, Theo. Only my wife. Yeah, no,
• 1:34:28
  Speaker 2: I like her. You don't have to know who I'm
• 1:34:31
  Speaker 2: talking about. No comment. She's like the hot John Daly.
• 1:34:35
  Speaker 2: I know who you're talking about. Yeah, she's like the
• 1:34:37
  Speaker 2: hot John Daly. Yeah. So John Daly doesn't really do
• 1:34:41
  Speaker 2: it for you. He's a good, he's a good dude though.
• 1:34:45
  Speaker 1: Oh no, I like John, man. Oh, if you need
• 1:34:48
  Speaker 1: a ride in an ambulance, hang out with John. You'll
• 1:34:51
  Speaker 1: get one in a heartbeat. And I'm just joking.
• 1:34:54
  Speaker 2: I think it was Tiger Woods. But also it's true.
• 1:34:56
  Speaker 1: I've been at two places where John's been taken. One
• 1:34:58
  Speaker 1: time they came in looking for him. He went out
• 1:35:01
  Speaker 1: there and was sitting in the shotgun.
• 1:35:04
  Speaker 2: It's awesome. And they're like, where is he? In the ambulance.
• 1:35:07
  Speaker 2: Oh my God. He tried to help you guys out. Oh,
• 1:35:10
  Speaker 2: that is so funny.
• 1:35:11
  Speaker 1: He's a legend. He's got to come on here soon.
• 1:35:13
  Speaker 1: But how do we stop that if all the senators
• 1:35:15
  Speaker 1: and congresspeople know it? Like Bernie Sanders said, there's three
• 1:35:18
  Speaker 1: times as many lobbyists um, in DC as there are, um,
• 1:35:24
  Speaker 1: congressmen and senators, then why.
• 1:35:26
  Speaker 2: Don't we get that shit out? Like, okay, here, here's
• 1:35:29
  Speaker 2: why doesn't it stop?
• 1:35:30
  Speaker 1: Like if all you guys know it and everybody's supposed
• 1:35:32
  Speaker 1: to be working for the people, then why doesn't it stop?
• 1:35:35
  Speaker 2: So I actually think that we're getting a little bit
• 1:35:37
  Speaker 2: better compared to maybe 10 years ago. And people have
• 1:35:39
  Speaker 2: no idea how much Washington was just completely run by lobbyists. And,
• 1:35:43
  Speaker 2: you know, you think about like guy on the left,
• 1:35:45
  Speaker 2: like Bernie Sanders, but most importantly, a guy on the right,
• 1:35:48
  Speaker 2: like Donald Trump, completely blows the existing system up. And
• 1:35:51
  Speaker 2: this is, by the way, like what I realized, because
• 1:35:53
  Speaker 2: I wasn't a Trump guy back in 2016, and obviously
• 1:35:56
  Speaker 2: I'm his running mate now, so I really like him.
• 1:35:58
  Speaker 2: What people don't realize is back in 2016, how much
• 1:36:01
  Speaker 2: lobbyist money and influence there was that wanted to destroy
• 1:36:05
  Speaker 2: Donald Trump. They hated the guy because he didn't owe
• 1:36:08
  Speaker 2: anything to them. He didn't come from the existing political process.
• 1:36:12
  Speaker 2: And if you look at some of the younger guys
• 1:36:14
  Speaker 2: who have come in, you know, we're much more just
• 1:36:17
  Speaker 2: open about the fact that lobbyist influence is out there. Right.
• 1:36:20
  Speaker 2: You can't be in D.C. without running into these people.
• 1:36:23
  Speaker 2: But you got to be honest with people like I'm
• 1:36:26
  Speaker 2: not going to let this person write a piece of
• 1:36:28
  Speaker 2: legislation for me. I'm not going to let this person
• 1:36:30
  Speaker 2: dictate how I vote. And, yeah, I've gotten some definitely
• 1:36:33
  Speaker 2: some criticisms from the lobbyist groups in D.C., Some of
• 1:36:36
  Speaker 2: them will say, well, you know, we don't know if
• 1:36:38
  Speaker 2: we can trust this guy. And that's fine with me.
• 1:36:40
  Speaker 2: I'm okay. I'm okay with him not- If a lobbyist
• 1:36:41
  Speaker 2: can't trust you, fucking good. Exactly. Then you're doing your job.
• 1:36:44
  Speaker 2: That's exactly right. That's my exact attitude towards it.
• 1:36:46
  Speaker 1: They don't know if we can trust you. Who gives
• 1:36:48
  Speaker 1: a fuck?
• 1:36:48
  Speaker 2: Exactly. That's exactly right. So, but that is how the
• 1:36:54
  Speaker 2: town works, is that if you come in and you
• 1:36:56
  Speaker 2: don't always take their meetings, you don't always do what
• 1:36:58
  Speaker 2: they want you to, then they'll start whispering about you.
• 1:37:00
  Speaker 2: And then they can get articles written about you. They
• 1:37:02
  Speaker 2: can have people say bad shit about you. This is
• 1:37:04
  Speaker 2: why people call it the corporate media. Because if you
• 1:37:07
  Speaker 2: pick up a story in the Washington Post and you
• 1:37:09
  Speaker 2: read it, and here's this anonymous source said this, this
• 1:37:12
  Speaker 2: anonymous source said that, there is a 98% chance that
• 1:37:16
  Speaker 2: the person who's attacking Donald Trump is on the take somehow.
• 1:37:19
  Speaker 2: For sure. Whether it's a lobbyist or whether it's a
• 1:37:21
  Speaker 2: political consultant, it's all dishonest, money laundering bullshit. That's all
• 1:37:26
  Speaker 2: DC ultimately is, is people who get paid to offer
• 1:37:29
  Speaker 2: an opinion instead of having a real opinion. Here's the
• 1:37:32
  Speaker 2: thing that I think we need to fix structurally about this.
• 1:37:34
  Speaker 2: So let me give you an example. My Senate staff
• 1:37:36
  Speaker 2: has probably 40 or so people and all extremely good people.
• 1:37:42
  Speaker 2: My staff tends to be a little bit younger because
• 1:37:44
  Speaker 2: I'm one of the youngest. I'm the second youngest U.S.
• 1:37:46
  Speaker 2: senator right now. And if I wanted to pay my
• 1:37:50
  Speaker 2: chief of staff $ 30, 000 more a year than what I
• 1:37:54
  Speaker 2: pay him right now, I'm not allowed by law. So
• 1:37:57
  Speaker 2: even though I'm a senator and I was elected to
• 1:37:58
  Speaker 2: represent the people of Ohio– I'm not allowed to control
• 1:38:02
  Speaker 2: who I pay and how I pay them. It's all
• 1:38:05
  Speaker 2: sort of set by law. And here's the bigger issue
• 1:38:08
  Speaker 2: is that if you think about it, a lot of
• 1:38:12
  Speaker 2: these big important laws are very complicated, right? They've got
• 1:38:15
  Speaker 2: 800 pages, 900 pages. And I think the law should
• 1:38:18
  Speaker 2: be simpler. But if you've got a 900-page law and
• 1:38:21
  Speaker 2: you've got a bunch of junior staffers who don't know
• 1:38:25
  Speaker 2: the town very well and they don't make a whole
• 1:38:28
  Speaker 2: lot of money, then the people who are writing the
• 1:38:31
  Speaker 2: laws are not going to be your junior staffers. It's
• 1:38:33
  Speaker 2: going to be the lobbyists, right? And we've seen this
• 1:38:36
  Speaker 2: multiple times with legislation that I've drafted where the lobbyists
• 1:38:39
  Speaker 2: will actually ask to get into like the draft of
• 1:38:42
  Speaker 2: the law and make changes for you and say, well, yeah,
• 1:38:45
  Speaker 2: we'll justify. No, no, no, no, no. I want my
• 1:38:48
  Speaker 2: staff that works for me to write the laws that
• 1:38:51
  Speaker 2: I'm drafting. But I actually think that we need to
• 1:38:54
  Speaker 2: empower senators and congressmen to hire who they want, to
• 1:38:59
  Speaker 2: make a bigger staff if they want. Because if you
• 1:39:01
  Speaker 2: think about it, the amount of staff a congressman has,
• 1:39:03
  Speaker 2: a congresswoman has, is a fraction of the federal budget.
• 1:39:06
  Speaker 2: I mean, we're talking about like a percent of a
• 1:39:08
  Speaker 2: percent of a penny on the federal budget. And so
• 1:39:12
  Speaker 2: we could actually give people the staff that they need
• 1:39:17
  Speaker 2: to be able to actually write the laws and to
• 1:39:19
  Speaker 2: make sure the lobbyists don't have much influence. And you ask, like,
• 1:39:22
  Speaker 2: who are the lobbyists? Okay. The lobbyists are the people
• 1:39:27
  Speaker 2: who are really good staffers. And then the staffers want
• 1:39:30
  Speaker 2: to buy a nicer house and they want to, you know,
• 1:39:32
  Speaker 2: start a family and they can't. You know, D.C. is
• 1:39:34
  Speaker 2: a very expensive town. I mean, you know, a one-bedroom
• 1:39:38
  Speaker 2: apartment in D.C. will easily run you $ 4, 000 a month
• 1:39:41
  Speaker 2: right now. Right? It's just a very expensive town. So
• 1:39:43
  Speaker 2: then those people go and become lobbyists. They trade in
• 1:39:46
  Speaker 2: their public service for a fat check. And I think
• 1:39:49
  Speaker 2: that we've got to fix something about that pipeline. Right.
• 1:39:51
  Speaker 1: It's the same thing that happened with OxyContin. And they
• 1:39:54
  Speaker 1: got the people that were working with the FDA to
• 1:39:57
  Speaker 1: come and work for them.
• 1:39:57
  Speaker 2: That's exactly right. That is exactly right. So it happens
• 1:40:00
  Speaker 2: at our Congress. It happens with our big bureaucratic agencies.
• 1:40:04
  Speaker 2: And I think we have to fix something about that.
• 1:40:06
  Speaker 2: We want the people in our government to be public
• 1:40:08
  Speaker 2: spirited and focus on doing the public good. I don't
• 1:40:11
  Speaker 2: think that the system that we have works very well
• 1:40:14
  Speaker 2: where You do public service for a little bit, and
• 1:40:16
  Speaker 2: then you jump and go make a million dollars a
• 1:40:18
  Speaker 2: year as a lobbyist. No, no, no, no, no, no.
• 1:40:21
  Speaker 2: I think you've got to separate those functions much better
• 1:40:23
  Speaker 2: than you have right now.
• 1:40:24
  Speaker 1: Yeah, because then being a public servant is just a
• 1:40:28
  Speaker 1: junior college for becoming a lobbyist, it seems like.
• 1:40:31
  Speaker 2: That is a big worry that I have, especially with
• 1:40:35
  Speaker 2: my staff. I mean, these are really smart, really good guys.
• 1:40:38
  Speaker 2: And a big part of what I think about as
• 1:40:39
  Speaker 2: a senator— You can't afford to keep them. as they
• 1:40:44
  Speaker 2: get more senior, as they become better at their job,
• 1:40:47
  Speaker 2: as they become better at figuring out what a lobbyist
• 1:40:50
  Speaker 2: is trying to sell them a bill of goods, right?
• 1:40:51
  Speaker 2: That's a skill, right? And you acquire that skill over time.
• 1:40:54
  Speaker 1: When they can just spend whatever they want when they're
• 1:40:56
  Speaker 1: the Yankees.
• 1:40:57
  Speaker 2: That's exactly right. Yeah. Damn. Shit, dude. We're all going
• 1:41:03
  Speaker 2: to be addicted. No, we're not, man. I'm telling you.
• 1:41:07
  Speaker 2: That's a joke. I'm telling you. We're actually going in
• 1:41:09
  Speaker 2: the right direction. This is what people don't, and I
• 1:41:12
  Speaker 2: recognize you probably have Of your millions of listeners, some
• 1:41:14
  Speaker 2: people love Trump and some people hate him. But the
• 1:41:17
  Speaker 2: thing that Trump really changed about D.C. is that he
• 1:41:21
  Speaker 2: was not beholden to the moneyed interests.
• 1:41:24
  Speaker 1: Oh, well, that's one thing that I also like about
• 1:41:26
  Speaker 1: Bobby Kennedy. I mean, I've known Bobby for years. Bobby's
• 1:41:28
  Speaker 1: been a friend of mine for years. I knew him
• 1:41:30
  Speaker 1: before I thought he was going to do politics.
• 1:41:32
  Speaker 2: Yeah, he's a good dude, man. I like Bobby.
• 1:41:34
  Speaker 1: He used to hold meetings at his house on Tuesdays
• 1:41:36
  Speaker 1: and we would go to him.
• 1:41:37
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:41:38
  Speaker 1: In his backyard, dude. And one of his dogs always
• 1:41:40
  Speaker 1: was slobbering stuff on me. It was a huge dog.
• 1:41:43
  Speaker 1: It might not even have been a dog because he
• 1:41:44
  Speaker 1: has a.
• 1:41:45
  Speaker 2: Lot of animals. What would it have been then? I
• 1:41:46
  Speaker 2: don't know, dude.
• 1:41:48
  Speaker 1: But he's had a lot of animals over the years.
• 1:41:49
  Speaker 2: Ask Bobby. And he can afford probably a big animal.
• 1:41:51
  Speaker 2: What was this baby dog that was slobbering all over Theo?
• 1:41:54
  Speaker 2: But he doesn't need anything else. He's got a great name.
• 1:41:57
  Speaker 2: He's got a cool wife. He's got... he doesn't, he's
• 1:42:00
  Speaker 2: always cared about just making people healthy. If he, is
• 1:42:03
  Speaker 2: he wrong sometimes on things? Sure.
• 1:42:04
  Speaker 1: He probably is just like anybody else, but I'd fucking,
• 1:42:07
  Speaker 1: I'd rather have somebody just raise their hand and ask questions. Like,
• 1:42:11
  Speaker 1: that's one thing that I just love about him that
• 1:42:13
  Speaker 1: he's not beholding.
• 1:42:14
  Speaker 2: To any of these people. You know, the thing that
• 1:42:16
  Speaker 2: I hate about politics and just media culture in this
• 1:42:19
  Speaker 2: country right now, man, is people are so afraid of
• 1:42:23
  Speaker 2: saying anything that's unconventional. They're, They're afraid of thinking thoughts
• 1:42:28
  Speaker 2: that you're not allowed to think. Like the biggest ideas
• 1:42:31
  Speaker 2: come from people who just follow the truth, right? And yeah,
• 1:42:36
  Speaker 2: sometimes they're going to be wrong. Sometimes they're not going
• 1:42:38
  Speaker 2: to get everything right. But we've got to stop punishing
• 1:42:41
  Speaker 2: people like Bobby Kennedy for saying, well, maybe this doesn't work. Yeah, hey,
• 1:42:46
  Speaker 2: what about that? Exactly. Like that, hey, what about that
• 1:42:49
  Speaker 2: is something we have to preserve. And I do feel
• 1:42:51
  Speaker 2: like we're trying to do, we're kind of destroying it.
• 1:42:53
  Speaker 2: This is, so I'm going to sound like an old man.
• 1:42:56
  Speaker 2: But this is what I think is really jacked up
• 1:42:58
  Speaker 2: about social media is, okay, we're all social animals, right?
• 1:43:02
  Speaker 2: We're all influenced by people around us. Oh, yeah. But look,
• 1:43:06
  Speaker 2: 30 years ago, an opinion, it would take it many,
• 1:43:10
  Speaker 2: many days before an opinion became the accepted conventional wisdom.
• 1:43:15
  Speaker 2: You'd have to be repeated in one newspaper, then repeated
• 1:43:17
  Speaker 2: in another newspaper, and people would talk about it. Now
• 1:43:20
  Speaker 2: you can have something happen on social media, it's viral,
• 1:43:24
  Speaker 2: and 10 minutes later, You've got like the social media
• 1:43:27
  Speaker 2: feeding frenzy that says, well, here's this thing that I
• 1:43:30
  Speaker 2: came up with 10 minutes ago. And if you don't
• 1:43:32
  Speaker 2: agree with that thing I came up with 10 minutes ago,
• 1:43:35
  Speaker 2: then there's going to be a feeding frenzy attacking you,
• 1:43:38
  Speaker 2: attacking your family, finding out where you worked and attack it,
• 1:43:41
  Speaker 2: trying to attack your employer for keeping you in a job.
• 1:43:44
  Speaker 2: Like that is a really jacked up thing to take
• 1:43:47
  Speaker 2: the normal human social impulse to want to be liked
• 1:43:50
  Speaker 2: and to want to make friends. And to put it
• 1:43:53
  Speaker 2: all on the internet where it operates at like the
• 1:43:55
  Speaker 2: speed of light, I think there's something very deranged about that. Yeah. Yeah.
• 1:44:01
  Speaker 1: Well, and it's also, it's like, are you a repeater
• 1:44:04
  Speaker 1: or are you a thinker? Like, that's the thing. It's like,
• 1:44:07
  Speaker 1: we get so preoccupied now and so occupied so quickly
• 1:44:11
  Speaker 1: that we don't even put it through our own filter.
• 1:44:13
  Speaker 2: That's exactly right.
• 1:44:15
  Speaker 1: And it's like, and then our filter starts to not
• 1:44:17
  Speaker 1: even be a filter anymore because it's like, well, nobody's
• 1:44:20
  Speaker 1: using me. I'll just- I'm just a pathway now. And
• 1:44:23
  Speaker 1: that's what starts to happen. That's how we all start
• 1:44:25
  Speaker 1: to become desensitized to everything.
• 1:44:28
  Speaker 2: And we just become repeaters, right? That's exactly what social
• 1:44:30
  Speaker 2: media does is it just turns us all into repeaters.
• 1:44:33
  Speaker 2: I like that Bobby Kennedy is sort of willing to say, no, no, no, no, no.
• 1:44:36
  Speaker 2: I'm actually going to think for myself on this topic.
• 1:44:39
  Speaker 2: I mean, it is crazy. Why do we have such
• 1:44:41
  Speaker 2: a terrible obesity problem? Why do we have all these like,
• 1:44:45
  Speaker 2: you know, certain types of diabetes are on the rise
• 1:44:48
  Speaker 2: among children today. It's like, okay, we're the richest country
• 1:44:50
  Speaker 2: in the history of the world And, you know, children
• 1:44:53
  Speaker 2: are getting diseases that they didn't get 30, 40 years ago.
• 1:44:56
  Speaker 2: Like somebody should be saying what the hell is going
• 1:44:58
  Speaker 2: on or like.
• 1:45:00
  Speaker 1: Yeah, somebody should. And it should be our leaders. But
• 1:45:02
  Speaker 1: it feels like there's so much compromisation in there.
• 1:45:05
  Speaker 2: I mean, do you know? OK, this is a paper
• 1:45:09
  Speaker 2: by a Nobel. Yeah, we'll take a few more minutes.
• 1:45:14
  Speaker 2: Now we're just having fun. But there's a paper by
• 1:45:17
  Speaker 2: a Nobel Prize winning economist that talks about. the return
• 1:45:23
  Speaker 2: to education in years of life. And do you know
• 1:45:28
  Speaker 2: how much, take a person who's got a four-year degree
• 1:45:30
  Speaker 2: versus a person who never went to college. Do you
• 1:45:32
  Speaker 2: know how much longer the person with a four-year degree
• 1:45:35
  Speaker 2: lives in the United States of America right now? Seven years.
• 1:45:39
  Speaker 2: Seven years longer. Yeah. So going to college, you get
• 1:45:43
  Speaker 2: rewarded with seven years of additional life. If that doesn't
• 1:45:46
  Speaker 2: tell you something is seriously fucked up in our country,
• 1:45:48
  Speaker 2: then nothing will, right? That is not okay. And it's
• 1:45:52
  Speaker 2: part of it. It's it's health. Part of it's that,
• 1:45:56
  Speaker 2: you know, people are working more dangerous jobs if they
• 1:45:59
  Speaker 2: don't have a college degree. But part of it's just
• 1:46:02
  Speaker 2: that we have have, I think, made it so hard
• 1:46:04
  Speaker 2: to get by in our country. If you don't have
• 1:46:07
  Speaker 2: a four year degree that people are, you know, they're
• 1:46:10
  Speaker 2: not making enough money to support their families and they
• 1:46:12
  Speaker 2: get stressed out and they turn to addiction. Of course,
• 1:46:15
  Speaker 2: addiction happens to everybody. But it's much more common among
• 1:46:18
  Speaker 2: those without a college degree. So I just this to
• 1:46:21
  Speaker 2: me is like, what is this campaign about? Like, what
• 1:46:24
  Speaker 2: is Trump being president about is fixing the big problems,
• 1:46:28
  Speaker 2: not like the bullshit fake problems that the media gets
• 1:46:31
  Speaker 2: us to focus on, not the slogans. But why are
• 1:46:35
  Speaker 2: people dying seven years earlier if they don't have a
• 1:46:37
  Speaker 2: college degree? Why do we have this historic obesity epidemic
• 1:46:42
  Speaker 2: in the richest country in the world? Why do we
• 1:46:44
  Speaker 2: have like wars breaking out like crazy all over the world?
• 1:46:47
  Speaker 2: Why do pharmaceutical companies get rich by forcing therapeutics that
• 1:46:53
  Speaker 2: aren't even always good for us, right? These are like big, big,
• 1:46:56
  Speaker 2: big issues that frankly, I think absent Trump, we wouldn't
• 1:47:00
  Speaker 2: even be talking about this stuff.
• 1:47:02
  Speaker 1: Well, I mean, I definitely think that one of the
• 1:47:05
  Speaker 1: things that certainly excited me about Trump when he first
• 1:47:09
  Speaker 1: was running was wow, this guy is fucking rogue. And
• 1:47:15
  Speaker 1: you know what? And this whole thing is so messed
• 1:47:18
  Speaker 1: up now that that's what you, I would, I hated
• 1:47:21
  Speaker 1: politics so much. I just, I hated it. that I
• 1:47:24
  Speaker 1: was like, I would hire a Muppet to go in
• 1:47:28
  Speaker 1: there with a hammer.
• 1:47:30
  Speaker 2: That's right, man.
• 1:47:31
  Speaker 1: I would hire a Muppet with a hammer. If I
• 1:47:32
  Speaker 1: could vote for a Muppet with a hammer. And that's
• 1:47:34
  Speaker 1: how most people feel. It's like, it doesn't even feel
• 1:47:37
  Speaker 1: like it's working for us anymore. So what does it
• 1:47:39
  Speaker 1: even matter? Yeah, but so that's why I think Bobby,
• 1:47:43
  Speaker 1: that's one thing that I did. That's one thing that
• 1:47:45
  Speaker 1: I thought was pretty amazing about bringing Bobby Kennedy into
• 1:47:48
  Speaker 1: you guys' campaign is that he's a sheriff for that
• 1:47:52
  Speaker 1: kind of shit.
• 1:47:53
  Speaker 2: He really is.
• 1:47:54
  Speaker 1: You know, for caring. I think for just for genuinely
• 1:47:56
  Speaker 1: caring about people.
• 1:47:57
  Speaker 2: I agree.
• 1:47:57
  Speaker 1: Because I know him. I know he cares about people.
• 1:47:59
  Speaker 1: It's like, I have friends that don't care about me.
• 1:48:01
  Speaker 1: They're still my friends, some of them. But he's a
• 1:48:03
  Speaker 1: friend that is a caring guy.
• 1:48:05
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah. That's absolutely right.
• 1:48:06
  Speaker 1: So that is, I think, why I've vouched for him
• 1:48:09
  Speaker 1: a lot.
• 1:48:09
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I had one more thing.
• 1:48:11
  Speaker 1: Let me see. Oh, the polls and stuff.
• 1:48:15
  Speaker 2: Okay, yeah. Yeah.
• 1:48:16
  Speaker 1: I've been looking at the polls recently.
• 1:48:18
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I hear you. Shee as a place where I
• 1:48:21
  Speaker 2: look at them. Okay. This is the betting market stuff. Yeah.
• 1:48:24
  Speaker 1: They're a website and an app where people can bet
• 1:48:26
  Speaker 1: money on regular happenings like in society, like not just
• 1:48:29
  Speaker 1: political stuff, anything from like politics to entertainment. And I
• 1:48:33
  Speaker 1: think it's a good tracker of in a capitalistic society
• 1:48:36
  Speaker 1: because it's people putting their money down.
• 1:48:37
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 1:48:38
  Speaker 1: It's like, So it's people saying, this is what I think, right?
• 1:48:41
  Speaker 1: With my money, as opposed to just other polls. What's
• 1:48:46
  Speaker 1: the latest on there?
• 1:48:46
  Speaker 2: What does it say? Oh, it's like Trump is 57,
• 1:48:50
  Speaker 2: Kamala is 43.
• 1:48:51
  Speaker 1: Trump, 57%. That's pretty good. Yeah, that's pretty good. Does
• 1:48:56
  Speaker 1: it say the total amount of money that people have
• 1:48:58
  Speaker 1: bet or not yet? Oh, it says $ 32, 917, 000 has been
• 1:49:00
  Speaker 1: put out there on this. It's just, yeah. So that's
• 1:49:08
  Speaker 1: why I like to follow their stuff just because it's
• 1:49:09
  Speaker 1: actually people putting their money down.
• 1:49:11
  Speaker 2: Sure.
• 1:49:12
  Speaker 1: Are there, what do you think of polls that are
• 1:49:14
  Speaker 1: out there these days? Do you guys follow these polls?
• 1:49:16
  Speaker 1: Is that real stuff to you? Like, I know that
• 1:49:18
  Speaker 1: like they had the Clinton Trump poll years ago and
• 1:49:21
  Speaker 1: they had Clinton who was neck and neck or something.
• 1:49:23
  Speaker 1: And then it wasn't when it came out.
• 1:49:25
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:49:26
  Speaker 1: Do you guys follow any of that? Or is that
• 1:49:27
  Speaker 1: really part of the daily routine?
• 1:49:29
  Speaker 2: Not really, man. I mean, I can, I can get
• 1:49:32
  Speaker 2: you in the weeds a little bit, but I'll try to,
• 1:49:33
  Speaker 2: I'll try to I live and breathe this stuff. So
• 1:49:36
  Speaker 2: I try not to make it, make it too intense here.
• 1:49:38
  Speaker 2: I just don't trust a lot of media. So it's like, yeah, here,
• 1:49:40
  Speaker 2: here's basically the way you shouldn't trust polls, whether they're
• 1:49:43
  Speaker 2: good for us or bad for us. And here's the
• 1:49:45
  Speaker 2: reason you shouldn't trust polls is about 10 years ago,
• 1:49:50
  Speaker 2: every 10th person you called to do a poll would answer.
• 1:49:54
  Speaker 2: Now it's about one in 30 people. Okay. And another
• 1:49:58
  Speaker 2: important thing is that if you're a Democrat, especially if
• 1:50:01
  Speaker 2: you're a higher education level, Democrat, You're much more willing
• 1:50:05
  Speaker 2: to answer pollster questions where if you're– excuse me. If
• 1:50:09
  Speaker 2: you're like my family, if somebody called them a stranger
• 1:50:12
  Speaker 2: and said, who are you going to vote for? They
• 1:50:14
  Speaker 2: would say F you and hang up the phone, right?
• 1:50:17
  Speaker 2: So the reason the polls have gotten so bad is
• 1:50:21
  Speaker 2: because Trump voters are less likely to answer pollster questions
• 1:50:25
  Speaker 2: and Kamala Harris voters are much more likely to answer
• 1:50:28
  Speaker 2: pollster questions. So it's very hard to get an accurate
• 1:50:30
  Speaker 2: sample to give you any sense of what's going on.
• 1:50:33
  Speaker 1: But do you just believe that or are you just
• 1:50:34
  Speaker 1: saying that?
• 1:50:35
  Speaker 2: I actually believe that. Yeah, no, I believe that. And
• 1:50:38
  Speaker 2: I've seen it in my own race, for example. I
• 1:50:40
  Speaker 2: ran for Senate. There were all these public polls that
• 1:50:42
  Speaker 2: say the race was tied or maybe we'd even lose
• 1:50:45
  Speaker 2: by a few points. And the pollster that I had
• 1:50:48
  Speaker 2: who just polls for my campaign, he's actually Trump's pollster
• 1:50:52
  Speaker 2: too and a very smart guy. And he said, look,
• 1:50:55
  Speaker 2: the reason these polls are wrong is because they're not
• 1:50:58
  Speaker 2: reaching voters who don't like to answer polls. And those
• 1:51:02
  Speaker 2: voters are going heavily for you. So I said, okay, well,
• 1:51:04
  Speaker 2: how much are we going to win by? And he said,
• 1:51:05
  Speaker 2: you're going to win by six points. And we won
• 1:51:06
  Speaker 2: by seven points. Right. So he was much more accurate
• 1:51:09
  Speaker 2: than the public pollsters. Now you ask, why is he
• 1:51:12
  Speaker 2: more accurate? Because most of the public polls, they cost 10, $ 20, 000.
• 1:51:17
  Speaker 2: Like if you see a poll published in a newspaper article,
• 1:51:20
  Speaker 2: 10 to $ 20, 000 to get an accurate sample, these guys
• 1:51:24
  Speaker 2: needed to really it's it's 60, $ 70, 000. Cause they've got
• 1:51:28
  Speaker 2: to call thousands and thousands of people. to get a
• 1:51:31
  Speaker 2: representative sample of the American people. So sitting here, honestly,
• 1:51:38
  Speaker 2: I think that chart's about right. I think that we've
• 1:51:42
  Speaker 2: probably got about a 60% chance of winning. I think
• 1:51:44
  Speaker 2: the polls would have to be wrong, but they'd have
• 1:51:46
  Speaker 2: to be wrong in a pro-Kamala direction, where normally they're
• 1:51:49
  Speaker 2: wrong in a pro-Trump direction. And we've got 18 days,
• 1:51:54
  Speaker 2: 17 days, man, and we're just going to do everything
• 1:51:56
  Speaker 2: that we can to win this race. But you shouldn't
• 1:51:59
  Speaker 2: believe the polls, basically. Yeah. And I say this right
• 1:52:03
  Speaker 2: now because the polls are all saying we'd win. That's
• 1:52:06
  Speaker 2: why it's 57-43. Don't buy the polls. Because here's the thing. Okay.
• 1:52:11
  Speaker 1: It could keep people from voting also.
• 1:52:12
  Speaker 2: It could keep people from voting. But let's say, for example,
• 1:52:15
  Speaker 2: that something happened. I don't know what happened. But let's
• 1:52:17
  Speaker 2: say something happened. There's a fire or something. Yeah. Where
• 1:52:19
  Speaker 2: the people who don't want to answer pollster questions are
• 1:52:24
  Speaker 2: now Kamala voters. Right. So you can't trust this stuff.
• 1:52:28
  Speaker 2: You got to assume that you just got to work
• 1:52:30
  Speaker 2: your ass off. That's what we're trying to do. You know,
• 1:52:32
  Speaker 2: President Trump and I do in multiple events a day
• 1:52:34
  Speaker 2: at this point. And if you if you want, in
• 1:52:38
  Speaker 2: my view, if you want to secure the border, have
• 1:52:41
  Speaker 2: common sense economic policy, then Donald Trump is your man.
• 1:52:44
  Speaker 2: And I say, man, something about Kamala Harris, like I
• 1:52:48
  Speaker 2: know a little bit about you. And I wrote about
• 1:52:50
  Speaker 2: some of your political views. We've invited her and Mr.
• 1:52:52
  Speaker 2: Walsh to come on. We would love it if they would. Yeah,
• 1:52:54
  Speaker 2: I'm sure you would. I hope they will. But like
• 1:52:58
  Speaker 2: Sean O'Brien, who's the head of the Teamsters, like one
• 1:53:02
  Speaker 2: of the things that President Trump has sort of been
• 1:53:04
  Speaker 2: known for is bringing more working class people into the
• 1:53:07
  Speaker 2: Republican coalition, right? It's I think one of the reasons
• 1:53:09
  Speaker 2: why he's been very successful politically. If you look at
• 1:53:13
  Speaker 2: like where Kamala is on– the big pharma stuff, or
• 1:53:16
  Speaker 2: you look at where she is on the foreign conflict stuff,
• 1:53:19
  Speaker 2: she's like very pro-war. Or if you look at where
• 1:53:22
  Speaker 2: she is on things like, how do we put tariffs
• 1:53:27
  Speaker 2: on goods that are imported from China so that you
• 1:53:30
  Speaker 2: don't have the Chinese undercutting the wages of American workers, right?
• 1:53:34
  Speaker 2: Or like the illegal immigration thing, like, yeah, it's about
• 1:53:36
  Speaker 2: fentanyl and drug trafficking. But when you bring in millions
• 1:53:39
  Speaker 2: upon millions of illegal immigrants who are willing to work
• 1:53:42
  Speaker 2: under the table, That undercuts the wages of American workers, right?
• 1:53:46
  Speaker 2: So our own people get poorer. And I don't have
• 1:53:48
  Speaker 2: anything against the illegal immigrants themselves. I have something against
• 1:53:50
  Speaker 2: Kamala Harris who lets these people come in. But I
• 1:53:53
  Speaker 2: want our people to be able– black, white, brown, whatever.
• 1:53:56
  Speaker 2: I just want our people to be able to work
• 1:53:58
  Speaker 2: for a solid wage. That doesn't work when you have
• 1:54:01
  Speaker 2: people coming in like this.
• 1:54:02
  Speaker 1: Well, some of it is we have to have personal
• 1:54:03
  Speaker 1: responsibility too as people running companies to not.
• 1:54:09
  Speaker 2: Hire those people as well. I agree.
• 1:54:12
  Speaker 1: You have to enforce that side of it as well.
• 1:54:14
  Speaker 2: I agree. You got to do both sides of it.
• 1:54:15
  Speaker 2: I think we ought to make it harder to hire
• 1:54:16
  Speaker 2: illegal labor. We also ought to make it harder for
• 1:54:19
  Speaker 2: illegal labor to come into the country in the first place.
• 1:54:21
  Speaker 2: I agree both sides of it have got to matter.
• 1:54:23
  Speaker 2: But I think that's actually why we're doing so much
• 1:54:26
  Speaker 2: better among working people is because they recognize like open
• 1:54:30
  Speaker 2: borders are not good for me, right? Oh, that shit's scary, dude.
• 1:54:33
  Speaker 2: Fitting all my communities is not good for me. Like
• 1:54:34
  Speaker 2: this stuff with pharma is not good for me. And
• 1:54:37
  Speaker 2: so they have become more open to Donald Trump. Um,
• 1:54:40
  Speaker 2: and I think that's a very good thing. Cause I think, look, man,
• 1:54:43
  Speaker 2: between Bobby Kennedy, me, obviously the president at the top
• 1:54:47
  Speaker 2: of the ticket, I think we're going to have such
• 1:54:50
  Speaker 2: a cool administration. That's going to try to tackle the
• 1:54:53
  Speaker 2: big things and not just govern along these bullshit slogans anymore.
• 1:54:57
  Speaker 2: So look, I hope that ends up being true. Cause
• 1:55:00
  Speaker 2: I think we'll do a lot of good if we win.
• 1:55:02
  Speaker 1: If you, um, no matter what happens in this election, would,
• 1:55:05
  Speaker 1: do you think you would run again in the future?
• 1:55:08
  Speaker 2: I don't know, man. Um, It's so hard to even
• 1:55:11
  Speaker 2: imagine running for anything after this because I'm so obsessed
• 1:55:16
  Speaker 2: with winning right now. And, you know, like I certainly
• 1:55:20
  Speaker 2: probably would do another term in the Senate, but that
• 1:55:22
  Speaker 2: doesn't come up for four more years because Senate terms
• 1:55:24
  Speaker 2: are six years. It's like whatever run nationally again. I
• 1:55:27
  Speaker 2: don't know, man. That's a big that's a big thing.
• 1:55:30
  Speaker 2: It's a big thing to put your family through. Yeah,
• 1:55:32
  Speaker 2: I can imagine. And I've only I've seen it for
• 1:55:34
  Speaker 2: two months, three months now that I've been the VP
• 1:55:36
  Speaker 2: nominee to run for that for two years. My attitude
• 1:55:40
  Speaker 2: is let's get Donald Trump elected and let's fix as
• 1:55:43
  Speaker 2: much as we can because then I think the country
• 1:55:48
  Speaker 2: will be in a much better spot. Like I don't
• 1:55:50
  Speaker 2: mean to sound like a doomer and I just really
• 1:55:54
  Speaker 2: haven't thought about what I– I haven't really thought about
• 1:55:57
  Speaker 2: what I would do in 2028 no matter what. But man,
• 1:56:00
  Speaker 2: if Kamala Harris is the president for the next four years,
• 1:56:03
  Speaker 2: we have four more years of open borders, four more
• 1:56:06
  Speaker 2: years of not putting tariffs on Chinese imports … Four
• 1:56:09
  Speaker 2: more years of the crazy foreign policy that's pro-war all
• 1:56:14
  Speaker 2: over the world. I really do worry that the country
• 1:56:17
  Speaker 2: is in a very, very bad spot. So I don't
• 1:56:20
  Speaker 2: think too much about future politics. I just want to
• 1:56:22
  Speaker 2: win this race.
• 1:56:24
  Speaker 1: How many times do politicians say stuff that's just on
• 1:56:26
  Speaker 1: the trail and then when it comes time to actually
• 1:56:28
  Speaker 1: get in office and do stuff, it seems like that
• 1:56:31
  Speaker 1: person disappears?
• 1:56:35
  Speaker 2: Me? Hopefully not at all. Some politicians definitely say one
• 1:56:39
  Speaker 2: thing and then don't govern that way in the privacy
• 1:56:44
  Speaker 2: of their actual office. I mean, some of it's negotiation, right?
• 1:56:47
  Speaker 2: Like some of it is, OK, so let's say you
• 1:56:50
  Speaker 2: have a tax plan where you want 10 things to happen.
• 1:56:53
  Speaker 2: But then to get the Democrats to vote for it,
• 1:56:55
  Speaker 2: you have to take out two of those 10 things.
• 1:56:56
  Speaker 2: Like that's just the give and take of governance. But
• 1:56:59
  Speaker 2: I don't think that's what you're talking about. I mean,
• 1:57:00
  Speaker 2: what you do see sometimes is people who say something
• 1:57:04
  Speaker 2: on the campaign trail and even though they affirmatively do
• 1:57:07
  Speaker 2: not believe that thing at all. And that's just dishonesty.
• 1:57:11
  Speaker 2: It's certainly not me. It's certainly not Donald Trump. And
• 1:57:13
  Speaker 2: I'd say what you will about Donald Trump, but he
• 1:57:15
  Speaker 2: just says what he thinks. And I think that's actually
• 1:57:17
  Speaker 2: one of the reasons why people like him.
• 1:57:19
  Speaker 1: A lot of people are going to vote for him,
• 1:57:20
  Speaker 1: I think, also because it's just the funny. He's the
• 1:57:22
  Speaker 1: funniest dude they've ever had in there. He is incredibly funny.
• 1:57:26
  Speaker 1: The shit he says is absolutely wild.
• 1:57:28
  Speaker 2: He's got a great sense of humor. Can I tell
• 1:57:30
  Speaker 2: you one story? Yeah. And then you have to go.
• 1:57:32
  Speaker 2: I know I have to go soon. I've got, you know,
• 1:57:35
  Speaker 2: my person over here. I understand. I want you to
• 1:57:37
  Speaker 2: get home to your family. No, I'm going to have
• 1:57:39
  Speaker 2: dinner with my kids tonight. So it's a big deal.
• 1:57:41
  Speaker 2: Skyline Chili. Not in Cincinnati. We're doing Skyline Chili in Middletown.
• 1:57:45
  Speaker 1: Even if you have other chili and you just say that,
• 1:57:47
  Speaker 1: they don't want to tell anyone. That's one thing I
• 1:57:49
  Speaker 1: don't care if you.
• 1:57:49
  Speaker 2: Lie about, dude. No, man. Skyline is good. Have you
• 1:57:51
  Speaker 2: ever had Skyline?
• 1:57:52
  Speaker 1: Skyline goes straight to the basement.
• 1:57:54
  Speaker 2: I know that, brother.
• 1:57:55
  Speaker 1: Ha!
• 1:57:57
  Speaker 2: Dude, I have had it. I respect it. Okay.
• 1:58:01
  Speaker 1: I've had it at a wedding. I've had it at
• 1:58:03
  Speaker 1: a wedding in Covington, Kentucky. I've had Skyline Chili.
• 1:58:07
  Speaker 2: That's a good wedding, man. Those must have been good friends. Anyway, yeah.
• 1:58:13
  Speaker 2: So the first time, not that he had ever met
• 1:58:16
  Speaker 2: my wife, but the first time President Trump spent any
• 1:58:19
  Speaker 2: like real time with my wife. Did he flirt with
• 1:58:21
  Speaker 2: her or not? He didn't flirt with her. He was
• 1:58:23
  Speaker 2: very sweet to her, gave her a big hug, told
• 1:58:25
  Speaker 2: her she was beautiful. He's a very engaging guy. Some
• 1:58:29
  Speaker 2: of the media doesn't tell people about him, but he's
• 1:58:31
  Speaker 2: a very engaging guy, very easy to talk to. But
• 1:58:34
  Speaker 2: it's so funny. My wife is super diplomatic. And so
• 1:58:37
  Speaker 2: he asks her, he's like, Usha, what do you think
• 1:58:39
  Speaker 2: about your husband being involved in politics? And she's, oh,
• 1:58:42
  Speaker 2: you know, it's nice. I like supporting him. He really
• 1:58:45
  Speaker 2: cares about public service, loves the people of Ohio, just
• 1:58:47
  Speaker 2: gives a very diplomatic answer. And then he kind of
• 1:58:49
  Speaker 2: chuckles and says, yeah, my wife hates it too. And
• 1:58:55
  Speaker 2: it just like broke the ice perfectly. And then she
• 1:58:58
  Speaker 2: could actually have a conversation with him because she wasn't
• 1:58:59
  Speaker 2: trying to like talk to the president. Then she was
• 1:59:02
  Speaker 2: just talking to a guy at that point. Yeah. And he's,
• 1:59:05
  Speaker 2: he's just, he's, he's got a very, a very good
• 1:59:07
  Speaker 2: way about him. And he breaks down those barriers.
• 1:59:09
  Speaker 1: He says some funny stuff, dude. At that Al Smith
• 1:59:11
  Speaker 1: dinner the other night, that shit was good.
• 1:59:13
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:59:14
  Speaker 1: What if Tony Hinchcliffe helped him write that or not?
• 1:59:16
  Speaker 2: I don't know. It's a good question, but. I'm telling you,
• 1:59:20
  Speaker 2: a lot of the stuff he just comes up with himself.
• 1:59:22
  Speaker 2: I mean, the line where he was talking about white
• 1:59:26
  Speaker 2: dudes for Kamala. Oh, yeah. That was tough. And he
• 1:59:31
  Speaker 2: was like, I forget exactly what he said, but something
• 1:59:34
  Speaker 2: to the effect of, well, it's okay. Their wives and
• 1:59:38
  Speaker 2: their wives' boyfriends are all voting for Trump.
• 1:59:40
  Speaker 1: That shit was pretty crazy, dude.
• 1:59:45
  Speaker 2: And like all good jokes, there's like an element of
• 1:59:47
  Speaker 2: truth to it.
• 1:59:48
  Speaker 1: My best wasn't even rubbed on lucky Chuck Schumer right there.
• 1:59:51
  Speaker 1: I know. Squeeze a couple bucks out of the fucking
• 1:59:54
  Speaker 1: insurance companies right there. Do you think our voting poll,
• 1:59:59
  Speaker 1: do you think that our voting is fair?
• 2:00:01
  Speaker 2: I do. I do. I mean, look, I think we
• 2:00:04
  Speaker 2: had some problems in 2020. I think the biggest problem
• 2:00:06
  Speaker 2: in 2020 is that big tech interfered in the election. Like,
• 2:00:09
  Speaker 2: I really think it's.
• 2:00:10
  Speaker 1: I can't believe that Facebook and Twitter, when it was
• 2:00:12
  Speaker 1: owned then... They admitted to leaving certain things off and
• 2:00:16
  Speaker 1: stuff and not facing any charges.
• 2:00:18
  Speaker 2: They admitted to censoring American citizens weeks before an election, right?
• 2:00:23
  Speaker 1: We'll have to talk about that another time.
• 2:00:25
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 2:00:25
  Speaker 1: We've got to get into that.
• 2:00:27
  Speaker 2: Yeah. If you'll have me back, I'll come back after
• 2:00:29
  Speaker 2: we win and have a good conversation. But you're always
• 2:00:31
  Speaker 2: welcome in Cincinnati, even despite your views on Skyline. Hey, man.
• 2:00:35
  Speaker 1: I respect that. We'll be cheering your mom on to
• 2:00:38
  Speaker 1: get her 10-year chip. It's in January?
• 2:00:39
  Speaker 2: It's in January. Awesome, man. Mr.
• 2:00:42
  Speaker 1: Vance, thank you so much for spending time with us today.
• 2:00:44
  Speaker 2: Thanks, man. Good to see you.
• 2:00:46
  Speaker 4: Now I'm just floating on the breeze And I feel
• 2:00:49
  Speaker 4: I'm falling like these leaves I must be cornerstone.
• 2:00:57
  Speaker 2: Oh, but when I
• 2:00:58
  Speaker 4: Reach that ground I'll share this peace of mind I
• 2:01:02
  Speaker 4: found I can feel it in my bones But it's
• 2:01:07
  Speaker 4: gonna take