Latest / The Talent Trade / Let's Get There Together

Transcript

Let's Get There Together · The Talent Trade

• 0:00
  Stephanie Maas: Welcome to The Talent Trade. I am Stephanie
• 0:03
  Maas, your host, partner at ThinkingAhead Executive Search,
• 0:08
  and today, I am super excited; incredible guest speaker with
• 0:14
  us. What makes him incredible is not just what he has done in the
• 0:19
  executive search world, but it's also who he is outside of the
• 0:24
  office. In fact, he became our team mascot, Team Labradoodle.
• 0:30
  And then when you think of a Labradoodle, certain things come
• 0:33
  to mind. Nobody doesn't like a Labradoodle. Everybody loves a
• 0:37
  Labradoodle. Nobody has issues. Even if they have dog allergies
• 0:41
  or sensitivities, they are still a Okay, meaning, if you've got
• 0:44
  personal problems or issues, you're still okay with the
• 0:47
  Labradoodle. Everybody loves Derek. Nobody has issues with
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  him. Consistently producing can be counted on, and has really
• 0:55
  elevated our team since he joined us. So Derek Schlender,
• 1:00
  take us from here. Thanks so much, Derek for being with us.
• 1:04
  Derek Schlender: Wow, thank you. Stephanie. Team mascot wasn't
• 1:06
  something I expected, but you know, sometimes you just get
• 1:10
  these little delights in life that you just gotta roll with it
• 1:12
  and embrace it. So it's an honor to be here. Thanks for having
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  me. And I think the last six years, they've been probably the
• 1:19
  highlight, just from a professional standpoint for me,
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  not just the work that we do, but the people that I get to do
• 1:26
  it with. But yeah, I focus on SBA recruiting for our banking
• 1:30
  team. Run that niche nationally. Personally, my family, we reside
• 1:35
  in Athens, Georgia. Go Dogs. Family of five. We have a nine
• 1:39
  year old, seven year old and a two year old. So my my world is
• 1:43
  beautiful chaos right now.
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  Stephanie Maas: I love it. So today, what I have asked Derek
• 1:49
  to come and talk and speak to is something that, in his niche and
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  in his world, he has not just revolutionized, but truly
• 1:59
  elevated in a way that nobody prior to him has ever done, and
• 2:04
  that is the MPC approach to driving business. He came in and
• 2:12
  started figuring out that there was this niche that he just
• 2:16
  found his way to and really took it and ran with it, and a big
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  part, a tremendous part, of his tremendous success, it's the MPC
• 2:24
  that he's really perfected. So I want to start there and have
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  Derek really walk us through what made you pursue this MPC
• 2:33
  approach to your market. How do you consistently build it such a
• 2:37
  high level with an MPC approach? And again, it's not all that you
• 2:40
  do, but I know it's the majority, so just kind of give
• 2:42
  us some history and then get us into the details, man.
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  Derek Schlender: Absolutely. So as I got started in search, a
• 2:50
  big conversation between my mentor and myself and just our
• 2:54
  team in general, was talking about, hey, what's going on in
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  the market in terms of what drives it? Is it client driven?
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  Is it candidate driven? Do we see that swing from year to
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  year? The thing that really came to light with SBA as a niche is
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  that it was incredibly candidate driven. And I guess the best way
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  to think about that from a macro perspective is just simple
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  supply and demand. My niche in SBA lending tends this way,
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  largely because there's been a high number of baby boomer
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  generation bankers who have been retiring. There's just not been
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  as many Gen X millennial you know, there's just not enough
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  people getting into banking to outnumber those that have been
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  retiring. And so over the last 10 to 15 years, that's resulted
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  in this growing bubble of demand where there's just a lot more
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  need than there is talent. And so that's resulted in something
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  for me that's just sustainably been candidate driven. I haven't
• 3:53
  really had a lot of client driven moments in my time so
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  far. You know, there's definitely been clients who have
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  said, Hey, Derek, you're the recruiter we want to work with
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  exclusively. You know, there's just some roles that have to go
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  to search, but the lion's share of what my market needs is the
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  talent, and it's on a constant basis. And so kind of this
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  supply and demand idea. You know, with demand so high and
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  supply so low if you can go bring to your clients what
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  they're needing, that's kind of what I would define as candidate
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  driven.
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  Stephanie Maas: Super helpful. So we figured this out, that
• 4:30
  it's candidate driven. Now what?
• 4:32
  Derek Schlender: Yeah, so it's candidate driven. I think what
• 4:35
  appealed to me a lot coming to thinking ahead, was that we are
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  not generalist recruiters, and so you've got a lot of banking
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  recruiters in the marketplace, a lot of finance recruiters, but
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  very few of them are truly market masters. Is what I would
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  say. We kind of call it as a niche expert. And so when I was
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  starting off, and frankly, anyone who's gotten their start
• 4:58
  in search, you don't know. What your niche is, until you really
• 5:02
  cut your teeth and you get a sense of, where can I win, where
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  can I go, add value. And so I just started to pull, what we
• 5:09
  call pull the thread in the market. Like you see a thread,
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  you start to pull it, and what, what comes of that is you start
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  to get traction. And so where I was getting traction was SBA
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  lending. What's unique is we were heading into the pandemic
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  as I was gaining traction. And so what happened is everyone
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  stopped coming into the office. The Marketplace, basically
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  overnight, was completely remote. And so while SBA lending
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  is a national product, a national program, I was thrust
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  into a market that was even more national by nature of everyone
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  being remote, it didn't matter where you lived, as long as a
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  company got hired in your state. And so that just became more and
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  more of a focus, almost as a product of just circumstances
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  around the pandemic. That's kind of where it all started for me.
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  Stephanie Maas: So when you're in this candidate driven world,
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  and MPC is your primary focus, what are some of the criteria
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  that, from your perspective, make a candidate extremely
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  marketable?
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  Derek Schlender: That's a great question, and I think that's the
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  most important question, because when it comes to marketing
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  talent, why are they marketable? Why are why is there value?
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  That's an important question. So for me, you know, you've got
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  kind of multiple candidate types that you are looking for in the
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  world of finance. You've got people who are, what, you know,
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  straight up and down, revenue contributors that are directly
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  tied to the bottom line profitability. You've got people
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  who are in the background, back office, people, credit
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  operations. So for me, it's different, depending on what
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  type of candidate it may be. But to put it simply, if someone's a
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  revenue contributor, have they produced is number one, have
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  they produced at a level that is recognized by the marketplace as
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  impressive, as meaningful, but even more complex than that,
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  have they produced within the deal box or the buy box of the
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  clients that I represent, if they have, I've got somebody who
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  can add value for my clients, for the marketplace that I
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  serve, if they haven't, there's a disconnect there. And so it's
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  my job as the market master to say, hey, tell me about
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  production. Tell me about where you've won. Let me make sure
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  that I'm connecting the dots in a way that's going to be
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  meaningful and recognized for the value that you bring. And so
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  I've got to uncover that with a candidate and understand that
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  and a deep level. If I'm a generalist who doesn't really
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  deeply know one niche over another, that's a lot harder. So
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  if you're somebody who does accounting, recruiting,
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  commercial, CNI, recruiting, mortgage, recruiting, all of
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  these things, that's great if you don't have enough depth to
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  talk shop with somebody and understand what kinds of deals
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  they actually do and where you could take them, or that would
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  add value. That'll be harder with credit and operations. I
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  think a lot of it comes down to efficiency and proficiency. Are
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  they efficient at what they do in credit decisioning from a
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  timeline perspective, but also, do they have a complexity of
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  understanding of different deal types, where they can actually
• 8:26
  get in and truly decision deals based on the experience that
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  they have? For me, a lot of times, somebody who is a MPC as
• 8:36
  a credit candidate, they need to be a little bit more
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  experienced, because if they're not, it's a lot harder to
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  showcase that talent and to say, hey, based on their experience,
• 8:46
  they're going to add XYZ and value. And then the same is, you
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  know, generally true of people in operations and other
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  capacities. It's it's a lot of just, they've had experience in
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  key areas that I know bring value to my clients. And then,
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  on top of all that, I would just say that their resume really
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  matters. A resume for a star candidate has to look like
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  someone who hasn't moved around a lot. You know, there's
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  occasions where a quick stint somewhere can be explained, and
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  that's okay. But again, I need to understand their story in a
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  way that can be conveyed in a way that's understood and
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  accepted. And then the last thing is just compensation.
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  Because as much as we're talking about representing candidates,
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  our primary responsibility is still our clients, which is
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  sometimes hard to think about. When you're thinking about, hey,
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  I'm representing talent and trying to go place them in the
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  market, you still have to ethically understand, hey, my
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  primary job is to solve a need for my client, and a lot of that
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  comes down to simple math. Does this candidate? Are they someone
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  who's affordable? Are they someone who's commanding a
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  salary that the market will support again, if I'm not
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  niched? I don't know my. Market. I may not be able to answer that
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  question, and I may not actually able to add value to my client,
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  because if I bring them someone they can't afford, that's great
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  that this candidates a rock star, they can produce, they add
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  all this efficiency value, but if they aren't in the budget for
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  what the client can pay, I'm wasting a lot of people's time.
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  Stephanie Maas: So let me ask you this; when you're
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  approaching a candidate and you're not specifically calling
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  on behalf of a search, which is what a lot of us do. How do you
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  get the candidate engaged? How do you even set up this MPC
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  relationship?
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  Derek Schlender: Yeah, that's a great question. I think again,
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  I'm going to probably beat this horse the whole time, but being
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  very specialized is the key, because if you get a phone call
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  from someone who is specialized to represent the niche you
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  literally operate in as a candidate, as a professional,
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  and someone calls you, it's a different conversation when you
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  can convey to them, Hey, the only space I recruit in is your
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  world. And so what I'm going to do first and foremost is I'm
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  going to pursue understanding you as a professional before we
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  I mean, whether or not I have an opportunity that I'm recruiting
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  for or not that for me is the right approach, even if I'm
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  taking a search to market, because it's going to take me
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  some time to truly understand if you're the right fit for this
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  Search. So even if there's a search, Hey, I am specialized.
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  I'm niche, specific. Let me understand your situation, and
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  as we develop that relationship with the candidate, the beauty
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  is the value we bring to our clients. It's not going after
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  people who are thanking God that you called them on that Tuesday
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  afternoon. It's the people who didn't really have time to talk
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  to you, but they start to catch, oh, there's value in talking to
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  this recruiter, because they are actually in my space, even if
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  it's a quick conversation, I want to keep in touch with them.
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  So it's very relationally driven. Again, it's a value
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  proposition to the candidate that, hey, whether or not I go
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  take you to one of my clients right now, we need to know each
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  other, even for long term relationship. And so that's the
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  approach that I take. And then from there, again, being
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  specialized, you can pick up on things that are causing pain
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  when you hear how things are actually going well. Derek, it's
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  been a good year. I've produced X amount in volume. The only
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  frustration is it's caught. It's taking 60 days decision to deal.
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  Hang on, that's a huge red flag. But I only know that if I truly
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  know the time frame it ought to take for a lender to decision
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  transactions so things like that. As you're talking to
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  someone and they're engaging with you, you can say, Hey, can
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  I provide some feedback based on my expertise in the market? I
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  think you're in a place that's kind of preventing you from
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  being the best you could be. You mind if I give you some
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  feedback? And so it's developing a relationship of trust based on
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  expertise.
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  Stephanie Maas: So that gets the candidates engaged. What about
• 13:01
  the client side? If everybody's hiring, if everybody needs these
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  people, how do you determine your target list?
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  Derek Schlender: That's a great question. So a lot of it, for
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  me, is just paying attention in a number of ways. It's
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  absolutely paying attention to who's producing at different
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  levels, who are the top places that are competitively looking
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  to be in the top 10 in the country, top 20 in the country,
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  and having a relationship developed with those hiring
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  managers to understand, how are you going about that? What kind
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  of talent is it going to take for you to achieve your goals?
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  Do you have the support in your back office to support the
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  production you're looking to have? But it's also
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  understanding what are the kind of new to market, new to the
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  stage, players who may not have as much volume publicly traced
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  where it's like, Hey, you're actually going to be a player in
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  the next two to three years. But knowing the people in your
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  niche, it's achieved through a number of things. It's what I
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  just talked about in terms of the rankings. It's attending
• 13:59
  conferences and actually getting in front of your market and
• 14:03
  getting to know the people in your space. But it's, again,
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  it's very relational, and it's asking, Hey, what do you need
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  right now? But where are you headed? What are you going to
• 14:13
  need? And the next year, if I came across a top qualified
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  candidate in the market is that someone you would want to have a
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  confidential conversation about, every hiring manager you talk to
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  is going to say yes, but again, it comes back down to can you
• 14:26
  actually produce that and value to them? And so if you can come
• 14:30
  back to the table and say, Hey, I really urge you, when you and
• 14:33
  I talked about the talent that it's going to take for you to
• 14:37
  get where you're headed, and give them some feedback that you
• 14:40
  actually have the talent that they're looking for 10 times out
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  of 10. Those those clients want to have a conversation with you
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  about that. The challenge for most of my clients is not paying
• 14:50
  a fee to a recruiter or even going the search route. It's
• 14:53
  working with recruiters who don't bring them candidates who
• 14:57
  are well vetted, who actually you. Solve a need, or actually,
• 15:00
  like thrust them toward your goal. So it's connecting those
• 15:03
  two dots. But again, I think it's a lot of relational
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  business development conversations that are not just
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  centered around, what search do you have for me today? But let's
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  have a business conversation around where are you trying to
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  get to? What type of people are going to help you get there?
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  Stephanie Maas: Dang. Just listening to you talk, it is so
• 15:22
  evident how you are so good at what you do. Okay, so my last
• 15:26
  question is, you've got this expertise. You approach
• 15:30
  candidates in a very relational way, you approach clients in a
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  very relational way, all under the umbrella of this MPC model,
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  which a lot of folks feel often, can be transactional, but you
• 15:42
  just walked us through how it's not. What kind of feedback have
• 15:47
  you gotten from folks that you've worked with about this process?
• 15:51
  Derek Schlender: It's honestly been extremely positive. And one
• 15:54
  of the things I love most about the world we live in is we have
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  something called LinkedIn.
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  Stephanie Maas: Is it on the World Wide Web?
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  Derek Schlender: It is. It is actually the website. But every
• 16:04
  placement I make, it's part of my process. I ask first for the
• 16:08
  candidates I place to leave me a review, and thankfully, almost
• 16:11
  everyone is so willing to do that, and the feedback I've
• 16:15
  consistently had is they just love the ethical experience that
• 16:19
  they have. And that's interesting to me, that that
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  comes to light so frequently, because you would think that
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  ethics or something that every recruiter considered to be a
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  high priority, but it's just not. And I think what it comes
• 16:32
  down to is a lot of recruiters don't really know what else to
• 16:36
  do with a resume, than to go run to their clients and try to put
• 16:40
  it in front of them. And so for me, it's a lot different than
• 16:44
  that. So much of what I do is it's not spaghetti on the wall,
• 16:48
  it's not resume spamming. It's very much a partnership with
• 16:51
  candidates in the market around hey, let's work together in
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  developing a wish list of organizations that you want to
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  go to. I'm going to come to the table with recommendations. I
• 17:02
  expect you to come to the table with dreams and desires. We're
• 17:06
  going to put that together and come come up with a list of
• 17:09
  target organizations. The result is, you're going to get in front
• 17:13
  of the organizations you want to get in front of. And a lot of
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  times, it's people who they have all of the qualifications, all
• 17:21
  of the resume to get them the job, but they don't have the
• 17:24
  connections. It's the timing, it's the coaching, it's the
• 17:28
  representation at the offer stage. It's giving voice to this
• 17:31
  is what the market's supporting. You need to be paid X amount to
• 17:35
  right size, you get you paid what you're worth, or it's Hey,
• 17:39
  you're paid very competitively. Let's go get you an opportunity
• 17:43
  that lets you maximize your incentive compensation to make
• 17:46
  you a lot more money all in it's that expertise, and without
• 17:50
  that, it's open season. They're on their own. They don't have
• 17:54
  representation, and so many people I work with have had that
• 17:57
  experience. They would much rather have a advocate working
• 18:01
  with them, but somebody who's really a guide, a trusted
• 18:04
  advisor, someone who's not just going out there and saying, Hey,
• 18:08
  let me go. I'll keep you posted on what I get for you in terms
• 18:12
  of an opportunity to interview. But no, let's go. Target an
• 18:16
  organization we agree on. You're in charge. I'm going to guide
• 18:19
  you there, and let's get there together. So the feedback I've
• 18:23
  gotten is that that's really value for a candidate. They
• 18:27
  appreciate that. They don't get that from everyone. And so I
• 18:30
  feel really good about the work that I do based on that feedback.
• 18:34
  Stephanie Maas: And I bet, too, from the client's perspective,
• 18:37
  you showing up with an MPC, is not you just showing up with a
• 18:40
  resume saying, Hey, you do the work, you do the vetting, and
• 18:43
  I'm just sending you this resume, and I hope you send me
• 18:46
  25% if you hire them. I gotta imagine the feedback from the
• 18:49
  clients is super similar. Hey, we know we're looking for
• 18:52
  talent, but you brought us the talent that's spot on for what
• 18:55
  we need to achieve our goals. I imagine you get some feedback
• 18:59
  that it's a game changer that way too for you.
• 19:01
  Derek Schlender: For sure, for sure. And I'd say too that like
• 19:04
  I think most organizations would like to have the unlimited time,
• 19:07
  unlimited bandwidth, to take everything, to search and
• 19:10
  competitively select a slate of candidates and pick the best
• 19:14
  one. And I mean, that's an ideal world, right? We want that on
• 19:17
  paper, but in the reality of what we are dealing with is you
• 19:20
  have a goal to meet by into quarter one. It's the beginning
• 19:24
  of March. Your top producer just collected his bonus and left for
• 19:27
  whatever reason. What are you going to do? Can you go to
• 19:31
  search? Can you go find that slate of candidates? Can you go
• 19:34
  through that full process? Well, what if someone called you and
• 19:37
  said, Hey, I've got someone who can produce at a level that's
• 19:41
  equivalent to what your top producer was producing at who
• 19:44
  wouldn't want to have that conversation. So again, it's a
• 19:47
  time saver and a money saver, because the time it takes to
• 19:51
  take an opportunity to search, you're losing money on that top
• 19:54
  producers revenue. And so a lot of it is it's a monetarily
• 19:57
  efficient way to select top talent, but. Again, I think the
• 20:01
  clients that I work with value the industry expertise so that
• 20:04
  they know when I bring them a candidate, it's not just
• 20:07
  someone's resume that I got from a job posting.
• 20:10
  Stephanie Maas: Man, that says a tremendous amount. Anything else
• 20:13
  that you think right now is critical for our listener to
• 20:18
  know or be aware of when it comes to elevating the MPC
• 20:22
  approach to the market?
• 20:24
  Derek Schlender: Stephanie, you probably said this already, but
• 20:26
  I think the overarching principle is that good
• 20:29
  recruiters are good listeners. Great recruiters are phenomenal
• 20:33
  listeners. And with everything I'm talking about, if you don't
• 20:37
  go in with a really active listening mindset, you're only
• 20:41
  going to be able to default to transactional recruiting, but if
• 20:45
  you can really listen and really learn from every conversation,
• 20:49
  you become someone who is incredibly valuable to your
• 20:52
  marketplace and to the candidates you recruit. So
• 20:55
  that's it. I mean, it's Listen, listen, listen and do something
• 20:59
  with what you learn.
• 21:00
  Stephanie Maas: Love it. Derek, thank you so much for being here
• 21:04
  sharing some of your wisdom. I know that there's a lot more to come.